#Jin ling See's Jiang Cheng as a father

[aracfox]

I have an mdzs headcanon where Jin ling's first words where a-die/baba -(dad in Mandarin) to Jiang Cheng, because Jiang Cheng practically raised him and because he (Jin ling) saw other children call the man that raised them baba he called Jiang Cheng baba. And that is the story of how Jiang Cheng cried for the first time since wei wuxian died because of is nephew

[least-carpet]

Thoughts about jl and jc relationship? I love them but their relationship is criticized a lot, I would love to hear your thoughts

Hi, anon! Very belatedly, here is an answer!

They love each other and Jin Ling is very secure in that love. It is very evident to me—and to Jin Ling himself—that Jiang Cheng loves Jin Ling and would die for him. Jin Ling trusts and relies on Jiang Cheng, and scoffs at the idea that his uncle has ever hit him, in a cultural context where corporal punishment is not unusual. Jin Ling goes to Jiang Cheng when he's crying. Jin Ling pushes back at Jiang Cheng, goes around him, and talks back to him fearlessly, with a sort of bratty entitlement rather than fearful defiance. This is not something a kid who is afraid of their guardian does. This is not something Jiang Cheng would have done with his own parents!

Jiang Cheng did a better job than his parents did with him. You might not personally want Jiang Cheng as a parent, but contrast him against his own soft-spoken father: I don't think Jin Ling would ever say that Jiang Cheng just didn't like him, or think to himself that Jiang Cheng wouldn't show up to save him. Jin Ling is way more secure in Jiang Cheng's affection for him than Jiang Cheng ever was when it came to Jiang Fengmian, and I don't think that's by accident. I think that's something that Jiang Cheng probably worked hard for. It is notable that Jiang Cheng, Jin Ling's maternal uncle, showed up for Jin Ling so consistently that Jin Ling has more trust in him than Jiang Cheng had in his own parents, despite being, like, twenty and running a sect by himself.

Jin Ling looks up to Jiang Cheng. Jin Ling, I think, patterns his behaviour after a couple of ideals. One of them I think, is an image of his father as a young and adventurous hero— young war hero Jin Zixuan, one of the best archers in his generation. (Also initially kind of a twerp with bad social skills, but Jin Ling doesn't know that.) And the other, I think, is Jiang Cheng. (He also very obviously cares for and admires Jin Guangyao, but I don't think he takes him as a model in the same way?) So Jiang Cheng is also important to Jin Ling as a role model. And why wouldn't he be? He's really good at a very hard job. (He's also, like, emotionally damaged from the war and its fallout, but realistically, a lot of the adults around Jin Ling would also be like that to some degree, especially in the Jiang sect.)

Jin Ling expresses care the way Jiang Cheng does, and that helps them understand and trust each other. Jin Ling also expresses his love in the same way that Jiang Cheng expresses his love: through defending the people he cares about. We see him do it when Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji want to enter Jin Guangyao's rooms, and again when Jiang Cheng is exhausted at the second siege of the Burial Mounds (Jin Ling just fucking scooping up Jiujiu and carrying him to safety remains hilarious to me). The scene where he thinks he hears Lan Sizhui say something about a ghost and he pops out and offers to kill the ghost for him also comes to mind. That's how you express affection if you're Jin Ling! He's going to put his foot in his mouth but if somebody threatens you, he's ready to go! Does this remind you of... anyone... like maybe Jiang Cheng, Mr. "Knife Mouth, Tofu Heart."

Jin Ling is definitely a little jerk sometimes, but I don't think it's fair to totally blame that on Jiang Cheng. Jin Ling's bad behaviour is often chalked up to Jiang Cheng being a bad guardian, but he's not the only influence at play: Jin Ling is at a terrible age. He's trying to individuate. He's at the centre of a lot of scrutiny because of his position, and potentially also danger. He's isolated and bullied in his home sect because he's an orphan, which, like, what the fuck. He splits time between two sects with wildly different philosophies and priorities, and probably gets a lot of conflicting messages about what's important and how he should act. His guardians have different parenting styles and priorities, and are themselves under a lot of scrutiny. People gossip about him, his dead parents, his live uncles—really viciously about Jin Guangyao— and probably his dead cousin, too. I would also probably be a very confused and angry teenager in those circumstances! Him acting out is not very surprising!

Jin Ling and Jiang Cheng are under a lot of stress during MDZS, and the way they relate to each other reflects that. Part of growing up is finding out your parents are people with, like, human frailties and their own trauma. Jin Ling's guardians have a LOT of human frailties and a LOT of trauma, and he finds out about it in detail during MDZS, in some pretty ugly ways. (We're shown that Jiang Cheng loves Jin Ling enough to shield him with his own body and that Jin Ling is comforted by Jiang Cheng's presence when he cries, but we also see Jiang Cheng give Jin Ling a pretty hard smack while he's freaking out in Guanyin Temple! Not good, although—based on what Jin Ling previously stated—not a usual behaviour from Jiang Cheng.) Despite this, I do think both Jiang Cheng and Jin Guangyao sincerely loved and tried to raise Jin Ling well. And they didn't do so bad! He's a snobby little brat with a mean mouth but he's also courageous, protective, empathetic, and willing to re-evaluate his beliefs when he's presented with new information!

Basically, I just think that you can be a flawed and harsh person and still love your kid enough that they turn out OK. Jin Ling's not perfect, by any means. But I think he's going to grow up into a pretty impressive adult, and I think no small part of that is because Jiang Cheng loves him, so, so much. (I also think that not all parental figures are great matches for every kid, but, like, these two just really get each other. Scorpio2scorpio communication.)

TL;DR I love them, they love each other, it's definitely not a perfect relationship and I understand why people react in a negative way to the thought of Jiang Cheng in a parental role (although I also think it's a mistake to assume that he parents like he was parented).

[letteredlettered]

Hi! I would love to read a JC and WWX post and how it is diff from what you’ve seen in western media!

I'd already started writing a JC post, so I wrapped that in to answer your question.

I follow a few JC fans so I see the backlash to the haters more than I see any haters, but apparently there’s some question in some people’s mind about whether Jiang Cheng loves Wei Wuxian, and I find that a little silly. That said, I think that to understand MDZS’s JC at all, you cannot just read the surface, so if you’re not thinking about him as a person or giving him any consideration beyond what other characters say and think of him, you’re not doing him justice. You’re also not going to see that he loves WWX and also loves several other people quite deeply, because a) JC's never going to be affectionate in his dialogue, b) JC's not going to even be affectionate in his body language or minor actions, and c) WWX, the main viewpoint character, is never once going to think about whether JC likes him or loves him.

Lots of posts have outlined better than I will how deeply loves not only WWX, but also his family, in particular JL. The short version is: JC’s his major flaws are all related to him loving his parents and getting shown very little affection in return—none at all from his father and only some in a backhanded way from his mother, usually in comparison to WWX.

As for Jin Ling, JC threatens him all the time, and even shoves him around a bit, but Jin Ling obviously adores JC and feels adored. JC is the one Jin Ling goes to when he's crying; JC is also the one who leaps to JL's side when JL is hurt. JL knows he's in trouble with JC when JL does something unsafe, but JL knows that his own safety is the most important thing in JC's life. Tellingly, JL rarely takes any of JC's threats seriously, and even tells other people said threats are bogus.

Then there’s WWX. Even while JC is berating WWX endlessly for making their clan look bad, he is literally carrying around WWX on his back. He is protecting WWX with everything he has. He sacrifices himself to the Wens to WWX won't get caught. After their falling out, after WWX lied to him for years and got their sister killed, JC still can't even stop himself from protecting WWX when WWX might get hurt by JGY's guqin string.

The guy is willing to throw himself on the fire for anyone he loves. Just heaven forbid he express any of it. But because he does not express love through speech, Wei Wuxian (who I will point out is a talker) doesn't understand this about Jiang Cheng—and this is shown to be a consistent flaw that WWX has. He also does not understand that LWJ is in love with him, despite LWJ defying all of society to follow him around and lift him onto donkeys whenever WWX gets droopy.

But I'd add the pretty much no one, other than Jin Ling, understands this about Jiang Cheng. If the cultivation world had understood JC, they would not have believed that JC and WWX had actually had a falling out. Part of the reason people don't know him is the same reason JC has such a terrible time with everything—WWX steals everyone's attention, praise, and fear wherever they go. No one is really looking at JC to admire his devotion or his loyalty, because WWX is there, doing it better than him, always. Imagine LWJ+WWX hadn’t defeated the Tortoise of Slaughter and had just been holed up in that cave for six days. All anyone would’ve talked about was how deeply JC must love his shixiong to make it back in such record time. It would all be “heroic rescue” this “unflagging loyalty” that. But instead, LWJ+WWX  had to really just steal the limelight.

In fact, the book is partly about the fact that people don't analyze people's actions too deeply. They believe what they hear. They believe what they want to believe. JC really can just say "I reject WWX" and they believe it. JGS can really just say "WWX is evil" and they believe it. Everybody says LWJ is perfect, so they believe he can't be a cut-sleeve who is in love with WWX. And WWX, who knows better than anyone that rumors aren't true, believes it too.

Even after WWX's death, JC's reputation is locked onto WWX. I do think this is JC’s own fault, given that he can’t accept his brother’s death and is obsessed with him but idk. Canon demonstrates that there’s a huge difference between what JC says he’ll do if he finds WWX and what JC actually does, and it’s not because LWJ is in the way. But no one really seems to pay attention to the difference between what JC says and what he actually does when the chips are down, except JL, so it’s no wonder everyone says he has torture dungeons, no matter how ludicrous that is.

I think what makes JC’s love for WWX particularly complex, and particularly incomprehensible in the eyes of the cultivation world, is WWX's position in JC's family. JC thought of WWX as a brother. He loved him like a brother. And yet JC was deeply aware that WWX wasn't his brother. JC's mom made sure that JC was deeply aware of that at all times, and you know what, so did his dad. And then, the rest of the cultivation world constantly talked about the fact that WWX was not a part of the family, that the Jiang Clan raised him like a son but he was really the son of a servant. MXTX expertly shows that this fact gets trotted out whenever WWX does something questionable--when WWX is brilliant, he's a lauded member of the clan, but when he is bad, he is of low-birth and adopted through charity. The truth is, it’s an unusual relationship for a world in which there’s a pretty big different between your clan (blood relatives) and sect.

How can JC hold both of these truths in his head? What makes it bearable for JC is that when they grow up, JC will be the Sect Leader and WWX will be his right-hand man; they will do everything together; they will be brilliant together; they never have to worry about blood or debt then, because then it won't matter whether they're brothers or best friends; the difference won't matter. They can both be the head of a family that they love. Except that doesn't happen.

JC’s parents die, and WWX disappears. I will, at this point in my understanding and credit to Jiang Cheng, say that the part about JC I find hardest to swallow is that he partially blames his parents' death on WWX. Yes, WWX stayed behind in the cave of the Tortoise of Slaughter to save LWJ, and yes, this meant that Wen Chao and WLJ have a particular grudge against him, which they use as partial excuse to attack Lotus Pier, but by god, that's a stretch. Lotus Pier would have been attacked anyway, and the fact that JC even partly blames the attack on WWX has far more to do with what his mom said about WWX showing off for the glory and bringing down the wrath of the Wens than it has to do with reality. YZY is going to say anything she can about how WWX being a hero with the Tortoise of Slaughter was actually a bad thing, because it's so fucking painful for her that WWX is a fucking legend when her son just . . . isn't.

As JGY points out, they were in fact the strongest sect once WWX comes back from the Burial Mounds and fights the Sunshot Campaign with JC. They could have been the power couple of JC’s dreams, but just as YZY pits JC against WWX, the cultivation world after the war pitted WWX against themselves and by extension, JC, and JC buys into it. I find this super understandable, and I think it’s pretty unfair to expect JC to be more understanding of WWX, given that WWX is constantly lying to him. Similarly, I think it’s pretty understandable that he doesn’t understand the plight of the Wens, given that WWX doesn’t explain it to him at all. From JC’s POV, WWX just leaves, at a time when JC really needs him, and he does it on a crusade for unrelated people—as though he never considered himself part of the family in the first place.

And you know what, that may be WWX’s POV too. He loves the Jiang family like his own family, but he’s also deeply aware that he is not blood. MXTX makes it very clear in canon that WWX felt that he owed the Jiang Clan, and not in the way you owe a family. That is—he doesn’t owe them his existence, but he thinks he does owe them his core and his cultivation. And he gives it all to JC.

I outlined above that the relationship between JC and WWX is unusual in the cultivation world given that they each feel like the other is family but are consistently reminded of the fact, and pressured to believe, that they are only sect siblings and that WWX is actually a subordinate. I also haven’t found many relationships like this in other media—though I’ll point out once again that my experience is mainly with western media. I think the closest things I can think of are stories in which the parties are of a different class but are raised together for whatever reason—because they actually are somewhat related but one of them has low class relatives, or because they were not as well-supervised in their youth but  one of them suddenly comes into money and is forced to leave his low-class BFF behind, etc.

Given that this relationship is unusual, you don’t see a lot of situations like WWX’s, in which WWX feels like he owes the Jiang family his golden core and then gives it to him. But there’s another element to this sacrifice that I’ve only seen in one other piece of media, and that’s the fact that WWX knows that JC can’t live without being special, and WWX thinks he can handle it.

There is so much in western media about brothers giving up their lives to protect their brothers (Supernatural), or even just giving up their dreams and ambitions so that their brother can follow his own dreams instead (It’s a Wonderful Life). But these sacrifices are always framed as “I love him so much,” or “It’s my duty” or “I couldn’t live with myself if he didn’t get what he wanted” and sometimes even, “I can handle the suffering and I don’t want him to live with it.” But there’s something about WWX’s “eh it’s not a big deal to me  and it is to him” or his “bro’s kinda petty and can’t get over himself, whatchu gonna do” that feels stupidly singular.

WWX never says it isn’t a big deal. He never said that it didn’t hurt or that he didn’t make a sacrifice. He never said JC was pathetic or a loser or anything that diminishes JC or makes him less than he is. What he says is that JC is always competitive and comparing himself to others, which is true. But the other sacrifices in fiction that come close are a little more “I don’t want you to have to suffer” or even “I’m strong, and you’re weak, so I’ll take on this burden for you.” Meanwhile WWX doesn’t think JC is weak, and while WWX doesn’t want to suffer, he certainly doesn’t want to suffer himself. The sentiment feels closer to “you need to feel special so I’ll make that happen for you,” and there’s something about it that is a little condescending.

I mentioned that I’ve only seen this kind of thing one other time, and it was in a baseball anime called Touch that aired in Japan in the 1980s. Touch is a story about twins, one of whom is smart, talented, and works hard. The other twin, Tatsuya, is good in school and good at baseball, but at first seems like a lazy guy who only cares about joking around and having fun. Then you find out he’s a genius and a one-in-a-lifetime talent, but just never bothered to focus on anything because he’s so stupidly good at everything that he would just show his brother up, and his brother cares about excelling and Tatsuya doesn’t, so he just…was careful to never apply himself to anything.

WWX isn’t Tatsuya, in that when they’re on an even playing field, WWX doesn’t really seem to have any compunctions about showing off. But as soon as the playing field becomes uneven, he also has no compunctions about destroying himself so that JC’s competitive spirit is satisfied. There’s something about it that has a flavor of “I’m better than you,” even if it’s never what WWX meant to communicate. No wonder JC feels like a clown.

Like, in the end, WWX kind of did make a fool of JC, even though WWX did it out of both love and loyalty. I'm not sure I've ever read or seen anything else where such a sacrifice has such ambiguity, and it really makes the WWX+JC relationship one of the most complicated I've seen.

[mxtxfanatic]

Bing-ge and Victim's Entitlement as Portrayed by MXTX

I was thinking about Bing-ge’s journey as an abuse victim into an abuser and how much the creation of Bing-mei is a critique on both the writing trope that creates Bing-ge as well as the societal expectations that drive it.

In the world of PIDW, one of Shen Yuan’s main critiques was about how terribly the young Luo Binghe is treated by the narrative, so much so that he views it as torture porn. From being abandoned as a baby, to being abused as a servant and watching his adoptive mother wither from sickness and die, to finding his way to Cang Qiong Mountain and suffering under a cruel shizun who then pushes him into hell, Shen Yuan finds all this unnecessarily cruel. However, Shang Qinghua knows that the trauma Luo Binghe suffers directly correlates to the enjoyment readers are meant to get out of the second half of the protagonist’s life when he becomes overpowered and primed for vengeance. Shen Yuan knows this, too, as this is the trope he girds himself with as Shen Qingqiu to work up the nerve to push his disciple into the Endless Abyss, to “earn” his happiness. However, is this a true happiness? Does the trauma justify any and all of Luo Binghe’s actions?

On the surface, Bing-ge seems happy! He is able to enact revenge on Shen Jiu—and demolish Cang Qiong Mountain Sect who acted as accomplices to his abuse—and was given narrative access to any and every woman of marriageable age who crossed his path. He is even able to destroy his world by merging the three realms with no consequences to himself. Bing-ge has seemingly reaped the twisted “reward” that having survived unconscionable abuse and abandonment from the time of his birth had sown for him, and PIDW readers were able to enjoy and defend Bing-ge’s later megalomaniacal actions directly because they had read through hundreds of pages of his ill-treatment beforehand. The worse Luo Binghe’s childhood was, the more they were willing to accept of his actions in adulthood. We see a similar thing take place in the SVSSS fandom: the reveal of Shen Jiu’s past as a child slave is used to justify his later abuse of his child disciples—children who had no hand in his trauma but who he has decided to bear the brunt of it, anyways. But Shen Jiu lived a very unfulfilling adulthood due to his unwarranted actions until his untimely death. Is Luo Binghe any different?

Enter Bing-mei: the revised protagonist who abandons revenge in pursuit of experiencing genuine affection from the only person who gave it unconditionally. No, Bing-mei doesn’t get all the girls or all the power. He does not become the emperor of all three realms and he is not an uncontested leader that all conscious beings bow to. In fact, he is very tame and controlled in comparison to his PIDW counterpart despite not having complete control of his sword that amplifies his negative emotions. But when Bing-ge slips into the world of SVSSS and discovers that, despite all of this, Bing-mei has an intact world, platonic relationships, and a shizun who loves him, he’s willing to throw it all away to experience that same life. Bing-ge is revealed to be the unhappy, unfulfilled one, because the one thing he wanted—genuine unconditional love—was the one thing that he cannot earn or forcibly take. No amount of audience hype can change the fact that Bing-ge must leave behind the happy Bingqiu couple to return to his destroyed world in his unsatisfying reality.

This isn’t just a theme in SVSSS, either; it’s present in all of MXTX’s works in how people—both characters and the irl fandom—react to antagonists and asshole characters who have experienced trauma. In mdzs: a female cultivator tries to say that Jin Ling endangering other cultivators should be forgiven “since he’s an orphan.” Jiang Cheng throws his parents’ and sister’s death around to justify being an unrepentant serial killer. Jin Guangyao cries about how much his father hates him compared to the legitimate Jin heirs that he murdered. In tgcf: Qi Rong escapes discipline at every turn because his mother had to escape with him from his abusive father, and Mu Qing’s transgressions against the marginalized are ignored because “he was poor, once.” All of these characters have their actions whitewashed both in their stories and by their fandoms at large because their defenders believe that their trauma excuses any of their subsequent behavior.

Yet, MXTX does not prescribe to this idea. Notice the pattern of how the above characters end their stories. Jiang Cheng tanks his reputation and loses the respect of his only living relative. Jin Guangyao and Qi Rong die. But Jin Ling experiences setback after setback until he adjusts his behavior, and Mu Qing had to earnestly apologize under harrowing circumstances to be forgiven. It is not characters who seek justice for being harmed who are punished in these novels but those who persevere in their entitlement to do whatever they want because they were once harmed, thereby eventually destroy any goodwill others, particularly their loved ones, had towards them. The characters who are able to contain their actions to aim only at those who wronged them or else honestly reflect on their sense of entitlement in order to change for the better become well-liked by their peers. And as for Bing-ge: his inability to change within the narrative of PIDW may have “earned” him all the material things his world could offer and the affections of an unseen audience, besides, but he misses out on true human connection and love. These are the things he can never forcibly take, because in real life, no amount of trauma would entitle him—or anyone—to those things.

[essekknits]

I am feeling the urge to write an AU where Jiang Cheng finds A-Yuan instead of Lan Wangji. And he’s conflicted and grieving and angry, but this is a toddler. Maybe a two or three years older than little A-Ling.

And because A-Yuan wasn’t hidden out in the elements for days like he is in canon, but this is relatively close to the battle itself, he isn’t as sick. He’s scared and confused and he’s crying silently for his Xian-gege, and when Jiang Cheng finds him, he looks terrified at the stranger and just starts wailing.

And Jiang Cheng is angry and grieving and this child is a Wen, and the Wen murdered everyone he loved, and the Wen are the reason his brother left him behind, but this is still a sobbing toddler that wasn’t even born yet when the Wen attacked Lotus Pier, a sobbing toddler who is crying for his Xian-gege to come save him, and as angry as he was, and as with as many people as he killed (because he was a soldier in a war, he’s killed many), he never killed a child and he wasn’t going to do it now.

So he awkwardly tries to calm the boy down, and when he cried himself to sleep, Jiang Cheng scoops him up in his arms and carries him off to Lotus Pier.

And it’s rough. Because the only acceptable way to go about this, about taking this boy in, is giving him his name. Making little Wen Yuan into Jiang Yuan. There is something wrong about it. About someone who belongs to those who took everything from him, having his name and his home.

He wonders if that’s how his mother felt, watching the son of the woman who took her husband’s heart run around her home.

There is something wrong about watching that child play and seeing the ghost of his brother, seeing his brother’s smile on his face and hearing his brother’s laughter from his mouth

He wonders if that’s what his father felt like, looking at Wei Wuxian and seeing the ghosts of the friends he loved.

And a realisation dawns on him that it doesn’t matter, because even though this child has the blood of his family’s killers, he can’t fathom the thought of hitting him with zidian. It makes him sick, to think of a child under that thing, or the many other punishments his mother found for them. For Wei Wuxian.

The boy calls him uncle Jiang, and Jiang Cheng remembers another voice calling that name excitedly across the piers, and wonders why his father, who everyone said loved Wei Wuxian, didn’t give him the protection of his name.

Jin Ling doesn’t grow up as alone, here. He has his big cousin Jiang Yuan, who is bright and confident and loves him a lot, and who he follows like a little duckling as he grows up. It’s only when they both grow up a little that they start finding things a bit odd, like how Jiang Yuan calls Jiang Cheng his paternal uncle, yet no one ever speaks of the man having a brother.

So they set to find out.

[spriteofmushrooms]

Your tag in this post about how wwx never sees jc for who he is. You are right and I am crying right now

Jiang Cheng takes after his mother, and that's an immutable fact so it doesn't matter that Jiang Cheng begged Yu Ziyuan on his knees to spare Wei Wuxian. They're the same! It doesn't matter that Jiang Cheng is more diplomatic than his mother or more active than his father, or that he raised Jin Ling in such a way that he feels safe talking shit to Jiang Cheng (which Jiang Cheng NEVER did, only Wei Wuxian talked back).

Wei Wuxian's torture of Wen Chao was all a display for Wen Zhuliu because Wei Wuxian wants him to know how it felt to watch Jiang Cheng suffer. And aren't they the same?

Wei Wuxian knows exactly who 34-year-old Jiang Cheng is: he's 9- and 12- and 15- and 17- and 19- and 21-year-old Jiang Cheng.

Jiang Cheng was most upset about his dogs, who all had stupid names anyway; but actually Jiang Cheng was most upset that his father could love on and comfort Wei Wuxian but not Jiang Cheng. Jiang Cheng was upset at losing because he's sooo competitive, but actually he smiles when he learned Wei Wuxian won in both CQL and the donghua.

Wei Wuxian is the one who knows Jiang Cheng best! Jin Ling is never right. It's impossible that Jin Guangyao knows Jiang Cheng well enough to hurt him.

Jiang Cheng is truly the child who cannot be taught! Jiang Fengmian said so. Which means that Jiang Cheng could never give up any negative feelings he has for Wei Wuxian, and there's no point in explaining anything, and it was all lost long ago without hope of recovery.

[oneeyedoctogod]

Gods this fandom sometimes, I swear. I'm sorry I read two deeply bad takes back to back, and I have to rant. I'm sure others have said it better than I, but really. Come on. I actually have to wonder if people who talk about the extras actually read them because...

Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji didn't leave the cultivation world in canon. They elope, and then they come back. The fact they're not involved in the bigger politics is... pretty much to be expected, but they very much do participate in the day to day lives of the Lan sect. They go where the chaos is to night hunt, they teach, Lan Wangji comforts his brother in his seclusion, and Wei Wuxian meets some new Lan disciples.

As for the cottage fantasy... Again, I honestly have to wonder if the people talking about it actually read the extra it's in? Because it's just that. A fantasy. A dream. It's basically a representation of Wei Wuxian's wants for a domestic life, something he definitely has now! He's always been characterised as someone who wants to help others and who loves cultivation. Why would you think the dream is to be taken literally?

And the idea that Wei Wuxian has 'several important relationships just floating there', that he's not dealing with... Where? Which ones? He teaches the juniors and grows closer to Jin Ling. He doesn't exactly interact with Lan Xichen, but he asks after him. He meets Mianmian again and wishes her well. He asks after Wen Ning after Lan Sizhui comes back then has some father-son bonding moments with him!

Nie Huaisang and Wei Wucian aren't close. They were friendly once, but they didn't ever meet after the lectures. I don't see how that qualifies as an "important" relationship, especially with Nie Huaisang never openly admitting to his part in Wei Wuxian's resurrection. But even then, Wei wuxian says he'll be keeping a close eye on him, so one can imagine they meet again at some point.

As for Jiang Cheng... what more do you want Wei Wuxian to do exactly? Even if you want a reconciliation, why can't Jiang Cjeng be he one to actually grow up and do the work for once? He's the one who never apologized. He's the one who is still openly hostile in the extras. If Wei Wuxian wants to move on and not interact with him, he's well within his right to do that, given how Jiang Cheng treated him. Hell, he's more generous than most since he encourages Jin Ling to talk to Jiang Cheng. If I'd been treated by someone like Jiang Cheng treated Wei Wuxian and saw him hit our nephew several times, I certainly wouldn't encourage them to meet. (But that's Wei Wuxian for you, the moral ideal and better than all of us.)

Anyway, I really don't understand why people insist on making Wangxian have a sadder ending than the one they actually did. It's a HEA for them, sorry guys. And yeah, maybe Wei wuxian has some trauma to work on... but the whole point of the character is that he doesn't let his trauma define him. That he wants to forgives, forgets and moves on.

(Also, just because he doesn't have a breakdown or the cultivation equivalent of therapy in the extra doesn't mean he's not working on them? He finally is at peace, with a solid support network. Maybe he does talk about his past hurts with Lan Wangji - Lan Wangji certai ly knows when to comfort him when he needs it. But the narrative point of the extras is to show they're moving on from the past! And you know what, sometimes the beat thing to do to heal is to do just that. They're living their best lives, deal with it.)

And finally... shit did you really read the whole book and come to the conclusion Wei Wuxian should have 'learned to accept help'? Who the fuck offered help? Who did he refuse?

(Don't say Lan Wangji. 1) I love him, but "Come back to Gusu" is very much not an obvious offer to help, and when Wei Wuxian understandably misunderstands him, he never manages to correct it.

And 2) once Wei Wuxian tells him explicitly he's not leaving the Wen remnants behind, Lan Wangji understands and backs off. He approves! I'm sure he'd do more if he could, but just like Jiang Yanli, he can't!)

Jiang Cheng literally said, 'No one will help you, no one is on your side' (and then made sure that was true by saying Wei Wuxian was the enemy of the cultivation world). Jin Zixuan chose to ask the one who was ambushed to disarm rather than the 300 cultivators attacking him and lunged at him when Wei Wuxian refused to comply (because he'd be killed if he did!!). How is that help?

Who else tried to help? Whose help did Wei Wuxian reject?

Wei Wuxian was presented with a series of bad choices and took the best he could, the ones aligned with his principles, accepting he'd have to face consequences at some point but also knowing it was still worth it. He's not the one who failed or made a fatal mistake or betrayed his word.

Rant over. Sorry about that.

[kjwaikiki]

Protective Jiang Yanli Headcanon:

I have this idea in my head where Jiang Yanli is a bit more protective and political than in canon.

In my head when Wei Wuxian comes to Lotus Pier Jiang Yanli latches on to him just as he seems to latch on to her. Here is someone who needs her, who to a certain degree relies on her. In many ways Jiang Yanli sees Wei Wuxian as her child because she is the one that raises him.

The political side comes in regarding her engagement to Jin Zixuan. Wei Wuxian isn’t treated well by Yu Ziyuan and Yanli knows that her father won’t step in to stop Yu Ziyuan from hurting Wei Wuxian. So Yanli comes up with a plan. Yanli plans to take Wei Wuxian with her to Koi Tower.

Of course this brings its own set of difficulties. She will have to convince her father to let Wei Wuxian go, the toxic environment of Koi Tower, and the fact that Jin Zixuan resents their engagement.

Jiang Yanli schemes. The easiest to overcome is Zixuan’s dislike, she just needs to make him see her as a victim or ally rather than an enemy. This idea leads to her ultimate plan.

Yanli is going to poison herself while she is at Koi Tower. She is going to lay the blame on either one of the female Jin disciples who acted out of jealousy or one of Jin Guangshan’s cronies with the excuse that they think closer ties with Yunmeng Jiang will cause a decrease in their power (or something similar). The point is that she needs there to be an initial panic, investigation, and ultimately while someone will be caught Yanli needs there to be doubt in her parents’ minds as to whether Koi Tower is safe for her.

At this point Yanli will request that Wei Wuxian comes to Koi Tower and acts as her bodyguard. She knows that with the recent poisoning attempt her father will be weak to her request and more likely to grant it. It will be even more effective if she can get Jin Zixuan to request that Wei Wuxian come to Koi Tower to look after her because her parents can’t deny a sect heir easily.

Jin Zixuan will make the request because after Yanli poisons herself and her fiancé comes to see her she will tearfully request that he bring one of her brothers to Koi Tower. She will say she is afraid and that she misses her brothers. She will act weak and pitiful to soften Jin Zixuan’s heart to her. Jin Zixuan will see how Yanli was poisoned by someone of his sect and see her as a victim. He will pity her and thus accept her request and bring it up to her parents.

Of course Jiang Cheng cannot come to Koi Tower he is the sect heir and must stay in Yunmeng Jiang where it is safe. Wei Wuxian however is much more free to come to Koi Tower and look after his Shijie.

Jiang Yanli is happy. Months of planning, carefully building up an immunity to poison, and gathering the necessary ingredients have all payed off. As for the toxic cloud hanging over Koi Tower, there was already one poisoning attempt who is to say that there won’t be a second and that Jin Guangshan is the unfortunate victim this time. Of course with Jin Guangshan dead and Jin Zixuan the new sect leader Wei Wuxian will need to stay at Koi Tower indefinitely to protect Jiang Yanli.

I’m not sure how this ends. Maybe with Jin Ling’s birth or maybe with Wei Wuxian marrying Lan Wangji. I don’t know how much Jiang Cheng or Wei Wuxian know about Jiang Yanli’s plan. I am aware that Jiang Yanli can be considered OC. In the end this is just an idea that I had and wanted to share. I hope you like it!

[red-garden]

When will we, as a society, understand that Jin Guangyao’s story is about survival and the things he had to do to make it, rather than one super evil guy just trying to be awful and kill people? We can look past Wei Wuxian torturing and killing nameless Wen soldiers because we’re not attached to them and they’re Wens. That gets to be justified because it’s the bloody revenge of the protagonist on henchman #362. We can look past his desecration of the dead, his raising of fallen soldiers to tear apart their brothers in arms, because they’re the baddies. We look past him deserting Jiang Cheng after his return because he had people to protect and Jiang Cheng is an asshole (affectionate). Don’t misconstrue me- I love Wei Wuxian, and I think that he is a basically good person that was pushed past his breaking point and did some truly awful things as a result. He’s not a bad person. But he’s not better than Meng Yao.

Walk with me, Jin Guangyao antis. Let’s recount every bad thing Jin Guangyao has ever done in chronological order.

1) killed Nie Mingjue’s general

2) got Su She to cast the 100 holes curse on Jin Zixun (possibly to frame Wei Wuxian)

3) advocated for and later worked with Xue Yang

4) killed Nie Mingjue

5) banged his sister before he knew they were siblings, later married her after knowing

6) everything about Jin Guangshan’s death

7) allegedly killed his own son

8) chopping nie Mingjue up into little pieces and keeping his head in a cupboard

9) putting all the juniors in The Zombie Cave to get everyone on Wei Wuxian’s ass and kill a lot of people

10) almost killing Jin Ling

Numero uno first ever Bad Meng Yao Deed was killing Nie Mingjue’s general. You know, the general that constantly belittled him and repeatedly insulted his mom. Not only is this one totally understandable, it was also filial.

Next the 100 holes curse. There’s not solid proof that he wanted to frame WWX for this, it’s more likely this was just a better hidden filial killing in the name of his mother’s honor that ended up negatively impacting WWX.

Xue Yang is a little freak, but he’s a powerful, smart little freak. He was to protect Xue Yang in the interest of his father, although he does keep working with him after JGS’s death. This one was a power grab, trying to have extra pieces on the board to ensure his position among the Jin.

Nie Mingjue was another filial killing. If there’s one thing Meng Yao is gonna do is always be filial to his mom. Additionally, Nie Mingjue was not a perfect innocent angel either, he supported killing the Wen remnants. This wasn’t Meng Yao killing the last unicorn y’all. AND AND ALSO ALSO Jin Guangshan ordered this!!!!!!!!!! He was obeying his father to maintain his social position!!!!!!! What’s not clicking?

I get really mad over the Qin Su stuff, because marrying her after she was already pregnant was the kindest thing he could do for her. Should he have told her they were siblings and let her make her own choice? Absolutely. But he was trying protect her, and I can’t fault him for that. (Call back the nonconsensual golden core transfer)

The only thing I won’t defend is how he killed JGS. JGS was world’s worst guy, but no one deserves to be raped under any conditions. The sex workers he hired didn’t deserve to die, they didn’t deserve any of that. One thing I will say is that he didn’t plan for Sisi to be there. She had been transferred, he didn’t expect her, and after the fact he fed and clothed and kept her comfortable for the rest of her life. Keeping her under house arrest was how he protected his social position. Psychologically speaking I understand why he killed JGS like this however. While jiggy loved his mom, it’s clear he didn’t love sex workers more broadly, and saw his mom as an exception among them. He didn’t see the sex workers he killed as people, only saving Sisi because she was another supposed exception. For JGS, this was a taste of his own medicine type beat. JGS is a rapist, who raped Qin Su’s mom and jiggy’s mom when she was 15. I completely understand why he chose to kill JGS this way, but that doesn’t make it okay.

Jin Rusong’s death is completely alleged. While it ended up being politically advantageous to jiggy to squash the smaller sects that plotted against him, we have no idea if he killed his son. While he does say he does, he also says he killed Qin Su, who killed herself. While he may feel responsible for both their deaths, that doesn’t mean he killed them. I should point out the one claiming he killed his son was Sect Leader Yao, you know, the mob mentality character.

Chopping Nie Mingjue up is just common sense. Harder for a fierce corpse to kill you if it’s just a head. Harder to identify a body if it’s just a leg. “This is desecrating the dead” AND WHAT WAS WEI WUXIAN DOING, RIDDLE ME THAT BATMAN

For the juniors, this one was just poorly thought out tbh. He needed the Jianghu to get WWX’s ass because he was going to uproot him from his comfortable life. So he harmlessly leaves all the kids in a cave, gets everyone out there, gets their energy sealed, and lets people point fingers at WWX when the zombies start coming. He knows this likely would result in the deaths of many cultivators- many cultivators who need I remind you, make up the bourgeois, talk nasty about his mom, and who supported killing the Wen Remnants. This was like the ocean gate of wuxia, but y’all aren’t ready for that. He was protecting the life he worked so hard for, plain and simple 

Okay there are two things I won’t defend. While I don’t think he would’ve taking JL’s life, I can’t imagine how traumatic that was for Jin Ling. BUT AGAIN, I understand why he did it. He was grasping at straws, clinging to anything he thought might keep him alive, and he did a desperate, shitty thing. If you want to believe he never loved Jin Ling because of this moment, be my guest, but if there’s one thing jiggy can do is love.

All in all, he did a lot of desperate, shitty things to claw his way to a better life, and a lot of desperate shitty things to keep it. If you think he shouldn’t have cared so much about being part of the Jianghu, CONGRATULATIONS, YOU MISSED THE POINT !!🎉🎊 Poverty is violence, and he grew up in it. It was his mother’s wish, what she broke herself doing, to give him a better life. He was a good son, not going to squander what his mother gave him, trying to protect his very precarious position in a society that hated him for the fact of being born wrong. He’s not a moral paragon, but no one in mdzs is. They’re all people that react in deeply human ways to deeply unfair situations. They lash out, commit violence, do things they regret. Jiggy did a lot of terrible things, but the point is that he shouldn’t have had to.

[sonik-kun]

MXTX describes Jiang Cheng as a negative person, but ultimately, he is not a terrible, evil monster.

We all know why Jiang Cheng is, by nature, a negative person. Aside from all the loss of life he has experienced, he had a rather toxic and tumultuous upbringing by his parents.

His father gave him little attention and seemed to favour Wei Wuxian (which only served to exacerbate the rumours of a secret affair he had with Wei Wuxian's mother, causing an even bigger rift between him and Madame Yu).

Not only did he seem to favour Wei Wuxian, he also often compared him to him, placed unrealistic expectations on him and refused to ever acknowledge Jiang Cheng's own amazing achievements (The fact that he was able to work hard and keep pace with a child prodigy like Wei Wuxian is impressive in itself.) He also told him that he didn't understand the family motto.. Do y'all not see how alienating that must be for Jiang Cheng? Especially being told that whilst he was still a child who was developing and set to be the future sect heir.

Then there was his mother who was both verbally and physically abusive to Wei Wuxian and him. She often demeaned Jiang Cheng and compared her to Wei Wuxian, pitting the two against each other despite the two of them wanting to just be friends. She was a wedge between a beautiful friendship and whilst I understand her grievances, especially towards her husband, she still put a huge strain on their friendship which only fed into Jiang Cheng's insecurities. It was unfair of her to take her anger out on her children and their disciple.

Jiang Cheng had no real, adult figure to ground him and reassure him other than his sister. But she too was a child under a great amount of pressure. That role should never have fallen upon her.

With all this taken into consideration, it is no wonder why Jiang Cheng grew up to be bitter, negative and resentful.

It makes you wonder that had he had a normal upbringing with supportive parents and never experienced the great amount of loss he went through, would he had turned out to be a completely different person?

I propose to you that he would. And we can see that person in his nephew, Jin Ling.

[helpmeimblorboing]

There’s just something about people looking at the children of late loved ones and thinking “you would be proud of them” that just makes me ugly cry

Jiang Cheng looking at Jin Ling and seeing all the shards of Yanli in him. Her gentleness, buried under his father’s bumbling, good hearted bluster

Lan Wangji seeing Wei Wuxian in the way Lan Sizhui smiles, in the way he acts around the people he loves

Further back, even something like Fengmian just going “You would have been proud of him, Changze”, while watching WWX train makes me cry

Maybe I’m just oversensitive

[admirableadmiranda]

I keep seeing the idea that Jiang Cheng is disliked or hated for his actions because "Jiang Cheng Antis” refuse to acknowledge ugly reactions to trauma, or victims who aren’t perfect, basically citing that he should be forgiven more than we do because not everyone is going to react the same to pain and trauma and just because his reactions aren’t perfect doesn’t mean that he should be held accountable for his actions, any of them, and us calling his actions wrong or abuse is us in fact being terrible.

I want to refute this idea for a few reasons:

First off, while I can’t speak for everyone, I know that I and my friends don’t think that his initial reactions being kinda bad are necessarily damning. Nobody is going to be perfect, sometimes when we are stuck in the worst parts of our lives, we do things that we will later regret in the process of surviving those times. It doesn’t really make it okay and we should understand if the people who are around us in those times don’t want to be around us anymore after that, but it isn’t a death knell that he reacts really poorly after the initial fall of Lotus Pier and the death of his parents and everyone he’s grown up with. I have forgiven characters for doing worse, but proving that it was their worst and turning around after that.

The problem with that part is that he doesn’t turn anything around. He never apologizes for strangling Wei Wuxian, he continues to turn the blame for what happened on people who weren’t involved even after getting to kill Wen Zhuliu and torture Wen Chao to death, holding Wei Wuxian, Lan Wangji and, for a time, Jin Zixuan as also being responsible even though none of them were, even though he knows this and adjusts his opinion later to drop Jin Zixuan out of the blame, even though he later adds Wen Ning to his list of those to blame despite Wen Ning rescuing him from Lotus Pier and sheltering him. It isn’t a worst moment of his life, brought on by trauma and pain, it’s just the start of his sliding slope downward.

Second off is the idea that this should exonerate him of all of his actions. Look at him! He lost his parents and his clan to war by the Wens! He has suffered so much, becoming a clan leader so young in the fires of war!!!

Except... he’s not the only one, not by a long shot. Lan Wangji, Lan Xichen, Nie Mingjue and Nie Huaisang all have their fathers killed and their homes attacked by the Wens as well. Both Nie Mingjue and Lan Xichen also ascend at very young ages, no one was over twenty when they took up their positions, and at the end of the novel, Jin Ling is even younger when he takes on his own clan leader position. Also he isn’t the only one to go into war so young, Wei Wuxian is a whole five days older than he is, and the whole jianghu falls into war against the Wens, no doubt with other fighters who also lost their homes and families in the process.

It isn’t that it isn’t impressive that he manages to pull it together in the face of all that’s happening, it’s that he’s not the only person by any means to suffer this trauma. Wei Wuxian goes through the exact same journey that he does, but when this argument comes up, it’s always just for why Jiang Cheng shouldn’t be blamed, not about how their whole generation lost so much to a war that their parents left to them by refusing to do anything before even when they all saw the signs of what Wen Ruohan was doing.

The third part is that there’s apparently no limit or expiration date on how long people have to forgive him for doing whatever he wants to do. His trauma is a reason for him to treat people however he wants for as long as he wants, and they should just put up with it because he’s suffering and not all pain is beautiful.

But by the time Wei Wuxian comes back to life, it’s been almost twenty years. A whole generation, long enough for Jiang Cheng to watch his nephew grow to almost adulthood. The world as a whole is changed, he himself has transformed Lotus Pier into a whole new place; and it wasn’t because the Wens had destroyed everything, Wei Wuxian no longer recognizes it, meaning that this happened after he died. The general attitude that JC stans have towards Wei Wuxian is that he shouldn’t hold Jiang Cheng leading a siege against him because it’s been long enough, he should get over it by now. But Jiang Cheng apparently should still get to act without hesitation or consideration of others and their own pain because he is suffering, he is an imperfect victim. It doesn’t matter what else anyone else has gone through and it is unreasonable to hold him to task because he lost his family.

The whole point of poor trauma reactions is that they are moments, responses in time to events. It is one thing for Jiang Cheng to react poorly right after his family is killed and his home invaded. But he gets worse over the course of the story. The day of the attack, he strangles Wei Wuxian. That’s one thing. But three years later he turns on Wei Wuxian, declares him an enemy of the world, tells him to let the Wens be slaughtered even though they are no longer at war, later declares war on Wei Wuxian and personally leads a siege to kill him. In the interim, a time of peace in which supposedly all of his enemies are dead, he hunts down people who he claims to be demonic cultivators and people that Wei Wuxian is possessing and tortures them to death, all the while doing very little to help his people as he will only intervene once someone has already died to the problem. When Wei Wuxian returns to life thirteen years after he died, seventeen years after the war, when Jiang Cheng is literally double the age that this began, despite him deliberately trying to avoid Jiang Cheng, Jiang Cheng seeks him out multiple times specifically to hurt him, first trying to kill him with a whip that can destroy spirits possessing bodies, then tying him up and torturing him with a dog. Later he leads a second siege upon Wei Wuxian, who still has done nothing to him aside from try to avoid him before later attacking him and Lan Wangji by first demanding that they leave, then refusing to let them do so, driving Wei Wuxian to a qi deviation (which can be fatal, that’s how Nie Mingjue died) and attacking Lan Wangji and Wei Wuxian with Zidian while Wei Wuxian is unconcious before Wen Ning stops him. Even in the temple, he’s still demanding that Wei Wuxian play by his rules of debts, he’s upset because he knows that he has gone so much farther than anyone has any right to and he has nothing to hold over Wei Wuxian’s head anymore.

Fifteen years of hurting everyone around him isn’t a poor trauma response. That’s deliberate and chosen. That is what he wants to do. It is a clear line of events where in the end, the trauma is an excuse over anything else.

If it had ended at the beginning of this list, Jiang Cheng would be a very different character and Modaozushi would be a very different novel. If it were just a trauma reaction and he didn’t want to hurt anyone in the long run, we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

But you cannot exonerate everything with the fact that his parents died when he was seventeen. Especially not when we have so many other people who react in so many other ways to the same pain. It is frankly ridiculous that people think he is the only one to suffer in the story, even though it is clear that no one escapes the novel unscathed and a hell of a lot of people die. Sometimes even at his hands or by his orders.

Jiang Cheng is not unsympathetic. I can understand what hurts he feels, at least to an extent. But an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind and he just keeps doing it. And then his stans show up and claim that it’s fine for him to want to kill everyone who he hates (not necessarily everyone who’s even done him wrong, and they certainly like to ignore everything he does to them) because he’s an ugly trauma victim.

He may be that, at the start. But twenty years down the line, when he gets excited at the thought of getting to torture people, that isn’t a trauma reaction anymore.

That’s a choice.

[mxtxfanatic]

He Who Can Be Taught! (or a Meta on Jin Ling and His Shishu)

Wei Wuxian and Jin Ling don't start off the story with the best relationship. Jin Ling has been taught all his life that Wei Wuxian intentionally murdered both of us parents, and added to the fact that the boy has picked up the worst traits between his father and maternal uncle, it would have been understandable for the relationship to fail. However, the more time Jin Ling spent with his shishu, the more he comes to care about the man he was raised to hate, going from this:

The young master was none other than Jin Ling. Crossing his arms, the boy said coldly, “Kick you? Anyone who dares utter the name “Wei Wuxian” around me should kneel before me in gratitude if I don’t kill them! And here you were shrieking and hollering it here in the middle of the street. Are you looking to die?!” Wei Wuxian hadn’t expected Jin Ling to turn up here, much less that Jin Ling would be as arrogant and dictatorial as this. What’s wrong with this child? How did he become so vicious and short- tempered? He’s stubborn and arrogant, and thinks everyone is beneath him. Excellent job picking up his uncle’s and his father’s flaws—but he hasn’t acquired half a speck of his mother’s virtues. If I don’t rough him up a bit, he’ll pay for it big time sooner or later. Seeing that Jin Ling didn’t seem done venting his anger and had closed in a couple of paces on the fallen man, Wei Wuxian interrupted. “Jin Ling!”

—Chapt. 20: Sunshine II, fanyiyi

Jin Ling spoke again. “My uncle grew up with him, and my grandfather saw him as his own child. My grandmother didn’t mistreat him either, but him? Because of him, Lotus Pier got turned into those Wen clan scum’s evil lair. Because of him, the Yunmeng Jiang Clan was decimated and scattered to the wind. Because of him, my grandmother and grandfather died together, and now my uncle is the only one left! He only has himself to blame for his inevitable death. In the end, all of the winds and waves he stirred up left him with a dismembered, mutilated corpse! What’s there to be unclear about, exactly? What could he possibly be let off the hook for?!”

—Chapt. 43: Beauty I, fanyiyi

...to actively trying to seek the other man out after discovering that maybe what he'd been told all his life wasn't as clear-cut as he'd been taught:

Little did he know that after he, Lan WangJi, and Wen Ning had left the Lotus Pier, Jin Ling had sneakily went to look for him. Realizing that Wei WuXian had disappeared, Jin Ling had ran to his uncle—who for some unknown reason was madly grabbing everyone he saw, asking them to unsheathe some shabby, old sword—and thrown a huge tantrum at him. Pointing at his uncle’s nose, Jin Ling had blamed him for Wei WuXian’s running away, and had gotten slapped by Jiang Cheng so hard that he’d fallen to the ground. Deciding to do what he had been planning to do in the first place, Jin Ling had gone off on his own to trace after Wei WuXian’s whereabouts with Fairy, without a care for consequences. ... Instead of answering, Jin GuangYao shot back another question. “A-Ling, what are you doing all the way over here?” Jin Ling shot a glance at Wei WuXian and hesitated in answering.

—Chapt. 99: A Hatred for Life Part 2, boat-full-of-lotus-pods

Hearing that both Wei WuXian and Lan WangJi had disappeared, Jin Ling hurried outside and nearly tripped himself by the tall doorstep of the Guanyin temple’s main gate. Despite his haste, the two were already nowhere to be seen. Fairy happily circled around him with her tongue out. Standing by a tree, rigid and sky-high within the Guanyin temple’s grounds, was Jiang Cheng, who looked over at Jin Ling and spoke coldly, “Clean your face.” Giving his eyes and face a few forceful wipe, Jin Ling dashed over and asked, “Where are they?”

—Chapt. 110: Concealment Part 4, boat-full-of-lotus-pods

...to even being able to nighthunt together, have a serious conversation, be teased, and be told that Wei Wuxian is proud of him and his growth (despite Jin Ling's embarrassment at the displays of affection) without Jin Ling lashing out in violence:

Jin Ling was still on guard. Seeing that Wei WuXian really didn’t seem like he was going to do anything else, Jin Ling finally managed to stay seated. When one of the waitresses saw that the chaos here finally ended, she came to add more water with a smile on her face. Wei WuXian took up the cup and took a sip, before he suddenly called, “A-Ling.” Jin Ling had on a haughty tone, “What?” Wei WuXian, however, only grinned, “This time, you seem to have grown up quite a bit.” Jin Ling stopped. Wei WuXian felt his own chin, “Right now, you appear to be, hm, a lot more reliable. I’m really happy, but I’m also a bit... How should I say it? Honestly, how much of an idiot you used to be was quite adorable as well.” Jin Ling, again, found it hard to stay seated. Out of the blue, Wei WuXian reached out and gave his shoulders a tight hug, ruffling his hair, “But no matter what, I’m more than happy that I get to see you little brat again, haha!” Ignoring the mess that his hair was in, Jin Ling hopped up from the bench and rushed outside. Wei WuXian dragged him back with another strike, “Where are you going?” Even Jin Ling’s neck had reddened. He spoke in a rough voice, “I’m going to check out the White Room!”

...

Wei WuXian knew what he was thinking even without looking at him. He patted his head and smiled, “Put up a good show, if you happen to come across the opportunity.” Jin Ling complained, “Don’t touch my head. You can’t touch a man’s head, don’t you know?”

—Chapt. 123: Iron Hook Extra, exr

Needless to say, the transformation of Jin Ling and Wei Wuxian's relationship from would-be "enemies" to a proper shishu-shizhi relationship that Jiang Yanli would have been proud of is just another notch in the list of reasons why Wei Wuxian's resurrection was a net positive in the cultivation world.

[mediocretosubpar-soup]

inspired by this post by @whumpbby and @marudny-robot but posted on its own because of the zhanchengxian vibes that don't fit the original post and the length. this really got away from me.

may i butt in here with the alternative idea of lan wangji and jiang cheng working together to revive wei wuxian?

for this to work three things must be a given a) jin ling must be grown up ideally with a family of his own b) yunmeng jiang inheritance is rock solid, c) the circumstances of wei wuxian's death must be harrowing. (yet another unasked for self-sacrifice would put jiang cheng into the correct headspace, i think)

so, lan wangji and jiang cheng work together to revive wei wuxian and they find out that the best body given the absence of an original body would be jiang cheng's.

lan wangji finds out first. this puts him at an impasse. because he does want wei wuxian back and he swore he would get him back morality be damned. and yet wei wuxian loved jiang cheng, unconditionally, beyond sense and reason. he would hate lan wangji for doing that.

lan wangji decides to test jiang cheng. he leaves the scroll for him to find. if jiang cheng reads it and never mentions it again, lan wangji can still decide to force him into the ritual. if jiang cheng reads the scroll and decides to go along. well, it's his choice, isn't it?

of course, the next day jiang cheng slams the scroll onto their shared table and says, he found a solution. lan wangji is stumped, he didn't expect jiang cheng to choose this. not really. so large is his surprise that he blurts out, why? do you want to die?

jiang cheng looks at him for a long moment, then his mouth twists into a wry smile. "i was always supposed to die for wei wuxian." he doesn't elaborate. instead jiang cheng sets a plan into motion, first he says, we must make sure that the other sects don't go to war with you. only, yunmeng jiang and jin ling will know of lan wangji's involvement, jiang cheng decides, if they find out some other way, they will assume you tricked me somehow. they'll probably still hate you but they won't persecute you or wei wuxian. the other sects can't know because that would damage lan wangji's reputation and your reputation is what protects wei wuxian.

as for wei wuxian, he doesn't need to know about your involvement, jiang cheng reasons, he hates other people doing what he does so callously and you'll be a prime target for his anger. lan wangji still shell-shocked by jiang cheng going with the self-sacrifice just stares. jiang cheng misinterprets his stare and goes, even if he does find out he'll forgive you, he only ever sees the best in you.

jiang cheng writes a few very long letters to jin ling, to his heir, his disciples.

"you're not writing to wei wuxian?" lan wangji asks.

jiang cheng puts down his brush. "it's better if he hears it from you." he explains. "my words, wei wuxian will find a way to twist them. he respects you, believes in you, it's safer for you to tell him if we want to stop him." lan wangji understands. "he'll try to bring you back." of course, wei wuxian loved jiang cheng. the man himself rolls his eyes, "yeah, the bastard thinks he's still indebted to my father."

"wei ying doesn't mention your father often. yet he speaks of you once a day, often more than that."

jiang cheng snorts, can't be anything good.

on the contrary, lan wangji drank vinegar more often than not when wei wuxian spoke of yunmeng jiang and the jiang siblings. adoration in every word about that past life. the vitriol he spared for jiang cheng of today and even for him his voice took on a wistful quality. if jiang cheng offered, would you still stay in gusu? lan wangji wondered in the morning gloom when wei wuxian still slept next to him. his mind only settled when he remembered that jiang cheng held nothing but resentment for wei wuxian and would never offer or ask.

"you don't think he cares for you." lan wangji concludes.

jiang cheng sighs deeply. "he didn't have much of a choice, did he?" he turns back to his writing. lan wangji cuts in, "you know better than to think him so opportunistic." jiang cheng pulls his hand from where it's reached for the brush and redirects his attention to lan wangji. "it's not opportunistic for an orphan to choose safety. maybe he was fond of me back then but he was young and didn't know what the world had to offer." lan wangji isn't going to convince jiang cheng otherwise, unlike lan wangji, jiang cheng has no doubt who wei wuxian would choose.

-

"we have a problem." jiang cheng states because he doesn't believe in social conventions like greetings and disingenious niceties, a trait lan wangji begrudgingly approves of.

"wei wuxian will have access to his golden core once he's inside my body, he could fuck the whole thing up." yet another thing of jiang cheng's that lan wangji must bitterly approve of. jiang cheng, lan wangji has noted, never refers to the golden core as anything but wei wuxian's. lan wangji insinuated the same thing to wei wuxian only once and wei wuxian's face had gone dark. the next day, he went on an impromptu three months trip after which he acted like the words and their subsequent argument had never happened.

"are you listening?" jiang cheng's brow is furrowed. "listen, i know the plan was for you to find wei wuxian a few days later but if wei wuxian fights me, ...."

"back in the cave, wei wuxian always believed you would come for him." lan wangji says instead of anything reasonable such as i wonder if you're fully commited which would light a zealous fire in jiang cheng to prove him wrong. jiang cheng stares at him. "lan wangji, i've never beaten wei wuxian at anything. we can't fail."

he's not looking for reassurance. what could lan wangji offer him other than insincere (sounding) platitudes. jiang cheng is not a man who leaves things to chance, his planning is meticulous, he has considered the jianghu turning on wei wuxian, prepared enough money and identity passes to dongyin and beyond. he expects wei wuxian to resist maybe even to overcome him, lan wangji is supposed to be the ace up his sleeve.

something churns in lan wangji's insides, he nods his assent anyways.

-

wei wuxian fights, furiously, viciously. but jiang cheng is equally furious and far more vicious.

"didn't you say you wanted to live your life? that you wanted to see the world? what about all those talismans you were going to invent?" jiang cheng mocks the plans wei wuxian made, he must have been listening at every discussion conference at every night hunt. then even more cruelly. "what about the people you left? what do you think happened to your lan zhan?" it's perfect, wei wuxian falters, heart suddenly cleaved in two.

lan wangji has his fingers on the guqin's strings, he plays,

"--"

the summoning array goes dark, the body inside collapses. lan wangji shoots up and runs inside the cottage. the body is lying unmoving on the ground. lan wangji rushes towards it, he's killed them both, what was he thinking?

a fist meets his face, hard enough for bone to crunch and teeth to rattle. it's instinct more than will that responds to the attack, either man would have the right to kill him. he ceases his defense and allows the other man to throw him on the ground.

above him jiang cheng's face twists into a jovial grimace. "husband," wei wuxian says. "what have you done?" lan wangji sags in relief as wei wuxian carefully places jiang cheng's booted foot on lan wangji's sword hand.

there's a flaw in jiang cheng's plan that lan wangji never pointed out.

"we brought you back." lan wangji's never been able to lie to wei wuxian. the boot grinds down.

"we?" wei wuxian tilts his head. "who's this we you speak of, i wonder?" bones are ground into flesh. "you're here hole and hale."

and here's another flaw, lan wangji suspected but wasn't certain of until now. wei wuxian won't forgive him. which is fair, he's not sure he could forgive in wei wuxian's place. wei wuxian leans in.

"how did you do it?" if he presses down any harder lan wangji's hand will be ruined. "how did you convince jiang cheng to...." wei wuxian's voice breaks off.

"i put the notes on the table for him to see." lan wangji says. the next moment, wei wuxian's hands are around his neck. "some notes? as if that would have been enough?" his nails scratch at lan wangji's skin, no pressure on lan wangji's throat. lan wangji is glad for that, wei wuxian would be upset if killed him, he thinks. at the very least, he would be upset if he killed him quickly. lan wangj can't decide if fighting him or staying still would prevent that.

"did you tell him, i was better than him?" wei wuxian hisses as if he hasn't said that a thousand times. lan wangji doesn't think pointing it out would help. but wei wuxian's eyes take on a hysterical gleam. "and the fool believed it, didn't he? all your lies. of how he couldn't make anything out of himself without me, how he was only ever half as good as me? how everyone always preferred me?" wei wuxian jerks his hand back and brings it down in a swift strike.

the hand stops an inch from lan wangji's face. zidian sparks to life, whacks wei wuxian in the chest hard enough to knock him off lan wangji. the whip wraps around wei wuxian in tight coils. lan wangji sits up, avoids looking at his throbbing hand.

jiang cheng's face glares at him familarly. "lan wangji," its mouth spits. "how dare you mess this up? a wrong note? of all the things, i expected to go wrong, you weren't even in my cards." jiang cheng hangs his head. "trust a lan to screw me over." the body goes stiff. and then hisses, "you planned this together?"

jiang cheng laughs, "what did you expect us to just accept your magnanimous sacrifice? fuck you, wei wuxian. you fool. you idiot."

"and your plan was to kill yourself? great job, jiang cheng, very original."

"aren't you the one called a genius? how could we, the mediocre brained possibly come up with an alternative when your first solution to every minor inconvenience is falling on a sword?"

"minor inconvenience, we were trapped! we all would have died! you and lan zhan had better chances of getting out. it was obviously the best choice."

"you decided." wei wuxian and jiang cheng focus on lan wangji. "you never asked us what we thought."

wei wuxian glares at him. "i didn't need to. i could tell what you were thinking. between the two of you, the choice would have been jiang cheng. you because you love me. jiang cheng because he's still hung up on the golden core. i wasn't going to let that happen."

in lan wangji's head a youthful rage sprouts again, he can't open his mouth, he doesn't know what will come out.

"maybe so. but if only you were open to discussing anyone but you, who knows maybe the rescue parties would have found us before we got to a decision. too bad, we'll never know, wei wuxian because you went and tried to do everything on your own."

"that's a bit of a leap, no one even knew we had been on a nighthunt. there is never going to be any situation in which i'm going to let you die for me, jiang cheng. do you hear me? i don't care how you feel about it as long as you're alive to so."

"it still could have been me then." lan wangji interrupts their spat. one of them frowns at him like shufu frowns at imbecilic sect heirs. lan wangji thinks that must be jiang cheng.

"lan zhan, don't be ridiculous how is that any better? you think i wouldn't be devastated by your loss? where would i even go without you?" wei wuxian asks as if current events left any doubts.

"you could have brought me back. if you called, i would come." lan wangji states earnestly.

"unbelievable," mutters jiang cheng. as if he wouln't have helped wei wuxian steal the remains of the yin tiger seal, just like he followed them into the temple. and then the body keels over.

-

the ritual drained jiang cheng's spiritual reserves. it's only sleep. lan wangji drags them over to the comfortable cot to rest and hovers over them, whistling inquiry while feeding qi into jiang cheng's body.

a groan. lan wangji blinks, tilts and jerks up right. a dark eye slides open, blinks twice to focus.

"lan wangji, why the fuck haven't you taken care of your hand? what the fuck is wrong with you?" jiang cheng calls back zidian and drags himself from the bed.

"stay down." he snarls at lan wangji. he stumbles over to a cabinet from which he drags a medical kit. he comes back and begins pulling out supplies. "you didn't even cool it. can you bend."

"it's not broken." jiang cheng shoots him a dark glare. lan wangji refuses to cower under it. "no just bruised like.... what the hell was he thinking."

"i enabled you on a suicidal endeavour." lan wangji says. "i never expected another reaction." jiang cheng has a very narrow minded view of wei wuxian but even he isn't bold enough to deny that wei wuxian had been upset. "he would have gotten over it." which is a bold statement after hearing wei wuxian swearing that he'd do whatever it took to ensure jiang cheng's safety. jiang cheng peers closer at lan wangji's neck and huffs, "made a right mess." whether he's talking about lan wangji's neck or the entire day, lan wangji can't say.

[blogauroragloryme]

Yesterday I was scrolling through Pinterest and stumbled into many fan art depicting Jiang Cheng and Jin Ling. JC taking care of JL as a month old baby ,then as a toddler,etc etc...

It reminded me that we never really give much credit to JC for raising JL. I mean sure JGY also played a part , but JC's affection and concern for JL is unbeatable. There was this fanart where JC is actually holding a very tiny JL , trying to figure out how to feed him , then how to change his clothes and all the things that involves taking care of a newborn. The expressions depicted in JC's face just made me ache. I mean just imagine the pain of losing his sister, brother in law and WY(cmon I know despite of JC's love and hate relationship with WY, there definitely must be a part in his heart that must be aching) fresh in his mind , having to take care of a new born , which you have zero idea about. You have to build your sect ,you don't have anyone else to rely on. You can't show your weakness to anyone else. Even if you are damn tired , almost near a mental breakdown,you cannot falter ,you have a nephew and he doesn't have anyone else but you as a family. I would like to believe many a times when JC would be extremely tired and feeling hopeless,JL must be a source of his motivation to keep on.

(I can see a bit of parallelism here with LQR where both of them were young(baby of the house 🤭)and thrusted the responsibility of taking care of their respective nephews. They're not married,but with hit and trial,they are able to raise their nephews to be fine young men.)

Just imagining what would JC have taught JL for his first word. Would he insist that JL learn Mother first before anything. Imagining JC telling a toddler JL about how his parents were ,his mother ,his father,his grandmother and grandfather and about his Da-jiu(only till the time JL doesn't understand as soon as he would grow up ,he would stop telling JL about how the three of them used to enjoy Lotus pier).

And JL eventually learning to call Jiujiu.When JC and JL had their first fight how JC must have felt? Like he's been a strict person like his mother and how certain traits of his mother can be reflected in his upbringing of JL? And when JL got his first scrape after falling down,how worried JC must be? Ok there are so many what if's and possibilities to think about...

But I just wanted to mention that JC tried his very best to raise his nephew. Parenting can always have good and bad , that's what we can see ,but both of them share a loving bond.

I really wanted to write this appreciation post for JC. I know JC has committed horrible mistakes, which are inexcusable ,but still some fans are really very harsh in criticizing him. As much as I love WY ,I won't deny that in some instances I even fault WY ,for not understanding the bigger picture. For me the simple conclusion is that both of them had pride and anger and the result was disastrous. Some are more to blame for their actions,some are less,but the mistake was on both of their part's.

So yes he's a Sour purple grape lol ,but I really hope post canon,him and WY are able to find some semblance and common footing.