#and i think that tommy joining with tubbo is the best thing for his character

[mango-macaron]

I'm just adding my 2 cents on C!Tommy and C!Tubbo.

He's one of the main characters, or THE main character really. The plot of him and Dream is kind of the whole reason the plot really started to develop.

I think he's incredibly tragic as an actual analysis. He's incredibly traumatised and doesn't actually get to live as a teenager. He's chucked into something he doesn't understand, becomes a child soldier for something he didn't really want, all the people he tries to lean on can't really help him.

Tubbo too. He drifts away from Tommy, endures much more than an actual teenager should. Hell, he got ASSASSINATED. He was BY his best friend with a conflict they can't win.

Not only that, they drift away from each other as well. The one thing that brought them together also breaks them.

That's a lot of relationships that also do that: The one thing that joins you together also destroys you.

Usually, you communicate it to your partner/friend/family member/etc so you can grow closer together and talk about your boundaries.

But they're in war, so they don't have any time to. And when it's over they keep drifting. And drifting. Away from each other.

The one therapist can only handle so much, and the burden on the two isn't spoken about by the others.

Yes, it's over. But there's still trauma around what they went through. That they shouldn't have actually participated in.

[mentallhealthmatters]

Hey im in situation with a Person on TikTok and I don’t want to give them wrong information, I forgot most of what the other responses to Wilbur was when they said they also went through his abuse apparently. I want to reply to show them I’m not backing down, show from that comment they made I want to have a strong argument on that matter that will tell them why I support him and some other content creators on the matter.

Yes I can argue that Nikki went through stuff and she was only 18-19 at the time when he came into her life, if I’m getting my information right. Yes you can make the argument “we don’t know what it was like off camera.” Which is very true and valid. We are an audience, and we don’t know about there personal lives fully and down to the T, for they can say/do stuff they want to put out on the internet or one can just dig up old stuff cause the internet never forgets.

I just want to give information and not a backhand response and be like “Well they are all horrible and we’re just using him for clout.” Or “Well Shubble was stupid for showing it on camera, and could have gone to police but she had to make it public and that’s why many people are saying they were also a victim to get clout.” I don’t want the response to be poor and make them twist my words. Because that has happened and I don’t want that again so I’m reaching out for some information, I did say that she is many things which are true (not the insult type of way). But now they are asking about others, the whole Alice situation was debunked and proven false but the others around that did stuff/with him to like Freddie, Billzo, Asmiey, Tubbo, and there were other Women as well that worked with him that came out I think a trumpeter, and probably two other women who I cannot remember.

I’m sorry this is long but I want to say what I thought and the information that I would need cleared up to give to this individual. I am asking anonymously for i don’t want my main out in the public.

Have a nice day and it’s ok if you don’t respond or give enough information I just want to break it down and show that I stand by my opinion, and tell them an answer that will show multiple people have spoke on to make my word also valid and not just a random output of how I personally feel/false information on the matter, for the people who Wilbur interacted with and said something about him and being bad to them and there friends publicly.

-musicliver

Im reread this several times over and am still not sure if im even processing this infomation correctly or what do with it exactly.

Im grasping at there is a request for infomation, but im no sure which info would even be best because i dont know the other persons arguements.

There is also a lot of info mentioned im sure is true but is talked about so less than shelby that much info on those specific subjects isnt evenbrought properly to light.

Example: i dont think and am not aware anything happened with Tubbo, or i heard Alice's story has been debunked but ive yet see info on this and dont focus on it because of it. Ever. I only try and focus on things i have evidence for or soldid argument in logic for.

The only thing i can think happened to Tubbo is the horrid story shafting or the "Miles 'Tails' Prowers" effect in terms of his character on the DSMP. In which more attention and focus was placed onto Tommy's character, because Dream focused more on Tommy, so Wilbur swooped in to pretray him as an underdog, often ignoring Tubbo or writing him off as Tommy's sidekick, ignoring the fact that its because of Tubbo that they were able to one up Dream during the pre-lmanberg disc wars. Legitimately we wouldnt have the DSMP we have now if it wasnt for Tubbo. Not Wilbur.

Legitimately if Tubbo didnt side with Tommy or join the server at all, Tommy might have lost the battle before he got a chance to win the war. And Wilbur may not have had as juicy of a story to get ahold off and spin into the underdog story we know and love today. Wilbur didnt make Tommy. Nor did Dream. Tubbo. Made. Tommy. No disc war means no DSMP. No DSMP means Tommy wouldnt have the same flavor of fame he has now, or may have dropped off a lot sooner then he will eventually. (He will eventually retire, jes not dropped off yet)

Wilbur overlooked that fact. And so did Dream. But other than that, i dont think or know if Wilbur actually did anything to Tubbo.

I support wilbur.

I also dont think even if he did the things he did and allegtations are even semi true, they are true to the degree that they are.

And Schlatts right there. People canceled him flr years. Wasted breath and effort. To the point he leaned into it and scary maybe abusive sexist man for a while. It was his stique, his gimick. To such a point people leget thought he was abusive, like people claim Wilbur is. Even Minx tried to accuse him of abusing her legitimately.

Like there are tons of clips where Schlatt seemingly is geneuinely scaring. Humiliating. Threatening or abusing his friends. Like it straight up looks like its not a joke or gimmick.

Yet Tommy looked up to him and still does. Jaiden makes videos with him. Etc. Etc. Its hypocrisy. If schlatt was to come out as geneuinely being abusive, no one would bat an eye. But no does because thats just how he is. Yknow?

[3rdsday]

This is a request for a c! Tommy rant

PLEASE YOUR PERSPECTIVE IS SO INTRIGUING I NEED MORE

thank you:))

Okay I've sat on this for a few days because I didn't feel like I was coherent enough to answer it but I think I'm ready now. This is probably still not super coherent but here we go:

The two rules Tommy was given when he joined the server were “no griefing” and “no stealing”.

Obviously these rules stopped being enforced pretty quickly, but it’s worth noting that Tommy immediately and blatantly disregarded and broke these rules. And I think that Tommy as a character gets punished for this throughout the rest of the story, in a sort of karmic retribution gone overboard way.

Tommy took things from others and destroyed their things, so he is not allowed to keep anything he cares about ever again.

Obviously the discs are the biggest example of this, with how many times they changed hands and were fought over and were used to taunt Tommy. But it goes so much further than that.

L’manberg gets destroyed. He gets exiled by Schlatt. Henry gets killed. L’manberg gets destroyed again. Wilbur’s dead. He gets exiled by Tubbo.

Every day in exile, Dream destroys everything Tommy has. It’s not subtle. There he is, isolated from everyone, no friends, no items, nothing. And he breaks in exile, for many reasons, but the fact that everything, everything has been taken from him, and continues to be taken from him, is a big part of that.

He leaves exile and teams up with Techno, but ultimately decides that L’manberg (Tubbo) is more important to him.

The second Tommy chooses L’manberg, he’s not allowed to have it anymore.

And that’s the thing, right? Everything Tommy loses, it’s not about what those things mean to other people, it’s about the fact that Tommy cared about them. Sure, Techno had his motivations for destroying L’manberg, but Dream? The one pulling the strings? L’manberg needed to be gone because it was what Tommy cared about.

Which was kinda Dream’s whole deal right? If he controls what people care about, he controls the server. If he has Tommy’s discs, he should be able to control Tommy… right?

Except, for as much as the discs matter to Tommy, they are far from the only thing he cares about. He gives them up willingly for L’manberg’s independence. He gives them up a second time when he realizes he’s gone too far, putting them above Tubbo and fighting his best friend. Dream can’t use the discs to control Tommy because Tommy always has other things to care about, other things that would matter to him even if the discs were gone.

So what does Dream have to do?

Take everything else away.

What started with exile comes to a head during the final disc confrontation, with Dream once again making Tommy give up all his possessions the way he’d been conditioned to do. L’manberg is already gone, Dream dealt with that before, so all that’s left is Tubbo.

But things don’t go to Dream’s plan, Tommy convinced the rest of the server to come to his aid, and Dream was defeated.

(Don’t even TALK to me about the disc confrontation being staged by Dream, I don’t want to HEAR IT. It’s not canon to me and if you think I’m wrong. No I’m not <3)

Here’s the thing, though. When Dream was about to be killed a third time, Tommy is stopped by the chance that Dream could revive Wilbur.

Tommy has lost so much, over and over, and the chance to get his brother back is too much for him to go through with killing Dream.

Maybe Dream lost the confrontation, but he still found a way to use Tommy’s attachments against him.

So Dream is put in prison, Tommy has his discs back and, more importantly, Tubbo back. Maybe it’s not everything he once had, but it’s a lot more than he once did.

And then he goes to visit Dream. And Dream kills him.

Limbo is different for every character, but it’s generally supposed to be an experience that’s torturous. And all it takes for Limbo to be the worst thing Tommy has ever experienced is… nothing.

His Limbo is empty.

For all that he lost during exile, during the lowest point of his life… he’s left with even less than death.

All that’s there is the voice of a brother he couldn’t give up attachment to, who is no longer the brother he knew and loved. Who taunts and torments him during his time in that empty void. Wilbur might be there, but Tommy doesn’t even have his brother in Limbo. Not really.

And it kills me because Tommy is, or rather was, such an optimistic character. Not so much in the sense that he had a constant positive outlook, because clearly that wasn’t the case much of the time. But he could have his home destroyed and his friends turned against him and his possessions taken and his pets killed over and over and over and over again, and still find a way to keep going. Still find things to care about.

It generally took very little to make Tommy happy. He loved dirt huts and cobblestone towers and spiders and things that meant nothing to anyone else, that anyone else would treat with neutrality if not negativity.

But in Limbo there was nothing. Absolutely nothing.

Everything he had, gone.

Even his life was taken from him.

And in the aftermath, after his revival, he was never the same. He didn’t belong among the living, another thing that was taken from him. Wilbur was revived, but Wilbur was so different from the brother Tommy knew. Even then, Wilbur left him in the end.

I hate the finale for a lot of reasons, so I’m not going to go into it much. But the story ends with Tommy dead, again. Is he in Limbo again? Who knows. But Tommy was never allowed to keep anything, and the ending solidified this as true.

I started this by saying that Tommy was punished for breaking the rules of the server. And I think it’s interesting to read the story that way, where Tommy’s relatively small crimes end up resulting in him losing everything again and again and never breaking free of it. This is a story where gods and higher beings exist and are willing to interfere with the lives of the characters, so I don’t think it’s too far fetched to see this as a warped degree of karma. But I also think that what Tommy is punished for, perhaps more than the rule breaking, is the fact that he cares so much. He found joy and love in everything, so he was left with nothing. Because the Dream SMP is a cruel world controlled by a cruel man who became obsessed with Tommy. And Tommy paid the price, but he also never stopped caring for the things that mattered to him. He could be broken but not defeated, not as long as there was more for him to love.

Unfortunately, the story demanded his defeat, one way or another.

And that’s why his Limbo is empty.

[nomsfaultau]

First ask since the daily ask ended hehe

If you had to make fault into a time loop story, what time period would you choose for each character and how would it go?

Clarification. You get to choose a time period (ex. Hour, day, couple of days, event, week) that each character has to repeat for over and over until they get out of it somehow. You get to choose from everything that has happened in the character's lives so far, whether it be in text or just living in your head. For clarification the character from that point in time has to repeat it, not the current character getting teleported into the past. And you can choose the rest of the circumstances for the characters, how the time loop works, how to break it, etc etc.

I just got this idea spontaneously and got curious. (Psssttt I was watching a In stars and time video essay)

Technically the amnestic arc is reverse ground hog day for Phil lmao. 

Anyway I thought the 1st part worked best for this ask considering it has a very defined start (Tubbo captured) and end (they escape). Since we don’t see anyone but clingy duo during that time, and because Tommy has limited capabilities, I elected to shove the time loop on Tubbo given information gathering and ability to effect things outside their cell. So the moment Tubbo is carried outside, they wake up smoke drowsy and half dead in their cell. Or say a month, since otherwise it could be years or lifetimes between the loop restarting given difficulties escaping. 

Tubbo naturally assumes the way to get out is to escape without anyone being killed. This is their chance to do it right. So simple things like asking the Farmer for permission to eat the potatoes to prevent a slaughter. At least…until armed with hind sight Tubbo is able to realize that’s The Blade. And they still have that trauma from losing their legs even if it’s now been undone, are terrified of The Blade above all else. It’s going to be many many loops before they can properly talk to him, and maybe could eventually have an easier time getting to bond with him, particularly with the lack of intense pain and the investigation done into trying to figure out how to prevent attacks. Cause just have Tommy Collect them before hand or it’s fine. Or they’ll have Rhodes adopt Jasmine it probably counts and would be permanent. Now. This would have to be a topic I handle very delicately, since the ‘magical un-do button’ on injury/disability is a very ableist trope, one which I haven’t always handled with grace. Things like erasing disabled representation at the very least, and at most catastrophic could imply things like ‘in the GOOD timeline Tubbo isn’t disabled because they did everything right this time’ which is pretty icky to me for the implying disability as a punishment/intolerable outcome angle. Idk how I’d try to go about it though. 

Also they’d try to get to Tommy as soon as possible. Small problem on that front: Tommy will not leave his cell unless compelled through the sirenic properties of an invitation to join the Hive. And Tubbo is hella traumatized from Rosalind, so that probably wouldn’t happen for a loop or two. But they need Tommy so so badly. Repeatedly asking Tommy and waiting for that rejection is probably painful as hell, but probably more in the cringe way as time goes on. Since originally Tubbo did it very much out of survival desperation and changeling instinct, which is embarrassing to reenact. 

Tubbo would also like immediately try to figure out the deal with UnCollection. Maybe not necessarily like trying to stop it since they think Philza is awful (though not terrified of him like they are post amnestic arc which won’t happen until time loop is broken) and Tommy is better off without him. But when Phil is like immediately ‘what no I would never’ and then Tommy is UnCollected anyway and he doesn’t know what’s happening, then they’d do investigated the 2-4th loops and figure out it was Foundation plot. While still shaded by murder from the Hallway and escape, they’d begin to find him a very useful source of information and strategy. Plus he is like. An actual source of good mental health advice unlike Tommy, and starts feeling like an emotional support unlike Tommy who is more like clinging onto a fellow drowning person. Might actually come out of it neutral to pro Philza. 

The real question is…does ALL of Tubbo remember? Because presumably you’d want Rhodes and Jasmine aware of what happened, and all the bees to be on the same page. Which leads me to believe that Rosalind would still be part of the hivemind. A separate body, somewhat, but still Tubbo. Which could mean that both Tubbo could take control of Rosalind’s body, and she could take control of theirs. Potentially? But they definitely can communicate telepathically. 

Because I like that death march for both of them, of knowing this ends in her brutal death, of knowing this ends in the shattering of their morals. They can’t ever fully undo it, the mistake irreversible, a permanent stain that both have to live with. The horror of Tubbos’ biggest regret born from survivalistic terror, having to ask if they’d make that choice again and again without the pressure of panic. A conscious and controlled choice to destroy someone, not driven by instinct and desperation.

Technically, this gets into the slightly nebulous territory of if Rosalind is even part of the Foundation at the start of the loop, since her first day of (interacting with the anomalies at least) is a week after Tubbo is captured. From what I can tell she joined willingly as opposed to the more standard ‘oh you’ve been traumatized by an anomaly hire time’ approach. This could mean she simply…never steps foot in the Foundation again. Walks away from Omelas as it were. For a couple loops that’s what she does at least, but Tubbos’ line of what happens to us if all the good people leave? would haunt her uncontrollably, as would their determination to rescue everyone plus constant appeals to her. Rosalind would willingly return to the Foundation and begin helping under the promise that Tubbo won’t kill her.

And I can’t imagine the look on Tubbos’ face when they realize they could have survived the beheading. That Rosalind didn’t have to die. Cycle after cycle of cutting off pieces of themselves over and over, pushing themselves to last long enough to make it to the reset no matter what they have to sacrifice. The long term effects would be so unique. Do they stop using their left hand if it’s gone more often than not? Does the phantom pain remain even if the limb is still there? 

It’s poking around in information she shouldn’t be that gets Rosalind Keter duty with Tubbo, and early loop investigations would keep this part consistent as they try to build info. With better handling of Lawrence, Clingy Duo and Rosalind escape. Only for Tubbo to wake up again in the cell. 

Okay. So now they start trying to figure out how to get The Blade, Wilbur, Philza, Skeppy, Halo, and Charlie out without murder. Hella complicated but they could get very clever between small bees infiltrating everywhere seeing everything moving stuff around and having a Foundation employee working with them. They have a month and literally all the time in the world to figure it out. And then they get everyone out and wake up in the cell again. 

They get intensive about it. Running over schemes over and over because they and Rosalind can get obsessive about planning, and could get really perfectionist  with it. Could get to the point where they find a way to get everyone in the Foundation out. Probably convince Philza to help with it if they explain the ‘Tommy Collected us and it’s a time loop’ since he does have enough control to fight without deaths. Now he would be planning to come back later and raze it but they’d never find out because after years of loops and they finally break every single anomaly out and they. Wake. Up. In that cell again. Do it all again and Tubbo stays, Tubbo chooses to never step foot out even when everyone else is free because Tubbo above all places the collective above the individual.

Because my partner in crime decided Tubbos’ win condition: every last Foundation worker is dead. 

My partner in crime insisted that at some point in eternity Tubbo would start killing people, but believe me I wrote an entire play about the whole time loop serial killer thing and it takes a certain set of character flaws to get there. Tubbos’ flaws are literally exactly what it takes to not become a time loop serial killer. They are stubborn, and determined, and murder is what stuck them in the time loop in the first place by their logic. This is the chance to absolve their guilt if only they can get it right. The whole ‘fleeting pointlessness of human lives that are eventually replaced/reset’ doesn’t work with Tubbo because they’re literally made of bees that live a month, indistinguishable multitudes. The lives cannot lose value to Tubbo, ESPECIALLY as they get to know each one so painfully intimately. 

Tubbo never escapes the time loop. They can’t. Tubbo is self sacrificial to a fault and cares far more for the collective over an individual freedom. And so much like in that original loop so long ago, they fall into disassociations and escapism, each loop fading into one another, indistinguishable fog blurring everything into nothing. 

Cool Anyways we decided if The Blade was in a time loop only the voices would know, and The Blade would be freaked out after a couple hundred loops where the voices gather enough cohesion to just fully speak in unison complex precognitive sentences. They straight up unionize in order to escape the time loop and The Blood God becomes obsessed with replicating that cohesion bc man loves the power of team work. Very much giving infinite monkeys type writers situation. We tried to make Philza’s win condition literally just not torturing Webb to death for one single loop but he’d wait however many loops it took for the Collected Covenant reparation period to pass before he started enacting hellish revenge, so Webb would live the first few times and it wouldn’t work. Also if Tommy was in Tubbos’ time loop he deffo would find a way to kill everyone and hate himself about it. Like he straight up tells subsumed Rosalind to her face she’s lucky she was dealing with Tubbo cause he would’ve just murdered her. 

[mellorphic]

In Defence of c!Niki - a Four Part Analysis of Every Arc

People who didn’t watch C!Niki see, in the fandom, a big sister type character with girlboss energy who wants to kill a child. Niki isn’t that. She has a well-written narrative which focusses a lot on her relationships with others. Here is me breaking it down!

PART ONE: c!Niki’s Early Days

PART TWO: c!Niki’s Rebellion

PART THREE: c!Niki’s Disillusionment (you are here)

PART FOUR: c!Niki’s Healing

TW FOR THIS SECTION: brief mention of sh, derealisation, a lot of discussion on grief and death. Let me know if I should add more tws

I don’t think c!Niki’s disillusionment arc started on Doomsday, randomly. I think it started on the day of the festival, when Niki watched her friend die, was chased out of her home, and saw how much her best friend had changed.

Despite her anger at Tubbo for his speech (which sounded very pro-Schlatt) she still told Schlatt to let him out once Schlatt and Quackity started to box him in. It still had not been revealed quite yet that Tubbo was a spy, yet Niki still stood up for Tubbo regardless of how she felt about him. That’s the thing about Niki. She is a good person with sound morals who will support people even if their views don’t align with hers, because she knows what’s right and what’s wrong and she won’t let ‘wrong’ happen to anyone.

Once Techno killed him, Schlatt literally fucking exiled her.

N: You killed him!

S: yeah, I did. I did fucking kill him, Niki.

N: you are so cruel- how could you do that? After everything he has done for you?!

S: he’s been a thorn in my side since-

N: I DONT EVEN WANT TO BE HERE.

S: he-

N: I DON’T EVEN WANT TO BE HERE!

S: […] you can leave if you want

N: ….Where am I supposed to go?

Manberg may not be Niki’s home but L’Manberg is and it always will be. That’s why the thought of leaving for good hurt her so much. Wilbur comes out into the open after she says this, and he defends her.

S: you really crawled up here on the day of my festival, celebrating my country. That you are not a part of. And you started- you started crying.

W: You sounded like you were gonna murder another person.

S: no, I was only gonna murder Tubbo.

W: you sounded like you were gonna go for Niki.

S: he’s the only person- well I mean, Niki..

N: what?

S: I might murder Niki, actually. I might murder her.

Wilbur tells her to run. Fundy gives Schlatt arrows but he and Quackity tell Schlatt not to do it, all the while Niki’s getting chased out of the country she used to love. This solidifies for her the fact that she truly has lost everything. Ponk chased her down and he killed her - Ponk, who a few streams before, Niki had called a friend. Earlier Techno had also killed her, when he shot at the audience after killing Tubbo. According to the wiki neither of those are canon deaths but I think they should be. At the very least, being killed by Ponk should be.

She joined Pogtopia that day, and Niki already had heard about Wilbur’s plans from Tommy. He, her and Tubbo had all vowed to get L’Manberg back and at this point in time, Tommy was the person she trusted the most. Her relationship with Tubbo had been ruined because of her thinking she was on Schlatt’s side - and even now that she knew he hadn’t been, it didn’t change the fact that he did not stick up for her while she was there. Her relationship with Wilbur was still a close one but she was scared for him and worried for L’Manberg’s future. But Tommy hadn’t wronged her, and she knew she could trust him to help with Wilbur.

Her birthday party was where she really saw the extent of Wilbur’s mental decline first hand and was completely powerless in stopping it. The day had been going so well, and she’d been having fun, until Wilbur went to blow up Manberg. Niki had to beg him to stop playing the anthem and Quackity talked him down from blowing it up, but Niki was terrified.

This is when Niki began working on her Secret City - intended to be a safe space away from the conflict, or a last resort for refugees if the war went badly.

On November 16th, Niki was hopeful, especially after Techno revealed his armoury. That day, Niki also defended Eret when they were accused of being the traitor, saying she trusted them and that they helped her. Once again, proving her loyalty and the fact she was grateful for people who stuck by her side.

We all know what happened later. After they got L’Manberg back, and were cleaning up, Niki found the TNT Wilbur had placed under the podium. She made sure nobody else saw it and she hid it again. Because after everything, Niki still believed in Wilbur. She was still loyal to him. She still saw the good in him and trusted that he wouldn’t. But he did.

She’d kept her promise, she’d been loyal to him and L’Manberg, and it didn’t change anything. She didn’t manage to help anything. And Wilbur, the one person Niki believed would always be there for her, no matter what, betrayed her. And she couldn’t even ask him why. So after that she was left hopeless and never wanted to let anyone in again. But as much as Niki didn’t want to, that doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.

Tommy reminded the L’Manbergians that the L’Mantree was still there. And I think Niki found that comforting, at the very least. She asked Tubbo what they were going to do with Wilbur’s body and his only response was “let him rot”. She and Tommy were the only ones who didn’t laugh.

At this point Tommy became a constant, for Niki. He’d been there since she joined, he was the only one who understood that she still wanted Wilbur back, and in her eyes he was able to take on his role in the sense of inspiring them all.

So, of course it hit her hard when he tried to blame her for burning down George’s house. Then, he’s exiled and the next time she heads from him it’s because he blew up the community house - we know he didn’t, but Niki didn’t. She begins to see Tommy as someone who just causes problems on the SMP, nothing more. She thinks he’s arrogant and a nuisance and that he doesn’t care for anyone.

When it comes to Niki’s character it’s vital that we understand - she has been through so much pain that got overlooked by everyone around her. At this point, she was poor, grieving, and felt as if nobody in New L’Manberg listened to her. She was going through the lowest point in her life and nobody in that nation seemed to care.

And she couldn’t hate everyone for it so she needed someone to blame and that happened to be Tommy. He didn’t deserve it but he was an easy target. And it’s true that he wasn’t kind to her, but he wasn’t the only one, and he was obviously going through his own things. But Niki was angry and she needed somewhere to put her anger. Is that fair? Not at all. But it’s what happened.

N: L’Manberg has not been L’Manberg. For many weeks. Maybe even months, maybe even.. maybe even, I don’t know.. since the start? […] I want the people to realise L’Manberg is not what they think it is. I want them to open their eyes and stop being in this circle.. in this circle of fighting for it. Because that will not bring us anywhere.

Do I even need to say anything? She fought for it for so long, on her own, and lost everything and everyone anyway.

On Doomsday, she spoke to Ranboo.

N: Do you.. do you really think L’Manberg should be safe today? …Ranboo, I will- If you think that we should fight for L’Manberg today, I will fight with you. Because I believe in you. And I always believed in you.

R: I think we should. […] the thing is, if we don’t fight with them, then what are we showing them? We’re showing them that we never cared about them.

N: .. i care about them, I really do. But I got.. hurt by them… They always talk over me, Ranboo. You know how that feels.

R: yeah. But like you remember yesterday, sometimes you just have to get louder.

N: You’re right..

R: sometimes you just have to get louder until they have no choice but to hear you.

And good god, isn’t that exactly what she did? Something something, peaceful protest is ignored (striking at her bakery, not paying her taxes, verbally standing up to Schlatt). OSomething something, she got louder. (Burning down the L’Mantree, blowing up her bakery)

An underrated line from Doomsday though? Niki telling her chat that she needed to save Puffy. I think she was muted so you’d only hear the line if you were on her stream, but she tried to help Puffy after and seemed distressed that she couldn’t get to her. Puffychu crumbs.

She held it together until she saw Ghostbur, believing she was hallucinating and repeating to herself that Wilbur was gone and that he betrayed her. She doesn’t want to care, but she does. And the idea of Wilbur still existing terrifies her, because what does that say about her grief? And if her grief isn’t justified, then the things she’s done definitely aren’t. As long as Wilbur is dead, Niki feels like she has a reason for her anger.

During her meltdown Niki is rambling. ‘Wilbur is dead’ becomes ‘L’Manberg is dead’ which becomes ‘L’Manberg is gone’ which becomes ‘I am gone’ and ‘I am L’Manberg’. This reveals a lot about Niki, even if it may seem nonsensical at first glance.

I’ve made a post before about how for crime boys, L’Manberg is interchangeable with the other person (For Tommy, it’s Wilbur. For Wilbur, it’s Tommy.) And I think that this is the same thing for Niki. L’Manberg is Wilbur. Wilbur couldn’t live without L’Manberg, and L’Manberg isn’t the same without Wilbur.

Then, she is gone and she is L’Manberg. Niki isn’t the same person she used to be and she’s starting to think that she can’t live without L’Manberg either, not happily, anyway. But at the same time, she helps to destroy it because the memories are too much to bare, and all it does is remind her of all the times she’s been hurt there. She can’t see the good in it anymore.

Destroying her own bakery was somewhere between emotional self-harm and trying to separate herself from L’Manberg as much as possible. There could’ve also been a sense of survivors guilt? Everyone else’s homes and things were destroyed but Niki’s bakery was untouched, and she found that really unsettling.

She talks to Jack about why she burnt down the tree, saying it was because she’s lost everyone.

J: that’s not a very good way of going ‘hey, I wanna be friends again’, burning down their sacred tree.

N: i don’t want to be friends with any of them again! Have you seen them?

J: then why do you care?!

N: because it hurt me! […] we both have been ignored by all of them all the time. We walk behind them slowly and-and carefully because they will ignore us all the time but we wanna be part! We wanna be part- we’re like little puppies, aren’t we?! Like little puppies, just walking and walking. But they’re never going to see us. All we are for them is something to take something from. […] whats the difference between these people and us? When we lose something, we lost it. And we grieve it. And it will be a part of us. When they lose something? They move on and they find something new.

I feel like people who think c!Niki is badly written or don’t like her just watch this stream and think she is overreacting because they don’t know her lore. But none of this came out of nowhere.

The thing is, Niki was ignored throughout Manberg and New L’Manberg by Tubbo and Fundy and sometimes even Eret. Niki has had things taken from her by Schlatt and Tommy. She has seen everyone move on from Wilbur when she couldn’t.

I think the other characters did care about her - Wilbur definitely did and Tommy did too. Karl did, Eret did, Puffy did. But it’s so difficult for her to see that because the love is so quiet in comparison to everything else. She’s no longer an idealist, she can’t see it when it isn’t right in front of her. And that doesn’t mean she’s wrong. She’s not completely right, but she’s not wrong about being used and feeling unwanted. That did happen.

So why does this turn into hatred at Tommy? Like I said earlier - he was a constant. The only one she still had after Wilbur, but he didn’t seem like he cared about her. In Niki’s eyes he became just like the rest of them - he used her left, and then when he came back she thought he’d replaced Wilbur with Techno and was now replacing him with Tubbo.

(I’m not saying I think that’s what happened but it’s what Niki saw. This part of my analysis is also partly speculation and partly based on things Niki said after the fact, because I can’t find the vod where she and Jack decided to target Tommy specifically, I think there’s a missing one between Niki’s Doomsday vod and the one where Jack tells her about the nukes.)

She directs her anger at him also because it gives her an ally. Jack blames Tommy for most of what’s happened to him, because Tommy resulted in him losing his second life; if Niki agrees that it’s his fault then she has Jack. So unconsciously she starts directing her anger more towards him.

The thing about Tommy is that he’s loud. He’s annoying. He can be rude. He doesn’t take things seriously, especially when he’s being painted in the wrong, because he doesn’t know how to handle it so he just deflects.

That makes him a really easy target for anger. But the vast majority of what happened to Niki was never Tommy’s fault. She blames him for Doomsday, she’s angry that he used her, and she’s processing her grief of Wilbur through hating Tommy. That’s why she does what she does.

[bugflies00]

RIGHT so the pirate au

well it's nothing very original don't get your hopes up or anything BUT. basically it's mainly lmancrew (with a crimeboys focus) and tntduo centered and it's set in like a medieval-esque fictional setting like basically six of crows minus the magic. like i literally typed six of crows into pinterest to get good images those are the vibes

wilbur's captain of this ship called the l'manberg (ok no but i hesitated between naming the ship or their og town lmanburg but i ended up naming the ship that because i just think it's such a good ship name like . she/her in a boat way. does this make sense) and the crew is niki, jack, eret, fundy and tubbo (well obviously theres more people cause how would a ship Function but the rest of those are Unnamed background characters).

wilbur's also a pretty high ranked official like idk general or captain of the guard idk how the military works i would have to figure that out, but basically he's kinda famous and so's his ship. they aren't participating in a war it's more of like an explorer position because wilbur's known for being a brilliant cartographer and so the previous king just kinda appointed him to this new position to let him fuck off & do his own thing mapping the whole world with his crew. the issue is the old king died with no heir and replaced by his nephew (dream) who's much more controlling and power-hungry than he was and who doesn't want to waste money & resources on some bs like maps. this will create Conflict (im so good at narration guys. Help)

tommy's like a homeless orphan (as he alwyas is) and really needs a job and money and all that and he hears the l'manburg isn't at sea for once and wilbur & his crew are taking a rest at the capital for a couple days before sailing back off again. naturally he sneaks in, lives in the storage room for like a week or two, surviving off scraps of food . then tubbo stumbles across him and almost reports him, but tommy convinces him not to and so tubbo helps him for a couple days. then someone else finds him, and he's brought to the captain and they all threaten to throw the stowaway overboard (they wouldn't actually they're all kinda softies) and tommy's like pissing himself from how scared he is especially cause wilbur's like . this really famous general who's had books and songs written about him and shit (he doesn't know yet hes just an annoying pretentious prick (/lovingly)) so he's like Ohmygod im dead and then wilbur's like . "Can you cook" "erm no" "can you clean" "yeah ig" "Can you fight even somewhat decently" "yeah bitch me and my knives are the best they call me th-" "Ok you're hired" AND THUS tommy joins the crew

and so they keep on sailing with their mission yadda yadda and WHAM they encounter the most notorious pirate crew of the continent, named, you guessed it, las nevadas. and tommy's heard a lot of proper horror stories about them and he's terrified but the crew have fought them off a bunch of times before so they're mainly annoyed because they're gonna have to deal with the frankly disgustingly homoerotic rivalry that their captain and the pirate captain have been passionately engaging in for several years now. THATS RIGHT TNTDUO BABY oh they are so pathetic and so gay it's actually embarrassing they'll have like sword duels . wilbur's the uptight, bitchy, and somewhat pretentious general with perfectly styled hair and ornate coat always huffing and puffing and waxing poetry meanwhile quackity's the fuckin bad boy stereotype with like a half unbuttoned poet or blackshirt (slut) (wilbur cannot stop staring its embarrassing) and he's always hanging off ropes and shit and doing sick acrobatics and taunting wilbur GOD they're so. and yeah they have sword duels where all they do is "distract the opponent" in order to "efficiently win the battle" which is code for "practically make out while hurling insults at each other"

also crimeboys is like "in awe of the legendary general" "who is this child on my boat" >>> "oh my god the general's a prick" "oh my god the child's a demon" >>> "maybe he's not that bad but i would rather die and curse his entire family line than admit that" >>> "that is my brother i would die for him and if you lay a hand upon him you won't have hands anymore" (the funny thing is they both end up with that same level of protectiveness and making the same threats despite wilbur being a like Adult and high ranked official with power and influence and decades of training of elaborate swordsmanship behind him . and tommy is a stowaway fifteen year old orphan with three knives and teeth and a whole lot of anger . but they're both like "no i must protect and die for the other" im sorry i just love them ok theyre so stupid) i just LOVE crimeboys having to go through begrudging bonding instead of instantly being ride or die brothers GIVE ME TO MORE ENEMIES TO FRIENDS TO BROTHERS anyway

also we also get emerald duo in the form of them being co-captains (please pretend that is a thing i know Nothing about anything ever) of this other ship and they're like independent merchants or whatever idk i have not figured out that whole bit yet MY POINT IS they're not affiliated with anyone they just sorta do their own thing and only help people if they want to or are indebted . they help out wilbur sometimes cause he's a dumbass

speaking of wilbur like i said he's had books and songs written about him (his age is kind of a grey zone like on one hand he's pretty young for a general but he's also had time to become this like famous and mysterious figure so can't be Too young . so i think probably like 27-29? smth like that) and one of them was a legend about how he fell in love with a mermaid . yes she had red hair and teal scales and her name was sally BUT SHE'S STILL AN OCEAN MERMAID I KNOW SALMONS LIVE IN RIVERS anyway . also for little tntduo crumbs he's called quackity a siren multiple times (in his mind he's insulting him like "ooh you manipulate people" and everyone around him is like "that is the Gayest thing you could possibly have said") and quackity's like "didnt you date a mermaid" "yeah but sirens are like evil mermaids" "so you want to date me" and then wilbur stabs him

ALSO more about wilbur's character development (this is a bit spoilerish but also it's not like im ever writing this full fic so you're not exactly risking much but just be warned) he starts out like i said as this really uptight military official who started when he was really young and trained really hard and flew through the ranks really fast because he worked his ass off . And so he's Very protective of his rank & title & prestige not so much because he's snobbish but because he worked so hard for it but so it often comes across as him being this like pretentious fuck (well he's also pretentious but thats just wilbur) . also he originally dreamed of being a cartographer and he spent his whole childhood drawing up maps but then he realised he couldn't make a living out of that so he decided to work hard enough to be at the top and then do what he wanted. and so he wears like his tricorn hat with a feather and his ornate coat and neatly tucked in shirt and everything cause for him it's like Proof that he Did it yknow . but then as time goes by, especially in the presence of quackity (who's very antihero-esque and so does not give a shit about ranks or whatever he's a pirate he does his own thing) and also a bit tommy (who was literally dressed in rags until they clothed and fed him but still behaves like a street rat on the most famous ship of the country) he slowly loosens up and he ends up ditching the coat and the hat and instead wears more stuff like loose poet shirts (open because he's a slut) . and so yeah character development through clothing and whatnot

ok so YEAH those are the tidbits that were plaguing my mind the most but there's definitely a whole lot more in my head like ive got a pinterest board and shit

[problematicfanfics]

One Night Stand (WIP)

TOMBUR, 18+ characters, consensual, guilt

no NSFW (yet)

lowercase intentional. ignore all errors.

* ⋆★

there was no “wilbur” without tommy, just as there was no “tommy” without wilbur.

they joined voice calls almost perfectly in sync. video ideas perpetually flowed between the two of them. every sentence between them seemed perfectly planned, comedic timing without flaw and wit beyond, without ever having actually been.

wilbur and tommy joked. It was sort of their thing. everything from family dinners, or even sunday morning church, to crude language and sex jokes.

but there seemed to be a shift in energy ever since tommy turned 18.

“Did you just say COME??” tommy screamed at wilbur through the headset.

wilbur winced at the noise despite the lack of camera. it was 2 am, and nothing with their late night talks had changed…

except for the fact that tommy was now eighteen.

wilbur pushed the thought from his head. he never bothered counting down the days until his best companion was legal. it wasn’t even a thought until now.

there were MANY different things… for example, tommy now lived with new people. and he lived in a new neighborhood. now that he thought about it, maybe it was tommy’s lack of concern for school in the morning.

the more thought that went into it the more tommy looked like an adult in wilbur’s eyes. he was an accomplished man now. he was on his own, save with the few questions he reached out to wilbur with about leaving the nest.

but he knew it wasn’t true.

sure, looking at it face value, tommy was a man. but wilbur knows him. wilbur saw him skip classes to play games with him, wilbur reported back to his mom if he was up past his bedtime, wilbur always played a sort of brotherly-role in his life. so for those walls to be broken down and now be seen as equals…

it felt foreign.

wilbur didn’t know how to act. how to not treat him like a child and instead like a man.

“really? cum??”

“i’d like to see your cum.”

wilbur held his breath. normally, he would’ve yelled at tommy, told him off for such a lewd joke at his age.

but he has every right to make that joke now.

wilbur would just have to cope.

all he could do was groan. “oh, god, tommy…” he laughed, his snicker fading in and out with tubbo’s.

“well, wasn’t expecting that…” tommy mumbled under his breath in a hurry. his tone was light, airy, almost playful.

wilbur wondered what he meant by that.

“tommy, what’re you playing?” tubbo asked.

“peep the discord, tubs.”

“you said that in the most uncool manner ever.”

“i’m just a trend setter,” tommy complimented himself, leaning back on his chair. “wouldn’t you say, wilbur?”

wilbur rolled his eyes. if he was going to treat tommy like a man, he’d get the full package. “i would disagree. you’re actually quite unfunny without me.”

“you can’t say that and mean it. i think we work quite well together, wilbur.”

“i feel like you meant for that to have some type of double meaning.” wilbur was reaching, he knew he was, but he just wanted to keep reaching. he wanted to give it meaning. a meaning for him, a little secret he never shared.

tubbo’s laughter came ringing back into wilbur’s ears. “you give him too much credit, wil. he doesn’t have the brain space for double meaning jokes, let alone gay jokes.”

tommy’s laughter filled wilbur’s headphones. in a hurry he removed them from his head, ripping the wires away from his body.

his ears were met with his own hearing damage, a low ringing he couldn’t shake through the absolute stillness of the room.

faint lighting had been his only supply of vitamin D for the last week, his eyes hurt when unfocused from his screen. he was in a particular dry spell when it came to women (and friends), so he turned to those he already had strong connections with to keep his spirits up instead of forming new relationships.

hesitantly, he placed the headphones back on his head. he wasn’t sure if he was ready to return back to the younger boy’s fast paced conversations.

immediately he was thrown on his toes by tommy.

“ey, wil! oyv, pussyfoot!”

“oyv, bruv!” wilbur yelled back at him. “have we gota problem?”

“we thought you died” the younger two laugh. tubbo speaks up. “tommy asked you a question.”

“ovy sorry mate, what’s up?”

“i was wondering if you were free to come by my house any time soon. i feel like you should really see me and my flatmates in our element. ash has been askin’ for ya.”

wilbur laughs, leaning back in his chair and pulling the mic with him. “ash speaks?”

“no, but he’s been leavingu these really cryptic messages around the house that vaguely mention you.”

“i still say ash is a witch,” tubbo starts. “he’s definitely hexing us all right now in his room.”

wilbur removes his headphones just in time, ash coming crashing into tommy’s room banging on the walls to annoy tubbo, screaming coming from both boys.

wilbur poured himself a glass of water while he waited for the calm after the storm.

he quickly slipped back into his thoughts as the screaming of tommy raised louder through his headsets.

tommy was still very much a kid. it was all in the voice, the way he presented himself. really he still acted like a child, especially around wilbur.

the little things like asking for a blanket instead of getting one himself, asking wilbur questions when he’s curious instead of just googling them, constant pestering and waltzing like he owns everything.

tommy is still a child.

but the big red 18 above his head says otherwise.

now he was overthinking it. over thinking every time he grabbed tommy too rough, the “manhandling” as tommy called it so often.

was tommy right?

would people really think he was a nonce if he was any less attractive?

definitely. and now the idea is seeping into his brain and bright red alarms are going off in his head.

he always acted rough with tommy. he always grabbed him and tossed him around. he just now realizes how light the boy is.

his brain thinks of the worst possible situations.

was he making tommy uncomfortable? did tommy ever feel scared to be around him? i mean, their physical difference is a lot. maybe it’s too much for him.

but also, at this point, tommy would’ve told him. yeah, there’s no way he would’ve let it slide this whole time.

his vision goes straight, and with a final swig of his water he puts the headphones back on.

“-but honestly, at the end of the day, i don’t think i miss it all that much.” tommy finished.

“what are you guys talkin’ about?”

“school shit,” tubbo replies, ignoring his long absence. “tommy and i were wondering if we missed it at all. i feel like content creators are just a different bread man. i don’t think i've heard one content creator say they enjoy school.”

“i mean, wouldn’t you kinda say that we make money doing everything school told us what exactly not to do?” tommy questions. wilbur can’t see him but he knows he’s not speaking into the mic. he’s probably fiddling with his jumper knowing him.

“like what?”

“sharing our information online, meeting strangers, sitting on our arses, no going outside for an hour a day, gaming, showing your face on the internet for everyone to judge, letting what are essentially strangers into our houses for the sake of content.”

“strangers is a strong word i’d say. i don’t think you're really strangers after a certain point.” wilbur comments.

the boys sit for a minute on the topic, no words exchanged. finally tommy raises his voice. “i mean i guess you’re right. by my logic tubbo is just a stranger, which sounds very wrong to say.”

“i hope we never get there,” they laugh together.

[rgbstatic]

Now I know I’m a bursona based blog, but sometimes I still think about other characters from the dsmp.

I also don’t like touching dteamblr/twt/etc with a 100ft pole ever, for many reasons. But strictly talking about characters.

I still think c!Sapnap is one of the most overlooked and most tragic characters on that smp.

He lost his best friend, cDream, to his demented and fucked up hubris. He was used by him, much much longer than Sapnap was lead to believe.

He lost his other best friend, cGeorge, to a weird and fucked god and some sleeping beauty fairytale esk shit.

His other friends, such as Sam or Punz, got so tied up into things that he lost them too.

He lost one husband, cQuackity, to a misunderstanding, to pain and suffering, and try as he might to fix it he couldn’t. He still loves him, and Quackity loves him, but what’s broken is broke and he doesn’t know how to fix it. It’s too late.

He’s actively losing his other husband, cKarl, to time and memory and the same god that fucked with his friend, and with no resolution to our knowledge, and Karl’s deteriorating memory worsening and worsening he could already be gone.

He’s lost his home twice. He built a home to try and protect those he cared about but it’s an empty kingdom, and he failed to protect those within to things he couldn’t ever control.

He failed to protect a kid, a friend, who he’d sworn to protect. He failed to kill his friend to put a stop to all the pain and suffering everyone else had went through.

He’d lost his father to a mind controlling egg, which unbeknownst to him had not only nearly been his deathbed but had also he’d unintentionally started the active spread of.

He lost his other father in that mess too.

He lost his pets, anything and everything else he held dead lost meaning.

Over and over despite this he kept trying, and it never ever worked.

Believe what you will about Tubbo’s final nuke, but to our knowledge of his previous nuke, with the blast at the prison and on Tommy’s home, it would’ve never reached Kinoko.

He would’ve seen it.

He lost where he grew up there, too.

He has absolutely nothing left in a desolate land, and again there’s no resolution in sight.

He is one of the longest living members of the smp, he is one of the first to join. He’s been in everything, seen everything.

Every time you look at things he did, good or bad, he very very rarely did stuff out of malice. Irrational anger? Yeah, lots of times. But he followed his best friend blindly because he trusted him, even if he didn’t agree with him (The L’manberg revolution). He retaliated, he fucked with people, there were the pet wars, but he genuinely apologized and grew as a character, and he tried so hard to right things, to start a new, to mend things. He couldn’t do it.

He lost everything and watched it. He fought a helpless battle and he watched himself do it.

[exiled-tommy-rp]

someone gets to go to tommys past thru a portal ig

As your muse was doing whatever, a portal lined with red opened. On the other side stood a younger and non-raccoon hybrid Tommy, a boy with brown hair, ram ears and a large facial scar in a presidential outfit, a fox, a man in a blue jumpsuit and beanie, and Dream in full netherite.

Tubbo and Dream spoke as Tommy looked around. As Dream talked about Tubbo being the best leader and how he was confident that Tubbo would make the right decision for L’Manberg, Tommy stared at them.

Tubbo laughed dryly. “You know, this is funny actually. It is! I’m sorry, Tommy. I’m sorry.”

Tommy chuckled as well, the stress leaving his face. “It is funny.”

“Tommy I’m so sorry. I’m sorry.”

“Tubbo?”

“Dream, I’ve come to a decision. The best thing for the nation would be for Tommy to be exiled.”

Tommy stared as the fox and blue jumpsuit man shouted and argued with Tubbo. Tubbo explained the logicality of his choice as Tommy sputtered. The other two continued to argue, saying that they had discussed this. “Tubbo, what the- Tubbo, why?”

“That’s enough! That’s enough, okay?!” Tubbo shouted, “Be quiet! You’ve undermined my authority from the get-go! From the beginning, no one here has respected me!” Tubbo ranted, continuing on.

Tommy shouted, “We agreed on this! What the hell!”

“I’m doing what’s best for this nation. Your presence is not best for this nation.” Tubbo responded.

“Dream, please escort and detain Tommy out of my country.” Tubbo said plainly. The three shared similar disappointment and upset remarks as Dream shoved Tommy off the wall they were standing on.

“Let’s go.”

“Tommy, you are hereby exiled.” Tubbo looked down at him. Tommy stared back up and scoffed, saying Tubbo’s name.

Dream led Tommy away, to Tommy’s protest. Dream pushed him off the path.

“Well im only exiled from L’Manberg.” Tommy looked at the walls as rain began to fall.

“No, you’re exiled from everywhere that’s been touched.” Dream almost chuckled. The two walked, with occasional bouts of conversation. Ghostbur joined them, clearly not understanding the gravity of the situation. The three boarded a boat. They boated until they reached an island. The three continued on land, Tommy complaining about his primes and Ghostbur agreeing that Dream wasn’t very nice.

Tommy yelled at Dream when Dream said he couldn’t go back. They boarded another boat and continued to sail. The permanence of the situation set in for Tommy.

They arrived to an island and walked through the plains. Dream dug a small hole.

“Put them in the hole.”

“No, they’re my things!” Tommy shouted.

“Put them in or I kill you.”

Dream hit him with his axe, and Tommy quickly threw all of his stuff in the hole.

“Fuck you. Leave. I don’t want your pity steak.” Tommy shouted at Dream, “I don’t want your pity things!”

“Okay, well, I’ll see you never.” Dream said and left.

“We’re gonna have a great time!” Ghostbur lowered his voice, “Tommy I think we just got robbed. A rocky start to our vacation but it’s gonna be fine.”

//anyone, of course. This will be a neat character study. @boba-bae-cafe-su-au @grian-rp @ghostinnit-rp idk uh anyone yeah yeah (also tags are ooc I didn’t mention that)

[atherix]

What are all the confirmed/mentioned pantheons and who/what kind of people follow each one? I love that all the religions(?) are true at the same time. It's my favourite. :)

I also wanted to ask how you felt about people using your world of Midnight, but writing in their own characters? I want to, but felt I should ask first. (With credits given, of course.)

:)

God I am so fascinated by religions and their effects on society, but all the war and fighting that comes with it is so exhausting. So coexisting simultaneously-true religions was just like "yeah!! Whoo! Best of all worlds!" bc I get to explore the differences in the religions and beliefs and all that without being like "religion is bs" or "only one religion is true." I lowkey always worry that someone might think I'm actually promoting religion (hi guys atheist/nonreligious here I am just super interested in the cultural aspects of religions thank you) so I'm glad people have been receiving the Pantheons thing positively <3

As for the confirmed Pantheons we have, there's Fate (which is The Big Pantheon), the Fae Pantheon, the Death Pantheon, the Watcher's Pantheon, the Old Pantheon, and I think??? I may have mentioned it but I don't know if I deleted it but there's also Creation and Destruction (which is The First and The Last, The Beginning and The End). Nobody follows the Fate Pantheon because every living thing- including gods- is bound from the moment of birth to it, and no one follows Creation and Destruction as they are Already Gone and Inevitable. I swear if I forgot to at least mention Creation in passing... but Creation was like THE first Pantheon at the beginning of time itself, the only Pantheon older than it is Fate (as the Creation god is also bound to Fate). The Old Pantheon is a mostly-defunct Pantheon now, but it was the Pantheon that came after the fall of the Ancients and when they first started rebuilding. Can't wait to talk about what happens when a Pantheon fully dies out... cue me glancing at Grian's dream from Midnight Flux... Oh! And I mentioned before when talking about the Werewolves' evolution story but the Sun and Moon also have their own associated gods and Pantheons. There's no Life Pantheon, that one will be explained later :)

Of course there are also Listeners, but I haven't really mentioned them. There's a lot of very small and minor Pantheons as well, but the ones mentioned above are The Big Ones.

You'll notice there's no Pantheon of Time mentioned here :)

As for who follows what, we have;

Death Pantheon: Mumbo, Cleo, BDubs, Cub, Doc, all Vampires in general, Phil, Tommy, Wilbur, Fundy; in general it's followed by Vampires and Undead Mob hybrids (for example, if Cleo wasn't a Vampire she'd still follow this Pantheon as a Zombie) and lower deities (such as Angels of Death and Harbingers and Reapers)

Watcher Pantheon: Grian, Jimmy, Scott (kind of- his is a little... complicated), Pearl; in general it's followed mostly by people born into it. There's casual and extremist groups, and it's considerably exclusive, the only way to join as an outsider is to be brought in by an existing member.

Fae Pantheon: Scar, Tubbo, Lizzie, Cub, BDubs, all Fae in general (with the exception of Joel); it's a Pantheon only available to the Fae and the Natural children they claim. Grian and Mumbo would not have access to it even if they marry Scar.

Old Pantheon: None of the main characters, but Mumbo and Tubbo were both born into this Pantheon. They've both since left it behind. Less than a thousand members are left of this Pantheon. This was one people were just born into, a sort of Default™ until people began (re)discovering other gods.

Moon's Pantheon: Ren, Werewolves in general; anyone can convert to worshiping the Moon God

Listener's Pantheon: Martyn; you HAVE to be born into the Listener's Pantheon, no exceptions.

No Pantheon/Unknown Pantheon: Joel, Gem, Etho, Iskall, Scar's Father; To have no Pantheon at all means to just never swear yourself to any one Pantheon. Changelings are the only Fae who aren't inherently tied to the Fae Pantheon, being a group of Fae who often never find out they're Fae.

BONUS ROUND- The Void, which was worshiped by Boatem's founders. While the Void's Pantheon is mostly dead now, the Void itself has found its way into most other Pantheons. Some Pantheons, such as the Fae, have nothing to do whatsoever with the Void.

I've spent way too long on this so if you have any questions about anyone else/anyone specific, feel free to ask <3 I have just spent wayyy too much thinking about this XD

As for writing within the world of Midnight, I absolutely don't mind at all! It's like having fic written about your world :o I think that'd be so cool~ And also now you got me wondering where my little character would fit in all this... hmm 👀

[lissbutnobliss]

Okay, can we have a talk.

This ending was… questionable. But very logical. I mean, everything was foreshadowing to that, we should’ve known and I am not surprised.

I have very mixed feelings about it and I don’t really know how to explain all of them, but let’s start with that:

1. I am proud of Tommy for writing this. No matter how some aspects of these are srewed and how some are not good in the message, he still did a great job. I mean, imagine being responsible for ending ALL of this? The server that was so big and gave so much to millions of people, and you are the one to write an ending of the story.

Endings are hard to write. I am sure, everyone who’s every written a story will agree with me. Happy endings are even harder, because if you have a long and complicated story, with so much angst in it, it’s almost always troubling to find a satisfying happy ending. And successfully lead everything to that.

And the fact that Tommy took the responsibility to finish this MASSIVE story is admirable. I know I wouldn’t do that on his place, wouldn’t have the guts. I am proud of him.

2. Being proud of Tommy though doesn’t make me less irritated with the last confrontation he and Dream had. I feel like everybody here already mentioned how the fact that his character said sorry to his abuser is… not great. Awful honestly.

And it annoys me. As an always inniter and c!Tommy enjoyer, I can’t be less angry with that. Because it’s not right. Dream did too much fucked up shot to earn that apology. Even if Tommy hurt him too, it’s not something you can redeem.

3. But I understand. I completely understand why cc!Tommy wrote it that way.

Hear me out.

c!Tommy is one of the most compassionate and emotionally smart characters on that server. He was always the one to see good in others no matter what. Even if he didn’t always act that way. I mean, just remember his conversation with c!Foolish: ‘I believe everyone have a little bit of good in them’, ‘I think Wilbur is a good person, but he’s been playing a bad guy for a long time’, ‘It’s not about giving him a second chance, it’s not about giving him a third chance, it’s not about chances! It’s about not giving up on people you care about’.

If there was a character on a server to understand (not forgive, c!Tommy didn’t forgive him or joined him, he understood c!Dream) the monster, it’s Tommy.

It makes so much sense for his character to realize the part of the picture he hasn’t seen before and accept his flaws and mistakes. Apologizing to c!Dream is a bad message. But it makes so much sense that c!Tommy did that. It’s about not giving up on people, eh?

4. Which makes me a little bit happy. Not a lot, but just a smidge. Just knowing that if they survived, c!Tommy would heal. After all, sometimes to heal from something awful like an abuse you need to understand what exactly happened.

And don’t take it as me saying that ‘Tommy should’ve realized that he is in fault for everything that happened’, because fuck no. He isn’t, and he is still a victim in this situation.

I mean it as the understanding and coming to terms with it would give him the closure he needed.

He would’ve healed, if they survived.

5. And of course I am devastated. I understand why people think of this finale as an awful one. I am in shambles. It’s so hard to take in the fact that everything just got erased.

I am a big c!clingy duo enjoyer. I loved a lot of other characters too, but they were the best for me. They were the ones who I would always love, no matter what. Hell, I even watched those streams despite Dream being in them just because I would never not watch an ending of c!clingy duo.

I wont repeat what others said about why this finale is sad and awful and devastated. I will only say the thing that makes it the worst for me.

Tommy and Tubbo didn’t get to meet that end together. They were so close to each other, a few more minutes, and Tubbo would’ve be there. But they didn’t, and I am just. I just. I hope people will write c!clingy duo fix its. I don’t even really need the rewriting of that particular stuff. Just maybe them going to the Moon and being happy and raising Michael together on stories about all the friends they had. Please.

That’s kind of the mix of my feelings.

——

I also wanted to talk about messages in general.

The Dream SMP story as cc!Wilbur once said is always not characters influencing the plot, but plot influencing the characters. And that’s what was best about it in my opinion. There was no meta gaming, it was a raw reaction of people in the situation, not from the distance.

So sometimes it’s not about writing the tight message. It’s about how that character would act right there and right now.

And all of this ‘i know *blank* better than *cc blank*’ is fun and all, I also post stuff like that, and it helps to say fuck you to canon to feel better. But no, we don’t know those characters better than ccs who play them. At least because it’s not our characters. We know their fanon versions better, sure. We know our versions of those characters better. And that’s cool! That’s how fandom works! But just imagine someone read a story about your own OC and said that they understand them better than you.

Why I am writing is: we can all be pissed off at the I am sorry to c!Dream thing. We should, honestly, it’s a bad message. But the thing is, it’s not about the writing, it’s about the person (in form of c!Tommy) and what this person feel and thinks after living through everything they did. That what was making Dream SMP so beautiful. The story was the driving force, not the characters. And I kind of appreciate that cc!Tommy didn’t metagame it till the end, but just went along with what it would lead his character too.

[10piecechickenmcnugget]

Still writing out my thoughts about Dogwarts, but I'm returning the favor anyways.

I wanna here all your thoughts about Purpled and Wilbur. Or whoever you're most interested in.

You're letting me talk about characters I like, I'm letting you do the same :D

FUCK YEAH

(@dewberries-sillyblog cause you wanted to learn more about my blorbos)

under the cut cause this is gonna be L O N G

(split into sections so I can “organize” my thoughts) Purpled: my stupid ass traumatized alien son he’s a bastard and I hate him (/j)

Early SMP: alien boy. he doesn’t know what he’s doing he is simply fucking around and finding out adopting a dog and gathering resources. just living life having a funky fresh time

he and tommyinnit fucking HATE each other they chased each other around and murdered each other for like over and hour fundy broke into his house and stole his shit he bargained with Tommy for his own stuff for like 10 minutes and went to court but just snuck out the back (??? idk he’s wild)

fundy built the socializing club to resolve their arguments and purpled booby trapped it and stole everyone’s shit cause he’s just like that

L’Manberg War(s): he dabbled in lmanberg shit my guy had no idea what the fuck was going on all the god damn time he was so confused bro was literally just standing there one time he say ccrimeboys (who were exiled from lmanberg and were absolutely not supposed to be there) and he (a member of lmanberg) decided to just ignore them cause he can’t be bothered to give a shit he literally allowed Technoblade to causally boat home after he massacred everyone at the festival and murdered Tubbo he has zero fucks to give

✨intermission✨: he disappeared for several months and no one knew what was up with that

the following is not in chronological order cause I forgor

but Bad hired him to kidnap/kill Puffy and he was basically like “yeah sure fuck it” and I think he did the thing?? I don’t remember anyways he was kinda working for the Eggpire for a bit and then Quackity was like hey wanna work for me instead to betray them (he attracted his attention by threatening to blow up his UFO talk about foreshadowing) and purpled once again went yeah sure fuck it and betrayed the Eggpire for the money and Quackity did his whole “wait don’t go in yet let the shark guy die” and then they saved everyone and yadda yadda yadda “you’re a hero purpled” “I try my best”

Aftermath: we all know this part purpled is like okay bitch boy pay up and Quackity makes small talk gives him his money and then destroys his entire life right in front of him good times they yell at each other for a bit and Purpled storms off in silence to go be sad

He goes back to his stupid little cottage and is even sadder for a while and then Mr Charlie Slimecicle gaslights him for 30 minutes and he decides to join las nevadas (he’s lying about wanting to be there)

he hangs around lying to people for a bit and then sets up his overdramatic lava trap and yells at Quackity some more and then kills his bf for revenge cause that’s what they do on this server I fucking guess

he kidnaps slimes dead body and holds it captive in a cave purely just to kill him again and then Punz shows up and manipulates him a bit and Dream is there also

they show up gaslight slime bulky Quackity blow shit up purpled and Quackity yell at each other some more and then slime reveals HE was gaslighting everyone the whole time and fucking kills purpled (L + ratio)

then there’s the whole “you’re not a good person” but idc about that sorry quackcicle enjoyers

and then that’s kinda it man idk the whole ass smp ended

Random ramblings: purpled is a petty bastard and I hate him that bitch is full of improperly processed trauma (thank you icarus appollosboyfriend for that quote) and he hates everyone and he only kills people for the money cause he just wants money and power (and friends he just wants to go home) but he only accepts jobs from people he trusts and he’s a stupid bitch and he’s mean and absolutely will insult your mother but your honor he’s just a silly little guy simply a funky little lad and he just lies to people constantly he’s so funny and every time I think about him I go insane

now.

Wilbur. Motherfucking. Soot:

I am mentally ill about him I legitimately get sad often over him he has brought me close to tears unironically multiple times this is a common occurrence I have so much autism about him I’m such a basic bitch 😔

there’s no organization to this part I’m just going to go insane for several paragraphs:

HES SO SAD my boy is struggling constantly 24/7 he has had shit brain chemicals his whole life and he pretends he’s fine cause he has to be fine but he’s literally been putting up a persona the entire smp I just ajrhjabdbwjsj

he’s just a little guy ur honor who wanted to start a little nation for his friends and he tried SO HARD to keep the peace and let everyone live but people continuously fucked him over until he thought he HAD to resort to violence

he has so much trauma and he ignores all of it he’s so stressed all the time and he got beat to death with an axe after his friend betrayed him and and and

and fucking SCHLATT took his country his fucking country from him and kicked him out and his stupid ass lived in a ravine for god knows how long and he developed more mental illnesses then he already had

he legitimately thought everyone hated him and was only staying for the power and wholeheartedly believed that they would leave him if someone else offered something better and he was so scared all the time he was NOT living la vida loca and he just fucking lied about it all the time cause he’s an idiot

and he finally snapped and he was going to press the damn button and his fucking dad showed up and he had made up his mind he was going to die and he was taking lmanberg down with him so he did just that (assisted suicide babyyyyyy)

and don’t even get me started on ghostbur (that’ll come later)

then he fucking died and LIMBO oh my lordy lord he was alone in literal sensory deprivation torture for THIRTEEN AND A HALF YEARS holy motherfuck he lost his fucking mind in there he was not doing well that’s for fucking sure

then his bitch ass got revived and dear god did a lot happen while he was gone and he put on another goddamn persona because he’s fine guys!! he had time to think over everything while he was dead he’s perfectly fine he’s processed all his trauma he’s so much better now he definitely isn’t doing worse he’s fine guys !!! :D (he’s lying)

and one time he tried to explode dream with his mind so that was a thing and also threatened to kill himself despite being apparently happy to be alive again and absolutely fucking terrified of going back to limbo so anyways he still hates himself so that’s a thing

he and Quackity had a homoerotic rivalry and then he went to fucking. Utah so that happened

I’m fucking insane about cwilbur I cannot articulate this to you correctly but I cannot stress enough how feral he makes me

NOW ghostbur I’m insane about him too he’s an amnesiac and he’s so sad all the time and he still hates himself cause ‘alivebur’ hates himself and he considers PERMADYING a happy memory and he can only remember good things and H A T E S talking about his mental health or anything remotely sad and he’s just a little lad with his sheep and he just wants to make people happy and oughhhhhhhhh. anyways how are you guys doing :)

[tobi-smp]

Extremely good points, but I would like to add

4: this is so funny because dream's best acting was far and away anything to do with exile, and that worked in its entirety because of how tommy bounced off of it. the fear and anxiety that c!dream was able to invoke Only functioned because of how tommy framed and reacted to it.

and it's Especially funny because you know damn well that dream apologists hate exile and try to erase anything and everything dream ever did in his actual story line.

I don't think Anybody could've filled in the exact dynamic that c!dream and tommy had, because so much of it jumped off from the dynamic they'd built early on. but that sure as hell doesn't make dream the best actor on the server. he's not the best actor in the exile arc

I Liked dream's role in the story (when he'd actually log on to do it and when he wasn't just there as a distraction for damage control), I Liked the prison arc before it turned to utter shit. but it was undeniably tommy that brought the emotional element to the table.

and say what you will about techno's character, but there's a Reason why he's always front and center in any Event he's a part of. it doesn't matter what you think about his character, his speeches Bang every time. name one thing that dream said that's as iconic as the theseus speech.

all of the names firesnap mentioned here should rightfully be up there for best actors on the server, and obviously I'd go shooters for tommy's acting. but Also Tubbo. tubbo and ranboo and sam and jack and fundy. Name A Single Thing Dream Has Ever Said In His Life That's As Impactful As "what am I without you?" "Yourself."

being able to convey these strong complicated Messy emotions Live On Stream is So Impressive To Me. jack's stream after tommy died is Legendary and he did that On The Spot, without knowing it was coming. Fundy's Everything, come on a spy's diary, learning that wilbur was still alive, his fever dreams before he joined las nevadas, his last stream with wilbur.

I'm sorry I saw this tweet and didn't have enough room to scream on my priv.

Dream literally did nothing other than suggest blowing up L'Manberg during the Revolution until Tommy's exile. And look at how that went. After Tommy's disc finale he sat and rotted in a prison, not answering people, and existed ENTIRELY as a plot device people had to drag him to do every few months.

LITERALLY THAT'S ONE OF THE WORST PARTS OF THE SERVER. He took up being the big bad, then didn't answer people and locked himself in a prison and stalled lore and delayed things and just fucking sucked. And his important role in most people's lore could have easily been replaced by a cardboard cutout after exile ended.

BBH paid for the server. People were already getting bored as fuck when Wilbur joined. Do people seriously forget how quickly vanilla Minecraft servers died back then? Literally the introduction of L'Manberg gave people something to do other than walking up the same wooden path over and over.

Bait used to be believable. I'm sorry if you think that guy was a good actor you literally never watched Wilbur or Charlie or Quackity. I never cared for Techno's 4th wall breaks, but you can't compare a single monologue Drm made to ANY of Techno's. The amount of crazy good and memorable lines everyone else had in comparison is hilarious. He wasn't even the best actor on the Dteam and one of those dude's slept through the whole story.

THE PRISON WAS THE WORST ARC THE SERVER HAD AND WAS AN EYESORE TO LOOK UPON

Fuck that guy. He wanted to be the villain and then would fucking retcon and change shit to make sure his guy never lost. Even when the story would try to frame something as a loss for him his ass would come back months later and go UM ACTUALLY like he's the fucking JK Rowling of Minecraft Roleplay.

[ao3feed-crimeboys]

sailing on a ship in a bottle

by wintergreenlake

When he joins his high school's sailing team, second-year student Tommy Innit goes in a little afraid, but hopeful. To be honest, he doesn't think that much will happen this year- even if he loves the sport, it's not exactly a fast paced, exciting, stream-worthy sort of thing. All he really wants is to win a few races, take home at least one award, and get some funny or cool stories. What he doesn't expect at all, however, is that he'll gain a new family along the way.

Over the course of a semester, Tommy forms a close bond with Wilbur, the junior driving him to practice, Techno, his partner in the boat, and Phil, the hard-working coach who has dedicated himself to bringing out the team’s full potential. With the help of the three of them and his best friends, Tubbo and Ranboo, Tommy navigates the complex web of relationships that exists in the L’Manberg sailing team, riding the highs and lows of competitive sailing as he gets pulled into the middle of a bitter, years-old rivalry between Wilbur and one of the team’s captains. As the seasons shift, he makes discoveries about himself and his friends that will shake the foundation of their relationships, burn down some old bridges, and make some new ones in the process.

Words: 3692, Chapters: 1/10, Language: English

Fandoms: Dream SMP

Rating: Teen And Up Audiences

Warnings: No Archive Warnings Apply

Categories: Gen

Characters: TommyInnit (Video Blogging RPF), Toby Smith | Tubbo, Ranboo (Video Blogging RPF), Phil Watson | Philza, Wilbur Soot, Technoblade (Video Blogging RPF), Alexis | Quackity, Jschlatt (Video Blogging RPF), Kristin Rosales Watson

Relationships: Wilbur Soot & Technoblade & TommyInnit & Phil Watson, Wilbur Soot & TommyInnit, Technoblade & TommyInnit (Video Blogging RPF), TommyInnit & Phil Watson (Video Blogging RPF), Alexis | Quackity & Wilbur Soot, TommyInnit & Kristin Rosales Watson, Kristin Rosales Watson/Phil Watson, Alexis | Quackity & Jschlatt, Ranboo & Toby Smith | Tubbo & TommyInnit

Additional Tags: Alternate Universe - High School, Sports, Competitive Sailing, that's not an actual tag? wailing, Families of Choice, Thunderstorms, Dissociation, writing the dp/dr rep i want to see in the world, Childhood Trauma, Abusive Relationships, Implied/Referenced Alcohol Abuse/Alcoholism, Implied/Referenced Self-Harm, Implied/Referenced Character Death, Angst with a Happy Ending, Hurt/Comfort, Communication

[xmooncanary]

Oops, looks like tumblr bit a random chunk out of my Phil lore ask - it's supposed to say: "Father status varies depending on server/fanon but generally ranges anywhere from biological or adoptive father of one-to-three (Wilbur Soot, Tommyinnit, Technoblade) (order of most likely to be his kid. Semi-canon sibling order is generally Techno oldest and/or twins with Wilbur with Wilbur being the younger twin and then Tommy youngest) though sometimes more (usually Tubbo and Ranboo, who are almost always adopted. Philza specifically found Tubbo in a box). On the Dream SMP specifically he also has a canonical grandson through Wilbur (Fundy) (and adoptive grandson, the NPC Michael, through Tubbo and Ranboo) (…and adoptive great-grandkids through Fundy again)"

Anyways his hardcore streams are probably the best place to start with Phil, since they're super chill and there isn't much of a story to catch up on since it's not an RP world, just misc shenanigans and in-jokes that you can pick up pretty quickly. Origins SMP is also very fun and some of the other members do upload videos to youtube about it so you can probably use that to get an idea of what's going on. The major swaths of his DSMP character you can probably glean through the Sad-ist animations, but the Extremely Rough Overview is basically "Philza Minecraft, Wilbur's dad. Wilbur dies, he is sad. Lives with Techno, he is glad. Spawns withers with Techno, he is bad? Destroys a country. Half-adopts a half-enderman. Joins a book club. Niki Nihachu is there. Phil's basement is a Bleach reference, just like everything else about him. Big Wife."

Glad you enjoyed my silly Phil lore recap though! He is a very fun chill streamer. Quality bird man 10/10.

Oh!!! Fair fair :D thank you for the update!!!!!

I SUPER APPRECIATE THE LORE UPDATE!!!!!! I LOVE TALKING TO PEOPLE I WOULD PAY SOMEONE TO INFODUMP AT ME ABOUT MCYT LORE HAHAHAH

Thank you again!!! I'm gonna look some streams on after work tomorrow and vibe a little I think!!! I can see an (unofficial??) Vod channel so that reassures me hahahha

When streamers don't upload things it feels like such a barrier to entry (LOOKING @ U OLI IM SO GLAD I CAUGHT ALL THE EMPIRES VODS BEFORE THEY DISAPPEARED), esp bc my timezone means it's haaaard for me to catch a lot of streams (Jimmy streams at like 3am in my timezone usually for example 🥲)

STILL I AM BABBLING gonna put on some vibes n see how it goes!!!! Thank you!!! :]

[cmyknoise]

i actually think this is leading toward positive character development for tommy. while i adore his time with technoblade, i will say that it seems to be a pattern that the people tommy allies with always rub off on him, and he realizes that he doesn’t want to be like them or be how they want him to be.

when he was with wilbur, he went along with all his plans, wilbur taught him to fight with words not aggression (as much anyway). in pogtopia he was taught to be a little reckless again, and he gave wilbur a lot, and i mean a whole lot of leeway, and he let wilbur push him around, tell him what to do, and he believed in him. he broke out of this though, realizing he has fire, and he can take the good things he’s learned from wilbur, but ignore the other things, and that way fight in his own way. 

when he was exiled and under dream, well, a whole lot happened. to put it simply, dream wanted to take away that fire and make tommy complacent. it nearly worked. but it just takes a spark with tommy, which is something i find really neat about his character- it just takes a spark and he’s that fire again. he left with more fire and passion than ever before- but, i will say dream did teach him caution, although unintentionally. tommy started thinking through his actions more, started thinking before doing. he learned caution and to not run into things head first, and to not always trust what he hears. 

when he worked with techno, and let me say first right here right now i am very :( that this didn’t end up with some SBI stuff to end off this arc, at least not yet, but anyway when he worked with techno, techno helped tommy break away from the rest of the bonds dream had on him, but i think this came with a price. tommy started doing things, letting things slip he’d never do before. their ‘minor acts’ weren’t minor. he kidnapped, tortured, killed, he got violent and angry and mad. techno taught him that it was okay to be mad at l’manburg, that he doesnt have to forgive them. which this is good, but at the same time, this wasn’t tommy. he didn’t want to destroy l’manburg like techno- he wants his discs, because according to him, maybe that would lead to peace, to stop dream and other forces from causing more problems. techno added fuel to the fire, but sometimes fire can run too hot, it can suffocate itself from oxygen and fizzle out.

it was there in the ruins of the community house, the argument with tubbo, that he realized this. he stopped himself before he extinguished himself. he got caught up in the discs, much more than he ever has before. he was mad at tubbo, the exile, what people had done to him, rightfully so. he let this anger take over- he was angry at the world but he funneled it to tubbo, and he said words, that in an instant made him realize. he said the discs meant more to him than tubbo ever had. but that was false, and he knew it was and instantly he realized this. 

in that instant he realized that he doesn’t value his discs over l’manburg, and especially not tubbo, and that’s why he told tubbo to give the disc to dream. you can hear/see tubbo hesitate too- he didn’t want to, watching as tommy’s burning anger turned to regret, and yet he insisted. he did something i dont think anyone would’ve expected, and that was let dream get both discs- willingly. he put tubbo and l’manburg, and his friendship with tubbo over the discs. dream laughed, calling tubbo stupid. 

see, what i’ve noticed is that, out of all the influences in tommy’s life, he and tubbo are the only ones where they sort of balance each other out. tubbo i think, is the only person where tommy has truly just, existed around. all those times on the bench, before the disc wars. tommy is right, this all started with them and the discs, but before the discs it was just them. what dream doesn’t realize is that, i think, in that moment, he lost. 

the discs don’t hold power over tommy anymore, he cares probably, sure, but not enough to risk the lives of his friends. l’manburg isn’t just a country, its the people, its the beliefs, its the passion. on a bench once, they promised each other, that no matter what happens to l’manburg, if its destroyed or if anything happens to it, that they stick together. 

so long as tommy and tubbo are friends and keep fighting, so long as anyone keeps fighting, l’manburg wont be destroyed. they can rebuild, they can move. ranboo is right, its just land and houses and buildings. l’manburg is their freedom, their symbol, their friendship. l’manburg is what gave everyone else the ability to create their own countries and homes. so long as people remember the anthem, what they’re fighting for, that they’re fighting for each other against dream and his ideals, then that’s all that matters. 

l’manburg never dies.