#fandom discussion

[amaliazeichnerin]

Well said. I agree 💯

why praising someone’s fic while at the same time tearing down other writers’ fics may not be the positive comment you think it is

first of all, I feel like I should be bringing this up because I’ve gotten comments where people praise my works (which I appreciate) while in those same comments they later say what they dislike about other writers’ fanfics, in a rather harsh manner, and while I know my commenters probably don’t have any ill intentions towards me, and while they never actually name the writers whose works they don’t like, I still don’t agree with and I certainly don’t condone the way they trash talk other writers’ fanfics either. so I think I should just bring this up, not to attack or target anyone specifically, but to hopefully make general readers see why comments like these are… not actually helpful to anybody.

before we begin, I also like to humbly point out that comments I’m talking about aren’t “oh it’s so hard to find a fic this good” or “your work is better than most of the fics I’ve read” because personally I think comments like these are harmless, not because I think my fic is “that good”, not because I think my work is “better than others”, but because no other writers were insulted and if my readers say they prefer my work — it’s all personal preference — then I’m honored, and the last thing I wanna be is a Comment Police, but I’ve unfortunately seen a lot of comments, especially lately, where other writers were rudely insulted in the name of praising the writer whose work is being commented on. I’m not gonna provide screenshots because I’m not gonna put a target on anybody’s back, but here’s to give an example of what I’m talking about,

“I like your work so much. It’s so hard to find a fic this good when most of the (insert character’s name) fics I’ve read are so bad and so out of character. I hate when some writers write (insert character’s name) as some sort of (x) and (insert another character’s name) as some (x), I think it’s so out of characters and so cringe that it physically makes me want to throw my laptop away. It feels like reading a garbage written by a bunch of five year-old kids or something. I wish I could set those trash on fire. Your work is not like those shitty fics though and it’s amazing to finally see a good fic.”

this is the kind of comments I’m talking about. because for me, personally, I don’t actually feel good receiving a comment like this, even though the commenter praises me and never actually mentions other writers, whose works they dislike, by names.

and again, the last thing I ever wanna be is a Comment Police, because I usually appreciate every comment I got, no matter if it’s just a heart emoji or a simple sentence like “I liked this”, I love and appreciate them all. but here we go;

WHY INSULTING OTHER WRITERS IN THE NAME OF PRAISING A WRITER WHOSE WORK YOU COMMENT ON IS NOT A POSITIVE COMMENT

comment like this can put a harmful pressure on the writer whom you praised and make them think that they now have to be extra careful to make sure their work is “good enough to please you”, otherwise they might get torn to shreds too. and instead of writing for themself for fun, which should be the most important thing about writing fanfics, they now feel like they have to write because they have to be good enough to earn their readers’ approval. and that just sucks out all the joy of doing something that was supposed to be a hobby, something writers do out of love and passion and not because they were pressured into doing, not because they were pressured into “being good enough and staying good enough”.

“if you’re this comfortable insulting other writers under my work, how can I know you’re not insulting me and my work under someone else’s comments section?” is a valid thought the writer you praised may have, even if they were too polite to tell you that.

“I hate when some writers write (insert character’s name) as some sort of (x) and (insert another character’s name) as some (x), I think it’s so out of characters and so cringe that it physically makes me want to throw my phone away.” how do you know the writer you praised hasn’t already written something like this in their drafts? how do you know they don’t plan on writing something that you deem “cringe and out of character”? it may not be your intention, but your comment certainly can be read as a subtle “hey, don’t you dare write something like this because I don’t like it!!!! I better not see it from you!!!” I shouldn’t have to tell you how entitled this is.

“this is so out of character” if a writer wants to write their favorite character like this, they can. why? because they write whatever they want and they write for themself, not for you.

fanfiction is not — and never will be — your average novel you see while visiting a bookstore, buy it with your money and bitch about it when it turns out the book is not to your liking. because fanfiction is free. fanfic writers write for themselves and for fun. fanfic writers write whatever they wanna write, because they themselves are their own primary audiences. not you. they’re only kind enough to share with you their works. for free. if you dislike a fic, keep that to yourself and move on to something you do like. don’t be entitled by insulting something you got for free, something that wasn’t even made for you at all.

you obviously can dislike a fic. of course, it’s your opinion. I mean I won’t say I like every fic I’ve ever read, but the thing about disliking a fic is that you can just exit said fic, forget about it and move on to something else without feeling the need to insult the work or the writer, be it directly or indirectly, because, again, fanfiction is not a movie you watch on Netflix or a book you bought with your money. fanfiction is an art, a hobby and a passion created by an artist for the artist themself.

a reminder that comments are public for everyone to see, not just the writer you praise. so while you didn’t mention any other writers whom you insulted by names, there’s always a chance of innocent writers finding your comment and thinking the part where you insult other writers’ works is about their works. and that can very negatively affect them too.

fanfiction doesn’t have to be “good enough for you, random reader”. fanfiction just has to bring the writers joy. and that’s what make a fic good enough.

if you really enjoy someone’s work, tell them that you enjoy their work, tell them what you like about their work. don’t turn their comments section into your own space where you can vent and trash talk other writers, because you are bringing that negativity to the writer whose work you said you enjoyed. and I can only speak for myself but, as a writer, I don’t enjoy seeing my comments section turn into a negative and unkind space where my fellow writers are being insulted.

[aconfusedkitten]

am i the only one who sees people reblogging things and going "you would never survive in x fandom?"

this is mostly directed towards people who post their writing and art and put "DO NOT READ AS SHIP" or have "if you like x stay the fuck away" or any of the more extreme things, because like??

do you not enjoy fun? people are gonna view your art regardless of what you say, what does tagging that sort of thing actually do? fuck, im less likely to interact with something i see that on, and i doubt im the only one.

[frontmansdefender]

shaming and making fun of people for still engaging in fandom activities once they reach a certain age is so embarrassing because why are you giving yourself an expiration date of time you have fun? why are you not-so-indirectly saying you will stop having fun once you reach a certain age? or do you really believe you have to stop engaging in fandom activities and having fun once you turn (x)? do you not think you will, what, live that long and turn that age too? do you think fun will suddenly stop for you and life will all of a sudden lose its meaning once you reach a certain age? how sad to be giving yourself an hourglass and just waiting for your time of having fun to run out.

adults can and should engage in fandom activities if it's what makes them happy.

adults can and should continue doing whatever they like doing as teenagers if it's what makes them happy.

age is just... part of life. it's a part of me and it's a part of you. shaming people for something you will have to go through (unless you don't think you will live that long) is such a loser behavior. indirectly saying you will stop having fun once you reach a certain age isn't the flex you think it is. it doesn't make you look "cool and edgy", it makes you look miserable.

[bunnis-monsters]

People who hate on reader inserts will not survive the winter.

Fanfiction writers keep your fandoms alive, and that includes reader inserts writers.

[threadfall]

[Image description: The original post has a screenshot of a Tumblr post with an overlay that looks like it's sitting underwater. The text reads as follows:

Had author Anne McCaffrey not been homophobic and transphobic she truly would have had one of the greatest science fiction/fantasy series ever. So much potential only to be stifled by the author. She also actively forbade fan fiction, fan art, and fan head-canons, and actively frowned upon gay and trans fan inserts, thus effectively stifling any chance her writing had to attract a larger audience. The concept and world-building are delicious, there would have been so much to build off of. But she actively made the decision to hate lgbtq+ people and fans

/End Description]

This post bugs the shit out of me because it completely divorces the author from the culture of the time she was writing in and ignores the fact that having nonvillainous gay characters in her work at all was actually insanely progressive, and not allowing fanfic or art was just. How it was. She was no where near anne rice levels of protective, and in fact her fan forums in the early 2000s did allow fanfic to be posted as long as the characters were all ocs.

Like, circling back to the gay and trans rep, she was writing in the 60s-90s, when being openly gay got you openly beaten to death in most parts of the us, reagan let the aids crisis go unchecked because of the perception it was only affecting gay people, being gay got you dishonorable discharge from the military, queer people had no civil protections from retaliation if their orientation was discovered, and anne McCaffrey was making gay dragon riders be the protectors of her fictional planet. Like. That's not homophobic especially for the times. She wouldnt be considered progressive by TODAYS standards, sure, but most of the pern books came out 40 years ago when dont ask dont tell was progressive policy.

And for a straight woman in her 50s writing background gay characters she was being pretty damn progressive for her time

PLUS op doesnt even bring up the most truly homophobic this she ever said which was her tent peg theory of homosexuality. Like do a little research before popping off

[communistkenobi]

in the discourse landscape of gay shipping I think a crucial element is the underdog effect. official approval of your ship from showrunners (ie ship going canon) compromises your marginal status as a fandom shipper on tumblr, and in the long run produces a sore winner subjectivity where you must constantly insist that your ship is still good and subversive. destiel is a good edge case as it went canon in the most homophobic way possible, thus maintaining something of an underdog status despite it being explicitly addressed in the text of supernatural, while still ultimately losing its fandom dominance as evidenced by it constantly losing in shipping polls. ofmd shippers in this respect occupy a conflict of class interests in which their gay canonicity confers a level of comfort and stability that gay shippers who have to work in the posting mines doing web weaves will never experience. therefore, we can consider ofmd shippers to be the petit bourgeoisie of the fandom ecosystem, caught between the big bourgeoisie (tv writers) and the proletariat (stuckys), predictably choosing to engage in downwards class conflict to maintain their narrowly privileged status

[questions-about-blorbos]

people who ship a ship that's unhealthy, toxic and fucked up and do not shy away from the fact their ship is unhealthy, toxic and fucked up by making them act all "lovey dovey" toward each other, or watering down the severity of the things that canonically make their ship a fucked up ship, in fanfics — and so they embrace the fact that their ship is fucked up, but that's the thing that makes their ship so hot, sexy, complex and fascinating — I am declaring my undying love and loyalty to you

[bebx]

“enemies to lovers as a fictional trope is harmful because it normalizes and romanticizes abuse and toxicity” my brother in Christ, touch. grass. they fuck while trying to murder each other and also they use each other’s blood as lube and yeah they look hot as fuck. what are you going to do about it?

[jaguarys]

I find it fascinating (derogatory) how the general fandom conversation has shifted from "this woman is getting in the way of our gay ship and she's USELESS and ANNOYING and WE DON'T LIKE HER!" to this weird "no actually she's just not involved in her own relationships because she's too cool and special and awesome and a girlboss". But the problem is that there's not actually a veritable difference there. People still aren't engaging with her as a fully-fledged character. Like sure man calling her a girlboss is fine it's whatever but let that lead somewhere else. Engage with her. Can you actually name any of her character traits or are you just blindly praising her so that you can focus on shipping the guys in the background without feeling bad about it

[inkwyvern]

I know we've seen the moment Blitzø decided to adopt Loona, but I want to see the moment Loona found out she was getting adopted. The moment she met Blitzø.

The first few agonising months where Blitzø didn't know how to be a dad, and Loona didn't know how to have a dad.

The awkward days of her avoiding him in the apartment, trying to figure out what exactly his goal was. Because why would he possibly want to adopt her?

And Blitzø avoiding her too, wanting to be the dad he never had growing up but having no idea how to start.

I want to see the moment Loona realises that Blitzø has been sleeping on the couch ever since she met him. She'd never noticed, because he's usually passed out on the couch before he can get to a bed most nights, but Blitzø doesn't have a bedroom. And her room's walls suddenly seem so freshly painted.

And then, I want to see the moment Loona fucks up. And when she completely expects him to send her back to the pound, Blitzø comforts her. In his awkward, doesn't-know-how-to-talk-about-emotions way, but still.

And after that, things get better. They find their own, strange rhythm. And slowly, together, they begin to heal.

[xx-slug-xx]

HEY!

If y’all didn’t think censorship would come for shit you like

SESAC just censored over 1 million songs on yourtube and they are no longer able to be listened to :)

This includes songs by Green Day, Nirvana, Alice In Chains, Mumford and Sons, and Kanye West just to name some that I have seen thus far

This means that on YouTube, if a song is detected in a video that is included in this new SESAC agreement on YouTube, the entire video is not viewable if you are in the US

This also means that Warrior Cats maps and other fandom related things up on YouTube that have songs included in this new deal on YouTube are now blocked in the USA. Speedpaints, Maps, and animatics for your favorite fandoms are now blocked if they include these songs.

Censorship comes for everything, including the things you like. It’s not a pick and choose ordeal, and it’s a bad thing no matter what is being censored and by whom

I implore people to protest against this, because this doesn’t slide. Send emails, complain online, use vpns, anything to fuck with YouTube at this point. This won’t stop with just music. No matter what SESAC tries to say about “protecting artists and their work”, this is censorship. The reason doesn’t matter. Censorship is still censorship at the end of the day. You don’t protect Jack shit by blocking songs from an entire country. Belive it or not, less traction and less people viewing their work actually harms these artists!

[allthingswhumpyandangsty]

"guys I do not condone any of this in real life" "this is fiction" "consent is key. this is only fiction" "murder is bad irl" — I wish fanfic authors didn't feel like they had to clarify this in author's notes or else they might be accused of being abusers or worse (I admit that such disclaimers are also something I personally use for my own stuff because I feel like I had to make it clear). like... people used to not care if an author wrote dead dove fics because people used to understand that ao3 fics are not a reflection of someone's in real life views or morality in any way. people used to understand that fanfics mean what they mean; fan fiction. none of it is real. maybe it's purity culture that normalizes witch hunt and censorship in the past couple years, and therefore authors feel like they have to clarify that just because they write about violence or noncon stuff doesn't mean they're murderers or sex offenders in real life. and I think it sucks that these things (purity and cancel culture?) have made authors feel like they have to apologize for the art they created instead of being proud of their hard work and all the dedication they put into creating these art. artists should not have to feel like they have to apologize for creating art that isn't all rainbow and sunshine. artists should not have to be made to feel ashamed of their own art if it's not all rainbow and sunshine.

I don’t agree with the “you can write noncon and dark fics as long as you make sure your readers get the message that these things are bad” or “you can write noncon and dark fics if it’s your way of coping with your trauma” take either. because writers do not owe you anything. the message writers want to send to their readers — whatever that message may be, if there’s any message or moral of the story for readers to take from the stories at all — is none of your business. why writers write what they write is none of your business. remember “don’t like don’t read”. no one forces you to read anything you don’t like. dark and noncon fics are a form of creative writing and creative writing is a form of art. you can’t pressure artists into creating art that “fit your moral compass” nor can you apply your own moral compass to artists to determine if they can create dark art or not, if their reasoning behind creating dark art passes your moral compass. like… what artists create and why artists create are none of your business. and you don’t get to shame artists for creating art that you hate / art that disgusts you. what you can do is ignore the art because it clearly was not made for you and that’s okay. what isn’t okay is you harassing artists because you don’t like the things they created.

writers, embrace and be proud of your works. as long as all the trigger warnings are tagged properly, you have nothing to apologize for.

[okkos-ferrum]

The fandom's disregard of Till's emotions

SPOILERS FOR ROUND 7 ALNST

As a Till fan since day 1 (round 2) I feel like some of the fanbase is so willing to ignore till's emotions for the sake of ivantill, especially after this round (and I'm saying this as someone who loves the tragedy of Ivantill and would love to see a world where they could get together)

It almost feels like this strange entitlement where because Ivan sacrificed himself for Till that somehow till must be in love with Ivan now, when his entire guiding light was Mizi. Ofc he doesn't change his mind overnight, and no, Ivan's sacrifice wasn't "wasted". Till was deeply affected by Ivan's death (why else was he fighting to stay alive in r7) and it's clear throughout r7 how much Ivan weighs on him. But his actions when seeing Mizi are totally align with his character, like u can't just drop his deep rooted feelings for Mizi SINCE CHILDHOOD just due for the convinence of the ship "becoming canon"

I see some people despairing that somehow mizitill is confirmed now (do u guys not know WHO VIVINOS AND QMENG are????) and it just shows that lack of nuance in Till's emotions. He isn't this rag doll that is only capable of simple mindedly liking ONE person at a time. He's a character with different layers to himself and complicated relationships with the cast

Fandom seems so overinvolved with shipping discourse that to me it feels like they have stopped viewing till as a seperate character but rather an award for Ivan's sacrifice. But I feel like the whole point of Ivan's sacrifice was his momentary selfishness in kissing Till when really all he had to do was fake an attack on Till to sacrifice himself. It is the culmination and a final acceptance in how his love will never be requieted by till, so if he must die, he will be selfish one last time and that's it. At the end of the day, Ivan was a tragedy of his unrequited love. Till was close to death in round 6 and he was running on borrowed time ("tik tok tik tok blink gone") in round 7, as his own distressed emotional state made in inevitable he couldn't hold himself against the emotional manipulator that is luka when he barely coped with mizi's "death" and even less so with Ivan's

Again no hate to Ivantill fans (eyes mizitill a bit suspiciously but I'm not the fandom fun police lol) and I pretty sure this a vocal minority but putting it out there

Also quick PSA for people feeling underwhelmed for this being a "final round", VIVINOS confirmed on patreon a while back there are like 2(?) more episodes left to wrap up the series dwww

[curiositysavesthecat]

*This poll was submitted to us and we simply posted it so people could vote and discuss their opinions on the matter. If you’d like for us to ask the internet a question for you, feel free to drop the poll of your choice in our inbox and we’ll post them anonymously (for more info, please check our pinned post).

[frontmansdefender]

"On AO3 there are about 6,400,000 fics as of now that are M/M and only about 1,200,000 fics for F/F. Fans should stop excluding female characters for the sake of male characters" Hold the fuck on???? People don't "exclude female characters for the sake of male characters". The ratio between M/M fics and F/F fics is literally because more people like M/M fics more than they do F/F and that's actually fine, it's not that deep. Because people can write whatever they like.

Yes, misogyny is a very real thing. But you're erasing the creditability of that word and are the ones doing harm to women if you scream misogyny every time you see something that slightly upsets you. Writers ONLY writing M/M doesn't automatically mean they're misogynists, without any other factors present that may or may not make them misogynists, the only fact that 'some writers ONLY write M/M' literally just means they like writing romance between two male characters and that's it.

This is fanfiction we're talking about, not a political debate or social justice protest. If the majority of people want to write about two male characters falling in love, then let them.

You don't get to shame a writer for "ONLY writing about M/M" because everybody has the rights to write whatever they like.

If you want more works for F/F, then write F/F yourself. No one's stopping you.

As a feminist myself, shaming writers for only writing M/M doesn't make you a feminist, it makes you an entitled dick.

(from this poll by @curiositysavesthecat nothing against the mods of the poll blog btw, they just run polls that were sent to them.)