#and I feel terrible even mentioning this bc I feel like it’s making their tragedy about me and that’s NOT what I want to do

[fortes-fortuna-iogurtum]

.

[prideprejudce]

I've seen alot of badfaith interpretations for the writers having 'forgotten' jaeherys' death when Rhaenyra says the 'son for a son' line, and honestly I thought it made alot of sense with how Rhaenyra sees the situation.

Rhaenyra clearly sees herself as a Good Moral Ruler who ONLY enacts violence as a Means for Peace™️, so I dont think she takes responsibility for Jaeherys' death at all. I think she sees his death as a random fluke tragedy that rests solely at Daemon's feet, and completely rejects that she has anything to do with it. She's the Good Guy she would never kill an innocent! She rebukes her husband very seriously for that waste of energy and violence, (wagging her finger at him bc no thats bad we dont kill children in 'Our Good Justified War'), but I dont think she cares enough about jaeherys or jaehera to consider it revenge for lucerys' death.

To Rhaenyra the fact that theyre innocent children, and therefore worthy of protection upsets her about jaeherys' death, but ultimately shes so removed from the kids themselves, I dont think she cares so much personally about them. I doubt she thinks one of their deaths is equal to her loss, and I honestly dont think it occurs to her that Alicent would feel for Jaehyrus as acutely as she did for lucerys. (Which might be correct, seeing Alicent was much more concerned about her daughter's grief than the death itself)

I think with the 'son for a son' line we do see the two sides at war within Rhaenyra. She's a mother who wants vicious revenge for her son's death, but shes also a mother who knows that this will destroy Alicent.

Her 'son for son' line is equal parts relish and sympathy, she wants to dig the knife in a bit bc alicent had a hand in lucerys' death, but also I think 'son for a son' could also be her terrible way of HELPING Alicent make such an impossible decision by framing it as justice. Like, 'One of your sons is guilty for killing mine, whether its by direct action or responsibility via usurping my throne, not to mention other warcrimes, Therefore, its okay to choose to save helaena because she's innocent where your sons are not, and finally this is justice.'

TLDR: Rhaenyra only considers Alicent's direct sons as compensation for her loss of lucerys, both bc theyre 'responsible' for it and also bc she barely remembers that the younger green targs even exist. She says Son for a Son specifically to Alicent to make the decision easier for her.

hey anon how does it feel to be born with a galaxy brain

[sillyandquiteawkward]

as a big enjoyer of suicidal evil characters i LOVE when fans actually put care into depicting jimmy... he's an awful human being but in a v specific and impactful way,... like pre-crash curly unambiguously liked jimmy and was closer to and prioritized him above the rest of the crew (that fucking psych eval... lmao...) which is RLY IMPORTANT to getting exactly how bleak anya's situation was...! anyways ummm i like how you draw anya and curly's noses. also that drink comic of yours is one of my all time fav  shitpost jimmys. that semi-not-joking mass death ideation + halfhearted backtrack is so choice

i think its valid to not want to depict jimmy, especially bc he is a terrible person whos done incredibly upsetting things that lots of people have experienced. but i think its important to not just label jimmy as a monster in general and then set him aside, but to acknowledge that hes a person that continuously choose to do bad things in efforts to self serve and shift blame, and that there is a method to his madness. theres a lot of really fucking interesting characterization going on with jimmy, and while he uses that all to be a shitty abuser, hes still a compelling villain protagonist. its a shame that this fandom is so hostile to any sort of delving into him, to even mention him, unless its surrounded by 300 warnings and disclaimers. understandable, but a shame.

the way jimmy wormed his way into positions of power over others due to the neglect of pony express and curly's desire to "fix" him, how jimmy had his talons deeply sunk into curly who just rolled over for him when it came to his assault on anya. how jimmy was able to use swanseas solitary personality and daisukes naivety to exert his dominance and desire for control over anya and the tulpar which he was never capable of handling in the first place due to his lack of responsibility and selfishness, which ultimately brought everyone down...oh that is wonderful tragedy. the trainwreck, the facade, the hubris, the unreliability. a big house of cards posed perfectly to be knocked over in an instant. sadly everyone knows an incompetent idiot who thinks hes the shit and makes it your problem, everyone knows the guy you have to warn new people about. not as fun when its in reality. but i think exploring these ideas in fiction can help prepare, notice, and prevent jimmys from ruining you and others lives.

and thank youuuu any time i can draw a big nose, or a big bumpy nose, im there. im ready im hype. <3

also hehe i like the drink comic a lot as well. im glad people like the little bits of character i was able to shoehorn into single frames. theres too many comments about "why didnt jimmy put drugs/poison in there" which completely forget that 1) this is all on video evidence, which the crew will be watching back/posting 2) he also has to drink it 3) literally what would he gain for killing the crew before they even leave earth. lmao. jimmy adding monster to what he assumes to be alcohol is reflective of his impulsive spite towards swansea talking shit to everyone (him), but played off as a joke to save face. loooook its just a little jab back at swansea, no biggie. just tit for tat. his willingness to make everyone suffer (including himself) bc one person made him feel tiny. gnashing my fucking teeth

[violent-viscera]

THEORY OF ENDING OF ARCANE

ok, so i should preface that while i guessed singed was orianna’s father p much right away after i read orianna’s lore (which im super proud of), im terrible w theories. but i just want to ramble a bit.

i feel like jinx is going to die at the end of the show (which i hope not bc she’s my favourite character and she’s suffered so much.)

but considering how much arcane loves parallels and tragedies, it makes sense to me.

i feel like the whole foundation of jinx/powder as a person is that she seeks to belong, family, love, and to feel useful.

this whole unending tragedy is bc of piltover’s oppression of zaun and the power struggle/imbalance there, of course. but that’s how a little girl—who is predisposed to mental health issues and deep laden insecurities—ends up accidentally blowing up her entire found family.

her deep sense of emotionality and compassion becomes her worst enemy; it’s the guilt and trauma left behind by her actions that propels her character into chaos and deviancy. she believes everything she does is bound to be cursed and she can never do anything good. or right. and it doesn’t help that her second father figure is cursed w the similar insecurities of inferiority, projects his trauma onto her to make it tenfold, and manipulates her so he doesn’t lose her.

so instead of facing her pain head on and accepting those parts of her, she leans into it and adopts the persona of jinx.

it’s less painful than being weak, fragile, sensitive powder who can’t do anything.

so, in season two, with all the scenes of jinx slowly finding morsels of powder still lingering in the depths as she adopts isha and reunited w vi (however fragile and tenuous it may be) and just seeing how that former little girl who just wanted family and be loved and to love…i feel like she will die.

except she will die this time as someone who didn’t fuck shit up and died for her cause (maybe she protects vi as we see she does when faced w feral warwick). she will be reunited w her family (her parents, silco, vander, and isha) in death and she’s been saying she’s been wanting to die anyway.

not only that but it could be the way to bring closure to the sisters in a way that is stereotypical of arcane where they reaffirm their love but also still is considered tragic. maybe as jinx is dying and the shimmer leaves her system, she dies w powder’s blue eyes.

it also would parallel silco’s death at the end of season 1 and we can see even through montages this season that their journey into darkness begun from just wanting to help.

and as i mentioned earlier, she also stepped in front of vi, shielding her from warwick whilst demonstrating her hope that vander was still intact inside (powder’s optimism and hope still alive) and vi acknowledging jinx doesn’t need her anymore as she’s a force on her own…feels like maybe jinx will protect vi instead of vi being the protector.

i could be so dead wrong and i would like to be bc i love jinx and her story, but right now so much feels so set up to jinx’s death.

like the amount of redemption arc they’re aiming for and how much powder is still left inside her (her capacity to love still is alive and well), it feels like informs me that she will die.

[aliesther-eistein]

Hi, I read your post about Messmer & the hornsent crusade, and I found it really intriguing but I also disagreed on some of your points, however I'm not sure if I just didn't understand them or I misunderstood, so I thought I'd ask about it.

To preface, I mean no disrespect or hostility to you or your opinion, I'm just curious about some of the things you brought up in your post & I'd like to just understand them better. If I come off in an aggressive or confrontational manner I apologize, this is not a hate ask, I'm not great with tone in through text.

you mention in your post ppl in the fandom talking about how they like Messmer, but feel the need to justify why, or try to find excuses for simply liking a character. On those points I do agree completely, I think it's a Little ridiculous to do mental gymnastics to 'excuse' simply liking a souls character even though 99% of them are very morally grey. What I don't understand is your next point though, you say Messmer's past does excuse the crusade.

The post makes it seems as if the hornsents are one big monolith, who all participated in the torture & genocide of the shamans, despite them being a massive civilization and the greater potentates being the ones who specialize in, and practice the jar stuffing. From what I understood from the post, you believe that the hornsent as a collective, deserved to be genocided because of what happened to Marika's village.

You also say in the beginning of the post, that you like darker themes in Fromsoft stories like death and suffering, that the characters do terrible things but that we like regardless because we understand or sympathize with their reasoning, why they do it.

So what I didn't understand abt your post was this: Why bring up how Fromsoft characters are capable of terrible things, but we like them Bc we understand WHY they do those things, if you think the crusade was completely justified?

Following that logic, that the Hornsents all deserved to suffer and die, that wouldn't make Messmer a character capable of great evil, because then that just makes the crusade him enacting justice for his & his mother's people and it wouldn't be a morally wrong action.

That's why I wanted to clarify if I grossly misunderstood your points on my end. but If I didn't misunderstand I want to know why you think the Hornsent deserved to be purged completely. To me, It's not like the entire people all committed crimes to the shamans. If Messmer wanted to prevent/protect more shamans being jared, (assuming they weren't all dead) He wouldn't need to destroy their entire civilization & kill them all. he would just need to go after the potentates, places like bonny village & whipping hut etc. He and Marika are literally Gods who command multiple armies so I'm sure it was possible.

I just don't see how the Hornsent are all collectively responsible for the shamans being murdered when there was a entire village whose sole purpose was torturing shamans. Assuming that the shamans are indeed all dead, and Marika (understandably) wanted revenge then why not go after the ppl who actually committed the crimes in the first place? There's characters like Romina, who you can see in the trailer her church being burned down while she cradles her pole blade or something, getting caught in the cross-hair of the crusade but how is she & others like her, deserving of Messmer & Marikas extermination?

Basically how is Messmer excused for the crusade, when it didn't even target the ones responsible & only continued the cycle of violence by committing the same atrocities that happened to Marika's people. I see your point about ppl trying to be '' all-forgiving '' and virtuous over fictional characters but I don't think it's abt ''forgiving'' or anything, the way I saw it the story was conveying how the Hornsent weren't the 'good guys' or entirely innocent whilst still showing the tragedy of the crusade, bc it was still wrong to wipe an entire race out of existence for the actions some of it's members committed.

Again, I truly don't mean any animosity to you by sending this ask. I know fandom discourse can often be utterly vitriolic and I'm not tryna contribute by being disrespectful to you over a post. I merely wanted to understand your points that I was worried I misinterpreted. Even if I didn't I still respect your opinion. Anyway feel to grill me or ignore this if I'm wrong/grossly misinterpreted your post lol. I'm sorry it's really long, I tried articulating my thoughts as best I could. I hope you have a good day.

Thanks for the question. It’s a perfect illustration for what I wanted to tell, but obviously failed.

You’ve noticed a lot of details, you know the lore of the game pretty well, I am not to question it, and in a way this is the problem. This post is not about the lore and the characters, but about point of view and the language we’re speaking.

What I actually wanted to say with this post is that it’s pretty easy to be forgiving when you are not in rage. When you are not in rage, when you don’t see death, when you are not in fear for the ones you love and/or for the people of your kind, it’s easy to say “they are not monolith”, “their culture”, “not all of them”. In this peaceful state of mind, when you see only the story on the screen, it’s easy to notice those details and play with words.

But when your point of view and your state of mind due to the situation you are in changes, you are not capable of this anymore. When you fear, when you are in rage, when you see mutilation right before your eyes for months and years, it changes you to the core. You are simply _not_able_ to forgive, you are not able to differ your enemies. There is nothing like “culture”, “not all of them” and so on. When you see one of their kind, you see “one of their kind”. Not “someone”. People, - no, creatures, - who are a threat to you, who have already brought you sufferings, are not humans anymore. It’s easy to recall their humanity in the back of your mind when you don’t have memories of them slaying people right around you with joy. But once you’ve seen something like that, there is no way back. You will never see all the things you are talking about now, they will never matter anymore, and the enemy will never gain humanity in your eyes. When you understand that someone wants to slain you just because you are you, and when you see them actually doing it with the people of your kind, on the streets you are walking, you don’t want to ask questions and discuss their culture. You want to kill them all just in order to stop it. That’s how this puzzle looks from another point of view.

Returning to your question, are right in a way, but you are speaking in the language of peace. Most of people here, on Tumblr, I believe, have never seen war and terrorism knocking at their doors. And what I wanted to say with this post is that the language of peace is a privilege of peaceful times. When war comes, you forget it once and forever, because now you live in the new reality, and in this reality language of peace becomes total cringe.

I am speaking in the language of war, rage and vengeance.

So Messmer does.

I expected this fandom (since all dark things and so on are okay for people here) understand it perfectly, but now I see that they don’t. They’re speaking about war in the language of peace because peace is their reality, and seems like they can’t even imagine another one.

Sadly, I can. I don’t even have to. This is the reason we misunderstood each other, and, obviously, we will keep on doing it again and again.

P.S.: Remember what I said in the end: that post wasn’t only about Elden Ring.

[irrealisms]

jun wu or bwx for character asks? 👁️

starting off: hi yen if you're reading this it's got spoilers so pls skip this post ty <3 u can come back to it when u finish tgcf which at your current rate will be in like. a couple days lol

How I feel about this character

Im Normal About Him.

the ending is. perfect. the bamboo hat. it's never too late. when he's defeated he looks relieved. quoting myself from discord:

he cannot face being proven wrong, because it means he’s done terrible things and hurt people when he didn’t have to. he wants so badly to be proven wrong, because it means that maybe there’s good in the world and not just endless crushing pain and evil.

i have a lot of thoughts abt him & the tragedy of him & his entire ideology!!! i am sort of failing at condensing them but i have a lot of thoughts about him .

All the people I ship romantically with this character

hehe. xie lian (i am a sicko). i can also justify this to some extent--jun wu/bai wuxiang (i think mostly bai wuxiang, actually?) remarks positively on xie lian's appearance a notable amount, there's the "makes one ache, makes one excited" bit which i cannot read as anything other than Kind Of Weird And Horny, there's the thing where jun wu tests xie lian's virginity by making him bleed on jun wu's sword (i have another whole meta in my heart about swords as blatantly phallic in tgcf but i assume you do not need to be convinced of this lol)--but honestly i don't fully stand by it. this is a ship i have at least 80-90% because i am a sicko. i hope you can all understand

My non-romantic OTP for this character

ALSO xie lian. im complex. i contain multiple guys. the thing is that i have a beautiful google doc that consists of every time jun wu/bwx is analogized to a parent/teacher and xie lian is analogized to a child and it has . like. 30 quotes? somewhere around there? it's a lot! it's a lot. "i have decided that we are the same guy due to The Parallels but also i am going to enforce this and Make us the same guy by Molding You into Becoming Me" is an incredibly good dynamic whether it is slash or gen, and i do think the "weird forced adult-child relationship going on" reading is in fact more supported by the text than a shippy one. also when i'm not being a sicko about it there's also something deeply beautiful to me about their ending, about xie lian defeating jun wu but also showing him this moment of grace. and of course the Parallels which apply equally when it's slash vs gen. also you may have noticed that neither this question nor the last one do i bring up guoshi. this is bc idgaf about him. sorry mei nianqing . he exists i just Do Not Care

My unpopular opinion about this character

im gonna be so real i have no idea what is and is not popular wrt jun wu. what are the popular jun wu opinions.

One thing I wish would happen / had happened with this character in canon.

once again im kind of at the same place i am wrt mu qing of, like.... nothing, honestly? i am incredibly happy with what we got, i think it's beautifully written and the resolution is perfect, mxtx is a good writer and tgcf is a good book, no complaints

having a bit more of his backstory with mnq might be cool, i guess? we get the huge infodump but it's kind of just an infodump, it is just Pure Exposition, going into that a bit more / more naturally than "guoshi helpfully exposits for us" could be neat even tho i dont think its necessary. as mentioned i'm p much happy with what we got

(ask game, give me a character)

[longsightmyth]

What are your thoughts on the destruction of Numenor? I have not read the silm (yet?) so all my knowledge comes from the wiki, but to me, it just seems incredibly cruel of the Valar? I admit to probably being biased bc I come from watching rop and really liking Miriel so I am Not Happy over her canonical ending but still. Ik Numenor did a lot of very bad things, but there were still good people on the island (it's not like everyone could have escaped with Elendil & co). There were children there! I just feel like there would have been a lot of ways to deal with the situation that did not involve just up and killing everyone. Ig it might have just been a somewhat unwanted side effect to the Valar remodelling the world to cut off Valinor from mortals but even then, was that *really* necessary? It's not like Pharazon & co seemed to really be a danger to Valinor given that the Valar easily killed them all and their entire island. They could not have at least saved the children and remaining Faithful on Numenor? It also seems especially unfair given All The Shit The Noldor Did, where the harshest punishment the Valar ever seemed to give was banishment. It's not like Numenor was the only place to ever get tricked by Sauron either (although tbf, they did do a lot of extremely terrible things)! But again, I did not actually read the source material for that so I might be missing smth important there, so I'd be very curious to hear your thoughts.

Depends on which notes and editions you pick up probably, especially given the framework that the silm was written by elves and so is a biased account. Some notes say Miriel was forcibly married and renamed: others say she was in on it. The silm is written more in the style of a textbook, albeit one with a distinct slant towards a people with a vested interest in presenting their views, and it isn't like we ever have a narrative story IN Numenor, at least not that I've found. @arondirslovechild will correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm not sure what you're asking me here. "Was there a solution to the general murderisland numenor had become without sinking it" I mean I can't sink islands so it's not on my list of solutions. This is a callback to the fictional atlantis, which isn't great (I've mentioned before the ties between atlantis theories and nazis) but at least doesn't pretend atlantis was just shining light etc etc by the end.

But to be honest, Numenor is not where most of my attention goes. There is a certain amount of Catholicism in Tolkien's works that is inescapable even if he personally disliked it being called allegorical. The valar warned numenor what would happen: the ones who believed them a, didn't sail west to try to conquer elf heaven, b, didn't do shit like human sacrifice, and c, got the hell out of dodge.

Unless they couldn't, as with the non-complicit version of Miriel, who, again depending on which notes you decide to fold into your tolkien canon, knew what was happening and tried to plead with angry gods (or archangels, whatever) from atop a mountain for her people until the last.

Which I guess falls into Tolkien's entire mission statement: grand, sweeping gestures are all noble and well and good, but what keeps us from getting to that point and what makes them effective is the small everyday things that can build you a base. If Numenor had not drifted so far from this philosophy, they wouldn't have supported Pharazon's hostile takeover, they wouldn't have started human sacrificing all over the place, and they wouldn't have persecuted the faithful, somewhat ironically meaning they wouldn't have needed the faithful at all.

Anyway I am ill-equipped to judge Mythical Fictional Beings on such a grand scale, but I am going to note that given Tolkien's track record they were irrevocably doomed to some tragedy the second Pharazon married his first cousin and doomed even further in the version where he married her without her consent. It's a tolkien thing. You creep on a lady, you get hurled from great heights in a literal fashion, and I am counting hurling from the top of the sea to a cavern under it for this circumstance.

[humanoidtyphoons]

thank god doffy has always been an asshole

i'd wondered you know, bc the DQ fam keep on making a show, that he's suffered, that he's overcome so much, that he's earned their loyalty by what he's lived through, how much he's achieved

and it's like. he killed his dad. he killed his brother. were they bad people? and that's why doffy turned out this way?

bc honestly, they keep saying that doffy, the young lord, has gone through hardship that no one ever has. and i was. just.

i wanted to believe them? i wanted to know what oda had up his sleeve to say: yeah, his backstory is sadder than the straw hats combined, it's sadder than ace dying, and you're weeping bc it's the revelation why he's become such a twisted individual reduces you to tears, bc he's done that to me several times!!!

and like. looking back. even mentioning the fact that he was once a celestial dragon, that he stole the throne nd hearts of the people of dressrosa by some manipulation... there was still some part of me that wanted to believe them! that there was another reason! they belabour the point so much, his backstory is not for the faint of heart, the young lord is so strong, and wonderful.

and it's just pure bullshit????? he's just a fucking asshole!!!!

he didn't want to give up being a celestial dragon! that was a choice his father made! his father wanted to live like a human being, and so doffy just kills him! and he can't return to being a celestial dragon and go back to heaven! so he's like. alright, fuck 'em, i'm going to be the king of dressrosa, beloved by everyone bc of his successful smear campaign and distorted memories. i'm gonna get the one piece. there's nothing i won't do to set the world on fire.

and it's like. this is your villain origin story? that your daddy wanted to live like a normal human instead of believing that everyone should kneel at your feet?

seeing doffy as a child, asking "father why aren't we buying slaves today" it just... really made everything click.

that's he's always been this way. that he's always been a colossal twat.

that i was holding out for some... emotional moment, some tragedy that would rival every moment i've wept overcome by the scope that one piece has moved me: merry's funeral, laboon's history.

and it's like. why the fuck was i believing DQ fam over... the people of dressrosa, law. why the fuck did i think when they said "you don't know what he's been through! he's suffered more than anyone!" i was like, yeah they're prolly right. looking forward to seeing it, that his dad was terrible, that his brother was a monster too.

and it's just. nah, man. doffy's always been fucked up and evil. there's no villain story here. he's just a typical celestial dragon, dethroned, turned pauper, and he's tricked and lied and clawed his way to the top once more. it's just. like michael cervantes character don quixote, doffy is full of grandeur, attacking windmills, and rewriting the narrative to suit his bizarre beliefs. there's no sad story here!

and like. i'm furious at myself. i'm proud of oda. i'm laughing. i just feel all kinds of hysterical, bc in a way: his name is a dead giveaway: full of bullshit!!!!

i’ve been feeling lightheaded all day wrapping my mind around this!!

but it's anticlimatic in the best way, and stupidly funny to think about looking back, to pin some sort of trust on his followers, how they love and admire him despite his terribleness, to insist -- and sincerely believe -- that he has gone through so much! angels would weep, if they could!

and.

he's an asshole. always has been. always will be. his family is as deluded as he is!

why did you even consider thinking otherwise?

what a relief, you know?

[romy350-romyakari]

You know, I have been thinking about Hades 2 for a while.

I love the first game story even if I don't have first-hand experience to mention.

And hell am I seeing the angst flags everywhere in Hades 2.

More or less because I am way too attached to the family down there. The story in Hades 1 as you progress has so many things that makes you really like the characters, it is rewarding as each clear of your way out of the underworld gives you more bits and story or progression with some of them.

And the way Hades 1 can leave this just makes me wonder, how badly did Chronos caught them off guard?

There is one scenario in my head that is possible, and it makes me more sad as I think through it.

Possibly, whoever was collecting the pieces of Chronos or just Chronos rebuilding himself was at the last stages when possibly Zagreus ran into this situation. My worst scenario is he did kill Zagreus and maybe stopped time on him so he can't revive, so maybe Chronos keeps him dead if he is not imprisoned.

Why I think that Zagreus was the one who found him? He is running through the underworld many levels that I feel it possible he stumble upon the situation by pure accident to his bad luck.

And that makes it more tragic, which yeah hurts my heart, nobody expected this but run with this tragic scenario of mine till maybe they give me something more heroic in canon than tragedy or it is more tragic in there.

The thing that kicks me in the gut of this terrible scenario my brain created just to hurt me a bit more is how everyone is taking in the situation. Probably everyone is just specting to see him stand up, but it doesn't happen. the dread of not seeing him reacting and maybe getting the feeling something is wrong.

I can picture everyone getting used to him, probably going on a run to the exit as any other time, only to see him float of the water but not freaking moving, that would be chilling bc you are used to see him just stand and walk to the other so first flag something is not right, then the things becomes a mess.

Then all is clear.

We can imagine how it went, maybe everyone ends in some imprisonment bc they come back again and again or stopped in time on their defeat.

In the end I may be so wrong but I don't mind that. I just need this brain worm out in the open bc it was talking to me for way too long.

I am excited to see Melinoë go and kick Chronos, though I wonder what factors will make the purpose of runs, keep retrieving others that were made prisoners? Run further into maybe till you defeat him? Fight whatever is guarding to find more pieces of information so you can get back your people?

Who knows, but I am all in to see how that goes 👀✨️

[magesforthedas]

Continue reading if you want to be SAD 😢

Okay, more updates + a couple photos! Honestly I got a few screen caps of the tragedies I just experienced, but idk if y'all really want to see those. I can post them if you want, just let me know, but also be warned!! I also can't post any more videos on this thread :P

Okay, notes!

Where you can go in and see the fallen, there's something placed over the sheet for big characters; ie Emmerich's staff, Taash's axes, Viper's hat, Strife's sword.

Talking with your remaining companions is terrible bc they'll mention (at least some of them) their grief at losing their friends :(

I tried leaving Lucanis to help the other forces at the begining of The Dread Wolf Rises, since he's a HotV, but he still dies. Possibly because it's the Dragon King that the companion faces, so either if that companion quest was completed, OR if any ally strength was higher, even if both things weren't true, he might have survived. Oh well, looks like everyone dies.

(I went back and left Harding bc if he's not going to survive anyways I wanted my boyfriend with me 🥺)

Said scene is HORRIBLE 😭 as in, super traumatic. There's the ogre, or the Dragon King if he's still alive, and your companion goes to protect Morrigan but gets knock down, and then it shows your companions face as their enemy delivers the final blow. Like, my hands flew up to my mouth in shock.

I could post some screenshots of these moments if people want, instead of suffering the actual video, but like.... Maybe you don't want to see.

I think the scene of (Bellara in my game) controlling the blight is the same? I couldn't remember the details from the last time, and then the blight covers her over. Difference is, at the end we don't see her breaking out of the blight again, so it just consumes her.

There was no decision to make once I got to Solas. It just auto played into attacking.... Your two remaining companions get turned to stone and Solas stabs Rook in the gut, though not before you manage to get him too. Then both of you get pulled into the tear while you are struggling over the knife. It shows the statues of your companions, left on the platform.

Morrigan says something ominous about the victory costing too much (I don't remember the exact words, which to be fair I'm already trying to block this whole thing out) over a black screen.

Then NO EPILOGUE ART CUTSCENE. It just shows this-

And then THIS

They're like.... Yeah, you f*d that pretty good, try again.

IM SO SAD 😭😭😭 it's kind of late but like.... I must start my next playthrough because I have to convince myself this was all a terrible dream 🥺 I had the thought that it'd be interesting to see what other companions say in between the last two missions, in the safe house; whichever three are still alive at that point.... Or if it's possible to have whatever last hero you leave survive, but you don't, and if that might give you any ending cutscene (I kinda doubt it, I think it depends on whether Rook makes it). But I CANNOT do that again, so those will remain unanswered 🙂‍↔️

Anyways I hope this benefits anyone else, and maybe keeps you from feeling the need to put yourself through this! ❤️

Mom I'm scared. Why oh why did I have to be curious about the bad ending 😭

NO IM NOT SURE.

NO IM NOT CONFIDENT. BUT WE'RE DOING THIS ANYWAYS.

I'm going to be so sad for the next few hours.

Update below the cut so y'all can see it (Beware)

Ooookay

I haven't finished bc I have to go to work, but I made it to the end of The Last Gambit... I'm in tears 😭 some things if you want to know but don't want to actually play it (why have I done this):

Whoever you send with the Veil Jumpers to take down the wards lives, but Strife dies.

Whoever you send to help the Crows & Lords dies. (Taash for me)

Whoever you send to help the Wardens and Mourn Watch dies. (Emmerich for me)

If the Shadow Dragons aren't strong enough, The Viper dies.

Haven't seen any sign of Anaris, and no Dragon King (though there was a letter right before Tearstone Island warning about him). No Red Lyrium Harding either, and Davrin is dead already in mine, but no blighted griffons or Gloom Howler. I finished Lucanis' quest bc I didn't romance him on a Crow the first time, and my next Crow will probably be romancing someone else, so wanted to see the Crow/Lucanis things during his quest line. But I wonder if Zara was still alive, if she might also make an appearance.

So far none of the other allies died: Irelin, Teia, Viago, Myrna, Vorgoth, Tarquin, Antoine, Evka, and Isabela are all still alive. So small mercies.

Irelin talks about Strife in the safe house, as does Isabela about Taash, and Tarquin about The Viper.

Some really terrible things thought of:

If Emmerich and Strife were in a relationship, and only one died? Even worse possibly, what if Emmerich was the one sent to help? But would Emmerich mention Strife, or Strife mention Emmerich if only one survived? Strife asks you to keep Emmerich safe in the good version.. Probably?

Also, if Manfred is still around and Emmerich dies... Worse if you didn't even do Emmerich's quest (like me) so he doesn't have magic or can talk or anything... What's going to happen to Manfred??? Did he even survive the battle, because he was in a cutscene but I haven't seen him at the safe house????

Didn't do enough content to have Harding and Taash in a relationship, so can't find out. But if they're in a relationship and Harding survives Tearstone Island, what happens if one of them dies here?

What if Lucanis & Neve are in a relationship and one of them dies here? Like, if Bellara got captured and Lucanis dies fighting Aelia? I'm making myself sad just thinking about how Neve would feel.

anyways I'm sad and have to go to work, and then finish my no good, terrible, awful playthrough when I get home. Wish me luck and sanity 😭

(and then I must immediately start my fourth playthrough bc no, they must have as much of a happy ending as possible)

[millipedish]

Dang. Wishing Night got me reinvested in notfm in a way that diaries and memory in the mirror couldn't. While i enjoy the gameplay for all four game modes, the stories had a very "by the way" feel to them that took immersion away. By the way, when Red was 10 she was way more powerful than she is now. By the way, Red has a sister that no one has even mentioned before. Even the Jerry route in full moon is a "by the way" that kind of tries to retcon some of my fav characters and i still don't know how i feel about that. Wishing night is the first true sequel and it's a long time coming

It also sold me on the central ship, a little? I can't say that I ship the kids but but the tragedy is interesting to me. Red's denial is engaging. Her denial about Jerry's death and even that fact that he's a werewolf. She is such a badass in full moon and diaries, but she is just a kid who's gone through way more than she should have. It's heartbreaking to see such a strong character showing the signs of a mental breakdown.

This makes mechanic Red the only Canon Red in my hc, simply bc of my feels. Will I feel like that still later? Who knows.

Not to mention that the reused art gives me brainworms. I can't imagine why the weapon dealer has become so enthusiastic about the weapons he sells given his backstory. Unless it's a different guy? The owl shopkeeper canonically being the other shopkeepers son is a great touch. And i love seeing the apocathary again. His English voice is so great.

Also several of my favorite characters from full moon were retooled as minions, mostly for Red. Probably this is the closest I'll ever come to seeing Red and Crocdad teaming up. Au where the forest spirit is defeated but instead of transforming back, the cursed people are recruited by mechanic Red.

Not terribly impressed by the new enemies, tho I am curious about wtf is up with the orbs. I wonder if the devs will follow up on that, our of its yet another lost thread.

Also i like the mermaid and the shark. The mermaid is adorable and I want to be her friend, and the shark's PTSD symptoms are haunting. His cage is his mind :(. Makes me want to write a drabble with him and the Tin Man, who's body turned into a cage.

Also hecking curious about Queen Italis(sp?). Not only how does she connect to the plot, but all this stuff about her not being of the world and having visiting the God of wish once before. My headcanon? She was the nightingale mentioned in one of the endings. Maybe she fell in love with the king she belonged to and wished to become his wife? But idk. Would love to see other people's theories

[scullysflannel]

i remember seeing your post about why bcs is better than breaking bad, with this last episode, how do you think it stands as an antithesis of breaking bad?

it's become even more obvious this season that better call saul is not at all the antithesis of breaking bad, even though it is the antithesis of the kind of antihero story breaking bad exemplified. both shows are about moral agency in the wild west. they assert choice as identity (you are what you choose to do) and ask whether those choices redefine you or just reveal who you are intrinsically. they're both about men who become the architects of their own destruction and about how one person's actions can trap others.

I think better call saul is doing it in a much sadder and richer way. jimmy is acting out of deflected love, in a system that gives him fewer options to succeed without bending the rules. walt is handed an out early on from his wealthy ex-partners, but he doesn't take it because of his pride. he does what he does for entirely selfish reasons: money, power, ego, control. I've seen some pushback against walt hate on the premise that it ignores the humanity in the writing or whatever, so let me be clear: walt sucks because he's written like a human being. he's terrible to his son and only dotes on him when he wants to feel like a big provider. he ignores and lies to his pregnant wife. his students don't like him. he thinks he cares about jesse, but he's manipulating him, and he's at his most affectionate when he has the most control over him. that's not real care. I do think in the later seasons it sometimes borders on ridiculous how loathsome walt can be, and he's not the best character on breaking bad (jesse, skyler, mike, and hank are all more interesting. marie and gus are cooler). but the writers took care to root the worst things about him in personality traits that clearly predated his little meth empire. this is not a good guy we caught at a bad time. this is a small man who's masked his bitterness in socially acceptable ways for years.

in better call saul the chain reaction is more tangled. jimmy takes the opportunities that he's given to change, and then he tanks them, and his self-sabotage is both a fatal flaw and a response to legitimate structural problems in the legal system. (the rules are harder to justify when those rules are designed to maintain a status quo that makes upward mobility so hard, makes forgiveness so hard. think of jimmy's speech in "winner": one teenage shoplifting incident will follow you forever. they are never, ever letting you in. he got a whole law degree, but it was from an online university, so should it count?) he's much more shaped by other people than walt is ("people tell me how they see me"). better call saul builds on the big ideas in breaking bad but really commits to making the world around the fucked-up guy fucked up too, and it makes the tragedy so much deeper. because ultimately it's still a story about personal responsibility, just as breaking bad is. even when you have no good options, you still have to live with your choices.

being a prequel pushes better call saul to be smarter (which is what I was saying in the post you mentioned). it makes the characters more reflective. shoutout to the new yorker article that pointed out what it does to the show that the actors look older, as if the characters are trapped reliving their pasts without the power to change them. jimmy believes his fate is sealed, and as a result we get to watch him seal it. it's agonizing. that's where better call saul diverges from the breaking bad antihero formula: there's no (lasting) thrill in watching him make bad choices because we know what they'll do to him in the long run. but rebuking the walter white problem doesn't make better call saul breaking bad's opposite; it just makes it a more fulfilling version of the same story.

[janecrockeyre]

scum villain is a greek tragedy disguised as a regular tragedy disguised as a comedy disguised as a danmei

this is going to be long, and this is only PART ONE.

a.k.a, Analysing the plot of Scum Villain’s Self Saving System through Aristotle’s Poetics, because I Have Mental Issues

Part One: Introduction and the Tragic Hero

Scum Villain’s Self Saving System is a tragedy disguised as a comedy, unless you’re Shen Yuan, in which case it’s a mixture of a romance and a survival horror. It's a fever dream. It's a horrible, terrible book that made me feel new undiscovered emotions when I finished reading it. 

The thing is... SVSSS shares characteristics with some of the most famous tragedies in the West, such as Oedipus Rex, Medea, Antigone, the Oresteia... if you haven’t read these, I’ll explain everything. But the gist of my argument is this: SVSSS is the perfect tragedy. In triplicate. 

Tragedy as a genre is old as balls and so it has meant slightly different things to different people over the last few thousand years. I'll be focusing on ancient Greek tragedy, which was performed at the yearly Festival of Dionysus in Athens during the 500-350s BC (give or take a hundred years). Aristotle, when writing about this very specific subset of tragedy, had no idea that one day Scum Villain would be written, and then that I would be using his work as a way to look at Shen Qingqiu’s Funky Transmigration Mistake. Anyway!

Greek tragedy greatly influenced European dramatic tradition. I have a lot of opinions about white academics idolising and upholding the classics as the "paragon of culture" but I'll withhold them for now. I have no idea if MXTX has read Greek tragedy or not, so don't take this as me saying they are writing it. 

In my opinion, tragedy is a universal human constant. We are surrounded by pain and hurt and none of it makes any sense, so we seek to process that pain through drama, art, literature, etc. We want to understand why pain happens, and how it happens, and try to make sense of the senseless. The universe is cold and cruel and random. Tragedy eases some of that pain. 

On that note: Just because I am analysing Scum Villain through a Greek lens doesn't mean that it was written that way. I'm pasting an interpretation onto the book when there's probably a very rich and deep history of Chinese tragedy that I just don't know about. If you ever want to talk about that, please, god, hit me up, I would love to learn about it!! 

Anyway, tragedy. MXTX is excellent at it! Mo Dao Zu Shi? Painful dynastic family tragedy. Heaven Official's Blessing? Mostly romance, but she managed to get that pure pain in there, huh? 

But in my opinion, Scum Villain holds the crown for the most tragic of her stories. MDZS was more of a mystery. TGCF was more of a romance. Neither of them shy away from their tragic elements. 

Scum Villain would fit right in between the work of Sophocles, Euripides and Aeschylus. How? Let me show you. Join me on my mystery tour into the world of "Aristotle Analyses Danmei..."

Part One: The Tragic Hero

What is a tragic hero? Generally, Greek tragic heroes are united by the same key characteristics. He must be imperfect, having a "fatal flaw" of some kind. He must have something to lose. And he must go from fortune to misfortune thanks to that fatal flaw. 

There are two (technically three) tragic protagonists in SVSSS and all of them are tragic in different but formulaic ways. Each protagonist has their own version of “hamartia” or a “fatal flaw”. 

Actually, hamartia isn’t necessarily a flaw - rather, it is a thing which makes the audience pity and fear for them, a careful imperfection, a point of weakness in the character’s morality or reasoning that allows for bad things to happen to them. For example, in Oedipus Rex, the king Oedipus has a “fatal flaw” of always wanting to find the truth, but this isn’t exactly a flaw, right? Note: this flaw can be completely unwitting, as we see with Shen Yuan. It can also be something that the protagonist is born with, some kind of trait from birth or very young. 

Shen Yuan

Shen Yuan’s “hamartia” is his rigid adherence to fate and his inability to read a situation as anything but how he thinks it ought to be. He believes that Bingmei will grow into Bingge, and it takes several years, two deaths, and some truly traumatising sex to convince him otherwise. 

Shen Jiu

Shen Jiu’s fatal flaw is his cruelty. It is his own sadistic treatment and abuse of Binghe which directly leads to his eventual dismemberment. This is kind of a no-brainer. Of course, it isn't all that simple, and as an audience we pity him for his cruelty as much as we fear it because we know it comes from his own abuse as a child. This just makes him even more tragic. Delicious. 

Luo Binghe

Luo Binghe’s fatal flaw is a complicated mix of things. It is his position as the “protagonist” which compels him to act in certain ways and be forced to suffer. It is his half-demonic heritage, something entirely out of his control, which sets in motion his tragic reversal of fortune when he gets yeeted into the Abyss. He also, much like Shen Yuan, has the propensity to jump to conclusions and somehow make 2 + 2 = 5. 

As well as having their respective “flaws”, all three protagonists match the rough outline of a good tragic hero in another way: they are in a position of great wealth and power. Even when you split the different characters into different “versions”, this still holds true. Yes, Luo Binghe is raised a commoner by a washerwoman foster mother, but his dad is an emperor and he also ends up becoming an emperor himself. 

Yes, Shen Jiu is an ex-slave and a victim of abuse himself, but Shen Qingqiu is a powerful peak lord with an entire mountain’s worth of resources at his back. 

Shen Yuan is a second generation new money rich kid. 

Bingge is a stereotypical protagonist with a golden finger. Bingmei is a treasured and loved disciple with a good reputation and a privileged seat by his shizun’s side. 

In a tragedy, having this kind of good fortune at the beginning of your story is dangerous. Chaucer says that tragedy is (badly translated into modern english) “a certain story / of him that stood in great prosperity / and falls out of high degree / into misery, and ends up wretchedly”. If we follow this line of thinking, a good tragedy is about someone who has a lot to lose, losing everything because of one fatal point of weakness that they fail to address or understand. 

If we look at Shakespeare, this is what makes King Lear such a fantastic tragic protagonist. He is a king in control of most of England, who from his own lack of wisdom and excess of pride, decides to split his kingdom apart to give to his daughters, favouring his murderous, double crossing progeny, and condemning his only actually filial daughter to death. He loses his kingdom, his mind, and his beloved daughter, all because of his own stupidity.

This brings us to:

Part Two: Peripeteia

This reversal of fortunes is called peripeteia. It is the moment where the entire plot shifts, and the hero’s fortunes go from good to bad. Think of it like one of those magic eye puzzles, where you stare at the image until a 3D shark appears, except you realise the shark was always there, you just couldn't ever see it, waiting for you, hungry, deadly, always lurking just behind that delightful pattern of random blue squiggles. 

Each tragic hero has their own moment of peripeteia in SVSSS, sometimes several:

Shen Qingqiu

In the original PIDW, SQQ’s peripeteia presumably occurs when he finds out that Bingge didn’t perish in the Abyss but has actually been training hard to come and pay him back. There’s really not much I’m interested in saying here - as a villain, OG!SQQ is cut and dry, and the audience doesn’t really feel any pity or fear for him. As Shen Yuan often mentions, what the audience feels when they see OG!SQQ is bloodlust and sick satisfaction. There is also the trial at Huan Hua Palace, which I will talk about in Shen Yuan’s section. 

Shen Yuan (SQQ 2.0)

One of SY’s most poggers moment of peripeteia is the glorious, terrifying section between hearing Binghe for the first time after the Abyss moment, and getting shoved into the Water Prison. 

“Behind him, a low and soft voice came: “Shizun?”

Shen Qingqiu’s neck felt stiff as he slowly turned his head. Luo Binghe’s face was the most frightening thing he had ever seen.

The scariest thing about it was that the expression on his face was not cold at all. His smile wasn’t sharp like a knife. Rather, it showed a kind of bone-deep gentleness and amiability.”

This is the moment of true horror for Shen Yuan, because he knows what happens next: the plot unfurls before him, inevitable and painful, and he knows that death awaits him at Luo Binghe's hands (lol). Compare it with the bone deep certainty with which he faces his own downfall during the sham of a trial later in the chapter (I’ve bolded the important part):

“In the original work, Qiu Haitang’s appearance signified only one thing: Shen Qingqiu’s complete fall from grace. [...] Shen Qingqiu’s heart streamed with tears. Great Master… I know you’re doing this for my own good, but I’ll actually suffer if she speaks her words clearly. This truly is the saying “not frightened of doing a shameful deed, just afraid the ghost (consequences) will come knocking”!”

After the peripeteia is usually the denouement where the plot wraps up and the threads are all tied together leaving no loose ends, but because this tragedy isn’t Shen Yuan’s but the former Shen Jiu’s, it’s impossible to finish. 

Shen Yuan cannot provide the meaningful answers that the narrative demands because 1) he doesn’t have any memory of doing anything, and 2) he wasn’t the person who did them. Narratively, he cannot follow the same path as the former SQQ because he lacks the same fatal flaw: cruelty. 

This is why Binghe doesn’t kill him - because he loves him, rather than despises him. And this is why Shen Yuan has to sacrifice himself and die for Luo Binghe in order to save him from Xin Mo: because the narrative demands that denouement follows peripeteia, and SQQ’s fate is in the hands of the narrative. 

(Side note: I believe that this literal death also represents the death of OG!SQQ's tragic arc. The body that committed all those crimes must die to satisfy the narrative. SQQ must die, like burning down a forest, so that new growth can sprout from the ashes. After this, Shen Yuan's story has more room to develop instead.)

It must happen to show Bingmei that SQQ loves him too. And this brings us to Bingmei.

Bingmei

Bingmei has two succinct moments of utter downfall. The first is a literal fall - his flaw, his demonic heritage, leads his beloved shizun to throw him down into the Abyss. From his point of view, SQQ is punishing him simply for the status of his birth. He rapidly goes from being loved and cherished unconditionally, to being the victim of an assassination attempt. 

He realises that he is totally unlovable: that for the crimes of his species that he never had a hand in, he must pay the price as well: that his shizun is so righteous that no matter what love there was between them, if SQQ sees a demon, he will kill it. Even if that demon is Bingmei. 

The second moment is when SQQ dies for him. Again, from his point of view, he was chasing after a man who was struggling to see him as a human being. Shen Qingqiu’s death makes Bingmei realise that he has been completely misunderstanding his shizun: that SQQ would literally die for him, the ultimate act of self sacrifice from love: that SQQ loved him despite his demon heritage. 

Much like King Lear holding the corpse of his daughter and wailing in sheer grief and pain because he did this, he caused this, Bingmei gets to hold his shizun's cold body and cry his eyes out and know that it was his fault. (Kind of.)

(Yes, I’m bringing Shakespeare into this, no I am not justifying myself)

Maybe I'm a bit sadistic, but that scene slaps. Let me show you a comparison of scenes so you get the picture. 

Re-enter KING LEAR, with CORDELIA dead in his arms; EDGAR, Captain, and others following

KING LEAR

Howl, howl, howl, howl! O, you are men of stones:

Had I your tongues and eyes, I'ld use them so

That heaven's vault should crack. She's gone for ever!

I know when one is dead, and when one lives;

She's dead as earth. Lend me a looking-glass;

If that her breath will mist or stain the stone,

Why, then she lives.

[...]

 KING LEAR

And my poor fool is hang'd! No, no, no life!

Why should a dog, a horse, a rat, have life,

And thou no breath at all? Thou'lt come no more,

Never, never, never, never, never!

Pray you, undo this button: thank you, sir.

Do you see this? Look on her, look, her lips,

Look there, look there!

Dies

Versus this scene in SVSSS: 

Luo Binghe turned a deaf ear to everything else, greatly agitated and at a loss of what to do. He was still holding Shen Qingqiu’s body, which was rapidly cooling down. It seemed like he wanted to call for him loudly and forcefully shake him awake, yet he didn’t dare to, as if he was afraid of being scolded. He said slowly, “Shizun?”

[...]

Luo Binghe involuntarily held Shen Qingqiu closer.

He said in a small voice, “I was wrong, Shizun, I really… know that I was wrong.

“I… I didn’t want to kill you…”

PAIN. SO MUCH BEAUTIFUL PAIN. Yes, I know Shakespeare isn’t Athenian, but he was inspired by the good old stuff and he also knew how to write a perfect tragedy on his own terms. Anyway. I’ll find more Greek examples later.

This post was a bit all over the place, but I hope it has been fun to read. Part Two will be coming At Some Point, Who Knows When. This is a bit messy and unedited, but hey, I’m not getting paid or graded, so you can eat any typos or errors. Unless you’re here to talk to me about Chinese tragedy, in which case, please pull up a seat, let me get you a drink, make yourself at home.

ps: if you want to retweet this, here is the promo tweet!

[septembersghost]

one of the best things is I see every character in BB differently now. Saul is heartbreaking. I love Mike more. I hate Gus WAY more (sorry to Gus enjoyers, he's a great character but he's easy to like in BB opposed to Walt, BCS reveals how terrible he is). Jesse makes me sadder in parallel to Nacho. and so on

that's the alchemical element of it all - if you're going to do a prequel, it needs to stand on its own, which bcs very much does, but it also needs to matter to the universe of the story as a whole. it needs to have weight that fundamentally impacts the narrative from which it was formed, or else it's not going to be captivating or have a unique purpose. a difficulty with prequels is we know certain outcomes that can't be changed - everything that happens to these characters has already happened, and therein lies the tragedy - and that can impede tension, but they've done an excellent job avoiding that and giving this narrative its own stakes. it's helpful that it's a sequel too, that we have glimpses of the future as counterpoint to the past. the magic act of taking characters we know well, whose fates are sealed, and adding in characters we didn't know and came to be very invested in, not only makes everything in bcs tick, it makes sections of brba resonate differently. we understand "saul" and mike far more profoundly as human beings now and it accentuates every single action they take in brba. nacho haunts the margins and jesse's moments that mirror him lead to escape rather than sacrifice, and that feels all the more necessary now. i think even antagonists like gus and the salamancas take on new aspects and shadows, and walt (as the antihero -> villain) does too (see: parallels, especially to chuck, and maybe even in ways to kim, which is compelling and terrifying!). as i've mentioned before, jane/jesse take on additional facets because of kim/jimmy and the devastating fallout of real love intertwined with that codependency and addiction. and we're not done yet! peter still keeps saying we'll view brba differently when all of this is over, even though that has already happened in so many ways! i can't wait to see what exactly that entails. we don't know where this ends on the tragic spectrum, if there's hope for reunion or redemption that perhaps brba could never have, but they have done a beautiful and brilliant job taking us towards it.

[curiosity-killed]

Lang Qianqiu deserves more love goddammit: a post, unfortunately

This brought to you by the wonderful @veliseraptor & @/yuer on Twitter but also mostly out of spite and the fact that it’s preventing me from writing a very dumb poke-the-bear post abt the entire weird social media culture around The Minors

As always ✨SPOILERS!! SPOILERS EVERYWHERE✨

So first off: when I hit the scene where lqq confronts xl and screams “I will never be like you” I sat up in bed, did a little shimmy of delight, and hissed “fuck yes” at like 2 AM so. Now you have a preview of wtf this train wreck will be

1 ) lqq is a good character

We don’t get a ton of time with lqq because tgcf is 87 side characters running across stage with The Most Interesting Concept constantly one-upping each other before vanishing. But what we do get is, I think, enough to make a pretty compelling story: Lang Qianqiu is a kind and generous prince who is also the sole survivor of the bloody massacre of his entire family, committed by the people dearest to him (both in his belief that Gusohi Fangxin did it and in the reality of An Le’s involvement), who goes on to peacefully lead his fractious nation into a peaceful reign before he ascends as a powerful enough (aka beloved and worshipped enough) god to be ranked among the top heavenly generals. That’s like. Pretty fucking classic protagonist vibes right there.

And, as usual with mxtx’s characters, we get a lot more than this lovely little backstory. In his interactions in canon, lqq is capable of great grief and anger; he is willing to sacrifice himself if it means avenging his murdered family; and he simultaneously holds both great hatred and great respect for his old teacher. And, of course, he winds up raising and taking care of his enemy’s son which shows a remarkable depth of compassion and emotional messiness that I find terribly compelling. He struggles with a simplistic view of justice that is supported by lies told to “protect” him and that is uprooted by the truth and forces him to try to make sense of the world without the guardrails that others installed around him (looking at you mister fangxin sir).

Also I’m stealing my own tweets bc I’m Right but:

*pulls up single barstool to lqq is a good character table* I think it’s interesting & Says Things abt the continued relationship btwn lqq & xl that lqq *didn’t* recognize xl, implying that he left fangxin’s mask in place even when he went to kill him

Like here is the man who killed his family & best friend, who left him abandoned in bloodshed on his 17th bday—& here is also the man who saved his life, who taught him, who lqq looked up to & wanted to be like

Even when lqq *does* recognize xl, he still has so much respect for him paired with that hatred that it’s honestly rlly tragic? Like man. There’s so much grief in lqq’s repeated demands for a duel & insisting it’s fine if xl kills him as long as he doesn’t hold back

*pats lqq pompom* this bb is so sad. And so much more like his teacher than either of them seem to realize or necessarily want

Despite being a pretty minor character, lqq gets a lot of complexity and nuance! Look at this child trying to be grown up while desperately turning to his old master for guidance and “the truth”! Look at him! Be sad!!

2 ) lqq is an excellent parallel to xl

Okay stealing my own tweet again don’t look at me I yell the same shit everywhere

Xl didn’t want lqq to become like him (self-sacrificing, vengeful, alone) but lqq not only became alone, chasing vengeance, & willing to sacrifice himself for revenge—he also became kind, open-minded, & remorseful!! & he still clearly respects xl @ novel end 🙃🙃

We all know hc’s “they’re not very alike at all” and yeah sure baby go support your man but narratively, there’s a lot of importance given to cycles, parallels, and foils in mxtx’s writing and most explicitly (compared to mdzs, haven’t read svss) in tgcf. For example, *gestures at beefleaf, gestures at Xianle Trio vs Wuyogn Crew, gestures at Xie Lian & Jun Wu’s whole uh. Deal.* And while I’d argue xl and lqq are part of a triumvirate rather than a pair, we’re not including mister three-face in this conversation so just looking at xl and lqq:

Both adored and sheltered crown princes

Both taught by a guoshi who was seeking to prevent the repetition of their own tragedies and in their efforts, lied/omitted information and failed to protect their charge from tragedy

Both were betrayed* by their closest friends

Both are the last living members of their respective royal families

Both caught the interest of supernatural beings from a young age

Etc etc I’m getting v bored and distracted writing this so moving on

Most importantly to me, we have their betrayal by a very close and adored mentor and how they react. The confrontation I mention at the start of this shitshow is really imo one of the most important scenes in the novel because it a) illustrates the differences in xl and Jun Wu and b) sort of gives you a preview of how xl ultimately wins

So a) Jun Wu and Xie Lian both take a talented, marked-for ascension young prince under their wing. Jun Wu sees himself in the boy and obsesses over shaping him into Jun Wu’s own image in the belief that this will make him the perfect heir. Jun Wu pushes his chosen heir into situations where Xie Lian is repeatedly harmed in an effort to show that the common people are fickle and cruel and don’t deserve his compassion and care.

Meanwhile, Xie Lian is reluctantly roped into mentoring his prince due to his inability to stand aside when he feels he could do something to prevent hurt or injustice befalling another (simultaneously his great strength and great weakness! God I love him). Xie Lian tries to teach his student to believe in and care for the common people and not to sacrifice himself (see: flashback convo re:taking the force of the sword strike into his own body).

When Xie Lian refuses to bend in the shape Jun Wu demands, Jun Wu bashes his head into the wall. When Lang Qianqiu cries “I will never be like you!”, Xie Lian laughs and says “Good!”.

B) this of course feeds directly into foreshadowing! Like Lang Qianqiu’s bold words, xl ultimately refuses to become like his mentor and remains defiant even when it would stop him from being hurt. Xl beats lqq and says so what if I tricked you, so what if I lied, I still won. Naturally, xl beats Jun Wu not through standard swordplay but by using a trick he learned while forced to busk and wander the earth alone and unlucky for centuries.

…okay so I have fully forgotten what I was actually saying here! Anyway!

Like Xie Lian, Lang Qianqiu spends a time consumed with the need for vengeance, hunting his enemy and rejecting the heavens. And like Xie Lian, he winds up caring for his enemy’s “son” and trying to both comfort him and maintain what’s left of Qi Rong’s life force despite having previously been hellbent on destroying him—bc he sees the impact it has on another person. In the end, he even gives a gift to Xie Lian—his mentor, his role model, and the one who killed his father—that was once given to him as a symbol of unexpected kindness. Sound familiar?

But, importantly, and contradictory to what I have been yelling abt but whatever it’s 12:30 am, Lang Qianqiu is not a direct mirror of Xie Lian but a closing of a vital loop in the story. Lqq is very similar to xl (I will die on this hill!! Only I won’t bc I’m stronger than y’all and will keep swinging these pots and pans) but bc xl tries to do better and keep lqq from suffering the way xl has, lqq is able to have a gentler and more optimistic path forward. He’s proof that even a small act of kindness or even kindness to only one person still matters and has a ripple effect that can’t be seen when you’re in the middle of it—a thread started with xl giving the coral pearl to Lang Ying and closed with Lang Qianqiu returning the pearl to Xie Lian.

So I have no idea if any of this is coherent or compelling but I meant to be asleep two hours ago and the points are:

A) Lang Qianqiu is good actually

B) parallels!!!

C) look ive already started another wip about Lang Qianqiu and Xie Lian and I didn’t want this but no one else wrote it so now I have to so pls just accept this as a warning

*sort of air quotes around this for Xie Lian bc frankly Mu Qing was right & Xie Lian kicked feng xin out BUT on the other hand, it was experienced as a betrayal and we also again have all of Jun Wu’s shit so it evens out

[unalivejournal]

u mentioned only reading kripke era fic do you have a reclist 👀👀👀and if not could you link some of ur faves cuz the stuff that gets circulated the most right now is all like late late seasons fic and kripke era is my favorite too but im having trouble finding that many fics for it or even seasons 6-10 era which im fine with also. its just that like. the last five seasons were so bad that it makes fic generally worse too because people have to jump off of just Thee stupidest plot choices no matter how good their prose skills might be. but anyway yea if u have recs that would be awesome :)

hi anon i was thinking abt making a reclist and u just gave me the perfect excuse thank u

jess adamilligan’s kripke era fic recs

from making this ive learned that i never bookmark ANYTHING. sorry all of these r like….. 10k and under. i DO read longer fic but i don’t have any kripke era longfics bookmarked & tbh i prefer short oneshots

season one gen

disclaimer because it’s unfortunately needed: NONE of these are w*ncest! they’re all completely tagged as gen and i did not read them with the intent of consuming ship content.

Coaster Park by fogsrollingin, 10.4k, G, gen

Coaster Park had been experiencing an unusually high frequency of technical difficulties. Dean wouldn't have pulled a shift treating nauseated, heat-stroked, or dehydrated park-goers for that if he could've helped it, but when 'technical difficulties' were accompanied by rumors of things moving and stopping on their own in front of the operators' eyes, Dean had to throw down.

No historical tragedies or disasters in the area, ectoplasm, or EMF. Dean's only lead was a battered-looking kid that'd been coming to the park every day since it'd all started.

really interesting au fic! slightly ‘it’s a terrible life’. dean winchester is a hunter/EMT and sam wesson is a college kid destined to die on a roller coaster ride.

two basic motivating forces by sahwen, 7.8k, T, gen

He can’t cry, it’s not allowed; even as a child he was hushed into silence, whether his tears were from a long car ride or a late night or a raging fever. It’s never been an option, it’s never been an available outlet, and it’s not about to start being one just because he’s having an emotional breakdown on the bathroom floor.

Sam isn't only afraid of clowns.

BIG emetophobia tw (both for graphic depictions of nausea/vomiting and for the fact that this fic is about sam suffering from emetophobia) for this one but it’s my favorite sickfic. portrays anxiety over getting sick really well and is a fascinating examination of the different ways that sam’s fear of loss of control can manifest itself. also has lovely brothers content <3

Let’s Start at the Very Beginning (Remix of Just as Easy as 123) by nwspaprtaxis, 4k, T, gen

Dean’s functionally illiterate and Sam’s determined to remedy it...

PLEASE READ THIS ONE god it’s so sweet. dean never learned how to read properly due to his nomadic childhood and sam teaches him how.

dean/cas

Broadway Musical by Griftings, 9k, M, m/m

This is the day that marked the Holy and Blessed Union of Dean Winchester and Jo Harvelle.

The merging of prominent bloodlines is always a grand occurrence, but breeding pedigree hunter families like Winchester and Harvelle is something to be rejoiced. It is also something to be meticulously planned, which thankfully the Host is very good at.

Or, the romantic comedy where Dean Winchester and Jo Harvelle are destined to get married, Castiel is given the task of playing matchmaker and fails terribly, the entire Heavenly Host becomes a sitcom audience, God warns against male pregnancy, and Jimmy Novak is incredibly unimpressed with angels in general.

somewhat of a fandom classic and the humor holds up wonderfully. a very silly fic completed with commentary from angel radio throughout the entire thing.

Sappiest Season by dollsome, 2.7k, G, m/m

In which Dean and Cas have to stop an evil Christmas tree (like you do), and it requires a little fake couple action.

hilarious little s5ish fic. one of the first i read when getting back into spn. i don’t want to spoil anything but this is my favorite pick me up and i still giggle randomly whenever i think about it

The (Mostly Accidental) Courtship of Dean Winchester by tuesday

Angelic marriage rites were never intended to go quite like this.

another fandom classic. ik this one is recced a lot but how could i NOT include it. dean and cas get married (mostly by accident) and they’re huge cunts about it

the one thing in the galaxy god didn't have his eyes on by prufrock, 2.4k, T, gen + m/m

“Wait,” Dean says. “Let me get this right. You can fly, right—you can teleport—but you can’t drive a car?”

or, after the events of S5E03 "Free to Be You and Me," Dean teaches Cas to drive. Cas finds it stressful

im always a sucker for a good ftbyam fic. also i can’t drive so. resonation

So Says The Sword by komodobits, 85k, E, m/m

The briefing was simple: ‘Stand guard over the Michael Sword until the battle is ready to commence. Await further instructions.’

Castiel doesn’t mind working security duty; he was briefed shortly after the initial salvation of the Sword from the pit, and again before taking up his position. He knows what to do. However, it’s easy to forget that the green room isn’t real. Time moves differently there, the space ever-changing to make a prison of mountains, cathedrals, salt flats, orchards, and whatever Castiel was led to believe about Heaven’s greatest weapon—Dean Winchester is something entirely unexpected.

NO introduction neede. i think everyone on spntumblr has read this already but still. if you haven’t then i am demanding that you read it NOW. tbh i’m just adding this one so that i have at least one long fic here 😭

the weight by @myaimistrue, 3.5k, T, gen + m/m

“Do you…” Bobby sighs. “Listen, Dean, do you have something you wanna tell me?”

It’s the conversational equivalent of being punched in the stomach.

Or, Dean works through some things with Bobby's help.

WHEN I SAW THE USERNAME I GASPED I HAD NO IDEA THIS WAS U. anyway i Love coming out fics idk why i just do. the world is ending and dean comes out to bobby

canticles by 2street2car, 10.3k, T, m/m

“But you know something? If I couldn’t get you laid, at least I gave you a good first date.”

feat: footsies at a Ruby Tuesday, stargazing, the recreation of an iconic "Dirty Dancing" scene (no, not that one—the other one), and practicing for When You're With A Girl.

another ftbyam fic that skepticalfrog (i believe?) recommended a while back. made me feel at least 28 new emotions

Epilogue by JayneL, 28k, E, m/m

Bobby is here, swearing somewhere above and behind him; and Dean is here, talking about 2014 like it's a foreign country; and Sam is here, and is not Lucifer. Which means-- Bobby is here, swearing somewhere above and behind him; and Dean is here, talking about 2014 like it's a foreign country; and Sam is here, and is not Lucifer. Which means--

Cas is no longer when he was. Lucifer sent him back.

Coda to 'The End'.

2014 cas gets sent back to 2009, feelings ensue etc. i don’t remember all the details of this one bc it’s been a while but it’s really good

bonus

currently reading

Fragile As We Lie by perilously, 11k, E, f/f

Dragging Bela Talbot out of perdition isn't so much a decision as it is a frantic choice based on gut instinct. Her soul is bright, if fractured, and Anna yearns to do good again after the perversion of free will that immediately preceded her death.

Bela's no ordinary human, though; she's prickly and damaged and beautiful, and Anna doesn't want to leave her side. So maybe they can figure out how to navigate post-resurrection, post-Apocalypse-that-wasn't Earth together.