#but i love elias loving jon more than anything else in the world

[somuchbetterthanthat]

Jonelias day 3! It's when people start to realize that, wait, I truly do have an endless recurring theme, huh. Setting: sick // Prompt: confessions

This... was not what Elias had expected. The goal, of course, had always been for Jon to be marked by the encounter in some fashion, and Elias had been eagerly waiting for it. This was to be the first stepping stone to his grand and final plan, after all, the apotheosis of centuries of work -- And yet, as Jon laid down on the ground, worms burrying into his skin, there had been no satisfaction whatsoever.

Hours later, Jon trembling with fever in Elias's bed, Elias still couldn't make out what had gone wrong -- or, rather, he feared he understood too well, but the idea was so ludicrous it was hard to entertain.

Half gone from both the sickness and the medication he'd taken for it, Jon was murmuring under his breath bribes of statements, mostly from the Corruption, his voice regularly shifting to the pitch of Jane Prentiss. Elias sat next to him, running a fresh wet towel over his face and neck, and kept staring, and staring, and staring.

Jon was going to be better in the morning -- he was too tied to the Institute for a few worms to claim him, and even if he hadn't, the spiders were protecting him; a few had slipped under his tongue a couple of hours ago, no doubt to devour the last remains of the unwanted parasites. Elias ought to let them to it, ought to let Jon to it, have him fully take in the encounter so that he may wake up stronger, changed, more beautiful still than he'd already been --

But he couldn't. Just as he hadn't been able to stop himself from bringing Jon home to him, ignoring Jon's fervent and exhausted insistence he was going to be just fine on him own despite having fainted mere minutes before, while finishing to interview Martin. Just he hadn't been able to stop his arm from pulling the handle of the fire sprinklers much earlier than first planned.

"I didn't think you'd care," Jon had muttered in the car, shivering, annoyed and quiet and still painfully grateful not to be alone after all this, no matter what he said out loud.

"You almost died, Jon," Elias had retorted, voice tight.

"Maybe you'll believe me next time I tell you a supernatural monster is hunting us," Jon had snarked, before slouching a little bit more into the car seat, eyes half closing. "You saved me, though. I guess I haven't said thank you yet, have I?"

"Rest," Elias had ordered, but Jon had fumbled to grab his arm, very briefly.

"Thank you," he'd whispered.

"What have you done to me, you terrible thing?" Elias asked now, at last, very softy. His hand brushed against Jon's cheek, who unconsciously leaned into it with a gentle sigh. "The Mother wouldn't have given you to me if they didn't wish for the same thing I do," he continued, all too aware of how tender his tone was. "If you were always meant to distract me, then why let Prentiss attack us at all? Is it all you, Jon? What do you have than none of the others had?"

Had Elias underestimated his own loneliness those past decades, that he would be so taken by this new young man to forget what truly mattered? Had it been easier to discard past lovers because they weren't made of the same ilk he was, or because he'd been then surrounded by many more people to fall in love with next? Was this a fancy, a midlife crisis, as it were, two centuries in the making, or was it just that Jon was everything Elias hadn't thought he would find one day? A mirror; a potential equal; a true partner, at last.

"I suppose I do truly love you," he confessed, slowly. The truth, not quite agreeable, seemed to be fearsome enough that Jon's eyes suddenly opened wide to look back at Elias. Elias shivered and considered killing him, right there, right then. It wouldn't be hard to explain away, after today, and Elias would not even have to fake the heartbreak.

But no. Just because it wasn't what he had expected didn't mean that it couldn't be interesting in its own right. Just because Elias hadn't wanted it didn't mean he wasn't curious about following another path, one closer to Jon and less focused, at least for now, on ending the world properly.

"Let's see together where this lead us," he told Jon. "It's been a very long time since I prioritized love, if I ever did at all -- this ought to feel novel for the both of us."

It seemed appropriate, then, to lean forward and kiss Jon. To make a proper vow out of it.

"Elias?" Jon mumbled, vaguely, against his lips.

"Shh," crooned Elias, now quite decided. "Sleep. Tomorrow is going to be full of surprises for the both of us, my love."

[kairos-polaris]

I have a lot of thoughts and opinions on jonelias and I was encouraged to share them, so here some things about how I see them/what I want from them in fics/how I write them in order of most to least important

the first two are equally important but I see the first one more so I'll start with it

1. Names

I am very particular about names so it's important to me the way Jon and Jonah call each other

I've talked about it before but it's so important to me that Elias calls Jon by his name. which he does canonically! he calls Jon by his name all the time!! so I am a bit annoyed when in fics Elias calls Jon Archivist every sentence. the exception for it is "my Archivist" but not if it's overused, then it doesn't hit the same

same for Jon calls Jonah Elias post reveal. I prefer the canon version of Jon calling him Jonah. it's an acknowledgement of the person Jonah has always been, the person Jon actually liked and then hated, not the man he never met

2. Elias' attitude towards Jon

it's vital to me that Elias isn't casual when it comes to Jon. I've read a couple of fics when he is casual about Jon and their relationship and I was like :((((

this might be me being sentimental but also I just don't think Elias would risk his plans by getting involved with Jon if he was casual or normal about him. it just doesn't make sense. for what purpose? showing that he has power over Jon? or that he controls him? I don't think it fits his character honestly. Elias is a passive observer first and foremost, he serves the Eye not the Web for a reason

3. Obsession

they should be obsessed with each other, not normal at the very least. Jon refuses to acknowledge that he is obsessed with his boss and keeps insisting their relationship is normal (no one believes him). Elias is aware and doesn't even try convincing people he isn't obsessed with Jon. maybe even claiming Jon in front of other avatars without Jon even realising it

4. Mutual interest

this one isn't as vital but I do want them to be like this 👁️👁️ when it comes to the other. both Elias and Jon should want to inspect the other under a microscope

Jon's interest can be less intense later on but he canonically deeply respected Elias and knew there was more to him than a mild mannered boring manger he presented himself as ("Elias is a difficult man to pin down" I bet Elias was extremely flattered, that his Archivist was paying attention and seeing what he painstakingly tried to conceal)

this is more about me not liking Peter Lukas but it's important to me that Elias is more interested in Jon than he has ever been with Peter. that his interest is so blatantly obvious (read one fic where Elias cheated on Jon with Peter and I was like 😟 nooooo)

also now that I think of it, I don't mind them being interested in someone else but I do need them to prioritise each other (exception is jondaisy but that's because my coolest mutual ships them and loves Daisy and I love their take on their relationship and Daisy)

5. Liking each other

this one isn't that important but I think it's neat when they just like each other as people, when they have shared interests, when they can talk for hours about the most random topics. and also Jon ranting to Elias and knowing he listens and is actually interested

hear me out, hear me out, if Elias postponed ending the world they could totally have some peaceful domestic relationship (am now thinking about them being married pre canon and having a comfortable relationship but everything else is canon and Jon spends season 3 wondering if anything about their life together was true and then one day in season 4 learning that it was real and true and Elias wasn't lying when he said his vows or when he said he loves Jon)

5. Sexless sex

while I enjoy je smut (especially the ones that include Jon being ace) sexless Eye sex is everything to me. and mind meld. anything involving telepathy and Beholding kink

whether it's them staring at each other (unnerving everyone else in the room) or Elias watching Jon read/take a statement or maybe even Jon compelling Elias or taking a statement from him. I love it all

Beholding is like a third in their relationship. To Me

[theanxiousghostartist]

TMAGP 30 Spoilers

(Reactions and Theories for S2)

Man, this one was a wild ride...

Sam and Celia:

Sam, pick up the damn phone!!

Alice doesn't understand, Celia? What doesn't Alice understand? That you are from another world? That you need Sam to manipulate so you can figure out what happened? Sam's trauma with the Institute and his need to figure out what happened to him?

Celia is definitely pushing Sam towards Hilltop Road. There has to be something important there...

Celia, what's your plan? What are you going to use Sam for?

How does Celia know that they are safe on the train? I assume she is just saying it to Sam to calm him down but still. It's true that [Error] was on the train, but they never attacked them. Maybe they aren't after Sam and Celia but something on Hilltop Road? The rift perhaps?

Alice and Colin:

I get why Alice chose to go after Sam and Celia, after all, she knew that they were in immediate danger. Plus, to everyone else, Colin seems to be "overreacting." He kept mixing up "I" with "Freddy," I wonder if he is Becoming? Maybe he is Becoming a part of Freddy? Or maybe a vessel for Freddy, like how Jonah used Elias to body-hop?

The ticket officer isn't paid enough for this. I love the transcript lol

Lena and Gwen:

Lena was FIRED???? Lena, what did you have to do for the OIAR? Who did you have to kill? What did you have to cover up?

Lena noooo, come back please!!

Theory for S2: Lena is going to appear as a mentor character and explain things, like Gerry did for Jon. I think she is going to distance herself from the OIAR, and eventually, send them snippets of information to help them figure out what is going on. She is probably going to send things to Alice, since Alice has been there the longest and didn't actively try to steal her job. I also think she might go in a vigilante - style to destroy the Externals, since she isn't restrained by the OIAR anymore.

Sam and Celia:

Ok, so Sam did eventually read some of Alice's messages.

17, I wonder if that number is a reference to something. I might have to more digging on this one.

"We want your teeth!" Dentist -> Stranger, probably. Maybe the Flesh or Web?

Knocking from the Gray's Appliances? Maybe the Buried or Spiral. I'm leaning more towards the Buried since the coffin had knocking while the Distortion's Doors were more settle and luring.

Someone works here???

Celia got that reflex during the apocalypse.

His bit seems like he's had to tell a good amount of people to stay away. I wonder how many people he's saved.

It's not supposed to be reassuring Sam )):

Alice: Yeah! Go save Celia and Sam!! :D I get that the Taxi Driver didn't want to get involved with anything. Glad that they stayed behind.

Statement:

[Error]!!!! The Custodian was able to resist the Compulsion more than Sam. I wonder if it's because they have been in a close proximity to the Fears.

So, there was a lot of dried blood on Hilltop Road, makes sense, especially if they were hunting for people to mark.

The owner had a wide smile, and didn't like questions being asked, so probably an Avatar?

1997- A drunk guy went into buy a lighter and was marked by the Desolation by a "haggard yet eager old woman," so probably not Agnes.

The store Patience had mannequins that were alive. Definitely the Stranger.

And then the Owner basically threatened him to not look into things anymore. Interesting.

The Owner died in his office, with all his blood vessels strung around. Maybe the Web?

At the end of his statement, the Custodian begins to turn into concrete, and Transform, saying that Hilltop and he are one. Maybe [Error] is triggering a Becoming-like Transformation and he is becoming a vessel for Hilltop Road. The transcript says, "he is gone." not that he died, so maybe his identity is gone? Maybe this is what happened to [Error]?

Sam and Celia:

Celia's tone here is very scary tbh.

Stairs, to a basement... Isn't this how Sam and Alice released [Error]? Even when she's joking with Sam, her tone is just not right?

It's the rift!!

I don't blame Sam for snapping. He's under a lot of stress, with a headache, and this is something really big to keep from him. CELIA FINALLY SAID THAT SHE'S FROM ANOTHER UNIVERSE!!

So, the worlds are out of balance and the rift is trying to force Celia back while she sleeps, and she wanted to sacrifice Sam to the rift, so she could stay with Jack, but for some reason, she couldn't bring herself to do it before [Error] came in. Is it because she likes Sam, she would feel bad sacrificing him? Why couldn't she find someone else? Like pretend to go on a date with a random person and take them here and push them in. Why did it have to be Sam?

Oh, maybe it's because Sam was involved with the Institute? But she was originally going to go to Hilltop Road with Sam AND Alice; Alice would stop Celia from hurting Sam, and Celia knows this, so maybe she was going to sacrifice both of them? But then the world would still be off-balance.

Maybe because Sam gave his statement to [Error] it connected him with the Institute more so that it would work?

[Error]!! And Celia's giving a statement about the Stranger! "AT LAST. IT IS MINE." Do they mean Celia's statement from another world or the rift? What do they want to do?

Sam is going to fight the [Error]. Go Sam!

Alice: GO ALICE!!!

Oh, so maybe I'm right about the Custodian, since they are still talking.

Gwen: I have a feeling Lena keeps alcohol in her office to cope...

Gwen, did you not realize that you got the job??

Gwen, you need to think this stuff through. You don't even know what your new job is. 😭 She has your full support to do WHAT Trevor??? Theory: I think that Trevor is alluding to killing Lena here and telling Gwen that he'll help her if needed. But because Gwen doesn't know wtf she's doing, Lena is going to live and go into hiding, which will come back to bite Gwen later.

Alice and Celia:

Sam and [Error] feel into the rift??? So, are they going to show up at Hilltop Road in TMA!Verse?

But the universes will be off-balance again, won't they? So maybe someone from TMA!Verse will be pulled through to maintain balance?

If someone does come, I think it will either be Melonie King or Annabelle Cane.

Melonie -> She is one of the only TMA!Verse characters that don't have a counterpart that we have met in TMAPG!Verse, so this would be a way to bring her in.

Annabelle Cane -> Annabelle was at Hilltop Road, and we have not heard anything about/from her, so I like to think, especially since Hilltop Road is a place of huge Web activity, like the Institute is for the Eye.

Overall thoughts: Great episode! 10/10! Did not expect half the things that happened! The only thing that could have made it better was another cameo lol.

Old Predictions:

I was basically completely wrong. The only thing I might be right about is that 'someone will Become', but that is not confirmed yet.

Predictions for Season 2:

Colin is going to Become a vessel for Fr3D1 and become something like [Error].

Lena is going into hiding and is going to observe the OIAR from afar for a while. She might try to send some information to Alice.

Teddy is starting to Become and get involved with the Externals, he will probably die.

Gwen is going to struggle with her new job and start relying on Fr3d1 for help. She will be manipulated by Augustus. She might become a vessel for him.

Alice and Celia are going to go back to one of their places after having an argument about what happened to Sam. Celia will explain everything to Alice and the two will continue working together at the OIAR. They will also start investigating the Insitute deeply and try to get more information out of Helen and Gertrude. Alice is going to resent Celia, but she will still work with her for Sam's sake.

Sam and [Error] are going to arrive at Hilltop Road in TMA!Verse, and [Error] is going to grow significantly weaker because of their distance from the Fears. They might start giving their own statement and we will get clues to their past identity, but we will not have a definite conformation of their past. Sam is going to find the ruins of the Institute and find someone, probably Barisa, Melonie, or Georgie, and rope them into helping him get back to TMAGP!Verse.

[horizon-verizon]

I initially assumed the insistence on Sara Snow came from the Rhaegar and Lyanna resemblance, but then I found out it was actually about Jonsa resemblance, which makes less sense... ok you have a Stark bastard, but where does Sansa fit into all of this?

A)

The jonsa ship? Sansa stans who ship this seem to hope for Sansa to become Lady of Winterfell and be "compensated" for all her suffering in the bk or the show, and having Jon be married and/o emotionally devoted to her serves to make a moody pretty boy with skills be her commander, a la Daemon for Rhaenyra you might say. This is the priority from what I've seen so far.

It's another illicit or forbidden love as he's her brother and a bastard who her own mother who died for their older brother and them all disliked. It's also, I think, a fuck-you to GRRM's orig plan to have Jon fall for Arya not bc Arya was also his sister and even younger than Sansa, but primarily bec this, to them, places Arya as the "true" Lady of Winterfell.

I'd take a gander to say this is actually the issue and why some might say it's a Jonsa thing. Perhaps they make similar how Sansa's father has a hand in her encountering danger through her planned betrothal to Joffrey (Aerys continually endangering Rhaegar and his his family, Jon maybe in thei minds being the "cause" of Sansa/Rhaegar's family's destruction) or they posit an unwanted marriage parallel of Sansa-Tyrion and Elia-Rhaegar? There might be more, but I can't think of anything else?

B)

When you say "resemblance", do you mean to say Sara Snow x Jacaerys Velaryon as a true thing that happened, or this story of such meant to parallel the couple of Lyanna and Rhaegar? Perhaps it's the element of her also not having any hope to marry and--pursue a longer and enduring relationship due to the political circumstances--an unavailable noble man, like with Lyanna and Rhaegar? That Jace comes from a Targaryen royal lineage and Sara from a Stark one? Or is it that this ship is in close proximity to the Pact of Ice and Fire, which some people espouse had to do with the actual prophecy Aegon I is said to have had and maybe told to Torrhen Stark, the King who Knelt, that got him to surrender, and thus Creagn and Jace agreed to have their childrne marry--thus being some sort of precursor and affirmation of Lyanna-Rhaegar narratively & metaphorically "destined" to shape the history of their society throught their own singular action? That Torrhen might have already known, as others say? Which all, I believe , is an argument meant for Jon being the Prince that was promised?

Bc these latter two "ran off" bec their personalities and personal goals/values didn't jive with the "obligations" both had; those that were like stones set against their own and those around them (Lyanna with her marriage and the entire woman-must-obey thing/her being found out about being the Knight of the Laughing Tree and thus punished vs Rhaegar and the prophecy against the legacy of his house/wanting to build a different Westeros from his crazy father through said prophecy, to "fix" Westeros and/or the world in a way Dany is seemingly supposed to).

Whereas Sara Snow and Jace either don't have such obligations (Sara) or don't have such relationships or regards to their obligations (Jace). Unlike Lyanna Stark, Sara Snow--if she ever even existed. I don't think she ever did, Mushroom is Mushroom and was never there to witness what he said happened--was reported to be a bastard girl, who Cregan, her supposed brother, would never confront anyone about or for if she were to have pursued a relationship for precisely because she was a bastard girl who no one could leverage like Lyanna's father tried to when he betrothed her to Robert Baratheon. Rhaegar had to leave Elia with his father when said madman ordered Elia and their kids to return to KL/the Red Keep while Rhaegar was away; he also had several "engagements" that Jace did not have a like to before the war that Rhaegar was compelled to act on, presumably for the world and not just his own father, wife, etc. Jace was just living with Rhaenyra before the war, anticipating marrying a girl he had been close woth for ages since childhood, and he was barely in his own majority when he died not so late after the war broke out.

Jace's story, unlike Rhaegar, was that he was suspected as a bastard/not his father's son and that the Westerosi stigma against bastards and their character and ability to have loyalty is unsettled by his utter devotion to his family and mother's claim--in other words, he was all in both because of and despite the logic of those rumors, ironic bec of later when Rhaenyra's compelled and unethically chooses to arrest the dragonseeds when her council basically demanded that punishment--in a way, Jace's work was…troubled by this, even with Jeyne Arryn, the Manderlys, and Cregan Stark pulling through later but too late.

In other words, the stakes are too different and the characters are not so similar for Jace to act like Rhaegar or have the room & circumstance to do so. Whether you think Rhaegar was chaotic good, chaotic evil, or just pathetic. This is also not me sayign that Rhaegar wasn't devoted to his family/family's legacy, but that his motivations were layered and has a chance of being more about, again, saving the world. The Pact of Ice and Fire was bt Cregan and Jace also, again, was for their kids to marry, not Jace to marry a Stark bastard girl and disobey his mother at a time when she needed

What exactly are we meant to take away from Jace being with Sara Snow for the narrative apart and what does this contribute or explain exegetically or diegetically apart from it from the pattern of in-world speculation in F&B? Yes they share those that I listed, but they hardly have similar narratives or "points"?

[katshuya]

cheating is a thing in Westeros, sono, Rhaegar isn't that bad in the characters' eyes when it's a common thing, and no, he didn't cheat. Elia was Dornish, and it's in their tradition, so she would accept it. And that makes Rhaegar much less guilty in Elia's eyes.

As for the favoring Lyanna over

Elia...well, the truth is Lyanna is the prophecy woman just as Rhaellaonce was. She plays a role in savingWesteros with Jon. She did more likable and attention attracting things like fighting against injustices while Elia only brithed children for the prophcey that ended up not related to the prophecy.

So, it is a normal reaction. Lyanna actually did something.

If Aegon is going to be alive, then he will not be important like Jon nor as honorable or good-hearted. He'll be Daenerys' enemy.

As for the pesants' deaths, they were for the greater good. Cruel but inevitable. But I agree some of them were unnecessary like Rhaegar's children, BUT they had nothing to do with Rhaegar or lyanna. I guess the author is trying to say that the prophecy children should come from only certain people, and Elia, unfortunately for her, stood in the way of the prophecy.

It may seem unfair, but that is the world of the AOIAF.

If Elia should accept her kingdom's tradition about *cheating* as you put it and had absolutely no problem with it (even though Arianne threatened Arys, Lord Yournword fought Oberyn. Oberyn never married, so he doesn't stay committed to someone, Doran married for love and stayed single afterwards.) then Lyanna had no right to complain about Robert's outside of marriage sexual activities and should have carried on with marrying him. Since cheating a tradition in Westeros.

Do you even hear yourself?

The normal reaction for you is that Lyanna escapes Robert and choses a married man but Elia should accept being abandoed for someone else after all she sacrificed?

You are sick. You are so passive-aggressive against a woman who gave everything for that nasty prophecy that you claim to be more important than thousands of deaths. A woman who paid a very high prince for Rhaegar's pitiful desires, Lyanna, to be free from Robert,Aerys madness and Tywin's grudge only to be raped and killed with her children's blood on her.

You are sick for thinking the prophecy justifies anything. Or that Rhaegar and Lyanna were heros.

Elia didn't stand in the way of the prophecy. She is standing in the way of your ugly and nasty ship.

You are trying to act logical and calm when you are just mad.

I'm not sure what else Elia should do to look as cool as perfect saint lyanna the good in your eyes.

Defy Rhaegar and refuse to give him children so she doesn't risk her life?

You would have said it's her fault that Rhaegar left her because she didn't give him what he needed, and Lyanna so perfectly was ready to give them to him.

You are just dying to prove their actions that lead to thousands of deaths as heroic. You have the same mindest as war criminals.

You need help. I'm serious.

[lycanlovingvampyre]

MAG 160 Relisten

Activity on my first listen: head empty, only eyepocalypse...

Yeah, The Eye Opens doesn't sound so good... Neither does the ominous slightly different version of the Institute’s motto...

MARTIN: "I still don’t think we should have brought it." JON: "Oh, it’s better than no warning at all." Hmmm, I think one would have just turned up. Like on the ship to Norway.

JON: "Yeah, well, it technically still belongs to Daisy, so – (small exhale) I’m just glad it’s not some sort of kill room." MARTIN: "Or – (pause for a huffed laugh) Or it is, and she just cleaned it up really well." JON: (small exhale) "Yes." MARTIN: "Are we? – Are we… safe here?" JON: (sigh) "Safe as anywhere. If Elias wanted to find us, I imagine he could, but – I doubt the police will be able to. If nothing else, I’m hoping there’d be some – jurisdiction complications, in Scotland?" I always love how there just happens to be a conversation that tells us where they are (or what object this is about etc.)

MARTIN: "And if she does?" JON: (exhale) "Well. At least we’ll know where she is." And here's the information that we lost Daisy :( Gone full Hunt.

JON: (teasing) "Anyways, don’t tell me the phonebox down there doesn’t appeal to your retro aesthetic." MARTIN: "It – might. Maybe." Ahhhh, the teasing!!!

MARTIN: "You’ll be okay here?" JON: "I’ll be fine." It's so soft...

MARTIN: "I mean, they’ve finished all the interviews? Apparently they’re calling it a 'terror attack.'" From what Basira said in MAG 158 ("From what I saw they’ve been toying with the rest of the Institute, but it won’t be long until they’re all dead or escaped.") I'd call that a proper killing spree.

MARTIN: "And she wasn’t sure which ones you’ve read already, so she, she just said she’d send a bunch." JON: ""There – There are tapes in here, as well. D-Did she say anything about tapes?" MARTIN: "She didn’t mention it? – But I didn’t check it until after the call." Do you know how long it took me to realize these are not the statements Basira sent xD I thought Elias smuggled his statement to the obvious stack of statements in the Archives and Basira grabbed it with the others and sent that... Yeah, it does make a lot more sense for Elias to simply watch Basira and then express-mail his own welcome-back package.

MARTIN: "– I will give you some privacy. Go for a walk." JON: (exhale) "Let me know if you see any good cows." MARTIN: "Obviously I’m going to tell you if I see any good cows." Famous last words... Love how it sounds there has been something going on with them defining "good cows". Already told this little story in the tags of one of the MAG 160 art reblogs: last year my spouse said they're going for a walk and I know there's a route past a field of highland cattle. So I asked them where they're going and it was this exact route! Of course I asked them to tell me if they see any good cows xD The world didn't end and I got a photo of highland cows!

Overall impression of these two scenes: Their conversations are so normal... They really are okay here. At least, how far we can tell from what little we have. I'm sure I already said this in one of my relisten posts, I think it's really good for the fandom to have so little. Yeah, of course I would have loved more fluff, but by keeping this so short, there's sooo much we fans can imagine happening here. TMA has a lot of this, referencing vaguely what happened, but keeping it open for us to explore that. This is actually also very good for the horrors in the show. It’s a genre I respond very well to. Keeping it vague, let my mind do the rest. Fucking love this shit.

JON: "Right. Statement of Hazel Rutter regarding a fire in her childhood home. Original statement given August 9th, 1992." OMG, I remember exactly, what my reaction to this was. I was like "What bullshit statement for a season finale is that supposed to be???"

JON: "Hello, Jon. Apologies for the deception, but I wanted to make sure you started reading, so I thought it best not to announce myself." And then I was "Oh SHIT!" Also, I always forget it's Jon reading this statement because Jonny's impression of Ben's Elias is sooo good! So this is Jonny pretending to be Ben pretending to be Elias by copying Jonny pretending to be Jon, all while still pretending to be Jon... I hope that makes sense... Also I used this sentence one time for a friend! She doesn't really like horror because she's easily scared, but she did listen to all of TMA for me. And I had a very cool and really creepy nightmare which just happened to include one of my cats and I wanted to tell her what happened in this nightmare. But it was also almost midnight and I knew she just wouldn't read my text if she immediately had recognized it as a nightmare. So I started to retell it by focusing on my cat only to hit her with the creepy stuff in the last sentence. She texted me "I hate u" back xD and a week later we talked about this via Twitch chat during a stream of our friend’s and she was like "I thought it was a cute cat dream!" and I answered "Yeah, I knew you would stop reading if it would have been too obvious... Hello *friend's name*. Apologies for the deception but I wanted to make sure you started reading..." We both laughed so much xD

So uh, I already made a post about this once, but I'm putting that thought in here again. The case numbers of the statements are always in the episode descriptions (here 0181810 - a palindrome!!! - 18th October 2018). These case numbers always refer to the date the statement was first given, either written or recorded directly. This is a written statement, so teeeeeechnically 18th October was the day Jonah wrote this statement, and not the day Jon read it. I do think this one episode is an exception of this rule, but hear me out for a moment: If 18th October was only the day Jonah wrote this, this could mean for Jmart to have more time for their Scottish honeymoon!!!

"but that you would quite willingly doom that world and confine the billions in it to an eternity of terror and suffering, all to ensure your own happiness" Capitalism is the real enemy!

"I once asked her what drove her, what had started her down that path. She told me the Desolation had killed her cat." Understandable, have a nice day! (Gertrude is John Wick...)

"You see, the thing about the Fears is that they can never be truly separated from each other. When does the fear of sudden violence transition into the fear of hunted prey? When does the mask of the Stranger become the deception of the Spiral?" Yeeees, like colors! They're all part of the same light! I love how everything that seemed like a plot hole in TMA actually has an explanation!

"It does tickle me, that in this world of would-be occult dynasties and ageless monsters, the Chosen One is simply that – someone I chose. It’s not in your blood, or your soul, or your destiny. It’s just in your own, rotten luck." And in the next few sentences he'll say "Oh wow, that one is marked by the Spider! Must be their blessing to send me someone already with that destiny!"...

"How is Martin, by the way? He looks well. You will keep an eye on him when all this is over, won’t you? He’s earned that." Jonah!Elias ships them XD

"And there, I think, we are brought just about up to date." I have listened to the episode starting this sentence soooo many times!

Ahhh, the soundscaping during the incantation is so good!

JON: (still distorted, with shaking laughter/tears) "Look at the sky, Martin. Look at the sky. It’s looking back." [AND NOW HE DOES BEGIN TO LAUGH IN EARNEST. IT’S NOT A LAUGH WE’VE HEARD ON HIM BEFORE; NOT A SHORT, CLIPPED LAUGH; NOT A SURPRISE BURST OF GENUINE HILARITY. THIS LAUGH SEEMS AFRAID, AND YET COLD. IT’S REMINISCENT OF ELIAS’S VILLAINOUS LAUGH, BUT IS TINGED MORE WITH FEAR THAN SATISFACTION.] [HE DOES NOT STOP LAUGHING.] That was it. I thought now he lost it. Completely. I was asking myself if he could pull it together next season, or if he'll be full crazy monster. And I totally felt that shock of “Oh no, this really happened. Everything is ruined. How can this progress? How can this every be undone??” I really, reaaally felt Jon and Martin’s (mostly Martin’s perhaps) emotions there at the end...

A few random thoughts at the end here, while I don't remember my surroundings listening to this episode. I remember being in the bedroom at the end of this episode. Like specifically that thought of Jon "going crazy".

I think it's funny how MAG 160 fanart is either super sweet Jmart or total devastation of the world ending. And memes. Lot’s of memes.

Fun fact: My father in law finished S4 today as well!!! He never struck me to be a person who'd be doing a relisten, which I found a bit sad because there is so much to discover in a relisten. BUT he said he's thinking about doing a relisten right now already xD This episode is always my most anticipated one when wanting friends and family live-blog their experience to me xD

@a-mag-a-day

[thepodcastcat]

I would like to wholeheartedly disagree because the show does discuss how regular humans can be evil as well. The problem is that this is a supernatural horror anthology, and therefore all the primary villains are obviously going to be or become supernatural monsters. In fact, we are told that that's how Avatars are made: regular ass humans who gave themselves over to an Entity, and plenty of them were stated to have done evil things long before the fears claimed them.

Jeffrey Amherst used smallpox blankets against Native Americans during the French-Indian War, Jude Perry was a reckless murderer before she became an Avatar, and Callum Brodie and Jared Hopworth were both violent bullies. Even Jane Prentiss admitted that her friends described her as "toxic". These people did bad things before the entities decided to bestow upon them the power to melt skin or whatever.

As for Gertrude, she was positioned as a morally gray individual doing what they believed was right for the sake of the world. A very "needs of the many" type stance. The show makes it clear that, like everyone else, she was acting with the information available to her to the best of her abilities. However, the writing never absolves Gertrude of her decisions, or acts like she never hurt anyone, or that her attachment to her humanity justified her actions. In fact, plenty of notable characters (on both sides of the morality/sympathy spectrum) have barely anything good to say about her.

As for the whole "people excusing the monstrosity of their loved ones while simultaneously blaming Jon for essentially being in the same boat", I mean...yes. That is pretty true to life. I would like to point out that a) character opinion = author views/objective truth, and b) that is how most people would act anyway. Emotions do not always work on a logical basis. Yes Elias is the main villain, and in a perfect world everyone would come together as a team and focus their anger on him, but they're not a team. Fanon likes to pretend as though the archive group were all friends at some point, but they weren't. Jon and Tim were amiable co-workers at best. Jon and George had a bad break up in college. Melanie disliked Jon from the start. Basira and Daisy were codependent police partners who nearly killed him.

Not only are people obviously going to be more understanding towards current friends/partners compared to Some Guy, Martin essentially does the same thing by caring more about Jon and even defending him way back when he was very clearly stalking his coworkers.

Finally, regarding the ethical issue of "causing harm as a necessity of survival vs. causing harm out of personal desire", the show never portrays it as a black and white issue. Jon struggles with it because that's the character, and every other character certainly disapproves, but again we're never told that he's wrong and they're right. If anything, we're meant to sympathize more with Jon since he is the primary POV and is portrayed with more nuance than everyone else. What would be the correct answer here anyway? Traumatize more people? Starve to death? TMA is telling you to come up with your own answer.

TLDR: I'm not going to pretend this show is the most perfect thing in the world, but in my opinion a lot of the "problems" boil down to "the show is asking me to critically engage with characters who are written to be flawed and come up with my own answers about the questions posed instead of informing me of the Paragon option so I know who to root for during any given scene"

now it may be my own weirdness with the nature of existence but, i dont really get why everyone in TMA cares if someone is inhuman?

so your buddy feeds on fear? ok! sure!

does being human even matter???? whats the big deal about not being human!

[jcryptid]

The Magnus (fic rec) Archives

This one has been literally years in the making and a true testiment to the power of hyperfixation and what I could maybe do if my brain decided something like graduating highschool was actually really interesting.

I'm sure my fic preferences will be made very much clear as you read this, so do keep in mind said preferences might not allign with yours. I have included a lot of Whump, H/C and angst in my list, so if you're not into that sort of thing, that's fine, have a nice day. I've also got some content warnings in my descriptions as well for the more... intense....whump?... yeah let's go with that.

(Most are all Jmart, but there's some JonTim, some LonelyEyes on the side, and the occassional OG archivist squad polyamory, anything tagged as Jon/Elias is 100% in some kind of whump scenario)

Rec list and key under the cut (^o^)/

Key:

Bold = 11/10 fic, very much had me thinking about if for way longer than I should have, recommending it way too many times than is necessary and pretty regularly rereading it

Purple italics = didn't quite have the same earth shattering effect as the bold fics, but very much worth a read all the same

Plain text = it's up there fam, but not quite on the same level as the purple italics or bold fics

The garden of forking paths - by bibliocratic

After killing Elias and presumably setting the world back the way it was Jon and Martin find themselves falling through the doors of the distortion, holding each other tight and doing everything they can to not let go. It's only when Jon wakes up later to an archivist named Sasha and the Tim he used to know waving an axe in his face that he realizes that wherever somewhere else was, he came through alone.

First fic I ever read for TMA that I connected with really, written midway through season 5 so we pretty much ignore any canon ending, but I don’t think any of us are particularly complaining about that one considering the sheer amount of fix its. (Completed)

Out There, Somewhere - Artyphex

Jon wakes up, blind and alone and bleeding out having been spat out of the crack between realities after the end of the world and now finds himself alone, alone and in pain, entirely alone in a way he's never felt before, in a world that is not his with no one he knows and loves beside him. And he is left to search, with unseeing eyes and shaking words for the one person he needs to know is okay. (Completed)

They keep trying to row away (series) - by assigned_Jon_Kin_Again (sparrow0), blackwood (transjon), radula (stickpenalties), screechfox, skvadern

Body horror mermaid fic that breaks my heart in the best way, feat. Archivist Sasha and maybe a polyamory between the 4 main archivist crew? Either way a hurt/comfort mermaid fic that I can't stop coming back to. If you're a big fan of Whump and excessive angst with the sweat relief of comfort this is the fic for you, but please for the love of god pay attention to the Trigger Warnings. (Series complete)

Family, Found - Dribblescribbles

Basira was there for the unknowing, she was there when Elias told them all to their faces that he was a bastard who was using them for something none of them could understand, and ever since the unknowing she's been doing whatever she could, taking whatever scraps of investigations she could to find the answers. And of all the people it had to be Helen who helped her figure it out. Because Jon is not a monster, but the Web and the Eye are doing their damn best to make him one, and she's going to make sure that the others working for the archives aren't doing the same. (One Shot)

My witness brings me Into existence - by driflew

A take on Not!Jon au with an exploration on what happens if he comes back and the experiences he has to deal with as someone who cannot be physically remembered but still wants to help out Sasha and the others, even if Elias, the one person who seems to know him, won't let him.

This one has me feeling a lot of things, currently existing as just a One shot but I'm still crossing my fingers from some extra additions to the series, and boy does this one have me coming back on the regular. (Completed fic, Series ongoing)

Not a Second Thought - by i_can_do_fics

An alternate take on Not!Jon, specifically involving the web instead of the stranger. Where people aren't replaced, but thin unseeable strings of spider silk force his hand and his tongue and his body in no way he can resist. And after everything that'd happened since this all started, he's not quite sure it's a bad thing. (One shot)

Miles to Go before I sleep - by AuralQueer

Sleep Dep. Hurt Comfort Set S4, feat. A Jon who is putting himself through way too much crap but honestly that's just par for the course. (One shot)

Beastly Behavior - by Prim_the_Amazing

Martin is a man struck by a curse, a curse that is vindictive and cruel and cast by someone he will always love despite everything she's done to him. Jon is a man on the run from a monster of his own, a man with all the power in the world to take everything he has left of himself for his own entertainment. Two men with two tasks, a mother and a grandmother, both dying in their beds and both losing a part of their freedom and themselves trying to save them. Both terrified of the world they live in, of the person they grow to love, of the people they may be becoming.

A Beauty and the Beast au with a bit of a twist, and a happy ending well worth the wait. (Completed)

The Sea Calls Me Home - mothjons

Martin Blackwood takes a job at Peter Lukas's estate in exchange for his mother's care and

their housing for his service. It's not a pretty job, it's not anything Martin would have picked for himself but nothing he'd had ever would be and he's resigned himself to that fact, no matter how much it hurts. And then he meets a strange man by the sea, and god knows all the secrets and the pain of loving someone is the one choice he knows for certain he'd never give up.

Not going to lie this one had by ugly crying by the end. A great and honestly very angsty take on Mer Jon x Martin but also set during the height of WWI and I promise you there is of course a happy ending they both deserve. (Complete)

Head in the Lion's Mouth - by renwhit

Au where Danny is alive, damaged goods but alive. So when a certain archivist, possibly delirious and in pain, narrows his eyes and tells him he looks familiar in a way the other uncanny circus members don't, it sparks something in him he can't explain and for the first time in over a decade the ringmaster has a name. (Series is ongoing)

Maybe they'll leave you alone, but not me - by ghostfrog

A cute ongoing fic where Jon becomes a teacher after Martin singlehandedly stops the apocalypse at the end of S4, and because they're both trying to move on with their lives Jon becomes an English teacher for a local school, where he has a class that are a bit too observant, and maybe just a bit too into cryptids.

There Are Monsters In These Woods - by DoilySpider

Once upon a time there was a prince of a kingdom named blackwood, with a wicked stepfather who wanted him dead. One day the prince asked his stepfather what he could do to claim the crown that they both knew was rightfully his, and the stepfather told him that a king must be brave, and to prove it he must then slay the beast of eyes.

Once upon a time there was a man named Jonathan Sims, a man who sought whatever knowledge and magic it would take to be able to protect those he loved from the monsters that took everything from him; and so he went to see the Mage Magnus, who would only be making him just one more.

Dark Fairytale au? Well that's what you get I suppose when the fandom is based around a horror podcast. All I can say really is that I love the world-building on this one, and the writing, featuring a happily ever after we all know they all deserve and some Jon/Martin/Tim/Gerry Polyamory. (Complete)

A Weather In The Flesh - by cuttooth

An emotionally devastating one shot about touch starvation that may or may not have made me feel a lot of things (One shot)

One of these birds, is not my bird - by updownandsideways

Just a good ol' Not Jon fic, a bit predictable in places but the gist is Jon is taken by the Not Them and Martin's feeling a bit different about Jon since he got back from the Prentiss incident, it's only when he re-reads some of his old poetry that he finds out why. (Complete)

Thresholds (series) - by bubonickitten

At the precipice of finding out he's changing into something inhuman, Elias decides to give Jon a push, with the perfect bit of information to leave him a wreck, and makes him know the story of a young man he remembers all too clearly being taken by dear old Mr. Spider. (Complete)

Chamomile - Dribbledscribbles

Chamomile is a mischievous little creature who finds its delight in seeing how many times they can give the people in this safe house a heart attack. It's attempts on Martin have been successful to a fault, pushing him as far as it can to scare the living daylights out of him before he comes at him with a broom and scuttling away before he can come close. It's a fun game they have, but when they try it on Jon it just doesn't work. It's not fun, because Jon lets it win, Jon names it, Jon gives him cuddles and lets it rest on his shoulder, and this little creature is rather determined not to give up.

Aka a cute fluff fic where Jon and Martin are living in their cottage in Scotland and end up adopting a few of the spookier residents. (Completed)

Go softly - by doomcountry

Martin brings home a jug of bleach, sets it on the counter with an eyedropper for when Jon is ready, and even if both of them know it will hurt, that is has to be done, but no matter what they are going to get through this together.

TW for eye mutilation (Oneshot)

Terror Management Theory - by prismatical

Jonathan sims was eaten by a spider when he was eight, he died, but then he came back. Since then Jon has a very interesting relationship with death, one that terrifies him more than anything else, more than any other fear, and it's going to take a hell of a lot to earn his right to death back. (Completed)

Nature has taught her creatures to hate - thepolysyndetonaddictsupportgroup

Many times Jon has tried to run, sometimes it even worked, sometimes he got barely made it out alive at the end of the day, but it never worked when he was running from the Magnus institute, from James Wright or Elias Bouchard, or from the horrors that have never let him go since he was eight and stupid enough to pick up that damn book. The powers that be had taken him as a child, wrapped him in tight cobwebs of contracts and kidnappings and under a bruising hand on his shoulder that guided him down the path of inhumanity no matter how hard he tried to run. And even now, when he's failed again and facing losing another of a short line of close connections to the curse that is the Magnus institute, he can't back out.

NGL this one is depressing at times, but it kept my eyes glued to the screen it was so thrilling. Featuring a Jon who was chased to the Magnus institute by a book and a boy overflowing with spiders, and then claimed by something even worse, lots of child abuse and Elias being a manipulative bastard. (Ongoing)

Reflection - by LazuliQuetzal

There's something haunting Jonathan sims, something that looks just like him, but different all the same. Something inhuman that he cannot allow himself to trust, no matter what it says or claims to know about him. Something that keeps telling him with every moment they have to stay away from the archives, no matter what.

Meanwhile, Jonathan Sims, the monster and remnant of a ruined world, is rapidly forced to reconcile with living in the past as something no one is able to see or even notice as anything out of the ordinary, not even with the power of the eye behind them, and as fun as getting some small sense gratification from being petty and messing with Jonah as much as he can, the only person he can really talk to is quite literally himself.

And he's a fucking idiot.

This fic is great if you just want a little giggle and some catharsis. Pending alternate title is currently tied between "Two Jons in an archive, what will he do?" and "Jon would be the first person to tell you that he is absolutely insufferable". (complete)

See the Line where the Sky meets the Sea - by The_Floating_World

Jon has always had a fascination with things vastly incomprehensible, staring out from a dock out at the ocean and marveling at the infinity of everything before him. How the sky can be perfectly reflected in the ocean, how everything is endless and so vast in such a beautiful way, and I need not tell you that fears have never been loved in the way Jon loves infinity. After a probably not so chance encounter with Simon Fairchild, Jonathan Sims begins his slow evolution to becoming as an avatar of the vast, but he's different in a way the others aren't. Asking questions with no answer and living on that threshold between the vast and unknowable and madness in a way the other's haven't seen before, and by virtue of his own strangeness, even in the face of the other avatars, he is known as the philosopher, a man who isn't a man that seems content to hide just how powerful he really is.

At least until he makes some friends of his own and they come under threat. (Complete)

Starving Gods - by sevansa

Jon is in a really, really bad place when he decides to go through with it, knowing with a certainty his future doesn't have that if he were to follow in the footsteps of Eric Delano, he wasn't going to allow himself the luxury of a chance to back out, not with so many victims at stake.

Needless to say the shock of finding Jon in his office like that, unconscious and mutilated is something none of them will ever forget.

TW eye mutilation but you already knew that, first fic i the series is complete, but the sequel is still ongoing.

The Unknown Watcher - by authureameslove

Martin knows the rules as well as anyone else. You do not stay out past dark, not for anything, lest you fall prey to monsters and madness more potent than any ghost story or relentless creature cooked up by gods bigger than anyone could have imagined. So on a dark night, chased by monsters a plenty and his own stupid decision to chance it Martin Blackwood stumbles upon an estate filled with its own monstrosities. Two killers stalking the woods that weren't there before, a stranger in the night, two who cannot leave lest they be unmade with wooden splinters where there should be skin, and a man with two glowing green eyes and a face that no one can see. Each with their own stories to tell, each bound to this place by powers out of their control and choices they have made and each playing their own part in the end of both themselves and the world.

And of all things, they seem to think that Martin just might be the only one who can save them.

Inspired loosely on Beauty and the Beast with its own unique and captivating TMA Spin, this fic had be glued to my seat in anticipation, and I highly recommend it to anyone who enjoys tales of vengeance, Jmartin and that classic ghost story style mystery. (Complete)

Déjà Vu - CirrusGrey

What do you even do with yourself when you are given a second chance? What does it mean to truly feel your death, being unmade or destroyed or unwound or stabbed through the heart by the man you love, and waking up alone long before you would have come to know any of it. Remembering everything, every pain, every choice that led to it and everything that you can't bring yourself to believe hasn't happened yet, and to do so all alone?

Sasha James was unmade, Tim Stoker was destroyed, Martin was unwound, and Jon was stabbed through the heart by his love. They all woke up alone on a day long before even the thought of Prentiss would touch them, and they all think they're the only one.

The Watcher's Bargain - arthureameslove

Fae au says what?

Martin hadn't known freedom since he was a child, when the witch Mary Blackwood took him in and bound him with silver threads and promises. So when she lays sick and dying in their house he makes a bargain with her. The Death's book of names and her life in return for his freedom. He should have known stealing from the Fae would have consequences beyond death, should have known the witch would have been vindictive enough to only allow him to leave her if it meant trading one prison for another, and this time, surrounded by the high court of the Panopticon, with Fae and tortured humans in chains, bound to one who speaks in half-truths and secrets, hope has never been so far from his eyes.

At least that is, until the fae proposes a bargain of his own. (Ongoing)

This Lonely Knight - arthureameslove

Martin doesn't remember why or how he came to join the knights of the Lonely, nor does he remember any of a life before that point. Like the many other heartless knights he cast away his memories and the pain they carried with them with his choice and that was just the way it was. It's not until he's sent to escort a strange man from the beholding to be the Watcher's betrothed that he begins to find what he'd been missing, what being of the Lonely had kept him from, and more importantly that he can't go through with his suicidal mission to see the death of his charge.

Honestly, this is classic fairytale knight and royal in an arranged marriage romance but with another perfect Magnus Archives twist from arthureameslove. (Complete)

What Belongs to the Sea - TwoDrunkenCelestials, WhyNotFly

When Jon first meets Elias he's dry as a bone and still smelling of thick salt with wild hair, knocking on his door with fury in his eyes and blood roaring in his veins as he demands back his stolen skin. For all his grandmother's warnings though, he still ends up in a gilded cage of his own making. Soon Jon, against his better judgement and consent is swept up into the path of the unblinking, newlywed and bound by powerful magic and paraded around in ceremony and unfeeling shows of affection and control. It's only after an admittedly prickly encounter with Martin, that he begins to hope.

TW there is abuse here, and alot of iron burns (Complete)

The Path of Least Resistance - chermit

Martin, Sasha and Tim go into what they think will be a normal day of work in 2016, and it is anything but. They arrive to find a crime scene, swamped with police officers there to inform them plainly that everyone in the institute is dead, except for them. Elias in his office clutching his head as if in pain, Jon shot three times in the chest with an empty look in his eyes and the rest of them from apparent cardiac arrest. Needless to say they want answers, they want justice, and if it means involving themselves in a world of monsters and fear a mysterious someone had tried so hard to keep them safe from, then so be it. (Ongoing)

The Sweetest Thing - JoyHeart

Martin has always been warned away from humans, his mother took great pains to plant that fear firmly within long before she and all of Selkie kind seemed to turn their backs on him. It isn't until he's rescued from some particularly nasty flesh worms by the Magnus Institute for Oceanic Research and Rescue that he finds an alternate perspective. Unfortunately, even if he doesn't yield his form, Martin's about to find that humans have more than one way of keeping a selkie under their grasp, even if completely unintentionally.

A martin selkie au that had me cackling, in suspense and squealing with just the right amount of fluff (for my tastes at least) featuring Marine Biologist Jon who's just as insufferable when it comes to his skepticism as he is incredibly sweet. (complete)

Heavy angst and whump warning for the sequel (which is ongoing)

A deeply annoying child - ajkal2

A oneshot (that I will defend until my dying breath) where Jon reads a Leitner that turns him into his 8 year old self right after his encounter with Mr Spider and Tim is there to help him pick of the pieces. (Oneshot)

Antigonish - softlyblue

Martin inherits an the Blackwood house from a woman he's never heard of sharing his last name and very quickly finds it inhabited by something trying to kill him, something that is not the four friendlier ghosts that inhabit the place, and something that goes a hell of a lot deeper than cold spots and whispers in the night. It's not so much a choice then to call in the cavalry when a portion of the very well-built roof tries to crush him for the third time in a row, so he sends a reluctant email to three ghost hunters under Basira's recommendation, with one of which being a man reportedly most adept of seeing and reaching out to things that are not there. (Complete)

The Reverb in These Holy Halls - Wolftraps (AlwaysBoth)

After a distinctly unwell day at work Jonathan Sims comes to awareness and marches in to the archives without so much as a word and declares himself to Elias and Martin both as the new head archivist. A lot of people are confused by this, a lot of people suspect Jon of murdering Gertrude and a lot of people want to know what the hell is going on with him. With a bargain made, and an eye and a Spider in his heart Jonathan Sims is going to save the world, and this time he's going to do it right.

Very generic premise of a Timetravel TMA fix it but it comes with some added flavor thanks to some clever writing from the author/s.

Two Graves - SupposedToBeWriting

In saving the world singlehandedly Jonathan Sims honestly thought he was going to die, so it was more than a surprise when he didn't, and even more than his plan actually worked. Now, with nothing but the remnants of fear and a broken heart he flees London, along with everything and everyone to do with the Magnus institute, but quickly finds himself a new purpose with a garden and connection to some avatars who need some help finding themselves after their patron's disappearance.

And then his world shatters when Martin and Basira finally manage to track him down.

This one got me through a particularly rough patch, a fic about reconciliation after the end of the world was... well, ended, and about reconnecting and forgiving the ones you love. TW for some implied sucidal thoughts and ideation. (completed)

The Archivist and the Adventurer (series) - paperdream

There are few things for a human that is worse than to be considered lovely by the Fae, and that is a lesson Jon, like so many things, had to learn the hard way. Ensnared by the wild hunt and bound to the high fae Elias and forcibly changed by the Mother of Spiders, all Jon has left to hold on to is his name, spending his days confined to the Archives to serve and be subject to the whims of the fae, whatever they may be. At least that is, until he finds his solace in helping an adventurer escape the cruelty of the fae unscathed, no matter how foolish he may be. (Ongoing)

Auspex (Series) - faridsgwi

(Victorian AU) The year is 1841, and Jonah Magnus is ready to begin building his archive in London. Now it's just a manner of going to the workhouse to find a child that won't be missed to serve as his repository.

Highly recommended au for you guys, as of now it's still ongoing but my god is it keeping my rapt attention in hopes for updates to the series. Featuring our good old Victorian asshole and resident child abuser Jonah Magnus, as he builds up his new archive and apprentice Jonathan Sims in preparation for his uses. Assistants will be traumatized, friends will be made along the way, and as always remember the apocalypse is always much closer than you think. (Ongoing)

The Kindness of Strangers - theOestofOCs

What's that saying? That Hindsight is 20/20? After a rather delicately arranged meeting in eye neutral terf (read as not in the institute) on Tim's request, Jon is finally able to get the chance to really talk to Tim since… well everything. So when the two find themselves snagged by Breekon and Hope and handed over to Nikola Orsinov, let's just say Tim being in the wrong place at the wrong time was the least of their worries.

Content warning for disassociation, forced nudity and non-consensual touching (not sexual), this one is heavy on the angst, but if you, like me, really wanted Jon and Tim to get the chance to actually reconcile before the unknowing, and love seeing Tim's protective older brother side, then this is the fic for you. (Completed)

Stag Story - With_the_Wolves

Stag's are notoriously hard to capture in the wild, using magic to flee and disappear before any bullet comes close to touching them. As a results hunts are often drawn out and tedious in search of trophies, and notoriously difficult to pull of successfully, at least until one of the most respected of the Hunter's alliance, Elias, comes up with something of a solution.

A solution he keeps under lock and key and threat of iron burns and torture should he disobey. His precious bait stag, cowed and shaped to his will, and he's going to use him to finally kill the Beast of the Northern Forest. (Oneshot)

The Fates Design - theOestofOCs

Kept hidden, starving and without any memory of a time before Elias saved him, the Archive had resigned himself to a life under his care and in his service. He was the Archive after all, a danger to himself and the world, this was what he was for.

So when a thief climbs in through the window of his tower, and gives him a story to ease the pain of hunger and asks him to come with him, at least until Elias's return, he accepts. The want for the pain to end winning out over the safety of his tower and unfortunately, the knowledge that this is where he should be for the safety of the realm.

And then he meets a ginger haired man he couldn't be sure he'd only ever seen in his dreams, and things change.

Alternately titled by the author as the Tmagled au (which I absolutely love), this one puts a really intriguing TMA twist on the classic Rapunzel set up, with some added mystery that had me desperate for more.

As it stands it is still ongoing, and pretty new, but as of posting this has actually been updated fairly recently.

The Lives We've Shared - The OestofOCs

Jon finds something he shouldn't have, something someone took great lengths to keep hidden, and something Elias Bouchard doesn't want him listening to. A tape from Gertrude, hidden below a loose floorboard in his office, speaking with certainty of death and leaving a warning for her successor.

Needless to say Elias will do anything to make sure a secret like that doesn't come to light, so after a short flick of a blade across his throat, all he needs to do is clean up as much of the blood from the office as he can and start again with one of his assistants.

What no one accounted for though, was Jon coming back.

Completed fic where Jon dies and comes back as a ghost, with the single goal to protect his people as much as he can from Elias and others like him.

Fold, Fallow and Plough - theOestofOCs

Jon is a marine conservationist researcher, so when he sees the net squirming and rolling on the beach with something impossible inside, he does what he always has and cuts it free, regardless of any praise or recognition he might have gotten from the discovery.

So when the head of the Magnus institute of Marine discovery arrives moments later, fuming and demanding to know what happened to his catch, Jon certainly isn't going to apologize for doing the right thing. No matter what earning the man's ire might bring upon himself.

He just… he didn't expect this.

Have I mentioned I'm a big fan of Mermaid Body Horror? TW for abuse, non-consensual body modification and a lot of whump, featuring Mer Tim, Danny and Sasha as they try to walk their unexpected charge through a new life under the waves, as others above continue to search for the missing researcher. (Ongoing)

Darkling I listen (half in love) - theOestofOCs

Jon had never had a good feeling about their newest client Jonah Magnus, but it's not until he sees him one night crawling down the side of his castle with spiderlike grace that he truly comes to realize he's not human, and Martin needs to survive this. So, throwing caution to the wind and what he knows has to be all sense with it, he makes a deal with Magnus. Martin will be sent back to London under the guise that Jon will be continuing their work here, and Jon's life is forfeit.

But Magnus has far greater plans for his new pet, and no intention of letting him go that easily.

If you're me and you've read the original Dracula by Bram Stoker this is one hell of a treat. Just the right amount of TMA and Dracula plot points with some very well written body horror as Jonathan finds himself slowly turning into a creature of the night. (Ongoing)

The Archivist's Moving Castle - Hallali

In a world full of magic and monsters a plenty, Martin's life on its own has thus far been profoundly uninteresting. But dreaming of adventure in the hills was never a way to stay safe, and Martin has always been quietly content, if a fair bit lonely, tending to the town's library under the employ of one Peter Lukas. At least, that is, until a strange man full of magic of his own seeks his sanctuary and promises to help him escape, a hope Martin can at least hold onto for now even as his world twists beyond the limits of what he thought possible and he is cursed and forced to flee before Jon could even have the chance to return. Which is all well and good he could suppose, he needed to get out anyway, he just wished there were less monsters trying to kill him involved. (Ongoing)

[catofadifferentcolor]

Terrible Fic Ideas #5: The White Princess, but make it GoT

I have a terrible weakness for female!Jon Snow fics - mostly because making the character female gives a fascinating array of opportunities to unite two rival claims to the Iron Throne and all the drama that involves. So what about a fic where the people with the strongest claim to the throne - female!Jon Snow and Robert Baratheon - end up married?

Hear me out:

Much as Elizabeth of York objectively had a better claim to the throne than her husband, Henry VII, a female!Jon Snow (called Joanna from here on out) would have the Targaryen bloodline claim but no chance of getting on the throne herself even if she wasn't presented to the world as her uncle's bastard. Westeros doesn't abide female rulers.

But if you marry her bloodline claim to the man with the next best claim - her second cousin once removed, Robert Baratheon, who's actually got the throne - you have the strongest of any possible claim. One which could make the greatest number of factions happy, if only they knew about it.

But how to make it happen? It's easy to imagine Robert trying to take Joanna to bed, as she resembles her mother a great deal, but how to make it a legal union? I see two options:

One: In the aftermath of the Greyjoy Rebellion, Robert heads north, sees 14 year old Joanna looking the image of his lost love, and pulls out some ancient Targaryen law that lets the king have two wives. No one is particularly thrilled with this idea except for Robert, but he's the king and the most optimistic hope it will turn down his whoring. Or,

Two: In the aftermath of the Greyjoy Rebellion, Robert heads north after Cersei has been found in the act of adultery while he was at war, and seeing Joanna the image of his lost love demands they marry on the spot. No one's particularly happy with this scenario either, but at least it's not bigamy.

Either way, Joanna ends up in Kings Landing as a/the Queen and because Robert is his usual lusty self, winds up with a son in short order. If it Cersei's still in the picture, there's a lot of politicking and worry for her life and that of her child. If Cersei's gone, there's still politicking but with whatever Lannisters remain upset her child is replacing their prince, who they claim is legitimate still.

Sometime while she's still a relatively young bride of 16 or 17, while she's about halfway through her second pregnancy, Robert dies like in the book, and Joanna ends up the regent to her young son, the new king. There's a regency council of course, but she has more power than one might think at first glance.

The truth of her ancestry is never really announced so much as quietly discovered by multiple parties in multiple ways, who quietly go along with it because it suits their needs/politics/etc. Eventually the various parties wonder why everyone else is going along with it too, and after some poking it just sort of... comes out. It doesn't change anything, because inheritance puts her son's claim before her own, but it helps the last of her detractors.

As a side plot, Prince Oberyn comes to Kings Landing to swear Dorne's allegiance to the new king on his brother's behalf and strikes up a flirtation with Joanna. At first that's all it is, especially as she's just about to birth her second child, but they end up forming an odd friendship. Joanna likes Dorne and how they treat their bastards, and Dorne likes her because they think her mother was one of theirs. After 2 or 3 years of this, they marry. It's part political - draws in Dorne, helps make up for Elia's murder, and gives Joanna and her son a loyal defender - and part a love match - they get along and Joanna begrudges Oberyn his paramours no more than she'd begrudged Robert.

That's all I really have, but the idea tickles me. So feel free to borrow it, just link me if you ever do anything with it.

Other Jon Snow Headcanons: Aegon the Unyielding | Aemon the Adventurous | Lady Arryn | Lady Baratheon | Lady Lannister | Lady Stark | Prince Consort | Prince of Summerhall | Queen Mother

More Terrible Fic Ideas

[lnakoi]

Everyone talks about how Martin and Jon are the only ones out of the og archives crew to live throughout the series that's straight up not true. MARTIN was the only one out of the og archives crew to live. Jon is hanging out by a the worlds most spooky thread. Without the powers of paranormal immunity he would be dead. Which brings me to my point...

Hello, Reader. Apologies for the deception but I wanted to make sure you started reading, so I thought it best not to announce myself. You see the real reason behind this is for me to give My Opinion on who/how the archives og4 would survive on an island abandoned and how they might perish on that island. So content warning for their hypothetical death(s)

1. Jon. Look, my guy is so pathetic (affectionate) he would be the first to freak out and the first to die. They would either forget to find food or collapse from heat. Look I love Jon but try to tell me he can’t walk up multiple flights of stairs without being out of breathe. He might do fine with other people with him. He can think of a plan if needed but it varies from situation to situation. I also think it depends on who they are paired with that really determines if he would survive or not.

2. Tim would live for a WHILE while depending on the climate of the island he may do better or worse but Tim how experience outdoors and is a generally fit guy in my mind. Maybe not abs for days but he can handle a hike. I think that he would be resourceful enough to live for a while and if I had to choose what I think would be what gets him on this mystery island I would say he would eat something bad. Either not cooked enough or (what i think would be more likely) a wrong type of berry situation. If he was paired with Jon I think Jon would live. 

3. Sasha was the kid to buy the survival books in the book fair. She is PREPARED and READY. She might not be the most athletic but she IS the type to go on walks or runs daily so she has the physical stamina. She is also stubborn enough to be more mad at the situation than sad. She would be able to keep anyone with her alive and maybe leaving them a bit more exhausted then they would be otherwise even with being stranded on an island. I think if she would die it would be because of animals in the area (if their are any) or injures from anything. If she was in a group she would be voted to be in charge.

4. Martin would panic and be so stressed the entire time. He would be able to handle himself for the most part. He would try anything for whatever outcome multiple times but he would give up on that particular strategy. So he would move on until he knew what worked best and made a routine. He also would go out of his way to avoid killing animals unless he absolutely had to. I think if he was paired with someone else he would try harder for the both of them. He would do the same in a group. If he was paired with Tim or Sasha he would go along with them (it would work out better for his mental health though he would feel guilty from time to time) but he would work as an equal with Jon and Jon would drive him just insane enough to stay mentally sound (besides the exhaustion of just being there). He would probably have the same downfalls as Jon. More likely the heat exhaustion though.

Lists on how they would be saved

- A fire/smoke they started would be spotted from the air or see whether a fire was lit for the purpose of being spotted with it (sasha) or by coincidence (Jon, Tim, Martin)

- Building a boat! (As a group)

- Message in a bottle and it is received relatively quickly (Tim)

- H-E-L-P written out largely for planes (all of them because it was in a book/movie they’ve seen)

- Peter Lukas because Elias needs them to work

[dracharenae]

The   truth   of   who   he   is   had   hit   him   like   a   bucket   of   water,cold   in   the   dead   of   winter.   Perhaps   it   hurt   as   much   as   a   stab   to   the   heart   because   it   was   another   world   shattering   realization.   He   was   not   a   bastard,   or   perhaps   he   is   and   they   just   put   a   more   accurate   title.   If   what   Lyanna   and   Rhaegar   had   had   been   love   or   kidnapping   he   will   never   know   the   truth,   despite   a   marriage   paper   having   been   found.   If   anything,   he   is   as   royal   as   Daemon   Blackfyre   had   been   legitimizated.   and   that   is   when   his   brother   tells   him   Rhaenys   Targaryen   is   arriving   in   Winterfell   for   an   alliance   and   he   finds   himself   staying   on   the   Weirdwood   tree.  

Ghost   lays   at   the   tree's   roots,   masking   with   the   snow   until   eyes   open   up   and   his   eyes   match   those   of   the   Old   Gods.   Ghost   alerts   to   the   presence   of   someone   else   and   he   knows   it's   her.   He   turns   to   look   at   her   and   he   wonders,   if   there   is   comfort   in   the   fact   he   looks   nothing   like   the   father   who   abandoned   her.   Or   there   is   little   comfort,   as   he   looks   like   the   woman   whose   name   started   a   war.   "As   long   as   you,   perhaps.   A   little   longer   maybe.   The   red   woman.   .   .she   spoke   of   tales   of   ice   and   fire   and   princes   promised.   I   always   thought   to   be   just   talk."   He   hardly   trusts   Melisandre   but   she   did   brought   him   back,   such   a   feat   something   that   don't   usually   happens.  

Only   a   few   had   been   brought   back.   He   scoffs   at   it   as   the   direwolf,   as   big   as   he   is,   stands   on   his   side,   and   seeks   to   comfort   his   distress.   "As   far   as   the   North   is   aware,   I'm   still   Ned   Stark's   bastard.   .   .but   I   cannot   hide   the   truth   from   them."   His   sisters   have   claimed   that   it   made   no   matter   to   them,   he   is   their   brother   and   the   Northerns   might   accept   him   more   to   learn   he   is   the   child   of   Lyanna.   But   would   the   same   thing   be   accepted   of   Rhaegar's   blood?   Even   if   Jon   had   proven   himself   to   be   his   own   person.   "I'm   sorry.   For   what   was   done   to   you."

༺✹༻ THE PRINCE WHO WAS PROMISED. RHAENYS FEELS a cold plunge into her chest, as if she has just been stabbed by ice itself. she remembers her father holding little aegon, the babe babbling in his arms . . . he doesn't need a song, he is the song of ice and fire, rhaegar had told her, when she had asked him if he would write her baby brother a song. rhaenys had her own songs, after all, so why not her new brother ? ? ? his answer her perplexed her, but, then again, she was so young. she was barely still a babe herself, sitting at her father's feet with little balerion curled on her lap. now her father's words ring less of gentle love than they do of madness, yet another example of it. this prince of ice and fire had never been her aegon, it had been this man. the son of rhaegar targaryen and lyanna stark, ice and fire made flesh. there is little of rhaegar to be found in him, however. funny. rhaenys is a mirror vision of elia. jon must resemble lyanna. but it had been aegon who looked the closest to their father, and it is him who is dead.

hatred fumes inside of her. rhaenys has always tried to suppress her true rage towards her father. she wanted to cling to those happy memories and believe he did, in fact, love her and her family. but jon snow is proof to the otherwise. ❝ i don't trust the lady melisandre. i don't think i can trust anyone who keeps so closely to fire . . . and so passionate in the art of burning men and women alive, ❞ rhaenys finds herself saying, a grimace forming over her lips. there is something off about the red woman. it is more than her ethereal beauty and unnatural red eyes. there is a malice and madness lurking beneath her skin. like fire.

the red woman had placed her hopes entirely in stannis baratheon. he had been her king, before she forsook him in favor of jon snow. her loyalties are fickle. and rhaenys does not believe in any god, much less the kind who require such a sacrifice from their acoloytes. ❝ and why must they know, jon snow ? ? ? ned stark kept the secret to his grave. why share it now ? ? ? ❞ her tone is curious, searching. on one hand, he's right . . . the way everything is falling apart, she imagines the secret will be unveiled one way or the other . . . best to be told from his lips. yet she cannot help but to imagine the chaos that would ensue, especially with the dragon queen beginning her role in the game of thrones. her mind, however, slips in regards to jon's following words . . . she stands in bewilderment for a moment, lips parting in surprise. and then she sighs. ❝ you are the first person to ever apologize to me . . . and yet you are perhaps the person who owes it to me the least. our father doomed both of us, jon snow, if we can even call him that. ❞

[bluejayblueskies]

Please say more abt how Martin fits the closed off trait I'm begging 👁👁

Okay, so I got a bit carried away with this and it got quite lengthy....

I've put a TLDR above the cut and the details, transcripts, and general discussion below the cut!

.

TLDR: Martin is at his core a closed-off character who keeps his vulnerable feelings hidden and close to his chest. He instead focuses on caring for others and considering their feelings above his own, particularly in the case of Jon, who he cares for (sometimes to the point of self-sacrifice) throughout the podcast. His arc with the Lonely in season four and his interactions with Jon in season five demonstrate this lack of emotional vulnerability, and it's really only during the moments he spends by himself that we get significant insight into Martin's emotional state and inner thoughts.

.

Martin, to me, is a character who is very used to hiding how he feels. He tends to care for others at the expense of himself, has low self-esteem, and has a predilection towards the Lonely, all of which go hand-in-hand with somebody who is very used to hiding their emotions--particularly the negative ones--because they either think they're not important or that they're inconvenient and inappropriate for the situation. On a textual level, that's probably due to growing up with a sick (and likely unsupportive) mother who he had to take care of, where there was 'no time' for his emotions to get in the way or for him to prioritize himself in any way, shape, or form.

Martin is self-destructive, dislikes moments of emotional vulnerability, and (I would argue) genuinely struggles when he doesn't have somebody else to prioritize over himself. (His mother at first, but as the series goes on, Jon settles comfortably into this role for him.) Additionally, the biggest way that we, the audience, know anything about Martin's emotional state is when he's alone and self-reflecting (such as in MAG 170 and 186 or when talking to the tapes) or when he's forced to talk about something vulnerable (such as when Jon confronted him about his CV).

We don't get much insight into Martin's character between seasons one and three (at least not as much as we get in four and five), but I find myself drawn to this bit in MAG 118, when Martin is talking to Elias:

MARTIN

So what? I don’t get to be angry? I don’t get to burn things? Just, just run around, making tea, while everyone else gets to actually have feelings?

I think two things are important to note here. The first is that Elias is surprised (or least intrigued) that Martin is acting in this way--specifically, acting on his emotions in such a dramatic way. (And given that Martin is doing this as a distraction, rather than actually acting out because of his own emotions, maybe he's right to be surprised.) The second is that this line very much implies that Martin doesn't talk about how he's feeling, not like 'everyone else' does. He doesn't talk about it, doesn't act on it--just 'runs around, making tea.' And when Melanie comes back in after Elias is done, Martin immediately focuses on the plan and whether it succeeded, ignoring Melanie when she asks if he's okay or not. He closes himself off, and as far as we know, doesn't talk about it at all after that.

And then Jon goes into his coma, and we reach season four.

Martin is incredibly closed-off during season four. He's self-isolating, self-sacrificial, and approaching a state of genuine emotional numbness by the time he's cast into the Lonely. There's a lot to unpack there, but I'm going to focus on a few main things, many of which can be drawn from this bit in MAG 158:

MARTIN

It’s not him! It’s not anybody. It’s just me. Always has been. I…

When I first came to you, I thought I had lost everything. Jon was dead, my mother was dead, the job I had put everything into trapped me into spreading evil and I… I really didn’t care what happened to me. I told myself I was trying to protect the others, but… honestly we didn’t even like each other. Maybe I just thought joining up with you would be a good way to get killed.

And then… Jon came back, and… and suddenly I had a reason I had to keep your attention on me. Make you feel in control so you didn’t take it out on him. And if that meant drifting further away, so what? I’d already grieved for him. And if it meant now saving him, it was worth it.

When you started talking about the Extinction, though… you had me actually, then, for a while. But then – (laughs sardonically) then, you tried to make me the hero. Tried to sell me on the idea that I was the only one who could stop it. And that I’ve never sat right with me. I mean, I mean, look – look at me, I’m not exactly a – a chosen one. But by then I was in too deep. So I played along. Waited to see what your end game was, and here we are.

Funny. Looks like I was right the first time. It’s probably still a good way to get killed?

This monologue is a big insight into Martin's thought process during this season, and I'm mostly going to focus on two parts: the self-sacrifice and the prioritization of Jon.

Self-sacrifice

There's quite a bit of discussion about Jon's self-sacrificial tendencies, but less so about Martin's, both in this season and in season five. In my opinion, Jon's self-sacrificial tendencies originate from (among other things) survivor's guilt from his traumatic childhood experience with Mr. Spider, his increasing belief that he's less than human, and the fact that he prioritizes the lives of others over his own. Martin's self-sacrificial tendencies, while very similar, come from the fact that he thinks he only has worth if he can help and care for someone else and the fact that he doesn't think he's important enough to live. (For example, he says in MAG 158 that he's 'not exactly a chosen one' and says in MAG 198 that he's 'not important enough to kill.')

It's a subtle difference between these two things, and I would argue that while Jon's tendencies are more rooted in the 'help' (ie, 'I want to help other people and I will sacrifice myself to do it'), Martin's tendencies are more rooted in the 'hurt' (ie, 'I will sacrifice myself and other people will be helped in the process'). There is, of course, overlap, and it's not a black-and-white distinction between the two, but ultimately, I think Martin is so used to prioritizing others' emotions and needs above his own that when he's left mostly alone as he is at the end of season three, with the only person left to hold onto being in a coma (possibly forever), he falls back into the same patterns of self-destruction and closed-offness, only without the 'help' to go along with the 'hurt' because there is nobody left to help (especially after his mother dies). Ultimately, he joins up with Peter because he thinks it 'would be a good way to get killed.'

Prioritization of Jon

But then Jon wakes up from his coma, and now Martin has justification for his self-sacrifice again, because he can protect Jon by continuing to work with Peter!

... Maybe.

Jon isn't harmed by Peter during season four, sure, but he does climb into the coffin and visits Ny-Ålesund and is tracked down by Julia and Trevor and struggles emotionally and morally with his own humanity and is hurt, in a way, by the distance Martin puts between them. And I hesitate to place blame for the apocalypse on anybody but Jonah, but if we're going to argue in-canon that Jon was responsible for the apocalypse (he wasn't, but that's not the point of this post), then Martin contributed to that blame and responsibility because it was his actions and decisions that ultimately drew Jon into the Lonely and resulted in him getting the 14th and final mark. (Again, I don't think Jon or Martin are at fault for the apocalypse, but if we were to blame Jon, we could blame Martin as well.) It was only after getting that mark that Jonah was able to use Jon to end the world, something that was hugely hurtful for Jon. So did Martin really protect Jon at all by staying away from him and continuing to work with Peter? Or was that just a convenient excuse to keep self-destructing?

Jon and Martin, in my opinion, had very similar arcs in season four. Martin was sinking further into the Lonely and Jon was sinking further into the Eye. We hear a lot more about Jon's emotional struggle with this given that he's the POV character, sure, but Jon also talks about this with other people. He talks about it to Helen (MAG 152):

JON

…

When does it stop?

HELEN

(impatient) What?

JON

The guilt. The misery. All the others I’ve met, they’ve been – cold, cruel. They’ve enjoyed what they do. When does the Eye (inhale) make me monstrous?

And to Daisy (MAG 136):

JON

My – (large sigh) My memories of the coma are not clear, but I know I made a choice; I made a choice to become… something else. Because I was afraid to die. But ever since then, I – I don’t know if I made the right decision; I’m stronger now, tougher, I can – (he cuts himself off) If I do die, now, or get sealed away somewhere forever? I don’t know if that’s a bad thing. And I don’t want to lose anyone else, so if I can maybe – stop that happening, and the only danger is to me, I – I’ll do it in a heartbeat; worst case scenario, the universe loses another monster.

But all we really get from Martin are the things he tells the tapes when he's alone and the monologue he gives in MAG 158. It makes sense that he wouldn't be as open, yes, given the nature of the Lonely, but I can't help but think of (MAG 154):

JON

The Lonely’s really got you, hasn’t it?

MARTIN

(no hesitation) You know, I think it always did.

Jon was always curious and hungry for knowledge; the Eye amplified it. Martin was always closed-off and isolated; the Lonely amplified that as well.

But then Jon pulls Martin out of the Lonely, they flee to the safehouse, and three weeks later, the apocalypse begins. Martin isn't as consumed by the Lonely as he was in season four, he's with Jon--the person he loves--for extended periods of time, and they're in an extremely stressful situation that's sure to be incredibly emotionally charged. There's a lot to be said about Jon's emotional vulnerability during season five and how Martin both pressures him for it and rejects it in different ways, but for the purposes of this post, I won't go too far into detail about the motivations behind how Jon is feeling and acting.

I will say, however, that in season five, Martin still continues to place a lot of focus on asking Jon how he's feeling, encouraging (or pressuring) him to share, and getting frustrated when Jon can't or doesn't (MAG 167):

MARTIN

Okay, so how exactly would you describe your current emotional state regarding all of this?

JON

I –

MARTIN

(overlapping) Go on, I’m all ears.

JON

I feel…

MARTIN

(go on) Mhm.

JON

(sigh) I feel… sad.

[Brief pause.] MARTIN

(flat) Sad.

JON

Very sad.

MARTIN

(*very* flat) Very sad.

[He sighs slightly as he says it. Their bags jangle.]

A few moments prior to this, Martin expresses displeasure that Jon is Knowing things about him, specifically pointing out his emotions (MAG 167):

MARTIN

It’s just – it’s weird knowing that you can know literally everything I think and feel. E-Especially since you’re not exactly the most open of people – emotionally, I mean.

I think Martin is making an effort to open up more to Jon. But I still think it's difficult for him to talk about how he feels so openly, and while he is completely in the right for not wanting Jon to Know things about him without his permission, I think it's interesting that the focus is on his feelings and that he brings up how Jon isn't emotionally open immediately after. It scares Martin to think that Jon could know, at any given moment, how he's feeling, and I think it's partially because he's not used to that level of vulnerability. He turns the focus on Jon, away from himself, and doesn't really make an effort to talk about how he's feeling about all of this, instead prioritizing Jon's feelings and mental state like he's grown comfortable with.

And when Martin bottles up his emotions--of which there are a lot, in such a stressful environment, they can explode out in hurtful ways:

MARTIN

(overlapping) I know! I know, okay, I just – (bracing exhale) Look, I j,just – don’t want to get burned, all right? It’s, it’s like my least favorite pain ever.

JON

Is that – a joke?

MARTIN

(a bit faster, a bit shaky) No, no, okay? I, I legitimately hate burns, alright? They’re, they’re awful, and they scar horribly, and they just – it – it just makes me sick; I, I hate it. Hate it!

I don't think Martin really thought about what he was saying when he told Jon, who has a large burn scar on his hand, that burn scars make him sick, and I don't think he meant it maliciously. But he'd spent the greater portion of the conversation talking around the fact that he didn't like burns and that was why he didn't want to go into the building, and so when it finally ended up coming out, it did so in an explosion of emotion rather than a conscious decision to share. Martin doesn't have a good handle on his emotions, and he doesn't have a good handle on sharing them.

(Is it too much for me to say that Martin was more emotionally vulnerable with himself in MAG 170 than he was with Jon when Jon finally found him?)

Throughout season five, Martin asks Jon questions, he expresses frustrations with Jon, he shows discomfort or fear at times, but for as much as Martin feels frustrated that Jon isn't talking about how he feels about their situation, Martin really isn't doing so either. The most he talks about his feelings is in MAG 170 and MAG 186, when he's by himself, and I remember MAG 186 in particular because before that, we really didn't know what Martin was thinking about for the majority of the season! And in this episode, we find out a lot of very important things about Martin's character. Like (MAG 186):

ALSO MARTIN

Look, I know what you know. Maybe I’m just a bit more… open about it.

Also-Martin acknowledges that Martin often doesn't say what he means and hides what he really feels, telling him that it's 'hard to be vulnerable,' and Martin is initially very resistant to the idea. And then, when Also-Martin suggests that Martin wants to stay so that he can be 'quietly sad,' we get (MAG 186):

MARTIN

We could talk to Jon about it.

ALSO MARTIN

We could. But we both know that loved ones make the worst therapists. They’re too wrapped up in trying to stop you hurting to actually help. But hey, we know all about that, am I right?

MARTIN

There’s nothing wrong with comforting people.

ALSO MARTIN

A cup of tea isn’t a resolution. At best it’s a… a plaster. At worst… a muzzle.

This is very interesting to me, because for all that Martin tries to help other people, he also believes that comfort doesn't always help and that you can't be your loved one's 'therapist.' I think this gives a lot of insight into why Martin doesn't share his emotions with the people he cares about, especially Jon; he doesn't want to put Jon in the position where he'll become his 'therapist,' and he doesn't necessarily think Jon can help. So instead, Martin just chooses not to be vulnerable at all, because he doesn't want to burden the people he cares about. But, when it's just him (MAG 186):

ALSO MARTIN

Don’t lie. You don’t need to. Not here. It’s just us.

He doesn't feel like he needs to pull his emotional punches. He can't accidentally hurt somebody or put them in an awkward position; it's just himself. But what's said to himself remains with himself, and (at least on tape), he doesn't discuss any of this with Jon. Not even the bit about, if it came down to it, Martin would have rather had Jon smite him than continue to rule over a domain. He goes right back to being closed-off around Jon, but now we, the audience, know what lies underneath, and how little of it reaches the surface.

In fact, the thing Martin's probably most vocal about is how Jon's feelings about himself bother him (MAG 199):

MARTIN

I guess that’s why it really bothers me, you know? I try, but I can’t actually imagine ever making a decision that I knew meant losing you.

And it… It hurts to know you can.

And I think he has a tendency to use anger and frustration to cover up hurt, shying away from the admission that something Jon's done has hurt him (an incredibly vulnerable thing) and instead relying on the less-vulnerable and more external anger to cover it. This is more speculation than true analysis, but I think that's a lot of what's happening in MAG 200, when he discovers that Jon has already assumed the position of the pupil and has, in Martin's eyes, broken his promise.

.

TLDR: Martin is at his core a closed-off character who keeps his vulnerable feelings hidden and close to his chest. He instead focuses on caring for others and considering their feelings above his own, particularly in the case of Jon, who he cares for (sometimes to the point of self-sacrifice) throughout the podcast. His arc with the Lonely in season four and his interactions with Jon in season five demonstrate this lack of emotional vulnerability, and it's really only during the moments he spends by himself that we get significant insight into Martin's emotional state and inner thoughts.

[i-want-it-on-fire]

Not sure how coherent this is going to be, but I have had Some Thoughts™ that have been pinging around in my head for a while now, but I'm still not sure how to properly articulate them.

You know what fucks me up about the final episode and about Jon's character arc in general? Agency. Like I haven't actually seen a lot of meta about the finale or reactions to it, but I know one of mine was "Jon wtf omg why" which was immediately followed by "oh wait oh no of course he fucking did this, this is so sad." Because something that's always fucked me up about him is how little choice he's had in anything that's happened to him during the show and just how cruel other characters are to him about that from the very beginning.

Season 3 is a notable example when Elias (I can't call him Jonah, it feels wrong lmao) tells Jon that maybe he never wanted to be an avatar/the Archivist but he "absolutely did choose it." Which is such a horrible thing to say to someone (especially someone you are actively manipulating into being your doomsday device.) There might be others, which I'll probably go back and find if I choose to write a full essay on this.

And the cruelty of Jon's whole situation really stood out to me with Annabelle's "and then we took his voice" comment. Because that's an extremely loaded sentence. The Web literally used his voice to construct its escape plan, but it also took away any agency or say Jon had in what was happening to him or the people around him. It took his voice both literally AND figuratively, and based on his immediate reaction to that statement, I don't think that was lost on him.

Jon's entire journey during this podcast (even his entire life if you want to take what Annabelle said at face value) has been one big chess game played by things bigger than him that absolutely do not care about him as a person. His whole life has been a charade leading up to this moment: ending the world, and then potentially ending it for other worlds as well. And at every turn the people orchestrating it have taunted him with the fact that he can't do anything about it.

Like...how fucked up is that?

I wondered in the moment why he would go behind everyone's backs (Martin's ESPECIALLY) like that at the end, but when I thought about it for more than a second I realized there's nothing else he could have done. That was his last opportunity to have any say in what happened to him, the world, or the Fears, and because of all the trauma he's been through and never really had the chance to recover from, of course he decided he wasn't going to let this kind of thing happen to anyone else, even if it meant betraying the people he loved and dooming his world all over again.

And I think what makes it worse is that I don't think anyone else ever really understood how much making that choice mattered to him, even if it wasn't the "right" one (though we could argue all day about which choice was the "right" one in that scenario. I would argue there wasn't one.) And I think part of the tragedy is that had Jon been better at reaching out to other people throughout the course of the series or had people reached out to him more, this may not have happened. And because of everything that happened to these characters, the ways in which it happened, and how they all reacted to it, I'm not sure how capable any of them were of doing that.

It's easy to judge people for how they respond to trauma when you're not in the thick of it, but when you're stuck in the middle of a horrible situation like that? Sometimes you feel like all you can do is try to survive. Trauma makes you feel like, well...like you have no agency. And sometimes it's impossible to know what exactly is going to be the thing that pulls you out of it and into a healthier place (though not being trapped in an eldritch library designed to feed people to evil gods probably would have helped.) The tragedy is that Jon's situation and the situation of everyone else around him feels like it could have been prevented, but it became so tangled and messy that it's impossible to say that fixing just one thing would have stopped it, and if you follow those threads long enough, you start to wonder if it could have been stopped at all.

[voiceless-terror]

I mean, I don’t believe in the predictive power of dreams, obviously, but still, it’s a deeply unsettling thing to find. I had Tim look into it, as I don’t entirely trust the others not to have written it as a practical joke and slipped it into the archives. - Episode 11, Dreamer

Jon stares down at the paper in his hands.

He’s had many an unkind thought towards Gertrude, his predecessor, the woman responsible for this mess and the current bane of his existence. She’s been the topic of most of his grumbling as he sorts through piles of nonsense and decaying cardboard boxes. He’s got no love lost for her, but that doesn’t mean he’s happy she’s dead. Or, specifically, to have a statement apparently predicting it through the medium of some prophetic dream. Ridiculous. He wants to feel detached, unaffected, but he can’t help the sickly sense of dread that creeps up his spine and lingers in his throat. 

It was your face and the expression upon it was far more fearful than any I had seen in eight years of wandering this twilight city.

Jon doesn’t know Antonio Blake and has no reason to believe him. But he’s known something’s wrong for a long time now.

He’s never admitted it aloud, never within his assistant’s hearing range, but he can feel it, as foolish as that sounds. This miasma of wrong, of being watched, of becoming...something else, that happens every time he records a statement. Despite the academic detachment he aspires to, he does attempt to empathize with each statement-giver and get into their mindset. But what he’s doing here...it’s different. He can visualize it so perfectly, the terror in their words sticking in his throat and setting his own heart pounding, as if he were the one experiencing it and not just regurgitating it to an ancient recorder. He’s always had an ‘overactive imagination,’ as his grandmother would say, but this is relentless in its manifestation. The fear is real, not imagined. Each statement draws him further and further away from the safety he used to cling to, where the only real cases were few and far between and the most sinister things lurking out there in the world were books and the monsters within them.

And as much as he wants to linger on the false accounts and take comfort in tearing them apart, his hands automatically seek the real ones, the right ones. It’s frightening, the ease with which he finds them nowadays. Perhaps he’s a better archivist than he thinks. 

She died and you’ll be next, something whispers to him. He’s being dramatic, as he’s wont to do, but it feels true. Every statement that doesn’t record correctly, every follow-up he has to qualify with an ‘I would dismiss this, but-’ is starting to add up. His nights have become restless. He often lies awake regretting that he ever took this job, that he left the relative safety of research for a position he’s not sure how to fill, his only reassurance Elias’s occasional emails that he’s ‘moving in the right direction,’ whatever that means.

Jon assumed he’d be more removed from the dangerous aspects of the job that research entailed- following up, going to locations, field work. And it’s true, he has assistants to do that for him now. Dependable, for the most part. And while he should feel safe in his tiny office with nothing but dust and paper and cobwebs (good lord, the cobwebs) he feels more unsettled and exposed than ever. He once joked he’d die of old age before getting the archives in order. But now a stroke sounds much more pleasant than whatever happened to Gertrude. If it’s true.

Perhaps it’s a joke, he thinks. Planted by one of the others, designed specifically to unsettle him. Well, it worked. 

It wouldn’t be surprising. He’s...not had the best start. The promotion was a surprise, but not wholly unexpected; he knew he’d been on Elias’s radar, though he wasn’t expecting it quite so soon. He’s young and unfortunately, it shows. The way he stutters through department meetings, talking about digitization while the others, all of whom have at least a decade on him, shoot pitying looks. He stays later and later, the desire to show some sort of progress even as he discovers more mess by the day. The permanent scowl that now graces his features becomes his armor as he walks the halls and feels himself becoming the uptight, unlikable curmudgeon everyone believes him to be. The one time I measure up to expectations, he can’t help thinking.

A joke. There’s a comfort in that. At least it’s familiar.

But it didn’t record to the laptop, his traitorous mind supplies. It's a bit sad he would prefer it to be a mundane attempt at bullying rather than a real expression of the supernatural, but he supposes it’s par for the course. There were many nights as a child he wished for the same thing, for that boy to go back to taking his lunch money and the occasional beating or two instead of…still, he dismisses it from his mind. You don’t know there’s a correlation. Follow up. Disprove it. 

He’s interrupted from his musings by a knock on the door and the vague outline of Martin through the frosted glass. “Come in,” he calls, attempting to inject some irritation in his voice to cover up the shakiness. “Did you need something?”

“Ah, I finished my write up for the Herbert case, was wondering if you had anything else for me?”

His hand hovers over the statement on his desk. He opens his mouth but then closes it, thinking better.

“Can you send Tim in, actually?”

______

“Sorry boss, I couldn’t find anything on this Antonio Blake fellow- well, at least with the details he provided, which were next to none. Proper spooky, though.”

Of his assistants, he trusts Tim the most with this sort of thing. 

On a surface level, it wouldn’t make sense to some. Tim can be loud and gregarious: the typical, charming extrovert. But he’s not unkind and he’s a hell of a researcher, especially when something grabs his interest. He digs into statements and doesn’t let go- not unlike Sasha, though he’s a bit better at empathizing and handling things...sensitively. Easily attuned to Jon’s moods, Tim’s always been willing to lend an ear whenever he gets too in his head about cases, helping him talk things through or on several memorable occasions, go down the rabbit hole with him. He’d taken the statement from his hands with an easy smile, though his face grew serious with the nervous look Jon shot him.

And if Tim couldn’t find anything, well. Maybe it was a prank after all.

He sort of wanted it to be true, frightening as the implications were. Because then it would mean this terrible, heavy feeling on his shoulders was real, and not just the byproduct of his own mediocrity. He doesn’t want to be scared, he doesn’t want to be in danger, but at least it would provide a real reason for panic, and not just his own inability to measure up.  He doesn’t want to prove them all right, collapsing under the stress of a job poorly done and so easily crumbling at a stupid, made-up statement, targeted as it may be. 

“A joke, then.” Jon says, rubbing a hand at his temples, trying not to let the hurt seep into his voice. Tim makes a commiserating noise.

“You know how people are, the institute isn’t exactly popular. You remember last Halloween, when-”

“Yes, I don’t need a reminder.” Jon sighs. He’d rather not relive that day, stressful as it was. “But that wasn’t quite what I was thinking.”

Tim stares at him for a moment, uncomprehending. Jon continues, attempting to make his hands busy as he pointlessly shuffles papers.

“It’s rather pointed, isn’t it? I doubt someone off the street would create such a detailed account of the death of an...archivist as opposed to the usual ghostly drivel.”

A look of pity flickers in Tim’s eyes and Jon has to turn away. “I don’t really think anyone here would-”

“Really? You don’t?” Jon lets out a mirthless laugh, rubbing a hand across his face as he stares down at his desk. “I’m not blind. Or deaf.” The derisive snorts if he goes off on ‘needless tangents,’ how Rosie pretends to be busy whenever he approaches Elias’s office, the way his name badge still reads ‘researcher’ after months of asking for a new one. He’s basically become a pariah.

“Jon, did someone say something to you?” The words are carefully chosen and he’s leaning forward now, making as if to stand up and god forbid, do something comforting. It’s not that Jon doesn’t want the comfort; he craves it more than anything. But he’s gone without for so long he doesn’t trust himself not to break at the gentlest of touches. Being on the receiving end of Tim’s protective streak is nothing new, but he shouldn’t need his assistant looking out for him like he’s some sort of helpless infant. 

He snorts derisively instead, covering up the insecurity and hurt with a sardonic, self-effacing smile. The kind he knows Tim hates. “They don’t need to. I’ve walked in on conversations, I’ve seen the way people go quiet, the looks they give me-”

“Hey,” Tim’s voice is low, like he’s dealing with a frightened animal. Jon wonders how he looks, if Tim’s going this soft. “Don’t listen to them, alright? You inherited a mess, we all did- but we’re doing our best, yeah? Study and record, like Elias said.” Jon doesn’t dodge the hand that finally lands on shoulder, and he’ll deny to anyone that he leaned into it. 

“Study and record.” He repeats listlessly, slumping back down into his seat. He’s let himself get too worked up, acting like a child instead of a boss. He’s not sure when he started wearing his heart on his sleeve, but Tim’s always been good at reading him. Though he’d rather people think him an arrogant ass than the seething mess of insecurity he truly is. 

“Atta boy.” The pat to his shoulder is purposefully light, devoid of Tim’s usually friendly force that sends him stumbling forward. “Now get out of here at a normal time, alright? We can grab lunch tomorrow. Just the two of us, if you like.”

Jon makes a noncommittal grunt, though the thought is nice.  He entertains the idea for just a moment, remembering their occasional outings back in research. Tomorrow he’ll make his excuses. He hasn’t been much of a friend as of late, and he’s not sure he deserves the kindness of company.

“And if there’s anyone that needs a stern talking to from me, I-” Tim wags a finger and Jon rolls his eyes, ignoring the pang of warmth the words send through his chest.

“Don’t, please. It’s fine.” It isn’t. “But...thank you, Tim.”

“Course.” A wink and a sloppy salute to lighten the mood, and Jon feels the tension in his posture ease minutely as Tim shuts the door behind him. 

He lets out a breath and reaches for the tape recorder. He’s wasted too much time already.  

Be careful. There is something coming for you and I don’t know what it is, but it is so much worse than anything I can imagine. At the very least, you should look into appointing a successor.

Good luck.

He fights a shiver as the man’s voice leaves him and the last vestiges of that twilight world fade back to his dimly-lit office. In his follow up, he tries to play it off as a joke. A bit of hazing for the new boss. And yet the uneasiness still creeps into his voice, and he ends another tape on a stilted, half-believed note.

If this is genuine…

Jon prays that it isn’t. 

And like most of his prayers, it goes unheard and unanswered.

ao3: https://archiveofourown.org/works/32165071

reblogs > likes

[katshuya]

Rhaegar wasn't perfect to Elia. He was just complex. You people just don't get it.

Rhaegar was a poor depressed prince and a good husband and father, and his bad actions were not so bad because he was depressed. It's enough that he didn't force Elia to have a third child, so that means he was a good husband. Even though he impregnated her during recovery or immediately after recovery of six months being bed ridden and you people just don't understand complexity and that when you are in a political marriage, cheating isn't cheating.

Thank you, Rhaegar Targaryen, for not being the complete asshole you could have been. What a great husband, father, and man you were that you never ended up killing her by childbirth.

For such kindness, you deserved to go love someone else on your wife whose health was ruined further because of you and your prophecy. Nothing is wrong with cheating on your politically married wife. It's not cheating.

You all are just idiots who can't get through your heads that he did enough. I'm sorry the poor, complex man in his twenties didn't win you jerks.

So what if he got her pregnant when she was just out of recovery? He was a man with purpose! He needed to fulfill the prophecy. It was either that or she/her health forced him to find another woman. It wasn't his fault. He tried people! He tried! He needed the third baby.

And he ended up right! This child had to be from Lyanna. Jon snow is Lyanna's child. It's not so good for Elia and all the sacrifices she made, but it's what it is. Rhaegar was right. He tried with Elia. It was not his fault, he needed to save the world. Elia's humiliation and sacrifices were just small prices.

We have little evidence that there was anything romantic between him and Elia.....we also don't have an actual evidence that there was no attraction or a romance blooming but still! The point is he did enough by not killing her.

I mean we don't see Naerys or Cersie let their husbands have other women willingly just because they don't like them but so what?

Selsye also doesn't tell Stannis to go get his boy from any other woman but so what?

Most marriages in Westeros, including Ned and Cat's, were political, and some ended in love other weren't happy about their cheating husbands.

But Rhaegar was different, you idiots. He fought for his family over a war he very much had huge hand in starting it and hid with his girl for more than a year while his family were very safe at dragonstone that belongs to his mad father with all the obedient knights in there.

He was a depressed man in his tweenties who finally fell in love after less than 2 years of his political marriage that in no way was or could have ended in romance like Cat and Ned's. Let that sink in.

Rhaenys whom he left when she was less than 2 and returned when she was about 3 knew Rhaegar well and loved him! She didn't know what he did and was doing considering she was only about 3 but she loved a man that was nice to her. That is enough evidence!

So what if he wasn't perfect to Elia? He was a depressed man in his tweenties who deserved love you heartless brainless jerks. You will never get brain. See how I so smartly recognized his mistakes and that he wasn't perfect, but I still know he was complex! Likable! You people can't recognize a complex jerk character when you see one. You aren't thoughtful.

I can't believe it goes over your heads. God, this fandom is impossible.

Rhaegar and lyanna are different. They are special love story.

LOL!

[buildoblivion]

I've been thinking a lot about mag 81 recently. Specifically, I've been wondering how much we as the audience knowing about "a guest for mr spider" colours our perspective of Jon as a person throughout the rest of tma.

Because I have chronic "must like the protagonist" syndrome, I've always personally had a soft spot for Jon even before we see a more vulnerable side of him in s3. But I can't deny that hearing his tragic backstory was a game-changer in how much I really empathized and understood him for the rest of the show.

There's that post on here somewhere about how hearing about his childhood, finding out he was an orphan, raised by a distant but dutiful at best, neglectful and bitter at worst grandmother, and then went through truly supernatural levels of trauma and guilt on top of that doesn't necessarily excuse his more dickish tendencies in s1 and 2, but it sure does help us understand him. The number of times I relisten to that ep and go "oh that's why you are the way that you are", and then go back further to s1 and s2 with episodes like mag 4 ("Page Turner") and mag 16 ("Arachnophobia") and go like "... ooooohhhhh I am very very sad".

Like we know from s1 that Jon's scepticism is a coping mechanism. We know that he cares about his assistants and does all sorts of human things like stuttering when he's scared and forming attachments to cool goth kids who also hate Leitners. But mag 81 adds a whole new level to that. "A guest for mr spider" really does peel back the tape to see a whole person who has been very very afraid and very very alone for a long time. Add on top of that the fact we meet Georgie and get to hear what a "weird ex-boyfriend who stress cleans and loves cats" Jon sounds like, the episode is perfect.

But we're the only ones who get to hear all that. Jon never brings up "mr spider" to anyone else and the only other character who brings it up is fucking Jonah when he gloats about how the web marked Jon for him as he forces him to end the world.

No one else knows! They don't get to see like us how Jon has been tied up in this before he lost all his baby teeth. They don't get to see how he's been carrying the guilt for the death of a bully more than twice his age and has been so very scared that one day whatever got him might come back and finish the job.

And then I think about s3 and s4, where pretty much all of Jon's allies either start to or double down on hating him, blaming him for the way their lives have all gone to shit and berating him for not making the right choices. When we know that the "choice" that set Jon down this path was opening a children's picture book.

I don't know. I just wonder how different our view of Jon might be if we didn't know how far back this all went. If we'd just heard him talk with Georgie, and skipped straight on to Elias sending the statements and let the story go from there? Sure we'd see the tragic hot mess that Jon was in s3 onwards as he desperately tries to do right by everyone else, but would we really appreciate how little agency Jon really had? What if Jon's backstory hadn't been revealed till late series four, or five even when other characters get a broad sense that the web had "marked" Jon for something but little more than that?

I know half of what makes tma so great is this handling of perspective, and that long "Chekov's gun" about mr spider finally being let off in s5 is what makes the end reveal about hilltop road etc. so impactful. Would the ending be so tragic if we didn't have all this time with the knowledge that Jon's first mark was the spider? But I think about how from pretty much the whole rest of the cast's perspective that's how it goes.  They have no idea how far these webs are actually tied around Jon, let alone how much his life really was tragic even before he stepped foot in the magnus institute.

And yet I can't imagine Jon ever telling any of them (except perhaps Martin maybe? Idk I always imagined Jon told him in the safehouse but that's just me). Why would he reveal it? When?  He’s not an open, sharing person like that, and he doesn't really understand the nature of his upbringing and the true gravity of what happened to him until it's far too late.

And in a story about knowledge, the consequences of seeking it and the tragedy of withholding it, I wonder how different it might have been if perhaps that tape went astray, or maybe one night there was just a little too much wine and it all came spilling out.

I don't think it would have "fixed" anything, but maybe it might have taken longer before Jon was cursed as a "monster", maybe Jon would not be so quick to believe it? Maybe he might have had a few more allies before it all came crashing down.