#rr crit (I guess)

[aroaceleovaldez]

I was reading a post about CoTG and I realized: Rick has seemingly started to write every character pairing with the exact same dynamic, and he's not good at writing that dynamic and it doesn't make sense for 90% of the characters he writes it for.

It's that very specific dynamic of one half of the pair who is almost aggressive to the other party - "teasing" them constantly/insulting them, affectionately punching/judo flipping/maiming/etc, seemingly almost always exasperated with the other - and said other party usually just accepts this treatment or blanketly views it fondly, and may generally be framed as more incompetent than their partner and a little bit of a doormat (particularly relating to being insulted/teased/etc by their partner).

We start seeing this dynamic in HoO with Percy and Annabeth, as a sort of semi-inconsistent twist on their rivals-to-friends-to-lovers dynamic from the first series. Then the dynamic pattern develops further with Leo and Calypso. Then Magnus and Alex. Then Nico and Will, particularly in TSATS. And now in CoTG, it's Percy and Annabeth again but even more in this direction.

I know people have talked about Nico and Will's relationship over the series rapidly being shoehorned into Percabeth Two™, and it's extremely apparent in TSATS that Rick's doing it on purpose (including directly quoting Percabeth scenes but minorly tweaking them to be Solangelo). But recognizing it as an overarching trend in Rick's later books honestly reminds me a lot of how Rick started trying to apply the "Percy Formula" so-to-speak to nearly every protagonist in HoO (and then try to replicate similar character archetypes with Magnus and Apollo's narrations - moreso Magnus in being jaded and sarcastic, very much trying to be first series Percy. He only sounds unique because Rick failed at making him Percy 2. Apollo is more akin to later-series Percy characterization of being goofy and incompetent. Apollo [and Zeus] even got retconned to give Apollo a more similar backstory to Percy's). Rick seems to have decided that he thinks the audience wants this specific dynamic but 10 times over, except he's not good at writing it the first time because it's a bastardization of the time he did a different thing okay.

And Rick also seems aware of that too! Because he retconned Calypso and Leo at the end of TOA, probably because he realized how absolutely awful it was reading when they were written with that dynamic of Calypso just functionally hating Leo and constantly being aggressive towards him! The only time Rick's actually made the dynamic even semi-successful was with Magnus and Alex, because it actually fits within their characters, their dynamics with each other, and their environment. Alex beheading Magnus on the regular works out fine because there are no repercussions to that in Valhalla, Magnus will be fine, so it does genuinely come off as humorous. And Alex has been effectively established to be abrasive at times but have her genuine feelings shine through regularly, and that meshes well with Magnus' jaded-and-aloof-but-quietly-very-empathetic character. And Magnus has been established to, yes, not be great at combat, particularly compared to Alex. They are the only time that flavor of dynamic in that form was effective and cohesive.

Percabeth is no longer rivals-to-friends-to-lovers badasses on equal levels with shaky pasts who finally found some form of permanence with one another. Now it's super smart doting and affectionately aggressive girlfriend and her silly goofy 50%-of-the-time incompetent boyfriend who she judo flips/pushes off cliffs/etc - but affectionately~! Solangelo is trying to riff off of the early series "Poseidon & Athena are enemies" dynamic that Percabeth had but with Apollo & Hades being "opposites" but learning to accept each other, except it ends up with Will just coming off as a huge asshole and Nico being retconned to a complete doormat about it - when prior to that those characterizations would be completely contrary to their established characters (even just from TOA!). Calypso in HoO gets retconned from her PJO characterization to being snooty and aggressive, and Leo's false persona gets merged into his just normal personality except he just also becomes a doormat but more goofy than Nico with occasional haha-dark/depression-humor! Which Nico also got. Which was also a bastardized Percy trait that got redistributed.

It's exhausting. Rick write more than one relationship dynamic you can do it I promise

[bayetea]

there are many things about hazel's povs that have an intensely de-racialized vibe to them (read: divorced from the black girl experience) but I think any black person will tell you that the most obvious sign is the complete lack of attention paid to her hair

like firstly:

she's from the 1930s her hair was definitely getting permed and straightened (it was not acceptable to just wear your natural hair out back then. optics + cultural assimilation/you'll be hard pressed to find photos of black american girls with unstraightened hair in that time period unless they're from like..... harlem)

I do believe that marie was straightening it for her For A Time but then she became more neglectful and stopped so hazel had to do it herself. I'm almost positive that hazel wouldn't have even been permitted to set foot in her school building without straightening it because that's just how much of an expectation it was

ok she comes back from the dead. what's she doing to her hair now bc it's not just gonna be cutesy effortless curls falling over her shoulder no matter what the length is

how does she feel about living in a time period where natural black hair is more accepted (read: more, absolutely not fully)

there are no black people around her At All. in fact she's around a lot of white people on the argo (+nico) so that would probably be giving her some intense feelings of double consciousness (look this term up if you don't know what it means) and that would inform how she feels about her hair

theoretically she ought to be wearing her hair in braids for simplicity's sake but I think it's more likely that she would cling to what she knows (perming/straightening) because it's not easy for a 14 year old girl (PSA hazel is 14.5 in hoo not 13 btw 👍) to go from assimilating to deeply-ingrained white hair beauty standards to just proudly wearing a distinctly black hairstyle all by herself

mind you black women and girls can do whatever they want with their hair and straightening/perming it does not always/have to come from a place of self-hatred or whatever but in this particular case back then straightening one's hair was political And a survival tactic. it was as normal as brushing your teeth. it was enforced through dominant cultural messagings about the Absolute Necessity of conforming to white conventions of beauty. if you don't understand then think of it similarly to how you'd think of 1930s women needing to be perpetually dolled up and modestly dressed in order to be considered "good women" and anyways I'm just saying that this would be a lot to unpack for a 14 year old girl so hazel's probably just continuing to do this impractical thing (straightening her hair all the time) like 60% out of habit and 20% out of shame and 20% she doesn't know what else to do

something something about a missed potential character arc regarding all of this and in general there's so little mind paid to race in hazel's povs which is just ridiculous to me because a black girl from the jim crow era should have at least a few feelings about where she fits into modern society even if that society is camp jupiter. rick demonstrates his capacity to talk about how his characters feel about their race most notably in the kane chronicles so I don't think was too much to ask for. see this quote from an early son of neptune chapter:

^ like....... hazel's feelings of out-of-place-ness are There in the text and important to take note of when understanding her character (note that she's been there for like a year already and she still feels like she doesn't belong) but the emphasis is always put on her Being from a different time or Being undead and is never put on her out-of-place-ness regarding her race as a black girl from segregation times who is literally so out-of-place in this weird post-racial camp jupiter society. it feels like such an obvious thing to consider so its glaring absence really bugs me when I reread her povs and it bugs me when her hair is never talked about by extension because It Matters

you might be thinking "well she had a lot going on and she's not a superficial person maybe she just didn't care what was going on with her hair" and my response is simply that Black girls don't get to "not care" about their hair it is not the same thing as a white person going to school with bedhead it's not the same thing At All (if you aren't black then chances are you've never actually seen what untouched black hair looks like in the morning), especially when it's been beaten into your head for your entire life that your hair is ugly and you have to "do something to it" for it to be acceptable (and again...... she's from the 1930s so that feeling is magnified like 50x over). remember that perpetually dolled up modest 1930s woman I mentioned previously. picture her time traveling to camp jupiter of all places in 2010 and struggling to drop all of her makeup/hairstyling routines and internalized misogyny and conceptualizations of what women are "supposed" to be. this is the kind of fascinating character exploration that we really missed out on with hazel (and tbh regardless of her race she was never believably written as someone from the 1930s. I don't think rick even really tried to be honest)

you might also be wondering "how was rick supposed to know/attempt to portray any of that" and then my second answer is that If you're going to write a character who is not the same race as you then you should do some research and we have the internet now so research has never been easier 👍 this would be especially important to do if that person is a poc from the jim crow era I think! (he could have at least googled black hair 1930s)

anyways what I choose to believe (this is pure fanfiction) is that during hazel's first year at camp jupiter (remember that she was there for about a year before son started) nico would have helped her figure something out after observing her distress over her hair c: like they both secretly watched youtube videos on black hairstyles circa 2010 and then they got attacked by monsters for using a laptop (neither of them know how to use a laptop but he's trying his best for her) but then after killing them he helped her do her hair as something she likes that is easy to maintain <3 (I could also see reyna doing this because she surely knows a thing or two from her spa days)

[zacharyblank]

Listen.

As a responsible fan, I would never suggest trolling Uncle Rick.

But...

After finding out that Rick and his editors use the fan-wiki for info rather than a series bible, I just can't stop thinking about all the hilarious things we could gaslight into the books/show.

Like, can you believe Rick forgot about Anabeth's LASER-VISION in this book!? She's ALWAYS had laser-vision! It's one of her Athena powers! Because OWLS!!!

And can you believe Percy's pet goldfish BLERCY wasn't even MENTIONED! Not once! He's always been such an important friend to Percy! Why would Rick just leave him out like this!?

[everythingwasalreadypicked]

Ocean. In Turkey. OCEAN—

Rick. Weren't you a teacher???? Second graders know this omfg

[wanderingmind867]

If there's one thing in a story that I can't stand, it's when they say that being calling you names is a sign of love. Technically, I'm a hypocrite for hating it (I love my dad, but yell at him a lot). But hypocrisy be damned! It's a bad storytelling technique, and it reminds me of those people who said I was bullied in Grade 4 because the girl secretly liked me. If she liked me, then i'm blind to romance. Because I don't think being pushed around or having your stuff stepped on is very romantic. That's just cruel.

Now, you're probably wondering what brought up this topic. Good question! It's the Magnus Chase books again, actually. The fact that Rick Riordan has Magnus realize that Mallory loves Halfborn through her repeatedly calling him an idiot…i didn't like that very much. If love is expressed through insults, then i don't want it. And again: i'm the world's biggest hypocrite here (since i am the type to yell and be really nasty with people), but I still don't like reading about it. And I don't like being reminded of my flaw. It just makes me feel more convinced of my own horribleness.

I'm rapidly losing the plot of my own note, but since we're here: is it possible that Percy and Annabeth classify as this type of ship? I… I think at the start it is. They definitely start off pretty antagonistic (if i remember everything correctly). Does Rick Riordan salvage it? Well, he has 10 books to do so, so of course he salvages it (to what extent, I can't say. I'm not super opinionated on this topic at present time). But can I still question the beginning of the relationship as being based in a cliche i hate? I would like to think so, yes.

[nicksandslick]

wrt pjo show. i keep trying to figure out what’s Wrong With It because it doesn’t feel quite right and it’s a challenge to articulate. even beyond an allergy to action sequences (it’s a book with swordfighting and monsters! why am i listening to people talk the whole time!) and an insistence on repeating the themes out loud every 20-30 seconds (hmmm. i wonder if we’ve said that the gods are bad parents and cruel to mortals enough times this episode. let’s add in 2 more just to be safe). and dusty stick me all you want for analyzing children’s books but the og series is so interesting because it walks that line between fantasy and the real world. the whole point is that being a demigod is analogus to being a preteen/teen in that you’re straddling the worlds of childhood and adulthood, never fully belonging to either. that’s what makes it such an effective children’s series. the point of low fantasy is that it incurs on the normal world, allowing people to see the fantastical in their everyday lives. (it’s why urban fantasy took off to the extent it did in the 2000s.) people, especially young people, can carry the escapism to their real lives. children are great at imagining the magical into reality and low fantasy just capitalizes on that preexisting talent. SO the pjo books took such pains to connect the magical to the everyday. grover plays hilary duff and YMCA to do plant and tracking magic. charon loves italian suits and annoys his boss for a pay raise. percy, annabeth, and grover return gladiola the poodle to her owner to get enough money for train tickets. these details seem random and unimportant, but they create a larger framework of cultural references and humor that weaves the two “worlds” together. (part of the success of this is a strong flavor of 2005, because “culture” moved far more slowly and could be more easily referenced in books and television without being grotesquely outdated by the time of release. but that doesn’t mean we should, like, completely give up and try to create bland timeless stories. imo.) the most successful episodes for me were 1&2—the episodes where the story takes place almost entirely in the mortal world or the mythical world. episodes where the balance has to be treaded are. lacking.

[boywithskull]

Have you heard of the sequel of TSATS if so are you going to read it? For me personally I'm pretty sceptical due to the first TSATS book also I'm not really a fan of Solangelo 😅

Just found out about it now, and came online to write something, so I'll put it here.

Honestly I'm with you. I'm not the hugest solangelo fan myself, and TSATS didn't do much to change my mind, unfortunately. I also don't really know what else there is to write about, unless they're making it a prequel and just basically showing the actual development of their relationship before they got together (but they tried to expand on that in TSATS so idk if there's much point in going back and retroactively building it from the ground up now). Plus the book was meant to close off the open ends in Nico's arc, so what's really the point in making a second one now anyway? It just feels like a cash grab, or stirring up more Nico hype before his introduction in s3 of the show.

I think Mark was the one who announced this sequel, no? No offence to them, because I'm sure their style works well for their own books, but I don't think Mark's writing meshes well with Rick's at all, and I hated the way basically everyone was characterised. If it's just gonna be another slog of therapy-speak, pop culture references, and poor pacing and tension, then I don't think it's something I'll be too keen to read. I love Nico, and it's because of that that I am respectfully asking Rick to stop. If Rick wants to write more, I would rather he do something about Frank and Hazel at Camp Jupiter, or expand on Jason and Reyna's time there pre-HOO.

[prospitsdream]

being in the pjo fandom as someone who isn’t white actually sucks i will not lie.

like, it feels like when anyone tries to criticize how stereotypical some of rr’s writing is (piper mclean, leo valdez, the ww2 and civil war stuff??) there’s 10 people who will come out of the woodwork to say “at least he’s trying” and “so you’d rather there be no rep?”. like criticism isn’t allowed. talking to a lot (NOT ALL. JFC.) of the white people in the fandom feels like talking to a brick wall. yeah, he was trying to include rep. that’s awesome! but he absolutely didn’t do it the best he could’ve.

and god(s) forbid you’re a person of color cosplaying a character from the book. the amount of times i see black cosplayers get “is this hazel?” when it so clearly isn’t and is tagged as such, as if she’s the only character they could possibly cosplay. or the absurd way this fandom treated leah jeffries when she was casted as annabeth for the tv show. the way i’ve seen people treat fanartists who draw characters as people of color when their race wasn’t specific in the books. all of it is genuinely so awful, and it’s like something people have just accepted as like. “i’m just being honest/it just doesn’t match with how i see the show.” i do not feel fully comfortable in this fandom compared to others i’ve been in, and this is definitely a reason why.

[hazellvsq]

[sparkysparklightning]

this may just be me, but Frank's bday being in June just doesn't make all that much sense? like idk it seems pretty left-field, which may seem dumb considering it's just a bday, but I can't see it for him. Piper maybe, but not Frank. imo Rick wasted a perfect opportunity to make Frank’s bday sometime in July bc a). Frank gives off Cancer vibes more than Gemini, and b). he could’ve connected Frank’s culture talking about July being the seventh month (aka “Ghost Month”) to his life being dependent on the piece of wood, which would’ve been really cool metaphorically and could’ve helped shed more light on his culture

[bayetea]

inflammatory prompts I'll never post on demigodpolls lol

[curseofdelos]

Since we're talking about asexuality in the rrverse on the dash today, here's my two cents as an aroace person

The only canon rep we have in the series (insofar as word of god confirmations can be considered canon) is Reyna and the Hunters. However, the way their asexuality (and aromanticism) was handled in the series could have been a lot better, imo

In SoN, Reyna talks about her relationship with Jason in a way that's very clinical. She doesn't say she has feelings for Jason - only that many praetors become romantically involved in a way that implies she expected that to happen for them. She does the same thing with Percy - never admits to liking him like that, just implies she thinks he could be a good candidate for a romantic relationship.

It's a common experience among aro and/or ace people who haven't realised they're aro and/or ace yet to pick crushes based on who makes the most logical sense. Reyna picks Jason and Percy because they're powerful, she works closely with them, and historically praetors paired off together. Her own feelings/attraction isn't a factor. I find this aspect of her character to be incredibly relatable! I was doing the same thing when I was her age! I doubt Rick was intentionally writing her as ace at this point in the series, but regardless, this aspect is great!

But the way he writes her in TTT... isn't. Reyna's lack of interest in dating is framed as a choice she is making rather than an aspect of her sexuality. It does touch upon comphet and how Reyna felt like a relationship was something she was supposed to want - which I do like! But then follows up with Reyna saying that she doesn't need a relationship (or a label) to feel fulfilled. While this is a good lesson, the way it's written does suggest that Reyna is simply choosing not to date instead of saying that she doesn't experience attraction (which is not a choice). It doesn't help that the words "asexual" or "aromantic" are never stated in the books, and Reyna explicitly says that she isn't labelling herself right now.

A lot of us choose not to date (myself included), but that's not why we identify as aro and/or ace. We identify that way because we don't experience romantic and/or sexual attraction. A lot of aros and/or aces do date and do have sex! Choosing not to be in a relationship is not the defining characteristic of our community, but the way Reyna is written in TTT makes it seem that way. Rick conflates asexuality and celibacy throughout the books which is disappointing.

I have similar issues with the way the Hunters are written. When Reyna, Thalia, and Bianca joined them, they took a vow of celibacy and renounced their right to have romantic relationships. This is not the same as being aro and/or ace. Hell, we know for a fact that Thalia isn't! In TTC, Thalia tells Percy that she thinks Apollo is hot, and a major point of contention between her and Zoe was that Thalia "could never leave [boys] behind". This is partly why Thalia joining the Hunters is framed as a sacrifice - she chooses to renounce romantic relationships and embrace immortality to delay the prophecy. It wouldn't be much of a sacrifice at all if she wasn't giving up something she wanted.

As an aroace person, I do like the idea of a travelling group of female aroace hunters, but their lack of interest in relationships is consistently framed as a choice. It's never said anywhere that they don't experience attraction. Because of this, I feel that Rick is misrepresenting our community by feeding into stereotypes. Again: aro and/or ace people do date and do have sex! Some of us choose not to, but our relationship choices are not what defines us. What defines the Hunters is their choice to give up relationships, not their lack of attraction. I get that he might not be allowed to talk about sexual attraction in a middle grade novel, but that doesn't excuse why aromanticism is presented this way. The way they're written, the Hunters don't feel like aroace rep to me.

I want to cap this post off by saying that I think it's valid to find comfort in the idea of the hunters being aroace! We get so so little representation in media as a whole that it's easy to cling to the crumbs we do get. A lot of the time, perpetually single characters is the closest we ever get. It just bothers me personally to see these characters labelled as aroace by the author not because they don't experience attraction, but because they're perpetually single. I think Rick could have done a lot better, and I wish the aroace rep in this series was more explicit, and took into account that there's a difference between being aro, being ace, being aroace, and simply choosing to be single.

(for reference, here's the source on Reyna being confirmed asexual:

)

[wanderingmind867]

I'm super pessimistic, so take this with a grain of salt, but I'm not too excited for the Percy Jackson show. I don't really know quite why, but I just don't feel too excited. So pardon me if I become overly negative as said show approaches. I'm just way too opinionated, and can't help ranting about things I don't have much of a personal stake in. But it just doesn't sound too exciting.

[nerdygirl2023]

Like I’ve said before the one place that riens old white guy syndrome showed was the way he wrote the Aphrodite cabin

Every so often I remember how PJO was written by a man. For some reason y’all have got it in your heads that we wear makeup for other people.

Seriously, though, this whole “She was pretty because she didn’t wear makeup and didn’t try too hard” is a common theme in the riordanverse, and basically used to describe ALL the main female love interests. People wear makeup for other reasons than to look pretty, Richard. Not all makeup is a demonic, harmful, shallow, symbol of fakeness that you paint it out to be.

[hazellvsq]

poseidon was the god of horses and the sea. if percy could speak to horses, why couldn’t he levitate them through the air and launch them as though from a catapult?

zeus was lord of the sky and king of olympus. if jason could be praetor, why not elect himself president of the world - and have everyone accept it?

athena was the goddess of wisdom AND weaving. if annabeth could learn to weave intuitively, why not be able to telekinetically manipulate every piece of cloth around her - AND the things attached to the fabric?

[santae-salt]

so cool and fun that for days ever since BMAC got a preview of the RR tiles we've been asking for the colors more saturated for ease of viewing and every time we got the same '^_^ it will be changed!!! ^_^' nonanswer and now not only is it previewed to the whole site (mere minutes after BMAC saw it, lol I guess multiple people offering the same crit was too much if you only want praise and asskissing) the colors STILL HAVE NOT BEEN CHANGED... one more thing added into the endless pit of "it'll be fixed eventually!!" for a site that prides itself on "accessibility" and inclusion so hard it's an absolute fucking joke to me that they won't color shift the tiles, something that will take maybe fifteen minutes to do, before repeatedly showing it off in multiple places.

☁️