#whoever hates it is wrong
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I often think of that scene in Teen Titans Vs Justice League, when Raven meets Damian and says he's just sad.
Like my dude does give off sad child who acts though because he is to scare to feel
#damian wayne#raven teen titans#teen titans#justice league#teen titans vs justice League#why is that not a tag#wtf#hence the reference to love aint it from descendants 4#i loved that movie#whoever hates it is wrong
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i feel like not enough ppl are factoring in the cultural clash between laios and shuro and the many micro agressions shuro faced while being in their group. literally the name 'shuro' in itself is one
his name is toshiro 😭 lets also not forget that he has his own communication issues, in the opposite way that laios does- thats literally a factor in their argument, that his envy for laios's ability to express himself sincerely manifested as part of his distaste for him.
ig all this to say like, was their fight heart wrenching, especially when reading laios as autistic? absolutely. anybody whos ever been in laios's position knows how much it hurts to realize someone you thought was your friend doesnt actually like having you around, especially when they didnt tell you and you had no way of knowing due to not understanding their cues. but im begging yall to step back and see the nuance of this situation cause im gonna be real a lot of you are kinda just brushing over it acting like everything is toshiros fault and that hes a terrible person when in reality hes an average guy who really, really clashed with laios and it led to a very long misunderstanding due to their supremely opposite methods of communication. even laios and toshiro, after letting everything out in their fight, were able to come to an understanding and start a foundation for an actual friendship built on better communication
ok yknow what Edit: i shouldve made it even more explicit at the end of this post, i hadnt thought i would need to since i started the post with this, but i think a few too many people are missing my point so i just wanna clarify. i shouldnt have said 'really clashed' and left it at that because yeah they did, but it wasnt just their opposite methods of communication, it is also very much that toshiro was experiencing microaggressions via laios. it may have been unintentional on laios's part, but it still happened and wore him down, made it harder for him to communicate on top of both the more subtle social cues that he was raised with and his own communication difficulties. i also want to say that the fandom reaction to toshiro and the complete ignorance of this point is also racist tbh or at the very least ignorant. i understand that the anime did not cover this panel, and neither did the manga, as this was an omake, but im gonna be real with you guys. there are enough context clues within the story to clue you into this. if you didnt pick up on it thats ok, but i think this is a good lesson in picking up subtext in the stories that youre watching and/or reading. kui shouldnt have to explicitly say 'by the way laios was racist to toshiro' for this point to be understood, and at the very least, when the author portrays a character in a sympathetic light (as kui clearly does) it should make you question Why they are doing so and what makes them sympathetic, rather than youre immediate and only reaction to be 'well i hated what this guy did/said so i hate them and they suck'. idk exactly how to finish this, just. idk. question your biases and gut reactions to things you see in media and stories, and think about whether or not theres subtext that youre missing.
#dunmeshi#dungeon meshi#shuro dungeon meshi#delicious in dungeon#toshiro nakamoto#dont get me wrong i understand relating to a character and hating whoever wrongs them cause youre protective or you relate really hard#but i think toshiros been getting the short end of the stick for a long time now 😭#even his love for falin is misunderstood#he literally states all the reasons he likes her#and none of them are superficial#but hes so closed off and has such difficulty expressing himself that instead of asking her out or smth he just#proposed to her out of the blue 😭#leading a lot of ppl to just assume that he went 'white woman spotted' and proposed#do Not misunderstand me i am#a HUGE farcille stan#obviously#but i dont think toshiros feelings are surface level and i think theyre absolutely crucial to understanding him and his motivations#as a character in this story
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Capri Sun... I miss you... (it still exists).
#detroit become human#connor rk800#chris miller#look i think at some point someone would have an impossible urge to have a capri sun but specifically in front of an android#and whoever is curious enough would be like well connor doesnt really seem to HATE many people#but we cant really convince hank to drink a capri sun so who would connor appreciate the bonding moment with#and everyone looks to chris because they think he can play it off easiest and theyre right#however i imagine hank eventually hears connor repeat the phrase respect the pouch and is like which of those fuckers showed you capri sun#and connor just whats a capri sun ?#because chris didnt elaborate thats just how they come#for that drink specifically#DO NOT TALK TO ME ABOUT BOTTLED CAPRI SUN SUPPOSEDLY IN 2025 THAT FEELS WRONG TO IMAGINE#i feel too strongly attached to the pouches (i miss them) (they still exist)#does it show that im actually a huge chris fan bc ahaha.... i am....
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#bye felicia
Pocahontas (1995)
#i end all my arguments this way#pocahontas (1995)#disney's pocahontas#disney pocahontas#disney john smith#pocahontas x john smith#pocahontas#john smith#pocahontasedit#pocahontasgif#disneyedit#disneygif#fyeahpocahontas#disneyfeverdaily#pocajohn#queso*edit#queso*gif#moment of all time. notice this is a parallel to john doing that dude thing of swinging on the tree branch earlier#whoever is elevated over the other physically has the advantage in the conversation/thinks they're in the right#every time john does it he gets humbled Immediately and it's hilarious#and he takes it like a champ. he even normally lowers himself around pocahontas throughout the movie#also i've seen ppl give john a lot of flack for this moment but i never saw a reason to hate him for it?#john's whole character is about being able to grow and unlearn the prejudices and toxicity you've been taught all your life#he's a flawed man and he's stubborn and he's trying to win an argument#but she schools him and he accepts that he was wrong. she puts down a boundary later on and he accepts that too#hating on him for not being mr. perfect at the top of the film is ridiculous imho#pocahontas is flawed too but for different reasons. they're both flawed people and they help each other grow in their own ways#there's a lot of give-and-take in this relationship and i really adore that#10/10 ship to Me#help i'm hyperanalyzing disney's pocahontas again
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Sanderson gave Kaladin Marsh's worldview with Kelsier’s charisma and then gave Moash Kelsier’s worldview with Marsh's charisma and I think that was very funny of him.
#this quip peer-reviewed by people i was chatting with at jordancon so now i'm sharing it on tumblr#cosmere#stormlight archive#mistborn#moash#kaladin stormblessed#kelsier#marsh#cosmere junk box#for legal purposes (not getting hate mail from whoever occupies the 'fuck moash'/'kelsier did nothing wrong' crossroads) this is a joke
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Apparently, Eloise is a mean girl and is not a girls' girl???
#bridgerton netflix#bridgerton spoilers#bridgerton#eloise bridgerton#pro eloise bridgerton#95% of the female friendship content this season is because of Eloise#the other 5% is because of Lady Danbury with Violet & QC#She knows Francesca hates being the centre of attention#so she makes a plan to try to ensure that she won't be.#she apologies to pen for accidentally revealing colin helping her find a match#she kept pens secret which makes her a far better person than me ngl because i would've done a i wanna watch the world burn esqe performanc#she befriended cressida and is actively helping her recognise her past wrongs to become a better person#DO Y'ALL JUST IGNORE THE ARC HER & DAPHNE HAD IN S1?#some of you pretend she didn't grow at all over the course of that season#they're different people with different ambitions but who love each other and who came to respect the others' goals#also do yas just ignore the fact that eloises fears stem from her mother nearly dying in childbirth right after her father's death?#she was the first of the Bridgertons to bond with Kate!#daphne was the first to clock Kate & Anthony but Eloise was the first to get close to Kate as a person not as her brother's future wife#defended Marina#wanted to find LW to defend Pen but well you know LW is Pen so -\°-°/-#wanted to uplift women in general and wanted to change society in order to do so#this is so chaotically tagged sorry to whoever read this far#in short#Eloise bridgerton they could never make me hate you
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"pronouncing 'Þerindë' as 'Serindë' is not that big of a deal" just say you've always been called right your whole life.
#i know it's a repetition but i can't stress it enough#as someone whose name is and has always been: mispronounced/misspelled/butchered/etc.#no. just because you don't like feanor you don't get to call someone else the wrong name. in this specific case it's extremely childish too.#“you're making it too big of a deal” well i'm glad you've never been told “i can't borher to spell your name right - we all know i mean you”#sorry but you (finwë/indis/whoever) can't claim to love/respect someone if you're knowingly and willingly mispronouncing their name.#and i promise this is not about defending anyone other than míriel.#and if you don't get it then good for you ig#i'm genuinely glad you're respected/loved enough for there to be more than literally 5 people calling you the right name#← number not related to míriel but to me#sorry for the rant but i truly hate when stuff like this happens especially when the disrespect is basically weaponized against someone else#probably no one will get it but it's alright. not every thérèse has to belong to you.#btw you can use súle for literally anything else and use thúle for míriel Þerindë specifically. crazy i know.#tolkien#silmarillion#the silmarillion#the silm#tolkien legendarium#míriel#míriel Þerindë#Þerindë#miriel therinde#miriel serinde#miriel#the shibboleth of fëanor#i know i've misspelled fëanor's name in the third tag but fixing it would take literal years off my life. call my hypocrite all you want#feanor#fëanor#fëanáro#feanaro curufinwe#feanaro
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I don’t think it makes sense to assume that Jason was mocking Mia’s past. At all. The thing that got jason painted as violent back in the 80s was his anger against rapists…how does that turn into mocking a victim? and that entire story was written by winick. Do we honestly think winick intended to communicate that? The same writer who made Jason’s first kill a man who was trafficking children? Who had Jason pause in his mission of madness to make sure those kids were found by the right people so they wouldn’t be in further danger?
#let’s knock on our skulls and kick our brains back into gear okay?#you can maintain that it wasn’t well executed or that the role mia played here bothers you#but you can’t say jason was mocking her for that or even seriously trying to hurt her physically#he was bsing like 90% of the story with his constant ‘we should all kill anyone who inconveniences us! speedy and GA should try to kill me#if they want to win’ like we understand that yes?#but that last part of his convo with Mia was the one serious part#he was wrong! of course he was wrong about ollie. but this was also Jason’s first time meeting ollie#it was ridiculous and unnecessary on his end and it put mia thru the emotional wringer for nothing#but that wasn’t the Intention. it was a stupid thing done by someone who never expected anything to come of it but still said what *to him*#was a way of offering advice#and as for the ppl who go ‘stop reaching abt jason being a victim and just read Mia instead’#a) there’s more to Mia’s character than her past. anyone who thinks that fits Jason’s past wouldn’t necessarily like mia bc they’re not the#same character#it’s the same way that if jason was confirmed to have been a victim of SA as a kid then all of Mia’s fans wouldn’t love him like they love#her? this is common sense. anyways stop being assholes online and just recommend characters too ppl nicely#b) more than one character can have experienced a similar form of abuse. also common sense#c) it’s not an unreasonable hc#d) it doesn’t hurt you personally. none of this killed your grandma#once again: hate whoever you like but choosing the interpretation that doesn’t make sense just to make up a#‘valid’ reason is serious loser behaviour
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i think the hardest thing ever is going to be getting rid of plushes like how can i do dis. These things have souls its like im abandoning an old dog on the side of the road in the rain.
#ill be giving em to family friend's mom who sells items at flea market#but ill worry no matter what ykwim#like if i didnt have extreme post office anxiety id be giving em away to good homes to whoever wanted em online#but even then id worry like what if someone buys em to do evil things to them. YKWIM??#theres something wrong wit me.#talkys#i hate when things are out of my control 🫶
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To whichever writer wrote Violet and Aunt Mallory’s characters and interactions in RoE…are you okay??? The toxic dynamic between these two and the isolation and emotional suffering on poor Violet’s end feels just a little too real to me. Like it’s well-written but holy shit, it feels like it’s been written from personal experience on such a transcendental level.
#don’t get me wrong#I thought they were easily the best written characters in the series#I HATE Mallory with a burning passion almost on the level of Barthelemy Beaumont#and I feel so fucking bad for Violet#so yes kudos to whoever wrote them#but also jesus are you okay???#choices rules of engagement#choices roe#rules of engagement#choices stories you play#playchoices#choices stories we play#pixelberry#pixelberry studios#playchoices fandom#choices stories you play fandom#choices stories we play fandom
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Wow, I’m reading reviews for a book I’m trying to read, and I’m appalled that so many people have a problem with a male author writing a sapphic main character. Damn, get your fucking head out of the sand.
They don’t even complain of him messing up representation there. They just hate it for some reason!
Sorry, but that’s just not it. A man can write a sapphic main character. There is no inherent problem with that. He’s just writing a character he finds fun and fascinating!
#y’all would hate my dad for this then#when really his sister was a lesbian#and he supported her through hell and high water#so of course he’d want to share that representation with the world#and people don’t even need a story like that to write whoever they want#i’m sorry am i going to hell for writing a chinese character#despite my minor in asian studies and hours of research?#thinking of rebecca kuang mentioning#this same idea that you can just write that representation#just do it#my god people#vent#salt#also one of my guy friends has a lesbian main character in one trilogy#what is wrong with that#nothing
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I went on a walk with my dad
#I’m so so so so so sorry that I keep complaining I’m really sorry if it’s annoying or bothersome or anything ask me to take this down and I-#-will; I don’t wanna bother anyone :(#But I went on a walk with my dad and after a bit of talking we somehow got to the topic of conversation on how me and H butt heads a lot#And the way he said made me feel like I was the problem and that because I am older I NEED to be the bigger person every time#And I told him I didn’t want to have to be the bigger person because I didn’t like how immature she is and he just deflected it saying that#-I’m going to need to because I’m older and more mature#He also said that I’m the one who’s always defensive or picking out the fight when that isn’t true#I don’t want to fight with her; I HATE fighting with her#And geez it’s making me feel like I’m always the problem and I’m the reason why we argue so much#That I’M defensive and immature when I know I’m not#He says I need to be more gentle with her and not expect her to get pissy and defensive bit i only do that(if i do that at all) because she#-yells and snaps at me for no reason so often! I expect her to act that way because it’s how she always acts with me!#I’m not that immature right?#And he says I need to put in the effort to fix it even though she probably won’t do the same#Why do I have to fix it? Why am I responsible? It’s not fair!#I don’t want to be the cool headed mature and bigger person every single time#If she hurts me with her words I should be allowed to make that known without her yelling at me!#🌾#again I’m really sorry for complaining to whoever may be reading this#It’s silly I know#I’m just dramatic I’ll get embarrassed for posting this soon enough and delete it#I don’t know why I’m like this :(#I don’t like it#Geez what’s wrong with me
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this fandom is acc driving me round the bend, guys, someone "jumping ship" or multi shipping is not a personal betrayal, do not take it as one
#911#fuck me some of you are so self-centred#people can ship whoever they want#not shipping two characters does not mean you hate any of them#you can ship things whether they are canon or not (no it isn't wrong to ship a canon couple)#people are allowed to change who they ship whenever they feel like it actually#you don't need to remain loyal to any ship - these are fictional characters#if you don't like what someone ships then just block them#negativity#(feel free to block the previous tag if u just want the happy stuff on ur dash - don't let me ruin any enjoyment)
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why are we shipping lang qianqiu with ANYONE at all
#let some characters stay single oh god#he doesn't have chemistry with anyone in the novel#and im pretty sure whatever some of y'all are seeing in the donghua#is nothing. maybe they're FRIENDS#have you thought of that? the concept of FRIENDship#sorry sorry if you're a lang qianqiu/xyz shipper keep doing your thing you're lovely have fun <3#BUT IF YOU'RE NOT#please tell me im not alone good lord#the amatonormativity is KILLING me. why cant he be a single dude. whats wrong with that#maybe he's aro and/or ace. maybe he's not interested in anyone#maybe whoever he loved is already dead#so many possibilities#but y'all want to ship EVERYBODY#it's giving jiang cheng/xyz ewwwww#again no hate to any jiang cheng/xyz shippers#but I'M ANNOYED#tgcf#mxtx#heaven official's blessing#anyways im omw to skim through the novel once again and write a Lang qianqiu centric fic BBYE#swan stuff
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So with Alphyne vs Huntlow poll nearly coming to a close and almost all the things that have been said about the toxicity in the notes, here's my two cents. I still don't expect Huntlow to win, but if by chance they do, then fellow Huntlow shippers; please, please do not replicate that toxicity. Don't harass Alphyne shippers, don't send death threats, don't feel like you have to return to them what they have sent to you. No doubt the vast majority of the toxicity came from the Alphyne shippers, but that doesn't mean all of them took part in that. And even the ones who did don't deserve that level of harassment in return. At the end of the day, win or lose (or tie) let's just enjoy our ships and let the harrasers wallow in their self pity.
#besttship#huntlow#alphyne#yeah i'm tagging alphyne#hoping that whoever i attract will understand where i'm coming from with this#and not try to start some shit#don't get me wrong i love the ship and i love the game#it's the shippers who chose to be toxic that i hate
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among the boundless billions zaniness like laugh track as it definitely has that moment of expressing "rolling my eyes as The Left makes a kerfuffle of Acting like they have a stance as a veneer over the true belief that [xyz] is cool & chill actually" like what, approximate 0.000% chance wendy isn't, as usual, given the Objective Stance of "yeah yeah ohh we are cancelling involved parties talking about how we Don't watch this But. we all love this damn epic movie & already have it memorized so shut the fuck up, kids today" like. don't wanna really delve into how much billions thinks taylor or anyone is "really" trans / nonbinary like not too much benefit of the doubt in this material including what does provide info abt that specifically
& the general like [head in hands. what do you think any of this could possibly be about (you're the one that made your show at all about Power)] of "yes, it's bad/wrong to be someone that someone has done something to / victim of something" like that to be anti misogyny All Women Must Be Epic Winners b/c there's something to be proved: that they don't Deserve to be victims (of misogyny), not taken as a Given. while when we see some epic winner men stepping on other men (who need not all be guaranteed Winners so as to say misogyny is wrong), that's often Good, well beyond any assumption that various forms of basic disrespect / violation / patterns of emergent/entrenched power difference as Bad (for being things done to people, not for there being people they're being done to), & generally billions has to take an extra step when ppl get shitted on & tell us the Specific Cases when it was undeserved actually & someone was being mean to a specific person who didn't deserve that. & the specific cases when hey guess it wasn't that bad(tm) or when hey It's Okay that you're someone something was done to, in this case. & tell us what we were supposed to know all along like when someone who something was being done to (wrong Of Them, whether b/c they inherently deserve it no matter what, &/or b/c they failed to be someone who could make it Impossible to do anything to them, which, how do you do that besides being The Authority / Superior yourself, exactly? nonrhetorically? what if the in group vs out group / fascism / authoritarianism protected Me?) was actually being treated Too Well b/c ah well the abuse meant you were getting any attention, maybe it meant you were claimed as any superior's property, maybe it meant you weren't Already disposed of, as all Losers were in the end, You're Welcome.
obviously referring to winston where it's spelled out all the abuse towards him was deserved, & More than he deserved in the case of rian having more access & taking advantage of that, all for billions' enjoying its own sendoff there of, again, maximizing violation & violence short of [real violence is physical & leaves bruises / draws blood / Literally kills] which would be distasteful in general But doesn't it make wags look like the winner & winston the loser is that the former's completely unrelated completely impersonal ego blow gets way amplified taken out on winston, the most vulnerable recurring character when spyros as [first & ultimate Everyone Hates Him role] is more entrenched in there & billions still magnanimously pities tuk, as it does winston too, just not quite as much. again that like completely surface level realized power fantasy of forcing the mirror up to the Inferior so they're like nooo my inferiorityyyy & in doing so like, the projection in that lmao, we get it re: the valuing of & need(tm) for such Power Tripping & Reaffirming My Superiority & My Ego Restored; Everyone Claps like good god. & then for all ben & tuk are the slightly softer Two Too Nice Boys duo to the rian & winston quant duo, also like too nice i guess but not as much, ben is in charge of tuk but Any instance of rian being in charge of winston outstrips them in that "yay interpersonal abuse" dynamic, like then in the end billions may be like "yeah it's possible to be mean to them unlike how being mean to winston is actually Nice b/c he deserves everything he gets, we only vicariously enjoy it vs Feeling Bad for tuk & ben sometimes (still magnanimously & it's Not That Bad / just goofin)" like ben & tuk still Fail by not being people it's impossible to do anything to. & not Exceptions who anyone is really being Too Mean to. like if they were women, in which case, no problem surely with a "positive" kind of victim blaming where there is something Inherent that Will be victimized so hey how about to cancel that out there's this special Paternal Protection you Need always, Or Else? :) but instead they are men who are asian & is ben gay & w/tuk & winston nobody mentions glasses or fatness but billions doesn't really do much or very in depth textual mentioning of Anything, even w/nonzero mention that there may be gender & race in this world. a gay man, once. no disability. we just Know who are the inferiors who deserve it when they're treated inferiorly, or if they don't, they start deserving it when they fail to stop/avoid it, but if you start mentioning the factors behind who we all totally agree is inferior like whoa nobody was Saying any of that? being the real agent of oppression on the basis of the factors only You spelled out, much? nonbinary? i never say anything about the Gender Binary when i'm subscribing to it, sounds like You've created & enforced it. obfuscation & deflection onto [so Just Normal nobody has to label, explain, or argue it] couldn't serve a purpose & protect the existing power differences as they are. maybe You're the problem? perhaps you brought it upon yourself & now you're causing too much trouble standing up for yourself while everyone else's criticism is laser focused on you as the prior & continuing negative actions done to you are taken as a given / unquestioned / covertly protected to overtly encouraged?
anyway so wild if the Completely Normal(tm) Victim Blaming is uncritically recreated & oft embraced for "if you're watching this & don't wish you were axe / find him appealing" [billions as a sequence of vicarious power trips] purposes in this series....but a bit wild considering like this is your multiseason show that wasn't just purporting to be those power trips for [enough demographic & apparently specific personal tastes overlap w/creators] & was at all purporting to question the matters of power at play in the material, or yknow, at least to not be completely superficial material while said material is textually & thematically all about power difference being leveraged, how, the consequences, & so on. thus i will have to intermittently talk about it forever like this like lord unbelievable. & the funny little & sometimes less funny less little characters it has trapped in there so that those of us who were never meant to be in the audience can be cursed with this knowledge. like i have some feedback. "imagine not victim blaming" & "imagine adjusting your perspective can go beyond superficial layers added to politely defer to some other ppl while they're present but really like cmon do they deserve that. am i not just saying what we're allll thinking"
#another random night another Verbal Effusion of [forehead to hand]#winston billions#who needs actual questions about power or the consequences of getting to consider others Lessers & acting accordingly#when we can last minute be like uh wendy is god actually. take it away wendy (wait she just does whole other shit half the season)#okay Now take it away wendy i guess b/c the series is dead set on you being the Moral Center#if mostly b/c gosh everyone either loves owning you as pseudo wife or correctly recognizes & defers to your superiority#the scene i couldn't bear to sit through at the start of s7 way too long sequence of wendy Going To Work to the ''cuz im awesome'' song#i was like. lol. i was like okay that is wendy's mood / perspective then. Wrong. it was billions conveying Fact to the audience. rip#abt as great setup for ''the only other shoe that finally dropped was that of Yeah It's This Completely Surface Level'' as possible (:#prince has exactly the same attitudes & actions as wendy does? uh well you see. it's just bad when he does it#if only more wendys were in charge. if only we go ''well even if it's bad if wendy does it? or axe or whoever? Could Be Worse''#nothing to analyze in the [but at least it's not worse] dead end re: justification of Power Leveraging & minimization of its consequences#tl;dr just the victim blaming embraced everywhere & the idea that everything that Deviates from the Norm Too Ethically Mindedly#is just that veneer slapped on overtop of [haha but truly: the norm] like no but seriously we all know It's Not That Deep(tm)#even for the characters written to exercise this [my Extra Mile Ethics] trait regularly it's expressed as this Polite Addendum#to the [what's Really at play] normal. the And Enbies tacked on; that's that on that & it Is an extra veneer to the norm#prince asking if taylor's changing up their pronouns; no more Meant a red flag than him immediately shitting on winston i'm sure#yet yknow why tf suppose taylor more than anyone else would Change Pronouns. taylor who the series also only ever shows as being#misgendered As A Woman. whose drag / cisguise As A Woman is not treated in the same way a man's would be / is#whose emotive / expressive affect isn't either. billions like [the genders are m/f] to [perhaps also amab/afab] Tacked On#as something politely Extra you do to their face that doesn't actually change (threaten) your idea of what's just Normal & True#like it's normal & true that ugh god don't you hate the autistic people around you? don't you wish you could go sicko mode on them#so that they couldn't be around you anymore & they'd have brought it upon themself & really it was good of you b/c The Group Cohesion#thanks you & b/c you just gave them free ABA? yes yep Surely Unquestionably#problem isn't abuse & concomitant violation in & of itself. it's Bad to be someone that's done to. we will announce Exceptions#rest of you either you brought it upon yourself or you failed to Correct that you're not someone who inherently deserves it#that is: someone who just can & will Stop It if done to them. well so you see winston pushing back is ignored or treated to further#backlash & then he withdraws (expression of his experience / creation of a consequence which tells the other Stop Doing This)#&/or otherwise conveys displeasure / being hurt (same as before. ''uh well push back / express xyz'' ppl did & were steamrolled/ignored)
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