#grrm has said that ONE interpretation of the title is:

[jonsnowunemploymentera]

Revanshe: There is some question as to what "A Song of Ice and Fire" refers to. Some people think it dwells on elements, such as the wall and Others and dragons, while others think it refers more to a character or characters, the favored one being Jon. Any comments?

GRRM: No comments on that one . . . except that I am known for titles that have several meanings

[branwyn-the-half-witch]

Comparative Mythologies of the Long Night: Part Two – Azor Ahai and The Red Sword

In part one, we looked at the origin story of the Long Night, and the ways in which it is reflected in the main series. Now, we shall move on to discuss the heroes who seemingly saved the world.

The most notable of these heroes, with whom you are likely aware, is the one most commonly known as Azor Ahai; emerging from Asshai, this is the hand that wields the flaming sword Lightbringer. They are also known as Hyrkoon the Hero, Yin Tar, Neferion, and Eldric Shadowchaser.

As a brief aside, it is interesting to note that all of these names can be related to specific places in Essos; the Patrimony of Hyrkoon is an ancient nation, Yin is a city in Yi Ti that has often been its capital, ‘Nefer’ is the last city in the distant kingdom of N’ghai, ‘the Shadow’, or the ‘Shadow Lands’ are a region in the furthest east, with AssHAI in the southwest, serving as something of a gateway to them – and it is the Shadow, as we will later learn, from whence the dragons may have first originated; tamed by an ancient, unnamed people.

Whether this solid anchoring of these heroic aliases in various places means anything more than a suggestion that the hero – or heroes – may have come from there, or were perhaps claimed by those peoples, I will leave you to ponder. For now, we shall turn to Azor Ahai’s legend.

Of Azor Ahai (AA), we have the most available information of all of the legends we shall discuss. He is also the only one explicitly prophesied to return again, and the manner in which AA shall return and be heralded is very clearly laid out for us from multiple sources.

AA is described as a leader, wielding a burning sword that radiates heat and light. He gave ‘courage to […] men and [led] the virtuous into battle’, returning ‘light and love’ to the world. So we should account for these aspects, as well as the finer points of the prophecy.

Much has been said about who AA reborn might be, with many candidates proposed. I will not be spilling that ink here; it’s Daenerys. Born on Dragonstone, a smoking isle in the great salt sea, she arose when darkness gathered and, beneath a bleeding star, awoke dragons from stone.

I would also point out that even Jon Snow, upon hearing of the Prophecy in the context of Mel’s candidate Stannis, zeroes on the importance of Stannis not being born on Dragonstone. One can almost hear the author himself tapping his fingers impatiently, no?

If you favour another candidate, a more abstract interpretation of the prophecy, feel free to do your own research and present it elsewhere; I am interested primarily in exploring the myths, not arguing. However, I do hope you will let me expand on my case and consider it fairly.

Dany becomes a leader, bringing hope and courage to mankind and returning light and love to those lost in the darkness. Moreover, she inspires them to fight for themselves, for their lives and loves; leading them into battle, but not doing their fighting for them.

I would also briefly highlight this echo of command from Quaithe, in light of one of AA’s names being ‘Shadowchaser’ – and that Quaithe wishes Dany to go to Asshai, from whence the myths of AA were born and the prophecy was written.

Going back here may mean in a temporal sense, revisiting the origins of AA and learning who he was, what he did, and most notably for Daenerys, why it was needed. She is, as present, unaware of the encroaching darkness that threatens the world, on any level except subconsciously through her dreams. A revelation is needed.

To add to this, we have the ‘Prince that was Promised�� title; these are used interchangeably with AA by Mel and by Maester Aemon and seem to often refer to the same person; in light of GRRM’s addition of Aegon’s dream to the canon, my interpretation is that they do refer to the same person, but by accident. Though we do not yet have it in GRRM’s words, Aegon saw the return of the Long Night and a Targaryen fighting against it. This is tPtwP, Aegon’s name for this leader who happens to also be the one who woke the dragons from stone to fight the cold.

And it is Aegon’s dream that dream-driven Targaryens have stumbled across in their scrolls – what Rhaegar to become a warrior and thence to confer the promise he initially saw in himself upon his newborn son. The Red Priests who herald Dany speak only of AA; Mel may have discovered tPtwP on Dragonstone itself. All other sources for the Promised Prince title seem to be either Targaryen or Targaryen adjacent – such as Barristan, who himself speaks of Jenny of Oldstones’ witch friend, presumably close to certain Targaryens.

But what of Lightbringer? Daenerys is not trained in arms, so how can she wield a sword? Recall that AA reborn is marked by waking dragons from stone and wielding Lightbringer. There is no separate mention of forging/reforging a sword. Perhaps there is more to the tale than that?

So let us examine Lightbringer and its forging; AA makes three attempts to forge the blade, quenching it in water, lion’s blood and, in his successful forging, the living heart of his wife, Nissa Nissa. The blade is described, by the Jade Compendium, as making its own fiery heat.

The blade never being cold, but being warm as Nissa Nissa was warm, is very alike to the description of dragons being ‘fire made flesh’; and the description of Lightbringer in action resembles nothing so much as the affect of Drogon’s flames. Lightbringer, Red Sword of Heroes, is not a blade; it is the dragons awoken from stone. But what of the three forgings? The exact arrangement of the forgings is sometimes debated, but the one I favour is this arrangement: the first forging in ‘water’.

The second in the ‘heart of a lion’; note that this moment is so important it appears again in the dreams that guide Dany’s steps to her eventual success.

And the third, successful forging – in the ‘sacred flames’ of a funeral pyre, fed by the blood of heart’s beloved. Note the proximity of the water/lion/heart imagery on each occasion, and that the conversations following the first scenes are about dragons, and then about war.

In the chapter prior to the pyre, Dany has dreams haunted by a pursuing cold, and by ghosts urging her on, with very familiar gemstone eyes; this links Dany and the dragons explicitly to the Great Empire of the Dawn and thus to the Long Night that followed the Blood Betrayal.

These dreams also link the dragons to sacrifice, just as Lightbringer is linked to Nissa Nissa’s sacrifice. Dany’s dreams show us the lives lost in her journey to that point (though Drogo is not yet entirely lost to her); those she has lost will lend their names to the dragons.

Blood sacrifice is a deeply potent power, both within ASOIAF and without. Many characters tell us of the potency of shed blood; of kin, king, and of holy men. Within many cultures in our own world, blood sacrifice was a holy act, to ward off catastrophe, as payment – and penance.

In Aztec mythology, for instance, it is now generally understood that blood sacrifice, both of slain captives but also one’s own blood on a daily basis, was both a fuel offered up to the gods for their daily labours, and as repayment for the debt owed by the living to the gods for their sacrifices made when creating the fifth sun, and so all human life. The dreams emphasise Dany’s own shed blood from the beginning; in her bloody footsteps, the burning in her womb, and the burning blood from her torn open back, which ultimately grants her wings.

When the time comes, she offers up her own blood by walking unafraid into the sacred flames of the funeral pyre, to bleed with her fallen beloved. Dany alone, among all Targaryens who have attempted to bring back dragons, took the last and most important step of self-sacrifice.

But if we understand blood sacrificed to be offered up, not just for power but for payment of debt, what debt is Dany paying here? Moreover, have we strayed from AA in this talk of blood magic and penance? I would argue not; for just as Dany’s Lightbringer is living dragons, so too do I believe that AA’s red sword was no literal blade, but dragons also.

I would here posit that Azor Ahai, in the coldest, darkest night, sought to bind fire made flesh to humankind. I propose that he tried and failed twice, before binding dragons to the fate of men.

I implore you to consider that Nissa Nissa was a dragon.

This concludes Part Two. Part Three shall answer the question, ‘what in the world did she mean by that last comment?’, by examining sacrifice, necessity, and the long, sad history of House Targaryen’s ritual offerings of innocence as payment.

[kellyvela]

Hi! Sorry if you've been asked this before, I just can't find anything. Do you know if George has ever talked or has been asked about joneris in the past? I only know about that instance in which he asked about whether Jon and Dany would fight or fuck, but I wonder if he has ever talked more about them as a romantic option.

Hello Anon:

I remember Kit Harington being asked about whether Jon and Dany would fight or fuck . . . . Did they ask GRRM the same? 😂 If you have a link, please send that to me 🙏

Jon (ice) and Dany (fire) as a romantic couple is mostly a fan theory, a very popular one, and the show made it even more popular just to destroy it in the very end, by one half of the ship (ice) killing the other (fire) . . . .

Now, as far as I know, GRRM never said anything about Jon and Dany as a romantic couple. He mostly avoid the question or make it about politics . . . . But there is certain secondary source that claims GRRM told him that the meeting of Jon and his aunt is the point of the story . . . .

Let's see:

[Future meeting between Daenerys and Jon Snow?] GRRM: Keep reading [Source]

~~~

“Some people I met thought we have to find the story’s through line. Who’s the important character? Somebody thought that Dany’s the important character – cut away everybody else, tell the story of Dany. Or Jon Snow. Those were the two most popular characters to build everything around, except you’re losing 90 percent of the story”. 

—Rollingstone 2014

~~~

“I had a number of meetings long before David and Dan, with people who said this is the next Lord of the Rings franchise. But they couldn’t get a handle on the size of the material, the very thing that I set out to do. I had all these meetings saying, “There’s too many characters, it’s too big — Jon Snow is the central character. We’ll eliminate all the other characters and we’ll make it about Jon Snow.” Or “Daenerys is the central character. We’ll eliminate everyone else and make the movie about Daenerys.” And I turned down all those deals”.

—Time Magazine 2017

~~~

Do you already know where certain events will lead the Game of Thrones story? Like the relationship between Daenerys and Jon Snow, for example? GRRM: That, I know it. And for many years. But of course, I will not reveal anything to you, it will be necessary to wait for the books. Fire and Blood is a long time before the tomes of the Game of Thrones saga, even if the most attentive readers will find some omens, allusions to subsequent events. But it's no more allusive to Jon Snow or Daenerys than a book about Abraham Lincoln to the Trump administration. —Society Magazine Interview [https://www2.lekiosk.com/fr/publication/society/21423629█ 201812 Society Magazine.pdf]

~~~

About the ice and fire thing that many people believe represents Jon and his aunt, that's a pretty cursory interpretation, not only because GRRM himself said the White Walkers are the ice and aunty and her pets are the fire, but he also said that the title's meaning has many layers, a primary, a secondary, a tertiary meaning, etc. At most, when someone asked about Jon and aunty being the characters most associated with those elements, GRRM said that that was a way to interpret it.

Ice and fire are not meant to be lovers, ice and fire are meant to clash! Read more about it here:

Also take note that GRRM still named the series A Song of Ice and Fire in the so called original outline, but Jon and his aunt was completely nonexistent in his plans. Doesn’t that kind of kill that whole ice and fire argument? Read more about it here:

And of course the Jon and aunt shippers will hold onto a secondary source, the GOT director Alan Taylor, that claims GRRM told him that Jon and his aunt are meant to be, are the point of the story, the ice and fire, etc, which contradicts GRRM's own words in the quotes above.

You can read about the Alan Taylor issue here:

But just think about this very telling fact: The supposed words that GRRM told to Alan Taylor about Jon and aunty being "the ice and fire", "the point of the story", are not featured in So Spake Martin, the legit source for anything that the author has said about Asoiaf over the years. Alan Taylor gave multiples interviews during GOT's S7 about what GRRM told him about Jon and aunty during the filming of S1 in Malta, and he even repeated those words in some behind the scenes DVD stuff or something, and none of these is featured in the main source of GRRM's words about Asoiaf. And I wonder: Why??? Why none of Alan Taylor's "reports" is featured in So Spake Martin, like many others fan reports of their talking, correspondace, encounters, Q&A, etc, with GRRM about Asoiaf???

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Thanks for your message!

[aegor-bamfsteel]

Why do Targ stans believe that Daenerys being the fire that the title of the series refers to, is a good thing? George has previously explained that the title of the series comes from the poem "Fire and Ice" by Robert Frost, and the literal first lines of the sonnet are "some say the world will end in fire, some say in ice". The poem also ends with "from what I've tasted of desire, the world will end in fire. But if it had to end twice, ice will suffice".

I’m not a Targ Stan, nor do I interact with them frequently, so I’m not the best person to answer this question. Maybe it’s because they recognize that the “song” refers to a war, much like how the Dance of Dragons refers to another war, just romanticized by singers. If the Others—mysterious cold beings who want to eradicate all life—are the ice threat and clearly evil, then the Fire being must be set up to oppose them and is thus clearly good (though that hasn’t yet been established, and the series shows there’s varying degrees of morality). Maybe it’s because they think like some GOT writers (Alan Taylor) that it’s referring to her protagonist status and contrast to ice protagonist Jon Snow, with whom she’ll have a series-defining romance that may play into saving the world, just like a romantic song (even though GRRM said she and Jon are just 10% of the story).

Of course, neither of those theories take into account Robert Frost’s poem, which goes:

Some say the world will end in fire, Some say in ice. From what I’ve tasted of desire I hold with those who favor fire. But if it had to perish twice, I think I know enough of hate To say that for destruction ice Is also great And would suffice.

So then there’s the theory that Dæny will die fighting the Others in a heroic sacrifice, or even be Jon’s Nissa Nissa (which tbh is even worse for her character), thus bringing down all Ice/Fire magic in the world. Ice in the poem is described as hateful, I guess like the Omnicidal others, slow-burning, but not interesting and ends the poem on a deliberate anticlimax. Contrast the Fire, described as passionate, quick-burning, and the writer’s first choice of destruction (not unlike “shooting star” reformer character Dæny, according to a certain BNF). It’s also been theorized Dæny will burn down KL but accidentally due to the wildfire caches, but then go north to die because she actually wants to save humanity, thus I guess being a fire threat but “””ultimately good”””” don’t pay attention to the half a million corpses in the corner civilians don’t count

That said, in reference to the title it does seem that GRRM was pointing to both the Ice and Fire as threats to humanity. However, GRRM also called Hector and Achilles two heroes when Achilles was a child murderer (Troilos) and Hector was a decent family man trying to defend his city, so it wouldn’t be first time I’ve disagreed with his literary interpretations. However, with this one “People say I was influenced by Robert Frost’s poem, and of course I was, I mean... Fire is love, fire is passion, fire is sexual ardor and all of these things. Ice is betrayal, ice is revenge, ice is… you know, that kind of cold inhumanity and all that stuff is being played out in the books.” I think he’s making sense with ice and fire as opposites but destructive in different ways.

[rainhadaenerys]

Jon and Dany being ice and fire is a fact. First, it’s important to distinguish the song of ice and fire as mentioned within the text, and “A Song of Ice and Fire”, the title of the series. The song of ice and fire is mentioned by Rhaegar in the House of the Undying in relation to the prince that was promised prophecy. This prophecy probably only has one correct answer that we don’t know yet. I don’t actually believe this prophecy refers to Jon and Dany, I think it refers to Dany alone.

However, A Song of Ice and Fire, the title of the series, has multiple meanings. Jon has a storyline very associated with the icy North, while Dany is associated with fire. Them being ice and fire is undeniable. GRRM has said that the title “A Song of Ice and Fire” has multiple meanings, and he has also said that Jon and Dany as one of those meanings is a possible interpretation (X, X). So yes, Jon and Dany are ice and fire. There isn’t really anything to debate here. They are ice and fire just like the dragons and the Others, the North and the South, winter and summer, death and life, hate and love, etc. I don’t know why people in the fandom are so insistent in saying that this or that interpretation aren’t valid, as if one interpretation being valid made another interpretation invalid. It doesn’t, all of these interpretations can coexist.

Now, Jon and Dany being ice and fire has nothing to do with the reason people think their romantic relationship will happen. I don’t know who came up with this idea that Jonerys shippers think Jonerys will happen because they are ice and fire, but this is not true. Jon and Dany being ice and fire is a cool thing, but it’s not the reason people think Jonerys will happen. People think Jonerys will happen because there’s a prophecy that implies it will happen. The Undying tell Dany about the bride of fire prophecy, and during this bride of fire section, they show Dany her silver (symbolic of one of her husbands), a corpse at the prow of a ship (that people speculate is Hizdahr after he is killed by Victarion) and a blue flower growing on a wall of ice (obviously Jon). Jon happens to appear in the bride of fire section of Dany’s prophecy, alongside with at least one of Dany’s husbands (Drogo, at least). This is why people think Jonerys will happen. This is the main evidence. The ice and fire thing, the parallels between Jon and Dany, Dany hearing a wolf howl and feeling sad, and all the other things we consider foreshadowing (X, X), all of this is supplementary evidence. They help build up the case that Jonerys will happen, but the main evidence is the prophecy, because a prophecy is something that has to come true one way or another, and the most obvious interpretation here is that Jon and Dany will get married.

It’s also worth noting that this prophecy happened in ACOK, and book fans have been speculating ever since. There were Jonerys shippers way before they ever became a thing in the show. Also, this prophecy is a BOOK-ONLY prophecy, the show never even showed it. So no, people who think Jon and Dany will get together are not just “show stans”.

[istumpysk]

After the whole accusation of how disgusting is Sansa's thoughts about Mycah, the only thing I remember her telling that he is smelly. Not a very positive look on Sansa, I would admit as a Sansa stan .

I want to be a bit petty. But this is some serious fucked up shit .

Pretty Pia from the buttery was a slut who was working her way through every knight in the castle. (ACOK, Arya VII)

The fact is all my years in the fandom and after reading the books many times , I don't know how I never came across this passage .

I think whatever headcanons we have about characters are more to do about the consistent open discourse in the fandom rather than actual interpretation of text . The Classist, ableist , bully Sansa is a narrative that has been popularized in the fandom for years . It's only been a few years since people have started to see Sansa as more than those titles. 6, 7 years earlier it was all about shallow Sansa unable to see the beauty underneath Tyrion and Sandor. Atleast now those ships are criticized and so is the behaviour of those men during Blackwater and the wedding night. Thats why I think Jonsa is hated because as a fandom, we have unearthed some pretty unpopular interpretations of characters. This quote about Pia is one such example ( You will never see it mentioned anywhere and even when someone comes across this, they will be surprised just like me )

Maybe Sansa isn't the only ableist and classist in Westeros. Maybe no matter how woke you are as a character, the fact that being born as a daughter of a feudal lord isn't going to erase the classism with which one grows up with. Thats why I believe Grrm is writing well rounded mentally strong female characters but not feminists . Also the fact all of the women even the ones who are non gender confirming like Arya, Asha and Brienne are highborns. So one could argue that Sansa is more classist than Arya but to say the younger sister is class blind is like saying a woke white person is race blind .

Could you imagine the consequences of Sansa slut shaming one of Cersei's spy handmaidens in her thoughts 😱 ?

You’re right, headcanons are so entrenched within this fandom, it’s almost impossible to introduce a new idea, regardless of its legitimacy.

I'm like you, I forgot all about that quote until I came upon it on @agentrouka-blog’s tumblr. It’s not one of her better moments, but at worst it's just a clueless kid repeating things she's heard adults say.

Yes, Sansa would be buried for thinking something like that, but as frustrating as it is that she’s held to a different standard than any other character in the series, we have to remind ourselves that’s not how the author operates. Thankfully he doesn’t care about narratives built on fan forums.

With that being said, if some Arya fan comes sniffing over here, it’s nice to have that quote in my back pocket, lol. Love a good opportunity to be petty.

[butterflies-dragons]

ELEANOR OF AQUITAINE

Art credit: Kinuko Y. Craft

Eleanor of Aquitaine, also called Eleanor of Guyenne, French Éléonore or Aliénor, d’Aquitaine or de Guyenne, (born c. 1122—died April 1, 1204, Fontevrault, Anjou, France), queen consort of both Louis VII of France (1137–52) and Henry II of England (1152–1204) and mother of Richard I (the Lion-Heart) and John of England. She was perhaps the most powerful woman in 12th-century Europe.

—Britannica

Eleanor of Aquitaine (1122-1204) was one of the most powerful and influential figures of the Middle Ages. Inheriting a vast estate at the age of 15 made her the most sought-after bride of her generation. She would eventually become the queen of France, the queen of England and lead a crusade to the Holy Land. She is also credited with establishing and preserving many of the courtly rituals of chivalry.

—History

This mighty medieval woman outwitted and outlasted her rivals. Ruler of two nations, mother to kings and queens, leader of a crusade: Eleanor of Aquitaine was a savvy power player in medieval France and England.

When reviewing the history of medieval Europe, no woman stands out as much as Eleanor of Aquitaine. Once the most eligible woman in Europe, she became queen of two nations, leader of a crusade, mother of kings, and patron of the arts. Her power and prestige earned her enemies in the 12th century, and her critics authored a black legend founded on gossip and rumor that has fueled ideas about her until the present time.

—National Geographic

Eleanor of Aquitaine [...] she was one of the most kick-ass women of the Middle Ages and, you know, she had her own crusade, or she went on crusade rather and she married two kings and then was the mother of several more, she was a great character.

—GRRM

***

The past April I wrote a very long post about the parallels between Good Queen Alysanne and Sansa Stark.  Consider this post its continuation, so I highly recommend you to read that post first before continuing reading this one. 

As I said before, I discovered that GRRM not only took inspiration from Katharine Hepburn playing Eleanor of Aquitaine in the film ´The Lion in Winter´ for Alysanne’s looks, he also took a lot from Eleanor’s life to write Alysanne, like Eleanor’s second marriage with her cousin Henry II of England with whom she had 8 children (Alysanne/Jaehaerys & their 13 children) and Eleanor’s Court of Love (Alysanne Women’s Courts).

But not only that, I also discovered that Eleanor of Aquitaine shares a lot of similarities with no other than SANSA STARK.

Join me in this new adventure, I assure you, it’s gonna be a blast!

ELEANOR, ALYSANNE AND SANSA

HIGHBORN

Eleanor was born to William X, Duke of Aquitaine and Count of Poitiers, and Aénor, Viscountess of Châtellerault, around 1122, in what is now southwestern France.  Eleanor was the oldest of the couple’s three children; she had a younger sister, Petronilla, and a younger brother, William Aigret. Various biographers also report that Eleanor had two bastard half-brothers, William and Joscelin. 

Alysanne was born to Aenys Targaryen and Lady Alyssa Velaryon in 36 AC, at King's Landing.  Alysanne was the fifth of the couple’s six children; she had four older siblings, Rhaena, Aegon, Viserys and Jaehaerys, and a younger sister, Vaella.  Alysanne also had two younger highborn half-siblings, Boremund and Jocelyn Baratheon.

Sansa was born to Eddard Stark, Lord of Winterfell, and Lady Catellyn Tully of Riverrun in 286 AC, at Winterfell.  Sansa was the second of the couple’s five children; she had an older brother, Robb, and three younger siblings, Arya, Bran and Rickon. Sansa also had a bastard half-brother, Jon Snow. 

Take note of how similar these ladies’ half-siblings names are: Joscelin, Jocelyn & Jon.

APPEARANCE

Back in 2006, many years before Fire & Blood, GRRM gave us this description of Good Queen Alysanne Targaryen:

You might consider Alysanne as the Eleanor of Aquitaine of Westeros, and model her on Katharine Hepburn’s portrayal of Eleanor in the film THE LION IN WINTER. Tall and straight, unbowed by time, she had high cheekbones, clear blue eyes. Age left crow’s feet around her eyes and laugh lines about her mouth, but her face never lost its strength. She was a fine archer and hunter in her youth, and loved to fly atop her dragon to all the distant parts of the realm. Alysanne was slim of waist and small of breast, with a long neck, a fair complexion, a high forehead. In old age her hair turned white as snow. She wore it in a bun, pulled back and pinned behind her hear.  [Source] 

There is not a reliable description of Eleanor of Aquitaine true appearance, just various interpretations of her physical features based on old paintings and medieval illuminations that are presumed, by writers and historians, to be of her.  Sometimes she is described and/or depicted as black of ayes and hair, others says she was blonde with blue or grey eyes, and in other cases she had auburn hair with green or grey eyes.  For more details about Eleanor’s appearance, you can read:

Elizabeth Chadwick’s blog entry: “Eleanor of Aquitaine’s Appearance or not”; and,

Michael R. Evans’ book “Inventing Eleanor: The Medieval and Post-Medieval Image of Eleanor of Aquitaine”  

The beautiful art pieces of Eleanor of Aquitaine that I chose to illustrate this post, created by the extraordinaire artist Kinuko Y. Craft, depict a redhead and blue eyed Eleanor. About this choice of the artist, Michael R. Evans tells us this:

Works of fiction are more likely to use modern images of Eleanor, such as Margaret Ball’s ‘Duchess of Aquitaine’, which employs a dynamic painting of Eleanor by the Japanese-American artist Kinuko Y. Craft. The Queen appears on horseback, crowned, with a falcon on her left wrist and long red hair floating behind her. This image matches the modern perception of Eleanor as an active, confident female authority figure. The falcon and the appearance of Eleanor on horseback both recall the Sainte-Radegonde fresco, although Craft states that she was not influenced by it.       

As you can see, we can’t make a true parallel between the physical features of Eleanor, Alysanne and Sansa. But what is a certainty is that GRRM took inspiration from Katharine Hepburn playing Eleanor of Aquitaine in the film ´The Lion in Winter´ for Alysanne’s looks:

So, for the ASOIAF universe created by GRRM:

Eleanor (Katharine Hepburn): Reddish brown hair + blue eyes  

Alysanne: Honey-colored curls + blue eyes

Sansa: Auburn hair + blue eyes

I see a patter here, auburn is by definition a reddish brown color, and if you googled ‘honey colored hair’ you would see a vast variety of reddish brown or reddish blonde hair colors. Enough said.

NAME

Eleanor is said to have been named for her mother Aénor, Viscountess of Châtellerault, and called Aliénor from the Latin ‘Alia Aenor’, which means ‘the other Aénor’. It became Eléanor in the langues d'oïl of northern France and Eleanor in English. 

It’s probable that George played with the Aénor/Aliénor pattern when he created Alysanne’s name, that is very similar to his mother’s name: Alyssa Velaryon. 

There is not this pattern in Sansa and Catelyn, Sansa was probably named after the other one Sansa in the whole ASOIAF universe: Sansa Stark, daughter of Rickon Stark, heir to Lord Cregan Stark of Winterfell, and his wife, Jeyne Manderly. She had an older sister, Serena Stark. She married his half uncle Lord Jonnel Stark.  

But the name Alayne it’s a different story. Alayne is certainly closer to Catelyn than Sansa, but most relevant to this post, Alayne is very similar to Alysanne. 

In summary:

Aénor/Aliénor

Alyssa/Alysanne

Catelyn/Alayne (Sansa) + Alysanne/Alayne (Sansa)

EDUCATION

Look at these reports about Eleanor’s education:

Their ducal court had a fine reputation as a patron of the arts. Eleanor’s grandfather, William IX, was known as the “troubadour duke,” famous for his poetry and songs about heroism and courtly love. Poets of the time, especially the famous Marcabru, found hospitality at the court of Aquitaine.

Culture and learning were a family tradition for Eleanor, who received the best possible education of the time. She was taught mathematics, astronomy, history, literature, Latin, and music. She also learned arts and crafts: embroidery, needlepoint, sewing, and spinning. Like any daughter of nobility, she danced and sang, as well as rode horses and went hunting. Like many noble daughters, Eleanor would have been raised to be a nobleman’s wife and was probably not expected to play any role in governing.  

—National Geographic

By all accounts, Eleanor's father ensured that she had the best possible education. Eleanor came to learn arithmetic, the constellations, and history. She also learned domestic skills such as household management and the needle arts of embroidery, needlepoint, sewing, spinning, and weaving. Eleanor developed skills in conversation, dancing, games such as backgammon, checkers, and chess, playing the harp, and singing. Although her native tongue was Poitevin, she was taught to read and speak Latin, was well versed in music and literature, and schooled in riding, hawking, and hunting. 

—Wikipedia

She was well educated by her cultured father, William X, Duke of Aquitaine, thoroughly versed in literature, philosophy, and languages and trained to the rigors of court life when she became her father’s heir presumptive at the age 5. An avid horsewoman, she led an active life until she inherited her father’s title and extensive lands upon his death when she was 15. 

—History

Sounds familiar?

No man ever questioned her wits. Later, it would be said of her that she learned to read before she was weaned, and the court fool would make japes about little Alysanne dribbling mother’s milk on Valyrian scrolls as she tried to read whilst suckling at her wet nurse’s teat. Had she been a boy she would surely have been sent to the Citadel to forge a maester’s chain. —Fire & Blood

It is written that the young king and queen were seldom apart during that time, sharing every meal, talking late into the night of the green days of their childhood and the challenges ahead, fishing and hawking together, mingling with the island's smallfolk in dockside inns, reading to one another from dusty leatherbound tomes they found in the castle library, taking lessons together from Dragonstone's maesters (“for we still have much to learn,” Alysanne is said to have reminded her husband). —Fire & Blood

“If I had not become a queen, I might have liked to be a teacher,” she told the Conclave. “I read, I write, I think, I am not afraid of ravens… or a bit of blood. There are other highborn girls who feel the same. Why not admit them to your Citadel? —Fire & Blood 

For three days she lost herself in the Citadel’s great library, emerging only to attend lectures on the Valyrian dragon wars, leechcraft, and the gods of the Summer Isles. —Fire & Blood

Once the initial frost had thawed, his lordship took the queen hunting after elk and wild boar in the wolfswood, showed her the bones of a giant, and allowed her to rummage as she pleased through his modest castle library. —Fire & Blood

And here is Sansa:

Sansa could sew and dance and sing. She wrote poetry. She knew how to dress. She played the high harp and the bells. […] It hurt that the one thing Arya could do better than her sister was ride a horse. Well, that and manage a household. Sansa had never had much of a head for figures. If she did marry Prince Joff, Arya hoped for his sake that he had a good steward. —AGOT  - Arya I

Sansa was a lady at three, always so courteous and eager to please. She loved nothing so well as tales of knightly valor. —A Clash of Kings - Catelyn VII

Sansa Stark, he mused. Soft-spoken sweet-smelling Sansa, who loved silks, songs, chivalry and tall gallant knights with handsome faces. —A Storm of Swords - Tyrion III

So the singer played for her, so soft and sad that Arya only heard snatches of the words, though the tune was half-familiar. Sansa would know it, I bet. Her sister had known all the songs, and she could even play a little, and sing so sweetly. All I could ever do was shout the words.—A Storm of Swords - Arya IV

The queen took Sansa’s hand in both of hers. “Child, do you know your letters Sansa nodded nervously. She could read and write better than any of her brothers, although she was hopeless at sums. —AGOT - Sansa IV

She pulled a chair close to the hearth, took down one of her favorite books, and lost herself in the stories of Florian and Jonquil, of Lady Shella and the Rainbow Knight, of valiant Prince Aemon and his doomed love for his brother’s queen. —AGOT - Sansa IV

“Do you read well, Alayne?” “Septa Mordane was good enough to say so.” —A Storm of Swords - Sansa VI

No one ransomed the northmen, though. One fat lordling haunted the kitchens [...] and the clasp that held his cloak was a silver-and-sapphire trident. He belonged to Lord Tywin, but the fierce, bearded young man [...] in a black cloak patterned with white suns had been taken by some hedge knight who meant to get rich off him. Sansa would have known who he was, and the fat one too, but Arya had never taken much interest in titles and sigils. Whenever Septa Mordane had gone on about the history of this house and that house, she was inclined to drift and dream and wonder when the lesson would be done. —A Clash of Kings - Arya VII

Later, while Sansa was off listening to a troupe of singers perform the complex round of interwoven ballads called the “Dance of the Dragons,” [sung in High Valyrian] Ned inspected the bruise himself. “I hope Forel is not being too hard on you,” he said. —AGOT - Eddard VII

Do you hawk, Sansa?" "A little," she admitted. —A Storm of Swords - Sansa I

The day before last she'd taken Sansa hawking. [...] Sansa's merlin brought down three ducks while Margaery's peregrine took a heron in full flight. —A Storm of Swords - Sansa II

Sansa can ride despite not enjoying the physical exertion of the activity.

Despite it is said that Sansa is bad with numbers and can’t manage a household, Alayne Stone is doing pretty well as de facto Lady of the Eyrie.

As final note on this section, Eleanor’s grandfather Willian IX being called “the troubadour duke” reminds me of Bael the Bard, being kin with the Starks. The Aquitaine court sounds as magical and cultured as what Sansa once thought the Red Keep court would be, full of musicians and poets and courtly love.  

HEIRESS 

Eleanor inherited the largest and richest lands of France at a very young age:

Eleanor’s four-year-old brother William Aigret and their mother died at the castle of Talmont on Aquitaine's Atlantic coast in the spring of 1130. Eleanor became the heir presumptive to her father's domains. The Duchy of Aquitaine was the largest and richest province of France. Poitou, where Eleanor spent most of her childhood, and Aquitaine together was almost one-third the size of modern France. (...)

Eleanor, aged 12 to 15, then became the duchess of Aquitaine, and thus the most eligible heiress in Europe. (...)

The death of William, one of the king's most powerful vassals, made available the most desirable duchy in France. While presenting a solemn and dignified face to the grieving Aquitainian messengers, Louis exulted when they departed. Rather than act as guardian to the duchess and duchy, he decided to marry the duchess to his 17-year-old heir and bring Aquitaine under the control of the French crown, thereby greatly increasing the power and prominence of France and its ruling family, the House of Capet. Within hours, the king had arranged for his son Louis to be married to Eleanor. 

—Wikipedia

Eleanor was the daughter and heiress of William X, duke of Aquitaine and count of Poitiers, who possessed one of the largest domains in France—larger, in fact, than those held by the French king. Upon William’s death in 1137 she inherited the duchy of Aquitaine. [Source]

Eleanor inherited her father’s title and extensive lands upon his death when she was 15, becoming in one stroke duchess of Aquitaine and by far the most eligible single young woman in Europe. She was placed under the guardianship of the king of France, and within hours was betrothed to his son and heir, Louis. The king sent an escort of 500 men to convey the news to Eleanor and transport her to her new home. 

—Britannica

Eleanor inherited her father’s title and extensive lands upon his death when she was 15, becoming in one stroke duchess of Aquitaine and by far the most eligible single young woman in Europe. She was placed under the guardianship of the king of France, and within hours was betrothed to his son and heir, Louis. The king sent an escort of 500 men to convey the news to Eleanor and transport her to her new home. 

—History

William X [Eleanor’s father] controlled many territories in west and central France including Aquitaine, Poitiers, Gascony, Limousin, and Auvergne. (...)

During the 12th century, monarchies were gaining power and expanding across Europe as alliances formed and linked them together. Powerful aristocracies that fell within their kingdoms still held great influence and needed to be respected. In France the Capetian dynasty ruled a slice of north-central France, the so-called Île-de-France, between the Seine and the Loire. The royal house of France, the Capets, when Eleanor was born, was led by King Louis VI (also known as Louis the Fat).

Much of what is now France was divided up into powerful dukedoms—Normandy, Brittany, and Aquitaine—and large counties—Flanders, Anjou, Lorraine, Champagne, Bourgogne, and Toulouse, some of which were larger and richer than the possessions of the Capetian dynasty. Of the dukedoms, the duchy of Aquitaine was one of the largest, wealthiest, and most influential.

To complicate matters, in 1066 William, Duke of Normandy (also known as William the Conqueror), became king of England. While William was technically a vassal of France on the French side of the English channel, when he was on the other side, he was king of England—the French king’s equal in rank. Who controlled the lands of England and France would lead to many bloody conflicts over the coming centuries as different houses vied for control.

Eleanor played a vital role in these power struggles. Her destiny took a radical turn when her younger brother died in 1130, leaving her the new heiress to her father’s dominions. When her father died unexpectedly in April 1137, while on a pilgrimage to Santiago de Compostela in Spain, Eleanor was thrust into the world of medieval politics in her early teens. 

Shortly before his death, Eleanor’s father had dictated his will and officially named Eleanor as his heir. He appointed King Louis VI as her guardian, and the Capetian king shrewdly saw a way to bring the lands of Aquitaine under his control. He quickly announced the betrothal of Duchess Eleanor to his 17-year-old son, the future Louis VII.

—National Geographic

We can hardly draw a parallel between Eleanor and Alysanne in this regard. Alysanne was never the heir of her father. Alysanne became Queen consort of Westeros due to her marriage with her older brother Jaehaerys.  But this is certainly a strong parallel between Eleanor and Sansa. 

Sansa Stark, despite the many discussions about the legitimacy of her claim to the North and the secret will of Robb Stark, is considered the heir of the ancestral lands and domains of House Stark, she is called ‘the key to the north’ by Tywin Lannister, the man behind his royals grandsons, King Joffrey and King Tommen Baratheon.  The North is the largest region of Westeros, and Sansa Stark’s claim to Winterfell and the Wardenship of the North is coveted by many lords in order to gain political power and influence.  

If Eleanor of Aquitaine was the most eligible single young heiress in Europe, we can say the same about Sansa Stark in Westeros.  The same way Eleanor played a vital role in Middle Ages European power struggles, Sansa Stark plays a vital role in the Seven Kingdoms of Westeros power struggles.  If Eleanor was thrust into the world of medieval politics in her early teens, the same is happening to Sansa Starks in the ASOIAF Books.

As I wrote in an unpublished meta:

It is also very interesting that while Sansa is in the south, we witnessed her objectification numerous times, by every character she interacted with. She’s not only being valued in golden dragons, she has been practically transformed into a stone castle, Winterfell, and the North itself, since the one controlling her would obtain all her lands and power. Or, to use the euphemism used in the Books, she is “the key to the north.”

Sansa reflects about this particular objectification in ASOS and elaborates inside her mind one of the saddest lines in ASOIAF, especially for a girl who yearns to be loved and always dreamed of getting married: “No one will ever marry me for love” (because everyone only wants her claim to Winterfell).

I think Sansa Stark being the most eligible single young heiress in Westeros has been explained in the Books twice already, during the development of Sansa’s arc, and in a more subtle and romantic way in “The Hedge Knight” tale.  

As I explain in yet another unpublished meta of mine about the Ashford Tourney:

(…) I think the repetition of this pattern in the list of men [Ashford Tourney Champions / Sansa’s Suitors] is accentuating the importance of Sansa and her claim to the North in the political scene of Westeros. After all, all of Sansa’s betrothals were arranged to gain political power through her claim to the North, which is the largest region of Westeros. 

Tyrion Lannister, married Sansa following his father’s orders to take control over the North: "The girl's happiness is not my purpose, nor should it be yours. Our alliances in the south may be as solid as Casterly Rock, but there remains the north to win, and the key to the north is Sansa Stark." (…) “When you bring Eddard Stark's grandson home to claim his birthright, lords and little folk alike will rise as one to place him on the high seat of his ancestors. You are capable of getting a woman with child, I hope?"

Joffrey Baratheon, when King Robert proposed Joffrey and Sansa’s betrothal, he was trying to reenact his own betrothal to Lyanna Stark, that was part of the so called Southron Ambitions Theory.

Willas Tyrell, his grandmother Olenna Tyrell secretly arranged his betrothal with Sansa in order to expand their power over another great region of Westeros: “Jonquil, Jonquil, open your sweet eyes, these Tyrells care nothing for you. It’s your claim they mean to wed.” The Lannisters discovered this secret betrothal (thanks to Dontos and Littlefinger) and Sansa ended up married to Tyrion and Cersei betrothed to Willas.

Harrold Hardyng, when Petyr Baelish proposed Harry and Alayne/Sansa betrothal, he was trying to gain more political power to further his own agenda. “When Robert dies, Harry the Heir becomes Lord Harrold, Defender of the Vale and Lord of the Eyrie. Jon Arryn's bannermen will never love me, nor our silly, shaking Robert, but they will love their Young Falcon... and when they come together for his wedding, and you come out with your long auburn hair, clad in a maiden's cloak of white and grey with a direwolf emblazoned on the back... why, every knight in the Vale will pledge his sword to win you back your birthright. So those are your gifts from me, my sweet Sansa... Harry, the Eyrie, and Winterfell”.

See? Tywin Lannister and Petyr Baelish, and even Olenna Tyrell, were acting exactly like Eleanor’s guardian, King Louis VI of France, betrothing her with his son and heir, the future Louis VII, as a way to bring the lands of Aquitaine under his control.

FIRST MARRIAGE

Eleanor became Queen consort of France due to her first marriage to his cousin Louis VII.  This marriage lasted 15 years and only produced two daughters:    

Louis and Eleanor were married in July 1137, but had little time to get to know one another before Louis’ father the king fell ill and died. Within weeks of her wedding, Eleanor found herself taking possession of the drafty and unwelcoming Cîté Palace in Paris that would be her new home. On Christmas Day of the same year, Louis and Eleanor were crowned king and queen of France. 

—History

The wedding was celebrated in Bordeaux on July 25, 1137. Seven days later, Louis the Fat was dead, leaving the teenagers Louis and Eleanor to rule as king and queen. The two were coronated at Bourges Cathedral later that year on Christmas Day. Despite the marriage, the lands of Eleanor’s family would not come under the control of the Capetian dynasty. According to the terms of her father’s will, Queen Eleanor first had to give birth to a son, who then had to reach the age of majority and become the new duke of Aquitaine before the lands would officially pass to Louis’s family. (…)

The marriage was not a fruitful one. The couple did not have many children. Eleanor only gave birth to two daughters: Marie, countess of Champagne, in 1145, and Alice (or Alix), countess of Blois, around 1150. By most accounts, the marriage’s failure to produce a male heir led to greater tensions between husband and wife. 

—National Geographic

The marriage was not a bed of roses:

Louis and Eleanor’s first years as rulers were fraught with power struggles with their own vassals – the powerful Count Theobald of Champagne for one – and with the Pope in Rome. Louis, still young and intemperate, made a series of military and diplomatic blunders that set him at odds with the Pope and several of his more powerful lords. The conflict that ensued culminated in the massacre of hundreds of innocents in the town of Vitry — during a siege of the town, a great number of the populace took refuge in a church, which was set aflame by Louis’s troops. Dogged by guilt over his role in the tragedy for years, Louis responded eagerly to the Pope’s call for a crusade in 1145. Eleanor joined him on the dangerous – and ill fated – journey west. The crusade did not go well, and Eleanor and Louis grew increasingly estranged. 

—History

In 1142 Petronilla, Eleanor’s sister, fell in love with the married count of Vermandois, who was married to Eleanor of Champagne, daughter of a powerful French family. The count set aside his wife and married Petronilla. Critics saw Eleanor’s hand in the affair, which may have been a love match, but could have served a strategic purpose of strengthening the bonds between the Capetian crown and the House of Aquitaine.

Petronilla’s marriage led to a war between Louis and the count of Champagne in 1142. In 1143 Louis ordered the burning of the small town of Vitry-en-Perthois, killing as many as 1,500 people. The church condemned the actions of the French crown, which caused the pious Louis deep shame. He vowed to mount a crusade to atone for it. (…)

A series of disastrous military decisions resulted in the failure of the Second Crusade. In 1149 Louis and Eleanor boarded ships to sail back to France in defeat. For Louis VII, the Crusade was a twofold disaster: He had been away from his kingdom for two years, involved in expensive military campaigns the results of which were humiliating, and his marriage had completely broken down.

—National Geographic

As you can see Eleanor’s first marriage was not a successful one, it produce not male heir and it was full of political and religious conflicts.  All of that resulted in Eleanor’s decision to seek an annulment.     Alysanne only married one man, her older brother Jaehaerys, but she married him twice.  The first time Alysanne and Jaehaerys eloped to Dragonstone and the marriage remained unconsummated.  That period was the happiest time of her romantic relationship with her husband; she called that time, and Idyll:

“Queen Alysanne, for her part, was in no haste to return to court. “Here I have you to myself, day and night,” she told Jaehaerys. “When we go back, I shall be fortunate to snatch an hour with you, for every man in Westeros will want a piece of you.” For her, these days on Dragonstone were an idyll. “Many years from now when we are old and grey, we shall look back upon these days and smile, remembering how happy we were.” 

—Fire & Blood

The period after their second wedding and coronation as King and Queen of Westeros were not as happy as their days at Dragonstone.  

Alysanne’s older siblings, Aegon and Rhaena, incestuous marriage originated several problems and conflicts with the Faith of the Seven and their more fervent followers, because the Faith condemned the Targaryen’s brother and sister incest customs.  That’s why Alysanne and Jaehareys’ mother, Queen Alyssa, originally planned other betrothals for them.  But Alysanne and Jaehaerys eloped and kept their first wedding in secret until Jaehaerys came of age and they were crowned as King and Queen of Westeros.  Later the Doctrine of Exceptionalism was invented as justification of the Targaryen’s incest customs.  Jaehaerys and Alysanne kept the Great Septon and the Faith’s followers in line thanks to a huge propaganda campaign and their dragons.      

Sansa Stark first marriage involved no love between bride and groom. Sansa was forced to marry Tyrion Lannister as a way to give her new husbands’s family, control and power over the North.  The marriage was unconsummated and of course produced no male heir or any children, the bride ran away, and Tyrion Lannister was accused of regicide, ruining Tywin Lannister original plans for northern domination.

Sansa’s first marriage caused no problems with the Faith of the Seven, but she is in need of the High Septon’s help to gain the annulment of her marriage with Tyrion Lannister.  

MARRIAGE ANNULMENT

Eleanor requested the annulment of her first marriage with her cousin Louis VII of France more than once:

After several fraught years during which Eleanor sought an annulment and Louis faced increasing public criticism, they were eventually granted an annulment on the grounds of consanguinity (being related by blood) in 1152 and separated, their two daughters left in the custody of the king.

—History

From 1147 to 1149 Eleanor accompanied Louis on the Second Crusade to protect the fragile Latin kingdom of Jerusalem, founded after the First Crusade only 50 years before, from Turkish assault. Eleanor’s conduct during this expedition, especially at the court of her uncle Raymond of Poitiers at Antioch, aroused Louis’s jealousy and marked the beginning of their estrangement. After their return to France and a short-lived reconciliation, their marriage was annulled in March 1152.

According to feudal customs, Eleanor then regained possession of Aquitaine. 

—Britannica

After the couple returned to Europe, they met with Pope Eugene III who tried to reconcile them—even threatening excommunication. It was no use, the union was doomed: On March 21, 1152, a group of bishops at Beaugency declared Eleanor’s marriage void for reasons of consanguinity. In line with tradition, the daughters remained with their father, and Eleanor retained her duchy in Aquitaine. 

—National Geographic 

On 21 March, the four archbishops, with the approval of Pope Eugene, granted an annulment on grounds of consanguinity within the fourth degree; Eleanor was Louis' third cousin once removed, and shared common ancestry with Robert II of France. Their two daughters were, however, declared legitimate. […] Custody of them was awarded to King Louis. Archbishop Samson received assurances from Louis that Eleanor's lands would be restored to her.  

—Wikipedia

Alysanne never pursued the annulment of her marriage, but she had a lot of tensions and problems with her husband King Jaehaerys, especially because their different views on matters of succession and the sexist and severe treatment that Jaehaerys gave to her daughters.

Sansa Stark is in need of a marriage annulment.  The fact that Eleanor obtained the annulment of her first marriage gives me hope that Sansa will get an annulment for herself and then marry another cousin of hers, willingly this time.  

Sansa won’t be able to plead consanguinity, as Eleanor did, as a ground for her marriage annulment, but she can allege the no consummation of her first marriage with Tyrion Lannister as the ground for the termination of that forced marriage.

GRRM has discussed with a fan the possibilities for Sansa’s first marriage annulment here.

INCEST

Eleanor married two of her cousins: King Louis VII of France and King Henry II of England.  She obtained the annulment of her first marriage with King Louis VII of France on the grounds of consanguinity.  Ironically enough, Eleanor was more closely related to her second husband, Henry Plantagenet, Count of Anjou and Duke of Normandy, future Henry II of England, than she had been to her first husband Louis VII of France. Rumours of sexual affairs with two uncles surrounded Eleanor, first with Raymond of Poitiers, Prince of Antioch, and brother of Eleanor’s father; and later with Geoffrey Plantagenet, Count of Anjou, and father of Eleanor’s second husband.

Alysanne married her older brother Jaehaerys Targaryen.  When Alysanne was pregnant for the first time, she suffered an attempt of murder at Maidenpool, perpetuated by three women, followers of the Faith of the Seven that reject incest:

“Doctrine of Exceptionalism had won over most of the pious in the realm, but not all. Some of the women who tended Jonquil's Pool believed that the pool's sacred waters would become polluted if the queen, pregnant with the king's "abomination", were to enter the waters. While she was inside, Alysanne was attacked by three of these women with daggers.” 

[Source]

Sansa Stark was not directly involved with incest.  As it was mentioned before, the first Sansa Stark married her half uncle Lord Jonnel Stark.  Sansa’s paternal grandparents were cousins: Lord Rickard and Lady Lyarra Stark.  

Sansa also have two cousins, Robert Arryn and Jon Snow, which are subtly and not so subtly linked with her with romantic undertones:

Robert Arryn was named after Robert Baratheon and Jon Snow is the secret son of Rhaegar Targaryen.  Robert and Rhaegar fought to death for the love of a Stark girl, Lyanna, the mother of Jon.

Robert Arryn and Jon Snow are surrounded by bird imagery. Robert with Falcons (Arryn sigil) and Robins (Sweetrobin), also with Winged Knights; and Jon with Crows (Night’s Watch/Black Knights) and dragons (winged creatures).

Robert Arryn idolizes Artys Arryn, The Falconknight (usually mixed with the Winged Knight); and Jon Snow idolizes Aemon Targaryen, The Dragonknight.

Sansa thinks about Jon in the Wall and recalled that in the songs the men of the Night’s Watch are called the Black Knights of the Wall.

Alayne is organizing a Tourney to elect the members of Robert Arryn personal guard, named the Brotherhood of the Winged Knights.  

Robert Arryn and Jon Snow are surrounded by weirwood imagery.  Robert and his weirwood throne and Jon with the Old Gods (literally weirwoods) and Ghost (weirwood’s coloring).

Robert Arryn and Jon Snow are the last males of their respective paternal houses. And both of them will face blonde threats to their claims.

Lysa Arryn intended to betroth Sansa with her son Robert Arryn.

Robert Arryn is infatuated with Alayne Stone (Sansa Stark in disguise) and constantly expressed his desire to marry her.  Alayne rejects him every time alleging her bastard status.

Sansa modeled her bastard persona on her bastard half-brother (cousin) Jon Snow. And she is acting as a foster mother for her cousin Robert Arryn.

Sansa’s first crush was a young knight of the Vale of Arryn, Waymar Royce, whose physical features are pretty similar to Jon Snow’s (grey eyes, brown hair, slender bodies, also both Brothers of the Night’s Watch).

The Pact of Ice and Fire could be fulfilled with the marriage of two cousins with Stark Blood. Like Jon and Sansa.

The original outline planned a romance between two cousins with Stark Blood. Like Jon and Sansa (Originally Arya, discarded by GRRM at Balticon 2016).

SECOND MARRIAGE

Eleanor became Queen consort of England due to her second marriage to his cousin Henry Plantagenet, Count of Anjou and Duke of Normandy.

This marriage with the future Henry II of England was way more fruitful than Eleanor’s first marriage.  The couple had 8 children, five sons and three daughters.

As Eleanor travelled to Poitiers, two lords —Theobald V, Count of Blois, and Geoffrey, Count of Nantes, brother of Henry II, Duke of Normandy —tried to kidnap and marry her to claim her lands. As soon as she arrived in Poitiers, Eleanor sent envoys to Henry, Duke of Normandy and future king of England, asking him to come at once to marry her. On 18 May 1152 (Whit Sunday), eight weeks after her annulment, Eleanor married Henry "without the pomp and ceremony that befitted their rank."

Eleanor was related to Henry even more closely than she had been to Louis: they were cousins to the third degree through their common ancestor Ermengarde of Anjou, wife of Robert I, Duke of Burgundy and Geoffrey, Count of Gâtinais, and they were also descended from King Robert II of France. A marriage between Henry and Eleanor's daughter Marie had earlier been declared impossible due to their status as third cousins once removed. 

—Wikipedia

Duchess Eleanor was only 28, and it did not take long for suitors to begin to pursue her—for her lands and her mind. Theobald V of Blois, six years Eleanor’s junior, tried to kidnap her (he would later marry her daughter, Alice). Eleanor had her eye on a different suitor. From her court at Poitiers, she sent for him in secret. His name was Henry Plantagenet, Duke of Normandy and Count of Anjou. (…)

Less than three months after her divorce from Louis, Eleanor married Henry Plantagenet, nine years her junior, on May 18, 1152. Genealogy shows that the pair were more closely related than Eleanor and Louis, but that did not stand in the way of the union. Henry and Eleanor were masters of Normandy, Anjou, Maine, Touraine, and the Aquitaine, and serious rivals to Louis.  

In 1153 Henry crossed the English Channel and was able to secure his position on the throne from the sitting king of England. By the time he and Eleanor were coronated in December 1154, she had already given birth to their first son, William, in August 1153—and was pregnant with their second child. In one bold stroke, the lands of Normandy, Aquitaine, Anjou, and other important French territories came under the control of the English king and queen. Eleanor’s children, as well as her lands, gave her much security. 

—National Geographic

Within two months of her annulment, after fighting off attempts to marry her off to various other high-ranking French noblemen, Eleanor married Henry, Count of Anjou and Duke of Normandy. She had been rumored to have had an affair with her new husband’s father, and was more closely related to her new husband than she had been to Louis, but the marriage went ahead and within two years Henry and Eleanor were crowned king and queen of England after Henry’s accession to the English throne upon the death of King Stephen.

Eleanor’s marriage to Henry was more successful than her first, although not lacking in drama and discord. Henry and Eleanor argued often, but they produced eight children together between 1152 and 1166. The extent of Eleanor’s role in Henry’s rule is largely unknown, although it seems unlikely that a woman of her reputed energy and education would have been wholly without influence. Nonetheless, she does not emerge again into a publicly active role until separating from Henry in 1167 and moving her household to her own lands in Poitiers. While the reasons for the breakdown of her marriage to Henry remain unclear, it can likely be traced to Henry’s increasingly visible infidelities. 

—History

Two months later she married the grandson of Henry I of England, Henry Plantagenet, Count of Anjou and Duke of Normandy. In 1154 he became, as Henry II, king of England, with the result that England, Normandy, and the west of France were united under his rule. Eleanor had only two daughters by Louis VII, but to her new husband she bore five sons and three daughters. The sons were William, who died at the age of three; Henry; Richard, the Lion-Heart; Geoffrey, duke of Brittany; and John, surnamed Lackland until, having outlived all his brothers, he inherited, in 1199, the crown of England. The daughters were Matilda, who married Henry the Lion, duke of Saxony and Bavaria; Eleanor, who married Alfonso VIII, king of Castile; and Joan, who married successively William II, king of Sicily, and Raymond VI, count of Toulouse. Eleanor would well have deserved to be named the “grandmother of Europe.”  

—Britannica

Take note that even as a “divorced” woman, Eleanor still was the most eligible heiress in Europe, and suffered various attempts to kidnap as a way to marry her.  This kidnap/marriage attempts against Eleanor reminds me of the Wildling beyond the Wall marriage customs.  

The period that started with Alysanne’s second wedding to her older brother Jaehaerys was very similar to Eleanor’s second marriage with Henry II of England:

Henry was in conflict with his uncle Stephen of Blois for the Throne of England.  Jaehaerys was in conflict with his uncle Maegor I for the Iron Throne.  

Henry and Eleanor had 8 children. Jaehaerys and Alysanne had 13 children.

Henry often traveled to different parts of his realm, and while he was away, Eleanor assumed the role of regent and other political duties.  Alysanne’s relationship with Jaehaerys was always very close. She was his most trusted counselor and his right hand: Alysanne remained in the Red Keep, presiding over council meetings in the king’s absence, and holding audience from a velvet seat at the base of the Iron Throne. —Fire & Blood

Eleanor outlived most of her children.  Alysanne outlived most of her children.

Eleanor arranged marriages for her children and grandchildren.  Alysanne arranged marriages for her children, especially her daughters.

Henry was an unfaithful husband. Jaehaerys was not unfaithful but he was very sexist and constantly wronged her daughters, granddaughter and children from his granddaughter in favor of his male children and grandchildren.  

Henry and Eleanor got estranged with time and lived separated for long periods after their quarrels. Jaehareys and Alysanne got estranged with the time and lived separated for long periods after their quarrels.

Eleanor supported her sons’ rebellions against her husband Henry II, and got imprisoned for it.  She would remain a prisoner until Henry II’s death in 1189. Jaehaerys and Alysanne’s quarrels happened mostly because their different views on matters of succession and the sexist and severe treatment that Jaehaerys gave to her daughters.

Eleanor died around age 80; she outlived Henry.  Alysanne died at 64, leaving Jaehaerys a widower.

Sansa Stark has not married a second time yet.  She is betrothed, as Alayne Stone, to Harrold Hardyng, often called Harry the Heir, cousin and heir presumptive of Lord Robert Arryn and would ascend to rule of the Vale as "Harrold Arryn" should Lord Robert die without issue.

Sansa Stark is not a mother yet neither.  But GRRM has planted seeds about her fertility and future motherhood, as I earlier speculated in this post. There I talked about Alayne’s location: “The Vale of Arryn was famously fertile and had gone untouched during the fighting”;  and Sansa being a half-Tully girl. Tully members are famously fertile; Cat, Lysa and Edmure manage to conceive at the first attempt with Ned, Petyr and Roslin.

CONTRIBUTIONS

Some of Eleanor’s greatest contributions were:

Eleanor of Aquitaine is said to be responsible for the introduction of built-in fireplaces, first used when she renovated the palace of her first husband Louis in Paris. Shocked by the frigid north after her upbringing in southern France, Eleanor’s innovation spread quickly, transforming the domestic arrangements of the time. 

—Britannica

While in the eastern Mediterranean, Eleanor learned about maritime conventions developing there, which were the beginnings of what would become admiralty law. She introduced those conventions in her own lands on the island of Oléron in 1160 (with the "Rolls of Oléron") and later in England as well. She was also instrumental in developing trade agreements with Constantinople and ports of trade in the Holy Lands.

—Wikipedia

Eleanor was also an excellent diplomat envoy and a magnificent patron of arts, as it will be explained later.

Some of Alysanne’s contributions to the politics and the welfare of the people of Westeros were:  

She helped Jaehaerys to create Westeros’ first unified code of laws.

Alysanne procured clean water for the people of Kingslanding: Queen Alysanne served each of them a tankard of river water at the next council meeting, and dared them to drink of it. The water went undrunk, but the wells and pipes were soon approved. Construction would require more than a dozen years, but in the end “the queen’s fountains” provided clean water for Kingslanders for many generations to come. —Fire & BloodQueen

Alysanne proposed a “New Gift” for the Night’s Watch: The notion did not please Lord Alaric; though a strong friend to the Night’s Watch, he knew that the lords who presently held the lands in question would object to them being given away without their leave. “I have no doubt that you can persuade them, Lord Alaric,” the queen said. And finally, charmed by her as ever, Alaric Stark agreed that, aye, he could. And so it came to pass that the size of the Gift was doubled with a stroke. —Fire & Blood

Alysanne aprocured the promulgation of the Widow’s Law: To rectify these ills, King Jaehaerys in 52 AC promulgated the Widow’s Law, reaffirming the right of the eldest son (or eldest daughter, where there was no son) to inherit, but requiring said heirs to maintain surviving widows in the same condition they had enjoyed before their husband’s death. A lord’s widow, be she a second, third, or later wife, could no longer be driven from his castle, nor deprived of her servants, clothing, and income. The same law, however, also forbade men from disinheriting their children by a first wife in order to bestow their lands, seat, or property upon a later wife or her own children. —Fire & Blood

Alysanne also procured the abolition of the lord’s ancient right to the first night: And so it came to pass that the second of what the smallfolk named Queen Alysanne’s Laws was enacted: the abolition of the lord’s ancient right to the first night. Henceforth, it was decreed, a bride’s maidenhead would belong only to her husband, whether joined before a septon or a heart tree, and any man, be he lord or peasant, who took her on her wedding night or any other night would be guilty of the crime of rape. —Fire & Blood

Sansa is not in a Queen position yet, but the possibilities for her ending the books as a monarch are big. We have books evidence and foreshadowing here and here. We also have the Sansa’s TV adaptation endgame as Queen in the North to support this hypothesis, and GRRM counting Sansa as a major character and also saying the endgame for the major characters would be the same in the Books.

Sansa was already betrothed with the heir to the Iron Throne once, but Joffrey Baratheon was a bastard disguised as a prince; so every time I remember that GRRM wrote a passage when someone called the Red Comet a sign of glory for Sansa’s betrothed, the dragon’s heir, I can’t stop thinking about Sansa being betrothed to the true dragon’s heir, and that that person is a prince disguised as a bastard.    

But let’s talk about how good Sansa could be as a Queen.  Tyrion Lannister, always praised by GRRM himself for his wits, has something to tell us about the matter:  

Tyrion led Sansa around the yard, to perform the necessary courtesies. She is good at this, he thought, as he watched her tell Lord Gyles that his cough was sounding better, compliment Elinor Tyrell on her gown, and question Jalabhar Xho about wedding customs in the Summer Isles. His cousin Ser Lancel had been brought down by Ser Kevan, the first time he’d left his sickbed since the battle. He looks ghastly. Lancel’s hair had turned white and brittle, and he was thin as a stick. Without his father beside him holding him up, he would surely have collapsed. Yet when Sansa praised his valor and said how good it was to see him getting strong again, both Lancel and Ser Kevan beamed. She would have made Joffrey a good queen and a better wife if he’d had the sense to love her. He wondered if his nephew was capable of loving anyone.

—A Storm of Swords - Tyrion VIII

Despite the popular belief, Sansa Stark actually thinks about the welfare of the smallfolk:

Halfway along the route, a wailing woman forced her way between two watchmen and ran out into the street in front of the king and his companions, holding the corpse of her dead baby above her head. It was blue and swollen, grotesque, but the real horror was the mother’s eyes. Joffrey looked for a moment as if he meant to ride her down, but Sansa Stark leaned over and said something to him. The king fumbled in his purse, and flung the woman a silver stag. The coin bounced off the child and rolled away, under the legs of the gold cloaks and into the crowd, where a dozen men began to fight for it. The mother never once blinked. Her skinny arms were trembling from the dead weight of her son. (…)

From both sides of the street, the crowd surged against the spear shafts while the gold cloaks struggled to hold the line. Stones and dung and fouler things whistled overhead. “Feed us!” a woman shrieked. “Bread!” boomed a man behind her. “We want bread, bastard!” (…)

Tyrion called to her. “Are you hurt, Lady Sansa?” Blood was trickling down Sansa’s brow from a deep gash on her scalp. “They … they were throwing things … rocks and filth, eggs … I tried to tell them, I had no bread to give them”. 

—A Clash of Kings - Tyrion IX

In the Show they translated this Sansa’s line of dialogue to this one: “I would have given them bread if I had it.”  

But I think the most telling evidence of how good Sansa could be as a queen is this one:

“The night’s first traitors,” the queen said, “but not the last, I fear. Have Ser Ilyn see to them, and put their heads on pikes outside the stables as a warning.” As they left, she turned to Sansa. “Another lesson you should learn, if you hope to sit beside my son. Be gentle on a night like this and you’ll have treasons popping up all about you like mushrooms after a hard rain. The only way to keep your people loyal is to make certain they fear you more than they do the enemy.”

“I will remember, Your Grace,” said Sansa, though she had always heard that love was a surer route to the people’s loyalty than fear. If I am ever a queen, I’ll make them love me.

—A Clash of Kings - Sansa VI

This is a stark contrast (pun intended) between ruling by fear and violence and ruling by kindness and protection.  And we all know that Sansa’s true nature will lead her to choose love over fear.  

WIDOWHOOD, REGENCY AND DEATH

When Eleanor became a widow, she not only regained her freedom after 16 years of imprisonment, she also got independency and power over England. She acted as regent in the absent of her son, King Richard I, she also acted as diplomat envoy for England and remained a huge influence in the political scene of Europe:

Upon the death of her husband Henry II on 6 July 1189, Richard I was the undisputed heir. One of his first acts as king was to send William Marshal to England with orders to release Eleanor from prison; he found upon his arrival that her custodians had already released her. Eleanor rode to Westminster and received the oaths of fealty from many lords and prelates on behalf of the king. She ruled England in Richard's name, signing herself "Eleanor, by the grace of God, Queen of England." On 13 August 1189, Richard sailed from Barfleur to Portsmouth and was received with enthusiasm. Between 1190 and 1194, Richard was absent from England, engaged in the Third Crusade from 1190 to 1192 and then held in captivity by Henry VI, Holy Roman Emperor. During Richard's absence, royal authority in England was represented by a Council of Regency in conjunction with a succession of chief justiciars – William de Longchamp (1190–1191), Walter de Coutances (1191–1193), and finally Hubert Walter. Although Eleanor held no formal office in England during this period, she arrived in England in the company of Coutances in June 1191, and for the remainder of Richard's absence, she exercised a considerable degree of influence over the affairs of England as well as the conduct of Prince John. Eleanor played a key role in raising the ransom demanded from England by Henry VI and in the negotiations with the Holy Roman Emperor that eventually secured Richard's release.  

—Wikipedia

After Henry’s death in July 1189, Richard the Lion-Hearted became king, and Eleanor gained her complete freedom. Her son restored her lands that had been seized after the 1173 rebellion. Richard appointed her to a government position, and Eleanor traveled the English countryside securing loyalty oaths to her son and his kingdom.

Even in her late 60s, Eleanor continued to follow and often direct the political events of her lands. In 1191 she arranged a marriage for Richard to Berengaria of Navarre. While Richard was crusading in the Holy Land, Eleanor wielded influence over the men ruling in Richard’s absence, including his younger brother, Prince John. Moreover, accused of having ordered the murder of Conrad of Montferrat in the Holy Land, Richard was imprisoned by Holy Roman Emperor Henry VI. Eleanor turned to the pope, Celestine III, to help arrange her son’s release and also secured funds for his ransom.

In her 70s, Eleanor sought to strengthen the bonds between the Plantagenets and the Capets. In 1200 she traveled to the Pyrenees to escort her granddaughter Blanche to marry the son of the French king in a continuing effort to maintain the power of her family.

—National Geographic

On her release, Eleanor played a greater political role than ever before. She actively prepared for Richard’s coronation as king, was administrator of the realm during his Crusade to the Holy Land, and, after his capture by the duke of Austria on Richard’s return from the east, collected his ransom and went in person to escort him to England. During Richard’s absence, she succeeded in keeping his kingdom intact and in thwarting the intrigues of his brother John Lackland and Philip II Augustus, king of France, against him.

In 1199 Richard died without leaving an heir to the throne, and John was crowned king. Eleanor, nearly 80 years old, fearing the disintegration of the Plantagenet domain, crossed the Pyrenees in 1200 in order to fetch her granddaughter Blanche from the court of Castile and marry her to the son of the French king. By this marriage she hoped to ensure peace between the Plantagenets of England and the Capetian kings of France. In the same year she helped to defend Anjou and Aquitaine against her grandson Arthur of Brittany, thus securing John’s French possessions. In 1202 John was again in her debt for holding Mirebeau against Arthur, until John, coming to her relief, was able to take him prisoner. John’s only victories on the Continent, therefore, were due to Eleanor.

She died in 1204 at the monastery at Fontevrault, Anjou, where she had retired after the campaign at Mirebeau. Her contribution to England extended beyond her own lifetime; after the loss of Normandy (1204), it was her own ancestral lands and not the old Norman territories that remained loyal to England. 

—Britannica

Henry II died in July 1189 and their son Richard succeeded him; one of his first acts was to free his mother from prison and restore her to full freedom. Eleanor ruled as regent in Richard’s name while he took over for his father in leading the Third Crusade, which had barely begun when Henry II died. On the conclusion of the crusade, Richard (known as Richard the Lionheart) returned to England and ruled until his death in 1199. Eleanor lived to see her youngest son, John, crowned king after Richard’s death, and was employed by John as an envoy to France. She would later support John’s rule against the rebellion of her grandson Arthur, and eventually retire as a nun to the abbey at Fontevraud, where she was buried upon her death in 1204. 

—History

Alysanne died before Jaehaerys, but, as it was said before, during their life together she helped him to codified the laws of Westeros, she procured the promulgation of important laws in favor of women rights and gave fresh water to the people of Kings landing.

Alysanne also acted as Jaehaerys representative in an important royal progress through the north, charming all the northern houses, specially the warden of the north, Lord Alaric Stark, and the men of the Night’s Watch, procuring the “New Gift” for them.

Alysanne, in open disagreement with her husband, was in favor of her daughter Daenerys and her granddaughter Rhaenys to be Jaehaerys’ heir to the Iron Throne, following the order of birth, not their sex.  

Again, Sansa is not in a Queen position yet, but she has the education and charms to become a great monarch. Her knowledge of history, heraldry and courtesies would also make her a great diplomat and negotiator.    

THE COURT OF LOVE

And we finally arrived to the section that will make you realize how much of Eleanor we can find in Sansa. After reading this part of Eleanor's story, I decided to write this post as a continuation of my Alysanne/Sansa post. And after doing some more research on GRRM's words on how much Eleanor has influenced their ASOIAF women, I think I made a good decision.

Eleanor was born in the South of France, in a court that was exactly like the Southern courts that Sansa read in her beloved songs and that she wished to live in:  

Their ducal court had a fine reputation as a patron of the arts. Eleanor’s grandfather, William IX, was known as the “troubadour duke,” famous for his poetry and songs about heroism and courtly love. Poets of the time, especially the famous Marcabru, found hospitality at the court of Aquitaine. 

—National Geographic

Now, lets read one of my favorite Sansa’s passages, one that tell us about her innocent dreams and wishes for a young and handsome singer that would make the walls of Winterfell alive with romantic music:

Once, when she was just a little girl, a wandering singer had stayed with them at Winterfell for half a year. An old man he was, with white hair and windburnt cheeks, but he sang of knights and quests and ladies fair, and Sansa had cried bitter tears when he left them, and begged her father not to let him go. "The man has played us every song he knows thrice over," Lord Eddard told her gently. "I cannot keep him here against his will. You need not weep, though. I promise you, other singers will come."

They hadn't, though, not for a year or more. Sansa had prayed to the Seven in their sept and old gods of the heart tree, asking them to bring the old man back, or better still to send another singer, young and handsome. But the gods never answered, and the halls of Winterfell stayed silent.

But that was when she was a little girl, and foolish. She was a maiden now, three-and-ten and flowered. All her nights were full of song, and by day she prayed for silence.

—A Feast for Crows - Sansa I

Somehow, Eleanor’s story is in reverse, because when she married Louis VII of France and moved to Paris, in the North, she found her new home staid and cold:    

Possessing a high-spirited nature, Eleanor was not popular with the staid northerners. […] Much money went into making the austere Cité Palace in Paris more comfortable for Eleanor's sake.

—Wikipedia

Within weeks of her wedding, Eleanor found herself taking possession of the drafty and unwelcoming Cîté Palace in Paris that would be her new home.

—History

By many accounts, Eleanor was a bright and vivacious woman. Life at the Capetian court did not entirely meet the expectations and tastes of the young bride who was used to the court of Aquitaine’s embrace of troubadour poetry, sophistication, extravagance, and a greater freedom of manners. The Parisian court and northern France were more reserved. 

—National Geographic

Years later, when Eleanor was Queen of England, she decided to return to her own lands and stablished her own court in Poitiers, when she became a magnificent patron of arts:

In The Art of Courtly Love, Andreas Capellanus, Andrew the chaplain, refers to the court of Poitiers. He claims that Eleanor, her daughter Marie, Ermengarde, Viscountess of Narbonne, and Isabelle of Flanders would sit and listen to the quarrels of lovers and act as a jury to the questions of the court that revolved around acts of romantic love. He records some twenty-one cases, the most famous of them being a problem posed to the women about whether true love can exist in marriage. According to Capellanus, the women decided that it was not at all likely. 

—Wikipedia

In this marriage, Eleanor was also able to become a patron of the arts, and at least four writers dedicated their work to her. She famously established the so-called Court of Love at Poitiers between 1168 and 1173. Along with her daughter Marie (from her first marriage), popular accounts describe Eleanor’s court as a flowering of culture where music, poetry, and chivalry took center stage. 

—National Geographic

During her childbearing years, she participated actively in the administration of the realm and even more actively in the management of her own domains. She was instrumental in turning the court of Poitiers, then frequented by the most famous troubadours of the time, into a centre of poetry and a model of courtly life and manners. She was the great patron of the two dominant poetic movements of the time: the courtly love tradition, conveyed in the romantic songs of the troubadours, and the historical matière de Bretagne, or “legends of Brittany,” which originated in Celtic traditions and in the Historia regum Britanniae, written by the chronicler Geoffrey of Monmouth sometime between 1135 and 1138. 

—Britannica

Eleanor’s time as mistress of her own lands in Poitiers (1168-1173) established the legend of the Court of Love, where she is reputed to have encouraged a culture of chivalry among her courtiers that had far-reaching influence on literature, poetry, music and folklore. Although some facts about the court remain in dispute amidst centuries of accumulated legend and myth, it seems that Eleanor, possibly accompanied by her daughter Marie, established a court that was largely focused on courtly love and symbolic ritual that was eagerly taken up by the troubadours and writers of the day and promulgated through poetry and song. This court was reported to have attracted artists and poets, and to have contributed to a flowering of culture and the arts. But to whatever extent such a court existed, it appears not to have survived Eleanor’s later capture and imprisonment, which effectively removed her from any position of power and influence for the next 16 years. 

—History

Now, after reading about Eleanor’s Court of Love, tell if she doesn’t sound exactly like Sansa?  And this give me hope about Sansa, once in a position of power and in her own lands, establishing a similar court full of poets and singers to promote chivalry and courtly love, just like in her little girl’s dreams and wishes.

Another customs from the Middle Ages that GRRM introduced in the Books, in line with themes of chivalry courtly love, are the jousting tourneys and the title for the queen of love and beauty.  The subject was discussed in this post:

That being said, what they did have in the twelfth century was the idea of the Court of Love, which developed under the aegis of one of my personal favourite medieval figures, Eleanor of Aquitaine, first queen of France, and then queen of England. Eleanor was the daughter and heiress of the duke of Aquitaine, whose court was known as a centre of arts and culture, particularly music and poetry. When she was in charge, she patronized many poets, musicians, and artists, and they of course reciprocated by referring to her as the queen of love. Her daughter, Marie, Countess of Champagne, followed suit, and is best known for having commissioned Chrétien de Troyes to write a romance about Queen Guinevere and thereby introducing the world to Sir Lancelot of the Lake.

—poorshadowspaintedqueens

Eleanor being called the queen of love and beauty by poets and musicians gives me hope about Sansa being crowned queen of love and beauty sometime in the Books. 

Alysanne also favored arts and introduced them again in the Red Keep:

Queen Alysanne looked back on the short-lived glories of her father’s court fondly, however, and made it her purpose to make the Red Keep glitter as it never had before, buying tapestries and carpets from Free Cities and commissioning murals, statuary, and tilework to decorate the castle’s halls and chambers. At her command, men from the City Watch combed Flea Bottom until they found Tom the Strummer, whose mocking songs had amused king and commons alike during the War for the White Cloaks. Alysanne made him the court singer, the first of many who would hold that office in the decades to come. She brought in a harpist from Oldtown, a company of mummers from Braavos, dancers from Lys, and gave the Red Keep its first fool, a fat man called the Goodwife who dressed as a woman and was never seen without his wooden “children,” a pair of cleverly carved puppets who said ribald, shocking things.

—Fire & Blood

But I think that GRRM took inspiration from Eleanor’s Court of Love to create Alysanne’s Women Courts:

Since holding the first of her women's courts during the first royal progress Alysanne and Jaehaerys made, the women's courts became an important part of every subsequent royal progress. Only women and girls were allowed to join Alysanne during these courts, regardless of their status of birth. Alysanne encouraged them to speak freely and openly about their fears, concerns, and hopes.

The first of Alysanne's women's courts was held in 51 AC at the town of Duskendale, when King Jaehaerys I Targaryen and Queen Alysanne made their first royal progress. In 52 AC, during Jaehaerys's second royal progress, Alysanne held a women's court at Gulltown, and another at the Gates of the Moon. The things she heard from the women during these two women's courts resulted in her plea to Jaehaerys to protect the widows of the Seven Kingdoms from being cast aside by the children of their late husbands from earlier marriages. In response, Jaehaerys promulgated the Widow's Law.

In 53 AC, when Alysanne was unwilling to join Jaehaerys on his royal progress due to her pregnancy, Lady Jennis Templeton accompanied the king's retinue in order to hold women's courts at Riverrun and Stoney Sept.

In 58 AC while visiting the North, Alysanne held a women's court at White Harbour, where more than two hundred women and girls came before her. When she eventually arrived at the Wall to visit the Night's Watch, she held a women's court in a brothel at Mole's Town. Following their return to King's Landing, Alysanne brought to Jaehaerys's attention the stories she had heard in her women's court at Mole's Town, concerning the right to the first night. As a result, Jaehaerys abolished the lord's right to the first night. These policies, influenced by Alysanne, came to be called Queen Alysanne's laws by the smallfolk. 

[Source]

As you can see, these women’s meeting with Alysanne resulted in the promulgation of laws to protect women’s rights against sexual abuse and domestic violence.  And let’s also remember that Alysanne, in open disagreement with her husband, was in favor of her daughter Daenerys and her granddaughter Rhaenys to be Jaehaerys’ heir to the Iron Throne, following the order of birth, not their sex.  

The most prominent dissenter was Good Queen Alysanne, who had helped her husband rule the Seven Kingdoms for many years, and now saw her son’s daughter being passed over because of her sex. “A ruler needs a good head and a true heart,” she famously told the king. “A cock is not essential. If Your Grace truly believes that women lack the wit to rule, plainly you have no further need of me.” 

—Fire & Blood

Now tell if this not sound pretty similar to:

The only way to keep your people loyal is to make certain they fear you more than they do the enemy.”

“I will remember, Your Grace,” said Sansa, though she had always heard that love was a surer route to the people’s loyalty than fear. If I am ever a queen, I’ll make them love me.

—A Clash of Kings - Sansa VI

Sansa Stark is Good Queen material. Tyrion Lannister And GRRM agrees.

Queen Alysanne was also fond of singers and gallant knights:

Three of the brothers had been singers before taking the black, and they took turns playing for Her Grace at night, regaling her with ballads, war songs, and bawdy barracks tunes. 

—Fire & Blood

Though his castle was small and modest compared to the great halls of the realm, Lord Dondarrion was a splendid host and his son Simon played the high harp as well as he jousted, and entertained the royal couple by night with sad songs of star-crossed lovers and the fall of kings. So taken with him was the queen that the party lingered longer at Blackhaven than they had intended.

—Fire & Blood

One of the Knights of Legends that Sansa idolizes, Ser Ryam Redwyne, crowned Queen Alysanne as the queen of love and beauty:

On the field, the highlight of the competition was the brilliance of Ser Ryam Redwyne, the youngest son of Lord Manfryd Redwyne of the Arbor, Jaehaerys’s lord admiral and master of ships. In successive tilts, Ser Ryam unhorsed Ronnal Baratheon, Arthor Oakheart, Simon Dondarrion, Harys Hogg (Harry the Ham, to the commons), and two Kingsguard knights, Lorence Roxton and Lucamore Strong. When the young gallant trotted up to the royal box and crowned Good Queen Alysanne as his queen of love and beauty, the commons roared their approval.

—Fire & Blood

Back to Sansa, let’s read one of my favorite pieces from last year, written a month before the Show final episode, an interview to GRRM to talk exclusively about the Stark Sisters, Arya and Sansa Stark:

I wanted to read you one of the earliest passages that you wrote about the two of them, if that’s okay.

Sure.

“It wasn’t fair. Sansa had everything. Sansa was two years older; maybe by the time Arya had been born, there had been nothing left. Often it felt that way. Sansa could sew and dance and sing. She wrote poetry. She knew how to dress. She played the high harp and the bells. Worse, she was beautiful. Sansa had gotten their mother’s fine high cheekbones and the thick auburn hair of the Tullys. Arya took after their lord father. Her hair was a lusterless brown, and her face was long and solemn.”

So what was the glimmer of an idea for these two sisters?

Well you’re taking me back a long, long way. That’s a pretty early chapter …  I first began in 1991. I wrote about a hundred pages of it before I got distracted by Hollywood stuff, and then I put it aside for like two years before I got back to it. Those words you read were actually part of the first hundred pages that I was doing there. When I was writing these, and I was creating a family for Lord Eddard Stark … I knew I wanted it to be a fairly large family, with a number of children. I suppose I cheated a little by not having three children who died in infancy in there, which was true of the actual Middle Ages. They had a terrible time with kids who died very young.

So I created Bran and in the very first chapter, I wrote where they find the direwolf pups in the snow. Bran is the viewpoint chapter there, and Robb and Jon and Theon are all with him, they’re the boys who rode out with their father to see the man beheaded. The fact that the boys went out was a reflection of what a patriarchal society it was, as medieval societies often were. I was following history in that regard … But I wanted some girls, too.

And when I actually got to Winterfell in the later chapter, I knew I wanted to deal with the role that women and young girls had in this kind of society. So to show the contrast, [we] have two sisters who were very, very different from each other. The Middle Ages was very patriarchal. I’m a little weary of over-generalizing, since that makes me seem like an idiot — but generally, women didn’t have a lot of rights. They were used to make marriage-alliances; I’m talking high-born women now, of course. Peasant women had even less rights. But I was focusing on a noble family here as the center of the book.

At the same time, this is also the era where courtly romance was born: the gallant Knight, the fair lady, the princess, all of that stuff. That became very big, initially in the courts of France and Burgundy, but it spread all over Europe, including England and Germany.  And it still has its roots in a lot of stuff that we follow today. I mean, in some sense the Disney Princess archetype — the whole princess mythos — that we’re all familiar with is a legacy of the troubadours of the romance era of medieval France.

Sansa completely bought into that, loved everything about that. She dreamed of jousts, bards singing of her beauty, fair knights, being the mistress of a castle and perhaps a princess and queen. The whole romantic thing.

And then to have Arya, a girl who did not fit that — and who, from the very beginning, was uncomfortable and chafes at the roles that she was being pushed into. You know, who didn’t wanna sew but wanted to fight with a sword, who liked riding and hunting and wrestling in the mud. A “tomboy” we would call it, I guess. But that phrase, of course, didn’t exist in the Middle Ages, so I don’t think I ever use it in the books, but you know what I mean. So that was the roots to create these two characters who were very different from each other, and who then necessarily chafed against each other in the context of the books.

—GRRM - RollingStone - 2019

Do I need to tell more? It seems to me very obvious that GRRM has translated Eleanor’s Court of Love into Sansa’s love for songs and stories, courtesies and profound beliefs on chivalry and courtly love:

Sansa was a lady at three, always so courteous and eager to please. She loved nothing so well as tales of knightly valor. 

—A Clash of Kings - Catelyn VII

Sansa Stark, he mused. Soft-spoken sweet-smelling Sansa, who loved silks, songs, chivalry and tall gallant knights with handsome faces. 

—A Storm of Swords - Tyrion III

Also, take note that Sansa loves her courtesies, they are her armor.

But there is more to say about Eleanor of Aquitaine and her influence in the creation of ASOIAF women, especially women profoundly linked and similar to Sansa Stark. Let’s see:

While promoting Fire & Blood, GRRM told us this about Eleanor of Aquitaine:

Question: A lot of your female characters are very empowered and motivated, which other fictional or historical female characters did you drawn inspiration from, if any?    

GRRM: Ahhh, well, there was a lot of them, Eleanor of Aquitaine of course was a major one, she was one of the most kick-ass women of the Middle Ages and, you know, she had her own crusade, or she went on crusade rather and she married two kings and then was the mother of several more, she was a great character. There’s also a lot of the... If you read the Italian History, a lot of the... During the Italian Middle Ages and Renaissance period, there were a lot of very powerful and bloody women who controlled various city-states in Italy, and did some amazing things.     

—In conversation: George R.R. Martin with Dan Jones FULL EVENT

We already know that Alysanne was called by GRRM, the “Eleanor of Aquitaine of Westeros”:

Alysanne was the queen, consort, and sister of King Jaehaerys I, the Old King, and like him she lived a long life. Since you pictured him as an old man at the end of his reign, I figure it would be most appropriate to do her the same way, rather than as the young woman she was when Jaehaerys first ascended the Iron Throne.

You might consider Alysanne as the Eleanor of Aquitaine of Westeros, and model her on Katharine Hepburn’s portrayal of Eleanor in the film THE LION IN WINTER. Tall and straight, unbowed by time, she had high cheekbones, clear blue eyes. Age left crow’s feet around her eyes and laugh lines about her mouth, but her face never lost its strength. She was a fine archer and hunter in her youth, and loved to fly atop her dragon to all the distant parts of the realm. Alysanne was slim of waist and small of breast, with a long neck, a fair complexion, a high forehead. In old age her hair turned white as snow. She wore it in a bun, pulled back and pinned behind her hear.

Her relationship with King Jaehaerys was always very close. She was his most trusted counselor and his right hand, and often wore a slimmer, more feminine version of his crown at court. Beloved by the common people of Westeros, she loved them in return, and was renowned for her charities. [Source] 

But Alysanne is not the only woman linked and similar to Sansa that was modeled from Eleanor.  GRRM has also said that he took inspiration from Eleanor of Aquitaine to create Catelyn Stark and Brienne of Tarth:  

Interviewer: One of the strongest female characters is Catelyn Stark, in my point of view.

GRRM: Well, I wanted to make a strong mother character. The portrayal women in epic fantasy have been problematical for a long time. These books are largely written by men but women also read them in great, great numbers. And the women in fantasy tend to be very atypical women… They tend to be the woman warrior or the spunky princess who wouldn’t accept what her father lays down, and I have those archetypes in my books as well.

However, with Catelyn there is something reset for the Eleanor of Aquitaine, the figure of the woman who accepted her role and functions with a narrow society and, nonetheless, achieves considerable influence and power and authority despite accepting the risks and limitations of this society. She is also a mother… Then, a tendency you can see in a lot of other fantasies is to kill the mother or to get her off the stage. She’s usually dead before the story opens… Nobody wants to hear about King Arthur’s mother and what she thought or what she was doing, so they get her off the stage and I wanted it too. And that’s Catelyn.

—Adrias News - 2012

So Catelyn Stark is “the figure of the woman who accepted her role and functions with a narrow society and, nonetheless, achieves considerable influence and power and authority despite accepting the risks and limitations of this society”.

Catelyn Stark, Sansa’s lady mother and role model, the symbol of strength she turned to when she pleaded for her father's life:

Sansa quailed. Now, she told herself, I must do it now. Gods give me courage. She took one step, then another. Lords and knights stepped aside silently to let her pass, and she felt the weight of their eyes on her. I must be as strong as my lady mother. "Your Grace," she called out in a soft, tremulous voice.

—A Game of Thrones - Sansa V    

Catelyn Stark, the woman whose name Sansa wanted to take as her new identity:

What should you be called?" "I . . . I could call myself after my mother . . ." "Catelyn? A bit too obvious . . . but after my mother, that would serve. Alayne. Do you like it?" "Alayne is pretty." Sansa hoped she would remember. 

—A Storm of Swords - Sansa VI

Catelyn Stark, the mother that Sansa didn’t forget and that reminds inside her to preserve her true identity:

I am not your daughter, she thought. I am Sansa Stark, Lord Eddard's daughter and Lady Catelyn's, the blood of Winterfell. 

—A Feast for Crows - Sansa I

That Catelyn Stark is the kind of woman that Sansa Stark will become and surpass in the future. To quote GRRM: “one of the most kick-ass women of the Middle Ages Westeros”.

Here you can read more about Catelyn Stark and Eleanor of Aquitaine parallels.

And this is what GRRM said about who inspired Brienne of Tarth:

“I enjoyed Xena the Warrior Princess a lot but I did not think it was an accurate portrayal of what a women warrior was or would be like, and I sort of created Brienne of Tarth as an answer to that.

I was inspired by people like Eleanor of Aquitaine and not so much Joan of Arc, but the queens of Scottish history, from Lady Macbeth on down - strong women who didn’t put on chain-mail bikinis to go forth into battle, but exercised immense powers by other ways.” 

—Pajiba - 2014

That quote was from the Edinburgh International Book Festival 2014.  During that event, and even before, there were reports about GRRM saying that: “Brienne is Sansa with a sword”.     

Since there was no primary source for this quote (I just found a broken link not longer available), just the fan reports we found in reddit and westeros.org, with the help of some friends, we decided to ask the man himself. We contacted him via email. 

And he answered us. 

More or less the question was this:

I recently came across a quotation that’s been attributed to you, but unfortunately the original source is no longer available, and I wanted to confirm it’s something you’ve actually said in the past. In 2014 at the Edinburgh Book Festival, multiple fans quoted you as saying that Brienne of Tarth is “Sansa with a sword,” with regards to certain personality traits. Is that an accurate quotation?

And George’s answer was this:

I don’t remember saying that, but it could be. It has been six years. GRRM

¡My friends and I are still ecstatic!

And as I said before, this beautiful quote “Brienne is Sansa with a sword”, also reminds me of this interview:

Game of Thrones Season 4 Premiere: 

Interviewer: Is there any character who is morally beyond reproach?      

GRRM: Beyon reproach? You mean like good, so good? Probably not.

Interviewer: I was thinking Brienne.    

GRRM: Maybe, yes, certainly. She’s up there. She’s very idealistic. At least in the beginning, but you know her journey still has a way to go, and my world has a way of testing one’s ideals, so we’ll see by the end.

That Brienne description sounds pretty much like Sansa, right?

So there you have it, I just love that Catelyn, Brienne and Sansa belong to the Eleanor of Aquitaine’s kick-ass women club.

BAD REPUTATION ¡KICK-ASS REPUTATION!

As you can imagine, through all these years, Eleanor of Aquitaine, for being the woman she was, had also gotten a bad reputation:

At times portrayed as a frivolous young woman or a manipulative schemer, Eleanor was a savvy player on the political stage—unafraid to exercise the power she held; her reputation may have been damaged by her boldness, but her influence on the political and cultural events of the 12th century remains undiminished. 

—National Geographic

She has been misjudged by many French historians who have noted only her youthful frivolity, ignoring the tenacity, political wisdom, and energy that characterized the years of her maturity. “She was beautiful and just, imposing and modest, humble and elegant”; and, as the nuns of Fontevrault wrote in their necrology, a queen “who surpassed almost all the queens of the world.” 

—Britannica

Indeed, while researching for this post I found awful reports about Eleanor, trying to disqualified her and her achievements, and trying also to demystify her figure calling most of the facts attributed to her, fantasies and fiction.  In a state where we don’t even have a reliable source about Eleanor’s true physical features, I think it is more probable that we only knew a few things about her, and knowing so little, she still is “one of the most kick-ass women of the Middle Ages”.

Thanks the Gods, Alysanne never suffered of this bad reputation “phenomenon”, the way other women from Fire and Blood had.  You just have to read the things that were told about the first Rhaenys and Rhaena to know that they were the subjects of misogyny and bad propaganda as a way to diminished them and exalt other characters.

I’m not saying that Alysanne didn’t deserve to be called the “Good Queen”, but Jaehaerys used her for his Targaryen supremacy propaganda campaign, and, as you may have already realized, most of the time Alysanne was the real author of the best initiatives and laws of Jaehaerys’ rule:

“Words are wind,” he told his council, “but wind can fan a fire. My father and my uncle fought words with steel and flame. We shall fight words with words, and put out the fires before they start.” And so saying, His Grace sent forth not knights and men-at-arms, but preachers. “Tell every man you meet of Alysanne’s kindness, her sweet and gentle nature, and her love for all the people of our kingdom, great and small,” the king charged them. 

—Fire & Blood

But Catelyn and Sansa were not freed of this bad reputation “phenomenon”. Catelyn and Sansa are two of the most hated and insulted characters of ASOIAF, no matter how many times the author himself has defended them of unjust critics and baseless judgments. Just like Eleanor, Catelyn and Sansa are called frivolous, manipulative, schemers; but also, and at the same time, useless and whiny.  It’s ridiculous.

Following the "Creating Characters" panel, Linda and I mentioned to George that some people gave Sansa and Catelyn a lot of grief, claiming they "whined" too much.

George was quite adamant that he disagreed with those readers. He pointed out that the problem is that readers often don't seem to make a distinction between internal thought and external speech in a way that an author might prefer. Specifically, in terms of "whining", to him whining is a verbal act -- you actually have to speak to whine. Cat doesn't do that, though -- all her dark, depressed thoughts are kept to herself. Yes, the reader is aware of them, because they read her POV, but she absolutely does not burden other characters with them. Basically, everyone has bad times among the good times, and they think negatively then but just having negative thoughts isn't whining.

[Source]

There you have it haters, GRRM wants for you to know that you can’t read.

So, let’s just change this bad reputation tag for a better one: ¡KICK-ASS REPUTATION!

And to finish this really long post, I will leave you with what I wrote about the l’Armure necklace that Louis Vuitton gave to Sophie Turner for the 71st annual Emmy Awards:

The dazzling piece in question is titled the l’Armure necklace, from Louis Vuitton’s “Riders of the Knights” collection. Made with white gold, 640 diamonds and 305 baguette-cut diamonds, it took over 1,175 hours of work to complete. “The design is inspired by medieval armor,” Louis Vuitton’s jewelry designer Francesca Amfitheatrof told Vogue. [Source]

The Riders of the Knights collection achieves an immersive aesthetic drawn from medieval codes of chivalry and heraldic crests. (…)

With this new collection, the House pays tribute to the powerful vision that impelled so many medieval heroines to transcend their limitations and forge their own destiny. These women made a lasting mark on the man’s world they inhabited, shaping their fate. They are the very embodiment of determination and independence, values that reflect the Louis Vuitton woman. [Source]

Louis Vuitton literally gave Sophie her own armor in the form of a white gold and diamonds necklace, in a very similar fashion to Michele Clapton giving Sansa her Needle necklace and her armor belt and dress, that armored her against all the claimers of her body and ancestral lands.  

A beautiful and symbolic way to honor the character Sophie played for about 10 years, Sansa Stark, a medieval heroine that prevailed against the patriarchal Westerosi society, never abandoning her feminine strength and courage, while still believing in chivalry and inspiring true knights along her path. 

¡The Queen in the North!    

¡The Queen in the North!    

¡The Queen in the North!    

¡The Queen in the North!    

[laboratorioautoral]

The original outline and why it is still relevant to ASOIF

Since the original outline for A Song of Ice and Fire was leaked there’s been a massive effort, both in fandom and mainstream media, to discredit everything that was revealed there as a potential clue for the future of the story.

Although I agree that some changes happened, I don’t subscribe to the idea that the outline is irrelevant at this point. This little essay is my attempt to analyze the outline and compare it with what has already happened and still could happen in the future books, how much was changed and more importantly, how it was changed. I won’t say this is an impartial analysis (because I don’t believe that such a thing exists) but an honest effort of textual interpretation.

Here we go:

“Dear Ralph,

Here are the first thirteen chapters (170 pages) of the high fantasy novel I promised you, which I'm calling 'A Game of Thrones.' When completed, this will be the first volume in what I see as an epic trilogy with the overall title, 'A Song of Ice and Fire.'”

First things first. A Song of Ice and Fire was first imagined as a trilogy and the fact that GRRM extended it to 7 books obviously has an impact in terms of structure. It seems quite reasonable to assume that a lot more would have to happen to fill the gap occupied by 4 additional books. That alone is a huge influencing factor, but it doesn’t necessarily mean that the essence of the story was changed as we can see in the following paragraphs.

“As you know, I don't outline my novels. I find that if I know exactly where a book is going, I lose all interest in writing it. I do, however, have some strong notions as to the overall structure of the story I'm telling, and the eventual fate of many of the principle characters in the drama. Roughly speaking, there are three major conflicts set in motion in the chapters enclosed. These will form the major plot threads of the trilogy, [unclear] each other in what should be a complex but exciting (I hope [unclear] tapestry. Each of the [unclear] presents a major threat [unclear] of my imaginary realm, the Seven Kingdoms, and to the live [unclear] principal characters.”

Here we have Martin admitting that he usually doesn’t outline his novels over fear that he will lose interest while writing it. However, he also clarifies that he has “some strong notions” for the story he is telling, especially in which concerns those he considers to be the main characters.

In some of interviews Martin already said that the ending he had planned many years ago is still in place and he has known the characters’ endings ever since. It’s safe to assume, I think, that the core of his plans hasn’t changed much. What might have changed is the path that leads the characters from one point to another.

“The first threat grows from the enmity between the great houses of Lannister and Stark as it plays out in a cycle of plot, counter-plot, ambition, murder, and revenge, with the iron throne of the Seven Kingdoms as the ultimate prize. This will form the backbone of the first volume of the trilogy, A Game of Thrones.”

Can anyone say that this didn’t happen? Of course not. This is the spark that lights the fire that will consume the Seven Kingdoms throughout the story, with major and minor consequences that will shape both the narrative and the characters’ development. The conflict between Starks and Lannisters is the first of three conflicts that represent the core of the story.

“While the lion of Lannister and the direwolf of Stark snarl and scrap, however, a second and greater threat takes shape across the narrow sea, where the Dothraki horselords mass their barbarian hordes for a great invasion of the Seven Kingdoms, led by the fierce and beautiful Daenerys Stormborn, the last of the Targaryen dragonlords. The Dothraki invasion will be the central story of my second volume, A Dance with Dragons.”

Here we have the second major conflict and with this one in particular I’ll have to take my time to elaborate some points. First of all, A Dance With Dragons became the 5th book of the series instead of the second. So far everything we saw about Daenerys was her preparing to take her place at the center of the stage.

Dany has her own arc which hasn’t integrated to the events in Westeros so far given to her geographic location. That doesn’t mean that Daenerys has no relevance to what’s happening in Westeros, but her existence wasn’t directly noticed by the seven kingdoms yet. Daenerys is preparing for her role in the main story: She is gathering a military force based on the Dothraki to invade Westeros.

We already know that Daenerys will have more than just the Dothraki on her side. The Unsullied were added to the plot and my guess is that they exist to humanize Daenerys and make us sympathize with her cause as she creates the great narrative of “Breaker of Chains”. This makes Daenerys sound heroic and noble, but I would like to point that Martin is very specific about one thing: The fierce and beautiful Daenerys Stormborn is first and foremost a threat. She is ready to invade Westeros and invasions are not peaceful.

At this point we already know two things worth being mentioned that are related both with Daenerys and the title of this book: The Dance of Dragons was a civil war involving two Targaryen claimants to the Iron Throne. On one side we had Rhaenyra, firstborn of the king and rightful heir if gender wasn’t an issue in Westerosi succession laws. On the other side we had Aegon, a son born from the king’s second marriage. His claim was mostly based on gender norms that favor male heirs in detriment of primogeniture.

It isn’t much of a dance if we only have one dragon, is it? Yes, Daenerys is the first half of this equation, but there is another half that Martin hadn’t created yet (or didn’t mention) when he wrote the outline. There is a second Targaryen, or at least someone who claims to be one.

Aegon VI, or Young Griff, is actually the first one to arrive in Westeros with invasion in mind. Does it mean that Dany is less of a threat or that she was suddenly placed in a heroic position? Absolutely not. No one with three dragons is a harmless creature and Dany is even more dangerous now that she has a direct enemy in position to take away everything she fought for.

I know that there’s a lot of speculation on whether Aegon is a Blackfire or not, but honestly I think his true lineage will be irrelevant as long as he has at least a drop of Targaryen blood and the right looks. Legitimate or not, Aegon looks like a Targaryen, has the house’s ancestral sword and a story that is convincing enough. More than that, by posing as Prince Rhaegar’s legitimate son, Aegon makes his claim stronger than Daenerys’. On top of that, he would be the Targaryen male heir in opposition to a Targaryen woman, repeating at least a part of the scenery that led Westeros to the Dance of Dragons.

Aegon and Daenerys are bound to become enemies because of their own ambitions. I don’t see Dany accepting him as a suitor or even the rightful heir. She doesn’t need Aegon to take Westeros and a queen without a king is, historically speaking, more powerful.

Everything said about Aegon can also be applied to Jon once his true parentage is revealed. Jon and Daenerys are a threat to each other and only one will survive this.

“The greatest danger of all, however, comes from the north, from the icy wastes beyond the Wall, where half-forgotten demons out of legend, the inhuman others, raise cold legions of the undead and the neverborn and prepare to ride down on the winds of winter to extinguish everything that we would call "life." The only thing that stands between the Seven Kingdoms and an endless night is the Wall, and a handful of men in black called the Night's Watch. Their story will be [sic] heart of my third volume, The Winds of Winter. The final battle will also draw together characters and plot threads left from the first two books and resolve all in one huge climax.”

The third and greatest danger also remains just the same. The Others are still the core of the last book and the major battle. There isn’t much to elaborate on in this part except for the title of what was supposed to be the last book, The Winds of Winter.

I don’t think A Dream of Spring will be some sort of extended epilogue, but most of the action and conflict should take part during The Winds of Winter. At the very least the center of the whole debate will be both the North, with all the plots there, and what lies beyond the Wall.

“The thirteen chapters on hand should give you a notion as to my narrative strategy. All three books will feature a complex mosaic of inter-cutting points-of-view among various of my large and diverse cast of players. The cast will not always remain the same. Old characters will die, and new ones will be introduced. Some of the fatalities will include sympathetic viewpoint characters. I want the reader to feel that no one is ever completely safe, not even the characters who seem to be the heroes. The suspense always ratchets up a notch when you know that any character can die at any time.”

Needless to say anything about this. The books are well-known for these hallmarks. Now we are getting to the juicy part.

--

“Five central characters will make it through all three volumes, however, growing from children to adults and changing the world and themselves in the process. In a sense, my trilogy is almost a generational saga, telling the life stories of these five characters, three men and two women. The five key players are Tyrion Lannister, Daenerys Targaryen, and three of the children of Winterfell, Arya, Bran, and the bastard Jon Snow. All of them are introduced at some length in the chapters you have to hand.”

I would like to make a point here. The five characters will grow from children to adults, changing the world and themselves in the process.

Although I believe that Martin made a bit of a mess in which concerns the characters’ ages, I think we can understand that the characters will not only be forced to act like adults, but also will be perceived as such by those around them and given positions of power or leadership.

Specifically in which concerns the female characters, both Daenerys and Arya will be perceived as adult women by Westerosi society and this is important for several reasons, mainly in that being an adult noblewoman is a relevant component to form political alliances via marriage. In Arya’s case in particular, it reinforces the idea that she won’t be a nine year old girl forever. This impacts her relevance in the political game (something people usually overlook or ignore) and also makes it possible for Arya to have romantic interests.

“This is going to be (I hope) quite an epic. Epic in its scale, epic in its action, and epic in its length. I see all three volumes as big books, running about 700 to 800 manuscript pages, so things are just barely getting underway in the thirteen chapters I've sent you.”

Can anyone say it isn’t an epic? Sometimes I wish it wasn’t so intense so the books would come earlier, but here we are.

“I have quite a clear notion of how the story is going to unfold in the first volume, A Game of Thrones. Things will get a lot worse for the poor Starks before they get better, I'm afraid. Lord Eddard Stark and his wife Catelyn Tully are both doomed, and will perish at the hands of their enemies. Ned will discover what happened to his friend Jon Arryn, [unclear] can act on his knowledge [unclear] will have an unfortunate accident, and the throne will [unclear] to [unclear] and brutal [unclear] Joffrey [unclear] still a minor. Joffrey will not be sympathetic and Ned [what appears to say] will be accused of treason, but before he is taken he will help his wife and his daughter Arya escape back to Winterfell.”

Here we have proof that Ned and Catelyn were doomed from the start. Basically everything in this paragraph happened, even the part in which Ned helps Arya to escape by giving her position to Yoren. The only problem is that Arya never reached Winterfell and her mother had left the capital before Ned was arrested. Also the part that says that “things will get much worse for the poor Starks before they get better” makes me think that it’s quite clear that the Starks (or some of them) are the main protagonists of this story.

Why am I saying the Starks (or some of them) are the main heroes? Because being a charismatic character, created with the intention of getting the readers’ sympathy, isn’t necessarily what makes this character a protagonist. You can like whoever you want in the story, this doesn’t make a secondary character a main character, nor does it make a likable character the ‘hero’. The structure of the story and who are the main players is already given.

“Each of the contending families will learn it has a member of dubious loyalty in its midst. Sansa Stark, wed to Joffrey Baratheon, will bear him a son, the heir to the throne, and when the crunch comes she will choose her husband and child over her parents and siblings, a choice she will later bitterly rue. Tyrion Lannister, meanwhile, will befriend both Sansa and her sister Arya, while growing more and more disenchanted with his own family.”

Tyrion and Sansa were set to be the ones with dubious loyalties to their families. This also happened with slight differences. Tyrion befriends Jon and is somewhat sympathetic to Sansa and Bran. Sansa didn’t marry Joffrey, but she did choose him over her own family  the moment she went to Cersei to tell her Ned’s plans to get Sansa and Arya out of the capital. This might or might not indicate that she will have the chance to repent and atone for this, but her dubious loyalty is consolidated. Also Sansa has no children so far.

“Young Bran will come out of his coma, after a strange prophetic dream, only to discover that he will never walk again. He will turn to magic, at first in the hope of restoring his legs, but later for its own sake. When his father Eddard Stark is executed, Bran will see the shape of doom descending on all of them, but nothing he can say will stop his brother Robb from calling the banners in rebellion. All the north will be inflamed by war. Robb will win several splendid victories, and maim Joffrey Baratheon on the battlefield, but in the end he will not be able to stand against Jaime and Tyrion Lannister and their allies. Robb Stark will die in battle, and Tyrion Lannister will besiege and burn Winterfell.”

Bran’s arc is pretty much the same. We saw all of these things happen to him. The biggest change is in Robb’s part and even so most of it remains untouched. Robb did win splendid victories and in the books he even strategically beats both Jaime and Tyrion. What changed is that Robb and Joffrey never fought each other personally. Also Robb’s death was not on the battlefield but during the Red Wedding and Tyrion wasn't the one to sack Winterfell and burn it.

Tyrion’s first act of explicit villainy in the outline was transferred to Houses Bolton and Frey with participation of Theon Greyjoy. Still it was all part of the Lannisters’ plot and it was executed by their allies.

“Jon Snow, the bastard, will remain in the far north. He will mature into a ranger of great daring, and ultimately will succeed his uncle as the commander of the Night's Watch. When Winterfell burns, Catelyn Stark will be forced to flee north with her son Bran and her daughter Arya. Wounded by Lannister riders, they will seek refuge at the Wall, but the men of the Night's Watch give up their families when they take the black, and Jon and Benjen will not be able to help, to Jon's anguish. It will lead to a bitter estrangement between Jon and Bran. Arya will be more forgiving ... until she realizes, with terror, that she has fallen in love with Jon, who is not only her half-brother but a man of the Night's Watch, sworn to celibacy. Their passion will continue to torment Jon and Arya throughout the trilogy, until the secret of Jon's true parentage is finally revealed in the last book.”

Here we have some changes. What doesn’t change is that Jon becomes a member of the Night’s Watch and ultimately ascends to the position of Lord Commander. Benjen is a famous member of the Night’s Watch and I believe he was the first choice to take the position of Lord Commander after Mormont, but Ben’s disappearance accelerated Jon’s ascension.

Catelyn and Arya never fled Winterfell, since their paths had already taken them somewhere else, but Bran did and his first impulse is to go to the Wall. Given the fact that the three eyed raven calls him, Bran’s magical journey leads him to go beyond the Wall before he can be reunited with Jon.

Arya and Cat had completely different journeys, or at least partially. Cat seeks her eldest son and stays by Robb’s side during his campaign. Arya, on the other hand, is stranded all over the Riverlands trying to find her way to either Winterfell or the Wall, although she explicitly says that she prefers to go to Wall, where she can find Jon. There was a clear intention to send both Bran and Arya to the Wall, but as the story progressed this decision might have been abandoned temporarily.

Thanks to his vows, Jon can’t take part in the realm’s politics. When news of Ned’s fate arrive at the Wall, Jon is devastated by the impossibility to help his family and fight side by side with Robb. Jon’s moral boundaries and his code of honor become a huge issue for him in the books, and they are tested the most whenever his family is involved. This seems to be his main dilemma in the outline as well.

Jon’s relationship with his family is also ambiguous in some aspects, especially when it’s revealed that his greatest dream since he was young was to be the Lord of Winterfell. This implies a level of rivalry and envy of his true born siblings. Jon repressed these feelings as much as he could out of love for the Starks.

Now I’ll make some guesses here, I don’t think it’s impossible for Bran and Jon to have some bitter estrangement between them, but it won’t be because of the Night’s Watch: If Jon is released from his vows once he is resurrected and takes back Winterfell along with the titles, it will undoubtedly lead to a succession crisis involving not only rights of conquest but also Robb’s will. Bran’s rights are directly affected in this scenario and, unlike the show, Bran never once questioned his position as Robb’s heir. It’s not impossible to imagine that factions will gather behind both claimants and this can cause another crisis in the North and bitterness between brothers in a moment when union is crucial.

Arya has a close relationship with both Bran and Jon and she is someone both of them feel inclined to listen to. I think Arya will be the bridge between them and the one to diplomatically avoid a rupture in the North, but it doesn’t mean the bitterness between Bran and Jon will disappear.

Now we reach the hugest taboo of the outline and the main reason why people claim “it’s no longer relevant” or that “Martin changed his mind”. Jon and Arya falling in love.

Let’s get one thing very clear, Jon and Arya already love each other in the books. This is not my opinion, this is the literal text.

Jon’s best friend was Robb and still Jon affirms that he missed Arya the most. Just go back to the books and count how many times and how affectionately they think of each other. They repeatedly say how they miss finishing each other’s sentences and how Jon loves to mess Arya’s hair. “The memory of her laughter kept him warm during the long journey north.” and “Needle was Jon Snow’s smile” are two small quotes that speak volumes of how deep this love is.

Am I saying this is a romantic sort of love? No. I’m not saying this. What I’m doing is  highlighting the fact that this particular relationship stands out as one of the strongest (if not the strongest) bond in the books to the point where it’s not even questionable that Jon and Arya love each other the most. It’s strong enough to make Jon forsake his vows and decide to march to Winterfell to rescue a girl he thinks to be Arya. It’s strong enough to make Arya lie to Ned because she would never betray Jon.

Jon didn’t break his vows for any other sibling, no matter how much he wanted to, but he did it to save whom he thought was Arya. His love for her is the cause of Jon’s death in the books. He committed treason the moment he received the pink letter and decided to march against Ramsay Bolton. Jon’s last thought is “stick’em with the pointy end”.

I think it’s safe to assume that Jon will be resurrected and Melissandre is probably the one to perform the ritual. We already know that resurrections have some side effects in the asoiaf universe, the most evident one being some sort of obsessive thought that keeps guiding the resurrected’s actions (like Beric Dondarrion’s obsession with keeping the king’s peace, and Lady Stoneheart killing Freys to avenge Robb’s death). Jon’s last thought was directly related to Arya and there’s no other possible interpretation. His last thought is likely to become his obsession.

I also think it’s safe to say that Jon’s memory will stay inside Ghost at least for a while and we will have to wait and see the effects that will have on Jon’s personality once he comes back to life.

Varamir said that Ghost would be a second life fit for a king and I think this is a clear foreshadowing of Jon’s true identity. There are also some other aspects of wolf pack dynamics that deserve some consideration: Wolves are social animals that have hierarchy and well divided roles inside the pack and although Ghost is a lonely wolf that was separated from his original group, it would only take one female for him to start his own pack. Curiously Nymeria is an alpha female already, leading a pack of regular wolves, but she rejects her smaller cousins as potential mates. Ghost and Nymeria are the alpha male and female of a new pack. The wolves of Winterfell will come back; stronger and more dangerous.

I think all of these elements will play a significant role in how Jon and Arya’s love will change once they are reunited. It won’t be immediate, but as the story goes the sexual tension will become evident. Jon’s perception of Arya as a sister will be blurred as a teenage Arya starts to see him as a love interest. At this point Arya will already be perceived as an adult woman according to Westerosi society, as I pointed out before. My guess is that she will be close to Daenerys’ age when she married Drogo. I’m not judging if this is right or wrong by our own moral standards. What I’m saying is that it’s acceptable in the world created by GRRM.

As the outline says, their passion will continue to torment Jon and Arya throughout the trilogy, until Jon’s true parentage is revealed. This necessarily implies that: 1) they are not siblings; 2) their passion brings a lot of moral issues and they are not comfortable with it; 3) their agony has an end when Jon’s parentage is revealed. Jon’s true parentage is a moral free pass for them and, at least from what we can read in the outline, this is more relevant than any potential succession rights.

This moral free pass wouldn’t be applied in a romantic relationship between Jon and Daenerys for example. It would actually have the opposite effect, giving Jon reason to question his moral choices and torment himself with doubts. This plot point is not applicable to Sansa either, mostly because Sansa and Jon don’t have a close relationship that’s already been established. They have a distant one and don’t even think much about each other. The whole point of Jon and Arya’s strong bond is to lay the foundations for a romance, establishing a relationship based on love, mutual loyalty and respect.

Do we have any indication that Jon and Arya’s romance was scrapped based on the books? No. Do we have any conclusive evidence in the text that Arya was replaced by any other female character? No. Why do I think Jon and Arya are endgame? Because we have only two books left and a lot of events that must be covered by them. It’s way easier to use an already established loving relationship with 5 books of consistent development and make it a romantic one (and make it believable as an epic romance because all the dramatic elements are already there), than to write a brand new one from scratch and make the reader believe that this is the ultimate love story.

“Abandoned by the Night's Watch, Catelyn and her children will find their only hope of safety lies even further north, beyond the Wall, where they fall into the hands of Mance Rayder, the King-beyond-the-Wall, and get a dreadful glimpse of the inhuman others as they attack the wilding encampment. Bran's magic, Arya's sword Needle, and the savagery of their direwolves will help them survive, but their mother Catelyn will die at the hands of the others.”

Catelyn was meant to be killed by the Others. It’s not hard to conclude that she would have become one of them. The major difference from the outline to the books is that Catelyn died elsewhere, however she was brought back to life by fire magic as Lady Stoneheart. I can also see Bran and Arya fighting against the Others with the help of their direwolves in the event of a great battle by the end of the books. There’s nothing indicating that this part was cut, it just hasn’t happened yet.

“Over across the narrow sea, Daenerys Targaryen will discover that her new husband, the Dothraki Khal Drogo, has little interest in invading the Seven Kingdoms, much to her brother's frustration. When Viserys presses his claims past the point of tact or wisdom, Khal Drogo will finally grow annoyed and kill him out of hand, eliminating the Targaryen pretender and leaving Daenerys as the last of her line. Danerys [sic] will bide her time, but she will not forget. When the moment is right, she will kill her husband to avenge her brother, and then flee with a trusted friend into the wilderness beyond Vaes Dothrak. There, hunted by [unclear] of her life, she stumbles on a [something about dragon eggs] a young dragon will give Daenerys [unclear] bend [unclear] to her will. Then she begins to plan for her invasion of the Seven Kingdoms.”

Daenerys’ arc here didn’t change much. What changed was her motivation to kill Drogo and how she gets the dragons. Everything else that happens to her since the second book is her preparing to invade Westeros.

“Tyrion Lannister will continue to travel, to plot, and to play the game of thrones, finally removing his nephew Joffrey in disgust at the boy king's brutality. Jaime Lannister will follow Joffrey on the throne of the Seven Kingdoms, by the simple expedient of killing everyone ahead of him in the line of succession and blaming his brother Tyrion for the murders. Exiled, Tyrion will change sides, making common cause with the surviving Starks to bring his brother down, and falling helplessly in love with Arya Stark while he's at it. His passion is, alas, unreciprocated, but no less intense for that, and it will lead to a deadly rivalry between Tyrion and Jon Snow.”

There’s only one character that was replaced, I think. The Jaime Lannister of the outline seems to have been replaced by Cersei in the books, and it makes much more sense.  The Baratheons are briefly mentioned and we know Joffrey to be officially one. We know that Tyrion and Jaime are Lannisters and that Tyrion and Jaime are brothers. Unless Joffrey’s official father was a Lannister, Jaime would have no place in the line of succession to the throne whatsoever and this is important even when you want to use the rights of conquest. Cersei could have one, by becoming her son’s heiress in case there’s no one else left.

Also, although Sansa didn’t marry Joffrey, her wedding to Tyrion still makes her a Lannister and ties her to the enemy. Her loyalty was put to the test because of Joffrey, but her ties to the Lannisters were consolidated with Tyrion. Her arc is still in place. Her marriage wasn’t declared null so far and I don’t think it will happen anytime soon. As far as public knowledge goes, Sansa is Lady Lannister.

As for the love triangle Jon Snow x Tyrion x Arya, I don’t think it’s impossible at all. While it’s true that so far Tyrion hasn't interacted with Arya and I doubt he even remembers her face from the short time he stayed at Winterfell, the Arya he will eventually meet will be an educated young woman that had many intriguing experiences in Braavos, is very charismatic and makes friends with everyone and anyone. Tyrion, being a man profoundly affected by his physical condition would gravitate towards her. I don’t think it’s hard to imagine him falling for someone capable of seeing him as an individual as Arya is.

There’s also an argument to be made that this love triangle might have been replaced by Ramsay x Arya x Jon in some ways. After all Tyrion didn’t burn Winterfell, Ramsay did. He also married a fake Arya (Jeyne Poole) to claim Winterfell in her name, leading to a violent rivalry between Ramsay and Jon.

This plot point might have just been either altered to replace Tyrion with Ramsay, or it hasn’t happened yet.

“[The next graph is blocked out.]

But that's the second book ... 

I hope you will find some editors who are as excited about all of this as I am. Feel free to share this letter with anyone who wants to know how the story will go. 

All best,

George R.R. Martin”

With everything said so far we can conclude a few things:

1) The three major conflicts remain the same.

2) Ned, Cat, Robb, Viserys and Drogo’s fate didn’t change.

3) Bran still went through a coma and can’t walk anymore. He also developed magical abilities. An eventual strained relationship with Jon is still possible.

4) Tyrion and Sansa’s dubious loyalties to their families weren't removed from the books and Sansa still got tied to the enemy via marriage, although to a different character.

5) Tyrion continues to travel, to plot, and to play the game of thrones. He didn’t kill Joffrey, but was blamed for it anyway. Eventually he will make alliances with enemies of his house.

6) Jon joined the Night’s Watch and became Lord Commander. His vows are constantly challenged, especially when his family is endangered. His incapacity to help them keeps torturing him and in the books it leads to his death.

7) Jon and Arya share a strong bond, based on love, mutual trust and loyalty, and respect. This relationship remains one of the most important ones in the books. This relationship was consistently developed throughout the 5 books already published and turning it into a romantic one is still possible.

8) Jon’s true parentage is super relevant.

9) Daenerys’ arc didn’t change.

10) The love triangle Jon x Arya x Tyrion was either replaced by Jon x FArya x Ramsay, or could still happen in its original form once Tyrion and Arya have the chance to interact with each other.

This was my lengthy analysis of the original outline and why I think it’s still valid. I hope you enjoyed it.

[lariskapargitay]

Brienne of Tarth is Lightbringer

Daenerys Targaryen, Jon Snow and Stannis Baratheon.

All three are grey heroes in the series, one of which is the most popular character in the book and especially the show. All three are legendary figures from their respected Houses- the one true king who should have been Lord of Stormsend, the secret prince born of ice and fire, and then there is the Mother of Dragons, Mysha, Khaleesi of the Great Grass Sea, Breaker of Chains and the last (so far as we know) Dragon.

All three have been, supposedly, chosen by the Lord of Light, and all three are the leading choices for Azor Ahai with their individual weapons (dragons, a valyrian steel sword and a burning sword) acting as the legendary weapon Lightbringer.

It makes sense; the great leaders who’ve been prophesied to end the long night. One even has DRAGONS, it would be absolute folly to imagine anyone else’s from three big huge players, one of whom the series is named for whose story is so heavily linked to the Others, to act as Azor Ahai or the weapon prophesied to end the Long Night; Lightbringer.

This post isn’t to dissuade those three or others from being AA or LB, but rather to put forth a new candidate to act as the legendary metaphorical ‘sword’. Someone who was a supporting player for the second and third books, ignored in the show, and for some reason people consider boring when she finally gets a chance to shine in her own POV.

Brienne of Tarth.

The ugly girl who wants to be a knight, a noblewoman whose house isn’t a great one, who has blood ties to both the Targaryen and Baratheon dynasty and who were kings and queens in their own right once upon a time. Not much is known about House Tarth apart from their sigil, rose and azure quartered with yellow suns and white crescent moons, the name of their keep Evenfall. Their descendants were not always called ‘Tarth’ though, their family name was once ‘Evenstar’, which has been passed down to be the official title of the Lord of Tarth.

Their House seems to have a fond appreciation for the sky and all that comes from it, including naming the small little island off Tarth ‘Morne’ to stand for morning, with only House Dayne as a challenger in regards to their love and admiration for the celestial. All that to say; House Tarth values light, in all its natural forms. The sun, the moon, the stars, the morning dawn… Their sigil and title literally brings light *looks directly at the camera like I’m in the office*, and it is one of only sigils where no matter what; it cannot be killed. No matter if the Dead or Living wins the war, the sun and moon and the evenstar will rise day after day until the end of eternity. Dragons and krakens and crows and stags and direwolves and lions can be killed, but the lights in the sky can never be.

The title of Evenstar itself also has connections to Lightbringer. Lucifer means ‘Lightbringer’ and it is the Latin name for the planet Venus. Venus used to be called ‘Evenstar’, and Evenstar is, as covered above, the title of the Lord of Tarth. With Faegon attacking Tarth, it is safe to presume that Selwyn, her father, is dead and Brienne is now the Lady of Tarth making HER the Evenstar which literally, not metaphorically, makes her, Lightbringer (which is something no other contender can claim.)

Another language fact is Tarth means smoke or fog in the Welsh language. “Born amidst salt and smoke,” is a large part of the prophecy of AA & LB and Brienne, being born on an island that means smoke in the middle of a salt sea…

ACOK Davos I

“To oppose it, the hero must have a hero's blade, oh, like none that had ever been.”

AFFC Brienne I

>When she was small, her nurse filled her ears with tales of valor, regaling her with noble exploits of Ser Galladon of Morne, Florian the Fool, Prince Aemon the Dragonknight and other champions. Each man bore a famous sword, and surely Oathkeeper belonged in their company, even if she herself did not.

Brienne often thinks of Oathkeeper as a ‘magic sword’, and here she not only calls it a heroes sword, but she is humble enough not to consider herself amongst them. The sword is worthy of being a part of something great but not Brienne herself. And right after she refuses to call herself a hero, she kneels, blade in hand, and says a prayer to the Crone whose known to bring light *once again looks at the camera like I’m in the office* to help guide people who would ask for it.

>**AFFC Brienne I**

>Kneeling between the bed and wall, she held the blade and said a silent prayer to the Crone, whose golden lamp showed men the way through life. Lead me, she prayed, **LIGHT THE WAY BEFORE ME**, show me the path that leads to Sansa.

Now, onto a huge moment for Brienne, where a large bulk of this theory comes from. The dream Jaime has, the prophetic Weirwood dream where most of his prophecies have come true.

>**ACOK Davos I**

>“In this dread hour a warrior shall draw from the fire a burning sword.

>**ASOS Jaime VI**

>Brienne’s sword took flame as well, burning silvery blue. The darkness retreated a little more.

>Brienne moved her longsword back and forth, watching the silvery flames shift and shimmer.

>Then his sword went dark, and only Brienne’s burned, as the ghosts came rushing in.

Lightbringer is, in its most basic form, a burning sword. Brienne, Stannis, Thoros, Beric, Jon and Jaime are the only ones to use a burning sword. Stannis sword is proven to be a fake, Thoros uses tricks to get his sword to light on fire, and Beric had a legitimate magical burning sword but he gave up his life for Lady Stoneheart. That leaves Jon in his dream then Jaime and Brienne in Jaime’s dream.

Again, this essay is not to dissuade the other candidates, but I personally do not believe that GRRM is the type of writer to let the secret dragon prince, the just leader, the Aragorn of Westeros get the big prophecy fight in the end. Aragorn wasn’t the one to destroy the ring, it was the unsuspecting big footed hobbit who saved the day. In any case Brienne DOES carry a flaming sword she uses to fight the dead, and she is the ONLY LIGHT left in Jaime’s world and the world itself. And yes, Jon does carry a red flaming sword in his dream whereas Brienne carries a silvery blue flaming sword in Jaime’s dream, but Oathkeeper, her sword, is red and black. It’s spell forged, it’s magic, **IT COMES ALIVE IN THE SIGHT OF FIRE**.

>**ACOK Davos I**

>And that sword shall be Lightbringer, the Red Sword of Heroes.”

>**AFFC Brienne VIII**

>In the light from the firepit the red and black ripples in the blade almost seemed to move.

Let’s move on to another significant moment in Jaime’s dream is when a naked beautiful Brienne touches him.

>**ADWD Jon III**

>Therefore after Lightbringer was never cold to the touch, but warm as Nissa Nissa had been warm.

>**ASOS Jaime VI**

>She put a hand on his shoulder and he shuddered at the sudden touch. She’s warm.

Brienne is warm in his dream just as Lightbringer the sword is warm, she carries a flaming sword, she brings light, she’s the only light in the world… The dream can be interpreted in a few ways, mostly done to either prove or disprove an eventual romance between Jaime and Brienne, (I 10000% proves it does along with all the other evidence but that’s another 2000 word essay for another time.) But I believes it also offered a substantial amount of proof to my theory that Brienne is in fact Lightbringer. Melisandre even says the Lord of Light created the sun and moon and stars to assist them in ‘keeping the night at bay.’ .

>**ADWD Jon III**

>The Lord of Light made the sun and moon and stars to light our way, and gave us fire to keep the night at bay.”

Once again; let me bring back the Tarth fascination with the celestial

>**AFFC Brienne II**

>The arms of Tarth were quartered rose and azure, and bore a yellow sun and crescent moon.

>**ASOS Jaime IV**

>“I am Brienne of Tarth, daughter to Lord Selwyn the Evenstar, and sworn to House Stark even as you are.”

Brienne is the sun and moon, she is the brightest star in the sky. Yes there was a magic comet that fell for the birth of dragons but it lasted only for a while then died off. The Evenstar will always stay in the sky, as well as the sun and moon. They will always bring light.

Now, branching off into LOTR territory for a moment, Brienne is given the exact same introduction as Eowyn was when she killed the Witch-King, as ‘no man’ could kill him

>**The Return of the King, book 5, ch. 6 "The Battle of the Pelennor Fields"**

>“But no living man am I! You look upon a woman. Éowyn I am, Éomund’s daughter!”

>**ACOK Catelyn II**

>“He is no man, My Lady. That’s Brienne of Tarth, daughter to Lord Selwyn the Evenstar.”

Don’t you think there’s just the tiniest bit of coincidence that GRRM introduces Brienne using a VERY similar quote to another blonde shieldmaiden who is confused for a man right before she helps destroy the leader of a great and terrible undead army and helps save the day?

Now, all this isn’t to say she’s an absolute shoe in for Lightbringer. That’s not to say it won’t be the obvious choice and Jon and Dany or Stannis save the day and they get to rule Westeros for 100 years and they get to be the ones who tell the Hobbits they bow to no man. But what I am saying is Brienne is just as much in the running to be Lightbringer as them. And just how bards can slay dragons, and Hobbits can destroy rings; an ugly girl who wants to be a knight can most definitely be a Lightbringer.

[daeneryswhitehorse]

Dany hate throughout the years.

( This is base on a reply I made in post create by @yendany . I also want to precise that it is only my perspective of the fandom as a dany stan, other people probably have a different opinion of what was going on. )

I came in the asoiaf/got fandom in 2011, when the show first came out. I fell in love with dany on my first watch and still like her after reading the books. I started to get involved in the fandom because I wanted to learn more about her.

I didn't know tumblr at the time so I was on westeros.org. The mad queen dany theory was already a thing, mostly for the persons who didn't like that dany could be azor ahai and not one of the male character. But the forum still liked her for her baddass moments in asos or her portrayal in the first season of got.

Everything changed when adwd came out. The incels in this site really didn't liked dany having sex with daario after rejecting jorah/quentyn. They also didn't understood her plot, were tired of her staying in Essos or not interacting with main pov character. It was enough for them to think she was boring.

From then on, there were a lot of bad take of her character. Grrm wanting to talk about the consequences of her mistakes and her decision of staying in meereen was understood as dany being dumb and incompetent as a queen. People made fun of her long list of titles and thought it make her look arrogant. They claimed she was nothing without her dragon, in contrast to male character like stannis. Or not a true warrior because she spend her battle hiding in her tent, unlike stannis or jon who fight with swords. Or that she didn't car about the common people, because she try to negociate with the meereeness nobles. Most of those claimed exist to prove why character like Jon or Stannis would be azor ahai or the true king of Westeros.

After season 3 of the show came out, a lot of people were rightfully offended by the final scene with daenerys where she surf on a sea of brown people. A lot of fans start seeing Dany as a white savior in both books and show, and a lot of essay were about how how her storyline was rooted in racist orientalist ideas. If you were a person of color and still stan her, it was probably because of internalized racism.

Before this season, feminist critized the butchering of most of dany storyline, like they did with other female characters. But none was as talk about then Sansa's, because the most popular female character like Dany, Arya and Brienne were seen as the cash grab of the show. It was considered more important to defend her in particular, and liking Sansa over them was seen as resistance act against D&D misogyny.

The intellectual part of the fandom really went out of their way in defending her. They liked her because she was a gateway to the political part of the story in King's Landing and the Vale. They didn't like how some fans victim-blamed her for the abuse she suffered with the Lannister, and praised the fact she didn't end up with stockolm syndrome like Dany or Theon. "Not everyone can be an Arya" did they said, as they wanted people to acknowledged she was the more relatable point of view and how her traditional feminity shouldn't be put down. They emphasis a lot on her kindness, her emphatie, or her observational skills but and said those qualities were unique to her and are what separate her of the rest of the cast. She was the representation of humanity in this crapsack world. And after outsmarting Littlefinger would probably be rewarded with an important political position and would be one of the builder of the new world after the apocalypse.

All of this probably wasn't meant to be interprete as hate toward other female and some of the male characters, but it sure did for the Sansa stan! Who would then create their entire defense meta around putting down any character they found and upliftting her above them. Their favorite target was Arya, but you could found from time to time one on Dany. I remember someone defending Sansa innocence in trusting Cersei in the first book, by emphasing on her age and naivety, and putting down dany for not knowing mirri maz durr would get revenge on her khalassar.

Talking about Dany, the intellectual part of the fandom didn't really like her. I mean they didn't hate her, and didn't diminish her importance in the story, but she clearly wasn't a fan favorite.

There was two angle in their analysis of daenerys: the political leader and the messiah.

For the first part, they were trying to define daenerys position in the story, and came to the conclusion she was the destroyer of the old world. In their point of view, dany didn't free the slaves in asos for pure reason but because she couldn't pay for an army, and then didn't know how to build a new economy, leading to the horrors in astapor in adwd and her failure in maintaining peace in meereen. For them, Dany is unable to control her emotion and confuse revenge with justice. They also think she is an incompetent queen who make decision on a whim and never listen to her adviser. Her relationship with Daario represent her want for easy solution through war, wich she embrace at the end of adwd. When she can't remember Hazzea name, it meant innocent would die in her violent path in twow. Because of this, the expression "the path of hell is paved with good intention" became popular to define her arc from asos to beyond.

For the second part, they were clearly interressed by the mystical part of her story. Dany has a lot of prophecy around her that can be used to determined the next plotlines post adwd. For some reason, they pushed their own obssession with it on Daenerys, who they now believed is blinded by her own destiny. They claimed she think she is the hero of story and is unable to see when she does something wrong. This until she will blow up King's Landing in ados. This would push her toward her true destiny in the fight against the others where she will sacrifice herself for the greater good.

And lets not talk about the weird part of the fandom who are obssessed with deconstruction and who would only acknowledge dany as azor ahai reborn if it meant the hero is actually the true villain of the story, and the Others misunderstood victims.

2015 arrive as well as season 5 of got. This season was so controversial it manage to divided the fandom in three.

The first one were book purist who were disguted by the total butchering of affc/adwd plotline to replace them with offensive mess, and decided to stop watching the show and focus on the books. While some of them were dany friendly, they all seem to favor character like Sansa, Stannis, Brienne, the Lannisters, or the Martells. A lot of effort were put into their metas to uplift their book plotline and personality above their show counterpart.

The second part is similar to the first one, exept they didn't stop watching the show but decided to view each season through critical lense to try to understand the sexism and racism of D&D. They were mostly Sansa and Martell stan.

Both of those point of view were seen as too radical and annoying by the dudebro show apologist. Being a Martell and Sansa stan also become a sign of being a woke feminist, a book purist and a show anti.

The third part of the fandom decided that the failure of season 5 was the responsability of Grrm for not finishing his books in time, and that the show writer had run out of material and were forced to improvised. Plus the book plots were too complex and boring to be adapted, they had to simplify them. And they were also given futur plot point by Grrm that could explain some of the controversial decision this season. Like Sansa wedding with Ramsay, it was probably made because the character would end up in the North in one of the next books.

Thoses three point of view are important to understand why when the theory saying dany is a villain not a hero became more popular, dany stan were pretty isolated.

And why did this theory became more popular? Well it's a mix of all thoses perception of daenerys that I mention above but mostly because of the peoples who decided that dany in season 5 was Joffrey.02. Like I say there were people who thought that D&D were now working with futur plot point given by Grrm. And since dany storyline was read as one of a white savior, and the fandom believed Grrm can't do no wrong, and dany did some stuff this season they disapproved of, they decided it meant dany should be seen as a villain. And in a way, it manage to reconciliate the feminist anti racist and the pro D&D point of view , now united in hating daenerys. It allowed them to still trust the show, because it meant it was not D&D and grrm who were racist but dany, and it made them feel smart for having figured out this big plot point. Plus a chunk of the show!jon stan decide the parallel between them this season meant he would become the true hero of the story. Because they thought janos execution was more honorable than mossador's, and jon fight against the wight walker to defend his brothers and the free folks was contrast with dany running away on drogon.

But there were people who didn't like dany and didn't think she would become a villain. Thoses people were feminist who thought daenerys, as the face of the show, was the embodiement of D&D fake feminism responsible of the ruined of character like Sansa or the Martells. Sansa in particular because they felt the show hated traditional feminity which is something Dany was not, which was what allegedly gave her more priviledge and love by the writer and fandom. When season 6 came out, they criticized the double standard between Cersei and Dany, where the former was demonized for burning a Church and the later was celebrate for burning the khals in their holy place. Obviously, the criticism of orientalism and racism within her story didn't make her very popular with feminist.

Season 6 end, and the sansa fandom decide to ship their fav with Jon Snow. But unfortunalty for them, it was obvious that jonerys would become a thing in later season.

Now Sansa was pretty well beloved by the fandom. Like I said earlier, the intellectual part of the fandom and the sansa defense squad really went out of their way to give a better image of the character, wich was fairly popular now that show sansa had a more active role. Plus the feminist adore her!

On the other hand, daenerys was seen as either a villain in the making, or the representation of the show fake feminism and racism. At this point dany stan were considered the dumbass of the fandom.

So, what happen when the jonerys vs jonsa shipping war happen? Well the jonerys shipper were seen as the big bully who victimized the poor sansa stan. Since in their point of view, dany stan were racist people who can't read, and the sansa stan were the woke book purist. Since Sansa was the underdog unfairly hated by the dudebro of the fandom, but beloved by the intellectuals. And Dany was the popular girl who got dumb stan and is only loved by pop feminism. People were naturally more incline into believing jonsa shippers as the victime of this war.

Even when the sansa stan were saying the most heinous things about dany and other female character to prop her up. Even when they were using the villain dany theory, the dark!dany theory, the white savior theory that had now become about dany being a colonizer and imperialist, or the ableist mad queen dany theory wich they backed up by diagnosis her with all the real life disorder they hated. It was seen as normal and dany stan just can't handle criticism. Even when multiple blog were created on tumblr to hate on daenerys which had almost no equivalent for the sansa/jonsa fandom, the jonerys shippers were the bad guys.

Jonerys was made canon in season 7. The intellectual part of the fandom either accept it but thought it was a cliche uninspiring ship, or they defend it for the themes but didn't see it as a complex relationship like jaime with cersei or brienne. The feminist, particulary the one who hated house targaryen, were shocked that grrm could romantize incest. And obviously, the jonsa hated it, and there ugliness started to be notice more with the weird theory they builted, like political!jon. The Jonerys fandom were finally getting some justice.

Plus more big name essayists in the fandom started debunking of the baseless incel hate dany receive post adwd. Dany had now the right to sleep with Daario, Jorah was a creep, Dany rejected Quentyn for peace, and Drogo being Dany rapist was getting more believed by the fandom.

During the hiatus before season season 8, @rainhadaenerys wrote down a lot of meta as a defense against the worst claimed that the fandom made about Dany. It gave hoped to dany stan, but it was crushed by season 8 with D&D deciding to make the mad queen theory canon the worst way possible.

Now the feminist and the intellectual part of the fandom are both defending daenerys. But there is the dominant idea that certain event of the last season could happen in the books, like dany burning King's Landing. And the possibility of her going insane should be accepted by the dany stan, and if not, it mean we are not real asoiaf fans.

[asoiaf-source]

Fighting Hate with more Hate. That always works, right?

“Sansa’s fans are so defensive of her because of the rest of the fandom demonize her and hate her for no reason.” - helenakey

So then the answer is to demonize the other women characters for no reason?

Of course there are going to be ‘fans’ that hate on a character for no reason, I’ve seen people post unnecessary and unreasonable hate on many of the characters, not just Sansa, and they can be as annoying, but they are not representative of the entire fandom. Not ALL fans are hating on her, and some are just looking at the character critically. I’m new to the tumblr metas (avoided for a long time due to the toxic reputation), but i’ve been on ASOIAF forums for a long time and there are plenty of Sansa supporters, even if she is still quite a polarizing character due to how people wish to interpret her... but Sansa stans on tumblr take it to the next level!

I’ve never seen this side of her fans before, or at least so much nearly every day, and subsequently the many rebuttals! And how often they like throwing other characters under the bus, often for hypocritical reasons. Like the OP yendany said, they ignore the trauma in other characters or dismiss it as not as bad, when it is often much, much worse. They criticize and attack other female characters to prop up Sansa ‘better’ survival skills, or attribute qualities to her she doesn’t possess (I see this a lot in fanfiction, before I realized the self-insert aspect), or use her age as excuse when all the main characters are young or even younger than her. The line porcelain to ivory to steel... can really apply to any character that has to grow up and face the harsh realities of the world... so it is really hypocritical to think Sansa is special in some way for overcoming her situation, all the characters are going through the same struggle, and many have it much worse. That is where I think so much of the anti-sansa stans come from, the hypocrisy and the tearing down of other just as deserving of sympathy/empathy characters, especially other women characters. It is a weird juxtaposition, that anyone with a reasonable sense of objectivity can pick up on and often do.

I mostly see it done against Arya and Dany, the two more prominent female characters in the books (thus the 2 who draw more focus than #3 Sansa?). The two female characters GRRM is telling a lot of his story through and spending a large amount of the text (right from book 1) to develop their growth as characters and showcase their strengths, intelligence, determination, fortitude, agency, cleverness, resilience and so much more. It’s as if because the other women are not ‘pure’ or see themselves that way and stronger in personality and character that somehow their suffering doesn’t affect them as much because they are tougher and didn’t let anything that happened to them stop them from growing stronger. They aren’t dwelling in victim-hood too long before they pick themselves back up and move forward.

And yet, they cheer when Sansa starts to grow stronger... Sansa’s growth has been much slower, we are moving into book 6 and she is just starting to gain a bit of agency, but she is still heavily under the tutelage of Baelish. We will see how far she gains in the next book and if she will break with Baelish by the end of it and be a fully independent player. But her development isn’t nearly on the same scale as Daenerys and Arya. That isn’t to imply that she isn’t going to be important, but it is clear from the text that she is not one of the main focuses for GRRM, or he would have developed her faster and given her more to do. We will see how much ground he can cover in 1-2 books, but there is only so much he will be able to accomplish and have it be believable, especially with so many POVs and story lines that he needs to develop.

I actually think their attempts to (over) defend her backfire, as so many feel the need to point out the falsehoods and misinterpretations, especially when they are wildly mean-spirited and completely refutable by the text. As I traverse through the ASOIAF metas I often come across fans metas writing rebuttals to other posts, to ‘correct’ their conclusion or ‘facts’. I’ve read so many of these they are starting to get repetitive, I also read some of the Sansa-stan posts they are rebutting and, yeah I can see why so many get upset. If you don’t like it when others tears down or dismisses Sansa, why do you think fans of the other characters wouldn’t comment when you go after their favs, especially so mean-spiritedly.

I don’t think I ever felt so much negativity towards the Sansa character until I had to read so many skewed and biased metas turning her into some kind of saintly YA Disney princess type that is just too good for this cruel world. That kind of character has no place in a series like this. You can’t help but want to point out the wild inaccuracies, and it makes me feel a negativity towards a character I didn’t feel negative to before. And I don’t want to feel negative towards her, she is a Stark and I root for the Starks, especially the kids. I often defended her against those who (I feel) just don’t understand what it is like to be a preteen girl, I relate to a lot of Sansa’s weaknesses and how she feels, especially at that age, and that is her appeal (to me) - the fact that she starts off very weak.

Sansa is weak both physically and mentally, she cares too much about rank, privilege, and what others think about her, her desire to conform, for everything to be proper, and properly in their place. She has the luxury to think that way because she is a rich, pretty, noble girl who ranks at the top of society, of course she sees life as great and never questions it... she is already at the top and winning from birth. This is why (I think) she is so hard on Arya, she messes with her idea of what is proper/good/right.  Arya isn’t pretty and doesn’t try to be, she acts more boy than girl, she plays with dirty, smelly, poor children, etc... Those are all an embarrassment to Sansa and go against what a proper lady of her rank should do and care about. Once they head south, all the things Arya gets away with at home will stand out even more and reflect badly on Sansa, by association. So, she criticizes and distances herself even more, because she wants to join the elite glamorous world of the nobility.

The other girls don’t have those weaknesses, that is why they are seen as better able to cope than Sansa does.  They grow quicker and stronger faster because they are not as inhibited by what the ‘rules’ are. This isn’t a criticism of Sansa, this is an observation and I think it is the entire point of including a character like her in the story. GRRM could have followed the original outline for her, but he wanted to ‘reform/rescue’ her character and give her (I hope) a better path back to her family and happiness. I think it is GRRMs way to show how young girls should NOT romanticize noble life or being pretty will lead to a ‘perfect’ life. That thinking of yourself as a lady or being a princess/queen isn’t what is important. That marring a ‘title’ (lord/prince) or a handsome face is not enough to lead to happiness. It is what you do with your life, and how you care about others and who cares about you - that is what is important. But some Sansa fans seem to miss that and want her to have all those thing and more... they want it both ways, her to learn all those things, and yet still get all those things... a beautiful princess life clear of the harsh actions to gain it and also a happy family married to the best, more heroic and honorable man - a fairy tale ending. And that is not ASOIAF.

They are reducing her entire arc to becoming a nicer, more pure, and pretty, prize for a man to love, marry and make their queen. If so, GRRM will botch the ending of his series and all the points he *seems* to be making thus far.

A major theme (to me) in Sansa arc is her lack of value in her home and family. Sansa (to me) is like the small town girl who can’t wait to leave her family / Winterfell behind and to move to the big glamorous city (King’s Landing) and become royalty. But once she got there wasn’t able to accumulate with its more complicated and corrupt realities of the court. Even setting the cruelty of Joffrey aside (he is an aberration, not a normal example), how everyone else ostracizes or ignores her (except the hound, and to some extent Tyrion - although he isn’t all that great). The way the Tyrells treat her before and after her wedding is much more representative of how typical court life and nobility behaves normally (I think). Sansa never saw the true value of being surrounded by people who love and care about YOU and whom you can trust and rely upon - until that is all taken from her. She slowly sees how the people at court are corrupt and deceitful under all the beauty and glamor she so aspired to only after being fooled more than once, and (to me) no longer wants any part of it, but is forced to play, thanks to Baelish.

This is a point I find many of her fan miss, they think Sansa is going to learn to play the game, destroy everyone with her cunning and beauty and rise to the top to be queen or a ruler - a path which will ultimately lead to down a very dark and cynical path... but somehow they think Sansa will be different, and her rise will be more like a Disney princess story, one where she will gain power without having to sink low to do it. That is NOT the kind of book GRRM is writing.

”I’ll make them love me.” - another childish statement, you can’t make people love you, you earn love and respect. And Sansa hasn’t done that once the entire series, she hasn’t made a single friend. No one is looking to follow or fight for/beside Sansa, save Baelish, and we all know that plan is doomed to fail, as he isn’t to be trusted or relied upon and wants to use her. I would even question her friendship with Jeyne Poole as it is clear she never saw them as equals, and that is not real friendship... more like Jeyne was a companion/lady-in-waiting type.

The few people who care about her (other than family) either are working on behalf of an oath to Catelyn, or have their own ambitions/sexual desires/pity for her and not necessarily care about her for herself because she was a good and loyal friend to them. Maybe this will change in the next book, but with Baelish keeping close tabs and guiding her, who knows how well she will be able to make any genuine relationships with others given all the secrets she has to keep.

Her only realistic path to leadership is through marriage and that is hardly giving her agency as a heroic rise to a leader of a men... more like sleeping her way to the top.  Not something I want for Sansa, and I hope her ‘marriage’ to Tyrion works as plot armor against her being used like that.

Besides GRRM has kinda stressed that ‘real’ leadership comes from understanding people, observation, and experience, and not just from strategics marriage (Margaery, Cersei) or inheritance (Joffrey, Tommen, Cersei - she could prove the point all on her own :). Every leader in the book so far has to make compromises, make hard decisions and even make harsh, sometimes very bad decisions and live with those consequences. None of the characters in the series have escaped this as much as Sansa has, since so much of her story thus far is about her lack of agency, and being a pawn used by others (and to some extent she still is with Baelish). For her to make it to the end w/o doing anything and staying ‘pure’ and that is how she ends up on top, by essentially not taking many large personal risks, allowing others to do all the heavy lifting morally, mentally and physically. If winning means standing on the sidelines watching everyone else do the WORK, and just giving suggestive nudges here and there to have things turn out in your favor so you can just coast to the top (that is the Baelish way)... well, that is kinda the worst message GRRM could leave us with.

If GRRM wants Sansa to become a leader, she will have to get her hands dirty too, she will have to take great personal risks to gain power and accept the consequences good or bad that result, learn from them and move forward... otherwise it defeats one of the main points of his series and turns her into a simplistic cliche version of a character.  Every character with a POV has gone through this, it is one of the major themes in ASOIAF, a more realistic, less easy way of looking at how you obtain power and learn by experience and a series of victories and defeats. Thus far Sansa has also avoided examining her actions and how they have affected her, she either never thinks about them, changes the facts to suit her better, or blames others without seeing the part she also played... I’m not blaming her, but her action did contribute to the situation... she never seems to realize this and I feel it is going to eventually hit her hard, she has to mature and grow out of her ‘unreliable narrator’ eventually, and it must lead to something for GRRM to make it such a large part of her narrative of coping with her trauma. I assume he wrote her this way for a reason and is going to do something with it.

I’m looking forward to a darker more realistic Sansa who has more agency and understanding, and I expect her to make her own mistakes and moral compromises (well she already has, but there was some coercion - but it also means she is capable of doing so) just like all the other POVs have had to do. I also look forward to her finally owning up to her past actions and how they also contributed to where she is now. If she can’t take some personal responsibility she will never grow. That is a part of having agency, understanding how your decisions and actions affect you and others.

I wish all the back and forth would stop, cause I’m tired of seeing it in my feeds, but I guess it has been going on for years - the same arguments/rebuttals - so I guess it will continue, even after we get the next book... I think only the completion of the entire series will end some of these arguments, but who knows - after some of the meta I’ve read, there will probably be even more, lol.

Well, I wanted to comment and give my two cents, but it ended up being longer and I guess for me all this is still new and offsetting.  I guess I had more to say that I thought, even though I edited A LOT out because I wanted to keep it focused. I’ve just started to dip my toes into this crazy platform, so I’m sure this is just the tip of the toxic metas that I heard can be found here... can’t wait to read the anti-dany metas... that is sure to fill me with a sad rage as well, i know the show did her no favors, sigh....

[kellyvela]

I just saw a post and i quote-

"When A Song (Arya) of Ice (Jon) and Fire (Daenerys) meet up, then you will see"

😂😂 i cant tell, how funny this is lmao...

1) Arya's name is not pronounced Aria like #they desparately want it to be, all music like and flowery, its Ar-ya, a harsh sounding name like a knife

2) Sansa's name ALSO has musical connotations as sanza is a thumb piano. In fact it has more merit being a stand-in for 'song' since it is a softer, more pretty name than Arya's and Sansa is also the one associated with songs the most

(i am not the one who said this about Arya and Sansa's names, it is George R.R. Martin)

3) Jon is not just ice, he is ice and fire both. Otherwise there is no purpose of Rhaegar being his father

4) if Daenerys is fire too, her ice is the White Walkers, not Jon

(again, I am not the one saying this, it is writer himself)

Imagine being this delusional and wrong on all front, I--

But I am glad, they are slowly exposing themselves that key 5 bullshit is just to exclude Sansa because they don't really care about Bran and Tyrion lmao.

LOL Anon . . . .

Yeah, I'm familiar with thouse quotes about the Stark sisters names:

The names Arya and Sansa are meant to represent the polar opposites of their characters, Arya being a hard sounding name, Sansa a softer more pretty name, etc. —GRRM

Arya, I say it ar-ya, two syllables, not three, not a-ri-a, like an operatic thing, but Arya, very sharp. I wanted something that was like a knife, that was sharp and hard sound, to be a contrast to the flowery Sansa. —GRRM

And about the ice and fire thing that many people believe represents Jon and his aunt, that's a pretty cursory interpretation, not only because GRRM himself said the White Walkers are the ice and aunty and her pets are the fire, but he also said that the title's meaning has many layers, a primary, a secondary, a tertiary meaning, etc. At most, when someone asked about Jon and aunty being the characters most associated with those elements, GRRM said that that was a way to interpret it.

But just think about this very telling fact: The supposed words that GRRM told to Alan Taylor (one of GOT's directors) about Jon and aunty being "the ice and fire", "the point of the story", are not featured in So Spake Martin, the legit source for anything that the author has said about Asoiaf over the years. Alan Taylor gave multiples interviews during GOT's S7 about what GRRM told him about Jon and aunty during the filming of S1 in Malta, and he even repeated those words in some behind the scenes DVD stuff or something, and none of these is featured in the main source of GRRM's words about Asoiaf. And I wonder: Why??? Why none of Alan Taylor's "reports" is featured in So Spake Martin, like many others fan reports of their talking, correspondace, encounters, Q&A, etc, with GRRM about Asoiaf???

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Thanks for your message!

[redbeanboi]

'Fire and Ice’: Parallels Between Jon Snow and Giorno Giovanna (Part 2 of ?)

While I’m taking a quick break from writing—let me get back into this. I’ve been re-reading parts of AGOT, and... I’ve found a lot of material that I want to use for this section.

First post can be found here.

Warnings: Extended Spoilers ahead for JJBA: Vento Aureo and ASoIaF.

I’ve discussed Ambitions and Childhood, but I haven’t talked about Personality.... Most especially the uncanny, bizarre charisma these two possess. 

Giorno and Jon are quiet and keep to themselves. They’re also very very bad at setting good first impressions. 

Before Jon is allowed to take his vows, he has to train in the yard at Castle Black with the other recruits. And... as expected of Lord Stark’s “bastard,” Jon—the teenager who lived in a castle and was trained by knights—is able to beat these fellow recruits (untrained, lowly born kids) singlehandedly and even breaks someone’s wrist because sparring with them is just child’s play to him. 

“They’re not my brothers,” Jon snapped. “They hate me because I’m better than they are.” 

“No. They hate you because you act like you’re better than they are. They look at you and see a castle-bred bastard who thinks he’s a lordling.” The armorer leaned close. “You’re no lordling. Remember that. You’re a Snow, not a Stark. You’re a bastard and a bully.” 

“A bully?” Jon almost choked on the word. The accusation was so unjust it took his breath away. “They were the ones who came after me. Four of them.” 

“Four that you’ve humiliated in the yard. Four who are probably afraid of you. I’ve watched you fight. It’s not training with you. Put a good edge on your sword, and they’d be dead meat; you know it, I know it, they know it. You leave them nothing. You shame them. Does that make you proud?”

— A Game of Thrones, Jon III

Not exactly making a splendid figure for himself as a recruit for the Night’s Watch.

Luckily for him, that scolding from Donal Noye leads Jon to reflect on the error of his ways and ultimately drives Jon to apologize and make friends with his new brothers. In good spirit, Jon offers to help them train and even makes them laugh, and would you look at that—everyone’s warming up to him!

Others were gathering around and looking at him curiously. Jon noticed Grenn a few feet away. A thick woolen bandage was wrapped around one hand. He looked anxious and uncomfortable, not menacing at all. Jon went to him. Grenn edged backward and put up his hands. “Stay away from me now, you bastard.” 

Jon smiled at him. “I’m sorry about your wrist. Robb used the same move on me once, only with a wooden blade. It hurt like seven hells, but yours must be worse. Look, if you want, I can show you how to defend that.” 

Alliser Thorne overheard him. “Lord Snow wants to take my place now.” He sneered. “I’d have an easier time teaching a wolf to juggle than you will training this aurochs.” 

“I’ll take that wager, Ser Alliser,” Jon said. “I’d love to see Ghost juggle.” 

Jon heard Grenn suck in his breath, shocked. Silence fell. 

Then Tyrion Lannister guffawed. Three of the black brothers joined in from a nearby table. The laughter spread up and down the benches, until even the cooks joined in. The birds stirred in the rafters, and finally even Grenn began to chuckle.

—A Game of Thrones, Jon III

Giorno on the other hand is just... He’s quiet and the other guys probably only feel unsettled by his sudden appearance (this is my interpretation of course, I know people just love the idea of an evil and manipulative Giorno) in Chapter 456.

They’re in a dangerous line of work and having some stranger join—and inevitably disrupt the existing dynamics on their team—is not a prospect they welcome wholeheartedly. It’s only because of Bruno’s endorsement that they kind of suck it up. 

But... not before trying to pull a prank on the unsuspecting new guy.

Pictured above: Four people who could not give a flying f*ck about welcoming the new guy.

Pictured above: Same four guys who are proceeding to ignore their new teammate.

Pictured above: Same four guys trying to pull a sneaky one.

Giorno finally catches the drift and sees that he’ll have to put in a little more effort if he wants to be taken seriously around here... 

And for some reason that means drinking the piss-tea. But sure, he “turned his tooth into a jellyfish.” Of course you did, dear Giorno.

Protagonists rising above their peers’ expectations is a trope you see throughout a lot of Shounen manga. Naruto is one that comes to mind, but there’s tons, and you even see it in Phantom Blood with Jonathan. This same device is present in VA with Giorno, who does it again and again. 

And just as Jon manages to impress the recruits (and even some of the sworn brothers), Giorno manages to turn the tables around and impress Bruno’s team. And this is not a solitary event. If anything, these few pages are only the beginning, and you see throughout VA that Giorno continues to earn their trust and admiration. 

This arc also applies to Jon, who goes from very unpopular bully to a leader (and eventually Lord Commander of the entire Watch) as the series progresses. He and Giorno have a knack for winning people over, and it’s precisely why people look to them for leadership. When things take a turn for the worst during the attack on Castle Black, everyone turns to Jon for guidance. Jon won their trust and they’re ready to follow his commands.

Giorno, on the other hand, does not have many solo fights, but his presence and influence are very evident when his teammates are despairing. One arc that comes to mind is the Talking Head arc. Narancia is able to keep moving because of Giorno. Giorno’s stand literally gives life to inanimate objects, and just as Gold Experience gives life force to everyday knickknacks, Giorno is able to inspire and breathe new life into his teammates. Charisma is a central trait to both of these characters and it’s one of their most notable traits—probably one of the traits that distinguishes them as leaders, too. Hm. 👀

—————

A/N: I actually have some stuff about Aragorn that I wanted to add (because Jon Snow is DEFINITELY GRRM’s version of Aragorn and our dear Estel has to also deal with rising above expectations and whatnot in LOTR), but uh.... seeing that this is about Jon and Giorno, I left it out. Let me know if you’re interested in seeing those additions to this meta. 

Edit on 06/23/20 — Changed the title to the meta because I remembered this old post I made.

[fedonciadale]

I read an article about a recent GRRM interview where it’s states that D*anerys fans believe from what he has said that she won’t die or turn MQ. What do you think?

Hi there!

This was an article in a German newspaper, and you can find the post here.

I would say, that the interview gives no reason to doubt that Daenerys will burn King’s Landing in the books as well and that she will die. She never became a Mad Queen though, powerhungry, yes, ruthless conqueror, yes, but not mad. Her actions followed a very specific logic, there is nothing “raving mad” about it.

Here is what GRRM said:

People know an ending – but not THE ending.

So, yes, the show is an adaptation:

So you can chose the version that you personally like the best. Changes are inevitable in this process. Even if the adaption is as faithful to the literary source material as it was the case with “Game of Thrones”.

The usual example GRRM takes to show how different movies and books can be is Scarlett O’Hara from ‘Gone with the wind’, and the fact, that she had three children in the book and only one in the movie. In this interview he also talks about the very different versions of Andersen’s mermaid and the Disney Arielle. Still, he sees “Game of Thrones” as a faithful adaption!

If you take the Scarlett O’Hara example I would even argue that the question of her children is not very important for her arc. I mean it is more realistic in the book, that she would get pregnant from all her husbands in an age without contraception, but apart from that? The only impact the children have on the story is the death of Bonnie and that happens in movie and books. The ending is still the same: Scarlett realises too late that she loves Rhett and they seperate.

As for the mermaid example. The general outlay is the same. The mermaid can only become human if she receives human love, and one story is the sad and melancholic take on that and the other is the hopeful.

So, I would argue that this specific interview does not point towards Daenerys’ arc being different in the book, not at all.

I have no doubt about that. Actually I think that the show ending possibly cuts close enough to the truth: GRRM is and has been very vague about the differences between show and books, and he only ever is clear on one thing: That there are many minor characters in the books, who didn’t make it on screen and whose story has an immense impact on the story (*cough, *cough).

I happen to differ in that regard. Sry, not sry, I am into this story because of the Starks, and to me all the side plots GRRM put in in AFFC and ADWD do not really capture my interest.  It is my interpretation that the show really cut to the bone of the story (and certainly shattered some of the bones in the process) and that of course the books will be more fleshed out.

That does not change the fact, that Daenerys going dark and becoming an antagonist (as stated in the Original outline, as hinted at in the title, as prepared in numerous arc ans foreshadowings) is part of the spine of the story.

Like Scarlett and Rhett seperating, like the love of a man being crucial for the salvation of the mermaid, DarkDaenerys is one of the centres of the story, and GRRM is not going to change that in the last two books. He’s said it before. He decided that he doesn’t care that some of his fans guessed the right ending, because he doesn’t want to waste his foreshadowings - and it would be a waste, and I hate people who make a plot twist, just because someone guessed where the story would go.....

Thanks for the ask!

[rainhadaenerys]

Here's what I've seen so far about James Hibberd's book, Fire Cannot Kill a Dragon (fuck you for choosing this title).

GRRM talked about what everyone is assuming are the three "holy shit" moments that D&D had talked about:

(talking about the 2013 meeting with D&D) It wasn’t easy for me. I didn’t want to give away my books. It’s not easy to talk about the end of my books. Every character has a different end. I told them who would be on the Iron Throne, and I told them some big twists like Hodor and “hold the door,” and Stannis’s decision to burn his daughter. We didn’t get to everybody by any means. Especially the minor characters, who may have very different endings.

So there's no mention of "Mad Queen Dany" or "Dany burning King's Landing". Sure, one could argue that GRRM is just mentioning a few examples and not saying everything, that Mad Queen Dany could still be one of the twists. But I find it unlikely that he would list all major twists (who sits on the Iron Throne, that Stannis burns Shireen, and what happens to Hodor) and NOT list Mad Queen Dany or Dany burning King's Landing, both being supposed major twists. GRRM even goes on to explain how the circumstances of Stannis burning Shireen and the Hodor twist will be different in the books (click in the link for details). If Dany burning King's Landing was a book plot point, be it on purpose or burning King's Landing accidentally, I would expect GRRM to say something similar, like "I told them that King's Landing would be burned by Dany, but it will be different, it will be an accident, blah, blah". I might be wrong here, maybe GRRM didn't mention this just because he didn't want to mention, but let me have my hope.

Also, he says he told D&D who would sit on the Iron Throne, but he doesn't explain if D&D actually were faithful to what he told them. Again, this is probably wishful thinking on my part, but maybe this could mean that it's not Bran (I sure hope it's not, because it makes no damned sense for Bran to sit on the Iron Throne).

I also don't understand what GRRM means with "It’s not easy to talk about the end of my books. Every character has a different end". Does he mean that in the books, no character will have the same ending that the others have? I mean, that's pretty obvious, every character in every book usually has different endings from each other. Or does he mean that every character in the show has a different ending from the ending that they have in the books? I saw one post on reddit that suggested this second interpretation, and they added this quote from Benioff to show that this could be the case:

DAVID BENIOFF: We don't get bonus points for being strictly faithful to the books. It doesn't give us anything extra. For every decision there is a fork in the road and the fork to the left is adhering strictly to the books and to the right is what's better for the series, we're always going to take that path to the right.

Maybe D&D did change a ton of stuff, if this is what Benioff is saying. So with GRRM's and Benioff's comments I'm going to keep hoping that Dany survives.

About Dany's ending specifically, apparently GRRM didn't directly say anything. What I found on reddit about Dany's "dark road" was this:

After lists Dany watched Viserys die, killed slavers, threated Qarth, and burnt Tarly, the book says:

Over the years, producers sometimes gave Clarke notes about how to play a moment, nudging the character toward her tyrannical destiny.EMILIA CLARKE: There was a number of times I was like, “Why are you giving me that note?” While I am quite consistently a “How can I help?” kind of person, there were a few moments where I was like, “Don’t tell me what to do with my girl. I know what to do!” It’s like Daenerys’s calling card became cold expressionlessness. I always wanted to infuse that with some humanity because no one’s consistently that. I would sometimes fight back a little: “I get that she has to be steely and unforgiving and a powerful force. But in this moment she’s also a goddamn human being. So I’m going to give you that and I really pray that you take that in the edit.”

Remember when Emilia said that she was given notes on how to play Dany and that she thought these notes must have been the ones building up to Dany's "turn"? Well, here she clarifies that said notes were simply to play Dany as "stoic" and "ice queen". So it doesn't seem to me that these notes were to build up "dark Dany", it seems simply that these notes just show how D&D never understood Dany's character (because anyone who has read the books know that Dany is warm and playful), and that they wanted Emilia to follow the "Ice Queen" stereotype. It had nothing to do with "setting up dark Dany" in my opinion.

The other thing I've seen about Dany was just this really dumb comment by Cogman:

BRYAN COGMAN (co-executive producer): In our minds, we thought the Randyll Tarly scene was disturbing. The I watched it with a crowd of people at a freind's house and they were cheering. Weirdly, the audience didn't care. They loved Dany.

So they really expected us to accept Dany's turn just because "Dany watched Viserys die, killed slavers, threatened Qarth, and burnt the Tarlys". This is what the book mentions as "setting up" Dany's turn. Not reacting when her abuser that just threatened to kill her and her baby is killed. Killing slavers to free slaves. Making an empty threat in a desperate attempt to save her people from starvation. Killing two traitors, something that everyone does in this medieval world. This was their justification.

So this is what I've seen so far about the book. Apparently, James Hibberd will do an AMA on r/asoiaf tomorrow, so maybe we'll find out more things. Also, if anyone knows something else I didn't include, please let me know!

[always-l-o-v-e]

Proposing a Proposal: Why the Idea Works, But Not in the Way You May Think – A Review of GoT Redirection

In 8x01, “Winterfell”, we had a scene where Davos, Tyrion, and Varys are observing Jon and Dany from the battlements of Winterfell.

Davos: “The Northmen are loyal to Jon Snow not to [Daenerys] her. They don’t know her. The Free Folk don’t know her. I’ve been up here a while and I’m telling you they’re as stubborn as goats. You want their loyalty, you have to earn it.”

Tyrion: “I sense that you’re leading to a proposal.”

Davos: “A proposal is what I’m proposing. On the off chance that we survive the Night King, what if the Seven Kingdoms, for once in their whole shit-history, were ruled by a just woman and an honorable man?”

Varys claims, “Nothing lasts.” However, beyond his point, GoT has a history of teasing possible marriages only to skew these relationships into something else. This kind of redirection has been shown multiple times in the series, for better and for worse. It is through marriage that the strongest relationship between two individuals and their respective houses is created. Here are some examples to date:

Brandon Stark & Catelyn Tully --> Ned Stark & Catelyn Tully (for security)

             - Catelyn deeply loved Brandon and they were engaged to be wed up until his death by the hands of the Mad King. To maintain the alliance between House Tully and House Stark, Catelyn was promised to Brandon’s brother, Ned, and although they did not love each other at the time they were married, they grew to. As Catelyn said, they built their love “stone by stone”. Ned and Cat’s relationship remains the healthiest we have seen thus far on the entire show.

Cersei Lannister & Rhaegar Targaryen --> Cersei Lannister & Robert Baretheon (for power via Tywin Lannister)

             - Cersei was enamored with Prince Rhaegar since she was a little girl and dreamed of marrying him in hopes of becoming his queen, but instead, Rhaegar married Elia Martell and he was later killed by Robert Baratheon during the Rebellion. Tywin would then marry Cersei off to Robert, the new king, and we all know how that turned out.

Lyanna Stark & Robert Baratheon --> Lyanna Stark & Rhaegar Targaryen (for love)

             - Lyanna was promised to Robert prior to the Rebellion. She was renowned as a wild beauty with a kind heart, but even she would not overlook Robert’s adulterous ways: “Love is sweet, dearest Ned, but it cannot change a man's nature.” Based on the show’s interpretation, Lyanna and Rhaegar truly loved each other and ran away to be wed in secret, after Rhaegar annulled his marriage to Elia. Lyanna would die from childbirth just after bringing Aegon Targaryen VI (AKA Jon Snow) into the world, whom Ned Stark swore to keep safe. Her apparent kidnapping at the hands of the Targaryen prince was the match that started the flames of Robert’s Rebellion and the rest is history.

Robb Stark & Roslin Frey --> Robb Stark & Talisa (for love)

             - THE RED WEDDING. Need I say more?

Sansa Stark & Loras Tyrell --> Sansa Stark & Tyrion Lannister (for power via Tywin Lannister)

             - With the pending doom of Robb’s fall from power, Sansa becomes identified as the new “key to the North”. In season 3, Lady Olenna Tyrell and Varys discuss marrying Sansa to Loras to strengthen House Tyrell’s seat of power and to prevent Littlefinger from whisking Sansa away for himself. But before any of this can occur, Tywin swoops in and has Tyrion marry Sansa instead as their heir would inherit Casterly Rock and Winterfell, further strengthening House Lannister’s influence.  Then, THE PURPLE WEDDING.

Jon Snow & Daenerys Targaryen --> ? (for ?)

             - The show has mentioned a possible marriage between Jon and Dany twice now: once by Littlefinger and again by Davos. And the unification would have been favorable had Jon Snow remained the respected Northern bastard everyone else thought he was, but he isn’t. He never was. He is Aegon Targaryen VI, son of Prince Rhaegar and Lady Lyanna Stark, apparent heir to the Iron Throne. When the Northern lords find out Jon is a Targaryen, they will be furious. But when they find out he’s a Targaryen who bent the knee to another Targaryen, because he loves her, and said-Targaryen desires to rule the Seven Kingdoms, which includes the North, the lords will be relentless. 

Whether you like it or not, whether it’s fair or not, the show has reiterated this fact to us time-and-time again: The North is very prejudiced against the Targaryens.

The North remembers. They remember the Mad King. They remember Rickard and Brandon being burned alive. They remember their beloved Lyanna being “kidnapped”. They remember Aegon the Conqueror, the subjugation endured under his reign, and having to give up their independence.  

Even Lord Royce, who isn’t Northern, said a Targaryen cannot be trusted.

They will consider Jon’s parentage a betrayal to the North and may even accuse him of giving the North to Daenerys because he’s a Targaryen. They will question his Northern roots, despite the fact that he is still very much half-Stark.

Jon and Dany’s union would be one the North would never accept and it would deepen the rift between House Targaryen and the North even further.

What is the best way to mitigate discord? Marriage, of course. But to who?

THEORY: Jon Snow & Daenerys Targaryen --> Jon Snow & Sansa Stark (for security)

             - Now, I know many of you are thinking “Wait, aren’t they cousins?” Yes, they are, and so were Tywin and Joanna Lannister, among others. It’s odd, I get it, but it makes the most sense. Sansa Stark, as the Lady of Winterfell, holds the most powerful seat in the North along with having the support of two other Great Houses in House Tully (Riverrun – Uncle Edmure) and House Arryn (The Vale – Sweet Robin). A union with Jon would secure four out of the six Great Houses remaining, except for Lannister. Possibly even five out of the six depending on where the Greyjoys stand after the war; we know Theon supports Sansa, but Yara would have to declare for them too. This is Game of Thrones we’re talking about, where power comes from the spread of influence, and the show has purposefully set up House Stark to have, possibly, the greatest influence over what is left of the Seven Kingdoms. Jon and Sansa’s union would be one for security, similar to Ned and Cat: it would be able to shield Jon from the Northern prejudice and keep the Stark Pack together. There are also underlying threads of poetic justice here: Robert’s Rebellion began over the convergence of a Stark and a Targaryen, and The Great War would end with the convergence of a Stark and a Targaryen. Not to mention threads of irony: A Targaryen ends up marrying someone he thought was his sister, but is actually his cousin, and Sansa grew up dreaming she would marry a prince and was betrothed to Joffrey (actually bastard, not a prince), only to end up marrying Jon (actually a prince, not a bastard). Davos’ words still hold true in this case too. The Seven Kingdoms would be ruled by a just woman and an honorable man. Sansa is pragmatic and Jon is a natural-born leader; a healthy balance of what it takes to rule. Whether they rule from the Iron Throne or maintain an independent North, Stark loyalty is fierce and anyone under their protection would thrive.

It’s rumored the final book of the series was going to be titled “A Time for Wolves”.

This story started with the Starks. I see no better way to end it.

I know some of you may ask, where does that leave Dany? Truth be told, I don’t know. I just hope that, wherever they take her character, it’s somewhere compelling, memorable, and epic, because she deserves that. Daario once called her a conqueror. In a perfect world, I imagine she, Arya, and Drogon go off to discover what’s west of Westeros.

A/N: Friendly reminder this is just a theory in regards to a possible ending to GoT! It is not meant to demean, judge, or bash any of the characters mentioned above. GRRM spent nearly 30 years crafting characters with such depth and even if you don’t agree with their philosophy or ways of doing things, I think you should still respect them as they are and all the work that has gone into developing them. Keep the comments section peaceful. Let’s enjoy the next 5 weeks to come. I’m sure we’ll all cry together once it’s over.