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withthewindinherfootsteps · 1 month ago

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Wei Wuxian and Narrative Agency – Part Three

For Xiantober Day Five: Past and Present, in which the author gets very unhinged about what parts of the past are shown and how that’s affected by the present!

(Part One | Part Two | Full version on AO3)

The Power of Agency: Shaping the Narrative

When I've discussed Wei Wuxian's agency previously, I’ve talked about how what’s shown and omitted tells us about a character, and we’ve talked about the character himself. Though this is a niche topic, it’s not necessarily something out of the ordinary to analyse, and we can assume everything up to here has been in some way intentional.

This? Linking structure to a character’s in-universe preferences?

This is where we get unhinged.

Before I start, let’s quickly establish something which will be important later: although Wei Wuxian is the central character, MDZS isn’t strictly from his POV. While omitting events a character doesn’t like to dwell on and concealing things the character wishes to hide is common in books with only one narrator, MDZS has multiple narrators which it switches between relatively quickly. This includes Wei Wuxian, but it also includes nearly every major character that appears in the story, and omniscient narrator as well. As a default, this format doesn’t lead to this deliberate shaping and omission because of one character’s preferences, since we have many other sources of information and events – which is what makes Wei Wuxian’s influence over the narrative and structure so interesting. We could have access to a lot more information, and access to it at different times, than we do (and that’s not an insult, quite the opposite!).

To begin: we’ve established that times such as Wei Wuxian’s time on the streets, his three months in the Burial Mounds and his loss in the Siege aren’t shown because Wei Wuxian has little agency there. But that’s not the only special thing about them. They’re also the three most traumatic times in his life, and so moments Wei Wuxian himself either can’t remember, or doesn’t like to dwell on.

This is why discussing Wei Wuxian’s treatment of tragedy in his life was important. Firstly, it shows he doesn’t focus on the tragedy in his life, so the idea that the narrative not focusing on this tragedy relates to his character has merit; secondly, it affirms that this is not a passive trait, but a choice. Therefore, when the narrative omits events due to this aspect of Wei Wuxian, it’s respecting not only a character detail – which would be cool by itself – but also an active decision. One that shapes the story it’s made in.

In other words, its very structure is respecting Wei Wuxian’s agency!

Now, of course there are flashbacks to other moments of his past he probably wouldn’t like to dwell on, too. But within the structure, they’re only shown when Wei Wuxian is thinking about them (or when he has reason to)!

Wei WuXian hadn’t woken up yet. His eyes were still tightly shut, yet his hand didn’t let go either. He seemed to be dreaming, muttering, “… Don’t… Don’t be angry…” Lan WangJi seemed somewhat surprised. His voice was gentle, “I am not angry.” Wei WuXian, “… Oh.” Hearing this, as though he finally felt assured, his fingers loosened. Lan WangJi sat beside Wei WuXian for a while. Seeing that he was motionless again, he was about to stand up when Wei WuXian grabbed him with his other hand, hugging his arm and refusing to let go. He shouted, “I’ll go with you, quick, take me back to your sect!” Chapter 63, EXR translation

Which, of course, is him dwelling on…

Lan WangJi spoke one word at a time, “Go back to Gusu with me.” Hearing this, both Wei WuXian and Jiang Cheng were surprised. Quickly afterward, Wei WuXian laughed, “Go back to Gusu with you? To the Cloud Recesses? Why go there?” He immediately seemed to realize, “Oh. I forgot. Your uncle Lan QiRen hates crooked people like me. You’re his proudest disciple, so of course you’re the same as him, haha. I refuse.” Chapter 62, EXR translation

…the painful flashback immediately preceding this. The third set of flashbacks (which are also painful) are a similar case. Look at the contex:

He lifted the bottom of his robe, revealing a prosthetic leg made of wood, “This leg of mine was destroyed by you, that night in the Nightless City (…)” (…) “Wei WuXian, I won’t ask you if you remember or not. Both of my parents died by your hands. You owe too many people. You definitely won’t remember them either. But, I, Fang MengChen, will never forget! And never forgive you!” (…) “In the fight at Qiongqi Path, my son was strangled to death by your dog Wen Ning!” “My shixiong died by poison, his entire body festering due to your cruel curse!” Chapter 68 (immediately preceding the flashbacks), EXR translation

And Wei Wuxian’s own thoughts and words:

Wei WuXian looked at the cultivators before the Demon-Slaughtering Cave. Their expressions were the absolute same as those of the cultivators from the night of the pledge conference, pouring their wine on the ground as they took the pledge to scatter the ashes of the Wen Sect’s remnants and him. (…) Wei WuXian, “Now it’s time to ask just whom it is that treasures it so much. It’s like Wen Ning. Back then, some certain sects or so were scared to death of the Ghost General. They said they’d kill him on the surface, but behind their backs they hid him for over ten years. How strange. Who was the one that said his ashes had been scattered back then?” Chapter 79 (immediately succeeding the flashbacks), EXR translation

Once again, Wei Wuxian’s own thoughts relate to the flashbacks we’ve just been shown. And, as I previously mentioned, though all the events which are shown are tragic, they’re also events which Wei Wuxian’s own choices and actions shaped – which he has this to say about:

“The things I did, not only do you remember them, I remember them too. You won’t forget them, and they’ll stay even longer in my mind!” Chapter 82, EXR

Admittedly, this applies more to the third set of flashbacks than the second (which is still fitting as the third set was the most recent), as in the second, although he still had agency within and influence over his circumstances, the majority of the pain was caused by others’ actions (excluding, of course, the Golden Core transfer… which is something we know stays for a long time in his mind, albeit with a caveat we’ll soon discuss). But it’s still important to note – especially considering that otherwise, focusing on this very painful time in his life wouldn’t seem like something very in-character for Wei Wuxian to do.

Of course, this can all just be explained by good writing. It is best to insert flashbacks when they’re relevant to the characters and events in the present day! But it is interesting to compare these to the start of the (not painful) Gusu flashbacks, which open this way:

At a later time, Wei WuXian pondered upon the reason why his relationship with Lan WangJi wasn’t good. Getting to the root of the matter, everything started when he was fifteen, coming to the GusuLan Sect with Jiang Cheng to study for three months. Chapter 13, EXR

Again, considering the circumstances around which these flashbacks take place – returning to the Cloud Recesses for the first time since the lectures, and meeting Lan Wangji once more – it makes complete sense for Wei Wuxian to be thinking about these events*. So it does fit the pattern of Wei Wuxian dwelling on something, thus leading to the narrative dwelling on it, too (and being shaped by his thoughts)… but there’s another layer to this. Importantly, it is the only flashback where Wei Wuxian’s present thoughts don’t lead to this happening, with his thoughts at an unspecified future time leading to it, instead. I like to interpret this as the text saying that, since these events aren’t something Wei Wuxian wouldn’t focus on in normal circumstances, he can dwell on them at any time. Therefore, they’re free to come up in the narrative at any time as well, even if he’s not dwelling on them in the present moment!

So, to summarise: Wei Wuxian’s decision not to focus on the painful times in his life directly influences the narrative to not focus on these times. When painful times are brought up and shown to us, it’s in the context of him thinking about them in the present day, and even then, his most painful moments still aren’t shown to us. His agency in this regard is still respected by the narrative structure.

This is the main way his agency influences the structure of the narrative, but I’d like to talk about the revealing and concealing of information, too. For example, I said I’d talk about the Golden Core transfer – though Wei Wuxian does think about this many times, as evidenced by his internal narration in Chapter 103. But unlike everything we’re shown through the flashbacks, this is something Wei Wuxian is actively trying to hide from others. And the narrative respects this choice (Wei Wuxian’s agency, again), never reveals it even when it would be relevant in the flashbacks, and we find out not through narration, but through a character’s dialogue!

And to clarify – I know these aspects may not be in the book for this exact reason. Showing flashbacks in relevant moments is good writing, concealing an important plot point you want to do a reveal for is necessary writing, and MXTX has said she didn’t want to write about Wei Wuxian’s time in the Burial Mounds, due to not liking to write transformation sequences (and also because it would not be pleasant at all, which likely also applies to Wei Wuxian’s death). That doesn’t prevent it from also being intentional – MXTX’s intelligence is shown in many aspects of this book, and there’s nothing disproving it – but there’s no proof for either option, so I won’t pretend there is. I bring this up because I know this feels like I’m overanalysing, as I feel that way as well.

But, whether it’s intentional or not, it exists in the text, and I adore it – so, regardless, it’s something I’ll explore. Because taking this into account… We aren't just told about Wei Wuxian having agency, we aren’t just shown it in the text, we aren’t even just shown it through which parts of his past are shown and hidden in the structure of the text (as I talked about in Part One). The parts of the past that are shown and hidden also have an in-universe reason for being shown and hidden, this reason being the choices he makes! Agency is the ability of a character to influence the story they’re in, but Wei Wuxian’s agency, as a property of a character who only exists in-universe, shapes the out-of-universe structure as well! That’s how we’re shown its importance! How cool is that?

At The End Of The Road: Summary and Final Thoughts

In this essay, we’ve covered how important Wei Wuxian’s agency is not only to the events of the plot, but to the structure of the narrative as well. The narrative omits periods in which Wei Wuxian has little or no agency, in favour of showing us periods in which he does, even when important events happened in the former. This indicates that who Wei Wuxian is without agency isn’t important enough to be shown to the audience, and therefore that his agency is an integral aspect of his character in MDZS. We’ve discussed how both in-universe and out-of-universe, tragedy does not define him – out-of-universe, the tragic events in Wei Wuxian’s life are used not to build sympathy but rather to show his strength of character and who he still is despite going through them; and in-universe, he chooses not to focus on the negativity and resentment caused by his circumstances or others’ actions, instead staying true to his moral compass and enjoying his life in the present day. Finally, we’ve also explored how this choice is another reason for the omission of certain events from the narrative, resulting in his agency shaping the story in a very literal way – it affects the out-of-universe structure, as well.

It’s quite fitting, for a story whose essence is about defying a conventional narrative – that of righteous clans rising up and defeating a great evil – and about a character who defies many conventional narratives on his own – that of status defining how skilled you could be, that for a golden core being necessary for cultivation and other paths being unavailable, that of a tragic but complete story of someone killed for staying true to their moral code (instead, that character returns to life and has a happy ending) – to have its own narrative play a role in such an important and interesting way.

(Or, if an image would be preferable:)

Thank you for reading!

(Part One | Part Two | Full version on AO3)

*This strong relation to the present day circumstances is another reason I love the flashback placement so much (and why I think it’s such a loss both screen adaptions altered it so strongly)!

#get ready for tag thoughts because there are a LOT of them #it’s for THIS reason that fanon wwx bothers me so much (didn’t want to get negative on the acual post)#bc so often all the changes are changes that woobify him!#self-sacrificial idiot wwx?? only doing things because… poor him he has so many internal issues and values himself so little-#-so of course he’d sacrifice everything before thinking of another option? woobifying #(whenever he sacrifices something it’s a deliberate choice to act on his morals because he values his morals so much – and he’s also very-#-capable and DOES often find ways for no people to get hurt!)#wasn’t aware that what happened to him at lotus pier was wrong and needs lwj to tell him that for him to have any idea if it?#woobifying (as we see in the lotus seed pod extra he KNOWS it’s unfair)#(he downplays it retroactively in his memory (links into not focusing on the bad things in his life))#(but that’s the actions themselves that are being downplayed not their fairness!)#he chooses to act! he is defined by acting! not tragedy – all the more impressive in the face of the amount of tragedy that’s happened #he could SO EASILY have been a woobie but instead he’s the opposite of one: defined BY his agency instead of the absence of it #that doesn’t mean he’s not impacted by tragedy or trauma – he is! but it’s not the most important aspect of his character (bc he doesn’t le #it’s also something that bothers me about the changes cql made #by making qq path and nightless city the fault of someone else it means he IS someone who’s more a victim of circumstance than anything els #he had no control over the tragedies of his first life at all #apart from ig his death being controlled by him? because he just leaps off the cliff during the nightless city siege?? but in THAT case it’#i watched that part recently (i’m getting through it very slowly) and yeah it reaffirmed my love for this aspect of the book even more #despite. having these exact thoughts for two years already #he also dwells on the past events a lot more than book wwx which adds to that version of him BEING defined more by tragedy rather than who #anyway over 7.3k words total (and 400 more in the tags apparently)... it'll be posted to ao3 in its completion this evening!#mdzs meta #my meta #wei wuxian #mdzs #mo dao zu shi #魔道祖师 #grandmaster of demonic cultivation #gdc

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nachosncheezies · 2 months ago

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In defense of late-canon x files (including the revivals)

I was thinking about this poll after I commented on it, and I kinda want to be brave and say more.

Short answer to the poll's question before I go any further: If you're a new fan and a sensitive sort who thinks you'll struggle with your blorbos Really Going Through It and you really need a happy ending, I suggest you stop at the end of season 8. Do not pass go, do not look at spoilers. Disregard this post entirely, close the internet, and go look at something that makes you happy. (Also fuck every part of society that characterizes sensitivity as inherently weak and bad and some kind of personal failing, you are valid.)

That said, "quality" as a concept is entirely subjective, and the question of whether or not there's a decline in quality for any story is wholly subjective, too. In the case of x files? I'm not convinced there is a decline. I am going to be upfront that I haven't yet watched past season 8, though I am almost completely spoiled on events after that - and the reason I haven't watched yet is not because of how I know events are going to unfold, but simply because I don't want it to end!!! Ohh, the tension between "I CAN'T WAIT!!!" and "Nooo don't be over D:"

When I first came to txf fandom on tumblr and gradually became spoiled about what happens in late canon though, I was often left uncomfortable and tbh kinda queasy about it. As I said in my comment on the poll, the hate for especially the revival and IWTB, or to a lesser extent even seasons 8 & 9, is very well documented. But! There are other takes to be found here on tumblr if you figure out where to look, and my feelings have changed!

The thing is, I have yet to find myself in any fandom where there isn't a vocal subset of fans who dislike the story after a certain point. I am not joking when I say that no one hates the things they love as passionately as sci-fi and fantasy fans. In my experience, it often hinges on the extent to which a viewer has strong notions on where they would like the characters to end up. In particular with series where shipping is a dominant component for the bulk of a fandom, I have almost universally found that there comes some turning point in the story where "let them be happy you cowards" is the dominant view, and things that compromise the attainment of a degree of romantic stability and/or domesticity are, to many fans, annoying at best and despicable at worst. But! As one tagset on the linked poll said:

and I think for any fandom, that last tag especially is so so so important. (I think that's harder for people watching a weekly series live, bc you have so much time to analyze and speculate and dream before the next breadcrumb drops, but I digress.)

So why am I saying this and how do I apply it to x files? Well, I eventually found that there are also a subset of fans who find redeeming things right up to the very end and actually quite like the whole thing! The things that I had seen people rage and ventpost so much about honestly never quite sounded to me as "out of character" or "untrue to the story" etc as those same ventposts made them sound. And I've discovered I'm not the only one who felt that way. Do I love that the spooky squad had to go through all of those things? No, those poor guys D: Life is hard and they have been through so much trauma. But do those events and their choices make sense to me in light of everything that came before? Yes! And I honestly can't wait to see them fight to overcome those things, breaking, healing, always learning, always growing, always getting better.

So if you're wondering "where does it go wrong"... well, I'm a completionist, as many people who've answered that post are, but also my personal opinion is that I don't think it does go wrong. If you're new and interested in exploring why I've gone from "vaguely queasy" to "excited" about the whole thing, or want to maybe balance out the impressions you're getting about the later seasons before deciding whether or not you want to see the whole thing, I'll put a few blog names in the comments.

Final admission: even once I started feeling a little more confident in the possibility that "actually ok maybe I'm not crazy, maybe this all kind of is in character and does make sense", there was one big plot point that I was NOT looking forward to and I thought I would never be comfortable about. In hindsight, I think my discomfort came from the negative responses being SO seemingly universal that I hadn't stopped to let myself truly consider other possible interpretations on that point. (I mean my initial instinct when I first read about it was, why are we mad about this?? CSM is literally the most unreliable narrator in history???? it's obviously fake news?????? this must be either a fever dream someone's having or it's a misdirection ploy against whatever shadowy forces might still be lurking?????????????? but for whatever reason I guess I had halfway written that off.) Happily, just last month there's a new post-s11 novel out, and although reviews for the book as a whole are mixed, it seems to have laid the groundwork for resolving that plot issue in a way I think most fans would be broadly happy with. If you're interested in being spoiled about that and seeing how, I recommend searching #perihelion on @agent-troi who liveblogged reading it with receipts, scroll back chronological-style to the first post on the subject and see how it unfolded. (And never forget that Dana Katherine Scully is the queen of denial as a coping mechanism lol)

Everyone's mileage will vary. Each person can feel however they want! But for anyone new, I wanted you to know that the very many ventposts you might be seeing are not all there is to this show or its fandom. Some of us love it despite - or even because of - all the things that went "wrong". I think we just don't talk about it as much.

#i don't talk about it much because tbh it can get *fraught*. and i've had that in other fandoms too.#i added and deleted so many qualifiers from this post over it lmao #people are passionate about fandom which is great! as a concept #but it sucks feeling like most people hate the thing you love or that - however diplomatically it's phrased - you should hate it too #or that folks think maybe you *would* be mad if you just looked at it a certain (sometimes seemingly cast as the 'correct') way #basically it's insane that half the time when i see people standing up and praising the revival i'm like 'damn bruh. you brave'#and feeling that way is partly a me thing. but i've seen posts that also lead me to believe it's not JUST a me thing yaknow?#i always wonder whether the 'vocal subset' in any given fandom who hate a thing are really the majority that they appear to be #or if they just appear to be the majority because they've needed to be vocal about it as a sort of internet support group thing lol #which fair enough i mean anyone's entitled to be disappointed or have feelings #for me? i don't think i can remember ever being mad about a series i liked #i'm just here for the vibes man i very rarely have fixed notions #i say to the writers: go ahead and surprise me. i'll make sense of pretty much anything they throw at me #i also think about a dd quote i saw ages ago that as an actor you (paraphrased): can't say 'the character would not do that'#...because if it's in the script then by definition they *did* do that. it's right there on the page.#and that's kind of me as a fan too.#p.s. i fucking love season 8 i love angst and holy shit it delivers. the new characters are fantastic the journey is *chef's kiss* and #yes i consider certain temperamental even assholeish behavior to also be *chef's kiss* there's so much trauma so much reason for it #it's be-yoo-ti-ful 💕 season 8 my beloved 😍#anyway watch it all watch none do what you want. just know that there are people who would cuddle the whole damn thing from start to finish #like a floppy wet lil raggedy ann doll if only they COULD #x files #the x files #txf revival #txf thoughts #i love you floppy wet raggedy ann doll

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ipwarn · 7 months ago

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Just watched the latest Starkid livestream - yes of course I was awake at 5 am on a Sunday - and I love this very specific throughline of Darren's life. It is especially clear after listening to his recent episodes of And That's What You Really Missed. Darren has always pissed off the people around him by being happy when everyone else was stressed.

Nick and Matt went on a mini rant about their experience making Starship and how the show was so derailed by Darren getting cast in Glee. He barely managed to write half of the intended songs for that show - all in his trailer on the Glee set. Matt specifically recounted the story of Darren popping over to Chicago to surprise his friends while they were rehearsing and it was hilarious. Darren being Darren he thought they would all be thrilled to see him and just thrilled to be doing a new musical, but instead he was met with dead silence, followed by a demand for the rest of the songs.

This man is forever happy to be making fun things with a big group of people. And the people around him have to deal with it.

The actual world inside Darren's head VS everyone around him:

#I did love what he said on ATWYRM #like he fully acknowledged how annoying that can be #if it's a really stressful day and he is fucking bouncing off the walls in his giddiness #Jenna and Kevin both seemed to imply his joy was consistent and at times very grating #which is 100% fair #he must have been told to shut the fuck up so many times on the set of Glee and in Starkid shows #Darren #Starkid #Glee #I will say I do love the Starship songs so damn much #especially The Way I Do #it's a beautiful love song

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lovesodeepandwideandwell · 2 months ago

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Besties give me a diplomatic phrasing to communicate "if I leave for the evening and tell you roughly when I'll be back and text 20 minutes before I'm home on your request, please be done having screaming sex by the time I'm home"

#this is the third time i've walked in and like #ok to be fair i said before they got married that i wouldn't be uncomfortable if they're not uncomfy with me hearing #but i feel like that's a fair boundary to change #esp given. the screaming #i just need the words to say that a) minimize awkwardness #b) avoid the implication that i'm trying to curtail their sex life #i'm happy for them to have sex! that isn't audible from the front porch!!!#i guess the other part that feels weird is the whole point of spending nights away is so they can be comfortable having sex #without me around #which is a huge drain on my energy and sleep and time management and heck even gas budget #but if they're totally fine having sex when i'm out of the house for an hour as on book club night?#and if they wait til i'm on my way home after being gone for 4 hours?#why am i doing that??#i'm SORRY i'm talking so much about my roommates having sex #it's very present in my life #just be glad you follow me now and not 6 years ago when i lived with julie and she picked up trevis on tinder #and had him over across the hall from poor little fresh out of evangelical college me #(yes trevis. pronounced like crevice. or trellis.)

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luck-of-the-drawings · 8 months ago

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OH ARTHUR BENNETT.. such a gorgeous and intriguing character. terribly burdened by a GRUESOME set of crimes, his light suffocated by a HEAVY century of GUILT. so tragic, so dark and broody, and yet PAINFULLY awkward in any social setting ever

#jrwi fanart #cw blood #jrwi show #jrwi suckening #arthur bennett #OUHH THIS ONE WAS SITTING IN MY WIPS FOR SO LOOOONGwhen i took it out there was mould on it :sob:#BUT i think i was able to fix it up okay #i keep seeing SO MANY MISTAKES RRAAAHHH BUT YOU DONT SEE THEM RIGHT?? THATS ONLY ME. RIGHT?? EXACTLY.#THE KEY IS TO SAY. AND REPEAT AFTER ME. 'FUUUCK IT WE BALL #so anyway. arthur bennett huh? grizzly says that arthur is reaal fuckin difficult to play. and i SUPER get that. i mean LOOK AT HIM..#grizz often needs a minute to think abt what hes gonna say in a way that matches w that Stoic Personality. which is FAIR but also that #ends up making way for awkward confrontations like: the lady in the parky lot. he took too long to answer and scared her away.& I LOVE THAT #arthur is tragic and sad and cool and stoic but hes ALSO awkward and silly and kinda dumb and short sighted. HE HAS COMPLEXITIES #I LOVE WHEN TTRPG CHARACTERS HAVE A GOOD SET OF SHORTCOMINGS. ESPECIALLY WHEN U FIND THEM ONLY AS U PLAY THEM.#I COULd go on and on saying the same things w different words abt arthurs intriguing and entertaining character but i shall spare u. for no #ILL ALSO MENTION HOW MUCH I LOVE HIS FLAVOR THO.. I LOVE TALL HOT BOY WHOS ONE W THE DARKNESS.. I REMEMBER WHEN HE FIRST MENTIONED THE #BADLUCK. N I WAS LIKE OOOHH THATS WHY HIS DESIGN IS SO COOL N CHAOTIC N ASYMMETRICAL. HES UNLUCKY!!! i love love love his design so much...#GRaaauruguguraguhhghghgh what else what else is there for me to spew on abt...i think im reachin a limit here..OH MAGNUS. i hope that #we get to know more abt how magnus and arthur met.. like How they became besties... ouuhh... I ALSO WANNA KNOW MORE ABT MARY DAVIS. LIKEHOW #he also apparently spent alotta time in a zone dominated by edward twilight? all he remembers is constant partying? I WANNA KNOW MORE..#i think i got room 4 one more ramble SO. THE ART PIECE.as i said its gone a lil stale BUT. im still very proud o the bits where hes allScar #I WANNA SEE HIM GET SCARYMORE. I like the idea of shadows solidifying to make him strange and eerie.like TEETH n CLAWS n SPINES n YESS #also the SILVER EYES.no1 does silver eyes like the show Claymore. they make em look so striking and eerie...i also like to think that #human arthur had deep beautiful brown eyes.just in my beaitufl heart.i mean look at him..i wanna cook him n eat him.ANYWAY #i think thats all my ramblin for this piece. now i gotta go cancel a single day i had ata hotel bc my work schedule change last minute FUCK #feel free to ramble in my tags aswell tho i read all of them and i chew on thenm and i love them so sos os mcuh

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daily-hanamura · 1 year ago

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#persona 4 #p4 #persona 4 dancing all night #p4d #hanamura yosuke #yosuke hanamura #satonaka chie #chie satonaka #see this is super funny because chie describes yosuke as cool behind his back and we know she finds him reliable and trustworthy #esp in p4au where we see how she turns to yosuke for affirmation when shes frustrated or terrified #chie and yosuke quibble a lot and shes 100% joking here because its very much in line with the kind of ribbing the IT give each other #i feel like yosuke took this a bit seriously though yaboy probably went home and replayed that moment over and over again in his head #so i guess when i say super funny i guess i mean someone please give yosuke a hug by which i mean lets all give yosuke a hug #i think he reacts like this a lot to be fair its rare that hes calm enough to realise that hes being poked fun at #he's good with his queue

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ganondoodle · 2 months ago

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(probably very problematic opinion on the english voices in totk

watching skittybitty's totk video for the 27864269th time and i STILL get jumpscared by the english voices, anytime anyone ever opens their mouth it just sounds like they took some random person they caught on the street to monotonely voice a line in one take, and sometimes one of them rly likes to pretend their are doing a voice but it just sounds like a little child imitating their granpa or someone trying to overact to their toddler, its especially sad for ganondorf, its hard to hear any of them for me but gan i start laughing and have to skip it bc thats NOT gan, thats me doing my worst evil guy impression, or zelda, thats not zelda talkign thats me doing a sarcastic uwu lil princess voice

to be clear, i have nothing agaisnt the people voicing them and i know people like the guy doing the gan voice but none of them fit at all and none feel like they are actually coming from the character, much more so you muting your TV and talking over the people on screen making shit up as you go for shits and giggles, i dont know what happened here, why are these SO bad, i listen to plenty of movies and games and whatnot in english and i only ever had a similar problem with the english voices of ghibli movies -though that could be bc im jsut so used to the german ones, which are fantastic- or maybe an extremely old game that was just weird on its own even

i take no pride in hating the voices, espeically knowing how badly voice actors are treated and often replaced with some shitty celebtrity, but i truly do not get why they are so bad, the voices themselves never rly fit, and even if it would be passable, they are all speaking in a way where it either sounds like they are some guy sitting next to you reading a line for the first time or overemphasizing so much it sounds like someone playing pretend with toddlers

and its not in an indie game where the devs did their best to voice people themselves bc they didnt have the money, this is nintendo, how is it still like that, bc even the ones returning from botw, are STILL just as bad, i dont know if that can all be the fault of the actors, its so weird to me

and it makes it even harder for me to believe that people take this game as seriously as they do or as emotionally affecting bc a, if not THE, biggest part of the fandom is made up of english speakers who would probably never even think about trying a different language

...anyway, i needed to say that at some point)

#ganondoodles talks #zelda #ganondoodles rants #also not trying to make fun of anyone #i just CANNOT take any of them serious #to be fair the german ones arent that much better in this case #most characters were fine but gan also didnt fit at all there #zeldas french voice is pretty great #but admittedly i havent heard every single one .. or remember them clearly #the japanese ones are the only ones i fully played with though half my og botw playthrough was in german #which was fine but didnt work for totk bc .... gan #even his japanese voice could have been a bit more .. unique? like the little bit of voices in the older games sounded very unique #kind rough like an old smokers voice? hard to describe lol #he just sounds like an evil guy there too in a way but at least its spoken with so much emotion #maybe this is a me problem #i hate to be falling into the 'only japanese voices in anime!!' thing but .... welll i guess in this case i am #(.. arcane for example i only saw in english and it was fantastic)#(i dont get how nintendo cant find voices like that.. or whatever went wrong there)

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