#WHY IS THIS DISCOURSE BACK??

[rei-does-stuff]

“You aren’t a REAL lesbian! If you like FICTIONAL MEN!” I’m gonna run you over <3

[sunnibits]

potentially hot take but this is a pet peeve of mine

[ruffbunny]

“growing up is going from billdip to billf/rd” growing up is realizing shipping is harmless and we all have bills and shit to pay and god above it does not actually matter outside of the online discourse bubble like…. It really doesn’t.

Please just go do something that makes you happy instead of being miserable and militant about thought crimes. Pleeeeaaaseeee Fortnite is free, the local animal shelter would love some volunteer work, there’s probably a shocking number of nature trails in your area, you could make bread😭

[nyaskitten]

This shipping discourse stupid as shit guys like okay llorumi is NOT my cup of tea either but why are people deadass campaigning to harass people over it? Like okay we can hate a ship AND be Civilized and Respectful about it? ??? why are we sending out the harassing goon squads or whatever what is this fandom's PROBLEM!!!

[trashhicon]

Another tfe discourse post but I have a crappy gift at the end

I wasn’t going to say anything more about the tfe situation because I know some people are just haters but…

If you’re upset Robbie, a main character, is getting screen time and development, you’re in for a rude awakening because spoiler alert: shows develop their MAIN CHARACTERS

I for one am ECSTATIC they’re trying to develop the main cast and not have Robbie be like every other human kid (absolutely nothing burger). The fact he can actually fight along his siblings is fucking cool.

All this negativity because earthspark isn’t tfp is making me piss out shit bricks like what were you expecting??? It’s a different story.

Anyway here’s a starbee sketch I made so we can end this with love as much as the parasites want me to send hate. Spread love, be kind, give your friends a compliment, support a Palestinian charity because paramount isn’t going to, be good.

[starryoak]

Making memes out of my headcanons, part 3, swinging bats at hornets nests edition!

[chipjrwibignaturals]

stupid ass discourse on the dash sorry

[wikiangela]

it's so crazy how people think a 10-ish year age gap is big and inappropriate and wrong or some shit

especially for people who met in their 30s and 40s lbffr the age gap is so not an issue

(I need some of y'all to remember buck is in his 30s, he's a grown man, tommy could be 20 years older and it'd be fine 🙄)

[gxtzeizm]

the fact that me, as a fan of both lando and oscar without any bias (maybe a bit on lando but not that much), is going to witness both "oscar fans, lando antis" and "lando fans, oscar antis" posts all in my one dash 🥲🥲

also the fact that atp i couldn't even bother enough with this same situation on both lewis and george. now it happens on lando and oscar as well which got me like....

[hogletthe2nd]

”DSMP fandom now should go back to 2021 dsmp fandom” it really shouldn’t actually. In fact I don’t claim this 2021 dsmp fandom space resurgence energy. Do not come to my house.

[inclined--plane]

trans people stop saying afab/amab when

[sword-swallower-pin]

we're in such a strange era where men will just casually wax poetic for several paragraphs in mainstream media outlets about how john and paul were in love with each other but no one dares to explore the real questions (were they having gay sex? when were they having gay sex? what kind of gay sex were they having?) mate you're a journalist, do your job

[cushfuddled]

Tumblr wants me to click the community tab so bad. Every time I open the website there's that purple popup and I'm like. Tumblr. Babygirl. If I wanted to make new friends and bond over a shared love for blorbo and glup shitto...only for that community to 1. discover I ship the wrong made-up cats together or whatever/believe people's fictional preferences don't dictate their real life ethics, and 2. slander me as a pedophile in retaliation...I would simply rejoin Twitter

[qcellbit]

meta talk. i don't quite know how to word this properly, but adding french creators to the qsmp is the riskiest thing quackity studios could've done and it doesn't surprise me that the success to which it was executed was minimal.

adding portuguese speaking creators exclusively from brazil as the first batch outside of the initial english and spanish speakers was the perfect "soft expansion" for the server when you consider the reason for the project's conception - because quackity had experienced poor treatment from white americans as a bilingual latino creator and sought to unite his two communities in an empowering way, further expanding this very noble and personal idea to encapsulate all communities and all languages spanning across the entire world. inviting more latino creators who have likely had the same experiences and would be able to appreciate what the project is trying to achieve is a no-brainer.

it's an uncomfortable thing to touch on (which is why i've never, ever, seen it spoken about on this website), but minecraft projects and communities have always had massive problems with all forms of bigotry, but especially racism. white americans and white europeans have probably not felt the euphoria of seeing their culture celebrated in mainstream global entertainment projects as they already absolutely dominate the entertainment industry on a global scale. as someone who is visibly brown and living in europe, i've always got a lot of grief from classmates and co-workers in the form of ignorant jokes and flat out exclusion - it's an unfortunate cultural norm that bleeds into streaming due to the medium's casual and open nature, unnoticed or unchallenged by white viewers who don't want to have to confront a content creator's bigotry in fears of having to stop watching them. something that cannot be ignored by the people it's actually affecting. there is a reason dsmp and hermitcraft cosplay meet ups are dominated by pale skin.

i love the qsmp because its inclusion of latin american creators and quackity's selectiveness based on personal experience have largely (and i do mean largely, not entirely, but that's a discussion for another day) eliminated that problem.

the most prominent and succinct example i can think of is the photo of quackity's bedroom that was mocked countless times by his english speaking community and his bigoted english speaking friends when he streamed on the dsmp - when that photo was brought to the qsmp, forever, a fellow latino creator, was the first person to gently offer solidarity because he had come from the same impoverished latin american background. to me, and to a lot of minorities, that is what the qsmp is about. yeah, sharing languages in a minecraft server is novel, it's a fun way for americans who did poorly in high school to get back into learning spanish, but it stands for so much more when you're a racial minority. when your pleading in the dsmp fandom was drowned out and ignored for the entire duration of its run. when you're completely unrepresented in minecraft tournaments, and when known bigots are encouraged to participate in said tournaments to boost viewership because numbers are paramount. when you are finally seeing your culture appreciated rather than mocked on streams with tens of thousands of viewers all over the world as part of a massive project with a brilliant, engaging story.

it was obviously necessary to branch out of the americas at some point with what the project is attempting to achieve, but such a task is daunting when the next group you're inviting and their community probably do not have the capacity through personal experience to appreciate what the project stands for at its core in the same way the first batches do. can non americans all relate in discussions of the internet and entertainment industry being america and by extension english speaking centric? yeah, of course. but can white europeans relate when the only representation you have in said media revolves around harmful bigoted stereotypes? can there be a quiet solidarity between a white frenchman and a brown brazilian based on experiences with government, racial profiling, and online mockery? no. and in the landscape of livestreaming stupid jokes for entertainment alongside fast paced gameplay, these nuances are probably not going to be acknowledged.

in complete contrast to the solidarity exhibited between quackity and forever when discussing their poverty growing up in latin america, i have not forgotten and never will forget aypierre excusing his constant racist jokes aimed at the brazilians on his uniquely "french dark humour" that the brazilians, hurt by his comments, could "not understand." this is not an excusable cultural difference, but a symptom of white european privilege, and total ignorance towards what the project is meant to stand for. a smooth integration of all the world's cultures necessitates white european and white american introspection in a way that i haven't seen a lot of streamers capable of. admitting fault to such a degree and the ego of a large online personality do not often mesh well.

i'm always very irritated when people (especially english speakers) complain about them not "adding the germans" sooner despite us seeing applications for german speaking admins many months ago - because it would not be a task of simply throwing out server invites to content creators and cobbling together an animation of a submarine crashing into the island. you cannot downplay the ambition of this project and the mammoth task its trying to accomplish. people take for granted and forget that this is an unprecedented melding of cultures that would never otherwise interact and clash on the rare occasions they do. the french qsmp community being small and the french creators largely being outliers when it comes to the qsmp is not something born out of malice or purposeful exclusion, but simply a symptom of an unspoken lack of solidarity and inability to meaningfully relate based on everything from wildly varying privilege to global placement.

and don't get me wrong - i'm not excusing things like the times at which events are broadcast (i literally live in europe and have to stay up until sunrise to see most events, i think the admins do have to bite the bullet and begin structuring events around a new timezone that isn't the globally inconvenient unsustainable PST), or the exclusion of clips from french content creators at the presidential dinner, but i think attributing those admin choices to the brazilian community being unfairly favoured is downplaying what the qsmp as a project means for minorities, especially when the brazilian community receive the most scorn for infamously being the first to call out bigoted behaviour from qsmp content creators. yeah, it sucks that the french haven't slotted into the qsmp as well as the brazilians and aren't anywhere as numerous, but with all these unspoken contributing factors being taken into account, i can't be surprised.

i wish quackity and his team the best in smoothly integrating more languages and cultures in this amazing project in the future, but for the love of god please understand that the implications of this project and its impact are far larger than any streamer "drama" you might've witnessed in the past. and stop underplaying what this project is trying to achieve in an online landscape saturated in bigotry.

[the-way-astray]

huh what was your rant’s main argument

this post is in no way a proper response to katie's response, so i just wanna make that clear from the start. i am actually going to make one of those. so this is not that.

the main argument of my rant is not "here is a list of keefe's worst qualities, doesn't he suck? now everyone point and laugh what a shitty/annoying/cringe/whatever-else-i-said guy" (well, except for the stuff that i said was subjective, like his humor). the main argument of my rant is that keefe's worst qualities never. impact. how. he. interacts. with. the. story. not a single flaw of his has any consequences, either plot-based or relationship-based. not a single bad moment redefines him in the audience's eyes (or is meant to, as written by shannon) or in sophie's. not a single shitty height he reaches has ever ever ever ever been portrayed as negative for longer than zero point four seconds. not one thing he does has any lasting, negative consequences, not for him, not for the people around him. not one thing. not one single thing.

the thing that confuses me about katie's response is that she is well aware that this is my main gripe with keefe. i am not silent about it in the slightest. i do not care that keefe uses his empathy dubiously. i do not care that he handed the cache over at the end of neverseen. i do not care that he breaches boundaries, or that he humiliates sophie constantly, or that he's infinitely stupid and reckless, or that he can't be serious during serious moments. serious. do not give one single shit about any of these things.

what i actually care about, my unending problem with keefe's character, my main gripe, the thing that will never stop annoying me about keefe, is that these things do not result in keefe facing any consequences for doing them, nor are they even villified by the narrative.

i understand that keefe's dubious use of empathy is because of his father. i know that he ran away to the neverseen because of his mom's manipulation. i get that he breaches sophie's boundaries because he genuinely might think he's helping, and that he humiliates sophie because he doesn't know when to stop, and that he's reckless and stupid because that's his character flaw and because he's trying so hard so fight his mom and make sure she doesn't hurt anyone else, and whatever else katie pulled out in her response to explain keefe's shitty behavior. i am aware. i know this. i am not trying to argue that keefe is a bad character because he has flaws and does bad things. that would be incredibly weird.

no, my main argument is that keefe's flaws do not function as flaws, but rather just as bad traits that, half the time, shannon herself does not seem to even be aware are bad.

here is a fantastic example. okay here goes: keefe has issues regarding not knowing where the boundaries are with empathy because he grew up with his fucked-up abusive father who likely extorted information out of him the same way he does with sophie and others (and also likely because he's brainwashed into thinking the law is moral, and there's no actual law against doing this).

now that i've passed katie's test, let's play my game: name one time keefe's using his empathy has, in the long-term, affected his relationships with people. name one time it's truly demonized and made out to be a bad thing by the narrative beyond "oh the person was angry and muttered something about empaths or glared at keefe". name one time it actually affects how keefe interacts with the story. name one time this flaw, something both katie and i agree on, actually affects keefe's relationships. name one time he's sorry, name one time he learns or grows out of it, name one time it's even just made out to be a shitty thing, and not in a "oh, that's just a thing keefe/empaths do, isn't it so annoying? oh well, guess we'll all just put up with it". name one time this flaw is actually recognized by shannon as a flaw. name one time. name one single time. name it. i want to hear it.

in theory, this is supposed to be a thing the reader keeps in mind as they read all my points. i think i actually did say after one of my points something to the effect of, "i'm not actually mad about [thing], it's just that keefe never faces consequences for [thing], which does make me mad. this is also something that applies to a lot of points i make, but it would get repetitive to say that after every single point i make, so just keep in mind that that's the angle i'm coming from". maybe it wasn't as clear as it was the way i just said it now (which i will keep in mind and change during the part two rant), but yeah. none of my points are meant to be "oh look at him isn't he so [flaw]" and stop right there with no further thought. they are meant to be proof that whatever keefe did is bad, so that when i get around to the back half of the rant, i can then say that [bad thing] is never developed or even made out to be bad. so, uh. yeah. here's a few times i say this in the rant itself:

also wanted to mention this quote (from katie's response):

the reason keefe reads as flat to me is that none of his flaws ever affect how he interacts with the story, not in any long-term negative-consequence sense. you can explain and over explain why keefe is the way he is all you want, but that will never change the fact that this is fully not at all my gripe with keefe. not even a little bit. explanation does not equal justification, and certainly it does not equal consequences. where are the consequences, shannon. where are they. where. where. i don't see them. i don't think they exist, actually.

YES!!!! EXACTLY!!!! IT DOESN'T JUSTIFY IT, IT EXPLAINS IT!!!! THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT I'M SAYING. YES. YOU GET IT. so you agree that this is shitty behavior. okay, cool. now name the place where keefe gets what he deserves for this. if this is shitty, it follows that it is a flaw, right? and if it's a flaw, it should be penalized, right? it should be made out to be a bad thing, right? now. where does this happen.

katie also makes a lot of arguments like this:

well, i actually did acknowledge fitz's main flaw at one point (exile incident, there's a screenshot a few paragraphs up), and i actually did explain why i don't think other characters (in this case, fitz) tend to be as bad as keefe. it's because there's actual development there with fitz's anger, and even if there wasn't, it's definitely vilified by the narrative. (i'd also like to say that katie responded to the bullet containing that fitz-from-exile section, but for some reason decided to cut out that section when quoting me in her response. i felt that was an important part of my argument, and that therefore its absence diminishes my point. in theory, this should not matter, but in reality, there are clearly people that are reading katie's response without reading my original post, and making judgement calls based on that.)

in conclusion, katie has made an argument. a good argument, even. one i actually mostly agree with, which is why i'm having such trouble writing a response to her essay. it's just that what she wrote is not (broadly speaking) a counterargument to what i wrote. it disproves nothing of my main point. nothing katie has told me is new information. i've read her pro keefe essay, which she knows. i'm aware that for everything keefe does that is shitty, there is a reason. genuinely it almost feels like an insult to my intelligence to imply i'm not aware of these things, especially considering shannon has a tendency to beat us over the head with the keefe pity party. i know why keefe is or does [insert flaw here]. i know exactly why it happens. i am aware. that does not change the fact that explaining why it occurs does absolute jackshit to change the objective fact that keefe's flaws are usually brushed aside or made out to be way less offensive than they really are. and honestly, if a flaw doesn't affect how a character interacts with the story, can we even really call it a flaw anymore? at that point, it's just a bad trait.

[idontwanttospoiltheparty]

It is truly fascinating how the common tumblr narrative around John and Paul somehow makes the guy who literally got violent multiple times over people insinuating he was queer appear more "on board with the whole gay thing" than the guy who said some awkward/dated stuff in interviews a couple of times.