#tw split attraction model

[our-arospec-experience]

What is SAM?

I mean, I’ve seen people explaining it using big, technical terms and I dot. Really get it.

good question :]

The Split Attraction Model (SAM) differentiates attraction into different forms.

The SAM allows individuals to describe their orientations separately, for example, aromantic and pansexual.

some individuals may also include a tertiary attraction in their identities.

Not all a-spec individuals use the SAM, most notably, non-SAM aros.

Some individuals prefer more precise terms for differentiation such as "romantic orientation", "attraction types", etc.

Not every individual who experiences different types of attraction necessarily have a distinct romantic orientation, and not every individual who has a romantic orientation necessarily experiences multiple types of attraction.

keep in mind, not everyone uses the SAM model. Whether you use it or not, you are valid :)

[libbyscribbles]

hi! In your pinned post it says you do pride blinkies, would you be able to make a non-SAM aro one? if so, thank you!!

of course! here you go :)

let me know if there's a different flag you'd rather i use, or a different color scheme!

[koifishanonymous]

hey fyi @/did-is-not-real is an aphobe, and as you can tell from their url, a pluralphobe as well. they just spread heaps of misinfo and arent even trying to sustain a debate so do yourself a favour and block them and also report them for hate speech (or spam? im not quite sure)

[unrestrainedbalderdash]

NOOO WHY'S THERE BI LESBIAN EXCLUSION IN THE ORIENTED AROACE TAG.

[carrionne0]

Cool Aro and/or Ace Spec Resources + Other Stuff!!

This list is for ALL people regardless of your identity. This blog is a safe space for all types of aro and/or ace spec people. Hate will NOT be tolerated. Questions are okay! :)

Also! I can't fit all the cool things I found on this list, so I'll make another one in the future! :)

Cool things!

Are You on the Aromantic Spectrum (quiz)?

Are You on the Asexual Spectrum (quiz)?

Aro Ace Character Database

Aro Arrows

Aro-Owned Businesses

Aro-Recommended

Asexual Pride Friendship Bracelet Tutorial

Attraction Layer Cake

Books With Asexual Main Characters

Canon Aroace Characters

Canon Aro and Ace Characters

Crochet Pride Turtle Modification Guide

Free Asexual Bee Crochet Pattern

Free Asexual Flag Cross Stitch Pattern Ace of Spades

Free/Online Aromantic & Asexual Fiction

LGBTQ+ Flags in Minecraft - Banner Tutorial

Pride Patch Tutorials

Learning and Resources!

7 Tips For Coming Out As Ace

Ace/Aro Mythbusting

Ace & Aro Spectrum Definitions

Advice on Coming Out As Aromantic

A Guide to Allo Aro Inclusion in A-Spec Communities

Am I Demisexual If...

Aromantic Info Carrd

Aromantic Spectrum Wiki Stub

Asexual Advice Tumblr

Asexual Affirmations: Things That Don't Make You Any Less Ace

Asexuality and Disability

Asexual Spectrum Wiki Stub

Ask An Aromantic Tumblr

Bi-Oriented Aroace Carrd

List of A-Spec Identities & Info

Myths About Demisexuals

Oriented and Angled Aroace Carrd

Split Attraction Model

Types of Tertiary Attraction

What Is Graysexuality?

Why I’m Founding Disabled Ace Day

Queering The Narrative: Tropes to Avoid When Writing Asexual Characters (intended for allosexuals, not asexual authors)

People's Stories!

An Interview About Allosexual Aromantics

Aro/Ace Confessions Tumblr

Aromantic Coming Out Stories

Asexual Authors Discuss Why They Write and Their Experiences

Asexual Coming Out Stories

Asexual Disabled People Exist, But Don’t Make Assumptions About Us

Asexuality Exists Tumblr

Existing and Defying Stereotypes As An A-Spec Disabled Person

Gray-Romantic, Grieving, and Dealing with More Internalized Amatonormativity than I Thought (tw: internalized arophobia, abuse)

How Asexual and Aromantic People Observe a Day Dedicated to Love

If You Can See the Invisible Elephant, Please Describe It

I'm Aromantic and Asexual - And I Love Valentine's Day

Is It Possible For Me To Be Lesbian and Aroace at the Same Time?

I’ve Realized I’m Asexual but Have Internalised Aphobia, So What Now? (tw: internalized acephobia)

Lesbian Ace and Aro Perspectives

‘Not Broken’: The Struggles of Being an Aromantic Allosexual

Three People Who Identify as Asexual and Aromantic Explain What V Day Is Like For Them

What Is It Like Being Allo Aro?

Communities!

Reddit

r/aaaaaaaarrrrro (memes)

r/aaaaaaacccccccce (memes)

r/aaaaaaaspeccccccc (memes)

r/aaabatterycult

r/aaapeople

r/aaarrroooaaaccceee

r/aarrrooooooaaacceeeee (memes)

r/aceandaroart (art)

r/acearoautistics

r/aceconfessions

r/acefood (food)

r/ace_arosover30

r/acesoftwaregeeks (programming)

r/aceteens

r/aegoromantic

r/aegosexuals

r/agenderaroace

r/allo_ace

r/amiace (ask)

r/angledaroace

r/animace (anime/manga)

r/apothiromantic

r/apothisexual

r/arcsexual

r/aroace

r/aroaceadults

r/aroacebooks (books)

r/aroacechristianity (christianity)

r/aroacecommunity

r/aroacenby

r/aroaceflux

r/aroaceindia (india)

r/aroacememes (memes)

r/aroacepoly

r/aroaceteens

r/aroallo

r/aroandacelife

r/aromantic

r/aromanticasexual

r/aromanticcirclejerk (satire)

r/asexual

r/asexualcirclejerk (satire)

r/asexualdating (dating)

r/asexualgamers (gaming)

r/asexualgaymen

r/asexualindians (india)

r/asexuality

r/asexuals_lesbians

r/asexualmen

r/asexuals_in_love

r/asexualteens

r/askallosexual (ask)

r/askaroace (ask)

r/askasexual (ask)

r/biorientedaroace

r/biroace

r/biromanticasexual

r/cupioromantic

r/cupiosexual

r/dateademi (dating)

r/demiromantic

r/demisexuality

r/faceoface (photos)

r/fictoromantic

r/fictosexual

r/fraysexual

r/graysexual

r/greyromantic

r/greysexuality

r/heteroromanticasexual

r/lithromanitc

r/lithrosexual

r/mildly_ace (photos)

r/myrsesexual

r/orientedaroace

r/panromanticasexuality

r/placiosexualityu

r/sexfavorableace

r/sexrepulsed

r/taskforcealphaalpha

r/traaaaaaarrrrrrro (memes)

r/transasexuals

r/tripleabattery

r/quiromantic

r/quiosexual

Forums

Arocalypse

The Asexuality Visibility and Education Network

Demi Grace

Organizations

Ace & Aros

The Ace and Aro Advocacy Project

Ace Week

Aromantic Spectrum Awareness Week

Asexuality Archive

Asexual Outreach

The Association for Asexuals in Denmark

AUREA

Resources For Ace Survivors

Discord (I don’t used discord so I haven’t verified if these are any good, but I choose the most popular ones)

Ace Homies

Ace Planet

Acing the Arrows

The Aro & Ace Café

Bows & Aros

For Creatives (Artists, Writers, etc.)

Aromantic Writing Month

Carnival of Aces

Carnival of Aros

Arospec Poetry Network

Aro Worlds

Videos

Asexuality 101 (playlist) (Haven't watch all the vids yet, but the ones I've seen seem pretty good)

Ways to Show Your Aro and Ace Pride

Tumblrs

(If I should remove any of these, let me know)

Acespec-Ed

ActuallySafe-For-Aro

Aro Humor

Asexual-Society

Asexual Spectrum Spector

AVENPT (Asexual Visibility and Education Network Project Team)

Fuck Yeah Asexual

Growing Up Aro

Perks of Being Ace

The Humorous Ace

Your Fav Is Aromantic

Inclusive Picrews

Heart Hold Character

Legitimate ID Maker

Little Guy Maker

Opossum Party

PotatoLord’s Persona Creator

Prideful Cats

Pride Icon Maker

Wervty’s Obscured Icon Maker

If you have any other cool aro and/or ace things you’d like to share, please let me know and I’ll add it to the list! :) Also, if there's anything I should remove, let me know (and please tell me the reason why)!

[anti-endo-aspec-space]

welcome to the anti endo aspec space!

[pt: welcome to the anti endo aspec space! /end pt]

we've seen a lot of pro endos in general aspec spaces & have felt insecure because of it, so we decided to create space for anti endo aspecs specifically. feel free to share your aspec experiences, thoughts, joys, vents, whatever you want to! every aspecs, not only aros and aces, are welcome here. your experiences may be related or unrelated to being a system / having a cdd.

about us

[pt: about us /end pt]

pronouns it/void. use we/us and i/me interchangeable. we're autistic cdid system with avpd, ocpd, and other physical and mental disabilities. we're loveless / heartless aromantic, asexual, and aplatonic. may sometimes post our aspec experiences here too.

what is aspec?

[pt: what is aspec? /end pt]

aspec is an umbrella term for having little to no attraction or gender feeling. aspec includes asexual, aromantic, aplatonic, anaesthetic, afamilial, analterous, etc. lack or absence some type of attraction. usually, aspec is used for orientation labels, but some agender people consider agenderness being part of aspec too. some people use split attraction model where types of attraction (sexual, romantic, platonic, alterous, familial, aesthetical, sensual, etc.) are seen as separated from each other. some people don't use split attraction model to describe their attraction or lack of it. both ways of describing own experience are valid.

dni (do not interact)

[pt: dni (do not interact) /end pt]

bigots (racists, sexists, queermisist, ableist, and other discriminations supporters), terfs, transmeds

endogenic / nontraumagenic systems and supporters

amisists, aspec exclusionists

radqueers, transids

pro-contact paras

anti-xenogenders, anti-neopronouns, anti-"contradictory" labels, anti-mogai

anti self-diagnosis

personality disorders abuse believers (narcissic abuse, etc.)

tagging things

[pt: tagging things /end pt]

#aspec space ask - for your asks

#aspec space [relationships] - for explicit and detailed descriptions of relationships and attraction. (ie, #aspec space sex, #aspec space romance, #aspec space friendship, #aspec space qpr, etc.)

#aspec space vents - for vents

#tw [insert trigger] - for triggering topics (ie, #tw amisia, #tw queermisia, etc.)

please try to put trigger warnings in your asks if they contain potentially triggering topics. i will try to find and tag triggers too. if i miss something, feel free to ask me to tag it.

[anulithots]

Welcome, non-plant beings, my creatures of night and nonsense, my dear audience, to this weird and wonderous collection of mine.

I promise you won't be told a story with an answer, with some "here's how I fixed my life & the journey it took to get there" I promise that there won't be a "hope to get better" which makes now feel so stark in contrast. I promise I wont make it seem simple or linear or a sudden "aha moment" to make things suddenly seem clear.

What I promise is a story, to the best of my ability, where there are no weeds to pull. no seeds to plant, no fruits to pick. The garden will grow and die, change & cycle back to the beginning. And through it all, in this moment with the dappled sun reflecting off the dew, the weeds in a thick blanket, forgotten fruit as a feast for the birds - we are wild and it is beautiful, no matter how much they want a cultivated, perfectly trimmed and oh-so-stale-garden.

----

TL;DR - I'm currently in a Link Click hyperfixation, and I my main WIP is the Land of the Fallen Fairies. I also have a biology fanfiction and a teddy bear nightmare warrior story on the side. And I like being asked about character analysis, whether that be my own characters or any character from this list + characters from LInk Click

-----

How the fae/faer/faerself pronouns work

Open to tag games and asks and... literally anything.

Name's Noor/Noorie btw. Closeted genderfluid and aspec (queer platonic/split attraction model... or whatever this is). Pronouns are they/them, it/its and anything fancy.

----

Each of the subsections leads to masterposts for everything! (The intro post got waaayyy tooo long)

The Land of the Fallen Fairies.

A nature-themed commentary on the pursuit of happiness and fixing yourself to deserve that happiness, told by an overthinking, unreliable, houseplant narrator.

Zine

Uquiz

TW: self-hatred, suicidal thoughts, and self-deprecation.

Anuli's story collection.

Anuli's (and my) favorite stories from around tumblr

Jujutsu Kaisen Hyperfixation

As the name suggests, I am hyperfixated. I have also written essays analyzing these characters. Be very afraid. And/or come suffer with me /pos

Also also, for those who don't want to see any JJK smut, this blog should be safe for you! <3 I ship Satosugu but in a... transcend labels, queer platonic flavor sort of way. And I flipflop on itafushi. Either way they are soul mates and transcend labels. Found family dynamics and everlasting friendships/comfort people are peak fiction for me.

Link Click Hyperfixation

They are my everything. They can live in my head rent free foreverrr.

Tumblr's houseplant garden.

Growing a garden of houseplants based off this weird thing called existence, "planted" by others from tumblr.

Fantasy Frog and Toad

A story about two princes cursed to be a frog and toad because they couldn't decide on whether to be self-determined and individualistic, or be traditional and family oriented, because why can't you be both?

_______________________

Tagging system

#link click <-- the collection of link click things I shall hoard like a dragon

#the land of the fallen fairies <-- everything related to the land of the fallen fairies (following this one would be a good idea if you want random updates, or you can join the tag list <3)

#feelings are weird <--- random snippets of Russian Roullet of whether I'll snap or not, along with some sideways spiraling. (this is different from the next tag, but it takes a lot of time to explain how so.)

#I'll fill my grave with fanart <-- doom posting specifically. Apparently I've learned how not to snap and I want to return that but the manager won't answer my phone calls.

#Anuli's favorite stories <-- Stories that I and Anuli like. (Give or take, Anuli faerself has a slightly different taste than I do... but here's the tag)

#plant posting <-- whenever I talk about houseplants

#Noorie listens to songs on loop <-- My inconsistent music taste (you get iphone piano ballads... just saying)

#Noorie infodumps. Be very afraid. <--- My rambling tag

#jjk <-- I reblog stuff without tags, so everything of mine that's jjk related will have this tag

my favorite post on tumblr

[redheadbigshoes]

tw: acephobia

as an ace lesbian posts this make me sick. blaming aces for the way other people have twisted and purported our terminology is just so ridiculous. seriously i’m sick of us (asexuals and lesbians) being scapegoated for intracommunity issues because it’s convenient. sure, some aces are responsible for promoting this idea, but to blame all of us? like aces aren’t gonna stop being or calling ourselves asexual just because other people have decided the SAM is for them. it’s fucking 2023 i shouldn’t have to sit here and explain why aces and ‘bi lesbians’ are 2 different things with different politics, and i shouldn’t have to defend asexuality from people who see it as nothing more than celibacy. asexual just means not heterosexual. genuinely cannot begin to describe the scope of harm this rhetoric does.

there are a lot of things some (terminally) online ace communities have done & said that i don’t approve of, but it is not symptomatic of our minority as a whole. there’s more to say about this but i won’t clog up your inbox. sorry to rant i’m just frustrated

This person (though they were correct to not support the “bi lesbian” label) is doing just what lesbians always complain about: that we’re often the target of the LGBTQ+ community whenever other queers want to blame something on a group. The Ace community is not to blame for this, we should blame individuals who either use or support this label, not a whole group of people - a minority - about it.

Just because some allo people have started using the SAM to describe their identity it doesn’t mean this has anything to do with ace people. A lot of people don’t understand that the SAM was supposed to be used exclusively by the aro/ace community.

Not to mention this person is acting as if “bi lesbians” all used that label because they also use the split attraction model, but they seem to forget a lot of them use the label because 1) they want to include nb people in their identity 2) they want to include trans men or women in their identity or 3) they want to point out they have a gender preference.

And tbh it’s more common to use that label for one of the reasons I mentioned than because the person uses the SAM.

I hate how this community thinks it’s a wonderful idea simply pointing fingers at each other instead of actually listening to each other and understanding our issues.

[aroaceking]

I literally cannot tell if you actually want me to answer any of the things you asked but I'm posting the entire comment and I will answer it. I'm going to be very honest and address that I am autistic so if I've taken the fact there were questions too literally I am actually sorry, I have no intention of requesting engagement from you if you are not actually trying to discuss it with me.

Reblogs are off because I don't really feel comfortable with reblogs when I'm going to address some of my trauma, but you're free to reply to this or send an ask (I think ask word limits are lower now?) if you wish to reply.

tw because I don't know how to explain any of my things without addressing a lot of this: transphobia tw, transmisogyny tw, intersexism tw, homophobia tw, racism tw, csa tw, cocsa tw, childhood sexual trauma tw, medical abuse tw, ableism tw, idk like literally it's just my life idk how to give it enough labels to give fair warning.

under a read more because it's long

@fite-club

okay. there’s a lot to unpack here. i’m gonna first address the “stop sexualizing asexuality” thing— asexuality is about sexual attraction, it is inherently a sexual topic in nature. but you’re alarmingly wrong about something here, and it’s the “recognizing ways I was different from my peers” part as a 14 year old, you WEREN’T different from your peers for not experiencing sexual attraction. MOST 14 year olds don’t. you mention trauma in your past— this is extremely relevant. why do you believe that the majority of 14 year olds were sexual, who told you that? ike, yeah, hypothetically someone who identifies as ace at 14 and experiences sexual attraction at age 18 can change their label from asexual to allosexual. but will they ACTUALLY do that, though? or will they just call themselves a sex-favorable asexual? when you make lacking attraction a part of your identity, what happens to your sense of identity if you DO experience attraction? also i need to point out that there are literal biological functions that are not done developing until you are over 18. your body and brain and hormones are still growing. you definitely cannot say with any certainty that anyone below the age of 16 knows they experience sexual attraction or not finally i need you to understand that by emphasizing “hey, it’s actually completely fine and normal to not be interested in sex at all when you’re in high school” it actually helps prevent teens from being sexually abused. “most teens are allosexual” is NOT the message you want to be spreading.

"asexuality is about sexual attraction, it is inherently a sexual topic in nature."

this is part of what I feel most uncomfortable with. it is innately a conversation about sexuality, but that, too, to me, feels simplified to state as 'sexual' when people are constantly equating sexual with 'having sex' or 'having sexual desires'. developmentally it's a lot more complex than that, especially when you don't use a split attraction model or thoroughly separate/classify all aspects of orientation. I understand why people may break down their identities into the tiniest boxes they can imagine, but I actually don't navigate it that way at all.

I'm deeply uncomfortable with the idea that discussing sexuality is sexual. I know I'm repeating myself, I just am not sure if I'm clear. It's also deeply unsettling to me to see people, of any orientation, act like it's sexual for a child to state if they like boys or girls or whatever else. Or how people act like it's sexual for a child to have a gender identity separate from their assignment.

I will acknowledge the assignment I was given had impact on my feelings on this matter, I was hypersexualized throughout my childhood for being intersex, for publicly going also from 'boy' to 'girl', for my race. I understand that these add to my experiences and are part of why I was reacted to the way I was. That it was a catch-22 because if I had liked boys, I would've been performing gender wrong and if I had liked girls, I would've been performing gender wrong, and that no matter what space I took up, it would be 'incorrect.'

But this experience is mine. I was doomed to be sexualized no matter what I did in the environment I was a part of, and part of that relates to this idea that gender and sexuality in children when 'off the norm' is innately sexual. That if a child expresses a relationship to gender or orientation outside of boxes defined for them that it's somehow sexual.

I tried to define it to an anon earlier also but developmentally I am including things like how children will play-roles as well. A lot of my friends learned gender and orientation through how they wanted to do pretend games or how they felt unfulfilled by them. This isn't sexual, this isn't weird, it's a normal part of development. This includes children picking and pointing out fictional characters or celebrities to admire or joke about wanting to marry/have as a boyfriend/girlfriend/whatever. This includes the way children will also explore themselves through putting claims out like 'so and so is my boyfriend now' or whatever.

"you mention trauma in your past— this is extremely relevant. why do you believe that the majority of 14 year olds were sexual, who told you that?"

I know the trauma in my past is 'relevant.' I'm sure if I had not been further sexualized by adults and children alike for being intersex and the WAY I was intersex that I would not have the same relationship to any of this. As I stated, it's why I feel so strongly about some of it. I don't know who I would be without trauma, I can't just take my trauma aside and yes, I've gone through therapy, multiple attempts, some forced and some me trying to approach it carefully. It's why I tried to study developmental psychology.

I really dislike the statement 'why do you believe that the majority of 14 year olds were sexual'. I believe a majority of 14 year olds weren't and aren't asexual because a majority of the population is not asexual. It's a minority group. So is being gay. So is being trans. So is being intersex. If they feel strongly enough to identify as asexual, it is probably because they have an experience where it has made them feel othered, or at the very least uncomfortable. I don't even see why it matters if they're wrong about it. Nowadays they're constantly seeing people misidentify it as rooted in action, as in if you have sex or not, and some of them are probably very scared of the expectation of sex, and so they may label themselves incorrectly because they want to feel like they have support in language to communicate a perfectly normal boundary to have and when they get older, hopefully they recognize that.

That's part of why I dislike the fixation on if it's about sex or not! Or even the fixation people have on labels staying stagnant! Lots of people identify as straight or cis or whatever before realizing they're not, and it's okay also for them to have gotten it wrong the first or second or fiftieth time around idk. I have friends that still don't exactly know where they sit on both gender and orientation. I think that's normal! We have our whole lives to navigate!

But also 'who told you that'. Almost everyone around me except maybe some of the xtians (I'm not xtian) and mainly the xtians were more focused on telling me that 14 year old girls weren't interested in those kinds of things, which is why they must be 'protected' from 14 year old boys who are entirely too interested in it and my biology would make me unsafe even after I had, against my will, been medically altered due to complications with my hormones and body.

I don't know. I don't know how to explain what I grew up in. I don't know if it's different cultural expectations, I don't know if it's the ways I was seen as a threat by white people, I don't know. It's not 'who' told me that because 'who' was nearly everyone. But even if they weren't telling me that, even if they were telling me I was 'smart' for not dating or that I probably shouldn't date anyway or that no matter who I dated it would be weird, they also thought it was weird I had no actual interest at all. That I didn't admire celebrities or had crushes or expressed any future interest in it. People thought it was weird as hell I thought the entire construct of it was kind of fake, and yes, I was also autistic and so there was a level of them just thinking I was stupid and developmentally challenged because I was autistic, but that's also part of why they tried to 'fix' it, because my presentation was one where I could 'try' to fit.

But also I know lots of people who were raised xtian and expected to be girls who also got really messed up by the confusing explanations and expectations around it. That hurt themselves because they thought there was something gross or wrong with them as they hit perfectly normal developmental milestones. I was also the outlet for a lot of weird guilt and self-loathing from both boys and girls who viewed me as innately sexual for my relationship to gender. That viewed my medical changes as something somehow for them.

I know it's perfectly normal to not date at 14, I don't know how to be more clear about that, I don't know how to say 'yes I am aware plenty of 14 year olds are figuring themselves out, plenty of them don't know or fake crushes or even will explain they don't know if they've had them yet, I know plenty of them are definitely not interested in sex or dating' and also state 'this is why I'm saying it's not about sex! the ways I was othered and hypersexualized and desexualized are about all the tiny other ways I did not fit into the boxes I was supposed to!'

I was trying to express how having 'asexual' as a term helped me cope. Helped me be more compassionate to my peers. Continues to help me now. That's what labels are even for. That's their use. I was upset seeing someone say "#you’re 15!#you don’t want to have sex! that’s fine!#it’s not an identity!" about a niece identifying as asexual on a post discussing how the op's relationship to crushes/attraction has changed from having a lot of them as a teen to mellowing out a lot as an adult (which is normal, which is why I'm so! fucking confused! on the fucking pushback!!!! on me stating that it was othering! to be a child outside of that and attacked by adults and other children over it!!! and now I'm being told 'nothing about ur experience was abnormal' then why!!! was I constantly!!! told!!! it was!!!).

I mean I can tell you part of why. I am not fucking stupid. I am aware I was 'abnormal' also for my body and my brain and my race. Normalcy is socially constructed and upheld. Something can be atypical but not treated as abnormal, and something can be common but socially classified as abnormal for structural purposes. Like we say 'minority' for nonwhite people as if white people aren't actually STATISTICALLY globally the minority. (Yes, I know, that depending on your country, they are statistically a majority, but they only became the 'majority' in the country I'm in through horrific violence and even in countries where they are statistically the majority it's violently upheld as they push back against nonwhite people moving in blah blah blah, ie still socially upheld through structures).

Like I feel like somehow I'm having entirely different conversations about this.

"like, yeah, hypothetically someone who identifies as ace at 14 and experiences sexual attraction at age 18 can change their label from asexual to allosexual. but will they ACTUALLY do that, though? or will they just call themselves a sex-favorable asexual? when you make lacking attraction a part of your identity, what happens to your sense of identity if you DO experience attraction?"

Okay but I don't CARE? The stigma around changing your orientation label needs to go but also I don't care if they're wrong. It's irritating, yes, and often derails these spaces and discussions, but also like it's their life, I can't make them change their identity. I can just share information on how other people have expressed attraction and learning to navigate it and offer solutions and pose questions on how their relationship may have changed and give examples of people coming into it deeper in adulthood.

There are people that think they aren't ace because they don't care if they have sex, even though they aren't attracted to anyone, and eventually reach a point in their life, sometimes late in it, where they learn about it and go 'oh' and suddenly have a word for this thing that helps them better define their experiences. And I don't mean 18, 18 is so young.

What happens to people who identify legitimately as a gender or orientation they later realize doesn't fit them? I can't control them. I had a friend who thought she was straight and it took a lot of self-reflection for her to realize she was bisexual. She had to be out of an environment where her attraction to women was dismissed, desexualized, and recognized as equal and not diminished by her attraction to men.

I've had friends who had been neutral on men in their lives, who realized they were lesbians only in their 20s because they had been neutral about men they tried to date due to expectations. I know women who transitioned and tried to like men out of gender obligation, who had to work through those feelings and the root of them to actually understand their relationship to orientation.

If we allow space and discussion for the myriad of ways it presents or develops or can be defined, then this becomes less of a fixation point. The fragility of people's identities rooted in NEEDING to strictly define them is not helpful for many, especially younger people. I'm still younger people. I know people who've changed their identities in their 50s. I know there are people I don't personally know who have changed and played with their identities even later in life.

I use language the way I use language because I'm autistic and descriptionist. I can't stop people from being prescriptionist with theirs.

I understand the harm people experience when they cling to identities that no longer suit them. But I can't constantly stop people from harming themselves, I can't control them! I ALSO can feel uncomfortable or out of place when people try to relate to me and utilize the same terms I do but in completely different ways. I don't know how to interact when someone my age comes to me identifying as ace but then also being alarmed when I do not relate to the ways they categorize attraction or lack thereof. It can be very strange to do so. A lack of something is even harder to define than the existence of something.

"also i need to point out that there are literal biological functions that are not done developing until you are over 18. your body and brain and hormones are still growing. you definitely cannot say with any certainty that anyone below the age of 16 knows they experience sexual attraction or not"

Okay, and again, they can just change how they define it. People biologically change their whole lives. Menopause biologically changes people but it doesn't mean that for the period of their life before they may utilize labels to describe their experience before that point, or that those identities may still be important to them after that point.

I didn't say they always know or correctly define if they experience attraction or not? I don't think people can really say with any certainty until they have reason to feel certain. I think people can be 16 and not know and 25 and not know and 52 and not know.

As stated before, I'm intersex. I was also medically altered in a way that potentially is part of why I do not experience attraction idk. I know people who were medically altered similarly who do experience attraction. Idk. I would say 'I don't care' if it would have been different otherwise, but I do care actually, I care a lot, but my reality is what it is now and it has been incredibly harmful to me to try and 'treat' it. If something changes, I will change my identity, and not feel ashamed that I utilized language the way I needed to while it was relevant to me.

I'm autistic and intersex. I don't. I don't know how to phrase this but like. I have never been developmentally categorized as in the position of 'normal.' Because normal is socially defined and enforced. There are stages and ranges that are categorized as 'normal.' People who do not fit those stages or ranges are treated differently. Sometimes they utilize language for it. I don't. Like that's all it is to me.

"finally i need you to understand that by emphasizing “hey, it’s actually completely fine and normal to not be interested in sex at all when you’re in high school” it actually helps prevent teens from being sexually abused. “most teens are allosexual” is NOT the message you want to be spreading."

It is in fact true that emphasizing to children that it is their right and completely fine and acceptable and a boundary they can uphold to not be interested in sex in high school, this is good and useful and helpful. Giving them language for that is important, regardless of why they need it.

It is also important to help prevent abuse by giving them better language and resources on how they may be developing sexually and that they do not need to be ashamed of interest or engage in unsafe sexual practices as a way to explore that. I had friends literally manipulated by the idea that there was something shameful in their development that was only suitable for adults to 'manage' for them and it was part of their exploitation. This is in fact an aspect of abstinence-only education being a failure.

Children also need to be taught even if they ARE developing sexual interest, they can also develop boundaries around it anyway! Shame, confusion, hiding, whatever about this literally directly leads a lot of teenagers into the arms of predators. It alarms and concerns me this topic can somehow shift into statements that may further confuse these lines, so I want to be very clear.

And I want to also state I don't. Ugh. I don't think children by and large actually are easily defined as 'majority straight' or 'majority allosexual' or anything like that. I think that obviously the majority of people meet that, hence my earlier statement of noticing a kind of othering, but I don't actually think that means it's fair to label hordes of children as either straight or allosexual or even cis because it is in fact typical that they wouldn't even know or have a definitive enough relationship to it.

Feeling drawn to describing an experience you have with language that is about how you've felt othered doesn't even mean no one else involved could later define themselves with those terms. Some of the people who were cruel to me found out later they were boys or found out later they were girls or found out later they were gay or found out later they were intersex in a different way from me even.

I AGREE that children should be taught they are allowed to have boundaries??? I agree that children should be taught it's acceptable and valid and completely within their right to not have crushes or interest in dating or interest in sex or be more focused on their other experiences (like poverty, like disability, like race, like trauma, like education, like gender, like media interests, like whatever else??) over defining themselves and their gender and their orientation?

I think we should in fact encourage that it is okay to not know or not need to know yet. I think we should encourage people to realize they don't have to rush experiences they aren't ready for. I have friends whose first relationship was 25 and they never identified as ace or aro, they just were never in a position to get into that part of themselves for a variety of reasons. I don't. I do not understand the reaction to what I've said.

I was upset because an individual child individually defined themselves and some adult in their life was alarmed by a fairly simple identity that was not in any way some permanent or damning aspect. I'm upset because in 2020 I saw some adult literally tell a middle-grade child who identified as asexual on the internet they were 'attracting pedophiles' by identifying publicly as ace. An adult thought it was appropriate to define it that way and say that kind of thing to a child because of the child's identity. A whole lot of other adults agreed with it and kept going on about the inherently sexual nature of the term meant to describe an orientation.

It's just weird. When I told my mom in high school, she became fixated on the ways she might have broken me or made me that way. She became focused on listing all the possible other explanations and getting me to counseling and then devolved into belittling me for it, when all it was was an explanation for how I felt I was experiencing the world. It helped my friends be kinder to me. It helped me be kinder to my friends. It still helps me navigate the ways I may be unable to relate to others.

[traumasurvivorshelpingsurvivors]

hi! tw for sexuality confusion?

I realize that sexuality is a spectrum and majority of my life I've considered myself ace or demisexual but now I'm not so sure. I think I can live just fine not having sex since I don't really see it as a necessity, but lately I keep thinking about it.

I'm not able to imagine myself with a person physically, but rather just touching. I imagine myself hugging someone tightly, and this person is larger than me as almost everyone is, and they're hugging me just as tightly back. I think about getting cramped in an elevator and them doing kabedon since it's so crowded, but this person has no face or head. I can't imagine who or what this person could even look like.

I don't think I can be fully naked or have sex, the idea of it is a bit unrealistic to me, but I'd like to hug this person, to sleep and cuddle with them, and to have them just physically with me. I've also started feeling aroused or I guess horny for the first time in a year but I don't want to have sex. I don't know how to handle it really

sex curiosity anon! just realized I may be hyposexual. I had only been aware of hypersexuality up until now, but I think hyposexuality explains what I experience much more accurately. I feel little to no sexual desire except maybe for a week or two every year or year and a half.

Hi anon,

I want to start by saying that there is no pressure to label yourself and your sexuality, as it can often be a very complex and fluid concept that may be hard to put any one label on, and that's okay. It's also important to consider that identity, including sexuality, can change over time, and that's okay too. Just because you no longer resonate with being ace or demi doesn't necessarily mean you were never either of these things. Discovering ourselves is an ongoing process. However, it's also perfectly valid to find comfort in labeling or naming your own experiences, and if this resonates with you, then I am happy to help you find a label that you are most comfortable with.

Especially when it comes to exploring the ace spectrum, I personally find it helpful to think of attraction in terms of the SAM, the Split Attraction Model (I also want to acknowledge that I think there is some controversy around this model but I'm not sure why). I find that this model helps distinguish some of the different kinds of attraction, such as platonic, romantic, and sexual.

It sounds like you've been able to identify a predominantly romantic attraction, and that while you seem to experience sexual arousal, the idea of sex doesn't interest you. I found a comprehensive list of identities within the asexual umbrella, and found a few things that you may resonate with, such as aceflux, apothisexual, and quoisexual. However, if hyposexuality is a term you resonate with then that is up to you to claim, as you know yourself much better than I do.

If anyone has any comments or suggestions, feel free to add on. Otherwise, I hope that I could help shed some insight into your identity, and please know that we're here if you want to follow up or if you need anything else.

-Bun

[our-arospec-experience]

The Split Attraction Model (SAM)

*keep in mind, not everyone uses or accepts this model, and wherever you stand with this model, you are valid. This is purely informational, not a guideline.

The Split Attraction Model (SAM) differentiates attraction into different forms.

The SAM allows individuals to describe their orientations separately, for example, aromantic and pansexual.

some individuals may also include a tertiary attraction in their identities.

Not all a-spec individuals use the SAM, most notably, non-SAM aros.

Some individuals prefer more precise terms for differentiation such as "romantic orientation", "attraction types", etc.

Not every individual who experiences different types of attraction necessarily have a distinct romantic orientation, and not every individual who has a romantic orientation necessarily experiences multiple types of attraction.

History:

the idea was first recorded in 1879 by Karl Heinrich Ulrichs, who published several books on non-heterosexual attraction

it's next use was in 1979 by psychologist Dorothy Tennov in 'Love and Limerence: The Experience of Being in Love'

became common in a-spec circles by 2009

The term was origionally developed from aphobes and exclusionists who insisted the a-spec community of forcing everyone to split their orientation into multiple parts.

The term was adopted by a-spec communities in order to talk about the issue.

SAM flag:

[hues-of-purple]

A pan ace seeing someone attractive like:

[koifishanonymous]

i'm going to punch someone. but sadly violence is not the answer

so i'm scrolling through twitter because my tumblr has been WHACK these past few days (i'm being swarmed by bots every hour) and i stumble upon a thread of some lady who was explaining how she was bisexual heteromantic and how she could never really do any traditionally romantic things with women

AND THE REPLIES OF THIS THREAD, MY GOD-

all of them some variation '' you are misogynistic and using women for sex ''

. . .

i dont get it. i dont get how having sex with someone is considered using them! if you're both consenting and capable of it (consenting that is) then WHAT'S THE FUCKING PROBLEM. WHAT IS IT

like i swear twitter probably says the same about aroallos but like. sorry queer experience aren't sanitized and are about sex sometimes

[intergrader]

I wanted to redo my post on the asexuality discourse because it was all over the place and some of my opinions have changed, so here it is.

1. Asexuals shouldn't be a part of the lgb community because they aren't oppressed.

What I think matters is that our experiences still differ from the norm, heterosexuality, even if it's less than other identities. It's present in little things to big things - from seeing sex in media and being repulsed at the thought of doing it ourselves to corrective r*pe. If there's some range of oppression you need to face to be a part of the community, then feel free to cut us out I guess (although that just seems ridiculous imo). What's important is that asexuals and those who are questioning are able to find resources and outlets, even if there's less exposure after being shunned by the community. In other words, asexuals should be able to have their own community and spaces. The problem is, we can't. At least on tumblr, I've seen numerous ace themed blogs or posts get invaded by exclusionists when anything relevant to the discourse wasn't mentioned at all. Please just let us be, even if you can't accept us.

2. Heteromantic asexuals especially!

Again, everything mentioned above. Straight passing privilege is only received by not being able to talk about our identity.

3. Gray asexuals don't exist because asexuality isn't a spectrum; you're asexual and you don't experience sexual attraction or you aren't.

The only logic I can find for this is the etymology of the word, so I'd assume this is due to a misconception. Gray asexual should not be a label for allies who want to be a part of the community to hide behind, nor for those who are really just allosexual. If someone feels significantly less sexual attraction than what would be considered normal, enough to warrant them relating to both asexuality and other labels such as homosexuality, but not fully to either, they should be able to find others who feel the same.

Actually, I agree with this.

demisexual (someone who does not experience sexual attraction until they have formed a deep emotional connection with someone) = so you don't want hookups

fictosexual (umbrella term for anyone who experience exclusive sexual attraction toward fictional characters, a general type of fictional characters, or whose sexuality is influenced by fictional characters) = wth

fraysexual (someone only experiences sexual attraction towards those that they are not deeply connected with and lose that attraction as they get to know the person) = considering asexual generally means lack of sexual attraction, I don't see how this should be an identity

inactsexual (when one experiences sexual attraction and desires a sexual relationship despite being sex-repulsed) = have no idea how you can be repulsed by sex but still want it, could be similar to comphet but I doubt it

lithosexual (may experience sexual attraction but does not want it reciprocated) = again, how is this an asexual identity

reciprosexual (someone who does not experience sexual attraction unless they know that the other person is sexually attracted to them first) = so you just want to make sure the feeling's mutual before so you don't get your heart broken, how is this why is this

aceflux/acespike (someone whose sexual orientation fluctuates but generally stays on the asexual spectrum) = seems like the only valid one. Again, please make sure you're not just an ally or an allosexual member of lgb that has internalized homophobia or something. Additionally, make sure your lower sex drive isn't an effect of medication or the like.

In conclusion, the ace spectrum just seems like where "orientations" go when there's not really a category for them (that post saying most things on the lgbtq wiki were based on random tumblr posts definitely seems accurate rn). The only identity I was supporting when writing the crossed out above section was aceflux/acespike. My stance on this is definitely still iffy considering I haven't heard of an agreed upon definition of the amount of sexual attraction one experiences normally.

4. R*pe is something everyone experiences, not just asexuals

The difference is that this is corrective r*pe, i.e. it was done because of sexuality and the want of heteronormativity.

5. The split attraction model is harmful.

This one is actually pretty interesting. The main arguments seem to be misleading people with internalized homophobia and sexualizing identities too much. I'd agree that it probably does hurt some people. However, lgb talks a lot about internalized homophobia and how to deal with it, especially when just joining the community. Plus, many people don't even know about the split attraction model what with so little people being ace or aro and it does a lot more good than harm by allowing people to set further requirements they're comfortable with. As for the latter point, I don't see how saying ace bi or bi ace is so different from saying biromantic asexual. It means the same thing. Just like how if you only say you're bisexual, people are going to assume you mean biromantic bisexual.

[epic-sorcerer]

I saw this post about how bi lesbians are valid and not bad but it was really angry and it triggered me.

So instead of reblogging that one I make my OWN post 😌👊

I’m also doing this because I used to have a very toxic “friend” (it was more of an attachment tbh) and I’m finally letting myslef have my own opinions on certain things. They were—and probably still are—really adamant that bi lesbians are really bad for the lesbian community. Also she was kinda biphobic so wooops don’t know why I was friends with her oh well it’s over now.

Also just bc you fit any of these definitions, doesn’t mean you have to identify as a bi lesbian or any mspec-gay. I knwo how jarring it is to be comfortable with the lable your in and then find a lable that would technically work, but you just don’t like it. This is just about the poeple who chose to identify as a bi lesbian.

This also applies to any mspec-gay but I flip flop between mspec lesbians mspec gays. But I do mean all of y’all. I’ll be using more bi lesbian examples because of my friend so I can take steps on breaking free from them.

Also I’m dyslexic so there my be typos

Mspec gays are valid because for a lot of people, including myself, sexuality is fluid. Someone can like only girls one day and than multiple genders another day.

Also, people who use Split Attreactuon Modle(I think it’s called?) can use bi lesbian too instead of homoromantic bisexual or something like that. As a dyslexic I completely understand wanting to cut back on extra syllables.

Also, some people have alter systems and some could be bi and others could be gay/lesbian.

Some people are mostly attracted to one gender but still are attracted to multiple. That’s mspec lesbian too!!

Also, lesbian started out to inclube mspec woemn until the some of the lesbian community started Villainizing mspec women because of their attention to men. The bi lesbian lable helps reclaim lesbianism for the rest of the sapphic community.*

Some mspec people don’t date a certen gender because of trauma. So mspec gay/lesbian would fit them

* sorce https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biphobia

Also, bi woemn are more likely to suffer biphoia from lesbians than bi men from gays

[angel-archivist]

i fucking hate exclusionists so much <3