#dog whistle for misogynists

[nerdsandqueens]

Anyone complaining about Mythal's design just like people complained about Mystra's design is a dog whistle.

Blocked. Blocked. And Blocked.

[jlf23tumble]

lmaoo are you really pulling the fucking misogyny card here as well?? it's creepy for a 30 year old guy to date a 22 year old, there can be a huge power imbalance in a relationship like that... she's my age and i know multiple girls who had their life completely fucked over by a guy that much older than them, men take advantage of women that much younger than them, when they're that young especially..and if it was the other way around it would be just as bad, someone in their early 20s is barely an adult, trust me i know... nothing about pointing that out is misogynistic..i really don't get your opinion on stuff, it's really fucking contradictory a lot of the time and you don't even realize it, everything is misogyny to you

[ixzotica]

RANDOM THINGS I'VE SCRIPTED THAT YOU MAY WANNA TOO took these out of my rules page in my script bcuz i'm too lazy to be creative rn but i still wanted to post something for y'all LMAO divider credits ♡

i never get scammed.

i know how to do cpr properly.

the world is less dull and dreary.

nobody ever succeeds in copying me.

kissing never feels awkward or weird for me.

there are way less racist/notsee dog whistles.

i can never lose any of my senses (e.g., sight, hearing, taste, etc.)

i always time my jokes correctly and people always laugh at them.

i always know the ages of characters even if they're not specified (because i'm TIRED.)

animals and bugs never piss, spit, snot, shit, throw up, or jizz on me or my belongings.

all fatphobic people end up being fat and struggle hard to lose the weight if they even try to (you will become what you hate.)

while on a plane, i still have service while my phone is on airplane mode and it doesn't affect the airplane or lines or whatever in any way.

i never center men or constantly seek male validation/attention. like if i get it for the right reasons then cool or whatever but i don’t really care.

i know how to roast people really well without bringing up stuff that’s like detrimental or very sensitive unless i fully intend to and it's absolutely deserved.

all men that make racist, homophobic, pedophilic, misogynistic, or any sort of derogatory jokes end up alone and sad until the end of their days. no one will ever love them or be there for them when they die.

anti-shifter, proship/profic, ageplay, pro ana, bigot/incel, and any variation dni

[genderkoolaid]

Hi. You always post a lot of info so I'm wondering if you might be able to help me. Is there a difference between radfems and TERFs? Are they both bad? If so, why are they bad? Are there any dog whistles to look out for when it comes to these groups? Please ignore this if it makes you uncomfortable. I've seen a lot of people pointing out that they're bad, but never really saying why. I want to make sure I follow intersectional feminism and not those groups.

Radical feminism is the name of a branch of feminism. It originally got its name because it advocated for extreme changes to society to address female oppression, but developed into a specific worldview which I (off the top of my head) would define by certain traits:

Oppositional sexism. Men and women (or "males" and "females") are fundamentally opposed. Oftentimes this is bioessentialist, arguing that this opposite comes from biology, but it may also be framed as a political necessity; a radfem might argue that gender and sex are fake BUT we need male vs female as political identities in order to identify our "allies" and "enemies". Regardless, males and females are physically distinct and political enemies. You can tell a man from a woman, either from their body or their behavior, the two categories cannot overlap, and no other gender/sex-labels are relevant.

Fatalistic perspectives on patriarchy. Not only are males and females opposed, but this cannot be changed. This may be bioessentialist (the opposition comes from something in our nature, which cannot change) or gender-essentialist (the opposition comes from socialization which occurs as a child due to outside pressure and/or internal gender identity, and cannot change.) Focus is not placed on an ideal future where men and women are equals and social partners. Instead, there is a sense that there is no way to truly have a society with men and women where males do not oppress females, or try to. Sometimes this is more implicit and other times you have people who explicitly believe in creating & enforcing female-only societies.

Misogyny as the source of all oppression, or at least the most important & the one people should identity themselves as before anything else. Those who call themselves intersectional generally only really care about other issues to the extent that they affect women in some way. Part of the downfall of the original radical feminists was the fact that the dominant groups were upper-class white women, who ignored racism and classism and silenced poor women & women of color, insisting that anti-racist and anti-classist action distracted from The Movement & that calling out other women's bigotry was anti-feminist.

A general suspicion of sexual desire and sex, often expressing itself as whorephobia (anti-sex work) and anti-kink attitudes, specifically under the argument that they are inherently misogynistic and abusive. Sex is associated with men and maleness, which again, are inherently the enemy. Sex WITH men, or with a person or object that could be construed as male, is especially bad.

The impetus to make your personal life As Feminist As Possible– "The personal is political." That isn't a bad slogan on its own (it's true), but with radical feminists it expresses itself as a high standard of Radfemmaxing. You should be celibate if you are attracted to men, or become a political lesbian, you shouldn't be masculine OR feminine (anti-butch & femme sentiment), you should reject makeup and shaving, you should cut off male relatives and even abort male fetuses– and you must identify with womanhood and femaleness, while rejecting any identity related to manhood and maleness. It's not just that you should examine your desires and choices and question why you feel the way you feel (again, this is a good thing). Radfems have the belief that they already know the correct answer to that Introspection, and if you come to any other conclusion than theirs (I like wearing makeup because it's fun, I want to be a man because it fits me), then it's taken as proof you are still brainwashed.

TERFS are trans-exclusive radfems. They believe that being trans is not real, or at least not healthy or an acceptable feminist stance. TERFs tend to use the language of "sex" and "males vs females." Many use the term "gender critical," meaning they see gender as fake and damaging, while sex is real and the proper platform for feminist analysis. I once saw a TERF define her stance as "it's not degrading because its feminine, its feminine because its degrading." They believe in things like autogynophilia and rapid onset gender dysphoria, and attribute transgender identity with sexual trauma, internalized homophobia and internalized misogyny.

TIRFs are trans inclusive. They believe that transgender feelings are natural and should be listened to and followed, and that feminism should take gender identity into account. However, they still have a "male vs female" worldview. They may argue that transgender men's internal gender feelings led them to internalize male socialization, while trans women internalized female socialization, meaning that all trans people's experiences with gender and misogyny align most with cis people who share their gender identity.

In both cases, anti-nonbinary exorsexism and intersexism are unavoidable. TERFs will label intersex people as "males/females with a disorder" and attribute nonbinary identity either to internalized misogyny (FTX) or to avoid being held accountable for male privilege (MTX). TIRFs similarly fail to acknowledge how someone's socialization can be affected by intersexism. MTX people are either trans women in denial or flamboyant cis men; FTX people are either trans men avoiding their privilege, or cis women avoiding their privilege*.

Not everyone who uses radical feminist arguments or shares the general perspective openly identified as radfem. There are many "cryptos" who purposefully obscure their political identity to spread radfem ideas in queer & feminist spaces. Other people adopt the general ideas of radical feminism without consciously identifying as one, because of cryptos and how pop feminism often adopts their flashier ideas. So it's important to understand these qualities as on a scale, with some versions being more subtle while others are explicit.

Radical feminism always reduces trans experiences (& experiences in general) to a simple, uncrossable binary, based either in gender or sex. Nuance and cros- or non-binary gender experiences are seen as anti-feminist and aligned with the patriarchy, if not part of a targeted plan to hurt feminist movements.

*the idea of "AFAB privilege" is. a thing in some people's analysis of transmisogyny.

[rebellum]

Do you guys consider "men should be allowed to be feminine without being told multiple times by many different people that they have to really be trans women" to be a dogwhistle?

Cause I could see how it could be used AS a transphobic statement, but I mostly see it in the whole current egg debate (don't repeatedly insist someone must be trans if they say they're cis, don't harass people or tell your friend "you're probably a woman" every single time they wear makeup, that whole debate)

Where it's being used to mean like "insisting that because a man is wearing something associated with femininity that he MUST be a trans women is misogynistic because it assumes men can't enjoy those things. Dont tell random people that they have to be trans, don't tell your friend they must be trans every time they wear makeup or a skirt or whatever, respect people's identities" kinda way

But I did see someone refer to it as a dog whistle so now I'm wondering if I am having an overly-charitable view of when people say that

[iphnh]

A trend I notice with radical feminist writers is how blunt and direct they are, which makes them easy to read. Valerie Solanas, Andrea Dworkin, Gail Dines--all of them cut straight to the point. Meanwhile, "queer theory" authors like Judith Butler and Michel Foucault are famously dense, obscure, and no one can ever agree on what their point is.

I see people talk about how there's an anti-intellectual backlash happening on the Left, but I think it's worse than that--it's not just that people are discrediting academics and research, they're discrediting common sense. It's common sense to say that a man who orgasms to the thought of women in pain is a misogynist. It's common sense to say that sex that is meant to hurt and degrade someone is not good sex. It's common sense to say that a man is not a woman.

And I think that's why radical feminist authors come across as blunt speakers--because they aren't intellectualizing the obvious, they're stating it. Meanwhile, the work of Butler and Foucault obscures reality as much as possible (oh sorry-- "problematizes" reality as much as possible).

I wish the people who accuse radical feminists of having dog whistles would actually read radical feminist literature and see how blunt the writing is--absolutely nothing has a double meaning or an implied meaning. Everything is direct.

[shesay]

The "male loneliness epidemic" is a glaring dog whistle that carries no real significance and is primarily used to undermine and dismiss the struggle for women's rights. The same goes for mental health discussions too. Young men, mainly teens were raised on easily accessed porn From an extremely young age, just 10 years old, even before the onset of puberty, watching vids of violent porn where the women get beaten and harmed in horrific ways. And when they are not watching porn, they're frying their brains with misogynistic podcasts and idolizing incel influencers. It's over for males and they've become so hostile and vicious, they can no longer be saved. Let them die alone and miserable.

[velvetvexations]

it's so unfair lol

That sounds really cool, anon!

we need to build a wall (in the Atlantic)

Thank you. <3

I don't think calling it "misandry" is accurate in all cases but you're correct that the terror of transfem sex offenders is essentially the same bigoted instinct that makes White people fearful of Black sex offenders. Trans women aren't men and aren't oppressed for being men but transphobes aren't lying when they say they see us as men. That doesn't make what we suffer misandry, but it does mean you can't just default assume "man" is a privileged category to be perceived as.

"it's bad to listen to trans women when they disagree with me" -apricot-aligator, 2024

Amazingly, my personal least favorite Tumblr user managed to make a post pointing out that "TME" appearances were only so high because it counted appearances and not actual individuals, and that it was mostly one person.

It'd be a real "worst person you know made a great point" moment if it had also realized the methodology was formulated specifically to craft that illusion. And it was right after it reblogged the school shooter post. These people make it so hard to praise them, you know? Kinna like a dog trained to piss everywhere when you give'em a treat.

baeddel is a slur to silence them and I wish it worked

very happy to have converted you to Dandadanism

I sure hope so as well anon

It wasn't even orchestrated that way by The Cis in this case.

Yeah. It's not that hard to just. Not be pointlessly cruel.

Sounds like you're playing the long game, anon, sneakily pretending to have adoring love for your AMAB trans friends for years and years to maximize the pain when you accuse them of sexual assault. I recognize the tactic because it's what all my non-transfem friends have been doing, they just haven't sprung the trap yet.

I still don't know anything about them or that discourse so I will welcome education on the matter.

Yeah!

The Homestuck fandom was very irony-poisoned and hated pretty much everyone for everything.

I don't think it's become a dog whistle because legitimate uses still vastly outweigh non-legitimate but the lie that it was invented exclusively for transbians does feel me with indescribable rage.

Yeah, the controversy has been ongoing from like, day one lol.

There is some debate about the precise origins and what exactly it referred to but I am pretty sure that "and that's where the word bad comes from, a term for trans women" is emo nonsense. Also, even if it did originally refer to feminine men, that is Not The Same Thing anyway.

I've literally never seen a trans man make a misogynistic joke, so I couldn't possibly know.

I hope you get that anon. <3 Somehow I have the same problem. Funny how transfem and transmasc depictions both trend towards femininity, isn't it?

[poebrey]

I’m tired of seeing all these caveats on The Acolyte saying that the writing could’ve been better or it wasn’t as good like there’s a need to preemptively defend criticism of it when saying it deserved to get renewed. It was just as good or bad as most of the other star wars live action, none of which in terms of either quality (everything except Andor) or performance has surpassed The Mandalorian.

The Acolyte had a good first season, set the stage for a new direction, was able to build word of mouth and attract new audiences, and by the end of the season was going viral in a way that only Obi-Wan managed to do by bringing in a second legacy character (Anakin). This is now the 4th production including the sequel series that received a targeted hate campaign, by which I’m placing strong emphasis on the words targeted and campaign because both Ahsoka and TBOBF received large amounts of racist abuse.

Star Wars is a stagnant media property, coming off of a widely-panned sequel series (which managed to achieve the rare feat of alienating both the racist and misogynistic parts of the fanbase and just about everyone else in refusing to properly develop the new leads as it re-tooled itself to appease the former.) Just about every actor of color in a leading role has been subject to widespread racial abuse, it frequently undermines its own initiative to focus on female characters, and in refusing to stand by its own IP it’s destroying any long-term plan to revitalize the fanbase before it even gets off the ground, the High Republic era now having years of investment and buildup cast aside.

When all of the following media projects fail because no one has faith in them after how they handled their previous projects (looking at the upcoming Rey-centric Sharmeen Obaid-Chinoy led film) its going to once again be blamed on ‘bad quality, bad production, whatever the racist dog whistle of the season is like the current “wokeism” etc.’ and not an inherent refusal of a company to stand by its own work. This is Star Wars, no one, not even the biggest fans of the prequel films were coming out of theatres thinking this was Oscar-winning high art. What made it work is George Lucas’ refusal to give in to criticism and fundamentally change his own creation, for better or worse, whether it be bad CGI and Jar Jar Binks, or making an annoying little kid named Ani the central protagonist of the first film in decades. That same attitude stood by giving Anakin a padawan named Ahsoka. It should be ushering in a new era of Star Wars, instead half the audience is convinced Lucasfilm hates its own IP.

[wizardsimper]

I hate to say it but I feel like if Wyll and Mizora's genders were reversed people might actually take the implications of their relationship seriously. It seems that the abusive dynamic is treated as a joke moreso than not (especially after watching the Christmas animated short), it's almost forgotten that Mizora manipulated and groomed Wyll into signing the contract as a child and has been abusing him since.

I don't like bringing gender into the conversation because the whole "oh if their genders were swapped..." is often used as a dog whistle by misogynists, but it's so clear that this is the case, I even see it with Gale and Mystra's relationship too (as well Halsin and the drow to a further extent).

I'm really glad that for the other companions the trauma they have faced at the hand of their abusers is taken seriously throughout the game, but we need to keep the same energy for Wyll too.

[albertserra]

What I haven’t really seen people talking about is how weirdly NYC neoconservative/red scare/dimes square it is. All the typical dog whistles are there… the tatu song, ivy wolk, dropping faggot and retard every other sentence. Even the meta narrative that seems to be condemning her for her “grift” and attempting to move upwards. It all gave me such a strange feeling.

I’ll be honest I have no idea who Ivy wolk is… also wait is all the things she said a dog whistle (genuine question I like the song I have no idea abt any of the culture surrounding it or whatever). The faggot usage was so stupid lmfao like I can’t believe that script was real . Idk what dimes square is either 😭 at lot of this message is flying over my head. But yeah imo the film read as pretty straightforwardly misogynistic to me. Anora being restrained in that prolonged scene playing as slapstick when she was just being sooooo crazyyyyyyy for uhhh. Resisting being held against her will by 2 strangers.

[takemyhand-justice]

I like Ryan (a lot) and don’t have that much of an issue with his interview honestly but people on twitter acting like calling ‘women’ females isn’t a misogynistic dog whistle just because your fave says it …

c’mon now

[lackadaisical-lesbian]

This may sound crazy, but it literally does not matter what a trans woman says or does, you do not have a pass to be misogynist towards her. Argue with her points, call her out for misdeeds, whatever, but the second you start diminishing her personhood or calling her a bitch or literally any other fucking off topic thing, then you're instantly in the wrong. Crazy, I know, but you do actually have to be aware of what you say even when angry, even when you've been wronged. There is no excuse in the world to start calling a transwoman a predator or throwing out whatever deranged dog whistles you can think of. Whatever marginalized identity you hold is also not an excuse to this, btw.

[watermelonflavoredwrath]

A rant about dog-whistles

I saw a person try to claim “if you hear dog-whistles you’re a dog”.  and that’s just. So fucking dumb. “Oh if this trans person hears transphobic dog-whistles they’re clearly transphobic.” “Oh if this African American person hears racist dog-whistles they’re clearly racist.” “Oh if this Jewish person hears a antisemitic dog-whistle, they’re clearly antisemitic.” And the that hits home the most with the people making this argument “If this woman hears misogynistic dog-whistles then clearly they are misogynistic too”.

You can hear a bunch of people in one group, and start digging into the meaning thanks to the internet and also by simply looking at what they’ve said in the past to catch when they’re using a dog-whistle. But noooooo, clearly when someone notices something fucked up that they are also part of the problem. Do the people trying to argue that understand stupid that sounds.

[redditreceipts]

i’ve been looking into a lot of “terf” ideas lately, and it’s been so eye-opening. i was, until recently, what you might call an ally to tras. when it comes to challenging terf ideas, i notice that tras rarely ever even do that. they would just call for violence against these women, which i think was the first thing that made me “peak”. the left has become so genuinely misogynistic (it was always an issue but it seems even more acceptable now) under the guise of trans rights activism. even tras seem to embrace mra ideology on here. i’m constantly seeing posts from them (especially trans men) criticizing misandry like it’s on the same level as misogyny. literally anything is a “terf dog whistle now ( ex. “female rage” using the word “sexism” or even flippantly saying “i hate men”) i’ve also seen so many perverted interpretations of gender from trans people. so many trans women seem to be weeaboos who became obsessed with anime girls, or silence women when we talk about the hardships of growing up female because we make being a woman sound bad. it’s all so disgusting to me and i’m heartbroken because i fear i’m no longer an empathetic person. i can’t find it in me to support these people. i feel like you still have some empathy towards the idea of being trans, and i wanted to know how you were able to do this? so sorry for ranting in your inbox but you seemed very approachable from other responses

hey! first of all, thank you and it's cool that you are here :) I have also been a trans ally for the longest time, but it's become harder and harder to defend them, even though God knows I tried.

I just want to tell you that you disagreeing on a political discussion is not a sign that you lack empathy. It also doesn't mean that you hate the group of people that you disagree with.

I actually do think that the gender critical position is the more empathetic one. For me, being gender critical includes being empathetic to detransitioners, being empathetic to women who feel unsafe, being empathetic to feminine men to which it is suggested that they are actually trans women and to masc women who experience the same. It's being empathetic to people with gender dysphoria who decide to transition but still recognise their own biological sex and to trans people who disagree with the current discourse as well.

And in the end, being empathetic means seeing someone else's struggle and respecting it, but it doesn't mean that you necessarily agree with them on how to resolve it.

so yeah, I wouldn't be worried about not being empathetic enough if I were you, but I do get where you are coming from! Here's a cute cat for you :)

[radfemsiren]

French anon is retarded. 99% of Muslim immigrants come from former French colonies so any legislation against Islam is basically a dogwhistle. Radfems have 0 political education

Egypt was colonized by the French but that didn’t cause FGM to be perpetrated for so long in my family’s home country. Refusing to legislate against oppressive behaviors when they are perpetuated by a group you have bias to makes you a coward.

Stop infantilizing arab/african men bruh… imperialism is evil, and harms women and children the most… but men don’t require it to oppress women. Cultural relativism is how FGM became so popular in the first place.

FGM is an African problem. Muslims and Christians alike practice it, and cite culture as their reason for continuing this barbaric tradition. These countries after gaining independence pushed for embracing any form of African tradition, as pushback against the influence colonial powers. This hyper nationalism had dire consequences.

Look at the first president of Kenya: Jomo Kenyatta. He was an anti-colonial activist and conservative politician. Cultural preservation was extremely important to him and he defended this barbaric practice many times, even though his political frameworks was expressedly anti colonial: “The operation is (still) regarded as the very essence of an institution which has enormous educational, social, moral and religious implications, quite apart from the operation itself. Presently, it is impossible for a member of the tribe to imagine an initiation without clitoridectomy (FGM). Therefore, the abolition of the surgical element in this custom means to the Gikuyu the abolition of the whole institution” source

This is just one example of how understanding systems of patriarchy can be perpetuated by non white communities, and legislating against certain practices that are predominant in minority groups is not a “dog whistle.” You seeing any form of progress for women as a dog whistle is actually dog whistling you as a misogynist, how about that 👀