#anti Luke Castellan

[punkeropercyjackson]

Percico and Lukercy and Perpollo are like the straightest gay ships ever,that's a canon gay boy and a trans woman who's basically his older sister/mom figure and a female YA book protagonist and the obligatory pedo white boy love interest and the same thing again but with the immortality and unnecessary incest bonus'

[freddie-77-ao3]

[massiveladycat]

maybe the "did you love me?" could be seen as platonic or romantic, but i'm not here to argue about that honestly, even if it was meant in a platonic way, luke was still an awful person. he manipulated kids in bad positions to join the titan army, knowing full well so many of them would die and knowing full well camp half-blood was full of children. in fact, he knew most of the campers personally children who trusted him were exploited and luke castellan is literally one of the most evil people in pjo deadass and it surprises me when i see people trying to defend him list of all the things he's done, excluding what he's done when possessed by kronos:

stole Zeus's lightning bolt to start a war with the gods, knowing full well that would have led to many deaths

framed 12-year-old percy for stealing Zeus's lightning bolt

gave 12-year-old percy cursed shoes meant to drop him into tartarus. he would NOT have survived that. that was done with every intent to kill percy.

summoned a hellhound to kill percy

left percy alone with a deadly scorpion

poisoned thalia's tree to put the campers (CHILDREN) in serious danger

tried to kill 13-year-old percy in a duel

deceived Annabeth into holding up the sky in place of atlas. she was 14. holding the sky is extremely painful. he literally took advantage of the fact she still had affection for him.

used Annabeth to make artemis hold up the sky

extorted silena into being his spy, threatening to hurt her boyfriend if she disobeyed; also took advantage of her crush on him (she was 14 or 15, luke was 23) anyways. fuck luke castellan and he is NOT innocent and never will be and he hurts children❤️ yes i agree that the gods are pretty messed up but he was more than willing to harm the people the gods were harming. he claimed to only want the best for them, but he was likely the number 1 reason that so many of the kids were dead and/or traumatized. he can't claim to only want the gods to be better when he's going to take it out on kids who've done nothing wrong.

[perseas-wellyboots]

The Luke Castellan problem in PJO books and Fandom

I just finished rereading the pjo series for the dozenth time and I have so many thoughts about Luke and how the fandom woobified him.

Like no Luke did not have the right idea and executed it in the wrong way. He wasn't a misguided victim, although there is no doubt Kronos manipulated him. But him being manipulated does not absolve him of his wrongdoings. Hurt people can still hurt people, you can be abused and still become an abuser.

Most of Fandom's idea of Luke being a 'hero' because he did the right thing in the end is extremely doozy like ok he killed himself to stop Kronos but that does not absolve him the blame of killing innocent people.

While Luke's main goal was the destruction of Gods, that was not because he wanted the demigods to have better lives. He actively killed demigods.

In the Sea of Monsters, when Percy, Annabeth and Tyson snuck into Princess Andromeda; they saw 12 year olds being trained how to kill a 'dummy in camp half blood tshirts'. He was actively exploiting children and manipulating them into killing other children and saw nothing wrong with it.

He only considered deflecting from Kronos when he found out that he was going to be possessed by him.

He only worked and cared for him, he was so lost into power and revenge that HE became a monster.

"Oh but he cared for Thalia and Annabeth!!" I'll get into that later too

I think Luke's fatal flaw contrary to the opinion of fandom is The Urge to Prove Himself.

He had one conversation with Hermes which made him angry and bitter and Thalia even notes that after that conversation Luke got into more and more fights with monsters like he had something to prove which Annabeth didnt seem to see as a problem since he was her hero. They got into more skirmishes because of his recklessness, fighting more monsters since Luke wanted to pick a fight with each one he came across.

(Conversation from PJO, The Last Olympian)

His fatal flaw being to Prove Himself would explain why he took the failure of his quest so hard that the night he returned from the quest was the same night Kronos started speaking to him for the first time. It didn't help that when he returned from his failed quest, the campers treated him with pity.

He wanted to pull Olympus down stone by stone because He failed his quest that he didn't want to do because it was already done by Hercules once. 🥴

His endgame has nothing to do with wanting to help ANYBODY. He wanted to take down gods because he had a grudge against them and wanted to Prove that he could do it. Everything else comes secondary if it fits his agenda.

This is one of the reasons why it bothers me so much when people say that Luke had the right idea or that Percy would have joined Kronos if Sally had died like you fundamentally misunderstood the character of Percy if you think he would have joined Kronos.

He talks about "driving humanity back into caves, all except the strongest - who would serve him" THIS IS LITERALLY FASCISM???

(According to Merriam-Webster, Fascism is a political philosophy, movement, or regime that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression)

Now onto the topic of Thalia, Annabeth and Luke

First of all, I absolutely hate that 'Thalia and Luke had a thing before she got turned into a tree bit' because Thalia was 12 and Luke was 14 when they met and Thalia was 15 and Luke was 20-21ish when they meet again in TTC ugh hate that.

Now TTC, where to begin, here I used to believe Luke had already bathed in river Styx as there are some narrations where Percy notes that Luke looked worse and like his scar was reopened and would certainly explain how he survived the cliff fall but on my rereading I realised that Thalia and Luke fought when Percy was holding the sky and Thalia injured Luke so nvm then.

It is however in this book that Luke began to realise Kronos's plan for him as it is implied by the General and he starts to fear for his life.

Mind you, what did Luke think would happen if Thalia did agree to join Kronos when he knew Kronos was looking for a host of body...

Luke is many things, he is cunning, manipulative, a great swordsman but what he is not is stupid. If Thalia would have agreed then Kronos would have used Thalia as a vessel 😬

And oh boy the can of worms that is Luke and Annabeth. I've seen many Luke fans/apologists deny that there is no canon evidence of Luke being romantically interested in Annabeth BUT THERE IS?? they refuse to believe and call Annabeth an unreliable narrator because otherwise their uwu white boy would be a Pedophile. Even if he wasn't a Pedo, he manipulated Annabeth so many times to make her sympathise with her and use her emotions against her.

(excerpts from various books: TLO, TLO, BoTL, MoA annabeth's pov)

^ Annabeth was 15 almost 16 or already 16 I believe when Luke asked her to run away with him in a romantic sense and he was 21-22.

also another evidence adding to the theory of his fatal flaw having proving himself.

Now, onto the topic of CHB and Luke:

Luke being hesitant to attack camp half blood in BotL has less to do with him suddenly growing a spine (as some fans suggest) and more to do with the inevitable possession.

When Kronos informs that he will himself lead the attack, Luke advises to use Hyperion instead because he knows for Kronos to attack it in person, he would finally possess Luke.

(first one is from TTC, the other two from BoTL)

One of the last things I wanna talk about is Silena Beauregard & Luke and Luke's portrayal in the new Percy Jackson series:

Luke was 17 when Kronos started speaking to him and 19 when he left the camp. Silena was 17-18 when she died which makes her 13-14 when Luke left the camp in TLT and 11-12 when Kronos first started talking to him. Adult Luke charmed an underage girl, and promised her that she was helping the demigods and then when she tried to stop, he started blackmailing her. [excerpts from TLO]

According to the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children UK, Grooming is when someone builds a relationship, trust and emotional connection with a child or young person so they can manipulate, exploit and abuse them. The relationship a groomer builds can take different forms. This could be: a romantic relationship, as a mentor, an authority figure, a dominant and persistent figure. They might use blackmail to make a child feel guilt and shame or introduce the idea of 'secrets' to control, frighten and intimidate.

So canonically, Book!Luke is a fascist groomer pedophile.

Now on the new Disney+ Percy Jackson show, it seems that Rick Riordan is subtly rewriting the character of Luke and removing the more problematic aspect of him (pedophile and grooming). Let me explain why I think that:

Even though in TLT the book, Luke describes Annabeth as his little sister we know how well that lasted but I don't think they are keeping Annabeth's crush on him on the show from what I've seen (though I could be wrong).

Secondly, the casting of Dior Goodjohn as Clarisse puts Clarisse on the same age range as Luke, maybe a year or two younger but in the first book Clarisse was 13-14 and she was 17 in TLO, so they have aged her up. It is my assumption that they will also age Silena by casting a 17-19 yr old actress as her.

And they have made Luke far more sympathetic in the show than the books (him not calling a hellhound during capture the flag and no pit scorpions in the finale), but we wouldn't know how sympathetic or villainous they are making him until season 2 comes out. Charlie Bushnell gives an excellent performance imo

Though this again reflects the double standards it comes to PJO, they have given much grace and praise for the changes made to Luke's character and little to no complaint for ageing up Clarisse but the hate Walker and especially Leah are given is so cruel. Leah has been so much racially targeted though I think she's an excellent Annabeth, just something to think about.

Also, before I forget-

We don't give enough flack to Rick Riordan for writing two weird age dynamics without recognising as grooming and pedophilic nature. (Lukabeth and Caleo/Capercy)

The characters are never made to realise (especially Annabeth) that an older person having feelings for them as a minor is not a normal behaviour.

Especially in regards to Calypso who may take the form of a 15 year old but is actually more than 4612 (according to the riordan wiki) and her having a crush on 14 year old Percy and 15-16 yr old Leo Valdez, not to mention how rudely she treated Leo. Also her cursing Annabeth because Percy left her. Not only is it plain nasty but she's never called out. Its actually so disgusting🤕.

Anyways this turned into a long rant but I would love to read your opinions, especially on Luke's fatal flaw.

I know for some people it may seem like I'm too hard on him but this is just my opinion.

IMO I have no problem if you like a morally bad or gray person, an antihero or a villain as long as their bad deeds aren't swept under the rug and pretend they never happened or glorify their good deeds.

I actually think villian's bad things make them more interesting.

Luke is an antagonist and a villain of the PJO series and a part of being a villain is that some people are going to hate you and that's ok.

Me personally, I was never a fan of his and that's ok.

I know some people are going to bring up the fact that Percy in MoA sympathises but the PJO characters are complicated and Luke was very skilled at making others think of his reason to destroy the Gods the way they would sympathise the most and we see that multiple times.

[bugwolfsstuff]

I will never like or forgive Luke mostly because he is the reason Castor is never gonna see their dad again

Like its assumed that Dionysus had a good relationship with his kids.

And yeah Castor will have Pollux in the future but they're never gonna see their dad again.

They're dead and Dionysus is deathless

They're dead and never gets to see the parent they loved because Luke hated his parent

[pain-is-too-tired]

Leeluke to me is less "aw they be cute together" and more "Idk if they were married but they are definitely divorced" fgxdc

Like Krisnix in Ace Attorney

Lee being a very bitter ex who's so done with Luke and Luke just not getting it is so funny to me.

Lee had to help care for a nearly dead 12 year old boy that Luke just left to deal with a pit scorpion on his own for and immediately filed the divorce papers.

Luke @ Kronos: my wife's leaving me and he's taking the kids :(

Kronos: What kids??? What wife???

Cut to Lee with the Stolls dhdh

Lee also took the brain cell in the divorce/j

Reason of divorce in the papers is just "He tried to kill one kid three fucking times in one summer. Wtf." Dhdhh

[comfortabletogether]

I LOVE ETHAN TOO BUT I CAN NEVER FIND CONTENT OF HIM THAT'S NOT FUCKING L*ke so spare hcs????

YES SIR!! I am not a fan of Puke in this household. Even as a stupid little kid I thought that Luke was weird as hell.

Ethan has constant headaches and dizziness due to only having one eye. Typically if not in the middle of planned combat he has a big ass water bottle hooked onto the loops of his jeans.

Chronic blue jean wearer. To the point where most people think that he just doesn’t own a pair of pants that aren’t jeans. On top of that he doesn’t put them in the washer machine but instead he puts them in the freezer for a day or so.

Ethan struggles to fight in dark places. And it’s a severe struggle for him. Because everything is so much darker when you only are using one eye.

He has an unnaturally high metabolism and they don’t feed him exactly enough in the Titan Army. That caused him and Chris to sneak out in the middle of the night to go steal slushies from 7-11’s.

Ethan thinks exclusively in words. I don’t think he is an artistic person either. But he lives off of logic puzzles and if he could he would play the New York Times games every day (wordle, connections, crossword strands, etc).

When he lived in Camp Half Blood he was a quiet kid back then and was rarely acknowledged by those around him. But he would end up hanging out/find himself trailing behind Clairess, Silena, Chris, Charles and Lee.

People (in universe) easily mistake him for being extremely obedient and will always fall into line no matter what. Which is what ended up making him Kronos’ top general. But he does have his own strict sets of morals he has for himself, and one’s that he would never cross.

He works himself up thinking about equality issues and is extremely adamant about them and people respect other’s identities.

Is a cat person and his father always owns four cats at all times. On that topic dad was a lawyer that focused on family and divorce cases.

[mik3stuff]

Ugh I hate blond Apollo and I think the way Rick wrote him was pretty dirty. Tho I like his character, I still wish he was better writen

[shiftingwithmars]

Luke: *Gr00ms and kills literal children* The fandom: He’s just misunderstood🥺

Annabeth: *Is a complex teenage girl* The fandom: She’s toxic and deserves to die

[wanderingmind867]

I still can't blame Octavian for being so wary of the Greeks. Especially when, y'know, it was technically a Greek Demigod who started everything bad (that we're aware of). No Luke Castellan presumably means no resurrection of Kronos. No Kronos means no Titan War. No Titan War means nothing to help accelerate the waking of Gaea. No accelerated waking of Gaea means the giant war happens much further in the future, if it ever happens at all.

So it really is all Luke Castellan's fault. And which Camp is Luke from? That's right, Camp Half-Blood. The Greek one. The Greeks are responsible for everything, and Octavian had every right to dislike them! He may not have known all this when he was acting judgemental of them, of course. But in the long term, his suspicions were 100% correct. And if I were to make a Camp Jupiter prequel set during the original Percy Jackson series, I would make that abundantly clear.

[punkeropercyjackson]

I've never liked 'positively masculine' 'slutty bisexual' Percy because Percy's always been so transfem-coded and that interpretation strips her of it pretty much entierly

She defies traditional manhood as an overarching trait of hers as proof she's the best greek hero ever and it's a direct plot point in the book where she enters puberty,by proving herself as completely unlike cis men to an archaic group of lesbians that're a group set to protect young girls against older men and Percy falls under a victim of them like them since literally every older man in her life except Beckendorf abused her and Percy's potrayed as and written as not a normal cis man throught not only in The Titan's Curse but in the entire saga as a whole.Her gender presentation is neutral and her boldness,emotional strength,snark,respect for women with her mama most of all and nurturing protector tendencies aren't masculine and only thought of as such due to sexism and she insults men for being overly masculine,particularly older men thanks to her trauma,and is enchanted by and loves women for being feminine and is also enchanted by girlhood as a whole and was jealous of Thalia for her specific girlhood in TTC because she wanted to be seen as and treated the same as her and they're depicted as two sides of the same coin who clash but learn to understand eachother and become basically siblings/sisters and Thalia is punk,a historically inherently transgender subculture,and Percy is too but she dosen't have the aesthetic and it only adds to her (gender) envy and the kicker is Thalia is a dead ringer for irl punk/alt transbians

Percy's lack of masculinity is also commented on/confirmed by two canonical queer characters-Piper,a sapphic butch who described Percy as 'unimpressive' in terms of mascness and brought us accidental meta commentary with her remark that everybody at Camp Half-Blood percieved Percy as a lot manlier than she actually is,and Nico,a gay boy Percy met in the egg metaphor Pjo book that developed a crush on her out of idealizing her as an ideallic she isn't nor wants to be and the crush in question is textually the one thing stopping them from having the familial best friendship they desperately crave with eachother as it ruins their dynamic and he eventually stopped and looked at her for who she actually is and realized she's 'cute but not his type' and only then were they Nico and Percy,the og dead sea siblings,again and she even compared her treatment of him to acting like a mother/acting like how her own acts with her and similar to Thalia,Nico is basically every disabled goth/alt trans teenage boy ever and every single female character who's had a crush on Percy is wlw-coded(Annabeth's gncness and resistence against traditional femininity and chemistry with Piper,Clarisse and Reyna/Rachel's pretty much the 'activist art school lesbian' stereotype but that's a good thing because it's a lesbian inside joke and not a derogatory one/Calypso and Reyna's romance storylines are near textually comphet)

Percy looks exactly like her dad,Poseidon,the god of the sea,a element that holds such endless femininity to it that much like Percy herself,as the sea herself personified,is mistaken for masculinity,which is such a common eldest daughter thing and she's tall and has a big strong build and she's insecure over her looks and thinks she's not attractive enough,especially compared to others,and Circe,a trickster goddess,showed her a masculinized version of herself as her supposed ideal apperance and this is never brought up beforehand and in the very next book,the transfem Pjo book™️,Aphrodite,an actual beauty and love goddess,tells Percy she needs to stop trying to be something she's not to achive her true beauty and 'The sea does not like to be restrained' is about multiple things-Percy's oceanic heritage,Percy's anarchism,Percy's autism she dosen't know how to mask,Percy's transfeminism.Her autism/audhd reflects heavily to the common overlap between autistic women and transgender women and so does her being punk as i stated before,completed with her own unnatural colored hair streak she didn't even need to dye in and growing up almost all her friends were girls except for a gay boy and effeminate boy that got picked on for being wimpy she stood up for and she's got a special interest in the color blue,a 'boy' color usually but her love of it comes from her mom and she's scared of becoming exactly like her dad but she's more of a mix of both her parents and she loves burgers and is a horse girl and inclined to kiddy things over 'mature interests' and her default outfit is baggy pants and dysphoria hoodies and converse and she's so much like me as a black woman that i can't help but see her as that too(though i'm tmasc and she's tfem)

It's not that i'm against bi Percy or playing around with her gender presentation,it's just that Percy feels like Percy and not a completely different person when she's transfem and i love the idea of her as a bi femme instead.As somebody with a lot of tgirl friends and a trans girlfriend who used to be my best friend,the characterization and story writings surrounding fanonized bi Percy play into multiple fascests of irl transmisogynistic rethoric and it happens so often it's extremely suspicious wether it's even accidental,especially with the self-proclaimed 'queer elders' of the Pjo fandom being the biggest posters of it and the unjustified entitlement they feel to Percy crushing on their male faves who're literally her abusers.Percy deserves so much better than to be reduced down to that when she's such a good and one of a kind character and transfem Pjo fans deserve someone like her as representation too,not to be disregarded when she's so perfect for them and they've earned her after all the awful caricatures of them they've been forced to put up with.Girl(🏳️‍⚧️)Percy Jackson is just canon Percy Jackson,i've known that since i was TLT age

[freddie-77-ao3]

Octavian started another war where he was willing and eager to firebomb a camp full of children so he could reap the glory of victory. I'd say his villainization by the fandom is very well-earned, especially since he had none of Luke's more sympathetic traits.

feel like you missed my whole point but okay.

Um. I mean if we consider Luke's sympathetic traits to be he was actually treated as a human with a backstory, sure, Octavian deserves to be villainized more but uh, I'd consider Octavian's reasons for waging war a lot more legitimate than Luke's tbh?

Like. Luke's boiled down to daddy issues. He was upset his father wasn't there, and decided to make that everyone else's problem. Sure, if it wasn't Luke, it would be someone else, but Luke's the figurehead here. Luke, who was actually treated pretty well by Hermes all things considered.

And yes, May Castellan would have been terrifying, and shouldn't have been Luke's caregiver but...

Having a difficult parental situation absolutely does not give you the right to take your pain out on others. And that's what Luke did.

And yes, Luke absolutely was manipulated. Kronos manipulated him.

Now let's consider Octavian's motivation to "firebomb a camp full of children" as you put it.

Number one: Octavian was also manipulated. Gaea did manipulate him. He thought he was listening to Apollo-- a god who, to him, was good. Should be respected.

Number two: he didn't start the war. No, really. The greeks, from his point of view, brought a warship over the city and started firing. They damaged homes, likely hurt people, all within what was MEANT to be a safe place.

Leo might have been possessed but that was never communicated to Octavian. So no, he didn't start a war.

Gaea forced Leo to start a war. Either way, the Greeks started the war in his eyes.

Also the fact you take such offense to Octavian waging war on children... did you somehow think that Luke was only waging war on the adults? Because I can tell you, most people consider a twelve year old a child, and Luke did in fact try to kill one of those. You know, Percy.

Also victims of Luke: Silena, actively groomed by Luke. Yeah she committed suicide, but she wouldn't have if Luke hadn't done that. Also, grooming is in fact also a crime.

And, you know, all the other casualties from that war. Because there were. Castor, Lee, Bianca, Zoë, Michael, Beckendorf, the other 15 campers dead from the battle of manhattan, and all the other casualties.

Also he did send Chris into the labyrinth, and didn't particularly seem to care that he was driven mad?

Not to mention the PTSD he inflicted on a bunch of kids.

So yes, you're right, Octavian did bad shit. But he also had his reasons for said bad shit. Reasons that I, personally, find a lot more compelling than Luke's.

Plenty of people have daddy issues, anon. Not many of them try to end the world.

[massiveladycat]

"luke was a good person deep down, and he deserves elysium-"

[shattered-glasswork]

I was scrolling Tumblr and saw a post about L*ke claiming he was a hero in the end but... Did we read the same books? L*ke was a monster who led tons of children into their deaths, betrayed almost all of his friends and tried to kill percy multiple times. I get that he like stabbed himself in the end but I don't think that cancels out the wrong that he did, L*ke c@st3ll@n was a traitor and he died a traitor.

[echo-stimmingrose]

If I see one more love song edit for Annabeth and Luke I might just lose my mind. Especially since y'all are using SHOW ANNABETH AND LUKE

Like the child and the legal adult! Stop it!

[pain-is-too-tired]

Trafficking technically being canon in pjo still- it just drives me insane.

Like yeah, it might be one(two if you wanna count ttc opening conflict) instances we see

BUT THAT STILL NOT GREAT

I mean it also is great for fic ideas- surprised I hadn't really seen it- but still.

Just insane to me. It's not even "the Titan Army is paying good money for demigods" it's "Luke Castellan is paying good money for demigods."

Like no matter what way your splice it Luke is at least complicit in it.

I know I get silly when writing him with the Leeluke stuff, but there's a reason I tend to focus on divorce Leeluke

Because it's so hard not to write him getting the consequences of his actions. Because he DOES STUFF LIKE THIS.

Especially with how I write Lee. If Lee found out the Luke was at least complicit in what's pretty much the buying of other demigods, he'd kill him with his bare hands. Being stuck as Kronos' vessel would seem like a mercy compared to how badly Lee would kick his ass.

Anyway... looks at my Fae!Lee/were-coyote!Luke au wip Suddenly that doesn't seem too out of pocket anymore...