#i don't care about the ff7 compilation

[masteraqua]

oh my GOD why am i just now learning that the phone cloud uses in advent children was a real actual product

LOOK AT THIS THING, THIS IS SO GODDAMN COOL

[phantomyre]

FF7 Rebirth Ultimania - Mini Vincent Bio

https://x.com/aitaikimochi/status/1778701268686651539

A small snippet of Vincent's biography has been translated from the very recent Rebirth Ultimania. While much of it isn't new per se, there is a small bit that I wanted to focus on as it is a small change from OG. 'Sleeps a lot because he wants to suppress the monsters within him' For anyone familiar with Vincent's who initial characterization in OG, it should make your brow raise. The whole reason why he chose to sleep in his coffin was to atone for his sins which is what Vincent has been memed for for many years. However, in Rebirth, we don't get any such hint of that within the main story. The only bit of regret we learn about is with his past with Sephiroth and not being able to kill him. However, at least according to the Ultimania, Vincent's past sins are not the reason for his slumber... but rather to suppress his monsters. This is new. While it was always eluded to, this isn't Vincent's original reasoning. It seems like Square is leaning very heavily into Vincent's monsters, aka the single glowing eye, how Barret calls him a freak (he says 'monster' in Japanese) upon immediate transformation, Galian Beast as a boss, Vincent becoming uncomfortable when Barret scoffs at the idea of monsters having feelings, etc. My guess is that SE is going to characterize Vincent having a lot of fear of himself and his lack of control over his demons (which again was hinted at in various compilations but casual fans would never have known this). And seeing as there seems to be a mysterious connection between Sephiroth and the whole theme of monsters, it could be that Vincent is also afraid of becoming what Sephiroth has already become-- a merciless killer. This would make sense as to why Vincent is so resistant to joining Cloud and Co, not only due to whatever happened between him and Sephiroth, but also fearing himself and how he believes he is a monster. I could see this also playing into Vincent keeping himself distant from the party in part 3; not only because he doesn't want to get close to anyone (so as to not get emotionally hurt), but he may be terrified of losing control of his monsters and harming those he cares about.

[getvalentined]

I posted about this on the twits, but I'm gonna do it here too because it's not like this is limited to that platform.

Since I've been seeing my least favorite shitty FF7 rumor around again, friendly reminder that there are no "legal issues" between Gackt and SE delaying anything. Sources claiming otherwise say "trust me bro" when Nomura has literally said it was just the workload.

People who claim that delays in production of anything in the Compilation are because of Gackt are parroting a rumor that's been around for over a decade, which was started by people who used it as an excuse to be racist and homophobic under the thin veneer of frustrated criticism. The majority of hatred toward the character of Genesis Rhapsodos in early fandom, and hatred toward Genesis in modern day fandom from OG Purists, stems from this same place.

Why do you think these people always assert that Genesis' very existence "ruins Sephiroth's character," but never complain about Angeal? Why do you think they have no problems with Aerith having a Jenova-infused Angeal Copy in her church for years—something that should totally change her understanding of the Crisis, but doesn't seem to in any way whatsoever—and yet anything and everything Genesis does is treated as an unforgivable retcon?

It's an excuse to say heinous, horrible things about an all-but-explicitly queer character who is modeled off a real Japanese man, and that's all it ever was, but it gets a pass because they dress it up as criticism of the franchise. Then, when they inevitably start throwing out slurs, nobody cares because "it's just Gackt—I mean Genesis, everyone knows he sucks."

Yeah, you "know" because you let a bunch of bigots tell you he should be judged more harshly than any other character in the entire series because he's not white or straight enough. Because he's based directly on a real flesh-and-blood Japanese man, and to these people that makes him deserving of hate, because people like that shouldn't exist. Because the character is all but explicitly queer (and it is even more explicit in the original language and when accounting for some key culturally-specific literary references portrayed throughout the narrative), and people like that shouldn't exist.

You "know" because you never questioned why this character specifically is the only one it's "objectively and morally correct" to hate and belittle, even though everything he's supposedly hated for applies to multiple other characters throughout the series.

The character is loathed, and the actor is blamed for everything, because some old guard fans said that's how it's supposed to be in this fandom, and if you don't engage with things that way then you don't deserve to be here.

Very cool and normal behavior!

There are very valid reasons to dislike this character, mind you, and plenty of reasons to be critical of the actor. I'm not saying otherwise. I'm saying the pervasive and frankly disgusting fandom-wide hatred stems from the same place as the continued, repeatedly disproven assertion that Gackt is to blame for everything "wrong" with the Compilation and its development: bigotry. I know this because I saw these assertions come into being in real time when Crisis Core first came out. I watched the people saying these things post the most homophobic rants on their personal accounts, I watched people I considered friends get banned from LJ communities for referring to Genesis as Gackt and referring to Gackt with racial slurs.

And I watched them come back later, promising they were better people now, armed with new claims and new arguments that allowed them to continue to be hateful trashfires without getting in trouble. As long as they weren't overt, it was okay. If they slipped up and used a slur in the comments that was mostly okay, since it wasn't in the main post. Mods might lock a thread here and there, but those people got to stay. Their "criticism" was "valid," and thus their bigotry was validated.

Those same claims and complaints are still regurgitated today, only now it's by people who aren't racist and aren't homophobic, but don't realize that their criticism is horribly unbalanced because it was all born from people who were just masking hatred.

Even worse is when these behaviors are mimicked by people claiming to like the character, because the fandom taught them that this was how you're supposed to engage with him, because it's just Gackt—Genesis (I said Genesis!) so he's a piece of shit no matter how you slice it and he deserves to be treated that way. Nobody else does, and nobody questions it, because this is just how it's done.

I'm sorry to be the one to tell people this, but if you slap a bunch of gay stereotypes onto Genesis and then have the characters around him treat him like shit because of them, while implying or outright insisting that IT'S OKAY BECAUSE IT'S GENESIS AND HE SUCKS SO IT'S FUNNY, you are following in the footsteps of bigots. If you constantly refer to the character as "Gackt" like the name itself is a pejorative, you are following in the footsteps of bigots.

No, there is no nuance here. I don't care if you allegedly came to all these conclusions on your own—you didn't and you know it—except for the fact that actually that's worse, because it means that you did some kind of deep dive in the source material and came out the other side agreeing with a bunch of racist homophobes who are still spitting bullshit after over 15 years.

Do fucking better.

[altocat]

Hello again :) Like many I'm still hyped by the FF7 compilation and especially the many AUs possibilities and potential, and I've been wondering something ... If Cloud had been the one to die instead of Zack on the wastelands when they reached Midgar, how would this had affected Zack ? Would he have become more hatefull, angry and resentfull against Shinra ? Even willing to commit to revenge ? Would he have become depressed after failing to save somoene once again ? Somoene he cared for for one year and who he cared deeply about ?

Would Zack have met Tifa and told her of Cloud's fate ? Would Tifa had been filled with even more grief and anger against Shinra ? Or even against Zack because he would have failed to protect Cloud, someone Tifa once fell for and who could have been the last thing she had left from her home and childhood, only to be brutally taken from her before she could even met him again.

Would Cloud's death had been of consequence to Sephiroth's plan to get the black materia ? Cloud was still the most capable of Sephiroth clones, and Zack seems to not be affected by Sephiroth or Jenova's influence despite also being an host of S-cells. Or could Sephiroth just have been able to wait for our rag tag group of heroes to get the black materia, and then taking it from them after the collapse of the Temple of the ancients ?

Would Sephiroth had been cruel enough to toy with Zack's heart by using an illusion of Cloud with his clones like he seems to be using an illusion of Glenn to mess with Rufus in Rebirth ?

I think, for the most part, that while Zack would probably suffer from untold amounts of trauma/likely depression in the aftermath of Cloud's death, he'd keep going. Losing Angeal was probably the worst thing that happened to him. And it seriously fucked him up...but he survived. I think he'd survive this as well, albeit struggling to maintain a level of optimism about the world.

I think his relationship would be decent with Tifa--especially if he tells her how hard he fought to keep Cloud alive. Tifa has her limits in forgiveness, but she also is rarely openly aggressive, even to people she hates. I think she and Zack were on good terms during Nibelheim. I think that for all her faults with Shinra, she wouldn't hold it against him, at least not in a way that comes off as her being openly resentful. She struggles to FORGIVE Zack, but she also can't hate him either. They'd probably build a more genuine friendship over time, even though Zack knows there are emotional boundaries. Part of his atonement, I guess.

As for Sephiroth, I think he'd honestly not be terribly interested in Zack. As far as he's concerned, especially after merging with Jenova, his relationship with Zack is over. It's meaningless. Cloud was the only one that mattered because Cloud was the only one who ever actually defeated him. So he'd just use Zack's S-cells to his advantage and then dump him like trash. And if he can't do that, he can always use more pawns at his disposal.

There's a tradeoff though--Sephiroth's sense of identity is tied to his relationship with Cloud. I actually think his identity would start to fracture a lot quicker. And, in the event of his defeat, I don't think there'd be much in the way of him returning without Cloud's memories.

[greagors-breath]

Non-spoilery FF7 Rebirth thoughts

So, I finished watching Rebirth and after having a few days to marinate on it, here are my thoughts. (I'm not gonna talk about the ending here for the sake of the folks who have not gotten to it yet.)

Regarding the parts that adapt the original story, I think they were pretty well-handled. Most of the changes they made made sense and added more to the characters and their relationships. Everyone in the main party felt important in their own right and I really got the sense that these people like and care about each other.

I like what they did with Rufus and the Turks too - on one hand, they felt much more like proper antagonists and an actual threat now, whereas in OG they felt more like an obstacle in the post-Midgar story. On the other, they also felt more like a proper, coordinated team now. I'm so glad they actually let Rufus be a villain while also giving him some humanizing aspects - I'm curiously awaiting his development in the next part.

Of course, as a Tseng fan I was very anxious about how he will be handled but I am pleased with what we got for him. I definitely got the sense that he has more thoughts about everything that's going on than what he lets on, which makes sense for his character and I love how they portrayed that with his subtle body language. My only wish is that we got more of him but that is my very personal bias.

Speaking of little screen time, Vincent was amazing in the short time he got to be there. I love that his past as a Turk was made more relevant, as that was never really brought up outside of his backstory before. Cid, on the other hand, was kind of just there? I guess they're saving most his character development for the next game but he really didn't get to much to do in this one.

Zack's storyline interfered a lot less with the main plot than I expected and I think the way it was eventually tied in fit with the themes and rules they have established in the story.

As a Before Crisis fan, I was geeking out over the new added lore for Kalm.

I've only two big gripes with the game; one is that my fear of it being too over-packed with minigames and side-quests was not unfounded. Only watching through them got tedious sometimes, I can only imagine what it's like to actually having to play through them. And when I think about how all that time and memory space could have been used for more story-relevant things... yeah. (I only recommend the protorelic quest in Gongaga if you're a Turks fan.)

Another was this insistence of the story bringing up the Tifa-Cloud-Aerith-Zack love rectangle. Like, they will be just interacting and all getting along, then someone would ask "does x like y?" and I was groaning and rolling my eyes. I am not strongly invested in any of these ships and this constant focus on the romance started to make it feel like their bonds don't matter if they're platonic. Not to mention how this will further fuel the seemingly endless ship wars.

Overall, I think if you're someone who liked Remake, you'll probably like Rebirth too. If you didn't, you might not like this either. When I first got into Remake, I didn't know anything about FF7 other the names of the 4 main characters and a couple of plot points. Having now played the OG and consumed the rest of the compilation, I have a better understanding of the frustrations ppl had with changes Remake and Rebirth made. Even some of the things I liked got changed. But in the end, I did enjoy Rebirth, I got what I wanted out of it and its good parts outweigh the bad for me. I'd give it an 8/10.

[unknown-lifeform]

I have been thinking of Dirge of Cerberus recently and there's like so many small dumb questions that come from random details of this game like

Is any Reeve we see actually he true Reeve or is it all Cait in disguise? If the real Reeve died would we ever know or would they Cait armies just pretend like nothing happened? Can the Caits self replicate at this point?

What is the range of motion of Shalua's arm, and how precise are the fingers' motions? Because it doesn't seem too high tech - she uses the other hand most of the time, and I don't think she does anything more complex than bending her elbow or closing her fist. Either it's a lot better than the game made it look, or I have to wonder why would Shalua get stuck with it given how advanced FF7's technology is

Speaking of, how the fuck does Shalua's dress work and how many pieces is it even? I know, I know, video games don't care about functionality, but I'm not even sure what the designers were caring about when they made her

Although in terms of whack designs Rosso's crotch plate has to be me favorite. Girl how aren't you stabbing your bare thighs whenever you walk

Why does Rosso have a Russian accent (I think it's Russian at least, I can barely identify accents in my native language let alone in English)? She grew up in a laboratory together with Nero and Weiss, and they don't have that accent. Was Rosso exclusively exposed to Russian scientists as she grew up? Who even speaks Russian in FF7? I can't remember any other characters with such noticeable accents in the rest of the Compilation so why

Are Nero's wings like something he wears or did people decide this man wasn't fucked up enough and implanted them on his back? I'm not even going to bother asking how he can fly with those because it's not like FF7 cares about aerodynamics in general

If Hojo made a backup of his mind on the internet, then is it even possible to entirely get rid of him? Are there going to be Wayback Machine copies of Hojo no matter how much they scrape him off? Is that going to be Shelke's long term job, keep the scientist bastard away?

(For my SCP folk: internet based pattern screamer Hojo)

Given the Protomateria was inside of Vincent, is Vincent like missing some pieces? A bit of lungs, a bit of ribs? When Rosso ripped the Protomateria out of him we know the wound closed, but like did it all heal or does Vincent have like a thin layer of skin and a hole underneath?

Given this is the only game where Aerith and Sephiroth weren't involved, were they just sitting in the Lifestream eating metaphysical popcorn and placing bets on the shitshow?

[terraxcloud]

There are a lot of theory-crafting videos trying to uncover what FF7 Rebirth's "mystery" is all about. Now there are videos explaining how all those theories are wrong.

It's not good to see the trees and forget you're in a forest. Every single "theory" made for FF7R that I know of ignores one major detail:

"FF7R is a love story. It's literally in the lyrics of the main theme."

The main theme of FF7R is designed after the FF6 Opera, but instead of Terra saying she'll wait for Cloud to return to FF6 as Celes originally sung, she'll take the initiative and come into FF7R. Zack's timeline is the key. The anticipation is that Cloud will return to FF6 as he promised when FF7R ends.

It's peculiar that almost all theorists are male. Why is that important? Men care more about cold hard "facts" than the "emotional" stuff. Also, they are constantly on and on about the male characters of the story while ignoring the female ones who are actually the mystery of the game.

The "shippers" are more close to the answer than the "theorists", because "defeating Sephiroth (the instigator of the past) in his new form" is not a mystery, it's just a change. The "shippers" also look at more games that have the answers than the theorists who are stuck looking at the "Compilation". However, it would have worked better if they worked together.

In the first game (Remake), the only mysteries are about Cloud's love interest. Everything else that "seems" like a mystery (Sephiroth and Zack) is easily understood when you know who his secret love interest is and always has been. I mean, who actually knows who Cloud loved during the quarter-of-a-century since the game released? It's clear that this is the real mystery, and if the game clearly hints that it is a love story, then that IS the real mystery!

The Dissidia/WoFF-related hints will never be uncovered by the mainstream fandom until Terra Branford appears in FF7R or is so clearly hinted that it's impossible not to research it. Her appearance is so hinted at in spinoffs, the compilation, and especially in FF7 Remake itself that it seems silly to me that no one knows about it.

To "outside observers" it makes no sense that a character outside of "FF7 canon" can have an impact on the series, but that is not right to believe. The entire series of FF7 is designed after Terra Branford because of this very reason, but it has simply been stuffed under the rug of "design decisions" (yet, even these are ignored).

A grand majority of FF7's main female characters are partly designed after Terra Branford including Tifa, Aerith, Jenova, Priscilla, Lucrecia, Shiva, Betty, and yes, even Yuffie and likely more (especially with Rebirth).

The FF6 Opera is the actual "beginning" this story. FF8 made it's own version of the story by modifying the original cut FF6 character that was Cloud and creating a new darker-haired version of Terra. FF13 and it's sequels hint at the game by using Lightning and Snow (representing Cloud) and Serah (representing Terra). Vanille and Fang may also represent Cloud and Terra. I could go on and on about other games, but I already did.

Most people don't even know the basics. Here's the bear minimum:

Cloud's Story - Dissidia 012 Duodecim Terra's Story - Dissidia 012 Duodecim Leslie's Story - FF7 Remake

Cloud Strife was the main character of FF6. He likely had a different name and his appearance was more similar to Squall and Leslie. The "story" is about him "leaving" Terra for his FF7 "friends" and Terra saying that she'll "wait" for him in case he returns. That is called the "Reunion" or the "Promised Land" as promised by the developers. That's it.

[ff7central]

Mod Miri here! Today on the blog we have Sephy (she/her), who can be found here on Tumblr and Archive of Our Own. 

General FF7 Questions

Who is your favourite character from the FFVII setting? What do you love about them?

I love every single playable character from the main game, but my favorite is without a doubt, Cloud Strife. He's so unlike a typical RPG protagonist. He's very standoffish and rude at the beginning, but you start to grow to really like him the more you play the game. The amount of vulnerability he shows throughout the game makes him very relatable, I think. He's the party leader and he is strong when it's needed, but he can crack under pressure. I could talk all day about Cloud and what I love about him, but I actually did a dash game on my Cloud blog where I gushed about him. It's here: https://defiant-ex-soldiers.tumblr.com/post/626278527072878592/lets-start-a-chain-of-sweetness

Favourite party (three person team) idea when playing FFVII? They don’t have to actually work mechanically (or even be possible in the game), just that you like the idea of them together as a fighting party.

When I was young, my main post Disk 2 party was an odd one. It was Cloud, Yuffie, and Red XIII. Cloud had to be in my party, Red was in my party because I loved cats and he was a giant cat, how could I not? I didn't particularly care about Yuffie, but I needed a girl to replace Aerith as the main healer.

I didn't really like Tifa at the time because I shipped Cloud and Aerith (and the LTD taught me back then that if you loved that ship you must hate Tifa. I have long since gotten over that way of thinking, but I was a young impressionable kid back then.) I don't think I have an ideal team, I just love all the characters so much. Honestly I experiment with party composition a lot when I play.

Is there a headcannon or AU you want to see more of?

AUs that change the fundamentals of a story fascinate me. My first fanfiction was a Zack lives fic where the direction the story goes in is drastically changed by the way Zack ends up living. I still find myself cringing at it sometimes, but I also still adore the fic just because it was my first. A more recent one involved Zack getting his hands on some Shinra R&D special Materia and being teleported forward in time where he meets Advent Children Cloud. Any of the fics involving changing the Nibelhiem incident somehow immediately interest me. I'm a big fan of the lore the game establishes already, so reading how fic artists take that world apart and put it back together, but differently, is exciting for me.

Do you have a favourite memory associated with FF7 (any part of compilation) or something particular you did while playing (such as what you named the characters, or how you arranged your materia) that you think is unique that you'd like to share?

I have so many. I have been playing Final Fantasy VII since I was around 9 years old (even if I probably shouldn't have been playing it at that age). I don't remember much at all of my first playthrough, but there have been very many playthroughs after that. I do remember that I always named my Chocobos after the main party. My favorite was a black one named Yuffie and I made her dance on the minimap if a song I liked came on the radio. I also remember that I started playing for the first time after we had moved houses, so I didn't have the memory card for the family's PS1, so I replayed the first mission over and over again until we found it. 

Once, when I was young I got locked out of my room while playing through the wall-market section of the game. So I got embarrassed because my family could hear the Don Corneo music while they were trying to unlock the door. Another time, I tried to fall asleep with my old CRT TV on because I thought the Chocobo farm music would help me sleep better.

Cloud always had the lightning Materia and he also always had the Chocobo Lure Materia because I thought it was funny and it made sense to young me because his hair resembled chocobo tail feathers. 

One quirk I keep to this day has to be the two name changes I make whenever I start FFVII. Aeris is changed to Aerith, of course. There's also Red XIII whose name I change to Nanaki, because I didn't understand why he would want to keep the name that Hojo gave him and not his real name. FFVII has always been a constant part of my life. I remember long car rides where I would do nothing but play FFVII on my PSP. I remember back when I only had it on PS2, setting it up in a hotel room and trying to beat Carry Armor there (I didn't and I remained stuck there for a while longer). I remember playing it on my PSP during class after I'd finished my work.

I remember back when I was starting middle school, I got a teacher into FFVII and she put a special question on one of our tests, just for me. I remember making a poetry book that had really childish drawing and poems about FFVII. I remember finally beating Crisis Core, huddled in the corner of my bunk bed, unable to keep my eyes off of what was going on, and tearing up because the ending was so sad. That isn't even the half of it, but I've gone on for so long. As you can see, I have so many fond memories of Final Fantasy VII.

Creator Questions

Who has been the most difficult character to write/draw? Who has been the easiest?

Recently I started my first Turk fic and it starred Rude. I found that his muse didn't come as easy as the others. Usually I'm good at writing most of the cast of FFVII. Cloud is the easiest for me to write because I just know him so well.

What’s your ideal creating environment? Background noise/silence, indoors/outdoors, desk/couch, etc.?

At my desk with music playing! Fun fact, I haven't had an actual office chair to sit in for years. My computer was next to my bed at my old living space and now I sit on a couch when I'm at the computer in my new one.

What’s your creative process look like? Pantser/Emotive Writer/Gardener or Planner/Structured Writer/Architect? (Do you outline or just go with the flow?) If you’re an artist, do you do a lot of sketches, or just dive right in? Backgrounds first, or the main focal point? Multiple layers or all in one?

I usually just go where the fic wants to take me. A lot of the time I do jot down an outline, especially if I know I need to do it in a set amount of time, like for the Fic exchange or Whumptober.

What do you do when you get stuck on a project?

I usually set it aside and work on something else or try and brainstorm if it's something that I need to do in a certain period of time. Oftentimes I'll do something else and let my mind wander. Most of the plot of my Turkfic I came up with at work while my mind was on autopilot.

Which of your works is the most memorable to you? I don’t necessarily mean favourite or best work, it could be the work that taught you the most through making it or that holds a special reason in its creation. Drop a link.

"To Break like Time". This fic was my first ever fic for an exchange. The spring tester for Gaia Santa, "FFVII Secret Spring" to be exact. I'm not entirely sure what came over me when I was writing this fic, but I got it done in a weekend and edited a few days after, at the very beginning of the challenge. Despite how easy of a time I had writing it, I was nervous about posting it. It's that fic where Zack wakes up in post AC times with a Shinra R&D secret materia in his hands. Not exactly everyone's cup of tea, but I enjoyed the challenge it gave. There are several parts I would change, but overall, I enjoy the story, even if it does get kind of weird at the end.

It’s hard for me to go through everything you’ve done to pick stuff to mention. Is there a particular piece you’d like plugged, other than the one in the last question?

The Night that Nibelheim Burned is my Gaia Santa fic from last year. I really enjoyed the way everything came together. It was a harder fic to write, but it was worth it. Kunsel was the character on the docket that I was new to playing this time. This fic is another one of those fics about what Kunsel's doing while Zack is on the run. He never gave up hope, no matter how much time went by, and I think this fic really shows that.

Community/Fandom Questions

What aspects of fandom spark the most joy for you?

Just, how creative this fandom is. I've always been a fan of a lot of the art the fandom has made, and several of the fics too. It always blows my mind just how many new ideas that someone can come up with for such an old game (as well as the entries in the compilation). It inspires me to write my own fics and create my own piece of that to share with everyone.

I love seeing long rambling theory posts about the OG and the other compilation games on my dash. I also love how silly the fandom can be sometimes :3 I also love how every character is loved by someone no matter how minor.

Is there something you'd like to see more of in the community?

Can't have enough of people being nice to each other! Spread around the art you love (with the proper credits of course), Recommend that fic you love to other people! Leave Comments on people's fics, even if you don't have much to say! Those actions have the potential to make someone's day, and I think that's amazing.

Anything you’d like to say to the community?

The LTD (Love Triangle Debate) is bogus, and for a long time, I was scared that it would be revived with the release of the Remake. I was worried there would be people fighting tooth and nail over who Cloud should be with. As far as I know, that hasn't happened yet, but maybe I'm just in a different circle.

As for me, I quit the LTD when I was a kid and started playing Crisis Core because I started shipping Cloud and Zack. You can even see it in my first fanfic where I adamantly refused to admit that I liked them together as a couple, but you can see with the way I had Cloud and Zack interact with each other (Especially in the last chapter) how much they really loved each other. 

Anyway, back to the LTD. I'm a firm believer in shipping what you want. I have a million different ships with Cloud and all of them are valid in my mind. I don't ship because I want something to be canon, I ship because I like the story that could come about from having the two be together.  

Here is one of my favorite posts on the subject of shipping: https://sephyathredon.tumblr.com/post/617204499133661185/sunandrainfic-brief-note-to-new-ff7-folks

Is there a work belonging to someone else that you’d like to plug?

 "Rejoice although you will not surivive" by PUNK MENACE 

I enjoy seeing Cloud get whumped and this fic has some good whump and an interesting aftermath of that whump. Heed the warnings though, this is not a light fic.

Thanks so much for joining me, Sephy! It is great working with you during the annual events! 

Interested in participating in a FF7Central interview, or nominating someone? Check out the form here.

[contritecactite]

Ok I have to get this down somewhere and this is technically my blog even if I'm certain no one is following it for my thoughts on ff7! Spoiler-free overview talk below.

Background context: I played the original like 15 years ago, played Crisis Core when it came out and Dirge when I upgraded to a PS2, watched Advent Children and ACC. Didn't deep dive into things that didn't get localized, and I never got the hang of mobile games, so I know I'm missing some super special lore details. Still think I have enough to work with, though.

Plus! Some of my longest-running friendships stem from a shared love of the game/compilation. But we're not here to talk about that.

I loved Remake a ton. I adore adaptation and change, and I loved the way Midgar came to life. I think the game did a great job at being the beginning of a big story and at dropping enough mystery to get new players invested. This meant shifting around some story elements and adjusting the relevance of some characters/sequences/etc. and, in some cases, adding new characters. All fine! It was setup. They gave us a lot of characters and a lot of time and reasons to care about them.

But... I don't think Rebirth delivers the payoff. I can somewhat forgive the grindy nature of the open world approach because it is properly optional. What I'm having a harder time with is the way the story proceeds... or doesn't.

Rebirth takes its job as the middle of the story very seriously—to a fault, I think. There are half a dozen B-plots going on, and some of them are so heavily obfuscated that I don't even know if they'll register to newcomers (especially those who don't pursue all side quests and world intel). Not a single one is fully resolved. There are even more characters, and I don't think we're given what we need to care about them the same way as Remake's supporting cast. It's an extended trail of different flavors of breadcrumbs... and that's great for something with a brief intermission, but we have no ETA on the conclusion.

If even I feel like I'm being strung along, I can't help but worry that players who are just entering the story with Remake or Rebirth are going to have trouble feeling invested enough to await the conclusion eagerly. (Not everyone, of course—some people live for that kind of suspense!)

There are more granular things I'd love to talk about, but as an official opinion now that it's done: I feel unsatisfied, but not dissatisfied. I hope the lack of closure is enough to bring new players back for the finale, but I don't think it would work for me if I hadn't been in it for the long haul from the beginning.

[buffaloborgine]

"I don't hate Sephiroth as a character, I hate how some people dismiss all of his heinous acts and cling to "He is a victim" and shove the tragedy he caused onto other characters."

It sounds like you are criticizing his character though(particularly how he's written so far), not just the ones who blindly excuse his actions. The part in EC in which he reveals he knows he is Shinra's propaganda boy(but doesn't want to be) was clearly meant to make the audience sympathize with him and even pity him. This aspect of Sephiroth was only added very recently to the FF7 lore, decades after Crisis Core even. I would say that's a writer's oversight. To you, it made him unintentionally unsympathetic in that you believe that he never told Angeal and Genesis that, causing the chain of events that led toward tragedy and making him look like an already terrible person before he even turned evil. Only the writers will notice the error and try to confirm whether or not he informed them that his "achievements" were fabricated before he even stepped foot on the battlefield. I admit that the Compilation Of FF7 has even written the characters from the original game poorly sometimes.

I find it hard to understand why you think the writers wrote the story bad because as far as I can recall the writing of CC is kind of a puzzle solving narrative, where you have to always be skeptical about the scenarios displayed at hand.

And while I admit my suspicion on whether Sephiroth was complicit in this is vague before the revelation of EC, I wasn't surprised at all when it comes out. What makes me so disturbed is how the fandom reacted to it.

Years ago they would simply dismiss any idea saying that Sephiroth is a propaganda but now they fully embrace it and go "Aww, he was a poor baby, so it was all Shinra's fault".

The fact is, Sephiroth was never meant to get any redemption so why would the revelation in EC makes people think he is a victim so as to sympathize with him? Imo, it doesn't mean to bring sympathy, but rather a reminder that he used to be a victim but how had he fallen so deep despite being a victim?

We weren't meant to judge a person just based on their past but how they act in present. So why when Sephiroth's past came out, people jumped in to absolve his crime and pushed those on Shinra?

I read a villainous character as a character, so I don't care how writers write villains, as long as their writings make sense and logical, that's fine. But I expect the fandom to be better at remembering that Sephiroth did heinous acts on his own resolve, those that aren't steemed from his past.

[breezeinmonochromenight]

Hey, first of all, I love your blog so much! Your writing is everything, your shitposts give me life and I have to say thank you for all your ff7 posts.

I wanted to know two things ff7 related :

Do we know what happened to Cloud between the end of crisis core and the beginning of the original?

And do you know if someone wrote a fic or something about the "switch" between the Cloud who've seen Zack died, being more or less himself, and the moment when he fully takes his "Zack" self ? #angst don't know if I make sense

Take care !

Tysm. That means a lot. <3

From the timeline that’s been compiled from Ultimania info, Zack dies in late September of [ ν ] - εγλ 0007, and Tifa finds Cloud “wandering around the Sector 7 slums” not long after on October 5th and invites him into AVALANCHE. That’s about as detailed as it gets, but it’s not a huge gap of time between the end of Crisis Core and the start of FF7.

And I’m not sure if I’ve ever seen anything like that, fic-wise. Cloud never really thinks he’s Zack, but he’s traumatized and has been in a coma from mako poisoning, so his brain is kind of… Swiss cheese for a while. Couple that with the JENOVA cells merging his and Zack’s memories and he’s bound to borrow a few things here and there. I can’t really name one off the top of my head because gets explored all the time, but I don’t think I’ve ever read anything where that specifically addresses the topic. I’ll edit this if I come across one, though!

You take care too!

[lany-d-flow]

Thoughts: Barret as a Father Figure

I wanted to give my perspective on this topic, as it's one of many stigma-heavy thoughts about the actions of FF7 characters. I'll try to provide examples based on anecdotal experience and the circumstances surrounding Barret and Marlene's lives.

So, is Barret overall a bad father?

So, short answer: No, I don't think so.

Long answer:

Okay, anyway, anyone who has seen or played Final Fantasy 7 is probably aware of two characters: Barret Wallace and Marlene Wallace.

We first see their dynamic early in both Final Fantasy 7 and Final Fantasy 7 Remake. We also see a bit of this written in further works of the Compilation of Final Fantasy 7 such as "On the Way To a Smile: Episode Barret and Episode Tifa".

On the surface, we see Barret's unconditional love for his daughter. So many quotes from the game reflect this:

"She's tougher than me"

"That's right, little angel, I am!"

"She's cute as a button, with the heart of an angel..."

...And many more quotes I could cite. As one more example, during the ending of Final Fantasy 7 Remake, we see a moment of Marlene taking care of reunion flowers while under Elmyra's care. After looking at them, Marlene and Barret call out to each other, foreshadowing a reunion in one of the next installments of Final Fantasy 7 Remake.

All right, so we see that these two love and think the world of each other. However, some view Barret as a poor father figure to Marlene for trusting her into someone else's care multiple times throughout the story, including but not limited to:

Having Tifa care for Marlene while AVALANCHE goes after mako reactors in Midgar; having Elmyra care for Marlene while Barret joins the crew to go after Sephiroth; and after defeating Sephiroth and Meteor, trusting Cloud and Tifa to act as parental figures to Marlene while Barret heads back to Corel to atone for his past and find a new purpose besides being a man with a weapon as his right arm.

All right, so based on these moments, one could argue that Barret is not being a good father due to how often he leaves Marlene in the care of someone else, and instead of truly settling down as her caretaker, pursues purpose(s) he thinks are more important.

However, I do not fully agree with this view, nor do I fully agree with other views that Barret's incapable of being a good father. Do I think he could be a better Father to Marlene? Perhaps, yes. Many of the roles that our heroes in Final Fantasy 7 have are not done perfectly. There are examples I could discuss now, but I'll save that for later. For now, I argue the reason Barret leaves Marlene in the hands of others is that...

Life’s answers for the greater good aren’t always as simple as they seem. To do what’s best for someone you look after--in this case, Barret’s daughter--there may come a time when someone else can fill in as a guardian if the person does not have enough emotional availability to care for an individual.

Allow me to demonstrate explain, first by starting with how long Barret has been her father figure in the first place: around 4 years. Barret adopted her to take his Dyne’s place as Marlene’s father figure. Dyne, his best friend, was lost when Shinra took their usual cover-up approach when a mako reactor incident occurred in Barret and Dyne’s hometown, Corel. Instead of owning up to their mistake, Shinra decided to destroy everything remaining in Corel, including its inhabitants. Barret tried to save Dyne, but his right arm that was holding Dyne was shot by a Shinra trooper, causing him to lose control of his forearm and leading to Dyne facing an unfortunate fall into the Corel prison. Among the inhabitants in Corel, Marlene was an infant when Barret took her in as an adopted daughter. Infact, here’s her character bio in a Final Fantasy Ultimania:

Barret’s four-year-old adopted daughter. She views Barret as her real father, having no memories of her birth father, Dyne (Barret’s old friend). Marlene is remarkably composed for a young child and even occasionally runs 7th heaven by herself. - Final Fantasy Ultimania Archive Volume 2 (Pg. 063).

So based on the context the story gives us, we can conclude Barret spent 4 years looking after Marlene while residing in Midgar. He was probably in the middle of taking on odd jobs during this time, of course, and could not see her 24/7. However, such action is necessary if he is to make a living for himself, and more importantly Marlene. Ultimately that part is up to interpretation. What’s not open to interpretation is when Tifa became a part of AVALANCHE, she was the one looking after Marlene during Barret’s missions with his crewmates (Wedge, Biggs, Jessie). While we know Barret was not always around to watch Marlene, we can conclude that he knew who to entrust his daughter’s safety towards, as someone like Tifa has many motherly qualities, and above many things, wants people to live, especially people she cherishes (And of course she eventually becomes Marlene’s mother figure along with Cloud acting as the father figure when Barret heads to Corel). Eventually, when the team decides to go after Aerith at Shinra HQ, Barret entrusts Marlene to someone else once again. This time. it’s Aerith’s step-mother Elmyra, who will continue to watch over Marlene until the end of our heroes’ journey. Perhaps we’ll get a moment of reunion near the end of Final Fantasy 7 Remake when the team returns to the people they are fighting for, but for the next month Marlene is without her father.

All right, we know the endgame of Final Fantasy 7. The team survives the Lifestream-Holy-Meteor clash and they are alive, but now they must find a purpose in their new lives. While Barret stays with Cloud, Tifa, and Marlene at edge for some number of months, helping to build a new Seventh Heaven bar and home for Cloud and Tifa, he eventually decides to embark to Corel and leave Marlene under the care of Cloud and Tifa.

Wow, what a way to not look after your child that you dote on so much, right? For being her adopted father, Barret sure does leave Marlene in the hands of someone else pretty often. For some people, this can lead to the conclusion that Barret is not a good father figure to Marlene and needs to learn how to settle down and act as a real parent for her. While it can be said that Barret’s not an amazing father, I believe what he’s doing does have a realistic approach. He has no job, he doesn’t feel fully available to watch his daughter, and in the midst of this there are two people who are more than willing--and happy--to look after the person he cares about so much. If Marlene can receive a better quality-of-life from someone close for the time being, isn’t it best to give her that better life for now?

Well, I want to get a bit anecdotal about this. I come from a family of 7 children so I got 6 siblings: 2 older half-sisters, 1 younger full-blooded sister, 1 younger half-brother, and 2 younger half-sisters (5 sisters, 1 brother). Well over a decade ago when there was 4 of us, my biological father and mother divorced, and the aftermath was extremely detrimental to everyone. My mother was in a heavy state of depression and lost a lot of money; there was very little food to come by; us children were pretty much doing as we pleased with little consequence at the time; and my birth father was hardly there to support anyone but my younger sister and me. 

So what action did my mother take for my older sisters? She sent them to another state for a year where our grandparents resided, as they were in a financially and mentally stable situation that could benefit my sisters for the time-being. 

I could be here all day talking about the outcomes in minute detail, but to make sure that doesn’t happen, I’ll give the general aftermath: Eventually my mother recovered, found someone who became a doting step-father for all of us, and has unconditionally supported all of us in what we do with our lives.

The point here is that life throws us in complicated situations, and parents sometimes hit said situations that involve their child(ren). Many parents will absolutely dote over their children. Barret absolutely dotes over Marlene and is extremely concerned for her safety. But like Barret, there arise decisions in one’s life that involve changing guardianship for children. Some people have to work overseas and cannot take their children with them, so for a little while they can entrust that duty to someone else they are close to. If I’m going to draw parallels from other games, then the Persona series is a good example. I’ll be more specific: Persona 4. The protagonist is sent to Inaba where his uncle, Ryotaro Dojima, resides with his daughter. This happens because the protagonist’s parents’ jobs require that they be sent overseas. But his parents do not have to worry about their son’s livelihood because he’s sent to be supervised under someone that they trust, and someone they’re related to.

Conclusion

Nobody is perfect, and life is complicated. Sometimes there are roles in our life that we want to accomplish, but when it involves someone you care about, especially your own child, you want to make sure they have the best life possible. Maybe Barret would love to spend his time with Marlene as much as possible, but before he can really do that, he needs to get his own life together first. When that happens, then he can return to the person he loves more than anyone else in Gaia. Let’s always remember: Children are brought into this world, and it’s a cruel world, just like the real world. We want them to be as prepared as possible for the challenges life throws at them, so while they’re still young, look for the greatest good they can get, like Barret does.

[iaintyourbro]

Lol I'm not a clerith, not everyone is after y'all guys! I just like good translations, that's all. Also I don't fuck with Silver Wield so I'm not gonna ask them anything (just because I dislike one member of the fandom doesn't mean I'm gonna be a d¡ck like/to others) And please say thank you to @magicalchemist for me! I can't wait to see the pro Cloti stuff, I was really excited for it to be true so I'm happy now! Thank you again. Have a good day.

Hey anon. 

I’m not going to speak for @silver-wield on this one. I will address the rest of what you said, but I don’t have any issues with her. That being said, I also am not going to leave her untagged since she’s mentioned in this. 

At no point have I ever felt that the Clerith folks are after me or anybody else. I’ve mentioned in multiple posts that I know the group of Cleriths that is aggressive is small and the bulk of their community is just in this for enjoyment like me and many other Clotis. I personally have never had an argument with any Cleriths, and I’d deal with it in a civil manner, because there is a real person behind the screen. I would hope they would do the same. We all know there are those that don’t care, though. 

I think @magicalchemist is one of the best folks on here to translate this in an unbiased way because she is a multishipper.

I also think it’s really important that information is updated when better information is presented. I’ve updated posts when told something wasn’t accurate. Most recently, the post regarding the conversation in the sewers between Cloud and Tifa. It was a really good thing to clear up, I think, since it’s definitely one of the points of contention in the community... and it’s not even an LTD thing.

As for how the whole bad translation posts were handled: I don’t think the person who did that meant any harm. They were newer to the community and probably weren’t fully aware of exactly how bad things can get with this stuff. Personally I have never had anybody come after me about anything I’ve posted, but I also don’t post anything that’s really serious - I try to find the humor in things, and I do love all the characters (except Hojo). I also don’t think anything I say is the final say - it’s my interpretation of things. I did not write the story for FF7, somebody else did for mine and everybody else’s enjoyment. I do not do translations, though, because I don’t know Japanese even close to well enough to try at this point. 

My biggest issue with how it was handled was the harassment of the original poster. Nobody should be pretending to be a lawyer and threatening to sue a small-time blogger. That’s ridiculous - and it didn’t stop. She did post an apology, but still felt she needed to deactivate shortly after that. 

How do I think it should have been handled? The same way @magicalchemist dealt with it on my sewers post. She gave me accurate information, explained it, explained WHY the original Japanese means it in a different context than what had widely been shared, and I appreciated that. I updated the post with her comments to make sure if people found it, they had accurate information. 

I don’t have any reason to think that neven-yuki wouldn’t do the same, but it wasn’t dealt with in a kind way to even see how she would have dealt with it. Folks got aggressive and pushed her out. 

I do look forward to the translations as well. I keep saying if they would have translated all of the Ultimania’s in to English, there may be less fighting, but both sides have extremists that aren’t going to budge on their viewpoints. Even with the archives being in English, people still argue and discount things. 

I think the only way this will “end” is if Remake makes it so clear there’s no denying it. You can’t deny screenshots and in game dialogue. I think they’ve already started that in Part 1, and it’ll just get more obvious as time goes on. Even then, extremists will ignore chunks of the story, other parts of the compilation, or say that Remake isn’t the OG, so the OG still stands... 

It’s really a shame that we can’t enjoy this without the fear of it blowing up in our faces. I do hope that they contemplate translating the FF7R Ultimania in to English to clear up some of the mistranslations going around on all sides.

[silver-wield]

Why does some of the Western FF7 fanbase misunderstand the compilation so badly? They say Cloud's relationship is open-ended, don't follow ultimanias and official sources (instead insulting them and calling them BS), don't know/care about OTWTAS, act like ZA in CC wasn't serious, misinterpret Hollow and devs intentions in FF7R, and constantly insult Nomura, even though he wanted a 1:1 remake, don't know about Nojima, then call them hacks for "destroying" a franchise they "love" which is just OG.

Because they're deluded dumbasses is the short answer.

Because they're salty deluded dumbasses is the longer one lol

The even longer answer is the dumbasses as Sony back in 97 who didn't check the story synopsis and put out an ad saying Cloud and Aerith were a love that could never be 🤮 which I find hilarious since the damn game is a jrpg, not an otome, but they were pushing that angle back then, and the dumbasses at SENA are still doing it now. Only difference is we caught them and they look like total morons and JP SE are gonna bitch slap them into line or some dumdum is gonna lose his job for fucking with the biggest remake project SE have ever done.

But yeah otherwise, the dumdums have this stupid ass habit of insulting the people behind the story and character creation and still expect their busted fanon dinghy to be legit. Insane lol

[goddessofroyalty]

(1/?) The ff7 rremake has hit all of us like a train and I found your 'Cloud is the mom of the remnant triplets' verse AND found 'The Completely Inept Courtship of the One-Winged Angel's Cloud' around the same time, and I started thinking about how Sephiroth's atittude towards the triplets would change across the compilation + time travel. In the OG Cloud would be trying to protect them via Seph&Jenova don't finding out about them and then mid-game Sephirouth is like 'oh yeah, i know about them

(2/?) 'it's fine, they'll become part of me when i become god' and that is just one thing to add to cloud's self-loathing. then in advent children he gets creepy and personal (just like with cloud, really), and by the remake timeline he not only is haunting cloud way sooner than OG, he is doing shit like picking one of the babies out of the crib and commenting on their looks.

On a side point to start off with, can I just say how good of a fic The Complete Inept Courtship is. For those who haven’t, go check it out - it’s outsider POV found-document of a crisis core era world dealing with time traveling Sephiroth and Cloud and their apparent newfound... obsession with each other. Super good honestly.

Anyway, back on point - that’s the thing Sephiroth isn’t actually all that super interested in the triplets during the original game. Mostly he’s interested in them as potential puppets but as far as puppets go a set of actual toddlers isn’t as useful compared to Sephiroth’s other options. They are an extension of him in his eyes, sure, but not one of much use.

At most they can be used to throw Cloud off center by revealing that Sephiroth has known about them the whole time (despite Cloud’s desperate attempts to prevent). But past that he has little interest.

Honestly I try not to think that much about Advent Children in this verse. Because... well... how would that work? Do the triplets go evil and decide to resurrect daddy (if so damn that final fight would hit Cloud so much harder)? Is it some random other ex-puppet/new-clone (would they have a level of reverence for the triplets/think they’re unpure because carried by Cloud?).

Like Sephiroth, once in play, would absolutely want the triplets as much as he wants Cloud and would be trying to get them on his side/in his possession to control Cloud with them as well. Just... how Sephiroth gets into play is less clear.

The remake he’s totally invested in them. Still a lot because he can influence Cloud through them. But he very much wants Cloud to know he’s aware of them and ware of his connection to them. And... also it’s a ficlet under the cut

---------

Cloud knows what follows the brain-splitting headaches. But it doesn’t stop his blood from running cold when he sees him.

Sephiroth.

Sephiroth who is standing next to the cot. Standing between Cloud and them.

The triplets – three infants that Cloud hardly remembers birthing let along conceiving.

But the silver-hair and cat-slit eyes make it clear who their sire is.

A sire standing over them looking down at them.

Cloud wants to do something, anything, to draw Sephiroth’s attention away from them.

But his muscles are frozen. And he finds himself feeling lucky to even be able to still breathe.

“You must be so proud of them,” Sephiroth says, reaching down into the cot, gently running a finger over Loz, Yazoo.

Cloud feels his muscles tensing. He wants to tear Sephiroth away from them. For all his conflicted feelings about the three he cannot deny the maternal instincts that are so strong in hi. The pressure under his skin demanding he protect the pups he birthed.

“To think,” Sephiroth says, picking Kadaj up, cradling the swaddled infant in his arms, “that we all start so vulnerable like this.”

“Let him go,” Cloud manages to growl out despite his muscles still feeling frozen in place.

Sephiroth gives a huff of almost laughter, but other than that he ignores Cloud’s words.

“We start so dependant on our parent’s care,” Sephiroth says, walking over to Cloud. Kajad tucked into the crook of his elbow – so tiny compared to him. So fragile. “You could have left them there to die in the elements.”

Left them where?

Cloud’s memories of their birth are fuzzy and patchy. Grief and pain and the wail of three infants, but that’s it. He doesn’t even know how he ended up under Tifa’s care.

“But you couldn’t, could you?” Sephiroth asks. And he’s standing right in front of Cloud now – Kadaj within reach if Cloud could just move his arms. “The instinct is too strong for you. Your body recognises them as yours and demands you care for them. Protect them.”

“You’ve never been good at fighting those instincts Cloud,” Sephiroth says and Cloud finally feels his muscles free up.

He lunges for Kadaj and as soon as his hands grab the baby Sephiroth vanishes. Leaving Cloud standing alone in the room, apart from Kadaj in his arms and the other two infants still sleeping in their cot.

Two seconds pass before a sharp wail fills the room. Cloud coming back to himself to realise it’s Kadaj.

“Shit, shhhh,” Cloud says, bouncing the boy in his arms to try and get him to calm. No need to wake his siblings or the neighbours after all.

[unknown-lifeform]

I have been having plenty of thoughts regarding this matter as of late and so here it is, a whole post

Cloud Strife: an Aromantic Reading

...and now you're all going to tell me, "don't you have hundreds of thousands of words of fanfiction about Cloud Strife being in love with various men?" which, yes, I do, I would say I am fairly invested in making Cloud kiss dudes. But, for starters, I'm not the kind of person who always has a single fixed headcanon about a character's sexuality. An interpretation of Cloud as gay is to me just as valid as one where he's aromantic. Second, aromanticism is a spectrum, and a greyromantic or demiromantic Cloud would be both aromantic and very much capable of being in love romantically with someone.

Lastly, and most crucial, I am aromantic, therefore, literally any media analysis I do is technically an aromantic reading even when it doesn't talk about aromanticism. And I today want to discuss why I believe it makes perfect sense for Cloud to be aromantic, and what parts of his character make him compelling from the aromantic point of view.

Note: this post is very, very long. Like way too long. Also it assumes a general familiarity with both FF7 and the concept of aromanticism. And because this is an analysis it also includes me discussing why I believe that certain relationships between Cloud and other characters which are often seen as romantic do not in fact have to be romantic at all. You have been warned.

The dating mechanics

Let's start with getting this out of the way.

The game allows you to go on a date with one of four characters, depending on your choices: Aerith, Tifa, Yuffie, or Barret. Aerith and Tifa have the highest base probabilities of being Cloud's partner. Yuffie's base chances are much lower, not to mention that she is an optional character that not everyone even obtains. Barret has the lowest base probability of them all, and I would say it's fairly hard to have him as the partner unless specifically trying to get him.

Because most people will end up on the date with Aerith and Tifa, given the highest chances of it. After all, Aerith and Tifa are also often presented as Cloud's "canon" love interests, and every day we thank Squenix for all the shipwars they brought upon us.

Before I continue, let me state that I do not care what you, person reading this, ship. I'm sure everyone here is partial to different ships. We all have different interpretations of the characters. This is my personal opinion and analysis, not some kind of shipping manifesto, and I fully realize that some people will disagree with what I say.

With that out of the way, let me just say that I've always found the romantic chemistry built between Cloud and either Aerith or Tifa to be fairly lukewarm. Which is understandable, because Square Enix wants to sell both options as potential ships. They have always presented both Clerith and Cloti as potential relationships in the Compilation, and leaning too hard into one side would risk taking away the potential for the other relationship to occur. Allowing the player to pick their favorite girl has been an integral feature since day one, and now they have to commit.

For example, I'm considering the date scenes with either girl. Note that I will base myself on the English version of the game, not the original Japanese, meaning I could very well missing some nuance present in the original version.

If the date happens with Aerith, she will be the one to show up, propose it, and then basically drag Cloud out of the room, who for his part seemed more confused than anything else. Some shenanigans happen, and then the two ride a gondola, where Aerith tells Cloud that he reminds her of Zack (albeit never using his name) but she has now realized Cloud is very different from him. She then tells Cloud she wants to meet the "real" Cloud, either meaning she wants to get to know him better or that she has realized something strange is up with him.

At the end of the date, she asks Cloud if he doesn't like being with her. Cloud's dialogue options are "No, I don't" or "That's not it". At this point Aerith says to go on more rides next time they come here, and we cut to Cait Sith being shady and the plot moves on.

This entire date is overall... pretty one sided. Cloud didn't want to go at first, and mostly plays along. His dialogue options seem to suggest that at best, he likes being with Aerith, but something of this situation was making him uncomfortable.

Tifa also essentially pushes Cloud out of his room for her date, but never uses the word "date", rather asking Cloud to hang out, which fits with her personality being in general less outgoing than Aerith. In fact, later in their gondola scene, Tifa decides to tell Cloud something, and states Aerith would probably be able to be more open about it. Tifa proceeds saying that it's hard being old friends, that timing is everything, and from her words one can imagine she wanted to confess to him.

Just then the ride ends, and when Cloud asks Tifa what she was about to say, she says it was nothing, leaving Cloud confused.

This date also seems pretty one sided, with Tifa appearing interested in Cloud and Cloud being pretty clueless about it. He even agrees with Tifa that being old friends is hard, but doesn't seem to catch on that she is interested in him.

Overall, as an aromantic person, let me say I relate to Cloud so much in both instances. I have also completely missed other people's interests in me, despite it being kind of obvious in hindsight. And if someone took me on a date, I would be very uncomfortable. Note that Cloud's apparent unease is only apparent in Aerith's date, the only one that was openly stated to be a date, while with Tifa he was simply told they were spending time together. Of course his uneasiness with Aerith may also be because of her strange words regarding to wanting to know the "real Cloud", but it's just as possible to interpret his line to be about the date itself.

And if someone wants to tell me that it should be obvious Tifa wanted it to be a date... It isn't. We, the audience, can guess she might have a crush on Cloud, but Cloud clearly didn't pick up on it. A girl asking a boy to spend some time with her doesn't always mean that she's interested in him, unless we want to pull the "men and women can't be just friends" card.

I've also taken a look at the various dialogues which in game allow you to determine which character you will go on a date with. The majority of these just amount to being kind to one person or prioritizing them over the others, but not in ways which are openly romantic. There is one dialogue where Aerith asks if Tifa is Cloud's girlfriend and he can confirm or deny, and another where Marlene asks if Aerith likes Cloud and he can say he doesn't know or that he hopes so. Both of these dialogues allow the player to make Cloud act uninterested.

Now, Yuffie and Barret aren't usually seen as Cloud's potential canon love interests. Yuffie's date features Yuffie giving Cloud a kiss on his cheek, which she is immediately embarrassed about and Cloud basically ignores that it even happened. Barret's date is the least romantic, given, well, I guess Square Enix didn't dare make it gay. Paradoxically it's also the one Cloud seems to have the most agency in, because he was the one to suggest they take the romantic gondola ride, which Barret wasn't a fan of. But in the end, it's awkward more than anything else.

Aerith & Tifa: relationship with Cloud

Given the girls are seen as the potential love interests, I'm gonna now focus on them specifically.

Again. I'm not trying to prove or disprove your favorite ship. I don't care. I'm doing my own analysis here.

Tifa is the one Cloud has known the longest. Their relationship is actually kind of weird thinking about it. They always call each other old friends, but they weren't that close in childhood, what with Tifa's father keeping Cloud away from her.

While Tifa's feelings on Cloud can be discussed, Cloud's relationship with and view of Tifa doesn't have to romantic at all. Remember, she is the only survivor of Cloud's hometown, basically the only real connection to his past Cloud has, that's in itself a very powerful bond to share with someone. Tifa is the only person alive who remembers Nibelheim, and the only one who can truly understand what Sephiroth's rampage was like. It makes sense for Cloud to be drawn to her, protective too. Plus, Tifa was also the one who found Cloud while he was still in a confused state, there might have been a certain level of imprinting there.

Also. We know Cloud didn't have friends in Nibelheim, that he didn't get along with other children. Tifa was the only one who was kind to him. That's another reason for him to be drawn to her.

So we have Cloud, who has a thousand reasons to be attached to Tifa, and all of them in addition to the fact that, you know, they're friends. Because, they are friends. Cloud's affection towards Tifa can be well explained by friendship and all the baggage that comes with their past, without having to drag romance in.

Someone may point to Advent Children, where Cloud and Tifa live together (at least, when Cloud isn't off being sad and emotionally repressed somewhere). That does seem like a couples thing. Furthermore, in the One the Way to a Smile side novel, Tifa basically explicitly says she loves Cloud (not words on Cloud's feelings tho). This doesn't however take away from the potential for an aromantic Cloud, and in fact makes my aromantic brain go brrrr with excitement.

Living together isn't exclusively something romantic partners do. Friends can do it as well, especially in circumstances where it's more convenient to do so, and for Cloud it would be better to room with Tifa than to find another place in Edge.

But also... found family. God, how I love found family, and in my experience it is in general a trope beloved my a lot of people in the aromantic community. Cloud and Tifa are raising two children, an orphan whose feelings towards them are unclear, and a girl whose father is not romantically involved with either Cloud or Tifa, this is in itself a very strange situation, and it doesn't become more "normal" if we assume those two are a romantic couple.

I personally adore the idea of two people who are not romantically in love taking care of children, becoming a family because of their own choice. Being platonic friends, or queerplatonic partners too. Because Cloud and Tifa are never stated to be officially a couple, they are a perfect example of a situation to which the queerplatonic label may apply. And in fact the idea of a queerplatonic Cloti is in my opinion spectacular. The devotion, the history, the complicated connection which cannot be explained as romantic but isn't close to friendship either? That's the kind of non-romantic partnership I want to see in media.

Let's look at Aerith now. The early relationship between her and Cloud was mostly driven by her, with Cloud kind of going along with her antics. Aerith is a whirlwind, and he is basically swept up by her. Given Aerith's bluntness and personality, I wouldn't be surprised if she were able to get almost anyone to follow her around the way Cloud did. And yes, she was flirty with him from time to time, but again this is her side of things, not Cloud's.

Their time together was unfortunately cut short by Aerith's death, and Cloud's reaction to it was heartbreaking. Her death scene is justly known as iconic, and it leaves me baffled that I have seen in the past Cloud's reaction to it being treated as "proof" he had romantic feelings for her. She was his friend, and she was murdered in front of him, while he was busy fighting against Sephiroth's mind control. Cloud's devastation is understandable, and in itself isn't enough to be connected to romantic feelings, unless someone want to try and convince me friends don't grieve for friends.

Aerith's presence continues to haunt the game - literally. She determines the ultimate victory from the Lifestream, and continues to act as a spirit even in Advent Children. In On the Way to a Smile she also says she loves Cloud, quite like Tifa does. Again, Square Enix cannot push too far in one direction without evening out the playing field.

Cloud, for his part, is drowning in guilt about her death by Advent Children. The same guilt he has for Zack's death. Now, his pain about both seems to be of the same magnitude, and we can't grab the grief itself as proof that he had romantic feelings for one of them without saying he must have also had them for the other. And I doubt Square Enix wanted us to think Zakkura is canon either.

All in all, Cloud's approach towards both girls can be read as platonic or romantic depending on your personal interpretation. Nothing ever says he was never in love with them, but nothing directly says he was either. His devotion can be seen as non-romantic in either case. These characters are in the end people who have gone through terrible things together, and it's reasonable to think their bond will be powerful regardless of its nature.

Devotion in FF7

It's common in fandom circles to hear the sentence "those two can't be friends, they are too devoted to each other to be friends". This is a wretched sentence. The idea that romantic love is far deeper and more powerful than any platonic friendship derives from amatonormativity, and it has plenty of issues which basically boil down to it's fucking wrong.

Romantic love is different than platonic love. That doesn't mean it's always stronger or better. Depending on the circumstances, it can be fully justified to put a partner above a friend. If an individual person feels that their romantic partner will always be their most important person, that is their prerogative, but people can love their friends just as much as they love a partner.

Insisting that only romantic love can push people to go to certain lengths for others honestly make me extremely perplexed. Don't get me wrong, everyone works in different ways, and I have no doubts that for some people romantic feelings will be more intense than platonic ones, but it's definitely not every single person in the world. The devaluation of platonic connection is something I have a lot of feelings about, and it's probably better if I move on with the analysis.

FF7 has plenty of instances of depictions of devotion between characters that we aren't supposed to see as romantic partners. Zack's love for Cloud comes to mind, he went above and beyond what anyone else would have done for another person, giving his life to protect a best friend after having spent months dragging Cloud around despite his coma.

And then... Barret spends his life raising the daughter of his best friend, and when Dyne dies Barret is broken by it. Cait Sith may be just one robot among many, but he also appears to have some degree of intelligence, and the first Cait Sith's last words make it clear he didn't want to be destroyed, but still did so for his friends. Zack in Crisis Core did everything he could to save Angeal. The Turks in Before Crisis put each other above everything else, even if they should in theory be a bunch of cold hearted assassins.

This is a whole other analysis, but FF7 is to me a game that fundamentally talks about people caring for each other or for an ideal. The positive characters, who care about the world and their friends, are placed in opposition to Shinra, full of people that care for nothing if not themselves, and to Sephiroth and Jenova, willing to sacrifice a whole planet just for their own sake.

Saying "Cloud treats X character in a certain way, therefore he must be in love with them, a friend would never" does to me an enormous disservice to both the game and to how strong real life friendships can be.

In short, none of what Cloud does has to be connected to romance to make sense. Doesn't he say so himself in Advent Children? There's nothing that he doesn't cherish. He's not fighting for X specific person because of romantic love, he literally tells us that everything is on the same level for him.

Because of this Cloud is so appealing as an aromantic character. He never claims to love something more than other, he fights in the same way to protect his best friends or the whole planet. Someone who never falls in love, and yet loves with such apparent intensity. It's not a kind of character that every aromantic person in the world can relate to, but he's still so compelling.

Remake scenes

Remake has given us plenty of new scenes concerning Cloud and romance. Mainly, approximately every character in the game flirting with him, from Aerith and Tifa to Jessie to whatever the fuck was going on with Roche to Sephiroth asking to be hugged (look I know embrace me is meant to be metaphorical but come on).

And every time, Cloud looks... quite uncomfortable. At least most of the time. To be fair at various points of the game he looks to be more at ease in ambiguous situations when it comes to Aerith and Tifa, who are both the main romance options and also the people Cloud knows the best. For the most part Cloud tends to brush off people who act flirty with him, even trying to get out of Jessie's hug that one time.

Again, it could be just his general tough guy persona, which is even more evident in Remake than it was in the OG, but it might also be that he genuinely disliked being approached in romantic ways.

When it comes to Aerith and Tifa, there are much more potentially romantic scenes with both, and many of them also do look more ambiguous. Remake is a much larger game than the OG, with a lot of additional content, it's obvious that Square Enix would add more scenes that build the relationship between various characters. Possibly also because it's easier to build tension between realistic models than it is between polygon people. Plus, with the success FF7 has enjoyed, and Clerith and Cloti both having plenty of fans, Square Enix might have decided to lean heavier into that side of things to please the fanbase.

My general impression of many scenes being more ambiguous than strictly romantic stands, because once again, Square Enix cannot validate either ship too much, and even if they keep the dating mechanics I doubt they will make any route "too canon".

That being said. I do agree that some of these scenes lean more towards being romantic than some scenes in the original game. Some are situational - like Cloud physically protecting both Tifa and Aerith from bad falls - but there's also plenty of additional dialogues implying Cloud may have feelings for one or the other. I still don't feel they are enough to say "Cloud 100% has romantic feelings for this girl", but I can admit they can be taken as a stronger indication than some of the OG scenes.

Now... So far I've always spoken of Cloud in terms of the no romance, no romantic feelings ever, kind of romance repulsed flavor of aromantic. However, as I said at the start of the post, aromanticism is an umbrella. It includes things like greyromanticism, demiromanticism, and in general identities where one may on rare and specific occasions develop romantic feelings for someone. And there are people who may be both grey/demi/any identity that implies occasionally feeling romance, and simultaneously be romance repulsed and unsure of what to do when they do have a crush on someone.

Tifa and Aerith are both people Cloud has very strong emotional connections with, regardless of the nature of said connection. He and Tifa have known each other a long time, and he becomes very attached to Aerith very fast. He is objectively annoyed by a lot of people flirting with him, and while he warms up to the two girls he still acts awkward and unsure around them. One could very easily make a case for a romance repulsed demiromantic Cloud, for example.

Considering also how many people say Remake!Cloud and OG!Cloud have different personalities - not getting into this argument now, I'm just saying that it is a common interpretation - one could also say that Remake!Cloud and OG!Cloud have different flavors of aromanticism. It's also a possible interpretation.

In conclusion

Can any of the things I have discussed so far be taken as definite proof that Cloud is aromantic? Not really. It's all up to interpretation, and my interpretation is heavily informed by my own orientation.

However, it's also not any less acceptable than any analysis speculating what Cloud's actual orientation is. Unless Square Enix decides to make Cloud officially state what he identifies as, every option is a possible option. Overall, as an aromantic person I find that many of Cloud's actions are very relatable, and that it doesn't feel at all like a stretch to consider him motivated always by non-romantic feelings of affection.

Anyways I want more aromantic Cloud in my life, and if you are thinking something along the lines of "hey, you're a writer, you know you can just write it yourself?" I want you to know that yes you are right about that but also I am allowed to wish that things would just spontaneously manifest in my life without me putting in any effort to make them happen ok