#lily orchard is not a leftist

[opinated-user]

LO does not understand what puritanism is

LO, you literally never heard a thing when people talk about stuff like code dresses in school that shames afab people for showing too much skin that "distracts classmates and the faculty"? never heard about the obsession that american society has with violence, but sex is a step too far and how that correlates with it's continuous degradation of queer people and kinky people?

never heard about the stigma that women/afab people face when they do dare to be sexual and open about it? never heard about the backlash that every woman/afab pop artist had to go through when they went through that? Britney Spears, Miley Cyrus, Nicki Minaj, just to give some easy examples that most people can recognize, even someone with such a media defiency as you. this isn't only about just gender either. when Lil Nas came out as gay and with the album Montero, suddenly his video Call Me By Your Name was too explicit and horrific, kids couldn't watch it, even though he had sang about sex before and nobody cared back then. why do you even think that conservatives keep insisting that kids are too young to know about queer people existing, that they want to make it illegal to even mention queerness in classroom, since they keep insisting that queer people are inherently sexualized? it is homophobia, for sure, but did you really never bothered to think for one second from where exactly that specific kind of homophobia come from? that kind of homophobia that says "this is too sexual, kids are going to be harmed by it", rather than the kind that just says you'll go to hell for being queer? i'm... these are the basic kind of conversation in leftist/femenist spaces. basic ones. the most surfice level white feminist Karen knows this, are aware it's a thing.

a movement called "the puritans" doesn't exist anymore as such, but if you honestly believe that they didn't have any influence in the current state of society then that, to me, it speaks volumes of how incredibly little work you have actually done to try to think about... well, anything critically. nothing outside of cartoons meant for children. puritanism is on the dress codes of schools today, it's on the current homophobia and transphobia that is making laws right now, it's on the book banning that are happening right now, it's on the knee-jerk reaction of the public when women aren't perfect, something you did talked about but obviously never thought too profound about because it was only about the women you fantasize about. people see it on you when you insist that sex scenes can never have any thematical or artistic value, only because you have never written one that wasn't purely for your own sexual pleasure. that's why they call you puritanical, LO, not because you're part of a specific movement like the Illuminati. i know you're lying when you say you don't enjoy porn and are only there for the romance. i know you're lying, because only someone that is way too familiar with pornographic material would be so bold to put Rapelay and a game about touching underaged characters, that doesn't even have an official English translation, on a video about SVTFOE. where do you think "purity culture", something that people that scaped oppressive religious environment talk about, comes from? are you going to go to those people, who often carry religious trauma, and tell them that what they went through wasn't real or should they look another name because you don't even understand what it is? you insist so much about people refusing to watch SU critically, but then you go and basically admit that have never looked at anything critically outside of your own nose. i guess i shouldn't be surprised by the woman who honestly thought was Cherokee because her mom told her, and never even knew her grandfather was from a completely different Nation, but color me surprised anyway.

i almost forgot: LO is still talking about the game with canon incest while still being accused of molesting her younger sister. i can't unsee this as intentional cruelty and deflection at the same time.

[spot-the-antisemitism]

got an interesting one for you.

https://www.tumblr.com/autistic-ben-tennyson/757093323039260672/some-beef-i-have-with-jedi-stans

multiple posts about this, i couldn’t even read all of them i got so bored of the regurgitation

hates Jews, asians, asexuals and anyone who likes the Jedi, likes fictional fascists and their blorbos, talks forever makes no point

This person either is part of the Lily Orchard cult of personality or her sockpuppet because both the views and the language fits hers to a T

[transpersian]

Zena and Poppy: Abusive Hypocrites - Master Post

For legal purposes, all testimonies and commentary on this page or any of the documents linked from it are allegations. The screenshots, however, are evidence. Any edits will be very obvious and for the purpose of respecting confidentiality. (click here to skip to the Hub Doc)

~~~~~~~~~~

Hi there! I'm Milena, Poppy Diabolique's "psychotic ex" and the alleged head of what she dubbed her "League of Evil Exes." While we're more of a co-op, that doesn't have the same ring to it as "League," does it?

This is mostly to track my own I'll be updating this post with additional content as it's published, so please check back to my page for the most up-to-date version, which I'll leave pinned.

Please be sure to also check out @poppyandzena's page (not actually run by Poppy and Zena), as they've been diligently collecting and cataloguing evidence and other testimonies for months.

Please take your time reading through these. It's emotionally difficult content and there's a lot of it, so please prioritize taking care of yourself. It gets worse than you think and I've put plenty of headers in these so it's easy to find your place again.

Feel free to reach out with any asks. Barring confidentiality agreements, I'm an open book.

Also, I've got a searchable index of everything they've ever said on stream. Tell me what you're looking for; I'll let you know where it pops up (with timestamps!) and potentially maybe telling you where to find the video itself.

~~~~~~~~~~

The Documentation

To save space here, I've moved the list of documents and their descriptions to the Abusive Hypocrites Hub Doc. If you're new to this and want to get right into the big stuff, start with Abusive Hypocrites 2.

My goal with these posts and documents is to provide as much context and evidence as possible, so please remember to take care of yourself if you need to and take a break. It's a wild ride full of deeply upsetting behavior. All of the abuse-related CWs, short of flat-out physical violence.

Please also check out @poppyandzena for more testimonies linked in their pinned. There are a lot.

Other significant posts:

Deep Cover - How I navigated going undercover with Poppy for over two and a half months.

Doc 3 is about PZ's kid - My initial announcement that I was in touch with Spawn and that I was planning on releasing a doc for them. The catalyst for Poppy reaching back out to me in January.

Zena's PMDD does not excuse their behavior

Why are you doing this?

@zenaandpoppyonyoutube are an engaged pair of content creators who have positioned themselves and their community as a safe place for neurodivergent, traumatized, emotionally vulnerable, and queer people, including specifically being a safe place for Lily Orchard's victims and fans to escape to. Poppy is a professional licensed therapist. Zena is... there.

Unfortunately, while they say some of the right things, what they do is a completely different matter.

If you're here, you want to know more.

The goal of our documentation and callout campaign is twofold:

to protect online communities from them

to provide a space for other survivors of their abuse to feel understood and heard

Why are you waging a hate campaign against a fellow trans woman?

Because this is not a hate campaign; it's a callout of PZ's patterns of harmful and dangerous behavior. It tends to start small and then turn into something genuinely horrifying. Nobody who treats people the way that they do in private should be in any position to tell anyone what's best for their mental health, much less be regarded as authorities, role models, and community leaders.

Poppy is charismatic, quick on her feet with responses, and weirdly mean-spirited sometimes; somewhat of a perfect combination for the leftist political space. Even now, I know people with friends on their server who've said that those friends have been slowly getting more bitter, judgmental, and cruel.

Despite their channel numbers falling, they still have the potential to gain some real momentum if they recover, and PZ aren't just abusers; I firmly believe that they're a toxic influence that will spread their genuinely harmful ideas about how relationships and boundaries work, particularly to younger people.

If they're not going to recognize, acknowledge, or change the ways in which they have, do, and will hurt people, we need to make sure people know to stay away from them and why.

~~~~~~~~~~

Why are you still doing this? Don't you think you've done enough?

At this point, our evidence has spoken for itself and literally over a million people are aware of the situation, but for one, these need to stay up for posterity. They need to be available as a resource for people looking to find out more about Poppy and Zena.

But beyond that, it's not over. Not by a long shot.

Since our last major doc drop in March, things have only expanded and escalated. We are currently pursuing litigation because their group's crimes now include doxxing my legal name, photo, and place of work, along with months of harassment smearing the names of other trans women for daring to not giving in to their emotional demands (including what has now inextricably linked one of them to the false accusation of "rapist" when you search her legal name).

On top of that, more victims are still coming to us. We need to make sure that they have a place to go.

PZ are not going to get better. We've tried. They don't even see the problem with their behavior in the first place.

And if they don't stop, we don't stop.

[salsaseth]

After hearing my friend, James bring it up in a call, we started watching Lily Orchard's video about Pokemon to see all the bad takes in it.

When she starts playing the DS games, she uses a mod to smooth out the aliasing and uncap the game's framerate to 60. And gah damn does it look fuckin bad. Even worse is during the 3D games where she uses another mod to smooth out the 3D models and it looks like peeled oranges. Unnaturally smooth. But it does get funny when she talks about the game running like garbage when she's fucked with the game's logic. Like no shit, it's running at a framerate it was never meant for.

Something really funny also begins in the DS games. I don't know why, but she replaces one of the starters with Ralts, cuz she's got some favoritism for Gardevoir. All well and good, but you know, Ralts is weak as shit until it learns confusion and it's still frail. So it gets its ass kicked all the way until it evolves into Gardevoir. But because of how much asskicking it receives, and I swear this is true, she suspects the game is artificially raising the strength of the enemy pokemon, as a way to explain for why's she losing.

Almost as if the game is designed to use a stronger than average pokemon to get you through the early game. ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) Still, I don't fully understand why she refuses to use the regular starters. Especially when you can catch Ralts and Kirlia for most of the games. save for black and white. Speaking of.

One takeaway I've had from listening to it is what she says is more revealing about herself than what is intentional. The most telling thing is when she's going off about the Black and White characters for speaking about their ideals and opinions. I mean, she mashes through that with the A button (VISUAL NOVEL HATER SPOTTED), so it's when she's paying attention. I don't know if she just doesn't know what the game is supposed to be going for, or if she's just purposefully ignorant for the sake of contrarianism, but the game's themes are about truth and ideals. The truth is out there, but the ideals we have shape our perspective of the truth. Even Cheren, who represents the truth, is still shaped his ideal. It's a little more deeper than, 'Characters excited that they all have opinions,' but what do i know?

She rails against these characters, N in particular for having opinions and speaking them out. Meanwhile in X&Y, which its cast and characters are there to mostly stroke the character's dick, she vastly praises and prefers these characters to the ones in B&W. Hmmm. Characters that have opinions and speak them out are hated, while those that don't and heap praise on her are loved. I wonder if this says anything about her?

The video gets pretty boring the longer it goes on. The hot take well starts drying up and it quickly becomes a bad screenshot let's play. "Then I did this, and then I did that!"

That's all I got to report. Besides the shoehorning in of lefty takes. I don't know if it's because she's not funny or if she wields everything with as much subtlety as anvil-nunchuks, but when there's an opportunity to make a joke with a leftist-slant, it's as heavy handed as a Titan's ballsack and as funny as stale bread. I'm a leftist bastard myself, but every time the jokes were shoehorned in, I'm like, "The funny? Where is it?!" Especially when it was about Looker and Nanu. I get not liking the police, but this isn't the time or place for it. Leave the jokes to the professionals. Like my friend Plate. Several unemployment jokes were made at Lily's expense, and each one was funnier than the last.

I'll report back if there's anything worth commenting on. Me and the friends got to the end of Sun and Moon, so we have SwSh and SV left.

And if you had time to read this 'post', Lily, I think you had time to 'post' your resume to get a job ;D ;D ;D

[foxgirltail]

Who is Lily orchard

I probably don't have complete information on this (because when I asked this a few weeks ago nobody responded and various searches I tried were not terribly enlightening) but my understanding was she's a pseudo-leftist YouTuber not unlike contrapoints

Also she was rude to someone I follow not too long ago (which is what spurred my initial search)

[britts-galaxy-brain]

you are a dirty right winger and i hope your parents die soon, someone like lily orchard actually has class while you are just someone who wants to kill gays and queers. You gonna vote for trump soon rightwinger?

Well this is certainly a take from someone who hasn't taken 5 minutes to look at my blog at all.

I'm a queer lesbian leftist. Lily is an incestuous sexual predator who has admitted to me directly and admitted indirectly in public on numerous occasions that she's a pedophile and a zoophile (see my pinned for archived evidence).

I'm sorry you're having to find out this way.

[sjbattleangel]

Lily and her lying

   Ever since that terrible “Steven Universe is garbage, and here’s why” video, Lily Orchard has constantly accused “Steven Universe”-a wonderfully LGTBQ+ positive series about loving others and loving yourself-of being “crypto-fascist propaganda” all because it didn’t reach her nigh-impossible standards of perfectionism. She was also enraged that Steven-instead of fighting the Diamonds in a Luke-vs-Vader-style showdown-stood up to the Diamonds whilst holding them responsible for their wrongdoings. So no, Steven did not “forgive the Diamonds” nor “hug it out with them.”    Throughout the video, Lily is purposely dishonest: By exaggerating SU’s weaker parts to outright lying about certain points via misinformation and manipulative editing, she aims to make SU look as objectively horrible as possible. All driven by her own personal, grudge against Rebecca Sugar.

Yes. Lily hates Rebecca Sugar as a person. Hang on, didn’t Lily say things like these?:

Lily is lying through her teeth as we can see here in a few little screenshots I caught flying around online:

Here, she contradicts herself, showing her true feelings: Lily believes Rebecca Sugar-a progressive, leftist, non-binary, bisexual Jewish woman, directly related to an actual holocaust survivor-is a Nazi-sympathizing, fascist, white supremacist.

Best case scenario: Lily has severe apophenia and sees Nazis and Nazi-apologia where they don’t exist. (Such as “Steven Universe”)  Worst case scenario: Lily Orchard really is a vile, vindictive antisemite. 

[opinated-user]

https://www.tumblr.com/lily-orchard/743326173992452096/furiousgoldfish-how-to-spot-a-smear-campaign

LO try not to villainise her victims challenge (impossible)

what a fun little game! can i play?

How to spot a smear campaign: Victims’s “crimes” will be enlarged, and even if they’re small missteps, they will be treated as if only the worst person on the planet would do such a thing

(like when Lizzy "made" LO to kick a bowl of soup into her lap by completely accident and that was turned into Lizzy somehow being abusive when she cried about it later? like when Courtney having common behavioral symptons for children who suffered CSA got turned into him being a "child molester"? like how he became a murderer in LO's posts for defending himself from a woman who attacked him? how about that time that LO bragged about beating Courtney 15 times in the stomach, because that is something she thinks is worth bragging about, got turned into Courtney threatening with a meatl tenderizer?)

Accusations against the victim will always be a reach, aka, they did ‘this little thing’ but it actually means they’re a racist/murderer/genocide supporter/fascist/have blood on their hands, even when the person’s actions never conformed to those crimes

(oh, like when LO called EssenceOfThought, a leftist transfemme, a terf for months because she dared to make video calling her out? like when she implied that P must be lying about her being a therapist and how it was "ominous" that she had a child, before anyone had any reason at all to suspect she was anything but a normal parent? like when she calls us hypocrites, supporter of child molesters and murderers of babies? like when she calls anyone who disagrees with her nazis? oh, do you remember too when LO spend hours arguing with an anon that was racist and transphobic only to treated them as if they were Lizzy? i do.)

All and any actions of the victims will be misenterpreted in the worst possible way, anything the person does will be taken as an offense and intentions will be read as hostile and manipulative, regardless of how clear they are

(like how Courtney not showing receipts for cat food means that he's scamming the people who donated to his kofi? something that is totally comparable to dishonestly using the 2000+ USD donated to you in order to buy a desk and then lied about when you had that event to pretend that desk was before it, of course. or do you mean like how he was talking about how, as a grown adult, he reasoned that your stories about being molested as a child are probably true got turned into "6 year old Courtney knew i was being abused and did nothing to stop it, she's to blame for everything that happened to both of us"? like how Brittany and other expressed concerned over you publishing the pictures of the health hazard your wife is still leaving in, but you turned all of that into them somehow blaming MO for it? like how you keep projecting that we're scared of you just because we abreviate your name?)

All victim’s actions will be taken out of context; ie, victim said something cruel to someone, but they take out the context of the victim being abused, threatened, tortured, forced into defense mode and finally attacking out of desperation to defend themselves and get free

(oh, just like Brittany having issue with her roomates and venting about it on her blog like any normal person would, got turned into somehow she not knowing how to deal with people! or do you mean like how you claim now that Brittany got a restriction order by her ex and almost drove her over with a car, completely ignoring that the first is a total made up lie and the second was completely taken out of context? or maybe how LO used for months one single phrase that Lizzy said with no context as her evidence that she was an abuser all along? or do you mean how Courtney totally threatened your life, but you left out the part in which your incest grooming of him had bothered him enough to react violently with the hope that maybe you could stop talking about how much you want to date your sister in front of third parties.)

The victim will commonly get provoked into giving a bad reaction, (anyone gets defensive if they’re accused of the crimes they never did, or simply triggering insults until they snap), and the reaction will become the new ‘proof’ that the victim is in fact, evil and guilty

(remember when Courtney had a violent reaction upon finding out that one of his abuser had a platform and responded by being transphobic? it doesn't matter that Courtney is out there defending the identity of LO. it doesn't matter that Courtney admits that was wrong of him and should have never done that. it doesn't matter that he has never misgendered LO once. it matters that she did it once and therefore he'll always be transphobic, and anyone who support him is transphobic, and clearly there's no other reason to dislike LO if isn't transphobia! or do you mean when you used all the mental issues and struggles of Patch against him as a reason why nobody should listen to him, especially not about the financial abuse you submitted him to?)

A lot of pressure will be put on you to react ‘correctly’ to the smear campaign; if you don’t accept to demonize this person at once, you’re getting scrutinized, shamed for your lack of morality, told that you support all these horrid things and that you are just as despicable

(oh, like how when Lizzy finally spoke up about LO cheating on her multiple times and sexually coercing her into doing things she didn't want, and only then LO pivoted into saying that Lizzy was a sexual abuser and a rapist all along! wait no, this one goes in the first. but anyway, how about everytime Courtney says anything and a minor happens to interact with that post? but it's okay when LO does it, obviously!)

You will notice a trend of people ganging together based on their demonization of the victim; they will set a standard where you’re accepted and welcome if only you also will demonize and hate this person, and if you don’t, you’re blocked, cast out, and accused of causing harm

(oh, right, exactly as LO did to KP the second she started asking questions about Courtney instead of accepting blindly whatever story LO decided to go about it)

It will feel very easy to accept to demonize this person, and going against it will feel risky, like going against the grain, doubting the word of the many and risking being demonized yourself.

(more KP examples insert here)

The smear campaign continues all the way until the victim is chased out of the community and denied a voice, even if the victim commits no further crimes, awful things will be said about them, their past ‘misdeeds’ continually brought up, until the victim is commonly believed to be worthless, and becomes completely isolated, scared of society and alone

(LO literally bringing up Courtney burning her pokemon cards when they were children as proof that Courtney was an abusive monster all along. or how Courtney fighting with her in general as children gets turned into more abuse. but when LO brags about beating the shit out of him, that's not abuse, that's just how children are!)

There will be no limit to what is considered okay to do to the victim of a smear campaign; even if the victim is accused of minor bad behaviour, it will become okay to threaten, insult, shout slurs, trigger, provoke, humiliate, manipulate, and repeat any kind of abusive behaviour to the victim, all because ‘they’re bad so they deserve it’.

(like how LO threatened to release the nudes of Lizzy to the public? like she keeps inventing new and boring insults to call us with? slurs? already done that, but you said that was censored so you, LO, have decided alone that was fine actually. LO has continously lie about things anyone can confirm)

People leading the smear campaign will switch between being ‘extremely grossed out and enraged’ to showing absolute joy and satisfaction when they find a new reason to demonize and smear the victim. People truly horrified of someone’s actions do not get a leap of joy when a new disaster happens, they’re not beside themselves to abuse the perpetrator all over again.

(oh, like when LO was so happy to keep publishing asks with archives of Courtney's old post that demostrated what a monster he was? or maybe like LO admitting that she only uses extremely serious situations about incest in order to spite people who read her blog=)

It will never, ever be acceptable to show any mercy to the victim. Forgiveness is out of the question, trying to understand them is out of the question. Even reading or listening to what this person is saying will be banned and forbidden, unless it’s for humiliating purposes. They will be shown as absolutely irredeemable, and associating yourself with them as evil and unforgivable. You will be instructed to block or unfollow or report the person based on what you’re told, without any significant proof.

(i decide to count here LO outright refusing to ever admit that Courtney went through any kind of abuse, even at the hands of her older brother, something that does actually nothing for her. the brother that, btw, not that long ago was using transphobic insult against her and never apologized for it anyway, but it's evil when only Courtney does it even if he does apologize.)

Do not fall for smear campaigns. If a large amount of people all agree that a person is the worst, but their story is exaggerated, out of context, sounds fictional, and doesn’t show any proof, and the people switch from being enraged to eager, doubt it. Participating in a smear campaign will help the abusers isolate and abuse someone, and you do not want to be a part of it. They will also smear anyone who stands up to their abuse, so you’re helping the abusers to create a place where pointing out abuse gets you cast out of the community.

(what a good article, LO. i'm sure this doesn't apply to you at all! because you have so much evidence and proof for everything you accuse everyone of being or doing, right? you have all the evidence unlike us, don't you? you always provide the entire context and never, ever, misrepresent, lie or forget to mention key details into anything... even if your target is a literal 6 year old child.)

[phantasm-masquerade]

Imagine putting hbomberguy and Lily Orchard(who RIPPED OFF the former) on the same level.

Also it's clear you didn't watch his videos. He didn't even title his RWBY video with "sucks", he called it "disapointing" and his videos are meritorical, especially his most recent work. Dude is an actual leftist and does much more than media analysis, like disproving alt-right rhetoric or misinformation campaigns like flat earth or antivaxx movement.

hbomberguy is not as bad as LO, that's for damn sure, but i included both of them because those kinds of critiques make up the basis of the media critical movement.

[yesmellowcollectionzombie]

Stop with your bullcrap

Why does she have the need to bring in feminist, political and other kinds of bullshit up in her videos constantly? especially that one image of Josh... how much of a grudge does this person carry on people, for no reason other than they have different political views. Like come on, how petty does this individual have to be, for how long? 3-4 years... my god just shut up and move on. Not only that doesn't help that she’s brainwashed her fanbase to be a bunch of white night sheep... feel sorry for them to be honest Hypocritical as well, complaining there aren't enough women in politics... well its the same reason not many women are in mining jobs, more men are more likely to apply for jobs like that compared to women. She also says the internet can wait, yet it’s her job? want to starve and go homeless homelessness or something, because you've made it clear plenty of times youtube, and patron are your forms of income. and no being hypocritical ‘but right’ doesn't count either, your still hypocritical, so change that. On top of that, being a racist, sexist, cisphobic bigot doesn't help your case out either. neither does preaching for likes/dislikes and comments to be switched off either. Just an excuse to get out of criticism, isn't it?

[olderthannetfic]

I feel like Lily Orchard is a good example of what I call the tumblr psuedo-left: against the minimum wage being raised, hates queer rep, against all religion but uninformed regarding anything that's not Christianity, quick to cancel fiction, creators and fans while defending shit like The Big Bang Theory and Family Guy bc she likes them therefore they are woke, anti-breadtube/anti-leftist and of the opinion she's progressive somehow. Conservatism, but with self-delusions of being left leaning.

--

Ugh.

Even breadtube are terrible about picking on "weirdos", but this flavor of fake-progressive is so much worse.

[ephrom]

Lily Orchard and Anti-Oppression

I'm not sure if I'm going to commentate on Orchard's latest video--video essays are the hardest to commentate on--but this video is not only bad, it's dangerous--and it represents one of the signs that somebody is not actually a leftist but just wants to rage against a machine. I'm just going to put all my cards on the table: The biggest issue with Orchard's view on oppression is the same issue people who voted Trump in 2016 to "shake things up" and declared him an "underdog" had. They saw somebody who was fighting against the system and supported him on that basis--never wondering what aspects of the system he was against and why he was against them.

Nobody declares themselves pro-oppression, and this includes actual Nazis and White Nationalists. On The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, one of the most famous pieces of fascist texts (although its embracement by fascists is really just coincidental), argues that the people of the world are being oppressed by a Jewish ruling class that is conspiring against them. The Turner Diaries is a literal underdog story about a group of fascists committing a coup against the American government because they're run by Jews and racial minorities.

It's funny that Orchard insults Vaush as genocidal in this video when this is the attitude he constantly has to fight against, primarily while debating actual geocidal people like Professor Flowers and possibly NonCompete. In truth, people like Orchard are the kind to back genocidal groups because their in opposition to shaky morally imperfect regimes. The only reason I know she's not a tankie is because I've previously seen her call the USSR fascist--which--okay that's wrong but that's a topic for another time.

Hitler told the people of Germany that he was going to free them from the oppressive status quo. Although this does not mean that everyone who makes that claim is Hitler, that does mean that bad people will claim to be good. In real life, nobody will tell you their the bad guys--most people don't consider themselves the bad guys even when they're doing bad things. Being "against oppression" is not an ideology on its own unless you have a coherent and reasonable definition of oppression--which Lily, and I cannot stress this enough, does not.

[britts-galaxy-brain]

Lily Orchard alternative suggestion: Conure

Leftist political streamer/youtuber. He reacts and dissects a lot of right-wing talking heads, and occasionally reacts to Jubilee episodes. He gets heated sometimes but never vitriolic, he's very knowledgeable, and he communicates complex concepts very clearly.

(In case you look him up and get concerned, I promise I'm not misgendering him. He identifies as a femboy.)

[aerithisms]

i mean dudes will 100% see show about a a man manufacturing and selling methamphetamine while abusing his wife and murdering people and think its the coolest thing ever, maybe thats what people have a problem with and not the show itself

i mean i agree that dudes do that and it’s very annoying but that post wasn’t really about that specific discourse surrounding breaking bad, it was using breaking bad as a famous example of a show with a morally corrupt protagonist that gets misinterpreted to talk about how there is now a brand of Online Media Criticism where people will go “well, people are getting the wrong ideas from this show and that’s Bad, so we can’t allow these stories to be told at all because the moral messaging must be kindergarten obvious enough that absolutely everybody gets it.” and these people absolutely DO exist because they’re the kinds of people that will make posts like “don’t consume any of this #problematic media that depicts the characters doing bad things. if the characters do bad things obviously the media is bad and wrong and there can never be circumstances where it’s not bad and wrong.”

similarly there are people (mostly people whose exposure to media criticism is like 99% fandom) who have developed this weird leftist version of the “all sinners must be punished” attitude to fiction because they don’t trust themselves or other audience members to think about the characters’ actions independently. and that attitude just leads to very restrictive, boring parameters for what gets to count as “morally sound fiction”. again people definitely do think like this - just look at lily orchard and the amount of people that think like her.

maybe breaking bad was not a perfect example for op to use because a lot of the misinterpretation of that show gets done by conservative dudes and they seemed to be driving more at discourse like “this story redeemed a character who Did Bad Things, oh the horror” but i think the overall point of the post is still very true

[opinated-user]

Serious question: If you have all the evidence for Lily Orchard being a child groomer, why haven't you brought it forward to the authorities as is your civic duty?

Creating a blog dedicated to how bad a person is on tumblr can only do so much if you have real reason to believe someone has broken the law, and it clearly hasn't helped you press any charges yet.

It's not even like Lily is some rich and powerful person that can escape charges pressed against her: she's some former brony (a community that already had several groomers sent to jail for charges pressed against them) that makes YT vids for a living. Not only that, but she is a transwoman and (respectfully) accusing a trans woman of being a groomer is like accusing a black man of being a rapist, everyone would believe you.

You have all the recipts, but instead of doing something about you just make tumblr posts and it seems like you only do this because you have a vendetta and not because you care about the victims involved.

if you think that all the bad people who did bad things are only those that are currently being investigated or behind bar, i'm sorry to dissapoint you but we don't live on that world. for every brony predator who was imprisioned that you're thinking, there's a ton more that nobody ever talks about even today because they quietly dissapear to continue to live their lives as if nothing had happened. if we count the art commentary community in youtube that number gets even greater. if we expand to YT in general, what about people like Onision, who has been investigated but has never faced any charges? do you think he's innoent because of that? with the same logic that you apply to LO, then he must be or else he'd have been arrested already. his victim then must be lying or exaggerating, and all the video evidence against him was made up. the people who still care about him having a platform, now geared towards children, exaggerating and making a big issue out of nothing because the man is not in prison, therefore he must not have done anything wrong. the truth is this: laws are not perfect and authorities aren't either. people have tried to dennounce LO before and it didn't result on anything because authorities won't do anything until it's too later. cases such as these are for the thousand and pretending they're not there is an actual disservice for everyone. someone that actually talked with the FBI to try to have another predator in jail recently talked about how that other case was also completely dismissed, despite all the relevant evidence being thousands and thousands of pictures. that predator was also part of the brony fandom and he's still free out there. if we're using identities as factors against someone being accused of anything, did you told LO anything when she made vague gross implication when told that Jess, a trans woman who is critical of her in youtube, has a child of her own? did you said anything to LO when she insists that EOT is a "alt right pickme" despite making content that is overwhelmingly leftist or when she openly misgendered EOT only to later justify it with "she deserves it because she acts like a debate bro"? did you defended any of these trans women when LO was the one weaponizing transmisogyny against them or only when anyone calls out how her creepy behaviour can be harmful to vulnerable people? how come her being a trans woman has to be taken into account but people who say this kind of things never defend the trans women she goes up against in front of her? it gives the impression you don't really care about trans women or marginalized people and more so that you only care to defend this one because she may have some opinion about cartoons you agreed with or she managed to convince you that she being a trans woman is all that matter, more than the people that she hurt, some of them trans themselves.

maybe it's time to put those priorities in order.

[briek58454521]

Cancel Culture?...

Okay.

I’ve seen this shit going around for a while. I feel obligated to correct the record.

In the wake of multiple Breadtube users being eviscerated by the public in the last year, I’d like to talk... about “cANceL cULTurE”.

But first, some back-round. I’ll be brief.

Over a year ago, Youtuber Lily Orchard’s video about Steven Universe blew up the internet, invoking praise from many facets of online culture, as well as a sizable backlash, as any video criticizing Steven Universe will invariably do. In an attempt at a response, Breadtuber Sarah Z uploaded a video titled “Bad Media Criticism”, which around 17 minutes in, talked about said video.

The response was filled with, let’s face it, lies and actual bad faith criticisms towards the content, misinformation, omission of context in important bits, and general shoddiness in action (yes, I’m biased. Reality is biased, sometimes). Criticism was swift to arrive, and the video provoked Lily herself to respond. And in the face of the factual corrections, and legitimate criticisms... Sarah doubled down, and in her infamous Twit-Longer, decided to continue to assure herself and others that her criticism was valid because regardless of whatever Lily actually said, it was still bad faith criticism.

A short while after that, fellow Breadtuber Lindsay Ellis uploaded a video discussing Black Ariel, claiming that the decision to make Ariel black was entirely a decision made because of “Woke Branding” to make more money off of people and continue raking in more and more cash, citing HBomberGuy’s “WOKE BRANDS” video essay. Many commented that this was rather racist, considering that Cartoon Network is just as much of a greedy bastard corporation as Disney was, yet, denounced criticism of Steven Universe, a show of Cartoon Network’s body of work, because “support minority voices”, with the same people commenting that this looked rather selective.

Lindsay doubled down on the criticism, and would continue defending it and publicly shitting the bed as more shitstorms (PLURAL) would erupt (lol).

After THAT, Breadtuber CONTRAPOINTS/ NATALIE WYNN would publish many videos that kept pissing of trans and non-binary viewers with a fuck-load of back handed remarks and general derogatory comments about them, as well as getting pissy that people ask for her gender and pronouns in public safe-spaces. In “The Aesthetic”, Natalie had a character playing the role of the people who make the CORRECT claim that gender is eternal and that you are what you say you are, and ANOTHER who was a truscum who would repeat the arguments that “kinda hypothetical” and, “kinda a weak argument”. This would create a backlash, and Natalie would respond with a thread that, contained a lotta shit, but also contained THIS BULLSHIT. Straight from the horses mouth, fam.

“I’m sure this is not the experience of many NBs. I’ll leave it to them to articulate what NB existence looks like in a binary world. I do not and cannot speak for them. But surely(sic) an account that begins and ends with “I’m not a man because I don’t identify as one” is pretty weak”

Later, after deleting the thread and getting more shit for it, she would upload an absurd non-apology video called “Pro-nouns”, where she would dress up like a fucking clown-ass Oompa-Loompa who just escaped from Wonka’s Chocolate Factory, and make several dumb-ass claims and a fuck-ton of truscum arguments, including stating that she “wants to be a convert” to “believe” NBs, and that she would listen and respect NB people’s beliefs “so long as those beliefs are valid” After more backlash to that happened, she would continue this trend, platforming actual truscum like Buck Angel, selling anti-semetic reptilian agenda merchandise, and hosted a Patreon stream where she just... basically shat on everyone. She shat on people like HBomberGuy, for performativity in regards to the meme “Donkey Kong said Trans Rights” (yes, she is that desperate. She will accuse people who raise 340,000 fucking dollars of performativity and virtue-signaling), stated that older trans people would be considered truscum, and even that most of her friends were truscum.

The one thing that was consistent in these stories was the insistence that the criticism was just an attempt at Cancel Culture.

Cancel Culture is essentially the point where in an attempt to either exclude, harass, or target others for political views, religion, ethnicity, race, sexuality, gender, etc., people will devolve into many forms of online harassment and abuse of the media outlets, among other things, in order to silence the target, or deter the target from making an argument. It can even happen just because people don’t like someone.

For Sarah, this took the form of accusing the people criticizing Steven Universe of having a dishonest double-standard, because if a straight, white, cis-dude made it, no one would be saying shit about it. Even though the show is historically praised by WHITE progressives, and criticized by EVERYONE else.

For Lindsay, it was that the people making this claim were just fooled by the “Woke Brand” train.

For Natalie, it was “the Left is eating itself”.

I would like to say this right now. The only time I actually saw Cancel Culture in action was during the shitstorm that erupted with VivziePop and her pilots for Hazbin Hotel, and Helluva Boss came out and everyone was looking for a bunch of shit to bring up about Vivzie personally, her apparent “transphobia”, “homophobia” as understood by Steven Universe fans, and generally just a bunch of bullshit that Rebecca Sugar got away with when she pulled the same shenanigans.

That is Cancel Culture.

And the only reason I can see for it was just because Vivzie (to my knowledge, at least) isn’t a member of the LGBT community. (Those same people would respond to her stating that she plans on having Alistor, the Radio Demon, be ace with “Hey, did you hear something?”, btw)

(EDIT: I initially stated, as shown above, that Vivzie wasn’t a LGBT community member. She is. She’s bi. Apologies for getttin that bit wrong. I’d also like to mention that she’s Latin as well, but is also shit-talked for apparently being too white to be Latin. 

So......yeah. Can’t begin to imagine why all of those mentioned weren’t given the same treatment.... Was there any doubt when Lindsay said she was Native?......)

And that wasn’t the case with any of the aforementioned. Natalie wasn’t “cancelled” until she kept shitting on people for the fiftieth (hyperbolicly fiftieth) time. Sarah was never cancelled. She got away with slander, and was quickly forgiven just because she’s a leftist. Lindsay is getting away with excusing away, and flat out DEFENDING PEDOPHILIA, AND IS STILL POSTING. She ain’t cancelled.

Cancel Culture may happen sometimes, genuinely, like with Vivzie, but those are the exceptions that prove the rule. It’s mostly just “this person said I sound completely contrary to what I believe, it must be (insert cause)”

It’s Lily’s fault, it’s a dishonest double-standard, it’s the radicals, it’s Woke Brand brain-washing, it’s “bAd faITh cRitISIsm”, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah...

Let me tell you something. In Sarah’s case, not all criticism is because there’s a dishonest double-standard. And even if it were, that doesn’t make doing something horrible because of your identity the right thing to do. Because NO ONE should be putting in the most racist, bigoted, and frankly gross and disgusting shit in their work, regardless of whether you’re white, black, gay, lesbian, trans, NB, Gen Z, Boomer, etc. Like the human zoo, the Amethyst-Garnet fusion, Bismuth, the Pearl-Rose dynamic, the Nazi woobification, and the blatant disregard for the very people the show claims to be an ally too.

See also, the N-Word.

Despite the belief that white people can’t say it while black people CAN, black people don’t use it in a conversation formally, and can’t really use it ANYWAY because it’s still a fucking slur. And if you say it in public, there will be consequences, whether it be social repercussions, or legal action. And people have been saying it less and less as a result of this attitude becoming more present.

In regards to Lindsay, we know, bitch. We fucking know. We know that Disney wants our money like crazy. We know that this could be just another woke branding thing. We know that brands aren’t our friends, we know, we know, we know, we know. We know, Lindsay, we know. But, don;t chat shit about it if you aren’t going to criticize Cartoon Network for Steven Universe, Amazon for selling Pride merch, and Target for Pride clothes. Because then we know that you’re being very selective about what you’re labeling as “woke branding”.

In regards to Natalie, SHUT THE FUCK UP. SHUT THE FUCK UP. That is literally all you have to do. Just SHUT. THE FUCK. UP. And accept that you aren’t as woke as you like to think you are. The left isn’t eating it’s own by disowning shitty people. It’s doing itself a favor for it.

Remember R. Kelly? Everyone said that black people were just turning on each other when actual, legitimate evidence came forward, showing that he;s a FUCKING PEDOPHILE. And that attitude would continue for almost three decades before someone FINALLY said, “No, this man is dangerous, lock him up”. You know the phrase “A few bad apples?” People only say that, and just ignore the rest when defending shitty people on the Left, mostly because they don’t want to disown them. The phrase, however is ACTUALLY “A few bad apples SPOIL THE BUNCH”. If you don’t weed out the bad ones, they’ll spoil the tree.

Most of this bullshit would have been solved easily if ANY of the aforementioned had looked at their behavior, ACTUALLY apologized, expressed due diligence, and STOPPED FUCKING DOING THE SHIT.

The only reason people get away with this is because A LOT OF PEOPLE ON THE INTERNET HAVE FUCKING TERRIBLE PRIORITIES.

People take more offense to someone shutting down an opinion rather than someone being a scumbag.

People jut decided not to care about Sarah’s lies ENTIRELY because “It’s Lily”.

People defended Lindsay entirely because “Fuck Disney”.

People defended Natalie because “The Left is eating itself, we need to support minority voices”.

Because the myth of Leftist-Cancel Culture is just an excuse to not have to change. To not commit. To not put in effort. To not expand time to bettering yourself or the environment around you. To jerk off to how woke you are while criticizing others who tell challenge that. To wax poetic because it’s good for your ego.

It’s not just them. It’s many of their fans, and hundreds of thousands, if not, millions of people on the internet. And by far, their worst deeds aren’t that they inadvertently or otherwise attract Nazis, keep sucking off incels, truscum, TERFs, pedophiles, and other facets of human garbage while disemboweling others for far, FAR lesser crimes on the basis that they aren’t woke or nice enough for their liking, or EVEN the harassment that they’ve engaged in, caused, and instigated.

It’s that they’ve convinced themselves that by doing all of the above, that they are in any way superior to the people they cry foul against. The people who call them out on their bullshit when it arises. The people who raise $340,000 for their OWN people while the most they’ve done is play dress up and recycle Eddie Murphy’s shtick for the 500th time. The people who are part of the very minority voices they claim to support yet disregard on the basis that they said some mean words, or argued in bad faith, or just have a personal grudge against the people that they criticize. The people of color who FLAT OUT know better than them, yet, who they write off at every possible opportunity as just believing that companies care, or that Disney is good, or even just write ‘em off as having the wrong priorities or being stupid, as if they are in any way super clever and superior for coming to a conclusion that many more talented, creative, intelligent, and just frankly BETTER people came to years ago. 

They are MORE PERFORMATIVE, more ENTITLED, more ARROGANT, more IGNORANT, more UNAWARE, more BIASED, more SELFISH, and more SELF-INDULGENT than a good 98% of the people they criticize.

They hate these people so much...because they hate looking in mirrors.

And Leftist Cancel Culture is just a manifestation of that psychological projection. Simple as.

If you skipped to the end, fuck you. No TL: DRs in this neck of ‘da fuckin woods