#meta fridays

[endomentendo]

IT IS A SPOOKY MONTH!

[ladystoneboobs]

idt we talk enough about how a song of ice and fire is also the song of incest and cannibalism. i mean, sure, obviously both of those subjects are noted as present, but the saga feels much more known for its incest, which idt is fair or accurate to the later materiel. iirc, jaime fucking cersei next to their dead firstborn is the last instance of onpage incest happening in present tl, and after that it's all about the cannibals, baby.

(disclaimer: cw/tw sa, cw/tw rape, and i'm not counting cousincest as that's normal in-world even for non-targaryens and also still legal in many places in our world today, nor counting the faux-incestuous freudian mess that is littlefinger/alayne(sansa)/sweetrobin, nor any dark humor jokes and/or unfulfilled threats wrt forced cannibalism)

in fact pretty much all the active incest during the present tl happens in those first 3 books:

the twincest as a major plot point ofc, kicking action off when bran saw them fucking in a tower

and viserys creeping on dany and twisting her nipple

tyrion relating his backstory to bronn wherein he and tysha were both raped by proxy by his father, tywin (tho tyrion does not use that terminology)

craster still being alive to rape and impregnate his own daughters (resulting in dozens of forced incestuous relationships)

and theon unknowingly groping his own sister while she (knowingly) groped him in return

jaime's early pov recalled how he shut up cersei with kissing when they fought after bran refused to die

bella of stoney sept trying and failing to seduce gendry who is (unbeknownst to them both) her half-brother as both were sired by robert baratheon (only example in these 3 books where incest was averted before any sexual activity or incestuous contact occurred)

the aforementioned sept twincest next to joffrey's corpse

tyrion learning from oberyn about cersei twisting his penis when he was a baby

cersei's failed attempt to seduce jaime in wst, pulling out his dick for either a bj or hj until her talk of tyrion's death made him lose his boner

while incest is not exactly absent from the text after that, it seems to exist in the feastdance only in hypotheticals or past memories:

aeron's trauma flashbacks of his (implied only in published text) csa by euron

jaime still feeling lust when seeing cersei nude

and her fond reminiscing about them fucking behind robert's back/brief dream of them as a married couple before her walk of shame

victarion misinterpreting asha's offer of partnership as a marriage proposal and suddenly looking at his niece in a new way with "his manhood beginning to stiffen"

jaime's recollection of fucking cersei at darry next to robert as he was passed out drunk before cersei sent him to hunt arya (which would have happened back in agot and the point of this scene is more his failed hunt for a child just to make cersei happy)

arianne's "uneasy" memory of a past fantasy about being seduced by a man whose description is suspiciously similar to her late uncle oberyn

the aborted marital match of aegon/young griff to his purported aunt dany

illyrio saying (the now dead) viserys tried to rape dany the night before her wedding to drogo (another event from agot concerning a guy we already knew was into incest)

and tyrion once saying he wanted to rape as well as murder cersei

conversely, the cannibalism in the earlier books is most often only unproven hypotheticals alluded to as possible cannibalism:

old nan saying the others fed their dead servants the flesh of human children (which we have not yet seen with any wights so far, whether or not one counts walking undead eating human flesh as straight-up cannibalism)

the mystery meat in flea bottom's bowls o' brown which may or may not contain symon silver tongue after tyrion had him killed

renly's recollection that cressen kept stannis from catapulting their old master-at-arms by saying they may need to eat him later (which did not come to pass thanks to davos)

joffrey telling his people to eat their own dead (with no way of knowing if any actually did)

lady hornwood eating her own fingers (though bran's pov only notes them being chewed on, not swallowed. it's only in adwd that people talk of her eating the fingers.)

the mentions of the ice river clans being the cannibals beyond the wall (who are def not among the free folk jon snow gets to know onpage, making it just background detail)

bran's (possibly mythical) story of the rat cook

and biter chewing on people he attacked and other corpses (which seems to be just a side hobby connected to his killing method moreso constituting a snack than a full meal from a person butchered for meat. this tendancy of his is just background detail in acok, with biter chewing a corpse in the background after the weasel soup operation, and the hindsight implication that it could well have been him rather than dogs or wolves who had "been at" the corpses after the skirmish where yoren was killed)

while the feastdance feels much more in your face with cannibalism, having not only more total mentions of the practice but also more actual cannibalism (as opposed to the ambiguity of each and every bowl o' brown), for those who know how to look at the evidence:

jaime learned that his father's mad dog aka the mountain fed parts of vargo hoat to all his prisoners (including vargo himself) after recapturing harrenhal

and euron bragged about pulling a similar trick with the warlocks he captured (the only twist being that the warlocks knew what they were being forced to eat, which vargo hoat and wylis manderly etc at harrenhal likely didn't)

the elder brother of the quiet isle told of biter eating all of a woman's breasts at saltpans after she'd been raped and killed (prob the largest amount of flesh biter's confirmed to have eaten from one corpse)

bran and co. ate "pig" supplied by coldhands which had to be long pig aka human meat

brienne felt her face being eaten by biter in her own pov (which is so much worse than him chewing others in the background of the weasel soup scene)

theon was told that two ironmen at moat cailin were found eating their dead comrades

the astapori were said to eat their own dead while under siege by the yunkishmen

and then were said to do so again in refugee camps outside meereen

khrazz the pit fighter cut the hearts from his defeated foes to eat them

cotter pyke's last letter to jon snow said the wildlings were eating their own dead at hardhome

4 of stannis's men were executed by burning for butchering and eating other men (with asha wondering how many others had done so without being caught)

and ofc the frey pies with wyman manderly having his 3 former guests killed and serving their meat to their own kin and the other guests at ramsay's wedding while eating some himself too

two of these examples (involving gregor clegane and euron greyjoy) must have actually happened during the course of asos, but grrm chose to give us the gruesome details in affc, which was brand new information about men we already knew were villains but did not know were into that fucked-up shit specifically, unlike being reminded that agot-era jaime and viserys wanted to fuck their sisters. (and not unlike how adwd has the clarification of multiple characters saying lady hornwood ate her own fingers as opposed to bran's acok pov just saying she chewed on them.) it's as if after craster was killed and jc effectively broke up grrm decided cannibalism was the taboo subject matter he would fill the later books with, so we'd really feel the increasing danger of starvation-induced cannibalism with winter's arrival (and have no trouble believing rickon's new home of skagos really is a cannibal island). however, in-universe it feels like there's some sort of environmental balance connection so that the decrease in one formerly common behaviorial abomination just allows another such abomination to fill in the gap with a sharp increase in activity, like deer overpopulation resulting from lack of predators as if all the active incest somehow stopped more people from eating themselves or other people.

[antimony-medusa]

The thing with RPF

Okay, I don't tend to engage much with RPF. I have read it, but only when recommended by someone whose taste I trust (I think it's all supernatural aus that I've read, to-date), and my intention is not to write it. Not really my scene.

However, I really think this fandom could stand to stop treating RPF like it is the devil.

If you engage only with someone in the form of like an hour a week of video of them performing for an audience, particularly if that video is edited, like, when you start mentally rotating characters to create with, your brain isn't gonna draw a huge difference between the guy from the scripted thing you watched, and the person from, idk, mythbusters. Love to see my guy make a big explosion.

In both situations, you don't know them as people, you know them as like, personas, characters. You are essentially engaging with them as fictional characters, cause you only see the small segment of their lives that they put into the video, and whatever story they're telling with that. You don't know them as people, because how could you? So your brain going "hehe what if hunger games au" is just one of the ways brains work.

And idk, as long as you know you're doing that, I think that's fine.

It's fiction. You're writing/reading fiction. It's in the name. You know that it's not true, you're dealing with fictionalized versions of like, stage personas, or teaching methodologies, or historical records, and you can make your little fictions, and you show it to the eight people who are also really into *spins wheel* Ancient Egyptian RPF or *spins other wheel* Taskmaster UK TV RPF or *continues to spin the wheel* Polygon (web series) RPF. You all shake each other's hands and go "man I really like [person/character] and I think about them a lot" and someone else goes "I also think about [person/character] a lot and I think that if he was a warrior cat he would be a kittypet" and someone else goes "I think if [peson/character] would boil an egg the egg would explode cause he's really bad at boiling eggs" and you go "go on". You are all silly together, and you are all doing fiction, and you go on your merry way.

Like that is A Thing People Do On The Internet, and that stays in its its designated space, and that's fine. Might not be your jam but it's fine. That is not more weird than inventing an elaborate imaginary religion for a minecraft world, or working out the emotional nuance of an arranged marrige au between fictional detectives, or carefully making an elaborate interlocking series of stories where someone from a children's cartoon is horribly tortured, rescued, recovers, and gets their vengance. All of that looks weird from the outside, and is a fine and honourable thing to do in your little circles on the internet.

The part where this becomes a problem is when you take your fiction (lies we tell recreationally) out of the designated circle of people enjoying the fictions, and you shove it in the face of the person it's based on, and go "do you like this" or "is this okay" or "I found this and I think it's bad is it bad".

When you are doing the fiction you are engaging with the person as a character which is like, fine, and a truthful reflection of how much you actually know them (not at all, you don't know them), but in shoving it in their face you are going "I don't know you but I want you to react to this for my entertainment/justification, because I think this reflects on you, and apparently I think I deserve your time and attention, and also I think I already know how you're gonna react and I'm gonna use it for my callout posts", which is like, so much ruder than just making fictions about people you don't actually know.

Like writing a superhero au about the person you watch video game speedrun— based. Love the imagination. That is making something from nothing, a great creative act. I could not do that at all but I salute you.

Telling the speedrunner about it? No were you raised in a barn. You are not writing it for the person to approve of— they don"t know you— you are writing it for fun and the enjoyment of other speedrunner enjoyers. Keep it locked down.

As long as we're all aware that RPF is fiction, and we keep it in circles where we're circulating it as fiction— ao3 archive locks exist for a reason! this is not something you want to show up on a google search!— this is just a thing people do for entertainment. Don't bring it up to the person it's about, and you're fine.

And I've been thinking about this because like, I don't think what I'm writing is RPF, but BOY from the outside people seem to think it is! Including the creators! Which means that even while I'm doing my best to adhere to character beats from the story and not just streamer personas, and differentiate between the dude in england and the dude in 3rd life, also I should be aware that if the creator hits it, he's probably gonna think that I'm just writing this about him.

Things go SO MUCH BETTER if the creator only finds it if he goes "huh I wonder what people are writing about me" and deliberately goes to look for it, not if he's just going along thinking about disney movies and someone comes screaming into his field of view like "people are writing about you on the internet". And then he's gotta deal with the ways he's percieved, and whatever weird warrior cat situation people were putting him in, and the fact that people don't know him but think he can't boil an egg, and the 3rd life cannibalism aus, and and and— it's a mess. Please don't do that.

All of this to say A) RPF is fine actually that's just like one of the ways storytelling works— we're not writing RPF but it isn't the devil either. B) STOP TELLING PEOPLE ABOUT FANFICTION.

[falceknight]

Happy Falce Friday No. 17!

Such interesting...butterfly.

[inconveniently-discorporated]

Still breaks my heart how you hear the ✨immortal drop-in✨ sound, and Aziraphale automatically looks to his left with a pleasant smile on his face, only to find it's not Crowley.

And I like how Gabriel appeared on the wrong side. And also how the sides haven't even really been established yet, so it's a really tiny detail that would be difficult to catch right away.

[akicklineisinevitable]

something about Hatchetfield is so Hadestown coded. something about how it's a sad tale, but we sing it anyway. as if it will turn out this time. (i'll find you in the next timeline). something about how not everyone can make it out, and those that do don't make it out unchanged. something about love that was doomed from the start (wait for me? i will) (when you shipped out, i thought i'd wait for you). something about how the scenery changes, but the stories are the same. something about it was a world of gods and men (there are monsters and there are men).

[orviposition]

<Once there was a man who had to live a long story to save one person.>

Until now, I've thought of "The Snowfield" as Kim Dokja's space.

<It is not the reader who lives between the invisible lines.>

The snowfield.

A grave of unrecorded existences.

<There was only one being who could live between the lines.>

Every story is written, but perhaps this was a place where nothing is written.

This snowfield is,

"Yoo Joonghyuk."

From the beginning, it was one person's world.

[officialjimmybuffett]

no because james flint was the son of a carpenter. james flint was cast out of civilized society for his beliefs. james flint was a radical preacher. james flint was the shepherd of thousands of lost men. james flint birthed his own kingdom. james flint was wanted dead by entire empires. james flint was betrayed by those he loved the most. james flint was only a story. james flint THE most christ figure of all time.

[freezingfogsblog]

Maybe another time bugette 🤝 she's not as hot as she uses to be 🤝 yeah ... I don't want to though...

[man-down-in-hatchet-town]

Do you guys ever think about how Matt Lang was a senior in college when they did AVPM, which means he started at UMich in Fall of 2005? And how when the Langs had to pick the most important year in the history of Hatchetfield, the year in which so much of the overarching plot has its roots, they (likely by coincidence) went with the year Matt arrived on campus and Starkid's origins started to form?

[minty364]

DPXDC Prompt #63

Danny was on the run from the GIW after a raid gone wrong and his family and friends are dead. He’s 15 years old and a king to an entire realm and has no where to go. He remembers a promise he made to someone named Harleen Quinzel, if he’s ever in trouble to seek her out. They we’re cousins after all and while he knows she’s a reformed villain, she’s also the least likely person to rat him out to the GIW so he takes a gamble. Of course little to his knowledge the bats keep a close eye on Harley.

[falceknight]

Happy Falce Friday No. 13!

Sweet oufits, hehe...

[obscurecurse]

Not Waving But Drowning (Ep 13)

ok sorry i got distracted by those other details from the ep. but i am once again asking for the KPTS scholars to dissect a kim look and it's this one right here:

(full disclosure the series of gifs for this post is titled like, "ohgodohfuck1, ohgodohfuck2, etc." i have been crying in public all week. and i accidentally dissected this scene in Reverse Chronological order, which is kind of interesting... does someone want to watch KPTS backwards with me? lord knows we've watched it forward enough times.)

i'm going to Posit™ some shit, but i did in fact ask for Your Interpretation...

this scene comes to the audience as a flashback, while kim is feeling emo about chay, looking at the polaroids in his apartment. and because it's got that flashback cinema feel, it almost reads to me like a glimmer of kim's mind, a bit of unreliable narrator? it's as if all of his memories of chay are compressed into a single moment, and its one that he feels he fumbled spectacularly. it's the epitome of their dilemma.

i didn't do a full rewatch for this (lol) but as far as i can tell, there's no other scenes where they're wearing these outfits, which makes it a little hard to place within the timeline. obviously this is before chay finds kim out, before chay is kidnapped, and probably before chay confesses? i reason that it's after kim has realized that chay is just a fan, though. the emotions behind the lyrics of chay's song seem to register as lyrics for Kim.

i think of kim, in general, as fairly composed. usually. he's an idol, well-mannered, and leans heavily on a poker face he's spent his entire life perfecting. (he obviously flips once he hits some threshold, which we see a few times. and then there's the moments where he literally has to turn it off, superseded by survival instincts.)

it's so interesting to me that he walks away here. he walks away when chay confronts him outside of his apartment, too. it's like, he doesn't trust himself, so he removes himself? or it's just muscle memory at this point? (he seems to flee quite a bit. he left home. he disappears himself after he pulls chay from the warehouse. its implied he's been avoiding chay. khun even seems to have a sense of humor about how aloof kim is when they meet in passing. kim continues to strengthen the muscle each time he walks away. walking away does not change things, but clearly he's getting something out of it. or it worked for him once and now it's just a character flaw. anyway)

he didn't even know he was playing with fire but now it burns. kim can't focus while chay looks directly into his eyes and sings to him. he can't sit still:

his jacket (HIS BLUE JACKET) is stained with black brushstrokes.

and perhaps my favorite thing about this scene is the envelope it comes in: we see chay how kim sees him now -> framed by the window of the sound engineer's booth, singing only for kim

my questions: why do you think he walks away here? what is behind that look? is it guilt? (because he knows how this will all later look to chay, and he understands now that chay had approached him honestly) is he barely containing the urge to return the apparent confession in chay's song? is he conflicted, torn by the firm belief that he's wrong for chay? is he considering letting the cat out of the bag, about being a theerapanyakul? is there something specific that kim does not want chay to see or glean from the look on his face? maybe a mix of some of these?

the other point of interest, for me, though not directly related to my query, is the look on chay's face. it's something like rejection or at the very least disappointed surprise? at face value, playing a song for someone you look up to is a very vulnerable act. this is not the reaction he was hoping for or anticipating. but it makes me wonder, also, if chay knows(/suspects) more than we all give him credit for? somewhere deep down he must know how unlikely it is that his idol would engage him, a fan, in this way? i'm not saying he's onto kim, but maybe he's aware something is off about this situation? or, i guess, another possibility is that he's just worried about kim?

[bird-inacage]

Love in the Air: The Significance of Security to Sky

This moment folks. I need to talk about it. I already gave it an honourable mention, but I want to dissect why Sky's reaction here spoke volumes - and how the significance of security (aka marriage) is so important as a conclusion to the Prapaisky story.

When we first meet Sky, he's still wading through the shadow of his abuse. The prolonged aftereffects which could potentially continue for the foreseeable future, affecting his overall happiness and ability to love again.

Now fast forward to this expression we see on Sky's face during the wedding. Despite all the trials and tribulations, despite thinking he might never overcome those demons - I saw in his expression - an echo of the 'young Sky' again. The innocence in his smile. The giddy wholesomeness which is often found in young 'puppy' love. Eagerness and anticipation for things to come. Hopeful excitement which isn't marred or jaded by the toil of hardship. An expression that contained an immense degree of appreciation and relief, a 'thank god you found me' relief. A 'close-to-tears' relief that comes with finally being seen and/or valued. The point is, that expression is very similar to the way he'd looked at Gun before everything that followed.

That's the expression of a boy who has fully and willingly opened their heart to another. And here it is again. On his wedding day. Sky has somehow managed to restore some of that innocence in love he lost.

Most of Sky's anxieties can be attributed to a lack of safety (such as difficulty with trust, doubt in stability, worry of being taken advantage of, insecurity in his self-worth). This all manifests from a very simple and basic human instinct we all possess - and that is to feel safe. When someone so intimately close to you betrays you in the worst way imaginable, they've effectively stripped any sense of safety away from you by force. This is the state in which Prapai finds Sky in at the start of the series.

I've talked many times before about how Prapai fulfils a 'protector' role incredibly well. But in fact his way of handling Sky goes beyond protection. He's very adept at creating a safe space around Sky, as well as allowing Sky to feel safe when he's with him. And that's not only by loving Sky, but truly caring for Sky's wellbeing and his basic needs. Whether that's ensuring he eats, making sure he rests, or reminding Sky he doesn't need to suffer alone. This is achieved by listening, by not overstepping, by holding back, by being patient, by being gentle. And eventually escalates to Prapai 'removing' Gun as a threat. The very genesis of Sky's suffering and the very person who robbed Sky of his safety, which Prapai had been working so hard to rebuild.

Safety comes first before all else, due to safety being intrinsically linked to survival. It's only once you've established safety, that you can add security - further measures to 'ensure' this safety lasts as long as possible.

This is where Prapai's intentions for marrying Sky (other than the most obvious) are really worth considering. By his very character, our boy Prapai famously never half-asses anything. He's all in, all the time. He wants to provide everything humanly possible to the person he loves, and that involves giving Sky the highest form of security he can offer, which is by marrying him. Binding them in name, on paper, as well as on all remaining principles.

For most people, the fine print and diplomacy of marriage is not particularly romantic. But in this case it's exactly the functionality and formality of marriage that will provide Sky with the security Prapai seeks. Prapai possesses privilege. And that privilege allows him access to means he can extend to Sky. So marrying Sky means: 'I will be responsible for you. What's mine is now yours'. 'If anything happens to me, you have everything I have.' 'I now legally have the permission and the right to fully take care of you.'

This isn't essential to Sky. He already has Prapai by his side, which is plenty as far as he's concerned. He doesn't need or desire anything else. But Prapai wants to. Because Prapai is thinking about the future - their future. He is always anticipating what Sky needs or may need before Sky does for himself. Sky's perspective has always been 'you've done enough, this is enough', whereas Prapai's perspective is 'what else can I do?' At first Prapai was just trying to ensure Sky's basic needs were met and now that he's achieved that, what's next? All of this is an attempt to safeguard the person he loves and their future together. It's the devotion in such an act, the restless pursuit of such a cause that means so very much to Sky. Because he knows (as do we) - that Prapai would do anything for him.

And that - that is what we call marriage material folks.

[desertfangs]

I’ve been thinking about Armand/Daniel a lot lately (as one does) and yes the whole thing is incredible but for some reason I can’t get this line out of my head: “In the midst of life they plunged”, and how perfectly it encapsulates their entire relationship. Like the IMPLICATIONS of it. Armand hadn’t actually had a life, perhaps only a semblance of it, in over 300 years, and this mortal boy gave it to him and offered him a shot at an actual existence. Full of experiences, adventures, discoveries, opportunities, romance, fighting, crying, LIVING. The highest of highs and the lowest of lows. Daniel giving Armand the opportunity to have a life and to reclaim his youth will never not make me feral ❤️‍🩹

Anon! It's like you're inside my head, because I, too, think about them all the time. That line though is really awesome and it does encapsulate their relationship so well. You're so right about this and you should say it.

Like, if you think about it, it's exactly true that Armand hasn't had much of a life for a long time. He spent decades with Louis, living in a shared misery. And while I fully believe they had tender moments during that period, I think it was few and far between. Armand wanted Louis to be his guide to the modern era, but Louis was too lost in his grief and pain and numbness to be that for him. When that finally ends, he spends the next decades watching over a sleeping Lestat, keeping the city free of "vermin" to protect him like a guardian who wasn't asked for.

And basically seems to be his life when Daniel crashes into Lestat's house and starts playing those tapes. He's just chilling in New Orleans, watching over the dirt where Lestat is buried, as life moves around him.

The Chase gives Armand something else to do, to focus on. He follows this young reporter boy around tormenting him and teasing him and in the process, he starts to delve into the modern era, learning about things Daniel does and places he goes and even his means of travel - accosting him on a train, in a taxi. He bails him out of jail. He orders dinner for him at a restaurant in the most unhinged way possible, but it's also the sort of thing you might do if you just want to push some of the limits around you.

And then they come together as a couple, finally, and then into the very midst of life they plunge! Armand finally has someone who will do all the things with him: parties, shows, concerts, museums, travel. Daniel has been patiently (and not so patiently) teaching him about the modern world for years already, so now they really dive in. And as you point out, they also plunge head first into a relationship, living together, existing together as a couple and figuring out what that means, and everything that entails, good and bad.

It really is Armand getting a second chance at his youth and his first opportunity in centuries to just be a guy and experience the world on the arm of this beautiful, curious, sardonic boy who loves him for what he is and who he is and is passionate and gentle, even as he can be defiant and argumentative.

It makes me feral, too. Like it's just so good. Daniel gives him the world and the love he deserves, and in the end, Armand gives him forever. And I just... love them so, so much. 😭😭💖

Thank you so much for this ask!

[born-for-eachother]

Can we talk about how much Inuyasha was just staring at Kagome during this arc?

He was staring at her for a solid 5 seconds here for instance, and paid attention to the incoming threat a little too late

And just scrutinizing her here

And here

He probably was trying to figure her out and once he realized she has more guts than he first initially thought, that’s when he gave her the haori. That’s also when he feigned indifference and wasn’t facing her after that.

They look so awkward in this shot here lmao but I loved how Kagome thanked him so softly and Inuyasha of course wasn’t facing her still cuz he woulda been so shy 😅