#bg3 cyric

[theannoyingurge]

Continued: Raphael, Bhaal, Withers (yes, even Bone Man is deceiving you) and the Strange Ox (he's lying to everyone, but especially You) Raphael - Knows you stole the crown with Gortash (thanks for the source!). Knows you probably did gross sex stuff with his former prisoner/foster son, whom he is now sending you off to kill. He knows all this and it eats at him, because telling you would make it harder to manipulate you into giving it back. That's His Crown that he wrote 100 chapters of fanfiction about obtaining, and His Stupid Bootlicker to get revenge on, and here he is reciting poetry to You and offering you deals that don't even include selling your soul (at first) and probably listening to you make fun of him at every opportunity. You can tease him about failing to steal it himself, and he pointedly leaves out the key detail that you were one of the annoying mortals who stole it. And then you can fuck his personal incubus and roast him again! Gotta love this game. Bhaal - Was dead for over a century before supposedly crafting Durge from his own gore. Or via 'divine parthenogenesis' depending on the dialog. Sometimes you're called his purest spawn. Other times you are 'spillage'. Whatever the fuck is going on with Durge's conception story, Bhaal is a lying bastard about it. (This one has little to do with amnesia, just carrying the theme of gaslighting my favorite murder woobie.)

Withers - Totally knew who you were from the beginning. Was/Is Jergal, the Lord of the End of Everything and OG god of Death. May or may not still be the BBEG, depending on how far you're willing to look into the future (to get to his ultimate goal of resetting time itself to a backup save of the universe that his super intelligent alien race created just before blowing themselves up and producing a baby God of Death named Jergal.) Jergal was responsible for the construction of ancient Netheril, the growth of the art of Necromancy among humans, the subsequent fall of Netheril (having manipulated Karsus from birth), and the ascension of the Dead Three. He can thus be held personally responsible in several ways for the Absolute crisis - not only for promoting the Dead Three in the first place, but via the crown that his divine grandchild eventually stole from Hell itself and did evil shenanigans with. Fun fact, he used to date Shar and may have incited horrors beyond all comprehension that we can't even list here. He canonically enjoys fucking with Shar and the Dead Three for funsies. He also exploits the Cult of the Dragon to blow up dracoliches in the faces of tyrants who get on his nerves. He might be using his twisted sense of humor for the power of the Greater Good nowadays. (Depends on how closely Kelemvor watches his butler, I guess.) TL;DR: When Withers brings Resist!Durge back from the dead, and claims he is now your advocate in both life and the City of Judgement, he may or may not just be covering his own ass. Whatever he showed Arabella is also sketchy. Don't assume granddad (aka 'The Pitiless One') has gone soft just yet. You are a pawn in a whole new scheme now. But at least this one has family reunions! And they don't even feature incest! You'll catch more flies with honey, Bhaal. The Strange Ox - Okay hear me out. It worships Cyric. End. (Just kidding! This one is itching to break free.) The Strange Ox seems to recognize that you're also a monster trying to be a person, and it uses this weird cameraderie to convince you to smuggle it into the city. The city where Bhaal currently reigns as Lord of Murder, after usurping Cyric ~10 years ago (who usurped him first). It was The Dark Urge who revived the the cult of Bhaal, a feat which presumably entails killing or reforming any existing murder cultists who worshipped Cyric. And now you're bringing his worshippers back, after wiping out Bhaal's temple for him. I cannot believe I'm saying this, but I think Cyric may have won this one. Like, I told my dad to get fucked, but I love that stupid ox. I will never stop gnawing on the letter Withers penned to the Dark Sun at the epilogue party. Please let my puny mortal mind understand it. Please.

Playing with the idea that none of the bg3 villains are fully honest with Durge. Everyone is hiding some piece of the puzzle and happy to abuse the amnesia situation to their advantage. 'Cept Kressa. She's psycho, but she's an honest psycho. In another life, we might have been friends.

Ketheric is the first, most obvious example of this. He doesn't even bother to inform the other Chosen you've reappeared. (Myrkul is the god of exhaustion, so this tracks.)

Balthazar also 100% recognizes you and also doesn't even bother. To him, your amnesia means no tedious reunions with annoying Bhaalspawn who are big mad that he stole their brother's name and rib bones.

The Emperor is sometimes overlooked when piecing together Durge's history, but he admits to knowing your past if you reject him in Act 3 (stating "I know everything about you" while threatening to turn you into a puppet like Duke Stelmane). Whether or not he's posturing, he should at least be aware of your past with Gortash, considering you helped kidnap him in the first place. For evidence, see Gortash's interrogation notes, which open with "When we captured you". (Sure, this could refer to Orin, but I simply do not see these two working as a highly functional team. More on this and the timeline below the cut.) Naturally, despite traveling together for months, The Emperor wouldn't want to fill any gaps in your memory that might cast doubt on his trustworthiness or help align you with his enemy.

The Absolute might be lying about respecting you/your plan and preferring you over your replacement. I am of two minds about this. If you were attacked immediately after crowning the brain, there should be no basis for a preferential relationship. In that case, the brain is just stroking your ego and need for approval. However, I have doubts about Durge being taken down during the initial raid.** I think some time must have passed after crowning the Absolute, giving it the chance to develop a working relationship with you that it lacked with the other Chosen, which caused everything to fall apart after you were tadpoled. This also buys us time to kidnap the Emperor and bring it under the Absolute's thrall as described in Gortash's interrogation notes.

**Some of Gortash's other notes claim Durge was lost during the first raid, but his journals are full of contradictions. He leaves the House of Hope out of his memoirs entirely. He seemingly retcons history to present himself in a more favorable light, which probably includes intentionally diminishing the work of his allies (or erasing the painful memory of his nearest and dearest). In any interpretation, the brain definitely hates Gortash the most, and that's good enough for me.

Orin and Gortash paint somewhat conflicting pictures of you pre-tadpole. The difference here might be genuine (the honest perspectives of a little sister vs a business partner or lover) or it could be a manipulative game of tug of war over your budding and impressionable self image.

Now, I like Durgetash - but I like every possible interpretation of these assholes, not just the mutually reciprocated and/or sexy ones. It's conceivable to me that Gortash may have discovered Durge's crush on him via the Prayer for Forgiveness and played up their history in Act 3 as a defensive measure. Maybe Gortash always knew of Durge's feelings and used them to his advantage (Orin outright tells you this, but again, nobody listens to Orin. Sorry sis).

It's also conceivable that he knew Durge was the first to be tadpoled, considering how close their pod was to his workbench. The brain was given orders to transform the party (that were resisted several times), so Gortash's surprise that Durge still lives makes sense, assuming he even knew Durge was with them (he doesn't seem to be checking the scrying eyes at all. What kind of loser tyrant ignores his own surveillance system? I digress). His general relief and preference for them over Orin is also still valid. (I imagine he feels something along the lines of Durge being the one who got away, you don't know what you've got until it's gone, etc etc. Cue hysterical bonding as the long lost love of his life waltzes into his coronation covered in blood to save him from their psychotic sister and the poorly housetrained Netherbrain they left him full custody of. Yes he wanted full custody, but still.)

Puppy eyes aside, Gortash is a blackhearted pragmatist (he will turn on Durge if they give him the stones) and progress is progress. The first True Soul was an incredible breakthrough, and the show must go on. So just imagine the bricks he's shitting in Act 3 if Durge comes back and remembers the Wrong Things from before the nautiloid. What if they want revenge on him? Nope, not good at all. Best to position himself as Durge's only friend and most trustworthy partner. Regardless of how well he treated them before, Durge was willing to piss off Bhaal to spare his life. That's an extremely useful vulnerability right now, because he's about to ask them to do it again!

Lastly, I have no proof, but I strongly suspect that Sceleritas is fibbing about Durge's past as well. Partly because the Slayer form is severely disappointing in-game and canonically excrutiatingly painful, despite Fel claiming you've always wanted it. It honestly sounds like a way to sell an unwanted used car back to it's amnesiac owner who failed to appreciate it before. Bhaal isn't a full deity any longer, so take what you're given (and you'd better damned well like it!) I also call bullshit on tossing a coin to a beggar being the "worst" crime Durge ever committed against Bhaal (*ahem* looking at you, Gortash). Some dialogue with the Oathbreaker Paladin suggests we've tried somewhat consistently to be good in the past, and Sceleritas has a vested interest in making Durge worse, not planting noble ideas in their freshly lobotomized murder-happy brain.

[effelants]

My theory, which may or may not be 90% wishful thinking:

We get BG3 DLC, and it involves the Spellplague 2: Electric Boogaloo, beginning.

We get BG4, and it involves us bringing about the Third Sundering.

Please see attached conspiracy board as to why I think this.

[bongbubbles]

Cyril has only one god - his father Cyric, but last night made him wonder if Silvanus had personally blessed him for him to get to hold a piece of Halsin's heart like this

Halsin's forehead kisses give me life, so enjoy this little bit of bonus content via a couple of screenshots. Fun little tidbit, the poly mod doesn't seem to properly account for Halsin, so I had to break up with someone and do the scene then force partner them again just to add Halsin to the equation. Unfortunately choosing to break up with one partner surprised me by breaking all of my partner's hearts, as well as my own when I went up to Gale and he got snotty with me. I find it ironic that the poly mod doesn't work right with the one person in camp who is canonically poly.

[theannoyingurge]

While I also cringe at Bhaalist behavior, I've coped by reminding myself that Bhaal might literally have the personality of a highschool edgelord with a chip on his shoulder because no one appreciates how badass and dangerous he is.

This is especially true compared to Bane and Myrkul, who used to be his friends but now bully him relentlessly because his portfolio wasn't the all-powerful chokehold he thought it would be (and he totally gloated about veto'ing their whole kingdoms before that was made apparent). Then make it all worse via Cyric and his red pill / incel madness.

Bhaal isn't the brightest. His worship is hugely restricted by having "few redeemable qualities" as an actual barrier to entry. That's probably for the best.

Twenty bucks says Jergal groomed Bhaal to be cringe and annoying for rate-limiting purposes. Slow and steady wins the race, and let's be honest, Bhaal's longevity is a tragedy of errors at best.

Or who knows, maybe Cyric is still tainting Bhaal's church and mocking him from the inside. It would be a tricky narcissistic thing to do.

Just a small thing that I complained about before in BG3; but still.

I really wish all of the Bhaalists just used the word "holy" to describe their practices. "Unholy this, unholy that" bla bla bla. It's lame edgelord behavior on part of the writers.

The point is that they view the vile, awful things they do in the name of their god as holy. That's the horror of it all.

[darija-morgan]

I can't help but adore that there are not one, not two, but six gods of death in FR lore!

Like...

God of Death

In pretty okay grim reaper way

God of Death

In bloody stabby stab way

God of Death

In dominant daddy bbc way

God of Death

In chaotic stupid bullshit way

God of Death

In fair unbiased judge way

God of Death

In insidious alien insect mummy way

They warms my dark soul in an inexplicable way :3

[deer-with-a-stick]

"Oh Jergal gave up his portfolios so his power level is like that of a demi-god lol"

I am a firm believer that if Jergal had the motivation to, he would absolutely fuck up the Dead Three, Kelemvor, and Cyric's shit all at once. Just yoink the power back. Dude just doesn't give a fuck. Sure, he hates Cyric and the Dead Three, but no matter what kind of bullshit they get up to, they a) can't kill him and b) really won't interfere with his paperwork. The whole non-interference thing is very Death God of him. The guy's Lord of the End of Everything, but killing everything at much was too much work and actively holding the power was too boring for him lmao

[theannoyingurge]

Thank you for pointing out this lovely bit of drama between the deities. There's so much poetry here.

I gave my Durge a personal vendetta against Cyric and Jergal before the amnesia. Having her unwittingly team up with both of her lifelong BBEGs felt like the justice they all deserved.

She hunted down Cyric's followers to reestablish the Temple of Bhaal ~15 years before the events of the game, only to smuggle the Strange Ox inside in Act 3, taking on the brain together. And possibly assuming leadership over whatever remains of Orin's doppelgangers.

The Ox praises Cyric for the ruse with the apple. The Ox that Durge bonded with over secret histories of incomprehensible horror, and the shared desire to be normal, and the unlikely fates that keep bringing them together.

I headcanon that the Ox knows exactly who Durge is, and Cyric gets a kick out of Bhaal falling victim to his own child's brain damage.

Allegedly, a remnant of Bhaal lived within Cyric's divine body, which drove him to madness. If strife is still a portfolio, Cyric has every reason to sow it between Bhaal and the godling who ushered his return to power.

Cyric hates the other gods. The Dead Three and their Chosen are fair game. (and Shar, and Mystra, and...)

If Jergal is truly Neutral now, it's possible he uses Cyric to disrupt the Lawful Evil mess he's responsible for cleaning up. That said, he was largely unsuccessful at controlling Cyric directly. Who knows how it turns out this time?

"Challenger of Gods" sure sounds promising..

'Jergal has nothing but scorn for Cyric, considering him anathema to the orderly dissolution of the universe.'

You know, I'm never sure whether that says more about Cyric or the Dead Three. I assume it's because Cyric's CE antisocial behaviour is harder to control that the Dead Three, who are either LE or adjacent and closer to Jergal's own Lawful alignment, so he finds them sort of tolerable. They might be idiots sometimes but at least they can organise.

It's also another reason I'm sad I can't play a Cyricist in BG3; I want to give Bone Man a migraine. There are just so many reasons to play one in this game: Annoy all the Dead Three, annoy Jergal, annoy Mystra, annoy Shar, annoy the Chosen, watch the looks of exasperation and horror on the party's faces when they realise what they're stuck with, fuck up everybody's day, romance Gale for the hilarity...

[greensleeves-redhead]

thinking

[vampireamon]

I’m so normal about Caxius and his deranged little self with his squid ink martini’s.

[mahiiimahiiii]

So lore wise, Li'ia, my tav- worships cyric.

WHICH IS SO FUNNY TO ME BECAUSE CYRIC FUCKING KILLS MYSTRA.

This is how my brain sees it:

Gale: you've never told me whom you worship- I'm curious. I also personally feel because I am your beau- I should know.

Li'ia: ....you're not going to like this!!!!

[vialae]

Sometimes I really get stuck between ‘this needs to follow 5e so strictly read multiple manuals for this one sentence’ and ‘girl it doesn’t matter that much if it’s slightly off just write it who cares nobody is analysing this that much’

[theannoyingurge]

I've heard the sentiment that Leira faked her death before, as well as Cyric later claiming he was her father (somehow, despite her being a god for longer than he was alive). Something feels weird about the relationship between Leira, Mask and Cyric and I can't put my finger on it.

[Fzoul] drummed his fingers nervously on the pages from The True Life. "I'm still not happy about moving into the open." "I'll be there to protect you," Mask offered with exaggerated deference. "If you take up my holy symbol, Fzoul, I'll serve you well. After all, Bane has been dead the past ten years, and you still mourn him. Isn't it time you got on with your life?"

Bane: patron god of people with the worst taste in men possible. Agape or storge or eros or whatever flavour of love; the point stands.

(And did everybody in this pantheon feel awkward when Bane came back, I wonder? 'Well, Cyric sure did kill the Dead Three.' Meanwhile Jergal and everybody in the future looking back just hums and says nothing. And technically Mystra and Mask killed the Dead Three.)

[effelants]

Thinking about Withers' note in the epilogue

So, "dark sun", I think we're all fairly confident that that's in reference to Cyric (or is it??? WHAT IF SOMETHING ELSE???? but then there's also a lot of other Cyric references in the game, so I'm fairly confident about this take tbh).

But what is "white sky"?

Any theories, any ideas? I'm coming up short (read: "I have ideas, but legitimately all of them are too dumb and/or far-fetched to print"), and I'd hate to just assume that because I can't think of what it could be, it's just there for poetic effect djfkghsdg

[bongbubbles]

The group certainly seems to have their own unique set of problems... An explosive wizard wasn't on his bingo card though

[macaroniandcheese]

started another run this time as my beloved shart and i think its funny as fuck that gale takes astarion being a whole ass vampire better than he takes shadowheart being a shar worshipper

[cielsosinfel]

From this post I just reblogged:

along with the Spellplague when Shar tried to get a god of murder to kill Mystra.

Now HERE'S something I feel should be a point of contention between Gale and Shadowheart. Just a little conflict. Since they're both so hung up on their respective gods/dommes.

Like, there's a lot of reasons for everyone to have a contention with a Shar worshipper, but someone deeply devoted to and in love with Mystra finding out his companion is a literal zealot in service of Shar, justifying every atrocity ever committed in her god's name and getting horny over committing torture as an act of religious worship and everything...