#you know it’s a Thai bl pulp when…

[serfergs]

I’m sorry but this man pushed you into his apartment, loomed over you threateningly, took off his shirt to show you a bullet hole, admitted he’s murdered who knows how many people and you’re upset he lied to you about THE SHABU PLACE???

[absolutebl]

This Week in BL - I Still On1y Care About...

Organized, in each category, with ones I'm enjoying most at the top.

Sept 2024 Week 1

Ongoing Series - Thai

Monster Next Door (Thai Thurs Gaga ) eps 7 of 12 - Deeeelightful. They are so damn cute + a nice kiss! The rise of the green flag semes continues. I like it when Diew flirts and shows that he does have some experience in a relationship, and he can/will flex his power. Props to God for being a man who remembers to TAKE HIS DRINK with him. 

Addicted Heroin (Thai Tues WeTV) ep 4 of 10 - Yep I still like it and all its toxicity. It’s fun to see how closely it follows the original. Now I really can’t wait to see how this one ends. Since this time around we get an actual ending.

Battle of the Writers (Sun YT) ep 6 of 12 - How did they know that what I wanted more than anything was a side couple = spoiled prince + demon lord? How clever they are to give them to me. Meanwhile, in a shocking twist, the leads have known each other since childhood. Because why be original? 

I Saw You in My Dream (Weds Gaga) ep 8 of 12 - Oh it’s very cute. I love Ing. I love that Ai was honest with his bestie. Best friend's older brother trope is a go! Also good kisses all round. 

Kidnap (Fri YT) ep 1 of 12 - Ohm has his shirt off less than 5 min in. I guess GMMTV is learning what we want. My boy Title is the creep character again. I’m assuming that’s why GMMTV brought him on board at this juncture. Sigh. New boy, Q, looks like Mek’s younger brother. Ultimately? I'm not convinced on this one. It is doing what it says on the tin, but nothing more than that. I’m not wild about it, but I will keep watching.

The Trainee (Sun YT) ep 10 of 12 - The more OffGun BLs, the more time they spend communicating as characters in those BLs. It’s kind of charming. They've become the pair that advocates for communication in relationships. I like it as evolution for their brand. Flirting via the printer was very fun. Especially as the Thai script is so beautiful.

Live in Love (Sun Gaga) ep 1 of 5 - I guess this is a lockdown narrative? Odd choice. A lot of familiar faces but from more minor rolls. Is this from the Destiny Seeker people? It feels like that. It’s a bigger cast than I was expecting, and a sort of classic university BL of the kind star Hunter produces. Or the end of love people. Pretty classic Thai pulp stuff. I’m mildly enjoying it. Hali is too hot to be the dorky second lead. Nice to see Boat back on my screen. However, it is… what’s the word I am looking for? Oh yes. Boring. Plus singing. 

Ongoing Series - Not Thai

The On1y One (Taiwan Thurs Gaga) eps 5-6 of 12 - I entirely lost my mind over this show this week. Fuck me it's so good. The delicacy sends me. I keep expecting it to be clumsy and then is just isn't - it's so subtle and it demands we pay such close attention. I feel like I'm holding my breath the whole time I'm watching.

Cliff's notes on these 2 eps as follows:

The pure unadulterated tsundere of it all.

The awesome angst, it aches.

The series of repercussions after the fight was pacing genius.

The brilliant juxtaposition of "the kid who self isolates too easily" versus "the one who has been forced into isolation" meets both of them being smart enough to know why they react out of hurt, but neither can stop doing it.

Baby’s reaction to learning he’s going to be left behind = to instantly make plans to do the leaving in the future hurts my heart in the best possible way.

"Maybe what we call eternity is just persistence."

Maybe one boy simply deciding to be another boy's rock is romance. 

Production better nail the second half of this show! It better be the world against them from here on out or the audience is gonna riot.

And by "audience" I mean me.

Sugar Dog Life (Japan Sun grey) ep 5 of 10 - Oh noes! Poor baby boy!!! My heart hurts. But also gah so cute and next week they shack up together! Hooray! 

I Hear the Sunspot AKA Hidamari ga Kikoeru (Japan Weds Gaga) ep 11 - too much time spent on the girl again. I don’t need excuses for why she’s a bitch. So can we talk about Taichi instead? It’s such a good characterization, this boy who understands everything about other people but doesn’t notice anything about himself, including his own abilities of observation. The person who is special never realizes how special they are, I guess. The soundscapes are so good with this show. The moments where prod decided to be silent are so vital and so pivotal and used with such delicacy and strategy, it’s truly audio magic manipulation.  

First Note Of Love (Taiwan Mon Gaga) eps 7-8 of 12 - I loved how Orca just jumped on the stage. What a great side couple. CHARMED I TELL YOU. Orca was all… singing? Naw. I came back to fuck the manager's brains out. Anything less than that is unacceptable. 

Takara's Treasure AKA Takara No Vidro (Japan Mon Gaga) ep 10 fin - Essentially this was a growth story for Takara and an exercise in patience while the two of them learned each other’s quirks and languages. It was also an exercise in patience for me... who doesn’t like the power differential of a weaker younger character having to do all the pursuing while constantly feeling like he is inferior to the older popular hot character. I know this was a BL that was definitely for some people, since plenty liked it way more than I did, but I didn’t like it very much even though there’s nothing objectively wrong with it. It simply wasn’t to my personal taste. 7/10 

Seoul Blues (Korea Fri? YouTube) ep 5-6 of 8 - Enter an ex or something? Well he certainly has a type. Bah. This whole series seems to be mainly about cheating. It’s very annoying because they are all so pretty. 

Happy of the End (Japan Tues Gaga) - Based on a manga, longer than usual run time. A boy is disowned for being gay, dumped by his boyfriend, and ends up in a dysfunctional co-dependant relationship with his would-be kidnapper. We were due for another messy JBL. Messy gay pain here we go.

Oh it’s exactly what I expected. Do I like it? No I do not. And ya know what? There is plenty airing. I have a bad feeling about this one. DNF 

It's airing but...

4 Minutes (Sat Gaga) eps 1-6 of 8 - Gaga picked this one up so we can watch it there. I'm waiting until the end, it seems angsty and confusing and full of awful people being awful. But also... high heat and I'm shallow. So we shall see which devil wins (and how it ends).

The Hidden Moon (Sat ????) ep 1 of 10 - This is a supernatural romance (my ghost boyfriend trope) ‘เดือนพราง’ by Violet Rain (I Feel You Linger)... A Bangkok writer is hired to write an article about an old mansion in Chiang Mai which is being converted into a café. He gets into an accident and nearly dies on his way there. After that, he sees the ghosts of people who died at the mansion, one boy catches his attention. Was substantially recast. Couldn't find it. Didn't really look.

In case you missed it

Meet You at the Blossom (China) - I'm eating crow, binging the fucker, and live blogging. It's just taking me some time. This isn't really a bingable show, not for me anyway. It's A LOT to take all at once. No new one this week.

Next Week Looks Like This:

Plus:

9/9 Jack & Joker (Thai Mon IQIYI) 12 eps? - Be gay YinWar, do crimes. Dehup gives us Yin, War, Mark and a few other familiar faces in a Leverage sitch, only queerer.

9/14 Love Sick 2024 (Thai Sat ????) ?? eps - Remake of the original. I'm scared too.

9/15 Bad Guy My Boss (Thai Sun Gaga) 10 eps - Assistant to a player boss who is in love with that boss decides to quit to save himself. The boss then makes a move. (A gay What's up with Secretary Kim?)

Upcoming BLs for 2024 are listed here. This list is not kept updated, so please leave a comment if you know something new or RP with additions.

Coming SEPTEMBER 2024:

9/17 Love is Like a Poison AKA Doku Koi: Doku mo Sugireba Koi to Naru (Japan Tues Netflix?) 10 eps - Lawyer and a con artist meet at a bar, pair up, fall in love.

9/28 Teenager Judge (Vietnam Sat YouTube) ?? eps - oh I don't know just Ba Vinh doing his thing with pretty boys again.

9/? The Time of Fever (Korea iQIYI) 6 eps - HoTae & DongHee are back! Side couple from Unintentional Love Story, same actors, same character names I an WILD for this.

THIS WEEK’S BEST MOMENTS

Not sure what this is from but I capped it for a reason so, shrug.

The scent trope AND the childhood crush trope? I see you suckering me into one trope because I like the other. Clever, Battle. Very clever.

(Last week)

Streaming services are listed by how I (usually) watch, which is with a USA based IP, and often offset by a day because time zones are a pain.

The tag BLigade: @doorajar @solitaryandwandering @my-rose-tinted-glasses @babymbbatinygirl @babymbbatinygirl @isisanna-blog @mmastertheone @pickletrip @aliceisathome @urikawa-miyuki @tokillamonger @sunflower-positiiivity @rocketturtle4 @blglplus @anythinggoesintheshire @everlightly @renafire @mestizashinrin @bl-bam-beyond @small-dark-and-delicious @saezurumurmurs

Sigh, Tumblr in its infinite wisdom doesn't like too many at-ings.

[lurkingshan]

(Different anon) I agree with and understand your points re: ~why you watch GMMTV if don't like??~ and why the question is/feels hostile.

But taking the question itself in good faith as "why do you (should I) keep watching shows I think/know I will not like based on how others have been handled?" in the genuine spirit of "explain like I'm 5 because I don't understand the lingo and background but want to understand the concept, how would you explain it to people not as into/knowledgeable/etc BL and the history of GMMTV?

Hi anon! This is an interesting question, because it depends so much on you as an individual and what makes you happy.

I think there is often a misconception that people who post critical meta are having a miserable time and torturing themselves with media they hate, but it's just not true. For folks like me who enjoy thinking critically, this is how we have fun. When I love something, I want to rip open its guts and see how it's all assembled. It's what stimulates my brain and gets me excited. And when I don't love something wholeheartedly, I am interested in figuring out why. I've often had the experience of watching something that I know should be working on me, and if it isn't, that creates an intellectual puzzle that I find very satisfying to solve. Why isn't it working, and what can that help me learn about storytelling? This is also fun for me.

Another misconception I often see in fandom is that if you like something, you can't have negative thoughts about it and you have to pretend it's perfect to be a good fan. Nonsense! Being a hater is fun, especially about things you truly love. I'll give you a really concrete example: Bad Buddy is one of my all time favorite shows. It first aired three years ago and I still think about it nearly every day. It's a show that stimulates my brain but also hits me straight in the heart. But I do not think it's perfect and I get a lot of joy from thinking about the parts that did not work (Wai's redemption, that stupid fake out in the finale, all of episode 9) and making fun of it (have you heard that PAT GOT SHOT??). This, too, is a form of love and source of joy.

So with those misconceptions addressed, why do I keep watching shows I suspect I won't like? First, because you truly never know until you try, and I like to be pleasantly surprised. Two of my favorite shows of this year, Cherry Magic Thailand and Knock Knock Boys, shocked the hell out of me. I went into CMT deeply skeptical only to be charmed against my will and so impressed by how they adapted it, and I went into KKB expecting it to be like 95% of weak Thai pulps only to realize its writing and themes were stronger than they had any right to be. If I stayed away from all media I thought I might not like, I would have never had the amazing experience of watching and discussing those two shows live with friends who also loved them.

Second, like I said above, I still have fun examining shows that are not quite working for me, and sometimes I am compelled by the ambition of shows even if I don't think the execution is serving. A great example of that is The Sign. I wanted to support that show because of who was making it, and it had so much early promise that when it fell apart halfway through, I stuck it out to try to make sense of what went wrong. In cases like that, I like to figure out what a show thinks it's doing, what it's actually doing, and where the disconnect is. It's a fun puzzle for me to sort through such an ambitious mess of a show. This is why, btw, I am never really moved by fanwanks to fill in gaps in story and characterization. I understand why others enjoy fixing shows in their brains and then pretending that's what they actually saw, but it's not what motivates me. My goal with shows like this is not to get myself to like it no matter what, it's to figure out why I don't like it and what could be changed to address that.

Third, I care about ql as a genre, and I like to be aware of how it's evolving and be part of the collective experience of watching it. QL fandom is tiny and I like to know what my friends are talking about! I can't watch everything because there is simply way too much content these days, but I like to watch or at least pay attention to most of the big buzzy shows to track trends and see what's getting the fandom frustrated or excited. I didn't watch We Are because I knew enough about what it was doing and who was involved to understand it was not for me, but I did pay attention to reactions to it. Watching Jack & Joker with Thai bl fandom right now is some of the most fun we've had since Only Friends killed our spirit. J&J is directed by my parasocial frenemy Tee Bundit, whose shows often frustrate the hell out of me and whom I have ripped to shreds on this platform many times over. But I'm not gonna let that stop me from having fun with this new show, because Joke is The Moment and we're all in this together.

So truly, anon: whether or not you should be like me and watch things you may not like or continue watching shows you don't think are very good depends on what motivates you. You should figure out what is most fun for you re: media consumption, and do that. You can seek out people who enjoy media the same way you do, and also befriend people who think differently if you want to learn from each other and don't mind a bit of productive discomfort from time to time. I have gotten better recently at recognizing when I'm just getting nothing out of a show and dropping it like a hot potato (because some shows are not bad in an interesting way, they are just bad), or realizing which shows I will like better on a binge (usually the ones with terrible pacing, that is not as tortuous for me when I can just watch it all in one go). You gotta do some testing to figure it out.

All of this has all been a really long-winded way to say you should do what makes you happy, and don't assume that just because someone else's happiness looks different from yours, that it's wrong.

[boozles]

QL Superlatives 2024 Part One: The Good Stuff

I don't even know if I'm doing this right, but not only do I love a good list, but a few people have tagged me to take part <3 I'm planning on doing a Part Two of stuff I wasn't too happy about, but for now let me ramble about my favourites!

Best Use Of Super Powers: Cherry Magic (Thai)

Oh, not Achi using his powers, but Karan taking full advantage of them. He didn't run away or get worried about his privacy being invaded, he just straight up loved that the love of his life could now have full 24/7 access to his thoughts.

Best Use of Sports Equipment: 4 Minutes

Well, what else are you going to do on a pool table?

Best Adaption Of A Manga That Already Has A Live Action Series But In A Different Language: My Love Mix-Up!

I loved this series! I thought Fourth and Gemini really pulled off their own interpretations of the characters, and it was so funny and cute. Fourth was hillarious, and I will not be standing for any slander, okay?!

Best Older Brother: Wei Qian, Unknown

They had a weird family dynamic but not only was Unknown a fantastic series, but Wei Qian's protectiveness was wonderful, if a little too much.

Best Mindfuck of a Series: Love for Love's Sake

For most of this series I was like OMG IT'S A GAME and the gamer in me was delighted then it was like WAIT A MINUTE THIS IS A GAME OF LIFE...IN DEATH! It's such a fantastic series, albeit bittersweet.

Best Tribute To 90s Movies: The Heart Killers

I wasn't going to include shows that are still airing in this list, but fuck it. When this scene happened I flipped because not only are we seeing a gay af version of 10 Things I Hate About You, but Jojo is throwing in other classic movies - you cannot tell me that Bison's religious shirts are not a reference to Baz Lurhmann's Romeo & Juliet. The Pulp Fiction dance tribute was perfect.

Best Surprise New Pairing: MarcPoon

I know we were all happy when this was announced because we didn't want to lose We Are, but I don't think anyone was expecting just how fantastic these two are together. Like, seriously.

Best BL That Isn't Actually An Official BL: Peaceful Property

Okay, I admit that High School Frenemy was a strong contender, but as P'Dome even said, it wasn't meant to be a BL but TayNew just have such chemistry that you can't help but believe it's more than friendship between Home and Peach. This show was gay af, and I loved it so much. Also, the bonus heartbreaking ForceBook was beautiful.

Best Character Redemption: Night, Last Twilight

Alright, I don't know if it's really 'redemption' because it seems like as soon as the accident happened Night really got his act together, but I feel like he worked so hard throughout the whole series to try and...not make up for his mistake, but to at least help. And THEN he falls in love with a girl and before she even gives birth he's already decided he's the daddy. Favourite character in the whole show.

Best Tofu Bodied Man: Achi, Cherry Magic (Thai)

They really tried to make New look smaller in this series, and it was so funny. He has such wide and muscly shoulders/arms and he is really the wrong person to put in a suit if you don't wanna show that off. The 'tofu' comment was hillarious - you could hear the collective guffaw from the audience world wide.

And that's it from me for now! I'll no doubt do a round up of my favourite shows for the year, but if I continue this list it's literally just going to be me going on about how Cherry Magic is the superior series XD I think it's probably been my favourite (yes, I know it started in 2023, but leave me be). I didn't watch a lot this year, I feel? Like, apparently I've only watched like 20 BLs this year, which isn't like me at all, but I've done a lot of rewatching? it's been an odd year, okay?

[the-conversation-pod]

Spring 2024 Lagniappe

And we're back! It's been a long production season for us, and we've still got projects to talk about! Join us and @twig-tea once more to answer our inbox questions and do quick takes on a bunch of projects we didn't cover in long form, and then hear Ben and NiNi catch up on a few shows or movies, wrap up the season, award Girl You Tried, and ponder the future.

Timestamps

The timestamps will now correspond with chapters on Spotify for easier navigation.

00:00:00 - Welcome 00:01:15 - Inbox: Comparing Cherry Magic Adaptations 00:10:17 - Inbox: Remaking Het Romances into QL 00:16:04 - Catch Up Corner: Young Royals Season 3 00:21:23 - Catch Up Corner: Man Suang 00:25:12 - Catch Up Corner: DNA Says Love You 00:29:23 - Twig’s Dispatch 00:38:35 - Winter Round Up 00:44:45 - Girl, You Tried 00:47:35 - Look Ahead

The Conversation Transcripts!

Thanks to the continued efforts of @ginnymoonbeam as transcriber, and @lurkingshan as an editor and proofreader, we are able to bring you transcripts of the episodes.

We will endeavor to make the transcripts available when the episodes launch, and it is our goal to make them available for past episodes (Coming soon thanks to @wen-kexing-apologist). When transcripts are available, we will attach them to the episode post (like this one) and put the transcript behind a Read More cut to cut down on scrolling.

Please send our volunteers your thanks!

00:00:00 - Welcome

NiNi

Welcome to The Conversation About BL, aka The Brown Liquor Podcast.

Ben

And there it is. I’m Ben.

NiNi

I’m NiNi.

Ben

And we’re your drunk Caribbean uncle and auntie here sitting on the porch in the rocking chairs.

NiNi

Four times a year we pop in to talk about what’s going on in the BL world.

Ben

We shoot the shit about stories and all the drama going into them. I review from a queer media lens.

NiNi

And I review from a romance and drama lens.

Ben

So if you like cracked-out takes and really intense emotional analysis…

NiNi

If you like talking about artistry, industry, and the discourse…

Ben

And if you generally just love simping…

NiNi

There is a lot of simping on this podcast…

Ben

We are the show for you!

00:01:15 - Inbox: Comparing Cherry Magic Adaptations 

Ben

And we're back. We have finally made it to the end of what feels like our longest production season we have ever been in.

NiNi

I feel like we have been recording this season since last season and we're recording right up to the end of the season. Our first recording for this season was on the 28th of January.

Ben

Oh my God!

NiNi

We've been here forever. We're going to change some things up going forward, and we'll tell you guys more about that when we figure it out. 

But for now, welcome to our spring lagniappe. Let's go into our inbox. We have two great questions from two new names and we also have a very special guest. Say hi, Twig.

Twig

Hi everyone.

NiNi

Twig is back with us, and she's gonna help us answer some of these questions. 

Our first question comes from @hellooobees and hellooobees writes: “I'm sure you plan to discuss something similar to this, but now that we have the Japanese and the Thai adaptations of Cherry Magic with the anime also airing, I would really like to know your opinions about them and the unique flavors they add to the mix.”

Thank you for the question, hellooobees. Ben, you've been tracking all of these adaptations. What are your opinions about the different versions of Cherry Magic now and what parts you enjoyed differently about different versions of the Cherry Magic story?

Ben

I'd say for Cherry Magic, I'm really glad that Akaso Eiji and Keita Machida were the ones who introduced us to Cherry Magic. I think both of those actors are really good, and considering what we now know about how much was changed in Cherry Magic, I think it was good that they had two solid actors who could handle that and bring some pathos to that when they were asked to do that. 

But I gotta be honest, having now seen complete versions of the Cherry Magic story as it was originally written out, I will not be returning to the original Japanese live action. The Thai live action is probably the best version in the sense that it's the most watchable, and I think the most consistently satisfying to watch. I think the cast of the Thai version is extremely good, and I think they're very funny. I think they all play off really well together, and I think the overall set of arcs that all the characters go through are really satisfying in that story.

The anime is probably my favorite. The Thai cast is just so likable. The anime cast is… not? And I think I like them more for that. We talked a lot about the Thai adaptation earlier when we had Shan on the podcast. Let's talk a little bit about anime one specifically. 

Twig, what were some of your standouts and notes you took while we were watching this?

Twig

The anime is my favorite version too, not because it's better, but because I had a little more fun with the way the characters are less perfect. Adachi in the anime… he's a little bit mean! And it's delightful. I love a mean twink, and Adachi in the anime version of Cherry Magic—he's a little sullen and a little mean, and he hates people a little bit. He's got a little bit of a misanthropy thing going on that is missing—from my taste—from the other versions of Adachi. 

My favorite moment is when he's standing on a street corner and he sees a couple canoodling, and he's. Just like, “Ugh, straight people.” [laughs] And it's like, yes! Go off.

Ben

He's always calling people normies in his head. It’s so fucking funny. [laughs]

Twig

It's like, “Fuck normies.” Like, yes, I love you! [NiNi and Twig laugh] He's also, like, a little bit less afraid to use his power for his own benefit. There's multiple times where he's like, “Oh, I'm just gonna find out what this person's thinking just because I wanna know.” And he has does moral qualms about it. I really enjoy that more morally gray character that we get in the anime.

NiNi

I have a question, actually, about the use of the different mediums and cultures. Is there anything that, for example, in the anime version, the medium of anime allows them to do that wouldn't play as well in a live action version, or vice versa even?

Ben

There's a really great example of that around the date episode. The [Thai] episode ends with Achi first having a long conversation with Jinta at their cafe, and then he goes to Karan and they have a really big heart to heart moment. That is probably the best way to do that in live action. The actors only have to build the emotions once. Today we are filming this really big emotional scene about the date, and the actors can be ready for that. 

But what I think anime allows you to do is the story can spread those scenes across multiple locations. In the anime version Adachi and Kurosawa unpack their bad date across a series of interactions, across like one or two days. A little bit at work, a little bit while they’re walking in the street, a little bit hanging out at a bar later, and then walking home.

You can do that in anime because you just can place the recordings at the settings that you want to put them in. And I prefer the way the anime handled the fallout of that bad date, but it's harder to do that in live action because it's hard to get the actors to deliver the right chemistry and mood in eight filming locations for a single overarching conversation.

Twig

I think also there is something about the medium that allows the characters to be a little bit more gray and still be lovable because everybody is in more of an extreme. If actors were trying to portray the level of intensity of emotion the anime characters do, that—it would feel very off putting. But characters are allowed to make giant faces beyond what a human can actually make in reality, [Ben laughs] and so I think it's easier to allow people to be more dislikeable and still be loved.

Ben

Twig and I really like how unlikable the anime cast is. That may seem incredibly weird, but like Rokkaku is so insufferable in the early episodes. And like, Fujisaki as a fujo is way more off-putting. Adachi is such a bitch, and then Kurosawa is intense and also aloof. I understand why Kurosawa is single in this version.

Twig

Yes, yes, exactly. [laughs]

Ben

With Karan it’s like, “Why is this man single?” And with Achi, it's like, “My body’s tofu.” Sir, you are New Thittipoom. [Ben and NiNi laugh] We are looking at them trying to pretend like you don't have these enormous fucking shoulders with the way they cut that shirt. Please. 

That gets a little bit fanciful in Cherry Magic Thailand that these guys are single, because they're both really emotionally available for the most part. Achi is just kind of shy.

Twig

Yeah. I also just really like how much more Adachi as a character makes his own decisions proactively in the anime. In the other two versions, Achi and Adachi, feel very led along by the hand by Kurosawa and Karan.

NiNi

Okay, so I think we have a hierarchy. We have a best, a favorite and an original, I think. If that's a hierarchy.

Ben

If you're asking us in a vacuum, like, what's the best one like to show someone so that they'll be impressed with the Cherry Magic story, they should watch the Thai version.

Twig

Yeah.

Ben

If you're asking us what I think my favorite expression of the story is, I really think it's the anime. I really like this version of the cast, like, I like Tsuge and Minato the most in the anime, too. I don't really wanna recommend the original Japanese live action anymore. And it's not because I think they did a bad job with that one. It's just, they made some changes to the story and ended up kind of spinning around towards the end.

Twig

One of the things I focus on about all of the adaptations is that whatever changes were made to the story, the way the characters are changed to work with that was done really well. The characters feel true in each version of the story, and they feel different in each adaptation as a result.

Ben

For those of you who don't watch a lot of anime, or for those of you who do watch anime, there are some real knocks on Cherry Magic anime. The walk animations are not great, particularly when someone's coming from the background to the foreground. Oh my God. There's a Kurosawa walking towards him moment that will haunt me for the rest of the time. [Twig laughs] 

I feel like I have to make that note because anime fans are very particular about animation and art. This is from a B-tier studio. So, be nice.

00:10:17 - Inbox: Remaking Het Romances into QL

NiNi

Let's move on to our next question that comes from happypotato48. And they write, “With all the recent news about Thai bl remakes and adaptations, it's getting me thinking if the industry is going to do remakes, why only BL, why not remake old hetero dramas or movies into QL/ GL/BL? So my question is, if you could pick one older or more recent non-queer Asian media that you wish to get remade into a QL/GL/BL, which one would you pick?”

I mean, I have my clear answers.

Ben

I really want you to go first because you are far more familiar with het romance than I am.

NiNi

My number one answer to this kind of question is always going to be Twenty-Five Twenty-One, because as far as I'm concerned, Twenty-Five Twenty-One is already a GL, they just got confused about what it was supposed to be. Twenty-Five Twenty-One is a Korean sports drama about fencers, and it has one of the greatest female/female relationships, supposedly a friendship, but I'm sorry, this was a romance to me. As far as I'm concerned, these two girls fell in love and it made me completely hungry for sports GL. That hunger that has not yet been appropriately fulfilled.

My other answer, which is an interesting one ‘cause I've been trying to get Ben to watch this. It's My Country: The New Age, fantastic historical kdrama about the birth of the Joseon era. Very warriors’ bond. And yeah, I would make that BL. I think it would work really, really well. 

What about you Twig? Where’s your head at with this question?

Twig

All right, so I had one immediately come to mind because I'm still mad that it wasn't queer to begin with. It felt like it was supposed to be. Nana. Nana is a Japanese manga, I think they even did a live action. It's about these two women who are both named Nana moving into an apartment together, and they are so queer and the underlying theme of the show is so queer. Everybody in that show is so queer. And then they made them straight, and I'm still mad about it. I'm like, “You were wrong. You're just wrong about who these characters are and who they're in love with.” That one absolutely needs to be made into a GL, please and thank you. Also the aesthetic would make me very happy. [laughs] So I just want to see it. 

The other one that came to mind is partially because I'm watching it now, but Hospital Playlist. It’s right there. It would be so easy to remake as a BL.

NiNi

Who would you put together?

Twig

Oh don't, don't put me on the spot. [laughs]

NiNi

Come on. I'm putting you on the spot. Who would you put together?

Twig

Who would you choose?

NiNi

Ik Jun and Jun Wan, I would absolutely make them a couple. I think they're fantastic. Not that I don't love Hospital Playlist exactly as it is, but if there had been an Ik Jun/Jun Wan romance, I would have also loved that. 

What about you, Ben? Where do you sit with this?

Ben

This one is always a difficult question for me because the reason I'm watching Asian drama is for queer reasons. So like, I don't go out of my way to watch a bunch of that stuff. So unfortunately I do not have a het drama that I would like to see redone as a BL. The ones I've seen were basically BL already, like Coffee Prince is clear. It does not need to be remade to be more BL. And I don't actually think that Goblin would be better if it was a BL. I think it works as it is, and I don't really want to change that. 

So I'm going to cheat. I'm not using an Asian drama for this. I want to see a gay version of Really Love. Which is like this generation’s Love Jones.

NiNi

This generation has a Love Jones?

Ben

It's really fucking good.

NiNi

Am I gonna have to watch this?

Ben

You really should. You need to go write this down and go watch it. These two people who are vibing at, like, maybe not the right time in their lives and the success that they're starting to get professionally and creatively is getting in the way of their ability to have the romance that is really important to them. 

I think about that film at least once a month. I'd like to see a gay version of that.

NiNi

I have made a note, dear friend.

Ben

And it's about black people. So you should watch it.

NiNi

Always a win.

Ben

One of the reasons why I have really taken to Asian dramas is the west—particularly Americans—really fucking hate romance and I really like how earnestly—particularly Korean dramas—engage with romance. I think it's what makes BL possible. There's a real appreciation for romance itself in this part of the world. 

I wish I had a better answer for this one, because I think it's a fun question.

NiNi

That's gonna wrap us up on the questions this season. Thank you guys so much. We always love hearing from our listeners. Please, don't be a lurker, don't be shy. Please send us questions. We love them so much.

00:16:04 - Catch Up Corner: Young Royals Season 3

NiNi 

So before we get into the things that I actually watched, like way, way behind the curve, like two years behind the curve, let's get into some of the stuff that we actually caught up on this season that was, I suppose, current. There's two things that we had been waiting for. The first one was the third season of Young Royals and the second was finally being able to watch Man Suang. 

Let's talk a little bit about Young Royals 3. I watched the whole thing. Ben still has not finished it. Ben, what did you think of the parts of Young Royals 3 that you have watched so far? How far have you gotten into it? Are you planning to finish it? And what do you think of it? 

Ben 

I got to Simon is grounded, Wille can't really leave the school now because of the curfew. I think that's as far as I got. I'll say this much: I like that this show seems to take the reality of dating a public figure seriously. I like that Simon is struggling with being online because you can't not be online in the modern age, and he is not given any real training for how to deal with it. Wille is given no fucking training either, he's like, “I'll handle it.” Really? Y’all let this impulsive boy who punches people whenever he gets mad and then just says whatever on national TV, he's in charge of teaching him on how to engage with social media? Okay, sure. Whatever. 

But I'm enjoying the struggle they're having with being public. It's different when your whole relationship has been kind of closeted and now you're suddenly out. You have to get used to what that means, and maybe this isn't exactly what you wanted. I like where it feels like the show is going on the front end, but because I know there's a lot of angst ahead for them and I haven’t been in a very high energy mood for a bit to deal with that, I have not been in a hurry to continue it. 

NiNi 

Though we, the show has presented this thing about being in a relationship with a public figure, for me, tying that back to some of the Asian BL that I've seen, I always go back to the Lovely Writer well. Having these stories in the western context is always really interesting. Interesting in the sense of, I haven't seen something like this be done in the queer western space, but also in the fact that I've seen these stories now. I've seen them in the Asian space and so they feel familiar enough that I don't feel like they’re anything new or exciting, necessarily. 

Did I enjoy Young Royals 3? I really did. But in terms of the Simon and Wille stuff, I like them. I enjoy their romance, I always have. But I felt a little bit like it had been done. And that's because I've been seeing these stories play out in Asian media for a while at this point. I thought that they did a great job writing it. I thought that it was fantastically acted. There's a sequence when Wille and Simon go swimming in the lake at sunrise that I think is definitely worth watching the entire season for, but, I feel like it's been done. 

Ben 

I will say on the way out from Young Royals that I want to applaud Omar Rudberg and Edvin Ryding for the execution of BGP over the last three or four years that they've been working together. I think those two have done a great job of managing the public version of their friendship and the professional requirements therein. They seem to have a really good handle on it, and it seems like their team did a really great job preparing them for all of this. They seem surprisingly chill for people who have gone through the BGP gauntlet.

NiNi 

It has been some gauntlet and Edvin is a young actor in his first major role. I am very impressed with how he's handled himself. 

Ben 

It's just not one of the shows that I am most excited to watch, and some of that is me being kind of grumpy politically. When we're trying to advocate for non-English language media people seemingly struggle with having to read subtitles and don't wanna watch foreign content as a result. But had no problem showing up for this show. There's a wider conversation to have about how fandom will do anything for a white man, even read subtitles. 

NiNi 

Say it. 

Ben 

It's frustrating. I feel like I'm pettily not finishing Young Royals because I don't enjoy how people who say they want more queer stories have ignored BL and then bitched that there's no great queer stories and they watch Young Royals and they're like, “Oh my goodness, I've never seen anything like this.”

I will finish Young Royals. But I am frustrated with the Western audience rushing to watch this show, and then snubbing anything Asian immediately afterwards. 

00:21:23 - Catch Up Corner: Man Suang

NiNi 

The next thing we're gonna talk about a little bit is Man Suang. This is finally, finally been made available to those of us in the West and in an English language subtitle version. 

I really enjoyed this—this is not gay. Or to be more clear, it is not obviously gay. But I thought this was a really interesting piece from Be On Cloud. 

Ben 

I did not watch this. I need you to tell me like, what is going on in Man Suang? Like, what's the drama here? [NiNi laughs] What is even the story they're telling? 

NiNi 

Oh, I get to summarize something. Okay, bear with me. 

Man Suang is a story about Khem, played by Apo Nattawin. When Khem is a dancer and after he dances, he basically gets called back by these various men, women, it doesn't matter, to come to their rooms and perform sexually for them. At the beginning of the film, some assassin sneaks into where they are and kills the guy that he's with, who is a very important guy. He tries to save him and can't, and he's then caught and arrested because of course it's assumed that he is the one who tried to assassinate this guy. And so to save his own life, he agrees to go undercover at this very fancy club called Man Suang. He gets a job there as a dancer and he meets this Chinese-Thai guy called Chatra, who is played by Mile Phakphum. It eventually becomes known to him that he and Chatra are basically on the same side, spying at this club, so they form an alliance and a friendship and possibly something more. But whatever more is happening is sort of subsumed by his trauma. 

Basically, it is a spy story. This feels about mid- to late-1800s in Old Siam. There's a lot of Chinese migration, that integral part of the story. Bas plays Khem’s friend, Wan, who is sent to Man Suang with him to join in the spy mission. Tong plays Hong, who is part of the family who owns Man Suang. They don't know whose side he's on. There's a lot of intrigue. There's a lot of drama, there's a lot of very familiar faces. 

I don't know how to describe the movie other than to say it is intriguing. It is gorgeous. I am not entirely sure the story holds together all the way. My understanding as well, which, I don't know if this is correct, its that the version that we have gotten on Netflix is an edited version. It certainly feels that way. I feel like there are bits of the story that are missing that we are expected to fill in. But the acting is fantastic and particularly as we get down to the climax of the story, there is some phenomenal acting from Bas and Tong. 

I have explained this terribly. When I edit this down it is going to be explained even more terribly. I wish that you had watched this so that you could explain it properly for our listeners. What I will say is that it's a gorgeous piece of cinema. It's beautiful to watch. Everybody is operating at a very high level in terms of the acting. It's a good film, it's not a great film. 

Ben 

I'll probably watch it at some point. 

00:25:12 - Catch Up Corner: DNA Says Love You

NiNi 

Our final catch up is, I finally watched DNA Says Love You! Ben, I'm gonna let you remind the listeners of what DNA Says Love You is about.

Ben 

DNA Says Love You is about this group of friends who are, it feels like late college kids, who are trying to make their little ghost hunting YouTube channel function. The guy and his friend had this other friend when they were growing up, who ended up leaving and they've missed her for a long time. This new guy shows up mysteriously and seems to be connected to her. And you spend most of the show wondering what sort of mystery may be going on here. Is there something spooky going on? Is this a trans story? We're not entirely certain what's happening there. 

When we finally get confirmation about what's going on, the reveals are really great and there's a really interesting execution of a… unexpected queer romance here. I'm gonna continue to talk around the reveals around Amber, because while I don't subscribe to spoiler culture, I do think the presumptions you bring to the table are part of the experience of this particular show, and I don't like revealing the full truth about Amber when I describe it to people who may not have seen it. 

NiNi 

Yeah, I think that's the right instinct. The first time we talked about the show, I remember you describing the show and thinking to myself. Okay, well, from that description I know what this is about. And then I go into the show and actually, no, I didn't know what it was about. I think that that experience is the right experience to have with this show. I think allowing the show to take you on the journey is the only way really to watch it? So I also will not be spoiling the show. 

We're gonna continue to talk around what it is, but I do want to say, having watched it now, I am going to echo Ben's praise of Erek Lin, who plays Amber. I think that Erek Lin did an incredible job with this character. I enjoyed the story. I love that this is a story about friendship more than anything else, and about what it is to be a friend and what it means to carry somebody in your heart for a really long time. 

I thoroughly enjoyed this. Is it perfect? No. There are a few things that I wish that the show had done—not differently, but probably given some more time and attention to. And then there's some side characters who I found fun and interesting, but I was a little confused about how they fit overall into the story. 

Ben 

I don't think the connective tissue with all of the romance bits going on was necessarily great in this. But I did appreciate the established gay couple sides who are dealing with a potential separation in their future. There's a whole thing of, like, growing pains and growing up in their story that I really connected to. 

NiNi 

Fair enough, but I wasn't entirely sure how they fit into the story thematically, or really, to be honest, narratively. They seemed to be sort of off to the side in their own little story. But yeah, overall, really good show. If I were in the business of recommending things, I absolutely would recommend it. 

Ben 

You have been recommending things with me for over two years now. Highly recommended, go watch it! 

This show is about a queer experience that very rarely gets depicted in any kind of media. This is worth watching. 

NiNi 

Well said, sir. Well said. 

00:29:23 - Twig’s Dispatch

Ben 

We are going to introduce a new segment to the lagniappe of The Conversation, Twig’s Dispatch. We wanted to make sure we gave airtime to all of the shows that we choose either not to discuss on the show or we didn't think warranted a very long conversation. 

NiNi 

The point of the segment is for Twig to just do a round up of what's out there that we may not have seen, may not have wanted to watch, may not have been able to put effort into at the time to get a sense of the landscape and also for Twig to point out, hey, maybe you should watch this one. 

Ben 

So Twig, why don't you run us down your list of shows? 

Twig 

Dispatch! Hey-o! 

So I've got 12 pieces of media that weren't on the list of stuff you've discussed in the season. My Universe it's on iQIYI, 12 two-part episodes that are only very lightly linked together. It felt like a series of school projects. There was a body swap, mistaken identity, in love with your sibling’s friend, destined lovers, enemies to lovers, love Triangle, a coach and an athlete, fake dating turns real, a twincest episode—it did walk a fine line, it made me very uncomfortable—age gap, paid companionship, and terminal illness. If you love one of those tropes, you can just watch that one miniseries associated with that trope, I guess. 

There was a lot of not very well handled difficult subjects in these, so if you have any need for warnings, I would check for the warnings about the episodes you might wanna watch. If you're curious and wanna try one of them, my favorite one was Right Time, Right You, the destined lovers one, episodes five six. It's a little bit lighter than some of the other ones and has some of the better acting. There's also three or four different directors who, you can try out a bunch of different creators and see how you feel about them, which is kind of fun from a viewer perspective. 

Night Dream is actually one of the ones that I like more. It's a second chance romance. I think it's on YouTube, childhood friends, Night and Dream. meet again after Dream had disappeared from Night's life for years and fall back into this sort of will they, won't they that comes from being closeted. This is one of the ones that I liked because it felt a little more queer and they did some interesting things with flashbacks, so we got a mid-series reveal that I thought was actually pretty well done. If you have time and you're open to a slightly more queer feeling story, it's worth giving a shot. 

Going in with low expectations is a good idea, but it's not a terrible waste of your time. 

NiNi 

Bake Me?

Twig 

The actual show was last season, but the special episode landed this season. My biggest complaint about this show was there wasn't enough baking. It was a really frustrating plot. Special episodes, you just have to have something to give people a chance to be with those characters again and see them be cute, really. Right? But they didn't take that route. 

For Shin’s birthday Peach ignores him for days, so that Shin thinks that Peach is gonna leave him, so that he could surprise Shin on his birthday as like the worst birthday gift ever. I [laughs] was not into it. I don't love a big lie as a plot device for a relationship. 

Ben 

VIP Only? 

Twig 

My biggest note about this show was Liu Li coming into his own, being self assured and exercising his own agency and figuring himself out was actually great, but it came way too late. He was so much more interesting as a character when he actually took control of his life, but he was just so passive for so many episodes. What I love about it was he lets go of what he thought love was, that juvenile understanding of what love looks like, to realize what love really is. I thought that was a really cool arc and I was really sad that it wasn't treated better. 

Love Senior the Series. Oh, I had such high hopes for this one, guys. It is essentially the lesbian version of SOTUS. It's a hazing ritual that happens with engineering. The first seven episodes were so great, we got lesbians who were thirsty for each other and they were actually more successful than their gay male counterparts in overturning the systems. We got a character who had casual sex, and it's fine. Yes, anti-purity culture! And then episode 8 happened and someone got drugged, there was slut shaming, there was a car accident, there was amnesia, and then noble idiocy—literally every one of my least favorite tropes. I guess they felt like they needed to have more for their characters to do, but I was, like, really enjoying them just being lesbians and horny for each other. Like, what was wrong with that?

Ben 

Anyway, what is You and My Stars? 

Twig 

That was just a little micro series of two episodes by Mind Trio. They're like a little indie BL-producing YouTube channel that I like to follow. They did my favorite show that no one heard of, Calculating Love. It's not actually that good, but it makes me happy. [laughs]

This one is a little love triangle—I think it's like 25 minutes total—and it's one of the better ones on this list for sure. There's two friends, Hunter and Win. And Win likes this guy Time, but he finds out that Time likes Hunter and so Win tries to help Time to woo Hunter, but Hunter steps away and then we find out who Hunter likes. But I will not spoil it. It's cute. There's some star folding, hence the name. 

After Sundown: essentially, they took the plot of Cutie Pie, but added ghosts, which sounds like it should be really fun. And so it was really disappointing how boring this movie was. [laughs] A poor kid comes to a large estate and is betrothed to a rich guy who's been cursed because his grandfather was gay. That's the summary. That should be really interesting! It was not. I was so bored. 

NiNi

Twins the Series.

Twig

Of all the sports to get wrong in a gay series. How dare you? So these twins, Zee and Sprite, Zee plays volleyball, Sprite does judo. Zee gets beaten up by guys who were looking for his twin Sprite, so Sprite feels guilty and takes Zee’s place on the volleyball team to make sure that Zee can still qualify to compete for the national team later that year. He has to integrate with the team in order to hide the fact that he's not Zee, but he's first of all really bad at pretending to be his twin, and also it takes until I think it was, like, episode 8 before he actually got volleyball lessons from anyone? I was like, what are you doing? He's pretending to be one of the top athletes in a sport that he doesn't know how to play, and nobody notices for the entire series. I was aghast. 

Sprite, the one pretending to be the volleyball player, falls for a teammate named First who hates Zee, the twin who he's pretending to be. The Big Lie went on for way too long. It doesn't get revealed till the very end. And First does not get to be angry about it for nearly long enough for my taste. The leads did have mad chemistry, and Ryan's waist is fantastic, so you know who, kudos to them for working with what they got. 

Do we talk about For Him? What I kind of wanna say about For Him is: pay your actors, and we'll talk about your show. Give Tor Atagorn another show. That was my takeaway from that show. 

NiNi 

Happy Ending. 

Twig 

My favorite thing about this is all of the lore, because everybody went into it going, “Oh, it's Strongberry, it's going to be good” and then it wasn't. And then Strongberry came out and was like, “It wasn't really us, we distributed it.” I mean, the director said outright, “I wanted to make a sad short with an ambiguous ending.” and that's what we got, and I think now he's realizing that maybe wasn't the best goal. 

NiNi 

Bringing things forward that people may not have heard about, there is a BL that came out from Myanmar called Healing Thingyan. 

Twig 

This is a little YouTube miniseries. It takes place as friends celebrate the Thingyan Festival over a period of a few different years. It's short, it's cute, it's free, and it's the only show from Myanmar that I've seen where nobody died. So [laughs] already it's crossing over the bar into things that I'm happier to send support to. 

One of the things that I feel like has to be said about anything coming out of Myanmar is the political situation. As long as it wasn't really bad, I was going to tell people to watch it because I wanna encourage views on shows where people are struggling against the political climate they're in in order to be able to show this kind of content. This show had to pass a censorship board to be made, so don't expect a kiss, but they're surprisingly cute for what they're allowed to make and in a country where the penalties are severe for making things that could be seen as encouraging quote unquote of queerness, I feel really strongly about sending views towards this thing. 

Support local Burmese shows. Give it a shot. Give Myanmar some love. 

NiNi 

That's our first ever Twig’s dispatch. Thanks for being here with us, Twig. 

Twig 

Thanks for having me again. 

00:38:35 - Winter Round Up

NiNi 

Always a fun time having Twig on the show, new friend of the pod. I like that we're building up this stable of friends of the pod. I like hearing the voices of BL fandom on our show. It's great fun. 

Ben 

It's also like inviting friends over to your house, like it's different when you're just hanging out and doing stuff. But every time your friends come over, you have to clean up and shit. [Ben and NiNi laugh] There's a lot more extra effort on the front and back end now. 

NiNi 

Let's talk about the season as was. Ben, I know you have some complex, complicated, mixed moody kinds of thoughts about how this season went. 

Ben 

It's tough. The most obvious thing from our release schedule that stands out this season is this is, I think, the first time Japan has outnumbered Thailand in our number of shows we talked about—oh, wait, nevermind. They caught up because of Twig. 

[Ben and NiNi laugh]

NiNi 

In terms of long form discussion, we talk more about the Japanese this season. That is true. 

Ben 

This is the most we've talked about Japanese content on this podcast since we started, which is a real win for me because that's what I enjoy the most. But it's also a reflection of what's going on. Thailand is still out-producing everyone, but it's less about countries now and more about production teams and studios. We managed to have a really great conversation around Cherry Magic and Cooking Crush about what longevity looks like in BL. Now that there are more players actively engaged in the genre, it's not just us talking about 8 to 10 Thai BLs, the one or two Japanese shows that got released, the maybe Korean project that got released, the maybe Taiwanese project that got released. There's a whole lot more people playing in the space now. 

My own life responsibilities have forced me to cut back on being present for every BL. The gap between a show I really am enjoying and engaged with and a show I'm not but I’m trying to stick with is a lot further than it's ever been, and I find it a lot harder to cross that gap. I'm relieved that we have more friends now because I can ask people what's going on. That's been the big shift for me. Being more cognizant of my own time and how I'm investing myself emotionally in the shows. I don't like showing up grumpy to productions. I don't really like being in a foul mood when I'm watching shows. I don't think that's fair to the shows and I don't think that's good for me emotionally either. 

NiNi 

This is generally where I've been overall, but that's just a function of my life right now. I've been so busy, even this season, I tried to watch as much as possible, but they are definitely things that just did not happen. And going forward they're going to be shows that I don't watch. Ben'll tell you my standard comment now when a new show comes up is, y'all tell me whether I need to watch this. There's some stuff that I'm definitely gonna be watching. That's not a quality bar, trust me, because there is some trash that I fully intend to watch [cough sound] cough We Are. 

But [laughs] yeah, my thing is, as Shan said in the year in review, reclaiming my time a little bit. I don't have the time that I did have and the time that I am spending to do this stuff, I want it to be time that I enjoy. Watching stuff with my friends, talking about that stuff that I enjoyed or at least was bad in an interesting way with my friends, that's what I'm gonna be focused on, not on getting volume. So it's really now question of y'all tell me what I need to watch because you really wanna discuss it, and that's actually in a lot of ways working out really well for us, I think.

So, I'm good to keep that going. I also like us having more friends to have these discussions with now. Ben and I agreed from the beginning that if this stopped being fun, we're gonna stop doing it. We're definitely still having fun with this, but we're having fun in different ways now than we did when we started, and this show is always gonna evolve along those lines. Whatever is fun for us now is what we're gonna be doing. So you would have heard a couple of really fun segments this season. 

One segment that we're not sure is going to keep going is the Catch Up Corner. Going forward, we don't know how much catch up there's gonna be in this show cause we just, we don't really have time to catch up on everything. 

Ben 

All I caught up on this season was two long ass Chinese dramas. [laughs]

NiNi 

Ginny and Shan have gotten Ben into the cdrama space, which is a space, I'm sorry, they're too long. I can't do it. [laughs]

Ben 

Nah nah, NiNi. All of these shows should be longer, 40 episodes, 58 episodes—

NiNi 

Oh my God.

Ben

68 episodes!

NiNi 

I can't do it. I can't do it. I can't do it. 

Ben 

Every single show should go on for half a year, multiple times a week. We should end in the middle of a sentence. 

NiNi 

[laughs] You're terrible. You're really, truly terrible. 

Ben 

In terms of catching up on BL, it isn't our style to show up super duper late to the fandom experience and talk over it. We don't wanna be those people. And so if we didn't engage with a show during the season, we probably won't have an extensive conversation about it. We're probably going to rely on the fact that we have friends now to highlight those shows if we didn't show up for them for whatever reason. So that we get a conversation around the time it released. But if something pops up, like, what happened recently for NiNi when we finally got her to watch something, we’ll try to bring it to you and give you some reactions. 

00:44:45 - Girl, You Tried

NiNi 

Girl, You Tried. Who are our contenders this season? 

Ben 

[funny voice] Oh my God. This is probably the most difficult Girl, You Tried we've ever had because things were either bad and it's like, “Oh, absolutely not.” And then there are things that are like, “What was she even doing?” So I think legit contenders for Girl, You Tried: Chaser Game W, The Sign?

NiNi 

I think it's those two. 

Ben 

Yeah, I was gonna say, I wanna kind of put Sukidoya there, but that feels mean. 

NiNi 

No, I think Sukidoya was better than that. 

Ben 

Exactly. That's the constant problem this season. There are things that didn't necessarily land exactly but they didn't really fail, or there were things that were just like, “Oh, absolutely not. We're not giving you an award for that.” [Ben and NiNi laugh]

I think it's really Chaser Game W and The Sign. 

NiNi 

So between those two, if I had to pick. 

Ben 

You do. That's the bit! 

NiNi 

[laughs] I think The Sign tried harder than Chaser Game W. So for me it's The Sign. 

What do you think? 

Ben 

It is The Sign because Saint really did try. There's a lot of effort that went into The Sign. While we have some real consternation with it as a piece of copaganda, and as a maybe too-watered-down adaptation of its source material and kind of confusing plot threads, I think there's a lot of real effort that went into that. I think the performances are really earnest. It's not a half-assed production in any way. While it doesn't land exactly for me, I think it is probably the best Girl, You Tried [laughs] show we have. 

NiNi 

Going back to the original intent of Girl, You Tried, it was really for something with a good concept, but problematic execution. I think The Sign fits into that. I think that they had the right ideas. I think that maybe they got in the weeds and did not know how to get back out. 

So, dubious congratulations to IdolFactory!

Ben 

I don't want you all to feel bad about Girl, You Tried. I think there's a lot of great stuff in your show. I think the efforts that went into CGI work are really noteworthy. There's technical gains there that are gonna be really beneficial for the Thai media landscape, even well beyond BL. I really thank them for introducing Babe Tanatat to us, because I really like him! [laughs]

NiNi 

And will cosign on Gap Jakarin. I am a fan. 

Ben 

We got to see Yoshi again! I haven't seen Yoshi properly since, like, Love Sick. 

NiNi 

It is the Girl Who Tried. 

00:47:35 - Look Ahead

NiNi 

Let's look ahead to the future. Give me one thing you're looking forward to this season or something that you're watching now that you're looking forward to talkin’ about. 

Ben 

I'm really, really looking forward to talking about Love is Better the Second Time Around. We just finished episode four of six as of this recording and it's still going very strong. I'm excited to talk about Unknown. I'm only two episodes in and it is really intriguing. I'm having a good time with that one, I'm looking forward to discussing that. I am hoping that 23.5 is a really good discussion for us. I would really like to have a positive conversation about Thai GL. I really want Milk and Love’s show to be really good. I love them both a lot, and it's really important to me that the show go over really well. 

NiNi 

My disaster loser lesbian love Ongsa. I want to say so much about what Milk is bringing to this role, so I am also [Ben laughs] looking forward to talking about 23.5. One of the things that I like about it so far is that it does not feel like flipped BL. It feels like a GL. It feels very specific to a lesbian experience and I am excited by that. 

I can't say I'm looking forward to, but I'm gonna watch We Are. I just am. Ben’s on my case already, I'm on Ben’s case already. We both have feelings about New Siwaj, opposite direction feelings. We're both gonna be watching this grumpily, but for different reasons. 

Ben 

I just don't really know what's gonna happen in this. It's gonna be 16 episodes of people vibing. We already went through this with the fuckin’ Star in My Mind Our Skyy episode. 

NiNi 

But you see the difference is that unlike things like Star in My Mind and Hidden Agenda, we are being told upfront that this show is about nothing. 

Ben 

Well, I'm glad you're looking forward to four months of nothing. 

NiNi 

We've already established that right now I'm in a very busy time of my life, so something I can watch mindlessly and enjoy the pretty, I will jump on. I mean, Phuwin’s here? Everybody loves Phuwin. 

Ben 

That's not how I'm built! [Ben and NiNi laugh]

NiNi 

For me this is really simple. Phuwin is here. We love Phuwin. I am looking forward to seeing what Winny and Satang give. I am very interested in seeing AouBoom. I grew to love Boom through the mess that was Hidden Agenda and I am looking forward to seeing what he brings to the table here. There isn't much of a table but they are going to lay it as best as they can. 

I am also looking forward to watching Unknown and Love is Better the Second Time Around. Looking forward to catching up with those once they're complete. 

Ben 

I'm excited for Living With Him. We've got an interesting one from Korea called Gray Shelter. We've got a meta one coming from Japan called At 25:00 in Akasaka, which is about two guys preparing to film a BL and complicated feelings coming in. 

Up Poompat is going to be back with us again in My Stand In. He's gonna be playing across Poom. That one looks like it's gonna be messy as hell, and I think Up is well suited for that kind of messy. 

There is another Korean one on the horizon called Boys Be Brave, and A Man Who Defies the World of BL 3 is supposed to release [laughs] sometime in April. I'm excited to see Inukai again. I'm excited to see Yutaro again. I'm excited to see Idegami Baku again. Very, very happy about this. 

NiNi 

I'm excited to catch up actually with Zettai BL. I have been meaning to watch that for years, so I might take advantage of this opportunity. 

So that's what we're looking forward to coming up. Going forward, we're going to be switching things up a little bit in terms of our schedule of when things come out. We're still going to be seasonal, but probably on a more extended schedule, bring us a little bit closer to real time. So look out for announcements from us, but for now that's going to wrap us up on the lagniappe and going to wrap us up on the spring season. 

We out! Say bye to the people, Ben. 

Ben 

Peace. 

[waitmyturtles]

Friends, family! Some updates and questions on the Old GMMTV Challenge -- if anyone catches this post, I would love your input! (AND THANK YOU for all the input on this watch journey so far, I LOVE YOU, FAM!)

1) Love Sick. Oh my gosh, I am TOTALLY enjoying this show. Yes, lots of problems, LOTS of issues, and I get to enjoy the BL cuts, so I’m missing all the messy het context (thank GAWD). 

But seriously -- oh my god, oh my god. Noh and Phun are like, a canon Thai BL couple? They’re SO PERFECT FOR THE JOB. It’s so amazing, they’re so amazing. Noh is so insane and WISE. Phun is SO CRAZY IN LUV. I love that Phun just CANNOT HOLD BACK! THOSE EYES! (This guy is my TUL?! TUL?!)

So watching Love Sick now makes me regret, by quite a lot, not watching these shows chronologically. I think it would have helped me a lot to watch Love Sick before SOTUS, but alas, I let my curiosity about Singto get the best of me. More on this in a second.

2) @absolutebl, @clairificusrex, @nieves-de-sugui, and anyone else who wants to chime in! Question for y’all: I found this playlist on YouTube for BL cuts of Love Sick season 2. Do these edits look reliable to you? I unfortunately have to multitask at all times when I’m watching dramas, so I can’t fast-forward -- I think I might need to rely on this playlist to finish out LS2. Gah. I hope these work for the task at hand!

3) Okay, chronology. I would love advice, thoughts, feedback on the following questions! (I’m sorry I’m asking all these questions, btw: I have a huge trip coming up, and may run into rights issues where I’m going, so I want to get a good watch plan solidified before I leave. Because... I’m a list person, oh god.)

Like I said, I think I messed myself up by watching SOTUS before Love Sick. I think it would have really helped me to understand SOTUS even more if I had watching LS first, to catch on some tropes that were clearly borne out of LS.

@absolutebl recommended, as the third drama of the OGMMTVC, 2gether. But, in a separate comment thread, @shortpplfedup also mentioned that Love Sick and Make It Right kind go together (@shortpplfedup, let me know if I’m stating this reliably) as two of the early high school pulp BLs. 

I don’t know if Make It Right is as referenced, trope- or script-wise, as an early BL as Love Sick or SOTUS. But it does have Ohm Pawat, who is one of the actors I permanently rabbithole, and I do really appreciate watching Love Sick now to see all the high school tropes being built. 

So I’m wondering: for chronology’s sake, would it make sense to watch Make It Right/MIR2 next, after Love Sick, if this is a side-path I want to take to learn about canon regarding high school settings? 

Or... is Make It Right not worth it? I know @absolutebl has said before that the heat of MIR may be wiggly for the youth of the actors. I’d love input! If MIR gives by way of education, I may want to dig into it while I’m on the road.

4) And then after that, closing out the OGMMTVC would be 2gether. However!

a) My other side commitment is to understand Aof’s oeuvre. And He’s Coming to Me and Dark Blue Kiss both aired BEFORE 2gether. So I’m kinda wondering if I should watch those first, before 2gether.

b) And then there’s his involvement with the 2gether franchise, which -- I had no idea about until I perused MDL. And I’m totally not quite following what all the sequels mean and maybe, why he got involved in the franchise?

Was 2gether so bad, in a way, that Aof and Fon Kannitha had to come in and, like, rescue the franchise for Still 2gether and 2gether: The Movie?

And, what the heck is this MDL description of the movie? Is it, like... a summary of the two previous series?

(Is all of this messy-mess indicative of why 2gether landed on the OGMMTVC list? Ha.)

I’m a little confused by what the whole deal is with 2gether, and if the sequels are worth watching. For me, the priority would be to watch Aof’s work as it progresses over time, which makes me think I should interrupt the OGMMTVC to watch He’s Coming To Me and Dark Blue Kiss first. Because, again, I’m wondering if he or GMMTV felt that he needed to come in and, like, save the 2gether franchise. When I was digging into all of this in MDL, I was totally surprised to see his name there.

Whew. I know this was a lot, but I appreciate ANY crumbs from the experts. (2gether, on paper, looks like a hot mess, but I know BrightWin are beloved, so...what’s up with that, ha.) If anyone’s reading and commenting this -- thanks, y’all, in advance, for your input!

[bengiyo]

Love in Translation Ep 1 Stray Thoughts

This looked like pretty standard fare I would check out on principle and I was curious to see Offroad again since I thought he was the best performer in Our Days, but Ngern Anupart is in this and that is the only thing I care about. OGs understand.

NGERN!!!! WELCOME HOME, KING!!

Very different character. Almost didn't recognize Offroad.

We have a named Black character in a Thai BL. That's our one for the year, so I hope he's a good character.

Truly incredible how the leads are getting even more attractive in these shows. I am not immune.

Ngern's character is in a secret romance with his brother's best friend!! I am seated!!!

I do like a language-based misunderstanding, given the premise.

This is a comedy of errors and I am amused.

Very believable that two guys could reasonably watch the CCTV footage after a scuffle to see who was right.

Okay, Yang getting Puzai auto-blocked by his favorite idol is petty.

Of course Puzai has to run back to Yang for this silly reason of appealing to his idol.

Goddamn this man would have waited until he was away from Yang before throwing his business card away.

Well, things are hard for Yang right now. Thankfully, today's beverage sponsor can fix him right up.

Antoine only having chocolate syrup to put on bread and only black coffee better not be a joke 🤣

It was part of a bread sponsorship!!

This show is genuinely funny.

I really like the way this next meeting between our leads is going to happen via Odo. This doesn't feel forced even if it is contrived.

He's just gonna have a business. Just like that. Amazing.

This bit of them singing a best friend chant before smash cutting to Puzai (sounds like they're saying Pojo) alone is so funny.

Yes, let them stumble into each other again and have a pleasant exchange when they don't know they're speaking to their fast enemy. I love this.

Yes, Odo. Leave during this critical moment. You might say something reasonable that undercuts the comedy.

They're having a food fight. Oh my god

I also like that desperation is going to be a thing that keeps them together. How fascinating. Normally these shows rely on school to force people together. This path is new.

These two leaning on the anonymous encouragement they gave each other as they glare at each other... Who wrote this?... The screenwriting team is new, but they're funny!

Okay, if Puzai's assessment of these three people is accurate, these seem like solid choices at first blush. It also adds two femmes to the cast. That's encouraging!

Next week: Hopefully not misappropriation of Tammy's likeness and some classic BL moments maybe?

Holy shit this was an incredibly fun first episode! I think we really need to revisit the way we use the term "BL pulp" around here because the varying levels of production and quality are so variable now. This is the most I've genuinely laughed at a BL in a long time, and I really like the silliness of the contrivances that brought this premise together. It's just believable enough for me not to roll my eyes and have a good time. Also NGERN!!! I am looking forward to reporting back next week!

[yourstormthlaylirahh]

A bit late for this because I took the app off my phone for a while and missed the event (I was going to make a bingo this year but oh well) but here are my reactions to the 2024 gmmtv trailers, from most to least anticipated.

On Sale: I have liked every ghost themed drama I have ever watched. I adore Jan. I think while this appears very silly and over the top, it has the potential to have very poignant moments, and I'm holding out for some class commentary through News character 🤞

Pluto's Love: Namtan! Film! Sapphic! Drama! I am very excited! Some hesitancy is felt because I'm always anxious about the treatment of disability in media, so I hope it's not patronizing or disrespectful to the blind community. 🤞

Ploys Yearbook: finally another female led drama. I have high hopes for this, even if it seems like it's retreading plots from other recent gmmtv dramas such as Warp Effect

Kidnap: the plot looks relatively fresh and dramatic. It seems up my alley. Ohm seems to be typecast now.

My Golden Blood: I am really excited for this, corny as it looks and all. A genre romance with Neo and Mond in evil roles, plus a plot pulled straight out of a pulp romance? Sign me up

My Love Mix Up: I'm a little torn on this one, but more positive than negative. I really love Kieta Hatsukoi, and I'm not sure the type of over the top humour and acting from Aoki will translate very well into a thai series. That being said, both Gemini and Fourth are very talented young actors and I think even if not as iconic as the original, their performances will still be enjoyable and heartfelt.

Ossans Love Thailand: another remake? And then another Japanese series but it's a sequel to the thai remake? I'm confused, I think I misunderstood something. I do however have a strong bias towards seeing Earth and Mix together on my screen, I think they act very well together. I also really loved Au Kornprom's directing for MSP

Enigma 2: I guess I need to get my ass moving and watch the first one. The trailer was very artsy

Wandee Gooday: I'm not super interested in the plot based on what we got in the trailer, but I screamed twice, once when I saw Drake and once when I saw Ploy. I love both actors, and I had thought Drake had quit to pursue acting in America so I was pleasantly surprised. I know In Sarin can act well because of Miracle of Teddy Bear (which you all missed out on and should have watched, it was excellent). Also, the scene at the end when he has to stop sex cause he got a cramp from holding his leg up was genuinely funny and relatable. Golf directing is a bonus.

Summer Night: I am a bit letdown, because I initially thought they were breaking up the CPs to put Dunk and Phuwin together in a bl and that would open up so many storytelling avenues for them and other actors, but that seems not to be the case. Regardless, this looks cute and fluffy and I am tentatively interested.

High School Frenemy: it wouldnt be a gmm line up without a homoerotic tale about 2 enemies in some sort of dark school setting. The trailer doesn't give one much to go on, it's a lot of very repetitive fighting scenes. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for the female characters to get some good scenes which showcase their acting abilities as well as the male characters.

Only Boo: let the record show 'boo' is the most annoying form of endearment in English, why did they translate it this way? The main character is pretty annoying, but to me the trailer got more interesting as it went on, so it should be fun at any rate, and Louis and Book are always nice to see

My Precious: still haven't bothered to watch the movie

The Interest: Yayas character looks wonderful and compelling. Brights looks like a fucking creep, though incidentally those are the characters I think he is best at playing, so hey

The Trainee: I just don't like office settings, I find them uninteresting and a lot of the formalities and etiquette of offices seems really silly and pointless to me. This trailer won major points for seeming to feature a wlw couple, so I'll watch for them anyways, and I got really excited to hear Sizzy so there's that.

We Are: I could barely get through the trailer, this looked really bland to me. I like most of the actors involved so I'm willing to be pleasantly suprised, but I'm not expecting much

Overall, even though there are 7 to 9 series I would say I'm looking forward to, I'm really disappointed overall. A lot of the series are really bland to me this year, so I'm hoping I'm more excited by Pt 2 whenever that is. I want roles for Khao, First and Fah :(

Roles for Mild too, though I know she is a freelancer and not under gmm

[heretherebedork]

Hii. Fellow Pining boys lover here! Could you recommend some BL series with unrequited love and long term pining? Thank you so much, lovely.

Unrequited love I can't help much with, honestly, there's not a ton of it in BL? But there are a few. But pining, oh pining, my favorite babies. I will only be recommending ones I love.

I mean, the first is the obvious of MekBoss from My Engineer. One of my personal favorite pining dynamics of all time because I adore piners who pick friendship over love every time until there isn't a choice anymore. But yes. Definitely good pining.

2moons2 is good for a speedrun of pining alongside some very flirty pining and it works very, very well for both, though I suppose arguments could be made about whether or not actively flirting with someone can also be pining but, you know what, I'll make an exception.

Cherry Magic does Kurosawa's pining oh so well and it's darling. Different than Thai pining but definitely one to watching.

Lovely Writer has both pining and unrequited love by the end. Honestly, I have to recommend this one strongly because the pining is delicious, the relationship is great and the unrequited love is painful in a whole rang of ways and goes in so many directions.

About Youth just ended but I cannot help how much I recommend it for the gentleness and pining. Not the plot so much but there is very gentle pining and love and softness.

Bad Buddy is A+ in terms of how much pining truly hurts and how much it can change a person when they know they can't do anything about it and how much that love can change them too. Absolutely A+.

Cherry Blossoms After Winter is truly all about pining that turns to love without distraction. I also love it so much, it's truly traditional yaoi in every sense but done by Korea so it's super stylized.

Cutie Pie is the only show where it is entirely about pining despite them already being in a relationship. Absolutely must watch for pining fans, honestly, both main pairs are established relationship that are still pining for each other because they're in arranged marriages.

En of Love TOSSARA is more like the conclusion of a long pining arc we don't see but it absolutely has to be here because it is glorious.

My Beautiful Man is dual sided pining with agony mixed in and is my purest 11/10 BL so, yes, you should definitely watch this one.

La Cuisine is close to this so Imma stick on here because I have a super soft spot for this little pulp. Very soft, very filled with lots of gentle and soft loving that starts as pining and pining that has lasted a long time.

Minato Shouji Coin Laundry is definitely perfect for this, honestly. They do everything. You gotta watch it for

My one mediocre recommendation: My Gear and Your Gown. This one is longterm pining but it's done super mediocre and they flubbed the ending but ugh SO MUCH POTENTIAL. Enchante also falls here but the ending was even worse for me so I can't recommend that one at all.

Old Fashion Cupcake is the mature version of this, in a lot of ways, but also just an amazing show and you should definitely watch it regardless.

Plus & Minus had good pining but, again, kind of fell apart at the end. But the pining was very, very good.

Secret Crush on You is a cringefest of the deepest emotions that somehow blended longterm pining and stalking into a gorgeous love story that is also... cringe humor but with an amazing message? I love SCOY so much and I think you will too, just remember that they're taking the comedic side characters and giving them depth and heart so that's exactly what it is.

Star in My Mind is very good at the idea of longterm pining on both sides but also deep, deep communication struggles so... watch out for that? I liked it a lot but I know it went too long for a lot of people.

Tonhon Chonlatee is another comedy that I honestly really enjoyed and it's all longterm pining and an oblivious idiot and also Neo Trai in one of his best roles before The Eclipse!

We Best Love No 1 For You is exactly what anyone looking for longterm pining is looking for, honestly, it's fantastic. Fighting Mr Second is... not exactly the same thing but does have a lot of good notes and has a different longterm pining couple that is also a touch more unrequited so this might just be perfect for you?

You're My Sky also has longterm pining in the main couple and is gorgeous.

Anyway, yes there are others but most of the others are ones I wouldn't recommend because I didn't like them. So... enjoy these!

[gillianthecat]

This or That

tagged by @negrowhat (Thanks!)

hot shower or cold shower 1 // texting or calling // earbuds or headphones 2 // paperback or hardcover// matte or gel 3 // 12 hour clock or 24 hour clock // blue or green // sunsets or sunrises // tulips or orchids// candle light or moonlight // sci-fi or horror 4 // pen or pencil // pandas or koalas // gold or silver // sneakers or boots // denim jacket or leather jacket // pink or purple // chocolate or sour candy // deodorant or perfume 5 // drive-in movie theater or the cinema // pastel colors or neutral earth tones // lemonade or fruit juice // past or future // 6

1. although coincidentally and unusually I just took a cold shower - it's hot where I am 2. headphones are usually more comfortable but i end up using earbuds more 3. i don't actually know what this is referring to. nail polish? 4. i'm a wimp about horror 5. i stopped wearing artificial fragrances after knowing many people with sensitivities and now I can no longer stand the smell 6. for many of these it depends on my mood or the circumstances. although I suppose that's true for most people, lol.

Now the BL version!

crying in the shower or making out in the shower // give cute boy line ID or stalk his IG // share his earbuds or share his closet 1 // manga or manwha 2 // long dangly silver earring or dark leather cuff // time loop or reincarnation // blue engineering smock or red engineering smock // kisses at the beach or kisses in the mountains // cactus or chili plant 3 // fairy lights or spot lighting // ghost boyfriend or vampire lover 4 // hard sub or soft sub 5 // stray cat or … actually that’s your only option // Hawaiian shirt or blue shorts 6 // evil ex-girlfriend or predatory fujoshi 7 // suit jacket or leather jacket // high school or university // kitchen drama or office drama // forehead kisses or check kisses // Viki or GaGaOOLaLa 8 // Japanese arthouse depth or Korean high concept 9 // pink milk or yakult // censored Chinese BL or trashy Thai pulps 10 // body swap or dead body // sexy or story 11 // back hugs or lap sitting // piggyback or cradle carry

1. this is probably based entirely on a scene from the non BL The Devil Judge 2. i've never read either (for some reason processing text and drawings together is hard for me) 3. i haven't encountered one in a BL yet, but I think they're pretty. 4. although i haven't watched either of these plots in a bl yet 5. sometimes i need them bigger or a different color. or to turn them off for screenshots 6. especially when hanging on by one button (hi fighter) 7. i hate them both, but at least the evil ex-girlfriend can sometimes turn into an interesting character. predatory fujoshi is nothing but a creepy fourth wall breaking plot device that gets me riled up just thinking about it. 8. it would have been viki a few days ago because gagaoolala initially ate my email address. but now that they've finally let me register i concede they are by far the better queer and bl option 9. the only one i've seen so far is Color Rush and i have to confess it didn't work for me... please don't hate me 10. look, censorship is evil. but i'm a sucker for angst and subtext. 11. obviously they go best together. if i can only have one it really depends on my mood which i choose.

I’m not sure who hasn’t done this yet.  @lelephantsnail? @placetneplacet? @moonchildridden? @halfmoon-trueself? Everyone, please consider yourself tagged if you see this and want to participate.

[i-got-the-feels]

highlight what you like or what applies to you

thanks amu and mor for tagging me - so sorry for getting so late to this : p @liyazaki @ommited-miscellaneously

hot shower or cold shower // texting calling or email discord // earbuds or headphones (they have saved my phone falling down so many times) // paperback hardcover or ebook (read in dark and cheaper on pocket) // matte or gel // 12 hour clock or 24 hour clock (this is too much maths for anxious brain)// blue or green // sunsets or sunrises // tulips or orchids (any and all flower in the garden and not plucked)// candle light or moonlight // sci-fi and fantasy or horror // pen or pencil // pandas or koalas (ALL OF THEM ANIMALS HAPPY AND SAFE) // gold or silver // sneakers or boots // denim jacket or leather jacket it is so hot NONE and even if cold i dont like jackets, hoodies ftw // pink or purple // chocolate or sour candy (you cant sit with us, sour candy) // deodorant or perfume // drive-in movie theater or the cinema // pastel colors (AND dark colors like whatever color and its closest version to black, favourite in purples and blues) or neutral earth tones// lemonade or fruit juice // past or future//

BL VERSION

crying in the shower or making out in the shower (#savewater) // give cute boy line ID or stalk his IG // share his earbuds or share his closet // manga or manwha (i am not cultured enough to know the difference so i am gonna say memes and novels) // long dangly silver earring (woof woof grr grr) or dark leather cuff // time loop or reincarnation (please my physics is bad i cant do time travel)// blue engineering smock or red engineering smock // kisses at the beach or kisses in the mountains // cactus or chili plant (i assume the one we can use in food- #savemoney) // fairy lights or spot lighting (please my anxiety ass cant survive that)// ghost boyfriend or vampire lover // hard sub or soft sub // stray cat or … actually that’s your only option (always choose cats AND puppies) // Hawaiian shirt or blue shorts // evil ex-girlfriend or predatory fujoshi (listen they suck but evil ex is just lazy and bad writing) // suit jacket or leather jacket (I refuse to chose. Both can be hot based on the aura exuded by the person wearing it) // high school or university // kitchen drama or office drama // forehead kisses or cheek kisses // Viki or GaGaOOLaLa (too broke for either) // Japanese arthouse depth or Korean high concept // pink milk or yakult // censored Chinese BL or trashy Thai pulps (Thai pulps are my shut off the brain show, I don't think censored bl where I have to use my brain to find the subtext and metaphors is my thing PLUS THEY SO LONG ) // body swap or dead body (I HATE deaths its sad and sometimes badly written for shock value) // sexy or story (good story is the sexiest but yeah sometimes when characters with great potential (mhm tharntype, fish under the sky, my gear and your gown - sexy becomes the story) // back hugs or lap sitting (my otps can multi task) // piggybacks or cradle carry

I tag @boysbeloving @surajmukhis @morathicain @smittenskitten @snimeat @ommited-miscellaneously @sereinartemishan @mileskinn @bisexualhedgehog @milkpansa and anyone who wants to do this fun littol game

[namtanlovesfilm]

I don’t know if it’s a norm in Thai Lakorn but I am deeply disturbed at the level of violence that I feel almost each Thai show has. It’s not little violence with a punch being thrown (which is still very bad). it’s literally multiple people ganging up on one person and/or literal beating.I don’t understand they are blurring cigarettes and alcool but they show people being beaten to a pulp. It’s not even if it was part of the storyline and they were showing the damage that it can cause, they act like it’s not a big deal, never pressing charges, only ever ending up solely with some bruises. No brain damage, no long term pain, no blurry vision…

I’m sorry I am ranting but I feel it’s everywhere, in BL and non BL and it’s not something that should be deliberately show as a small thing. Of course it touch everybody and it’s awful but currently there is a high amount of hate crime where Asians people and LGBT people are being beaten up, ending up in the hospital and some not even surviving. I wish they kind of take that seriously.

ohhh, good point anon. I personally had never realized that at all bc I came from western shows that I find way more violent & explicit in every way. in fact some shows that depicted violence super explicitly like the revenge really surprised me, bc it wasn't something I was used to in thai dramas. I feel like violence is very much normalized in media, so I've frankly never blinked an eye at it. but it's true that it often is pretty unnecessary, let's be honest, and violence is very much used as a plot device most of the time. that being said, if we're gonna talk about hate crimes, I'm not sure it applies to thai dramas in the way you're saying. firstly thailand doesn't have much immigration at all, and most of it comes from other asian countries, so it's almost an entirely asian country. the hate crimes against asian people have been in western countries against asian immigrants (which btw were criticized by thai citizens everywhere online when a thai person got killed in one of them.) therefore, the violence shown in thai dramas is a thai on thai, or at the very least asian on asian violence & never has to do with the ethnicity of the character. as for lgbtq+ hate crimes, I'm sure they still exist in thailand, but they're a LOT less likely to happen than in the west. thai people are known for their tolerance, bc even when they don't like lgbtq+ people, they aren't very likely to physically hurt or kill them. not saying it doesn't happen, but it definitely happens less, so once again I don't think it applies. besides, most of the violence is either straight on straight or lgbtq+ on lgbtq+, I've never seen a straight character beat up an lgbtq+ one, unless we're talking about homophobic parents hitting their queer child, but we can argue it's to show the reality that many lgbtq+ people go through. so yeah, sorry it got long as always, but I do agree with your point to a certain extent, though I must admit violence has never really bothered me bc I realize it's fictional & I've never experienced it myself. it could definitely be triggering for victims of domestic abuse & bullying though, and it's important to keep that in mind so thank you for bringing that point up!

xxx

[absolutebl]

Best 23 of BL 2023 - Quirky Awards

SHOCK & AWE AWARDS

1. Biggest BL surprise of 2023:

The last 3 months of 2023 in general got my biggest WTF award.

GMMTV fielding OffGun AND TayNew in the same quarter while also airing Last Twilight (arguably one of their best BLs ever)

That they ALSO optioned 3 JBLs

That there's a high heat omegaverse BL staring Pavel

That there were 20 BLs airing and none of them Korean.

With 5 VAMPIRE BLs announced for next year

But my prize in this category goes to My Dear Gangster Oppa.

It's just crazy:

Thai talent, Korean money + IP (this is adapted from a manwha) airing on a Chinese channel (iQIYI). Plus it was GOOD and made smart reuse of a pair who richly deserved it. I'm delighted by the eclectic insanity of this production. And wonder if any other film genre could even do anything like this.

2. The “that country did WHAT?” award:

The 8th Sense from Korea?!

I mean, seriously?! Dealing with metal health, suicide, darkness, therapy, age gap, & first time love BUT FROM KOREA? And then openness and casual boyfriend physical affection? What's next? An actual hard fought coming out narrative with an HEA? Gay domesticity and families?

Careful Korea, you'll strain something. Possibly your own culture and film industry.

I should stop having expectations of Korea, they keep surprising me.

Runners up: Korea letting OnlyOneOf do Bump Up Business not to mention that OmegaX thing. AND Korea adapting Why R U? What are you up to, Korea? Qua? Is this a coded message? Should we send help? Do you need snacks?

3. Biggest casting whoa! where did you come from? award:

GeminiFourth in My School President.

Seriously? Babies what? How did GMMTV find you? How do you exist? How is BL this lucky?

4. That studio did WHAT now? award:

GMMTV putting EarthMix into Moonlight Chicken.

And then doubling down with G4 as the damn sides.

Fucking genius.

5. I’m sad you were ignored award:

Destiny Seeker.

It's just a really fun little Thai pulp, the pairs were good, silly dialogue, plus consent and other good rep. I enjoyed it. No one talked about it AT ALL.

6. 2023 BL That Actually Made Me Lose My Mind Award?

Laws of Attraction. -The casting, the crazy story, the soapy drama! But specifically: Film playing Charn - the range of his smiles alone. GLORIOUS

I mean I Feel You Linger in the Air also sparked something in me, but LoA drove me actually nuts.

NARRATIVE AWARDS

7. Best story 2023:

La Pluie

I know, you're surprised, right? At the time I didn't chat much about it but I really enjoyed the discourse others were having. I love anything that really examines the fated mates (soulmates) trope and the idea of "the one". What a clever way to do that. (This is one reason UWMA is my favorite Thai BL.)

This one reminded me of the way Color Rush approached allegory and that's no bad thing. Such an impressive little piece.

8. Best narrative structure 2023 award:

Unintentional Love Story.

I know this may seem a simplistic pick. But I love the tidiness of this no frills contemporary romance, how the culture of work and personal ethics and corruption fight against the main character's affection and integrity. Poor baby boy is driven into a corner and then punished for it. But it is punishment he feels he deserves, and so it is up to his (now) ex to figure out what went wrong and why.

It's just great. I love it when no one is stupid or wrong, it's just impossible circumstances and unintentional love deeply felt.

9. Best 2023 dialogue (script) award:

Jun & Jun

Never before has Korea laced a BL with that much perfectly executed innuendo. It was a master class. I didn't know you could be that lascivious in Korean, quite frankly. Plus the way the 2 Juns constantly seamlessly transition between formal register (work, public - where they are boss/employee) to informal register (when they are alone and age mates + childhood sweethearts).

Beautiful to hear and watch.

10. Favorite scene 2023:

The dub con scene in I Cannot Reach You because I AM TRASH for an out of control seme. I'm sorry I just AM.

I have said it before, I will say it again, NO ONE DOES THIRST like Japan. And when that thirst bubbles over, it is heart-clenching and very hot.

11. The most rewatchable BL of 2023 award:

Our Dating Sim

That scene where they lie on the floor + the stolen kiss + giggle? Come on, it should be on comfort repeat in war rooms. It could bring world peace.

ACTORS & CHARACTERS AWARDS

12. Best performance of a queer actor in a leading role, 2023:

Fluke in Make a Wish.

It was fun to see him as an irreverent immortal and while I love OhmFluke I also really enjoyed this new pairing. It was a genuine pleasure to watch.

13. Best pining 2023:

The moot pining in Tokyo in April is...

Boys, seriously? Japan must you destroy us like this? Hurts so good.

14. Best wingman 2023 (The Namgoong Award)

Tiw from My School President

I mean, come on, of course it's him!

(Also can you believe Mark went on from this to do fricking Only Friends!? To Last Twilight! Come on GMMTV GIVE HIM A LEAD!)

15. Biggest OMG I LOVE you boys together, YAY!

Dimpled McMafia & Feral Bunny Foo Foo from Kiseki Dear to Me.

They were feral for each other.

We were feral for them

It was a whole delightful THING.

16. Most unexpected return of a BL pair? award:

The Private Lessons pair showing up in Love Class 2.

I know it was only a cameo, but SERIOUSLY? Thank you SO MUCH Korea! A big studio picking up a Strongberry pairing? I love you.

Seriously tho between them, Taiwan & Korea tried for ALL THE CAMEOS this year.

17. Well aren't you two just the prettiest? award:

NetJames in Bed Friend.

Need I say more?

18. LIFETIME ACHIEVEMENT AWARD

Bah Vinh in Vian & Mr Cinderella 2. I did like either show but I loved him in them. Especially the make outs.

Yes you have chemistry with all the boys in Vietnam and you kiss beautifully. But it's okay now honey, you have the crown. Relax, you're stressing us out.

RANDOM PICKS

19. Favorite Linguistic Moment of 2023:

Our Dating Sim

Caught in the act by the elevator scene. OMG it's so funny. They're being such boyfriend shits to each other, and to be caught in the act by THAT character, and try to manifest formal language whole cloth? Hilarious.

Honorable mention to War Peanuts in Destiny Seeker.

20. Biggest disappointment of 2023:

You Are Mine

Seriously Taiwan, AGAIN you disappoint me with an Office BL? You're Taiwan, land of offices and suits. This should be YOUR SETTING TO WIN. And yet... argh. I mean it wasn't bad. But it wasn't good either. Stop it Taiwan, do better.

Runners up? Between Us, Chains of Heart, Dangerous Romance - this was a HOTLY contested category.

+ 2 Winners in the sub-category of FUCK YOU FOR THAT ENDING award:

The Director who Buys Me Dinner - I mean this nicely but: you have your lane now Korea, stop hurting us, that's Japan's responsibility and they do it better.

I Feel You Linger In the Air - I'm just hugely disappointed. Thailand ALMOST got its second 10/10 from me, but that damn ending.

Argh.

21. Best Wardrobe/Prop Use 2023

The shower of packaged bedsheets in My Personal Weatherman

Amazing. Brilliant. No notes.

22. Best Queer Rep 2023

Chot in Step By Step

In fact, all the queer characters in this show were treated with great integrity.

AND props to this cast for refusing to do fan service. GOOD FOR YOU! Fuck those sasang wankers.

Runners up? The found family cast of Love in Translation and the Rainbow Rice Cakes in The New Employee.

23. Best Meta Trope call out

Tin Tem Jai

Come on, what a zinger, but at themselves (and Taiwan)

Final question: which of the 23 was the hardest for me to pick?

Honestly? Question #1 this year. But also question #20.

(Last year: 2022's Version) 

Remember I only pull from shows that were completely finished by the end of 2023. Or The Sign probably would have taken multiple categories. But it will fall into 2024 offerings.

(source)

[kaesficrecarchive]

this or that

i wasn’t tagged but i just really wanted to do this lol, and in the end: i make the rules on this blog (+ no one can stop me)

crying in the shower or making out in the shower 

(preferably both so ppl can make parallel gifsets)

give cute boy line ID or stalk his IG 

(as i myself am not a direct person i think it’s so much more relatable but also just funnier when characters stalk social media)

share his earbuds or share his closet 

(domesticity >>>)

manga or manhwa

(haven’t read either oops)

long dangly silver earring or dark leather cuff 

(don’t really have a set preference)

time loop or reincarnation

(triage my beloved) (everyone go watch that show rn)

blue engineering smock or red engineering smock 

(just blue in general)

kisses at the beach or kisses in the mountain

(sorry atots for betraying you like this)

cactus or chilli plant 

(insert both? both? both! both are good gif)

fairy lights or spot lighting

(i have fairy lights in my room and they’re just so superior in every way)

ghost boyfriend or vampire lover 

(not a big fan if ghosts tbh)

hard sub or soft sub 

(thought this was abt bdsm for a sec)

stray cat or… actually that’s your only option

cats >>>

Hawaiian shirt or blue shorts

how do they always make these shirts work

evil ex-girlfriend or predatory fujoshi

the both meme but instead of both it’s neither

suit jacket or leather jacket

love it when ppl get dressed up

high school or university

did anyone choose high school?

kitchen drama or office drama

i blame the movie ‘no reservations’ for this

forehead kisses or cheek kisses

something about them brushing the hair away as well

viki or gagaoolala

just more acquainted with viki

japanese arthouse depth or korean high concept

don’t think i’ve watched a japanese show actually

pink milk or yakult 

don’t know if other countries have this but i used to be obsessed with fristi lol

censoured chinese bl or trashy thai pulps 

when is the tgcf live action coming pls i need it

body swap or dead body 

not a fan of body swap

sexy or story 

see: censored chinese bl

back hugs or lap sitting 

both actually (but something about lap sitting... idk, the intimacy of it)

piggyback or cradle carry 

so underrated and for what

[cilginfillermigoruyorumne]

BL this or that tag game

@geyikligece thanks for tagging me 🤎

crying in the shower (third my sad og boi) or making out in the shower 

give cute boy line ID or stalk his IG (I like when they stalk a boy in a "no-homo" way yea sure honey you're just checking what your rival is doing ;) )

share his earbuds or share his closet (i kinda hate sharing earbuds, it's not hygienic and you can't enjoy the song fully with just one earbud HOWEVER SHARING SHIRTS!! 💯)

long dangly silver earring or dark leather cuff 

time loop or reincarnation 

blue engineering smock or red engineering smock 

kisses at the beach or kisses in the mountains 

cactus or chili plant (I have a better option: venus's flytrap) (@geyikligece you’ve touched my ramking heart damn it)

fairy lights or spotlighting 

ghost boyfriend or vampire lover (I crave for main characters wearing a white shirt covered in blood 🛐 I haven’t really watched vampire bls tho)

hard sub or soft sub (I don't have a strong opinion about it but seeing edgy subs feels better)

stray cat or … actually that’s your only option 

Hawaiian shirt or blue shorts

evil ex-girlfriend or predatory fujoshi (no never pls I thought we got over this area)

suit jacket or leather jacket (but what about denim jackets????)

high school or university

kitchen drama or office drama 

forehead kisses or cheek kisses

Viki or GaGaOOLaLa (i didn't know about GaGaOOLaLa and I've just checked it out, this is a treasure for me I hope it has free content but what kinda name is this)

Japanese arthouse depth or Korean high concept 

pink milk or yakult

censored Chinese BL or trashy Thai pulps

body swap or dead body 

sexy or story

back hugs or lap sitting

piggyback or cradle carry 

I’m tagging @daysofbeingnothing @thisautistic <3 (feel free to ignore if you don’t feel like doing it)

[shyishsarawat]

this or that tag game

tagged by @billlkin thanks bestie <3

crying in the shower or making out in the shower ( you know that scene from theory of love )

give cute boy line ID or stalk his IG

share his earbuds or share his closet

manga or manwha

long dangly silver earring or dark leather cuff

time loop or reincarnation ( something about ppl finding each other again through time just hits )

blue engineering smock or red engineering smock ( blue is my favorite color its just that simple )

kisses at the beach or kisses in the mountains

cactus or chili plant ( i dont like either im not a plant person )

fairy lights or spot lighting ( idc either way )

ghost boyfriend or vampire lover ( ultimately i prefer werewolves but i like vampires too )

hard sub or soft sub ( mostly prefer for m/f relationships tho )

stray cat or … actually that’s your only option ( im not sure what this is supposed to mean but i am a cat lover )

Hawaiian shirt or blue shorts 

 evil ex-girlfriend or predatory fujoshi  ( i dont really like either but i do like drama and hate fujoshi characters )

suit jacket or leather jacket 

high school or university 

kitchen drama or office drama ( i dont really watch a lot of either so ig it doesnt matter much )

forehead kisses or cheek kisses ( i cant choose im a SUCKER for affection in all forms )

Viki or GaGaOOLaLa ( i paid for gg once and watched some of the worst things ever and like 1 cute and too short gl )

Japanese arthouse depth or Korean high concept (i dont know )

pink milk or yakult ( idk what the second thing is but Perth made a video where he made pink milk and it made me curious )

censored Chinese BL or trashy Thai pulps ( both )

body swap or dead body ( i think body swapping can be fun when its each other's bodies bc then they can discover more about each other and their lives away from each other and it can deepen their relationship. if its with a third party like a sister or fujoshi its usually a wash bc it adds nothing but drama )

sexy or story ( i just want good love stories and good dynamics like that's all i need- something to root for, idc about sex, just give me something to latch onto )

back hugs or lap sitting

piggyback or cradle carry ( idk i just think its cuter )

i tag anyone who sees this and wants to do it bc im too lazy to tag agsjdds