#nor whatever interpretations of their relationship(?) exist

[atu433b]

@writerman @twilight-secret-gift-exchange

[handweavers]

Cab you elaborate a little on that post about artists of color not having a good understanding of materialism? Like, do you mean that they are unknowingly perpetuating capitalism by being materialistic or something else?????

( This is a genuine question because I misunderstand long posts easily, sorry if it sounds rude ).

when i say 'materialism' i'm referring to dialectical materialism, the marxist theory that political and historical events result from the conflict of social forces - people's access to material needs like shelter, food, healthcare, etc. and their relationship to the means of production. these events can be interpreted as a series of contradictions and their solutions. it is the scientific method for understanding politics/economics and history, and the basis of marxist analysis and of marxism leninism as a framework.

i'm saying that many artists of colour in the west speak a lot about capitalism, imperialism, colonialism, war, etc. from a vaguely 'leftist' but ultimately still liberal perspective, and thus they are not actually challenging anything with their work. they will talk about anything But class, and fall easily for bourgeois politics as long as it's concealed in social justice or "leftist" or antiracist sounding language

and it's because they won't engage directly with marxism leninism, they won't engage with learning materialist analysis, and having this understanding would prevent them from falling for these attempts and allow them to do work that actually has some kind of meaningful impact on these systems they claim to be against. so they are trying to talk and write and make art and organize about capitalism and colonialism without understanding how these things actually function in a literal, material sense...

simply existing as nonwhite people in the west doesn't inherently teach us these things, otherwise all people of colour in the west would be communists. we have to actually do the reading and be open to another framework of understanding the world, to having our worldviews shifted. but i think some people don't want to do that because of their relative class position. it makes them uncomfortable, or they don't want to admit that they benefit from imperialism in some ways. they can't - or won't - decouple an awareness of their class position from morality or their personal feelings.

without a marxist framework for understanding what capitalism is and how it functions, whatever work they claim to be trying to do to challenge capitalism or colonialism or whatever At Best doesn't do anything, and At Worst continues to serve bourgeois interests. the confusion between colonialism and imperialism in particular is easily exploited, so that with the language of anti racism and decolonization people end up agreeing with and promoting US/NATO foreign policy on imperialized nations - these buzzwords can sound pretty good if you don't know better. all this talk about decolonizing our minds and art practices and being anti capitalists but no one can actually explain what capitalism is or how colonialism works or the material role of racism under capitalism, nor do they want to talk about their own relationship to capital, so the talk is just empty lol. all these artists trying to figure out "alternative, embodied ways of thinking and being" and it's all just more liberalism

[raven-at-the-writing-desk]

Idk if you've already posted about this but opinions on Jamil's relationship with Kalim?

I’m pretty sure I’ve talked about the Scarabia duo’s dynamic before, although not in this broad of a sense 🤔 I guess it wouldn’t hurt to try and condense my thoughts?

I think Kalim and Jamil’s relationship is one of the most complex among the core cast of 22. To simplify, it’s similar to “frenemies”, but it runs much deeper than that. There is a relationship on an individual level, but that in of itself also speaks to the expectations places on them in-universe , as well as real-world cultural differences.

I won't bore you with a summary of Jamil and Kalim's history I'm going to assume you did the required reading for that/j, but essentially their conflict is this: Jamil's family, the Vipers, have serviced Kalim's family, the Asims, for generations. Kalim sees Jamil as a childhood friend that has grown up alongside him, but Jamil sees Kalim as an ignorant and useless master. Jamil doesn't want to live this life of servitude, nor does he want to keep playing second fiddle to Kalim by downplaying his own abilities to maintain the illusion of Kalim being better than him. When this is revealed in book 4, Kalim tries to apologize to Jamil and even insists that they can still be friends or just start over as rivals. This offer is swiftly rejected by Jamil, who claims he wants nothing to do with Kalim anymore. Come book 5 though, Jamil informs us that he has decided to stay by Kalim's side for now, as it just isn't feasible for him to "break free" right away (Jamil wants to work on rebuilding his reputation, which has taken a plummet since book 4).

Now, before I move on with my thoughts, I want to point out a difference in how EN and JP presents Jamil and Kalim's relationship. JP is very clear in delineating that Jamil is a servant and Kalim is the master. Meanwhile, EN obfuscates the true nature of their relationship by labeling Jamil an "employee" and Kalim as the "employer", which come across as less of a power dynamic than that of servant and master and thus dampens the seriousness of his eventual emotional breakdown.

Another major difference which may impact how you see the duo is some book 4 dialogue changes. When asked by Grim why he doesn’t stand up to Kalim, Jamil very explicitly says in JP that Kalim’s father could make the Viper family suffer for it. In EN, this was changed to Jamil complaining that his parents would lecture him. In the original JP text, Jamil then continues and says that his whole family would be put out on the streets due to his own selfishness, and that’s something he won’t allow to happen. He also remarks that “this is the fate of those born a Viper”, referring to generational trauma. In EN, this doesn’t happen; Jamil just implies he doesn’t want to get scolded, which is admittedly a much… lesser consequence than what was stated in JP.

Please note that these differences between the original script and the localization may affect how some fans interpret Kalim and Jamil's relationship.

These are things I've mentioned in other discussions of "potential solutions" to this conflict, but I'll repeat them here before going into more detail since they are relevant. In book 4, Kalim offers Jamil whatever he wants (even the dorm seat and Kalim going home to his family). To this, Jamil refuses and states very clearly that "as long as Kalim exists", he can never be content. I feel that oftentimes this is interpreted very literally, as in "Jamil wants to kill Kalim because he hates Kalim and/or hates serving Kalim". But just because a character says one thing doesn't mean it's what they actually mean. If you think about it, what does killing Kalim do for Jamil? Aren't there countless other Asim siblings he could be sent to serve once Kalim is gone? What Jamil is literally saying does not make sense.

The other way to interpret his words is that Jamil is using Kalim as a scapegoat for all of his frustrations with larger problems that have no physical form or simple solution to them. Recall that their arrangement has been going on for several generations now—Jamil's parents, too, were given no choice in whether or not they wanted to devote their lives to the Asims, but it's all they've known and all they will enforce onto their own children to keep the cycle going. This is the root cause of Jamil's suffering—but he isn't exactly a time wizard, and there isn't a simple solution to something that has been brewing for hundreds of years. It's easier for him to cope with the unfavorable circumstances by directing his hatred towards someone convenient. And who could be more convenient to blame than the young master Jamil is forced to serve? He becomes the symbol, nay the face, of what Jamil detests about the system that put him here. This is a case of generational trauma and Jamil not knowing how to cope with it other than lashing out at someone who is unaware of his suffering.

On the other side of this equation, Kalim gets a lot of flack for not noticing Jamil's pain and not intervening to help him out despite claiming that he cares for Jamil. This coming from an omnipotent perspective (as in, we have all the information so we feel entitled to cast judgment on the characters), rather than from Kalim's perspective. We, the audience, understand Jamil's inner turmoil due to how the game presents us with each OB boy's backstory. Kalim doesn't get to have that. He may be an empathetic individual, but he also isn't a mind reader. Jamil actively hides his true resentment from Kalim. And if you were in Kalim's shoes, given everything you want and praised endlessly, why would you suspect your childhood friend, who is always at your side, to hate of you or to hate working for you (especially when Kalim is the type of person to blindly trust others)? Of course he would be totally oblivious. The Asims are so obnoxiously wealthy and privileged that they can afford to shelter their children from the harsh realities of the world, and that includes the plight of those that toil for their family. Kalim is not used to people telling him he's wrong or he sucks or he can't have something; it's how he was raised and in part why he remains largely ignorant of the real world. He shouldn't be faulted for how he grew up and the limited worldview that resulted from it; that’s something he cannot control. What he can control is his own behavior, and that’s why we see post-book 4 as he takes steady strides to earn recognition rather than be handed it simply for existing.

On the topic of Kalim intervening (whether that is through speaking with his own father and/or speaking to Jamil's parents), well... Firstly, I don't think Kalim is someone who would intentionally keep another in a bad situation out of malice or out of selfishness/not wanting to lose Jamil (as some have suggested). Yes, he deeply values Jamil's company, but I don't think he would keep someone with him knowing that they would be completely miserable even if he would be happy. Kalim is someone who cares so much for the wellbeing of others, especially his friends. He will literally give you the world at the slightest inconvenience. I suspect that there is another reason why he hasn't spoken to an adult about what went down: and that's actually consideration for Jamil’s situation.

Let's imagine a scenario where Kalim does approach his dad or the Viper parents. What exactly would he say? I suppose Kalim doesn't necessarily need to tell them about the OB, but just telling them "Jamil is not happy doing this" may not be enough on of itself to invoke a change of mind. To the Asims, they get capable people they can trust and keep close to them. To the Vipers (the parents), they are compensated for their work (Jamil implies the Vipers are quite well-off, though not to the same extent as the Asims) and are provided job stability. I don’t think either side would be willing to end a long-standing arrangement like what their families have so quickly just because there is one open instance of discontent. It is practically tradition and mindset at this point. The groups are mutually benefitting (at the cost of individual freedoms). Letting go of that isn't as easy as deciding whether or not it would be pleasant to be punched; it isn't a binary of "freeing the genie" or "keeping the genie bound to the lamp", there will inevitably be a mess left in its wake to clean up after. Again, this is generational trauma which has been normalized for generations and generations. It cannot be solved with a single conversation, the same as all the other OB boys' traumas.

Let’s say that Kalim does spill the beans about Jamil’s OB in an effort to convince them then (assuming they’d need some extreme justification). Wouldn’t that just make everyone panic and further damage Jamil’s reputation? What would the Asims and the Vipers think of him? Maybe Jamil would be released from his duties out of concern for Kalim’s safety, but what would this do to the Viper family as a whole? Jamil mentioned they could be thrown out onto the streets if they were dismissed from the Asims or found out to have so much as spoken out against Kalim. That fear could become their reality.

Another variant of "Kalim could do something about it" is simply "Kalim can release Jamil on his own". In book 5, Jamil even says that he will continue to be Kalim's aid "until Kalim dismisses him". So why not give Jamil the freedom he wants? Kalim himself seems pretty receptive to the idea, or at least to what he views as a very simple solution. Well, 1) there's no way their families wouldn't find out and question it, they are teenagers and cannot just give the middle finger and proceed to do whatever they want, and 2) again, consideration for Jamil. (It could also be said that the current Kalim just isn’t mature enough or emotionally ready to let Jamil go, but we’ll save this point to discuss later.)

Jamil cannot leave of his own will because he worries about what that would mean for his family and their livelihood. (Again, this harkens back to the line he had in JP where he said the Vipers could be thrown out into the streets.) They could get jobs doing something else, sure—but their reputations may be forever stained by departing from the Asims (especially if Kalim basically fires him). They could be scorned, ostracized, maybe even blacklisted, no matter how amicable the departure is. Kalim being Kalim would offer to pull strings to smooth things over for Jamil—but the thing is, that’s probably not what Jamil wants. He wants to be able to live free from the Asim’s influence, and likely has too much pride to accept assistance from them.

I would argue that social shame is a very subtle yet looming threat for the Scarabia duo, and particularly Jamil (especially if you look at the original Japanese text). Social shame is something that is prominent in Japan, and this aspect of Kalim and Jamil's story may not translate well for western audiences. Japan is a collectivist culture. That means the status of the group (the Viper family in this case) is more valued than the status of the individual (ie Jamil). In western countries, this is reversed and the individual is seen as more important than the group (individualism). Because of this, western audiences may not fully understand why Jamil is putting his family's needs above his own, why he doesn't talk back to parents that actively keep him down, or why he doesn’t just… rebel on the spot.

Jamil would bring intense social shame upon his family if he chose to leave or got fired. His behavior would reflect poorly on his family, likely attracting criticism of his parents for how they raised such a rebellious child and perhaps even limit the opportunities they have in the future depending on how intense the shaming is. He would feel guilty about being the cause for their fall from grace. Jamil is immensely worried about what his parents, his dorm mates, and society at large will think of him breaking from tradition and betraying the family for what would be seen as selfish and self-serving reasons. (Ideas which are all reflected in Jamil’s JP dialogue, where he comments on his own selfishness and how it could impact his family.) These may not seem very serious to those from western countries, but social shame and intense filial piety has the capacity to put so much pressure on an individual and cause their mental state to deteriorate.

Remember, too, that Jamil is already facing social shame at school for what he did in book 4 and he specifically says he has chosen to stay with Kalim to regain the lost rep. This is why he cannot be freed from his shackles as easily as Aladdin made a wish to grant the Genie his freedom. Jamil constantly has to consider the consequences and social ramifications of his own actions on his family and their wellbeing. Isn't it plausible, then, that Kalim, who is now aware of Jamil's true feelings but is also aware of the long-standing circumstances between the Asims and the Vipers, to bite his tongue and wait for less precarious conditions before even pitching the idea? Additionally, he would also technically be supporting Jamil's current wishes by standing aside for now (Jamil is willingly staying to aid Kalim in an attempt to rebuild his reputation). Is that not in the spirit of mindfulness that Scarabia extols? Mindfulness is not just knowing when to act, but when to not act. I think Kalim’s just doing what he can within a preexisting system to support Jamil’s decisions and (limited) autonomy.

Something that I feel often isn’t brought up is the responsibility that Jamil’s parents play in all of this. A lot of the blame is put on the Asims for hiring the Vipers as servants, but the fact of the matter is that the Viper parents are the ones forcing Jamil to be subservient to Kalim. They are also guilty in perpetuating the problem by projecting onto their eldest child and urging him to follow in their footsteps. Jamil is their child, so there should be some responsibility on them for not giving him the freedom to choose his own career path and teaching Jamil that he should keep his head down and always be inferior to Kalim. The blame isn’t squarely on Papa Asim (who isn’t even guilty of starting this relationship, it has been happening for generations before him; he’s just perpetuating it), this is a shared issue.

Now, as to whether or not Kalim and Jamil could or should be friends despite the bad blood between them?? It’s really on Jamil if he will reciprocate or not since Kalim already offered the olive branch. As it’s currently going, I don’t think it will happen anytime soon. There’s no doubt that a relationship with Kalim would be a valuable asset (not just for negotiating Jamil leaving and doing his own thing, but in general for the future), but whether the benefits outweigh the mental anguish of associating Kalim with his generational trauma is worth it… well, there’s no doubt that Kalim wants to start over, make amends, and be equals with Jamil, but it’s not up to Kalim to decide to make friends or not. That’s Jamil’s choice, and ironically one of the few choices he does have 😔

I do think Jamil would be happier away from Kalim for some time, finally allowed to enjoy solitude and doing whatever he wants to. Kalim would be sad about this, but then again who wouldn’t be sad to lose someone you consider your friend since childhood? That ability to let go is also something he has to learn for himself, and I feel that’s going to be a component to Kalim’s future character development.

Kalim has been doing his part to keep a distance from Jamil and develop his own agency and sense of awareness (at least in the main story; the events and vignettes are kinda screwy timeline-wise). Jamil’s working on getting over his own ego and learning how to use his own traits as strengths rather than wallowing about what he doesn’t have or looking down on others. They’re trying to improve themselves independently of one another, and I think that’s beneficial for them both.

I would personally label the Scarabia duo’s dynamic as a toxic one, but it’s not “toxic” in the way we typically think of. Often when we see “toxic”, we think of someone who is malicious and intentionally so. In Kalim and Jamil’s case, Kalim isn’t purposefully mistreating Jamil, but their circumstances are such that Kalim existing hurts him and starves Jamil of freedom. This causes Jamil to lash out (which is more closely aligned with what most would perceive as “toxic”)—but, in a way, many can understand and sympathize with Jamil’s actions. It’s like a never-ending cycle of hate 😔

I do find their dynamic (Kalim being a big ol’ gullible ball of sunshine, Jamil hovering and nagging him for being silly) entertaining on a surface level. However, it’s really stressful for me to observe them for prolonged periods of time knowing the family history keeping them in these arbitrary roles 💦 It’s quite interesting to look at their conflict on a larger scale rather than an individual one; it’s a problem with society and systems they can’t necessarily fix on their own, but when the question arises as to whether they can work together to tear down those expectations, Jamil’s pride and negative feelings for Kalim pose a roadblock.

[offtorivendell]

On Elain, Gwyn and their apparent romantic worthiness.

TW: mentions of death, violent or sexual assault, infertility and pregnancy/childbirth related trauma. Please do not proceed if these topics bother you.

Disclaimer: please, please engage with this post with kindness. I promise I am not writing it to stir the pot, but because I - and many others - are fed up with seeing hurtful and harmful rhetoric spewed by the fandom, yet having no back up when dealing with it. Word vomit incoming, I'm sorry. This has been bothering me for a while.

My love to everyone who has been hurt by things they've read in this fandom. 💜

It's 2024 and I cannot believe we are still seeing posts, almost daily, about both of these women; all giving reasons why they cannot possibly be with Azriel. And I don't mean the debatable but utterly harmless discussions about Elain not looking good in black or Gwyn blabbing to Merrill when asked not to. Whatever, go nuts. I mean the truly horrific takes based around things these two women have had no control.

Now, my post history makes it very obvious where I stand in terms of ships, and yes, I'm well aware I've spoken before about the inherent power imbalance - that I perceive - which would exist if Azriel ever became involved with any of the priestesses in the women's shelter he is charged with protecting (to be clear, that's not me suggesting that Gwyn and her story isn't powerful, or powerful representation to those who see themselves in her, nor is it personal to Gwyn, or indicative of any of the sheltered priestesses and their ability to heal; it's purely a function of Azriel's position of authority over their sanctuary). I want to reiterate that my stating my feelings about this was never done with the intent to shame people who do ship them; we all ship who we like, and real world ethics should rarely come into it.

That being said, the following, in my opinion, is one of those times.

Firstly, I just want to say that lived experience informs how we interpret fiction, so please let me clarify something: the people who have said that they don't think Gwyn is ready for a relationship yet, and that NSFW fan art of her with anyone makes them uncomfortable, are not in any way in the wrong. They're simply the other side of the coin to those who find it empowering, and both are valid responses, often related to personal trauma. The problem lies with those very few who say that Gwyn could never have a romantic relationship, and call those who talk and/or post about it "gross." Some have called her "damaged goods." This is absolutely wrong and whoever is doing it needs to stop.

The entire fandom, even those who find romantic or NSFW content involving Gwyn uncomfortable to consume, frequently acknowledges that her trauma doesn't define her, and of course she should be able to enjoy love whenever she feels ready for it. Those who say otherwise are readily condemned from all corners. I've seen it happen and called the people out myself, as have many other Elriel shippers when necessary. However, Elriels are still very regularly and very publicly blamed for the actions of a few (some of whom I truly believe are burner accounts wanting to cause chaos, with their Elriel themed usernames and no post history), despite our largely collective action to call them out when we see it.

Could we do better? Absolutely, but so can you!

Because, on the other hand, I've noticed that, whenever I or others have tried to explain why the pliable bones "theory" - which attempts to reason that Elain could never be endgame with Azriel, as she and any baby would die during the course of pregnancy or childbirth - is equally as harmful, we are met with people publicly and wholeheartedly refusing to understand why (especially recently). Some horrific comments have been made to my friends, not to mention all of those I see well after the fact, which are never widely condemned by any but us. People will argue back that we're wrong, and have even suggested we're weaponising infertility! On Mothers' Day, of all the fucking painful days to say that.

Some of the push back I've seen recently includes:

"Nobody has said Elain is infertile."

No, nobody has, and that's not what we're saying or have ever said. We know you don't think this, as the Elucien fandom loves to write and draw Elain and Lucien's hypothetical future children (which is super understandable, as this is a romantasy fandom after all - no shame, enjoy your warm fuzzies).

What we are saying is that, if it's true that Elain's anatomy wasn't changed as Feyre and Nesta's was - and to be clear I cannot stand that entire plot, I wish SJM had chosen literally any other reason why Feyre's pregnancy was dangerous, as it is simultaneously degrading and doesn't fit with her previously established lore - then Elain and Azriel, together^, would be functionally infertile. Yet it's only ever framed as Elain's body not being able to work with Azriel's, never the other way around.*

^Why didn't the bat boys have to sacrifice their wings to keep their wives/mates safe? Why did the women have to change their anatomy? Because it would make it harder for them to be all powerful? Well Nesta sacrificed her powers! Why not just have Feyre be cursed by an enemy or something, and Nesta found a way to use the Dread Trove to save them all. Ugh. I love SJM's books, but this was such a miss.

*HOSAB/HOFAS SPOILER: funnily enough, this was never said about Ruhn and his eventual mate, even though he actually did think he may be unable to father children, thanks to the Oracle's prophecy. People shipped the hell out of him and a couple of different women throughout the CC series, despite the chance he could never get them pregnant.

"People haven't called Elain damaged goods, so it's not the same. We're allowed to not like her."

My faerie porn* lover in christ, what the fuck do you think the pliable bones "theory" is actually doing? It is suggesting that Elain's hypothetical inability to survive having children with Azriel, and for those children to also survive childbirth, is impaired. Ergo, she's damaged.

We don't care if you don't like Elain, we're allowed to have different preferences in characters and ships. That has never been the problem.

*I use this term with affection as a great lover of the genre.

But "damaged" vs a functionally "impaired" uterus? It's the same damn thing, and sorry, it's misogynistic af, not to mention ableist and homophobic at a minimum. In the same breath you are also reducing your favourite to her apparently functional uterus (even though the pliable bones argument is medically inaccurate, by the way - this is really damning of the state of health education across so many countries).

"Hahaha/lol."

Yes, I have seen people laugh and treat this as a joke. As recently as tonight, in fact. It's disgusting.

Regardless of your lived experiences and shipping preferences, both of these takes about Elain and Gwyn are equally degrading and horrific and need to stop, but if you're only calling out the comments that hurt you/your friends/your ship and not the others, then you should maybe attempt some basic self reflection and analyse those double standards you're carrying.

This entire fandom needs to do better. I'll say again, for the umpteenth time, to any of my fellow Elriels that if you think mocking Gwyn's past is funny, then you're not mature enough to read an adult series. But this works both ways, and if you think mocking infertility is funny/use it as a win, then you're just as immature. I would really and truly appreciate it if we were not left alone to argue over and over again why discriminating against someone who couldn't "have a man's children" is wrong, and why many, many people in this adult fandom - that is largely comprised of women! - might find such a theory, and the resulting discourse, incredibly upsetting.

Infertility hurts; not having a kid when you want one can be viscerally painful. Besides that, I know very few people who have given birth who don't carry around some sort of emotional or physical trauma from doing so. Treating a character's hypothetical infertility with one man as a joke is gross.

Please don't call Gwyn "damaged goods" or suggest that Azriel would choose somebody else over Elain because she couldn't have his kids.

They are the same thing.

It's not hard to be kind. Pain is not a competition.

We should all do better, and take care of each other.

[ltlemon]

thinking about how if tsubomi accepted mob’s confession for whatever reason, how utterly Shit it would go. the world’s most autistic aroace boy and the school popular girl are like so doomed to crash and burn and it would be Incredibly fun to watch.

first off, mob really doesn’t have a crush on her.

he knows her from kindergarten and they’ve rarely spoken since-they might’ve counted as friends before, but now they’re much closer to just acquaintances. fact is, he doesn’t know her. he’s interpreting these feelings of adoration, nostalgia, and a desire to reconnect, as what’s entailed for a romantic crush. he likes a girl, she’s pretty and popular, so this must mean he likes her.

tsubomi is the shape of a person. she’s an ideal to adore, a fantasy to think towards, but she’s not a part of a real grounded relationship, nor is he ever setting her up to be.

don’t get me wrong here! he definitely likes her well enough, and maybe thinks she’s beautiful, in an aesthetic sense, but he doesn’t really ever involve himself in those feelings. they’re very analytical, they’re treated not as reasons he loves her, but just as…things. when mezato asked him “what exactly do you like about her”, he seemed genuinely shocked, like he’d never really thought about it. he stood there and tried to think about something that he loved about specifically her, some reason or some sign that he was in love, and there was nothing. all he could say was that she respected him.

so anyways. what i’m getting to with this, is that i honestly don’t think mob planned any further ahead than just…”confess”.

she’s the ideal crush, this far away idea of the girl he should like, and she doesn’t exist outside of that. since there isn’t anything deeper, if she accepted him…??? GOD.

i actually don’t think he’d know where to go from there. he didn’t plan that far ahead, even though she was the goal, this carrot on a stick the whole time.

there’d be so many weird attempts at dates and outings, they’d do “couple things” but neither really knows the other enough to know what they like, or how to talk to each other, especially with the sudden change in relationship.

mob never thought to bring her flowers or a gift until teru told him that was a thing couples usually do. so following that, he’d probably mainly instigate things in that same sort of “well, this is what couples do” sort of way. adhering to the societal expectations of how you should act when you get the girl. their relationship would be empty and forced, dragging each other along… and i just think it’s interesting because. that would be the standard ending right? boy gets a crush, works really hard on himself, musters up the courage to confess, then they get together and it’s great and everyone’s happy forever!!!

but one of the main messages of the whole show is literally “we’re all living our own lives, and we have to be ourselves despite it all.”, and having the classic guy meets girl ending specifically and loudly not click with who mob is as a person is a Very Interesting Choice. dating tsubomi, while also obviously not what she would ever choose, would also crash and burn for mob. him ending up with her would mean not being himself, and that’s basically textual. mob’s happy ending is literally accepting his emotions and walking away smiling at rejection. if that’s not so incredibly aroace of him i don’t know what is. 🎉

[patchwork-crow-writes]

Kralsei is Doomed (and that's why I love it)

To me, Kralsei is a commentary on the idea of being in love with the idea of being in love - that is to say, being enthralled with the anticipation of courtship and falling in love, without really taking into consideration how the ensuing relationship would... actually work.

The depth of longing that is evident in Ralsei towards Kris is indeed intoxicating, and as I've mentioned previously, the game itself seems to push this pairing in the way that certain events are made to happen - most notably the acid tunnel of love running parallel to Noelle and Susie's heart-covered ferris-wheel ride. And add to that the whole nature of dark worlds as synonymous with dreams, fantasy and imagination. From a narrative perspective, the relationship seems almost destined to occur.

But I think Ralsei might find himself a bit adrift if and/or when he actually succeeds in wooing Kris... or the player, or whoever is predominantly in charge by that point. Like a dog chasing a car, I'm not certain he'd know quite what to do if he got what he was after, because at that point it stops being a flight of fancy and becomes real... which is very much the domain of the light world, and outside the darkness's purview.

And when getting swept up in the thrill of romance stories, it's easy to forget that the "struggle" does not end just because the couple share a tender kiss or whatever. Reality can, and often does, quickly ensue, and questions of long-term compatibility in the face of waning desire can spell doom for any relationship, no matter how "destined" it might seem in the run up to it.

This does not even take into consideration the biggest obstacle to this relationship - to exist in a form that we as players might recognise as reciprocal, it'd have to either be entirely confined to the dark world, or there'd have to be some way to bend the rules of Deltarune's reality to allow Ralsei to manifest in the light world, which... presents entirely new problems, not least because of the whole "Roaring" shindig.

Indeed, the more likely scenario, aside from the whole thing fizzling out or otherwise coming to an unfortunate end, is that Kris begins wearing the horned headband that is supposed to represent Ralsei, which as romantic a gesture as that might be, does not exactly live up to the promise that the pairing hints at... although in a strange way, such an outcome might end up strengthening the fantasy element of Kralsei, as a nascent relationship brought to a tragic end by the unflinching and immutable rules of light and dark. Such relationship never has to be actually tested by reality, which allows it to exist in a sort of crystalised state, a seemingly-perfect snapshot of a love that can perpetually exist in an idealised form.

It might be worth watching in future chapters to see how Kris and Ralsei's friendship develops, as it might give hints as to how Deltarune itself might end. Should the above come to pass, and the two come together only to be tragically wrenched apart by outside forces, it will suggest that the dark worlds will not be completely closed off, as the fantasy of Kralsei will be allowed to persist unchallenged by reality. If, however, they drift apart, or decide to remain friends only, or perhaps even if they break up mid-game, it would allow for a cleaner break between light and dark, suggesting some sort of sundering of the bridge between the two.

This, of course, sidelines any other interpretations of their relationship, such as an extended metaphor for self-love and acceptance, or of a coming-to-terms with the past, though I don't see that these can't co-exist alongside the above.

One final note: much of my focus has been on Ralsei rather than Kris, and there are grounds to argue that Kris does not wish, nor will they ever wish, to pursue a relationship with Ralsei. However, the fantasy of Kralsei's potential that exists both in Ralsei's head, and in players receptive to the game's suggestions, almost renders Kris's feelings and opinions on the subject moot. In other words: the reality of what Kris might want, even if that DOES end up wanting to be with Ralsei, is supplanted by the fantasy of their potential thrilling romance story.

In this, the core themes of Deltarune are again reinforced - Kris's choices do not matter, even if their choice would align with the fantasy-romance being suggested. This is not to suggest that I do not care what happens to Kris, but it does highlight that there is a narrative reason for Kralsei, or at least the idea of Kralsei, to exist in the game, and lends further weight to the idea that it is ultimately doomed to failure, regardless of the wishes of its participants.

[yuseirra]

Today's analysis/thoughts~~ I really should leave the story at that but the thoughts keep coming to me, here's what I thought of today!

It's the final arc, isn't it? So if the author goes: "5 chapters until the finale!" now or something - I’ll have to grab the author by the collar… because that would mean they just threw the story away.

But when you combine the chapters, they’re connecting ones that don’t make sense together, so I’m left wondering, “What is this supposed to achieve?” That’s what I’ve been thinking.

The author will handle it, of course, but if this is the end, the movie arc seems unnecessary. Even if it existed, if Hikaru’s reaction had been a little different, or Ai hadn’t told Aqua, “I’d love it if you could help me save this person together,” everything would’ve clicked into place. However, those chapters really stand out to me, and I judged them to be crucial, so I based my interpretations on them. I really like those chapters and consider them to be my favs, too...

I feel like the psychological bridge between the movie arc chapters and the current developments could actually be tied together by the two songs. They work like a sort of adhesive, making me wonder, "Oh, could this be it? Is this what it's about?" Otherwise, I’d just let the story go, thinking, “Whatever happens, happens~~”

Anyway, Ai imagining a happy little family with this person, where they’re pretty and happy…

Or, when Kamiki was in his happy times with Ai…, with a bright smile that’s identical to Ruby’s—something you’d never see now, and a smile that Aqua would never have because of his personality— smiling that brightly…

I very liked those kinds of things.

Like them holding hands or being wrapped in each other's arms… I think they had a beautiful relationship. It could have been that way if not for the terrible life situations Hikaru had to put up with.

That explains why Ai left those words behind.

And it also explains how Kamiki couldn’t give up on Ai and couldn’t bear the fact that she was gone. They did a lot in reaction to that to somehow reverse the situation from their own point of view, and in that process, they completely broke down. If this person hadn’t loved Ai so much, or if they didn’t love her at all, they wouldn’t have fallen apart like this…

Really…I'm sure they never anticipated Ai’s death, nor did they ever wish for it, so that's why when it happened, the shock was immense, and they became so desperate that they completely changed.

If they had knowingly caused this to happen, they wouldn’t have been so extreme, risking everything, pouring their entire life into risky behavior. Why would they go through all of that? They have talent, good looks, and seem to make good money, so what’s there to be unsatisfied about? If they had some idea of what might happen, they’d have gone through a process of rationalizing it. He wouldn't be all about "feeling Ai's presence" the way he is, that seems like the only thing he wants.

From their actions, you can see Kamiki hasn’t come to terms with Ai’s death at all.

He loved Ai so much, and in a world without her, he felt like he simply couldn’t go on. He just can’t break free from those feelings…

If you look at this person’s life, Ai was the only one who ever gave him real happiness, love, or cared for him in a meaningful way. And regardless of how good or bad you are as a person, when someone like that disappears from your life, no one can stay sane. The narrative structure really supports this well. Ai had the president and his wife, her B-Komachi team members(although it wasn't completely friendly), and eventually her children. There were at least people she could share affection with, however small that might’ve been. Even toward her fans, Ai expressed love in her own way. But… if you look at Kamiki’s portrayal, he had none of that, and the relationships he did have were either destructive, indifferent to his situation, or not bad but still not dependable. So, even if Kamiki’s base personality was really good (actually, it's because he had such a good nature that he could smile and endure as long as Ai was there with him, even if she was the only one. He would have recovered; he could have lived if Ai existed. Looking at it, Ai really was that kind of person for him. Despite that, Kamiki never clung so unhealthily to her. It’s only after her death that he lost his mind. When she left, he let her go, and later tried to send her flowers with a smile. If he had been obsessed with her—most people would have been to some degree—then the songs wouldn’t have come out this way, and Ai wouldn’t have left behind so much regret about him. Ai was a character who had the insight to recognize someone’s true character. That’s why I believe Kamiki really was a good person. It’s rare to find someone like that…).

Anyway, I don’t think I can discard the reactions from the movie arc… Since many aspects of Kamiki's emotional state and why he acted the way he did can be derived in those chapters. I feel what he had with Ai was indeed genuine.

When you combine them with the songs, everything meets in the middle and harmonizes perfectly.

The movie arc’s depiction (where they really did love each other and had a good relationship) and the current chapters (where the character has completely lost his mind)

and the songs (something had an influence on Kamiki while he was in a desperate, unstable mental state, wanting to meet Ai again after her death)

—when you put those together, it makes sense.

If you just look at only the movie arc and the current chapters, there’s a gap in between.

Really, this manga…

It’s strangely keeping so many things hidden. If Kamiki were the final boss or the true villain, they wouldn’t handle it like this. I don’t think he can be the final boss or the true villain, anyway… The author will figure it out. But if they were going in that direction, directing it this way would backfire. If Kamiki had done all these bad things, they should show everything and make us cheer for Aqua. But I can’t bring myself to think Aqua’s in the right. He just seems foolish, and it’s frustrating to watch him. He’s not cool at all. It’s annoying. How can he not understand his mother’s heart? He doesn’t listen. He’s stubborn.

Kamiki's a depressed person who’s suffered too much, gone mad, and had no one to help him…

In the song "Fatal,"

“How many times have I wished for it? For a hand to soothe the festering wounds in my heart” < doesn’t a lyric like that come up?

Haha, isn’t this exactly Kamiki? It makes sense that he’d miss Ai so dearly. How would he NOT long for her? She’s gone!! He has no one!!! He believes she died because of him. That’s why he’s gone insane!!!

His own son is trying to kill him, self-harming, drowning him… If he dies, then seriously, what was this person’s life even for? I don’t feel sorry for Aqua. He’s not cool. No one ever wanted him to die, not even Kamiki, who was trying to send him away. Aqua is such a fool!! And anyway, he’s not going to die, is he? So it doesn’t even matter. Saltwater will only make his wounds worse, that idiot. I don’t feel sorry for him at all. He stabbed himself! (I’m so mad). No, I care for Aqua, but the current situation frustrates me~~~~~ why is the story making me feel this way about the main character? And it's not like I'm a person who can't read between the lines. I think A LOT. and I think that's why I've been suffering from reading this piece, UGH.

Honestly, Hikaru’s character analysis can be summed up in just a few words if you look at it simply:

A guy who went insane because he missed Ai too much. This is basically the summary, and I don’t think this will change. After all, the songs are about that—those are the parts of the story that have already been concluded, fully complete.

But when you delve into the details, there are contradictions, lots of unanswered questions, and things don’t seem to fit together. It’s confusing.

However, it doesn’t seem like his character has actually changed that much either. I feel like this was somewhat expected. I just didn’t anticipate the extent of how far he’d gone off the deep end. It was always about the extent for me.

But, when you think about it…

If Hikaru hadn’t really intended to harm Ruby, then Aqua’s actions would have looked completely foolish, so perpaps it was inevitable that something would show he had truly gone mad.

Aqua was trying to avenge Ai by going after this man, but when you think about it, this man really was the one who loved Ai more than anyone else in the world, wasn’t he? They were mutual—both loved each other deeply, and they cared for one another. Kamiki was genuinely a good person, but because of Ai’s death, he broke down because he missed her too much.

So, if Aqua wants to kill him and get revenge for Ai, there’s actually not much justification for it. The address he gave? Honestly, I think that was completely done out of good intentions. Given how he was described as noble, he probably wasn’t such a strange guy up until that point. Considering the fact that Ai and he were mutual, and Ai wants to save him, I think it’s highly likely that he wasn’t guilty of anything major, at least when it came to things involving Ai.

Therefore, if Aqua really planned to die together with him for the sake of revenge or tried to kill him, it'd have just resulted to Aqua just having made a huge mistake. (I mean, in the movie arc, Ruby’s understanding of her mom grew, but Aqua seems like he doesn’t even understand his mom and, despite playing the role of his dad, doesn’t understand him either. Is this because there’s some hidden backstory where he knows his dad’s true nature? What’s going on? Is this because Hikaru really did target Ai on purpose and try to kill her? But if that’s the case!!! If Aqua wanted to kill him over Ai, we’d hear something about Ai, wouldn’t we? He’s only talking about Ruby. In their conversations, it’s Kamiki who brings up Ai directly… even when he’s sinking into the sea he’s thinking he wants to feel Ai’s presence forever. From what I see, aside from asking Ryosuke to deliver flowers, I don’t think he did anything wrong concerning Ai. Maybe he just wanted to deliver flowers, but everything spiraled out of control, driving him insane.)

It all happened by chance. If this guy hadn’t gone insane to the extent of targeting Ruby, then Aqua completely messed up this time, and Aqua is lucky that Hikaru turned out to be such a strange person.

Honestly, this whole development is frustrating.

I can’t even root for Aqua right now, and it just leaves me feeling conflicted. And isn’t Aqua the protagonist? But this whole revenge thing—I'm not even sure if the basic premise is solid. I used to like Aqua, but now I’m left confused—did he really do the right thing? Has anything really been resolved? I don’t know.

This is nothing like a satisfying, cathartic revenge. I’m not even sure if he truly protected Ruby. I mean, sure, maybe he did? But this resolution isn’t good for Ruby either. I don’t think this aligns with what Ai wanted or what Ruby wanted.

Even the dramatic scene of Aqua falling into the water—he’s doing the exact opposite of what Ai wanted, saying, "My mission wasn’t about revenge." That’s what makes me mad. What’s he doing? He said he’d grant Ai’s wish, right? Well, then what he’s doing now is not that!! What would’ve happened if his dad wasn’t as crazy as he thought?

So, plot-wise, even though this direction might fit with Aqua being the protagonist,

I still don’t understand what any of this is supposed to be… Two people who lost Ai and fell apart are now trying to kill each other. It’s frustrating. This doesn’t feel right. It’s like there’s some other culprit who caused all this, but instead, it’s just these two broken people destroying each other.

This isn’t the end of the story, no way. I’m not worried at all, the plot is too weak for that to happen.

I’m not even a bit concerned about Aqua’s life; it wasn’t a wise choice he made to begin with.

Maybe Taiki will come and pull him out of the water, take him to Kana’s concert in his car.

And as for Kamiki… if Ai’s wish holds any meaning, maybe he has a chance for redemption.

Honestly, if he’s saved somehow, that would be something worth watching. The fact that we don’t know anything concrete yet suggests that his thoughts and words may be insane, but his actions might not have amounted to much at all (yeah...I also think that's really low chance). Still, I don’t expect much—I just hope there’s a reason behind why this character’s life was written to be so miserable.

I have some idea of how the manga might progress overall, but as I’m reading it chapter by chapter, I can’t help but get caught up and swayed by everything happening in it… I should probably just read on and accept whatever comes. As long as Kamiki doesn’t have hundreds of hidden corpses somewhere (because then the genre really would take a turn… lol), I think it’ll be fine. That would be so freaky and scary and ridiculous and it'd make me go what is this manga even??? Hope that won't happen because Ai, really did love this man with all her heart. And I think he tried...to do his best for her in his own way but somehow that made him turn this way... hope that's handled as something tragic and melancholic, not just.. some disastrous, freaky, undesirable mess.. it wouldn't contribute to the story in any way.

[idontwanttospoiltheparty]

What's ur top five for the mclennon evidence tier

Depends from whose perspective, so I'm dividing them up

(and I feel this demonstrates why I have very different opinions on who had feelings for whom; if someone disagrees they're welcome to argue with me [I like that lol] but it really comes down to what type of evidence I find more convincing)

John

1. His Widow Literally Saying It? You know, THE quote:

From chance remarks he had made, she [Yoko] gathered there had even been a moment when—on the principle that bohemians should try everything— he had contemplated an affair with Paul, but had been deterred by Paul’s immovable heterosexuality. Nor, apparently, was Yoko the only one to have picked up on this. Around Apple, in her hearing, Paul would sometimes be called John’s Princess. She had also once heard a rehearsal tape with John’s voice calling out “Paul … Paul …” in a strangely subservient, pleading way. “I knew there was something going on there,” she remembers. “From his point of view, not from Paul’s. And he was so angry at Paul, I couldn’t help wondering what it was really about.”

2. 1972 Sandra Shevey interview:

I wanna be clear like. THIS is BY FAR the best evidence. I will list more, but nothing else really comes close to the above quote. There is zero interpretation needed (or room to take it as a joke) and it's coming from about as close a source to John as possible.

The only thing ever lacking in working with another artist and they were usually male - whether it was Stuart Sutcliffe (my art school friend) or Paul McCartney (my musical friend) - is that the relationship only goes as far as the front door and after that you are alone in bed. It's a plus not a minus. The plus is that your best friend, also, can hold you without… I mean, I’m not a homosexual, or we could have had a homosexual relationship and maybe that would have satisfied it, with working with other male artists. [faltering] An artist – it’s more – it’s much better to be working with another artist of the same energy, and that’s why there’s always been Beatles or Marx Brothers or men, together. Because it’s alright for them to work together or whatever it is. It’s the same except that we sleep together, you know? I mean, not counting love and all the things on the side, just as a working relationship with her, it has all the benefits of working with another male artist and all the joint inspiration, and then we can hold hands too, right?

3. David Sheff insanity feat. Yoko:

JOHN: Well, that’s rubbish, you know. Because nobody controls me. I’m uncontrollable. The only one that can control me is me, and that’s just barely possible. [Yoko laughs] But that’s what life is about. And that’s the lesson I’m learning. Because – nobody ever said anything about Paul having a spell over me, when I was with him for a long time. Or me having a spell over Paul. They didn’t think that was abnormal, two guys together. JOHN: Or four guys together. In those days? Why didn’t anybody ever say, “How come those guys don’t split up? I mean, what’s going on backstage? I mean, what is that Paul and John business? Why – you know, how can they be together so long?” YOKO: They might have. [laughs]

These next ones are again a tier below. The above three are eyebrow-raising independent of each other, but the below two sort of require the above three to feel like they've got argumentative weight IMO.

4. "It's just handy to fuck your best friend."

5. 1974 self-interview.

The last one is a good example of what I meant here. The self-interview could be much more easily dismissed as a joke if the above points didn't also exist.

Stuff like John marrying Yoko immediately after Paul married Linda is interesting when considering John having feelings for Paul, but I don't think it would constitute evidence in isolation. I think it's important to differentiate events which take on a very specific meaning when you make a (perhaps reasonable) presupposition from things which directly imply said presupposition. I also find the fact that there's an incredibly strong case for John experiencing attraction to men who are not Paul – while not evidence for McLennon per se – significantly increases the likelihood that the above quotes are pointing to real feelings for Paul.

(also notice how none of these are song lyrics lol – songs would almost always fall under that idea of something which might take on a connotation, given biographical context, but can almost never be seen as evidence of something on their own)

Paul

1. That "Maybe if I had been a woman I could have–" quote. I don't have the exact phrasing handy, but you know the one.

2. Generally how defensive Paul has historically been about John's sexuality. This is completely circumstantial, but I agree it's a reasonable reading of Paul's behaviour.

The above two points are by far the biggest arguments for Paul IMO though they are notably not as directly linked to the idea of Paul having feelings for John as my John quotes were (which doesn't mean Paul being in love with John is impossible, of course).

The next stuff doesn't really convince me at all but I still think it's the best:

3. His general reaction to JohnandYoko*

4. Paul going off about John's looks a lot.**

5. I guess lyrics lol. Dear Friend and However Absurd are probably the best ones. Honourable mention to the "I find my love awake" verse of Too Many People.

*I'm actually a fierce believer in the concept that a) JohnandYoko were not a normal couple so this isn't just a simple case of being upset at your bestie getting a partner and it's imo willingly obtuse to act like that's what was happening and b) even then, platonic jealousy is not unheard of. But I certainly recognize that it could be a sexually-driven jealousy.

**Gay men and straight women will fawn over women's looks and talk in much more sexually charged language than Paul about John. Sure, "it's different for straight men", which is why I'll grant it, but just something to think about as well.

The Paul stuff looks a bit half-hearted – because it is, but I did spend a lot of time trying to think of stuff. If you can think of something you personally find more convincing than any of these points, feel free to send it over and I'll tell you how I would "rank it" and why. It's possible I'm forgetting something that deserves to be up there.

Last point, but I actually think it's really important to be able to more or less rank evidence of one's own beliefs. And of beliefs one doesn't hold.

[foxtrot91]

I’m actually really excited for Eddie’s arc. I don’t think we’re going to get queer Eddie, and I’m totally okay with that because to be honest, as much as I’d love it, seeing the fandom fight to interpret every little thing as a sign of queer Eddie is really frustrating. Not every emotional upheaval is a result of queerness and I think they’ve made it pretty clear that in the show Eddie’s issues stem from:

1. His issues from childhood related to a father and culture that embraces a form of toxic masculinity. Now, I know some people point to this and say that that history could also be resulting in him repressing his homosexuality. Which, sure, that’s totally possible, but toxic masculinity doesn’t only affect LGBTQ+ people by forcing them into the closet. Toxic masculinity has negative impacts on men who aren’t a part of the LGBTQ+ community as well. I’ve seen it first hand growing up in a Greek family; there was a very clear difference in how my father interacted with his sons vs me, his daughter. I’ve seen the repercussions of that in my brothers as adults and it scared me so much that when my husband and I decided to have children I was very clear that if we have a boy there’s none of this “tough it out” bullshit that my brothers went through, boys need affection too and not just from their mother.

2. He became a father very young. I think it’s implied or at least generally accepted that Eddie got Shannon pregnant right out of high school and then had a shotgun wedding. He didn’t get the chance to really grow up and grow out of his childhood in the way that most people do. He didn’t get to find himself and make mistakes because he was suddenly saddled with adult responsibilities he wasn’t prepared for. That’s a lot of pressure for a 17-18 year old to handle. Hell, I was 30 when I had my first (planned) child and it was a daunting change once reality hit. I can’t begin to imagine that responsibility at 18.

3. And finally, grief. Whatever your thoughts on Eddie’s relationship with Shannon, this was the woman he went through major life changes with. He already felt immense guilt for abandoning her for a military career (whether you feel it was abandonment or not, it was clear that he felt it was), and anger at her for subsequently leaving when he came back. Those are complex emotions to intertwine with already existing emotions that he already had for her as the mother of his child. And then, before he could even begin to unpack and resolve those emotions, she died.

These are all some pretty big things to be dealing with without even touching on sexuality. It’s no wonder he struggles to connect romantically with others, Eddie doesn’t know who tf Eddie is, and having an identity crisis doesn’t necessarily mean a sexual identity crisis. I think too often in this fandom people are conflating the two. I’m queer, and it makes up a piece of my identity, but it isn’t my whole identity. To say that queerness is the only explanation for his behaviour is reductive and quite frankly, offensive, if I’m completely honest. Just because that’s the way you personally might have interpreted his character, doesn’t mean that that’s the only way, or that others are wrong for thinking otherwise. Nor does it mean the writers are queerbaiting when they go in a direction that doesn’t match your personal interpretation.

I don’t know if we’re going to get queer Eddie, maybe we will and I’m excited to see how they tell that story if they choose to. But if that’s not the direction they go I’m STILL excited for Eddie’s story because there’s so much more to his character than his sexual identity and the above leaves a lot of room to explore.

[kaurwreck]

Hello, sorry that it’s kind of a messily stated question but after scrolling through your blog a few times (of very thoughtful and involved analyses, loved reading them), I think to me you’re the most accurate Asagiri interpreter and I am starting to enjoy delving deeper into literature and history myself to understand BSD(and other fiction in general), so I want to ask, how reliable do you think Asagiri is when it comes to various things he outright says and interviews with him? It feels like a lot of things he puts in the story are deliberate but the way he often talks about his work, his manner is, like he’s just including stuff based only on general famous authors’ vibes? I’ve been thinking on it for awhile but especially after the recent Chuo University lecture/interview, where he talked for example how Chuuya and Dazai’s view of each other is simply loathing without any “but” or how he thought chapter 39 might be taken as justifying abuse when I thought it was clearly intended as something deeper and more complex.

It makes me wonder whether I even should delve deeper in themes and references, if even such simple thing as relationship between 2 characters or a character’s complicated past is, it seems, more surface-level than I thought. Or there is more depth to the world and ideas but less to the characters and I am just expecting more from the part that has no need for that.

Maybe I am approaching it in bad faith or missing a big chunk of something, overall I am sometimes quite confused by the author when he speaks on his works, so would be nice to hear your thoughts. Thank you in advance if you’ll take time to answer.

I've found more than once when I've revisited an Asagiri interview that something he's said that I initially interpreted as flippant has, with greater context, adopted more layers.

Like, in the two examples you provided: (1) I do think there is sincere loathing between Chuuya and Dazai, but that doesn't preclude love, nor does love qualify it— if you consider Chuuya and Dazai's communication styles and approaches to matters, they conflict gratingly — but love and loathing also can't exist without the other, and Kafka Asagiri has said quite a lot about Chuuya and Dazai's relationship; (2) many people do interpret Ch. 39 as justifying abuse, acknowledging how he might be misinterpreted isn't the same as his intent, so I wouldn't conflate the two. (Especially considering Ch. 39 is named Portrait of a Father— I recommend skimming the source material to better understand the depth of Asagiri's sincerity in telling that story.)

Which is to say, I think Asagiri's interviews provide valuable insight into his thoughts and process and, for whatever it's worth, I didn't throw myself into the deep end of bsd analysis until I read his interviews and realized how much he intentionally layered in bsd.

But if you're going to lend any credence to anything he says, it's relevant to listen to what he has to say, and be mindful of any language barriers (if there are any) in interpretation.

[voidcat]

— embrace the poison

characters: dazai osamu, you

notes/warnings: implied toxic relationship, dazai and you being exes and getting back together, dazai implied to be manipulative from the sidelines and basically make one person leave your life.

this is technically a follow up to the fic ‘mutual intoxication’ self-indulgent fic as always !!

The calm of the day and the idle rush of the city, the unkind breeze of the winter strokes your cheeks, further making you tense up and smallen.

With the cold and a fiery mind irritated at things one too many, the state of your shoulders– or the rest of your body for that matter, do not come into your attention until you feel a pair of hands there, slowly kneading the flesh under layers of cloth.

At this point, you do not need to turn to confirm this is Dazai, just as once before.

So much for moving on and pretending he doesn’t exist– that the two of you didn’t exist. He has taken root once more and does not seem to be willing to let go.

Not just yet, not until he has all of you to himself, your undivided attention, your touch, your warm breath, your cold gaze and empty smiles as well as the rare occasions you let go of the mask.

Maybe that online gimmick you pulled wasn’t all for vain after all.

Sure, you are annoyed at how dense one can be, the sheer audacity of their words– or, at least your interpretation of it, but how can you not, when it was all talked and agreed on before, stated on clear terms? What does that make you then, what position does that put you in? Some sort of indecent person maybe, take things a little further, reach a little longer and call it being an attention whore, worse things if you get creative but you doubt that would be needed in their case. They can assume whatever the hell they want for all you care.

Dazai was right, you hate to admit it, as his fingers dig into your skin, it is lost on you entirely when the two of you made it back inside.

The cafe under the agency is as welcoming as ever but it is the work of dazai’s skilled hands that has you melting into the cushions.

In the heat of ranting, quoting whatever you could recall from past conversations and messages  and good ol’ hypothermia setting in, you hadn’t even noticed.

It doesn’t matter any longer, for Dazai Osamu is here– by your side again, with all the mess, and how tainted your souls can be, for all the toxic purple ooze born from your unison, this feels better– right.

Though you’d rather be caught dead than to ever say that in his vicinity. Spoiling the man too much could always blow into your face, and nobody wants a face all blown up, exploded and has nothing left but the distorted bones.

Dazai Osamu was right once more, you deserve someone to match your wits and pick up on your meanings before you can even finish the sentences. Someone to clash your teeth with, baring your fangs, all claws and snarks when needed, to keep up that excitement, never tame, never settling down, do not show mercy nor compromise.

Gentle hands massage your scalp, leaving you at a loss for a moment. After so long of just clashing and crashing, then avoidance and playing pretend, you have forgotten underneath the demon, the prodigy, the fallen angel; Dazai Osamu can be kind and gentle, radiating comfort with his very existence. 

In the blink of an eye, everything returns back to ‘normal’– or what you may call that. It takes a while to not care about anything again but once the seed is planted, the deed is done.

People at the agency have missed you, they say and you accept their exclaims with open arms and a big smile. 

It hasn’t been the same around without you, Dazai hasn’t been the same, blah blah blah, same old same old. 

What catches your attention though is that Dazai has begun spending more time on work, or so Atsushi says. You cannot blame the kid when even Kunikida takes his extra hours on the device as working.

But you know a fire when you smell incense in the air. 

And above all, you know Dazai Osamu.

So you do not pry, you do not bother checking his devices this time or to see if the end of his  hard worker period aligns with the time they have started dating someone.

Why should you bother, poke the hornet’s nest when this is all working in your favor? 

If your suspicions are true, Dazai is only helping you out in the long term really, it is but a technical detail that just happens to redirect your attention and thirst for it back to him.

What good comes from a person who makes you want to rip your hair off, strangle yourself and gag for a good decent of the time you converse with them after all? And it’s just cherry on top, for you at least, that suddenly their way of acting and talking switches and even labels an innocent thing you’ve said as flirtatious. 

Their loss, not yours, it was them who talked of people acting all close and all only to leave, ask you to not leave their side after all. If they care so much, they would’ve acted smarter.

Then again, how much can you blame this on them if they are incapable of the act itself? 

It doesn't matter, you can hear Dazai’s honeyed voice whisper into your ear– the small Dazai in the back of your head, not the real one, for the real one does not even require to state the obvious for such a person.

Shooting a glance around the office, you see their most treasured detective taking a nap, Kunikida across you typing passionately on his computer.

A moment’s breath later, Dazai reemerges from the kitchen, holding two mugs of hot beverage.

From the scent alone you can tell it’s your favorite, made to perfection, as always.

As difficult and complicated of a person Dazai Osamu may be, he has his ways of showing he cares, no matter how… concerning some might be, or even obsessive– as some might have called it if they knew the depth of things.

Dazai’s love is twisted, his display of it, his way of declaring, acting out on it; and so is yours– all leashes and grips.

It is beautiful in a tragic sense, really, how the two of you make it work, the harmony of this darkness intervening, enabling one another.

Not as bad as it sounds when it scratches that itch in your brains and hearts– the two of you were respective wrecks on your own already– crashing into one another meant no harm, only casualties.

When Dazai wraps an arm around, you lean back, your hand placed on his.

Why deny what you had and settle for something inferior to your tastes when Osamu always brings a mouthful of excitement to the way of things, the dull stream of river called living?

[neverenoughmarauders]

Finally someone who doesn't ship Wolfstar, and has a correct interpretation of the Marauders and their era. People like you are rare to find though I know two others.

Prongsfoot atleast makes sense but as you described, the Marauders era was all about 'four bestfriends, an `enemy to lovers`, a war and a betrayal.'

:)

Hello hello!

Indeed, there are very few of us canon-obsessed Marauders era fans, but I think the few of us that exist have a strong appreciation for each other. What I wouldn't give for a larger Marauders era canon fandom though!

While I am always always thrilled to hear I have got a good grip on the era (thank you very much for warming my heart <3), I will acknowledge that there are many ways to interpret the canon. What I try to do, and I always appreciate when others do too, is to distinguish between (1) what is canon; (2) what is fair/reasonable/likely interpretations based on the canon and (3) what is hc based on small stuff/limited evidence, or even nothing other than our imaginations/desires. There's nothing wrong with sharing (3) or arguing (2) - as long as it's not treated with the same authority as (1).

While I never saw Wolfstar in the text (nor do I see romantic Prongsfoot - it's just indulgent fun because I love the 'never saw one without the other' relationship Sirius and James have), I don't think I'd mind Wolfstar if it was kept truer to the source material. I am okay with different non-canon ships (Wolfstar, Prongsfoot, whatever they call RemusxJames) if it's based on the canon characterisation - and maybe that's why Prongsfoot often works best for me - because those stories, at least, cannot ignore the close relationship that exist between Sirius and James in canon.

For me though, like you point out, the Marauders are all about the friendship between the boys, and no story will get my love if the Marauders' friendships are ignored (not even Jily stories - unless we're talking narrower scope stories, like one shots). Sirius and James were best friends. Sirius and Remus were close friends. James and Remus were close friends. Peter were a close friend to them all. They were all great friends! And most of the time, I prefer the story of their friendships above this idea that they had to be sleeping with each other.

[tothepointofinsanity]

Do you have any super into detail thoughts on kyosaya? I know you've drawn a few art pieces for the ship, but I haven't seen any written think pieces about it from you.

I know there are some who don't like to use ships as a way to tie to a characters personality, so I guess I'm curious what your overall thoughts are on it and how it ties into sayaka as a whole.

"Think pieces" is a pretty neat way to put it...The primary foundation of KyoSaya to me revolves around a uniquely sapphic relationship that I hope would be expanded upon in future shows in the series.

↑ Yet, what are all these words supposed to mean? Sayaka has always done things for the sake of others. Her sense of justice elevated to the point where she views herself as a knight, someone who kneels in the face of goodness in respect of whatever is honourable to maintain it. But a knight is just another form of a pawn, just a stronger one whom everyone perceives has the ability to: 1) protect others 2) kill The Enemy.

Sayaka used to only ever have been able to interpret this in an extreme and binary vision. If she has to defend others, she has to devote herself fully to the cause. To her, the notion of self-care and self-preservation is difficult to comprehend since she feels as though she always has to be a monolith of one singular thing, of one side of things. To her, everything is like a chessboard. There is no way to play knight for both teams at once: either you prioritise yourself, or you prioritise others.

I understand that it is also a realistic depiction of how individuals like Sayaka constantly push through their own struggles alone while always uplifting others, a demonstration of unbalanced relationship dynamics. When this vision is challenged, Sayaka does not know where and how else she is expected to just "move forward" when she realised reality is not a simple game of chess. So she shrinks her view of the world further by clashing with Kyoko, since Kyoko is The Enemy who obstructs Sayaka's own perception of all that is Good and Just. Sayaka knew she was manipulated by Cubey™, but it was not only in the later movies that she comprehended the full extent of it. Something like that feels too complicated in her mind, so it's easier, much less burdensome to just lock onto one person to be angry with. This mentality is almost a sort of fallacy for Sayaka given she becomes a Witch in every cycle she becomes a magical girl.

Sayaka wants to feel relied on by humans. Kyoko does not desire nor expect anything from people, and thus balances out the extremes of Sayaka by being detached from worldly expectations - at least, that is what's consistent with Kyoko's perception of herself. A puppet without strings. She is not a pawn, not a knight. That's why she was angry when she realised the wish-granting alien omitted information on magical girl mechanisms and their life cycles. Instead of shovelling forward headstrong like Sayaka, however, Kyoko reconsiders her childhood memories and her desire, and it was to die with Sayaka so that Sayaka would not have, in Kyoko's eyes, perished for the sake of The Greater Good, because Kyoko believes still in the Self, not the vague promise of a better future.

Uhm. It's probably nonsense now that I put it in legible words. Some other KyoSaya fans who are big brained enough should educate me more on their dynamic, but I find their relationship to be interesting. It's very fallen angel x demon coded. I feel...as though Sayaka and Kyoko are hard to separate given they exist as characters that neutralise and support each other. Perhaps not codependent, but Sayaka was unhinged enough for Homura to not threaten her once, but twice whenever Madoka's feelings are involved. Meanwhile Homura was more...tolerant of Kyoko. Kyoko is there to keep Sayaka in check to make sure she doesn't piss off the Devil to the next century, and to me that is also funny.

[Although, it is tragic that since Sayaka embodies the sea, the only way Kyoko can only be with her "in death" due to the theme of Ophelia, her lover and the flame of the witch. Who could have predicted the doomed yuri is doomed. A sinking ship, even.]

[aliusfrater]

speaking of bad takes, did you see the one that said dean was never the angry one in spn because that was only sam and john? i was speechless

@helenoftroysam

YEAH !! i only saw it when chii had gotten an ask about it and i started writing that post about my interpretation of how sam's anger and revenge works because of it. i feel like the thing about anger on supernatural is that it's buried under multiple layers of presentation that has to do with the masculinity of our characters and the different complexes each character is written with, the drama that has it has to be presented with, the actors' and directors' own complexes about masculinity and anger, the complexes of the how the audience perceives and interprets anger, as well as ultimately what the core meaning and purpose of a character's anger is.

the thing about me is that i don't think Any of the characters can be assigned as 'the angry one' at any point in the show, but sam's anger (from what i'm remembering as i type this out) is the only one that's explicitly explored by the show in conjunction with whatever supernatural metaphorical arc that anger is presented with. like sam's anger had a purpose but is/was a morally neutral emotion; it existed alongside his grief, happiness, sadness, etc. just like every other character. it didn't take up more of his head just because the show had been exploring its purpose more than it had been his happiness or sadness and it doesn't help that it exists alongside side his grief within this exploration of his character, and grief is a major theme within supernatural. anyway, i think the same for both john and dean. john's anger was Not used as a point of character exploration at any point in supernatural and the thing about dean's anger is that, and i've talked about something adjacent before, the anger isn't the part that's explored, it's the extension of it, the action and this extends towards all of his emotions. he isn't an angry person, he's a reactive person and in a very similar way to john, his emotion bursts outwards towards the people around him. but the thing is that people irl have this misunderstanding complex about anger as well which distorts the depiction of it !! it isn't an inherently violent emotion but it can lead to violence, just as much as disappointment, sadness, and confusion can.

okay here's an example: dean smashing that lamp in conversation with sam in 4.04 was violent, but to say that it's an action that resulted from anger is pretty shallow considering the topic of their conversation as well as dean's current personal conflict (unrelated but it's abusive, due to dynamic and pattern of behaviour it indicates within sam and dean's relationship). another one: sam holding dean at gunpoint in 7.02 during his psychotic episode was violent, but it's not an action that results from anger (also isn't abusive, considering the lack of history regarding this kind of behaviour and the fact that it or something adjacent never happens again; there's no behavioural pattern (though i will say that this is part of their dynamic—the 8.23 monologue can be mirrored with it)). last one: john's dying wish is not violent behaviour nor is it anger (but is is abusive. i don't think i have to elaborate). of course these instances vary greatly and whatnot but the very summarised point here is that people give too much credit to anger as an emotion. she's stealing other people's work and rubbing off the watermark.

[lurksunderthebed]

Hi, I saw that you had a discussion about the queerness of our beloved characters. I really hope you’re not tired of that topic, because I wanted to add another point.

First of all I don’t really care. I really like the dynamic between most of the characters, especially Ghost and Soap, but I don’t care if it’s interpreted as besties or lovers. I think both is fun.

I just wanted to add that maybe all of the MW story feels so fucking gay, because we lack cool women? We have Farah and Laswell, but let’s be real Farah is basically married to Alex (I thought they were a couple at first) and Laswell is married to a woman. Now people go great lengths to ship the male characters with female villains, who only appear in a small fraction of the story and have no real chemistry. I mean they can do whatever floats their boat, but I don’t really see the point here.

Which leaves us with a bunch of man ‘flirting’ with each other vor comedic value. I think given this and the points you already said on your account, I think it’s even a bit intended that most of our characters might not be the straightest.

Sure, a bunch of straight men can exist without women and still be straight and the military still might not be the most women friendly institution, but I think having more girlpower would have been an easy way to make everyone appear more straight and the devs didn’t go that route sooooo… (I still would love to have more cool women, but that’s another topic)

Anyways, I hope you have a good day and I wanted to add that I really enjoyed your character analysis posts <3

Ahh thanks for enjoying my analysis posts. 💞🥹 Honestly, I'm still surprised people are reading them lol. (And asking me about it haha)

But yes, I don't think I'll ever be tired of the ol' queerness discussion. It's a fun topic to debate especially with these characters in this particular game.

Controversial take, but I actually don't think adding any extra female characters would've been helpful in making the 'gay' go away.

(gonna be a long discussion here, settle in if you want to read it haha 😅)

What we have to put in mind, is that this game wasn't made for the female audience. The vast majority of the people buying and playing it are going to be male. That's the facts. It's going to cater to men.

A game made for men is going to have a majority of those characters be male. Adding new female characters in a REBOOT series is a delicate task when a good chunk of the population playing have played the OG and want to see legacy characters back (which are all male—the OG was all men).

That means that when we look at why certain things are framed and why there aren't many female characters, and especially why there isn't much of any confirmed (het) canon romantic ships between any characters, it's because the game itself isn't focused on it.

That same vast majority of men don't actually care about ships in general and with people trying to be more progressive, any female characters introduced are painstakingly written to omit any overt possibility of romance. In one sense, it's a welcome change from the action movie style plot line where man + woman = relationship with the women being just side characters/window dressing to the MC.

Women here are shown to be tough, that they don't need a man at all. They have their own agency. It's pretty nice actually that they did that. None of the female characters are infantilised nor is there a sense of them being there to "check boxes" in the minority bag. They make sense in the framing the game has placed them in.

But we do have this interesting dynamic whereby removing the romance factor, but having female characters in a setting that most are conditioned to read as man + woman = relationship, it de-emphasizes heteronormality and actually emphasises the relationships between the core characters.

And with a game full of men, that means the relationships between men are going to be the focal point.

Adding extra female characters, wouldn't have changed any of this, because the writers have gone out of their way to not make romance a plot of any sort. (There's a whole other discussion on the flaws of trying to give women agency/proving strength of character, but by doing so, taking away their sexualities by removing any sort of romance, but that's beside the point)

I think there's also an argument to be had that meaningful relationships with others don't have to necessarily imply romance between characters. It's totally fair to be sick of always having romance injected in to these sorts of relationships. That's an extremely valid take.

But there most definitely is a double standard that everyone is operating on. And we see that when we compare Alex/Farah's relationship with Ghost/Soap's.

Alex's most meaningful relationship is with Farah. He sacrifices himself for her cause and loses a leg for it. He comes back and stays by her side. Most people assume to take it as Alex is in love with Farah. We never see any type of flirting between the two. In fact it's mostly Farah testing Alex and looking at their dialogue you can tell there's respect between the two, but anything more is undefined/up for interpretation.

Yet it's just assumed by virtue of Alex and Farah being man + woman, that they must be together because of how much Alex had sacrificed. Completely ignoring the possibility of Alex doing so because he believes in Farah's cause and was sick of being jerked around with no choice by higher ups who largely didn't care about the suffering of Farah's people. Suffering that the man had personally witnessed. But no, he must be in love with her. (If Farah was a man, their whole relationship would be read as platonic with Alex's beliefs as a focus, not him being potentially in love)

Ghost's most meaningful relationship is with Soap. Soap has changed Ghost's whole MO as a lone wolf, and has challenged his very notion of trust. Ghost tests Soap and is proven wrong when Soap survives despite the odds. We even see them have plausible deniability flirting/snark. They are framed as a unit and on the off times (off of missions in cutscenes), they are always physically together. There's definitely respect between the two, but anything more is undefined/up for interpretation.

By itself, their relationship seems innocuous, but looking at the context we see a very different picture. Context matters heavily in seeing how this relationship has changed Ghost/the importance of it to him. It's assumed that Soap is the first person in god knows how long, that Ghost is emotionally attached to. What constitutes a normal, albeit flirty and snarky, friendly relationship for most, is amplified for Ghost in the glaring fact that he really doesn't do this for anyone else ever. As far as we can tell for a man that appears to live his job, Soap is Ghost's most important person.

We can even arguably say that Ghost and Soap had a flirtier, friendlier, more emotional relationship than Alex and Farah ever had, yet it's assumed (by the male audience) to be completely platonic by virtue of them both being men.

For all those people who argue to stop shipping characters, those same people turn around and are completely implicit in the notion of Alex and Farah being a thing.

It's a really annoying take, because you and I know that it's not the romance they're bothered by. It's the idea of having a character that exemplifies the silent male loner badass archetype as anything but the pinnacle of masculinity. IE, totally and utterly straight.

I feel I could go on about all the ways Ghost surprisingly subverts his archetype, but I'll leave it there. This is prob already too long 😅

But yes, having new cool female characters is always good, but it still wouldn't settle any sexuality debate since they would most likely be written without any hint of romance between the core 141 group and that potential new character. Just like how Farah and Laswell, as you said, have been both removed completely from the romance/sexuality debate, any new female character would also be put under similar framework.

I suppose it would just make them appear more straight (and get rid of all the speculation) if they had a new female character added into 141, but I don't see the point of adding a new character for that sole purpose. And tbh, it would come across as insulting to women if they did for that one reason.

Given how little character development we had in the latest game, I heavily doubt they would introduce new characters at all when they barely showed anything of the current ones we have already. We need more development of the characters we have, adding someone new would arguably take away from building proper relationships/dynamics between the characters we do have currently.

But yeah, heh. I'll stop for real now. If you got this far in my latest Ted Talk™, kudos to you good sir 🫡, you have all my love ☺️

Hope you have a great day too nonny, and I hope this helps with the discussion. Feels like I went off on too many side tangents. 🤔🤔🤔

[jojotichakorn]

What are your thoughts about the fandom believing that Ray doesn’t “deserve” Sand and that Ray thinks of Sand as someone he can purchase and then own. I don’t quite agree with that interpretation of things and would love to hear your thoughts.

listen, i could sit here all day talking about how most of sandray problems occured due to communication issues on both sides and the unique insecurities both sand and ray have all day. i could also talk about how sand is not the saint uwu baby that some people seem to think he is and - as someone whose favourite ofts character is sand - his woobification is truly the bane of my existence. however, i will not be talking about any of that in detail, because it kind of doesn't make sense to mention while answering your particular ask, considering the fact that i simply fundamentally do not believe that love is something you deserve.

there is no special formula that makes someone deserving of being loved by another person, nor is there any comparison list on just how many times each person can fuck up before one of them stops deserving the love of the other. that's just bullshit. two things are true: 1) sand loves ray and 2) that love is in no way intrinsically damaging or bad for sand (yes, there have been times when he was hurt, but that was, for example, due to lack of communication in episode 5 or ray jumping to conclusions in episode 10, which he apologised for - esentially, none of it is an inherent feature of their relationship).

see, i don't know whether it's people projecting their personal issues on the characters or - much worse - thinking ray being "difficult" (read: in most cases, just mentally ill and an addict) makes him fully unlovable or undeserving of love, but that's not the case not just in general, but specifically with sand. the simple truth of the matter is: sand does NOT find loving ray or being with ray or the person ray is difficult.

from the very beginning, even before sand falls in love, he is annoyed by ray but he also takes care of him - not just because sand is a helpful person and that's what he's used to doing but also because he does not find it burdensome. like, if someone would find it difficult to be in a relationship with a suicidal alcoholic - alright, they're not alone, they can go hang out with mew and chueam, who are in the exact same boat. and if someone would find it hard to be in a relationship with someone who is extremely emotional and "blows up" a lot - ok, then don't be friends with or date people like that. but sand just does not find it hard.

and that's kind of the whole point. there are always people in the world who will love someone with ALL their issues and flaws and idiosyncrasies and complexities. there are genuinely people who are going to be in a fight with someone who is deeply emotional and also deeply intoxicated and not internalise what they are saying. not because they don't care about themselves and are with someone undeserving of them or whatever, but because they understand that the person doesn't mean what they are saying in that moment and they can deal with it. if every time i was rude to someone because i was overstimulated (due to being autistic) that someone dropped me and called me undeserving of their love, i'd have no fucking friends, which is thankfully not the case.

when mew told ray "no one can put up with everything you do" he was wrong. plain and simple. just wrong. sand can. in fact, it's not even that he can "put up" with it - it's more like he can live with it just fine. let sand love the man he loves, seeing as he is very much not struggling with any part of their relationship or his partner's personality, especially after they resolved the issues they had (which is fine, by the way? just because someone is having issues in a relationship doesn't mean they gotta jump ship - if they want to and can deal with them, that's a good thing, actually).

as for the purchase part of your ask, i do always find it quite peculiar how simple people can make things. "rich + poor = automatic objectification" wow thanks for the analysis, boss! profound! like, i truly wish i knew where this could be coming from. i am also a dangerous romance watcher and if someone asked me about this in regards to kang and sailom, i would dive head-first and deep into those waters, because that's actually something that's relevant there. but with sand and ray... truly, i'm baffled by the suggestion.

the whole point of it to ray is that the relationship is genuine. that's deeply important to him, in fact - that is why he reacted the way he did about his father giving sand money. how in the world do you combine "(angrily and in disbelief) so this was all about money to you?" and "i literally bought you, i hope you remember that"?

idk, is this about ray buying sand gifts? 'cause gift giving is just an expression of love and ray just happens to be loaded so yeah, it's guitars and coachella trips or whatever - the guy lives in a mansion, i think it'd be weirder if he went "well, just to be sure i am not buying you, here is a pebble i found on the street for your birthday". is it about him being jealous or perhaps even possessive in the penultimate episode and likely the finale? 'cause that's just an emotion lots of people feel and while you could argue about 'ownership' in terms of the wider optics of how lots of monogamous relationships work, regardless of the financial situation of the partners, this is definitely just a fairly standard situation where two people are in an 'exclusive' relationship and suddenly a clear third party steps in.

ray has never expressed any disdain or even weirdness towards his poor friends in terms of their socioeconomic status, he has only brought up the wine selling issue when he fully blew up because he clearly understood that it was a source of income for sand, his initial suggestion to pay sand to hang out was in response to sand working at that time and literally needing the money he was meant to be earning that day to survive. like, where are we? how did we get here?