#i'm not saying it doesn't make sense i mean it's a completely logical thing to do

[sepiasys]

I love trauma! I love being traumatized!

[siena-sevenwits]

Disclaimer: These thoughts are more emotionally than logically expressed, and reflect my own experience and preference.

[m4lexxx67]

Everyone go read this, it's hilarious as well as interesting and maybe even a little magical. I mean I don't understand all of it, obviously, but it's enough to make me happy 😊

Also as a German speaking person, I have to say that some parts of this (namely some the names of the elements) read like very poorly translated German because if you took e.g. the German name for oxygen (Sauerstoff) and translated it literally into English, it would be called sourstuff (same goes for hydrogen, carbon, and nitrogen). Which I think is the main reason, I find this so funny because it just sounds so ridiculous in English, and then it gets you thinking "I literally call it that everyday, what the fuck?" 😂😂

look, I know I've talked about this essay (?) before but like,

If you ever needed a good demonstration of the quote "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic", have I got an exercise for you.

Somebody made a small article explaining the basics of atomic theory but it's written in Anglish. Anglish is basically a made-up version of English where they remove any elements (words, prefixes, etc) that were originally borrowed from romance languages like french and latin, as well as greek and other foreign loanwords, keeping only those of germanic origin.

What happens is an english which is for the most part intelligible, but since a lot everyday english, and especially the scientific vocabulary, has has heavy latin and greek influence, they have to make up new words from the existing germanic-english vocabulary. For me it kind of reads super viking-ey.

Anyway when you read this article on atomic theory, in Anglish called Uncleftish Beholding, you get this text which kind of reads like a fantasy novel. Like in my mind it feels like it recontextualizes advanced scientific concepts to explain it to a viking audience from ancient times.

Even though you're familiar with the scientific ideas, because it bypasses the normal language we use for these concepts, you get a chance to examine these ideas as if you were a visitor from another civilization - and guess what, it does feel like it's about magic. It has a mythical quality to it, like it feels like a book about magic written during viking times. For me this has the same vibe as reading deep magic lore from a Robert Jordan book.

[inkskinned]

it's because the bear wouldn't kill me just for being a woman. the bear doesn't kill me for fun. the bear can be shouted at, and will leave me alone. the bear won't make a tiktok complaining about how i crossed to the other side of the path when i saw him coming. if a bear kills me, it's just being a bear: it cannot understand logic. it is not acting out of malice - just fear or hunger.

bell hooks once wrote about how porches might be the only outside space left for women - it is still the domain of the house while it is also outside-but-safe. when i am in the woods, i am in the bear's home, and he has a right to defend his property. outside spaces - anywhere at night, certain parks in the day - those are often implicitly "owned" by men. i cannot explain the feeling of knowing when you have entered a man's "territory." you walk into a place and just know you are in their space. you get a sick sense - you're in danger.

the other day a group of about 8 men were fooling around in the woods while i walked my dog. i had to go around, take the extra 3 miles just to avoid them. it's okay, i like walking. this wasn't even a #feminism moment. it was just a tuesday.

what a plain and easy question. only one of the situations is seen as a tragic accident. i would rather die and have a park bench erected in my honor rather than have my family questioned about why they let me, an adult, walk in the woods in the first place when i should really be at home in the kitchen.

i worked in retail and food service. i have had women say and do absolutely heinous and abusive things to me - not because i was a woman, but because i was there, and they were angry. the way men treated me when angry was different - it was because i was a woman. you can always feel the difference, how there's an undertone of i'd hurt you worse if i could get away with it. i keep seeing people try to cite stupid statistics. why is there always a strange rage whenever women agree on things? like men can argue their way out of our lived experiences? it isn't a buzzfeed quiz - which of these traumas are you? 10 super cute ways not to fear strange men.

i have actually (thrice!) seen a bear in the wild, by the way. i died each time, obviously, and am a ghost writing to you. (it was scary but completely and utterly fine). the second encounter was a black bear with her cub. she looked at me like - do we have to do this or are we good? my dog was busy sniffing a bush, completely nonreactive. i felt like i was in a sitcom: feminist poet reacts - does she actually mean she'd choose the bear? my only thought was - she's so beautiful. her paws are massive.

and there's a part of me that feels the rage spinning out in a corner. why do we have to come up with quippy little comments in order to teach men empathy. would you rather die in a car accident or due to a mugging? and would you rather your house burn down due to an electrical fire or due to arson? gee willikers - it's almost like we're human people, and want to risk the accident versus the intention.

i would rather my last thought be oh shit, a bear rather than i'm a person too. why doesn't that matter? why don't you care?

[rosyandraw]

idk if this is redundant on your end but thoughts on Damen needing to talk during sex? in the books it isn’t even dirty talk it’s just endless want for Laurent and how long he’s been waiting for him and how different Laurent feels. Also in canon & in ur own writing

Definitely not redundant! You have just knocked on the Damen Character Study door in my head lmao but it's late and idk how much sense this will make so i'm sorry in advance.

Mini meta on Why Damen Likes to Talk During Sex in Canon

First and foremost words are hugely important to Damen, not just during sex but in general. It is part of the reason that Vere trips him up so badly, why he just doesn’t get it. Because Vere is a veil of word play and innuendo, it’s double speak and flowery bullshit and lies.

That’s not Damen. His word is his bond, it’s tied to his honour and they mean a great deal to him. He never says anything he doesn’t mean. Ever. If it’s coming out of his mouth he is saying that shit with his whole damn chest and doesn't give a fuck.

The few times he is forced to lie or to say something he doesn’t mean he says it as a strategy play but it barely makes it out of his mouth and he hates it.

For a long time by the time they get to Ravenel Damen has been playing a part. Living a half truth and not saying everything he means. Or wants to say.

Likewise, in Akielos, Damen keeps himself held back. We know this because in 3 books, despite being the darling crown prince and heroic military leader, he mentions 1��person by name that he is actually and genuinely close to. One. He’s never been in love with anyone before Laurent, he doesn’t get close, he doesn’t get particularly attached. If he did Jokaste would have been a Princess and not just his mistress.

It speaks of a whole heap of childhood trauma and issues, thanks in large part to his father and Kastor and this picture that is painted of strength in Akielos being The Most Important Thing. (And i have too many thoughts on said implied trauma to write it all out properly here because it's an essay unto itself.)

We also know that Damen does the talking thing with Jokaste too. So we know it's an indicator of intimacy in bed for him. He's certainly not doing it in Vask, for example. Because Damen values words so highly he does wear his heart on his sleeve, but he guards that heart close. Sharing his feelings becomes something then tied to both the value Damen places on words and the lack of emotional intimacy in his life. To Damen, opening up like that especially during sex, is an act of giving unto its self.

Damen is strong, yes. Crazy strong and the perfect warrior. But he also likes the wordy sad poems and has craved approval (and affection) from his father and Kastor seemingly most of his life. For example, Kastor stabbed him and made Damen believe with words that it was a good thing because it meant Kastor respected him enough to fight him like a man.

It’s the perfect anecdote to draw all of those ideas together. Damen being happy about being stabbed at 13 by his brother because Kastor said it was a good thing to be strong enough to fight properly and bear the consequences.

Words matter to Damen, he assumes they do to other people too. It's what nearly gets him killed.

It’s funny really, because Damen values words but he himself is a man of action and Laurent values action but is a man of words.

When it comes to sex we see them swap places from their usual dynamic and therein lies the intimacy.

Laurent acts and Damen talks. It’s a complete role reversal and it was always meant to be. Pacat has said, several times, that Laurent tops Damen with words all the time and it was a purposeful choice to have Laurent bottom because of this. So to follow that through to it's logical conclusion for the sex scenes to really hit we needed to see them swap places completely and Damen needed to talk.

Laurent is a mouthy little shit but when it comes to his important scenes (the building of their intimacy and their sex scenes) it's never his words that he's speaking loudest with. Like when he just hugged Damen after the meeting with Jokaste in KR or when he went to get ice for him in PG, it's an offering in place of words and Laurent does it frequently: letting his actions speak louder than any of his words because to Laurent words don't really matter, lies are too easy. He's been taken in by words before.

Damen gets to Laurent through his actions and it's Laurent's moments of honesty, of saying something unexpected, that make Damen really pay attention. This isn't to say that Laurent's actions don't get to him, they do of course, but only really when Damen comes to realise that's how Laurent is being honest. Likewise in reverse for Laurent.

It's the language the other understands that allows the distance to bridge, but the intimacy comes in the opposite every time.

So when they fall into bed Laurent instigates with action, all three times they are together. And Damen talks. Because it’s the thing that is important to them that they are willingly giving and sharing and that is what makes it intimate.  

Quite simply, Damen holds himself back emotionally so talking during sex like that is a way for Damen to let go and to let his partner know that's it not just sex. Laurent, in reverse, shows his want through the instigation and by the time it happens they both know what it means: Laurent never does that and Damen knows it. Laurent knows Damen says what he fucking means.

It's such an intimate sex scene because of that awareness.

In my writing I kind of try to take that and run with it. Damen says what he means and what he wants Laurent to hear, because words of affirmation are important to him personally so he makes sure to share that.

Plus, it’s just sexy, you know? Got to love a man who talks in bed, that sex rough voice when he’s so far gone you know what his saying is just the shit flying through his head?

Hot.

Loved this ask so much. I could literally write a thesis on Damen lmao

[love-byers]

so as hard as it may be to believe, i was a mileven shipper right up until just before vol 2 of s4 came out. not hardcore twitter mileven, but a shipper nonetheless. i did love will and mike's relationship, maybe even more than mileven, but i never clocked it as romantic. i vividly remember thinking "aww, will and mike would be so cute together but they would never let that happen." and never thought about it again. even when i saw the rain fight and heard "it's not my fault you don't like girls" i was like "ohh wow so will is probably gay" and didn't even think he was in love with mike. i didn't believe that until the s4 trailer said "i think there is someone he likes" and of course, this was because of my own heteronormativity. i dismissed everything i saw and didn't even look for hints because the idea that the writers would allow a gay relationship between two main characters was not even a thought in my head. once i dropped that and started to trust that the writers actually cared and did want queer characters/storylines, everything made sense.

so i went into s4 thinking mileven were gonna be fine and that will was sad and hopelessly in love with mike. i mean fully believing it. so im mindlessly watching s4 e2 and thinking "aww poor will mike is so in love with el he can't pay attention to will" no questions asked.

then the fight happened. when mike blew up and said "you were! you were! you were rolling your eyes, you were moping, you were barely talking you basically sabotaged the whole day" i was like " how do you know that" but still, i dismissed it and barely thought about it.

then it happened. "we're friends! we're. friends." all the alarm bells went off. red flags flew up. my eyebrows furrowed. "ummm what mike? he didn't say you were more than friends. why is he viewing this romantically and why is he being so defensive???"

i was so deep into believing the writers would never let the gay romance happen, but that just couldn't get past me. there's no other way that line can be interpreted. that's a trope that means one thing and one thing only.

my next thought was "ok, this is gonna be like the rain fight. will is gonna be really hurt by this and go silent."

but nope, will claps back with "well we used to be best friends!" and i was stunned. utterly stunned. what is going on here? what is this dynamic? and why is mike more worried about this than finding el? why did he care enough to completely stop walking so he couple blow up at will for not talking?? but still, i was somehow able to let this go. because the writers just wouldn't do that. would they?

the mileven fight happens and i've never wanted to backhand a teenager more in my entire life. i'm reminded of stancy and their whole "i love you" thing

then THIS happened, and i was thinking more and more that mike doesn't love el romantically. look at his face when will says "whatever you didn't say you can say it to her then". will starts talking but the camera stays focused on mike and will remains blurred. we're supposed to be taking in mikes reaction. he says yes, but frowns and blinks rapidly. will was trying to reassure him, but mike has not been reassured. i don't know how to describe the emotion on his face. it's like you just had a chance to clear up your lie, but you still didn't, and now you're back to thinking about the moment your lie will blow up in your face. it's like his face is saying, "no, i can't just say it to her then because i don't want to."

the scene where they talk on top of the car is what started to make me think mike doesn't love el romantically. his reaction to will saying "it's scary, to say how you really feel. especially to people you care about the most. because..what if they don't like the truth?" he nodded. he felt seen. i remember thinking "ooooh. he doesn't love her and he knows she won't like that" everything made sense. if we apply mike's monologue logic to this, it makes no sense. whatever it is that mike is feeling, he thinks el won't like it. then he supposedly decides that the moment to tell her that is when she's dying?

mike is lying. he was holding back saying how he feels because he knows el won't like it. then when she's dying, he suddenly thinks his feelings are what she wants enough that it'll save her life? whatever he was feeling on top of the car and what he tells her in the monologue are not the same. you don't tell someone something they won't like when they're dying.

and 2 years ago i came to this conclusion without an ounce me believing byler could be canon.

[sanguineterrain]

Hi, I love your fics. Feel free to say no to this request but I was wondering if maybe you could write something about asexual Jason Todd? I've always felt like he'd be aspec and identified with him because of that. You write intimacy and love without sex so well, and it'd be wonderful to see it with ace Jason. Maybe one where he tells the reader and he's really scared but they accept him? But if you don't want to, completely fine. Thank you for sharing your writing. 🧡

Hey there nonnie. This one is very personal to me; I'm also ace and have often had the thought that Jason is aspec too. I think sometimes I write him that way without realizing it. I hope you and others enjoy this one! 💓

asexual!jason todd x gn!reader. tw sexuality discussion, some internalized acephobia, love confession. please be kind in the comments.

****

Rain patters on the kitchen window. You'd come over with the excuse of the two egg and cheese sandwiches from the bodega Jason likes so much.

"I think I could eat egg and cheese sandwiches for every meal," he says, mustard on his nose.

You want to say something stupid. Something about bringing him egg and cheese sandwiches in the rain forever. Something about a grave and hunger and what it means to be fed, to feed.

"From anywhere or specifically from the bodega?" you ask.

"Bodega, obviously. Alfred's, too. And yours. Food made with love." He shakes the foil. "I can taste the love."

"Jason?"

"Hm?"

"I..." You touch your nose. "Mustard."

He wipes it off. The thin takeout napkin is tiny in his hand.

"Don't even know how it got up there," he mumbles.

Oh, God. You're about to say something stupid.

"I love you," you blurt. "I—I'm falling in love with you, Jason."

Silence. Jason freezes mid-bite.

"Fuck," he whispers.

You watch as he springs from the couch and starts to pace. He chews on a cuticle, eyes wild. The sandwich is abandoned on the coffee table. You frown.

"Jason. Jay. Hey. Jaybird."

Nothing. You catch his free hand and rub his knuckles. Jason's eyes dart to you. He stops.

"I didn't say that to scare you," you say, even though it hurts, the idea that your love scares him. "It's okay if you don't feel the same."

"I do," Jason says miserably. "Fuck, I do. I love you so much. You're the best thing that's ever happened to me."

You squeeze his hand, suddenly, incandescently happy.

"You do?" you ask.

"But I—" He shakes his head. "I can't love you the way you want me to."

"Jay, whatever you think coming back did, I promise that—"

"No." Jason swallows hard and shuts his eyes. "God, that's the thing. 'S not from the Pit. I thought—y'know, I waited for everything to slide into place. The Lazarus Pit is s'posed to resurrect a person. Build them anew. But I felt the same."

"Felt the same?"

Jason looks at you then, and you know that expression. It's a plea. Don't use this information to hurt me.

You tug him back to the couch, coax him into sitting. He very carefully doesn't let any part of him touch you.

"I didn't, uh, have a name for it when I was younger. I didn't, like, think about sex or anything like that very much before B took me in 'cause I was in survival mode, y'know?"

"That makes sense, Jay," you offer gently.

"Right. Well, but it just... stayed that way. And before you ask, yeah, I've tried. I've tried to force the feelings." He takes a shaky breath. "I remember Dick telling me about how he'd started dating Kori—I mean, Kori, she's beautiful, y'know? And I was like, what's wrong with me that I can't feel that? I knew that she was beautiful, logically, but I didn't... feel it. I picked it apart for months, trying to figure out why I couldn't be like him or B or Selina."

"Oh, Jay..."

"No, I know. I tried. I crushed on a few people, but I never acted on it 'cause I knew there was something... different. Something to hide. And then I thought the Pit would give that to me, that feeling I've never had, and it didn't. And I guess I should be happy that it's not something that needs to be fixed or restored or whatever, but all I feel is shame. I feel sick when someone looks at me like I'm a piece of meat. I attract more attention with how I look now, and it's worse than before, having no control over how people desire me."

You frown. "Jason, if I've ever made you feel that way, I hope you'd tell me. I'm sorry if I have."

"No, you—you're perfect. God, you make me feel so safe. Cared for in a way I haven't known in a long time. And that's why this is so shit. 'Cause this won't work. You want something I can't give you."

"Who says I don't want what you can give me?"

Jason laughs. It comes out choked. "Oh, no, no. You don't know what you're saying. Maybe it'll take six months or a year or two years but you'll get fed up with not having sex. I'm not worth celibacy. I know I'm not."

"Jason." You lightly touch his cheek. He looks at you, eyes wet. "Oh, Jay. Why do you think that? Why do you think you're only good for your body?"

"Hah. I've only been good for my body for years now. 'S nothing new, and it doesn't matter whether I'm a boyfriend or a soldier."

"Jason. It does matter. It does. You're not a body to me, you're a person. A brain. A heart. A good soul."

He blinks fast. "Don't... y'don't have to say that stuff. Let me down easy. It's okay if you leave. I don't have what you want."

"But you do. There's no reason you don't. Sex? I can do without."

He scoffs. "That easy, huh?"

"With you? Yes," you say. "Easiest choice I've ever made, actually. Like deciding to bring you a breakfast sandwich. I woke up and I did that. Because I love you."

His fingers creep to yours. You hold them as soon as he's within reach.

"I'm not gonna change," he says.

Jason thinks it's a warning. You see it for what it is: hope.

"That's alright," you say, squeezing his hand. "I'm not trying to change you."

[my-rose-tinted-glasses]

Peaceful property is a bl even if it's not. It's also about so many other things although not really delivering on a consistent message.

I thought about adding my thoughts to this thread but it was getting long and I started to get sidetracked so I decided to just make my own post about it and share my thoughts on it. @lurkingshan @bengiyo and @twig-tea all made good point about why this show is faltering with its own themes, and @respectthepetty made a compelling argument that the show knows what its doing.

I think no one is wrong and I land somewhere in the middle with it. As in, depending on what I choose to care about. Much like @respectthepetty, I am bias about this show. For different reasons tho. I like Tay and New a lot so I lead with that instead of my critical thinking. just as a personal aside, I tend to do this when my brain and heart don't align. I ignore when my brain tells me that the show is doing something wrong so that I can enjoy the rest. This works particularly well with QL for some reason. I am after all a person who liked Dangerous Romance even when my brain kept trying to damper my enjoyment with logic. And also sometimes I'm a hypocrite and there's no reason for why I like a show and not another. Ok, there's usually a reason but it's most often not a good one, or a rational one at least. That's just how it is.

Anyway. Because of all the excellent points made by that post I decided to fully engage my brain and I've been thinking about what this show is trying to say and I agree that unfinished business is the main thing in the ghost stories but I would have to shut off my brain completely to not see how class factors into all of it as well.

The ghosts up until now, except the chef, were all lower class and one can argue that it played a part in how they died or what happened after. I'm not including episode 7 for reasons that I will explain in a bit. Even if Ride's unfinished business was about love, the fact that he was the only rider doing deliveries in the rain, at least to me, read as he was driven by the need to make money in the first place. Even in the chef's case, the customer that Peach basically poisoned was rich and it was a part of the headlines about it and the reason for the restaurant getting shut down. Also most of the individual stories didn't get deep into these issues, case of the week usual issues, but it was always an underlying theme. Also as @twig-tea said all the parallels work even better because this disparity also exists between Home and Peach.

All this gets me to how I started this post. This is a bl even if it isn't. The choice to include the tragic bl storyline in the middle of this, in my own brain, can only be explained if I believe this is a bl. (The tragic bit was thematically consistent with this show.) Specifically a gmmtv bl. Cause ultimately they have a tendency to forsake narrative consistency if it stops serving the main romance. It's also the only way I can explain having a bl pair mirroring the other bl pair on screen. So in that way it's consistent with gmmtv. Just brush aside anything that can get in the way of the couple not having a happy ending. This is also how I explain my biggest issue with it. Pangpang. She's the shipper. She's been the shipper from basically the start.

Home basically killed her brother, why would she be the driving force in getting him forgiven? Because of my previously admitted bias, I forgave Home almost immediately. It's New and he didn't mean it, it was an accident and he wanted to call for help and do the right thing but his family interfered and.... I could come up with a lot of reasons because I want to forgive him. So everything else can be ignored. But all this obviously doesn't apply to Pang. So it can only be the bl in the not a bl show.

Now, on full brainy mode, this last episode makes no sense with everything else this show has been saying until now. They used a branded pair to ignore any class disparity between our mains, since the last ghost story didn't really parallel that, and over the forgiveness part, and jump straight into Peach has forgiven Home and will probably now become his saviour. Don't even get me started on the fact that Peach is still broke but saving the rich dude that turned his life to crap will be the most important thing right now. I wonder if gmmtv has ever ignored class disparity between a main couple and instead focused on the richer dude's drama while ignoring the struggle of the other one, all in favour of the main romance and lovey dovey moments 🤔. But I guess I'll reserve full judgement on that until the next episode.

yeah, so basically this is where I am at with this show. My two sides are fighting but come next wednesday my brain will take the back seat for 45 minutes so I can enjoy Tay and New and after that maybe I'll think about it some more.

[sophieinwonderland]

Debunking Anti(-endo's)Misinfo. AKA: How are anti-endos so bad at sources????

(The original)

Oh, well good on you for trying to cover everything! Nice of anti-endos to finally start trying to use science to prove their arguments. I'm sure these sources will totally be reliable and will prove your points beyond a shadow of a doubt, and that you won't just be falling flat on your face with every single attempt at basic reading comprehension, and end up repeatedly make a complete fool of yourself.

Let's go!

Off to a pretty strong start, acknowledging that many endogenic systems don't have DID or OSDD. Sadly, that basic fact is something that seems to escape most anti-endos. So with this in mind, I think it's safe to say the goal of this post is going to be to prove...

You can't possibly have DID without trauma.

You can't possibly have OSDD without trauma.

You can't be a system without DID/OSDD.

Let's read through and see how they'll do at proving their points by the end. I promise you, the results... won't surprise you. 😉

Well, there goes that strong start.

The source here is a Carrd and so-called "common sense."

Meanwhile, in the World Health Organization's ICD-11, alters or dissociative identities are described as "distinct personality states." In the same page, it's stated that you can have multiple "distinct personality states" without a disorder.

This is information from the World Health Organization affirming that you can be plural without a disorder. And I think that prevails over your so-called "common sense."

See also these screenshots from the plurality chapter of Transgender Mental Health, a book published by the American Psychiatric Association:

Finally, I really want to put a focus on this line of logic: "you cannot have alters without having a disorder, this is common sense as it's not normal to have alters."

Normal has multiple meanings in different contexts. The ICD-11's boundary with normality uses normal to mean "non-pathological." But this post seems to be using "normal" in the lay way to mean "common."

And that makes this particular rhetoric extremely dangerous and harmful to many communities. "If it's not common, it's a mental illness," was the basis for homosexuality and being transgender being listed as mental illnesses. "Most people don't think this way, so there's something wrong with them."

This could also easily be used to pathologize Otherkin and other alterhumans as mentally ill because it's not "normal" to identify as an animal.

The modern World Health Organization and American Psychiatric Association recognize the fact that simply thinking unusually or differently isn't an illness or disorder.

Statements like yours do not exist within a vacuum, but harken back to decades past when any non-typical thinking would have you labeled as having a disorder that needed treated.

Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.

Let's be thankful to live in a world today where our differences aren't considered disorders. And let's not resort to ideologies that threaten to return us to those days past.

Wait... who suggests this? Who are they? I think I need more info...

So... "some researchers."

Also, can we talk about how this starts off with "sometimes called multiple personality disorder." I checked to see if this was before the name changed in the ICD (which I believe was 2015) and it doesn't seem to be! Oldest archive I can find is 2020!

Rethink.org is a charity.

These are not peer-reviewed papers.

The page references "some researchers" without names or sources.

I have no idea who authored this or if they're qualified at all in this field.

This is a terrible source. A web page by an anonymous author citing other unnamed authors with no reason to think anyone who wrote this had any idea what they were talking about!

This says DID is caused by many things, and lists trauma as only one that's included. This doesn't back up the idea DID/OSDD can only be caused by trauma, and suggests the opposite.

Oh, and "it's also known as split personality disorder." 😔

Go home WebMD.

Usually associated with doesn't mean it's a requirement, and in fact implies that it isn't always.

"Is associated with." "Can be a response to trauma."

Reiterating that the first two goals here were to prove you can't have DID or OSDD without trauma. And these aren't doing that.

An association doesn't mean there's a causation, and it doesn't mean that association is there in 100% of cases.

"often develop."

Like with "usually", you wouldn't use the word often if if something always happened. The choice of wording implies you can have dissociative disorders without trauma.

Are... they messing with us right now???

I swear, you can't have a post that sets out with the goal of disproving the existence of endogenic plurality, and then use quotes that seem to consistently imply there can be other causes for DID and not pick up on that theme!

Oh, yay! We finally got a quote that's actually trying to argue the point we started with.

But, again, this runs into a similar issue to the ReThink.org one. This is a random independent organization. There is no author for this article. It hasn't undergone peer review like an academic paper would.

There is no evidence the person who wrote this article is actually educated in dissociative disorders.

And finally back to "usually."

You must be so proud...

Source Round-Up

There was a lot here, so let's just recap.

6 out of 8 of these sources only say that DID is "usually" or "often" or "can be" caused by or associated with trauma. These actually imply there are cases where it's NOT caused by trauma, going against the original goals of this post.

Finally, there were two sources, Rethink and Mind.org, which did suggest DID is just caused by trauma, full stop. But both of these are extremely questionable as sources.

Neither named their authors. There's no indication what the review process is for their websites. And "Rethink" merely said this is what "some researchers" believe.

So let's double back to those goals set at the beginning.

You can't possibly have DID without trauma: One source says this, but the reliability of that source is questionable. Another source says some researchers are saying this but doesn't name any researchers or cite those sources. Meanwhile, the other six sources imply that it IS possible for DID to exist without trauma.

You can't possibly have OSDD without trauma: Neither of the two sources that suggest DID can only be caused by trauma mention OSDD at all.

You can't be a system without DID/OSDD: None of the sources suggest you need DID/OSDD to be a system or to be plural.

So far, you've failed to prove you can't be a system without DID or OSDD. You've failed to show you can't have OSDD without trauma. And the case for DID being exclusive to trauma frankly looks weaker than before you started talking.

Incredible work so far!!!

And I mean that in the way that nothing about this is remotely credible!

Ugh. There is SO much wrong here. First, no sources for their claims about tulpamancy.

Now, tulpamancy draws its name from a Tibetan Buddhist practice called sprul pa.

This is not the same practice though. And the Tibetan Buddhist practice is NOT CALLED TULPAMANCY.

Something which should be obvious to anyone who knows even the most basic facts about language, with the -mancy suffix being derived from Latin. And tulpamancy as a practice generally isn't religious.

From Dr. Samuel Veissiere of McGill University:

The community is primarily divided between so-called psychological and metaphysical explanatory principles. In the psychological community, neuroscience (or folk neuroscience) is the explanation of choice. Tulpas are understood as mental constructs that have achieved sentience. The metaphysical explanation holds that Tulpas are agents of supernatural origins that exist outside the hosts’ minds, and who come to communicate with them. Of 118 respondents queried on the question, 76.5% identified with the psychological explanation, 8.5% with the metaphysical, and 14% with a variety of “other” explanations, such as a mixture of psychological and metaphysical.

When discussing the research into tulpamancy, we're not discussing a religious or spiritual practice that's been validated by psychologists.

We're talking about a primarily psychological practice that's been validated by psychologists.

And as for the DSM quote, it confirms that religious practices aren't a disorder. Cool. But it also implies that religious practices can result in multiple distinct personality states. Hence why they needed that criterion. It's not stated as explicitly in the DSM as in the ICD, but the implication is there, especially when taken together.

Whether you call these "alters" or not is up to you. Most endogenic systems aren't using the word "alter" to describe their headmates.

But regardless of the word, what the research is showing is that there are multiple phenomena which can result in people having multiple self-conscious agents sharing the same body.

I mean, you've still done a really bad job at showing DID and OSDD form purely from trauma, with many of your sources straight up saying the opposite.

And remember, a lot of mixed origin systems will say that their other headmates aren't caused by or related to their disorder. And there are documented cases of people with DID both having alters associated with DID, and having non-aversive entities they commune with outside of that, as Kluft references in this paper:

The woman he describes here, who experienced ceding control to another entity who talked through her, would qualify as a mixed origin system in the modern plural community.

SIX OF YOUR EIGHT SOURCES LEFT THE DOOR OPEN FOR DID TO FORM WITHOUT TRAUMA!

NONE CLAIMED OSDD COULD ONLY COME FROM TRAUMA!

NONE CLAIMED YOU NEEDED DID OR OSDD TO BE PLURAL!

Your sources are NOT claiming what you think they're claiming!!!!!!!

If this is "all the proof you need," to say endogenic systems aren't valid, it's clear you were only ever interested in confirming your worldview.

But surely you can't seriously think this will convince anyone who isn't already indoctrinated!

Not even addressing this in full. It's such a blatant strawman that it's not worth my time.

There are similarities between plurality and being LGBTQ. Especially to the many trans systems out there who are seeing anti-endos use the same rhetoric that transmeds have. Or like you did earlier, are endorsing the same types of views that led to homosexuality being pathologized until the 70s. But nobody is saying it's the exactly the same!

I'm not sure what this is specifically referring to. But it might be about the line in the differential diagnosis for DID in the PTSD section where it's stated DID may not be preceded by trauma or have co-occurring PTSD symptoms.

It does also say in another section that DID is associated with trauma, but it never actually says that's the only way to get DID.

This is a straight-up lie. Most sources used by endogenic systems are less than a decade old, with some being as recent as 2023.

Here's the breakdown of some of the dates in @guardianssystem's doc, for reference:

I mean, I feel like part of the reason nobody has been able to disprove it is because a lot of its more specific claims have been really hard to test.

But that's neither here nor there.

The bigger issue you'll run into is that the creators of the theory you're citing have stated that there may be other ways for people to be plural. Or as they phrased it, having "conscious and self-conscious dissociated parts."

The above quote is from two of the three authors of The Haunted Self, the creators of the theory of the structural dissociation.

The TOSD is made to propose a way trauma can cause dissociative disorders to develop. But it does NOT suggest you need to have dissociative disorders to be plural, and I doubt the authors appreciated their work being twisted like that

Final Grade:

F-

This started with three goals.

Let's look back at them one last time.

You can't possibly have DID without trauma.

You can't possibly have OSDD without trauma.

You can't be a system without DID/OSDD.

By the end of this, have any of these claims successfully been proven?

I don't feel they have.

The first claim is what all the sources tried to focus on. But most of the sources didn't say that and didn't support it. All but two implied that DID could possibly form other ways.

And for the others? Nothing suggests OSDD can only be caused by trauma.

And you failed to provide any sources that suggested you couldn't be plural without DID and OSDD.

You completely and utterly failed to find decent sources to back up your claims, and to make a compelling case for them, at every conceivable juncture.

If I were you, I would be embarrassed to have put out something of such poor quality.

What have we learned:

Non-disordered and endogenic plurality has been supported and validated across the psychological field, including the World Health Organization's ICD-11 and Trasngender Mental Health which has been reviewed and published by the American Psychiatric Association.

The creators of the theory of structural dissociation believe it might be possible that "self-conscious dissociative parts of the personality" might form without trauma and that this needs to be further researched.

Tulpamancy is a mostly psychological practice that has been studied and validated by psychologists.

Anti-endos are really bad at sources.

Conversely, the majority of endogenic sources are actual peer reviewed academic papers. And contrary to false claims here, many of the papers are actually very recent.

(Tagging some tags from the original post)

[glisten-inthedark]

I don't know if I'm more chill about Byler endgame because I have the intel that people didn't have during volume 2 or what, but to any other ending that doesn't involve Byler becoming canon would just make the Duffer brothers the worst writers in the history of ever.

Because what do you mean you have a gay character that doesn't believe he'll get a happy ending only to prove that you know, he's right? How would that make any sense?!

I've said it before and I'll say how many times I have to: They could've made Will in love with literally anyone else. I don't know, some boy from Lenora, some other guy from Hawkings, hell, even Dustin was an option. But noooo, they instead chose to make him in love with his best friend.

They could've presented another male character with Argyle, instead they spent God knows how much money of their budget getting every Byler scene just right. Who would give this much dedication to a sinking ship? Like, they literally talked about how they had to wait during the day just so the lightning was just right during the van scene.

And also, the lighting during the cabin scene as well? Because that must have taken them ages to get it right. For the line to poor down only on Will, and that's not an artificial light, is literally the sun. So you're telling the Duffers were going to waste precious time getting these scenes just right but you know what? They don't mean anything at all, forget about it.

And to further drive the point home, the storyline makes no actual sense from a logical standpoint. Remove Byler. Let's all pretend we don't ship for one second.

Why in the world would they make Will in love with Mike of all people? He could've been gay without having to be that in love with someone. I know I'm repeating myself but I have to because I don't think you guys understand how senseless this plot is if they're not going to do anything about it.

And I mean senseless in the sense that it literally has no use to the plot (that we know of which is why I made that post about how Will's love will be fundamental to the story).

And not only that, not having Mike go with El to the Nina project thingy literally stalled their progression which is a huge deal. I know some people don't like that Byler was removed from the supernatural plot, but I for one think it was a necessary evil to allow Will to explore his feelings and for Mike to miss him.

And to honest, even if the writers are the most douchebags to ever douchebag, it still wouldn't explain the amount of care they took in every Byler scene. It wouldn't explain how whenever we are in Mike's POV, is like he literally sees Will like this shinning beacon of light.

Because if they wanted a quick cash grab on the expense of the queer community, I can assure you there are easier ways of doing it. I remember when I was at the Sterek fandom and J*ff Davis was an ass about the ship during interviews. I remember how Tyl*r P*sey made terrible comments all the while they were clearly using the shippers in the series. And yeah, while I do agree Teen Wolf wasn't necessarily queerbait because there were actual queer couples, it still left a bitter taste on my mouth.

The way they built this, they didn't give themselves an easy way out. It would be one thing if Will was gay but not in love with Mike, it's a completely different thing for him to love Mike so deeply that he's willing to sacrifice his own happiness for him.

The writers made him to me irrevocably in love with Mike. (You don't make her (him) feel like a mistake at all), El (Will) needs you and she (him) always Will. These aren't the words of someone that has a crush or whose feelings are fleeting, these are the words of someone who would rip his heart out just so that the man he loves can be happy.

These aren't the words of someone that can be just be: yeah, I moving on from this. Mike is Will's heart.

So sure, Will needs to discover self acceptance and self love. He needs to recognize that he can be happy and deserves to have happiness, but if that was the entire point all along, he literally could have figured that without having to be in love with his best friend whom he believes will never love him back.

If the sole point of his arc was: Needs to learn how to accept himself for who he is, there are other - less cruel - ways of going about.

Because at the end of the day, making Will to be this deeply in love with Mike only to be rejected is just that: pointless and cruel.

And again. Pointless.

The GA already believes that to be the case, the Mil*evns too, Will also believes that. So why would it be a conflict at all if it was actually the case?

Why would they make a slowburn reaction? Will already thinks he was rejected, that's the thing. He already thinks it's hopeless.

So why would they use the painting? Why would they frame everything as a love triangle? Why not get this shit over already?

Why pair them together with the already canon couples?

At this point I'm just rambling and repeating myself. I'm gonna sleep, but I hope I was coherent enough.

You guys are welcomed to chime in, I love to hear your thoughts on that because I feel like I wrote all of this before but I'll say however many times I have to.

[burningcheese-merchant]

When Burning Spice was introduced a lot of people made comparison with Capsaicin, and even thought they were related. You have any thoughts on that?

I do, and you're all probably going to be very disappointed lol

Not only do I NOT vibe with the idea that they're related, I'm actually really annoyed that it's as popular as it is lol. It doesn't even make sense. Burning Spice was in prison for thousands of years; when, where and how did he have a kid? At what point in time did this occur? Capsaicin is a young man. A regular mortal, outside of his "Spice Overlord" thing. I ask you all again: when? Where? How? WHY? Has anyone ever actually thought this through?

"ThEy LoOk SiMiLaR" okay, and? So fucking what? Neither of them own the concept of "long hair" or "muscles" or "sharp teeth". Pitaya has those too, and he has an arguably more substantial connection to Capsaicin because they're actually from the same fucking area. Happenstance. Lots of characters in this game have similar attributes, that doesn't necessarily mean anything

"ThEy'Re BoTh SpIcY" Refer to point A. Do you all think all the nut-based cookies are related, too? That's the logic you might as well be operating on. Correlation is not causation

"Blah blah both jail" you know how many characters in this whack-ass phone game count as felons, bro? How many of them SHOULD count as felons lol? The Cookie Run universe might as well be one giant Alcatraz with all the shit these little affronts to God get up to every day, I ain't making them all each other's relatives because of it

They're the wrong ages for them to be family. Burning Spice was serving a life sentence since long before Capsaicin was even thought of, he literally got out after the guy was already a grown ass man. They're not even from the same fucking CONTINENT! Capsaicin has probably never even HEARD of Beast-Yeast! Even that little comic the CRK Twitter account posted makes fun of all this shit!!! The Wild Spices mistake Cap for Spice from behind, and then get confused when he turns around because THEY VERY CLEARLY DO NOT KNOW WHO HE IS AND HAVE NEVER SEEN HIM BEFORE! Wouldn't an army know if their general had a son, even if it was only mentioned in passing? Wouldn't THIS army have a vested interest in having their general's son around if he existed, and stop at nothing to bring him home should he vanish, to gain favor with Spice and because of how powerful Capsaicin is and how useful he could be to them?

I wouldn't be so bent out of shape about all this if it wasn't LITERALLY FUCKING EVERYWHERE!!! I cannot enjoy any content of Burning Spice OR Capsaicin without having to endure a fucking barrage of "hurr durr father and son" posts!!! I just want to ogle my hot, sexy, deliciously evil spice man BY HIM-FUCKING-SELF in peace, I never asked to have to hear the exact fucking same "hi son I came back with the milk" joke over and over and over again

I know I sound like a massive dick right now and I'm truly sorry. You are more than welcome to think of these two as related in some way if you wish. I am not your mother, nor your leader, nor your god, I'm just some cringe loser on the internet. Enjoy this game and its characters in whatever way you choose. I even actually like a good bit of the father/son art, a lot of it is cute and funny. I'm able and willing to say that with complete sincerity.

I just wish I didn't have to feel like it's being forced on me. That is one of the biggest issues I have with this fandom: how oppressive it often feels. You MUST ship this particular pairing, you MUST headcanon these characters as family, you MUST take this one-off joke that was clearly just a goddamn joke and preach it 24/7/365 like it's the gospel truth that Devsis themselves wrote on stone tablets and delivered from the top of Mount Sinai. And then when someone doesn't want to do that, everyone else descends upon them like a plague of fucking locusts. I actually saw a Dad Spice + Son Cap post on here with the person who made it saying something like "ok since everyone agrees that these two are family [...]" and I just got so fucking irritated. No, actually, not everyone agrees. Not everyone agrees on a lot of the fanon that's shoved down the entire community's throats on a regular basis. PLEASE stop acting like they do. I still remember when people would get flat-out harassed for not acting like Herb is Sea Fairy's son (old ass drama lol).

Say what you will about me, I'm just one person and you can block me or whatever dumb tags I use for my dumb shit. There is NOWHERE I can go to avoid this. Twitter? Plagued. Tumblr? Plagued. Even fucking reddit is on this nonsense (only in my personal opinion). But that's what I get for acknowledging Reddit in any capacity lol

I shall once again sincerely apologize for my harsh tone here, I am not attacking you personally or anyone who headcanons these two as relatives. I am just generally, profoundly frustrated and I need to get it out. I appreciate you taking the time to ask me an honest question, I hope you can forgive me for my painfully honest answer

[aoxizu]

i have another 2.1 character dynamic post in the recesses of my brain but i need to get this out first

star rail's 2.1 update main plotline leans a lot more into existentialism and absurdism than i thought it would which is a really nice surprise

like i thought before 2.0 that at most it was just going to be some "oh no capitalism bad ipc bad cults also bad" thing but honestly what we got is so much more interesting. the spoilers start now

also massive disclaimer i am not a philosophist and actually i really don't like philosophy because it makes my brain hurt and i would much rather just look at logical nice things like math and plants so. if i get anything wrong please correct me

acheron's past and how she became an emanator of nihility reminds me somewhat of the absurdist theme of how people always look for meaning when there isn't any, until they finally realize that the universe is meaningless

and the entire path of nihility basically is a road towards that realization that people tread on, and the difference between the real world and star rail is that in the real world here we have people who will see that and then go write a book about a guy not crying at his mother's funeral, whereas in star rail it seems that just accepting that the universe is meaningless turns you into a pathstrider or even emanator of the nihility (not sure if i remember the details, correct me if i'm wrong)

and then aventurine's whole motivation is trying to understand why the universe is so cruel to him, and to find meaning when you have everything except freedom, both of which are absurdist themes

the leap of faith argument often attributed to søren kierkegaard claims that even though there is no rational logic for believing in god, you should do it anyway because the alternatives are madness, suicide, and ignorance. this was one solution to the problem of confronting the universe's meaninglessness: choosing to believe in a higher being regardless

later world wars i and ii both contributed heavily to the rise of absurdism as people returned from the war, having seen so many others die around them, and then just going back to a normal society with none of what they as individual soldiers had contributed seemingly doing anything. and then it happened again, but on a much greater scale with even more deaths. both wars and the destruction they brought led many people to start questioning why a supposedly moral god could allow this suffering, and this is where camus comes in and says that actually religion and nationalism both aren't good solutions, and instead we should just accept meaninglessness and keep living despite the absurdity

and i think dr ratio's scroll thing kind of relates to that

he tells aventurine to open it when he's about to die, or when he's completely out of answers for the question of how to confront absurdity

and dr ratio's answer for aventurine is to just tell him to keep living, good luck

which is. yeah

it's the argument that there are more answers to nihilism than just 1) going insane, 2) pretending like it doesn't exist, and 3) dying

it's the bold claim that despite everything, you can still choose to live

sure nothing makes sense but that does not detract from your life. it doesn't need to make sense at all

and with the understanding that things do not need to fit our human definition of meaning, we can continue on knowing our true place in the universe

and with that aventurine walks into the very big black hole like look at that thing you cannot tell me there is no symbolism there

let's go back to acheron.

in the part where you get a snippet of acheron's conversation with some guy just before this cutscene, the other party states that "[IX] leave[s] woven strands of fate for humans to walk, and together THEY weave a great shadow...And this shadow silently envelops them."

which to me sounds like a statement on how people across time and space have again and again come to the same question, what is the meaning of life?

and acheron's whole color thing seems to mean that she is one of the few who, after walking so far on the path of nihility, somehow have not died yet, be it from madness or something else

like it seems implied that many many more have seen the meaninglessness of the universe and have not reacted as well as acheron has

ok i have more to say about the elation and how it in turn relates to the nihility but that will have to come later but there is. a lot of interesting things there to explore

once again disclaimer: I Am Not A Philosophist And Do Not Know What The Correct Definitions Of These Words I'm Throwing Around Are. thank you for coming to my ted talk that was more of a longwinded ramble

[vroomvroomwee]

I don't think some of you should be coming down on Aziraphale so hard for his decision and I'm going to point out something not enough people take into consideration.

Just think of the circumstances he was in. He got offered a deal that could fix pretty much every single problem they have and that could consequently make both him and Crowley incredibly happy.

At least that's how he sees it. It all comes crashing down once he realises that that's not what Crowley wants. That it's not that easy for them to have that perfect life. Having that opportunity and then it being ripped right out of his hands. Just look at how giddy he was when he was telling Crowley, after which he straight up went into denial and refusing to listen to what Crowley has to say, because this. would. have. solved. everything.

But... it's not what Crowley wants. And it's not as if he can make him go with him to Heaven (thank god) because he's not that kind of person. He's not possessive or controlling. And more than anything he loves Crowley and up until that moment he had the perfect means to make him happy. And now it's gone.

So not only does he have this earth shattering realisation about Crowley and what he wants he also now has to deal with what he himself wants. Now if anyone knows how it feels to be in such a stressful and agonising dilemma over something, you will probably feel and emphasise with Aziraphale pretty hard in this scene. Because this is where old coping mechanisms start to hit. This is where he falls back on something reliable, something he can trust will make the right decision, and that is his old belief that Heaven is to be obeyed and that it can do no wrong, that is still so ingrained in his instincts and decision making. This is where his trauma comes into play.

And he fights it.

How fucking strong do you have to be to be able to fight your own gut feeling, that has been trained and created for millions of years. He actively tries to tell the Metatron "no" multiple times, shame that the Metatron is a master manipulator and doesn't let him the opportunity, but he still does it nonetheless.

(This is the part I wanted to point out) This boy had to make a life changing decision that would determine how he would spend the rest of eternity itself. And he didn't even have 10 minutes to make it.

He had only minutes to make this decision. Imagine the sheer soul-shattering heart-rending turmoil that has been going on inside him. The sheer panic and dread he was probably feeling.

And despite what millenia of training and what his thoughts and logic were telling him, he still followed his heart, he still chose Crowley... until the Metatron sensed exactly that and told him about the Second Coming.

Well, now that made things much simpler. His happiness or the universe. And he sacrificed himself. Again...

And to top it all off, he had to fucking smile. He has just lost everything he loves, earth, the bookshop, crepes... and Crowley. No. No, it's more than that. After Crowley's confession he realised he lost everything he never even had. Utterly and completely alone. And he cannot dare shed a tear. How. Fucking. Strong. Do you have to be to be able to do that.

[hils79]

Hils Watches Tibetan Sea Flower - Ep 1

Yeah, sorry to The Spirealm but I've been very upfront about my intention to drop everything as soon as Tibetan Sea Flower came out.

I wasn't expecting it to drop overnight while I was asleep with zero warning but here we are. The DMBJ fandom is the embodiment of chaos and that extends to the way they release things too.

Also apologies to Choi San. I was going to gif you today but, well, see the above.

Apparently the official English title for this is Adventures Behind the Bronze Door but we've all been calling it Tibetan Sea Flower forever and that's also the title of the novella so I'm using that for my liveblogs. I'll use both titles in the tags.

Right, I've rambled enough. I'm going in.

Oh, god, I'm not ready.

Okay, first of all OMG LOOK AT HIS CUTE LITTLE FACE! But, also, I love that this flashback has him still looking older than he does in the retirement era movies

I mean he is not a skilled tomb raider, this is true. That doesn't stop him from trying though

Wait, that's the baby triangle! Are you telling me a 27 year old and a 44 year old are playing a character at the same age? I know I shouldn't expect logic from DMBJ but come on

Wait, is this a completely different actor? At first I thought they'd just used special effects to make Zhang Luyi look younger but I don't think that's actually him at all

Aww it's nice to see Wang Bowen back too. I do enjoy his Pangzi

Okay, but why is Young Pangzi being played by the same person who played retirement age Pangzi in the movies. MAKE IT MAKE SENSE!

I don't know who this is because the drama doesn't even had a MDL page yet but I like him. He's a good baby Wu Xie. Look at his little face when Pangzi says they need to go and see if Xiaoge is still alive or not

There's our special boy!

Starting with the whump early. Love to see it.

Only 20 mins into the first episode and Pangzi is crying because he thinks he found Xiaoge's body. I'm fine. This is fine.

FFS I know he's not dead and this is still devastating

Take a drink! It's the standard DMBJ hallucination!

Oh, not even that! It was all a dream!

Bleeding himself to lower his heart rate enough to fake being dead is definitely a very Xiaoge thing to do

I guess that's one way of describing what happened

Is he...using his architecture skills to map out the Zhang ancestral home that he went to? IS HE DOING ACTUAL ARCHITECTURE?

And wipe out an entire family so it was safe for Xiaoge when he got out, but we don't need to mention that small detail

I do like that this one shot shows you how obsessed and unhinged Wu Xie was during the time Xiaoge was gone

AH HAH! Now he's Zhang Luyi!

SURPRISE JI XIAOBING XIAO HUA????

A NEW XIUXIU??? Everything happens so much!

Baby, do you know what franchise you're in?

So weird seeing Xiaoge without his hood

Well, that was a lot. And I still have another 2 episodes to watch. Good thing it's a bank holiday here today

[stellocchia]

I absolutely adore the fanon Nightmare Gang found family stuff but... If one of these suckers gets sick they're gonna struggle.

Like, okay, I don't think Nightmare can reasonably get sick. It would make no sense for any virus, bacteria, or parasite to have evolved to survive and thrive in a goop that literally only he posses. He's fine.

But he's also gonna be completely useless when it comes to looking after his team. He would fall for the good old paranoia-inducing mistake of googling the symptoms and finding only death-sentences. And then he's just gonna be miserable and mope until his boys are better.

Killer meanwhile, would logically get sick, but also he would definitely hide it. Like, he was still conditioned by Chara to be a killing machine, no way my guy would just share such a big vulnerability. The others would only find out once he's already in really bad shape and most of the time they wouldn't find out at all.

On the other hand, while I imagine he'd be adept at setting broken bones and the general basic field medicine (again, because of his past he probably had to learn the basics to survive and remain functional), his solution to deal with any actual illness would be "just ignore it until it goes away".

I'm pretty sure Horror is technically already dead, so I don't know if he can get sick... Though I'd say probably? I mean, his body doesn't seem all too different from that of other monsters. Regardless, when sick I say he'd go in full survival mode, build a nest somewhere and be completely unapproachable unless you want your hand chewed off.

On the other hand, being the only one with a living brother and with both of them living in really harsh conditions, he probably has had to handle sickness rather often. Of course, with the lack of resources back in his universe, he mostly had to go for the basics, so his solution is a warm broth and some wet pieces of cloth. At most hot water to disinfect wounds. He's still at least doing something.

Cross is basically like Killer. He doesn't want to appear weak (with a father like his I highly doubt weakness was allowed) so he hides any minor sickness. Though I do think he'd tell, like, Horror if things are getting really bad. If anything, ao he doesn't become a burden for the others during missions.

And, again, much like Killer, I think he definitely would know field medicine. He was trained as a Royal Guard after all, they must have taught him things like that. But actual sickness? Yeah, they probably had medics that handled it when it got too severe. He doesn't know jack shit. His solution is just going to Horror and hoping he's got it handled.

Dust would straight up gaslight himself into thinking he's not sick and that's just his body punishing him for his sins. He literally would not believe it's anything else until someone (again, most likely Horror) pointed it out to him.

And the worst part is that, once he knows, there's no fucking way he'd let anyone treat him for it. That self-loathing fucker would rather suffer through it in some pointless attempt at receiving some form of redemption. He's cooked. Horror would need to tie him to the bed just to force him to get some rest.

So, anyway, this is my propaganda to say let's get at least one Sans who is mentally healthy enough and knowledgeable enough to keep these guys from dying in here.

My vote is for Lust Sans. Just because I love him.

Though someone like Color could also unlock some very fun dynamics. And he may actually get Killer to stop hiding his symptoms like an idiot. And perhaps Cross too. Literally, those guys would lie about getting bit in a zombie apocalypse

[ttlurking]

While I keep working on the design for the Cipher twins AU here's some more things i thought to add!

They both have Ford's 6 fingers hands, since they're mostly made of his genetic material it was a high probsbilty that it'd be passed down.

I'm not sure about Canon but in this au the twins are partially responsible for their parents divorce, not for a fault of their own but because their parents think they're too freaky and contributed greatly to the cracks already existing in their marriage. So they've been sent to who they think is their actual father/creator, not knowing its Stanley.

They have shared dreams/dreamscape (this is actually inspired by real life because when me and my brother slept in the same room as kids we'd sometimes have conjoined dreams? It's a story for another time anyways) plus the fact that Bill is technically on of their fathers means they can always lucid dream and have a pretty good control on their dreams. They have their own separate dream areas, almost like they "split" their rooms, especially as they grew. This is to give eachother privacy in their dreams and also because their tastes in dreams are vastly different.

They can talk telepathically, being linked through the dreamscape has their consciousnesses closely linked. They keep it as radio sort of situation, as neither is keen to look in the other's thoughts. It could be a completely open channel. It used to be when they were younger, which greatly contributed to their freakishness as they used to talk together, as if they were one being.

Dipper and Mabel have personalities that stick pretty close to canon, with Dipper taking more after Ford and Mabel after Stan. Tho as they're Ford's kids I'd say they've both inherited his genius in different ways, Dipper is smart and logical, a bit too calculating and probably on the spectrum. He likes to study things because he wants to know more and likes feeling in control. He has a quick mind, good for puzzles, equations and observation. Very fast learner. Mabel is creative and a tinkerer, while she still loves to make sweaters (and bedazzled eyepatches) her inventiveness is cranked up. She's made some pretty complex sweaters, some that could light up, so it's not even too much of a reach. She likes to make useful machines to help around the house, and while they do work, they're usually weird looking and usually made for unnecessary tasks: like glitter dispensers, disco toilets, rainbow colored shower water etc.. although she's good at making things on request, like Stan's beloved automatic backscratcher.

Stan started wearing the eyepatch as his Man of Mystery persona to make the kids feel more welcomed. He says that it's so they can sell the while "Mystery Family" deal and make more money but he always thinks of his brother and how it was for him as a child to be a "freak"

Dipper's constellation glows when he's sleeping.

The twins don't know they're not completely human. They just think they've inherited the "Family weirdness" that they've heard about.

They still think Stan is their Grunkle. Things start to click after they first meet Bill. They have an easier time in this Au, since they're used to their own dreamscape, they're much more of a threat to Bill, who retreats after he realises just what the twins are.

Their realisation about Bill is complex, along the lines of "We're connected but I don't know how."

They have heavily suspected that the author is related to them since the first season because what are the chances of a 6 fingers handprint on a diary.

When they meet Ford they're like "oh ok- Stan has a twin? So we have two great uncles, makes sense, we must have the 6 fingers mutation in our genetic makeup, a family thing. He's our dad. He's our dad???"

Granda and Candy are still awesome best friends and they never make Mabel feel bad for being different. To them, she's just as weird as they are.

Dipper doesn't have a crush on Wendy. He thinks he does, because he has no experience with this sort of things, but it's actually a mix of admiration and envy, he'd like to be more like her.

And that's it for now cause I'm really sleepy, sorry for the rant~