#jayce: the undercity is EVIL AND WRONG

[ultfreakme]

S1 I genuinely did not examine the Jayce-Viktor side of the story too much but on rewatch...Jayce got Heimerdinger, a founder of the country, removed from the Council purely because he wanted Viktor to keep fucking around with the highly dangerous and ominous magic thing which sucks up blood as freely as he wants.

That is. Nuts.

Like Jayce has next to no lines when it comes to Viktor. Viktor goes "Jayce do this" and he goes "aye aye partner" and immediately does the the thing. Backbone? What's that?

[strawberry-shortcakey]

my defense of Caitlyn in wake of season 2

    Defending my wife rn 

    Lets get right into this mind you my spelling and punctuation are like non existent so yk

Starting off with the thing i feel people seem to not really understand is whats happening is shes being tugged in like 5 different directions struggling between her obligations to her family name the kiraman family is matriarchal this rests on her entirely she wants to maintain her mothers legacy yet theres the undeniable rage fueled by her mothers death and her feeling of failing all of piltover the feeling that if she had killed jinx before there wouldnt have been so many lives lost she feels ultimately responsible for everything in her life which makes that rage overpower her i mean most of the council civilians enforcers who she had been around her WHOLE LIFE. she feels all that weight in her heart and on her mind much like vi due to her trauma generalizes the people of piltover and enforcers cait blames zaunites and i feel its unfair to give vi a pass and not caitlyn shes trying to hold onto her morals she fights for avoiding innocents getting hurt until the memorial attack where it turns into more than an attack by jinx now an attack from multiples causing her to lose that part of her morals and the last pull is for vi caitlyn loves vi thats something i have never doubted for even a second i mean seriously she puts so much at stake for vi. People don't seem to see that her bringing vi before the council in season one couldve ended poorly for her it couldve reflected horribly onto her family if the council had decided not to hear her out. And on top of all of that shes trying to hold it together. We see her cry a few times but she doesnt ever really let it out i mean shes putting herself under that pressure part of her character has always been that she hates when things are just handed to her as we see in her scene with grayson when she gets upset at the mere idea of her parents paying off grayson to let her win and we confirm that stayed into adulthood when jayce offers her that job for him and shes offended at the mere idea and i feel part of her feels if she shows that pain shes in things are gonna be handed to her out of sheer pity something that would likely fuel her rage further and further.

Next topic is her being willing to kill isha if it meant killing jinx. Now i understand the shock of this how it feels “out of character for her” but it really isnt yes she has been openly against the idea of people getting hit in the crossfire but in her mind its 1 innocent for multiple innocents including her own mother. she also isnt the first character to directly or indirectly result in a child's death and she didnt even succeed so yk but anyway every single councilor is responsible for countless deaths of undercity children and families heimerdinger honestly the most responsible because yk like 200 years of  ignoring the undercity and can i also just mention vis switch up on her opinion season one jayce kills a kid when fighting at the shimmer lab and vi has the mentality “you did what needed to be done one life for like 100” yet when caitlyn finds herself in that same mindset vis all “whats wrong with you you're evil now” so uh yeah not an attack on vi just trying to expand on it throughout this i will make comparisons on how we excuse vi but attack caitlyn and why i think thats really telling of how people see her as a character only there for caitvi romance plot!! But anyway caitlyn had every fucking right in that moment mind you she also was running on adrenaline something that i feel a lot of people don't understand in that moment its often impulse you do the first thing to come to mind she was just fighting off sevika shes in that do or die mindset its kill jinx or people die people also don't understand how deep caits trauma around jinx runs we don't know what she was put through during the time between her abduction and the like final scene of season 1 also just yk the entire show. jinx is her personal trauma.

Now onto the caitvi argument in the tunnels lets loop back to the state of mind she was in shes pumped on adrenaline rage and fear. She feels a deep sense of betrayal much like jinx does when vi “picks cait over her” its that feeling of “oh so you care more about someone who deeply hurt me and a random kid than me.” that only fuels her rage/pain that is making her less and less of her core values. caitlyn gets on the defensive she makes a generalization Something once again we see vi do to caitlyn earlier with the oil and water speech which no doubt left a hole in caits heart something that will stick with her dare i even say that plays a part in why she no longer sees zaun and pilover as two sides of the same coin the person who helped her learn something so crucial suddenly saying “actually we are different piltover is all the same you're all horrible. We can never get along, you are not an exception” which no doubt shattered that view and helped cement the separation in her mind. The key difference is that vi didnt get physical cait pushed her and hit her with the rifle but like i said she's on the defense. Also ive seen people saying “oh well cait knows how shes traumatized by enforcers” to caitlyn that trauma is equal to the trauma of what jinx has done to her and honestly it is caitlyn has lost almost everything to this for the sake of what started off as her dreams of justice her need to prove herself has been what she feels like is the sole cause of the  downfall of piltover. Which is why i truly believe caitlyn is still herself that the development to her character logical and her actions fully explainable and defendable 

Little added thing it’s after getting compared to jinx that she hits vi I mentioned how that’s literally her main trauma jinx killed her mom and ruined her life I’d hit someone with a rifle over that too.

And thats all ive got for now lmk if i should cover more!! And i will be adding as arc 2 and 3 release!

[aldana-brillantina]

HERO OF MY OWN STORY, A VILLAIN IN OTHERS'.

Nobody is good in Arcane(maybe Ekko). If you watch the show you can take a side depending on who you empathize with the most or who you consider their reasons to be good and justifiable to a certain point. This is a story of sides, of perspectives.

Caitlyn is a good person, who has never had anything bad happen to her and lives in a perfect world where her city is an example of progress, she is a person raised in a peaceful environment and she never had the need to be bad or wish evil. That makes her naive, like a baby. That makes her even somewhat insensitive in very specific occasions like when she sees a reality that is not hers (You don't have parents? You're wrong) but it also makes her feel empathy because she doesn't conceive that someone can live like garbage (when she hugs that man addicted to shimmer, when she criticizes her mother and the council for the situation in undercity). But what Jinx generates is what I want to discuss. Before her encounter with her, Cait had never been in danger and bad things classified as horror movies had happened to her, that was in the past. That's when you start to think, she was good because she never had or felt the need to be anything else. Hate can warp a person, and someone like Cait who never felt it, really felt it, well. She's still a person.I think bad situations are the ones that really bring out some hard truths about a person. But also, do we all process trauma the same way? No, does that justify any wrong you do? No, it makes it understandable.I think people are very unfair to Cait, Jinx, Vi, and even Jayce. I think it's because we all judge them from one reality, our own. But they have many.

If we look at it from Piltover's perspective, the Enforcers are heroes, people who protect them from those who want to harm them and risk their lives all the time, that it is thanks to them that they sleep peacefully in their beds and that it is thanks to the council and their good management that everyone has what they need to live. If I grew up under that reality, the Zaunites are wild animals, less than them.Jayce did not belong to the elite in the beginning of the series, he really worked hard to reach the position he is in and he believes that with enough dedication one can achieve their dreams. That is not Viktor's reality, because no matter how hard he tries or how much effort he puts into it, he is a Zaunite and people will always look down on him. That is when two realities collide without letting the other be a lie. Because Jayce really tried hard and Viktor is still less.

Jinx is a killer, a monster in Piltover, the bogeyman who took the city of progress out of peace and balance. She is Silco's attack dog, his pet for most of Zaun. She is the daughter of her boss, for Sevika. His daughter, the representation of the city he always wanted and his greatest weakness for Silco. But I think the worst thing is that she is a product of a violent environment, an environment that never saw any other way to survive than by stealing like rats or kicking others, and this was Piltover's fault. How much of the damage she does is justified if we look at it from the Zaun perspective?

For Undercity, Zaun, Piltover's live off their blood and beat them in the streets since before Silco. How many of them lost families, friends and lovers at their hands? The protests are the result of rage, pain and hunger. My dad said that if there's one thing you never forget it's hunger, guys, this is a city that lives hungry and on crumbs. No, Enforcers are not heroes, they're boogeymen and it's been a reality for, if my calculations are correct, over 150 years (I'm guessing a bit here, taking into account Vi's birth date and Piltover's founding in the lore). So the Zaunite mentality is different, like, you slaughter us for a few when you slowly killed thousands over all these years? It's not right because I'm sure there are innocent people in Topside who live in ignorance of the cost of all the pleasures they enjoy and probably see them even more as animals after these "senseless" attacks. But this makes a lot of sense to them. And Caitlin along with Mel's mom, how many lives will they take, how many mothers? She would be someone else's Jinx.

I remember Silco, in his meeting to remind the chemis of their place, mentioned the mines and how they all breathed shitty air and did they remember it. They don't look old, they started young. Vander and Silco met there, young. Because, here I am playing devil's advocate, Silco despite being a shitty person did not invent child labor or all evil as some of us like to believe, he is a product and he grew up with it, it is normal for him. And yes, at some point, even before he died, he wanted something more, believed he deserved something more when many people simply continued to think they belong under the boot of topside. But he also poisoned his people and did not change the reality for younger generations, he only made it harder for them to prosper. Because in his reality, people who want to survive will do so at all costs, for him only the one who manages to reinvent himself deserves to remain standing, because that's what he did to live. Swim or you sink, there's no other option.

And isn't that the reason why Ekko and his community are still alive? They reinvented themselves, but by lifting each other up rather than tearing each other down. And that's their reality. They didn't need to leave anyone behind because they all contributed to the boat instead of swimming individually.

People who work for Silco, do they have families? Children, siblings. When you hurt someone, regardless of whether they're bad or good, it's someone's brother, someone's child, someone's friend. Someone always gets hurt, directly or indirectly. The Firelights are the good guys, probably the most well-intentioned organization in the series. That doesn't change that how much they screw up those Silco jobs (for good reason) they put other people in danger who may have children or family and they'll think, even if they're wrong, that they're the bad guys.

But did Silco have Vander and were leaders in their own movement for independence? Well, it didn't work out and they lost everything. That formed Silco. What would Ekko do if he lost everything? Even though he's done it once, can he do it again?

That's the litmus test for every character, who you are, what's left, after a great loss. You become like Jinx or Cait, who get lost in their grief and punish people regardless of whether they're responsible or not. Or like Ekko, who like a tree, resists blows because his roots are stronger.

[cherrybomb107]

Okay, so on the topic of Jinx’s actions, I feel like they’re blown out of proportion for several reasons. (Obligatory I am a certified Jinx stan warning. I love my girl DOWN, so take this with a grain of salt.)

Bootlicking is definitely a reason, as is sexism ofc. But, I think a pretty big reason has to do with the fact that people think killing someone is the worst thing you can do to them, when it’s far from it. It’s about who you kill, why you kill them, how you go about it, what did you do to them beforehand, and what you do to their bodies after. Ofc I wouldn’t defend a psycho killer who just went after people for no reason in real life, but that’s not what Jinx does! I’m not saying you have to like her or defend her actions like I do cause my love for her blinds me sometimes, I can admit it. But if you ARE gonna hate on her, do it for the right reasons yk? Lead with love before you hate🤣🤣🤣

Okay so, the fact that Jinx is an oppressed person. Jinx comes from Zaun, where they didn’t even have clean air to breathe. Not to mention the militarized police force that brutalized her people and killed her parents right in front of her all before she hit double digits. As well as the apathetic Council who could give less of a fuck about her, her family, or the Undercity itself. They don’t give a damn, which leads me to my next point: who you kill.

Jinx kills enforcers, Council members, and Firelights. She does not, nor has she ever killed an innocent person. She doesn’t kill random people for just looking at her wrong, as much as the fandom likes to act like she does. Her targets are very specific. Let’s start with the enforcers. My love for Jinx aside, enforcers are Piltover’s version of cops. I’m Black, queer, female and from the US. Ain’t nothing you could say to me to convince me killing cops is “psycho” or “evil”. If you knew anything about the history of policing here, you’d understand my feelings. Fuck em🤷🏾‍♀️🤷🏾‍♀️🤷🏾‍♀️

Same story with the Council. Fuck em. They sat on their asses for centuries while people were suffering right down the street from them. They chose to ignore the suffering of Zaun. They were unfazed by Caitlyn telling them about how Silco flooded the Lanes with drugs, pinned all his crimes on the Firelights, and had Marcus working for him as a dirty cop. They didn’t care. But when Jayce and Viktor told the Council that they could make a deal with Silco and give Zaun its independence? THAT’S when they cared. THAT’S what got them up out of their seats, yelling and screaming about “policies” and “procedures”. NOT when Vi and countless others were thrown in Stillwater and forgotten about. NOT when enforcers killed people in cold blood on the bridge during the opening sequence back in episode one. They only cared when they wouldn’t be able to oppress and exploit people anymore. So, like I said. Fuck em. Jinx shoulda killed more 🤷🏾‍♀️🤷🏾‍♀️🤷🏾‍♀️

Now, onto the Firelights. I love the Firelights, as well as their ideals. I want the best for them, I do! However, they are by no means “innocent”. They’re literally a gang. I’m not saying that to make a moral judgement, it’s just a fact. They are a gang. If Silco is a kingpin, and Jinx is his daughter, then she’s just protecting the shimmer from their attacks. I agree with them wanting to dismantle shimmer. But I am saying that by engaging in direct combat with Jinx, they are not “innocent”. At that point it’s a street fight. Anything’s fair game. Additionally, the Firelights have been shown to be willing to use lethal force. Scar would’ve speared Vi in the back if Ekko hadn’t stopped him. So Jinx actually succeeding when she uses lethal force isn’t this big deal y’all like to make it out to be.

As for why she kills them, with the Firelights it’s because they were fighting each other. With enforcers, it’s by virtue of who they are and what they represent to Jinx. She sees them as monsters. She doesn’t explicitly kill them for oppressing her, but that doesn’t need to be made explicit imo. Jinx’s actions are very politically charged, whether she realizes it or not. With the Council, it’s both because of what happened at the tea party, as well as what they represent. They did nothing to help her people for centuries. Her firing the rocket was for revenge.

As for how she goes about it, she kills people quickly. She doesn’t gloat, she doesn’t play with her food, nor does she torture them beforehand. She shoots to kill or blows them up. For me, it’d be a different story if she drew things out and made them suffer for a long time before she kills them. Now that’s fucked up! But that’s not what she does; it’s quick. I’m not gonna lie and act like they don’t suffer at all, but it’s very quick. The length of suffering means a lot. To continue that, Jinx doesn’t disrespect the bodies after. She doesn’t take souvenirs (the feathers from the crows aside lol). Nor does she prop them up weirdly or kick or hit them either. She doesn’t relish her killing, she just does it and moves on.

In conclusion, killing is wrong ofc. But it’s not always as black and white as it’s made out to be, especially in a show as complex as Arcane. Now before somebody’s like “Omg how can you hate Caitlyn but defend Jinx like this?!” that’s a different conversation entirely. I didn’t say anything about Caitlyn, and bringing up another character’s actions when it’s time to criticize your fave is both unserious and pathetic. I get wanting to defend your faves! I just think that’s a weak defense and you should come harder

[helplessavacado]

Arcane S2 Spoilers below the cut because I have some THOUGHTS

I apologize for the person I will become when this show ends because they are consuming my entire brain rn and I cannot imagine how crazy I'll be when the arcs are resolved

Calling Zaunites animals for attacking a memorial of Piltover's leaders/Caitlyn's mom... and then authorizing an attack on the Undercity's memorial for their leader/Vi's dad. A little bit of a double standard methinks. Just a tad of "it's fine when my people do it." Just a smidge. Caitlyn girl I love you as a character but the hypocrisy and privilege is POTENT and I cannot WAIT to see you get called out for it.

Also everyone was talking about how the JayVik divorce was rushed (which like, fair), but I don't see anybody talking about how Caitlyn's turnaround came out of nowhere. Like I know she wasn't on the best of terms with Ambessa in regards to continuing marshal law but that doesn't negate her quest for revenge and ending Jinx. I just??? I really hope we get a more in-depth explanation in arc 3 because that just felt too sudden. I trust the writers (rare in today's media) but that was very strange to me.

Also unless the orange-haired police officer is plot relevant in the next arc I see no point for her and Caitlyn hooking up other than to induce rage. The scream I scrumpt when that girl popped up on screen was primal because wow Caitlyn you really dumped Vi and decided to screw the Piltover version of Matilda. She wanted a yes-man with benefits and I really thought she was better than that. I am all for women's wrongs but damn.

Ekko. Where's my favorite character. YOU GAVE JAYCE BACK BUT WHERE IS EKKO???????? RIOT CAN YOU HEAR ME????? WHERE IS HE???????????? Heimerdinger is also there BUT WHERE IS EKKO

ANYWAY: JAYCE. JAYCE SHAVE THE BEARD ITS MAKING YOU EVIL. JAYCE. JAYCE WHAT DID YOU SEE IN THE ARCANE WHAT THE ACTUAL HELL WAS THAT. I CANT EVEN DEFEND YOU RIGHT NOW MY GUY. WHY DID YOU DO THAT. LET ME SEE THE VISIONS I N E E D TO UNDERSTAND.

Viktor I know you're gonna live because Duh the divorce arc isn't done yet but holy shit PLEASE backhand your ex-situationship for me

I S H A V A N D E R W H A T T H E F U C K. ISHA. WE HAD A HAPPY MOMENT WHY IS EVERYONE'S SOLUTION IN THIS FAMILY SELF-SACRIFICE VIA DEATH AND OR PERMANENT BODILY HARM???????? Sevika with her arm Jinx with the prison bust Vi with her everything Vander with his Also Everything HAVE YOU ALL PERHAPS CONSIDERED THAT A SACRIFICE COULD ALSO BE STRUGGLING THROUGH GRIEF TOGETHER?????

Ambessa. Ambessa when I catch you Ambessa. Singe what the hell my guy.

Mel honey you got this I believe in you. Kick some ass I NEED to see your badassery and new backstory because this is gonna be FUN.

[comicaurora]

spoiler thoughts in no particular order:

The theme of this season seems to be "replacement." Characters are constantly taking on other character's roles. Heimerdinger highlights that Jayce is his former pupil and Ekko is his new pupil. Jinx acquires a Powder-esque kid sidekick and finds herself in Vi's role, while Vi finds herself hurt and abandoned by someone she loves most in a very Powder-y position. Caitlyn struggles to replace her mother, and Ambessa very tactically places herself in that authoritative role to give Caitlyn the motherly guidance she no longer has - essentially replacing Mel in the process. Everyone is being shuffled around, and very few of them are taking it well.

It's interesting to me that, amidst all this replacing, two roles are conspicuously not being filled: Silko and Vander. Silko's death has left a gaping wound in Jinx and Sevika's operation, and neither of them are attempting to replace him - instead, they're trying to figure out their dynamic without him between them. In a strange way, it feels like Jinx is maturing. She's beginning to recognize that she doesn't actually destroy everything she touches; there are things in this world she CAN fix. This is extremely un-Silko of her. If anything, it's a genuinely healthy extrapolation of her dreams as Powder - to be useful, to help. If she's reaching the point where she thinks she really CAN make things instead of just breaking them, that's a legitimately good sign.

Vi is the obvious candidate to become the new Vander, and I think she will eventually. The first three episodes have taken her some of the way along a very complicated journey. A lot of people have pointed out that she sacrificed every part of her identity to try and help Caitlyn in her grief - she put on the uniform of the people who killed her parents and sold out Vander, the people who tortured her in prison. She compartmentalized her love for Powder and convinced herself she could kill her for Caitlyn, even though she demonstrably couldn't. She packed away everything except her moral code, and then Caitlyn nearly shot a child to get to Jinx, so Vi stopped her. And so she learns that Caitlyn didn't appreciate anything of what she was asking of her. She didn't understand the weight of the sacrifice Vi was making for her. She didn't see Vi as a partner, only as a tool for getting her shot at Jinx, and when Vi broke from that purpose, Caitlyn police brutality'd her and abandoned her at the bottom of a hole. We've never seen Vi at this kind of rock bottom before, because she always had her identity, her stubbornness, her anger. She gave them up for love, and when her guard was down, she was punished for it. Vi is the character most reluctant to change. She voices it overtly; she sees everyone else changing, she begs it to stop. Everyone is preserved in her memory from before the night everything went wrong. Powder's not Jinx now, Powder is dead and Jinx is a new problem. Ekko is still "Little Man." I think Vi can't start becoming whoever she's meant to be until she gets past that terror of change, and it looks like she can't do that until she loses absolutely everything.

I'm less clear on what to expect from Caitlyn, but I think it's going to be fascinating. She's really at her worst in this part of the show, and it's incredibly interesting. Her unchallenged worldview is on full display: the undercity is disgusting and evil, the enforcers are the pinnacle of goodness now that the one bad apple has been excised. She was doing Vi a favor giving her the badge, obviously; Vi deserves the badge so she'll kick up whatever fuss she needs to in order to make it happen. Vi's one of the good ones, so Vi can't be like the other Zaunites, those animals. Her mother sealed up The Gray to keep them from asphyxiating from the pollution? Well, they killed her mother, so they don't deserve to breathe that free air anymore. Vi defies her one time and Caitlyn snaps into the only alternative she can currently understand: you're just like them, you're my enemy, you're beneath me. She never really made an effort to understand Vi's world because she clearly thought she was saving her from it. You don't deserve to be down there in the dirt, you deserve to be up here where it's nice. The dichotomy of Piltover Good, Zaun Bad is so deeply ingrained in her that her raw grief has left it completely exposed. If Vi won't help her, she deserves to be left down there. I want to see where they go with this, because Caitlyn's at her own kind of rock bottom right now - a sniper's fixation on her target causing her to hurt and cast away every other priority. Ambessa's correctly identified her as a weapon and is precisely aiming her wherever she needs her to destroy, and Caitlyn is so fixated on Jinx she can't even tell. I expect "what are you shooting for?" to come back in a big way.

I don't know WHAT the hell is going on with Jayce and I am so excited to figure it out. They really sold the whole "whoops you've been meddling with forces far beyond your comprehension just like Heinmerdinger said" thing and the implications are fascinating.

In the same way that Jinx seems to be sort of building a role all her own instead of taking someone's place, Viktor seems to be doing the same thing. He's not taking anyone's place; what he's up to is totally new. He's doing exactly what he wanted to back in season one - using hextech to help the people in most desperate need. He can heal the poisoning of Shimmer and the toxins in Zaun. He has what nobody else in this show has - a form of power that is curative and presently unchallenged. It isn't a fight for him, not like everything else has been. All he's ever cared about was alleviating suffering, and as far as we can tell, now he can. Nobody else was doing anything to help. I am very intrigued to see where this goes and how the magic system gets fleshed out around him.

I have a hunch that wild magic situation might be yeeting Ekko out of the timeline for a bit. The act 2 preview had him on the Remembrance Wall, so I assume the firelights are gonna presume him dead for a minute - bit of a bummer, but if he comes back with his canonical time powers I'll take it.

Minor note, I liked how they highlighted that the council hall was aggressively non-wheelchair-accessible. A very elegant way to underline how Piltover has never actually been a beacon of progress and opportunity.

Have you watched the new Arcane episodes?

my first "oh FUCK yeah" happened during the opening credits when I noticed Ekko's two shadows were moving like the hands on a clock and that momentum carried for basically the whole rest of the viewing experience

[moonsdancer]

Everyone in this scene is wrong (and lying). But also everyone in this scene is right. And Mel is the most right

A drive-by analysis of THAT ep7 scene.

The fandom reading of this scene has long been a source of frustration for me, which I've written about elsewhere in meta here and by way of fic here. Primarily because so much of the focus was on positioning Mel as a mean baddie conniving villain in opposition to Jayce and Viktor and / or using her evil politico-feminine wiles to drive a wedge between Jayce and Viktor (both readings reinforced by a distinct shippery lens, let's be honest). You can watch the full scene here and even the title of that video frames this scene in the ways I outlined above, it was the only somewhat full clip I could find.

But that's not what's happening in this scene.

All three characters have actually got three different and VALID positions and perspectives playing out here, and the show is wonderfully good enough to allow for that nuance even if fandom doesn't:

Mel, the pragmatist and strategist whose job it is to safeguard Piltover and identify threats is proposing the building of a defensive system to combat the clear, oncoming threat of a soon-to-be weaponized hex crystal. While we know in her heart she wants to foster peace, she believes that "war is a failure of statecraft" and she hopes to figure out a diplomatic solution but she's not unaware of the realities of the challenge confronting them (and she has some pretty clear blindspots that she has to confront as well re: how the council / Piltover are positioned). She is also shouldering the alarming news from foreign allies that potential enemies perceive Piltover as "vulnerable" due to the ongoing unrest in the undercity.

Jayce, who is caught between his role as a scientist and his position on the council, to which he was elevated explicitly to protect Piltover from oncoming threats after the two bombing incidents in ep4 and the theft of the hex crystal. He's always wanted hextech to "protect" and "improve lives" but he's also increasingly aware that the threats facing them may require some kind of active means of defense. He wants to take some kind of action, he always does and it's both his strength and his downfall. We also learn later in the episode that he's always dreamed of building magical hammers with which to play vigilante, so this notion of active martial-militarised "defense" has always been in him. Also, important to remember that Jayce by this point had already instituted some pretty reckless, sometimes fascist policies in his bid to "take action", including the decree to restrict movement from Zaun in the interests of protecting the city.

Viktor, sees himself as something of a pacifist-idealist and he's a Zaunite. He believes hextech should only be used to "help save lives", that they are "scientists not soldiers" and no amount of threat or danger justifies building a defense mechanism that may easily become a weapon that's used against the most vulnerable, and specifically against his people or innocents. For context, much like the two above, we can't read his aggression towards Mel and Jayce in this scene without recalling that mere hours before he had been detained on the bridge between the undercity and top-city like a criminal because of a decree that his best friend put in place. He's likely still justifiably smarting from the indignities of that experience.

Everyone in this scene is withholding information or outright lying.

Mel isn't telling the whole truth about her concerns for the city's safety and what she's heard from her allies, she is afraid and one can see it in her face throughout the scene, but she believes she's not in a position to express that.

Jayce isn't sharing that part of him very clearly does want to make weapons, and he already has ideas down for a prototype that he later completes in ep8 to go on the unsanctioned raid with Vi.

Viktor is lying about the potential of the hex crystal being weaponised at the beginning of this scene. I can only surmise he's lying because Viktor is not a stupid man. He recognises the skill and talent in the crude bomb in his hands, it doesn't take a genius to see that whoever built it could make even more advanced weapons EASILY. But he insists that it's "a stretch" - bullshit.

Everyone in this scene is right, too. BUT, and this is key, the show also wants to show the damning consequences of their stances / carry these positions to their likely damning conclusions.

Like really, I think as I've tried to outline above, each one of them has a pretty valid point of view.

Even Jayce, whom a lot of the fandom somewhat unfairly imo tends to dismiss as an impulsive idiot, makes some sense. If his raid with Vi had been carried out with a bit more foresight, it would've been a sound strategy to weaken Silco's power base. And yeah, the inaction has been a serious issue on many fronts. The narrative quickly forces Jayce to learn the most destructive / harmful conclusion of his approach to act first, think through the potential consequences later, when he kills a child.

Viktor is also correct that this is a slippery slope. It's dangerous to hide behind the notion of having "no choice but to do things" because that can so easily be used to justify reprehensible things. He, like Jayce, is forced to confront some harsh truths and his own hypocrisy when he accidentally kills Sky in his thirst to use the hexcore to strengthen his body.

Mel, who understands war and power plays better than anyone in the room, knows how precarious things are and that the city is essentially a powder keg. She's correct that the crystals will be weaponized and it'll come back to bite Piltover in the arse, and the show's own narrative proves her right (which is why I said above she's kind of the most right). As far as we know, they're all dead right now because no one ever got around to building a damn defense system. Thanks, guys. But like the other two, she's forced to confront the negative sides to her plan in the shape of her mother, who sees any move to develop hextech, even in much-needed defense as an opportunity to exploit for her own benefit and hunger for power.

tl;dr

The one thing this show is fairly good at is multipolar ideas and perspectives. In some instances, this may become frustrating. But in this scene it's one of the STRONGEST times that I feel like it's such a strong narrative choice because it gives us three distinct characters, with three distinct points of view, and none of them undermine each other - but they are held accountable and forced to learn. That's really mature writing.

The unfortunate thing is that so many fandom readings only acknowledge one side or actively shit on individual characters, which, and I'm not afraid to say this, is such a lazy, reductive way to read these three, their positions and the story as a whole, imo.

Anyway, this was meant to be a drive-by post but here we are. Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.

Other random questions I ponder because of this scene:

Does Viktor ever feel guilty about the fact that he's helped Piltover to widen the gap of inequality with Zaun as part of the Hextech innovator team, and is in some ways, kind of a sellout? Could make for interesting nuances to his journey next season. Is he deemed a sellout?

Just how long has Jayce been playing around with swaggy prototypes of hextech weapons. He was already dabbling prior to this scene at the Talis Forge. Hm.

If they make it out alive, will Mel get to say she told them so? Because I'd really like for that to happen, bye!

[pocket-size-cthulhu]

ARCANE SPOILERS~

Watched a video essay the other day that was like, "what if you're rooting for the WRONG people in ARCANE??"

And i was like, first of all, you guys are rooting for someone??? 😅 All of these characters deserve happiness but they are all making terrible choices that i just can't get behind lololol, who are you "rooting" for at the expense of someone else??

Second of all though, when the video went on to say, "imagine the greedy topsiders as the villains" i was like... That's LITERALLY the point of the show. Not topside=bad undercity=good, but that Piltover IS evil, despite appearances, it's worse than it looks; and Zaun is... Also evil but maybe not all bad. It challenges your first perception of what two such cities are going to be like.

Here's the thing.

a) Arcane is Jinx' show. Hers are the eyes that introduce us to this world. She's making the decisions that shape the plot and when she's not, the decisions others make that shape the plot are usually about her. And Jinx is of the Undercity through and through.

It's not a stretch to say that the creators probably did this in part to challenge (white, Western) perceptions that this shining City Of Progress MUST be the "good guys". Zaun and Piltover are both filled with evil, but one type of evil looks more acceptable to the Western eye. We see corruption and greed irl but as long as it hides behind riches and glamour we Pretend We Do Not See It.

It's pretty obvious that Zaun isn't a nice place. It's not safe, it's not healthy, the people there are not prospering; but i do feel like the show goes to pains to tell the audience that Piltover isn't better than Zaun. In some ways, it's actually worse.

b) there... Really isn't good/evil in this show. The list of dualities Arcane explores could be a mile long, but good vs evil is not among them. There are no heroes and villains, just messy people making decisions in less than ideal circumstances.

It's just my opinion, but i think you're supposed to understand and care about all of the characters and want them all to be happy (those characters including Piltover and Zaun, as they are basically characters unto themselves), but you understand them as complex people who make good and bad decisions. Is Silco's iron grip on the Undercity worse than Mel's subtle manipulation? Are Jayce's naive optimism and equally naive decision to go to war better than Zaun kids looting the home of a rich academic? Is Piltover's total neglect of Zaun somehow more moral than Jinx's retaliative terror? Is Piltover's treacherous, silver-tongued society better than the honest, if dangerous, relationships of people in the Undercity?

Jinx IS the hero. And the villain. Silco is the villain because we don't like his methods, but we do see his point so is he a real villain? Heimerdinger never kills anyone so he's a hero(?), but we can see how his decisions actively make things worse for others.

It's reductive to paint this show in terms of good vs bad and that's the point. Real life is like that too. It's close to home. It's really good.

[incognito-duo]

Pls anyone correct me if I misunderstood any of this, but to me, it just made me think about how Jinx attacking the council is seen as bad and terrorism (but if the sheep's always being hurt by the wolf, would it be bad for the sheep to fight back? Would it be bad for the sheep to kill the wolf to ensure no one else in the pack dies?) But Cait can totally just pollute Zaun with toxic gas cus PILTOVER CONTROLS THEIR AIR???

When Vi wants to get revenge on Silco, to kill him, mess up his entire shimmer factory, she didn't care who she was hurting. But she still felt sympathy and stopped when a child got hurt, even though she wanted to continue. Jayce stopped her from getting her revenge on Silco - Piltover's Wonder Boy is telling Vi, a Zaunite who's been deeply hurt by Silco and couldn't get her sister from him cus she was taken by enforcers at age 14 - because it was dangerous and would hurt too many people. Because it was too violent - a violence that she's seen and gotten used to, a violence that she endures every day, one that's inflicted on her and the rest of Zaun from Topside.

So we have Zaunites who want revenge, but they're stopped or seen as bad, criminals, dangerous, going too far. But Caitlyn? She can become a decorated officer immedtately after getting her mom's key, she can LITERALLY POLLUTE AND TAKE AWAY ZAUN'S ABILITY TO BREATHE??? (The gasp I did when I heard the Kirammen archive thing say "The undercity deserves to breathe" LORDDDD LOOK ME IN THE EYE-) and it's ok in Piltover's eyes. It's needed, these are necessary evils. It's seen as different as Vi trying to get revenge on Silco, different from Jinx blowing up the council.

Cait asks Vi to take up a enforcer badge because, in her eyes, that's the only valid way to get revenge. To do it her way, to do it as a enforcer. In Caitlyn's eyes, Vi is one of the "good ones." (And Vi, due to being attatched to her past, let's Caitlyn believe that. She plays the part, she works with enforcers, she BECOMES one - because her attachment to her past makes her... a coward, I'll say it I'm sorry 😭 like Vi your girl is walking around saying she's a decorated officer, she's not the kind girl you think she is. She "changed" the moment she decided she can let toxic gas out in Zaun and you let her to do that without any protest. The truth is that Cait was always capable of that imo.)

Cait respects Ekko because he wants to stop Silco, which aligns with what Piltover wants. The moment he started calling her out about being a enforcer, about how they work with Silco, about how they're oppressive and killers, she's instantly in his face denying it. Zaunites are only respected if they align with Topside, if they aren't, then screw you. (And your water and air, cus I was yelling with Ekko when Jayce was like "but it's far away from the fissures." Alsooo, yes Jayce deserves to be chewed out for that, but Heimerdinger should be too...? He was a councilman too, and though he was one of the better ones and WAS correct about the Arcane and didn't deserve to be kicked out like that, he was complacent with what was going on in Zaun. But anyway-)

"She's in your blood" when Caitlyn said that to Vi - OH MY GOSHHH. It soldified that Caitlyn wasn’t on both sides, cus you can never actually be on both sides! She's for Piltover, she's a enforcer, she'll kill and hunt Zaunites like animals, she'll pollute their air and water, and she leaves Vi when Vi tries to stop Caitlyn from trying to shoot at a CHILD. (I WAS TWEAKING WATCHING THAT-) She truly thinks that if Vi were to dare say that she's wrong, it's cus she's from the Undercity, that she's born wrong, that she's just like Jinx and isn't "one of the good ones." (You telling me that Cait wasn't in her head justifying that it's ok to endanger a kid cus they're a Zaunite? That they're on Jinx's side?)

When Zaun gets revenge, it's a crime. When Piltover gets revenge, it's justice. And it makes me so very sad and angry.

(This is why Ekko is the best because he's not like Vi where she works with enforcers, but he isn't like Silco, where they were hurting Zaun by controlling them with Shimmer. Ekko is the only character who truly has done not a single thing wrong and is the only one who consistently cares and wants the better for Zaun. Cus like... you can argue that Jinx is fighting for Zaun as a more personal thing cus she's angry about Silco's death, it's less so about wanting to build up Zaun. Well, maybe it will be, but at this moment no - Silco wanted a independent Zaun too. He's not a good man by any means, but that want is valid and shared and is also villainized by Piltovers. Again, I'm very new to the show still and really wanna hear others if I misunderstood something. Ekko is still the best)

I don't really go here (in the sense that I don't engage directly with the Arcane fandom) but I just wanted to point out how the conversation between Caitlyn and Vi where Vi is offered the badge as a test of her loyalty is a prime example of how the show is constantly asking its audience to think about who is allowed to grieve and take revenge and who is not. You can see that theme reverberate throughout their interactions for the rest of the first act; idk if that's something folks are discussing in here but that's what's on the front of my mind rn

[st-just]

Most of your Noxus take is correct but there are a couple of other things i feel like pointing out. Black Noxians are a New Lore thing, so theyre not mostly Black unless you meant morally. In their old lore they were The Place Evil People (who are white) Come From but now theyre trying to reframe it like no nation is specifically just full of bad people so much as the governments are bad while also trying to diversify previously all-white nations like the former Place Good People (who are white) Come From, Demacia (which has flipped conceptually to be very oppressive to anyone who uses magic, leading to a recent event in lore being a mass rebellion of mages).

The Medarda clan to me comes off as possibly Shuriman on origin based on their individual aesthetics and Mel's mom's accent. Shurima is a desert nation which had part of it conquered as Noxian territory, so that's not implausible.

Either way they take the "Only the Strong Survive" mentality literally (their motto is Strength Above All) and for all foreign affairs they are very imperialist/expansionist, trying to unify the world under the Noxian banner. Meanwhile on the inside it is just a lot of political intrigue and backstabbing and assassinations between competing noble houses. One of the places Mel painted is a sunny and happy place (in a sarcastic sense) called The Immortal Bastion so it gives you a certain idea of what kind of place Noxus is tbh.

Piltover used to be The Good Guy Steampunk city, Zaun was The Mad Scientist Chempunk city but when they revamped the lore they took a much more subtle approach and added some class war stuff instead.

With all of this, though, surprisingly casting Jayce as Latino (both in casting and based on his mothers name and accent) and Caitlyn as Asian have been more of a racial shake-up in their world and lore than Black Noxians. Typically their Asian coded characters have been from a place called Ionia, but here's Cait just being Asian without needing to be explained as Ionian immigrants.

Ah okay just Noxus is just basically ye old generic evil empire that they've been trying to backfill some nuance/internal drama in? Yeah makes sense.

Come From, Demacia (which has flipped conceptually to be very oppressive to anyone who uses magic, leading to a recent event in lore being a mass rebellion of mages).

Oh cool I might eventually get a half-decent Dragon Age tv show after all. Preemptively saying the mages did nothing wrong.

With all of this, though, surprisingly casting Jayce as Latino (both in casting and based on his mothers name and accent) and Caitlyn as Asian have been more of a racial shake-up in their world and lore than Black Noxians. Typically their Asian coded characters have been from a place called Ionia, but here's Cait just being Asian without needing to be explained as Ionian immigrants.

I mean I'd just kind of assumed Piltover was kind of just Runeterra's New York or similar, honestly. Like, sufficiently large center of trade and economic growth (and with a sufficiently prestigious university) that previous waves of immigrants are just integrated into the social fabric in time for the next ones to arrive. (Also, racism just doesn't seem to be a thing? Which presumably makes the process rather smoother).

The bigger question is how Viktor has a Russian accent when literally noone else in the show does. Gotta assume there's a Little Moscow buried somewhere in the Undercity, I guess.

[takerfoxx]

Arcane, Season 1, Episode 7, "Oil and Water," First Impressions!

Evolution does not always mean improvement.

It was inevitable that our game characters would eventually take on their final form, become as we know them in LoL itself. Unfortunately, that is not always a positive thing.

In the case of Vi and Jayce, they finally take up their iconic weapons and act as the defenders of Piltover, and we get a pretty awesome fight as they work together to fight off Silco’s Shimmer-induced henchmen. However, immediately after they are treated to a harsh lesson of who ultimately suffers in war, and the consequences of meeting an evil with direct force. Were they wrong to act? No, not necessarily. But to sit atop one’s throne and order violence for the “greater good” is one thing. It’s another to see the innocents that will suffer and die as a result of your order, especially when it’s by your own hand.

In the case of Jinx, Silco’s love for her compels him to seek help from probably the last person one ought to go to in such a situation. Singed is effective, but like the proverbial monkey paw seeking his help will often make you wish that you hadn’t. I mean, dude had to freaking tranq Silco just to keep him from freaking out because of what he was going to do to Jinx. Silco!

Regardless, Jinx’s body has been saved, but her mind has been further fractured, and now she is loose, and coming for Cait, whom she blames for taking Vi away from her.

Also, Singed has a daugher? Was it Rio the Salamander? It seems like something he'd do.

And then we get to poor Viktor, another excellent reason why seeking the help of Singed is a bad idea. Yes, combining Shimmer with those runes and touching the hexcore is “healing” him, replacing his corrupted flesh with metal. But even as he was able to walk and run for the first time, it was hard to feel any triumph for him, because we all know what happens next. It’s not enough to simply restore strength to his leg. His entire body is failing, and so he desperately gives more and more to the hexcore.

And that results in the loss of his childhood friend Sky, poor girl. My man is about to snap.

Though seriously, lock the door from the inside next time you meddle with powers beyond mortal ken.

On a brighter note, Heimerdinger seems to have taken Jayce’s words to heart and has resolved to make up for his neglect of his people and goes to the Undercity to see if he can help. Doesn’t work out at first, but that leads him to Ekko, fortunately still alive, and the two form a bond from their love of machines and their desire to help their people. If ever there was a more unlikely pair that could do the most good, it’s them.

I admit, I was somewhat surprised how little Mel had to do in this episode, considering that she got the lead-in flashback. But aside from that tiff with her mom and the council meeting, she didn’t do a whole lot (unless she did and I just forgot about it). She is an interestingly morally grey character, and one of the few that I really can’t tell where her story will end up. Same for her mom. Why is she really there?

As for Vi, her problems are a lot more personal. She feels that she failed to bring the help to the Undercity like she promised, she feels that she failed in her duty to protect Piltover, and we get her sobbing in the shower over the memory of Vi walking away from her in the rain as water pounds down both in reality and in her mind, a clear metaphor for the oil and water, but also possibly something else often associated with women and water and-

Look, they’re being anything but subtle. Cait is falling for Vi, and much like Jinx, she feels rejected by her, but unlike Jinx, she has no one to blame for it.

Unfortunately, she so happens to be that person that Jinx blames for costing her her sister, and now the newly healed and completelyderanged sister of her crush is on the loose, things are about to get a whole lot worse for her.

Only one episode left. My body is ready, but my heart is not.

[nefelibatat]

I think Jinx is aware of the fact that Silco is to Vi what Caitlyn is to her, actually. The dinner party in particular always read to me as a fair trade kind of deal — as in, “I'll get rid of the person who hurt our family and made you feel threatened, but you gotta do the same on your end or it's not gonna work”. Hence the derisive scoff when Vi refuses to shoot. She knows she can't keep both of her loved ones, so Vi doesn't get to keep both of hers either. That sounds fair, right?

The thing about Jayce though:

and can all be traced back to the jayce's dangerous experiments, which vander's kids never would have gotten their hands on if it had been secure in the academy instead of lying around his living room

is that he couldn't have done that. The Academy would've never authorized the project because of Piltover's strict anti-magic laws. Jayce had to do it in secrecy, using whatever means available, or just give up. He wasn't counting on someone breaking into his study (out of every house in Piltover, a lot of which are probably more enticing targets), stumbling upon those particular materials even though they are hidden in a chest that doesn't stand out in any way, and then horribly misusing them.

The truth is that the whole story — Ekko seeing Jayce and deciding to follow him back home, Powder finding the crystals because there was a sandwich nearby and dropping one in a hurry when the owner came back at a bad moment, Silco resurfacing at the exact same time — had an extremely low chance of happening the way it did. While it adds sting to the tragedy and justifies Jinx's name, it also means Jayce had no reasonable way of foreseeing his actions would end up hurting people from the Undercity. What he was doing was dangerous; he even acknowledges that (“A little danger is worth the risk, don't you think?”). However, it also had the potential to massively improve people's lives, and the person in danger was mostly himself.

So as usual, the root of all evil in Arcane doesn't come down to anyone's individual fault, but systematic issues. Had the Council been more open to innovation (ironically, for a city of progress), Jayce could've conducted his experiments in a safer manner, and had they done more to help Zaun, the kids wouldn't need to steal anything in the first place. Of course Jayce eventually becomes a part of the system and makes a boatload of questionable decisions, which is why Jinx blows him up along with the other people responsible (…and Viktor). But when talking about Act I specifically, I find it hard to say he's done anything wrong.

arcane season 1 is like yes this is jinx's villain origin story, but if you think about it, is she really that evil? is fighting back against your oppressors with weapons of their own creation (both hextech and jinx) really that unjustified? and personally i don't think it is. but the point isn't finding the answer, it's that you can ask so many difficult questions in the first place

[bobobono]

I have no one to talk about Arcane with so here I am

Love Mel, Victor, Vi, Sevika, EKKO

Caitlyn is cool, idk I just feel 🤷

I don’t hate Jayce but god why is this man so quick to fight

Jinx is so unhinged after the time skip I love it

Multiple times I thought oh [character] is dead! But they wouldn’t kill then … right????

To keep my sanity, I googled many characters to find out if they lived or not

I agree with Vi about doin smth but don’t agree with Jayce about doing smth… maybe I just don’t like him

Thought Mel was gonna be more evil and vile when I saw her and was ready to fall in love with a villain, but obviously she isn’t and I fell in love anyways

I also thought the show was gonna be about the sisters getting separated after Jinx is discovered to have some supernatural ability (like the mages they talked about) and she gets sent to the academy. And then there’s a war between the topside and undercity, and they would be on opposing sides. Like I was half expecting Viktor to take her in …. Obviously I was wrong in many ways

[thelittlepalmtree]

So firstly look at my icon. I am not a silco simp, silco is not even my favorite character. Secondly I actually wrote a very long post explaining why Silco can't be shoved into the villain role.

My point is not that Silco did no wrong. I just think that if you are focusing on Silco as toxic or evil you are missing the point of the show. Silco isn't the antagonist, in fact he's much more of an antihero. The antagonist is class oppression. How is Silco significantly different from Mel and Jayce other than their wealth and class? In fact the whole point of his relationship with Jinx and sevika to a lesser extent is that he does care about people. He, like everyone else in the show, is trying to navigate circumstances that are impossible. And unlike Vi and Jayce and Viktor he actually does make change. His methods work to some extent the undercity has a lot more money, and the air is literally cleaner. The people that were sacrificed along the way? Well how many of them would have been sacrificed to the status quo anyway?

I mean the second you examine Silco's ethics and actions you see that he has the same morality as any twitter or tumblr leftist you can find. And THAT is the fucking point. That change costs something. Silco is what happens when you're willing to sacrifice almost anything to make it. But in the end even he couldn't sacrifice everything. And so the dream of autonomy for the undercity was destroyed.

This is why if your only analysis of media is to pass moral judgments on the characters you are losing so much. Imagine the complexities of Silco's relationships and going "well I wouldn't want to be his friend and that's all I need to know" you lose so much!

"Silco is toxic" "Silco is evil" "Silco corrupted powder"

tell me you didn't understand arcane without telling me you didn't understand arcane.