#more desperation than manipulation

[just-some-guy-at-shiz]

Okay, so I’ve got the stupidest AU idea:

When Boq encounters Elphaba after the intermission she became the “Wicked Witch,” he’s spooked and looking around for a weapon. But as soon as she says she won’t hurt him, and appeals to having known him in school, he jumps at the chance to get away from Nessa, and begs Elphaba to let him work for her instead. She’s a little offput and unconvinced by how quickly he’s willing to switch his political alignment, but he manages to convince her that he’s secretly harbored sympathy for her cause. He reminds her how much he admired Dr. Dillamond and his teaching back at Shiz, insists he’s helped an Animal or two on the run in some small ways, says he wished he could do more but he doesn’t have a head for organized protest and doesn’t know how to truly be of use, but if only he had Elphaba to rally behind. And besides, surely she could use a companion that didn’t fail Home Ec, but in fact aced it and knows lots of helpful farming trivia and can totally do her laundry without messing up the intricate beadwork on that fancy new Broadway-costume-cloak she’s got on. What’d’ya say? Need a lackey?

Elphaba agrees on the principle that the more people on her side the better (and also being reminded how long it’s been since she’s done laundry), and having helped Nessa, she sets off with Boq as her new sidekick. Nessa is dumbstruck and heartbroken that Boq is so eager to leave her (and with her own sister!!), but she doesn’t get a chance to cast any ill-advised magic. Boq gets to keep his flesh another day.

This is not the stupid part of the AU. So far this is actually rather plausible.

Anyway, Boq helps Elphaba for a little while. It doesn’t bother him at all, because he has about zero political opinions, and is neither supportive of Animal-racists nor quite as critical of them as he should be. Trying to help the Animals’ cause serves him well at the moment, so for self-preservation’s sake, he gives it his all. Boq’s motto for life is to just survive in whatever situation he’s stuck in, and do whatever emotional labor is necessary to be convincing(ish). So sure, he’s a passionate activist, abso-totally-lutely 👍. But then he gets the chance at a better position, and decides to flip his political opinions again and talk his way into somebody else’s good graces.

Actually, Elphaba goes straight from Nessa’s to the Wizard’s place, so either we change things so there’s more time in between events (my preference), or there’s no “illegal Animal-helping montage” and Boq never has to prove his commitment to being Elphaba’s not-so-evil henchman. But at some point, Elphaba goes to the Wizard to rescue the winged Monkeys and give him a stern talking to, and Boq sees his chance to be protected by the most powerful person in Oz. Boq, morally grey as he is, doesn’t hesitate.

Elphaba tries to sneak in and set the Monkeys free without anyone noticing her until it’s too late. Boq was instructed to go around to the other side of the cage to help her, or he snuck off, or something else happened that separated them, but as soon as he’s out of Elphaba’s sight, Boq runs to the nearest guards and the Wizard and raises the alarm. The Witch is here! Elphaba barely escapes being caught, but doesn’t manage to free the Monkeys. She doesn’t realize Boq is the one who alerted the guards, and assumes he’s been captured and arrested and imprisoned, and makes plans to free him when she comes back for the Monkeys.

Boq, meanwhile, is pleading his case to the Wizard. He claims that he was imprisoned by the Wicked Witch and forced to serve her, do lots of horrible anti-government things, but he never forgot his true loyalty. As soon as he had a chance to betray the Witch, he took it, risking his life in the hope that he might provide some small bit of aid to the wonderful Wizard who has done so much in the fight against wickedness. If the Wizard would have him, Boq would like nothing more than to enter the Wizard’s service as a way of repenting for the deeds he did at the Witch’s bidding, and to join the fight against evil by helping the most good person there is. :3

The Wizard, a seasoned conman, sees right through the flattery. And he’s impressed. It’s clumsy, of course, ameturish and obviously over-exaggerated, but it has potential. Boq reminds the Wizard of himself. Only acting in his own self-interest. Just clever enough to convince people to like him. Just a good enough actor to seem happy and admiring when he’s not. Just a straight liar when it comes to flattery, and good enough at bending the truth to fit his cause the rest of the time. Above all, they’re both opportunists. The Wizard hires Boq as a personal attendant (aka do whatever random tasks boss needs at the moment), but secretly the Wizard is considering Boq as a sort of successor. If he can train that natural talent as a conman, and get rid of the few morals that might interfere with things, then in time, Boq might be exactly the person he needs. He’ll promise Boq power, which equals safety, and that’s all he’ll need to say.

So Boq gets a snazzy green uniform and works for the Wizard for a while. He hopes he’ll run into Glinda now and then, considering they work in the same building for the same person, but tough luck, buddy.

Before long, Elphaba comes back trying to free the Monkeys again. She expects to have to rescue Boq too, so she’s surprised to be met upon arrival by Boq himself, looking like a very green bellhop. She initially thinks he might have been pressed into service, but the look on his face tells her all she needs to know. Sellout. It’s like Glinda all over again, groveling in submission to feed ambition and all. She’s furious that he betrayed her, and swears never to give anyone the benefit of the doubt ever again. 🎵 No benefit of the doubt / Will I giiiiiive / Agaaaaaaiiiiinnnnnn 🎵 and all that jazz. Boq says sorry not sorry, the fugitive life isn’t for me, I saw my chance and took it, and you’re stupid if you wouldn’t have done the same in my shoes. I work for the literal Wizard now. I have a snazzy uniform and health insurance. It doesn’t get better than this. lmao you wish you were me. ;)

Anyway. The Wizard was expecting Elphaba to return for the Monkeys, and Boq was sent to meet her when she snuck in and bring her to the Wizard’s throne room so she and the Wizard could chat. He does just that, with Elphaba fuming at him all through the hallways until they get where they’re going, which makes it a really awkward trip.

The following encounter goes roughly the same. The Wizard does a more professional version of Boq’s “put a nice spin on the truth to win them over” tactic, and almost convinces Elphaba to trade her rebellion for the Monkeys’ freedom, but then she sees Dr. Dillamond and tells the Wizard no, I’m nothing like you, I’ll never join you, as protagonists do, and makes her exit.

When Boq is summoned back in after this disappointing (to the Wizard) result, he’s more than a little horrified at seeing what Dr. Dillamond has become. Boq may be self-serving, but he’s not heartless (ha), and he may not have cared that the Wizard was behind the whole silencing-Animals thing, but he had yet to be asked to actually interact with the Animals the Wizard has captive. Maybe he didn’t think the situation was that bad for the Animals, or maybe it’s just harder to ignore injustice when you have to look it in the eye, but the Wizard notices Boq’s weakening resolve.

Boq knows that the conversation with Elphaba was supposed to go a little differently, and asks what now? The Wizard sighs all regretfully, in the way that’s very ominous coming from villains like him, and looks at the cage where his winged Monkeys used to be. He says that he had hoped it wouldn’t come to this, because he had such high hopes for Boq (another ominous thing for a villain to say). Given more time, Boq could have learned to shut away old ideals and become powerful, influential, etc. etc. etc. But the Wizard has become a little desperate, and it’s time for the backup plan, and Boq is the perfect, candidate (because… I don’t know, some reason ¯\_(ツ)_/¯).

Madame Morrible shows up, standing behind Boq so he can’t try to leave. Ominous trifecta!!!

The Wizard tells Boq that nothing is going to change, not really. Boq can still have all he’s ever wanted… as long as he continues to do as he’s told.

This. Is where it becomes stupid. I mean, I like it, but so far this AU has been fairly well-thought-up. The last bit is the part that makes me cringe self-consciously a little. But good news, cringe culture is dead, so I’m just gonna keep going.

Soon after the last, there’s some kind of third interaction between Elphaba and the Wizard. Don’t ask me how they get in the same space, they just do. Also Elphaba is hovering on her broom out of reach. She has the high ground!!! The Wizard says something to the effect of “you stole away my spies. So I had to make a replacement.” And Elphaba is like “more spies?” thinking oh man how many rescues am I gonna have to do in one week? Then the Wizard says “better than just spies. I have created the perfect soldier… for catching witches.” A blur flies out from behind a curtain and straight towards Elphaba in midair. She’s shocked to find her hands being tied by Boq, still wearing emerald city green, but having a pair of feathery wings and looking very ill at ease with the whole situation. Also in pain, very much in pain. This isn’t the result of a magic spell, not with Elphaba on the opposing team. This whole (literal) operation was like 20% Morrible magic tops, and the rest was questionable mad science. The Wizard didn’t even give Boq three full days to recover, and Boq is not only in pain but terrified he’s gonna pull out the stitches on those wings and plummet to his death, or bleed out from his back if the fall doesn’t kill him.

Suffice to say that working for the Wizard no longer feels like a “safe” job.

Elphaba basically says just that, trying to convince Boq to let her go by asking him if he’s really willing to suffer like this for the Wizard’s sake of all people. Stop making your “I’m on the clock” decidedly neutral face and answer me honestly, do you want this? Because you look miserable.

She can see that she’s winning him over. He loosens his grip on her.

Elphaba then launches into her recruitment campaign. She tells Boq to think of everything he’s been through, and how the winged Monkeys were forced into this exact same scenario before she rescued them, and that Animals are suffering like this or worse every single day, and if he would want someone to help him when he’s suffering than surely he can do the same and support the Animals’ efforts to push back against—

Elphaba is then interrupted by the Wizard, who put a lot of effort into this hyperobedient flying soldier of his and doesn’t want to see all that psychological manipulation go to waste. The Wizard talks again about how Elphaba is evil and he’s good, and how Boq is just like him and he’s proud of all the Boq has done, and if Boq stands by the Wizard, he can have power and fame even, everything he’s ever wanted—

And this is where Boq interjects to say that he’s never cared about power or fame or saving anybody. Literally all he’s ever wanted is to just get on with his own life like a normal person, without having to do weird and difficult things like this! Neither Elphaba or the Wizard care about him, they just care about how they can use him. And, you know, fair enough, because that’s exactly how Boq thinks of them as well. Glad we’re all on the same page.

Boq unties Elphaba’s hands, but makes no further move to do anything helpful to either side of this argument. He glides to a landing, exhaling in relief at no longer having to put stress on wings that haven’t even healed yet, and says that he’s not going with either of them, please and thank you. He’s going to leave right now, and don’t they dare try following him, or… else! In the short term, he is going to find someplace to get a decent coffee, and in the long term he is going to find a nice quiet farm to work on or a tradesman to apprentice for or perhaps even risk trying to fly over the great desert at some point just to get away from ALL THE CRAZINESS AROUND HERE. GOOD DAY TO YOU BOTH. GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR REBELLION OR ATTEMPTS TO DEFEAT SAID REBELLION. BOQ OUT!

And he throws up his hands in exasperation and turns on his heel and marches away.

This isn’t bad. It’s just the wings bit that’s a little badly written, because it’s sort of unnecessary. I think I just like it for the drama. We can’t have (musical) Boq without a little transformation-related body horror at some point, now can we? He’s just lucky it’s not as all-encompassing this time.

Really though, the fact that it’s unnecessary and dramatic maybe just adds to the humor. Like, wow, good job giving me wings and making me look like a super powerful protagonist, I’m going to squander that immediately by wanting nothing to do with flying or protagonist-ing. You chose the wrong test subject, loser.

[pharawee]

[nobodysuspectsthebutterfly]

Jaime Lannister didn’t think Robert Arryn would live long to breed, and he most likely had little interaction with him. Do you think Jon Arryn thought the same? Do you think he regretted marrying lysa, especially with how she turned out?

Correction: Jaime and Robert Arryn lived in the same castle for the first six years of Robert's life. Jaime was aware Robert was still breastfeeding at the age of four. Jaime undoubtedly witnessed several incidents where Joffrey called Robert cruel names, and probably the incident where Joffrey slapped him with a wooden sword. (Which I imagine took place in the training yard, where the Kingsguard frequently hang out.) Jaime probably saw more than one of Robert's seizures, as he had the "shaking sickness" from birth. Jaime has full context to judge Robert's fitness for survival, even if he does so coldly and with Westeros-typical ableism.

I don't know what Jon Arryn thought exactly, but the fact he continued to care for Robert and didn't bring his great-nephew Harry Hardyng to the Eyrie (as Randyll Tarly surely would have done) suggests that no, he hadn't given up on his son. In fact, Jon was planning to take Robert away from Lysa and send him to be fostered at Dragonstone:

[Catelyn] glanced at her nephew and sighed. “The boy is utterly without discipline. He will never be strong enough to rule unless he is taken away from his mother for a time.” “His lord father agreed with you,” said a voice at her elbow. She turned to behold Maester Colemon, a cup of wine in his hand. “He was planning to send the boy to Dragonstone for fostering, you know… oh, but I’m speaking out of turn.” — AGOT, Catelyn VII

“The boy is weak and sickly,” Lord Stannis objected. “Even his father saw how it was, when he asked me to foster him on Dragonstone. Service as a page might have done him good, but that damnable Lannister woman had Lord Arryn poisoned before it could be done…” — ACOK, Prologue

So Jon evidently believed that Robert could grow stronger, as long as he was away from his mother. But this pissed Lysa the hell off:

“I proposed that Lord and Lady Arryn foster two of my grandsons at court, and offered to take their own son to ward here at the Twins. […] Lord Arryn wouldn’t have him, or the other one, and I blame your lady sister for that. She frosted up as if I’d suggested selling her boy to a mummer’s show or making a eunuch out of him, and when Lord Arryn said the child was going to Dragonstone to foster with Stannis Baratheon, she stormed off without a word of regrets and all the Hand could give me was apologies. What good are apologies? I ask you.” —Walder Frey, AGOT, Catelyn IX

and so she killed Jon (under guidance from Littlefinger and with the help of Pycelle's malpractice).

Again, I don't know exactly what Jon was thinking regarding his choice to marry Lysa, but also... I don't actually care? Oh, so when you were in your 60s, you married a "soiled" girl young enough to be your granddaughter because you were desperate for an heir, got her pregnant nine times in your loveless marriage, and only had one chronically ill child survive the miscarriages and stillbirths? Sucks to be you, Jon, and I'm glad Lysa outlived you.

[oldtestleper]

i wonder if it all Has To Do With Gemma actually. like i thought for a minute lumon was effectively just using her reanimated body as a prop to induce an unresolvable misery in outie mark so he would keep coming back to work (because for some reason his mystery work is so important and hes the best at it...) but she "died" before he started working on the severed floor. so they collected her body, faked her death, and started testing severance or some aspect of severance on her, and then they either headhunted mark, or he applied to work at lumon and genuinely volunteered for severance, and then he became the most important boy whose work must continue--but either way gemma's death and severance came first. she was abducted by lumon before she was made into an instrument of lumon's manipulation of mark, such that the manipulation couldn't have been the purpose of her abduction. unless the car accident was somehow staged in order to induce a grief in mark so profound that lumon anticipated he would be able to be guided to pursue severance because for some reason they thought this college professor was that important to their work and there was no other way they could get him. but that just seems convoluted you know. occams razor what does lumon WANT. employees that you can do anything to and who have no context for your demands or sense of their own personal rights and dignity and never expect to leave perhaps?

[froggy-nebula]

vriska is really funny cause when you look at the shit she actually does shes not the best at manipulating people or flarp or combat she just cant win at any of her hobbies

[dxxtruction]

Personally, I think the “That’s how it happened right? You standing in my blood, stroking my hair?” Was how it happened. Louis is just super detached from that headspace he was in before, and validly wanting not to have it be true that he didn’t, at one time, care about Claudia being gone, would be reasonable, and in character. Blaming Armand, partly, for why things got to be like that is correct. Though in this instance is misdirected to include things Armand did not in fact do to get it to be like that, but had, very much, done in a recent unrelated incident. He's essentially combining two events together to get it to align with his current set of beliefs. (Surely everyone's looked back on a situation before and saw it differently given time to think or feel differently about it. Get differing information, and so on. The show is directing us to that a lot, if not making it one of its major themes.)

But I say this is probably, almost definitely, the case, because Louis story beats need to be told accurately lest it take away from his character arc, as well his whole character and its complexity. Obstructing from his, very powerful, highly emotionally driven, story in a way that's frankly offensive. Armand having total and complete control over it, is bullshit. While, he does this though, to himself. Does a character armor on himself to get away from his own flaws, and role, in how things came about. Not intentionally, because it is emotional, and a lot of times just a result of blocking out that trauma. But this is something he’s seen doing often - Not remembering situations in the light in which they’re most accurate, and in so doing painting himself better sometimes, and others worse. Straight up forgetting, or overlooking information, and so never reevaluating why certain things came about until this moment. Not accurately applying the emotions of then, to the way he feels about it now, because he can't, or couldn't previously, actually remember it in that way. As he doesn't connect to those feelings, even those memories. His feelings in a lot of ways keep clouding his memories and his judgments of them.

Daniel gets at this too, where he brings up the tapes, and how Louis was basically just raving the whole time, and this story all happened differently then. It's the same story beats, yes, but it's all so emotionally different to the point where information gets completely changed around, even looked at like it's forcefully constructed to be a certain way, and not actually, therefore, accurate. Louis always tells an emotional story, and that’s important. It places him in time and continuum, in his own history as opposed to outside of it. That’s like, I think a history that can’t be overlooked, even if it's a history that's subject to change. And shouldn't history be? Shouldn't we look back on events that took place in our lives differently? Isn't that how any society grows? And why shouldn't Louis judgments be clouded by his emotions when that's the reason for most any other characters actions? Isn't that the story being told here?

[velvetjune]

I will find Barry Wheeler and personally save him from Chester Bless

[icewindandboringhorror]

I'm so heavily anti-advertising that all pitches sound goofy silly to me/I can never take them seriously, so I have no idea how I'll manage to to advertise my game even if I do finally finish it soon-ish lol...

[shyfurby]

I have not posted any of my analysis to reddit yet and I think I might just post it and ghost it. I've already spent too much time looking at other people's threads on there to feel any way good about interacting with folks.

I already went in an added the "I know you're going to bring this up let me save you the time" section which is exclusively touching on the frequent topics of:

"well what about the fingerprint nostrum and finger mimics? He is clearly just a crackpot"

And

"it's definitely some weird elaborate sacrifice to Metyr thing"

[astarlightmonbebe]

the whole point being that taeoh, for all his intelligence and strategies, might still have made it to kangoh, but he would never have a chance to actually grab power without using inha’s ‘insider’ status, which inha seems to be ‘realizing’ these episodes. because at the end of the day, taeoh is still kangoh’s tool. he has no authority. he’s something for the chairman to use, never more than that.

[bitchfitch]

idk all of Esti's non-Pavo based problems come down to the fact that hes half predator/half prey species. The humans around him see him as just another wolf that's particularly close to the pack leader, the demons see him as a novel type of sheep their leader is being selfish about not sharing.

He has no place in either community and so has no safety net to fall into should his extremely tenuous alliances with the bravest sheep and most patient wolves falter.

[lususnatura]

blamore having to wear things like back-less shirts / lower - cut tops and just items of clothing that will allow him SOME sort of free range of movement for his tail in general + will actually not constrict his rib cage may just make him a fashion icon y'all... sorry, i don't make the rules ( nah i'm just joking around with you guys LOL... mostly )

[pinksilvace]

actually I'm NOT done with talking about the scene in Antarctica. It's been talked about ten thousand times before but OUGHHHG the creative direction!!! It's the only scene where Pitch isn't connected to any shadows!!! because it's a domain we would associate with Jack!!! The two of them are alone and Pitch has nowhere to slip away to and the art book specifies that this is the place he feels safest so he doesn't need to be near any shadows!!! in the place meant to represent Jack's emptiness! that's where he's most comfortable... and then he goes on a lecture and says I KNOW WHAT IT'S LIKE TO LONG FOR A FAMILY

[snekdood]

why do ppl you barely know or interact with at all think you give a huge fuck about interacting with them?

[amatres]

raphael portraying his deal as a 'last resort desperate hope deal' when in reality balaerra just already hated a dude, her bestie said take this deal, and she shrugged and signed her soul away. the most casual deal with the devil he has seen

[doggendoodle]

fucked up and singlehandedly cost my group a kudos fight in front of someone i respect (this will have a negligible impact on their day but i will forever be haunted by their first impresson of me being ruined)