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room-surprise · 1 month ago

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PSA: Mithrun doesn't run a noodle shop after the end of the manga!

(WARNING FOR SPOILERS)

Awhile back I posted a PSA about how Mickbell and Kuro don't run a noodle shop in the canon, they run an "everything store." In this post I mentioned that "Mithrun running a noodle shop" was also not canon, and that I'd get around to talking about it later.

Both of these fanons are the result of some mistranslation and information getting passed through multiple people, resulting in a very popular fanon that some people think is canon, that Mithrun is running an Asian-style noodle shop in Merini, and that he's in competition with Mickbell and Kuro.

Please note, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with Mithrun (or Mickbell and Kuro) running a noodle shop! If you like the idea and want to write or draw things about that, it's fine! It's just not canon.

SO WHAT IS CANON?

Unfortunately a lot of the information we have about what happens to Mithrun after the end of the manga comes from the still untranslated second version of the Adventurer's Bible, a Chinese Q&A posted by Kui's Chinese publisher, and autograph sessions where Kui answered fan questions, and fans posted about it on Twitter and Reddit.

You can understand why the last one, fans self-reporting what Kui told them, is extremely unreliable and shouldn't be considered the same level of "canon" as something that Kui had printed and published, or that was recorded in an official capacity.

A fan at the Korean signing described it like this (paraphrasing for clarity):

A group of about 100 fans gathered in big room with a screen, where they were playing the anime. The publisher called us up one by one, and we were guided to a smaller room, where Kui was sitting with 5-6 people from the publisher and a translator. We were not allowed to use our phones to take pictures or video.

I don't know if all of the signing events were like this, but we know that Kui and many other manga artists want to preserve their personal privacy, so I'd assume most of these events are run this way.

This makes information from autograph sessions really unreliable, since anyone could post anything online and claim Kui said it, and even other fans who were at the event wouldn't be able to prove that it wasn't true.

I have heard that sometimes fans "overheard" answers that other fans got, which doesn't fit with the above description, so some signings may have not been that private... Or maybe after a fan got their autograph, they talked with other fans at the event and shared information that way? Or maybe they talked about it online afterwards? I can't say for certain.

Anyway, moving on!

IF HE'S NOT RUNNING A NOODLE SHOP, WHAT IS MITHRUN DOING?

Here's Mithrun's updated biography page from the World Guide:

"島の迷宮が消失した後は、女王の命を受けメリニに駐在する。"

"After the island labyrinth disappears, he is stationed in Merini under the orders of the Queen."

The confusing part here is that another comic says Mithrun is retiring, and that he'll no longer be part of the Canaries.

MITHRUN: 何の用だフレキ (What do you want, Fleki?) FLEKI: 実は隊長が隊をや��られると耳にしまして･･…. (I actually heard that the captain is leaving the squad…) MITHRUN: 事実だ (It's true.) FLEKI: おおっ第二の人生を歩まれる (Oh, you're starting a second life.)

Cithis also confirms that Mithrun is leaving the Canaries:

"それで隊をやめたあと何をされるご予定で? (So what are you planning to do after you leave the corps?)"

This seems like it would be a contradiction with "he is stationed in Merini under the orders of the Queen." If he's retired, why is he still taking orders? Why is he stationed there, a term normally used for military duty?

I think what Kui is telling us is that even though Mithrun isn't a Canary anymore, he's still nobility, and as a noble he has to obey the elf queen, and even if he isn't actively a Canary, he's considered a military asset - one of the duties of nobility is to always be ready to perform military service for their monarch.

Since the elf queen is an absolute monarch, anything Mithrun does is "with the Queen's permission/under her orders," since she owns her subjects.

(This is fun because it hints at potential future conflict. Will the Queen ever command Mithrun to do something he doesn't want to do? What happens if he refuses? Will he defect, and swear allegiance to his new home in Merini instead?)

Ok, Mithrun's retired from the Canaries, but what is he going to do in Merini?

"メリニに残り悪魔の監視を続けるはびこ魔物の蔓延る場所を巡り活動を記録する魔物とは迷宮とはなんだったのか生涯をかけて追い続ける (I'll remain in Merini, and continue to watch out for demons. I'll travel to places where monsters gather and record their activities. I'll spend the rest of my life seeking to understand monsters, and the labyrinth.)"

(Why does the translation call it a labyrinth, not a dungeon? PSA on this here.)

As you can see, there's no mention of noodles here. Mithrun has something he seriously, passionately wants to do, and he plans to do it for the rest of his life. Fleki's reaction, by the way, is complete and utter horror (she was hoping Mithrun would return to his family's wealthy estate and she could mooch off of him):

"残る･･･魔物のこんな未開拓地に? 蘇生術なし (Remaining here… in such a primitive country that's full of monsters? Without resurrection magic?)"

This tells us that the elves probably consider the Eastern Continent an uncivilized and primitive place, where an elf wouldn't want to stay longer than necessary. Fleki seems to think living there would be worse than going back to prison in the elven lands.

Here is where some of the confusion probably starts:

CITHIS: 蕎麦打ちは? (What about making noodles?) MITHRUN: それもやる (I'll do that too.)

Note that Cithis does not say running a noodle shop, she just says "making noodles."

Obviously a person can make noodles for themselves, or for the people around them, without getting into the huge enterprise of opening a restaurant. It's illogical to assume "I'll make noodles" actually means "I'll open a restaurant that serves noodles."

Also, Mithrun is smirking when he answers Cithis, which implies that he's joking, or being sarcastic. This makes sense because "what about making noodles?" is part of a running joke in the manga about ramen noodles and how their presence in the primarily European-style setting of Dungeon Meshi doesn't make sense.

THE RUNNING GAG ABOUT RAMEN

The word Cithis uses, soba (蕎麦), literally means "buckwheat." The full name for buckwheat noodles is soba-kiri (蕎麦切り "buckwheat slices"), but soba is commonly used alone.

Historically, soba noodles were called Nihon-soba, Wa-soba, or Yamato-soba, all of which mean "Japanese noodle." This was meant to distinguish Japanese buckwheat noodles from wheat noodles of Chinese origin, such as ramen, sōmen, or udon.

In the modern era, soba is the word used to refer to noodles in general, regardless of origin or composition. So Italian noodles can be described as a type of soba.

The loan word パスタ (pasuta) is what is normally used to talk about Italian noodles, but the confusion between soba (Japanese buckwheat noodles) and soba (any other type of noodle) is the core of Kui's joke.

In Chapter 81, Laios and his party try to make food for Marcille that will remind her of her home and childhood (which is clearly supposed to be someplace like Italy) but they end up making Japanese-style pork ramen instead. The punchline is that Izutsumi, the only Japanese member of the party, can tell that they've made the wrong type of noodles, but the rest of the party doesn't understand what she's talking about to a comical and ridiculous extent.

In Chapter 94, when Kabru and the Canaries are trying to encourage Mithrun to keep on living, Fleki and Lycion go off on a comical tangent about making noodles:

The punchline of this joke is that Kui is depicting Mithrun servingJapanese-style noodles, which makes no sense because the elves aren't Japanese... Something we know for a fact because there are actual explicitly Japanese characters in Dungeon Meshi. Laios thinks "That's like Marcille's (local cuisine)..." in reference to the joke in Chapter 81.

The panel on the left shows Mithrun looking like a stereotypical ramen stand operator: gruff, covered in sweat, proudly presenting his finished work.

(Sorry for using your thumbnail, random furry youtuber.)

The headband, black tunic and white apron that Mithrun is wearing, and even the crossed arms in Laios' imagination is part of the look of your stereotypical Japanese chef.

So it's understandable that people look at all this, and think "Mithrun will run a Japanese-style ramen stand!" because it's a very cute, very funny idea.

But canonically it's an idea that only exists in Laios' imagination, as something that is meant to be comically outlandish, because the things Lycion and Fleki are saying are also presented as being pretty silly. A bit of levity in an otherwise very melancholy chapter.

I'll also note that when Lycion talks about Mithrun making soup bowls to serve his noodles in, he says "He could enjoy his handmade cuisine in his own bowls!"

There's no mention of serving the noodles to anyone else, just that Mithrun could enjoy the satisfaction of being self-sufficient, making his food and tableware from scratch. This is something which actually aligns very well with the themes of Dungeon Meshi.

DIDN'T KUI SAY MITHRUN IS MAKING NOODLES IN A Q&A?

During the post-manga publicity tour Kui went on, she did several signings where she answered short questions from fans while giving out autographs and drawings.

Remember, these questions and answers are being collected by fans from random tweets and other posts online, translated into English by amateurs, and there is no way to prove their veracity.

Q. Did Mithrun get to live a happy life after ending? A. He is doing work and hobby, living a happy and fulfilled life, although he is not that friendly so he will not be doing diplomat for a long time.

Taking this information at face value and assuming it's true, it sounds like Kui differentiated between "work" and "hobby" - So Mithrun has something he is doing seriously, like a job, and something he is doing for fun, as a hobby.

This makes sense with what we've seen in the official materials: monitoring the monsters and keeping watch for the return of the demon is Mithrun's "job", and making noodles (and doing other things, probably, since the noodles were a joke) are Mithrun's hobbies.

WHAT ABOUT THE WRITTEN WEIBO Q&A?

These Chinese fan questions were answered by Kui in written form, and posted online by her Chinese publisher in both Chinese and Japanese, so in my opinion, these answers should be taken more seriously than things that were solely reported by fans.

However, the question and answer about noodles here is clearly a light-hearted joke:

Q: 米斯伦会做出什么样的荞麦面？(What kind of soba will Mithrun make?) A: おいしい蕎麦だといいですね。(I hope they're delicious soba.)

As with many other answers, you can see that Kui answers in a vague, polite, and gently joking way. "What kind of noodles will Mithrun make?" "Tasty ones, hopefully!"

It's similar to how she answered questions about if Falin's lifespan is longer because she's a chimera or if Thistle is still alive with "That would be nice!" or "I hope so!"

This is clearly a sort of non-answer, but even if you take it to mean "Mithrun is 100% for sure making noodles," there is still zero indication that Mithrun is canonically running a restaurant.

In closing: if you want him to run a noodle restaurant in your heart, in your fanfics, in your fanart, that is perfectly fine! Japanese fans love this idea (they use pasta emojis to represent Mithrun!) and there's tons of artwork about Mithrun being a ramen chef. I think that would be a lovely thing for him to do! I bet he'd have a lot of fun!

But it's not canon.

What is canon is that he's living in Merini, going to group therapy, learning to appreciate the people around him, enjoying himself, and both his work and his hobbies are going well 💕

#dungeon meshi #delicious in dungeon #spoilers #dungeon meshi spoilers #mithrun #mithrun of the house of kerensil #dunmeshi #PSA

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levemetal · 3 months ago

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Hi hello, I rushed this and I cannot be arsed to properly render this. I have other things to draw, many of them. But also. I really put too much effort into the flat of this that I kinda burned myself out LMAO

ANYWAY CALAMITY/GHOST KING SHEN JIU DESIGN. Take it, cherish him like I would. I wanted to dress him up like the pretty princess he is <3 Plus, ghost kings a la tgcf gotta slay in all categories so here we go. I'll ramble more about the more coherent thoughts I have but you can tear ghost king SJ from my cold dead hands. ٩( ᐛ )و

His motivations more becoming a ghost king/calamity are fairly straightforward if you're familiar with Shen Jiu and all the funky workings of his mind. It is to be stronger than everybody else and attaining a place that cannot be taken from him cause he has the power for it. So that no one else can have any power over him either.

However this also means that he does not necessarily have any grand plans of what to do with that power. I imagine he'd be a recluse, living off and alone somewhere hardly getting involved in the affairs of the living and gods etc.

If he does, I imagine it might more be in the style of killing slavers and otherwise bad men. Maybe a sort of brothel workers protector, getting rid of the most problematic and horrible clients? Let your imagination wander!

For a title? I have no clue man, I am not good enough at words for this. Something with green or teal as the color and leaves. That's how far I got.

Now the juicy stuff, POWERS. Leaves. Leaves and fans is the tldr version. I imagine he'd use the qi-infused leaves as in canon, just far more deadlier (probably) and conjured rather than just reliant on leaves off trees in the vicinity. For a weapon, if available (read: SY is not possessing SJ's OG body, or Xiu Ya was not obtained) I think he should get to keep Xiu Ya, or otherwise a blood weapon shaped after it. Tho if I had to give him a blood weapon a la Hua Cheng's E'ming, it would be a fan. The blades on it would likely be shift on, both an edge to cut with and places for darts to fly out. Otherwise in terms of weapons I could see daggers very well too for SJ. They'd suit him, as he could get in and get a quick stab or just throw them from afar. With his fighting style that likely has a lot of the ruthless tactics of his youth incorporated, I think it would fit just like a battle fan.

Otherwise, I do see him being a capable shapeshifter, or some sort of abilities to stay in the shadows undetected. If he needs some sort of animal or communication/surveillance skill associated with him, I personally would pick ravens. Spiritually created ravens as a sort of spying network and surveillance method.

Another juicy detail could be cultivation method. Tgcf does mention that the ghosts still have their own form of cultivating their power. For example, He Xuan eats and absorbs the abilities of other ghosts, whereas Hua Cheng is mentioned to cultivate via slaughtering. The xianxia in tgcf is rather vague now that I have a few more danmei under my belt, and specifically Devil Venerable also wants to know has given me a looot of thoughts about some interesting ways to detail this if it is so desired for a setting. Do please keep in mind tho I haven't really researched cultivation and the wuxia/xianxia 101 worldbuilding yet so this may not make sense. Anywho:

For Shen Jiu in particular I'd find it interesting to give him his own form rather than just copying either Hua Cheng (most fitting imo) or He Xuan (bonus eating disorder included, hooray!). So here are some ideas I had in no particular order:

- Take the core melting aspect from mdzs and applying it to ghosts (sorta): dissolving and absorbing the cores/qi of cultivators and ghosts alike, thus claiming the power for his own.

- Blood. Think less vampire and more slaughter. The messier the kill essentially, bleed the victims dry and absorb the blood to transform it into qi. (Thank you returning Dragon Age brainrot)

- dvawtk's Path of Slaughter. It doesn't really fit SJ as it relies on constantly finding stronger opponents to fight and challenge, especially ones stronger than oneself and persevering against the odds. Not his personal choice but it would poetically fit him and his entire life pretty well.

That's all for now. If you made it till here.... have a gold star: ⭐️

#svsss #shen jiu #original shen qingqiu #ghostSJ #No I will not shut up about calamity!SJ #I have finally accepted that this is my terminal brainrot and I am willing to die on this hill #anyway feel free to use the design <3 Enjoy!

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skyflyinginaction · 1 year ago

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Clamp Art Style Analysis: Part 1: Creation Process and Materials

Introduction

Clamp is a manga artist team of four women. They are a prominent distinguished manga artist team known in the West and in China. The thing they are most recognized for is their highly detailed art style many people may have known and many may not. They did several manga you might have known such as Card Captor Sakura, Chobits, and even Tsubasa.

Clamp is one of the artists whose art style I highly admire and want to imitate in my art. I created this post so I can understand and take apart their art style and better understand it. It is going to be difficult since there are four people with different specialties and years of professional experience in their belt. They are constantly changing and adapting to every genre.

I am going to analyze Clamps’ art style in this post and this may take a while to crack due to how extensive the Clamp style is. I am going to pile up everything and explain this in this post which is going to take time to explain in this post. I am going to take apart interviews from different sources while explaining their art style in this post.

I am going to examine their art style and the materials they use. I am going to split into sections talking about the art style and what they use for materials for the manga.

To understand the art style and how it is defined I need to understand Clamp themselves since they created an entirely individual style that is going to talk about other things, not about the art style there is going to be so much I might miss while explaining in this post. I could be wrong while explaining this is an analysis I am going to take my crack at understanding the art style.

Influences

Though the members of Clamp are largely self-taught they are inspired by many figures that influence their art. The list consists of Reiji Matsumoto, Osamu Tezuka, Go Nagai, Hirohiko Araki, and Moto Hagio. The other works that influenced Clamp are animated cartoons and Galaxy Express 999. Reiji Matsumoto and Osamu Tezuka are major influences in their works Clamp used Osamu Tetsuka’s star system in their works which is seen often in the crossing over of characters from their series into their other works. You can see this prevalently in Tsubasa, X, and Kobato where you would find characters from the different series crossover.

Nekoi's favorite cartoonist was Moto Hagio in high school and Mokona mimics pictures by Reiji Matsumoto when she was younger.

While working on manga Nekoi started copying Shinji Wada and Rumiko Takahashi, in which She copied her art in drawing legs. She drew them thick and big. She liked the legs Rumiko Takahashi drew since they seemed long until short feet. She took them to make them more delicate and feminine. Clamp used other artists to help them while drawing.

Go Negai influenced the creation of X, taking inspiration from his work of Devil Man featuring two main male characters, and the murder of the lead's sweetheart triggers the apocalypse. Devil Man is used in creating x The extreme levels of violence depicted in X came from Go Negai's works. Clamp knows about Devil Man. They did a doujinshi of Devil Man in their works as doujinshi artists a while back and even had a doujinshi about the lead character's relationship in their works.

X was inspired by Go Nagai the heavy violence in x inspired from Go Nageis works and the assembled cast of x is inspired by Kyokutei Bakin's Nansō Satomi Hakkenden, The fight sequences of x were inspired by the manga Dragon Ball specifically Akira Toriyama's use of white backgrounds.

Mokona influences are H.R Giger and gérard di-maccio are used for the RG veda backgrounds.

Mokona likes Alphonse Mucha who is a considerable influence in drawing XXXHolic art.

Hirohiko Araki is another influence of Clamp with JoJo's Bizarre Adventure fan manga back when they drew doujinshi and starred in Clamp in wonderland animation with Jojo animated.

They drew a doujinshi on Jojo a while back starring Josuke and Kakyon and even they drew Jolynn once.

There is a lot of Kakyoin and Josuke fanart with Yaoi art drawn by these two characters.

Jojo was used in drawing wish with Kohaku and Shuichiro strongly resembling Jotaro Kujo and Noriaki Kakyoin and Kohaku's hairstyle strongly identical to Kakyoin and Shuiichiro resembling Josuke.

Members

Nanase Ohkawa

The main leader of the group, the main writer of the scenario, is in charge of the original story, script, and design. The other three artists are Mokona, Nekoi, and Satsuki, who are in charge of the art.

Mokona

Mokona is the artist and designer in charge of drawing. Mokona is in charge of sketching out the construction of the characters by hand. Mokona draws the storyboards and sketches out the characters. Mokona is responsible for drawing female characters.

Tsubaki Nekoi

Nekoi is in charge of character design, background scenery, finishing touches, and charge of the foundation of the art in their works. Her booth has been painted for design and screens for finishing touches.Nekoi likes to doodle and throw pages. Nekoi is in charge of drawing male characters.

Satsuki Igarashi

Satsuki Igarashi is in charge of design and drawing and is in charge of the finishing touches. She is in charge of designing the cover of the book itself.

Bio

Three members of Clamp were classmates in high school who took art-focused classes in school; none of them studied at school for manga. Nekoi tried using colored pencils and opaque watercolor in school when she was young. Satsuki and Nekoi were in middle school when they first started drawing manga. Mokona was in an art club in middle school. In high school, she started drawing manga with proper frames and dialogues. Mokona, Nekoi, and Igarashi studied art in high school Nekoi, Mokona, and Igarashi met in high school as a kid She found a friend who loved manga, Satsuki went to an art-type highschool and Mokona high school and college had art-focused classes, Igarashi was at an art department in highschool then to computer graphics vocational school. Clamp started as doujinshi artists who first published doujinshi fanzines Back then they had more people it went down to four in the year of their commercial debut.

The group never worked as assistants with most of the members being self-taught with Tsubaki and Nekoi being more self-taught.

They never used assistants to help them with their work since they wouldn’t be able to understand the years of jargon they created among themselves They created work for years without any help from assistants since assistants would slow them down and wouldn’t understand when we would tell them to do the same thing as before disrupting the workflow they created for work.

For inspiration, Ohkawa gets her ideas from dreams or inspiration based on events she hears or sees on the news a lot of times its deadlines. Ohkawa doesn’t always take notes and she usually loses ideas.

Clamp’s daily work hours while working on manga is in the morning, get in the studio at about 10 or 11 in the morning and in the afternoon they eat dinner at 6 in the evening then stop working at midnight.

The members share a single workspace and are separated into three booths while they work.

There are four separate studios and the member's workspace accommodates all four of them. Clamp work requires complete perfection with members having their own space where they have to work to create one of their works

The art of Clamp is lush layered and amazingly detailed. It has a high-quality art style with extensive details. Due to this, it's almost difficult to adapt to animation.

Each of Clamp’s titles has a different art style depending on the genre or magazine they are running in; their art styles change to suit the work and magazine the manga will appear in. The art style of the work is based on Ohkawa’s decision in charge of the art direction of the work. The art styles and pictures have changed but not their methods.

There is a lot to talk about the Clamp art style which may not be enough to explain one segment

Creation process

Clamp's work process is similar to an animation production; they work like a small animation studio. if you look closely at the work process for creating works it's more like an animation with the director, playwright, character designer, painter, background artist, creator, and publicist treating the manga or story like a script for a movie or anime, the creative process for creating manga is similar to that of animation and movies.

Ohkawa is the storyteller and writes the scripts other three draw drafts and original design, Mokona is the chief character designer, and Tsubaki and Nekoi work for the background Sometimes they they take turns doing different jobs

Ohkawa writes then it goes to Mokona who draws out the outline of the storyboard and sketches the characters

They would normally go to Nekoi for the finishing touches Igarashi and Nekoi work on the final touches the team may shuffle roles. Clamp members do get outside work with computer graphics. For drawing sometimes the members do character backgrounds or may draw everything depending on the story. They have a work where one person designs the character and another draws the actual story. They make storyboards and start drawing. Sometimes they decide who is going to make storyboards and then start drawing. The art is drawn by Satsuki, Mokona, and Nekoi, Nekoi draws the rough draft and thinks about how the story is going forward to next month's script. The designs are handled by Satsuki and Mokona. Satsuki worked on the design for the cover page. In the beginning, they believed that everything in the comic from front to back was important to the story. They take turns completing the rough sketch depending on the story. They divide the story into frames; they mostly draw it on art board paper after they create characters and scripts. Ohkawa explains what in each frame props and the characters in they have how they turn around and include emotions in the panel. Ohkawa and Igarashi never drew manga with split frames. They Look like frames from a movie

When Ohkawa comes up with stories Ohkawa drafts the outline of the story and the story setting The ending for each story is determined from the last scene back to the first scene and the end last and deciding the thing and heading into this way makes way for change drags the reader along for the story Ohkawa drafts the outline the other three members formulate characters designs by creating character profile sheets to avoid confusion. Ohkawas style of writing is considered a color woodblock print in the way it conveys and portrays things the manga is close to picture books and elimination of everything unneeded. Ohkawa thinks about the setting of where the story takes place and Ohkawa constructs a visual image at least in their head then splits up panels in their manga. for the writing process, they come up with the story Ohkawa gets together to discuss the story with the members about the purpose of the story and the main characters when writing and drawing After the members get well used to the story they write it down when creating a story for a weekly magazine they first decide on a rough story from beginning to end Ohkawa works backward from the ending for the story to have an ending like this the members don’t always know how the story develops. Ohkawa's style of writing for stories is not telling anyone the progression of the storyline before it happens reason for that is that when the members of Clamp learn of Hokuto's death one of the members couldn’t draw Hokuto's smile the same way this is how badly shaken they were since that the way Ohkawa created her stories changed for most of the works it was until Chobits she could tell them again. Ohkawa kept using memos in the beginning when she wrote the stories where she kept track of the flow of the story.

Before they start drawing they decide the flow of the story up until the end as well as the materials used for color and monochromatic drawing and the direction of the illustration. The members consider the art style during the planning stage and the materials for the manga, for materials Clamp uses color samplers In the order of how they draw. They draw them the same size as manuscripts, they draw rough sketches, and the size of the manuscript is b4 size and genkou size. They seldom use computers to create manga but only to color pictures, sometimes Clamp uses the scanning method when they draw or draw the rough draft using tablets. They don’t use references for their designs except at one time for Ohkawa she drew inspiration from a perfume and drink package she gathered together she drew more influence from the business art and art from Alan Chai's design.

The amount of lines and the thickness of the lines in the manga depends on the work. When you look at the manga, there are a lot of lines in the characters, Clamps can make the lines, and the thickness of the lines depends on the nature of their work from the thicker lines shows how serious and heavy the story thicker lines match the nature of their work that fits with a heavy theme like works like Tokyo Babylon, which have a heavy atmosphere. Mokona draws with thicker lines and uses pens with strong pressure when drawing. Clamps drawing methods changed with Tsubasa and xxxholic.

In the process of launching a serialization first is to decide on the major storyline work out the details of the characters later and consider the number of chapters needed to tell a story, second Ohkawa has a meeting with Mokona and Nekoi to decide on the design of the main characters Ohkawa asks for designs once they are finished they go over one more time. They go about creating manga and have two processes, one creating a manga based on the request from a publisher The second Clamp decides on the story first and then thinks about the magazine to write it for. Clamp comes up with an outline for the story First after they create the outline they discuss who's going to draw pictures or if they all draw together. They turn the project into a movie telling how a story goes and who the main characters are among themselves. They talk about the rough story and how they should do it when they bring a story to the publisher, attach the rough story and characters, attach characters' settings to them and draw the appearance in the manga to the publisher. Then after they show the work to the editor if the editor thinks it's okay they start the story. After receiving approval from an editor, Ohkawa assigns roles to each group member and then chooses the visual styles depending on the factors such as the complexity of the story and chosen art style the artwork depends on the genre and magazine of the story. Ohkawa provides a rough draft for each chapter with things such as dialogue panel size props and movement and characters' emotions. Storyboarding takes 12 hours while the script takes 8 hours to write. To Mokona from rough draft to inking 10 pages per day, the average Mokona puts into how many pages of black and white manuscript draws in a day the number of pages they draw in a month to finish one installment For example if they're in two monthly publications like Tsubasa and xxxholic one is about 19 or 20 pages other takes one day to finish 6 pages for the foundations for the fishing touches and inking takes a couple of days every 2 weeks when it comes to two weekly series its 120 and 130 pages a week. xxxholic takes two days and x took four days

Ohkawa will specify the proper production for the story and character. After the story, they will choose a person to perform the character design. Clamp switches up who works on character design and the drawing. Igarashi and Ohkawa do it together. One of them directs the work for design and the person in charge of the drawing for that work will draw a rough sketch which is discussed. Mokona is one of the concept artists When the scenario is specified in detail, Mokona listens to the basic story and consults the original concept with Ohkawa Mokona will show what she designed on the spot of the drafting and period. Mokona and Clamp often decide on the design first, then Mokona draws the illustration from format, paper, and photoshopping specifications to color specification. Mokona does pencil drawing first then ink and color it the pencil stage first so Mokona can fix errors in the pencil stage. Ohkawa as the main scriptwriter Ohkawa determines the story and setting and tells the members about it and the rest give their thoughts on it Ohkawa maps out the location, ideas, and character design Ohkawa gives the character's figures hairstyles, and clothes she envisions to the designers or sometimes Ohkawa draws them herself only sketches the rest get the art close to Ohkawa original version. Ohakwa doesn’t talk about the characters until it's time to create their visual design, Ohkawa decides the design of the character and the group visualizes it She explains their appearance she sometimes brings sketches instead of explaining Ohkawa decides the characters they have long or short hair their style of clothes and complexity. Clamp discusses together and thinks about how to make characters, Ohkawa makes requests and discusses them with the other three Ohkawa gives concrete and specific thoughts on what she wants the main characters to be. Ohkawa is the one who decides on the details of the characters and Clamp crafts their characters. They explain the story in the works that include the drawing of the clothes of what the character wears. Ohkawa takes all the info she gathered and has them design the characters based on the descriptions she gave like body build, hair length, and small details, next decide who is going to design the characters either Nekoi or Mokona design them characters and pick one of them then make a character setting chart and decide on the character's height. After the story they choose a person to perform character design. When that is happening, they use specific proper proportions for the story and character. They come up with a story through a character design phase Clamp and choose different styles and proportions for the characters. When it comes to designing characters they determine the head and body ratios since the person drawing can change the proportions in their sketches without knowing. They reference the proportions of the characters in case the person drawing it gets it wrong. Igarashi and Ohkawa consult each other and ask for revisions so that the proportions don’t shift, so it can come in tandem when working for 4 people. Mokona had difficulties drawing Yuko's proportions; she considered drawing them constantly a nightmare. Mokona found it reassuring to have partners who can check your work. Sometimes they decide on the colors to get the approval of the publisher to work on the storyboard and then agree on the birthday and height of the characters. The height is important because it's for drawing proportions that are made to keep consistency when drawing characters. The character designs look like character sheets like the ones you would see in anime. When they first set out to draw the members consulted such things as whether or not thin lines mesh well in the manga. what color materials they would be using the members play it by ear as they go along when they draw. Before drawing the portraits of the characters, Nekoi takes special care of the characters by differentiating them with their hairstyles.

For creating the clothes for the characters, Clamp dresses their character in stuff based on their own or things their acquaintances wear. Clamp reads a lot of informational magazines and fashion magazines on a personal basis which serves as inspiration for characters. Some of the clothes and other items that characters in Clamp wear are inspired by real-life pieces but most of them are done initially by Mokona.

Once the main characters are completed, they decide on the detailed settings for those characters, The members decide on each character's birthday and height. The height is used for doing the proportions of the characters. for the character settings the group goes into detail about the characters like what food they eat, special skills, how and when they do things, how they grew up, when they were young, their hobbies, the type of house they live in whether its Japanese or western style, if they are sleeping wearing pajamas or negligees and whether they like sweets or not; for example if a character is eating sweets it means that a character grew up in an environment where sweets can be easily eaten and if a character has long hair it can be tied or untied these details reference the characters way of life and polices the reason Clamp focuses on what a character likes to eat is because what a person eats says a lot about a character in personality. There's a lot of thought that goes into making character settings. It's mostly to advance writing their characters or fleshing them out as individuals. The character settings are important when writing the characters in the story These details are important for them to write for the characters the character profile is used so they won’t get confused when writing a character for the story to keep the writing of the character to remain consistent throughout the story.

Materials

When drawing manga and illustrations the group often determines the materials they use to draw during the meetings

Once they set out drawing they first consult things like whether or not thin lines and colors. Clamp used different techniques, art materials, and paper when they did manga and color illustrations Clamp used different materials at their disposal. For drawing Rayearth, the materials they use to draw manga are used include other works as well. The heavy colors are used to suit the tone of the story. This goes to show that you can change the impression by changing the pen you use and the paper used.

You can change the impression based on the paper you use. The paper makes a great first impression on the manga. Paper is not the only thing that changes the impression of the manga they draw, also the materials they use are used to change the impression.

Clamp uses different paper sizes for each work, the manga paper is sorted for each one of the members to use. Clamp has strong drawing pressure for their strong drawing pressure they chose thick paper. They use paper made by Daieidou printing for manga drawings because the members have a strong drawing pressure so they chose a thick paper that's three times thicker than manga paper. For the paper that the members use for illustrations Igarashi, Nekoi, and Mokona use Watson paper, BB Kent back of manga paper of copy paper. Both Ohkawa and Igarashi like acid-free paper, they love the sandy texture and don't like smooth art-coated paper. The reason for that is that if the paper is too smooth the texture will not be the same. Clamp uses many materials for works such as Copic markers and alcohol-based products, They use Kaimei Indian ink, and for color inks, they use Holbein and Holbein special black The screentone they use Brans that Clamp uses is I.C. 's and Letraset.

When they first used computer equipment, they were instructed by Takeshi Okazaki and Katsuya Terada. satsuki was into photoshop so Takeshi Yamazaki gave satsuki lessons in photoshop.

For the materials that Clamp used in their past works, rg veda used color inks, aeroflash, Liquitex, and modeling paste, Rayearth used Copic markers, Mokona used color inks for Mask of 20 faces, Tokyo Babylon used color tones and angelic layer had them use thick fountain pen like liner markers for drawing the manga.

Mokona’s pen uses a Kabura and a Marupen. Depending on the weather she draws a line to see which is better. Her favorite pens are Zebras Maru pen and Kabura pen nibs. with lnks, her favorite is Kaimei Indian Ink and Holbein’s Grey or Nouvel’s Burnt Sienna. What she used to draw backgrounds is Pigma 0.05, Mokona has strong drawing pressure. The G pen is too soft for her. She tried using one but it is hard to adjust and prefers using a harder pen. She uses a magic marker with a pigment ink called Prokey she used to draw letters on paper and uses Pentels water-resistant brush pens for solid areas like hair. She uses a powder board for paper with larger pieces and Baron Kent paper stretched with water. For RG Veda backgrounds Mokona used a lot of airbrush techniques. Mokona draws with thicker lines, and her drawings have been drawn with thicker lines. In the beginning, like in the third volume of Tokyo Babylon, the character's faces are angular and have thicker lines which show that her art is changing. Syaoran was Mokona’s favorite character to draw in Tsubasa.

Nekoi uses different nibs for the maru pen and g pen; she uses the Kabura pen for concentrated and close straight lines, also Pigma 0.5 for backgrounds.

For paper Nekoi uses whatever paper they have at hand to the back of wrapping paper bits of cardboard that have fallen around the back of cosmetics box envelopes from the publisher, the wrapping paper from a cup of tea that is Japanese style. She uses an eraser to reduce the tones in the screentone and sandpaper to reduce the large areas of tone she uses. A fine grit sandpaper will decrease nicely but not allow for fine adjustment which she had to fix with an eraser later. Nekoi loved experimenting with new painting materials; she especially loved painting in color.

Step to Step in Creating Manga

When it comes to drawing manga there are steps taken to create manga. these are the materials they use for drawing manga The list of materials and things they use in the steps to create manga are listed as this

1.) plastic eraser, mechanical pencil 0.5 HB

2.) Pigma 0.5, magic marker

3.) brush pen

4.) screen tone, tone cutters round sand eraser

5.) pen white, liquid paper ink, Mython

lastly, for writing the script, they use a pc

For the steps they use to create manga Rayearth I think it might be the same steps they use to draw other manga that come after it might be the same steps they did for Tsubasa,xxxholic, and other manga that come after it, and the materials they use. I bet it's the same materials used for Tsubasa, Card Captor Sakura and xxxholic.

1.) The plot is written by Ohkawa on a personal computer with manuscript paper, For the rough they draw frames with a pencil and roughly insert characters and other elements, they draw the rough while paying attention to the composition and balance the draw the panel as to what you want to show most when you are doing a specific scene. The rough is a lot of lines and its way is less detailed. The rough is used for the placement to know the place of things to ink. You can see the same rough stage with Tsubasa and xxxholic.

Clamp pays attention to the distribution of lines in the panels, the reason why Clamp pays attention to the number of lines is because it's a manga and they are going to ink over and over again. The reason they pay attention to the number of lines in the rough is to calculate how much you ink while you draw. the number of lines you use while you ink is important because you are going to use it over again

the rough is drawn with a pencil, they used a regular pencil for the rough rather than a mechanical pencil since the mechanical pencil has fine lines

2.) Next is the sketching phase, in the sketching phase the characters are drawn with a mechanical pencil they check the drawing by looking through the rough manuscript and back. Once the sketch is finished the member will fix it until they are satisfied The background is only included briefly in the sketch.

3.) The inking stages for the steps of Magic Knight Rayearth are inked mainly using a Pigma 0.05 or Kaimuji marker or brush. When Mokona was drawing Rayearth Mokona had strong drawing pressure so her lines became thicker She changed pens as soon as she noticed it her strong drawing pressure caused Mokonas tip of her pen to break quickly they often used 4 to 5 bottles a day for inking.

4.) Next up the beta stage, after they are done with inking they erase and check it again After that the members add solids the tool used is a brush pen to fill in areas like hair and stuff. They use ink that is resistant to water because if it is water resistant the area will become thin when the eraser is applied.

The steps for rough and sketch are used in their other works only the materials that are used for inking change consistently Depending on the series

5.) Next is the toning stage when they add screentone traditionally to a manga page, when it comes to screen tone they make sure that no more appears in the overlapped areas Clamp use a circular blade type cut when they apply screentone traditionally to a manga and small areas might be scrapped with a sand eraser scrapping the tone can change the texture of the object. They consider the effect and carefully cut it and their grain to the tone and know in which its neatly scrapped directions are not scrapped.

In Rayearth tint and gradation tones are used, and a little gala for the screen tone of the manga.

6.) This is the last stage of Clamp creation in drawing manga. The last stage is to express light and create glamorous images white is used for it. when applying white fluid to the image which is done by flicking the brush on the correction fluid with the rim of the container the effect changes depending on the concentration of the liquid. You can add white to the toothbrush or flick it with your finger. It changes the effect of the image. If you add fine white dilute it with water to adjust for the white. Clamp uses quirk drawing because the pen can be put on the white later.

This technique was applied in other manga like Tsubasa, Card Captor Sakura, and their other works. They used the same white ink to make a beautiful panel.

#clamp #x/1999 #meta #card captor sakura #card captor clear #tsubasa reservoir chronicle #chobits #tsubaki nekoi #Nanase Ohkawa #Satsuki Igarashi #Mokona #magic knight rayearth #xxxholic #kobato #angelic layer #tokyo babylon #my meta

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tunamayuuu · 1 year ago

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ranpo edogawa go

i know this is about asking for my thoughts and hcs but i wanted to draw ranpo from memory so here u go c:

ok so this is coming from a fan who stopped catching up with bsd for like months. so forgive me if i miss details about ranpo, i'm still getting back into bsd

thoughts below the cut

he's a first fav! i got into bsd because i genuinely thought it was a detective solving mystery anime... nevertheless, i found ranpo cute and clever!! i'm usually drawn to the detective types and his straightforward way of going things is so entertaining and admirable for me, who relates more to poe who's more complicated in going about things...

ranpo's interesting to me because while he is confident in his skills and lets it be known to anyone and everyone who comes across him, that confidence is also fragile to me?

we're introduced to this image he's built over the years, but overtime, these pages were the most memorable to me whenever i think of ranpo

his confidence feels so solid until you take a closer look and realize that confidence can't survive without other people to validate this image he built up. it reflects such a common human experience for me and to me, is what humanizes him?

he's so good at what he does! he's skilled and that skill saves his found family plenty of times! as well as many civilians! and he clings on to that accomplishment as his sole identity most of the time

this is not just a fear of what he doesn't know, that second "i don't know" is so personal, as if his identity is shattered because for once, the very thing he's good at can't solve the situation in front of him.

if you ask me, the most intriguing thing about him is how he carries himself, how he carries his identity.

onto hcs!

insane sweet tooth but has times where he's picky on the sweetness level of the dessert he gets

doesn't have textural issues with food, but may struggle with combined flavors in his food ("if it's sweet, it should stay sweet! if it's salty, it should stay salty!" those flavors cannot mix into one food item unless it's savory food)

keeps a comb in his pocket to style his bangs as spiked out looking as possible! probably gets gifted said comb by mushitaro so he can take care of the knots in his hair

does not care about personal space but may feel one way or another about someone suddenly invading his personal space

loves to give oddly specific nicknames to his co-workers at the agency to remember them better

#bungou stray dogs #bsd #bsd ranpo #bsd ranpo edogawa #armed detective agency #bungo stray dogs fanart #bsd fanart #bsd armed detective agency #bsd edogawa rampo #i didn't think i'd type this much but here you go!#cleaning out my inbox #tuna answers

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luxtoony · 2 years ago

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My take on @dianagj-art / @separatedleoau dtiys/ HAPPY BIRTHDAY MONTH!

(sound on plz)

Yes I chose the last pic, I am a softie (⁠´⁠ε⁠｀⁠ ⁠) ... with a soft spot for angst

ಡ⁠ ͜⁠ ⁠ʖ⁠ ⁠ಡ More info and still images under the cut.

It seems only fitting to give a gif to the author of a comic who's most characteristic thing is usage of gif/animations. I am terribly impressed by that (not even mentioning that I love your style, comedic timing, and the way you interact with fans). I wish I had the time to redraw all of the prompts, allas life. Anywhizzle, I hope you will enjoy this lil thing. (Originally I really was going to draw only happy babies, but my thirst to do angst and the awareness that happyness does not come easily, paired up with the fact that this Baron may not be a total monster, but is still... well Baron from season 1, made me do this)

Bonus Donnie bc ofc I had to :>

#rottmnt art #save rottmnt #unpause rise of the tmnt #SLAU fanart #rise leo #rise of the tmnt #separated leo au #luxtoony #rise fanart #rottmnt mikey #rottmnt donnie #rottmnt raph #rottmnt dtiys #my art #fanart #digital art #rise of the teenage mutant ninja turtles

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2dmax · 10 months ago

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2dmax commissions info spring 2024

last updated april 12th

to place an order for a commission, you may PM me; if you prefer, you can also fill out this form or commission me through fiverr.

text and additional info below the readmore.

thanks for reblogging, even if you aren't interest right now!

Packages

These are excellent starting off points for most common commission types. Additional specificity and complexity can be purchased. All basic packages are artist's medium of choice, include simple backgrounds, minimal/no props. All include full color, fully finished works.

Standard Illustration - $80

Artistic and expressive "full body" illustration (roughly 75-100% of figure).

Mini Illustration - $50

Chibi, portrait, half body, icons, and the like.

Couple's Illustration - $100

A duo version of the above styles. Doesn't have to be romantic couples - friends, enemies, family, pet & owner, or other pairs and duos OK.

Multipose, Reference, and Group Lineups - $120+

For commissions that require either multiple poses of the same character, groups, more than two characters generally. Reference pages can include close-ups and detailed shots.

Experimental Commissions

18"x24" Handmade Poster - $200

artist’s choice of medium only. typically acrylic/mixed media. always on extra large poster sized paper. great way to celebrate your favorite OCs or canon characters!

paper clay figurine - $100

chibi humanoids/animals/ferals/anthros only. between 2"-3" cubed, give or take. armature wire, paper clay, paint, and varnish. these are delicate art items, not toys; not suitable for children. includes a photoset at no additional cost.

standalone comics page - $200

2-5 panels, 1-2 characters, 1 location. artist’s choice of medium only. can be OCs or canon characters.

wildcard commission - $???

submit your request and your budget; results are up to the artist.

pay what you want means get what you get!

here’s what to expect when you order:

Send me a PM with basic info; what you would like me to draw, your budget, and if you have a deadline.

I will ask a few questions to be able to build up the concept. I will also give you my e-mail, where you can send me further info and any references you’d like to share!

Your sketch is typically ready within a week; I’ll always update you on my progress. After we agree on the sketch, payment will be due. After it’s paid, I will give you an estimate for when I will be finished with your piece.

Your finished artwork will be e-mailed to you. I am also happy to mail physical art at cost!

terms and conditions:

Your commission is for personal use; icons, roleplaying, in your blog theme, as a wallpaper, or to print out and tape to your fridge. Commercial use can be negotiated.

You must credit me on the platform used if reposted. Always OK to post to ToyHouse; my username is 2dmax there. On instagram and all other platforms where I don’t have an account, please credit my instagram @/maximumgroove.

You may not use my art to promote anything hateful or illegal. You may not claim it as anyone else’s creation. You may not use it for commercial uses, or to edit, adapt, trace, or directly reference, without getting permission. I may use my art in my own promotional material.

➽ navigation desktop view ★ F.A.Q. browse my finished art ★ sketches ★ other media look at buyables & adoptables fan art ★ ttrpg art ★ flight rising art ask me a question ★ browse my archive visit my toyhou.se ★ follow me on instagram

#art commissions #artists on tumblr #manga art #manga style art #anime art #nostaligiacore #webcore #furry art #traditional art #digital art #artist alley

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erika-xero · 2 years ago

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A small guide to commissioning artists: how to avoid getting scammed by people who use image generators

Because “Ai-art” is not art and everyone can use image generators for free.

Disclaimer! This post will include generated images which were originally uploaded on DeviantArt and Twitter by people who generated them. Some of these images are of erotic genre but censored out. I beg you, do not bully these people. This post wasn’t written to call anyone out, it was written to help human artists and their potential commissioners. While some of the “Ai-artists” out there may be real scammers, others are not, and I strongly believe that no one should be bullied, doxxed, stalked and no one deserve any threaths over some silly ai-generated pics. And - as always! - scroll down for the short summary.

Commissioning an artist in 2023 may be scary, especially if you are not experienced in working with artists and have a hard time to distinguish artworks from images generated by neural networks. But even now, with the tech evolving and with neural networks generating pics with multiple characters and fan art, there are still quite a few ways to avoid scammers.

The creator you are going to commission must have an established gallery

This doesn’t mean that you should not commission someone who is new to platform, someone who started drawing in 2022 or later or someone who didn’t upload their work online prior. Image generators actually forced some of the artists to remove their work from social networks. In addition, image generators can generate thousands of images within hours, which means that the scammers may have quite a lot of works uploaded. What I mean is that real artists grow. Their skills gets better over time – even if they are already established artists with huge experience. Their artistic approach constantly changes and evolve. It means that if there are hundreds of images in the artist’s gallery but their skill is always the same level and their artistic approach doesn’t change over time – this definitely might be a red flag. As an artist with a tendency to nuke my galleries on certain platforms (such as DeviantArt, VK and ArtStation), if I get asked to provide my commissioners with examples of my early artworks I will do it with no hesitation.

You need to look through the artist’s gallery and analize their work

Searching for some decent examples on DeviantArt I stumbled upon a gallery which is four weeks old but already has 660+ deviations all of which look the same way in the matter of skill and artistic approach. While stylization may vary from image to image (some of the artworks look like typical anime-styled CG artworks from visual novels and others have semirealistic proportions), the coloring, the “brush” imitation, the textures on the backgrounds are absolutely the same on every image I analized.

There are a lot of images depictinioning conventionally attractive white or sometimes asian girls in this gallery, some of which seem familiar or resemble the characters from various media. Yes, image generators can now generate fan art. But what they can not generate is diversity. There are of course living artists who tend to draw only conventionally attractive white or asian people too, but now when the image generators gain popularity this lack of diversity automatically raise my suspicions. Drawing a crooked nose or dark skin is not hard and living artists who use references rarely fail at it. It’s image generators who fails this task constantly.

Here is an image titled as a commission. The person who uploaded it also have some content under the paywall and I do not see their images being tagged as Ai-generated too.

Remember the golder rule: spotting an Ai-generated image is the same as spotting the evil faerie in a dark folklore tale. Look them in the eyes. Count their teeth. Look at their hands and count their fingers. Check if they have a shadow and if that shadow is of human form.The devil is in the details.

While this image may appear like a hand-painted artwork of the conventionally attractive girl at the first sight, however it has quite a few clues that may help you to realize that this artist is a scammer and his entire gallery is just a selection of most-decent looking images they managed to generate with neural network. This elven girl is insanely tall, and the shore behind her back, the stones, the grass and the trees are insanely small compared to her. The piece of jewellry is attached to her nips and it’s design makes no sense. What is the gold chain under her breast, which doesn’t seem to be attached to anything? Where does this piece of cloth hang from? Why does her head cast a triangular shadow on her arm?

Many details are easy to be spotted when an image is in high resolution. I do not recommend artists to post their works in high resolution online to avoid feeding the Ai-monster and also to avoid people using your works to produce pirated merch if they draw fan art. Yet in my opinion posting close-ups might become essential - because people who call themselves ai-artists are usually hiding the artifacts under filters and upload their image resized. So yes: avoid commissioning artists, who never post high resolution faces or overuse filters and blur. Because analizing the characters’ faces is now essential.

You may look at this picture and think: how is this possible for a neural network to create such a detailed image and not fail at it (if you also ignore the fact that the girl on the horse doesn’t have legs). Luckily, the person who uploaded it uploaded it in high resolution, so we can zoom in and... yeah.

The artifacts on these evil faeiries’ faces (especially eyes) and their hands speak for themselves.

Image generators have a tendency to either give characters extra fingers, phalanx or nails or hide the hands completely, if the person writing a prompt decide to to so. I do not know whether and how fast will the algorythm learn to generate normal human hands, but for now you should pay attention to these details to spot a generated image.

Like this randomly nakey fellow with two palms on a single wrist and with some extra fingers on their elbow...

...Or this Asuka Langley fan “art” I had to censor out, with her fingers twisted and crooked.

If you are up to commission an artwork and are in search of an artist who will actually do the job you absolutely must pay attention to small details on their works: the clothing, the jewellry, the tattoos, the anatomy.

While Ai-generated images may appear photorealistic at first sight, the neural network usually misses small details, creates artifacts and makes mistakes if there are too many similar objects or repetative patterns. For example, the infamous MidJourney Party Selfies depicting girls with roughly fifly teeth, extra collarbones and green watercolor spots instead of tattooes (and don’t forget to check the ginger lady’s hand). The hair dissolwing in fabric folds? Image generator. The clothing designs which makes no sence? Image generator. Jewellry dissolwing into character’s hair? Image generator. Moreover the image generators also make mistakes while generating interiors and architecture, since the algorythm is not aware of perspective and space and once again fails either at perspective and object size or with repetative objects and patterns.

Like this image here: the bed, the window, the picture on the wall. The perspective on this image makes absolutely no sense: two walls and the bed all exist in different dimentions, while the character is once again of enormous height.

If you try to analize the background on this one, I swear, you can go insane. Look at the window and then look on the corner above it.

There is also another red flag which makes it easy to spot a scammer: dozens of iterations of the same image, which usually happens with people who can’t choose the best image out of the bunch generated with the single prompt.

There are, of course, artists who do series of works, and sometimes these works may have similar ideas and themes, but they hardly ever look this similar to each other: they may differ in angles, poses, character designs and even the artistic approach (lineart, brushes, rendering and etc). The posting time is also important: drawing an actual artwork requires time and effort - for example, I need at least two weeks to finish an artwork with two or three characters and detailed background. So a bunch of ten similar images that are uploaded at the same time it is definitely a red flag. The ai-generated images have a lot of problems with anatomy, details, perspective and other basics human artists have to learn long before they become professionals. All while having glossy semi-realistic render which can only be achieved with years of practice. I’m not saying that there are no living human artists, who may make mistakes (everyone makes mistakes now and then, even the professionals who works in this industry for DECADES) or who choose not to give much thoughts to backgrounds while focusing on characters and rendering (it is okay too), but the combinations of various red flags listed above is something you definitely have to take in account while deciding whether or not you are going to commission an artwork from this creator.

Another example (this person openly admits that they use the images generators for funsies and I did not find him mentioning paywall anywhere). The image generator even imitated the watermark.

Red flags you may spot while working with the chosen artist

Image generators are tricky: they can generate multiple iterations of the same image, imitate WIPs and many more.

First of all, the artist should provide you with WIPs on every stage of work, not when the work is already done. We artists, do it for a reason. We need your feedback constantly, even if you grant us artistic freedom to chose the idea, the character pose, the medium and technique. There are always changes to be made, and we need to make them at proper stage: for example, change the pose or angle of your character while working on a sketch is thousand times easier than to do so while rendering the image. However, the minor changes are usually possible on the later stages (some of artists may require you to pay a small fee of a few bucks, others may not). While the living artists can easily change small details such as the character’s eye color (or other small design changes) not touching the rest of the artwork, image generators simply can not do so not rerendering the whole image. If an artist does not provide you with WIPs or only provide you with them when the work is done, if an artist refuses to make any changes - these may be interpreted as red flags. If an artist agrees to make any change, even the drastic ones, at a late stage, when the piece is almost finished - it is a red flag too. Ask for a small change every single time you need one. I know that there are artists out there who prefer to only provide their client with the finished image once it is done, but now when image generators gain populatiry his may be misinterpreted as if you are a scammer.

Here is a good example of image generators generating WIPs for an existing image: it might actually look scary both for many artists and many commissioners.

I know that some of the artists are panicking that the only way to prove that you really did the artwork is a timelapse recording but this method is not for everyone. Not everyone has a setup which allow them to record a timelapse for an every single commission (my laptop will simply explode if I try). Ask your artists which software/setup do they use, ask them whether or not they can provide you with a timelapse video, ask them which brushes do they use. I know that not everyone like sharing info on their pipeline but at this point it is essential to provide your clients with information on the information about your pipeline, tools and software. For example, if your artist works in Procreate (which is available in Ipad) they have all the timelapses recorded automatically. But please, mind that not everyone have such a privilege.

As a commissioner you can ask an artist for screenshots of their workspace with all the interface visible. If they refuse providing you with that or have a hard time answering the questions about the software they use it might be a red flag. I would also suggest you not to force your artist to draw everything on stream, especially if these streams are public, because there are already cases when people took screenshots of the work in progress, used the image to image generator to apply the shiny rendering to it and accused the original artists of plagiarism. It is a risk for artists and it is okay to refuse such a request. You can also ask an artist for .PSD file of the commission, but the artist have a right to refuse sharing it online for copyright-related reasons. The original .PSD file is a best proof of authorship in court for residents of many countries. Artists can still provide you with the resized .psd file with some of the layers merged or with the background/character png with transparent background without putting themselves at risk. Of course there are artists who draw on the single layer - but without a timelapse recorded this may indeed seem suspicious that the artist does not have a .psd file with layers at all. Always ask your artist to provide you with high resolution image when the commission is finished and fully paid for. There are artists who works on smaller canvases, but working on the canvas smaller than 1000px wide might be interpreted as a red flag, since it is easy to hide artifacts on a resized image. I myself prefer working on larger canvases, from 6000 pixels wide to 10000 pixels wide (300 DPI) because I had an experience with printing my images out to sell them at conventions. While I do not sell commissioned works as prints I still give my commissioners a right to print the finished images out for non-commercial purposes. Thus, I always make sure that it is possible to make a wall print of a decent size out of the finished product. Avoid working with platforms which do not support refunds. It must either be a payment system which support sending invoices or an established platform known and used among the art community (patreon, buymeacofee, boosty, Paypal and etc.). Most artists do not do refunds for finished works — which is absolutely a right thing to do - but sometimes an error might occure. I know people who accidentally paid for their commissions twice and the artists still had to do a refund. Yes, you must respect the artists Terms of Service, but ithas nothing to do with unrelyable platforms used to scam people.

To sum it up

Search for an artists with established galleries,which has a believable amount of works and the visible artistic progress/evolution;

Analyze the artist's gallery, carefully inspecting their work for anything that might be interpreted as a red flag. Excessive fingers, crooked hands, broken perspective, clothing designs and jewellry that makes no sense, extra collarbones, lack of diversity, excessive teeth, artifacts in the eye area, interior and architecture elements which makes no sense — all while the images being glossy, fully rendered as if the artist have decades of experience;

Avoid people with too many iterations of the same image in their profile;

Avoid people with too many images being uploaded at the same time (it is okay to upload a bunch of prevoulosly done artworks when you start running your account, but uploading hundrends of images every week for a long period of time is really suspicious);

Ask for constant WIPs. Give feedback at a proper time. See the reaction;

Ask for a small change when the image is almost finished: it is impossible for the image generator to do so without fully rerendering the image, at least for now;

Ask your artist which software and assets do they use;

Ask (if it is possible) for a timelapse recording — either if the commissioned work or at least of one of their previous works (if they had an opportunity to record it before);

Ask your artist for in program screenshots with visible interface and history (if possible);

Ask your artist to show you the layers of the artwork — at least character/background only layers (mind that the background might be less detailed/wonky at the places which usually are hide but the character's figure). Ask for a resized .psd with some of the layers merged or a gif animation of each layer being added on top — this is what I usually do;

Ask for high resolution file of the commissioned image once you paid for it and it is finished. If the artist doesn’t have it and claim to work on the canvas smaller than 1000 px wide and/or claim that they intentionally delete the original file somehow - this may raise suspicions. Of course a person can delete the file accidentally or have their hard drive crushed, but if you have already spotted some red flags while working with this artist it might be a sign of a person trying to scam you too;

Many of the stuff listed above might be interpreted as a red flag , but I strongly advice you not to judge anyone by one or two points from this post. For example, a person can draw on one layer and mess up the perspective on a drawing entirely! However, if you've played a bingo and suddenly won — you have most likely encountered a person who try to fool and scam you;

Avoid working with suspicious payment methods. If you never heard about a platform before — google it and see whether or not other established artists use it. If not - it might be a scam;

And remember! People may use the images generators for various reasons: for fun, to create references of their characters to later commission reall artists artworks with said character (for example, the art breeder is a useful tool to create arealistic image of the character, even though I find it slightly limiting). Yes, image generators are unethical and trained on copyrighted data, but a person using it may not be aware of this problem. Not every single person who call themselves an “Ai-artist” has malicious plans to scam people or to gain wealth using their funny little tool. Sometimes they do it for fun and do not pretend that it is anything more that a game. Thank you for reading this far and good luck with your commissions!

Have a picture of an absolutely normal and realistic woman, generated by the neural network!

#ai art #ai art is not art #support real artist #support human artists #support artist #how to spot ai #how to spot a scammer #scam #art scam

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april-first · 5 months ago

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Guide to the Bravern Flower Shop Verse

Posting this for archiving purposes and for future/new fans who won't experience any of this live (or maybe ever, if Twitter breaks) just encounter it as older, out of context fanart on Pixiv or social media.

So. If you’ve ever looked up Japanese Bravern fanart (or fanfic) on either Pixiv or Twitter you must have stumbled upon a certain flowershop AU. It’s official (made and named by the staff, got referred to as such in the 2nd talkshow apparently) and it’s called 花屋バース. Details with links under the cut!

The contributors

Kamokamen, original/main character designer (Twitter @ sangsilnoh)

Oobari Masami, director (Twitter @ G1_BARI)

Ura Ryuuta, chief animation director (Twitter @ matatabeat)

The origins

"happy new episode release" bonus arts by the main character designer

and their two Yotsuba&! joke tweets:

Isami works at a flower shop called Brave Flower

Smith is the single father of the "mysterious girl" Lulu who is in kindergarten

This spiraled into a whole AU that has Actual Lore because the staff kept adding to it.

My main sources were 2 different tweet compilations made by Japanese fans and the very broken Twitter search. I got into the fandom when Episode 9 aired (before that I was just watching the show weekly and nothing else) so backsourcing all of this was not easy, and unfortunately I can’t guarantee this post has every relevant tweet. For example I found nothing about Smith’s job. It might exist, it might not, who knows. But the staff was very clear that they just wanted everyone to have fun coming up with ideas when they were tweeting about Bravern-the-character.

Isami & Bravern

- Isami and Bravern drive a motorcycle with a sidecar (ART!) called Brave Thunder

- according to the director Bravern wears a helmet

- Bravern exists in that miniature form which was designed by the director, completely unexplained (first appearance of "easy-to-draw Bravern-kun" | official plushie version which he brought to the 3rd talkshow | non-flowershop AU maid uniform update! also designed by him | "bunny day" update)

(T/N: this is not actual canon, but in the Animedia (May issue) interview’s Q&A section the director said Isami has the impression of someone who has a much older brother who passed away when he was young. JP fandom said nope this is the happy AU so he’s alive)

Smith & Lulu

- Smith and Lulu drive a "granny bike" called Spar Kaiser

- Lulu's seat is a child bike seat dubbed "co-pilot seat"

(T/N: answering a fan’s question, the character designer who designed Smith’s weird shirts once tweeted he’s probably using a translator app to scan the text on them.)

Other characters

- as far as I know there’s no "official" flowershop AU version of Superbia

- some time ago the director made a miniature design for him as well, but people usually draw Superbia in a humanoid form in this AU which was designed by the character designer

(T/N: not flowershop AU related, but Superbia speaks in Hiroshima dialect.)

- Miyu has a moped (a modified old Honda Super Cub) and she rides around town with Hibiki to get McDonald’s

(T/N: also not flowershop AU related, but Hibiki considers Isami a younger brother, according to the 3rd talkshow reports.)

- Satake was Isami's homeroom teacher and he was the one who taught him how to properly ride a motorcycle

- it was due to Satake’s influence that Isami chose an American-style Japanese bike which he bought secondhand for cheap for the fun of repairing and customizing it

(T/N: the tweet linked above is from March, but at the 3rd staff talkshow we learned that Satake’s bike in canon is a Honda CBR250RR. At the 2nd talkshow the staff said he gives off the impression of being a good cook, and the director shared he must be single because of the bike & red jacket combo.)

ADD ALT TEXT if you share this on other sites as screenshots. I genuinely can't be assed to care about credit, but I care a lot about accessibility.

I’m collecting the interviews and talkshow fan reports, and I'm also reading Lulu’s spinoff novel so eventually I’ll post summaries of those. (Unfortunately I don’t have time to do more than summaries.) In the meantime you guys could MTL this collab café report/article if you're interested! (I checked googletranslate and it’s readable)

#Bang Brave Bang Bravern #Bravern translations #I had to google wtf ジャメリカン was because idk motorbikes #I'm trying to prioritize the 3 talkshow reports because if twitter breaks those will be all gone #I was geoblocked from the Matsuri stream but it being available for only a limited time with no physical release announced made me think #media archival is so important yet both the audience and creators are at the whims of corporate

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venus-is-thinking · 4 months ago

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DRDT Chapter 2 Episode 14: Initial Thoughts

What an episode! I can't believe that we're probably starting to near the end of the Trial. But, considering we're almost there, we DEFINITELY have a lot to talk about. It's a longer episode, and there's a LOT to go over, so buckle in!

SPOILER WARNING FOR DRDT CH 2 PART 2!

T/W: Murder, hanging (with depictions)

The Reactions

Hu is literally so pretty.

I wasn't expecting her to get a whole mechanic defending Nico, but it makes sense. Letting other students cut in during the Class Trial is a great way to draw specific attention to a character point, and it's very clear that Hu's over-defense of Nico is going to be important moving forwards.

RIP to my "using the weight rack as the carousel" theory. The fan probably makes more sense. I just still have no idea how the 300-ish pound or whatever weight rack managed to get knocked over in the struggle.

I'm glad they directly pointed this out. Trying to kill everyone in the Class Trial was the EXACT thing Hu was so pressed about David doing. It's a weird double standard to be so forgiving of Nico when they tried to do the same thing.

Insane thing to say if Eden is the culprit and killed Arei because she didn't believe her. Then again, if my explanation for a lot of Eden Trial dialogue is "she's speaking out of regret for killing Arei now that she knows Arei was being legit," maybe she's just calling herself cruel as well.

This is honestly very valid.

Do you think "here" implies Nico trusts someone in the outside world? Based on their secret, it seems like they probably didn't have many friends. Could also be referring to animals? Or Mai Akasaki?

Big psychic damage to Hu though, considering we know she thrives on other people relying on her. She wants Nico to be someone who relies on her sooo bad, but they just... don't.

Like, girl. They literally JUST said that they don't trust anyone. That includes you.

She's clearly projecting in some way, though, which is definitely an oof. I wonder if Hu wishes she had someone who was undeniably on her side in the past...?

(To be clear: I think Hu is a very well written and interesting character. She fits the fucked up vibes of Despair Time, but coming from a more surprising angle of "that really nice and caring person can also be fucked up." She's just clearly in the wrong here, so I get to clown on her as I clown on everyone else.)

Ace is honestly so valid for this. Like, yeah he's kind of a bully and he sucks sometimes, but. Like. He did almost get murdered and people are, like, mad at him for it? Huh???

If Ace does end up being the Chapter 2 killer because he snapped, I honestly think he's so valid for that.

It is my personal agenda to record every instance of J being notably anti-murder. I don't know where it's going but if it does go somewhere I want my credit because it is Apparent.

(The entire fanbase nods in agreement.)

I know some people definitely still think/thought that Hu and/or Nico was responsible for the crime, so we've all DEFINITELY been squinting at that alibi. I fully believe it's true, but that doesn't change the fact that I wouldn't put it past Hu to make a fake alibi to protect Nico. Idk if Nico would go along with it, though.

I got so jumpscared by the Closing Argument-style CG.

I'm so glad we did get a definitive answer on how this thing worked. I was so afraid that we were just gonna solve the Arei murder method and the exact solution of Ace's would be a "left to audience interpretation" kind of thing.

I'm not exactly sure where the blood on Ace's fingertips comes from? Maybe he cut his hand on the wire when he was trying to struggle after he woke up or something.

This makes so much more sense than anything I saw theorized though, lol. The fan falling from drop hanging totally checks out as a way that the murder mechanism could fail.

I have NO fucking clue why Nico opted for this as the murder mechanism, though. I get wanting to use Hu's wire to frame her, but why didn't you just cut Ace's throat with the wire in the first place???

where did their cape go :(

Potentially suspicious line from Ace? I don't know what he's referring to as "go through all this." Like, maybe just reliving the murder attempt, I guess...? Could also be going through the Class Trial, though, if Ace killed as a result of Nico trying to kill him.

*Levi's secret quote looms*

Things that make me think Nico is either a victim or a survivor. Like, are you really gonna say this and then go try to kill someone else? ...Or Ace again, I guess??

Fun fact: this was actually what guided me to my initial killer picks, before I discussed with anyone else or read any theories! I thought the killer was trying to frame Nico, so it had to be Eden or Ace. The tape and everything else was just what locked it in for me. It's fun to see Teruko follow more or less the same path that I did when I was trying to solve the mystery :)

TAPE TIME :D

The use of the Bound Wrists truth bullet actually really confused me at first bc I didn't realize we were just talking about the tape. I was like, were Arei's wrists bound because Ace's were and it was intended to be another similarity???

Maybe Eden's just being nice, but I find it really suspicious that her instinct after all this time is "didn't MonoTV take it" and not "oh I guess Ace is probably the murderer."

Teruko has now outlined two different ways that it makes sense if the killer was in the gym that night. If I were Eden, and I were innocent, I would be realizing that there's a very small suspect pool left, and I know that I'm not the killer, giving me additional information. Instead, she's questioning the validity of the tape argument, which isn't useful for narrowing down the killer-- it's useful for keeping the suspect pool wider and not leaving herself as one of three (but basically two) options.

I kinda get why people are upset with Rose here, but it's also kind of an oof because they're only mad because Rose is really smart. Like, no one's out here like "oh my god Ace you didn't recognize the tape??" Y'know, because they think he's stupid. Rose has a really good memory, which raises the standards really high, which sets Rose up for failure.

In Rose's defense, she also never saw the tape in Nico's gym murder OR on the carousel for Arei's murder. She only saw the pieces in the trash can, which seemed to be inside out. Against Rose's defense, it would probably have been for the best if she'd gone in to look at the crime scene.

Am I tripping, or is "fish misunderstanding" a weird way for David to phrase this? The misunderstanding with Teruko was assuming that the murder happened last night, which was in fact because of the fish-- but the thing Teruko should have noticed, which makes it Teruko's mistake specifically, was the body swinging.

I'm probably reading into things too hard, but it's so hard with David. What do you know!!!

Damn, Teruko is SPEEDRUNNING this character arc. Considering we basically know she's locked in for all 6 chapters, I'm really surprised to see her making this much progress this fast.

I'm guessing that this means that Teruko is probably due for a major setback sometime sooner or later. But, interestingly, this makes me feel like Teruko realizing that working alone doesn't work isn't her character arc's end destination; it's the willingness to open herself up to caring about others even in the face of the consequences of losing someone you love. Teruko is closing herself off from everyone because she knows she's going to lose them. Maybe her end destination is allowing herself to love people, even if she might lose them someday.

This was fruity as hell btw. I'm starting to think Rose may be our replacement support if Charles does die in Chapter 3.

It's so funny that this is basically Teruko claiming in-universe protag privilege. Go off, queen.

I also said something along the lines of "Hu are we really doing this again." Totally forgot that the BDA is still relevant, lol.

I personally find the way Veronika phrased this to be very telling from an author's POV. Veronika doesn't say "she must not have committed the murder," she says "she must not have witnessed the murder." It would be totally reasonable for any of the students to forget that the rule is written in a way where a killer could fail to see the moment of murder, but DRDTdev wanted to draw attention to the rule's exact phrasing again, which is a deviation from the phrasing in the canon games.

To be clear here, I stand by this even if Eden isn't the killer and the BDA group really is Eden/Whit/Teruko. I still think it could be a reminder for a future chapter when it comes up. But, I don't think it makes sense to change the phrasing of a base rule unless there's a specific reason you want it to be different. Whether now or later, this feels like a reminder that it IS possible for the blackened to trigger the BDA.

I don't necessarily "believe David," per se, but I do think it's interesting that we're drawing attention to this. I don't really think it matters, especially because I doubt the characters remember, but I'd place my bets on Eden being the last one because of that, "Teruko, wait!" thing.

It doesn't matter because, if David or anyone else saw the body, no one can confirm which two of Teruko, Whit and Eden set off the BDA, but it's an interesting note.

It's so funny how no one, fanbase or in-universe, can tell if David is lying though. Like, he COULD have seen it, but he also easily could just be making shit up to try to throw the Trial again.

will I EVER understand what the fuck this man is cooking

Why. I thought you wanted to end the killing game to finish what Xander started. I don't know what's happening :( /pos

My guess for now is just that he's still trying to kill Teruko, in keeping with Xander's plans?? Idk how making her more distrustful makes her more likely to die, though.

I do find it very interesting that Eden's approach/reaction has been to be very quiet and freaked out whereas Ace's approach/reaction is to freak out VERY loudly. Ace's is fitting because what does he do other than freak out loudly, but I might have expected Eden to do... idk, something else? It makes enough sense though, considering either the group is right to suspect her, or she's still coping with losing Arei a little bit ago.

...*squints REALLY fucking hard*

The music and voice acting in this section is REALLY fucking good. It's sad/charming/soft enough that it feels like it could be genuine, but there's still a little something that makes you have to question whether or not it's real. You WANT to believe Eden, but it's so hard to do so fully.

Y'all think Eden's crying is reminding Teruko of whatever Arei's crying reminded her of?

i'm out of images :(

I really like Teruko assuming that Eden is innocent first. She's too distrusting and also reasonable (it is life or death after all) to just hard clear Eden based on nothing, but she's offering a bit of a reprieve to Eden. Eden's friendship means that she isn't going to get immediately targeted in her most down moment, and that's it. It's a small way to show Eden she does care.

On another note, the fact that Eden got to hug Teruko and that Teruko said the "let go of me" NOW is honestly one of the main reasons I trust Eden more. I felt like that was obviously going to happen, but I was expecting the post-Trial. Putting it here is wild.

Theory Update/Analysis

Oh boy, it's accusing time! It makes sense that we're going to start with Ace. At this point, I can honestly see it going either way. Major props to DRDTdev either way, but ESPECIALLY if Eden really is the culprit. I was so confident in it, but they're really making me question my assumptions.

I think that both Ace and Eden have good reasons to be the blackened or not to be, and good reasons to die here or to not. I'm going to do my best to make a list of reasons for both characters and give a bit of my thoughts on them. They're roughly ranked in most to least important order imo, but I didn't think too hard about it.

EDEN

Reasons Eden Would Be The Blackened:

THE TAPE: It would be easier for her to take the tape than Ace, as attention was on Ace in the gym. The tape's disappearance from the background also happens to coincide with Ace knocking her over and her standing back up.

THE NOTE: Eden already knows all the info she would need to know to write that note. She could have put the note back together to give herself a defense, to try to disprove herself as the culprit with her handwriting, because Rose was going to do it anyways, and/or to frame Arturo if she didn't know he had an alibi. I think any of these reasons, or a combination of these reasons, are enough to make it possible, and while Ace could've overheard, it's definitely less easy for him.

NOT BELIEVING AREI: Both Arei and Charles have, in this trial, been shown to question whether or not Eden believed Arei wanted to be Eden's friend. If Eden simply did, this plot point goes nowhere.

A GOOD PERSON: Eden has been called a good person, but other than that freaky CG, nothing has really come of it. Is the plot relevance of Eden being a good person really going to resolve by saying "Eden is a good person, she'd never kill her friend!"? If a good person isn't gold, Eden still feels like a missing piece of that puzzle.

INCENTIVE TO FRAME NICO: This one's a bit more of a reach, but I don't really understand the point of framing Nico if you're Ace. Of course Ace is going to insist Nico is the murderer no matter what. If you're Eden, you have a direct audience to setting it up similarly: Ace. If you can get Ace to go all in on Nico, that's one less person who was in the Gym who suspects you. Eden and Teruko feel less likely to say "oh well it looks like Nico's murder so it MUST be Nico."

HEAVY FOCUS IN CH 2: DRDTdev seems to give the chapter death's important content shortly before their deaths. Eden has been one of the most prominent characters this chapter, which could be a bad sign.

Reasons Eden Wouldn't Be the Blackened

HER EMOTIONAL REACTIONS: I think I stand with everyone else when I say that the thing giving me pause with Eden!Culprit is how devastated she truly seems to be. I do still think it could be a combo of guilt and panic over the prospect of dying, but it's hard to justify everything.

HER FRIENDSHIP WITH AREI: Sort of a spinoff of the last one, but Arei was at least offering to Eden to be friends and to protect her. If Eden did believe that, to any extent at all, it's hard to imagine her killing Arei in cold blood.

THE FISH: The biggest question when it comes to evidence as to how Eden could be the killer. If Nico fed the fish and they were all still there last night, and Eden had an alibi until after the Relax Room closed, how would she have gotten the fish to add to the crime scene?

THE BDA: Easy to ignore imo considering we've already called it into question within the series proper, but still worth talking about. For Eden to be the culprit, either someone else saw the body first and isn't claiming to have (or it's David), or we're burning the "Eden didn't witness the crime and thus could still trigger the BDA" card here.

GENDER BALANCE: Possibly an irrelevant point, but it is true that we've had 2 women and 1 man die so far. If a man was the killer, it'd keep it even. Unlikely to be relevant as any disparity could be easily balanced out in Chapter 3 with (presumably) 3 death slots.

Points About Eden That Could Go Either Way

THE FORK CG: I firmly believe that this could be setting up for Eden being a more important character throughout the series or to die after a moment of intrigue, possibly letting us explore/imply more in her post-death bonus episode.

RELATIONSHIP WITH HU: Hu has lost David as a sane ally. Nico is telling her that they don't want her speaking for them and that they don't trust her. Would DRDTdev prefer to fully isolate Hu moving into Chapter 3 by getting rid of Eden, or to leave Hu with one friend who still believes in her.

CHARLES HAVING EDEN'S SECRET: By telling us Eden's secret ahead of time by Charles revealing it to Teruko, extra focus was given to Eden's secret. Was this just the easiest way to get everyone's secrets revealed based on character dynamics, or was it meant to imply that Eden's secret is extra important? Is that because she's the killer? Is it a #ArEden sweep???

ACE

(why are they both orange)

Reasons Ace Would Be The Blackened:

NO EVIDENCE-BASED ISSUES: This is the biggest and strongest point across the whole board imo. There is no tangible, evidence-based reason why Ace COULDN'T have done the crime. Out of all 13 currently surviving students, he's the only one who that's true for. That obviously makes him a viable suspect.

WOULD ABSOLUTELY FUCKING DO IT: Ace has been Freaking The Fuck Out this chapter. I could VERY easily see him deciding to kill here. I don't think anyone is trying to argue that Ace is too emotionally attached to the cast to try to kill all of them, because he clearly isn't.

WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE?: I'm not really sure where Ace's character is going to go from here. I'd be interested in seeing more from him, but, like, where is his character arching to if not a killer? Ace is so disliked and intense that it's hard to imagine him really, fully pivoting and caring about others, but if he can't do that, is he destined to be a killer eventually?

HEAVY FOCUS IN CH 2: DRDTdev seems to give the chapter's death important content shortly before their deaths. Ace has been one of the most prominent characters this chapter, which could be a bad sign.

Reasons Ace Wouldn't Be the Blackened

OBVIOUSNESS & POINT OF CHARACTER: Of course Ace would be willing to kill Arei or whoever and the rest of the students. This is kind of the inverse of my "would absolutely fucking do it" point-- I don't know exactly how much surprise it would carry if Ace were to be the culprit. And, more than that, I feel like the point of Ace is that he is a victim here, but he's so unlikable that no one wants to acknowledge that or believe in him. I think it'd be an interesting comparison, if everyone really wants Ace to be the killer, but he just isn't. To everyone's dismay, Ace is still here. Now what?

SECRET LARGELY UNRESOLVED: Ace's secret hasn't really had any plot relevance yet. It seems like most people's do. I'm like lowkey expecting them to bring back the starvation motive from SDR2 in Chapter 4 and have SOMETHING happen with Ace there. Either way, while it could be reserved for his bonus episode (a la Min and Xander), I'd expect that his secret would have more main-story impact before he dies.

EXISTENCE OF SCRUM DEBATE: We're suspecting Ace first, but we still haven't done the scrum debate for this trial. Unless the scrum debate is "do we just vote for Ace without ever really pursuing Eden" and the answer is "yes," I don't see how we get out of this suspecting Ace period with a scrum debate without at least entertaining the idea of Ace's innocence.

STRONG CONNECTIONS TO OTHER CAST MEMBERS: Ace is very relevant to the Levi, Nico and Hu plotlines right now. Are they really going to just... get rid of him, when that's what both Nico and Hu would want?

ABILITY TO FIGURE OUT THE CONTRAPTION: Ace would not only have to recognize the way in which Nico was trying to kill him (which, to be fair is easier if he did wake up partway through), he would also have to conceptualize and figure out how to make the playground contraption successfully. I think Eden's clockmaking skills and... generally higher intelligence imo would be better suited to that.

COWARDICE: Ace is so fucking scared of everything. Would he want to put himself into harm's way by becoming the killer and having a do or die moment in the Trial? But, is he more scared of dying as a victim in the killing game, after seeing how close Nico came to killing him?

Points About Ace That Could Go Either Way

TAYLOR LORE DROP: Ace's friend, named Taylor per a Q&A with the dev, got vagued about in this Trial. Is that something to be pursued in a later Ace free time (following the one with Levi), or is that something that's going to be explained further in Ace's bonus episode (which could VERY easily be about friendship, considering it's Mai fucking Akasaki as the other person in the convo).

ACE'S BREAKDOWN @ LEVI: When Ace said he didn't fall for Levi caring about him at all, was that him affirming himself that it was the correct decision to try to kill, even if it'd put Levi's life at stake, who he previously kinda liked? Or was he lying to himself, and, at least previously, he wouldn't have wanted to kill Levi, no matter how harsh he seemed on the surface?

Well, that's all I got! Please let me know if you can come up with any more points for any of the 6 categories, because I'm very very curious to hear them! I'm thinking I might try to do an expansion on this in a separate post before next episode if I have time, exploring the ins and outs of each point with more textual evidence to back it up. I'd love to discuss any reader-suggested points too, if y'all have some in mind!

For now, I'm still personally leaning towards Eden as the culprit over Ace, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it be either of them. Well, other than the fact that my reaction to the killer being revealed is going to be :O no matter what.

#drdt #drdt spoilers #danganronpa despair time #teruko tawaki #eden tobisa #ace markey #i think those are the only characters for today #but i DEFINITELY talked about ace and eden enough for them to qualify #actually wait #hu jing #i talked about her a decent amount at the beginning #anyways sorry this is late! i had a concert night of the drdt drop so i'm just kinda a day behind everywhere i'd normally be re:drdt #killer reveal soon... insane

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prinzrupprecht · 1 year ago

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Counter argument to those that are complaining about sexualizing anime high school characters

Why are people now crying about writers sexualizing school kids in anime? It’s fiction, they’re not real. Anime is not real. Finding a minor character in a show attractive, doesn’t make the reader or the writer a pedophile. Actually, the term pedophile has been loosely thrown around way too much. It’s a psychiatric disorder when a person has a strong attraction to pursue or try to engage with pubescent children below the age of 13. This is completely different to liking a character that is not real. Hate, disagree with this all you want. Liking or having a crush on underaged fictional characters isn’t comparable at all to pursuing/sexualizing minors in real life. People need to stop comparing the two. Fiction doesn’t equal reality at all. I couldn't care less what authors/writers do as long as we all can understand the difference between fiction and reality. For the longest time, I had a huge crush on Manjiro and I thought he was 18, but turns out he was 16. A lot of the time they don’t look or even act their age. Hidden inventory 16 y/o Gojo fanfics are insanely popular on wattpad/AO3 and he barely even looks like he aged from 16 to 28. There's also so much r34 art of Zero Two and Marin Kitagawa. It’s pen and ink. So who cares?

“Omg tHaT’s a cHilD yOu sIcK fuCkS.”

Some people here don’t seem to understand Japanese culture and it speaks loud and clear. Do these “anime” high school characters act or look like a child? No. Does Yuji/Megumi/Yuta look like a shota? No. They have bodies of an adult and don’t even look like or act like children. Also, liking underaged fictional characters doesn’t mean we are attracted to children / minors in real life. Stop with that shit. A lot of Mangakas sexualize their minor characters. It’s normal in their culture. So that makes Japanese weird too? Nah stfu, let the Japanese cook. I’m guessing the minority that are crying about it are probably pissy Americans that can’t seem to accept that it’s normal in someone else’s culture and many others to like the looks of fictional 2D drawings of characters that don’t look like real humans. All it is, is just art. None of it is real.

It may seem wrong to you, but it is normal to others. Especially those who’ve been writing fanfiction for years on Wattpad and AO3. There’s millions of fanfics of “underaged characters x OC/Readers” which has been normalized already for decades because people can separate their fictional fantasies from real life. Age doesn’t exist in fiction when you can change it in your fan made content. Authors can change the age of the characters too in their fanfics/one shots. There’s been countless of people making High school AUs of Gojo x reader/OC fan made content surfacing Wattpad and AO3.

Some of y’all be reposting Geto x reader smut, & Sukuna x reader smut and they are mass murderers, child murderers, Geto is a racist, and Sukuna is cannibal and arguably a rapist. Would you fuck a child murderer in real life? Y’all be having fantasies of these characters. Majority of Sukuna smut on here is him using a “minor’s” body to fuck the brains out with the reader and that’s somehow better than people finding Yuji or Megumi attractive? Relax. It’s just fantasies we all have, they’re not real.

Anime characters are 2D drawings, so no, I don't consider finding anime girls/boys attractive equivalent to finding young real-life girls/boys attractive. No more than being attracted to drawings with absurdly disproportionate eyes means you like humans whose eyes take up half their skull. It's just an art style. That’s the whole point of fiction, it’s just fantasies as long as you don’t act on those same thoughts in reality who gives a shit. I would never like minors irl, so ffs call me a pedo for liking anime characters or disagree with me. Idc.

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fluffernuttermushroom · 5 months ago

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KND Community Challenge

1: when did you start watching the show?

I think it was near the end of 2023? I was introduced to the fandom by one of the comics that @fallen-gabrielle posted. I was a fan of old fashioned cartoons already and loved the unique art style! A few comics and several episodes later, I was hooked!

2: favorite season?

I haven’t watched trough the entire series yet(Currently on season 3). But Iike season three for all the new characters introduced!

3: favorite episode?

T.U.R.N.I.P.

T.H.E.-F.L.Y.

Q.U.I.E.T.

G.R.O.W.-U.P.

D.O.G.F.I.G.H.T.

F.U.T.U.R.E.

U.T.O.P.I.A.

4: hated episode?

P.I.N.K.E.Y.E. (ick)

5: favorite character?

Favorite character(s)!

Rachel(I often feel her ‘I have been everyone’s councilor at this point and I am tired of people’ feeling. Is this an INFJ thing?),

Hoagie(He reminds me of my cousin + we have the shared love for bad puns & dad jokes!),

Abby(Cool!),

Sally Sanban(I am obsessed with her for some reason),

Nigel’s grandson(Same reason with Sally. Dunno why),

6: did you cry when you watch OP INTERVIEWS?

I didn't cry but It felt quite bitter sweet. I’m the sort of person who watches the end before finishing a series. So I kind of scrolled through the entire wiki and watched I.N.T.E.R.V.I.E.W.S. before actually watching the C:KND. It is an inevitable fate for all kids to grow up to grow old and gray at some point. But I have never seen characters grown up in a cartoon before. The whole episode made KND hit a bit too close to home to me.

Ironically the episode that made me upset the most ended up being one of the reasons that I like about the KND.

You will grow up

But you will never grow out of some things

7: funniest moment?

Wally saying “C’mon she already has every single rainbow monkey there is!”

And then watching in horror as the rainbow monkey aircraft coming into view before saying;

“Oh yeah, except that one.”

8: saddest moment?

Abby giving up in Operation M.A.U.R.I.C.E. after facing that every one she knows and loves in the KND will turn into teens & forget about her eventually.

9: favorite KND artist?

Again, can’t pick just one! This is going to be long so the list of artists and why I like them are listed below

10: favorite canon KND ship?

3x4 and 2x5

11: favorite headcanon KND ship?

Ummm... can’t choose! Straight, Gay, Lesbian, Pan, Poly, Platonic I love & have them all!

I have a lot of different head cannons for different scenarios.

But the ones in my fanfiction are currently 1x362, 60x86, 2xAce(the kid), 83x84, 23x35

12: what's one thing you love about the fandom?

The thousands of fan theories, fan fiction with their own interesting head cannons, multiple aus and crossovers, and of course the beautiful fanart with unique art styles!

13: what's one thing you hate about the fandom?

Those weird pedo & insest shippers that keep spawning out of nowhere

14: do you wish there were more die hard KND fans in the fandom?

YES. A thousand times YES.

15: when did you start drawing KND art?

Near the start of May 2024 and have been drawing almost daily ever since! But It’s mostly animation plans and sketches so I don’t post often nowadays

16: how old were you when you started drawing KND art?

Hm, will answer that on my birthday.

17: how old are you now and are you still drawing KND art?

Same with the answer above! I will answer on my birthday

18: what's one thing you wish would stop in the fandom?

The pedo & insest ships, art thefts, rude requests and just disrespecting other people.

19: quick pick your favorite 2×4?

M.A.R.B.L.E.(Mustardy Armament Releases Big Loud Explosion) and

G.A.R.G.O.C.Y.C.L.E.(Granite Augmented Rocket Glider Outstandingly Creates Your Cool Looking Escape)!

20: what's your Codename?

Numbuh 9.24!

(KND Community Challenge Template Credits To @arudan)

+Answer to question number 9

@fallen-gabrielle: The one who brought me into the fandom + has a lot of lovely AUs!

@midnight-the-goth-artist: Satisfies my inner goth, has helluva boss inspired art

@gen-toon: Beautiful angles & poses

@numbuh02: The scratchy art style!

@artsygirl0315: Her OCs remind me of ENA! And they interact with the fandom often

@elijaheldridge: FLOOF EVERY WHERE

@mixxxerlyishere: OC with a unique design!

@scarlett-v-the-fox: The head cannons for minor KND characters are really intricate

@bluccoli: Rare fellow Korean KND artist & takes a lot of requests!

@gettan49: Still reading ‘Operation: BEYOND’ it’s a really well made fanfiction

@parasite-doll: Always love the creepy art style

@mixx0: The sillies (OCs)

@kandykatz: Uses the tumblr aesthetics to it’s full extent + draws hair really well!

@bluepastels29: Insane attention to detail to her cloth designs

@numbuh900: G:KND OCs!

@numbuh-72: Great at KND edits! It looks like a part of the show if I don’t look closely

@ohlookanothercartoontofallinto: Lineless art. LINELESS ART.

@kndrules: Sector V as grown-up comics!

@sok-knd: Uses brushes really well & has a lot of different art styles

@kukiiisblog: 3x4 art in webtoon + old cartoon style

@numbuhinfinitys: Reyna and their cute shenanigans with the delightful children

@your-genious-artistic-girl: I dunno how she makes line arts that clear! Mine are always squiggley

@pennywhistle2021: Numbuh 30c art! Most of the fan art of 30c that I find on deviant art is theirs

@knd1234isme: Numbuh 4 in every form possible

@torra-and-the-toons: Has really specific Nigel head cannons + old cartoons!

@spicedwatermel0n: Not picky with ships & is understanding with others

@kidsnextdoor-doodles: Moonbabies :)

@pinkmeanschaos: KND genderbend everything! And a fellow 60 x 86 shipper

@bugtoonz: Pastel art! Their art is always easy on the eyes

@rubiisun: The art style always gives me a fluffy feeling

@kommandonuovidiavoli: Everyones favorite grandma :) Penny’s chaotic nature always tickles me

@rainbowbeam231: Uses colors really well with her OCs!

@totallynoteggos: Unique concept with making the (Y/N) self insert as and OC!

@some-loozzr: Good with lighting! + The spank-happy sector V members look so scrappy I love them

#knd #codename knd #cknd #kids next door #codename knd fandom #codename kids next door #knd community #community challenge

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tobiasdrake · 8 months ago

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One of my favorite bits of Dragonball trivia is that Yajirobe canonically sounds exactly like Krillin (because Toriyama wanted to make sure Krillin's VA still had a steady job while he was dead). so in honor of that, what are your thoughts on Yajirobe?

I support the commander and general of Yajirobe's Special Forces.

...okay, that probably needs some explaining. A bit the anime liked to do for their filler was to have news cameras and reporters swarm the action to report on everything that's happening. This became very awkward later in the series when it was a plot point that nobody remembered Goku more than ten years after Piccolo's defeat.

One of these bits has reporters interviewing Yajirobe while the Saiyan battle was going on. Yajirobe claims that his elite team are out there engaging the Saiyans. So this became a running joke on another site I was on. Dragon Team? Z Warriors? Nah. Yajirobe's Special Forces.

But in seriousness, let's talk Yajirobe.

As noted, this is a character who only exists because, for a brief period, Krillin didn't. Toriyama killed off Krillin but didn't want his V.A. to go without work, so he purposely and explicitly notes in the manga that Yajirobe conveniently sounds just like Krillin.

"Oh wow, you sound just like someone who would be played by Mayumi Tanaka in the anime adaptation of my adventures!" ~Goku

Yajirobe is pretty unique in Dragon Ball for being a weapon-based fighter. The only other character who relies on a sword is Trunks, and he loses his sword pretty early in the Android arc.

Due to his function as a surrogate character for Krillin, Yajirobe is pretty underdeveloped. He's a wandering ronin wildman Goku happens to run into who's tough enough to hang with 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai top contenders.

Somewhere, Tenshinhan doesn't know why but he's incredibly offended right now.

Though when he does get a chance to attend the tournament, it doesn't go well. Then again, he's pit against God in the qualifiers so that's bad luck.

Don't worry, Yajirobe. Yamcha feels your pain.

God came to defeat Piccolo but he figures, as long as he's here, he might as well humiliate martial artists for lulz. This whole drunken boxing-esque "Whoopsy did I win?" shtick must be so demoralizing to lose to.

As a fighter, Yajirobe leans on his katana. This is what makes him so distinctive, compared to other martial artists. He does fight hand-to-hand when he isn't taking things seriously.

But for Yajirobe, getting serious means going for his sword. He practices iaijutsu, a form of kenjutsu revolving around rapid drawing, striking, and sheathing of one's blade. 90's anime fans may recognize iaijutsu or its older name battojutsu as the basis for Kenshin Himura's style in the samurai anime Rurouni Kenshin.

This kill was brought to you by iaijutsu, a popular art for anime swordsmanship because it's fucking cool. Vegeta would later fall victim to Yajirobe's iaijutsu as well.

Imagine being the second-most powerful being the universe literally on the cusp of annihilating the last line of defense that this pitiful world has to offer, with the only truly dangerous opponent broken in your hand....

And then suddenly you lose everything to Krillin's stunt double. This is worse. This is definitely worse than having God Whoopsy Doodle Headbutt you in the balls. 100%, this is worse.

This was both the first and last time Yajirobe had any meaningful impact on a fight. I don't count killing Cymbal up there because Goku would have done it if he hadn't. That was an establishing moment to show off Yajirobe's abilities.

Rather, despite his abilities and standoffish demeanor, Yajirobe is primarily the party healer. It's super weird. Right from the start, his first contribution is a fish Goku swipes from him to get his strength back.

Goku had no idea that this was stealing. He thought fish just... happen like that sometimes.

Goku's bad at life.

But then everything changes for him, after. Uh. Piccolo kills Goku and then Goku... inexplicably springs back to life for no clear reason at all.

Yeah, this beat-for-beat copy/paste of the Taopaipai fight has some jank to it. But that means Yajirobe's next order of business is to serve as a mode of transportation to bring Goku to healz.

And then he moved in. Now he just. Lives there. Obnoxious college roommate to the God of Martial Arts, running errands in the world below. Karin's personal gofer.

Hey, God wants to see us all for fight practice and also your weird island house is dumb and obnoxious.

Here are your Senzu; Bean Daddy out.

The best thing about Yajirobe is the total lack of fucks he gives about whatever this is. Any time he's onscreen, you can feel his resentment over having to earn his rent by continuing to be a character in this manga.

(And the second best thing is that somehow, Wildman With Sword is the party healer.)

#dragon ball #dragon ball z #yajirobe

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atwas-gaming · 2 months ago

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People who complain that Sonic's character is "static" must have never played Unleashed or Black Knight. Or they did, but they didn't understand them.

I think one of the reasons why Unleashed and Black Knight are such fan favorites and stick in our memory so well is because the entire theme of both games is about taking Sonic out of his element, taking away things that he has relied on for so long- speed, jumping, spindashing, boosting, homing attacks- taking all those things away from him, and seeing how he does.

And he still shines. Even without all the abilities that he has relied on throughout his entire life, he still manages to beat the Big Bad.

(Please note that I haven't finished either game yet and I'm just drawing from what I've been spoiled on.)

As the werehog, Sonic is not able to curl into a ball at all (we're ignoring the mobile games for this post), and his greater height and weight, probably due to a larger bone structure, as well as heavier, thicker fur, keeps him from being able to run as fast or jump as high as he's used to. He now how to resort to fighting styles he has never used before, including several forms of martial arts (aided by his Dark Gaia-powered stretch abilities). Perhaps the most unusual of all is how he has to get down on all fours to run.

In addition, Sonic describes his werehog form as "pretty ugly." Sonic thinks of himself as good-looking, and this is a part of his personal identity, which is part of why he was upset that Amy didn't recognize him (no matter what feelings he may or may not have for her). The werehog form also seems to be physically uncomfortable and taxing on Sonic's body due to the heavier weight, as the werehog idle animations include Sonic stretching in an exaggerated way and forcibly rotating his shoulders (motions I, myself, have learned to use after years at a desk job that has ruined my neck and upper back). Sonic's idle animations also include him being jumpy and looking around every few seconds- basically, the werehog never fully relaxes.

All in all, Sonic is very uncomfortable as a werehog, and prefers not to be seen in this form. But the reason why is not fully evident until he thanks Chip for protecting him and keeping him from turning evil. To this, Chip replies, "I haven't done anything, Sonic. You're too strong to lose yourself."

On top of this, Amy doesn't have a problem with Sonic's appearance. She still loves him. Tails also doesn't care what Sonic looks like. Neither does Professor Pickle. Neither does ANYONE. Even if they're startled by the werehog's appearance at first, they all seem to go, "Oh, it's just Sonic. This is just what he's like at night."

The entire story of Unleashed was about Sonic coming to realize that he is not who he is because of what he looks like or how he is built.

Black Knight takes this a step further. In Unleashed, Sonic wasn't able to run, but he was still able to use his body as a weapon. In Black Knight, Sonic can run again, but nowhere near as fast as his normal speed. All of Sonic's abilities to fight with his body are stripped from him, and he is forced to use an actual weapon, instead. And Sonic hates this. He even says it: "I wish I didn't have to use this dang sword!"

Sonic has never used a weapon before in the games (as far as I am aware, anyway). His weapon has always been his own body: his feet, his fists, his whole body via spindash and homing attack. Now he's having to train himself to fight with something outside of his own body. This requires not only the creation of new muscle memory, but also a complete shift in the way his brain processes information to fight. He always has the option to just crumble and say, "I can't do this, it's not what I'm used to, I give up." He never does that. He complains a bit at first, but eventually rises to the occasion and excels at swordfighting.

Please bear in mind that I haven't ever gotten past the King Arthur battle. I presume Sonic is forced to kill him, and then I believe there's another half a game after that. But so far, it seems that Sonic's character arc in Black Knight is about him learning that he is not who he is just because of what he can do.

What makes Sonic Sonic is not what he looks like or what he is able to do, but about who he is inside. Sonic is someone who cares, someone who is strong, someone who doesn't give up, someone who sees a difficult situation and, no matter how much of an inconvenience it may be, turns it around and finds a way through.

#sonic the hedgehog #sonic unleashed #sonic and the black knight #in this essay i will #my opinion #character analysis

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sabrinatvband · 5 months ago

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Notes on Comic Art #2: To Hatch or Not to Hatch, also some coloring stuff

One of the most influential things I've ever read on the subject of comic art is a piece Jesse Hamm wrote on Alex Toth where he talks about flatpacking.

[I discovered while writing this that Jesse Hamm passed away in 2021. He was a brilliant educator, one of the best in the history of the comics medium, and will be sorely missed.]

In the piece Hamm basically discusses how over-rendering objects usually makes them function worse as comic art. Many other people have discussed how using thicker lines for objects closer to the "camera" is good practice, how colors can seperate shapes and create depth, etc.

The question is, where does cross hatching fit into all of this? Or rather, various methods of adding more detailed rendering to artwork? I'm trying to figure this stuff out as I'm doing layouts for my comic, because I want to know the answers before I start inking the final artwork.

I try/want to have an uncluttered, clean, easily readable art style. I occasionally add hatching to my drawings, because hatching is fun, but I often feel like I've slightly ruined my artwork when I'm finished.

I've decided to look at some of the art that I feel like my own work is trying the hardest to emulate, at least philosophically, to see how other artists "weigh in" on this debate. It's important to remember that inkers embellish artwork [hence the alternate title "embellisher"], and so I'm going to try and find inkers most representative of a given penciller's intentions when applicable.

As I was working on this piece, I read Hamm Tips vol 1.1, and I discovered this diagram, which seems to relate with what I'm going to discuss later:

I think it's accurate to say that my desired approach is Uninflected/Deliberate; I think most people going for a clean and cartoonish look fall into that quadrant. Some people might describe Toth's work as being "clean", and so I should clarify that I'm talking about clean in the spirit of "lines meet neatly".

Some of the artists I'll discuss have lines that fall somewhere between being Inflected and Uninflected, and I think a lot of this comes down to inker approach. I feel like, in spirit, all of these pencillers are Uninflected, but some of the inkers use brushes, which creates a sort of middle ground. Brushes add different weights to a line, whereas crow quill nibs and pens have a uniform width. [The technical term for unweighted inked lines is "dumb line"; I believe this was coined by David Mazzucchelli.]

Let's first look at Adam Warren's work in the Dirty Pair volume Fatal But Not Serious. I'm a huge fan of how this comic looks; the flat, cel animation-style colors are very clean and easy to read. It's a very pleasant look, and I'm surprised more comics don't do this.

There is some hatching here, but it's not "serious" hatching. Just a few lines on cheeks, hands, etc. 98% of the artwork is shapes delinated entirely by a clean line and color. The convention floor panel is able to have a ton of detail without really changing the visual "rules" of the comic. An artist who does things in a more highly rendered way may've, for instance, reduced the crowd to a series of heavily shadowed figures, or colored in a single expressionistic wash to paper over things, etc.

Warren's Magical Drama Queen Roxy used a very similar approach to Fatal But Not Serious:

Let's now look at Rick Mays. I'm not a huge fan of Rick Mays, I've only actual read a single issue of a comic by him, but as I was reading Gen 13 he immediately stood out as being the best artist on that series, aside from Adam Warren himself [speaking only about issues Warren wrote]. It feels very telling that Rick Mays later did the final art for a graphic novel Warren laid out called Livewires.

These are from Gen 13 vol 2 #70:

The biggest difference between this piece has nothing to do with Warren or Mays, and everything to do with the coloring approach. I don't think the coloring here is bad, but the gradient-y colors do create a vastly different visual effect than the cel look I highlighted earlier.

The inking approach feels quite similar between the two artists; while Mays's art takes one or two steps towards realism relative to the Fatal But Not Serious stuff, texture is largely used to the same degree [with the grass and tornado being understandable exceptions]. What's interesting is that this issue has three different credited inkers; Karl Story, Rick Mays, and Jason Martin. I'm assuming this happened for deadline reasons.

I feel like I'm maybe starting to sound a little repetitive, and so I feel like I should share an issue of Gen 13 that I disliked, and then we can move to things that aren't Adam Warren-adjacent. These are from #43 and #44, with pencils by Lee Bermejo and inks by John Nyberg:

I'm not a big fan of this. The borderline chiaroscuro inking makes everything look heavily referenced, labored, and weird, and the "acting" in the comic suffers because of the over-rendered faces. It's a real shame the artwork is like this, because this two-part story is actually quite solid and would be a minor classic with better artwork.

I notice that many newer comic artists [which is to say, people who began their careers during the 90s onwards] put a lot of heavy shadows on figures in a way that feels too slavishly devoted to a certain kind of realism. I say a "certain kind" because the high contrast look of black spots being put onto a figure make the shadows way darker than they'd actually look in real life, so it almost makes the figures look dirty.

Look at comic art from the olden days and figures are largely defined by outlines/color. If a figure in an old comic has a lot of shadow on them, it's for reasons that are obvious and motivated; noir-y venetian blinds stuff, a mysterious villain being obscured, someone being underlit, or having half their face obscured, etc. There's a clear reason shadows are being used in these cases, rather than it being done to add usually unnecessary detail.

Anyways, let's look at Amanda Conner's work. Image on the left is from a Vampirella story called Fantasy Feast, and the image on the right is from Power Girl #12. Texture is used, like on the walls of the bathroom, but sparingly.

Looking at Conner's work in this context makes me realize, I don't think I've ever seen Amanda Conner's stuff colored flat [at least after she fully matured as an artist]. I don't think the more three-dimensional rendering used in any of these panels is bad, but I'm not going to be doing that kind of coloring in my book, and so it's not quite as instructive to me.

That being said, I really love Conner's style. I've noticed that Marvel and DC are increasingly using artists with styles that are broadly similar to Conner's; I've included an example below. Maybe it's because the artist below is too lazy to draw a proper background, but their work feels so much more flavorless than Conner's in comparison. I think it's because the "acting" is not as impressive, and Conner brings a fun-factor that feels completely absent in the page below.

I realize "fun" isn't always the order of the day, but this page doesn't really reflect . . . anything. It's completely bland.

Here's Kirby, who couldn't be bland if he tried. The left image is from the Young Romance collection Fantagraphics put out, and the right is from OMAC. The former is from the 40s, latter is from the 70s. [By the way, the Young Romance image is photographed from my own collection; there's no warping visible because Fantagraphics knows how to design a book].

Looking at these pieces side-by-side really challenges a lot of my assumptions about Kirby's artwork, because in some ways his artwork changed less than I previously thought it did without direct comparisons. There are some things that are more abstract about the OMAC page, like the wiggly shadows. Someone unfamiliar with Kirby might assume these were drawn by two different people, but only because 30-odd years of growth seperate these two pages.

Kirby's style, in my mind, is highly geometric and defined more so by abstract shorthand squiggles than hatching or other forms of rendering, but there actually is a fair amount of hatching on the OMAC page.

However, that OMAC page I believe was inked by Mike Royer, or at least someone using a brush. I noticed that, by sheer coincidence, almost all of the Kirby art from my first post in this series was inked by D. Bruce Barry, who didn't use a brush and also followed Kirby's pencils perhaps more literally than any other inker he ever had. In those images, it's clear that most of the hatching in Kirby's work was added by his inkers.

When Kirby did ink himself [using a brush], his style was oddly clean. He did add in hatching, but it was never particularly dense.

Anyways, I want to close this by including some Jesse Hamm quotes from his instructional PDFs:

-Simplicity is great, but often you need extra texture to seel weirdness.

-Another sign of experience is texture. The pro-level artist has learned to give different textures to grass, hair, tree bark, bushes, etc. Meanwhile, the amateur uses the same one or two shading techniques on EVERYTHING, giving it all a samey feel.

-Open spaces of black or white may be "activated" with a bit of texture. A few pebbles/ripples/etc will spur the mind to fill what's missing.

-We talk often about spotting blacks, but spotting greys (i.e., details/texture) is also crucial to clear compositions.

The lesson in the bit of Hamm writing I most often revisited, the flatpacking post, was that too much texture and rendering can make a comic exhausting to read. But reading more of his work, it turns out he had a more nuanced, texture-inclusive view of things.

What's the lesson here? Discretion.

#making comics #art #comics

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