#and not just bronlies or whatever

[blanketforcas]

for those who are still unaware

[maipareshaan]

I think i'm only blocked by one person currently

[scoobydoodean]

A bronly just started a squabble with someone who reblogged one of my posts. I don't usually name names, but because a short peruse tells me the sole purpose of their blog seems to be to reblog the posts of people they don't like (mainly destiel shippers looks like) to throw tantrums about straight dean and whatever the fuck else... I'm going to tell you their name is brainrotmeta so you can add them to your blocklist in advance before they decide to spit up their cry baby vomit on you and try to hit you with their baby hands.

[orionsangel86]

Aa someone who pretty much threw away all their hope as soon as SPN cons started up again after the finale, it is a really crazy position to be in now to have to once again adjust my views and reconsider everything thats been said over the last 2.5 years.

I quit spn fandom and stopped paying attention to cast interviews because frankly:

Jared literally does nothing but spew the absolute worst most rancid takes I have ever heard to the point that I genuinely believe the man is completely deranged and has no idea about the show he filmed for 15 years

Misha has basically given up hope and stopped caring. He started off fighting to ensure people took the confession seriously, and seemed genuinely proud and passionate about ensuring people understood the love confession was legit and Cas knew exactly what he was saying, but over the years it seemed like he was broken down behind the scenes and forced to toe a company line of ambiguity for some unknown suspicious reason. Now he's back to resorting to jokes most of the time.

Jackles though, Jackles has until this point always been a fucking head fuck of a mystery. The "sexy silence" post finale. The sole interactions being with Misha and about the confession. The way he gushed about the confession shortly after it aired before the finale. Then the production company, The Winchesters, the J2 messy public fallout and cringy PR fake reassurance of love for his "brother". The fact that in every con up until this point he has kept any answers about the confession abiguous and deliberately vague - always playing both sides, always trying to keep ALL fans happy whatever they believe about the show. The attempt to explain it as Cas not feeling love the way humans do at one point (much to fandoms horror).

I admit I have joked many times about the "jackles long con" (the conspiracy theory that ever since he found out how spn has ended he has personally been on a war path to fix things and give us a satisfactory ending for Dean and Cas) but I was always in 2 minds about whether it was legit a thing. I believed he wanted to fix Dean's ending somehow yes, but I always figured Cas's story was an afterthought the same way Sam's was. I had no delusions that Jackles would legit want to give closure to the confession and give us reciprocated Destiel - whatever that may look like. It just didn't seem like a thing Jackles would want to do. Save Dean? Yes definitely. But actually make it canon that Dean is bisexual and madly in love with his angelic best friend? Even on his most Destiel friendly days I have never been able to truly believe that.

But this latest response from him at jibcon is veerrrry interesting. To plainly state that he hopes the confession is addressed. That he wants to see that. Its the first time he's ever mentioned it in non vague terms.

Look I have no hope of a fanfiction style sappy romantic destiel reunion scene in the Winchesters or whatever. But for Jensen to genuinely give a clear and thoughtful response about what he thinks that would look like, that he thinks Dean would want to talk about that, and address it, that is certainly progress beyond anything we've had from him before.

One of my friends in our group chat raised the thought of Jackles addressing the confession only to have Dean tell Cas he's sorry, but he doesn't feel the same way. THAT is a terrifying thought, but I gotta ask, would Jackles really do such a thing? He knows exactly how much Destiel means to the fans. He knows how important it is, hell, he was online watching the Nov 5th fallout along with everyone else. If it wasnt important, it wouldn't have trended above the US election. He would alienate the majority of his fanbase. Remember, he has already technically picked a side - something I thought he would never do. The Jared stans and bronlies and Destiel haters all loathe him now. They curse his name as much as Misha's ever since he dared to exclude Sam/Jared from The Winchesters. Jensen isn't an idiot, he knows who his main fanbase is, and that is proved even more obvious by The Winchesters itself, which according to my friends who watch it, is very pro Destiel. My friend described it as what SPN could have been were it not for Jared and Bob Singer - a kinder, friendlier, queerer, and more equal, show. I haven't watched it so I can't comment, but I see so many people say that this among other recent behaviours proves that Jackles is on our side.

I am of course still a bit hesitant to give him so much credit. I'm not gonna stamp him with a big HELLER FRIEND stamp like the one we stamped on Misha years ago. But I am feeling more positive towards him than I have in ages.

Ever since the confession, the official stance on Destiel seems to be to keep it as vague and ambiguous as possible. To never confirm or deny anything especially when it comes to Dean. This has been frustrating, but has kept the door open at least.

By Jackles stating today that he wants the confession addressed and even hinting that it may be in the cards sooner rather than later, tells me that a decision has possibly been made.

The ambiguity has got to go. Dean either reciprocates or he doesn't. Those are the only options available.

If, as it has so often been teased and alluded to, Cas is going to make an appearance in The Winchesters, Jackles would surely need to get Misha on board with his plans. Misha who has been firmly on the side of Destiel since day 1. Would Misha really agree to step back into Cas's shoes only to have his heart broken by a rejection from the man he loves? I don't think he would.

So surely, the only way for the confession to be addressed is to go with the other option. Full reciprocation.

Who else is there to even object anymore? Jared? Fuck that guy? Bob Singer? That old asshole has no power anymore. The CW? Maybe. I dunno what Jackles situation is with the execs and how much power he has over the Winchesters stories. But perhaps he's been able to convince them? Given the state of queer media in 2022 and how rapidly the world has moved on from tolerating CW style queerbait.

Shows like OFMD, Good Omens, The Sandman, IWTV, WWDITS, etc etc... they have proven that queer is popular. It brings in cash. The CW has always been sitting on a goldmine with Destiel, which has never really stopped being popular, even now. They were fools to not go all the way the first time around, and after the queer media boom of 2022 they look like even bigger fools. I still have my own beliefs about the circumstances that prevented a proper destiel ending (mostly to do with the business of the one star the CW were holding onto at that time and his stupid cop propoganda show) but considering all that has happened since then, were the CW given another chance to explore Destiel now, I think they'd be absolute fools not to take it.

Anyway, the point of all my rambling is this: I think I'm back on board. Laying it all out logically, if Jackles is gonna address this, he's gonna do it in the way that will be the most popular, and generate the most publicity, engagement, and ultimately, cash.

In other words: we may see yet ANOTHER "Destiel is canon" day before the decade is over.

[caslikescoffeeandfreckles]

Why does today feel like we’re all gearing up for war and saying our final goodbyes to our comrades we’ve spent the last 12 years training with side by side

[steveyockey]

do you think that -- if they WERE planning to do gay angel press initially -- part of the reason they didn't might have been the (reactionary) bury your gays backlash from fans and non-fans? in which case. twitter rly does ruin everything. :/

I’m not tied to this but here’s a hypothetical to work through that at least provides a theory on the lack of gay angel press (probably not very different from any other theory on this website but just writing it out for continuity),

okay. pre-pandemic. the arc of the final few episodes seems to have been set and 15.18 was the last piece, pending jensen’s approval. roadhouse heaven ending was a go — presumably featuring a cas cameo among other various and sundry friends. approving 15.18 introduces a problem by way of the fact that cas has just confessed his undying love for dean and there’s an expected response. but it’s fine! you don’t actually need that, you’ve been baiting fans for a decade, you can work your magic one more time with a lil wink and nudge and never have to deal with that again. ambiguous “to each his own” ending, you talk up the gay angel on one side and the bronly-ness of the last hunt on the other; everyone walks away happy. you have successfully threaded the needle of finishing off a twelve year queerbait without “caving to the fans,” high fives all around.

15.18 gets filmed. the angel is gay gay. the footage is. we don’t know what the footage looks like. there could be anything. maybe there’s a kiss with tongue. ends up not really mattering because the pandemic happens and they have to stop shooting and stop airing. no idea how much changes in 15.19 (clearly SOME stuff considering we know the folks who got chuck snapped in the silo were supposed to be shown back in the flesh and that got cut). 15.20 has to change — so roadhouse heaven becomes three person heaven (plus the cast and crew, who were already on set so no, this is not proof they could have brought a crowd of actors anyway, it’s just. weird. I don’t like this decision. strikes me as authoritative like WE told the story not YOU. anyway). putting cas in three person heaven makes winking and nudging a lot harder to do and would make the absence of an actual substantive response to the confession uhhhh very obvious. so you have to cut cas. and then maybe you have to cut other references to cas in 15.19, maybe you cut some emotionality from dean’s side in 15.18, maybe you straight up insert the moment in 15.20 where dean tells sam to stop being an eeyore about cas’s death! we don’t know how much was changed, but there was at least the opportunity at this point to dull dean’s response to the whole thing so the absence of cas in heaven is more palatable. it’s the bronly ending, but you already gave the audience the gay angel. and the gay angel is alive and building heaven with his son! no more cashing in on the queerbait but still cashing in on canon gay.

it’s november 5th. 15.18 airs. it trends higher than the biggest election “of our lives.” holy shit! gay angel! but of course the issue is the people responding aren’t the people who have been watching the show. they don’t have context for what’s going on and “turbohell” catches on. fuck. did you kill the gay angel? of course not, he’s in heaven with his son! lisa berry can post her goodbye instagram to her character because obviously billie’s dead, she’s the villain. she’s not expected to come back. but cas is... cas is different. and he’s not dead and you won’t be taking any questions on this until we get to the end, when everyone can settle down. so you have your actors gush about the episode, you leave everyone on pins and needles so they’ll come back for two more, and then! well. 15.20. cas is “alive” technically. dean is dead, as you always planned. some people are happy, some people are middling, and some people are fucking pissed at you because apparently by not outright killing off the gay angel you promised them the gay angel was coming back. any clarification you would offer here would unspool your entire plan — gay angel on one side, brothers on the other. erasing cas isn’t the same as killing him, but you can’t say that (though misha basically did in response to the rogue translator shenanigans). killing dean wasn’t even supposed to be about cas, but now everything is about cas. you took him out of the story completely and he’s still managed to take over. and all you can say is, well, it’s always been a story about brothers.

this obviously doesn’t account for everything, such as what the fuck was uriel’s actor doing? why the fuck did the show actually give us the instructions for how to get someone out of the empty and not do it? and there’s an infinite number of things that could have happened that I would simply never guess not knowing specific onset dynamics and money decisions. whatever happened that caused this clusterfuck really does suck for everyone in that writers room who was on team gay angel because, as I have said in the past, 15.18 only works due to at least four years, if not seven or more, of consciously writing the angel as gay. I hope bobo and yockey and even misha feel personal satisfaction at a job well done, but god if a single fucking interview could at least let us indulge in the victory with them. anyway, all of this is to say, yes I do think the bury-your-gays of it all definitely plays into it (and I would say, again, linking this to it chapter 2, it’s significant muschietti and co decided to make richie gay over eddie; people who haven’t read the book might not know that eddie like. literally drinks mineral water. in the 80s. he wears gucci loafers. he marries a carbon copy of his mother. stephen king would never admit to writing a gay man but that was a gay man. but eddie dies! eddie always dies. so they had some good sense in giving the gay story to the one who lives and leaving the dead one holding all the coding). and I definitely think randos on twitter making fun of the confession did not help matters. but I also think the decision to pull press cannot be extricated from the rubble of the last two episodes and everything they promised but never delivered. literally a single second of cas in the finale would have been their golden ticket! that’s far more than what jj did for star wars! but they got played at their own game by, of all things, an international pandemic. somehow a very supernatural ending after all.

[ladyluscinia]

Normally I just kind of roll my eyes at bad takes by bronlies, but the sheer cognitive dissonance in their approach to side characters has been really nagging at me recently.

I've seen too many "explanations" of why some non-Winchester is not worth attention and they tend to have pretty repetitive reasons: the character doesn't affect the plot, they have insufficient characterization, Sam and Dean barely know them / don't care, or they are random extra #6254. These points are usually exaggerated to absurdity, but that's the core of the problem with side characters. And bronlies will put it forth as reasoning why the show should have never bothered with side characters at all.

Ignoring, of course, that every one of those problems does exist, but as a direct result of Supernatural not treating its side characters like, well, normal side characters!

Side characters are supposed to affect the plot. They exist to fill supporting roles! Get called for backup. Deliver crucial info. Prompt protagonist actions. See Ruby and Cas in S4. It's impossible for two people + antagonists to move a story along.

Side characters are supposed to get minor character arcs. It's how you give the mains some breathing room and prevent the show from getting repetitive. It helps the viewers get attached. It's makes them more interesting. As a bonus, it often loops in the main characters, leading to...

Side characters should have well built relationships - platonic, familial, parental, whatever - with the main characters. Not necessarily structuring their lives around them, but friends should show up regularly. No one chooses to live in isolation just because. If you haven't established a strong in-narrative reason why your main characters wouldn't have any friends (and Supernatural doesn't) then it makes no sense for them not to care. And kinda makes them assholes for no reason.

And finally, not developing side characters normally and keeping them around still doesn't let you write a show without side characters. It literally just makes more of them. Every writer who needs a side character to fill a supporting role in their episode just makes one up if they don't have an established pool to pull from. Or they grab a character they liked from a previous one-off. Or they replace a character that got killed off, starting the development from scratch. Killing Kevin gives us Donatello. Ugh.

It's just... there is a reason shows do not have a two person cast. Can anyone point to any other show they think successfully pulled that off for more than a year or two??? Can they tell me how they think S4 would have worked as a plot with no Ruby or Cas (or Bobby or Anna or Uriel or-)? And why they think any season after that magically regained the ability?

Bronly hostility toward side characters (both in the fandom and the writing room) didn't change the necessity of having them, it just prevented the show from having good ones for most of it's run. And their frequent proposed solution is that the show should have given us more underdeveloped one-off characters instead of (rarely) bringing people back???

(And now I'm thinking how even the "good" side characters of Dabb era weren't allowed to do a lot of this either, despite getting more episodes. Society if Rowena was finally the replacement for Ruby's vacant supporting role and Sam actually got a Witch!Sam arc.)

Side characters exist for legitimate storytelling reasons. They aren't optional past a certain point. The only option is whether you handle them well, and why the hell would you choose bad decisions over good ones?

[deansawthetvglow]

okay as a casual viewer who sometimes sticks her nose in spn blogs to see what they're up to just for plain fun, i have to say that destiel shippers may be a bit too delusional and weird and whatever but y'all are so funny and creative it's incredibly sec see. antis and bronlies mad boring y'all are amazing. destiel rights

destiel rights so true anon

[sinnabonka]

15x19: So bad, that it’s actually good

Yesterday I had the experience of my life. I couldn’t watch the show (hi, everyone stuck in UTC+ shithole), but I couldn’t sleep either, so I ended up at 3 AM reading my people livestreaming it on Tumblr. This was one hell of a roller coaster, given the absurdity of the plot and the weakest writing in this season.

(I don’t mean the excellent and ironical and powerful message to the fandom, we’ll get there)

I was aware beforehand what I was getting, so no major disappointment regarding not seeing Cas back this week. Also, it kinda was my call, that he’ll be back in the final final.

The Ultimate Happy End, the biggest win of Dean Winchester. Chuck’s book ended, and Cas is not in Chuck’s book.

Was it bad? Yes, it was. Did I enjoy it? Hell yeah, I did. 

Everyone on Tumblr already gave their two cents of hatred regarding the writing, the montage, the solemn aim of this episode (spoiler alert: to please the general audience and bronlies), and I will give mine, too. Watcha say?

It was so bad.

I didn’t believe it was the same show as the rest of Season 15. It was like rereading the fanfic my stupid 13 y.o. self wrote after like half a season and no skill or whatever. Full OOC, everyone. Learn what not to do. 

I am so happy I didn’t watch ep 18 and 19 in one night. Could you imagine? That would be like getting kicked in the balls after a pretty good blowjob or something. Idk, but I can imagine.

It was lazy, it was just connecting two dots in the shortest way possible, although, leaving dozens of gaps! How, in the name of God, did they manage it?

Why Chuck could bring Lucifer back, but Jack didn’t pull Cas out of the empty before evaporating? 

Why Sam has no fucks to give about Eileen?

How did Michael miss the whole thing of Jack gaining powers, don’t angels, like, have a nose for such things?

What battle is he talking about? It’s was a single stab!

It’s all just so easy, so short sighted. God is bad, let’s defeat God. Lucifer is bad, too, let him do bad, again. Michael is petty, and with Adam gone he’s back to his tropes being daddy’s boy, let him not being appreciated one more time and lets kill him off, too. I mean, my speculations on this ep were stronger.

Let’s make our characters retell the villain what was happening off screen. Let’s put some direct call backs to the previous episode, but make it feel like a grain of sand in the eye. Let’s give Dean a miracle, just for Miracle to be yanked away from his hands a moment later (parallels to Cas, anyone?). 

Let’s pretend there’s no Eileen, there’s no Cas, let’s pretend they don’t matter! Let’s pretend “Just us” is a happy end. Let’s have two bros driving in sunset, because after all those years and all their losses, that’s the only thing that matters. “To everyone we’ve lost along the way”, my ass.  

(Totally following my call in here, though, I hate being right)

It was everything I’ve hated about the show back in 2013 when I left. And it was everything this show is not now, which I am so thankful for, and why I am back.

All those sloppy plot decisions, episodes with no logic, awkward and ridiculous montage, “only bro” dynamics, bending and totally ignoring the rules of the universe. The episodes with Lucifer, too, for crying out loud. 

Forced happiness, fake smiles, a lingering touch, close up at the beer bottles. It’s just them, the Winchesters, and the whole world can go fuck itself, as long as they get to drive their Impala to the end of the world and back.

This is something Chuck would love to be their ending. You see what I’m doing here? This episode - it’s Chuck’s book, it’s the bad ending Becky’s been talking about: all action and no Cas. In other words, not good. 

So, what’s good about it then?

In this episode we hear “the old Supernatural” talking through the words of Chuck and “the new Supernatural” answering, with Dean’s and Sam’s help:

Chuck: “What did you do?”

Dean: “We won.”

Chuck: “So this is how it ends?”

We won. The Author (TM) is defeated.

Chuck: “For the fist time I have no idea what happens next. Is this where you kill me? Dying of hand of Sam and Dean Winchesters. It’s kinda glorious?”

Chuck - the old Supernatural - wants the story to end this way. With killing God, with this bittersweet aftertaste, because Cas says all those beautiful words, but Dean still feeds off his anger and kills. Typical Chuck, right?

But, no! Not this time!

Dean: “See, that’s not who I am. That’s not who we are.”

Chuck: “What kind of ending is this?”

Sam: “His power. You sure it won’t come back?”

Jack: “It’s not his power anymore.”

It’s not their call! Writers tried to control the narrative so hard, but just kept circling around, killing one of the brothers just to bring him back. This time, there’s another ending. 

Dean: “It’s the ending where you grow old. You get sick. And you just die”

Sam: “And no one cares. And no one remembers you. You’re just forgotten.”

Because that, my people, is the destiny of Supernatural if it ends this way. It’s the ending of “Supernatural” by Chuck Shurley. If it is the story of two brothers hunting evil for fifteen years and finding themselves back in the place they begun in, what’s the point? Yes, we love the characters, but the story is empty.

Everyone is going to forget about it before the final credits end. And the writers are well aware of it. 

Quoting myself, If we keep taking the same route - we end up in the same place. How many seasons ended with Winchesters together, just the two of them? You’ll find one, that’s for sure. There’s no novelty in that ending. 

(And Bobo didn’t provoke The Ultimate Shitstorm of 11/5/2020 for nothing!)

The episode 20 will be something Supernatural will be well remembered by. It will be a game changer! 

I’ve written here about the change of the philosophy of the show (point 6). I’ll be a bit of a Chuck myself and put my own quote here once again:

The message the show wants to give the world has changed. From “it’s all about the journey, about saving people, killing things, no one ever gets what they deserve”, the philosophy has changed drastically toward the “good things do happen, you deserve to be saved, to be loved”.

And this, my people, is what we are getting in the next episode. Because Chuck’s story was about killing your brother, killing your son, one apocalypse after another, Lucifer, Michael, all that shit. 

But Dean’s and Sam’s is not. And in their book, there’s Cas, there’s Eileen, and everyone they didn’t lost along the way.

So, brothers driving in sunset? Not the end, but the beginning of their own story.

“Supernatural” indeed ended tonight. But our story didn’t.

[fictionkinfessions]

its weird seeing so many interpretations of yourself as like... transmasc... like... yeah im a traumatized kids brains interpretation of a character from a videogame to cope as escapism, so... not exactly one to one... but its funny to, should i allow myself the hubris of considering myself the original sunny suzuki or whatever the last name ends up as- anyway... its funny that id give off trans energy then peopled just assume the wrong one... mh... the other host i mentioned, kins basil p hard whereas im just sunny, anyway, she would probably say thats at least partially due to like... transmisogyny or something... ... wonder if i count as a woman... like for the purposes of.. misogyny... misandry........misandrogyny... misgynoandry... thats a fun word...... 'm probably like... genderqueers probably the term... wouldnt really consider myself a guy or a girl... m....... hm....'m sunny... 's all........ i miss kel... i miss all of them... obviously... but rn the miss-ter is the one the only the bronly the slonly the gonly kelsey belsey derelsy kel kelliums... m.... you know how like... the animal uhh analog... me and mewo, kel and hector, aubrey and bunbun, basil doesnt have a pet... always thought hed be a... wild rabbit though. smaller than the domesticated... stays in gardens... timid but guarded... either that or a rat... a fancy rat... but rats are too nice to be basil... methinks rats cant be... intimidating like rabbits can...rats will be scared and look scared... rabbits will be scared and look frenzied... u kno............ yeah...... m... thats probably enough rambling to fall asleep... oh well... night tumbr.com kinfessions blog

-sunny of hikikomori fame <5

'

[maipareshaan]

I cannot fully enjoy bullying Sam bcz i feel like i don't have a group you know like i'm all alone and i like the bronly Dean factions or really its mostly simply about being sane, like ppl who aren't throwing weirdo tantrums about the character's death and deserves better and trauma and doing fiction right while doing it so wrong blech, like just blech, and besides bronlies or whatever mostly noone meets that criteria. So ya i can't tolerate them and their weird anti dean crit obsession. I get it if like again a sane person complains but if its one of those ppl literally still making blogs about how traumatised they are and hated they are blech bcz of killing a character blech. BLECH.

Again i am sorry but the delusion is just so weird like just such weirdos. Like its fine and they are so weird about the actor.

Like their whining is very clear even tho they think they are geniuses, Dean a child abuse victim should be a good victim narrative and hate his father and reject the codependency imposed on him by separating from his brother in whatever way shape or form who cares not about him and would it not give us gay rights finally and establish world peace to have found family D*stiel, do we not deserve good things, we do, i am owed this for watching this show and having these hopes and thinking this wqy bcz i do media right actually, have my third eye open. Oh how Jensen Ackles the closeted reformed gay homophobe hates it so much too bcz of the same reasons yup the same reasons cuz he loves Dean so much yup not bcz he just wanted to continue making spn so him dying is a problem and not manly to die and clearly he fully loves Dean loving his fathere even when literally noone cares.

Delusional.

[starsovermyhead]

Wait, what’s changed for autographs at cons?

@plaiddoodles said: I keep hearing whispers about this but I have yet to see the actual changes that people are talking about (besides of course from Denver Con when JA switched days)

Answering both at once:

Basically, J2's schedule changed, splitting some of their events into two days (which was already gradually happening at Dencon and Charcon). And there's now a separation at J2's autographs: photos and photo ops are signed on Sunday, while everything else is on Saturday.

I don't see anything special about it, other than an attempt to make actors and handlers' work easier. But many people consider it a reaction to fandom's behaviour, it seems. Bronlies say that this rule was added because Jensen was asked to sign (and did sign) an illustrated Destiel fanfic anthology at Charlotte; hellers say some events were rescheduled because (most likely) a bronly recorded and then posted Jensen's answer from meet & greet at Denver. It's weird, and I don't understand this logic. We probably will never know the truth.

Before that, at Charcon, an NDA was added for Jensen's m&g only. While it could be because of "Rust", many people said that he isn't allowed to talk about this anyway — and Jensen himself explained that at the panel. I saw a post pointing out that CE has been trying to stop leaks from m&g's for some time, and NDA could be part of those efforts. Whatever the reason is, this change is definitely a result of the Dencon leak. It's interesting, though, that NDA was added only for Jensen's event instead of becoming a blanket rule.

And that's what makes me wonder if Jensen actually wants to stop going to SPN conventions, while Creation tries to keep him by adding more accommodations. Because out of three changes, two were made for him, and the third could've been as well. This is purely speculation, though, don't quote me on this. Maybe both Jays just don't want to cram 10+ events into one day anymore.

[orionsangel86]

Lets talk about the Bare Minimum

Okay guys, obviously there is a huge divide here among those of us that are super positive and excited and those of you that are really doubtful the finale will give us anything remotely worthwhile. So lets break this down okay? Perhaps it can get us all on a fairly level playing field?

What is the absolute bare minimum the Supernatural Finale can give us to satisfy us?

Everyone will have different ideas of course, but if we dismiss all our wildest dreams and high expectations and consider the fact that yes, this is still Supernatural and they do tend to run on a mix of batshit crazy, profound and poetic beauty, and things seemingly falling into place so perfectly it was clearly 100% accidental (eg: The Monster at the End of this Book) then we should probably try to find a centre point. A point that we can use to gauge how the episode will fair overall.

So what is the bare minimum?

Castiel returns

This is it. This should be the bare minimum we should expect in order to make this finale meaningful.

If we are given nothing else, Cas returning should be enough for us to nod and say “okay Supernatural. You tried. You got him back. He was there for the finale. That’s the main thing.”

If Castiel isn’t back and the finale is just Sam and Dean driving around looking for generic MOTW hunts like in Season 1 in some sort of bronly wet dream, that would be a massive anticlimax and miserable way to end the series. It will be the worst ending of a show since GoT.

BUT we know Misha filmed 20. I will hear no more to the alternative. Misha filming 20 is and always has been a fundamental FACT.

So Castiel returns. Bare minimum met? Right? Of course there are caveats to that key point.

Castiel returning in flashback form only, or as a memory or dream, whilst the actual Castiel still remains in the Empty is NOT an acceptable option. If the show takes this route, this is still below the bare minimum. This would be deemed a failure in my opinion just as if the finale is just Sam and Dean being bros on the road.

What really needs to happen for the bare minimum to be met, is for Castiel to be rescued from the Empty. Whether that is by Jack, by Dean, or by himself or some other means, Castiel must return from the Empty to fix the only actual loose end not tied up in 15x19. We should also finally get the Empty being sent back to sleep, because having just binge watched episodes 12-18 all in one week, let me tell you, the amount of times it is repeated that the Empty desperately wants to go back to sleep is a LOT. From what I have been told, the Empty isn’t even mentioned in 19, so that is the only plot point actually still hanging over the series.

Of course, had Castiel not confessed his “homosexual feelings of love” for Dean in 15x18, then at this point I would have said that the bare minimum I needed was for Cas to be saved, and for Dean to give him a heartfelt hug and a look of love and to say “lets go home” off into a future where we know the story ends with Dean and Cas together in an ambiguous relationship. (Honestly, for a long time, this is the ending I thought we would get).

But Dabb and Bobo have written themselves into a very specific corner.

Castiel’s confession was not ambiguous. Because of this, the big question hanging over the final ever episode of the longest running genre show on TV, isn’t about whether the heroes will stop the big bad, it isn’t whether or not they will live or die, nope, it’s whether the lead male character will reciprocate romantic love for his “equally male” (Note - I’m talking in terms of mainstream here don’t @ me) best friend. The big question Supernatural has gone and put to its audience is “is Dean Winchester also in love with Castiel and therefore, is he also queer?”

This is an unpresedented situation that the show has put itself in.

Because of this, the bare minimum is no longer just Castiel being saved. It’s also Dean answering that question that the show has put to us.

Castiel must be saved, and the love confession must be addressed. These things are the key points going into this final episode. If either of them are glossed over in any way, the show would have fundamentally failed it’s audience, its characters, it’s cast, and everyone involved in it. Given how optimistic and happy everyone who works on the show seems to be currently, I highly doubt that is the case.

So. Castiel must be saved, and the confession must be addressed. Do we accept Dean rejecting Cas?

There is I suppose, a very slim chance that this could happen. If the Network let their own homophobia get to them (before you come @ me, no I don’t consider the CW’s many young attractive lesbian characters to let them off the hook for years of avoiding any non stereotypical queer men. IT’S TOTALLY DIFFERENT) then they may have greenlighted Cas’s queerness whilst refusing to do the same for Dean. They may consider simply saving Castiel and therefore #resurrectingyourgays as enough to satisfy the queer viewers, even though Castiel’s love was not returned. Perhaps in the final episode we will get a flashforward to years down the line and Cas has got over Dean and is living it up with another man? It’s possible right?

It would also cause utter outrage in the fanbase. Dabb and Bobo are far more savvy than fandom gives them credit for. I personally think that had the network said no to Dean reciprocating Castiel’s love, then Dabb and Bobo would have kept it ambiguous, and simply strongly implied that they end up together in an ending like the one I always thought we would get when my hopes for Destiel were at a low point.

So Dean reciprocating Castiel’s love also falls under the bare minimum requirements for the episode to be a success.

How they go about showing Dean reciprocating Cas’s feelings I don’t know. Do I absolutely need a kiss? No. It’s not a bare minimum requirement. Anything beyond Dean simply telling Cas he loves him back and Cas smiling at him is a bonus. Perhaps they could show it the way they showed Jesse and Cesar in 11x19. Through affection and care, but no actual kisses.

Whilst I personally believe we will get a kiss, it’s not a bare minimum, and if we don’t get one I will still be satisfied so long as we get all of the following:

Castiel is saved from the Empty

Dean reciprocates his love

Dean and Cas end up together (whether that be to live lives together on Earth, or both go out fighting and reunite in heaven together. Whatever the case, they must end up together)

My 3rd point here is the only other bare minimum requirement I need to not feel like they have screwed it up. I don’t care whether Dean and Cas end the show alive or dead. What I DO care is that regardless of where they end up, be it Earth, Heaven, or even Purgaytory, they are together. They must end the series together.

There are of course many other things I want. I want Cas to give up his grace (by choice) and become a human (I really wanna see him in Winchester plaid at least once!). I want to see them slow dancing like Garth and Bess did in 15x10. I want Sam to reunite with Eileen and also get a happy ending. I hope they get to keep the damn dog too. Ideally, I want a soft epilogue, because these boys are good people, and they’ve suffered enough. Whatever else may happen though, so long as those bare minimum requirements are met, I will consider the ending a resounding success.

Personally, I don’t think I’m asking for much.

[theyarebothgunshot]

Bronlies might see this as them getting what they want, but in my opinion, I think it’s quite telling that Jared is apparently available to do panels on Saturday, and yet they didn’t just swap days for the J2 panels, which probably would have been an easier way to rearrange the schedule. Instead, Jensen still has a solo, and the J2 one is short (and also probably only a thing due to the ridiculous emails the wincesties/bronlies were flooding creation with 🙄)

ehhh not to come to j*reds defense (cause i would never <3) but i dont think it is that black and white, there could be a million different reasons for the short panel (scheduling issues, or whatever, or maybe j*red does actually have prior engagements other than the planned panel(s)).

[swiftnatural]

They really reduced Dean to “oh hey pie...oh look impala...sammy” and after years of character development that SHOULD piss you off. That should piss off everyone in the fandom who actually CARES about Dean. Years of character development and he was reduced to s1 Dean and that should piss. you. off.

I don’t care if you’re a heller or a bronly or WHATEVER, how is it an ideal ending to just erase character development? I’m getting the impression that the people who liked the ending are the people who despised Misha/Cas so much that they ignored everything meaningful that they were seeing. Make it make sense.

[mute-jensen]

I recently got several hateful asks at once. Right now I have like 12 hateful asks in my inbox. And it was not wierd for me that such a thing happened because I had clearly explained my opinion to some people, but it was wierd to get all these asks at once. Before starting my blog, I had blocked all the Bronlies i knew so that they couldnt find my blog and couldnt bring their hatred into it. But surely all these bronlies finding my blog all of a sudden was suspicious. Then I looked around and finally found the blog I was looking for.

The owner of this blog screenshots your post and puts it in her own blog with an EXPLANATION. You can read her bio.

I literally found every destiel post i have ever posted in this blog.

I really dont blame her . When you dont like something bad as wincest and you say you hate it out loud this happens.

But whats her problem with other blogs😕

Like @flowersforcas :

Or @roguecas :

@trenchcas :

@superduckbatrebel :

@princesscas :

@castiel-left-his-mark-on-me :

And many others...

I dont know you but i really dont like people take screenshots of my posts and mock it.

And ofc she came to myblog (where else she should go):

This one was my fav:

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

Does it really matter????

But wow, thank you so much for showing how problematic my spelling is( i really dont double check my post for spelling errors ). Honey, English is my fourth language and I'm still learning. Posting in tumblr is just a hobby for me to strengthen my writing( as you can see im not doing any progress😐) But maybe for you a person who knows four languages ​​and does not know how to spell a few words is an illiterate person, OK whatever you say!!!

If you dont want your posts to end up there ...

BLOCK HER NOW!