#anti Karen traviss

[jedi-enthusiasm-blog]

In five millennia, the Mandalorians fought with and against a thousand armies on a thousand worlds. They learned to speak as many languages and absorbed weapons technology and tactics from every war. And yet, despite the overwhelming influence of alien cultures, and the absence of a true homeworld and even species, their own language not only survived but changed little, their way of life and their philosophy remained untouched, and their ideals and sense of family, of identity, of nation, were only strengthened.

Mando'a, wookiepedia.

What kind of utter bullshit is this? This is impossible. Languages are in constant change, and even more so when they interact with others! That's how Spanish, Italian, French, and many others were born from Latin! How German, English and Swedish were born too!

I'm not a linguist so my knowledge of how languages work is limited, but I know this: language is in a constant state of change. I know there are words that are less than four decades old in English.

My own first language has had over a dozen words created in the past two decades. Many of them come from English, or were created for the Internet, and most of our words come from three or four different languages.

My country has many words used exclusively in certain regions. We like to joke about how difficult it is to learn our language, since so many words have multiple meanings and others only exist in limited places. There are over four regions where language is concerned, all of them with different accents and words exclusive to their respective region.

Languages and cultures don't exist in a vacuum, they are formed thanks to experiences and changes communities go through. Interacting with people from different backgrounds is how Ancient Greek philosophy was born! And that philosophy has shaped the whole Western world!

Nuclear family, despite being seen as the norm, is less than a century old. America's (the continent, America is a continent, US is the country) independance happened in recent memory as far as history is concerned, less than two centuries ago (the movement started in the early 19th cetury, but its main points were the 1870's and the 1890's, and it finished in 1898 when Spain's last two colonies gained their independance). The French Revolution that completely altered Europe's governments happened just a little over two hundred years ago, in 1789. World War II started eighty five years ago, and Hitler rose to power ten years before that. My country has been a democracy for less than fifty years, my parents are older than my country's democracy. The cold war finished in the fucking late 1980's. The "schools" in Canada that were used to forcibly convert/assimilate First Nation children were active until the last one closed in the 1990's.

This is just a very small glance at what has happened in the west (which I'm more familiar with, since I'm western) in the past two centuries.

If we have changed so much in just two hundred years, it's impossible that Mandalorians have remained the exact same in five, fucking, thousand.

And the most stupid for the end:

Nation: a large body of people united by common descent, history, culture, or language, inhabiting a particular country or territory.

If Mandalorians don't have a planet to call their own, they are not a nation.

[roseaesynstylae]

Star Wars: Republic Commando: Triple Zero, Chapter 4

"Mereel was on Kamino. If Zey was heard to mutter that the Nulls were Skirata's private army, he wasn't entirely wrong."

You say that like it's a good thing.

"'I never said good-bye to the lads who didn't come back, that's all. I lost nine out of my batch.'

'But the last time you saw them, you left them feeling confident, respected, and loved. That's enough for any buir to achieve.'"

*narrows eyes* *with a remarkable amount of spite* I fucking doubt that calling them "wet-droids" made them feel loved. Just because you're constantly licking daddy's boots doesn't mean everyone else does.

Okay, that was going a little far. But everyone talking about this asshole like he's the ideal parent makes me want to throw something across the room. Hard. And repeatedly.

"'Have you met Sergeant Kal yet?'

'No.' Kal was always there for Darman, somewhere, even at times like this when she wanted to say so much to him.'

'Darman beamed, clearly delighted. 'Oh, you'll like him, General. You'll really like him.'

Etain certainly hoped so. And if she didn't, then she'd try, for Darman's sake."

*beaming smile* I'll just list things off, shall I?

"Even at times like this when she wanted to say so much to him." Etain, I want to say so much to him as well. It isn't what you want to say, though. It's a bit more...profane.

"You'll really like him." I've been getting a look into this man's mind for the past few chapters. I don't fucking like him. I actually prefer Walon Vau, since he's at least open about the fact that he's an asshole.

"And if she didn't, then she'd try, for Darman's sake." I could not try. It would end in an attempted strangulation.

"Vau was settled in one of the deeply upholstered hide chairs with the strill draped across his lap on its back, all six of its legs flopping in an undignified sprawl while he scratched its belly. Its huge fanged mouth was slack, tongue lolling, and a long skein of drool hung almost to the floor. Its body was a meter long, lengthened by a whip of a tail covered in more loose skin.

The strill was still prettier than Vau, though. The man had a long square-jawed face that was all bone and frown lines, and graying hair cut brutally short. Faces rarely lied about the soul within."

MIRD!!

PRECIOUS BABY!!

Oh, yeah, and its human servant. Great to see him too.

Who is the most adorable little killing machine?! It's you~

Mird, My Beloved: 1

"'The Jedi Council is pretty adept at turning blind eyes,' Skirata said. 'For an organization that knew it was taking on an army with an assassination capability, you do send out conflicting signals to simple soldiers like me.'

Vau was watching like a man being mildly amused by a holovid. The strill yawned with a thin, high-pitched whine."

Mird, My Beloved: 2

*sourly* I'm glad someone is amused by this.

"'We didn't even know we had an army until a year ago.'

'Maybe, but the fact that you're sitting here now with a general's rank means you've accepted responsibility for it. You could have objected, collectively or individually. You could have asked questions. But no. You picked up the blaster you found on the floor and you just fired it to defend yourself. Expedience ambushes you in the end.'"

*in the most fake nice way imaginable* Fuck. You.

Lemme just break this down a little...

"You could have objected, collectively or individually."

They did.

"You could have asked questions."

They did.

The problem isn't that the Jedi didn't try to find a way to object or that they didn't try to investigate. The problem is that the Separatists were actively attacking, the Senate wanted a war, and Palpatine had manipulated everything so they had no other choice. They took the role of Generals and Commanders because they felt that it was the best way to prevent excessive casualties and lessen suffering.

But, no. It's all the Jedi's fault. It isn't that they're a group that was not and never has been intended for a military position who have just been forced into this role. It isn't that they're trying to keep to their principles in the middle of a situation they are not meant for. It isn't that the chaos of the war made it so that trying to object or figure out what the hell was going on impossible.

In conclusion...

WHY DON'T YOU ASK JEDI WHAT THEY FEEL ABOUT THE SITUATION AND WHAT THEY DID? THEY'D TALK TO YOU. THEY'RE NICE, REASONABLE PEOPLE. I"M SURE THAT YOU'D LEARN A LOT MORE IF YOU HAD AN ACTUAL CONVERSATION INSTEAD OF RANTING ABOUT A GROUP OF PEOPLE YOU BARELY KNOW.

Jedi-Bashing: 7

"'Oh no, I'm just a civilian now,' Vau said. The strill rumbled. Vau, apparently distracted, fondled its ghastly, stinking head, his slightly narrowed eyes revealing a doting affection that he never seemed to spare for any other living creature."

I'm going to make this clear right now: I like Vau considerably more than Skirata. 80% of that affection comes from Mird.

Mird, My Beloved: 3

"'How far is too far, Kal? Can you answer that? How far did you go?' Vau called after him. 'I made that boy a warrior. Without me, he wouldn't be alive today.'

With him, Ordo thought, Atin very nearly wasn't."

Vau's training methods are a discussion for another time.

(I still prefer him to Skirata. Like I said, Vau's open about the fact that he's a bastard, unlike some people.)

"It was delightful to see the mix of armor -- yellow-striped commanders and pilots, plain white troopers, and the motley mix of commando colors -- drawn together in one ancient Mandalorian ritual, every face the same.

Etain felt adrift, excluded.

She had never truly felt this degree of bond with her Jedi clan. The connection in the Force was there, yes, but....no, the real strength here was attachment, passion, identity, meaning."

Attachment is not love. Attachment is not a good thing. Passion is not a good thing for a Jedi. I am explaining this in small words for the author's benefit.

Also, nice shit you just took on the Jedi's Youngling Clans.

(Don't fucking insult the Jedi Younglings. They're adorable and have done nothing wrong, ever.)

Given the fixation on (relatively nuclear and standard by sci-fi standards) families in this series, this really feels like a jab at the "fact" that *extremely mocking voice* ThE JedI DOn'T HAve FaMilIEs.

Jedi-Bashing: 9

That's it. I'm exhausted by this series' bullshit and it's only been one chapter. Thankfully, I have a vacation coming up where I can ignore these books and concentrate on actually good Star Wars content. Once I'm done decompressing, I'll be ranting about this again.

Jedi-Bashing: 9

Mando-Shilling: 1

It's a Man's World: 1

Shut the Fuck Up, Kal: 1

Deltas, Move Out: 4

Mird, My Beloved: 3

Is This The Bad Batch?: 2

Main Post

[lieutenant-teach]

Trying Karen Traviss 'Republic Commando' (critical)

I’ve read loads of criticism on Karen Traviss ‘Republic Commando’ books. Despite being weaponized with knowledge of her treatment of Jedi and Mandalorians, decided to read anyway, because clones! Though I’m in the camps of ‘anti-Mandoclones’ and ‘pro-jedi’, and from my previous reading experience I know my whole being protests when I see even an ounce of Jedi-criticism both in books and fics, I still thought – maybe, at least the plot will be interesting? And clones!

Well… I lasted about 10 pages (was reading from an e-book, so it’s hard to tell) of the first novel of the series, ‘Hard contact’.

I’d even ignore anti-Jedi stuff that starts from the very beginning – as if I would believe the Jedi would treat the clones as ‘created for war, so they must be used for war’.

First thing that started to turn me off – the treatment of common clones, ‘regs’. The main characters immediately began to smell disgustingly like The Bad Batch. They have special training, they see each other as ‘family’ – unlike these regular clones! They are even treated poorly by the ‘regs’, poor things! :(

The second – the language. A lot of Mando’a words that are referenced in the end of the book. Thanks to fics, I know several terms, but in next books I scrolled through – whole incomprehensible dialogues in Mando’a! Seriously?! 1st, technically uncomfortable, 2nd – disrespect to the readers.

And the main reason that made me delete all these books – it’s written boringly. Plain boringly. I guess it’s just her journalist-influenced style, but still – one more reason not to read her.

[mysticaltora8276]

“Skirata didn't hold it against Palpatine for being a Sith. It wasn't a big deal for Mando'ade; they'd worked for Sith in the past, and they'd fared better with the Sith than they had with the Jedi.”

Yeah remind me why we’re supposed to root for the guy who’s okay with genocidal fascist Sith but hates Jedi because *checks notes* reasons that are entirely out of their control and xenophobia.

[roseaesynstylae]

Oh yeah. KT is, beyond all doubt, my most hated SW writer. I’m stuck in a toxic relationship with the RepComm novels where I keep trying to just abandon them and get them out of my head but just keep getting pulled back. She excels at creating deeply enraging characters (Kal Skirata, my beloathed). To put it in perspective, I’m only seven chapters into the second book and keep having to put it down and walk away because I just become too furious. These books are the first in my life where I’ve seriously considered writing hatefic where all her Mando Sues die.

The sad part is that there was potential in the RepComm series, the Mandalorian worldbuilding (when it isn’t glorifying the warrior/military aspects to the point of nausea) is decent, but all the potential was pissed down the drain by her Jedi-bashing, Mando-shilling, and disturbingly far right ranting. In my more charitable moments, I fantasize about a complete rewrite.

I am not going to waver from these opinions.

When a Star Wars writer engages with the material but not the narrative.

I'm writing a long post about the Jedi and the clone troopers and there's a whole section that I had to remove because it was too long:

Karen Traviss' take on the Jedi and the clones.

I already wrote about why Karen Traviss' take on the Jedi and Yoda doesn't track with what George Lucas had established in his narrative of the Prequels. Since then, I've been able to do more research.

It's no secret that one of the reasons Traviss listed for criticizing the Jedi in the Expanded Universe books she wrote is their treatment of the clones (or at least what she understood it to be).

In 2008, she wrote a now-deleted blog post about it (it was really long, so I'm only including the part relevant to my point, if you want the full context you can look it up, this is old stuff).

So if you ask me, in the above quote, Traviss is essentially doing the equivalent of saying:

"Batman is a psycho elitist who beats up the mentally ill and indoctrinates kids, turning them into child soldiers for his unending crazy vigilante war on crime, and if you can't recognize that then you scare the living crap out of me."

Like... you can argue that, and a couple of comics have argued that.

But by and large, the general consensus is that Batman is a superhero, the Robins are his sons and daughter, and the "mentally ill" are in fact the Joker and Two-Face aka mass murderers.

So if you make that argument, that's you applying your real-life values and conclusions to a narrative that deliberately doesn't acknowledge those points, in-universe, in order to tell the story it wants to tell.

It's counting on your suspension of disbelief, defined as "the avoidance—often described as willing—of critical thinking and logic in understanding something that is unreal or impossible in reality, such as something in a work of speculative fiction, in order to believe it for the sake of enjoying its narrative."

The Jedi accepting the clones and the clones being slaves isn't a "delicate point". It's barely a point at all!

It's never addressed in the film (because of course it isn't, the Prequels are about Anakin and the Republic, not the clones).

It's only addressed once by Slick, an unreliable narrator, in The Clone Wars.

That's it. Hell, in 2008, when The Clone Wars writer Henry Gilroy was asked to comment on the relationship between clones and Jedi, he explicitly said he'd "rather not get into" that particular point.

I recently got Mythmaking: Behind the Scenes of 'Attack of the Clones' and nowhere is that detail touched on by Lucas at any point.

Nobody wants to touch on that point with a 10ft pole, because it's not relevant to the story.

So while Traviss acknowledges the Jedi are fictional characters, she doesn't follow that thread through to the end by acknowledging that fictional characters don't have free will, they must abide by the story and the whim of the writer.

She's engaging with the material, but refusing to engage with the narrative. She's having her cake and eating it too.

My reason for saying all this is that in the book Star Wars on Trial, she elaborates on her thought process upon discovering this detail.

Shortly before to this, she acknowledges twice that she knew nothing about Star Wars, beside seeing the original films in her youth.

Another writer who saw the new films and saw Mace Windu argue against there being a war...

... the worry on his face at the prospect of the Jedi being thrown at the Separatists...

... and the sheer melancholy on Yoda's face upon announcing the Clone War had begun...

... might have instead wondered how the Jedi, so opposed to war, could've ended up being generals.

Because while we don't see the Jedi openly protest the use of the clones in the film... they're not exactly giddy about it, either. All they can do is watch powerlessly as it gets voted by the Senate.

"The Jedi are there. But the Jedi aren't really allowed to be involved in the political process. They're there, but they can't suddenly step up and say, "No, no. You can't do that." They have to let the political process go." - George Lucas, Attack of the Clones, Commentary #2, 2002

We also don't see them take on the role of generals, either.

We only see them begrudgingly lead troops on Geonosis, specifically.

But they're not referred to as "generals" yet.

Another writer might have imagined a scene where after Geonosis, Mace Windu talks to Palpatine thinking the Jedi will go back to their roles as diplomats, and that what we saw in Attack of the Clones was a one-time thing to save Obi-Wan, but Palpatine politely goes:

"Ha! No. Didn't you hear? The Senate was so impressed by your performance on Geonosis that they voted to make you all generals in the GAR. Now, get back to the front."

Another writer might've elected to write them having that "big moral debate" she mentions.

Instead, Traviss immediately jumps on the "Jedi are elitists" train.

Because her personal experience with the military makes her sympathize with the clones and her personal belief is that - while the story may frame the Jedi as "the good guys" - nobody is that good a guy, real life people aren't that pure and selfless. There's gotta be something off about them and aHA! That's what it is!

That's her choosing to take that line of thought instead of one more in-line with the story, because she perceives it as unrealistic. But like... Star Wars isn't real life, it's a fairy tale.

That's like saying:

"The hunter in Little Red Riding Hood commits animal cruelty by cutting the Wolf open. He should've let nature take its course, the wolf earned that meal fair and square. If you think the hunter should've saved Red Riding Hood and her Grandma, then clearly you're the kind of monster who thinks one life is worth more than others."

... no?

The story's narrative clearly portrays the wolf as the villain of the tale and frames the Hunter saving Red Riding Hood as a good thing.

Disagreeing with that narrative is absolutely fine, but anybody who acknowledges the wolf is the bad guy in the story isn't automatically an animal hater and/or a bad person. Just because you say "the wolf is the villain" doesn't mean that you think that, in real life, killing wolves for shits and giggles is good.

Conversely, the narrative of the Prequels asks you to suspend your disbelief and not consider the implications that having a clone army entails. Because the use of clones doesn't have a direct impact on either Anakin or the Senate's stories.

Edit: I finished the post this one here originally spun out of!

You can find it here:

[mandalorianhistorian]

expanded universe mando females vs Disney Mando females a short post on actual diverse women vs lazily written my thoughts

(little reminder EU mando culture was written by a women and disneys and clone wars was written by a man)

what makes a mandalorian women in the expanded universe

calling A mandalorian woman, weak or small, is a huge insult to them, so start running if you can. Mandalorian women come in all kinds of ways, human, alien, any shape, height, etc., but for them, strength, honor, and loyalty are of the utmost regard. Mandalorian women do the same as their fellow men, equal in all parts of Mandalorian life. Women of the Manda can raise children adopted or born by themselves or with a partner. Mando women do look after their home wherever the nomads may travel next and raise their kids, but that responsibility isn't just for women; their partner must always help, regardless of species or sex. Mandalorian women are feared by many, especially by their own brothers. Mandalorian men are not scared by many things, but Mandalorian women terrify them Deeply. Mandalorian women in Mando society and culture are the same as the men. We have many moments in the books, games, and comics with amazing women. There are too many to name, but the most known would be Shae Vizla, Mirta gev, Rav Bralor, Parja Bralor. The stories that have these women are amazingly written by many authors but mainly Karen traviss.

why the Disney mandalorian women are not the same as EU mando women

the mandalorian women of Disney do not have the same values or honor as the EU mandalorians instead they seem to have a system that has royalty and hierarchy which was never present in the EU and lets not forget Disney seems to have death watch and the pacifists as the main vocal point when in the EU we have many different groups but Disney mandao women seem to have no value of equality and work. When we do see them they seem angry bitter hostile and just nasty to mandalorian men and the main one we have seen the most is bo katan and by god that women is not fit to be a mandalorian apparently shes the princess which is like how on earth do nomads go to that but that's a topic for another day but it seems Disney has also forgotten alien mandalorian women we see quit a few in the expanded universe. it really just baffles me how terrible their female mandos are. Mandalorian culture has been diverse, and they took it 50 steps back in modern Disney star wars.

difference in Armour non gendered and gendered

The armor in Mandalorian culture is shaped in many ways, but men and women do not have a certain design fixated on them in the expanded universe; they can share the same look or wear any design armor shape, Kama cloak jetpack with their armor, or any other add-on they want for themselves.

expanded universe Armour

the armor of the EU Yes, there is way more in SWTOR, so many helmets and gear, but men and women both wear them; there is no special so-called lady armor for female Mandalorians.

Disney Armour

For Disney Mandalorian women, they seem to all have the same helmet design; however, it is only seen on female Mandalorians putting on a gendered look, which is utterly silly for this culture.

thanks for reading :3 this is just my view as i grew up with Karen traviss writing and work so seeing it destroyed just makes me sad so these are just my quick thoughts.

[roseaesynstylae]

Star Wars: Republic Commando: Triple Zero, Chapter 2

"'I think your sergeant should be leaving all that to Coruscant Security,' said Captain Maze, who clearly didn't understand the situation well enough.

Typical ordinary ARC. Typical stubborn ARC."

You are really one to talk about stubbornness. Not, to be honest, that Maze comes across as particularly stubborn in this situation.

Also, hi, Maze! You're one of the characters in this series that I like (that aren't problematic faves) and who isn't ruined.

"Maze squared up. 'Look, Null, I don't know who your sergeant thinks he is, but you obey a general when he --'

'I don't have time for this.' Ordo brought his fist up hard and without warning right under Maze's chin, knocking him against the wall. The man swore and didn't go down, so Ordo hit him again, this time in the nose -- always demoralizing enough to stop someone dead, but nothing seriously damaging, nothing to cause lasting pain. He would never harm a brother if he could help it. 'And I only take orders from Kal Skirata.'

Jusik and Ordo sprinted the rest of the way to the speeder to make up lost time.

'Ordo...'

'Yes?'

'Ordo, you just flattened an ARC trooper.'

'He was delaying us.'

'But you hit him. Twice.'

'Not permanent harm done,' Ordo said, lifting his kama to slide over the pillion seat behind Jusik. He sealed his helmet. 'You can't convince Alpha ARCs of anything by rational argument. They're every bit as obtuse and impulsive as Fett, believe me.'"

Okay. In order.

Maze immediately zoomed to the top of my RepComm characters' list. Who does Kal Skirata think he is?

Only taking orders from Kal Skirata is one of the Nulls' biggest flaws. This may be shocking, dear, but the man is not always right. In fact, as the series goes on, we will see that he is wrong about a lot of things.

"Can't convince Alpha ARCs of anything by rational argument?' I think that applies to you.

In conclusion, Ordo, prove yourself better than your father and learn to be quiet.

(I want to like Ordo. Like, a lot. But he isn't making a great first impression.)

"'General, do you remember being taken from your parents?'"

Before I say anything else, I will direct this to Ordo: SHUT UP. I AM TRYING TO LIKE YOU. YOU ARE NOT HELPING.

Okay, first, that is really insensitive. Even putting aside the Jedi-Bashing, you don't just say that to someone. It isn't a question that will make him come to terms with himself (although in this series...), it's a question that makes you look like an asshole.

"Taken?" Taken implies kidnapping. Taken implies stealing. I will be dissecting this in a future chapter (which also involves Ordo), but for now, I will just say this.

JEDI ARE NOT BABY-STEALERS.

I swear, I am going to tattoo this on Kal Skirata's forehead so he has to see it whenever he looks in the mirror.

Jedi-Bashing: 5

"'No, I remember being taken from my family. Just being taken. Not my family though.'

'And what makes you so attached to us?' Ordo chose his words carefully, knowing precisely what attachment meant to a Jedi. He knew the answer anyway. 'And doesn't that worry you?'

Jusik paused for a moment and then turned with an anxious smile. Jedi weren't supposed to feel powerful emotions like vengeance or love or hate. Ordo could now see that conflict on the boy's face daily."

*Deep, deep, deep breaths*

Okay.

Now that I've had my first proper rage, I will merely say a few edifying comments.

Attachment is not love.

Attachment in Star Wars is not a good thing.

There needs to be a flashing neon sign saying the above in every Star Wars writer's office.

I don't believe I need to say anything else.

Jedi-Bashing: 8

Shut the Fuck Up, Kal Ordo: 2

"'Save your sympathy for the troopers,' Ordo said. 'Nobody uses us.'"

No one uses them, either. Not the way you put it anyway. Go ahead, tell Rex or Cody or Wolffe they're being used.

I dare you.

"'I'll be cautious,' Jusik said, meshing his fingers in front of him to do that little Jedi bow that Ordo found fascinating. Sometimes Jusik was one of the boys, and sometimes he was ancient, wisely sober, another creature entirely."

Jedi-Bashing: 10

"'Fifteen dead.' Skirata clearly didn't care about civilian casualties, traffic disruption, or structural damage."

If it was anyone else, any other writer, any other book, I wouldn't be too bothered by this. But given Kal Skirata's track record...

Jedi-Bashing: 8

Mando-Shilling: 1

It's a Man's World: 1

Shut the Fuck Up, Kal: 2

Deltas, Move Out: 0

Mird, My Beloved: 0

Is This The Bad Batch?: 2

Main Post

This is the second chapter, people. Second chapter, and I've raged like the Hulk and wanted to strangle a character I literally just met (something that usually only happens with Kal Skirata). I'm trying to be fair and give everyone a fair shake, but this... Maybe it'll get better.

[mysticaltora8276]

Listening to this lovely piece of music again, remembering that in the Republic commando books the so called moral character jumps in the middle of a bunch of teenagers trying to flee the genocide of their own people and defend the clones who are reenacting a genocide only to be killed then the ideal father gets “angry“ then proceeds to massacre the teenagers, whose only crime was trying to run away from their genocide.

[bg-11]

Filoni always was and always will be a hacky, overrated creator who was never any good. I hated all the pointless retcons that TCW made to the existing EU, the change in Ventress' backstory and fate and especially the character assassination of Barriss were some of the worst.

(The Mandalorians I can't be too mad about personally, I think of Traviss as a proto-Disney writer, to be honest. Combative with fans, didn't give a shit about established canon and made retcons and twisted characterisation when it suited her to prop up her pet characters...she and Filoni have a lot in common. Fuck 'em both)

general grievous is one of the characters ever. he’s a pile of lizard organs in a robot suit. he has four arms. he was invented before george lucas had any idea what his personality was and everyone though he had to be the coolest guy ever and then george decided he was an absolute fucking clown and didn’t tell anyone else. he has two different backstories, one of which is him being a tragic warrior-king fighting to preserve his spirit and to avenge his dead queen, and the other is him being an asshole who turned himself robot because the jedi wouldn’t invite him to their parties. he has some of the most raw artwork ever. his real name is qymaen jai sheelai. he has a moe schoolgirl version. they had to spend all of clone wars writing it so that he never met anakin because of one line. he killed a jedi named after shaggy from scooby-doo and another jedi named “master baytes.” he was trained by count dooku and the only thing dooku taught him was spinning. his voice is like 80% post-processing. he has a cough because george lucas had a really bad cough. the cough he uses is george lucas coughing. he has a pet monster and a sassy robot doctor. he has an infinite combo in lego star wars skywalker saga. nearly every one of his lines is a solid meme. i dressed up as him for halloween as a kid. he’s great.

[phoenixyfriend]

Is Karin Travis the reason I keep seeing people who think that the Clones had any attachment to Mandalorian culture?

Uhhh, possibly? I think most Mando'a comes from her Republic Commando books, at least.

[lieutenant-teach]

I really dislike it when anti-Jedi and Jedi-critical crowd uses EU books as a prove for their points. Why they’re all wrong:

a) The books were written by various people who didn’t consult George Lucas about what they’re going to write. Everyone understood SW as they did. When an original author has never claimed such art as canon and actually refused it – this is a definition of fanfiction, isn’t it? Paid, yes, but fanfiction nonetheless.

b) Most of these books were created way before PT. They didn’t know about the Jedi things what we know now. It becomes quite hypocritical – I mean, in the EU the clones were enemies, not allies, but somehow I don’t see any claims ‘but the clones are enemies! The EU says so!’. Even in Karen Traviss books not all the clones have a personality, but we all ignore it now, aren’t we? She wrote her books before the TCW, not knowing how the series would spin the story. So EU retcon works for the clones, but not for the Jedi?

[toaarcan]

Hi, hey there, did you know that the whole "Jedi can deflect blasters so Mandalorians used solid-shot weapons to kill them because blocking a bullet with a lightsaber just results in molten metal spraying the Jedi" meme is actually bullshit?

Like, first thing you have to know about that lore is that it was written by Karen Traviss. Traviss is fairly infamous for writing a shitton of military wank and really hating the Jedi, portraying them as cruel, cold, fascist idiots, who are much, much lamer than the cool Mandalorians, who are badass military types and definitely haven't carried out multiple genocides in the past (they have). She was also known for not exactly playing ball with other writers, and ultimately ragequit the franchise when TCW started to include Mandalorians and portrayed them differently. This was not a detail that basically any other writer in anything Star Wars ever actually backs up.

And like, here's the thing... this exists.

That's a Jedi using the Force to deflect bullets with her bare hand.

This is Tutaminis. And/or Force Deflection, it's not really clear whether they're the same thing or not. It's a pretty standard Force ability that a bunch of characters have demonstrated. Obi-Wan blocks both bullets and a flamethrower with it in the 03 Clone Wars microseries. It's how Yoda catches and redirects Force Lightning during his duels with Dooku in Attack of the Clones and Palpatine in Revenge of the Sith. It's how Vader absorbs Han's shots with his hand in The Empire Strikes Back.

It's also evident from the amount of times that the Mandalorians fight the Jedi with normal blasters instead of breaking out their "anti-Jedi" weapons for their ancient enemies. And the fact that the Mandalorians lost their wars against the Jedi.

If solid-shot guns/slugthrowers were the amazing anti-Jedi weapons that totally always worked against Jedi, then we'd see a lot more slugthrowers and a lot fewer Jedi. We see the CIS' Droid armies fight against the Jedi for three years, we see the Clones being designed from the get-go to kill the Jedi at the end of the war and being highly successful at it, we see the Empire hunting Jedi for the next 19 years and the rest of the Galactic Civil War after that, and y'know what they have in common? None of them use slugthrowers. They all just keep using blasters.

The answer to "How to kill a Jedi" equation has traditionally been depicted as "Use more blasters than they can actually physically deflect."

There's also the detail that Jedi are precognitive space wizards who can move with superhuman speed. If you're actually in range to shoot one with a gun, they'll sense you, evade or block with the Force, close the gap before you can chamber the next round, and revoke your Hand Privileges.

Even the "You'll kill them with a spray of molten metal from the melted bullet!" thing doesn't actually track with what we see on-screen. At the climax of Revenge of the Sith, we see Obi-Wan and Vader fight in the middle of an active volcano. They get splashed with showers of lava a couple of times, and at the end of the fight, both of their clothes are scorched and burned from the embers. Obi-Wan continues to wear his charred robes throughout the rest of the movie. And he's fine. No lava burns. Neither of them actually gets hurt by the lava until Obi-Wan cuts Vader's limbs off and he can no longer move or protect himself, and even then, Vader survives getting burned to a crisp by being really fucking mad about it.

So yeah, it's nonsense. A dumb "Hurr, Jedi are so lame and my unproblematic genocidal warrior race could totally kill them super-easy" take written by Star Wars' own version of Ken Penders.

[mysticaltora8276]

No it’s bad writing that’s all

What if the reason Etain and Bardan seem to think they were kidnapped as children by the Jedi is because neither of them can comprehend the idea that their parents could have given their children away willingly? Etain looks at Kad and wonders how her parents could do the same and still want to give her away

[david-talks-sw]

George Lucas & Karen Traviss' visions of Star Wars are NOT the same...

So whenever I come across this image:

I keep in mind that it's from a book written by Karen Traviss, who is a brilliant author (I adored Legacy of the Force: Bloodlines and Sacrifice) but whose stance on Anakin, Yoda & the Jedi and Star Wars morality is this:

As opposed to George Lucas' stance on Anakin, Yoda & the Jedi and Star Wars' morality, which is this:

In a children's story about Light and Dark, good and evil, selflessness vs selfishness, George Lucas marks the Empire as absolutely evil and the Rebels as absolutely good, in the Original Trilogy.

In the Prequels, the situation is more complex (the Jedi are drafted into a war and forced to do things they know they shouldn't be doing, but have to for the greater good; the Sith bring about order to a corrupt government) but the morality stays the same... the selfish, greedy Sith are absolutely evil and the selfless, compassionate Jedi are absolutely good.

That's George's thesis.

And, as a character, Yoda's function is to deliver that thesis. It's no wonder why Lucas treats Yoda's words as absolutely correct:

Yoda is Lucas' mouthpiece in the Prequels, his self-insert.

George Lucas' narrative frames Yoda as objectively right.

So when Karen Traviss questions the Jedi, particularly Yoda's character and wisdom, she's disagreeing with George Lucas' thesis.

Which is fair. Traviss, is a different person than Lucas, she's an ex-journalist with a more "grey" view of the world and a different philosophy re: fiction aimed at children. "Death of the author" and all that. Again, fair enough.

And if you like Travis' interpretation and philosophy more than George's, if her read resonates with you more... also fair enough.

But the EU is not a reliable source on Lucas' vision.

I've talked about this in MUCH more detail here, but if you do care about George Lucas' vision, then maybe don't draw from the Expanded Universe, which includes content written by authors who expressly disagree with him, like Traviss.

Sounds logical, but for some reason people will read the above-posted Dooku quote and treat it as reflective of Lucas' vision, when it's not the case.

George Lucas' Dooku doesn't have an issue with Yoda or the Jedi (at least not openly, as Darth Tyranus, the Sith Lord he wants them all dead). Dooku's issue is with the Senate and the Republic.

George Lucas specifically added that most Jedi share Dooku's concerns. Before he's revealed to be a mass-murdering, Sith who enslaves neutral systems, the Jedi think he makes a good point and are even reluctant to consider him a murder suspect.

But let's not start saying that Lucas' Prequels are meant to be about "the Jedi's failure" and "Dooku being right that the Jedi are corrupt.

Because that's not the case.

If that's how you see them, great. It's certainly how Traviss saw them. To each their own, authorial intent be damned.

But it's not what they were about, to Lucas. Stating the contrary is... I dunno, lying? Rewriting history?

It's as if I got hired to write a Lord of the Rings prequel seen from Gandalf's POV. And y'know what, maybe I don't like Gandalf. So I write him as a scheming asshole going “myahahahah, fuck hobbits! I’m gonna let them keep the One Ring so a bunch Nazgûl will swoop through the Shire and murder them!” and suddenly, everyone starts writing posts about the notion that “Growing up is realizing that Tolkien always intended for Gandalf to be the secret villain of LOTR!” as if that had always been the case and I didn't just reframe him that way retroactively.

Finally, I'd also encourage you to read @rendar-writes' well-made point here about the fact that, while claiming she "doesn't give the answers", Traviss nonetheless shows a clear anti-Jedi bias.

[starbeltconstellation]

No matter how I look at it, I get the feeling that Lesyle Headland is racist against Asians. Seeing all those characters portrayed by Asian people get mistreated horribly makes me very uncomfortable because I'm Asian myself, and I've been through that multiple times during my life. I'm not the only one who thinks that. I saw there are a couple of other people who think that Lesyle Headland is against Asians too. Kathleen Kennedy keeps pointing out the racism in the fandom, yet she ignores the racism that she HERSELF and her co-workers are doing, and that includes Lesyle Headland! Why did Star Wars now have to be in the hands of a Western company where they keep mistreating Asian characters and Asian people??? Now, with what happened in Sol in the finale, the SW fandom is going to be even more racist and spout more BS against Asians now. I'm tired af of all the hatred towards my people! Both Asians and the Jedi deserve better!!!

Hello, dear anon. ❤️

Firstly, I just want to DEEPLY apologize for the long wait in my response. 😅💔😖 I try not to get behind on asks, but life has been crazy for me at the moment, and especially with longer asks like yours, I really want to take my time and give a good and in depth response.

And yesssss! 👏👏 Speak your truth, dear anon! 😖✊

I will be honest and say that my view—while I HEAVILY dislike LH’s writing morals and style (and just the whole concept of The Acolyte show in general being some ‘girl power fantasy’ for women when the Dark Side is anything but that and is nothing but weighted chains tying you to the ocean floor to drown)—was more charitable at first where I know in my SOUL if I ever met this woman that we probably would not be able to get along if we talked about SW fandom lore too much. And I can accept that! 😂

Not everyone will like or agree with each other. At least she’s not as bad as Karen Traviss, because dear GOD I have recently just learned about the petty hatred that woman has towards the Jedi (with a WORD FOR WORD line of a character in her books EXPLICITLY saying the Jedi Order deserved their genocide! 🤢), and I KNOWWW I would dislike that woman if I met her on the street. I can acknowledge the incredible feat she accomplished with developing Mando’a, while still maintaining that she seems like a very mean spirited person to be around), and it is literally nauseating in the most highly disgusting and disturbing way.

KT is basically a rapid and foaming at the mouth Jedi anti who believes they “got what was coming to them.🤢🥶” LH on the other hand (at least in HER head), views herself as Jedi CRITICAL. And while there is a little bit of a difference there, it’s not as stark a line as fans would try to convince us pro Jedi’s to believe.

There are plenty of fair criticisms about the Jedi that I can acknowledge: the Shimi thing, for one, which is I think just a bad symptom of GL’s writing being more “metaphorical” than literal. Shimi HAS to stay on Tatooine because Anakin eventually HAS to murder the Tuskens in cold blood so GL can tell the story he wants to tell of how Anakin can’t let go, and so the Jedi are never given the opportunity to do what I truly BELIEVE they would’ve done, which is go back and free her, at least for the peace of mind of one of their newest initiate. The plot literally physically bars them from doing so.

And even THIS is not without its flaws, because they would ONLY have wiggle room to free Shimi after the heat of TPM problems had died down where they had time to do so… while walking past/avoiding eye contact with all of Shimi’s slave neighbors, because as specified before—The Jedi have no jurisdiction in the Outer Rim, and you bet your ass if they freed all those slaves and started a war with the Hutts with their little 10,000 strong army, the Republic would take one look and go “Lol, good luck with that,” and not help them at all, which would be basically suicide for the Order to try and accomplish on abolishment of slavery on the Outer Rim all on their own in the TRILLIONS of people in the galaxy. They do not have the MAN POWER for that. Not without the Senate army/clones.

People want the Jedi to do something about it? Get on the Senate’s ass about it then—the REAL people who are responsible for all of the shit going wrong in the Outer Rim while they line their pockets and kiss up to clueless galactic citizens for votes come election time. THEY are the ones that should be responsible for the problems of an ENTIRE galaxy—not a small little minority group (which I’ve already come to realize that the Jedi are. They are a culture/religion/family, and 10,000 is but a drop in the ocean of the galaxy. They are so small in the grand scheme of things that it’s SCARY when considering how easy it was for Palpatine to lead them to almost total annihilation) that try and try and TRY as hard as they can, which is apparently somehow NEVER enough, for the galactic citizens AND the SW fandom itself.

And why is that? Why is it so HARD for SW fandom to relate to them? Why does LH (who I’m sure in her head BELIEVES she’s as progressive as they come) view the Jedi as some type of “space cops” who are “oppressing 🙄” the Sith as a representation of her religious trauma that she is clearly projecting onto them as something completely separate than what the Jedi Culture actually is? Why does she view them as “emotionally repressed” and “almost catholic-like”, and views the fucking SITH (literal SPACE NAZIS 😭🤦‍♀️) as a representation for her persecution as a gay woman?

It’s because—just like MOST SW fans in the US—she cannot fathom a culture outside of the lens of western philosophy. In her mind, the Jedi aren’t a “real 🙄🤢” family. In HER mind, the Jedi aren’t necessarily evil, but she still believes those “poor little culty Jedi 😔💔🙄” didn’t see they were ‘sewing their own destruction’. (Which is blaming them. It’s BLAMING the victims of genocide, and it’s to this day the most disgusting thing I will always remember about the show’s “your actions will cause the destruction of every Jedi in the galaxy” quote that made Twitter go wild with genocide apologia galore).

Some lovely examples! 😁🙃🙃

Disgusting Example 1:

Disgusting Example 2:

Disgusting Example 3:

Disgusting Example 4: REALLY YIKES. 🥶

Disgusting Example 5: Ahhh, would you look at that? We’ve made it into good ol’ ✨dehumanization✨. 🙃🙃🤢

ALL of those examples are not a small portion of the fandom. They are the MAJORITY. This is what the MAJORITY of the fandom truly deep in their hearts believe about the Jedi and their culture and way of life, even if they won’t word it as bluntly as those commenters did out loud.

THIS is what I believe LH’s beliefs regarding the Jedi’s non-western culture is like. She thinks she’s being “fair”, because hey! I made you like Jecki and Yord, didn’t I? 😘😘😘

… And then mere episodes later, she throws the rug out from under you in having Quimir (who she has ADMITTED in interviews is basically her mouthpiece for her own personal thoughts on SW) dehumanize not just Jecki and Yord by saying they were “incapable of going deeper to care about Osha like she deserves 🤢🙄🥶”, but also just by dehumanizing the Jedi in general. It becomes CLEAR in the final episodes that everything was meant to lead up to Osha and Quimir meeting (because they’re clearly Reylo 2.0, and this was LH’s way of getting to smash her Barbie dolls together), which basically gives a feeling of hollowness to the entire backdrop of the show—because the rest of the characters ARE a backdrop to them. She FAKES THE AUDIENCE OUT by pretending to humanize Sol as someone repentant, teasing the possibility of him and Osha being able to talk things out, before swiftly turning him into a one-dimensional caricature of himself who seems to have done a complete 180 on his remorse, only for the sheer purpose of him and Osha not being able to have a conversation. You may say, “Oh, but the show is an unreliable narrator! 🤪🤪🤪”

Except… no, it’s really not. 😭🤦‍♀️ Especially with the way LH spells out that she AGREES with Quimir’s philosophy, she AGREES with that asshole Senator treating the Jedi like shit who are “corrupt/emotionally repressed space monks”, she AGREES with Oshamir fans’s interpretations that the finale of turning to the Dark Side is a TRIUMPH for Osha instead of a heartbreaking moment that will lead to only ruin.

And it’s because—just like most western fans—she just doesn’t even WANT or CARE to understand the eastern philosophy of the Jedi’s culture, and instead projects her feelings from no doubt sympathetic trauma onto something that has no true basis for it. She views something that doesn’t have the “passion” of the Sith’s ‘love 🙄’ as lesser than. She doesn’t really view them as a family, because she only believes in a more standard family dynamic, and instead views them as an institution that “brought everything on themselves. 🥶”

And… honestly? I think you’re basically RIGHT, anon. I don’t think it’s truly this big CONSCIOUS thing. I don’t think she wrote out Sol’s death for the sheer purpose of “Muah-ha-ha”-ing over Asian fans losing some of the honestly most MEMORABLE and AMAZING representation they’ve had in YEARS in the very franchise that borrows from their own culture and philosophy. But I DO think she doesn’t view it as something worth considering. Oshamir is where her mind was at at the end of the day (because ROMANTIC love is something she clearly views as the most important and powerful thing, because OSHAMIR is who stand together at the end. Not Osha or her sister), and I think any other storyline factors became all but insignificant to her in the grand scheme of things. It was easy to kill all of the Jedi characters, because the “new fave” was here—the Sith. And to be fair, his hotness drew in a lot of buzz! But the cancellation and the renew the series petition signatures I think show the gap in how many people were truly interested going forward that weren’t reylo 2.0 fans. Yeah, a lot of people are into villains. But even MORE people want to root for their heros. The Jedi are supposed to be the heroes of SW, and such a show PURPOSELY and VINDICTIVELY portraying them in the worst way possible (the EMPATHETIC SPACE MONKS covered up a massacre? REALLY? 😭🤦‍♀️) throws more people off than LH would like to believe.

The way she killed Sol… it was brutal. And in interviews, she says some bullshit like Sol was “taking away Osha’s agency” by forgiving her and telling her it was okay. Because the portrayal of the Jedi in this show isn’t just “showing their flaws! 🤪🤪🤪” It is purposely writing them in a way that they’ve NEVER been shown to act on screen before—all to make the villain sympathetic, because LH clearly has adopted the thinking (much as radical Anakin fans have), that because someone has become a villain, then SOMEONE must’ve forced their hand. But that’s not how all true three dimensional characters WORK. Yes, there are tragic characters whose circumstances make things worse, but the idea that a villain is always “misunderstood” creates the narrative that the HERO is somehow in the wrong. LH does this because both Osha and Quimir are her new OCs. She makes the Jedi almost completely OOC and portrays them as oppressive to JUSTIFY Quimir and Osha’s actions. Because THIS is what The Acolyte was about: giving Reylo 2.0 a happy ending.

There has been criticism from fans that Jecki and Yord were killed too early which only gave fans an “awww ☹️💔” feeling, because they barely had the chance to even solidify into real characters to make the audience sob and cry at their loss. And I would argue this thinking is right. Because if you look CLOSELY at the background, you can see how it all was just a hollow backdrop for LH’s “dark romance” idea. And I’m not saying such an idea was BAD—I’m saying it wasn’t originally marketed that way. Sol is marketed as the main character (representing Asians in a fantastic way), and then she brutally kills him off, because he was never REALLY important to LH’s story. None of the Jedi were. She was always more interested in the Sith. And so, she tries to make the Sith the “oppressed 🙃🙄”. And I would argue she fails at this with the larger audience, even if loud fans of reylo are chanting about it on tumblr and twitter. The viewership is lower than expected for the show (and part of that is because of the horrible racism and campaign against it from SW dudebros). But honestly, I think a part of it is just… what’s left? Everyone except Osha and Quimir are dead. Sol was brutally murdered on his knees (one of the best Asian representation I’ve seen in a while in SW) like he was nothing but garbage. The Jedi lost, and apparently LH has also character assassinated Vernestra by what she does in the finale, if the character’s fans huffing on tumblr are anything to go by (which is TOTALLY within their right to feel disappointed and angry over an aroace character being treated by the narrative like she and the culture she believes in have ‘no emotion or empathy’ 🥶🤢. There’s that good ol’ ✨dehumanization✨ kicking in again, huh?)

THIS is what SW has apparently decayed into. Into being vindictive and petty and blaming victims for their own persecution and pain. It’s a sign of a self involved culture, which is what the USA/the west is, I’ll admit. Other countries are collectivist. We are individualists. (ie; “I got mine.”) People ENJOY these tales of flipping everything around to blame the heroes and not the villains, because they SEE themselves in villains like Anakin or Kylo Ren or Osha and Quimir. And look—there’s nothing wrong with seeing yourself in a villain and even with sympathizing with them! Anakin’s past as a slave no doubt makes him very much deserving of empathy in that regard.

But the problem is—since they SEE themselves in the villain—then they don’t want the villain to be in the wrong (ie; Anakin). Because if the VILLAIN is in the wrong, then they TOO can also be in the wrong, and a lot of people don’t like to grapple with that. I have seen a recent post going around from someone I was pretty disappointed with that switched sides from pro jedi into anti jedi territory so vindictively and quickly (do NOT attack this person if you know who I’m talking about. I am bringing this up for the sheer purpose of meta. Not to pettily call them out or something), who was responding to an ask where the asker was thanking this person in basically defending Anakin by excusing his actions. The anon said they related heavily to Anakin, and apparently hated recent posts going around which call Anakin out on his behavior, because the anon and this person both believe that the criticism is meant to be vindictive and cruel, when that is rarely the case.

This is where the “Anakin was bullied by The Council/Mace/Obi-Wan” excuses come in. Because Obi-Wan gently offers CONSTRUCTIVE criticism at times, he is somehow viewed as someone who never truly respected or understood Anakin as a person. Because the Council didn’t worship the ground Anakin walked on and didn’t just let him get away with things without a sometimes gentle/firm reprimand, they are somehow viewed as people who have been out to get Anakin and ‘didn’t trust him’ since he was a child. Because Mace butted heads with Anakin at times because they had different opinions on how to be a good Jedi and in their battle strategies on the war, Mace is somehow the most petty and worst man alive who has been “jealous” of Anakin his whole life.

All of these above excuses—in the most nicest way I can state possible—sound like the platitudes that children tell themselves against parents who they’re angry at. This is WHY Anakin went to Palpatine; because Palpatine always told him “Yes.”

And believe it or not?

Sometimes being told “no” isn’t the end of the world or means people hate you.

Sometimes you’re a good person who made a mistake, and just need to be called out to get back on the right track.

Accountability.

LH apparently believes in none of this for her characters. The backstory crafted for Osha and Quirmir clearly shows that. It’s meant to ABSOLVE them.

Funny how the JEDI (the ones based off of Asian inspired culture in certain areas) aren’t given the same courtesy, huh? 🙃🙃

This is why the pro jedi fanfic I’m writing is free therapy. Loooool. 😂❤️

In conclusion—yessss, I think you’re pretty on the mark in a certain type of way, anon, even if we both have a little bit of a charitable gap for LH between the two of us.

I apologize for the late reply again! 😭❤️❤️❤️❤️ I hope the wait was worth it!

-

To any readers that stumble across this and are curious enough to check out my fic:

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Tags:

@ensomnia

@heartfairy

@fangirlteallie

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@lexskiss

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[roseaesynstylae]

Star Wars: The Clone Wars: No Prisoners

So…

I burned out on the RepComm series. I do want to return to it and dissect it as best I can, but I was feeling incandescent rage after reading a two to three sentence paragraph, so I decided to take a break. Hopefully, I’ll be able to restart (I haven’t even gotten to the parts I know I’m going to have Thoughts on), but I need to do something else first.

That’s where No Prisoners comes in. Another book written by Traviss, and, while not as infamous as the RepComm series, is still one I haven’t heard great things about. Why not take a look at it? Who knows, there might be something of value in it.

Look, I can hope. I’m not expecting much, but maybe this won’t make me as angry as Republic Commando does.