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dunmeshistash · 8 months ago

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How do you feel about Milsiril? Like what do you think of her interactions between the canaries, her goals, her intentions and morality? I keep seeing people with mixed feelings about her, some saying she's just toxic or morally grey or doing bad but with good intentions or that she's just a mentally ill and literally so much more, also with the comic about Otta calling Milsiril love for her children/Kabru as just love for a pet, I always saw people take it at face value and say yes, Milsiril did love them more as pets instead of children, did she take up raising/adopting non-elf children because she felt like none of them could ridicule her like the elves did because they didn't know what an elf was supposed to be like (and also because they were children) or did she inherently view them as less? I mean the canaries and I'm pretty sure almost all of the cast in dungeon meshi have some sort perspective on different races especially because how they were taught about them, i just think it was interesting to finally see someone interpret it as Otta just misinterpreting Milsiril, I'm just really interested in her, i think shes neat, sorry for the rant!

Ooh, well to preface this, I hadn't really realized Milsiril was such a controversial character before my last post, I kinda live under a rock. She's really not a character I had given much thought besides what I wrote there before it, but I can do my best to express what I have thought since, with sources for it. I'm not sure what order to go thru so I'll just go by manga appearances and then extras, this will probably be quite a long post

This is the first time she shows up in the manga (ch55) Kabru is wondering about what future they might have if the elves take them into custody because of the ancient magic, he thinks about Milsiril as a get out of jail card, and mentions "There's a chance they would make us become permanent resident of the elven lands." with the image of Milsiril holding him. I don't think that means she would be the one to not let them leave, since this would probably be an legal issue, and the fact Milsiril lives away from other Elves. It does set up that Milsiril is quite overprotective tho, with Kabru's reaction to her teary hug. (rest is under a cut)

The next time she shows up is in ch61 right after Kabru falls down the dungeon along with Mithrun, he faints and has this flashback

She's being her overbearing self treating Kabru's small injury as if its something you need to be in bed for, hand feeding him like he's a toddler, and when he insists he wants to learn how to fight and be strong like her, she hugs him revealing to us for the first time her arm scars, she's cleary in distress too, so you wonder "what has happened to her?"

It continues in the next pages, as she tells him to stay there, where it's safe and there's cake, and describes the bad things he might encounter. Until he tells her he will go with or without her help

Honestly this is a Kabru we don't see often, this is the version of him that is usually in thought bubbles, he's blowing out in frustation over being smothered and demanding straight up what he wants, instead of trying to manipulate Milsiril, very blunt for him. Milsiril seems to flip a switch into battle mode, when she decides to train him for real.

I really thought this was funny, the visual of these cuddly toys and this Mom that was being so soft just a second ago completely flipping into something menacing is very amusing to me. She says "I'll give you an exhaustive, thorough training in how to use a sword... until you finally decide that you're ready to give up." although it sounds cruel, it seems she really trained him as best she could to make sure he would survive the dungeon. If he couldn't take the training with her there was no way he would be able to take on the dungeon, but he could, so much so that he managed to make her let him go. I can see this being seen as her trying to prevent him from going but to me it seems more like some tough love from a traumatized war veteran in this case.

The last thoughts he has is admitting his Mom was right, "Not only were there plenty of traps, monsters, and malice... but there were times when I felt so hungry and cold that I couldn't stand it."

And he concludes with "I never once thought that I wanted to go back there. That room where I could eat all the cake that I wanted..." While I can understand the interpretation that he means he would rather go thru all this than go back, perhaps cause he hated it there, I think it's rather a statement to how committed he is to defeating the dungeon, the visuals show him in rubble vs him in a soft big bed, the rough reality he fought to be able to face and the comfyness of what his life could be. Plus is mirroring exactly what Milsiril said to him. Admitting she was right about the bad things but that he won't give up for the safe easy life he had.

After that visuals of Milsiril are used while Kabru tries to sus out Mithrun but she shows up again in Mithrun's backstory.

Here she's straight up called Gloomy, which wasn't really the version of her we saw so far, gotta remember this is also how Mithrun saw her and that she was called gloomy as a way of bullying. Kabru mostly cuts off her part in the story until the end, when she's the one to find Mithrun after he was eaten by the demon

She doesn't really care much for Mithrun as we see in some extras, and she was ready to mercy kill him, but she is also the one to spare his life. This could be seen as her thinking he can still be of use, and it's how it sounds with how Kabru tells the story, but I do think this was also a merciful act, Mithrun was in rehabilitation for 20 years after being saved, by the time he was actually useful for anything Milsiril had already left the canaries and adopted Kabru.

Now for extras... About Mithrun/The Canaries, Milsiril was cleary someone that hated the people around her. This is her extra in the Adventurer's Bible

Milsiril seems to be the type that hates "popular kids" so to say, her description says she was bullied by other elves for being so introverted so I believe she holds a grudge against people like Mithrun that seem to have succeeded where she failed. But realizing he was a twisted person like her seemed to make her feel more sympathetic towards him, that's why I think she really did act with mercy when she saves Mithrun, he's now someone she sees as similar to her, she sees he also suffered like her

Her decription also mentions she left the canaries specifically because she was disgusted with how the Utaya situation was dealt with. Yet it seems like she came back to help Mithrun with his rehabilitation once she quits.

There's an interpretation to be made that she did this only to get "revenge" on the demon since she just saw the destruction of Utaya, and that she's using him. On the other hand maybe she wants to help him find a motivation to live, she's no longer a canary and she has time to actually help him now. I don't know which one is the truth but it's not obviously something self-serving if you ask me. Especially in the context that right before this scene Milsiril admits she wishes they could have talked before.

My interpretation of her relationship with the canaries and other elves is that she's someone depressed that was mistreat for her 'quirky' side, the dolls are clearly one of the ways she used to cope with anxiety/depression but it only caused her to be bullied by her own kin, she's the daughter of an important family and it's shown in other extras, including one about Mithrun, that nobles often send out the kids they don't want around to become canaries. It's an easy way to get rid of someone undesirable and I think it was the case for Milsiril. (Pattadol even assumes her parents love her less than her sisters for sending her to join the canaries).

No wonder than that now that she's finally free from the canaries she chose to seek her own happiness away from the society she felt she could never fit into, she clearly likes to take care of children too, I think it's mean to assume she only likes them because she feels superior to them when there's no indication that this is the case.

And I don't think it's a coincidence she's so overprotective of Kabru after Utaya, it's literally the tragedy that was the breaking point for her, and he's a surviving small child from that tragedy, Milsiril cares about Kabru and wanted him to have a comfortable safe life after everything he went thru...

This ended up getting way too long so I'll make second part tomorrow about the rest of the extras and Kabru, and some other things I've seen said about Milsiril, but to answer the questions...

I don't think she treats her children as pets, Otta is just salty she was called out for dating like Leo Dicaprio.

Every single dungeon meshi character can be called morally grey because they all have flaws that in our world can be considered unforgivable, but they don't live in our world. To me Milsiril is doing her best in the context she lives in.

Who even is neurotypical in dungeon meshi, Milsiril is yet another flavour of a neurodivergent traumatized character among so many.

I believe she thought of the other canaries, especially Mithrun, as the same type of people that were cruel to her, probably because some of them really were, but that she generalized it to the point she thinks of all of them as bad by default. You can only get hurt so many times before you assume everyone will hurt you.

Part 2

#dungeon meshi #adventurers bible #this is REALLY long because I dont know how to say things #and I want people to make their own interpretations of this...#Milsiril #Ask #Long post #longpost #Part 1 of 2 #Edit: I went back and rewrote some stuff I thought were written in a confusing way #I keep repeating this in tags but I really am bad at writting I say things in a weird order using strange words sometimes #If you ever dont understand something I said please ask #dunmeshi thoughts #character ask

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raven-at-the-writing-desk · 18 days ago

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book 7 part 12 thoughts! (dec 9th update)

***THIS POST CONTAINS MASSIVE SPOILERS FOR BOOK 7 PART 12 OF THE MAIN STORY!!*** This spans part 227 to part 244, focusing on Cater and Deuce.

We will get the other 3 Heartslabyul boys in 2 future updates. The second part is Ace, then Trey. Riddle is last!

Please note: this is NOT meant to be a summary or a translation; these are only my initial thoughts on the events that roughly unfold. There may be details overlooked or misunderstood in this post, so PLEASE do not use this as a translation.

We land in what seems to be a hallway at NRC. Unfortunately for me (who seeks vengeance against a certain lion for emotional damages), Leona provides no funny reaction to the bumpy travel while dream hopping. He even makes fun of those who had a hard time, calling them weak if something like that gets to them 💀 YOU'RE ALREADY ON FUCKING THIN ICE, KINGSCHOLAR

Grim gets distracted by the smell of lunchtime so he scampers off to the cafeteria to eat! But... um!??!?! Scarabia mobs in mohawks get aggressive with us.

Before they wail on us, who should appear but the owner of the dream, Deuce!! Our guy has blonde hair (it's a Japanese trope that delinquents bleach their hair). He intimidates the mobs away with some backup from dream!Trey and dream!Cater, who still appear to maintain their vice dorm leader and "#3 in Heartslabyul" positions, respectively. Sounds like Riddle is still the dorm leader as well.

Deuce, Trey, and Cater spot Leona and kind of start picking a fight with him???? They say that if Ramshackle has been taken over/absorbed by Savanaclaw, then there will be problems (or something to that effect). (SORRY, THE DIALOGUE IS SO WEIRD AND FULL OF TERMS I DON'T UNDERSTAND CUZ EVERYONE'S SOUNDING LIKE A DELINQUENTTO SOME CAPACITY)

Cute detail: it's stated that Yuu is typically seen with Ace and Deuce! So even in the world of Deuce's dream... he still thinks about their friendship!!

Leona (and Ortho), actually Being Smart, backs off and lets Deuce take Yuu + Grim over to the Heartslabyul table to eat (even though Sebek gets mad about it). Leona tells the others it's better to observe the enemy first, then demands that Idia find a way for him to listen into the conversation Yuu + Grim are having with Heartslabyul. Luckily, Idia is able to hook them up aaaaand...

We get sort of a reinactment of that part in book 1 where Trey explains the 7 dorms at NRC to us, except this time Deuce is dropping the lore in a really bombastic way.

ALRIGHT, SO. In Deuce's dream, the 7 dorms are still the same as they are irl but each dorm sort of functions like its own... gang????? And there are daily gang wars to use the facilities at school. Certain dorms rule over certain territories, and if you want to go there or do something specific then you have to beat a member of the respective dorm in a battle. Rach dorm has a suuuuper over-embellished title... THIS FEELS LIKE SOMETHING STRAIGHT OUT OF A DELINQUENT MANGA (I also want to add that the devs chose the most unhinged expressions in each character's repertoire for the following visuals:)

Heartslabyul is centered in the library; you need to pass them to borrow books.

Savanaclaw owns the botanical garden (LOL BECAUSE LEONA'S ALWAYS FUCKING NAPPING THERE *flashbacks to the time he almost kicked our shit in for stepping on his tail*). If you want any herbs or other items from the greenhouse, you need to go through Savanaclaw.

Octavinelle is in charge of the area bordering Ramshackle, around where the Mystery Shop is. Sam has apparently signed a deal with them to have his store there. You can avoid a fight with them if you pay a "toll".

Scarabia is considered moderate compared to the other dorms, but they're serious about food, as they reign over the cafeteria, as well as places on campus that produce food/ingredients, like the windmill and chicken coops. It'll be hard for you to take the Master Chef course if you aren't comfortable with constantly pummeling Scarabia kids.

Pomefiore handles the courtyard and the potionology/alchemy labs. If you have to do a makeup lesson in that department, be prepared to contend with them.

Ignihyde students usually don't come out of their territory, which is the auditorium and infirmary. hbfbyoadfadfpfas DEUCE SPECIFICALLY MENTIONS THAT ORTHO IS A NEW MEMBER AND THAT HE'S LIKE A FIERCE GUARD DOG 😭😭😭

Finally, Diasomnia has hold of the coliseum and stables. They are considered the toughest dorm and command respect, otherwise lightning will fly.

Ramshackle is basically Switzerland (ie neutral territory); the ownership is not determined by fighting but rather is determined by the headmaster. (We got no cool visual, lol)

Leona and co. try to think about ways to wake Deuce up... Since fighting seems like an everyday thing in this dream, maybe we have no choice but to go with a physical blow...? But if fighting is so normalized, maybe that wouldn't work... Plus, there are so many faces that the darkness has taken on, so it would be hard to overpower them all. They also discuss their own impressions of Deuce (ie how he looks/tries to present as an honors student versus his efforts and suspected "bad" background). In this dream, Deuce is apparently considered a top performer based on his contributions to the uh student gang wars 💀

A Heartslabyul mob rushes in and reports to Riddle that Octavinelle students are invading the library. Riddle sends Adeuce to clean up and they have this really shounen manga-esque battle where the Octa mobs call Ace and Deuce by long nicknames and Deuce even lets out an ORAORAORAORAOROARAOROAROA!!

A bunch of books are chucked around in the ensuing battle, which causes Sebek to literally FALL TO HIS KNEES and check on them. He laments that they've been damaged and is very upset by this. However, Sebek becomes truly ENRAGED when he actually opens a book and notices its contents are faulty. Like the spelling is screwed up, the pages are blank, or the writing that's there is hard to read. Sebek concludes that the contents of the books are fucked because the dreamer, Deuce, has not read these materials himself to understand them. AND DEUCE DARES TO CALL HIMSELF AN ASPIRING HONORS STUDENT???! SEBEK WON'T STAND FOR IT!!

... This fucking green haired fool shouts at Deuce and provokes a fight by shaming him 🤡 LMAO, Sebek calls the books just papers bound by a cover, IT CANNOT BE CALLED A BOOK!! He tells Adeuce to READ the damn books and then hit each other with the knowledge they gain from reading... OKAY NERD

They open up a book that should list the rules of the Queen of Hearts, but because so much of the book is blank, only like a handful of rules are written down. Deuce says that's not correct, there are WAY more rules--in fact, 810 of them! This starts to wake him up, but dream!Ace becomes darkness and tries to convince Deuce that, at NRC, only strength matters so he doesn't need to study to get to be an "honors student".

HJBAHJBAFSBHDSAHBAS HLAFHL DEUCE STARTS HAVING FLASHBACKS TO ALL THE TIMES ACE FUCKING BULLIED HIM AND DEUCE LEGITIMATELY GETS SO MAD HE FULLY WAKES UP

Wait, this is so sweet 😭😭😭 The image that Deuce has in his mind right before he wakes is his and Ace's reunion with Yuu and Grim at the end of book 6...

Deuce joins us to beat back dream!Ace. Of course Ace isn't this one, the real Ace is way more insensitive and annoying!!

Deuce starts to sort of talk down to himself. He says if his dream turned out like this, then there must have always been a part of him that "wants" to solve everything with his fists. Ortho comforts Deuce by saying that though Malleus's dream is created based on a person's desires, the output can be highly variable depending on the individual.

Sebek starts scolding Deuce again for not reading books in their entirety, and they discover one book that seems to have more information than the others. "The Story of the Trump Soldier" is a famous children's book in the Queendom of Roses, containing short stories about the Trump Card soldiers that serve the Queen of Hearts. Deuce says that he has always admired those soldiers and how cool they are, especially when they chase lawbreakers through the rose maze!

AWWWWW Deuce would beg his mom to read this book to him when he was little.. and when he finally learned how to read himself, he'd read and reread the book from front to cover. WDBHLYOIDFFIADIADF WAIT WHY IS THIS ACTUALLY SO CUTE... OTL

Deuce wants to continue reading where he left off and Sebek says the ideal way to read is in quiet so you can focus on the words. ASBHBLSAIHIDBASSD THEY CRACK A JOKE ABOUT HOW SEBEK ONLY EVER SHUTS UP WHEN HE'S READING...

Sebek seems to demonstrate genuine interest in what Deuce reads. I half anticipated him to follow up with an insult, but Sebek is actually very mindful about different reading levels. He even makes a comment that a simple children's book such as this is able to be the start of someone's love for literature, that it can still have the power to move someone as it does Deuce. That's honestly really powerful.

They then get into a conversation about picking books for each other; Sebek suggests that Deuce pick out an easy book for Yuu and Grim to read sometime. We also learn that Sebek would do this for Silver, but that Silver would get sleepy and never fully finish Sebek's recommendations. Deuce has this nice line where he goes "Even if these books are empty now, someday they will be filled", expressing his desire to become that honors student ideal for real and not just superficially.

Guys, I'm glad you like reading (I like reading too) but now is REALLY not the time for it... 🤡 The moment's cute and all (and it definitely feeds into Sebek's character arc about opening up to non-fae), yet it still feels weirdly placed to have so much casual banter when everyone knows what's at stake.

aiuaidbadab Sebek says that he will check out "The Story of the Trump Soldier" when he's out of the dream world... which is so sweet, right up until he transitions into mocking people who don't understand the emotional value of books. Silver apologizes to Deuce for Sebek's attitude and they prepare to hop into the next dream.

But wait! Where's Leona...?

... BRO WAS NAPPING ON SOME LIBRARY CHAIRS WHILE EVERYONE ELSE WAS TALKING ABOUT THE JOYS OF LITERATURE 🤡 ASJVUFEOVEOQIVib;WBIEQTOIPfwpib He finally wakes up with a stupid hot yawn and asks if they're done with their errands.

Okay, NOW we're ready for the next dream. Off we go!

We land in front of Heartslabyul dorm.

OH LORD Grim's gonna be fried up and eaten, I swear... Leona gets mad at him for clinging to his necklace while they fall out of the sky. Grim claims he didn't notice it was Leona because his hair was all over the place (Grim just grabbed what was close to him), and that leads to Leona filing a complaint to the manager (Idia). "Oi, daikon radish sprout! Make travel more convenient for me." Idia refuses, claiming he's too busy and that since travel only takes a moment, Leona can suck it up. He also has the BALLS to say Leona shouldn't pull a selfish second prince move ,adbilbiodsbiasdi AND THEN LEONA GOES HE HAS SOME CHOICE WORDS FOR HIM NEXT TIME THEY MEET FACE TO FACE, YANNO?????? Omg guys... the girlies are FIGHTING...

On the other hand, Deuce LOVED dream hopping. The wind in his face is even better than what he experiences when he rides a magical wheel. Even if he can't control where he's going while falling, he really liked the rush.

Up comes dream!Ace. He asks if Leona's over for tea or something, which makes me laugh a little because even though Leona knows how to act all proper, he LOATHES actually doing it. Anyway, Ace says that there was a Magicam notif about an urgent matter, so they're going to hold a trial. Deuce is confused that such an important announcement would be made via social media, then tells Ace off for not being in dorm uniform for the trial. Deuce also says that students from other dorms are NOT allowed to be present for trials since they're one of Heartslabyul's most sacred traditions. Riddle would behead you so fast! ... Which confuses Ace. SO YEAH FELLAS, I THINK DORM LEADER!CATER IS CONFIRMED...

Ace leaves for the trial, with Deuce chasing after him. The rest of us decide to go after them, since all the Heartslabyul students would be gathered at the trial and it will be easier to determine who the dreamer is.

But up comes... Deuce?! This must be the dream! or NPC Deuce. So we decide to deal with him early and get him out of the picture. He doesn't revert to darkness at any point, so we speculate that this is because we haven't run into the dreamer yet, or maybe because the darkness has yet to register us as a threat to the dream's stability. In any case, we tie up dream!Deuce so he doesn't interfere!

To the courtroom we go! I think it's the first time we've seen this asset...?

It's very lively inside, some students aren't in dorm uniform though.

OH MY GOOOOOD dream!Riddle is a regular ol' student now. Interestingly, he's got a little red heart as his card suit. It's a similar color and placement to Cater's diamond mark, but he shares the same suit as Ace. sdhlbabiyfaio AND HE'S NOT WARING HIS DORM UNIFORM, HE'S BREAKING A DARN RULE HIMSELF

(Trey is still vice dorm leader!)

The courtroom doors open and someone zooms in on a skateboard! It's Cater, the Heartslabyul dorm leader and our resident dreamer.

He is surprised to see students from other dorms present, especially Leona. ADBKHLADBILADBSI LEOAN LIES HIS ASS OFF ANS CLAIMS DEUCE INVITED HIM TO TEA AND CATER BELIEVES HIM

Cater takes a selfie with Leona and posts it on Magicam. Dream!Riddle interrupts to let him know the trial is starting 15 minutes late, so Cater apologizes and says they should begin for reals.

Leona and Idia have a brief exchange about dorm leadership. Most students probably want to be dorm leader more than not being dorm leader. They each express their own opinions about their title; Idia doesn't want to live under someone who is incompetent (he thinks highly of his own skills) and Leona just hates the idea of following someone else's lead. Spoken like the duo who don't have vice dorm leaders, eh...

Uuuuh so it looks like the trial is for a mob student that was too afraid of Cater to invite him to a croquet game. Cater decides to skip to the part where he gets mad and commands Riddle to behead the mob. Sebek complains about the lack of actual deliberation, but Cater dismisses it. All that he needs to render a judgment is his anger, right?

Mmm, that's interesting. Cater's being just as strict as Riddle is irl and continues to use Riddle's power as a means to punish others. His reputation is also just as scary as Riddle's is in book 1, and Cater mainly seems to be using his emotions to judge others. So in one way, yeah, Cater is laxer with the rules (he allows other students to join trials, lets people wear the wrong uniforms for important ceremonies, makes announcements via Magicam, etc.) but is still a force to be reckoned with.

Dream!Trey suggests hearing some witness testimony since there are special guests in the audience today. They have Deuce bring up witnesses, so Deuce picks Yuu and Grim. On the stand, we claim we don't know anything and the jury records our statement using their smartphones.

abhldbilasiyasoyfe THSI IS SO DUMB THAT LEONA GAVE UP TRIYNG TO UDNERSTAND THE SITUATION AND PROCEEDS TO NAP 💀

Deuce drags the still sleeping Leona up to testify. Despite being handled so roughly, he doesn't wake up one bit!! Leona mumbles something in his sleep, it's an order to Ruggie about how he wants a deluxe menchi katsu sandwich at noon. Cater announces that this is SUPER important testimony so the mobs hurry to write it down.

Last up is Silver! He's the only one that takes being questioned seriously and answers with sincerity. He is asked where he was and what he was doing at the time the grave offense was committed. Silver says probably enjoying tea in the dorm. Dream!Riddle asks why, is it his unbirthday? To which Silver says his birthday (May 15) is a little further away.

This makes dream!Trey realize it's an unbirthday, so Cater announces they MUST have a party! And... BOOM, the background goes dark with tons of neon light fixtures! Cater demands food (which I guess is the context for his new SSR's initial artwork) and has dream!Riddle DJ FOR HIM??????!?!??!?!???????? 😭OKAY, I did NOT want to side with Kingscholar but I'm afraid I have to this time... This has got to be the most nonsensical dream so far, which I guess is fitting seeing the source material www

Deuce wonders if Cater is dissatisfied with Heartslabyul irl, because the Heartslabyul in the dream seems so different. Leona drops it on us that this is actually the Heartslabyul of the PAST, when the previous dorm leader was in power. Deuce would not know about it because he's a first-year student.

BEFORE ANYONE SAYS "Omg, Cater former dorm leader theory real!!!", the game does NOT confirm this. Leona speaks about the previous dorm leader as if it was another student. He never once names Cater. (Oh, and we learn that Leona challenged his dorm leader for the seat when he was a second-year student.)

Deuce reflects and realizes he never really knew anything about the third years because he never bothered reaching out to them. YES, HERE'S A POWER OF FRIENDSHIP AFTER SCHOOL SPECIAL LESSON OTL He also thinks back to book 1 and how not enough strictness (like what they are seeing now) is its own vice, like how too much strictness can also be trouble.

asfuiadofadaefi WHAT THE FUCK

Leona proposes the idea that Trey and Cater are both "using" Riddle. He compares the scenario to how people will bring up a young leader, Riddle, as a pawn in order to overthrow the previous regime (ie the lawless Heartslabyul). Then Trey and Cater become advisors to the new ruler, manipulating him in order to create the kind of country THEY want. It's a tale as old as time. anfbiyoaafiyodgovyqefoiy I HATE HOW MUCH OF A BIG BRAIN MOVE THAT IS...AND OF COURSE FUCKIGN L*ONA OF ALL PEOPLE SAYS IT

The dream!Heartslabyul boys encourage us to eat and drink. Most of us are force fed or pressured into taking a bite/sip, but Leona won’t fall for it. Cater tries to get him to drink mysterious juice from a bottle (does Leona wanna be beheaded?), but bro’s not having it.

Ortho (the one guy who cannot eat) interrupts and reminds everyone that the darkness is trying to lull them back to sleep. We then get the reveal that Trey, Riddle, AND Cater are the darkness, meaning that this Cater is a clone and the real Cater is elsewhere.

Battle time~

Aaaah so Ortho couldn’t identify Cater as a clone because apparently it takes a really strong imagination to make convincing copies??? That, and he comments that Cater sees himself an objective way?? Something, something, because this is a dream, it is hard for Ortho to determine what the true composition of something is.

LOL???? The real Cater barges in, he saw the other Cater’s Magicam post about Leona coming over for tea and got excited about it??? He sees the black sludge everywhere and is sooo confused… It’s literally the meme of the guy walking in with pizza boxes only to find the room on fire 😭

Dream!Riddle is on a rampage and beheading everyone, and THAT triggers Cater to wake up. His own dream fucked up THAT hard.

Deuce is about to be collared but Cater uses Split Card to make a bunch of clones that catch the strays of Riddle’s UM and protect Deuce. This must be the context for his new SSR's groovy!

He and some new clones join us to beat up the darkness! As they’re melting away, dream!Trey and Riddle call out to Cater AND CATER SAYS THEY’RE DISGUSTING, THE REAL TREY AnD rIDDLE QoULD NEEEEVERRR… “Could you please disappear? Bye bye ⭐️”

OH MY GOD 😭 Cater Diamond is not beating the bi allegations… First it was him excitedly running into the courtroom when he saw that LEONA was there, now he’s all like “It’s thrilling to be woken up by the prince”. I THINK WE ALL KNOW WHO THE REAL LIONKISSER IS HERE FOLKS.

zbsnsbiska Cater compliments Idia’s video an says it’s sooo cute 😂 but Idia is not thrilled with that comment.

Cater says that he’s not unhappy with Heartslabyul irl (Deuce’s misunderstanding, ig??). He actually likes the dorm the way it currently is. So I guess Leona's theory about Cater trying to revolutionize Heartslabyul wasn't true after all?? ADFHJAFBUASDUO CATER ROASTS LEONA BY SAYING HE'S NOT THE TYPE TO BE SAYING THAT BECAUSE WASN'T LEONA TRYING TO DO THIS SHIT IN BOOK 2.

ADBILABIYOAOYOIB CATER MOM MODE?????? He scolds Leona and says the Heartslabyul underclassmen are cute because they're stupid and easy to deceive, he doesn't want them to become twisted and gross because of Leona's' poor guidance. THEN CATER CLAIMS HE HIMSELF IS A KIND RELIABLE AND COOL UPPERCLASSMAN THAT WOULD NEVER EVER TAKE ADVANTAGE OF DEUCE... Is this the same guy who fucking tricked us into painting the roses red for him??? THAT Cater??? *stares at him* Leona says no way will Deuce buy that bullshit BUT DEUCE DOES INDEED BUY CATER'S BULLSHIT OTL YOU POOR SWEET SUMMER CHILD...

ADFBHUFSYUOFSOYFEO CATER CALLS SEBEK "SEBEK-CHAN"... This throws him off, because "Sebek-chan" is something his older sister calls him, but when Cater says it, it sends a shiver down his spine!

The group agrees to head to Ace's dream next. Before they depart, Cater seizes this opportunity to take a group selfie~! aberiylaiyladasd Cater wanted to take a pic of his dorm leader outfit as a souvenir, but then he says he also wants to take tons of pics of Leona-kun! (Leona says this feels like harassment adshasd) adshuvoayafeyovifpbiVIYFWPF CATER DIAMOND YOU WON'T FOOL KME, I KNIOW A LIONKISSER EHWN I SEE ONE.

Aaaand we set off to the next leg of our journey! That's it for this update.

Man. I did NOT expect a Deuce and Cater-centric update to be THIS bulky but here we are, I guess 💀

The highlight of Deuce's dream was definitely the part at the end where he shares his favorite book with Sebek. Now, I still got HUGE gripes with the pacing and how the characters continue to waste valuable time chit chatting and hanging around but that aside, I really liked what this moment did for both Deuce and Sebek's characters. We get confirmation that Deuce truly does want to work and study hard to be an honors student--and as for Sebek, we get to see him actually opening up and sharing something he genuinely loves with others. You can tell just how much he values reading; he doesn't dismiss Deuce for reading an "easy" book and sees actual value in it being a jumping point for others to get into other books. He is constantly sharing books he loves with his friend Silver and encourages Deuce to do the same for Yuu and Grim. AND THIS IS FURTHER PROOF THAT SEBEK IS THE BEST B--*is bricked into silence*

Anyway, I'm glad they didn't stop Sebek's character development in Lilia's dream. I'm definitely now getting the sense that Lilia's dream was just the initial "rude awakening" for him when he's confronted with a dose of his own racism thrown back at him. He's not used to his loving grandfather being so vitriolic to him on the basis of his race. And now in more recent updates Sebek is being exposed to the good side of students from other dorms (such as Jack), as well as connecting with them via shared interests (like he is now with Deuce). It's so adorable how Sebek promises he will check out the book Deuce loves so much once he returns to the real world, AHAHHHHHHH H HHHH H H H H H HH H H H H H H H OTL SEBEK-CHAN LEMME SQUISH YOUR CHEEKS MYR PRECIOUS BABY BOI

Something else I appreciated about Deuce's dream is how his friendship with Ace, Yuu, and Grim is made relevant. When he first runs into Yuu and co., he worries that Ramshackle has been absorbed by Savanaclaw and doesn't want to fight his friends. Then when things are cleared up, Deuce still invites Yuu and Grim to come eat with Heartslabyul. He and Ace fight together very well in his own dream--so well, in fact, that it reminds me a lot of how Silver and Sebek are perfectly coordinated with one another when they fought the flowers in GloMasq. It's Deuce's own (loving) anger towards the real Ace that ultimately wakes him up. And you can tell that Deuce places value in his relationship with Ace, Yuu, and Grim by how he acts. AND THEN WHEN HE WAKES UP HE'S THINKING OF THAT TIME WHEN ALL OF US REUNITED... HOW IS THAT NOT SUPPOSED TO MAKE ME TEAR UP A LITTLE...

I thought I wouldn't enjoy Cater's dream, but I actually found it to be very fun! I loved how silly and nonsensical it was; it really tickled my Alice in Wonderland-loving bone. asdvhdvsoidsa I'M SHOCKED AT HOW MUCH WEIRDLY PLACED L*ONA CONTENT THERE WAS IN ACATER'S DREAM OTL I expected him falling asleep to be a gag at some point, and I was right (it happens in both Deuce and Cater's), BUT I WAS NOT EXPECTING CATER TO BE SUCH A LION SIMP, NOR WAS I EXPECTING L*ONA TO MAKE THAT REALLY SMART ANALOGY ABOUT A POTENTIAL HEARTSLABYUL REVOLUTION... **slams an angry fist on the ground** LITERALLY SHAKING SOBBING THROWING UP OVER HERE 🤡

The twist with the real Cater being somewhere else was really interesting, but it's a shame we never got to go deeper with this idea or get exposure to the "real" personality of his. I think there was another missed opportunity (although this would still prolong the pacing problems, lol) with dream!Deuce being taken out so early. I thought for sure that dream!Deuce would escape his binds and interrupt the trial, and then that would lead into a whole Ace Attorney style segment where they try to deduce which Deuce is "real". It would parallel how Cater's UM allows him to make clones, as well as how Cater keeps putting on an act and not showing his true self to others. At the climax of the trial, the OG Cater could make his grand appearance and the rest of his dream could still proceed like the version we really got. I DON'T KNOW, I THINK IT WOULD HAVE BEEN COOL TO SEE... (<- totally biased Ace Attorney fan)

That being said, Cater's dream felt... more geared toward comedy than being serious? And it's not like we haven't had dreams like that before, but it feels especially hollow because we've been waiting SO LONG for him to get more depth, be if exploring his dark side or explaining more of his general inner thoughts. It sucks we didn't get any of that.

Cater's not a character I care for a ton, but I think I saw a side of him today that's pretty funny! He was delivering banger roast after banger roast, especially when he called out Leona for trying to overthrow another regime while accusing him of doing the same. dbiabsiofobiapb Also love that we get a reminder of how underhanded Cater is (something I felt we didn't see outside of book 1 when he tricked Adeuce into doing his chores for him). He fr abuses his status as a "trustworthy" senior and accuses LEONA of corrupting the kids to gain Deuce's support 💀 That scene was so funny, it had me in stitches!

With every new dream, I think I become more and more confused about how these things even work. It feels like they offer a completely contradictory explanation or a new detail to overcomplicate the situation every update, and now I have like NO understanding of anything. What confuses me the most about this update is how BOTH Deuce and Cater claim what we saw in their dreams does not reflect what they actually want. Like... Isn't Deuce ASHAMED of his delinquent era? Doesn't he NOT want to go back to that? Isn't he trying hard to study and to be an honors student irl? That's the opposite of what the dream shows. Yeah, it would be more convenient for Deuce to understand and succeed if everything were decided with strength instead of smarts, but this is still actively NOT what he would want, especially given all the time and effort he sunk into reforming himself. Cater also very explicitly states the has ZERO interest in being dorm leader, so why is it that his dream manifested this way??? I suppose you could say he's lying (because he very much is a liar) and is hiding his true desires?? BUT EVEN THEN THIS DOESN'T MAKE TOTAL SENSE BECAUSE HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN DEUCE OVER THERE??????

So how are these supposed to be their "happiest" dreams????? THIS MAKES NO SENSE and all I'm getting from this (until the writing clarifies) is that the devs didn't actually make the dreams "happy", it's partly this way because they just wanted a convenient excuse to write scenarios that would be interesting for the players to see, such as Leona being king or delinquent Deuce or Savanaclaw Rook or whatever OTL I'm hoping this gets properly explained by the end instead of continuing to flounder and leaving the fans to come up with all the answers for themselves... (I also pray for us to stop wasting time doing nothing while the world is about to end, but given that this is an Important Part of the Pattern, I'm guessing there is no chance this is happening. A BIRD CAN ONLY DREAM.)

Alright, that's all from me. See you next main story update for Ace and Trey's dreams...!

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