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mostlysignssomeportents · 6 months ago

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Canada’s ground-breaking, hamstrung repair and interop laws

If you'd like an essay-formatted version of this post to read or share, here's a link to it on pluralistic.net, my surveillance-free, ad-free, tracker-free blog:

https://pluralistic.net/2024/11/15/radical-extremists/#sex-pest

When the GOP trifecta assumes power in just a few months, they will pass laws, and those laws will be terrible, and they will cast long, long shadows.

This is the story of how another far-right conservative government used its bulletproof majority to pass a wildly unpopular law that continues to stymie progress to this day. It's the story of Canada's Harper Conservative government, and two of its key ministers: Tony Clement and James Moore.

Starting in 1998, the US Trade Rep embarked on a long campaign to force every country in the world to enact a new kind of IP law: an "anticircumvention" law that would criminalize the production and use of tools that allowed people to use their own property in ways that the manufacturer disliked.

This first entered the US statute books with the 1998 passage of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), whose Section 1201 established a new felony for circumventing an "access control." Crucially, DMCA 1201's prohibition on circumvention did not confine itself to protecting copyright.

Circumventing an access control is a felony, even if you never violate copyright law. For example, if you circumvent the access control on your own printer to disable the processes that check to make sure you're using an official HP cartridge, HP can come after you.

You haven't violated any copyright, but the ink-checking code is a copyrighted work, and you had to circumvent a block in order to reach it. Thus, if I provide you a tool to escape HP's ink racket, I commit a felony with penalties of five years in prison and a $500k fine, for a first offense. So it is that HP ink costs more per ounce than the semen of a Kentucky Derby-winning stallion.

This was clearly a bad idea in 1998, though it wasn't clear how bad an idea it was at the time. In 1998, chips were expensive and underpowered. By 2010, a chip that cost less than a dollar could easily implement a DMCA-triggering access control, and manufacturers of all kinds were adding superfluous chips to everything from engine parts to smart lightbulbs whose sole purpose was to transform modification into felonies. This is what Jay Freeman calls "felony contempt of business-model."

So when the Harper government set out to import US-style anticircumvention law to Canada, Canadians were furious. A consultation on the proposal received 6,138 responses opposing the law, and 54 in support:

https://www.michaelgeist.ca/2010/04/copycon-final-numbers/

And yet, James Moore and Tony Clement pressed on. When asked how they could advance such an unpopular bill, opposed by experts and the general public alike, Moore told the International Chamber of Commerce that every objector who responded to his consultation was a "radical extremist" with a "babyish" approach to copyright:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/science/copyright-debate-turns-ugly-1.898216

As is so often the case, history vindicated the babyish radical extremists. The DMCA actually has an official way to keep score on this one. Every three years, the US Copyright Office invites public submissions for exemptions to DMCA 1201, creating a detailed, evidence-backed record of all the legitimate activities that anticircumvention law interferes with.

Unfortunately, "a record" is all we get out of this proceeding. Even though the Copyright Office is allowed to grant "exemptions," these don't mean what you think they mean. The statute is very clear on this: the US Copyright Office is required to grant exemptions for the act of circumvention, but is forbidden from granting exemptions for tools needed to carry out these acts.

This is headspinningly and deliberately obscure, but there's one anecdote from my long crusade against this stupid law that lays it bare. As I mentioned, the US Trade Rep has made the passage of DMCA-like laws in other countries a top priority since the Clinton years. In 2001, the EU adopted the EU Copyright Directive, whose Article 6 copy-pastes the provisions of DMCA 1201.

In 2003, I found myself in Oslo, debating the minister who'd just completed Norway's EUCD implementation. The minister was very proud of his law, boasting that he'd researched the flaws in other countries' anticircumvention laws and addressed them in Norway's law. For example, Norway's law explicitly allowed blind people to bypass access controls on ebooks in order to feed them into text-to-speech engines, Braille printers and other accessibility tools.

I knew where this was going. I asked the minister how this would work in practice. Could someone sell a blind person a tool to break the DRM on their ebooks? Of course not, that's totally illegal. Could a nonprofit blind rights group make such a tool and give it away to blind people? No, that's illegal too. What about hobbyists, could they make the tool for their blind friends? No, not that either.

OK, so how do blind people exercise their right to bypass access controls on ebooks they own so they can actually read them?

Here's how. Each blind person, all by themself, is expected to decompile and reverse-engineer Adobe Reader, locate a vulnerability in the code and write a new program that exploits that vulnerability to extract their ebooks. While blind people are individually empowered to undertake this otherwise prohibited activity, they must do so on their own: they can't share notes with one another on the process. They certainly can't give each other the circumvention program they write in this way:

https://pluralistic.net/2024/10/28/mcbroken/#my-milkshake-brings-all-the-lawyers-to-the-yard

That's what a use-only exemption is: the right to individually put a locked down device up on your own workbench, and, laboring in perfect secrecy, figure out how it works and then defeat the locks that stop you from changing those workings so they benefit you instead of the manufacturer. Without a "tools" exemption, a use exemption is basically a decorative ornament.

So the many use exemptions that the US Copyright Office has granted since 1998 really amount to nothing more than a list of defects in the DMCA that the Copyright Office has painstaking verified but is powerless to fix. We could probably save everyone a lot of time by scrapping the triennial exemptions process and replacing it with an permanent sign over the doors of the Library of Congress reading "Abandon hope, all ye who enter here."

All of this was well understood by 2010, when Moore and Clement were working on the Canadian version of the DMCA. All of this was explained in eye-watering detail to Moore and Clement, but was roundly ignored. I even had a go at it, publicly picking a fight with Moore on Twitter:

https://web.archive.org/web/20130407101911if_/http://eaves.ca/wp-content/uploads/2010/Conversations%20between%20@doctorow%20and%[email protected]

Moore and Clement rammed their proposal through in the next session of Parliament, passing it as Bill C-11 in 2012:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Modernization_Act

This was something of a grand finale for the pair. Today, Moore is a faceless corporate lawyer, while Clement was last seen grifting covid PPE (Clement's political career ended abruptly when he sent dick pics to a young woman who turned out to be a pair of sextortionists from Cote D'Ivoire, and was revealed as a serial sex-pest in the ensuing scandal:)

https://globalnews.ca/news/4646287/tony-clement-instagram-women/

Even though Moore and Clement are long gone from public life, their signature achievement remains a Canadian disgrace, an anchor chain tied around the Canadian economy's throat, and an impediment to Canadian progress.

This week, two excellent new Canadian laws received royal assent: Bill C-244 is a broad, national Right to Repair law; and Bill C-294 is a broad, national interoperability law. Both laws establish the right to circumvent access controls for the purpose of fixing and improving things, something Canadians deserve and need.

But neither law contains a tools exemption. Like the blind people of Norway, a Canadian farmer who wants to attach a made-in-Canada Honeybee tool to their John Deere tractor is required to personally, individually reverse-engineer the John Deere tractor and modify it to talk to the Honeybee accessory, laboring in total secrecy:

https://www.theregister.com/2024/11/12/canada_right_to_repair/

Likewise the Canadian repair tech who fixes a smart speaker or a busted smartphone – they are legally permitted to circumvent in order to torture the device's repair codes out of it or force it to recognize a replacement part, but each technician must personally figure out how to get the device firmware to do this, without discussing it with anyone else.

Thus do Moore and Clement stand athwart Canadian self-reliance and economic development, shouting "STOP!" though both men have been out of politics for years.

There has never been a better time to hit Clement and Moore's political legacy over the head with a shovel and bury it in a shallow grave. Canadian technologists could be making a fortune creating circumvention devices that repair and improve devices marketed by foreign companies.

They could make circumvention tools to allow owners of consoles to play games by Canadian studios that are directly sold to Canadian gamers, bypassing the stores operated by Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo and the 30% commissions they charge. Canadian technologists could be making diagnostic tools that allow every auto-mechanic in Canada to fix any car manufactured anywhere in the world.

Canadian cloud servers could power devices long after their US-based manufacturers discontinue support for them, providing income to Canadian cloud companies and continued enjoyment for Canadian owners of these otherwise bricked gadgets.

Canada's gigantic auto-parts sector could clone the security chips that foreign auto manufacturers use to block the use of third party parts, and every Canadian could enjoy a steep discount every time they fix their cars. Every farmer could avail themselves of third party parts for their tractors, which they could install themselves, bypassing the $200 service call from a John Deere technician who does nothing more than look over the farmer's own repair and then types an unlock code into the tractor's console.

Every Canadian who prints out a shopping list or their kid's homework could use third party ink that sells for pennies per liter, rather than HP's official colored water that cost more than vintage Veuve Cliquot.

A Canadian e-waste dump generates five low-paid jobs per ton of waste, and that waste itself will poison the land and water for centuries to come. A circumvention-enabled Canadian repair sector could generate 150 skilled, high-paid community jobs that saves gadgets and the Earth, all while saving Canadians millions.

Canadians could enjoy the resliency that comes of having a domestic tech and repair sector, and could count on it through pandemics and Trumpian trade-war.

All of that and more could be ours, except for the cowardice and greed of Tony Clement and James Moore and the Harper Tories who voted C-11 into law in 2012.

Everything the "radical extremists" warned them of has come true. It's long past time Canadians tore up anticircumvention law and put the interests of the Canadian public and Canadian tech businesses ahead of the rent-seeking enshittification of American Big Tech.

Until we do that, we can keep on passing all the repair and interop laws we want, but each one will be hamstrung by Moore and Clement's "felony contempt of business model" law, and the contempt it showed for the Canadian people.

Image: JeffJ (modified) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Tony_Clement_-_2007-06-30_in_Kearney,_Ontario.JPG

CC BY-SA 3.0 https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/

Jorge Franganillo (modified) https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Duga_radar_system-_wreckage_of_electronic_devices_(37885984654).jpg

CC BY 2.0 https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.0/deed.en

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putschki1969 · 8 months ago

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📢UPDATE📢"sprinter" LIVE AUDIO

Thank you to everyone who voted in my poll and left a comment in the reply section of my previous post on the matter. I was intrigued when @gslin sent me a link to this audio but I had no idea it would spark so much interest.

I received two very enlightening messages today that provided some substantial evidence. With the added information, I now feel confident that I can clarify the situation. This will hopefully clear up some of the confusion.

The first lovely follower (who would like to remain anonymous) sent me their personal recording of the live in question. They have been a fan for a very long time and got the chance to attend the concert back in 2008. First up, a big apology. I wish I could post the recording but they asked me not to share it so I will respect that. However, I've been given permission to talk about it so here's what I've been able to find out〈(•ˇ‿ˇ•)-→

Just in case you are wondering, there's no doubt in my mind that my follower's bootleg is legit. You can tell immediately that this was recorded from within the audience. There's clapping all around and the music is considerably louder than the vocals. You can still make out the song pretty well though. None of the voices sound off or out of place. It's blended together pretty well without losing the distinct vocal colours of the individual singers. Which is why I know that this can only be from the YKL Vol.#2 front act performance since you can clearly make out Maya during her "bokura ni dekiru koto wa tada" line and some other parts. From what we know, no other live performances of "sprinter" have featured Maya.

For the past hour or so, I've been listening to different versions of the song on repeat, mostly focusing on the YouTube audio and the newly acquired bootleg. While the bootleg is of admittedly quite low-quality, there are two things that very clearly set it apart from the version on YouTube. Those two obvious differences make it absolutely impossible for the recordings to be from the same live performance. And since we've already established that Maya was not present for any other "sprinter" performances, we can easily conclude that the YouTube audio is fake.

Difference #1: Absence of the infamous guitar riff. @octopusofpaint already mentioned this in the reply section of my original post. The YouTube audio has a pretty blunt opening whereas the bootleg recording starts with the guitar riff we are all so familiar with. It's hard to know how audios are cut/edited so I'd be willing to let this slide if it weren't for the next difference.

Difference #2: In the authentic bootleg recording of YKL Vol.#2, one of the final lines, "naite sakende kiete yuku bokura wa", is sung by no other than (!!)Keiko(!!). That is very surprising since it is usually not one of her lines. Look up any random official live performance of "sprinter", starting as early as 2009 on the NHK program Pop Up Japan, you'll absolutely never hear Keiko sing that line. You know who has always been in charge of it since becoming a three-person-unit? Wakana!! Now let's listen closely to the YouTube audio again, shall we? Whose voice do we hear? I'm giving you a hint! It's not Keiko's! But it's not Wakana's either!! Surprise, surprise, it's Hikaru's!! And do you know where Hikaru sings this line? Only in the studio version (and most recently during Kalafina covers at YKL but with a notably different voice so I won't take that into account here). And you know what else is very specific to the studio version? The lyrical cold open without a guitar riff. This leads me to believe that the studio version was almost certainly one of the main sources for this awkward mash-up on YouTube.

Now onto the second message I received today. This time from my lovely follower @concretebadger. Thank you so much! Many of you speculated that the 2010 live performance might have served as an inspiration for this supposed "unreleased" audio track. And I think you were not wrong about this. While I do believe that the studio version might have been the "main" source, I do think that the creator needed to add something else to make it sound more like a live performance. This is where the 2010 Red Moon version comes in. @concretebadger actually took the time to mash up the two tracks for a comparison and the result makes it quite clear that the two audios are eerily similar. Check it out for yourself〈(•ˇ‿ˇ•)-→

If you use the studio version and Red Moon live version as base layers and then add a few tweaks here and there to distort certain sections in order to make them appear more raw and unedited, you basically end up with that mysterious track that's currently floating around on YouTube. The previously mentioned line "naite sakende kiete yuku bokura wa" might actually be a good example for the layering/mashup of those two sources. While you can definitely identify Hikaru's vocals during that part in the YouTube audio (indicating the usage of the studio version as base), there seems to be a slightly different texture to her voice that makes it sound almost ethereal. This is most likely due to Wakana's singing of the line being added to the mix. It's very subtle and Hikaru's vocals are certainly more prominent but it's worth mentioning.

Anyway. Mystery solved. At least for me. Maybe you still have some thoughts on it. Feel free to share them below.

#kalafina #sprinter #random #maya #wish you didn't have to take my word for the bootleg >_<

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opinated-user · 8 months ago

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I feel like it's time to shine a light on MOs immigration again:

For the uninitiated: November 2022 is when LO asked her fans to donate money for this process. December 2023 is when one fan finally asked what happened to the money (they gave a good amount) and LO claimed they had at this point submitted all the necessary paperwork and are in the background stage. It is Now September 2024.

All the following information is taken directly from the official Canadian government page:

1. During the pandemic average waiting times spousal immigration was around 12 months, it has since gone down to ten. MOs immigration therefore should be going through within the year.

2. Once you've submitted your paperwork you are eligible to apply for a working visa, that is easier and quicker to get than normal if you link it to your immigration, and move to and work in Canada. This will also show the authorities that you are willing and able to support yourself in your new home, thus have a positive impact on your process.

While we don't know MOs circumstances, she very clearly loves LO and wants to be with her + her living conditions in the US are very bad. So I'd assume she'd want to move asap.

The fact that no further updates have been given to fans who gave them money is already suspicious. Best case scenario these two are not very good at navigating government sites, worst case scenario LO is stringing her along and pocketed the money raised. Also LO claims to have a lawyer on standby, who she could then theoretically consult about any questions about the process. Weird all that.

(while I do not necessarily think moving in with LO would be good for MO, I even more do not want her hopes and dreams crushed)

actually, that is not all. it's my belief that LO not only does not have any intention of moving MO with her, she also has already misused the money that she gained from her followers for her own gain without any disclosure.

in that post i showed, with evidence that i gathered myself and LO herself provided, that is highly likely that LO spend the money from that fundraising on a desk. not only that, at the same time that LO was bragging about getting this new desk (two days after making that fundraising, then lying about it), she was also talking about getting a another desk, a more expensive one, for MO. a desk that only LO would end up using because, again, they don't live together. all of this we were talking about at the start of this year and nothing has changed.

for the record, if LO had just said openly "guys, i need urgently a new desk, i need to use this money", nobody would have a problem with it. if LO had done a fundraising for a new desk in the first place, nobody would care. streamers and youtubers ask donations from their fanbase to get new equipment all the time, that is normal. the lack of transparency is the issue here.

the issue is that LO over two years now promised, both to her audience and to MO, that she'd be working on the immigration process. she used other people's money in order to do that. they deserve to know what happened to that money.

#lily orchard #lily orchard is a scammer

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centralcitylibrary · 17 days ago

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The Crimes of Sonic Adventure 2 (2001)

Before we begin, another brief reminder that we have a Discord server now! Click this link right... here! To join the server. There's a permanent link on the blog's pinned post.

The Crimes of Sonic Adventure 2

DISCLAIMER: I am not a qualified United States of America lawyer (nor do I even live in the United States of America), do not treat anything in this document as legal advice. This is all to entertain a what-if scenario.

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Do you like crimes?

Do you want to see the rap sheet of the characters of Sonic Adventure 2?

Well I know I wanted to see the rap sheet for Dr. Eggman, so I begun digging into his history… and very quickly realised it was unfeasible for a singular document.

So how about instead a singular document covering Sonic Adventure 2? And to sweeten the deal, we won’t just be looking at Eggman, we’ll be looking at everyone, even Sonic the Hedgehog himself.

These are…

The Crimes of Sonic Adventure 2.

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Why start at Sonic Adventure 2?

Well, Sonic Adventure 2 takes place in a city that visually resembles San Francisco, giving us a frame of reference for a real word location and time period (2001) to list the crimes over, unlike the Classic games which do not given any kind of reference. This is kind of important to actually listing crimes, since what’s considered a crime and what the punishment for that crime is varies depending on the country/nation, state, city, and even district within that city (though I won’t get that specific), and they change overtime.

Okay, but what about Sonic Adventure 1? Station Square shares the same name as Station Square, Pittsburgh, surely that’s good enough for a location to base the crimes on?

Well you can blame this one enemy for that. They do not spawn infinitely, and as I am in a position where I cannot legally play the game myself (and, unsurprisingly, nobody is willing to count for me), I cannot get a precise number for them. So I’d rather just wait until I’m either in a position where I can do that or I find someone who IS willing to count for me (in the unlikely chance that you, reading this, are willing to do so, I’d provide credit to you for it).

Needless to say, I have a solution to that issue for Sonic Adventure 2.

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A note from future Numbug: uh it might turn out that I didn’t need to count the individual amount of Eggman robots anyways, as illegal weapons manufacturing is counted by the process of manufactoring weapons, rather than the individual amount of weapons made – and since they lack robots, Beats wouldn’t be counted for that anyways.

Hooray?

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Some clarification:

If committing a crime in gameplay is possible but optional without glitches (or other unintended behaviour), the assumption will be that no such crime occurred. Even though in some cases this will go against common logic or otherwise be out-of-character, this will provide the best case scenario for each character (and if we went the opposite direction, multiple characters can rack up violations ad infinitum). This “best case scenario” will also be applied on a per-character basis, so one character’s rap sheet might be assuming a scenario that’s mutually incompatible with another character’s.

Related to the above, the assumption is that each character only goes through each level once, and always on mission 1. There’s no evidence anything else is canon, and there’s no evidence the characters visit the chao garden during SA2 (nor would that make logical sense the way it’s presented).

The desert levels, while clearly inspired by the Egyptian Pyramids, are shown via the in-game map to be within walking distance, so they’ll assumed to be an equivalent historical site in the USA and treated as such.

The ARK, being a United Federation space station, will be treated akin to a military base (abandoned or not, they would still have government ownership by default). Any crimes committed on it 50 years ago will be treated akin to the law for 1951.

While I will link the English version for convenience, this crimes ranking will be using the original Japanese dub, and in any instances where the dub changes changes the legal status of an action the Japanese version will be given default priority and linked appropriately.

Robots and artificial creations will only be counted IF they display any autonomy from their creator. So Shadow will be given his own spot, while the Biolizard will not.

Some terminology:

Conspiracy to commit: you planned with another person to commit a crime.

Complicit in: means you didn’t do anything per say, but you were with someone who committed a crime, and did nothing to stop them.

Aiding & abetting: you didn’t commit the crime itself, but you helped someone else to commit it.

Attempted: you attempted to commit a crime, but didn’t end up doing so (whether you failed, you changed your mind, or some other third thing).

1st degree murder: you planned on killing someone in advance (regardless of if you discussed such plans or not).

2nd degree murder: you decided in the moment to kill someone present.

And lastly, as much as I hate to admit it, there will be no sentence given for these crimes. I did want to, I really wanted to, but I found researching it not only incredibly difficult, but also definitely not up to the quality standard that I expect from not only the Central City Library, but also myself.

Now, onto the rankings, from least crimes committed to most crimes committed. Starting with those who have a perfect record...

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Clean: Pilot of Flying Dog (real name unknown)

Age: unknown (at least 16+)

Nationality: United Federation

Species: human

Only including him for consistency’s sake, since the other two have codenames

n/a

Total crimes committed: 0

Sentence: n/a (deceased)

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Clean: President of the United Federation

Age: unknown (35+)

Nationality: United Federation

Species: human

n/a

Total crimes committed: 0 cases (if only all presidents could have such a perfect track record)

Sentence: none

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Clean: President of the United Federation’s Secretary

Age: unknown

Nationality: United Federation

Species: human

n/a

Total crimes committed: 0 cases.

Sentence: none

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Clean: Spider Troop (real name unknown)

Age: unknown (at least 16+)

Nationality: United Federation

Species: human

You know him, he pilots Big Foot!

Assault on a minor: 1 case – unfortunately, outside of particularly egregious examples, the right to self defence when arrested for a crime you’re not guilty of is not enforceable, so this charge is most likely dropped.

Total crimes committed: 0 cases.

Sentence: none

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Clean: Scorpion Troop (real name unknown)

Age: unknown (at least 16+)

Nationality United Federation

Species: human

He pilots Hot Shot.

n/a

Total crimes committed: 0

Sentence: none

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Clean: Maria Robotnik

Age: n/a (unknown at time of death)

Nationality: United Federation

Species: human

Attempted theft of government property: 1 case – because yes, Shadow the Hedgehog is a top secret military research weapon, artificially created with G.U.N. budget. So yes, Shadow was owned by the military. However, Shadow has displayed awareness and autonomy, and the entire shutdown of the A.R.K. was a corrupt operation from the beginning, to such a degree that by all accounts Maria should be acquitted for attempting to let Shadow escape. That, and the fact that under U.S. 2001 law a living being technically a slave wouldn’t fly.

Total crimes committed: 0 cases.

Sentence: n/a (deceased)

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Clean: Omochao

Age: n/a (robot)

Nationality: n/a (robot)

Species: n/a (robot)

I’d positively love to give Omochao a rap sheet a mile long, for no other reason than how funny it would be. However, I need to apply the same standards to everyone, and that includes Omochao. Omochao is a mass produced robot, producer unknown, who are incredibly knowledgeable and widespread. One even had knowledge on the Biolizard, that’s how much they know. And yet, they only activate if someone approaches them. That means that, giving them the same leeway we give the rest of the cast, they haven’t committed any crimes. No aiding and abetting, no conspiracy, not even entering military bases, since it’s assumed the military would have to bring them in.

n/a

Total crimes committed: 0 cases

Sentence: none

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And now we reach the point where characters have committed at least one crime, and can thus be charged.

Oh, by the way, initially I wanted to present the minimum and maximum penalties for each character, but uh… turns out, finding a minimum charge for a crime is very difficult, far more difficult than finding the maximum penalty.

So, I’ll be sentencing according to the maximum penalty, preferably for specifically 2001 when I can find such metrics. As before, if I make an error on this (and, as I’m not a US lawyer knowledgeable on the law as it existed in 2001, nor a US lawyer, nor a US citizen, nor ever set foot on the USA, I’m bound to make an error on this), please inform me so that I may correct it.

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#13: Egg Golem

Age: unknown (a few days old?)

Nationality: n/a (robot)

Species: n/a (robot)

Yes, we’re seriously covering the Egg Golem. It spends 1 boss fight free from Eggman’s control, so it is eligible for committing crimes.

Aggravated assault with a deadly weapon: 1 case – for the entirety of its time spent independent from Eggman’s control, it spends that time attempting to kill Eggman. We know this isn’t from self defence (or defending Sonic and co.), since it does this in response to Eggman insulting it. It’s with a deadly weapon because the Egg Golem IS a deadly weapon.

Attempted 2nd degree murder: 1 case.

Total crimes committed: 2 cases.

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#13: King Boom Boo

Age: n/a (unknown at time of death)

Nationality: United Federation

Species: ghost (formerly human)

Assault on a minor: 1 case.

Attempted 2nd degree murder of a minor: 1 case.

Total crimes committed: 2 cases.

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#12: Knuckles the Echidna

Age: 16

Nationality: n/a (sole resident of Angel Island)

Species: echidna

As the first playable character on the list, I need to define a unit of value for the stolen items, or more accurately what the maximum penalty shall be. … I don’t want to do that, so instead, I shall just label “compensation for stolen item” instead.

Illegal border crossing: 1 case – Knuckles might have de facto diplomatic immunity for being the sole representative of his own nation. Even if he doesn’t, he only entered the United Federation in order to stop Rouge from stealing the Master Emerald, a gemstone of unimaginable value.

Theft: 1 case – yeah it’s a rural canyon, but those Shovel Claws surely belonged to someone, and Knuckles made no attempt to find the original owners yet along return these to them.

Trespassing: 2 cases – an abandoned mine is still, well, a mine, and thus a place Knuckles doesn’t have clearance to enter unannounced. And then he goes through a sewer. Of course, there is genuine argument that Knuckles is unaware that he’s trespassing, and nobody informs him of such nor requests that he leaves these areas.

Complicit in trespassing into a government space: 1 case – going inside of a vehicle is considered trespassing, and this appears to be the president’s private limo, given the screen set up for a private discussion with Dr. Eggman.

Complicit in hacking: 1 case.

Complicit in interfering with a government meeting: 1 case.

Trespassing: 2 cases – given the existential threat Eggman is currently posing, any efforts to stop him would absolutely be forgiven under law.

Conspiracy to commit grand larceny: 1 case – ditto.

Conspiracy to launch a rocket without clearance: 1 case – ditto.

Theft: 4 cases – ditto.

Grand larceny: 1 case – ditto.

Launching a rocket without clearance: 1 case – ditto.

Trespassing a government space: 1 case – the ARK, while abandoned, is still a G.U.N. base, and is still being patrolled by G.U.N. robots. However, Knuckles is here to stop a global atrocity like the rest of the gang.

Reckless endangerment: 1 case – attempting to commandeer a vehicle you have no idea how to pilot while it’s in flight in outer space is a one way ticket to kill everyone on-board.

Resisting arrest: 1 case – by this point Knuckles has associated himself with Sonic and co. (whom have certainly committed various crimes by this point), and thus is liable to being arrested.

Resisting arrest: 1 case – everyone was saving the world.

Total crimes committed: 6 cases

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#11: Amy Rose

Age: 12

Nationality: unknown

Species: hedgehog

Entering a restricted military base: 1 case.

Aiding & abetting escape from lawful custody: 1 case.

Petty theft: 1 case – stole an identification card to release Sonic from prison.

Resisting arrest: 1 case.

Conspiracy to trespass onto a government area: 1 case.

Conspiracy to hacking: 1 case.

Complicit in trespassing into a government space: 1 case.

Complicit in hacking: 1 case.

Complicit in interfering with a government meeting: 1 case.

Trespassing: 2 cases – given the existential threat Eggman is currently posing, any efforts to stop him should be completely legal.

Conspiracy to commit grand larceny: 1 case – ditto.

Conspiracy to launch a rocket without clearance: 1 case – ditto.

Grand larceny: 1 case – ditto.

Launching a rocket without clearance: 1 case – ditto.

Conspiracy to commit destruction of government property: 1 case – ditto.

Complicit in attempted destruction of government property: 1 case – ditto.

Total crimes committed: 9 cases

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# 10: Big the Cat

Age: n/a

Nationality: unknown (presumed United Federation)

Species: cat

As hilarious as it sounds, Big commits some crimes in his cameos. Under the logic of giving everyone maximum benefit of the doubt, his cutscene cameos will not be counted, as he only appears given player input. But his in-level cameos will count as he’s there regardless of if the player checks on him or not.

Entering a restricted military base: 4 cases – Big is seen in Prison Island in Iron Gate and Weapons Bed, and is seen on the Space Colony: ARK in Lost Colony and Mad Space.

Trespassing: 5 cases – enters in Eggman’s base in Sand Ocean, Egg Quarters, and Hidden Base. He also ends up on a blimp in Radical Highway and under the road in Mission Street.

Reckless Endangerment: 1 case – Big hanging onto a blimp like that endangers everyone inside of the blimp.

Escape from Lawful Custody: 1 case – despite appearing behind bars in Prison Lane, Big later appears out from behind bars.

Total crimes committed: 11 cases.

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#9: Professor Gerald Robotnik

Age: n/a (unknown at time of death)

Nationality: unknown

Species: human

Anything the Biolizard does can be presumed to be a direct result of Gerald remotely reprogramming it, and so its actions will be added to Gerald’s (post-humous) list. Oh, and given Gerald lost his sanity before committing his crimes, it’s entirely possible for him to be posthumously declared innocent on grounds of insanity. Crimes committed 50 years ago will be listed in bold to note the time gap.

Reckless endangerment: 1 case – Gerald was blamed for a crime that never happened to cover up a separate crime G.U.N. committed.

Collective punishment: 1 case – while you could argue this should be “conspiracy to commit [x]”, the fact of the matter is that Gerald had already set all of the programming up for both the Eclipse Cannon, the ARK as a whole, Shadow, and the Biolizard. The plan was already in motion by the time he admitted/talked about it, and all he needed was someone to wake up Shadow. To me, that’s more than enough to sentence him for actively attempting these crimes, albeit posthumously.

Attempted mass murder: 1 case – same as above in regards to violating the Geneva conventions.

Attempted mass property damage: 1 case – ditto.

Assault: 2 cases.

Aggravated assault with a deadly weapon: 3 cases.

Attempted 2nd degree murder: 2 cases.

Assault on a minor: 1 case.

Attempted 2nd degree murder of a minor: 1 case.

Total crimes committed: 12 cases.

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#8: Sonic the Hedgehog

Age: 15

Nationality: unknown (born on Christmas Island)

Species: hedgehog

Resisting arrest: 3 cases – Sonic is constantly ignoring G.U.N. trying to apprehend him, the mistaken identity doesn’t matter as he began resisting by immediately assaulting government officers, which is, well, crime.

Assault on a government officer: 3+ cases – took out “everyone aboard” on the G.U.N. helicopter, and then later fought Spider Troop.

Destruction of government property: 5 cases:

1 Mono Beetle (cutting off as many from homing attack chains as possible)

Stripped off 1 piece of a G.U.N. helicopter

1 wooden boxes

1 Big Foot

Some metal casing

Theft of government property: 3 cases – stole that aforementioned strip of the G.U.N. helicopter, a pair of Light Shoes, and some of that aforementioned metal casing.

Jaywalking: 5 cases – I mean. Yeah. He kinda does do that. The G.U.N. truck chase doesn’t excuse anything, as he still runs on the road before it even arrives.

Speeding: 4 cases – well technically he’s not driving, he’s running/snowboarding. Can’t speed without a car.

Reckless endangerment: 3 cases – Sonic ran along the streets of City Escape on two separate occassions, once on an impromptu snowboard. Even assuming he didn’t hit anything, that’s still dangerous to everyone on the road.

Entering closed off areas: 2 cases – ignores “do not enter” signs twice; though it turns out you also need to be told to leave and then refuse to do so in order to be sentenced.

Trespassing: 1 case (+$5,000 fine, 1 year in prison, and 2 years probation) – runs down the side of a building.

Entering closed off areas: 1 case – the instance just before the G.U.N. truck is arguable due to signs providing conflicting messages.

Reckless endangerment: 1 case – okay see in this case a giant 2 lane truck is chasing him and trying to run him over, this is more acceptable.

Assault: 2 cases – Sonic charges at Shadow, assuming he’s being framed (incorrectly). He does so again later on.

Escape from lawful custody: 1 case.

Trespassing into a government space: 2 cases – clinging onto the G.U.N. rocket launch, and then later jumping into the president’s limo.

Resisting arrest: 4 cases – first the island’s blowing up, and Sonic and co. are just trying to not die from that; then Sonic’s trying to save Amy from Eggman, then Sonic’s saving the world, then everyone’s saving the world.

Conspiracy to trespass into a government space: 1 case (+$10,000 fine & 10 years in prison).

Conspiracy to commit hacking: 1 case.

Interfering with a government meeting: 1 case.

Complicit in hacking: 1 case.

Trespassing: 2 cases – given the existential threat Eggman is currently posing, any efforts to stop him should be completely legal.

Conspiracy to commit grand larceny: 1 case – ditto.

Conspiracy to launch a rocket without clearance: 1 case – ditto.

Grand larceny: 1 case – ditto.

Launching a rocket without clearance: 1 case – ditto.

Conspiracy to commit destruction of government property: 1 case – ditto.

Attempted destruction of government property: 1 case – ditto.

Resisting arrest: 1 case – hostage situation + trying to save the world.

Destruction of government property: 14 cases – there’s saving the world from the Eclipse Cannon, and also saving Amy from her hostage situation.

Theft of government property: 1 case – given the hostage situation he was in and the fact he was actively attempting to stop Eggman’s existential threat, stealing one measly Flame Ring should be excusable. Besides, we don’t even know if Sonic kept it afterwards, as next time he gets something similar he’s seen buying it.

Total crimes committed: 35 cases.

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#7: Boos & Boom Boos

Age: n/a (unknown at time of deaths)

Nationality: United Federation

Species: ghosts (formerly humans)

Given the Boos are a group of people, and not an individual, the charges will be doled out as 1 case per individual Boo involved.

Assault on a minor: 29 cases – pretty simple, whether they harm or grab, they’re still assaulting Sonic and Knuckles.

Attempted 2nd degree murder of a minor: 19 cases – most of these cases are from directly attacking, but some are from grabbing Sonic in close proximity to another hazard such as a trap or one of Eggman’s robots.

Assault: 2 cases – they attempt to grab Rouge too.

Attempted 2nd degree murder: 2 cases.

Reckless Endangerment: 2 cases – some of the “fright” Boos do so in the presence of traps, Eggman robots, or more aggressive Boos.

Aided & abetted assault on a minor: 1 case – a Boo holds an hourglass for King Boom Boo.

Aided & abetted attempted 2nd degree murder of a minor: 1 case.

Total crimes committed: 56 cases collectively.

Total number of Boos: 68

Average of cases per Boo: 0.8 cases per Boo (rounded down)

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#6: Miles “Tails” Prower

Age: 8

Nationality: unknown (born on Westside Island)

Species: fox

This is the first time that it’s relevant, but for the multiplayer I’m making the assumption that it’s inclusion isn’t a canonical event, but items made within it are considered canonical, especially since external media does provide an origin for some items (such as the Chao Walker and Dark Chao Walker).

Illegal weapons manufacturing: 1 case – the Cyclone, a personal mech that can transform into a plane and a car, is not a weapon you can just carry around. He also built the mech that Chao uses in the multiplayer mode. It’s only one case as the law is defined by the act of manufacturing weapons, not the specific number of weapons you make.

Entering a restricted military base: 1 case.

Aiding & abetting escape from legal custody: 1 case.

Destruction of government property: 54 cases – Tails has to destroy G.U.N. robots to progress in his stages. Including:

23 G.U.N. Hunters

2 Hornet-3s

19 Mono Beetles

10 caged crates

Resisting arrest: 1 case.

Theft: 1 case – stole the Boosters.

Hacking: 2 cases – accessed government computers.

Conspiracy to trespass into a government space: 1 case.

Conspiracy to commit hacking: 1 case.

Trespassing into a government space: 1 case – he and Sonic jump into the President’s limo.

Interfering with a government meeting: 1 case – he and Sonic interrupted the President’s attempted surrender, which caused Eggman to attempt to fire the Eclipse Cannon again.

Underage driving/driving without a licence: 1 case – from my look, I don’t see a separate charge for underage driving, to my surprise. Instead, the charge gets applied to the legal guardian/s. Tails seemingly has no legal guardians on account of having his own homes and labs, implying he’s an emancipated child, so that charge should still fall onto him regardless (as all of these other charges, in case you’re wondering).

Speeding: 1 case – clearly sped on the road to reach the President’s limo.

Reckless driving: 1 case – I mean when one of the optional missions is “don’t hit other cars” and another is “don’t hit walls”, even the game itself considers your driving dangerous.

Trespassing: 2 cases – given the existential threat Eggman is currently posing, any efforts to stop him should be completely legal.

Conspiracy to commit grand larceny: 1 case – ditto.

Conspiracy to launch a rocket without clearance: 1 case – ditto.

Grand larceny: 1 case – ditto.

Launching a rocket without clearance: 1 case – ditto.

Conspiracy to commit destruction of government property: 1 case – ditto.

Resisting arrest: 2 cases – first time he was trying to save the world, second time everyone was trying to save the world.

Complicit in attempted destruction of government property: 1 case – ditto.

Destruction of government property: 9 cases – given the situation, Tails is excused for attacking the robots trying to attack him.

Theft of government property: 1 case – given the situation, Tails using the Bazooka is excusable.

Total crimes committed: 68 cases

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#5: G.U.N. (short for Guardian Unit of Nations)

Age: varies

Nationality: varies

Species: varies, typically human

Now we leave the realm of mundane crime volume and jump into the truly absurd… And you can thank a singular truck for that.

As both their name and dialogue in Sonic Riders: Zero Gravity shows, G.U.N. is an international military, not beholding to any specific branch of government. However, perhaps as a requirement of being an officially recognised government branch, they do still need to abide by the local governments of any nation a particular branch is stationed in, as seen by the future G.U.N. Commander, Abraham Towers, obeying direct orders from the President and generally protecting his well being. This is all to provide important context for not only their current actions, but also the actions they performed 50 years ago (the latter of which will be in bold).

And, due to a majority of the robots being either controlled by an AI and/or remote controlled, it’s practically impossible to determine how many G.U.N. soldiers are truly involved, meaning I can’t present an average like I did with the Boos.

Lastly, as the G.U.N. Truck driver was responsible for a vast majority of these cases, charges for them specifically will be underlined.

Conspiracy to commit mass murder: 1+ cases – the ARK’s Indestructible Seal, a top secret plan detailing the closing of the ARK, involves killing the scientists who knew of Project: Shadow, and pinning it all as an accident caused by Professor Gerald.

Conspiracy to commit a false accusation: 1+ cases.

Conspiracy to falsify information: 1+ cases – the plan was carried out on the premise that G.U.N. knew nothing.

Mass murder: 1+ cases – Maria doesn’t even get singled out, she’s one of an unknown number of victims.

False accusation: 1+ cases – successfully pinned the blame for the ARK’s shutdown on Professor Gerald.

False arrest: 2+ cases – successfully captured both Professor Gerald and the finalised Ultimate Lifeform, Shadow the Hedgehog

Improper documentation: 1+ cases – until Shadow himself expressed recollection of being captured, it was unknown if Shadow was even the original or a clone, which proves that said capture was not properly reported.

Failure to comply with a lawful order: 1 case – I decided this has enough to be worth including, but not enough to be worth sentencing, as the President requesting Rouge obtain this information from G.U.N. implies that he tried asking them directly and got nothing. It’s plausible that G.U.N. (truthfully or not) claimed they couldn’t access it, and later that they couldn’t look for it due to fighting Dr. Eggman, so this is a grey area. And as said, I lean on the best case scenario for these rap sheets.

False arrest: 1 case – can’t apply to Shadow breaking out of Prison Island, since breaking out of jail is still a crime even if you’re innocent of the crime that got you sent to prison to begin with.

Animal cruelty: 1+ cases – holds the turtle hostage.

Aggravated assault with a weapon: 4+ cases.

Assault on a government officer: 1+ cases – oh yeah, Rouge is a government officer and isn’t even undercover yet during her first stage.

Spying: 4+ cases – the Gold Beetles are canonically reconnaissance robots. Now, spying on your own population is (as far as I can tell) fully legal, unfortunately. However, G.U.N. is an international organisation, and can & has acted in their own interests in the past and during this game, even spying on a United Federation government agent.

Assault on a minor: 3+ cases.

Reckless endangerment: 6 cases – Knuckles and Rouge could’ve died from these robots attacking them. Oh, and the G.U.N. truck driving through a populated city, including Big the Cat. Poor guy. Lastly, the G.U.N. Robots in Cannon’s Core still attack Sonic and co. despite them working to save the world (something Rouge can easily communicate to the President and by proxy G.U.N.). We can reasonably assume that G.U.N.’s still in control over their robots given the teleportation technology and the fact that Shadow 05 presents G.U.N. robots as good aligned (given that destroying them gives Shadow dark metre). G.U.N. failing to get these robots to stop attacking the 5 of them risked both their lives and the lives of everyone on the planet.

False arrest: 2 cases – arrested Sonic the Hedgehog due to mistaken identity.

Reckless driving: 1 case.

Vehicle size violation: 1+ cases – it might be made by the military, but even the military needs to be able to drive on the road without causing widespread devastation. Anyways, the exact sentence depends on the weight of the G.U.N. truck, which I can’t know with certainty, but can estimate. Its height, in comparison to the cars it runs over, is roughly 3.6 times wider. The average car is 1.94 metres wide, while the average semi-trailer truck (what the G.U.N. truck appears to be) is 2.5 metres wide, 3.6 times 1.94 is 6.984 metres wide, making the G.U.N. truck 3 times larger than a semi-trailer truck. Applying square cube law, that should make the truck 270,000 pounds. As the California weight limit is 80,000 pounds, this makes the G.U.N. truck 190,000 pounds over the weight limit. If you have a better calculation, please let me know.

Speeding: 1 case.

Attempted 2nd degree murder: 1 case – tossing a truck this big on one person is clearly an attempt to kill.

Property damage: 185+ cases – the G.U.N. truck, in one 30 second segment, breaks through the wall Sonic just went under (it clips through it, but realistically that wall is just gone), destroys 98 cars, 1 bin, 72 trees, 2 ramps, 1 street light, and 4 traffic signs. On top of that, I’m also going to assume 2 houses get damaged every time the G.U.N. truck turns (which it does 3 times), purely due to its sheer size. And it’s likely committed more violations, given we see it driving in from the area Sonic was just in, it likely destroyed everything in there too.

Assault on a minor: 1 case – the right to self defence on a false arrest is not enforceable, except for particularly egregious examples. Now, I’m no expert, but attempting to run over someone with a truck so big it cannot fit onto the road properly, and did widespread damage to the immediate area in an attempt to run them over would count as particularly egregious.

Total crimes committed: 215+

Total crimes committed (50 years ago): 8+ cases

Total crimes committed (current day, sans G.U.N. truck driver): 22+ cases

Total crimes committed (G.U.N. truck driver): 188+ cases

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#4: Shadow the Hedgehog

Age: unknown (chronologically 50+)

Nationality: United Federation (G.U.N. created weapon)

Species: hedgehog/Black Arms hybrid

Realistically speaking, after Shadow is confirmed to survive post-SA2 (and gains his memory…), he has a solid argument to avoid being sentenced for any of these crimes, by virtue of a mixture of government conspiracy and the fact that his memories were tampered with by Professor Gerald, with evidence in Gerald’s diary itself, and thus he can argue he was coerced to commit these crimes. A moot point, since he’d likely be fully pardoned after Heroes, but the argument remains.

Resisting arrest: 1 case – we don’t actually get any evidence that G.U.N. ever made any attempt at a formal arrest on Shadow in SA2 or supplementary material (other games will be covered if/when I get to those specific games), so there’s no grounds to argue he was resisting arrest. Even if they did, the military’s actions in this game are blatantly corrupt in hindsight, and are far more than enough to warrant an exoneration for such a charge.

Theft of government property: 1 case – Shadow being an artificial lifeform created by G.U.N. gives credence to the idea he was owned by them, but as above the corrupt nature they attempted in order to capture him should be more than enough to exonerate him.

Escape from lawful custody: 1 case (7 years in prison) – Escaped from Prison Island. Yes, breaking out of prison when you were put in for a crime you didn’t commit is still a crime in and of itself.

Assault on a government officer: 1 case – attacked the pilot of B-3x Hot Shot.

Destruction of government property: 37+ cases – Shadow has destroyed a fair number of robots, machines, and other government equipment. This will also included every single robot in White Jungle, as regardless of if Shadow personally destroys them or not they’ll still be taken out in the ensuing explosion. However, non-robot equipment will be excluded from White Jungle due to their cost being negligent in comparison, unless Shadow directly has to destroy it.

Conspiracy to commit grand larceny: 1 case – plotted to steal more Chaos Emeralds with Dr. Eggman.

Conspiracy to commit terrorism: 1 case – plotted to use the Eclipse Cannon with Dr. Eggman.

Grand larceny: 1 case – stole a Chaos Emerald from a bank.

Theft of government property: 1 case – stole the Air Shoes (not to be confused with his shoes, which are also called air shoes).

Resisting arrest: 4 cases – continues running even as G.U.N. robots chase after him.

Collective punishment: 1 case – plans on inflicting a punishment on the entirety of the human race rather than just those who were responsible for the raid on the ARK/Maria’s murder in the first place.

Jaywalking: 1 case – Radical Highway might be the most unsafe highway imaginable. But it is still a highway, and Shadow clearly has no regard for staying off said highway.

Entering a restricted military area: 2 case.

Conspiracy to commit usurpation: 201 cases.

Conspiracy to commit destruction of government property: 1 case.

Conspiracy to commit destruction of a government base: 1 case.

Conspiracy to commit 1st degree mass murder: 1 case.

Aiding & abetting destruction of military property: 1 case.

Aiding & abetting grand larceny: 3 cases.

1st degree mass murder: 1 case.

Destruction of a government base: 1 case.

Complicit in aggravated assault with a lethal weapon: 1 case.

Complicit in assault on a minor: 1 case.

Complicit in attempted 2nd degree murder of a minor: 1 case.

Assault on a minor: 1 case – Sonic attacked him first, so it’s self defence.

Complicit in hijacking of radio signals: 1 case.

Terrorism: 1 case

Mass destruction: 1 case.

Mass manslaughter: 1 case.

Mass reckless endangerment: 1 case.

Mass emotional damages: 1 case.

Holding a hostage en masse: 1 case.

Inducing public panic: 1 case.

Aiding & abetting attempted usurpation: 1 case.

Stalking of a minor: 1 case.

Complicit in attempted 1st degree murder or a minor: 8 cases.

Intimidation: 1 case.

Assault on a minor: 1 case.

Attempted 1st degree murder on a minor: 1 case – while he didn’t know it was Sonic specifically, he knew someone was approaching the Eclipse Cannon, and was going to guard it, likely with lethal force (and in both languages he expresses intent to kill towards Sonic).

Uttering threats: 1 case.

Collective punishment: 1 case – needless to say, all of humanity didn’t assault the ARK 50 years ago, nor did they kill Maria. A large majority of them wouldn’t have even been alive back then.

Attempted terrorism: 1 case – the reason Eggman gets charged with this and Shadow doesn’t is pretty simple: Shadow knows everyone is going to be killed, while Eggman didn’t.

Attempted mass murder: 1 case – this isn’t a genocide charge since it isn’t targeting a specific demographic of humans, but rather all humans.

Attempted mass property damage: 1 case.

Total crimes committed: 288+ cases.

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#3: Rouge the Bat

Age: 18

Nationality: unknown (presumed United Federation)

Species: bat

One complicating factor is that Rouge was an undercover agent, not working for G.U.N., but working directly for the President, with a specific goal to achieve. So if she commits a crime in order to maintain her cover to achieve her goal, as assigned by the President himself, is that permissible? Does that get struck from the record? Looking it up, it counts as a crime if she took up arms/aided the enemy against her own during times of warfare. Which… yeah, she did. I don’t know, I’ll list them here regardless, but she might get a Presidential pardon after this game since she did accomplish her primary objective. If a crime is in italics, then committing it was part of her spy duties. If you don’t count those, then Shadow takes the #3 spot instead.

Illegal border crossing: 1 case – Knuckles is constantly on the lookout for intruders to his island, and Rouge still came on and stole the Master Emerald regardless.

Burglary: 1 case – technically Knuckles doesn’t have a defined house, but surely if Rouge got onto the island in the first place with the sole intent of committing a crime then she should get this charge regardless.

Grand larceny: 7 cases – Rouge steals the Master Emerald, then when it gets broken into pieces she steals 6 of the fragments.

Stalking: 1 case – puts a tracker on Dr. Eggman to follow him into his base. I’m not sure when she was able to do that, but apparently she did.

Destruction of government property: 2 cases – Rouge destroys two G.U.N. Hunters. However, these G.U.N. Hunters were holding a turtle hostage, so destroying them would be defensible as preventing animal cruelty.

Trespassing: 1 case – infiltrates Eggman’s base.

Destruction of private property: 4 cases – Rouge destroys 4 of Eggman’s caged boxes.

Theft: – steals 3 of Eggman’s keys to infiltrate his base, and the Pink Nails that were in there.

Entering a restricted military base: 2 cases – Rouge infiltrates ARK independently of the rest of the gang, and then infiltrates Prison Island with them.

Conspiracy to commit grand larceny: 1 case – plotted to steal more Chaos Emeralds with Dr. Eggman.

Conspiracy to commit terrorism: 1 case – plotted to use the Eclipse Cannon with Dr. Eggman.

Conspiracy to commit usurpation: 201 cases.

Conspiracy to commit destruction of government property: 1 case.

Conspiracy to commit destruction of a government base: 1 case.

Conspiracy to commit 1st degree mass murder: 1 case.

Complicit in aggravated assault with a lethal weapon: 8 cases.

Complicit in assault on a minor: 8 cases.

Complicit in attempted 2nd degree murder of a minor: 1 case.

Grand Larceny: 3 cases – and here’s where Rouge stole 3 Chaos Emeralds.

Aided & abetted 1st degree mass murder: 1 case.

Aided & abetted destruction of a government base: 1 case.

Aided & abetted destruction of government property: 13+ cases – just like Eggman, every robot in Security Hall that Rouge doesn’t destroy personally will still be destroyed with the island’s destruction, so they’ll be counted as part of this list at bare minimum.

Assault on a government officer: 1 case – fought against the pilot for R-1/A Flying Dog.

Destruction of government property: 1 case – destroyed Flying Dog.

Complicit in hijacking of radio signals: 1 case.

Complicit in terrorism: 1 case

Complicit in mass destruction: 1 case.

Complicit in mass manslaughter: 1 case.

Complicit in mass reckless endangerment: 1 case.

Complicit in mass emotional damages: 1 case.

Complicit in holding a hostage en masse: 1 case.

Complicit in inducing public panic: 1 case.

Complicit in attempted usurpation: 1 case.

Espionage: 1 case – I mean- it’s the entire reason she’s here.

Stalking a minor: 1 case.

Speeding: 1 case – clearly sped on the road to reach Tails’s Tornado-2.

Reckless driving: 1 case – I mean when one of the optional missions is “don’t hit other cars” and another is “don’t hit walls”, even the game itself considers your driving dangerous.

Complicit in 1st degree attempted murder: 7 cases.

Hacking: 1 case.

Resisting arrest: 1 case – Rouge ignores G.U.N. robots trying to apprehend her during the events of Mad Space.

Assault on a minor: 1 case – while it’s ambiguous who specifically started the fight, the fact remains that she’s stolen Knuckles’s Master Emerald fragments, so even if Knuckles began the fight it’s to protect and reclaim his property.

Attempted grand larceny: 6 cases – maybe, if you squint, this could be part of her duties as a spy to sabotage the enemy, but it’s pretty clear she’s doing this because she wants the gemstones themselves.

Resisting arrest: 1 case – everyone was saving the world.

Total crimes committed: 292+ cases.

Total non-undercover crimes committed: 11 cases

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#2: Dr. Ivo “Eggman” Robotnik

Age: unknown (at least 60+)

Nationality: unknown (presumed United Federation)

Species: human

Was there ever any doubt? I mean, seriously, this man was the mastermind for most of the game and most of his robots commit 2 crimes each by just existing. For the rest of Team Dark, plotting to take over the world accounts for most of their crimes, but for Eggman… well let’s just say that’s just a footnote.

Counting up the total number of Eggman robots in Sonic Adventure 2, there are 9 in Egg Quarters, 43 in Hidden Base, 15 in Pyramid Cave, 18 in Death Chamber, 2 Egg Beetles, 1 Egg Golem, 1 Metal Sonic (in the multiplayer), 1 Egg Robo (in the multiplayer’s kart racing mode), 1 Egg Walker, and to top it all off that little custom pistol he has, for a grand total of 91 robots, mechs, and weapons. Just purely from making and using these weapons Eggman has committed:

Illegal weapons manufacturing: 1 case (yep, all 93+ weapons would fall under a singular case).

Animal cruelty: 84 cases.

Possession of unregistered firearm: 2 cases.

Usage of firearm without a licence: 1 case.

You read that right, 260 crimes just from Eggman’s gear – we haven’t even gotten to Eggman himself. Speaking of which:

Theft of government property: 4 cases – Eggman has stolen from the government: Gerald’s diary, the Jet Engine, and the Large Cannon. Also technically, he stole Shadow, who was made for the President and is/was thus United Federation property.

Entering a restricted military area: 3 cases – pretty simple, he assaults Prison Island twice, and takes over the ARK.

Burglary: 2 cases – Assaulted Prison Island twice, both times with full intent to commit a crime.

Destruction of government property: 84+ cases – As an absolute bare minimum (not counting Weapons Bed since everything there would get destroyed later on anyways), Eggman destroys:

36 G.U.N. security doors

4+ G.U.N. robots – 1+ in Iron Gate (implied, cutscene), 1 in Lost Impact (guards the elevator upwards, impossible to avoid without taking damage which I figured is too far beyond the realm of believability), 2+ in Weapons Bed (the + accounting for Eggman’s intent to cause a distraction)

2 wooden G.U.N. boxes

8 G.U.N.… storage silos? Empty missiles?

35 caged boxes

1 G.U.N. storage metal slider

6 metal G.U.N. boxes

That weird drill thing in Cosmic Wall

Complicit in assault: 1 case – stood by as Shadow attacked B-3x Hot Shot, even calling its destruction “spectacular”.

Aided & abetted unlawful escape from custody: 1 case.

Attempted grand larceny: 1 case – attempted to steal the Master Emerald from Knuckles even while knowing it’s not what he needs.

Desecration of archaeological ruins: 1 case – hidden his base inside of the nearby pyramids, including re-sculpting many of the statues to match his face.

Desecration of a graveyard: 1 case – yeah a pyramid is a tomb, and as the various Boos inside show, Eggman absolutely learnt that and continued with it.

Unlawful claim of territory: 1 case – the pyramids are, obviously enough, not actually Eggman’s, he just built a base inside of it.

Complicit in grand larceny: 1 case – didn’t make any attempt to take away Shadow’s Chaos Emerald, and even proceeded to collect more for Shadow’s plan.

Assault: 1 case – Eggman’s robots attack Rouge during Egg Quarters. I call it assault and not reckless endangerment, as the robots are clearly placed to keep people out of Eggman’s (illegal) base.

Aggravated assault with a lethal weapon: 13 cases – combine the assault and assault on a minor charges together, as Eggman uses weapons for all of them.

Assault with intent to kill: 13 cases – ditto.

Conspiracy to commit grand larceny: 2 cases.

Conspiracy to commit terrorism: 2 cases.

Conspiracy to commit usurpation: 201 cases – according to this graph, there are 201 recognised nations during the year 2001. While this list is not definitive, as the number of officially recognised nations varies depending on which nation you’re in (and 2001 is over 20 years ago), I am using it as the closest available estimate for how many there are in the Sonic canon version of Earth during Sonic Adventure 2.

Conspiracy to assault a government base: 1 case – self explanatory

Conspiracy to destroy a government base: 1 case.

Conspiracy to commit 1st degree mass murder: 1 case – those government soldiers on the base.

Aided & abetted grand larceny: 3 cases.

Aided & abetted destruction of government property: 246+ cases – at bare minimum, every robot that was present in Iron Gate & Weapons Bed would be added here. I will not count non-robot debris in these levels as their individual costs would be negligible regardless of if Eggman destroyed them personally or not. The true volume is likely higher. I counted a combined total of 66 robots in Iron Gate and 180 in Weapons Bed (not counting two robots that I had to destroy)

Aided & abetted 1st degree mass murder: 1 case – according to this website, the average number of military personnel assigned to a military base can vary from a few hundred to several thousand. Again, assuming best case scenario for Dr. Eggman, we’ll say this military base had 200 soldiers stationed (this should balance out its overall size and importance with this military’s reliance on using military drones for direct combat).

Aided & abetted destruction of a government base: 1 case.

Assault on a minor: 12 cases – attempts to kill Amy, Tails, Sonic, and Knuckles a total of 9 times throughout the campaign. In addition, his robots collectively attempt to kill them an additional 3 times collectively as they assault his base.

Attempted 2nd degree murder of a minor: 4 cases.

Attempted destruction of personal property: 2 cases – attacked Tails’s Tornado 2 – judging by the aftermath, he was seemingly unsuccessful. Same with the follow-up, where Tails was able to use the Tornado after his fight with Eggman regardless of who won.

Hijacking of radio channels: 1 case

Terrorism: 1 case

Mass destruction: 1 case – destroying the moon should have global ramifications, causing untold amounts of damage and death, alongside emotional torment en masse. Technically we can’t charge for the destruction of the moon in and of itself (besides the few spacecraft that have been left on the moon, which are negligible in comparison) as there are no laws against destroying the moon and it isn’t considered any nation’s property (if such a situation happened in real life a crime and a charge would likely be decided in the following court case, however we obviously lack the precedent to decide such a case), however the destruction to Earth that happened as a side-effect can be charged.

Mass manslaughter: 1 case – ditto to above.

Mass reckless endangerment: 1 case – ditto to above.

Mass emotional damages: 1 case – ditto to above.

Holding a hostage en masse: 1 case – According to this website, the population of the USA during 2001 is 285,470,493. Subtracting 1/25th to account for Alaska and Hawaii (a severe lowball) reduces that number to 274,051,673. This should be enough to qualify for a mass hostage situation.

Inducing public panic: 1 case.

Attempted usurpation: 1 case.

Coercion: 3 cases – attempts to make the President surrender to the Eggman Empire, makes Sonic go to him with the Chaos Emerald and give it to him, and attempts to convince Tails and Amy to give him the Chaos Emerald via threatening their lives (and, depending on the story being played, seemingly succeeds).

Stalking of a minor: 1 case – co-ordinates with Rouge and Eggman to track Tails’s location, with the intent of stealing his Chaos Emerald.

Uttering threats: 2 cases.

Attempted 1st degree murder of a minor: 9 cases (including the final room of Crazy Gadget).

Holding a hostage: 1 case.

Intimidation: 1 case – repeatedly emphasised that he will kill Amy while Sonic’s on his way to the meet up point.

Illegal usage of explosives: 1 case – tried to kill Sonic with one.

Grand larceny: 1 case – yeah, giving Eggman the benefit of the doubt, the only Chaos Emerald he conclusively stole in this game was at the very end of the main story, after fighting Tails.

Attempted terrorism: 1 case.

Resisting arrest: 1 case – everyone was saving the world.

Total crimes committed: 593+ cases.

---

Now we can wrap up with- huh? What do you mean he was only #2? Oh… But then that means… #1 is…

---

#1: The Population of Central City

Age: varies

Nationality: varies, typically United Federation

Species: varies, typically human

Congratulations on the combined population of Central City, by working together you all managed to commit so many crimes that you all collectively placed 1st! Wow, what an unsafe city! I’m going to break these up per stage to make it more digestible, but the totals will all be combined together.

City Escape

Road safety violations: 67 cases per day gone without being fixed – With a total of 16 roads sloped 45 degrees, 8 ramps plopped in the middle of the road, 31 abrupt 45 degree shifts in elevation, 10 crossroads without traffic lights, and 2 un-fenced cliff ends for roadways, the “City Escape” portion of Central City is a disaster.

Disability accessibility violations: 20 cases per day gone without being fixed – with 16 roads sloped 45 degrees, alongside 4 sets of stairs without an accessibility ramp, the disabled cannot navigate this city at all.

Traffic violations: 12 cases – now, since we want to avoid sentencing something ad infinitum, this specific violation requires an upper cap. So, I decided to use Mission 4’s time limit of 3 minutes to serve as that upper cap. There are a total of x stop signs that cars will just blatantly ignore and drive past. Starting at 1:18.19 and ending at 4:18.29, a total of 4 cars ignored the first stop sign. Assuming a similar pace for every stop sign that we can see cars violating it, the total value comes out to 4 stop signs and thus 12 violations.

Missing signs: 1 case per day gone without being fixed – there are three sections with “do not enter” signs leading into them, where the bulk of violations lie for non-road sections. However, these signs are only placed on one end (the entrance from Sonic’s perspective), making them all too easy for a clueless civiliation to enter from the back end, endangering themselves in the process. It’s also the reason these violations aren’t being removed, as it’s entirely feasible for someone to not realise that they’ve entered these areas.

Structural safety violations: 71 cases per day gone without being fixed – With 63 easily accessible dash panels (possibly more, I might have missed one during the GUN truck sequence with how fast that goes), 6 easily accessible drops without a protective fence (including the two road drops above as they’re also dangerous for pedestrians to be walking near), and 2 springs in accessible locations, it’s a blatant hazard for anyone to be walking about. This is both assuming the 45 degree slopes aren’t considered hazardous for able-bodied people and ignoring the final on foot area, as both ends are labelled well enough to feasibly indicate it’s off limits (presumably for plans on changing the construction).

Improperly placed signs: 1 case – the above mentioned fence has a “do not enter” sign and 3 “pass under” signs on the same side of the exact same fence. No matter what, their placement is contradictory.

Radical Highway

Road safety violations: like a bajillion cases – the road is clearly under construction, so it being unsuitable for driving is excusable. We can’t charge them for safety violations…

OSHA violations: 63 cases – That’s right baby, we’re charging them for OSHA violations! No means to get to the construction site (1), higher entrance is accessible only via blatantly hazardous means (spring, pulley, etc.) (11), no means to get to another area of the construction site (2), easily accessible drop without adequate guard rails (temporary or otherwise) (33), unguarded rockets (3), and accessible giant roller without guard rails (3).

Unsafe road construction: 13 cases – a 45 degree slope was built into the road 7 times, a loop-de-loop was built into the road 4 times, corkscrew built into the road 2 times.

Mission Street

Road safety violations: 2 cases – 2 instances of the road just ending. The rest at least seem to be clearly inaccessible to civilians, so…

OSHA violations: 18 cases – given the same aesthetic and the fact the road’s all sorts of messed up, I’m assuming this is also a road construction. As such, there are no means to exit the construction site (2), high falls without sufficient handrails (temporary or otherwise) (11), no means to access another section of the construction site (1), higher entrance is accessible only via blatantly hazardous means (spring, pulley, etc.) (3), unguarded rockets (1).

Route 101

For this stage and route 280, I’m assuming them having no support railing underneath at all is purely an abstraction born from the fact that these games are from 2001, since otherwise they’d instantly fall down as they’re not attached to anything for immensely long periods.

Road safety violations: 2 cases – there’s 1 ramp on the road, and 1 45 degree slope… it’s… Well, not perfect, but believably illegal. Insanity.

Route 280

Road safety violations: 12 cases – ah, here’s the cartoon level of safety violations. Straight up 5 massive holes in the road, 2 ramps in the road, 3 parts of the road without any walls to avoid driving off the bridge, and 2 45 degree slopes.

Total crimes committed: 652 cases collectively.

Total number of citizens: 782,223 (presumed, based on the population of San Francisco circa 2001)

Average of cases per citizen: 0.0008 per citizen (rounded down)

---

In conclusion.

…

Central City is an unsafe disaster and every major character is a wanted criminal.

---

CREDITS:

The whole document: Numbug

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#Sonic Adventure 2 #Knuckles the Echidna #Amy Rose #Big the Cat #Professor Gerald Robotnik #Sonic the Hedgehog #Miles “Tails” Prower #Shadow the Hedgehog #Rouge the Bat #Dr. Ivo “Eggman” Robotnik

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lymooniee · 1 year ago

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Why I hc Shadow as autistic:

Just gonna preface this before I begin, this is all for fun and is a headcanon of mine. Your headcanons may be different to mine and that's valid too! Any grammar mistakes uh- ignore because I'm too lazy to edit this like crazy.

I will also link the video I made of all the moments, too, since it is way too long to post it on here. Keep in mind that not every moment is in the video, but like 95 percent of it is.

Shadow for me has always shown plenty of signs of being autistic, I'll provide as much evidence as I possibly can while doing my best to try and keep this at a reasonable length.

Shadow has always been the silent type of character when he is written correctly or, in other words, whenever Shiro Maekawa was involved with his writing in SA2, heroes and 06. Currently Prime too has done his character justice. I have to state this because I feel this is the best possible way of actually understanding Shadow as a character, so I'll mainly be touching his good characterizations and then some from his own game (not a lot however). He was silent, lonely, calm and often was in his head more than outwardly speaking out. I believe many autistic people like myself, connected to this side of him. Facing with so many adversities because of our differences from others, we become shut in and lonely too, since most autistic people don't feel as if they fit in. You can easily argue this is because of his ptsd from losing Maria, but I'd like to challenge the idea that it can easily be both and his ptsd enhances his traits.

I'll first begin with SA2, Shadow's first scene with eggman to me is quite hilarious if you put a different lens on it, the way he stand there ignoring Eggmans questions and then quickly demands Eggman to abide his rules. It puts Eggman into shock, but I think you could tie these moments that Shadow has as an autistic trait of his. Social cues are quite difficult for a lot of autistic people, and having no filter adds into this difficulty. The way Shadow ignores Eggmans questions to quickly ask him to do what he wants instead really emphasizes this point I made.

I love how he remains calm too, he doesn't yell this at Eggman and instead walks away casually and confidently. It's always been one of my most favourite moments with him. It really does make him stand out as he was able to influence Eggman to follow his wishes. If we want to talk about when he gets introduced to Sonic, I find this moment also again pretty funny in an endearing way when you put in this perspective. Sonic running to him asking Shadow to say something to speak, as Shadow stares at Sonic with silence. He's once again in his head more so than externally present, he also may be struggling to craft up a response or is at a lost with why Sonic is desperate for an answer. Conversations or socially interacting with people is challenging for most autistic people for a plethora of reasons so anything can really explain why Shadow here wasn't responding.

I've also found some of his moments when thinking of Maria (two specific moments being when Amy encourages him to help fight and the other being before Rouge approaches him to ask why he saved her), these moments he's very in tuned with his thoughts. After realizing his true promise with Maria he is in his head not responding right away to Amy, he sheds a tear and runs quickly to help and exclaims how he has to go now to keep that promise. This confuses Amy, however she doesn't stop Shadow or anything. When Rouge approaches Shadow and saying it was unexpected and unlike him to save her, he answers by saying that he didn't go to save her and was doing it for the chaos emeralds. She clearly catches on that this isn't the entire truth, this moment to me is harder to explain. But I think it's because of how he struggles to express his true intentions and feelings in the matter, similar to the Amy one before because he doesnt understand his own empathy.

Now one of if not the most obvious moments in SA2 is when Amy mistakes Shadow for Sonic, he slowly turns to look at her. Doesn't say a word or anything the entire time, and just continues to stare at her. I always loved this moment. I feel this one just speaks for itself lmao.

Now moving onto Sonic 06 moments (sorry there's not a lot in heroes tbh. There is a lot in Sonic X/Prime, Murder of Sonic the Hedgehog, and the Twitter takeovers though!) Sonic 06 main one points out how he is going to discover himself and make his own path. I've always loved this about him as a character, he's not there for anybody but himself, he knows he is different. He will embrace this about himself and not let others try to make up what he has to be. Other subtle traits in 06 are also ways in which he responds to those around him, head nods or simple "yes" responses. Again, it's his way of expressing himself in conversation that really hints at his struggles for social cues. I also adore when Rouge asks him a question and he once again demands for something, and she is like "ok cool, but you didn't answer my question?" Moments like that not only add a lot of charm to him, but something I really connected too because I do this all the time without realizing it. I think partially it's because I get stuck with my own thoughts and those questions I feel I've already got it answered for myself so it's prolly similar where that realization that you may know the answer already, but the other doesn't just doesn't click together sometimes. It could also be because he needs to get out what he needs right away to feel a sense of stability.

Sonic x just has a lot of funny moments that really make his character shine, when he crashes the plane with Espio, Vector and Charmy. He doesn't use his words and instead guides it down forcefully, I similarly do stuff like this where I struggle to express what I need or have to do so I usually just do it without saying it. This happens often when people are in the way of something I have to get to. Like if I have to throw out something for example. I also love that when Espio asks why Shadow didn't just ask, Shadow responds by saying he needs to go find Dark Oak and then just crashes straight into the wall. He really just has such a difficult time expressing exactly why he needs to do things lmao. I also love how he has a challenging time understanding instructions. Eggman asks him to do something and because to Shadow they didn't feel clear, he asks more than once for confirmation. Or when he gives the silent treatment to Rouge and she teases him about it, he just walks away without a word. Now this isn't only applied to Sonic X but Shadow has a really REALLY REAAAALLLY difficult time finding the true intentions of people, Sonic X he gets upset at Rouge and Chris for calling him out on trusting Eggman. He gets defensive and argues back at them saying that Eggman is worthy of trusting because he knows the most about him. It's all he has even though Eggman has been evidenced of tricking others around him. There's countless of other times where Shadow struggles with this, like basically every moment in his own game where he blindly trusts Black Doom. One other moment too I can't exactly remember which game it was, but Rouge was clearly lying and goes "you can trust me! really!!" And he does and then tells her absolutely everything that she wanted to hear.

Sonic prime moments are a lot less, but I do feel his way of just remaining very inwardly or to himself about things can once again be his difficulty in trusting. The way he also overanalyzes a lot of things around him as well. I also just love certain scenes like, "they're air shoes" or "hardly, I'm the ultimate lifeform" because he is blunt and took it quite literally. As he usually does in Prime, where he takes things quite seriously in general. I also feel because sonic is very VERY adhd coded in prime, it really does emphasize the contrast between the two of how someone with autism may interact with someone with adhd. In the most recent episode, he once again finds it difficult to express his protectiveness and plays it off. Or when he does compliment Sonic, he just glares at him when Sonic somewhat jokes around because it felt out of character for Shadow to do that. Even though Shadow was just being blunt about his thoughts and had a moment where he does express properly, but then his glare somewhat shows once again how he has a difficult time crafting up responses lmao.

Some more stuff but more miscellaneous, the Twitter takeovers is funny but it depends on if we want to take it as canon. He loves dry foods, adores kittens to the point he wants an orphanage (connection to animals on a deeper level), he has an organized bedtime routine, and yeah that's basically all the ones I can think of atm. These are quite explanatory I feel. Murder of Sonic the Hedgehog shows he has empathy but struggles to show it similar to basically every other moment I've described, but also just love that he can't handle computers I think that's so funny idk why. I can't even describe how it's an autistic moment for him it just feels like it. He stims with his quills a lot as well, which ugh I adore so so so much.

A lot of these things I've expressed about Shadow come from just from me loving him but also being able to see myself in him as well. I'm happy that Prime is bringing back his character to what it was, I think so many people love Shadow in the fandom simply because of how much they relate to him. He's such great representation despite it not being canon, because of how easily those can see themselves in him. I really do love Shadow and I know this is super long so if you read this, thank you and I hope you enjoyed it.

Have a cute photo of him as a reward ♡

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waitmyturtles · 5 months ago

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I decided to wait until I caught both episodes of Spare Me Your Mercy (episodes 6 and 7) this week to offer my thoughts. @clairedaring has been on that button with the (spoiler alerts!) updates between the show and the original Euthanasia novel series, and these posts have provided so much needed context for me to understand how this show was constructed.

@my-rose-tinted-glasses (I'M SORRY, ROSE, I can't find a link at the moment to your tags on this) has posited that there is an editing issue with the show, which I FULLY agree with. The scenes and the dialogue, at this point in the series, are making big jumps to move the story along, when we need more time spent on building more emotion between Kan and Tew. At this point, like others (nice to meet you, @shima-shimmer!) I am still in the guessing stage about where these two are in their situationship (can I call it a relationship yet?!). I don't know what their actions mean between each other, from sharing the bed and alternating among glaring/staring/rifling though things/snuggy-wuggy?, to wanting a smooch on a cheek and getting a tiny tap instead. Where was the build, where was the journey, where were the very obvious conversations that a drama needs to establish a consensual relationship? Not in Wiang Singh, y'all.

But besides that -- I actually think the mystery itself has gone a little haywire, too. I do think the set-up of Boss ended in a way that wrapped his storyline up fine. But it ended up not being terribly bombastic or revealing? He was clearly a very fucked up young man who did very, very bad things.

It was the whole sending-Orn-into-Boss's-house that really threw me. Tew -- you're a COP. (ACAB.) SEND AN EXPERT IDIOT TO GATHER ILLEGALLY-OBTAINED EVIDENCE. How could he sign off on this? To send Orn to almost-certain danger? Like? And Kan is all like, omg we need to check on her, and these two dudes are just in a pretty living room, on their phones like, omggggg what's happeninggg. Y'all actually sent a NURSE to be a COP, what?

We have one episode left to unwind a lot of shit. Something's up with my favorite creepy forensic pathologist. (Clown theory: she's the daughter of Kan's mentor who Kan euthanized.)

And, oh yeah -- KAN, YOU NEED TO TALK WITH TEW. Instead of SHOOTING the guy who was gonna NARC on you, KAN, maybe you could just, you know, HAVE A CONVO WITH TEW about your past deeds! I am waiting with BAITED. BREATH. (/snark) about how this show is going to convince me that Tew should remain with Kan vis à vis Kan's very, very morally gray ass.

At this point, I would much rather ship Tor and JJ in real life, and I hate real-life shipping, I hate it. But my hopes were high to see these two dudes kill a script, and the script killed them instead. I'm hanging on to the end, because Kan needs to get some sort of punishment from Tew. And if that doesn't happen? I'd at least like to know how the show will attempt to save itself.

#spare me your mercy #spare me your mercy the series #euthanasia the series #torjj #tor thanapob #jj krissanapoom #jaylerr #kan x tew #kan x thiu #sammon

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dreambeloved · 1 year ago

Note

you don't think that the snaps were sent to someone else? he's said on his twitter that he had relations with someone over age back in 2020, from where I'm standing it looks very much like that person was possibly nat, who has admitted recently that she's been in contact with the people behind the burner.

not to mention that the evidence of the alleged exchanges between dream and the victim are images of screenshots of screenshots of a video of someones phone.

I just think it's way too soon to go throwing everything away, he hasn't even released his video yet!

much love and i hope you're ok <3.

There are over 50 asks in my inbox right now, but this one is actually worded kindly, so I’ll answer. Believe what you want of course, I’m not here to harass people into seeing things the way I see them, but just an explanation on the way I view it.

It’s very clear to me that he lied about who he sent those snaps to when everything is put together. At first, I wanted to attribute it to just forgetting who they were sent to, or mixing people up- but the way he went about proving that lie is what makes it obvious that this isn’t some mix-up.

To start, I want to point out that both the burner account and Nat (who Dream says is the actual recipient of those snaps) have denied Nat’s involvement with the burner beyond sharing the “chia seeds” discord screenshots. She also provided proof (linked here) that she hasn’t been in contact with him on snap since 2019. (burner account confirmation linked here).

Now, when he provided proof of Nat being the recipient, he provided this screenshot (seen below on the left). It should be noted that the “Sam” in discussion was a mutual between them both on Twitter, and not his ex, like some think. In the screenshot Nat provided (seen below on the right), there are voice memos that were either edited out or deleted before Dream posted them. Nat also provided videos (linked here) to show that the messages are authentic.

Okay I’m going off on a tangent here. I don’t have the energy to go through every little piece, so for now, here’s my conclusion for the Nat thing. To me at least, it very clearly isn’t her. But if the actual recipient of those videos wasn’t someone that shouldn’t have been sent them in the first place, why go to such lengths to claim so? Why go through all the trouble of bringing in someone completely uninvolved if there was nothing wrong with it in the first place? Even as a stan, I could admit that he has a thing about lying at first when he’s in the wrong, so all this just feels like the final nail.

Now, even if this was just some elaborate set-up to get him cancelled, I still find it really uncomfortable and strange that he sent something like that to a fan anyways? I feel like a lot of people forget the whole power imbalance aspect when it comes to youtubers with their fans. The fact that he has so many intimate relationships with stans/fans strikes me as weird whether they’re legal or not.

That’s all I have for now, at least on the “could be Nat” situation. There are a Lot of asks and messages that I don’t have the energy to go through, so I’ll probably make a final post and then never look in my notifs again.

#anyways thank you for being kind with the question #ask #anon ask #dreamwastaken #dwt #dream situation #idk if im even supposed to tag these still honestly #dream neg

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intersexcat-tboy · 9 months ago

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I don't feel like responding to your entire reblog and also I'm blocking you but CVI is NOT visual processing disorder

Context (link)

Sources will be at the bottom after disturbing arguments are addressed.

I'm going to respond to this assuming there is a missing "a", as I never said CVI is VPD, I said it's a type. That's probably clear but I'll make it crystal

Could you clarify any particular reason as to why you believe you are the arbiter whose opinion should be regarded above all else? I welcome the opportunity to be educated and proven wrong, but you have yet to support your original claim and still fail to provide any evidence regarding this one.

Saying a disabled individual knows nothing about the condition they literally have? Wow. Just wow.

You previously called someone obsessed and implied they were stupid for reblogging with a response and leaving a comment on your post. If that's considered obsession, what would you call yourself, who has subblogged someone after you left an ask saying you've blocked them?

And then I find this?

Are you actually fucking kidding me? I can't believe I fell for someone's obviously bad faith bullshit as you clearly believe that those who have disabilities understanding senses have sensory disabilities. How is sensory processing disorder NOT a sensory disability when you blatantly include one of the manifestations???

I find it notable you did not respond to stitchieau-the-actual-one or trashiesttrashboy’s points like this, instead, you opted to fabricate a quote as a personal attack to mock Stitch as if they had said “I'm as dumb as rocks”, when one could've easily pointed out how dyspraxia is a form of SPD, not the other way around.

Very interesting, it seems your motivation for blocking could very well stem from the desire for the inherent concealment of concerns about misinformation and bigoted biases, particularly after having sanism and hindrance to disability activism pointed out. Funny how the sanist comments suddenly disappeared after I mentioned them, shame I didn't screenshot it.

You "don't feel like" responding to my (or any respondent, really) reblog because you HAVE nothing to respond with.

SOURCES N SHIT

I wasn't just saying it for the hell of it.

The Child Neurology Foundation (link) describes CVI as visual processing disorder. The American Association for Pediatric Ophthalmology & Strabismus (link) explains that in CVI, "the message is not properly processed or integrated".

The Pediatric Cortical Visual Impairment Society (link) notes that "CVI is a problem with the visual processing centers and visual pathways of the brain, not the eye." They continue on another page (link), "the eyes can see, but the brain can't interpret the visual world.” Perkins (link) says it is "caused by damage to the brain’s visual pathways or visual processing areas," and that "the brain has trouble processing what the eyes can see".

The Eye & Ear Foundation of Pittsburgh (link) states "it can involve any visual processing part of the brain," and that it "affects the visual processing centers in the brain". The National Eye Institute (link) drafted a definition in a workshop sponsored by NIH, defining CVl as "a spectrum of visual impairments caused by an underlying structural and/or functional brain abnormality that affects the development of visual function and processing'":

This PubMed article (link) states that “[the] broad consensus definition embraces the wide range of damage or dysfunction of the neural pathways, centers and networks involved in visual information processing," highlighting how this particularly impacts the visual brain areas “involved in integration, identification, analysis and interpretation of […] visual information […]." Given this complexity, it follows that “disturbance of any element of these complex mental visual processes can occur in a range of patterns of CVI", including "impaired processing of visual details", showcasing how "cortical or cerebral visual impairment can interfere with any or all aspects of visual processing."

Another study (link) mentions that "an important aspect of CVI are visual processing dysfunctions (VPD)" processing dysfunction is synonymous with processing disorder.

A different study (link) notes "CVI can be characterized as a condition of 'dorsal stream dysfunction' and represents the most common type of visual processing impairment observed in children with this condition.”

Boston children's hospital (link) lists autism as a confusing diagnostic entity, probably because dorsal stream function were significantly associated (link) with autistic traits.

This study (link) calls CVI a "visual processing disorder"

The only argument I can possibly interpret to be made in good faith would be pointing out how cerebral is different from cortical, which is not what you've done. It isn't a strong argument anyways, as cerebral is often substituted for or used interchangeably with cortical "to more globally encompass these higher order visual processing deficits and their presumed association with damaged areas of the visual processing pathway".

That study (link) continues by explaining how “a practical and useful conceptual framework in characterizing observed deficits in CVI is to incorporate the two-stream hypothesis of visual processing". Within this framework, “impairment of dorsal visual stream processing would impact upon an individual’s ability to process and interact with complex visual scenes […]". This concept is supported by recent studies investigating “individual pathways implicated in the processing of visual information between cortical areas of the brain with the aim of establishing a possible association between the structural integrity of these pathways and visual dysfunction in CVI.” Those studies reveal that “the observed reductions in the structural integrity associated with the key extra geniculostriate visual pathways implicated in visual processing help provide for a neuroanatomical basis for the visual dysfunctions observed in individuals with CVI”

CVI Scotland (link) has discussed a paper titled "Central Auditory Processing Disorder: The Hearing Equivalent of CVI".

Again, I welcome being wrong! I love being educated (: but you have given absolutely 0 indicator that this is anything more than your personal opinion sneered out of frustrations taken out on fellow disabled individuals (oh that's right, you just think they have issues)

#asks #answered asks #chronic disability #disability issues #disability #disabled things #disabled #disability activism #disability awareness #disability advocacy #disabled ableism #ableism #fighting ableism #sensory disability #sensory disabilities

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iviarellereads · 1 year ago

Text

System Collapse, Chapter 6

(Curious what I'm doing here? Read this post! For the link index and a primer on The Murderbot Diaries, read this one! Like what you see? Send me a Ko-Fi.)

In which 57 sources of anxiety sounds low, actually.

The team is not happy. Iris records another briefing, even though it's early for a check-in, and Murderbot hopes that this and the other pathfinder return soon with some insight from the rest of the team, but only counts on it as a way to let them know what happened if the B-Es attack them. Threat assessment puts the chance of a B-E attack low, but mostly because these three and MB aren't much of a threat to at-least-5 and another SecUnit.

And oh, that SecUnit is causing some discussions among the team. MB has to explain that it can't just go around freeing every SecUnit willy nilly, and besides that, a freed SecUnit doesn't instantly become trustworthy. A freed unit might need to be killed anyway, if it goes rogue and attacks the humans. Tarik seems to understand. Ratthi definitely doesn't, but acknowledges that MB is the expert on the matter, and he doesn't want to press it into something it doesn't think is safe. MB appreciates that about Ratthi.

After all that, MB and AC2 arrange a secure connection for Iris and Trinh, the primary "operator" for AC2. Trinh is a little unnerved at a second group of strangers making contact so soon after B-E. MB figures it'd be pretty freaked out at that, too. Iris explains the situation, and Trinh observes that she's saying the same thing B-E did: that she's here to help. MB groans mentally that the colonists have no reason to trust them.(1)

Tarik, Ratthi, and Art-drone strategize on the shuttle, and a lot of time is spent on the potential arguments to be made, and what the colonists might and are likely to know from their sporadic contact and, potentially, spying via AC2's connection to AC1.

On the plus side, AC2 gave MB the location of the B-E shuttle, and the best route to it without alerting them. So, it takes the opportunity to go scout it out. MB grumbles about the lack of cameras in the last section of the path AC2 directs it to, as well as none outside. Preparedness is everything, dangit!(2) Meanwhile, Art-drone has taken a defensive position just inside the hangar.

MB takes some comfort that the colonists might not trust them, but AC2 trusts it. Mostly, computer systems trust easily if you keep things simple and don't try to provoke their boundaries. AC2 wants to protect its humans, and MB has so far showed no sign of wanting to harm them.

So, it provides the team with the video feed where the B-Es are still talking to most of the humans. There's no audio, but Art-drone is interpreting from mouth and facial movements, and they probably understand more than the B-Es do since Thiago's translation module is "clearly better". AC2 vouching for MB won't win over any humans, though. Sometimes not even solid evidence can convince them.

AC2 asks MB why the B-E SecUnit refused a connection request. MB thinks that's a good thing, since normal SecUnits can't hack, only CombatUnits.(3) MB is pretty sure this one's a normal SecUnit, since its armour is very similar to Three's. So, it has to explain to AC2 that it's under the control of a governor module. It doesn't have an answer for AC2's subsequent why (is this allowed)?

By now, MB has made it to the other hangar, where the B-Es landed. It wonders how the B-Es knew to look here particularly. Earlier, Iris asked Art-drone if the B-Es could have followed them in, but Art-drone came to the conclusion that they arrived at least a day earlier, from some gap in Art-prime's pathfinder scanning. Art-drone is miffed enough that it expects Art-prime will be furious.

Still, back in the present, MB realizes it's drifted off again, and Ratthi brings it back to task by noticing a second door. AC2 sends MB a rough map of the installation, and MB shares it with the humans. With nothing better to do, MB decides to stand there and hang out on purpose.

The wind outside gets stronger, screaming through the hangar's crevices. Art-drone says pathfinders confirm the weather is getting worse and it may lose contact with them. AC2 confirms, that matches its weather station data.

MB pulls up some Sanctuary Moon, not wanting to distract Art-drone with something new. After a couple of minutes, AC2 asks what MB is doing. MB explains watching media, and AC2 offers its entertainment partition, and MB has hit a goldmine, though some of the titles don't match words in its language modules. When Art-drone notices, it says these are pre-CR media.

The scene flips(4) over to the now-unredacted incident again, and MB says it's fairly sure the corpse never chewed on its leg, but it's even more sure it saw that happen to a human at some point on a survey mission. It told Art that it (MB) had fucked everything up and that Art and its humans shouldn't want it to do security for them anymore. Art asks why, and MB says something is broken inside it.

Art points out that its wormhole drive is broken. MB says that's fixable, and knows it was a mistake to say so since it really doesn't know all of what happened to Art from Art's point of view, but continues that its flaw is in its organic neural tissue. Art points out that this is how the humans diagnosed it so quickly, and asks if they're disposable when it happens to them. MB grumbles that that's what corporations say. Art says it's not a corpo.

MB tells Art to stop, that this isn't it talking, just its… Art finishes the thought MB trails out of: its certification in trauma protocol, which is obviously useless in this situation. MB says it's for humans, and Art points out that this affects MB's human bits. MB says it's not talking to Art anymore.(5)

The first thought MB has is that it should trade all its media for all AC2's. The second is that its humans aren't going to be staying much longer, whether they go with Art or B-E. At least the situation sucking so bad is a great distraction for how much MB feels it sucks, it thinks, just before realizing it missed something in its distraction.

Trinh invites the team to spend the night in the installation, since the weather is worsening. Iris asks MB if they should, and despite the threat of the B-Es, MB agrees. Art-drone thanks it, and MB knows it's not the only one that was imagining the other SecUnit sneaking up on the shuttle.

Trinh sends them directions, which they don't need with AC2's map, but that put them at the opposite end from the accommodations the B-Es were given. It's a nice gesture, even if it's only a twenty minute walk apart.(6) MB sneaks back through the back corridors to meet up with the others. MB does its best to act like the others, even to folding its hood and helmet back. It's not sure what AC2 has told the colonists about it, and it doesn't want to ask, in case it hadn't told them about MB and this causes it to. MB knows it can't stay a secret, but it wants less interaction with them if possible.

Flash to a clip of it telling Mensah it doesn't know what's wrong with itself, and Mensah saying she thinks it knows, and just doesn't want to talk about it yet.(7)

In the present and in the team feed, to prevent eavesdropping by B-E, Iris says so far, Trinh has rejected B-E's requests to speak to the whole colony. They're only allowing them the smaller group. Ratthi worries what kind of employment pitch they might make, and Tarik says they'll be real good at dressing it up, and this group might be more vulnerable to their manipulation.

Iris says the group seems pretty independent, she thinks the chance of them falling for it is low, but it might not even be in their best interest to leave with the others. If they can forge the charter right, they'd have the right to choose to stay or go as they please. Ratthi adds that it would be even easier if the University comes to study the contamination, offering a means of transport out later as needed. Tarik is about as optimistic about this as MB, which is to say, not very.

MB notices that they all look really tired, and kicks itself as it asks Art-drone how long it's been since they slept. It replies that they were supposed to take naps on the flight in, but nobody could rest. MB feels like it fucked up again, but Art-drone offers that they both fucked this one up.

AC2 notifies them that there's a human approaching, as they near their assigned quarters. Ratthi asks in the team feed if this is a sign of trust, on the system's part. Iris asks Art-drone if that's possible, and it reminds her that they've discussed anthropomorphizing machine intelligence before. Ratthi asks what Art-drone considers human characteristics in this way, and Tarik begs them not to start. There's some lighthearted teasing of Tarik by Art, and Iris laughingly says she's sorry she asked.

The human doesn't have a feed ID, but AC2 supplies a name of Lucia and he/him pronouns when MB asks, since it knows the humans will want to know. Iris thanks him for inviting them in, and he nervously says she's welcome and walks them to the rooms, showing them the facilities. Iris tries to initiate three different conversations, to no avail. The team all worries B-E poisoned the well already.

Iris goes to lay on one of the beds in the other room, while Ratthi and Tarik stay in the first room to talk about what's going on between them. MB is stuck in the doorway between the rooms, monitoring everything in case of attacks. It recalls overhearing a heated discussion on Art after the incident, and learning that it was Ratthi and Tarik having a "sexual discussion". Apparently, this felt like the right time to talk again. MB backburners their audio except for a keyword filter in case they yell for help, plays a nice nothing loop of sound, and stares at the wall.(8)

The humans do, eventually, manage to get some sleep. Art-drone gets MB to watch an episode of World Hoppers. MB thinks about how it has fifty seven unique causes of concern or anxiety, and it can do nothing about any of them. That goes up to fifty eight when Trinh calls to ask for an in-person meeting with them and B-E.

=====

(1) Trust the process. (2) There are reasonable limits, it's true. Being prepared beyond a certain point is just feeding your own paranoia. Just look at all the right-wing "preppers" who keep expecting the apocalypse. But, a certain amount of preparation and expecting the worst can keep you safe in an emergency. Never installing cameras in a whole section of your installation or at the exits is absolutely an error in judgement on some level. (3) I'm sure it means hack something this complex, but… Murderbot, you hack literally all the time. Are you secretly a CombatUnit? (4) It's not lost on me that, now that we know what the redacted incident was, it feels like more pre-CR talk means more flashback and MB being more distracted in the present. (5) If that lasted 5 minutes I'll do something improbable. (6) I dunno, see, this is one of those things where MB is programmed to go past what I think are reasonably pessimistic expectations of danger. It's understandable, this is what it was literally built for, but situationally speaking, I think it's a bit excessive. Nobody wants to make a bad impression on the colonists, if nothing else. (7) Why this conversation? Why now? Why here, right after being worried about the colonists figuring out what it is? (8) Personally, I want all the juicy details, but I can't blame MB for its lack of interest.

#the murderbot diaries #murderbot diaries #system collapse #murderbot #secunit #iris (murderbot)#tarik (murderbot)#ratthi #art (murderbot)#trinh (murderbot)#adacol2

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horizon-verizon · 2 years ago

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What I like about Alicent and what I will always like about her is that she and Corlys Velaryon were the only ones to say at any point during the Dance, “You know what, let’s put down our swords and talk.” By that time, Alicent could recognize that there was clearly a disputed (and disputable) point of law in the Dance, stemming from the Great Council of 101 AC. Jaehaerys had in 92 AC set the precedent that a king could name his heir, over the dictates of traditional Andal-First Men succession rules. That’s fine and dandy, until 101 and the apparent precedent that a male-line claimant comes before a female-line claimant. Viserys named his heir as Rhaenyra, but his male-line claimant was Aegon. Which precedent was more correct ? With three great lords (Stark, Arryn, and Tully) declaring Rhaenyra to be the rightful claimant, and three others (Tyrell, Lannister, and Baratheon) advocating for Aegon, the answer was obviously not as clear as either side had previously believed it to be.

So what does Alicent do when Rhaenyra flies into KL ? She says “Let’s call a Great Council”. She put a lot on the line here; there’s no second try or appellate court for a Great Council’s decision. Now, did she think Aegon would probably win ? That’s a fair guess, Viserys had won 20 to 1 over Rhaenys and her children in 101 AC, but it’s not a guarantee, or the Green council would not have pored over the records of the first Great Council to note which lords would and would not support Aegon. Still, Alicent was willing to risk losing in a very public Westerosi legal forum to end the bloodshed and destruction in the realm. That takes courage and wisdom, the wisdom of a woman who saw her eldest son crippled and horrifically burned in his first battle, her eldest grandson coldly beheaded in the name of vengeance, and her daughter descending into madness.

So I like Alicent. She’s no saint, she’s not a good person, and she fought hard to place her son on the throne over his half-sister. But she offered to back down, and that takes guts.

Maybe a post responding to this recent one.

You: "But she offered to back down, and that takes guts."

AND

You: "Still, Alicent was willing to risk losing in a very public Westerosi legal forum to end the bloodshed and destruction in the realm. That takes courage and wisdom, the wisdom of a woman who saw her eldest son crippled and horrifically burned in his first battle, her eldest grandson coldly beheaded in the name of vengeance, and her daughter descending into madness."

No. Absolutely not.

Always Remember:

If we compare her to Alicent, Alicent is a heavy-duty blood purist who never looked out for other women, even seized power from another woman entirely for herself and her house's patriarchal prestige and power. No matter who Rhaenyra was before King's Landing or after, Rhaenyra was "vulnerable" to this due to her gender's inequitable access to higher positions of power in Westeros. Rhaenyra was never a tyrant before King's Landing and the greens' usurpation.

.............................................................................................................

And to the second bold text, refer to section A of the post I linked above, where I provided evidence of her doing very much the opposite and did it to deceive, bide time, or because she was angry. Not for "the realm"!

Aside from the fact that Alicent had been after & had been actively publicly (subtle and unsubtle) undermining Rhaenyra years (since she was 10) before the Dance and Viserys' death, there is so much that shows that no one can trust Alicent to be so self-sacrificing or diplomatic towards Rhaenyra and most blacks.

Grand Maester -- Geradys (Rhaenyra's candidate) vs Alfador (Alicent's candidate)/her saying Rhaenyra was "meddling" despite Gerardys saving Viserys' life

Alicent enlisting Criston Cole after he killed Joffrey, seeing the separation bt him and rhaenyra

her making as if she were concerned about Rhaenyra's well-being concerning Cole years before, but really trying to get Cole separated from her/dismissed and Rhaenyra's prepubescent virginity questioned in the minds of others

try to get Aegon married to Rhaenyra not for Rhaenyra's sake, but Aegon's...as Viserys himself pointed out

Rhaenyra had no reason to think Alicent would be so, and we even have more information proving that!

You: "So what does Alicent do when Rhaenyra flies into KL ? She says “Let’s call a Great Council”. She put a lot on the line here; there’s no second try or appellate court for a Great Council’s decision."

Quote to which you refer ("The Red Dragon and the Gold"):

...anon, did you skip over the "Upon seeing that resistance was hopeless, the Dowager Queen Alicent emerged from Maegor’s Holdfast" part that shows she only came out bc she saw there was literally nothing else she could do? There was no graciousness about her motives for doing this, nothing but defeat for herself and survival.

And like the anon from before mentioned, she was doing all she could to keep Rhaenyra and her armies back right before Rhaneyra took KL. She had every intention of winning and resisting to win before Rhaenyra put her into a corner...as well as biding time for Aegon and his kids to escape.

Why is it so hard to remember that Rhaenyra is the one to have tried to negotiate for the throne that is already hers through Viserys' ruling and by being firstborn? why do you, anon, and others think Alicent & Aegon were the ones gracious 7 rational when they sent those terms for Rhaenyra's surrender way before any fighting began? ("The Blacks and the Greens"):

Rhaenyra vs Aegon - Negotiations (Alicent and the green council's Terms, really) ->

Oh and, this lovely line of her wanting Rhaenyra to die in childbirth is so "gutsy" and a sign of her willingness to "back down" ("The Blacks and the Greens"):

Is it so hard to contemplate that Alicent hated Rhaneyra?

I'll say why: bc you actually think the sexist customs and feelings against women leading are in themselves valid enough to bar women from leading. Apparently, "culture" wins against logic and actually figuring out how to create safer environments for more people and not just a select few.

You'd say bc the Great Council? Once again, Jaehaerys muddied succession by allowing subjects to participate in selecting their new king/monarch when he was all about consolidating power for his own dynasty...this precedent he set for strengthening male primogeniture is actually both self-contradictory AND relatively new. Yes males are preferred in Andal succession customs, but there were female heads of house in their own right while male relatives existed. Or female candidates that were eldest but actively barred from ruling without Jaehaerys' precedent and despite women having some ability AND her being older than the 8 yr old male candidate. A few named ones are in TWoIaF: Shiera & Agnes Blackwood.

It's quite obvious that misogyny worked against these women to their deaths or inability to use autonomous power and leadership despite some becoming leaders. Alicent comes from these actions becoming president, Jaehaerys' actions reaffirmed the feeling against female rulers. To try to minimize the detrimental effects to not only the target of misogyny but wider society is ridiculous.

You confused either show!Rhaenys or show!Corlys for book!Corlys ("The Blacks and the Greens"):

Corlys only did the "You know what, let’s put down our swords and talk" thing after Rhaenyra died and the Greens had Baela in custody. Remember that she tried to kill Aegon above Dragonstone when he came on Syrax.

Again, Alicent only did something similar when Rhaenyra was going to kill her sons/her side could lose ("Bastard blood shed in war") AND after Rhaneyra dies she has the luxury of conceding...bc Rhaenyra is dead and her supporters hadn't really grown enough for her to be vicious or worried as much as she would later be. Neither were really doing it for the sake of peace for smallfolk or social peace & harmony. Nor were neither against violence for their own ends (section B, mentioning what happened right before and after the Battle of the Kingsroad).

There is this maybe-rumor--but in my eyes, a very believable one considering her words about Rhaenyra's labor death and her wanting to mutilate 10- year old Aegon, and her actions putting KLers more at risk than you seem to think--of Alicent laughing at Tumbleton death and rape, including children's in her anticipation of it coming back at the blacks/Rhaenyra ("Rhenayra Triumphant"):

QUOTES of Alicent and Corlys actually being at odds on how to go forward (her never actually trusting him, being annoyed at him for holding her back) and her actually not being "gutsy" but calm enough to listen to others (who were conspiring against her for their own ends after she and Aegon became more and more resilient to some advice, eeven threatening Aegon III and Baela), and despite when she did "listen", her insistence on killing all of those who supported Rhaenyra AND harming Aegon III/Baela leads to Corlys and Larys working together to kill her son:

Larys:

You: "By that time, Alicent could recognize that there was clearly a disputed (and disputable) point of law in the Dance, stemming from the Great Council of 101 AC."

AND

You: "Viserys named his heir as Rhaenyra, but his male-line claimant was Aegon. Which precedent was more correct ? With three great lords (Stark, Arryn, and Tully) declaring Rhaenyra to be the rightful claimant, and three others (Tyrell, Lannister, and Baratheon) advocating for Aegon, the answer was obviously not as clear as either side had previously believed it to be."

Anon refers to Alicent after Rhaenyra dies and Corlys switches before he kneels to her and they are negotiating, which I already showed she wasn't that willing to accept his particular terms.

Anyway, how does Alicent see what you think she is seeing? Where is that proof? Especially in the face of the total opposite happening that my quotes show, anon? In order to argue that she somehow "changed her mind", you need proof and a reasonable argument using said proof, not pure conjecture.

This, the debate over which precedent was "more" correct, was never an issue for Alicent. She never philosophized over it, nor doubted that the throne should have gone to her son, Aegon. Not once. Ther eis no suggestion that she had a change of heart. Just as Rhaenyra in her last words affirmed her right to rule Aegon by emphasizing her firstborn status, Alicent' never expressed her thoughts's thoughts about the succession in regards to her own son never deviated from what she said in the following quotes:

("A Question of Succession")

("The Blacks and the Greens")

She went to her grave trying to kill Aegon III and spite Rhaenyra and her legacy, willing to use anyone and anything at her disposal. How many times do I need to repeat this?

Conclusion

NONE of what you say, anon, was an honest or observant reading of the text!

You have not used context and past events nor seen tone and mood in the language given to you to see that Alicent remains as she was, even becoming more determined to get to her goals/desires. To realize her enmity against Rhaenyra.

#alicent hightower #alicent's characterization #asoiaf asks to me #fire and blood characters #fire and blood

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