#trans inclusionary feminist

[rjalker]

No one:

Cis women:

[ID: The "wouldn't that make you" penguins meme, with the penguins from the movie Madagascar on a raft, with the leader first leaning forward while speaking suspiciously, then screaming dramatically, with the dialogue edited so it now reads:

"If you're a trans man who wants the equal right to healthcare in regards to pregnancy without having to be misgendered or detransition, wouldn't that make you…A misogynist??!?".

The words "A misogynist" are in all caps and very large font.

End ID.]

Cis women hate trans men so much they'll literally claim to be the victim of misogyny because trans men dare to ask for equal rights in regards to pregnancy and abortion.

The cis woman was literally making the discussion about gender neutral language in regards to pregnancy all about how women need the gender neutral language too, and completely erasing, ignoring, and shouting down all the trans men, nonbinaries, and genderqueers who spoke up. And then with the one trans man she was fucking calling him a misogynist for telling her she's being transmisic, and she claimed that he was making the topic all about how it affects MEN instead of women.

Cis women literally hate trans men so much they'll fucking claim ownership of issues that specifically are created to support trans men, nonbinaries, and genderqueers, and make it all about women, even though women are literally not the ones impacted by the problem at all, because women are the fucking default when discussiong the rights and health of people who can get pregnant.

Cis women shut the absolute fuck up about shit that does not impact you. Stop fucking weaponizing your poor fragile fucking femininity to silence trans men, nonbinaries, and genderqueers when we talk about shit that affects us that you have no fucking stake in.

You do not get to cry "misogyny!" when you enter a discussion that is not about you and make it all about your feelings and shout down all the people for whom the topic is literally life or death.

You are in fact being the fucking misogynist by telling other people who are literally actively being oppressed by misogyny that they need to shut up and stop talking about how it is literally killing them when you try to talk over them.

[Plain text: You do not get to cry "misogyny!" when you enter a discussion that is not about you and make it all about your feelings and shout down all the people for whom the topic is literally life or death. You are in fact being the fucking misogynist by telling other people who are literally actively being oppressed by misogyny that they need to shut up and stop talking about how it is literally killing them when you try to talk over them.]

Being a trans inclusive feminist does not fucking mean you only support trans women and call it a day. It does not mean you fucking tell trans men, nonbinaries, and genderqueers who can get pregnant that they need to shut the fuck up otherwise we're being misogynists when multiple people correct you because you're being a transmisic piece of shit.

[radfem-polls]

what do you think about TIRFs (trans inclusive radical feminists)?

if they support actual radfem ideals then they are radfems (TERF or TIRF doesnt matter because trans discourse is a trivial part of radical feminism)

it depends on how they are trans inclusive

making distinctions between TERF or TIRF is pointless, a radfem is a radfem

no, supporting the trans ideology cannot be accepted as radical feminism

im bald

Thank you for your submission!

I hope you don't mind that I may slightly tweak the options to be more clear/specific.

Key:

TIRF - Trans Inclusive Radical Feminist

TERF - Trans Exclusive Radical Feminist

GC - Gender critical

fi TIRF - female inclusive TIRF (inclusive of trans identified females; may refer to them as trans men, female nonbinary, transmasculine etc; may use desired pronouns)

mi TIRF - male inclusive TIRF (inclusive of trans identified males; may refer to them as trans women, male nonbinary, transfeminine etc; may use desired pronouns; usually also inclusive of trans identified females)

[girliemenace]

You hate trans men because they’re trans (unbased + cringe)

I hate trans men because they’re men (based + pinkpilled + femcelpilled)

[transirfanon]

(AGP) Trans women and how they see women and themselves?

A pattern I've noticed recently is that when some trans women would make a persona of themselves, it's very much porn fueled. Now I think this is because due to their agp, they make themselves what their attracted to and what they're attracted has been influenced by the misogynistic porn industry. Here are some random example below.

Cis female V-tubers types do similar things, and it still disgusts me, but I believe it's because theirs are meant to appeal to their predominately male audiences while these examples (who are not all v-tubers) don't really *have* an audience at all or of that sort, but they're sexy because they are meant to appeal to themselves and that worries me because this is not a good way to view women, though you yourself may be a one. (One of these claims to be a huge feminist, can you guess which one?)

[nothorses]

Hello there, I found on my tl this post presenting a different view on "baeddelism" from the perspective of a trans woman that claims that she was actually there when the og group existed and explains why the word has become somewhat of a transmisogynistic slur. And I wanted to ask you If you might have any thoughs on this reading of the subject matter?

www.tumblr.com/euniexenoblade/741692501713387520/anyways-baeddel-is-a-slur-against-trans-women

I mean, I think there's merit to the idea that calling people "baeddels" when they don't actually claim to be one themselves is at best counterproductive. The term refers less to A General Ideology, and more to a very specific movement- or, more accurately, two unrelated-but-similar movements that happened in the early/mid 2010's.

There's a term for what folks are usually talking about when they call some random trans woman a "baeddel" when she says she believes trans men oppress trans women: "TIRF", or trans-inclusionary radical feminist. It's a term that was coined by people who call themselves by it, and it's a lot more broad & generally useful here. It doesn't come with ties to a group that dissolved because of sexual assault allegations & rape apologism, and it isn't rooted in an Old English slur, which means it's a lot less charged. It's less likely to get people to shut down or laugh your whole point off because of how clear it is that you aren't listening to or engaging in anything they have to say with good faith.

So yes, I agree, calling random people "baeddels" is not in good taste. Don't do it. "TIRF" exists, it's more accurate, and it's less likely to hurt your argument anyway.

That said.

I take issue with the implication that:

a) Baeddels were tiny and utterly non-influential (therefore all references to them at this point are malicious exaggerations and bogeymen), and

b) Everyone self-describing as a "baeddel" today is actually just reclaiming a slur, exactly like people do with "tranny" and "faggot".

Baeddels (on Tumblr; again, there was a "baeddel" movement on Facebook at the time as well, but it was unrelated and ideologically distinct) were not so small that they had no impact, and to characterize them as widely unpopular- or, worse, influential only in that everyone hated them so much that alt-right bigots immediately revived "baeddel"s original meaning as a slur to in order to victimize all trans women- should immediately ping some alarm bells.

Baeddelism's core ideology centered around the idea that trans women are the most oppressed group, that transmisogyny is the root of all oppression, that trans women are always victimized, never safe, never understood, except around and by exclusively other trans women. This sucks, because there is very real oppression and trauma being preyed on here; trans women are encouraged to be paranoid and distrustful of anyone different from them, and their own experiences with oppression are weaponized against them in order to do so. This should remind you of the recruitment tactics cis radfems use.

That aside, there are some places where baeddelism's influence has been documented: @baeddel-txt is one example. Note that a lot of the posts archived there are recent. Here's one of the original crew, still active and spewing the same shit. Baeddelism has been experiencing something of a renaissance in recent years, too. Here's one of the original (ex-)baeddels talking about it as recently as 2021.

This is not "reclaiming a slur", these people are referring very explicitly to the original ideology & the desire, or observed desire, for that same movement to be brought back in the present day.

Does that make every TIRF-y trans woman a baeddel?

No!

But it is incredibly, and suspiciously disingenuous to deny the harm they caused, the influence they had, and the admiration people still hold for their ideology. And it is downright ahistorical to claim that the term is now, or was at the time that the group was most popular, used genuinely as a slur (sources, I am begging you).

Do not call people "baeddels" unless they're claiming the word for themselves. Do not allow anyone to make you think, even for a moment, that transfeminine people are The Enemy; they do not oppress us, they do not benefit from our oppression, and the vast majority of them are not interested in any kind of lateral violence against us in the first place. They are our allies. Do not forget that they are our allies.

Forgetting that trans people are each other's best allies is what lead to baeddelism in the first place. We need each other. Things can only improve for any of us if we fight for each other. Don't let resentment sabotage you- or hurt our trans siblings.

[pinkhutia]

when people isolate de beauvoir or wollstonecraft or whoever quotes to prove feminism has always been inherently and explicitly trans inclusionary it's like..... don't be shy, put that quote in its wider context. explain the ideological bases for their theories. explain how early feminist thinkers differentiated sex from gender, and be sure to use several quotes from throughout the texts to support your argument. make sure to dedicate at least one paragraph to counterarguments. you will have 1hr 45mins for this exam, no.2 pencil only. your time starts now

[fymo-blogs]

I'm a TIF

(Trans inclusionary feminist)

[typhlonectes]

We finally reached 30,000 followers!

Hey y’all, I just wanted to say thank you so much for following the blog. I’ve had a big influx of followers lately, so I thought I’d re-introduce myself.

HI, I’m Paxon. I’m a wildlife biologist, and I work as a naturalist at a nature center in Houston, TX, USA. I’m cis-male, gay, and interested in a variety of leftist political philosophies. Trans-inclusionary intersectional feminist, vegetarian, ANTIFA, anti-racist, Latinx.

This is a science-natural history-wildlife-conservation-biodiversity blog (with some politics, philosophy, Pokémon, anime, poetry, punk, art, cats, gay stuff, naked guys, and other personal interests).  :3

____________________________________________________________

I’ve worked in wildlife science and environmental education since I was 17 years old (I’m 45 btw). My field experience includes:

bird surveys, 

small mammal surveys, 

deer counts, 

amphibian call counts, 

bayou fish surveys, 

reptile and amphibian surveys, 

insect surveys, 

Loggerhead sea turtle monitoring in Viginia Beach,

Piping Plover monitoring on Long Island, NY, 

shark surveys in Florida Bay, 

King Eider monitoring on the Arctic tundra of Alaska, 

Bluebird and Prothonotary Warbler nest box surveys, 

wetland plant monitoring, 

prairie and bayou restoration projects.

I’ve worked as a guide and naturalist here in Texas, Corkscrew Swamp in Florida, and at Sacha Lodge in the rainforest of Eastern Ecuador, near Yasuni. #SachaRuna 

I AM AN AVID BIRDWATCHER, and spend a lot of time hiking. My nature and outdoor interests include: herpetology, entomology (especially native bees, butterflies, moths, and beetles), malacology, native wildflowers, native wildscape/pollinator gardening, marine biology, and hiking.

I identify animals for people for a living, so if you have any nature questions, or would like me to ID animals for you, I’m here...

https://typhlonectes.tumblr.com/ask

I’m also here if you just wanna chat, say hi, or talk about something else.

Ciao, and thank you for following, I love you,

Paxon

[rjalker]

I'm still astounded and pissed off so here have a collection.

You are encouraged to save them and just use them as reaction images for jackass bigots.

[ID: Fourteen versions of the "wouldn't that make you" penguins meme, with the penguins from the movie Madagascar on a raft, with the leader first leaning forward while speaking suspiciously, then screaming dramatically.

The first panel in each meme is different, while the second panels except for the first, which is entirely blank, all shows the penguin screaming dramatically, "A misogynist??!?" in all caps in very large font.

The first has the top section blank, with the bottom shouting, "A misogynist??!"

The rest read, in order:

"But if you're telling me, I, a woman, am being a bigot, wouldn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"But if you're not a woman, doesn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"If you're a trans man, doesn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"If you as a trans man demand equal rights, doesn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"But if you're genderqueer, wouldn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"But if you literally just exist, wouldn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"But if you're trans, wouldn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"If you're not a woman, but you can get pregnant, and you want people to stop denying your existance, then doesn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"If you're not a woman, but you can get pregnant, and you want equal rights in regards to bodily autonomy and reproductive healthcare, wouldn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"If you're a trans man who wants the euql right to healthcare in regards to pregnancy without having to be misgendered or detransition, wouldn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

"If you're not a woman, because you're a trans man, nonbinary, genderqueer, or something else like that, but you can get pregnant, and thus demand to be included in conversations about the rights of people who can become prepgnant, because being left out of the conversation literally gets people like you killed because they're denied healthcare, wouldn't that make you…a misogynist??!?"

End ID.]

[dumbdomb]

an intentional misspelling referring to both the exclusionary and inclusionary form of anti-trans and anti-intersex feminism on this website.

Gender critical feminists advocate what they call "sex-based rights," arguing that "women's human rights are based upon sex" and that "these rights are being eroded by the promotion of 'gender identity.'"

Gender critical feminists generally see gender as a system in which women are oppressed for reasons intrinsically related to their sex, and emphasize male violence against women, particularly involving institutions such as the sex industry, as central to women's oppression. Holders of such views often contend that trans women cannot fully be women because they were assigned male at birth and have experienced some degree of male privilege.

(...) the existence of intersex conditions does not impact the usefulness of sex categories.

Although trans people were active in feminist movements in the 1960s and earlier, the 1970s saw conflict among some early radical feminists over the inclusion of trans women in feminism.

Carrera-Fernández and DePalma argued that "the increasingly belligerent popular discourses promoted by TERF groups since the 1970s [are] appropriating feminist discourses to produce arguments that contradict basic premises of feminism."

Claire House noted in 2023 that "key streams within trans exclusionary women’s and feminist movements increasingly engage in collaborative action with right-wing populist-centered anti-gender coalitions, which include right-wing religious, conservative, and right-wing extremist actors."

In February 2020, 28 feminist and LGBT groups in France co-signed a declaration titled Toutes des femmes denouncing trans-exclusionary feminism, saying that "questions disguised as 'legitimate concerns' quickly give way to more violent attacks" and that "it is a confusionist and conspiratorial ideological movement using the cover of feminism to disrupt real feminist fights.

Gender Critical Feminism Wiki (source)

A Radical Feminist View of Gender Ideology - Maureen Young on The ACL Australian Christian Lobby (ACLOBBY)

How Liberal Feminism Turns Into Fascism by Alice Cappelle

Women's March: Feminism V. Womanism by Joya G

providing the above information is not an act of hatred, and i do not condone sending hate to anyone for any reason whatsoever! i am not interested in changing anyone's mind, and this is not an invitation for debate or challenging any person's beliefs. if you disagree with anything in this post, you can block and continue scrolling. there is nothing ill-intentioned in the above info and i don't hate anyone for having different povs

[incorrect-transpirings]

Regulus: I’m not a trans exclusionary feminist I’m a trans inclusionary feminist! wait that still spells TIRF… stupid English vowels!!

Lily: You’re French, you don’t get to complain about vowels!

[transirfanon]

Will the trans community ever challenge this idea of Women?

That’s what’s creating a lot of distress from me

[spacelazarwolf]

whats a tirf

trans inclusionary ra/dical feminist. basically the same as a t/erf but they rely on gender essentialism instead of bioessentialism. (except gender essentialism is highly based in bioessentialism, so tirfs oftentimes have straight up t/erf beliefs they just change the wording from “male” to “man/masc” and “female” to “woman/fem.”)

[phoenixshallrise]

neil gaiman could literally rape a young woman and liveblog it on his tumblr and this webbed site would get on their knees and beg to be allowed to fellate his dick clean of the blood afterwards. genuinely staggering how quickly people drop their "believe victims" stance when the accused is a member of their political tribe. neil gaiman has a long and ugly history of misogyny and creepy behaviour around young women and teen girls, and yet all of that gets forgotten because people have decided one member of the team behind exposing him is a terf and therefore must be a manhating feminazi liar (she's not even a terf - terfs are marxists by definition, rachel johnson is literally center-right!).

Rachel Johnson has a very iffy view of trans people. She’s no necessarily a “terf” per se, she actually called herself a “trans inclusionary radical feminist”, but her views on the validity of trans people and her feelings on inclusive language are… interesting. I’d be interested to see some sources on Neil Gaiman’s supposed past ickiness because I don’t know anything about it. I’m also not entirely sure how terfs are Marxist?

[jadenainelynch]

On the inherent transphobia of radical feminism, even “trans inclusionary” radical feminism

“Considering trans women to be Madonna/Whore genders and trans men to be a part of the male oppressor class, although it may seem trans inclusive, does not actually do very much to deconstruct all of the harmful social structures which harm trans people in the first place. 

“Often, trans men and transmasculine people feel isolated by this rhetoric. Non-binary storyteller Ivan Coyote describes how, “a lesbian separatist… cornered me up against the wall at the Lotus Club and chastised me for wearing a mascara moustache out to the bar on women-only night.” This is far from being the only instance of the way in which “trans inclusionary” radical feminists’ demonisation of masculinity has hurt trans and gender nonconforming people. No distinction between the masculinity of those for whom Manhood is little more than birthright, and the masculinity of those who have spent their whole lives with the knowledge that masculinity has rendered them Failed Women-Failed Men, is made whatsoever. And how can such a distinction be drawn, without invalidating the hard-earned maleness of transgender and transsexual men? How, under an ideology which casts maleness as a state of inherent privilege on the axis of gender, completely ignoring the category of Failed Man, can one quantify the idea of a man, who experiences gendered oppression not in spite of his manhood, but because of it? 

“In order to rationalise this, one must either state that this man is actually a woman, and what he is experiencing is actually based in misogyny; or, one must state that, actually, he experiences no marginalisation whatsoever for this, and should either cease his expression of masculinity for the sake of the movement, or accept that, as a Man, he experiences no gendered oppression whatsoever.  In other words: one must become either a TERF, or a so-called TIRF. “The point being led to is this: there is no such thing as a TIRF. I mean this in the sense that even “trans inclusionary” radical feminism is inherently incompatible with the identities, lived experiences and existence of transmasculine people, and transgender people in general, and that this is not an accidental flaw but by design. The reason radical feminism does not, and can not, account for transmasculine gender variation is because it is an ideology which relies heavily on oppositional sexism - a fundamental tenet of radical feminist ideology is that Men are violent and are threats to women, and that women are victims of Men and of all gendered oppression. The fact that this dichotomy between genders  is presented as either innate, or as being something induced by socialisation which is so ingrained in individuals that the only society wide solution is female separatism, compounds this; additionally, not only are these genders presented as binary and immutable, they are almost entirely indistinguishable from the way in which social conservatives view gender. “Casting violence, rape and the subjugation of women as inherently male traits, and casting passivity, purity and victimhood as inherently female traits is not some radical new subversion of patriarchy; it is virtually identical to patriarchy. Therefore, radical feminism at its core is so reliant on oppositional sexism that it can never, no matter how it is twisted or reinvented, be truly trans inclusionary. In other words, there is no such thing as a TIRF.”

[sapphicthunderhead]

I hate that transphobes who happen to be cis women are called TERFs (Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminists) because they’re not radical feminists. They’re not even feminists.

I’m not being pedantic here. By nature of their belief that trans women should be denied the bodily autonomy necessary to live their truth, they demonstrate a fundamental lack of conviction in anyone’s right to control their own bodies. A truth universally acknowledged by every sincere believer in basic rights I’ve ever known: people should be able to do what they please with their own bodies, so long as their actions aren’t harming their fellow human beings or infringing on others’ fundamental rights.

Feminism, especially radical feminism, is about reinforcing our understanding of and protecting all people’s fundamental human rights. This is why we (and why I personally) fight for reproductive rights, for educational equity, for free healthcare, for feeding the hungry, for protecting refugees and abuse victims, for housing the homeless— and you know who ends up homeless at a disproportionate rate in the US? Trans folk.

When I hear people use “TERF” to refer to (almost always cis female) transphobes, cisheterosexists, trans-exclusionists, or whatever you’d prefer to call them, it brings to mind certain white anti-abolitionist suffragettes. It reminds me of the hypocrisy of white women who wished to empower themselves politically, but deny that empowerment to POC— because for these white women, it was never a fight for human rights, decency, and dignity; it was never about truly representing the will of the American people in the democratic process. They wanted to stop their own suffering, their own subjugation, but lacked the empathy to desire the same for people with whose experiences they could not identify. This problem is echoed in the contemporary conflict between anti-trans bigots and trans folks and their allies.

I could go on about how important the issue of trans rights is and should be to feminists and the queer community in general. I could talk about the trans community’s current status as canary in the coal mine for the rest of us who are LGBTQIA+, or how the attack on trans rights has coincided with the reduction of women’s reproductive rights & the overturning of Roe V. Wade. I could talk about the media’s peculiar tendency to erase the existence of trans men, because their mere presence in the conversation challenges the grotesque narrative that right-wing pundits are determined to push about the inauthenticity, duplicity, and immoral intent of our trans sisters. I would also love to air my hypothesis that the (often traumatized and paranoid) former radfems who turn against trans women are falling into a trap laid by the patriarchy to isolate them from the vast majority of a community that would otherwise offer them a great support network.

But I thought I'd put this out here. It's pride month as I'm writing this, so the timing seems right. Disrespecting any person’s harmless acts of self-expression and right to exercise bodily autonomy is glaringly anti-feminist. I support trans rights, and so does every other radical feminist I know. Hell, the term TERF was coined by a trans-inclusionary radfem. (I disagree with the pervasive usage of the term, which is often inaccurate, but I appreciate her initial intent.)

Happy pride month. Trans women are women. Trans people are human beings who deserve the same rights as everyone else. End of story.