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theoriginalbylergod · 1 year ago

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Mike Wheeler is important and there's nothing wrong with analyzing him

Since y'all wanna be insufferable bitches about it I'm gonna explain to you why he's important, why Will loves him, why his struggles should be acknowledged, and why his character depth is pivotal to byler endgame being a satisfying conclusion for both Mike AND Will. Deal with it!

We are not seeing smoke where there isn't a flame. We are seeing smoke where there is a literal fucking forest fire.

Starting off with something a lot of people aren't ready for but I've seen more people talking about: Mike is the main character of s1 at the very least. He is the character that brings us into the world of stranger things. He is the character that the writers chose for this. Mike is the main character of s1 and it was an instant hit. The writers love Mike. Contrary to popular belief, giving a character an arc where they are struggling and their behavior changes from what is normal for the character we know and love does NOT mean the writers hate that character. It means they deliberately chose to give that character complexity and depth. Your inability to like characters that do anything wrong ever is not the fault of the writers. Your decision to act as if a character is not important is not reflective of the actual narrative because it in fact is in direct opposition to the narrative. So just to be clear, if you genuinely believe that Mike isn't important, or that the writers hate him, or don't care about him, or that his story "takes away" from any other character's - ESPECIALLY WILL'S - you are simply wrong.

In s1 and s2 Mike is established as an extremely caring person. He's loving, loyal, brave, intelligent, and trying his best. He is also established to be hot headed, someone who speaks without thinking quite often, someone who is capable of hurting his friends despite that being the last thing he wants to do. He is all of these things and more. He is a human. He is a kid. So in s3, when suddenly he is entirely different, it is completely logical to assume that there is a reason for that. He did not just wake up one day and decide he wanted to be an asshole, push Will away, make his friends feel abandoned, and echo the same sentiments their bullies held. Something is happening with him. He has so much going on in his head and it is painfully obvious. He's holding something in, he's hiding from everyone and from himself. We see glimpses of what he's trying to hide after Will calls him out on his behavior. Will gets through to him. Mike is usually unresponsive to tough love, except for when it's coming from Will. After their fight, it is obvious that he's trying to be better. But he still doesn't wanna face certain things, and he doesn't know how to navigate that. Because he's 13 years old.

There is a reason for all of that internal conflict. There is a reason it comes pouring out of him at certain times. He's crumbling. He is quite literally falling apart because he's holding on to too much. It's not a stretch to assume that, it just takes basic media literacy. Why would the writers have Mike act this way if he was just supposed to be a one dimensional character? Why would Finn be directed to portray Mike the way he does if there was nothing more going on? There are times where Mike looks like he's in physical pain because of his internal conflict. There is a reason for that. And acknowledging that DOES NOT mean people are taking away from Will. That's the most idiotic thing I have ever heard. Do y'all seriously not understand that more than one character can have emotionally complex storylines? Genuinely asking, is this a new concept for you?

Will's love for Mike

Will is head over heels in love with Mike. That is very much established. So when you're dismissing the emotional depth of Mike's individual arc because you think acknowledging it "takes away from Will" you are actually diminishing the significance of a huge aspect of Will's emotional arc. By taking away the significance of Mike, you take away from the significance of Will.

Let's do a quick recap of the very significant role Mike has played in Will's entire life:

Mike is Will's first friend.

They have grown up together and it can be assumed that they've reached important milestones together.

Mike has always been a safe person for Will. He's been a constant in Will's very chaotic and unfair life. Until the summer of '85, Mike had always been something good in Will's life. (That's not to say he is no longer something good, but it can be assumed that the summer of '85 is the first time Mike has been a causal factor in Will's unhappiness)

When Will went missing, Mike did not hesitate to search for him. It wasn't even a question of if. The moment he knew Will was missing he knew exactly what he'd be doing that night. He spearheaded the search amongst the party. He was the leader.

When Will came back, Mike was the only person that didn't treat him like he was gonna break. He cared for him, and he was there for him, but he didn't treat him differently; Will tells us as much. Which means we can infer that the way Mike was with Will in s2 - how gentle and loving he was - was nothing new. He had just always been like that.

When Will was possessed, Mike stayed by his side. Even when it was scary, even when it could've gotten him killed, he stayed. Because once again, for him, it wasn't even a question. That's just where he knew he needed to be. He was in the shed when they were trying to get through to Will. He was set apart from Lucas and Dustin, but he also wasn't equated to family. And his retelling of the story of the day they first met was the final push Will needed to find a way to communicate.

After a year of things being "weird" between them, Mike tells Will that he didn't deserve to be treated the way he had been. Mike tells him that he wants them to be okay again, and for the rest of the season he puts in the work.

Things get rough in s3, and at the beginning of s4, and despite all of that, Will confesses his love (albeit veiled). In a moment where Mike is feeling awful about himself, he tells him that he loves him and needs him, and he tells him why. And to him it doesn't matter that he's breaking his own heart to do it, because it's Mike. Mike, who makes him feel like he's not a mistake at all, and that he's better for being different. For Will, there was no other option. The person he loves was hurting and he knew how to help, and so he did.

Mike is the first person Will tells about Vecna still being alive. Because they're back to being a team. He knows he can trust Mike, and Mike seems to be very determined to prove him right.

SO.

These are all real and canon aspects of Mike's presence in Will's life. Will falling in love with Mike isn't something that just happened for no reason. Will fell in love with Mike because of who Mike is. When you acknowledge that, and when you acknowledge the reasons they've set out for why Will loves him - the reasons Will literally told us - you can better understand Will. But when you dismiss all of these things about Mike, you are dismissing a large portion of Will's emotional and romantic arc. You aren't being a Will Warrior. You are erasing so much of him and his feelings and his lived experience. That is not the hill you wanna die on.

Will loves a person. Not a feeling. Yes, he says that Mike makes him feel like he's not a mistake and that he's better for being different. But that's not why he loves him. He feels that way because he loves him.

Mike is a fully fleshed out character with his own feelings and struggles and fears and traumas and motivations. He's not a plot device. He's not just an accessory to Will's arc. He's not a character that was written only to be Will's love interest. He's Will's love interest because he's Mike.

If Mike didn't matter, and if Mike didn't play a significant role in byler, then they would be able to write in a love interest for Will in s5 and have it be somewhat satisfying. But they can't do that. Will's love for Mike has so much depth because Mike has so much depth. It is genuinely crazy that this has to be stated and that I have to back up this claim because it is simply a canon fact.

So yes, the rain fight affects Mike's character development and his involvement in it is important. Yes, the van scene literally could not exist without Mike and therefore his involvement in it is incredibly important. Yes, every single byler moment has an impact on Mike, and Mike has an impact on it because they are BYLER moments. Yes, Mike will have a lot of significant moments - with Will AND on his own - in s5 because his arc deserves and needs as much attention as Will's in order to execute byler endgame in a satisfying way.

No, none of these facts negate Will's importance or take away from his story. If anything, they add to it because Mike and Will's arcs are corresponding and intertwined.

Mike's struggles

To name a few

Dysfunctional family

Has been bullied his entire life

Extreme self worth issues

Inferiority complex

Hero complex

Lack of self preservation

Suicidal ideation (has been on display since SEASON ONE)

Internalized homophobia

To get this out of the way: Mike's internalized homophobia is allowed to be discussed. Discussion of it is not the dismissal of Will's internalized homophobia. Surprise surprise, two queer kids in the 80s have internalized homophobia! Who'd'a thunk it?! Their internalized homophobia presents in different ways but it is there for both of them. I personally relate to the way Mike's is portrayed way more than I relate to Will's. So why is it that we can't discuss it without being accused of erasing Will's experience? Or without people saying that we're "copy and pasting" Will's story? Because quite frankly, that feels dismissive of my - and likely many others' - real and lived experience. So please for the love of all things that are good just stop with this talking point because it will never hold up.

Moving on

I'm not gonna do a full breakdown of all of Mike's issues. Because contrary to popular belief, there are a lot. And that would be exhausting and I'd get carried away and it's not the point of this post. The point of this post is to defend the acknowledgement and mere existence of them.

If you're a byler that for some reason thinks Mike only exists to be Will's love interest and his trophy as compensation for his trauma, let me ask you this: Have you considered how awful it would be to have a queer character's individuality and emotional depth completely ignored for the sake of focusing on the queer character that "really matters"?

If Mike's own issues, with his queer identity and otherwise, aren't thoroughly explored... What's the point of all this? If Mike really is insignificant in this storyline and his individuality has no effect on it.. where's the emotional payoff? If his perspective doesn't matter... Why have the writers gone to such great lengths to ensure we don't have that piece of the puzzle yet?

Analyzing Mike and understanding Mike is very important to understanding byler. Once again, I think it's crazy that this needs to be said.

I also think it's important to note that characters can have similar struggles. There's no rule against that. Just like real life. Characters having similar struggles is not a bad thing, and acknowledging that their struggles are similar is not dismissive of either character. We're talking about STRANGER THINGS. Jonathan and Nancy's thing is "we've got shared trauma". They have literal matching scars. Shared experiences are some of the main building blocks for this show's romances. Byler has a TON of shared experience, basically their entire lives. We already know that. So wouldn't it be so beautiful for them to learn that they've been struggling with the same thing this whole time? That the entire time they felt alone in what they were going through when really they had each other and they never even knew it? Wouldn't it be so beautiful for Mike's acceptance of Will and Will's love for him was also a step toward accepting himself? Wouldn't it be beautiful for Will to learn that his love makes Mike feel like he's not a mistake? None of that would be in the realm of possibility if Mike didn't have emotional depth and if his individuality wasn't important.

And that leads me to my concluding point...

A satisfying execution of byler endgame hinges on Mike's individual emotional arc being handled well

God I hope this isn't controversial to say. I sincerely hope most people haven't forgotten that.

Here's a hypothetical:

Imagine season five has been released. You're watching it, and you notice that Mike has been relegated to just a supporting character for Will. We don't get any of his perspective. We don't get any explanation for his s3 and early s4 behavior. His breakup with El doesn't have any real tangible effect on him, it's really just used for El's character development. We never see him pining for Will like we saw Will pining for him. And then suddenly Mike is learning about the painting and then suddenly he's confessing his love and then suddenly byler is canon and official.

Now wouldn't that just be awful? Wouldn't that be unfair to the audience, to Mike, and to Will? For us to never learn just how much Mike had to go through to even be able to say it out loud? For Mike to never get the chance to prove to himself through word and action that he is the heart? For Will to never get an explanation for why things did get so "weird" between them? It would leave us with one big, nagging question: What was the point of everything Mike has said and done throughout the entire show if his conclusion is that lackluster?

Disregarding Mike for a moment (I know that's incredibly ironic given what the entire point of this is but just bear with me) - how would that be a satisfying conclusion for Will? I mean, Will's s4 arc was basically dedicated to showcasing his struggle with his sexuality and with his love for Mike. We were shown just how deep that love is. We were shown how patient, unselfish, unwavering, and beautiful that love is. So how would it be satisfying for Mike's love for him to not be shown with just as much depth? How would it be satisfying for Mike to just be a one dimensional character whose s5 arc is essentially "break up with girlfriend, wait to find out best friend is in love with him, say he loves him back, then they live happily ever after"? I think Will deserves for his love to be returned with the same intensity at which he gives it. And I think it should be clear to the audience and to Will himself.

Back to Mike!

Mike has been through so much shit. I don't think anyone that is denying that actually believes he hasn't been through shit. Because you'd actually have to watch the show on mute and with your eyes closed to think this kid hasn't had just the worst time. It's so ignorant to act as if this stuff hasn't affected him. There's stuff we've seen but there's stuff we also haven't seen. There are issues he has that date back to his childhood pre-canon. Just like Will, Mike has been a queer kid growing up in 80s smalltown conservative america. Acknowledging the pain he 100% carries because of that is so important. His perspective has been withheld from us, not because it's unimportant, but because it's the final puzzle piece. If we had Mike's perspective in s4, byler wouldn't be a "will they won't they" (even though we all know they will). If we got his perspective in s4, byler would be a "100% certain without a doubt they will". But the thing about his perspective is that it's so much more than just loving Will. It's fear. It's pain. It's insecurity. It's doubt. It's the belief that his happiness just doesn't matter all that much. All of that has to be explored. All of that has to be laid out in the open for us in order for byler endgame to feel earned. Mike's emotional payoff will lead to byler's emotional payoff.

Mike has known he loves Will. In s5 we will see him make a deliberate and active effort to overcome the things keeping him from doing something about it. And then he will do something about it.

And so when it finally happens. When both Mike and Will finally know that their feelings are requited, and when their arcs end with us knowing that they will face whatever life has in store for them together, that will feel earned. That will feel like the logical conclusion for both of them. Not just for Mike. Not just for Will. For both.

And Mike is just as important to that conclusion as Will is.

And one last thing...

Some people are going to talk about Mike more. Some people are going to talk about Will more. Because newsflash, people have preferences. Some people just relate to Mike more, or they find his emotional arc extremely compelling, or they just like him. It isn't an attack on Will or any other character. No one is saying Mike is more important than any other character (I'm sure there are people that say that but they are a vocal minority and they are simply wrong). We are just saying that he is important. If you wanna engage in media analysis, please understand that "main character" or "central character" does not mean "only important character" and "only character that should be analyzed". If you wanna talk about Will and only Will, that's fine. But you don't get to act like people that talk about other characters are doing a disservice to your fave, because that's not how any of this works.

#mike defenders i need you to back me up on this #i hope my points come across well #anyway #the way people have been talking about mike lately is so infuriating #its called BYLER analysis because its the analysis of BYLER the ship involving will AND mike #st fandom consistently proving that they have absolutely no idea how fandom works #its almost like people wanna talk about things they care about and you dont get to tell them to shut up #if you dont wanna see people talking about mike you can just mute tags about him #but if you dont wanna talk about mike youre missing a huge part of the byler puzzle and thats your loss #please just let people discuss whatever they want to discuss as long as its not ACTUALLY harmful #sometimes i think y'all are allergic to fun #byler #mike wheeler #mike wheeler analysis #will byers #< this is about him too #byler analysis #byler endgame #stranger things

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dykedvonte · 3 months ago

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Mini rant below and in the tags, the only time I’ll talk about this and my personal take on it.

The way people talk about hypothetical male Anya on Twitter and the idea of how Mouthwashing would play out if the genders were swapped makes me remember how people still don’t take sexual assault and rape with male victims with the same gravity, especially when the perpetrator is female.

#not even gonna tag this cause I don’t want to start discourse in the tags but you can absolutely still explore the concepts of patriarchy #toxic masculinity misogyny and rape culture if the genders where swapped #like those concepts don’t disappear just because Anya is a boy now cause you have to think of all the ways it applies to male victims and #I just don’t understand why people keep getting angry when people facilitate different discussion the game opens you up to #like yes I get the frustration with not seeing the conversations you want but start them go find them why complain on other posts when #people are bringing attention to similar issues and the ways they are overlooked dismissed or blame the victim #I for one think we should have more basic clarifying conversations of SA rape cultures and how toxic masculinity and sexism create scenarios #like the Tulpar and enable men like Jimmy but I also can understand and enjoy the topic being expanded upon to include other cases on a #flipped scale like yes how male centered the fandom is is annoying considering the topic but seeing comments saying that SA isn’t as harmful #to men cause they can’t get pregnant is a whole can of worms you really need to unpack cause holy shit #like in this scenario if Jimmy is pregnant and can’t get rid of the baby Anya is the father yes Jimmy is pregnant but that’s because in this #swap she assaulted a man lied to either say it was consensual he forced himself on her or like canon panicked and semi admitted to forcing #him either way he is afraid to do anything because men do get blamed for defending themselves against women in these situations not to #mention the shaming that occurs because he is a man and should step up for the kids sake and likely be told he should be proud a girl wanted #him that much like yes you have to explain it more but bodily autonomy in this scenario is just as nuanced and I can’t believe I have to #defend something being male centered in a game where the rape of a woman is the catalyst just because people are saying SA for men #is not as damaging or degrading or harmful to autonomy as it is to a woman like how can you want conversations on rape culture and shut down #people bringing up other nuances in the conversation #like people are gonna jump around with it I know but if you only want to talk about one thing stay in that sphere like I just don’t get #going to another space especially one that isn’t even being weird or toxic and starting shit cause you don’t like it like the amount of #unnecessary and mean comments on normal art of think pieces I’ve seen on Twitter is crazy like it’s stupid callout shit for the sake of just #not liking something like I’m seeing so much screen shotting and vague posting like just at the bitch and fight about it like it’s still a #relatively small fandom ur just asking for in fighting on like the few things we shouldn’t have to worry about #as a victim my self and who has been in other situations and being afab I just can’t understand the vitriol toward this sort of discussion #mouthwashing #actually I will tag this cause you can explore the themes in mouthwashing still stop being freaks and just block bitches ong

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loveromeo1641 · 10 months ago

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I recently reinstalled tiktok and GOD it was such a jumpscare remembering how god awful the tiktok tdlosk fandom was compared to tumblr. Like jesus christ why is everyone so negative and shitty all the fucking time, do they not get like exhausted from it

#“saiki is aro/ace so if you ship him with anyone youre a terrible awful person” have you ever experienced joy in your life #“*insert ship here* is such a terrible ship i dont know why anyone would like it” have you ever experienced happiness #anyway this post was prompt by me seeing someone complain about the saiki x satou ship saying its terrible and bad #like girl its not that serious #if you dont like it you can just scroll away?????#i seriously dont understand why people cant just live and let live #being negative all the time about fandom stuff is so fucking awful #it must be exhausting #saiki k #tdlosk #the disastrous life of saiki k.#saiki no psi nan #im too lazy to tag

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spacekatdet · 2 months ago

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Already seen victim blaming on xitter 👍 Lets not do that and lets leave the hermits alone. Make up your own minds on if you should support Iskall. But I feel like if one of his VH team members leaving for differing morals, the hermits going back 6 plus years to remove him from thumbnails and titles, and removing him from the site and merch should be enough Doc even said they can't talk about it which could mean anything, including something legal. Mumbo said there were no minors invovled but doesn't mean others weren't since there ARE victims Just leave the hermits be, and let the victims decide if they want to come out. And stop victim blaming lmao

#hermitcraft #drama #tagging it that tho its not drama and serious #Let the hermits have time to get through this too #as someone who has something like this happen and wasn't given that its not fun just leave them be #never got how that was so hard to do #sit back and wait but if they can't or won't talk about it accept that #I'm not going to talk about this #there is basically nothing out about it only things I've seen #you decide what you want to do #guess those people who wanted him out got what they wanted lol #I don't like people thinking it might be less of an issue cause stress left too jsut makes me hmm more #but not my monkies not my circus #Just needed a little venty vent cause I'm already seeing the same thing I went through and what I seen in the wc fandom happening #like stop demanding the hermits share #also stop saying but his mental health #mine is in a ditch on the side of the road and my friends have terrible mental health too and none of us ever acted out #🤷#dunno might delete this later #you can be upset just don't make it about YOU yknow

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elllteo · 2 months ago

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gonna be real seeing you boil down someone else's concerns abt making light of a rapist in media as fandom drama really hurts as someone who's experienced that kind of violence first hand. the character is fictional and obviously doesnt exist. but rape victims do exist and we see when people sexualize or joke about predators. idk. i don't intend to tell you what to do, but i hope this helps maybe explain why someone else could've been startled or upset to see that on your blog. its your space you can do what you want with it. i think some media doesn't need to be fandomized or treated as yaoi fodder. maybe it can just be taken seriously and discussed with respect. i think its pretty reasonable for victims of particular types of violence to express discomfort or concern when people joke about or make light of those who perpetrate it.

I genuinely get where you are coming from, I do. But what that ask was getting at did not convey to me what you seem to have taken from it.

There's a difference between making light of/mocking/making jokes about sexual assault/rape vs drawing a character who does those things in a narrative in an unserious way. Likewise, I feel that boiling down the narrative to just be about that One Act in many, many ways does a disservice to the narrative and characters as a whole.

I'm also not understanding where exactly this is coming from, to be entirely honest.

A person can be fully capable of breaking down and analyzing Jimmy in a way that is entirely respectful while still, also, making light of other aspects or enjoying him removed from that context. Drawing a character in a goofy way doesn't mean the person is making light of Anya's SA, or even excusing it. You can ship two characters while still finding the canon actions of one absolutely despicable. These things are not mutually exclusive!

Just as you're not telling me what to do, I'm not saying you, or that other anon, or anyone else has to put up with seeing that character or engaging with media that portrays him that way, to be clear. I'm not trying to tell you that your feelings or hurt or experiences aren't valid, they clearly and very much are.

But it's not my job, or even obligation, to protect you from it. Or any other trigger, for that matter. I do what I can with tags, but that's a courtesy I try to apply when and where I can.

That's what I'm getting at here. I tagged for him and that ship so others could avoid it if they found it upsetting. The anon did not do that, so I explained my stance.

People will engage with media in ways that are upsetting to you, or ways that even disgust you. I can't stop them, I make no plans to, and if my opinions or behaviors around this are upsetting or disappointing to you, if I endanger you or anyone by behaving this way, it is in your best interest to block me and have a safer and less stressful experience online. Those tools are readily available for that very reason.

I know far too many others who have also experienced that kind of violence, family included. I know the frustration and hurt of making light of that kind of thing, and how it can and does impact others.

But this is not that.

If, however, you feel it is, that's your right! I can't tell you how to engage with anything, nor do I intend to. I cannot change my space to fit your needs, and I'm genuinely sorry if that makes you feel unsafe or upset. I'm not trying to make light SA or the victims thereof.

I'm trying to, as best as I can, explain that policing how others engage with a fandom and its characters simply does not and cannot work. That isn't "fandom drama" - it's the psychology of humans and the media they connect with. Humans are complicated creatures, and our needs and interests vary wildly.

There is no monolithic way to demand others engage with a source material, and attempting to do so does more harm to you than that effort is worth. I hope you and that other anon can have a less upsetting day/night/etc - again, I'm sorry if this is frustrating to hear, but I fear this is an impasse we simply won't agree on in this way.

#asks #anon #i have slept for 3 hours so i hope this makes sense #im not passing judgement on jimmy other than that guy fucking sucks #however please remember that. I didn't make that art. and you have no context about the person who did #for all you know people making art in that way do so bc they cant handle the heavier aspects #there are people who do that as a way to avoid their own triggers for the same reasons you treat it seriously #victims do not only ever have one way to cope or connect with these things #all you can do is protect yourself as carefully as you can #if you need extra tags on anything with him genuinely let me know! i will add them!#im not actively in that fandom and I barely use tumblr FOR fandom #idk the tagging etiquette for it #also if you know me off anon you are free to nudge me or have a better discussion abt this in DMs #im genuinely not trying to make light of it. i just dont see where that came across in that way so I feel our perspectives arent aligned #answers #rape mention #SA mention

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fountainpenguin · 8 months ago

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Things that happened in Martyn & Cleo Double Life canon:

Cleo hoping to find her soulmate and start a life with them

Cleo dumping Martyn without giving him a chance to explain his side of the story, but hearing him out when he comes to her later

Martyn watching Cleo through his spyglass and telling the audience she seems safe and happy even though he thinks it's weird she's outside at night

Martyn, after he's had time to consider how he wants to play this, spinning a story about trying to be a provider for her and Cleo explaining that she wanted him, not things

Cleo not being remotely impressed by the "I was providing" sob story, lol

Martyn calling Cleo selfish for choosing to be with Scott because she's supposed to be HIS soulmate and he wants a partner

Cleo willing to forgive Martyn if he meets them halfway

Martyn refusing to meet them halfway because he doesn't think he did anything wrong

Martyn screaming about how Cleo's building bridges with Scott but "When will she think about mending our bridges???"

Martyn explaining to Cleo that he doesn't understand why his Session 1 actions bothered them

Martyn centering his character arc and roleplay on trying to win Cleo back without actually apologizing

Cleo giving Martyn a flower and stating that if he loses it, she'll be real cross with him

Cleo chasing Martyn out of her yard because he tried to put an HOA sign on her base and she wanted to make it clear that she wasn't associated with them and their hate for his base (even though she does think his heart base is strange)

Martyn attacking Cleo after she said attacking is a form of affection to her

Cleo setting boundaries with Martyn and explaining what he can do to get her back

Cleo sighing when Scar set her up on a date with Martyn, but taking the chance to talk to him instead of walking out

Cleo genuinely wanting Martyn in her alliance

Martyn and Cleo giggling constantly when they chat

Scar asking if Martyn wanted him to play a romantic music disc for him and Cleo (and Martyn getting excited and saying yes)

Martyn offering to take Cleo's armor and weapons to the deep dark so he can enchant them and bring them back while she stays safe

Cleo gifting Martyn diamonds, expecting nothing in return but not wanting him to die from lack of a good sword

Martyn and Cleo forming a secret alliance that allows Cleo to live with Scott while being on good terms with Martyn

Martyn expressing frustration that Cleo wants to keep this alliance secret because he wants them to be public allies; Cleo softly shushes him when people approach and might overhear

Martyn telling Cleo that she's putting out a lot of mixed signals because she keeps reeling him in and then pushing him away, claiming he is very confused about where he stands with her

Martyn teasing Cleo by punching her off a cliff and accidentally killing her and feeling so bad about it that he apologizes profusely despite roleplaying as someone who refused to apologize for Session 1

Martyn and Cleo immediately threatening Bdubs together when he said hi to them while they were hanging out, sdkfj

Martyn genuinely apologizing to Pearl for dumping her after Session 1

Martyn hiding under Cleo's bed while she defends him from an enderman attack

Cleo offering to let Martyn move into her house after Etho and Joel grief his base; Martyn saying he might take her up on that

Cleo and Martyn agreeing to move out and base together at Box

Cleo trusting Martyn with the location and resources of her red life base

Martyn rushing to Cleo's aid in the deep dark and trying to turn everyone against him instead

Cleo responding to Martyn's panicked shouts for her to eat by opening her inventory to get food (and drowning because she forgot she was in water)

Cleo hanging back and letting Martyn attack Scott while she does nothing to stop him from doing so, implying as much as she likes Scott, she won't kill Martyn (and herself) for him (and/or she trusted Scott to handle himself even though he ran away while Martyn was shooting at him)

Things that did not happen:

Cleo unwilling to forgive Martyn or consider being his friend and partner

Martyn and Cleo hating each other

Thank you for coming to my TED Talk

#Listen. listen. I understand. but consider... them #Zombiewood #ZombieCleo #Martyn InTheLittleWood #Limited Life canon: Cleo making Martyn godfather to her kids #I 100% support everyone taking their own interpretations from the episodes-#but I often see ''Martyn and Cleo hate each other'' and I wonder ''Did we even watch the same thing?''#and with so many POVs that only see them from the outside perhaps we did not!! So consider... them. Let's rotate them <3 #This post is about the sheer amount of 'Martyn dumps Cleo for Ren' fics tagged Martyn/Cleo vs. minimal affectionate fics. help??#also fics where Martyn/Mumbo was canon but Martyn claims he was never attracted to him- only Ren?? Fascinating.#sir can the whole plot be about that because hold up I feel like we should unpack your loveless marriage before you date Ren #I will 100% read a story about you charging into marriage with Mumbo and then going ''Uh I just made a big mistake.'' hilarious #I mean I'm not Ren but if my crush confessed he never loved his husband in the first place I feel like I'd have Questions #To each their own! And I for one greatly enjoy how much Martyn will chase Cleo without humbling himself. lol. idiot. get wrecked.#but just to be clear I am a huge fan of break-up 'fics and choosing to be with someone you want. ergo my interest in Grian/BigB #This post is about Martyn/Cleo and Grian/BigB being fandom rarepairs despite having canon interest in each other #which is 100% fine because everyone should write what they want but!! Come rotate them with me because they are so fun and silly #Grian the man who deliberately cuts comments about Grian/Scar and Martyn/Mumbo from his vids but pursues BigB?? hilarious #In-universe this man went from ''Romance? I do not see it'' to ''Actually I want the cute cookie man'' and took the leap??#Yes king tell me more about this journey of self-discovery. I am aspec-beam'ing you.#Anyway. Need more Martyn/Cleo in my life which is why I'm writing fics of that and other people write fics about what they like <3 #but sometimes people don't like it when I pair Martyn and Cleo because ''They hate each other'' and I laugh sfdlkj

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chilfucked · 5 months ago

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okay hear me out

i know that i’ve got a wip for a man eating plants fic (sexual. chil is the only character) in the works right now

but what if i worked on chil stuck in a chest instead

#that one’s like dubcon leaning noncon #with the reader as the perpetrator #and i don’t know how people feel about that #but like #i dunno #he’d be into it pretty quickly if that helps #it’s the nature of stuck fics unfortunately but like #it’s so hot dude what can i say #honestly i’m torn between who should be stuck in the chest #i kinda wanna do two versions and have the reader stuck in one of them #also for him stuck i was gonna try my hand at an amab reader #partially becuase amab doesn’t get as much rep in fandom #but also i wanna fill his ass ya know #but for reader stuck i’d probably do afab #i’m rambling now anyway thoughts?#no tags on this one the future folks don’t get to see this one

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tossball-stick · 2 months ago

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everyones freaking out over the brothers thing, but they state that they arent actually related, and the term brother for men youre unrelated to has a long homoerotic history. especially during the victorian period, of which piltover is inspired by. you guys dont need canon reasons to ship things, you can ignore canon thats fine to do. regardless, here is another reason you all can ship the yaoi brothers guilt free: they arent actually brothers, therefor you can ship them.

like seriously guys please for the love of god stop acting like you arent allowed to think differently than the show creators and game writers. there is so much LoL lore that im rewriting for myself because it doesnt matter. you can do whatever you want forever, and also riot doesnt care about the games lore whatsoever. even if there are people working on it with love, riot is just forcing another fucking rewrite of all of it. so who cares

this isnt even to mention the fact that the show itself loves to compare and contrast familial and romantic love; the show loves paralleling vi and jinx (familial) to vander and silco (romantic; also!! they call each other brothers!!!! the show itself uses brother as a homoerotic term of endearment!!! you can too), as well as making vi's two choices be between family and romance, with jinx jealous of caitlynn 'replacing' her. again, we are seeing the emphasis of how familial and romantic love are intertwined with each other. like, ultimately this should be its own post, but im trying to make my point here:

jayvik is purposefully vague about its status om whether its romantic or familial love. you can interpret it however you like, thats no sin. what IS the sin is that riot games (allegedly) has a history of doing this with their characters. there are many more instances of LoL characters that are clearly intended to have gay vibes with others of the same gender, but they cant just outright confirm that. fucking. udyr and lee sin come to mind as blatant examples of this, they have extremely gay vibes and lore and dialogue (they even love to be nebulously fused like jayvik), but have no actual word on their relationship. they could genuinely just be really good bros, or they could be gay! its up to you.

in conclusion, if youre letting this stop you from shipping fictional characters: stop it! get some help! have some creativity of your own and make things up that may seem out of character. thats the point of fandom- have fun with it. if youre scared about something not being canon, i have something i regret to tell you: none of your interpretations of either of these characters is anything close to canon!! nobodys is!! theyre our interpretations, so do whats most fun!!

#jayvik #<- i am never going to make another post in this tag hut i am in the fucking trenches over here #'im so sad i cant ship jayvik!!' why not is there a cop breathing down your neck #otherwise i cant see a reason why you need to stop shipping them just because christian linke got offended that jayce might be queer #he admitted he self inserts with the character at points. he just doesnt wanna be seen as gay himself guys #you can ignore this insecure weirdo. he holds no say over things #that last jayce image is included to accurately portray my mental while watching everyone freak out over what one fuckin guy says #who cares. it doesnt seem like many people like him anyway #uuurrggh okay this sat in the drafts for a couple hours and i debated over posting abiut it but variety is the spice of life #ill microdose on participating in big fandom

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qcomicsy · 9 months ago

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Lately I've only been wishing to grab a comic about my favorite character and just have a genuinely good time reading it.

#I can't remember the last time I took a Deadpool comic and genuinely had a good time about it #I hate the direction they took with his character and it's so disrespectful that I don't even talk about I don't even think *any* Deadpool #fan genuinely talk about it because were so tired of his kids characterization we all just collectively decided to ignore whatever hell #marvel through at him #but rant aside #it's just–#I am not sure if comic books are fun anymore I don't even know who I am making content for half of the people on my notes haven't touched #comic book and aren't pretending to do so #people who read the comics tend to be so mean or bitter about it that even if you follow most will be angry about something #comic or fan related and I don't know if I can blame them but following that is draining #and as much as I was trying to be a good sport about it you make a post about comic book characters and #and the overwhelming response is 'I don't read the comics but'– following up by a take about them that doesn't even recognize any core #aspect of their personality that you can't even grasp you can't even recognize them #you can't recognize them on tue cannon you can't recognize them on the fannon #and no matter how engaging you try to make content about the fandom people just–*refuse* to read it. And then– they *refuse* to tag fannon #content as fannon #and *refuse* to leave either #Yes we are all having fun but how can a character tag be so so filled with people who have no idea of who they are #how can a character can be properly loved and take care of and have content that respect them if no one makes any attempt to *know them*#and it's disheartening because *comics* are supposed to be fun *fannon are supposed to be fun*#but for aome reason it's really *really* hard to have fun here anymore #I created this page to share my love for the characters I care about and see more content of people who care about them too #but I can't even *find* people who care about them any more and when I do they're all so angry and upset– And I *cant even blame them*#I just... I don't know why I am doing this anymore or for who I am doing this anymore #sorry to vent but it's been a while since I haven't been had a genuinely good time™ enjoying comics #I don't think even people who write those comics enjoy those comics or care about those characters #Sometimes feels like everyone is projecting on those characters rather than *writing about them*. And I can't find them anymore #fanfics used to be about love petters to characters who you love #nowadays seems like a competition to see who makes more funny words with tropes pre-written since 2007 #vent

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dollypopup · 10 months ago

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y'all can all cancel me (again) for this, but if there's even a SHRED of 'who should I pick?' from Penelope in season 3, I am tuning out SO fast because like. . .sorry not sorry, there IS no choice. Debling is some crusty OC suitor she barely even knows and Colin is a man who she has been so supposedly in love with to the point where she'd ruin her entire family's reputation to have a potential love story with him. Penelope and Colin have background, years of knowing each other, intimacy that few people in the Ton can boast of having (letters, conversations about purpose, fights and arguments and makeups) and her and Debling have. . .a dance or two at a ball because he's a rebound for Penelope's broken heart. he means nothing. he has no nuance, he has no weight to the story, he is such an afterthought to me. either I wanna see Penelope going 'you know what? I don't even LIKE this dude. he's. . .fine, but I don't care about him even a shred as much as I care about Colin' or the INSTANT Colin's like 'you know what? we should get married' if it's not an immediate 'say less, you're already my husband, try returning me without the receipt, Debling whomst?' then I don't want it!

like. . .it's just so frustrating to see all the 'I hope Debling sweeps her off her feet and she rejects Colin's proposal and she makes him work for it and and and-' nonsense from the fandom and it's always tagged and no matter how many times I block it, it just keeps popping up. I go into the Polin tag for POLIN. I don't give a SHIT about a male love interest other than Colin. Not one. Not a shred. Not an iota.

and also. . .Debling has the 'benefit' of not having depth, or character traits, or HISTORY, so peeps can project onto him however they want, but I'm calling it now, there is NOTHING he could do or be that would make me like him more than Colin. Colin will always hit different, and I will always love him more. and if Pen's not on that same page? lol bye

you want me to believe Penelope and Colin are soulmates and it's romance for her to hem and haw about how difficult a decision it is for her to marry a stranger who knows barely anything about her. . .

when Marina was out here dropping banger lines like 'You were the only man with which I could see myself being happy' and 'I do not care about any of these men, where is Colin?'? like hello??? and she wasn't even fully in love with him!!!! but we'll demonize her until the cows come home in our fandom and make her the villain in Polin's love story for DARING to get in between Polin, yet Debling, a white man, is a darling dear perfect prince for getting in between Polin? existing in our fandom solely so Penelope can be like 'lol, Colin ain't shit, let me entertain any and everyone else'?

if that's the direction it goes then, ten toes down and on my mama, she doesn't deserve Colin and she can move because I'm on my way to court him my damn self

and that's that on that

#you know what? lol it's been a bit since i've posted a controversial opinion #tagging it #polin #sorry not sorry i ship polin. . .so i wanna see. . .polin. . .and i'm getting damn sick and tired #of all the bullshit pen/oc pen/other dude theories and stories in the polin tag #and i don't want polin to lose screentime over a frankly bleh male oc #you can't change my mind #if i don't see at least marina's 'you've seen him with the little bridgertons!' level of squee and 'i only want to talk to colin'#levels of devotion then i don't fucking WANT IT!!!!!#yeah definitely try out the marriage market #realize that NO ONE has a good time on the marriage market #try to get over him w/ whomstever #but then be like 'i don't even LIKE this dude where's colin i miss him' about it!!!!!#because otherwise i am not here #i am asleep #and i am courting colin in your place pen #i'm coming for your man #anti debling #if debling has 100 haters i am one of them if he has 10 haters i'm one of them if he has 1 hater i am the hater if he has 0 haters i'm dead #it's incredibly obvious that 'pebling' is half rooted in a revenge storyline fueled by anger at Colin and his complexity #and half a projection of wanting Penelope to have 'choices' because she is a representation and manifestation of the fans themselves #and so people think an OC that can be 'perfect' for them- whoops I mean Pen (because he doesn't have any real depth or interest)#he's a cardboard cutout we can throw whatever you want onto #so we can make him 'perfect' instead of the much more meaningful storyline of pen and colin both being messy and loving each other more #and part of it is bitterness over Polin not being insta-love #which. . .if it was i wouldn't like them as much as i do #anyways y'all ain't slick #and it's fucking WEIRD to be in a fandom that's like 'i ship this couple but i hope she gets with ANYONE else'#maybe you. . .don't ship the couple??#like. . .to the point of wanting her necklace to be from debling. . .and her wearing it everywhere??? WHAT??

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