#messianic Judaism

[hailruth]

Hello! I came across this blog while looking at menorahs and wanted to ask why Messianic Judaism/Messianic Jews are disliked. I used to be part of the Messianic Jewish circle but escaped as of a couple of months ago as it didn’t seem to correct preserve history and was using the Bible for fetishizing extreme punishment (like the Hebrew Roots/Hebrew Israelite movements). I understand they wanted to preserve historical traditions but something still felt very off and predatory about it. What are the red flags one should look out for when this group tries to indoctrinate someone?

disclaimer: i'm writing this on mobile so there's a high chance of spelling/grammar mistakes. look back for any future edits or comments with resource or corrections. tumblr kept deleting some very important paragraphs and i'm too frustrated to make this a very polished post.

okay, first things first: messianic judaism never has been and never will be jewish. they are not accepted by any jewish denominations and the christian consensus is that they are christian. institutions such as the u.s. military (where messianic "jewish" chaplains have to wear the insignia of the cross meant for christian chaplains and not the ten commandments for jewish chaplains) and the supreme court of israel agree that they are christian. judaism is not just a religion, it is an ethnicity and a tribe. the majority of messianics have no connection to judaism in the slightest. people who have converted to actual judaism have gone through a lengthy process of assimilation into this ethnicity. their language, calendar (and very conception of time), diet, clothing, body, community, family, etc. is changed forever once they convert. you can't just decide to be jewish, as messianics have done. the fact that some messianic "jews" are ethnically jewish is incidental and means nothing for the jewishness of the religion.

i was so thankful when this post came out about a year ago because it condenses the main points i've been making for a while: "messianic christian red flags" (by jewitches on instagram). it has a list of things to look out for which can help you spot messianic "judaism" masquerading as actual judaism. but i will still explain my arguments in this post. i also recommend jews for judaism.

however, there's still some points i want to outline in this post. most importantly: the goal of messianic "judaism" is not to preserve any kind of history, but to target jews for conversion to christianity. there are claims that it grew out of a movement of jews who converted to christianity but kept onto some jewish practices (which would make them apostates). but this is absolutely not what the movement is, it's very clear that it actually came to be in order to eradicate judaism (by converting all jews to christianity). as the post i linked above points out, two good examples are that the board of missions to the jews became chosen people ministries and the hebrew christian alliance of america became the messianic jewish alliance of america. these were christian orgs whose entire purpose was to target jews for christian conversion, who rebranded to messianic orgs because the function of messianic judaism is to convert jews.

the messianic movement and organizations target jews via extremely deceptive and predatory tactics. the biggest issue that every jew faces when trying to google anything about judaism (which is often the case for jews who already don't know much about their religion and don't have a community with a rabbi to go to) is messianic sources doing their absolute best to look jewish. often times, you have to scour a site providing "information" on jewish holidays, traditions, etc. until you finally encounter something about "yeshua." the post linked above is very helpful for avoiding these sites. this isn't just a digital phenomenon. messianic churches are often disguised as synagogues and mark themselves as such on sites like google maps (i know there have been initiatives to get their labeling changed to that of churches on these sites). there are countless examples of these churches pretending to be synagogues in order to lure in and hopefully convert jews who do not know better.

messianics constantly pretend to be real jews in order to infiltrate jewish communities. i don't have to explain how weird it is to pretend to be of a certain ethnicity in order to force your way into their rituals and lives. this ties into the entire fake synagogue issue from the previous paragraph, but extends far further than that. a few years ago, for example, a jewish politician invited who she thought was a rabbi to pray at an event. this "rabbi" ended up being a messianic. jews across the country were, of course, deeply disturbed by this and it was condemned. messianics aren't stupid, they know what we think and what they are doing, this is an intentional action. there are countless examples of this and it is never anything but vile.

if you want to pretend that judaism is this perfect precursor to jesus whose entire function was to predict his arrival, you're going to have to smash it to unrecognizable bits in order to build anything that'll support such a cause. it's never going to work. many core beliefs of christianity are antithetical to judaism, making the two fundamentally incompatible and different religions. saying otherwise is ahistorical and disrespectful to the thousands of years of separate cultural development of these two religions.

i haven't proofread this and refuse to do so at the moment, but i don't want to keep you waiting on a response. i hope this can help you understand why jews are very much not fans of messianics. if you have any further questions/something isn't clear, feel free to ask whenever.

[askjumblr]

I was raised as a "messianic jew" as ive gotten older i have realized the, uh issues to say the least, of that community, I would like to connenct with the jewish heritage I have in a better way, my question is if there are any tips or advice for this as i am quite aware of the difference but not the details of things like how jews pray or connect with G-d (? Should i do that??)

.

[redditantisemitism]

Here’s an interesting one-is this antisemitism? I think so. Let’s discuss:

First, the context. This comment was left on a post containing this meme, poking fun at the messianic “Jews” (they aren’t Jewish) and antisemitic Christians that appropriate Pesach.

Now. This person does make a few correct statements, and I’ll give them credit. They’re right that a lot of Christians and Christianity are antisemitic. But with that out of the way, let’s look at the myriad of ways they’re so very wrong:

I'm not going to pretend to know a lot about Passover

User admits that they are not qualified to be making judgements. As a Christian it isn't their place to tone police Jews anyways, but especially since they admit that they have no idea what they're talking about.

I would refrain from throwing all Christians under the bus

I'm sure they would. That isn't what is happening though, and framing it like this highlights their defensiveness- they aren't trying to have a productive conversation, they just don't like seeing Christianity being portrayed this way. Playing the victim, and not for the last time.

The Catholic church has largely been the main culprit here

Interestingly, there is a Catholic elsewhere in the thread blaming the Protestants. Typical Protestant vs. Catholic stuff, and this user is using it to attempt to distance themself from the "bad" Christians. Also, in my experience, almost every Christian "seder" I've seen or heard of has been held by a Protestant sect of some sort.

it's important to know that all the while the persecution was happening to jews by christians, there have been other christians speaking out against it.

More of the same, see above. "not all Christians!"

Please don't forget about the Christians who are willing to lay down their lives for the Jewish people.

Here's where the fetishization starts. Also, literally nobody asked you to do that, don't use us to feed your martyr complex. Also also, where exactly are these Christians, because they've been doing a shitty job.

Christians like myself are perfectly capable of seeing Yeshua in the Passover without changing it, or preaching to you up and down about it.

And this is where the explicit antisemitism starts, as opposed to the red flags we've been seeing. This person, based on their language, seems to be some sort of "Torah believing Christian"- something inherently appropriative and antisemitic.

Furthermore, YOU SHOULD NOT BE SEEING JESUS IN PASSOVER. That is, at best, idiotic, and at worst, actively antisemitic. It's certainly supercessionist. JEWISH TEXTS DO NOT PROPHESIZE JESUS. Christians should not be touching Pesach uninvited in ANY way, regardless of if they change things or not.

Yeshua didn't change it and neither should we

This person demonstrates an astounding level of ignorance. Any modern Seder would HAVE to be different than any Seder Jesus might have held (assuming he even existed), because it is impossible to do it like him. There is no temple to offer animal sacrifices at, like there would have been at the time. Regardless, not only should Christians not be changing seders, they shouldn't be touching it.

They then rant for a while about how Easter is bad. Which. My dude. That's your holiday. Go fuck around with that and leave Jews alone.

Please have patience and a soft heart for Christians who believe that:

More "not all Christians", this time with an added level of playing the victim. Hard pass.

-Jews don't need to be converted

Even stopped clocks are right twice a day.

-Christians have the holidays and events wrong

Uh? No? Is this some weird Christian intracommunity thing? Your holidays are your holidays, leave ours alone.

-the dietary laws were upheld by yeshua

Regardless of if this is true or not, Jesus was Jewish. This poster isn't. Kosher is for Jews. Christians aren't entitled to Jewish practice just because they worship a Jew.

-all of the torah was upheld by yeshua

see previous bullet point.

-the Jews are the chosen people of God

Typical Christian misunderstanding of "Chosen". "Chosen" to uphold the mitzvot, not to be better, or put on a pedestal. This is another example of how they fetishize Jews, and it does not get better.

-the Jews come first

See previous bullet point. Fetishization like this is disgusting and harmful. It removes humanity and personhood from Jews, instead presenting us as some mystical object of worship that we never claimed to be and can never live up to. We are not a zoo exhibit, we are a vibrant and living culture.

-salvation is of the Jews

See previous bullet point. We are people, not a tool for your salvation.

-the Jews have been entrusted with the words of Yah*weh

See previous bullet point. Also super disrespectful to just throw that name around in Jewish spaces, but I don't know what I expected from an antisemitic, philosemitic Jew fetishist.

-we should be suffering with the Jews, not against them

WE ARE NOT FUEL FOR YOUR MARTYR COMPLEX. Plenty of Jewish suffering would be alleviated if Christians like this person would just leave us alone. But they don't actually want Jewish suffering to stop, because then they'd lose a tool and a way to play victim.

they end with a plea not to lump all Christians together with the "bad" ones- something literally nobody was doing. Once again, it's a lot of "Not all Christians!!!" and their own self-victimhood. They say not all Christians are "like that", which is true. But this one certainly is.

Chag Pesach sameach everybody, and stay off the fuss bus.

[thewayofyehoshua]

Shabbat Shalom my friends.

The holiness of Shabbat emerges as the shackles of daily life and the hurriedness of the workweek are set aside for a day. In loving care, YHVH provides Shabbat as a weekly time of restoration between humanity and their Creator.

[creature-wizard]

TMW somebody's like "I know all about Judaism because my father was a Messianic Jew!"

...No.

If you knew the first thing about Judaism you'd know that the Messianic movement is just Evangelical Christianity appropriating Jewish culture.

What you are is an antisemitic ignoramus.

[manydeer]

My favorite song. Heard this live in 2010 at the Dylan concert when my son was a precious, adorable, fat little baby. Thanks Bobby we love you 💕🌈🌎

[bonyassfish]

“Messianic” Jews aren’t actually Jews. Occasionally they’ll manage to bring in an actually Jewish person into their cult, but in form and practice it is a Christian organization, with Christian values and Christian beliefs, and it’s actually a little insulting that they think so little of our culture and beliefs that they assume we’ll be stupid/pliant enough to just take up Christianity if they throw in little pieces of Judaism here and there

[rw7771]

NKJV Audio Bible - 24/7 Live

[tuviapollack]

Jerusalem, part 1 - the Old Testament

I love standing in front of cool places and talk about them. So since I live in Jerusalem, the coolest place on earth, why not do that at home, right? This is part 1 of 3.

[bryttworld]

[msguidedangelann]

Charles Spurgeon Desires Towards GOD: A Sermon for the Weak AMEN-AMEIN SELAH!!

Charles Spurgeon was a GREAT CHRISTIAN PREACHER Charles Spurgeon was a GREAT CHRISTIAN PREACHER Charles Spurgeon was a GREAT CHRISTIAN PREACHER ( Matthew 6:9-13 KJV ) “After this manner therefore Pray ye: Our FATHER which art in Heaven, Hallowed be thy Name. Thy Kingdom Come. Thy Will be done in Earth, as it is in Heaven. Give us this Day our Daily Bread. And Forgive us our debts, as we…

[immaculatasknight]

Weaponized obfuscation

[thewayofyehoshua]

Shabbat Shalom! To His people of the "WAY".

[mosho347]

Click the link to check out the music vid & sample of the main single from the upcoming album HINENI: L'Y"H (pronounced "Hee-neh-nee: Leh-YA"), Here I Am: Unto Y-h (spelled in English as 'Y, A, H,' a transliteration of the Hebrew hyphenation of the Tetragrammaton, G-d's name... This description's kinda long, huh). I tried uploading the original video, but tumblr won't let me.

I shot this music video while I was homeless lol, in two separate locations; my aunt's house in Denton, & my sister's apartment in Dallas, both in Texas. I used only my phone's camera & a flashlight; it was fun if nothing else. Album coming soon.

https://youtu.be/GIt6PfkBCjc

[theexodvs]

The notion that the continued presence of Anglicized names of Biblical figures into English translations of the Bible is driven primarily by conservative politics not only plays into the (discredited and arguably racist) Sapir-Whorf hypothesis, but is easily disproven by Messianic Jewish translation which re-Hebraicize the names and are used by primarily by political conservatives.

[weemietime]

👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

Say it and say it and say it again. No notes, Amein.

Hello! I came across this blog while looking at menorahs and wanted to ask why Messianic Judaism/Messianic Jews are disliked. I used to be part of the Messianic Jewish circle but escaped as of a couple of months ago as it didn’t seem to correct preserve history and was using the Bible for fetishizing extreme punishment (like the Hebrew Roots/Hebrew Israelite movements). I understand they wanted to preserve historical traditions but something still felt very off and predatory about it. What are the red flags one should look out for when this group tries to indoctrinate someone?

disclaimer: i'm writing this on mobile so there's a high chance of spelling/grammar mistakes. look back for any future edits or comments with resource or corrections. tumblr kept deleting some very important paragraphs and i'm too frustrated to make this a very polished post.

okay, first things first: messianic judaism never has been and never will be jewish. they are not accepted by any jewish denominations and the christian consensus is that they are christian. institutions such as the u.s. military (where messianic "jewish" chaplains have to wear the insignia of the cross meant for christian chaplains and not the ten commandments for jewish chaplains) and the supreme court of israel agree that they are christian. judaism is not just a religion, it is an ethnicity and a tribe. the majority of messianics have no connection to judaism in the slightest. people who have converted to actual judaism have gone through a lengthy process of assimilation into this ethnicity. their language, calendar (and very conception of time), diet, clothing, body, community, family, etc. is changed forever once they convert. you can't just decide to be jewish, as messianics have done. the fact that some messianic "jews" are ethnically jewish is incidental and means nothing for the jewishness of the religion.

i was so thankful when this post came out about a year ago because it condenses the main points i've been making for a while: "messianic christian red flags" (by jewitches on instagram). it has a list of things to look out for which can help you spot messianic "judaism" masquerading as actual judaism. but i will still explain my arguments in this post. i also recommend jews for judaism.

however, there's still some points i want to outline in this post. most importantly: the goal of messianic "judaism" is not to preserve any kind of history, but to target jews for conversion to christianity. there are claims that it grew out of a movement of jews who converted to christianity but kept onto some jewish practices (which would make them apostates). but this is absolutely not what the movement is, it's very clear that it actually came to be in order to eradicate judaism (by converting all jews to christianity). as the post i linked above points out, two good examples are that the board of missions to the jews became chosen people ministries and the hebrew christian alliance of america became the messianic jewish alliance of america. these were christian orgs whose entire purpose was to target jews for christian conversion, who rebranded to messianic orgs because the function of messianic judaism is to convert jews.

the messianic movement and organizations target jews via extremely deceptive and predatory tactics. the biggest issue that every jew faces when trying to google anything about judaism (which is often the case for jews who already don't know much about their religion and don't have a community with a rabbi to go to) is messianic sources doing their absolute best to look jewish. often times, you have to scour a site providing "information" on jewish holidays, traditions, etc. until you finally encounter something about "yeshua." the post linked above is very helpful for avoiding these sites. this isn't just a digital phenomenon. messianic churches are often disguised as synagogues and mark themselves as such on sites like google maps (i know there have been initiatives to get their labeling changed to that of churches on these sites). there are countless examples of these churches pretending to be synagogues in order to lure in and hopefully convert jews who do not know better.

messianics constantly pretend to be real jews in order to infiltrate jewish communities. i don't have to explain how weird it is to pretend to be of a certain ethnicity in order to force your way into their rituals and lives. this ties into the entire fake synagogue issue from the previous paragraph, but extends far further than that. a few years ago, for example, a jewish politician invited who she thought was a rabbi to pray at an event. this "rabbi" ended up being a messianic. jews across the country were, of course, deeply disturbed by this and it was condemned. messianics aren't stupid, they know what we think and what they are doing, this is an intentional action. there are countless examples of this and it is never anything but vile.

if you want to pretend that judaism is this perfect precursor to jesus whose entire function was to predict his arrival, you're going to have to smash it to unrecognizable bits in order to build anything that'll support such a cause. it's never going to work. many core beliefs of christianity are antithetical to judaism, making the two fundamentally incompatible and different religions. saying otherwise is ahistorical and disrespectful to the thousands of years of separate cultural development of these two religions.

i haven't proofread this and refuse to do so at the moment, but i don't want to keep you waiting on a response. i hope this can help you understand why jews are very much not fans of messianics. if you have any further questions/something isn't clear, feel free to ask whenever.