#like. romance is a valid interpretation of the canon

[felassan]

Some more DA:TV and related snippets from Sylvia Feketekuty, Part 6. rest of post under a cut due to length and spoilers. [Post One, Post Two, Post Three, Post Four, Post Five]

User: "after [Emmrich and Rook's] argument they don’t really bring it up again, is it pretty much the case that Rook being lost in the fade made them both realise what was important so that conversation wasn’t really needed? or did they have it off-screen?" // Sylvia Feketekuty: ""is it pretty much the case that Rook being lost in the fade made them both realise what was important so that conversation wasn’t really needed? or did they have it off-screen?" I think either one is valid. There's some time skips, so I figured if you imagined your Rook and Emmrich talking about the argument, it could've happened while, say, they're traveling to the Necropolis. Flow-wise it seemed best to rely on that passage of time to smooth that part over, and get to the point where we enter the talk by the coffin. Or perhaps they're so in-sync that, like you said, Rook and Emmrich feel they can just move on. (If you bring Emmrich to Isle of the Gods he's apologetic there, and Rook picks up on it, so maybe that was enough short as it was.) (To my mind it's not a huge thing to declare one way or another, but I'd prefer this one to be player's choice)" [source, two, three, four]

User: "had a question about emmrich's last name. i know there is a banter with harding that confirms it is a commoner name, but i was interested in what his surname breaks down into meaning? I assumed volk=folk perhaps, but is there any other meaning/significance? thank you!" // Sylvia: "You pretty much have it right with "volk" = people. I liked the idea that Volkarin would sound fancy to someone speaking English (well Harding's not speaking English per se, but you know), but have its roots in something that plain. So yeah basically I got a kick out of the thought that in Nevarra, Emmrich's last name is the equivalent of Smith, or Jones, or Wilson. (The "arin" part is just because I thought together it paired well with "volk")" [source, two]

User: "With Hezenkoss, as a romanced rook, it feels like she's a bit jealous and was stuck in a one sided crush with her "friend" Was this intended? Or was she just competitive and annoyed at his popularity with everyone?" // Sylvia: "I always pictured Hezenkoss as annoyed that as they grew up, Emmrich become popular and effortlessly well-liked, while she, with her sheer brilliance, was clearly resented by jealous fools. Fools!!! (I pictured Johanna needling Emmrich over his romance mostly her going 'now there's some nice sore-spots I can press' because she has correctly anticipated his insecurities.) "become popular" Arg I meant to write BECAME. Cripes." [source, two, three] // Sylvia: "TBC I also don't want to invalidate any head-canons! My general rule is that if it's not stated outright in game, it's up for interpretation, regardless of my thoughts. La mort de l'auteur, etc." [source]

User: "I recently made an appreciation post on reddit how relatable he is for me and how it helped me with my anxiety. There were also other users agreeing and sharing their love for the character." // Sylvia: "I read your post and the others, and I'm glad meeting Emmrich touched people like that. His story was a team effort, and everyone making him knew we needed to hit this theme right. (His actor Nick Boraine deserves especial praise for nailing those lines.) I have indeed experienced what Emmrich does, and from the thread and other fan interactions, it's not an uncommon thing. If I can offer something I read a long time ago: you have the right to think about death without being in a state of absolute fear. I don't know why, but that thought helped me focus when things were rough. Maybe because it was correct: we DO have that right. Even if life and our own psyches conspire against us, it's ours." [source, two, three] // User: "I felt seen in a way I never have when Emmrich said he is terrified of dying. I've had panic attacks about it since I was old enough to understand what death is. Thank you for making so many feel seen and helping people realize its not just *them.*" // Sylvia: "I'm really glad it helped, because the conclusion I've come to is this is more common than we think, it's just not something people talk about." [source]

Sylvia: "(Full credit to the great feedback I got from the other writers and editors early on [re: Emmrich], he wouldn't be as good without them.)" [source] // Sylvia: "All credit to the team, especially the writers and editors who gave feedback that made him so much better during those early days and beyond." [source]

Sylvia: ""who came up with Davrin's "hand-to-bone combat" line?? 🤣" Haha that was Davrin's writer, John Dombrow! I'll let him know you (and other people) got a chuckle out of it!" [source]

User, on Manfred: ""I'm so curious -what about the almonds caught his fancy, and why so many?" Some things are a mystery even to me when it comes to Manfred. (Whatever his reason, I thought as a vegetarian Emmrich would probably have a lot of nuts handy which was the germ of the idea.)" // Sylvia: "Some things are a mystery even to me when it comes to Manfred. (Whatever his reason, I thought as a vegetarian Emmrich would probably have a lot of nuts handy which was the germ of the idea.)" [source]

User: "When Rook romances Emmrich, through banter we can see that Emmrich is surprised that the other companions know about the relationship, and also h says to Johanna that it's a private matter. Is it because he wants to keep things private only, is it because he is worried that Rook may not be the one true love, or is he worried about the age gap, or all these reasons and/or others?" // Sylvia: "In this particular case, I think Emmrich just wanted to be discrete because he didn't want to assume it was a serious thing, and for people to think HE thought it was serious. (Though his line to Hezenkoss is snappish specifically because he knows she's needling him, haha.)" [source]

Sylvia: Down Among the Dead Men and Luck in the Gardens "mean a lot to me, being my first published stories in a book.)" [source]

User: "Are there any other areas of Thedas that you think young Altus mages would tour? Poor Dorian looked like a fish out of water in Ferelden." // Sylvia: "Completely talking off the cuff here, but Orlais and Antiva, certainly, and some of the "better" Free Marcher states seem like good candidates. (Poor Ferelden! Always forgotten by the north.)" [source]

User: "I know you said previously that emmrich doesn't really vibe with cats or dogs But like if rook already has a dog or something (that someone is like pet sitting for them while they're kicked out of their faction and traveling with varric) would that be a deal breaker" // Sylvia: "Nah that'd be fine, they're not his favorites but he'll put up with them for Rook." [source]

Sylvia: "I have indeed seen Cushing's version of Hound of the Baskervilles, for some reason that part where he whirls around and throws the knife is embedded into my brain. What a great Holmes he made." [source]

User: "1. Where did Emmrich live in Nevarar when he was a child? 2. When do you think his birthday is? 👀 3. How did Johanna know him?" // Sylvia: "1. He lived inside the bounds of Nevarra City itself. He's always been a city boy. 2. For some reason, he feels like a January/February birthday to me. 3. They met as young students in the Mourn Watch." [source]

User: "if Emmrich didn't think it was serious when he'd always wanted one true love -apparently-, why did he embark on this relationship, especially with so much passion?" // Sylvia: "I think he thought it wouldn't be so serious at first, but then things progressed. And people want conflicting things, sometimes." [source]

User: "I really love Strife being a love interest for Emmrich! What lead to him as the choice if he isn't romanced?" // Sylvia: "The writing team discussed who felt right, and I liked that Strife was from one of the factions because it gives the feeling of your followers interacting with the wider world. And I felt Strife would provide a nice contrast with the romance with Rook. Unlike them, he's more established in his place in the world, like Emmrich is. Just felt like a different dynamic." [source, two] // User: "Strife balances Emmrich well since they are both interested in study but have gone about it differently." // Sylvia: "Agreed! (I wish I had thought to put it like that.)" [source]

User: "how are pets and animals honoured in the Necropolis and by the Mourn Watchers? The same as any other being?" // Sylvia: "Beloved animals are absolutely permitted to be buried with families. Mild Necropolis exploration spoiler: inside the passage you unlock after finding all the wisps in the belfry area, there's actually some caskets for faithful hounds interred in the crypt." [source]

User: "My question is do the mourn watcher/nevarra in general raise their pets after they die to keep them around? like a dog skeleton with a whisp in it?" // Sylvia: "To be honest I hadn't thought out this one, but it's a very good question. I'm not sure how common that would be, or even if it's permitted to have pets running around the family crypt. (I definitely thing people would WANT to do it.) You know, I think I'm going to have to leave this one in the vague quantum foam of the future. I think I'd want to not only double check existing lore, but answer that in-game (or in a book or etc.) if we ever need to. (Hope that's not too much of a cop out. Sometimes I like to leave questions I'm not sure about alone, because until it's in an official game or story, it doesn't quite count.)" [source, two, three]

User: "how long has Manfred been under Emmrich's care?" // Sylvia: "That's a good question, yet another thing I left a little vague in case I needed to define it concretely in the future. And since I've left, the answer is very much in my head only. But I feel it's likely to have at least been a decade. (Hezenkoss acts like she knows about Manfred, I figure she could've met him during an earlier clash. But I don't think Manfred was around when she and Emmrich were young students.)" [source, two]

User: "if Emmrich had tattoos, on what theme would they be?" // Sylvia: "Something anatomical/surgical, patterned on the MW's mystic theories of the body and death, feels appropriate to me." [source]

Sylvia: "BioWare put out an infographic about choices a few weeks ago, and "lich" was winning out. 1) When Emmrich says how he feels will change did he just mean his senses or is it on an emotional level?" He's definitely talking about his senses in that scene. On an emotional level: unknown. (I imagine it WOULD change someone because it's such a big shift, but exactly what does it do, mystically, if anything, is something I'd like to leave alone since I didn't really cover that in the game, and it feels like it'd been bigger consideration if that makes sense.) I kind of want how the lich-romance proceeds to live in players' imaginations, purely so people can tailor it to their own story. I'm afraid any writer-declaration would narrow the possibilities instead of expanding them, if that makes sense." [source, two, three, four]

Sylvia: ""I've been waiting for Nevarra for years and it was everything i could have dreamed of and MORE!" I'm very glad to hear it. The rest of the Necropolis team and I were very excited to finally get to portray even a small portion of the ancient and hallowed graves of Nevarra." [source]

User: "If I remember correctly, we only really see Emmrich use necromantic magic in-game. Are there other types of magic (elemental, healing/spirit, etc) that you think he would gravitate toward?" // Sylvia: "Hrm. He does have a bit of healing magic, mechanically in combat. It coudl work, but somehow I don't think Emmrich would ever be a high-level healer. He could maybe get the basics but it's not his great gift. Something about the gravic magic of the force mage specialty feels appropriate though." [source]

Sylvia: "I'm so glad you liked meeting and getting to know our necromancer. (Huge props to our cinematic and audio team on that garden scene, it was incredible seeing it come in finished for the first time.)" [source]

Allegra Clark: "I just wanted to say that I miss you so much and I’m so excited for whatever comes next in your career. Josephine means so much to me and I’ve fallen utterly in love with Emmrich (how dare you, he’s perfect). Thank you for trusting me with your child over a decade ago ❤️" [source] // Sylvia: "Allegra! Thank you so much! I'm so excited you've been digging our gentleman necromancer. I hope you've been seeing people ping me about their love of Josephine. I heard someone very good did her voice.. Thank YOU for embodying her so quickly and completely!" [source, two]

User: "how was Emmrich doing when Rook was trapped in the Fade?" // Sylvia: "Probably very poorly! Poor man would've been incredibly anxious and working all hours towards a solution." [source]

User: "So i asked you before what music emmrich does like but um is there any music he hates I feel like he'd die if someone took him to a death metal concert XD" // Sylvia: "I think that's a good one to pick, lol. "It's all just noise!"" [source]

User: "Did Emmrich teach (or at least attempt to teach) Manfred how to read?" // Sylvia: "I think that was beyond his skillset, beforehand; Manfred could be taught to recognize objects, but the abstraction of reading was one step too much at that point." [source]

User: "Do Mourn Watchers undergo a Harrowing?" // Sylvia: "They do! You may've missed it but there's a MWer in the Necropolis who mentions MW Harrowings if you go by them. (The MW has had to suspend theirs because chaos in the Fade.) But that's a temporary suspension, probably resolved by the time the credits roll. In general: I figure that if you're a mage who underwent a harrowing in some other circle, that stands, but that the MW would also perform harrowings for students they took in early. Also: not a silly question! It doesn't really come up with the MW except that one ambient line, and it's very easy to miss." [source, two, three]

User: "Doing a 3rd MW playthrough after not playing one for a couple of months feels like coming home again" // Sylvia: "That's some commitment to the dead! The Mourn Watch approve." [source]

User: "if two mourn watchers were to share a piece of grave dowry between them, that's grounds for a serious relationship?" // Sylvia: "You mean like each one having the half of a necklace, or having the same bit of gold made into matching rings? Or swapping jewelry? Either way, what a nice idea. It could be!" [source]

Sylvia: "Emmrichwas very much the work of the team, including some very good feedback early on from the other writers and editors." [source]

Sylvia: "The team and I were also super excited to get to explore the Necropolis. It was an honour to open up the tombs to everyone." [source]

User: "Emmerich's particular respect for trans characters was extremely enticing to me." // Sylvia: "Thanks, I'm glad he resonated. (Some trans colleagues kindly spent the time to give me some feedback on the wording of the lines, which I think made them way better.)" [source]

User: "Emmrich is so amazing" // Sylvia: "Thank you again, that is incredible to hear. (And I want to mention, only possible with the team; they helped improve the story every step.)" [source]

Sylvia: Tevinter Nights "was a fun collection to work on" [source]

User: "Does lich Emmrich feel anything when Rook kisses him or touches him?" // Sylvia: "yeah, I don't think he's "numb" so to speak, he can sense a touch (with his new powers from beyond the graaaaaave 🪦💀🌹)" [source]

User: "about Emmrich so i know he's into flowers and botany but is he into plant meanings and symbolism" // Sylvia: "I think he is - Emmrich mentions some flowers that are "famed in verse and song", I think he'd enjoy reading up on the cultural importance and symbolism layered on to them." [source]

User: "Obv the game mechanics require Rook to make the choice but would a romanced Emmrich choose to become a Lich if the choice was in his hands? Would he abandon his dream for love?" // Sylvia: "I must refuse to answer on the grounds that it's too melancholy to contemplate. ;_;" [source]

User: "On the dinner date in the Necropolis I loved how Emmrich felt philosophical, it was so relatable, especially when he talked about the connection to something finer than we are. It was magical!" // Sylvia: "I'm really pleased that last part of the dinner date, resonated with you, I was trying really hard to get a certain feeling across." [source]

User: "What month do you think Emmrich was born in? I really wanna know what my guy's zodiac sign is" // Sylvia: "I don't know anything about zodiac stuff but weirdly, I do have a range, for some reason I always thought it'd be January or February." [source]

User: "1. How does Emmrich feel about children, both in general and possibly having them? 2. Would Emmrich be into gift-giving?" // Sylvia: "1. In general, he likes kids okay, and tries to be kind, but his students are mostly older so he doesn't really chat with many. Regarding having them, if circumstances aligned so that was the case, I think he'd be excited if maybe a little overwhelmed by the thought. 2. I think so! Not overbearing about it, but he would like to show some tokens of affection at appropriate times. (There's no way he's not delighted to get gifts.)" [source, two]

[freyfall]

saw a post the other day about how the dsmp fandom doesnt pay attention to any of quackity's relationships other than the romantic ones (also specifically shitting on quacksicle) and tbh while I think it's a valid point to talk about because quackity has so many other important relationships, you do realize that his romantic relationships (at least the arguably canon ones - specifically referring to fiances and schlackity though I guess you could argue tntduo but I'm personally not arguing that) like, completely inform a major part of his character?????????? It's about like. showing vulnerability to people and getting screwed over for it.

AND, perhaps the key part here, is that quackity and slimecicle follow in this pattern of quackity showing vulnerability to someone he has a close relationship with and then that relationship falling the fuck apart. so I don't know if it's necessarily off the mark to say that, in a sense, quacksicle was implied to be the same strain of relationship that q had with schlatt and karl and sapnap (and perhaps also wilbur) and that may or may not be romantic.

like, a platonic reading of it isn't incorrect (in fact it is probably the MORE correct version if I'm being realistic about cc intentions, etc) but like, the subtext isn't NOT there imo. Shrugs

anyways the op was right in that the entire other half of q's character is heavily informed by his nonromantic relationships - like. the entirety of LN (foolish, fundy, PURPLED) everything with the prison (sam, DREAM!) and also the friends he had in earlier dsmp days (tommy, eret, p sure bbh, this list can be added to but I wasn't a big early q watcher so this is all I got). (also, like, tntduo, but tntduo exists in the weird grey area yknow.)

anyways I love c!quackity and all of his relationships. they're all so fucking good

[mika-kagehira]

shumika is canon to Me even if they never directly say they are Gay Dating In A Romantic Relationship... i dont think they have to say it or even Be dating for it to be canon. the new story has shown that the story of valkyrie, especially from now on, is a romance... at least that's how i interpreted it. and that is whats canon to me: that their story is one of romance. that makes their relationship inherently romantic to Me even if they aren't confirmed to be Dating..... that is my opinion and how I see it.......Personally...

[daviesroyal]

As an acespec, I'm getting really tired of creators coming in after a piece of media has been released and saying, via Word of God, that "oh yeah this character is totally ace, I meant them to be ace all along, couldn't you tell?"

It's a fucking insult, to try and use representation as a shield from criticism (or, in the case of Arcane, because the creator apparently hates the Jayvik ship).

I openly accept any corrections, especially from actual Lucanis fans or demisexuals. If you disagree with anything I say this point onwards, please tell me!

The way Lucanis went from "bisexual disaster " to "panromantic demisexual" after the game came out feels weird (Both are direct quotes about Lucanis from Mary Kirby). Before I get into this I'd like to clarify, neither is a problem, Lucanis being demisexual in a vacuum is not what I take issue with.

But it feels like another excuse. Being demisexual means something it's not just another word for inexperienced or hesitant. If Lucanis is demisexual why does he fall for Neve or Rook nearly just as fast as any other companion does and why does he never acknowledge that?

There are many hints that he's never dated before (not sure if it's ever outrught stated), and again, he is shown to be hesitant... but nothing uniquely in the direction of demisexuality.

This game clearly isn't afraid of using real terms (it has an entire codex going over different non-binary labels), so why is this where they draw the line? Why does Lucanis never acknowledge the fact that he requires a deep connection before he feels certain things?

I've seen people call Krem from DA:I bad trans representation because he's never called transgender, which I respectfully disagree with. Still, Krem is explicitly trans and then Lucanis's demisexual coding is just... pulling away before you can kiss? It doesn't help that the scene happens after something that would definitely explain why Lucanis would need to clear his head.

That's also paired with the fact we do get told constantly that he's traumatised and he mentions having little faith in people prior to his romance (at least with Neve). This isn't to say he can't be demisexual, not at all, but there's always an explanation for his behaviour that people would think of before demisexuality and there's no effort put in to otherwise lead us to it.

For a game that is on the nose about everything, I find it hard to give them the benefit of the doubt that this was the one thing they handled with subtlety.

Best case scenario, Mark Kirby was just trying to... I don't know, set up expectations to defy them? Worst case scenario, this is just another case of someone from Bioware lying to us about this damn game.

[sixtharrow]

It’s weird. Way back in the day (like, pre-Voltron Legendary Defender era) the relationship between two unrelated fictional guys being considered “brotherly” would have been quite validating to us slash shippers. It’s like, oh wow, they’re that close, huh. They already consider themselves each other’s family. They’d die for each other. We’d have thought a romantic relationship stemming from that was perfectly logical!

And it’s not like the ship would ever be canon, so having that sort of deep bond was the next best thing. The fanworks would just have to take it from there.

But it’s so different these days. A character says “you’re like a brother to me” and now shipping two unrelated fictional guys is literally incest? Even though this has been a trope in straight romances for forever? Wow, the view has really shifted! Of course, shippers back in the day were much looser regarding canon roles, ages, power dynamics, or hell, even whether or not two characters existed in the same universe in the first place! But this is one argument I’ve just never been a fan of. Like, I used to say my first gf was my sister all the damn time because I didn’t know how else to interpret my feeings for her early on. And the fact that this seems to disproportionately affect m/m ships and f/f ships is telling, too. Also, people’s views of each other can...change? Sure, maybe Character A once saw Character B as his brother, but something is different now, and so he has to go and navigate those feelings. I mean the whole point of fanworks is exploration. For the characters as well as the writer. And just like back in the day, the ships are rarely canonized, which means something is always being changed or expanded. We just didn't have killjoys in our ears telling us we couldn’t ship two unrelated fictional guys because one of them once referred to the other as a brother or whatever. Well, we did, cause homophobes exist, we just didn’t usually hear it from fellow shippers.

[laurelsofhighever]

On Lucanis and ace representation

I have mixed feelings about it. Spoilers ahead, obviously.

On the one hand, I have been writing ace representation into Dragon Age fandom for at least five years by this point; I have made posts speculating which characters in the franchise could be read as aspec, I have critiqued the conflation between apparent aspec identities and brokenness that happens so often in mainstream media, and I have longed for a canonically aspec character in the stories I love. To me, however, this new declaration about Lucanis does not feel like a victory.

It feels convenient.

Mary Kirby tweeted six months ago that she specifically wrote Lucanis to be a disaster bisexual, not panromantic demisexual. In the real world, of course, people can discover new things about themselves and change their labels, and it’s fine. The problem is that Lucanis is not a people, he is a character with a static set of responses to a limited set of inputs from the player. In other words, he is what he is. That this change in Word of God about his sexuality comes directly on the heels of the very poorly received AMA from the devs is something I don’t view as a coincidence.

To be clear, this isn’t an attack on Mary Kirby, nor is it a tantrum about not getting a sexy Zevran 2.0. I am ace – I love slow burn emotional depth before physical intimacy, and I was drawn to Lucanis because of his struggles with alienation and the softer playfulness that’s there to see if you look for it. (And the voice, and the wings, but that’s not relevant here.) However, there is something severely lacking in the connective tissue of his romance. For the first two thirds of the game he is unresponsive to flirting to the point where the game feels like it’s bugged. Multiple people have pointed out that it’s almost impossible to tell when the romance is locked in without looking at the companion screen – I myself only realised when took him to Rivain with Taash and they started talking about him popping out the wings. The idea that this woodenness was a deliberate choice does a disservice to everyone who has pointed out a valid critique of the content – mechanically, rather than narratively – of the romance.

It is also immediately contradicted if you don’t romance Lucanis. Because instead he gets together with Neve in a relationship that not only lacks the emotional closeness that is required for Rook to lock in a romance, but also gets physical far more quickly, which is the exact opposite of how demisexuality works. For Rook, romancing Lucanis requires repeated declarations of support and care, and he will only fully reciprocate once they have battled through his inner demons to encourage him to start healing from his trauma. Even after that there is no physical touch between them until after Rook is pulled from the Fade prison. Neve, meanwhile, is one of the locks on his cage, but creates a ‘hats off’ rule for Spite. It's like watching Aveline run around finding marigolds for Donnic all over again. Not to say that all ace experiences are the same, but if someone described these two relationships to me, I would assume only one of them involved a demisexual character.

Truthfully, however, this isn’t really about the evidence for whether Lucanis is or is not demi. You could argue that back and forth all day because interpretation goes both ways. For example, he says he’s inexperienced in relationships, but then he’s arguably more competent than the other companions who ask you for romantic help, more lacking in confidence than skill – and analysis of that is a whole other post. But it’s not useful. There isn’t one way to be aspec, and I’m certainly not saying he can’t be read that way.

What this is about is the way representation feels like it has been retconned in as a response to the genuine critiques brought up in the AMA and elsewhere. Excusing the gaps in his romance by saying it’s because he’s demisexual feels like a cheap attempt to divert attention away from weak character writing. Perhaps I’m just being cynical, but after all the dodged questions and misrepresentations from the devs in almost every aspect of this game, if Lucanis had been planned as aspec from the beginning then the TRANS WOMEN ARE WOMEN game would have made a huge thing of it. I know this, because they did it already, they stated all the companions were pan (except for Lucanis who was bi).

And I don’t know what’s worse: it not being planned and only trotted out as a smokescreen to avoid engaging with the flaws in the writing; or it being there from the beginning without any care for how it might look to have the ostensibly aspec character be a literal abomination whose interpersonal issues stem from being imprisoned and tortured. Again.

A good slow burn would have addressed Lucanis’ relationship to attraction, though hopefully with more nuance than Taash was allowed. A good slow burn would have not made one character exchangeable for another in a romance regardless of the personal journey Lucanis can only take with one of them. A good slow burn would have at least had him reacting to the things the PC says to him. But this is not a good slow burn and the devs are using a token attempt at queer rep to cover for whatever went on behind the scenes to give us such a patchy final product.

[seangardnerxiv]

Shadow and Maria's Complex Relationship

FOR DISCLOSURE: this thread is going to be discussing the complexities of Shadow and Maria’s relationship based on many different factors. Though I will be including the romantic interpretation (NOT a sexual one – I do not support nor condone sexualizing these two, nor most of the characters in Sonic, as they are almost all minors) as a potential, I will not be arguing to assign a definite label to their relationship – I will, in fact, be doing exactly the opposite (I am also not interested in engaging in shipping discourse over Sonic the Hedgehog characters). I would simply like to disclose that that will be discussed in case the topic upsets you and you would prefer to stop reading now. I accept this post may not be received well by some.

SPOILERS FOR SONIC X SHADOW GENERATIONS

So I've had to break out my Tumblr for this - my usual haunt is Twitter/Bluesky, but those don't really allow for longform posts. This is also a major departure from my usual FFXIV posting, so apologies to anyone who follows me for that.

Sonic x Shadow Generations recently dropped, alongside the short animations “Dark Beginnings” as well as the (non-canonical) manga “The Jet Black Hedgehog: Shadow the Hedgehog.” With it, discourse surrounding Shadow and Maria’s relationship has kicked up again, largely in two parties – that Shadow and Maria held a sibling relationship, or that Shadow and Maria held romantic feelings for one another (some people have also argued that Shadow is her uncle, or Maria is his mother, but I won’t be discussing those views). There are arguments for both drawn from a variety of sources – I will do my best to present both (if there are others I've missed, please feel free to comment and I will add them).

For siblings:

This Twitter post of artwork for Dark Beginnings has the following alt text: “Shadow and Maria reach out for one another in an infinite abyss (as long-lost siblings would) with the Moon and the Space Colony ARK in the background."

The manual for Shadow the Hedgehog (2005) describes Maria as “like a sister to Shadow.” I have also seen another screenshot of a different manual that states that Shadow as "like a brother to Maria," but I've been unable to find which manual it is. (EDIT: It’s a Prima Games manual, not written by Sega)

Gerald refers to Shadow as “son” during the climax of SxSG.

For romantic:

Maria saying “I love you” in the Japanese version of SxSG uses the kanji “ai shiteru,” whilst her “I love you” in the Japanese version of the manga uses “daisuki.” Whilst it can be used for familial relations, it is apparently very uncommon for both of these to be used outside of romantic intent.

Shiro Maekawa – the original creator of Shadow and Maria – based them (or at least parts of them) off of a romance manga known as “Please Save My Earth” (with Maria sharing the Japanese voice actress for the female lead from the anime), and has frequently supported them together, often retweeting romantic art and posts of Shadow and Maria.

In a recent interview from Sega, Maria touching Shadow’s face in Dark Beginnings was equated to Beauty and the Beast.

For Tanabata – a Japanese festival celebrating the meeting of the deities Orihime and Hikoboshi, and the separation of them as lovers – Sonic Channel posted artwork of Shadow and Maria reading the story beneath the stars. Sonic Channel has also published fanart for Valentine’s Day relating to Shadow and Maria (although they publish a lot of fanart).

Before I go any further, when the topic of Shadow and Maria in a romantic lens comes up, many of the same criticisms arise that I do not believe are fairly levied – namely accusations regarding their age, species, and familial ties. I would like to address – and debunk – these three before we go any further. Keep in mind while you read these – this is not meant to convince you that their relationship was one thing over another, but only to provide validity to a subjective point of view I feel is unfairly stigmatized.

“It’s incest because Shadow is Maria’s brother/uncle(?).”

While there were notions of family stated by both Maria and Gerald, Shadow was grown in a tube with alien DNA and has zero blood relation to the Robotnik family. Whilst there are abstract labels of “like a sister” or “sibling coding” that are only ever applied in a meta sense, neither of them define their relationship in such a way within the lens of the universe. And it is not as if the topic never arises - in Shadow Generations, Maria herself likens young Abraham Tower as akin to her little brother, but she makes no such distinction with Shadow.

“Sibling coding” is ultimately a nothing statement, and unless a proper adoption is made, it does not magically turn romantic feelings towards the two involved into incest. Frames of reference are often informed by what young people are familiar with, and they sometimes lack the proper tools to acknowledge that their feelings towards each other are more complex than they first believe - to say that this is something that potentially occurred with Shadow and Maria is not outlandish, and not a concept unique to Sonic as a series.

Similar examples to this include Clive and Jill from Final Fantasy XVI (Jill is accepted into the Rosfield household and raised alongside Clive and his brother, only to later enter a romantic relationship with him as an adult), Nero and Kyrie from Devil May Cry (Nero is fostered by Kyrie's family and considers Kyrie a sister initially, only for her to become his love interest as adults) and Sidon and Yona from The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom (Sidon grows up perceiving Yona as a sister, only to realize his feelings for her are more complex later on). None of these are incestuous relationships, nor is Shadow and Maria’s were it to be romantic.

“It’s bestiality because Shadow is an animal.”

Bestiality is applicable to regular animals that do not hold human sentience of thought, as they are unable to consent to a relationship, like a dog or cat. Shadow is not this, nor are any of the anthropomorphic characters within the Sonic games - were you to change the anthropomorphic animals in Sonic into humans, basically nothing about the series' content would change. All of them are completely sound-minded beings that are essentially just people who look different. Shadow is not Maria’s pet, he is her fully sentient friend that holds the same degree of thought as she does – given that Shadow’s entire arc is about finding his purpose in life, degrading him to simply a lab animal rather than acknowledging he is a person defeats that entire arc (something the manga also touches upon).

A lot of people also cite Sonic and Elise from Sonic ‘06 (namely the scene where Elise kisses the deceased Sonic) as a reason why Shadow and Maria should not be done - while I think it’s valid if you didn’t like watching a human girl kissing Sonic the Hedgehog, I maintain that a good chunk of that disdain stemmed from two major reasons:

Elise was very poorly characterized in her game. She existed to constantly get kidnapped and be saved by Sonic, and so both the relationship and the kiss came off more like pandering than something earned.

Sonic '06 had a bizarrely realistic artstyle for the human characters, whilst all of the animal characters retained their cartoonish appearances. This clash of artstyles looked its worst when Elise kissed Sonic at the game's climax.

Maria, however, does not fall into these pitfalls. She does not exist to be purely a love interest for Shadow - she’s certainly not someone for him to save, as the entire inciting event of Shadow's character is his inability to save her when she saves him.

For a frame of reference, Shadow is more akin to an alien from Star Wars – a setting where humans also exist. It is not bestiality for a Human to hold a relationship with a Twi’lek, as both races are fully anthropomorphic and sentient. On a similar note, Beauty and the Beast is not considered bestiality either, even though the Beast bears obvious animalistic traits. Some people have also entertained the notion of Rouge and Topaz from Sonic X, even though the latter is human. This is all the same principle, and none of it is bestiality.

“It’s creepy because Maria is young.”

Shadow – while said to be ageless – is not an adult, and to imply that he is one is a fundamental misunderstanding of Shadow’s character – whilst there are many instances where he demonstrates maturity on some levels, he has shown much immaturity since his inception in Sonic Adventure 2 (his desire to destroy the world out of revenge for Maria), and his most recent storyline in Generations involves his naïve desire to change Maria and Gerald’s fates (or rather, an initial indifference to what it will bring). Not only that, but his time on the ARK was mired in confusion over the point of his existence – Maria was the one that helped him field through his confusion, and was arguably the more mature one between the two of them. We can safely say that Shadow is not an adult character, nor is he ever presented as one in the lens of the game.

As the closest thing Sonic likely has to an equal in both body and mind (Sonic holds his own immaturities similar to Shadow), he can likely be placed mentally close to his age of fifteen. This is reinforced by the leaked transcript of Sonic ‘06 that refers to Shadow as 15 (the red squared text in this image).

Maria has no canon age established in game material, but Sonic X lists her as 12. 15 and 12 is the same age gap as Sonic and Amy respectively.

In addition to that, many people have claimed that Shadow is over 50 years old, but this is only true of his chronological existence, not the time he has been conscious and aging. He spent 50 years stuck in cryosleep, and awoke exactly how he was when he was placed in there.

A similar example would be Aang and Katara from Avatar: The Last Airbender - Aang was frozen at the age of 12, and awoke 100 years later. Nobody, however, tried to claim that he was 112 years too old to kiss the 14 year old Katara, as Aang was physically and mentally still a 12 year old upon awakening - most people who watched the show were also actively rooting for these two characters to kiss, which they did at the show's finale. It's the same principle regarding Shadow - he is 50 chronologically, not 50 in mind or body.

If we’d like to really get into it, I would point out that nearly every character in the lens of Sonic is in and around Maria’s age range (according to the Sonic Channel). As stated previously, Sonic is 15. Amy is 12, Knuckles is 16, Rouge is 18, Blaze and Silver are 14, etc. Nobody bats an eye at notions of romance between any of these people (not that I’m saying they should inherently).

Romantic intent between minors is not inherently viewed as a bad thing - see the examples of Aang and Katara or Clive and Jill above, or for an in house example, consider the canonical (to Sonic X at least) relationship between the 8 year old Tails and Cosmo - yet for some reason when it comes to Shadow and Maria, a relationship is stigmatized.

To reiterate in the wake of the last point, my discussions of romantic intent ARE NOT SEXUAL IN NATURE. As I acknowledge these are minors, any notions of that are completely off the table, and I do not agree with anyone who would imply their relationship was a sexual one. I want to make that unmistakably clear.

My major takeaway from observing both the Sonic fanbase and those on Sonic Team seems to be that in western circles, Shadow and Maria as siblings is the popular perception, whilst in eastern circles, they are more commonly perceived romantically. But ultimately, Shadow and Maria’s relationship seems to have many contradictory signals that makes it hard to pinpoint a concrete definition, especially in the most recent releases – and I believe that this is fully intentional.

Shiro Maekawa has stated in DMs has stated this regarding their relationship when asked if he saw them as siblings or love interests (translated from Japanese):

“I think they have a special bond that is unique to them that doesn’t fall into either of those categories. Just my personal opinion.”

From the way that the two are written post-Sonic Adventure 2, this appears to be a sentiment that is fully carried forward – their relationship is more nuanced than a canonical label would make it. Maria was the only person who made Shadow feel loved, and Maria unquestionably loved him back. What kind of love that was is up to the viewer, especially given that Maria died when they were both young, before they even had a chance to expand upon their relationship, if that was ever on the table – not that they needed to, given that their bond seems to have transcended both labels. Maria was the only one who acknowledged Shadow as more than an experiment or a weapon, and Shadow was her rock in an environment where she was isolated away from her family and home. Maria was Shadow's person, and still remains that in death.

To disclose for me personally (in case it was not obvious), I have always interpreted their relationship as romantic - or at least having romantic implications - ever since playing Sonic Adventure 2 Battle and Shadow the Hedgehog when I was a kid. I have both a fiancé and a sibling, and the way they treat each other is far more evocative of how I treat the former than the latter (especially in Dark Beginnings – I do not imagine my sibling through a shoujo filter while I wistfully think about cuddling them in a field of flowers). I do not take the awkwardly placed alt text verbiage from the Sonic Twitter account, used to fake-argue with the Wendy’s Twitter account, as gospel for anything, and I think that treating it as a damning disproval is silly. Had she lived, I believed the complex feelings they held would have been identified as romantic down the line. The relationship always just read as too intimately charged for me to perceive as siblings (it still does especially in the wake of seeing how she touches and speaks to him), even before I had a serious relationship. I think that arguing the nitty gritty over Twitter alt text and translations is silly, as all it took for me to takeaway that the relationship was still romantic was to play the game, watch the animations, and read the manga for Shadow Generations - but that's just me.

That said, I will concur that if you are weirded out by romantic notions between the two of them, that is completely understandable, and I would never argue that you should not feel what you feel for yourself. The sibling viewpoint is also wholly valid an interpretation, with or without word from a meta source. Though she had her grandfather and later Abe, she was largely alone on the ARK away from a family that she clearly loved and missed, and it’s not unusual to presume that Shadow filled in the role of a brother for her. I will also acknowledge that many things I have not mentioned - such as Shadow blushing at Maria calling him cool, or her saying "I love you" in general - are not inherently indicative of romantic intent, and can be read as fully platonic interpretations, and I find those that try to state that the romantic interpretation is the objective one just as irritating as those that state the sibling interpretation is the objective.

My intent is only to dispute the idea that romantic interpretations, and the people who hold them, deserve to be scrutinized. The pairing is completely innocent, and the treatment people have received for believing them to be romantic is obscene. Sweeping blanket statements have been made to insult all who do (some going as far as to wish death and harm upon them), all just based on subjective viewpoints held by people who see them platonically. The fact that there is so much discourse surrounding this topic, and that there is evidence enough on both ends to make an argument, means that Sega has intentionally left the relationship up to interpretation - including the romantic take.

Everyone unclutch your pearls.

But with all that said, I will reiterate that this post was not meant to convince anyone of one thing or another, but rather that both interpretations of their relationship are valid, as it is essentially a secret third thing that transcends both labels and is special only to them. Strictly defining their relationship as “siblings” or “love interests” (even as someone who perceives them romantically, I would never want that to be definitively confirmed for this reason) is deconstructing what is perhaps the most nuanced part of a series that does not always tend to be terribly nuanced, and a definition matters far less than acknowledging what Maria means to Shadow in the present – he is who he is because of her, and because of that, he is now living a life for himself. Shadow the Hedgehog (2005) ended in a way that had Shadow let Maria go, and Shadow Generations ends with him carrying her forward with him after accepting her loss. She was, and will always be, the person who loved Shadow - however you define that love is up to you.

Nothing has ever been hard confirmed by Sega, no matter how much either side wants to pretend it has been.

In summary, both points of view regarding Shadow and Maria’s relationship are simultaneously true and not true – it is a matter of interpretation according to the viewer what their feelings towards each other were, yet their relationship in the lens of what it is now after the tragedy of their existence (even before Maria died) is purposefully indefinable, and it should remain that way. Nobody should ever try to say that Shadow and Maria are definitively something - that goes for both points of view. I doubt it will, but I hope this goes towards removing the stigmas towards one of the more nuanced parts of this series, as nuance in Sonic the Hedgehog - frankly - does not come along very often, and it would be nice if that were encouraged rather than smothered.

Thank you for reading.

[thevagueambition]

My feelings on the slash ships vs male friendships argument that occasionally pops up is that if other people shipping two male characters with each other genuinely ruins your ability to appreciate the intimate male friendship depicted in canon, that says a lot more about your personal anxieties and insecurities than it does about shippers or culture at large

The argument is typically about devaluation of friendships, right? that imposing romance/sex on these canonically non-romantic, non-sexual relationships between men implies that friendship without those elements is "lesser" or "not enough"

And I am sympathetic to a fruatration with devaluation of friendship and I do agree that the language shippers use or the argument they put forth in favour of why their ship is a valid reading of the text or going to become canon or whatever, that this is sometimes language or arguments that imply the superiority of romance and sex over relationships without those features

But the thing about it is that

1) the canon version of the relationship in question typically is a non-sexual, non-romantic one, the mainstream version of this story is one that puts emphasis on and values male friendship, which is proof in and of itself that there is no danger of stories about the importance of male friensships drying up

2) this is an issue far, far more prevalent in the depiction of relationships between men and women, like there actually is a lack of stories that center non-romantic, non-sexual male-female friendships, there genuinely are people who see every non-familial male-female interaction in the light of romance, yet it's the slash ships that get hit with this accusation of devaluing friendship

At the end of the day, how other people interpret a piece of media really doesn't have to affect your own relationship to a piece of media. It's perfectly fine not to like a ship! It's not homophobic to prefer a male friendship to a gay romance. Getting angry about other people engaging "incorrectly" with a fiction relationship is immature and in the case of the "devalueing male friendships" argument it is also homophobic

I have a straight male friend who really values Frodo and Sam's friendship and who doesn't personally read it as romantic, who indeed is a man with intimate, non-sexual, non-romantic relationship with other men and thus find that interpretation personally meaningful. But he's not immature or a homophobe, so he doesn't feel the need to complain or argue if someone else makes a reference to them as a couple in his presence. We all agree that the relationship is important and endearing, why would we have to agree on the particulars of whether they fuck or not?

If you find shippers annoying, that's perfectly reasonable because shippers often are annoying (I say as a shipper). But at the end of the day, the only reason to position slash interpretations and platonic interpretations as enemies is homophobia

[loredrinker]

I Would Not Lay With You Under False Pretenses

In my Dragon Age Inquisition head canon, Solas and Lavellan had a sexual relationship. Throughout their time together in Inquisition, I’ve always imagined them sharing that kind of intimacy - it felt like a natural progression to me. (Despite not getting those scenes in the game—though we know they intended to.) I'd also like to thank the writers for leaving it open to interpretation on purpose. (I’ve held this interpretation long before Veilguard, and with the revelations of Solas’s memories and regrets, it has actually deepened my understanding and added even more layers to this perspective.)

Why is this my take?

On a personal note, it just makes his betrayal way juicier, more devastating, and tragic (And I'll be honest, I am totally into that level of tragedy).

From a more analytical perspective, I interpret Solas as spiritual (he was a spirit first, after all), and the kind of man who falls in love with someone’s mind and spirit before anything else. For Solas, sex isn’t just about physical desire; it’s a spiritual act – and it’s his spirit that seems to be the most wounded throughout the games. This kind of intimacy feels like it could provide him with some healing and to me, it seems a natural progression for him to connect intimately with someone he truly loves.

So, here are some of my justifications for this interpretation (this is a long post!): 

Solas is lonely – we all know this. His immortality and all the secrets and regrets he carries isolate him. Lavellan’s love is one of the few things that lets him connect with someone who sees him. Their intimacy would become a refuge from his solitude. 

It’s his moment to just be Solas. When they’re making love, he can set aside being Fen’Harel, the Dread Wolf, and just be a man. Vulnerable, open, and present. That’s something he craves but seems to rarely happen.  As his letter in Veilguard to a romanced Inquisitor says - “...put my plans aside and simply stayed with you as Solas...as I wanted”. 

It’s not total deception. While he hides that he is Fen'Harel (by omission - his words, not mine!), I don’t think making love to Lavellan is deceptive on his part. For him, it’s the purest expression of his feelings. Words can lead to lies, but in their intimacy, bodies speak truth. That’s why his line in Trespasser, “I would not lay with you under false pretenses,” resonates with me in this interpretation - he means it. He wouldn’t make love to her unless he loved her. Love does not come lightly to Solas.

And perhaps, in his mind, this intimacy is also a gift to her - a way of saying, I truly do love you. In moments where words risk exposing too much, this is how he shows her the depth of his feelings. For a man as burdened by guilt and secrecy as Solas, this act becomes a truth - an offering of his unguarded self, if only for a little while.

(On consent: Many valid arguments suggest Lavellan can’t truly consent, given she doesn’t know his full truth. I’ve thought about this a lot. For me, my Inquisitor is not passive. I played her as an intuitive and intelligent, and experienced woman. She is aware that Solas is holding something back. She senses his sadness, a chasm within him, a fight within him. She chooses intimacy with him despite knowing he’s hiding something - not out of ignorance but out of love and faith. Partly because she believes her love can offer him solace and maybe even help him heal and of course, she too is seeking the same connection with the man she loves, that he is seeking with her. What I'm saying is, my Lavellan is an active participant in her own choices. That’s why I find her relentless pursuit of understanding after Trespasser so delicious—she owns her choices and chases answers.)

Love overwhelms him. Despite all his restraint, his love for Lavellan overwhelms him (look at the way he gets lost in her kisses alone). Making love is the only way he can fully express the depth of what he feels for her (other than the actual truth, but he chickens out on that). In those moments, they exist together beyond guilt, secrets, or duty.

It anchors him. For an immortal like Solas, stuck between the past and the future with no real connection to the present, being with Lavellan pulls him into that present. Imagine what a relief that would be - to stop carrying the weight of eternity, even briefly, and just feel good in the moment. 

It’s a reclaiming of his humanity. Lavellan brings out the parts of him that are still human. Sex is a way for him to reconnect with those fleeting, mortal emotions that may have dulled over centuries of war, betrayal and...well, immortality. 

Sex as a spiritual act. Sex, in itself is very spiritual - it is more than just a physical act - it’s an exchange of energy, a union where two spirits connect and strengthen one another. Each moment of intimacy strengthens their shared connection, draws them closer, forging strands of energy that tether them together. This isn’t about taking - it’s about giving, receiving, and creating a sanctuary for each of them.

This shared energy would then carry spiritual significance for Solas. He is a man fractured—both wisdom and pride, split between dualities that circle within him. Through this connection, this literal merging of their bodies and spirits, he might find a fleeting sense of wholeness within her.

Side note: This is why I don’t think Solas is interested in casual sex. He’s far too deliberate, private, introspective, and connected to the significance of mind and spirit. For someone like Solas, casual encounters would feel hollow, draining him rather than sustaining him.

The Fade connection. Solas holds the Fade sacred, a place where reality and fantasy blur. This parallels the merging of bodies in sex—the blurring of secrets and truth, pain and solace. For someone like Solas, whose love of mind and spirit is central, making love would be sacred.

(And harkening back to my side note above, I’m convinced Solas has had very few lovers in his long existence - two for sure, maybe three. I have theories about who those others might be—not Mythal!—but that’s for another discussion.)

But of course, this is Solas we’re talking about. So all of this romantic theory comes with a heavy dose of pain. 

Every time they’re intimate, their bond deepens, their shared energy strengthens, making his inevitable betrayal hurt that much more (oh hindsight, I hate you!). He knows the truth will break her heart, but he can’t resist her. It’s both a gift and a festering wound.

For Lavellan, these intimate moments are about trust, connection, and offering Solas her love. For Solas, he is offering his love as well, but for him these moments are tinged with the weight of his secrets and the heartbreak he knows he’ll cause. That contrast - their shared intimacy against the shadow of his betrayal - it's just what makes their relationship so compelling, so messy to me and why I am completely comfortable with this interpretation.

*since first posting this I have edited it to be a bit more streamlined and removed some redundancy.

[raven-at-the-writing-desk]

I interpreted the "adaptation from the manga" thing to imply that they'll animate the 3 Yuus (like you said) but my partner proposed smth to me that raised my concerns... what if they only animate Yuuka? or like- default to a female Yuu? I could see that bc it would be probably easier for them to have only one protagonist.

don't get me wrong I like Yuuka and I know a lot of TWST fans are women but since the studio involved is apparently known for shojos I'm scared they'll make it seem like the story is romantic/the game is an otome... Which I mean- we do have SOME fanservice stuff but it's definitely not a romance story. That's why I'm scared 😭 if they do go that path... I much rather prefer the disconnection (?) of having 3 different Yuus than the possibility of this...

Also I'm just 🥲 I'm scared ppl will see that and say ahhh So Yuu has always been a woman!! Because as a trans guy, one thing that rlly made me feel valid in a way was seeing that in the game Yuu has no gender at all... I don't go by they/them but I'd much rather be referred as that than to be misgendered. It's a small thing but it's such an important detail for me (the fact that Yuu is gender neutral/can be whatever u want them to be) that it being erased in the anime would make me pretty sad... even more if ppl take the anime as "confirmation" of Yuu's gender, which it wouldn't be regardless if they end up giving us a girl OR guy Yuu- it would just be another Yuu interpretation different from the game.

But yeah, personal stuff aside, I'm more scared by the possibility of them making it seem like it's a romance story 😭 or ppl calling TWST an otome... which I mean... some people already have that misconception, even some fans...

[Referencing this post and this news!]

I definitely think they're probably leaning towards a new Yuu every season; otherwise, there would be a very uneven distribution of screen time for one Yuu over the others, and that leads into the problem of one Yuu being "more" canon than the rest. Yes, it will probably be easier logistically speaking to keep the same Yuu for the entire anime--but I also said the same thing when we only had the Episode of Heartslabyul manga, and look what happened with that. We ended up getting Yuuka and Yuuta following Yuuken, regardless of the logistical inconvenience of it all. I think if the anime intended to have a singular Yuu to follow for the main story, they would have chosen to adapt the light novel (which has Yuuya across multiple volumes) instead of the manga. The conscious decision to adapt the manga (with changing Yuus) says something to me. So really, I don't think we have to worry about one "kind" of Yuu dominating the anime. I took a look at the portfolios of the two studios collaborating for the Twst anime and didn't see a ton of shoujo myself. There was definitely a handful of them, but overall there was a spread of genres. I think Yumeta Company (one of the studios) has Tokyo Mew Mew New under its belt, which is probably one of its better-known works and maybe that's where the "they're known for doing shoujo" allegations are coming from? Don't quote me on that, though. I'm not someone who closely follows anime studios.

I would, however, like to point out that we shouldn't put all our stock into the studios behind the anime. Yes, they are obviously animating the project and thus have an influence on how the final product is. However, there are tons of other people involved (like the script writer) that will dictate how the anime looks and feels. (In fact, the script writer for the Twst anime, Kato Yoichi, is not known for writing shoujo.) I highly doubt all the staff involved at every possible level of production are conspiring to make Twst a genre it's not. (Related: I blame socialization for this, but it's a little sad that most of us by default think one woman + a bunch of men in a cast must be romantic.)

Now, to your main point. I understand the initial fear of people misunderstanding Twst as a dating sim/otome from how it is presented. Really, I do. I also understand the frustration that comes with people claiming Yuu's identity or gender or what have you is "confirmed". But to that, I ask you: so what? And I don't mean that in a "your feelings aren't valid" way (because your feelings are very valid!) I mean in like... Do these misconceptions others have truly impact your own enjoyment? Do the people believing in these falsehoods erase what you know is the truth? I would wager it doesn't. There has been and always will be those who see Twst or interpret Yuu as something they are not. Lots of us (myself included) thought Twst was an otome game when they first heard of its concept. People claimed Yuuken was the definitive Yuu when the first chapter of the manga dropped. That's fandom, especially the larger they get. If we fixate on those sore spots, it will ultimately make us unhappy because there will never be an end to misunderstandings. I would advise that you try and detach from those worries and just focus on having your own fun in the fandom rather than worrying about how others are consuming or reacting to Twst. Yes, we want Twst, a franchise we've seriously been invested in and love, to be seen a certain way--but I don't think that should come at the cost of your enjoyment. Fandom is meant to be fun, and we don't want to make ourselves miserable by stressing over the "what ifs", you know? Please focus on yourself!!

[maul-of-shame]

[TW: Rant about toxic and very vocal Haladriels/ Saurondriel ship]

As always, if you can’t be polite in the comments, then just keep your thoughts to yourself. Seriously. Scroll on by. Don’t even bother reading this if you’re a die-hard fan of Sauron or Haladriel because I’m not in the mood to deal with that energy today. This isn’t a public debate, this is my space. Respect it or leave.

Now that we’ve cleared that up—guess who’s back? Still a little sick, but salty rants are officially back, and oh boy, the fire is burning. You see, I’ve been resting and recovering like a good little elf, but now that I can play SWTOR again, the energy is back, and I have some words. Buckle up Buttercup-

This is probably not the last time I’ll talk about this, but I really need to lay it out again because the levels some people will go to justify a villain’s actions—because he’s “hot”—is genuinely disturbing. If you genuinely believe that Sauron is “just misunderstood,” that him literally trying to kill Galadriel was some kind of twisted “sex metaphor,” that Elrond isn’t actually Elrond but Sauron in disguise, or that people calling Sauron abusive are just being “patriarchal,” then honestly, please block me.

This isn’t about ships or fanfiction anymore—it’s about the deeply concerning way people are twisting logic to absolve a literal villain of his actions. Sauron is not a misunderstood anti-hero. He’s a manipulative, power-hungry, genocidal tyrant who tried to deceive Galadriel, manipulated her, used her vulnerabilities against her, and then turned around and tried to kill her when she wouldn’t submit to him. That’s not romance. That’s not “enemies to lovers.” That’s a literal villain’s modus operandi. And yet, some of y’all are out here claiming that any criticism of Sauron is rooted in patriarchy or that it’s “anti-feminist” to call him out for what he is.

I’m sorry, but if you need to do this much mental gymnastics to justify your take, maybe it’s time to step back and reevaluate. Fiction is fiction, sure, but the way some people are willing to twist and dismiss abuse dynamics, manipulation, and outright violence because the villain is attractive is deeply worrying. And I genuinely hope this way of thinking doesn’t extend into real life, because the idea that a villain’s charisma or looks somehow absolve them of their behavior is terrifying.

I’ve seen way too many excuses for Sauron that border on outright denial of what’s in the text or on screen. People saying things like “He didn’t actually mean to hurt anyone, he was just lonely” or “He’s the true hero of the story because he was willing to go against the Valar”—do you even hear yourselves? You’re romanticizing literal abuse and manipulation while vilifying the characters who are actively trying to protect others from him.

And the excuses don’t stop there. Apparently, some people believe that Galadriel is “the real villain” or that her refusal to accept Sauron’s “help” was a sign of her weakness. The amount of vitriol thrown at her—an actual hero in this story—is staggering. And meanwhile, Sauron gets to be the misunderstood, brooding anti-hero in these takes? The mental backflips are exhausting to witness.

This fandom loves to talk about Tolkien’s messages and themes, yet somehow ignores that Sauron is the embodiment of corruption and deceit. If you can’t even accept that Sauron is supposed to be evil, maybe Tolkien’s work isn’t for you. And before anyone starts with the “separating canon from fanon” argument—I get that. I write fanfiction too, and I’m all for exploring creative interpretations.

But there’s a difference between exploring something fictional and outright denying or twisting what’s on the page to fit your narrative.

Stop saying that people who don’t like Haladriel are “anti-feminist” or that they just don’t understand strong female characters. That’s such a tired, lazy, and frankly pathetic excuse to shut down valid criticism.

Disliking Haladriel isn’t rooted in misogyny; it’s rooted in the fact that this dynamic is textbook abusive. There’s nothing “feminist” about glorifying a relationship where one person manipulates, gaslights, and literally attempts to murder the other. Feminism isn’t about blindly shipping any relationship where a woman is present—it’s about recognizing and calling out dynamics that strip away her agency or put her in harm’s way.

Sauron is not a misunderstood anti-hero. He’s not a tragic, brooding soulmate for Galadriel. He’s a literal villain who preys on her vulnerabilities, uses her trauma against her, and tries to dominate her when she refuses to submit. That’s not feminism—that’s a gross romanticization of abuse. Saying that people who call out this dynamic “don’t get it” or are “patriarchal” is ridiculous. If anything, defending and romanticizing Sauron’s behavior undercuts the entire feminist argument by normalizing the idea that women should forgive or redeem abusive men because “he’s just lonely” or “she brings out the good in him.”

Not liking Haladriel has nothing to do with feminism and everything to do with not glorifying toxic dynamics. Feminism doesn’t mean excusing abuse just because you find the villain attractive or because you want a strong female lead to be in a “romantic” relationship at all costs. Stop hiding behind feminism as a shield for these takes—it’s insulting to the movement and to anyone who genuinely cares about advocating for women’s empowerment.

Morfydd Clark literally said — and repeated — that Galadriel has to relearn how to live because of Sauron, that she has to build herself back up again after what he did to her. She even called it out explicitly, saying he can’t get, and I quote, “his nasty claws” into her. It doesn’t get clearer than that: Galadriel’s arc is about rejecting Sauron, rebuilding herself after his manipulation, and making sure he has no power over her.

If you can’t understand that, if you keep twisting the narrative into some delusional “tragic lovers” dynamic, then maybe stop calling other people “illiterate” for not agreeing with you. Because at this point, refusing to acknowledge what the actual actress and the show’s narrative are telling you says way more about your own willful denial than anyone else’s supposed misunderstanding.

It’s honestly ironic how some of the most vocal ones are out here screaming things like, “I KNOW YOU SCREENSHOT!” and “I KNOW YOU HATE ME, GET A LIFE!” while conveniently forgetting they spent days—if not weeks/months—making sure that anyone with opposing views wasn’t welcome anymore. They bullied, condoned bullying, and created environments so toxic that people either left or were pushed out entirely. But now? Now they’re out here screaming bloody murder because they’re suddenly feeling the heat? Please.

I'll happily quote you since I also know my takes are shared judging by anons I received the previous weeks:

You built this. You enabled this. You made fandom a hostile space for people who simply disagreed with your takes, all while claiming moral superiority. You acted as if fandom was your personal battleground, and now you’re shocked when people push back or call you out? The hypocrisy is mind-blowing.

Do you not see how ridiculous this is? You cry about being “hated” or “screenshot,” but you had no problem encouraging others to dogpile on anyone with a differing opinion. You allowed, or outright supported, the harassment of people who didn’t agree with your headcanons or your ships, and now you want sympathy?

You want grace?

Do you even think, for a second, that you deserve some after what you've done?

I genuinely hope you get a life of your own and one day—hopefully—you’ll reflect on all the toxicity you spread. Maybe, just maybe, you’ll realize that fandom is supposed to be a place for joy, not a warzone.

Do these people honestly need me to remind them that some of us have received death threats, rape threats, relentless bullying, and even explicit instructions to kill ourselves—all because we dislike Haladriel or refuse to romanticize Sauron? Do you even realize how utterly insane that is?

Do you people understand that there are MANY of us who’ve had to block, lock down inboxes, and step back from spaces we used to enjoy simply because some of you lack even the most basic decency and empathy? That this isn’t some one-off incident, but a pattern? And yet, somehow, we’re the ones painted as villains or “anti-feminists” or whatever ridiculous label you’ve latched onto this week.

Take a moment to reflect. Maybe instead of excusing or escalating this behavior, you should think about the kind of environment you’re creating. You’re not defending your ship or your takes—you’re harassing real people, and it’s unacceptable. Some of you seriously need to learn where the line is, because you crossed it a long time ago.

It’s honestly pathetic and weak how some of you go out of your way to call anyone who dislikes Haladriel all kinds of disgusting names. Have you ever stopped to consider—just for a second—that maybe, for some people, it’s not about ships, aesthetics, or lore?

That maybe they genuinely hate it because it reminds them of the abuse they’ve gone through?

That maybe they can’t stomach the idea of romanticizing something that feels eerily close to what they lived through?

Good for you if you’ve never experienced abuse. Good for you if you’ve never had to rebuild yourself after being torn down by someone manipulative or cruel. But calling people names, mocking them, or dismissing their pain because they can’t find joy in a ship that screams power imbalance, trauma, and toxicity to them? That’s awful. It’s cruel. It’s thoughtless.

And honestly, it’s such a slap in the face to victims of abuse. You’re not just invalidating their experiences; you’re actively mocking them for refusing to engage with something that triggers them. You’re throwing their pain back in their faces while you scream about “artistic freedom” or “feminism” or whatever other hollow justification you use. And let’s be real: if you genuinely think “disliking an abusive dynamic” is a reason to hurl insults at people, that says a hell of a lot more about you than it does about them.

It’s one thing to love a villain or a toxic ship—go ahead, enjoy your fiction however you want. But the moment you start mocking survivors of abuse for setting boundaries, you’re no longer defending your tastes; you’re showing how little empathy and decency you actually have. Grow the f up. Reflect on what you’re doing.

And maybe, just maybe, stop contributing to an environment that alienates and harms people who are just trying to navigate fandom without being retraumatized.

You tell people to "cater their experiences"—to curate their fandom spaces, to block, mute, and stay in their lane. And yet, you’re the ones scouring tags you hate, finding posts and creators who have explicitly said they don’t like Haladriel or Sauron, just so you can spew vitriol in their inboxes and comments. Do you even hear yourselves?

How can you possibly say that “those people are the problem” when you’re the ones actively seeking them out? You are the ones who can’t scroll past something without leaving hate. You are the ones sending threats, name-calling, and mocking people for their boundaries or preferences. You are the ones making fandom unsafe for anyone who doesn’t agree with you. It’s not “those people.” It’s you. You ARE the problem.

It’s wild that you demand respect for your own opinions while showing none for anyone else’s. You cry about being called out, about screenshots being taken of your bad behavior, but maybe—just maybe—if you weren’t acting out so viciously, there wouldn’t be anything to screenshot. Maybe if you weren’t jumping into people’s inboxes with hate, mocking survivors of abuse for disliking something that feels triggering to them, and calling people awful names for simply existing with a different perspective, this entire conversation wouldn’t even need to happen.

The fact that some of you are so wrapped up in your ship or your villain that you’ve forgotten how to treat others like human beings is honestly sad. You don’t care about boundaries. You don’t care about empathy. You don’t even care about fandom being a place where people can enjoy themselves without fear.

All you care about is being "right" and silencing anyone who disagrees with you.

If you can’t let people dislike a ship or a character without throwing a tantrum, then maybe the problem isn’t them—it’s you. Maybe the next time you feel like sending hate, you should log off, take a walk, and ask yourself why it’s so important to attack strangers over fiction.

Fandom is supposed to be fun. It’s supposed to be a space where people can share their creativity and ideas, not a battlefield for self-appointed gatekeepers. And until some of you learn that, until you stop seeking out posts you hate just to harass the people writing them, you’ll keep proving what the real problem is. Spoiler alert: it’s not the people you’re targeting.

[moltensmusings]

I still remember the anger of watching people try to paint Fjord as someone infantalizing jester for going along with Marion's request to protect her rather than shutting her down. How people were like "FJORD SHOULD KNOW JESTER IS STRONG HES SO DUMB AND DOESN'T DESERVE HER" as they tried insulting fjord and jester while pitting them against other ships.

Even back then I knew their take was so void of the actual context of the show but my anger made it difficult to articulate.

Fjord knows jester is strong. Like the reoccurring joke of her being one of the strongest characters in the nine makes he clear. He's seen her fight, he's aware of her strengths. Him going along with Marion's request is what you do to any parent that is worried about their kid. It's simply being a good friend. You agree to take care of your friend and keep them safe because it helps put their parent at ease and let's them trust that their kid will be well Ioved.

Telling Marion "she can handle herself" would've felt like a dismissal of Marion's concerns. And even beyond that, jester herself wasn't phased by the request because that's simply the type of mother Marion was. Jester was the most important thing in her life. Her wanting to make sure these people she barely knew put her daughter above all else (especially the one it was clear her daughter had a crush on) make sense. Turning it into some "fjord doesn't believe in jester/this is sexist" moment is to twist the original narrative to serve your own purpose.

And this wasn't even the only time the fandom try to pretend fjord was shitty compared to the others. Several people acted like only fjord was doubtful of the traveler/tried to convince jester to be wary of him. The whole group was wary of the traveler. And for good reason. To them, some cult like figure had such a hold on their friend that she would do anything for him and they didn't know how far that extended. Throughout the story most of the nein either make comments about him being weird or make fun of the idea.

Fjord isn't alone in this. Is it right? No not really. But trying to push him as the problem to raise your faves and justify their romance with jester over him comes off making it seem like you willfully misunderstood canon moments of the show to feed your own interpretation.

It is perfectly fine and valid to not like a ship, but I'm so tired of people altering the canon narrative and acting like fjorester wasn't built up or didn't have moments just to feed their own preference.

[bananasfosterparent]

you can reinterpret and headcanon all you want, but creators telling a story are not “hindering roleplay” by telling the same story they’ve always been telling. AA has been an explicitly toxic and abusive dynamic since the beginning

Yes! you're so right.

Look...

at how abusive he is...

So toxic...

Much abuse is happening here

I can't figure out how I missed all of this toxicity!

You seem to be lost and/or confused, my friend.

Are you familiar with the term "You'll catch more flies with honey than vinegar"? Because you should be. I'd actually be more willing to get into the spawn ending and the spawn side of the fandom, if people weren't so condescending and invalidating to AA-fans like this. What is with this holier-than-thou attitude toward anyone who doesn't agree with your personal "reinterpretation" that you believe in? Even if you genuinely think there is some overarching, "canon" ending to his story, how is it helpful to anyone (especially AA fans) to be condescending about it?

I have at least enough levels of maturity and understanding to say to you "your interpretation of the information is different from mine but still valid for your roleplay(s)". What's so hard about returning that basic level of respect?

Also....

You can't ""reinterpret"" a piece of art that is open-ended and meant to be interpreted however you want as the roleplayer (within canon logic, that is). You just interpret it however you personally do.

As far as "hindering roleplay" goes, you do realize that any time the game assumes how your character feels or what they think (on an emotional level) that it can hinder roleplay, right? Meaning, it disrupts immersion. We simply want the ability to customize the responses and experiences our characters have, just like you want to. And it's an ability we all can share (with the new modding tools coming out in the new patch).

Believe it or not, but not everyone has the same brain as you. Not everyone understands and views things the same way as you. And your way isn't the only "right" way to enjoy something. I know it's really, really hard to fathom, but I'm going to ask you to try really hard to do it.

Can you please answer this question: Why are so many anti-AA people focused on players being punished for something spawn fans don't enjoy? Why not just enjoy Spawnstarion and call it a day?

What is this responsibility you assume to "save" AA fans from our own supposed media illiteracy and misinterpretation/reinterpretation/mischaracterization/misunderstanding of AA and the romance?

What do you gain from this? No, like.... I legitimately want to know. Please reply.

And yes, to be clear, I know I'm also being snarky and condescending a bit in this reply, but I'm just matching vibes.

[mare-sanguis]

The queercoding in Sangcheol's and Jeongwoo's relationship

Let me preface this by saying: everyone is still allowed to see them as whatever they want (a work related relationship, best friends, close friends, soulmates, lovers, and and and) but I think most (if not all at least here on tumblr) can agree it would be ignorant if we completely overshadow just how much queerness there is.

This analysis is brough to you by this thread (why JW is snow white and why SC is the prince) and @thedevildeer latest post. Its not structured and really just a ramble so excuse me if it might sound a little confusing at some points.

Let's start by looking at it through a heteronormative kdrama lense below the cut 

How often do most kdrama fans watch a drama, see the lead man and the lead woman and think "woah, they would look so hot as a couple" even when the drama isn't a romance? Quite often, that's right. That's because most M/F leads are designed to be shipped even outside of the stereotypical romance genre. If it's a crime drama, thriller, mystery etc. Where the focus should solely lie on the plot they will still most likely try to create an M/F duo so most kdrama fans will have something to latch into. It has happened so many times that people dropped a non romance drama because it had no M/F couple, but people apparently want it so badly because how else can they enjoy a non romance drama, right? And kdrama directors/writers know this- they see and read the reviews and work with them; That's why in kdrama land M/F ships are still the norm, still seen as the most canon- even if there is a 2nd ML who has insane chemistry with the 1st ML (perhaps even more than the FL, cuz let's also face it in a lot of kdramas women are written flat)

When the ML is near the FL, everyone immediately interprets all kinds of thoughts into it, even worse when they go as far as to look at each other and hold eye contact, when they worry about each other, support each other, visit each other or are just having a work related conversation. They dont need to confess their love or kiss for the viewer to know they are in love*

Those are all valid points for shipping, that's obivously not the issue- The issue starts when they genuinely can't see the FL as her own character, when they can't seem to understand that men and women can be platonic friends, the issue continues when the 2nd ML appears whos got way more chemistry with the 1st ML or even takes the place of where the FL should be. Its then where the issue peaks- their relationship will automatically treated differently (2nd ML get potentially hated by the M/F shippers even) and it creates rift within the fandom, its shipping and arguments about queerness as a whole (discrediting that queerness is a large spectrum) by cishet fans

Suddenly, if it's M/M those actions I mentioned earlier dont seem romantic anymore, suddenly it's just a simple bromance (and while the term per se isnt homophobic, in these circumstances it sure sounds like it which is why I personally dont like it and rarely use it), best friends caring about each other because homies are homies. ("why can't men stay friends?" we all know that argument) *if they don't confess to each other outright, don't kiss each other, then they aren't i love (last part especially is targeted towards specific BL fans who only think a relationship is valed if they kiss and maje out)

So, this out the way let take a look at SC, JW, HS and BO approach (intentionally or not) on queercoding and the importance of a strong man-woman friendship.

First, let's look at tropes commonly (but not exclusively) found in queer media or media that tries to imply queerness and the similarities they share with SCJW:

Found family (the most common trope in queer media, especially the media that emphasises on realness, as found family serves as a safe space for queer characters when they arent accepted at home)

A strong opposite gender friendship or a friendship that defies traditional views

Color coding (mostly a warm and a cold colour, often times its blue and red)

Language coding (do the characters say they are queer, do they use specific terms, do they confess or declare their love for each other through something deeper; just what are they saying?)

The character design (this is not just about how they look but the desgin as a whole: background story, family, friendships, career, driving force, are they representing something (like a specific color, a flower); what was the creators thought process while creating them)

How do they express love around the person they ador (for example, men express love with touches while women often times use words and actions)

Broken friendships (because old friends dont accept)

Then of course we have common tropes found in all media highlighting love

Clothes sharing

Intense eye contact

Personal space

Lingering

Caring

Hurt/Comfort

Touches

And what do we have here? That's right. Black out s well as SC, JW and HS fit right into the common tropes and the queercoding tropes and yet we see some totally discrediting its validity to exist within the universe because god forbid both JW and SC are queer or viewed as such cuz they both were with women prior and they can't possibly be one of them queers... right?

HS is a really well written female character who's got nuances, a great backstory with a fair share of suffering and the additional nosiness which makes her so special. She is sweet and caring to everyone who seems nice in her eyes. She cares about JW's mother (prior to knowng he's JW's mother so thers no point in saying she does it cuz of JW), cares about Suoh and is genuinely interested in his hobbies. Her character takes care of everyone because she's a med student (you can take a med's job away, but you can never take the job out of a med). This is what her character is about- taking care, worrying. Her purpose in Mucheon was (as we know by ep.13) to find what shes looking for, to find her way back. She is by no means not connected to eithe JW and SC but her story is canonically detached from both JW's and SC's- it takes part in a different pace, in a different setting and through a different lense and most of it happens off screen or throug her observig the people. We rarely get any of her POV's, unless it's either around Suoh or Geonoh. The other times when we do get a POV of her is when SC and JW and in the same frame. Then she is postitioned as the onlooker, the one who observes. When she is alone with JW she gets almost no POV, even less that focuses on her feelings towards him. But the most important thing I said already: her story is detached from SCJW. She grows alone unlike SCJW who grow together. She is that friendship JW needed to show him a part of humanity that got lost with his fake friends. She is to represent and tell that you do not need a large group of friends to feel at home. 

Then there is JW. Beautifully written full of nuances, a tragic yet amazing written backstory- easily to read as a story of someone being queer. A big group of friends, a beautiful home with loving parents and then you got the catalysator which sets the whole plot moving. While for JW it's murder, abuse, gaslighting by friends and people he thought were family, prison and finding new hope in humanity through one person- how can one not look at this and think "yeah it's somewhat reminiscent of someone coming out in a conservative country with traditional family values"? Family and friends ditching before the person can even stand up for themselves, people spreading venomous lies, all the guilt trips, that person shutting themselfs off retreating into their own little world. JW was obviously never meant to be read as such and some even might find this part weird, but it's undeniable he has those classic queercoding tropes. He finds true meaning in humanity again through HS and SC at the same time, yes, but it is SC alone who stands by his side the whole time- every single day. JW feels the safest around SC, falls asleep in his home (therefore also in his presence) and gives in to being taken care of only when SC is around, he also laughs at his dumbs jokes and makes sure to catch his reactions when he is sassy (handing out flyers scene or the scene at the scrapyard). JW is meant to not grow alone but together with someone else- and that someone is SC. who he shares the exact same pain with. He sees the good in people- he sees the good in SC so he keeps on pursuing him even when he would reject him. Because he can see himself in him. Because he feels he's different- just like him. (And isnt it like: Queer people know someone is queer when they see one?). We cannot forget him being a metaphor for Snow White which imo solidifies the queercoding in him even more and how he steps in to save SC and then again to support him by beating up those debt collectors. (Also, just a random little side note: I think it's funny how he's either loved or hated, there was no inbetween. BM and MS hated him, they were eaten up by jealousy; BY, NG, DE and the twins loved him (also again, random side note to me any anyone who cares: it's so easy to read the feelings GO felt towards JW prior and post time skip as more than just friendship tbh which again, adds to the queerness layer))

And then there is SC, just as complex and full of nuances like JW. Having an almost identical tragic backstory to hm even- losing the love of his life. While hes story is way more difficult to decipher as queercoding, his character is most definitely not. He is portrayed as rude and rough towards any criminal and at the beginning of the story we genuienly dont know where we stand with him with this ever fluxuating personality. He is hurt, struggles, doesn't even seem to know himself very well, has seen a lot and he also doesnt trust anyone (as seen when he immediately clocks BM as suspicious when the review the CCTV footage) except JW. How come he trusts him more, even after he had accused him of the hit and run accident, but is side eying everyone the moment the incident with the mother happens? When he should have more trust in his own people then defending and caring for a guy whos accused him of causing the car accident. Even when he finds out JW apparently killed the girls, his actions towards him are differet than the actions we see him taking against the guy he chases after in the beginning. We see him falter and struggle even more in the manhole when he's threatening to shoot JW, we see it again when they are at the shed and JW is reinacting the murder scene- he is reluctant. Even when using violence against JW. Because, just like him, SC feels they are the same. And it doesn't even take much time for him to switch side- we can see him questioning everything onwards from from episode 4 during their first team dinner. And when he switches side he suddenly becomes so soft and caring- completely taking on the role of a possible love interest in both drama, romance and fairytale. Because he has seen the good in JW, saw the same suffering, this unfair treatment. He is a character not meant to grow alone but together and this togethes is only JW. JW still has HS by his side but in SC's world there was only JW who shows him all aspects of what it means to be a good human being. It's through him he grows. 

Their shared journey:

To quote Leo Buscaglia again "Too often we underestimate the power of a touch, a smile, a kind word, a listening ear, an honest compliment, or the smallest act of caring, all of which have the potential to turn a life around."

And isn't this what SC's and JW's shared bond is about? How they grow with and around each other- thanks to each other.

The little things SC does to make JW more comfortable, to show him love still exists? He takes him home without thinking twice because he's worried he might get sick when he could've taken him back to his house. He dresses him up in his clothes, let him sleep on his couch, in his blankets, gives him something warm to eat and drink (the glass of milk will never stop making me sob), showers him in touches and shows him warmth through them, always reaching after him because he's afraid something might happen to him, watches out for him, observes his reactions and waits for him. The little things JW does to SC- giving him a reality check that not everything is as it seems, graduately bringing back his old personality, stays by his side.

It's how SC brings JW's smile back and how JW brings SC's smile back. Its how SC not once but twice declares his worries, adoration and love towards JW: once when he's so worried sick JW might get hurt so he installs that app on his phone and the second time when they say their "goodbyes"- those words are so easy to read, so full of love. The "if you move" highlighting just how much he wants and hopes JW to stay in his life a little longer. It's longing and we can clearly hear it in his voice when he says "I'm sure you can" right after the monologue and then tilts his head. It's how JW doesn't know how to approach him after this, contemplating what to do and then goes on for the hug first. This is JW's way of showing his love. 

And yet, despite it all there are still people who only see it as a bromance. Those who think JW and HS will end up together because they are at the same uni, study the same. And are a man and a woman. If either SC or JW would be a woman, no one would even bat an eye to think they aren't in love- no one would even come up with the idea to even ship JW and HS. If one of them was a woman, every little gesture would be seen as romantic, betting on it the drama would perhaps even be a lot more popular as well as the ship. It's so disheartening to see how many deny an obvious queercoding between them just because they are men and for the sake of a straight, not well manouvred, ship because again apparenlty many kdrama fans don't dare to ship queer.

We know Black Out/Snow white must die is a fairytale because it very much is just one of many iterations of a snow white and exactly because is one of many nothing is impossible and queerness is allowed to exist within it.

[trianglesimpfordpines]

the thing is. i'm not really interested in arguing over whether or not "billford is canon," because we know the story of bill & ford and interpreting it as romantic or not romantic doesn't change much at this point. whatever they had, whether or not you personally view it as romantic, was very intense, had a profound effect on both of them, and was horribly abusive on bill's part.

deep friendships can be abusive and cause lifelong trauma, just as much as romantic relationships. so i'm not gonna be out here being like "um, billford is canon, cry about it" because it's not my business how any given individual fan goes about interpreting the semantics of their relationship.

that said, though, it's become very clear that romantic feelings between bill and ford are a valid and canonically plausible interpretation. no, that's not the same as "100% explicitly canon," and no, it doesn't mean you have to ship it. but it does mean that continuing to behave as though people who do interpret it as romantic are doing something morally and/or intellectually wrong by having this interpretaion is unreasonable.

since bill was abusive to ford either way, why is it that interpreting ford's feelings for him pre-betrayal as having been romantic in nature is viewed by some people as being Uniquely Problematic? like being interested in the dynamic of their still extremely toxic friendship is normal, but the second you read anything besides friendship into it suddenly you're crossing some sort of line into Trivializing Abuse?

because...like. romantic relationships get ugly in real life. frequently, in fact. it's a very well-known, extensively-documented phenomenon. and, while "the use of romance-coded language to describe bill and ford's relationship in tbob is just a joke" is also a valid and plausible interpretation, why is that Less Uncomfortable than the idea that ford could have been in love with bill? if the goal is to avoid acknowledging the unfortunate idea that a person can hold positive and affectionate feelings for their abuser, then shouldn't viewing them as ex-close-friends be just as bad as viewing them as ex-lovers? after all, platonic or queerplatonic feelings are not "a step down" from romantic feelings. friendship isn't a "lower" tier of love, just a different type.

and most of all, why is agreeing with the romantic interpretation still treated as if it means you can't possibly be taking the story (or ford's abuse) seriously? because this is a common thread i see in a lot of fandoms, not just gravity falls. the idea that applying a romantic or formerly-romantic lens to the relationship between two characters, especially two male characters, can ONLY be done out of a "zomg hawt yaoi 😍" mentality. again, i am not saying you have to ship them or view this interpretation as "canon," but i kinda wish people would spend a bit of time thinking of why, whenever somebody else does ship it, their immediate conclusion is that that somebody else must be a "brainrotted fujoshi" who can't possibly understand how serious abuse is.

like, why is it that so many people think "shipping" is some kind of uniquely frivolous thing that is fundamentally incompatible with (a) actually understanding the story, (b) engaging with any serious and/or uncomfortable themes in a mature or respectful manner, and (c) knowing when a ship is not realistically healthy?

why is it that saying "ford held very deep feelings of platonic affection and admiration for bill, and viewed him as his closest or only friend" all fine and dandy, even though this interpretation does not change the fact that ford once felt very positively about his abuser, but saying "ford was in love with bill" nosedives straight into Gross Icky Weird Freak behavior?

finally, a lot of billford shippers are people who've had personal experiences with abuse. as are a lot of people who are triggered by billford content and don't want to see it. this isn't because the shippers are problematic abuse-fetishizing fujoshis, nor is it because the non-shippers are coping and seething and refusing to acknowledge canon. it is, in fact, because different people, even different people with similar experiences and similar traumas, are going to have different reactions to seeing things that hit close to home in a fictional story. neither party is necessarily "wrong," nor are they necessarily invalidating the other.

and again. just to be absolutely clear. i view all three interpretations (romantic billford, qpr billford, & platonic billford) as valid. the one i personally go with is that ford was in love with bill romantically, but i do not think this is the One True Canon Interpretation. this post is not arguing about the canonicity of billford as a ship.

[toscrollperchancetomeme]

Interpreting Marius from an historical angle with consideration of the values of ancient Rome and Renaissance Italy is valid.

Interpreting Marius from the angle of the author’s intentions and statements about him is valid.

Interpreting Marius from the angle of gothic romance/gothic horror is valid.

Interpreting Marius from the angle of 21st century values and modern social politics is valid (and can be very interesting!).

Preferring one or several of these interpretations to others is valid.

Behaving like having/preferring a certain interpretation of a literary character is morally superior or morally reprehensible is, actually, a bit of a dick move.

And also, sorry to say this, but… the interpretation of a person who has read all available canon material about a character, will always be more valid than that of people who have not. If you want to discuss the books, you have to actually read them. And yes, of course this takes time, but it’s not hard to contextualize interpretations and statements with a sentence like “I have only read books x and y at this point" or even to say "I don't feel like I know enough to give a balanced interpretation on this yet."