#Jughead isn't ace in this

[navree]

ngl, i liked the comics canon of jughead being asexual but when it comes to riverdale, i vastly prefer him and veronica being together. besides, their fanfics are 👌🔥💯👀

As a writer of some Jeronica fics back in the day, so true

Honestly they could have kept Jughead being ace while still allowing him to have romantic relationships, just have him not having sex, but how can you make a show if guy not shirtless I guess. And there's no way a CW show would have ever allowed the more comics accurate aroace Jughead characterization, not when CW shows live and die according to shipping.

[atalana]

if you're also interested in comics, legally obligated to give a shoutout to the 2015 jughead series for being the first aroace representation i ever encountered

(him being uninterested in romance had been a running bit in the archie comics since like the 80s, but that series made it explicitly and wonderfully canon with several storylines dedicated to it and a writer who's not afraid to joke about it)

Do you have any book (or show or movie) recs with asexual men? I feel like all the books with asexual characters I’ve read feature asexual women but no asexual men. Fiction or nonfiction is good. TIA!

ooo this is a great ask!! women are definitely more likely to be the ace rep in the books I have read!!

first off, How to Be a Normal Person by TJ Klune is fantastic. the love interest is a man and asexual. it's a mlm adult romance novel, very low stakes and I totally cried. I haven't read the sequel, but the main character is demisexual in that one and a man. bonus, TJ Klune is asexual himself and (if I recall correctly) The Lighting Struck Heart has a prominent asexual side character.

Ace by Angela Chen is a nonfiction book and she interviews many people throughout her books, and I distinctly remember her interviewing men, specifically talking to one about how his gender intersected with his asexuality.

I never finished Tarnished Are the Stars by Rosiee Thor, but one of the three main characters was an aro ace teen boy. This is a scifi, set in space, YA novel.

Radio Silence by Alice Oseman has a major character who is a demisexual teen boy. It's YA contemporary. I also cried reading this.

Rick by Alex Gino is a middle grade novel about a middle school boy questioning his place in the queer community. Very sweet.

That Kind of Guy by Talia Hibbert is a contemporary romance and one of the main characters is a demisexual man falling in love with his best friend (who is a fantasy author). This was unexpected for me because I picked this up for the author, not the demi rep so I was over the moon.

side note, for tv shows, I've only watched Todd's ace clips, but there is a male character who realizes he is ace.

The podcasts A-OK and Sounds Fake but Okay both have interviews with ace men, so if you like podcasts, I would check those out as well.

[it-is-only-a-novel]

Aspec symbols

So I've been trying to gather a list of aspec symbols! Old and new, widely accepted, but also more obscure. Here's my list so far, including links and explanations (in italics) where possible. I've tried also to add in the specific labels that the symbols "belong to" where relevant/possible.

Arospec:

the color green (and anything green)

white aro ring which is worn on the middle finger of the left hand link

aro flag

archery (bow & arrow)

arrows of any type

frogs they are green (this is a more general queer symbol as well) link & link

yellow roses (& yellow flowers in general, seems to be more for alloplatonic aros, since yellow represents platonic love) link

sunflowers (aroallos) aroallo flag colors link

aardvarks link

anglerfish link

manticores link

rats link

nandays and caiques link

griffins link

phoenixs link

anatomical hearts distancing ourselves from the regular outlook on love, and/or love in general may be more for loveless and/or heartless aros

<2 link

succulents green

cacti green & many do not want romantic partners and can be seen as prickly, or want to be prickly

plants in general green!!

"no romo"

hummingbirds (aroallos) link

pineapples (aroallos) link

pizza & ice cream link

kiwis link

the emojis:🫀, 🏹, ↖️, ↗️, 🌻, 💚,🍍, 🍏, 💘 explanations: link

paper crowns references jughead jones from the archie comics link

Acespec:

dragons link

cake cake is better than sex link

garlic bread

the color purple

black ace ring which is worn on the middle finger of the right hand link

ace flag

space

pirates "Ace pirates aren’t interested in your booty" link

wolves

ghosts (demisexuals) link

axolotls

denim vests

cryptids

AVEN triangle

ace cards suits: spades-aroaces, Hearts-Alloromantics, Diamonds-deamisexuals, Clubs-grey-asexuls link

the emojis: 💜, ♠️

some of these are based off this post, and this master post

Aplspec:

the colors blue & yellow in the apl flag

apples (green apples can be geared toward apls that are also aros)

blue heart 💙

bees

iridescence

apl flag

blue roses link

Blue apl ring on the thumb link

based off of this post, explanations are there.

Aspec:

aliens & robots reclaiming stereotypes about dehumanization link

Artemis goddess in Greek mythology focused on her passion for hunting. Represents finding fulfilment in other aspects of life not only sex, romance, friendship, love, and so on. Also used a bow & arrow link and also my own interpretation from reading about her

Many thanks to @merely-a-caricature, @the-big-gayheart, @heartless-aro, @arosunflower, @saffigon, @crab-in-progress, @aroace-thoughts, @apl-aro-narc, @entropy-sea-system, @dateademisexualpersonwho, @legally-x, @askanaroace, @aroace-people-are-lgtbq, @the-amber-droid-dreams, @foolishfynnesse and @itsnotasecret20 I used their posts/reblogs/comments to compile many of these symbols (and I've linked the posts). If I've missed someone, I apologize, it isn't intentional!

Last edit: 23/2/2024

I also want to add, that this post doesn't include all aspec identities, such as agender, afamilial, asensual, and more. They are important parts of the community, but I'm only informed on some, so couldn't include them.

[disastergay]

why do people write smut of asexual characters?

"isn't the whole point of being ace that they don't want to fuck?"

They're fictional characters

It's not and never will be canon

Some people are actually shitty and don't believe in asexuality, which is fucked up of them and they should be told off for it

They're fictional characters

Not every ace is sex-repulsed/averse and some are in fact sex-favorable, please don't erase those of us that do have sex

Still others have high libidos despite a lack of sexual attraction

Some aces do experience sexual attraction and feel comfortable acting on it

They are, and I cannot stress this enough, fictional characters, and besides, no fanfiction will ever influence the future of the work's canon because there are literal laws and regulations in place to stop that from happening

say it with me: attraction =/= action. attraction does not equal action.

it's 100% okay to feel frustrated when you see people drawing lewd art and writing smutty fanfiction about your favorite asexual characters. a lot of the people doing that aren't even ace themselves, and plenty of them deserve a side eye. I'm right there with you on that. but PLEASE stop perpetuating the myth that the only reason someone would ever write/draw smut of ace characters is because they're allosexual and acephobic.

I'm not trying to hurt those of you who are sex repulsed by writing about sex between two fictional characters (which I'm told I do so in the most asexual way possible, I might add).

the ace corners of fandoms have always been hostile towards aces who experience sexual attraction and/or are interested in having sex. this is unfair.

fandom at large has always been guilty of erasing ace representation (see the jughead debacle), ESPECIALLY sex repulsed aces who never feel any sexual attraction whatsoever. often times fans will hide behind sex favorable aces and grey asexuals' existence to justify their erasure of canon sex repulsed ace characters. this is also unfair.

both of these things can be true and equally important. stop with the infighting so we can start setting a better example for how to treat both canon and fanon aspec rep in the future.

this has been a PSA.

[taliesin-the-bored]

Arthurian characters I interpret as acespec:

Galahad, the Grail Heroine, and Bors: They generally have no apparent trouble or qualms with the eternal chastity thing (except Bors when he gets cursed, but he gets cursed).

Brangaine: In La Tavola Ritonda, she tells Gouvernail that she never wants to have sexual relationships, and in a text I haven't yet read or been able to identify, she apparently stops Kahedin from sleeping with her by using a magic pillow to make him fall asleep, a role which is Camille's in Kaherdin and Camille.

Dinadan: In LTR, they call him the Wise Man Who Does Not Love, and while he has a romantic interest in LTR, their relationship isn't sexual. To the best of my knowledge, he has no other romantic interest and no sexual relationship in all of medlit and pretty much always scorns both concepts. Usually aro, demiromantic in one text, and always ace.

Lucan: It's not anything he says or does, but unless you count the actions of Lucano the evil half-giant half-lion in LTR, he doesn't have any romantic and/or sexual relationships in any medlit I know of. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, but in my mind, he's on the aro and ace spectrums.

Happy Ace Week to all who celebrate!

Edit: I had somehow left out Dinadan, who I originally meant to include a picture of. I guess you could say he's implicit. Truly one of the aroace icons of all time. He ran so Jughead could also run.

[rythmicjea]

I REALLY need people to stop pushing this narrative. Because it's just plain wrong. Tell me you never read Archie comics before Riverdale without telling me. Jughead was asexual (Not AroAce) in one comic line. A short lived one at that. They also play his aceness as a joke too.

Canonically, for the past 80 years, Jughead has always been Allo and been romantically involved with several girls. He married Ethel in one iteration and Midge in another. Fuck, if you think they pulled Jeronica out of thin air in S7 you definitely haven't read the comics. He dates Veronica several times in the comics and there are hundreds of panels of him being attracted to her (don't believe me? I rbed a comic from 1952 where he basically manipulated Archie and Reggie so Veronica could be his date to a dance). He doesn't even date Betty until the 21st century.

The reason why people are so quick to call him ace is because they literally ignore every time he says he doesn't want to date someone is because he doesn't want a relationship built on drama. Archie craves two girls after him at the same time. He's girl crazy! And that's from his very first appearance. Jughead has always loved deeply and completely. At most he's Demisexual. So to call him Aromantic is just insulting.

Jughead in the comics is a pretty complex character who gets relegated to "comic relief" because he "wears a funny hat". He was anti-establishment from the beginning. He is completely devoted to Jellybean too (which, because BH fans were so insane, didn't get explored along with other team-ups). There's a comic that shows how connected they are. When she cries, he cries; when she's hungry, he's hungry; when she laughs, he laughs; when she's sleepy so is he. He routinely climbs into her crib to cuddle with her because he's her favorite person (in the comics he's 16/17 and she's no more than 18mo old).

Jughead is not and has never been "AroAce". STOP pushing this narrative because there's literally eighty years of history that contradicts you!

I was rewatching Riverdale (you don’t have to tell me how bad it is, I already know) and I always get so pissed because of how CW totally rewrote key aspects of Jughead’s character, my boy is canonly aroace and CW straight up just decided that that didn’t mean anything all because they wanted to have this weird love triangle thing going on. And if you wanna be all like “well they took creative liberties to push the plot of the show forward” they could’ve kept it true to his character and still have ways to push the plot forward, to me it just seems like it was lazy writing on their part.

if you ship Jughead with anyone, no hate to you, but I just think that it’s totally unfair for them to change his storyline/character so drastically, especially since there’s like basically no aroace characters/representation in pop culture.

[lontra23]

List/ Collage with A-Spec Characters: canon confirmed, and popular headcanons

Colours:

Canon confirmed: blue

popular headcanon/ speculation: orange

Alastor, Hazbin Hotel: ace, aro

Senku Ishigami, Dr. Stone: ace, aro

Vi Moradi, Star Wars: ace, aro

Victor Vale, Vicious: ace, biromantic

Spongebob: ace

Kirby: ace, aro, non-binary

the Knight, Hollow Knight: agender, ace, aro

Todd Chavez, BoJack Horseman: ace

Georgia Warr, Loveless: ace, aro, aego?

Jughead Jones, Archie: ace

Doomguy/ Dooomslayer: ace

Seiji Maki, Bloom into you: ace, aro, aegoromantic?

Monkey D. Luffy, One Piece: ace, aro

Connor Hawke, DC Comics: ace, alloromantic

Perry the platypus: ace, aro

Kusuo Saiki, Disastrous life of Saiki K.: ace, aro

Yelena Belova, Marvel: ace, aro

Izaya Orihara, Durara: ace, aro

Daryl Dixon, the Walking Dead: ace

Keyleth, Critical Role: demisexual

Neil Josten, Foxhole Court: demisexual, demiromantic

Isaac Henderson, Heartstopper: ace, aro

Vernestra Rwoh, Star Wars: ace, aro

Light Yagami, Death Note: ace, aro

Caduceus Clay, Critical Role: ace, aro

Murderbot, Murderbot Diaries: ace, aro, genderless

Jonathan "Jon" Simms, Magnus Archives: ace, biromantic

Shouto Todoroki, Boku no Hero Academia: ace, aro

Lilith Clawthorne, Owl House: ace, aro

Bill Cypher, Gravity Falls: ace, aro, agender

Ezperanza "Spooner" Cruz, Legends of Tomorrow: ace

Nadia Van Dyne/ the Wasp, Marvel: ace, aro, quoiromantic

Peridot, Stephen Universe: ace, aro

Gwenpool, Marvel: ace, aro

Frieren: a-spec, ace, aro

Joffrey Baratheon, Game of Thrones: ace, aro

Sherlock Holmes, Arthur Conan Doyle: ace, aro

Lord Varys, Game of Thrones: ace, aro

Reyna Avila Ramirez-Arellano, Percy Jackson: ace, aro

Son Goku, Dragonball: ace

10th Doctor, Doctor Who (David Tennant): ace, panromantic

11th Doctor, Doctor Who (Matt Smith): ace

Sakuko Kodama, Koisenu Futari: ace, aro

Satoru Takahashi, Koisenu Futari: ace, aro

Felicity Montague, Lady's guide to petticoats and piracy: ace, aro

Jasnah Kholin, Stormlight Archive: ace, heteroromantic

Loth, Priory of the Orange Tree: grey-ace

Tané, Priory of the Orange Tree: ace, aro

Adèle, Baker Thief: demisexual, bi

Claire/ Claude, Baker Thief: aro (aroallo!), genderfluid

Sandry, Circle of Magic: ace

Ling Chan, the Diviners: ace, lesbian

Nancy Whitman, Every Heart a Doorway: ace, alloromantic

Kel, Protector of the Small: ace, aro

Natalie, Natural History of Dragons: ace, aro

Raphael Santiago, Shadowhunters: Cassandra Clare: ace, aro (In the show only ace)

Please note that I took most of my information from online, and I didn't personally read/ watch everything, so there may be some mistakes. Also, some of the not-canon characters are very likely aspec, but just not confirmed. And especially if they say/ do really obviously aro/ ace stuff, I wasn't sure if it's enough to put them in the "confirmed" category. (e.g. Saiki literally said he isn't attracted to anyone regardless of gender, and never wants to be in a relationship. But there are still people who doubt his aroace-ness. (And at this point I don't see how it could be anything but aphobia, to deny the mere possibility of him being aroace so vehemently lol.) ) Also: Sadly, I couldn't find good aro-allo characters except Claire/ Claude from "baker thief". There is tons of good a-spec representation in that book (also more side characters that I didn't mention here), but I couldn't really find any fan-art. So then I just slapped the entire book cover on the collage.

[roseredsnow]

I've said this so often but saying it again and please reblog.

"But people headcannon straight people as lgbt+ without a problem, why is it an issue for aroaces"

Is such a bullshit argument.

Cause what character is actually confirmed straight? Genuinely name me one, not assumed because it's still the default, or because they like someone of a different gender.

But writers or an actor or said in the media and never retconned, confirmed straight.

That's the difference.

(Fuck Marvel for supporting genocide and I don't even ship it but the most common example)

Shipping Bucky and Steve doesn't erase anything because neither character is confirmed straight.

Shipping Yelena and Bucky or Kate blatantly ignores Devin Grayson (Also fuck her for how bad she screwed nightwing) confirming she's ace and clearly implying she's aro just didn't realise it needed to be specified too.

It ignores the line in Pale Little Spider #2 "I'm not a lesbian, Im not anything" and the entire trio of those comics where Yelena is baffled about the idea of sexual attraction.

(And don't you dare tell me that's out of context I've read it multiple times I know the context).

It also ignores other aroace characters that have had their identity erased for the sake of plot. Jughead Jones and Shatterstar to name two, I've even seen a fic shipping the High Republics beloved Vernestra Rwoh and while I don't believe her identity will be erased in Acolyte (cause HR fans will riot) it's still a major concern new fans will.

However shipping Vernestra is not comparable to shipping say Reath and Bell because neither character is confirmed straight.

This isn't even touching on the fact (cis) straight people don't experience discrimination for being queer (both from queer and non queer people) and have already got tons of rep to see themselves in.

[forgottenspring]

Mild rant on Alastor bc I'm tired.

*takes deep breath*

I was going to stay out of this so rip to my inbox.

Does anybody remember the whole ace doxing list on here? The whole discussion of not shipping gay characters with the opposite gender? The rep for pan/bi representation and the steps to do it right? Does anybody remember when ppl on here discussed how aros and aces aren't a part of the queer community bc they're not 'gay enough' in a way? Bc I do. That was about a decade ago. And I remember when Alastor was first introduced in the pilot and ppl not accepting he was aroace back then.

It doesn't matter if Alastor is entirely aroace and if he's capable of dating or not.

What matters is we still have so little ace representation and acceptance, especially aroace rep, that a few years ago when a real person Jaiden Animations came out as aroace, ppl tried to destroy her, bc even with a perfect valid explanation of her just saying aroaces are their own thing and she just doesn't want to date, ppl treated it like she was lying or was trying to sneak into the queer community and was straight or all the other horrible things yall might remember "fans" did to her.

Alastor being aroace isn't about being the rep of "Aroaces can feel attraction!!!" bc be real honest.

How many aroace popular characters can ppl list that a regular person on the street is going to know? Bc I've heard all their arguments to invalidate their representation.

Jughead? Oh you mean Cole Sprouse who made out and got it on with Lili Reinhart playing Betty bc he found her sexy? Oh but in the old comics he's a gay character whose in denial. Yelena Boleva? Who? Oh that woman? She's hot she's just traumatized and needs to find the right person. Charlie Weasley? Oh he was only in the books? He was confirmed as aroace through a passive comment most ppl didn't know about from the author that never used the term? Luffy? You mean one of the most shipped characters in One Piece? No he's just an idiot/childish so he doesn't understand girls are pretty. Caduceus Clay? Sorry I didn't watch Critical Role whose that? Are you sure he's aroace? He feels gay to me.

I can list more ppl, but I'm sure most ppl couldn't.

I remember the whole discussion of the pan/bi representation argument of "Yes! We know pan/bi ppl can date the opposite gender. But straight ppl don't know about pan/bi nearly at all or don't accept it," so showing it as gay, who know the term more, until it's shown clearly the character is queer and not "confused straights" they then can have opposite gender attraction. Bc sooooo many pan/bi characters end up "straight" at the end of their show/book. Bc I remember when ppl refused to accept that Deadpool is pan bc of his wife and started freaking out when he dated a nonbinary person in the comics or helped that one genderqueer person he knew.

Representation is about showing to ppl what they're not understanding about the identity in the plainest sense of the words of the identity, then when there's enough rep to show they're not all the same, then you can have the ones that break the rules.

Alastor whether or not he wants to date doesn't matter. What matters is this whole situation blew out of proportion bc ppl refused to accept that some ppl don't feel comfy shipping him. Bc they see themselves in him and don't want that. BUT! Also ppl under the aro and ace umbrella also have no rep and wanted to see him breaking the stereotype they probs have yelled at them of "You can't have a partner you're aroace I forbid it" and wanted to see thru their own experiences how that would be done.

Here's the problem.... As someone who has read a lot of aroace headcanon fanfics as an aroace....... A lot of ppl who are allo don't realize aroace "crushes" are missing emotions... That's why they're aroace. And they'll write them like they're the same just "muted" or "needs to warm up" kinda thing. Or make the character's love "childish" to explain the lack of romance/sex. Which is messed up. And that's the problem here.

Alastor didn't need to be this blown out of proportion of a situation. The problem is ppl found him sexy and the classic "But aroace hot, they can't be aroace bc why hot?" discussion got brought back up without the gentle post format discussions and instead it was a lot of shippers on tiktok with tiny word counts arguing a complex issue.

Ppl should be allowed to ship whatever (except problematic I know yall too well), especially if they see themselves in the characters and especially if they have the same identity and want to explore that!!

The truth of the matter is this is such a huge issue that just keeps happening bc ppl are too used to fandom queer spheres where ppl already know aroace means "off the table" and so they want to play with qprs or grayromantics/sexuals not knowing what that entails bc there's sooooo lil aroace rep that actually explores being aroace and a lot of ppl don't know the basics, and even how very different aroace "off the table" is when you aren't the classic "uwu I'm just innocent and have no friends or importance to the plot so just ignore me and have me be adopted by one of the main couples as a 'kid' figure."

Not to mention that a lot of ppl still think ace means aroace. That aces can't date bc there's ppl who don't know that romantic and sexual attraction are different!

I'm just.... So tired. So very tired of having ppl shout at me what it means to be aroace and being unable to look up the lil aroace rep we have bc of this issue I've seen a million times is all.

[thesunniest]

Why do showrunners feel the need to erase aromanticism when adapting media? (Spoilers for Shadow and Bone Season 2)

First it was Jughead Jones just for the sake of a love triangle but honestly I let go of that show after season 1.

Now we have Tolya Yul-Bataar, soldier, poetry and sun summoner enthusiast who literally said in the books he is not interested in anyone and his books and faith are enough. He is also the only one who doesn't have a love interest in a cast of 10+ central characters. And yet in the Shadow and Bone Season 2 it is implied he might have a crush on Inej. I'm out. I'm done being erased like this just for the sake of... what exactly? A plot point that's going to be dropped because we all know who the endgame is? I'm exhausted. Also for me it isn't a headcanon, we all know Leigh doesn't explicitly state major things about the characters and instead makes it clear in her own way so we can figure them out. For me this scene is as clear as day a confirmation he is aro/ace (or at least aro). Also we don't ever get to see Nina Zenik explicitly say she is pansexual, she says she is attracted to people, we don't see Jesper say he is bi we see him saying he likes boys and girls, but when we have the equivalent to those said by an aro character it is "up for interpretation" just so people can still have their ships. Like you don't expect Tolya to explicitly state he is aro/ace when this terminology doesn't even exist in the Grishaverse, do you?

[peacerisendove]

Big Ethel Energy Season 2 Episode 29

I'm reacting strongly to what feels like literal ace/aro erasure and honestly aphobia the more I think about it. Aromantic, asexual, and or aroace people are really just getting their shit kicked in the narrative of this comic and it's upsetting.

They made the antagonist/source of conflict in Ethel's Season 1 narrative Jughead, who in Season 1 was very strongly implied to be aroace, but now they're just backtracking on both him being ace and aro.

It's so sad and frustrating to see.

Look Mr. Lodge isn't generally viewed in positive terms. He's associated with and concerned with money, self-interest, and his businesses, but the fact we're just getting judgement calls without even seeing evidence of Hiram character or what even his goal is with running for city council once again forces the reader to side with Ethel and her friends.

I love Nancy and her character, and of course when it comes to these situations you want the underdog who works hard and clearly cares about the city to win an election, but I don't think the comic takes into account that to be a contender in a political elections you need experience and resources to win. This panel might portray that it's Nancy's actions or resolve that is what might lead to her potentially losing this election, but honestly I think that it's a lack of experience and resources in which to convince people to vote for her for Mayor.

Now this? After a whole fucking season of alluding and pretty much confirming in all ways except explicitly through the words that that Jughead is asexual and/or aromantic.

It feels like a retcon or wishy-washy writing in which the author purposefully kept Jughead's sexuality and romantic identity vague (aka did not explicitly state he was asexual and/or aromantic) in order to keep him open to potential future love interests. It feels like an insult because the way Jughead is written in the first season and in particular his explanation to Ethel that he has never wanted sex and never wanted anyone romantically (the only exception to that is Trula):

(S1, Episode 58)

Yes, sexuality is fluid, but that is not what is going on in this case.

His sexuality in Season 1, which very clearly reads as Ace and/or Aro is just swept aside. The author is back tracking on their own writing and it's so frustrating and insulting to see because the Ace and Aro representation that we got with Jughead in Season 1 wasn't even remotely good or positive because he is put as Ethel's central antagonist in her personal story and narrative because he was an eighteen year old boy who has sex with Ethel in order to fully understand that he did not have any interest in sex or romantically attracted to her.

The whole first season, if you look at Ethel and Jughead's conflict, is simply the vilifying of asexuality and those who are aromantic. That's it. That is the crux of Ethel's entire conflict.

She blames all of her romance-based troubles on this one moment and one person without once looking inward. Jughead should not be held accountable or vilified because he had sex.

-SIGH- It is just so goddamn upsetting that this is the narrative that was portrayed and one along the way said or thought that anything was wrong.

And you know what? This perspective is even more upsetting and disappointing because the comic appears or tries to be inclusive as we explicitly have gay characters, trans characters, lesbian characters, disabled characters, and more who are open in their identities, but asexuality and aromanticism don't even get an explicit mention. The words "asexuality," "aromantic," or "aroace" are not once mentioned in the comic. Jughead isn't even the only character who qualifies as aromantic. Trula is written in a way that suggests she's aromantic (Season 1, Episode 48; Trula after being described to pick up guys one after the other states that relationships don't interest her), and yet asexuality and aromanticism are utilized as a source of conflict, are treated as erasable, and simply not treated with the same respect or standard as other identities are mentioned in this comic.

As I have stated it's frustrating and infuriating as a reader and especially as a reader who cares about asexuality and aromantic identities and its representation.

There was more I had to say about this episode but honestly Ethel's elitism can take a back seat as I find the topic of how BEE represents, treats, and writes about asexuality and aromanticism insulting.

[theaceoftales]

Ace of the Week #3: Jughead Jones

Jughead being asexual isn't just implied like many mainstream figures... it's explicitly stated! The word "asexual" was used in the text!

"You just don't get it cause you're asexual..." "Yeah, well, it's why I can think clearly... I'm not hobbled by these hormonal impulses!"

Another thing that really stands out in this canon-reveal is that it's treated with comedy (which is befitting to the Archie Comics universe and style). He's poking lighthearted fun at the allosexuals - especially Archie.

And while it may not be garlic bread or cake, Jughead's stereotypical love and preference for food (in the shape of a burger) is most definitely present.

"On some primal and fundamental level, all I really want to do is hang out with a giant talking burger. I know that about myself now, and I accept it gladly."

The reason why Jughead's intro graphic labels him as Aro-Spec(trum) Asexual is because Chip Zdarsky states that where he falls on the aromantic spectrum would likely change as he grows into adulthood. Which is perfectly valid. Orientation can be fluid for some people; that's part of the appeal of treating queerness as a spectrum.

Relevant Additional Context: A popular meme amongst and about the asexual community is "who needs sex when you can have cake/garlic bread?" So, it's a rather long-standing joke and stereotype that we love food.

Relevant Definitions for Context:

Aromantic: An orientation where an individual feels little to no romantic attraction towards another particular person.

Demiromantic: A label underneath the umbrella identity of "aromantic" in which a person may feel romantic attraction towards a particular person if a deep emotional bond is established.

All credit for my information and screenshots goes to @hotdogwithagun, this Tumblr post by @oneshortdamnfuse, this Comics Alliance article, and a few things I've picked up via osmosis prior to the Riverdale show airing that I wish I still had the links to.

[jupitermelichios]

you know, riverdale really doesn't get enough credit for its queer representation

sure there's a bunch of memeworthy cringy moments (mostly from the first season, when it was functionally a different show, but i can't give "it's not queerbait if it's to save the world" a completely free pass even if it is one of the funniest lines ever said on television), and we absolutely should be side-eying them hard for erasing jughead's asexuality (although we might finally be getting that in the current season)

but for all that, there's so much stuff i love

Toni and Fangs being explicitly a queer couple, despite being opposite gender, because the show didn't just forget that they're both bi when they got together. I geuinely cannot think of another example of that on tv, and it really meant a lot to me to see it

Cheryl having lost her childhood to her mother's emotional abuse and homophobia immediately agreeing to foster Britta when Britta's parents throw her out for being gay. (everything season six did with Britta was insane, but for season 5 at least her and Cheryl and Nana Rose were a little gay family and I loved it sm)

Betty figuring out she's bi while in a relationship with a man and that just being some new self knowledge she has, rather than it being seen as a threat to her and Archie's relationship

Kevin continuing to be refered to as Anthony's dad and having a relationship with him, even though he's not his biological father and he and Fangs split up before Anthony was even born. (They were using a friend as a surrogate, the relationship ended before the birth, later a DNA test is done that shows fangs is the biodad, but when he's not being mindcontrolled by evil wizards he continues to have a relationship with the baby - he chose to have this kid, and that's the thing that counts, not whether he's on the birth certificate)

And yes the Abigail episodes are all very silly, but they're also all about how queer people have always been here and will always be here, and no attempt to erase us will ever succeed. and yes sometimes we're immortal witches driven mad and evil by the loss of our one true love, but afterall, don't my evil immortal wlw witch girlies deserve some representation too?

And yes the hedwig episode is so dumb, it's maybe the dumbest of the musical episodes and I'm including the american psycho one in that, but at the same time, it's an epsiode about how drag is important art and teenagers should if anything be exposed to more drag than they are because queer art is important, yes even the stuff with sex in it, and in the current political climate i can't help loving it for taking that stance, even if the songs are all really bad

the show's representation isn't perfect by any means, and yes the fact that it look them 7 seasons to even think about acknoledging that jughead is ace in the comics really sucks, but it also does a lot of things really right, and i just think those should get the same level of attention as the cringeworthy stuff

also "it's not queerbait if it's to save the world" is still an incredibly funny line

[acetyzias]

no seriously like why is all the "ace rep" out there always children or animals or as a shield for homophobe audiences accusing a character of being gay can't we get anything genuine for once

it also quite irks me that ace rep is incredibly limited, and in the case of childrens media, often conflated or combined with aromanticism. and that isnt to say that aro-ace rep isnt valid or needed! i just wish it wasn't the only way media overall chooses to depict asexuality AND aromanticism.

todd from bojack is the only good ace rep in, well, anything i can think of. I know there's also alastor from hazbin hotel (aro-ace iirc) but to my knowledge it doesn't really come up other than him saying "ace in the hole" which...isn't really saying much? i think jughead is also asexual but that got erased hardcore in riverdale >_> and lilith from the owl house, who is also aro-ace but that had to be confirmed outside of the show :(

spongebob is kind of in the same boat as perry the platypus imo, in that they're only asexual because their creators/writers don't visualize them in any romantic relationships, and are too childish or are animals. like yeah ill headcanon both of them as pan-ace and gay-ace respectively, but representing asexual people wasn't exactly hillenburg or povenmire's intentions...

its complicated to say the least. anyway, i think the lack of good n proper asexual rep is because of a general lack (hah.) of awareness of asexuality as an identity in wider media. at least to me thats what seems to be the case.

[yusuke-of-valla]

Problematic Ace Rep Tournament Round 1, Match 7

Note: the definition of "problematic" and "rep" is up to you. Propaganda under the cut:

Hua Cheng:

Ace: Only loved one man his entire life, never had sex for 800 years or wanted to anyway, was willing to never if his love didn't love him back. Thinking along the lines of demisexual. Problematic: Ghost king, killed 33 gods for disrespecting his god, known for being a terror to heaven, general asshole towards anyone who isn't who he loved. Spent 800 years semi-stalking as best he could his love, lied about who he was, made 10,000 statues of his love and horny wall art.

Jughead:

It is consistently implied that Jughead considers food more important than all else, doesn't really care for women, and has no interest in sex. He was confirmed as ace by the author The thing that makes him like, very mildly problematic is that it sometimes ends up making him act more misogynistic, especially in the older comics. I also think that, once again in a lot of the older material, the fact that the jokes about Jughead being ace were mostly "haha he eats and doesn't care about girls 🤪", but I still love and relate to him, so I don't think he's problematic in terms of being ace representation, more in terms of how he was portrayed previously. Also Riverdale exists and that's enough to make me mad

[sergeantpixie]

One more if you're not sick of me yet! Five reasons you prefer Barchie to Varchie and Bughead?!

No, I'm not sick of you! These are really fun!

I'm largely gonna stay away from comparisons to Bughead and Varchie and just talk about what I like about Barchie but I will give at least one reason each as to why I'm not into either of those ships. I'm far past the point of thinking ship wars are important.

Why I don't ship Varchie: it's hard to articulate, I just was never interested when they interacted onscreen and I couldn't figure out why they liked each other beyond being hot together - which is actually a valid reason for teenagers to hook up and for someone to ship it, in my book tbh. Not every ship has to be That Deep!

Why I don't ship Bughead: like I said in my unpopular Riverdale opinions I really wanted Jughead to be Ace/Aro like his comic book counterpart. I've only seen the episode where Betty and Jughead kissed for the first time so I can't even say I don't enjoy the relationship - I never saw it in the first place, not really - but I know when I watched I was disappointed that that's where it went.

From this point on it will be about Barchie only! Friends to lovers is my favorite trope! I definitely have plenty of those ships I dislike because the guy was never really the girl's friend in the first place, but I feel like Betty and Archie are solidly friends who love and support each other.

In a lot of ways Betty and Archie are the same. Betty's always having everyone's perception of her perfection forced on her while being a very real and flawed person. Archie is expected to to be the archetypal golden boy football hero who is actually very traumatized by his romantic relationship with an authority figure (he lost his virginity to his teacher, that's so fucked up.) and has a deep love for music and poetry. Archie even forces this idea of perfection onto Betty too because his idea of himself is very warped by his trauma and thinks he isn't good enough for her because of it. I love when characters learn more about someone they thought they understood already.

I love characters coming back to each other. I do like that they didn't get together in the pilot. I like people going out into the world and looking for themselves before they come back to someone else. A lot of life is the journey you take on your own, but coming back to someone who knows you well and accepts every version of you is very lovely to me.