#they can also apply to fictional women
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semisolidmind · 6 months ago
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somebody should study dj’s hold on us. it’s been like 3 years and i still dream of that man lol
well, there are some factors to consider when studying popular fictional men. one must ask;
do they exemplify some of the following traits?
long/beautiful hair (not required but appreciated)
pretty/unique eyes, usually half-lidded
sharp teeth or fangs of some kind, usually shown via cocky smirk or smile
b i g (though a quick study of tumblr sexymen would say this one isn't required)
by this criteria, DJ is certifiably irresistible.
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musical-chick-13 · 1 year ago
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Regarding the whole "Fandom Is An Escape, so why should I have to care this much about misogyny/racism/ableism/transphobia/etc." thing. Idk about the rest of you, but it gets kind of hard for me to "escape" when I keep seeing people say the same vile things about characters who share aspects of my identity that I hear all the time in real life.
#gotta say: it doesn't make me feel any better getting ignored/disparaged on account of my gender irl and then seeing every fictional woman#also get ignored/disparaged when there is no material difference between her and popular male characters other than her gender#how do I escape from irl misogyny if y'all keep willfully ignoring and flinging gendered insults at 99% (<-lowball estimate) of#female characters? how do I put aside the ableism I face in real life when y'all discuss disabled/mentally ill characters in the most#absolutely out-of-pocket way? how do I forget about biphobia when the 'arguments' you make 'for fun' about bisexual characters#in fiction sound EXACTLY the same as the things people say about my bisexuality outside of the internet/fan culture?#and then obviously this gets compounded if you are trying to even simply EXIST in fandom as a poc or a trans person or an intersection of#any or all these varying identities/life experiences#like yes caring about fictional characters is not the same as caring about real people OBVIOUSLY I can't BELIEVE I have to keep clarifying#that. and at the same time!! because multiple things can be true at the same time!!!! engaging in behavior that enforces pre-ingrained#societal biases and prejudices!!!!!!!! does not help dismantle those biases and prejudices!!!!!!!!!!!!!! in a real-world way that DOES#involve caring about actual people!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!#it's also. interesting. when people go on & on about how some newest show about thin cis white (male) gays is So Important & Revolutionary#So We Must Do Everything To Keep It Relevant And Visible and then act this way about women/poc/trans people/disabled people/fat people#in media. so like. you DO agree that seeing a variety of life experiences represented in fiction is beneficial. you DO believe in the#value of depicting marginalized people. interesting that that only seems to apply to a VERY narrow and specific category of marginalization#(ugh remember when I talked about this and someone called me a straight person good times)
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stardustedknuckles · 2 years ago
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I don't understand hating Beau for being an asshole like that's not the most empowering thing about her as a character. I have to assume the Venn diagram of people who have a problem with it and the people who think fiction and reality are the same is a circle. Because if you love the Nein, you've already accepted you're dealing with a bunch of assholes you wouldn't wanna be around in real life. That's why it's a story, and I get that some folks don't like that story. I'm talking about the ones who love the Mighty Nein and hate Beau. I fundamentally do not understand what the hell you watched for 500+ hours because nearly every day I'm thinking about the value of her anger and what it meant to get to see a woman so loved and respected not in spite of it but because of it. Someone who grew because of her anger at mundane abuse the likes of which is never given such a narrative weight - the abuse itself or the way it fucks you up. Women don't get to be angry like Beau without being villains or rejected by the narrative until they learn to behave more acceptably. How do you look at the radical good faith that is the m9 and the cobalt soul and decide Beau of everyone is least deserving of it because "she's mean." They're dicks. That's the entire point, and that doesn't change because you don't think this specific character had a good enough reason or was more overt about it. They are all fucked up in different ways for different reasons consistent with the things they went through. Get well soon I guess.
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swallowtail-ageha · 6 months ago
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Someone on twt is getting their ass beat because they said that the omegaverse is... kinda misogynistic in nature as it's an excuse to make male characters experience misogyny while removing women from the equation but... i kinda agree with oop
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bowtiestash · 11 months ago
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dawg im so sick of weirdos on the internet defending really problematic shit and saying "it's fiction" cause like, while i do get where they're coming from, shutting down an argument with it sucks. sure, fiction can be used to explore problematic things, its just that i have an overall issue with how these people expect it to be consumed without any thought at all??
it also doesnt even address the nuance when it comes to this kinda shit (which is why i dont like the pro/anti labels bc wtf do those labels even fucking mean. i hate it)
#i dont wanna go full rant on the post so ill put the rest of my thoughts here#basically i dont care about what you consume in fiction. but i also want you to be critical of whatever youre consuming#for example i recently watched a vid about isekai harems and ppl were talkin about how it was escapist fantasy for lonely men in japan#but it just makes me feel a bit icked out bc i feel like this kinda media CAN affect how men view women#the same applies to shit like. rape fantasy and stuff#im not sayin that EVERY person who enjoys this would do this irl#but its problematic anime like this that makes me lowkey worried about how men view women yknow??#and the same applies to loli/shota stuff#these guys act like bc theyre fiction it doesnt reflect on their actions irl and i do agree to an extent#but i feel like it only applies to some select individuals#some of them can draw a hard line with fiction when it comes to this shit. but there are others who look at problematic anime and go#'oh well bc the guy in this anime does this it MUST be ok!!'#obvs tho im not sayin problematic shit shouldnt be in media. a lot of ppl also lack media literacy#and that shit annoys me too#overpolicing of what people should enjoy is annoying#ive rambled a lot but my conclusion is this: if you enjoy smth problematic just keep in mind if it affects the way you think towards others#also goes without saying but keep your space away from minors as well#and if someone expresses they dont like the thing you like then just respect that???#skypeaks
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loregoddess · 4 months ago
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actually trying to explain that my favorite "movie adaptation/retelling" of a classic work is Outlander (aka scifi Beowulf) is weird bc it's like, barely Beowulf, BUT it does have a Christian priest actively trying to convert the Vikings in the movie, and this is the most "yeah, the version of Beowulf we have is probably a Christian AU fanfic retelling of the original story of Beowulf, but that's also the only reason it didn't get burned by the church during that time when the church burned a lot of books, but God was probably inserted in at a later date" Beowulf adaptation that I know of, which is admittedly not that impressive (since I only know of two others, and one was technically Fine even if it was also not Beowulf), but still worth at least one accolade
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batboyblog · 1 year ago
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Copy Right and Public Domain in 2024
Happy 2024 all! its also Public Domain Day! a magical holiday here in America where things enter the public domain. Works published in the year 1928 (or 95 years ago!) have entered the public domain, which means they belong to us, all of us, the public!
Mickey's Back!
Yes! I'm sure you've heard, but Mickey Mouse (and Minnie Mouse too) is entering the Public Domain today. This has been news for a few years and indeed Disney's lobbying in the late 1990s is why our copy right term is SO long. So what exactly is now public domain?
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Most people know about Mickey's first appearance Steamboat Willie, but a second short film, Plane Crazy was also released in 1928 so will also be public domain. So what's public? well these two films first of all, you're allowed to play them, upload them to YouTube or whatever without paying Disney. In theory you'll be allowed to cut and sample them, have them playing in the background of your movie etc. Likewise in theory the image of Mickey and Minnie as they appear (thats important) in these films will be free to use as well as Mickey's character as he appears in these works will be free to use. Now Mickey's later and more famous appearance
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will still be protected. Famously the Conan Doyle Estate claimed that Sherlock Holmes couldn't be nice, smile, or not hate women in works because they still held the copyright on the short stories where he first did those things even though 90% of Sherlock Holmes stories were public domain. It's very likely Disney will assert similar claims over Mickey, claiming much of his personality first appeared in works still copyrighted.
Finally there's copyright vs trademark. Copyright is total ownership of a piece of media and all the ideas that appear in it, copyright has a limited set term and expires. Trademark is more limited and only applies to things used to market and sell a product. You can have a Coke branded vending machine in your movie if you want, but it couldn't appear anywhere in the trailer for your movie as thats you marketing your movie.
Where trademark ends and copyright begins and how trademarked something in the public domain is allowed to be are all unsettled areas of law and clearly Disney in the last few years as been aggressively pushing its trademark not just to Mickey in general but Steamboat Willie Mickey in particular
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Ultimately the legal rights and wrongs of this might not matter so much since few people have the money and legal resources of the Walt Disney corporation so they might manage to maintain a de facto copyright on Mickey through legal intimidation, but maybe not?
And Tigger Too!
All the talk about Mickey Mouse and Steamboat Willie has sadly overshadowed other MAJOR things entering the public domain today. Most people are aware Winnie the Pooh entered the public domain in 2022, but they might not realize his beloved friend Tigger didn't. Thats because Tigger didn't appear till A. A. Milne's second (and last) book of Pooh short stories, The House at Pooh Corner in 1928.
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Much like Mickey Mouse only what appears in The House at Pooh Corner is public domain so the orange bouncy boy from the 1960s Disney cartoon is still on lock down. But the A. A. Milne original as illustrated by E. H. Shepard is free for you to use in fiction or art. His friend Winnie the Pooh has made a number of appearances since being freed, most notably in a horror movie, but also a Mint Mobile commercial so maybe Tigger too will have a lot of luck in the public domain.
Other works:
Peter Pan; or the Boy Who Wouldn't Grow Up
Peter Pan is a strange case, even though the play was first mounted in 1904, and the novelization (Peter and Wendy) was published in 1911, The script for the play was not published till 1928 (confusing!) meaning while the novel as been public domain for years the play (which came first) hasn't been, but now it is and people are welcome to mount productions of it.
Millions of Cats
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The oldest picture book still in print, did you own a copy growing up? (I did)
Lady Chatterley's Lover
The iconic porn novel that was at the center of a number of groundbreaking obscenity cases in the 1960s and helped establish your right to free speech.
All Quiet on the Western Front and The Threepenny Opera in their original German (but you can translate them if you want), The Mystery of the Blue Train by Agatha Christie, and Orlando by Virginia Woolf will also be joining us in the public domain along with any and all plays, novels, and books published in 1928
for Films we have The Man Who Laughs who's iconic image inspired the Joker
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Charlie Chaplin's The Circus, Buster Keaton's The Cameraman, Should Married Men Go Home? the first Laurel and Hardy movie, Lights of New York the first "all talking" movie, The Passion of Joan of Arc, The Wind, as well as The Last Command and Street Angel the first films to win Oscars for Best Actor and Best Actress respectively will all be entering public domain
For Musical Compositions (more on that in a moment) we've got
Mack the Knife by Bertolt Brecht, Let’s Do It (Let’s Fall in Love) by Cole Porter, Sonny Boy by George Gard DeSylva, Lew Brown & Ray Henderson, Empty Bed Blues by J. C. Johnson, and Makin’ Whoopee! by Gus Khan are some of the notables but any piece of music published in 1928 is covered
Any art work published in 1928, which might include works by Frida Kahlo, Georgia O'Keeffe, Alexej von Jawlensky, Edward Hopper, and André Kertész will enter the public domain, we are sure those that M. C. Escher's Tower of Babel will be in the public domain
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Swan Song, Public Domain and recorded music
While most things are covered by the Copyright Act of 1976 as amended by the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, none of the copyright acts covered recordings you see when American copyright law was first written recordings did not exist and so through its many amendings no one fixed this problem, movies were treated like plays and artwork, but recorded sound wasn't covered by any federal law. So all sound recordings from before 1972 were governed by a confusing mess of state level laws making it basically impossible to say what was public and what was under copyright. In 2017 Congress managed to do something right and passed the Music Modernization Act. Under the act all recordings from 1922 and before would enter the public domain in 2022. After taking a break for 2023, all sound recordings made in 1923 have entered the public domain today on January 1st 2024, these include.
Charleston by James P. Johnson
Yes! We Have No Bananas (recorded by a lot artists that year)
Who’s Sorry Now by Lewis James
Down Hearted Blues by Bessie Smith
Lawdy, Lawdy Blues by Ida Cox
Southern Blues and Moonshine Blues by Ma Rainey
That American Boy of Mine and Parade of the Wooden Soldiers by Paul Whiteman and his Orchestra
Dipper Mouth Blues and Froggie More by King Oliver’s Creole Jazz Band, featuring Louis Armstrong
Bambalina by Ray Miller Orchestra
Swingin’ Down the Lane by Isham Jones Orchestra
Enjoy your public domain works!
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writers-potion · 9 months ago
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Writing Female Fighters
The Heroine Must. Fight.
Today's female protagonists cannot sit on the side crying and breaking down or whimpering as the battle ensues.
Readers want to see autonomous female fighters who can at least defense themselves with courage and adequate skill.
Not all women are the same, but the heroine should get her butt moving.
Less Muscle, but More Flexibilty
The average woman is shorter than the average man, which makes it more difficult to wield a long sword or slam something down on the opponent's head.
A woman who works out can plausibly be stronger than a male couch potato, but if her male counterpart works out as much as her, the man is going to be much stronger.
On the other hand, the center of gravity in a woman's body is lower than a man's which makes it harder to knock her off her feet.
She is also more flexible, which gives her advantage in grappling fights, making use of complex landscapes, or deflecting blows.
A woman's small size can also be an advantage if her opponent has only ever trained with male opponents. His big hands might not get a good grip on her slender limbs.
In historical fiction, giving your heroine good muscule build can be tricky as exercise was generally considered harmful for women, with some exceptions for horseriding any maybe archery at best.
In such cases, make your heroine an accomplished dancer or an eager horsewoman, or the only girl whose father considered to be son replacement and thus, gave her a boy's education.
Women of lower classes who couldn't afford to be fashionably weak will be plausibly stronger, perhaps even more than an idle gentleman.
More Room for Negotiation, but Prolonged Ruthlessness
In the Suspense part of your fight scene, females are more likely to negotiate and talk more, strategically trying to descalate the situation rather than attacking on a momentary impulse.
Generally, women are less aggressive than men and remain level-headed longer than her male counterparts, opting for non-violent methods first before using force.
Exceptions apply if she is trying to protect her children (or someone who she cares for as a child). Mothers can be tigresses.
A female pre-fight conversation may be: "If you had not done so-and-so and betrayed me with so-and-so, we could have been good friends as I thought we would be." "What do you mean? It was in fact you who brought bad blood between us. I can still hear you laughing with so-and-so, taunting me, purposefully making me look bad -" "But that was so long ago! If you want me to say sorry about something so insignificant, you should have just said so: I'm sorry. There. Satisfied?" "Ha! I can't believe you say that so easily. You still don't get it, do you?" "Who's being petty and unreasonable now?"
A male pre-fight conversation will be shorter: "Who's the coward now?" "You're wrong." "Prove it." "Bastard."
Compared to men, it will take more time for a woman's fight hormones (adrenaline, neurotransmitters and such) to kick in.
She would be slower to engage initially, throwing reluctant punches and thinking, but she'll grow more and more violent and lose all rational thought and compassion, and once she's in full flow, may not stop even when her opponent begs for mercy.
When writing a male-female duo, you can show him going for the first blow while she observes and strategizes first. When he's past his peak and panting, she is flying about left and right. Later when the tension wears off and she becomes wobbly and teary, she can rely on him to have recovered faster and distract other teammates so that they won't see her cry.
Plausible Skills and Backstory
In many cultures and time periods, the general attitude of society towards girls is that they have no place in fist fights or martial arts, unlike how it is encouraged for boys of the same age. So if your heroine has physical prowess that surpasses typical 'fitness' or is hidden, build a backstory of how she's obtained it.
For modern heroines, it can be as simple as signing her up for martial arts classes or yearly membership at the local gym. For historical fiction or girls with strict 'feminine' upbringing, it can be trickier.
It can be related to profession: maybe she was an erotic wrestler, catfighter, or an assasin who thought killing was more honorable than prostitution. They may have dabbles with it for a short time and is now trying to hide their past from their respectable employer or fiance.
It can be family backstory: Perhaps her mother was an accomplished martial artist or she had to fend for younger siblings on the streets from an early age. Maybe she was the only girl in a family of many boys who refused to be the punching bag.
Inexperienced Female Fighters
A woman with no fighting experience or training is likely to resort to one of these on instinct:
Try to talk herself out of the situation, attempting to persuade or negotiate for her life.
Grab something to use as a weapon. This instinct seems to be stronger for women than it is in men.
Use her hands to try and break free, or kick (often wth little success)
Pull hair
Scratch.
In a serious fight, pulling hair and scratching won't be helpful, except when the police come to find her body, they would find the opponent's DNA under her fingernails.
Plausible Weapons and Clothing
All of the above applies to scenes where both parties have no weapons, or has the bare minimum (like one dagger each).
Weapons are equalizers, and if your heroine is pointing a gun at her opponent she will definitely NOT hesitate to be the one to shoot first.
When giving your female character a weapon, choose one she can plausibly use. It would take an unusually brawny woman to wield a great medieval longsword.
For historical fiction, give your heroine something she'll plausibly own. Swords and firearm were a no-go for women, but archery was borderline acceptable.
For clothing starters, you definitely CAN NOT dress her in a tight miniskirt and chainmail bra with long, flowy hair and multiple silver chockers. Unless she's trying to seduce her way into her opponent's bedroom, and he has a chainmail bra fetish.
A practical heroine will have her thighs covered, preferably with leather but at least with fabric, since a lot of blood flows through the thighs and a slash would be critical.
She'll keep her hair tied, tucked under a helmet, braided back, etc. so that it won't impede her vision.
She'll support her breasts with a strong sport bra. In a historical eprioid, she'll either tie her breasts tight with a fabric bandage or support them with some kind of leather corset.
Invent a female version of male fighter clothing of the time you are writing about if it doesn't exist.
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0-therw-0-rldly · 6 months ago
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I’ll preface this by saying I’m not really a shipper. I just enjoy canon couples on TV Series/films.
Terms I’d like B*ddies to remove from their vocabulary because they don’t know how to use them correctly:
Media literacy: For a group that uses this term a lot you sure do misinterpret everything in this show.
Queerbaiting: Going to expand on this one. A show that’s already been pre established for having queer characters simply cannot queerbait.
Ship baiting: While sometimes you can argue that they could be doing that, that’s only if you look at the show in a very biased manner. You might think this is the case but the general audience doesn’t think the way you do.
Ship war: This isn’t a one tree hill situation where there was Team Brooke Vs. Team Peyton where the middle guy (Lucas Scott) had canonically been with both women. This is people not understanding fanon vs. canon and not being able to just watch the show. It’s like playing quarterback on Madden and thinking you could be better than Patrick Mahomes.
Plot device: everything’s a plot device. Move tf on.
Predator: You sound like crazy MAGA supporters calling everything regarding the LGBTQIA+ community as predatory. Sit down.
Co-parenting: I know this is a big one and discourse was brought up during the hiatus. Oliver and Ryan have loosely mentioned this years ago but it was never to be taken this seriously. Do y’all even know what co-parenting is or are you that big of a donut? Buck is someone who loves his best friend deeply and by extension, his kid too. Him taking care of him frequently does not make him a co-parent. Maybe he is a parental or uncle figure, but he isn’t a co-parent. Also, I swear y’all need to learn how a will works. He is a GODPARENT, not a GUARDIAN. Stfu.
Hag: This especially applies to women, but to say that someone 25-30+ is a hag for still being in fandoms or enjoying tv shows/films is inherently misogynistic. Men are never held to this much criticism for enjoying fictional media, but women aren’t allowed to?
Queer Coding: people of the same sex “looking at each other”, hugging, or having intimate moments all together doesn’t make them queer coded. It could mean that they just love each other that deeply platonically. While representation is amazing and just because you interpret a character as queer coded (just like my ship baiting comment) doesn’t mean others interpret it that way as well. In addition, network TV has stipulations, and also actors are allowed to decline storylines. Ryan has mentioned his character is heterosexual an abundance of times which means (at least for now) that he isn’t willing to go for this storyline.
Dead naming: Y’all construing the fact that Buck wants people like coworkers and some of his former love interests, to saying Evan is his dead name is inherently transphobic because do you even understand what a dead name is? Evan Buckley is shown as being fine with being called Evan by both Tommy and his sister. I’m pretty sure some of his love interests have called him Evan as well.
Fetishizing: You guys saw two hot guys who “looked at each other” and for 6 seasons have wanted nothing but to see those two make out with each other. Those of us who enjoy Tevan saw Buck giddy at the thought of Tommy and have wanted domestic fluff for them since.
Anything to do with racism, homophobia, and misogyny: I’ve seen the way you guys have conveniently weaponized Henren and by extension Aisha/Tracie when you didn’t get the Ryan/Oliver interview, don’t try to act like you’re morally superior. Not to mention wanting a canonically gay man to die in a show and not even holding those who use your ship name to write CSA fics accountable because you’re petty and want to throw hissy fits. Anyone looking at your comments as an outsider would think you’re homophobes and yes queer people can be homophobic.
I do hope you can expand your vocabulary. 🤍
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lxdymoon0357 · 1 year ago
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Hi, Navi! May I request some headcanons for Felix Chamberlain from I have become the hero’s rival with a transmigrator!reader who just wants her favs to be happy and to have a peaceful life too, but somehow gets the magician’s attention anyway? It would be interesting if one of the original male leads had interest in the transmigrator!reader, though it’s all up to you! :)
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Felix Chamberlain X Transmigrator! Reader HCs
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▼ You were ECSTATIC to be a transmigrator and that to your special manhwa!! You were definitely gonna help Irene, Claudia and Felix and you really wanted to see Irene and Felix's love bloom in front of your eyes and luckily you were a middle-class person and you applied to be Claudia's playmate or something...
▼ You quickly got close with her and Irene and you three were the ICONIC trio!! and you quickly became friends with Felix as well, you'd help Claudia escape the male leads as much as you could by remembering the manhwa!
▼ And you slowly started developing feelings, before it was for him like a fictional character, but now for real....But you were afraid that after this finished, you'd be thrown back into your real world, so you didn't act on your feelings...
▼ You became very close with them and eventually told them about you being from another world, Irene was VERY happy to learn someone was from her world, and you couldn't bother to explain to her how she was also a part of the manhwa, so you went along with it!
▼ Also Irene was mean to end up with Felix, right? Yeah, it's not like the manhwas you read where you might end up with the character when their love interest is RIGHT THERE! But he seemingly never got close with Irene in a romantic path and neither did Irene...and this confused you...
▼ Felix would love to bond with you by asking you how you used to live, what you used to eat, where you lived, what you looked like...and whom you dated, yes he's jealous of them...don't worry...
▼ And soon you confessed and you started dating, it was such a big thing for Irene and Claudia who had been shipping you two since day 1 and Lerase himself was quite happy as he seemed to have taken a liking to you as well...
▼ He would love to hear stories about how you lived, how things are different in your world and whom you hated and loved and liked or some random stories from childhood...He wanted to know what you are like before you came into his arms in this world.
▼ He would have a portrait of you painted on what you looked like before, and he gets a smaller copy on a page and he sleeps with the smaller portrait beside his bed! He can not get over the fact you looked so cute!
▼ Irene and you would often reminisce on how life was before you came here and how much you miss things from back then, but you both are so utterly grateful to be here and be in love with the Chamberlains...Yes, Irene liked Claudia...
▼ Oh btw, Benjamin took a weird liking for you and Lerase apparently didn't like that....and crushed his skull in his bare hands, of-course you didn't see him crush his skull, but you were there during the aftermath and god in your eyes does Felix look hot covered in blood...
▼ Oh you got Irene and Felix and told them how in the original story, Irene and Felix were meant to be together and how they both....yeah...of-course those two looked a bit grossed out and a felt a bit weird, because first, they don't like each other, they like Claudia and you respectively and they can't honestly see themselves together, no matter what you say or do...and you honestly find it funny and bring it to make the two cringe up and look grossed out...
▼ Claudia loves to hear about the pretty dresses and what women can do and can't do in the modern world and how much people wanted her and Irene to get together and sh's happy to hear that
▼ In all honesty, it's a adventure everyday with the trio and you being with them! Double dates, double couples and quadrouple trouble~
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elrielsgarden · 1 month ago
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As evidenced by many a comment and post, yes, they do. At the very least when it comes to Elain Archeron.
And it’s largely, from what I have seen, women saying these things while still uplifting characters such as Feyre, Nesta, etc. Why has the major girlbossification of female characters been taken so far we have now circled back and missed the point of feminism? It is good to be more traditionally feminine, or to go slay enemies (if you’re in a fantasy novel anyways), or to be some wonderful combination of those sorts of traits. One is not “good” while the other is “useless.”
Elain is similar in many ways to Elide and Yrene, from the Throne of Glass series. But they are each individual presences, their own person. I also cannot accurately describe Elide or Yrene to be “popular” in the ToG fandom; it is rare indeed that I find someone whose favorite character is one of these ladies (I personally adore them). And one cannot properly compare their story arcs to then say that people don’t hate the two women from ToG because they’re perhaps more traditionally feminine (which in many ways I might argue against, if you’re comparing simply their more “feminine” traits)—and so readers don’t hate Elain for this reason. In fact, the hate for Elain seems to come from a lack of reason.
The very fact that, despite their similarities, Elide and Yrene are loved while Elain is not would indicate just how this hatred lacks reason and is indeed based on a superficial judgement of character based solely on Elain’s more traditionally feminine traits.
Elain has a presence. An absolutely essential one. And her story is not complete, meaning she will grow and surprise us in beautiful ways.
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Good. I don’t want Elain to be perfect. She isn’t perfect. Aside from “plot devices” that aid good storytelling, a perfect character is not worth reading about. No human is perfect—so why should we be interested in the life of a perfect fictional character? Find a character, in book or other media, that’s perfect. I’ll wait.
Elain can be gentle, kind, and a dreamer while still being a beautifully flawed character. That is what makes a good story. A good character who readers can get behind, but who also messes up, has flaws, and finds or creates ways to overcome those very flaws.
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I don’t buy this for even a second. Assuming that sweetness/gentleness and flaws can’t both contribute to what makes a character who they are is quite simply incorrect. You maybe don’t “buy the nice persona” of someone like Amarantha, when she tricked Prythian. That logic simply does not apply to Elain. She is kind, gentle, a dreamer. And flawed, too. Every character is layered. The whole of the rest of the inner circle. As Elain is, too.
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Elain is disliked because readers choose to look past and away from her gentle, nurturing qualities, instead labelling her as “useless,” “boring,” and “personality-proof.” All that tells me is that you did not read the books, not truly. You took one cursory glance at her, missing every moment of her trauma, every part of what makes her who she is.
Nesta’s flaws are louder—darker, perhaps. This, too, drew hatred from readers. I never hated her, just as I never hated Elain. I saw a deeply wounded and traumatized character, who dealt with that in different ways than her sisters did—because her flaws are not the same as theirs, because she possesses different strengths and good qualities than her sisters. Nesta’s journey of healing was beautiful. As Feyre’s was. As Elain’s has begun and will continue to be.
To not identify with a character is perfectly acceptable. To dismiss and discard someone simply because one hates her kindness says many things about the reader who does this, about the ideas society has cultivated.
Elain is a beautiful character. To dismiss her is to dismiss every reader who identifies with her gentle soul. 🌸
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perseidlion · 7 months ago
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Fandom needs to have a serious conversation about the difference between a sexual character and a predatory one.
A character who is comfortable in their sexuality, is a flirt, and attempts to charm other characters isn't a predator by default. Predatory behaviour ignores signs that the attention is unwanted. Predatory behaviour means ignoring consent and pursuing someone when they're clearly not interested and blatantly ignoring their wishes.
Conflating the two downplays ACTUAL predatory behaviour and makes it harder to spot both in fiction and in real life. It's also different in the context of a story than it would be IRL. It's important to keep in mind that the purpose of fiction is to have narrative tension, conflict, and character development. The purpose of fiction unless it is religious or for children, is not to model ideal behaviour. A story for mature adults trusts that its audience knows the difference between permissible behaviour in real life and permissible behaviour in fiction.
Still, someone flirting with someone when they aren't immediately into it isn't some transgression. Neither is continuing to pursue someone or show attraction when they aren't given a hard no or directly blown off. ESPECIALLY in fiction where one party playing hard to get is a common story element.
The difference between a predator and a sexual person is emotional intelligence and an ability to both read and respect body language and signs. An emotionally intelligent flirt will back off when they know their attentions are unwanted. But shooting their shot to see how the person responds isn't evil behaviour, nor is trying to convince the person of their merits.
If this were true, a lot of people would never get together both in fiction and in real life. You can never 100 per cent know how a person is going to respond when you flirt with them. That's why flirting exists, to test the waters. Not every relationship starts with friendship, either. A lot of people jump right to romance. Also, sometimes people aren't into it immediately because they haven't thought about it. So the response can be ambiguous. There's been a worrying trend of people vilifying and painting characters as criminal/problematic/evil for simply being sexual and making their desires known. This is a prudish attitude that is very damaging - especially when levied on queer people who have historically been vilified, criminalized and experienced violence for expressing their sexuality.
It may be uncomfortable if someone expresses sexual attraction to you when you don't want it and don't reciprocate it, but if it's done respectfully, it isn't a crime. The crime comes if they ignore your wishes and pursue you anyway, or objectify you. **Addendum to note that I am talking about flirting that approaches a person like a real human being and not an object. This doesn't apply to say, dudes trying to talk to women on public transit with headphones in, or street harassment of any kind. I'm talking about flirting that comes from a place of respect and genuine interest at an appropriate time and place. Edited to add proof that the Cat King is definitely reading emotional signals from Edwin that encourage him to keep flirting:
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olderthannetfic · 11 months ago
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I have really mixed feelings about the small proportion of F/F fiction (original or fanfic), because yeah sure, people have their desires, they should write what they want, I get it. It all works out when I hear it from person to person. But somehow the logic only ever applies in one direction? "There are more male protagonists because men only care about male characters! Women also mostly care about male characters, because that's the majority of characters they get!" And then somehow we also yet kvetch when men write female characters (because it's incorrectly or something, nevermind if women are writing male characters correctly). Why don't we expect gay men to feel compelled only by femslash for the same reasons (but gender swapped) as the lesbian slashers/fujoshi? All of those very rational justifications are applied selectively, "for me for not for thee," and it all only leads to "idk I just don't wanna write femslash", for Reasons. Do we get to call them microaggressions yet?
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No, you don't get to call other people's fantasy life a microaggression.
That is indeed "for me but not for thee" in the sense that you get to want what you want but other people aren't supposed to follow their id.
Do you also police gay men who spend too much time on drag and obsessing over female divas? That's an actual real world behavior that's somewhat equivalent. It frequently goes unchallenged, at least by progressives, because men are allowed to do whatever they want with chick stuff, while women are "stealing" if they dare to stray into dude stuff.
(God, I've seen so much more policing of drag kings being ~problematic~ for acting out stereotypical gender than policing of drag queens for the same. It's nuts!)
Fujoshi are often queer, but it's absurd to think we're mostly lesbians. We tend to be bi or asexual women with gender stuff going on, though there is a mix of everybody, including lesbians. There are also a lot of AFAB non-women who get lumped in with us. On the rare occasions I find a man willing to admit to being a similar demographic, he usually does like gender play in his hobbies and entertainment. It's just that men face even more pressure than women do to fit into tidy categories. Bi women get told we're whores. Bi men are told they don't exist.
Yes, I know plenty of lesbians who write more m/m than f/f, but in the big picture of all of AO3 or all of fanfic or all of media, they aren't the demographic driving these numbers. They're vastly outnumbered by the bi women, the asexual women, and the straight and gnc women.
The men we should be looking at as an equivalent aren't cis gay men but bicurious soy boys and the like.
Do most of us fujoshi object to equivalent men doing an equivalent thing? I've seen it sometimes, and I agree it's hypocritical. I'd like us to afford men the same ability to play and take on identities in their art. I remember enjoying Ranma fandom back in the day and reading quite a lot of f/f that was probably by men. It had some of that same sense of distance and fantasy that I so enjoy in m/m aimed at fujoshi. (I do consume some by-cis-gay, for-cis-gay content, both m/m and f/f, but it's often too literal and too bound up in specific named identities for my taste.)
On average, the people I see complaining most about men producing f/f material are the same people who think that because I have a clit, I should center my life around women exclusively. In other words, people spouting radfem ideology, perhaps on purpose or perhaps without realizing.
I do agree that some of the ways of expressing a lack of desire to write femslash can get pretty douchey. I want us to move away from some of the less accurate ones like "There are no compelling female characters" because of this.
But the reason for all these jerkass explanations is that women and people perceived as women who like m/m are constantly asked to explain ourselves. These aren't usually microaggressions: they're openly hostile. People get defensive and try to answer with important-sounding reasons about identity and pain because society at large won't accept "I like this" as the true explanation.
Pleasure is never enough of a reason for a woman to do something.
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shaanks · 5 days ago
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Okay I gotta ask this silly question bc I see this headcanon around a lot and I want to hear your take on it: do you think Shanks bathes? Like I don't think he has a five-step skincare routine or anything but I also don't think he's severely lacking in personal hygiene either, y'know? Any thoughts? 😅
I have a little backlog of Shanks asks in my inbox but THIS one I absolutely have the energy for.
I have no idea beyond like. A desire to apply this universe's pirate era hygiene to the OPverse's residents, and/or a need to kind of downplay a fictional man's standards by applying IRL men's aversion to soap to them, why or how people have come to the conclusion that Shanks stinks and never bathes and all his clothes are greasy and so on and so on ad nauseam. Weird work weird behavior, even from the folks who like want him real bad.
Like to a degree I can see where a group just starting off might end up a lil stinky if they're like. On a skiff like Luffy Zoro and Nami started out on in the baking sun or whatever but like?? Shanks went from Roger's crew on Roger's big nice ship where prime Rayleigh was and where they also had facilities, money, and a doctor on board, to his own crew and the shortest stint ever as Regular Pirates before becoming a Yonko himself and acquiring the Red Force which is also a big nice ship with facilities and a doctor on board.
Not only would hygiene be easy to keep up with, but any doctor worth their salt (which Crocus and Hongo both certainly are) wouldn't let them get the battery of preventable illnesses that come from not keeping themselves clean.
Additionally?? And I covered this briefly in another ask, but like?? Shanks has nice clothes! Are the prints on his pants silly? Sure. But everything he wears is nice good quality fabric, his hair is thick and soft, he keeps his facial hair, brows, and nails trimmed nicely? Aside from just like. Being a guy, I would love to know what part of his appearance suggests he doesn't take care of himself. Because I truly don't see it.
Also ALSO additionally it's canon that Shanks is very attractive and well-enjoyed by loads of folks but esp women, and I can't imagine if he was gross and filthy and stank that that would be the case. To each their own, ofc, but like. Statistically speaking.
tl:dr I think that while he probably isn't doing a 12 step K beauty routine or whatever, Shanks is clean and well kept and smells nice and takes care of his teeth and the like. Definitely not a man who would be shy about washing his ass, you know what I mean?
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gamorahww · 22 days ago
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Analyzing Glinda Upland Through MBTI - Why She Doesn't Go With Elphaba, Why Ableism is Just Part of Her Worldview and Why She’s Upset, Fiyero Started “Thinking” -
Hello, this is a Glinda analysis no one asked for. It doesn’t contain any spoilers for Wicked: Part 2.
Glinda is one of the most interesting characters with one of the most interesting story arcs I have ever seen in any media. I love the deconstructed “good” of her character and all the layers that the music, the actresses playing her, even the choreography, and in the movie, the editing gave her. Which is why I am slightly annoyed that a portion of the fandom refuses to see her as anything but Pink Fairy Princess With a Girl Crush™. This analysis is meant to look at how Glinda functions, and why she clashes with the two other important characters of the story, Elphaba and Fiyero, based on their personality types.
Yes, I am biased. I ship Fiyeraba, and I even wrote a similar essay on why they work so well, also through the MBTI lense. This is one of the reasons why I will not look at Gelphie only, I would like this to be as broad as possible. I don’t mean to attack anyone’s shipping preferences, this is just a character study. If you are here for that, welcome! Grab a snack, this won’t be short.
Disclaimer Regarding MBTI
I know many people think MBTI is bullshit and even a bit limiting, when we talk about real life, and the people inhabiting it, but in the case of well-written, consistent fictional characters (which applies to Glinda, Elphaba and Fiyero) I think MBTI can be used without worrying about negative effects.
I.) Context, If You Are Not Familiar with MBTI
When it comes to MBTI, there are two angles of looking at the types. One you are probably familiar with is the four-letter abbreviation (ENFP, INTJ, ESTJ, etc), but there is a deeper layer, where looking at those cognitive functions that each type uses. There are 16 variations of the four-letter types, but only 8 functions, that vary in order, and preference in each type. 
We identify four main cognitive functions in each type. Introverted types (their four-letter type stars with an I) are most comfortable using their introverted functions, and extroverted types (their four letters start with an E) are most comfortable with their extroverted functions. However as a person grows up, goes through life and evolves, they learn to harness their initially weaker functions better, and this gives them a more well-rounded personality, and a more healthier way of living in the world and be their authentic selves.
The order of the functions is also important, so whatever is in first place is their strongest function, and whatever is their last is their weakest.
You may be looking at this thinking “I didn’t ask for this”. And you are right, you didn’t, but bear with me.
So, lets sum it up: Each four-letter type has four main functions, and the extroverts are good at extrovert stuff, while introverts are good at introvert stuff. Got it!
II.) Glinda and her MBTI Type and Cognitive Functions
Glinda is an ESFJ personality type. ESFJs are also known as “caregivers”, because they are deeply social people, and they use their skills of being able to read people to influence the lives of those around them. Usually they thrive on giving to others, and they genuinely don’t want anything in return. ESFJ is the most common personality type among women, with their introverted counterpart (the ISFJ) they are considered the “mother” stereotype. They enjoy hosting parties, making sure everyone around them has a great time. They hate conflict, and in an ideal world for them, everyone would just get along, while upholding their own ideal of the world.
ESFJs have a deep sense of community, but they are also deeply traditionalists. They have a hard time letting go of the idea of “how things should be” according to them. Their ideals however don’t come from personal beliefs, they come from learned and social input that they interacted with throughout their lives. "How it should be" for them, always stems from what they are used to, and they usually struggle with thinking out of that box.
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Glinda - ESFJ - Cognitive Functions: Fe-Si-Ne-Ti
(Fe) Extraverted Feeling: Focuses on creating harmony and meeting others’ emotional needs, making decisions based on group values and relationships. Glinda goes with the flow of the groups she inhabits. Whatever environment she is in, she wants to ensure the people around her are in harmony. When people around her have differing emotional needs, then she hits a wall, because she has to decide which one she prioritizes over the other.
(Si) Introverted Sensing: Draws on past experiences and traditions to create stability and provide a reliable sense of order. She relies on what she knows, and what she has experienced before. If she has to chose between what is new and what is familiar and therefore reliable, she will always chose the latter.
(Ne) Extraverted Intuition: Explores possibilities and connections, generating new ideas and perspectives for problem-solving. This function is used by ESFJs to explore creative ideas on how to improve the lives of the people around her. "Popular" is a great example of her trying a bunch of versions out to see how she can improve Elphaba’s life - mainly in ways that Galinda herself finds useful.
(Ti) Introverted Thinking: Analyzes information internally to find logical consistency, supporting nuanced and precise understanding. Glinda has this internal sense of logic, where she sees how in her mind, things hang together. This is an internal system, that is rather rigid, and to change one aspect of it would mean to change everything else around it as well. She uses this to decide what is actually possible, and what’s not - according to her.
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III.) Clashing Values and Peronalities
Elphaba and Fiyero are obviously the two main characters Glinda interacts with the most throughout the story, but her relationship with either of them mostly works on a superficial level only, and the main reason for that lies in the cognitive functions each character uses. Let’s take a look below. To see how two characters are similar in their personalities, what we are looking for is the same functions in their function stack.
Fe-Si-Ne-Ti > Glinda
vs
Ni-Te-Fi-Se > Elphaba
Se-Fi-Te-Ni > Fiyero
As you can see, Glinda doesn’t share a single one of the functions of the other two. On the surface this would not be a huge issue. Different people find beauty in their differences all the time, and can greatly benefit from those differences. If this was a story, where personal values are of no significance, if there wasn’t you know, an authoritarian regime on the horizon, they all could be friends, as they are. But that is not the case, and in the context of the story, this situation first makes, but then also breaks both of these two relationships she has. And the main culprit in their personality for that is…
Elphaba and Fiyero's Introverted Feeling clashing with Glinda's Extroverted Feeling and Introverted Sensing.
You see, Introverted Feeling (Fi) is what Fiyero and Elphaba bond over. (Fi) is the part of a person that holds their values and integrity. It’s what they hold dear, it’s their sense of what is right, and how things should be. People with introverted feeling are more driven by what they perceive as just, vs what people around them see as just acceptable and normal. You can read more about my exploration of (Fi) in Elphaba and Fiyero here.
Glinda doesn’t have (Fi). This is very obvious in how she reacts to injustice around her, and how she doesn’t really care about Dr. Dillamond’s fate, even when she saw him getting dragged out of the classroom with her own eyes. 
In the deleted scenes, Glinda tells Elphaba that she would have helped, if Elphaba asked her to do that. Glinda is telling the truth. She would have helped, but not because she thought it was the right thing to do, but because Elphaba asked. Her motivations stem from what the outside world wants her to do, and if she loves the person asking her to do the thing, and it doesn't clash with her how others view her or what she thinks others expect from her, then she will do the thing. But had Elphaba put a spell on everyone, except for herself and Glinda, Glinda wouldn’t have done what Fiyero did. She wouldn’t have jumped out of her seat immediately to pick up the cub, on her own accord, and if it was the two girls in that situation, they probably would have stood there for a while, not really knowing what to do.
Neither of them are the taking action type of people, that's Fiyero.
See, Glinda's love for Elphaba can take her as far as helping her save one lion cub when everyone else is asleep, and there are little to no consequences for doing this. She is absolutely right, she would have helped. But this is the limitation of her helpfulness, and essentially, her love for Elphaba as well.
Glinda can’t help who and what she is. “Popular” is not her “I want” song in the musical, but it is a declaration of her values, and how she thinks the world works. I feel many people write "Popular" off as a comic relief moment, but it actually spells out exactly what she is, and what is important for her. She sees social standing as the most important thing in the world, so far that she even would teach Elphaba whom she cares for at that point, how to get a more appropriate status, so she can get by. She truly believes that “networking” with anyone, and maintaining good relationship and a beneficial personal brand is the best way to get what you want. She is not wrong, in many cases, her way of diplomacy are useful, impactful, and may also lead to some level of change.
Glinda is very manipulative, in bigger and smaller ways, but she is usually able to manipulate people in a way that they don't get angry with her for it. (see her directing Boq's attention towards Nessa, something that Glinda thinks kind, but it actually also a self serving act.)
However... Elphaba’s integrity does not let her to compromise in the face of what she percieves as injustice. Her morals don't allow her to network with people, who are so willing to do… well, fascism.
IV.) Satisfying the System
I won’t go into details of how far Glinda goes to be the part of the established system, as that is spoilers territory for part 2, and maybe not everyone is here for that. Nor do we know, how this will play out in the movies. But…
Glinda has no interest in questioning the system and how it works. She understands how it functions, and she uses it to her advantage whenever she can. She uses her social standing and the image she cultivated to get what she wants, and this takes her as far as she can go, like she said in "Popular", without “brains or knowledge”, but she hits a wall with Madame Morrible, and the sorcery class. Magic is so rare in Oz, and Glinda wants to be able to do magic so bad. There is an almost throwaway joke that, when we examine it closer, I think explains why she wants to be a sorceress.
In her conversation with Morrible, Glinda mentions she submited and essay titled “Magic Wands: Need They Have a Point?” which is a pun on the shape of wands (and Glinda eventually not having a wand that has a point at the end of her transformation into Glinda, the Good, but one with a sphere and crystals at the end) but also, if we break it down a bit, she is saying “does magic need to have a point?”. I believe this means she wants to do magic for the sake of it. Not to change the system, or improve it, no. Of course, she also wants to help others with her magic, but, importantly, to help them in a way she sees fit, and to help others meet the standards of the system and the society they live in, so they fit in nicely into Glinda's world.
Not everyone is able to fit in like that however. I would like to briefly touch on the ableism she exhibits by manipulating societal perceptions of Nessa as “tragically beautiful” and giving her a suitor Glinda herself doesn’t want. Glinda exploits the pity she knows people feel for Nessa to manipulate Boq, using the ableist system to her benefit while perpetuating it. She views herself as superior to both Boq and Nessa, which is why she feels justified in orchestrating this situation.
Another example of her ableism is when she criticizes Dr. Dillamond for his inability to pronounce her name. The professor explains that his lack of upper front teeth, a physical difference that impacts his ability to articulate certain sounds in human language, prevents him from doing so. However, Glinda dismisses this explanation, insisting that “every other professor” can manage. She fails to recognize that a skill she considers basic might not be universally achievable, and she unfairly holds him to a standard he cannot meet.
Glinda’s actions perpetuate an ableist system by upholding and exploiting societal biases against those with disabilities or physical differences. By manipulating perceptions of Nessa and disregarding Dr. Dillamond’s explanation, she reinforces the idea that people must conform to arbitrary standards of “normalcy” to be valued. This behavior not only marginalizes individuals with unique challenges but also normalizes the expectation that their worth is contingent upon overcoming or compensating for those differences.
V.) It’s Safer inside the Bubble
To ignore the fact that Glinda comes from great privilege in a story that has this much politics in it would be a silly thing to do, but I will kinda do that anyway. The only level of privilege I would like to touch on is the fact that her and Fiyero come from similar backgrounds, royalty and power. They both had a presumably an easy and sheltered life before meeting Elphaba. Elphaba also comes from wealth, but society and her family made life a lot more difficult for her.
Glinda sees this similarity with her and Fiyero, and feels like she found her match. In the state Fiyero is in, when they initially meet, he seems like the perfect fit for her. But the thing about Fiyero is that he is in a very-very emotionally unhealthy state when they meet. (You can read about his looping in my Fiyero and Elphaba analysis) 
Isn’t it interesting, that Glinda sings about popularity not needing “brains or knowledge” and Fiyero claims to dance through life “painless” and “brainless”?
Fiyero lives superficially and carelessly, literally shutting his brain off, and not engaging his inner world. This inner world is where his Introverted Feeling lives, so him not using that keeps him from clashing with Glinda on the points mentioned in III.) above.
But that is not Fiyero’s natural state, and he shouldn’t behave like that. However the fact that they can only connect when one of them is not entirely themselves is something Glinda clocks, when she says he is being “distant” and that he “has been thinking”. After his encounter with Elphaba, Fiyero starts engaging his (Fi) - again, more about that in the other analysis - and Glinda has no idea, what to do with that. He presumably even told him that it had to do with the day Dr. Dillamond was taken, but Glinda cannot connect to this on an emotional level, and she calls him “an old goat”, which is pretty insensitive of her. She can’t really cope with the fact that Elphaba and Fiyero were both affected by this thing that seems almost trivial to her, just another day at school, and she didn’t like Dillamond anyway.
She is very pereptive, and she can see the change in both of them. And change for a traditionalist like Glinda is devastatingly scary.
Little does she know that Fiyero from that point onward is no longer inside the same bubble as she is, and he is a lot less afraid of seeing it all in the rearview mirror, and never to return to it again. Well, if he could help it, that is.
So, taking Fiyero and the lion cub, and school, and all that away, Elphaba and Glinda go to see the Wizard. Once they realized (well, Elphaba does) that the Wizard has no magic, and he is also behind all the things happening to the animals, Glinda's bubble doesn't... pop. She aligns herself with the crowd, preserving the status quo.
She has to chose between what is right, and what feels right for her, and well... she stays behind. And she doesn't do the right thing. This time.
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gl1tched-g0th · 8 months ago
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Happy Pride. Can we celebrate by, just for the month, having fandoms not be weird about lesbians/lesbian-coded characters.
Can we acknowledge that just because a woman character exists, and doesn't stare directly into the camera like an episode of the Office to say "I Do Not Like Men", that doesn't mean they aren't lesbian?
Can we please acknowledge how fandoms, especially cartoon spaces, are not normal about lesbians and lesbian coding. Can we acknowledge that lesbian is not a "dirty" or "taboo" word, and that it is okay to admit that a character is just a flat out lesbian.
Can we not try to maneuver our way around it by saying "well they could be bi/pan!", like so many people do with lesbian characters. For example:
-Amity from TOH, confirmed lesbian. People still argue that she's bisexual, because she drew herself with a fictional nonbinary character from a book once in the entire show.
-Velma from Scooby Doo, confirmed lesbian. When she got confirmed, people still argued she was bi because she dated men in past shows/specials - despite her being visibly uncomfortable in the relationships in question. Some even argued it was "bi-erasure" to make her a lesbian, which is insane to me.
-Amaya from The Dragon Prince, confirmed lesbian. Before she was confirmed, people said she was a "bicon" instead of lesbian, despite her showing no interest in men within the show. All she did was have a male interpreter (because shes DEAF and needs one), and people immediately paired them together.
-Ellie Williams from TLOU, confirmed lesbian. She shows no interest in men, states multiple times that men are "not her type", has only dated/had crushes on women within all games, the show, and even the comic, and yet people still claim she's bi.
-Robin Buckley from Stranger Things, confirmed lesbian. There's not much I can say here. She came out as a lesbian in the show, and people still call her bisexual. The jokes write themselves.
-Sammy from Camp Cretaceous/Chaos Theory, lesbian-coded. She's often headcanoned as anything but lesbian, often excused with "she never Outright said she's a lesbian like Yaz said she was bi", or that a few crew members said she was meant to be ambiguous. Yet I see nobody questioning why she specifically - the only other main female character, and who has never shown interest in men - is being kept that way.
-Vanessa from The Hollow, lesbian-coded. Developed a friendship with a male character, but has never expressed romantic interest in men. Laughing at a joke made by the opposite gender, and wanting to impress a male character because of a need for validation are not signs of romantic interest, by the way.
I am not saying you can't headcanon characters as bi, or that bi people are "evil", or trying to ""police"" who you ship together or whatever else excuse people use to derail conversations about this. There is a frequent pattern within fandoms where a lesbian (coded) character exists + has any relationship with a man ever + doesn't explicitly state they don't like men = not a lesbian. And fuck, even when they DO say they don't like men, they are still seen as bi.
Queer-coding is just as eminent as having a character be confirmed as queer. And, surprisingly (sarcasm) that also applies to lesbian coded characters. Lesbian characters do not need to "prove" their lesbianism to the viewers by hating/isolating themselves from men to be lesbians. They do not need to say outright that they don't like men in order to be lesbian coded. They can have relationships with men without being romantically interested in them. Lesbians have been fighting for so long to not be seen as "needing" to be with men in order to just. exist.
And believe me I could go on a whole rant about how this entire issue has roots in misogyny within the community, or how some people still haven't unlearned the idea of how a man and woman can have an 100% platonic relationship, or how people treat calling a character lesbian as a "last resort", but this post is already a wall of text as it is.
Please just be normal about lesbians in media.
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