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commentaryvorg · 3 years ago

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Digimon Data Squad Dub Comparison Episode 34 - The Norstein Family Secret

This is a companion to my commentary on the original Japanese Digimon Savers! Reading my commentary on the original version of this episode (which you can find here) is recommended before reading this dub comparison.

(As ever, the spoiler warnings I gave for the original episode commentary also apply here too!)

Original name ~ Dubbed name

Masaru Daimon ~ Marcus Damon

Yoshino Fujieda ~ Yoshino “Yoshi” Fujieda

Tohma H. Norstein ~ Thomas H. Norstein

Ikuto Noguchi ~ Keenan Crier

Sayuri Daimon ~ Sarah Damon

Chika Daimon ~ Kristy Damon

Professor Suguru Daimon ~ Doctor Spencer Damon

BanchouLeomon ~ BanchouLeomon

Gizmon ~ Gizumon

Piccolomon ~ Pixiemon

[Since several characters share the same name between the original and the dub, quotes from the dub will always be in italics, while quotes from the original will not, in order to distinguish them.]

Recap Marcus: “…but I had my own problems. That Kooky guy wouldn’t stop until he beat me in a fight…”

Marcus is doing the recap! Unfortunately, it’s suddenly very clear that he never actually said Kouki’s name in any of the previous episodes, because it seems like nobody told his voice actor how to pronounce it. (It’s Koh-ki.) Neither did anybody bother to check if this pronunciation was correct before throwing the line in like this. Did it really not give anybody pause to think, wait, are we sure this supposedly-threatening villain is really called Kooky?

The dub is using the National Security Council as its stand-in for what was not even just the Ministry of Confidentiality any more in the original but an entire government-wide committee. And, yeah, the National Security Council works fine for this purpose. Most sensible fix of one of their mistakes the dub ever did.

Agumon: “Let me eat something…”

Masaru: “Now? There’s nothing!”

~~~~~

Agumon: “I’m just a growing boy!”

Marcus: “Yeah, growing fat!”

This bit in both versions is mostly a comedic “look at Agumon being his usual hungry self”, but the original does also present it slightly as a problem with Masaru’s last line, while the dub does not. They really don’t have any food in the shelter, and that’s going to be a legitimate issue if they’re going to stay here, even for people who aren’t Agumon!

There’s sinister BGM playing over the helicopter’s approach to the Norstein mansion where there was just silence in the dub, which seems a little incongruous when Thomas is about to reunite with his sister. The sinister music does cut off at that point and get replaced with something cuter – in fact, it’s Probably Marcus’s Theme: Heartwarming Piano Edition, so I guess they don’t always use that for Marcus-specific moments.

Relena: “Welcome back, Tommy!”

In the original, Relena calls Tohma “Brother”, as younger siblings tend to do to their older siblings in Japanese – it’s onii-sama, probably the most respectful way to phrase it, making her come across as very refined and polite. (Who knows what she was actually saying in German, but let’s assume this is an appropriate translation of the intent.) In the dub, the Japanese convention of calling older siblings that doesn’t exist in English, so this had to be changed to something that doesn’t seem especially refined and is more cute.

Relena’s voice performance is also quite distinctly different in the dub. She sounds older, in the sense that she seems more… self-aware? Normal? She doesn’t sound nearly as much like a young sheltered disabled girl from a posh family who probably never gets to do much of anything that isn’t what she’s told to do.

Relena: “No, nothing like that. In fact, it’s good news!”

Like, the wording of this line, too. It’s more articulate than you’d expect a five-six-ish-year-old to be, I feel. I wonder if the dub doesn’t realise she’s supposed to be quite this young and is assuming she’s older. (Based on evidence from a later episode that led me to deduce her age to be roughly this, I think the absolute oldest she could possibly be is seven.)

Gaomon: “O-Of course, Miss Relena!”

~~~~~

Gaomon: “Uhh… yes, of course, I’ll… be your friend. I’d be glad to.”

Dub-Gaomon kinda sounds here like he isn’t actually glad to be her friend and is only saying he will to not disappoint her or Thomas. In the original he was incredibly flustered, but he still sounded eager about it beneath that.

Relena: “Thank you, Brother.”

~~~~~

Relena: “Thanks, Tommy. I’m fine, don’t worry about me.”

This, as Thomas helps Relena up the steps and back into her wheelchair, is more of her dub version being more able to advocate for herself than she is in the original.

Franz: “After hearing that you returned to Japan without a word, I find this.”

~~~~~

Franz: “You just ran off, without a single word. Choosing to join DATS over your family.”

It comes across in the dub like Franz hasn’t seen Thomas since he joined DATS. Except… that was years ago, and Thomas has been at the DATS branch in Europe for some of those years. The implication in the original was that Franz last saw Tohma at some point during that time at the EU branch, based on him bringing up Tohma going to Japan specifically, not DATS.

(And how does Relena seem to know and remember him so well, if it’s been that many years since he’s been around his family, given she’s so young and that’d be a significant proportion of her whole life? How does she know about Gaomon?)

Maybe this is the dub randomly deciding for this particular episode that it doesn’t want to mention that we’re in Japan (an earlier line of Thomas to Relena also doesn’t mention Japan specifically where Tohma’s did). Even though the dub’s usually okay with that.

Franz: “Tohma won’t be going anywhere. Set yourself at ease.”

~~~~~

Franz: “Thomas isn’t going anywhere. Just ask him yourself.”

Franz is being more overt about manipulating Thomas into staying, with how he tells Relena to ask him if he’s going anywhere.

Franz’s dub voice acting is a lot more cold and strict, even when reassuring Relena here. I think the voice actor’s leaning just a little too much into the Bad Rich Dad vibe without any nuance. Original-Franz still has some level of softness and affection here behind his posh tone. He does love his kids, even if he’s really bad at expressing it or acting on it.

Franz: “Exploit her? I’m her father. What’s wrong about me thinking for my own children?”

~~~~~

Franz: “I’m just being her father. Why don’t you try being her brother for a while?”

Wow, instead of making a point of trying to justify his actions, dub-Franz responds by being even more passive-aggressive, implying Thomas is usually a bad brother.

Tohma: “You didn’t do anything when both Mom and I were suffering, so why now…?”

~~~~~

Thomas: “You weren’t around when Mother and I were suffering, and now suddenly you’re Father of the Year?”

I don’t know if Thomas’s mother even really needed his dad to be around; she probably just needed him to contribute some money to help her get by. But then, I suppose it’s fair that Thomas might have also just wanted to have a dad there, money or not. (Heh. These kids and their absent fathers.)

Tohma: “What are you thinking?”

Kurata: “I will help your little sister, Relena-chan. In exchange, your intellect will help me. I want us to make a fair deal.”

~~~~~

Thomas: “What are you up to, Kurata?!”

Kurata: [chuckling] “I don’t know what you mean. I’m simply here to help Relena. Of course, I am going to need something from you in exchange. The more you co-operate, the better your sister gets.”

I actually kinda like this! It gets across a little better – but still subtly enough to not completely give the game away – that really Kurata’s threatening Thomas. Even though he’s still presenting it like it’s about curing Relena, it’s a lot clearer that he only cares about doing so in order to get Thomas’s co-operation, making the undertone that he’d do the opposite if Thomas refused to co-operate a lot more apparent. There’s a cheeky tone to that “I don’t know what you mean”, like, oh, what could possibly make you think I’d be up to something, little old me would never use your sister to buy your co-operation, of course not.

Tohma: “You can cure Relena, right?”

Kurata: “Of course.”

~~~~~

Thomas: “You *swear* that you’ll be able to cure Relena?”

Kurata: “Yes, of course, Thomas.”

However, Thomas’s isn’t leaning into that subtext as well, because him putting more emphasis on this sounds somewhat more like he’s genuinely invested in Kurata being able to cure Relena. Maybe that could be part of his act, but I don’t know if the dub writers are thinking of it that way.

Kurata’s reply in the dub continues to have more subtle hints of that simperingly innocent I’d-never-put-a-bomb-around-your-sister’s-neck tone and I still enjoy it. Man, why is the dub so good at Kurata and literally nobody else.

Yoshino: “What is it? In this world, it’s survival of the fittest. The fastest wins!”

~~~~~

Yoshi: “What’s wrong? Do you have something against food? We’re starving!”

Kinda sad at the loss of Yoshino’s attitude of ruthless pragmatism when it comes to free food.

Kristy: “You need all the help you can get, Marcus.”

Kristy being sassier than her original counterpart, as ever. This “help” she’s so sure she can give him is literally just food!

Marcus: “You’re aiding and abetting criminals!”

Marcus’s tone of voice sounds really weirdly mad about this. Like, almost hysterically so? It’s a strange line-read.

Sayuri: “It’s all right. No matter what happens, you’ll always be my son, Masaru.”

~~~~~

Sarah: “Yes, I know! But, you’re my son… and even criminals have to eat!”

Sarah sounds incredibly cheery and excited about aiding and abetting criminals and the fact that her son is now one… which I actually kind of like. It’s very much the point of this moment that she’s putting on a brave smile over a situation that’s really very dire. She is good.

Chika: “Masaru-niichan, don’t push yourself too hard.”

~~~~~

Kristy: “Now don’t be bossy. You tend to do that.”

Ah yes, lovely, the characters informing us that Marcus is a jerk of a person in ways that are never backed up by his actions, my favourite thing about the dub. In the original, Chika was worrying about him! Why can’t we just keep that.

Marcus: “What are ya talkin’ about? Ever since your boyfriend Thomas left, I have to be the boss!”

Urghrgh, no, can we please not. Even if it’s slightly possible that Kristy might have a precocious crush on Thomas, that’s like the least relevant thing ever and can we not bring it up and act like it matters at all. Even if she does, that does not remotely make Thomas her “boyfriend” and it disgusts me when people do that and Marcus is absolutely the last person who’d care or think to make this kind of comment. No. Stop.

(Also Masaru really doesn’t actually care about being the boss? I suppose it seems to fit Marcus a bit better because of what Agumon calls him.)

Kristy: “In other words, Thomas isn’t here to save you from being a doof.”

This part is correct and intact at least. An appropriate moment for Kristy’s dub-specific habit of calling her brother that.

The dub keeps the exact same effect the original had of making it look like the Damons are reacting to BanchoLeomon’s badass background music. I am happier than I should be about this tiny silly thing.

Franz: “Not that again! Think about your situation! I will not forgive you if you return to DATS!”

~~~~~

Franz: “You’re so selfish! I swear, if you don’t help her, you won’t be welcome in this house any more!”

Franz in the dub makes this part entirely about helping Relena, and not about anything to do with DATS. Which I guess is indeed the most pressing issue right now, but I do like how this line in the original shed some light on Franz’s attitude towards Tohma being in DATS, and implied that he’d been subject to Kurata’s anti-Digimon DATS-are-traitors propaganda.

(Also, “not welcome in this house” is not actually a very meaningful threat for Thomas, who doesn’t want to be here anyway aside from getting to see Relena. But then I suppose Franz may not realise that, or just have no better threat to make.)

Thomas: “Why don’t you just say what you really mean? This isn’t about Relena; you just don’t want me to tarnish the precious Norstein reputation!”

Mmmmm, given that Franz was just making it about helping Relena and didn’t bring up DATS at all, it’s a lot easier in the dub to assume that it really is all about Relena. Why wouldn’t he care about curing his daughter? Why would that have to have anything to do with the Norstein reputation?

Kurata: “In the end, all that DATS’s methods succeeded in doing was increasing damage that could have been avoided. That small bit of justice you’ve waved around all this time only brought pain and sadness with it.”

~~~~~

Kurata: “Haven’t the Data Squad’s methods caused more problems than they’ve solved? Even the very basis of the Data Squad’s ideals have been proven to be misguided. Desperately clinging to them is just going to bring *more* pain and sadness. Do you really want to be responsible for that?”

Kurata’s dub-specific point about the Data Squad’s ideals is presumably referring to the idea that Digimon are sapient people who can live in harmony with humans, which has obviously totally been proven to be wrong and actually Digimon are violent beasts who need to be wiped out, because Kurata is definitely the most correct. But that does make his argument here less technically-possibly-maybe convincing, because it only works if you accept the premise that Kurata’s view of Digimon is the truth.

In the original, he never actually made any kind of argument here about whether or not the Digimon deserved to die. It was more like: the Digimon are going to die one way or another no matter what, so why not just give up and stop fighting it and help it along, because it’s easier that way and who really cares about Digimon anyway. Still an absolutely monstrous argument – of course you should try and stop a genocide if there’s anything you can do about it, genocides are bad – but I think it made slightly more sense that Tohma might be technically possibly willing to buy into it, because he doesn’t even need to agree with Kurata that Digimon are dangerous vermin in order to do so. He just needs to decide they’re not worth the effort of saving. You know, like some kind of megalomaniacal genius who looks down on everybody else.

Kurata: “Above all, there is Daimon Masaru. Thanks to him, the situation grows even worse.”

~~~~~

Kurata: “And then of course there’s Marcus Damon. He’s the main reason this conflict hasn’t been resolved yet.”

I don’t know if “Marcus is the main reason the war’s still going” is the same thing as “Masaru has made things worse”. If Marcus hadn’t been reckless, maybe the Sacred City would still be around, but Kurata would also still be trying to kill all the Digimon – Thomas’s cautious defensive approach certainly wouldn’t have been able to take him out. Kurata’s original line about Masaru making things worse works as something Tohma might actually be thinking could be true, but there’s no real way that the dub argument is anywhere near as liable to lodge somewhere.

That said, the dub version of the line here does match better with what Tohma says later in the episode when he confronts Masaru – “As long as you’re around, the fighting won’t end.” (Which will also be basically the same in the dub.)

Kurata: “I foresee great things from you.”

~~~~~

Kurata: “I have big plans for you, Thomas.”

This is not a direct callback to the last time Kurata said something along these lines like it was in the original. In the dub of episode 23, Kurata said he saw “a very bright future” for Thomas. I guess the dub writers didn’t pick up on that parallel. This also sounds a lot more like Kurata is only intending to use Thomas. Which, I mean, is true, but it’s not really something he’d say when he’s trying to persuade Thomas that his intellect and genius is better off here.

Kurata: “…and we can create a new world.”

Tohma: (A new world…)

~~~~~

Kurata: “And then… we can create a better world for everybody.”

Thomas: (That’s exactly what Nanami said to me…)

Okay on the one hand I want to say: way to lose the subtlety by having Thomas point this out. But on the other hand, that’s not exactly what Nanami said to him at all! She said she wanted to create “a new world”, which is not at all something that’s necessarily “better for everybody”. Kurata’s proposal, worded like it is here, actually sounds like a good thing, not like something only a megalomaniacal genius with a god complex would say!

Kurata: “Well, then? Will you help me forge this new world?”

Okay, now he’s saying the same thing Nanami did, but only after Thomas had already internally commented on it.

Relena: “Brother, have you finished talking yet?”

~~~~~

Relena: “Tommy? Wanna play a game?”

In the original, Relena seemed like she was getting impatient and bored of waiting for Tohma to finish his grown-up conversations, hence butting in at this very bad time to see if he has finished yet. In the dub, she’s apparently decided that now’s a great time to play a game with him, despite the fact that she should know full well he might not have finished talking with her father and Kurata. It doesn’t make as much sense as a thing she’d do in this situation.

Tohma: “What I wish for… is a peaceful world. That must be made into reality as quickly as possible.”

~~~~~

Thomas: “All I’ve ever wanted… is a peaceful world… where my sister can be happy… and healthy.”

This is all still not actually a lie. But the fact that he makes a point of his sister being healthy where he didn’t in the original makes it read, again, more like he is genuinely being swayed by this because of the offer to cure his sister.

What Tohma’s actually planning to do is double-cross Kurata before his sister can be cured. So really, Kurata’s offer of curing her is completely irrelevant to why he agrees to this and is therefore less likely to be something he’d think to mention.

I suppose you could put this down as part of his act, trying to make it sound like he was swayed by Kurata’s offer to cure his sister, fair enough. But even then, it hinders Thomas’s goal to act like he’s only doing this for his sister and wouldn’t want to otherwise. In order to get Kurata to trust him, he needs Kurata to believe that he wants to do this anyway, regardless of anything to do with Relena.

So, bottom line of these changes where Thomas talks about curing Relena: I’m not a hundred percent sure they’ve watched ahead to know what Tohma is really up to here. I think they may be scrambling to try and better justify Thomas genuinely joining Kurata and don’t realise that his sister’s being threatened, nor that he’s only faking it.

Kurata: “Now then. There’s a little favour that I need to ask of you, partner.”

AGH. That “partner” is new to the dub, and it gave me a visceral reaction. Aaaghrgh no no no they are not partners. Very good, I approve.

Agumon: “And the Digivice Burst has already given us an awesome new weapon!”

[…]

BanchoLeomon: “It’s about your Digivice. The new ones are called the Digivice Burst, and…”

Yes, BanchoLeomon, they already know what it’s called, you literally told them that yourself in episode 29, and they clearly haven’t forgotten because Agumon said the name like half a minute ago.

They’re still pronouncing it like “Geo GreySword”, by the way. I guess that’s just its name in the dub? …Or not; Marcus and ShineGreymon have called it that, but BanchoLeomon pronounces it as “GeoGrey Sword”. So who knows. Consistency? What’s that?

Marcus: “What does the Burst Mode do?”

Agumon: “…Besides burst.”

Thanks, Agumon, that’s helpful. Amusing little dub-style silliness that I do enjoy.

BanchouLeomon: “If you make a mistake in using it, you will be swallowed up by its dreadful energy and destroyed.”

~~~~~

BanchouLeomon: “Make one mistake… and the Burst Mode will destroy you along with your enemy.”

I do kind of appreciate the added mention that it will also destroy their enemy even as it destroys them. Because yeah, that’s pretty accurate to what actually ends up happening.

Marcus: “Destroy…”

Since this is the dub, I can’t help but think that this is Marcus wondering, “so does he mean death this time, or is this one just actual regular destruction?”

BanchouLeomon: “Listen. You must never use the power of the Burst Mode. For your own sakes.”

~~~~~

BanchoLeomon: “I don’t want you stumbling into this power, that’s why I’m telling you now. But you must never use the Burst Mode… for your own safety.”

You know, BanchoLeomon, if you’re actually aware of the possibility of them accidentally stumbling into the Burst Mode without meaning to use it, then you ought to know that simply telling them not to use it is not going to help; you need to teach them how to actively avoid stumbling into it. …Yeah, granted, this issue of him not teaching them that was there in the original, of course, but the dub’s line highlights the problem even more by having him be perfectly aware it might end up being an accident.

Masaru: “Now they’ve done it!”

~~~~~

Marcus: “How cold-hearted!”

It feels weird and not quite in character for Marcus to comment on the cold-heartedness (of a Gizumon killing the Pixiemon they were trying to save). That’s more the sort of line I can see Yoshi having, but not him. Masaru meanwhile was suppressing how he felt about this and simply letting it provoke him into fighting back, which seems more right.

You know, you’ve got to feel bad for the fact that the dub editors need to cut out the boobs and butt every time Rosemon—

…oh god, Falcomon’s voice just from his evolution call reminded me how terrible it is. He otherwise has no lines in this episode, but that still hit me, geez.

—ahem, I was trying to write this while the evolutions were happening to save time and then Falcomon’s voice blindsided me. Anyway, about Rosemon, I was saying that editing the fanservice out every time she evolves means they also must need to find something extra to edit in somewhere to fill in those lost few seconds for every single episode with Rosemon evolving in it. That must be a huge pain.

Masaru: “Tohma! You’re late, jerk! What were you doing?”

~~~~~

Marcus: “Thomas… Well, it’s about time; where have you been?! We were worried *sick* about you!”

Marcus’s voice as he first sees Thomas again sounds a lot more bitter and angry, almost as if he actually does feel there might be something sinister about this. I really liked how in the original, that was absolutely not the case and Masaru had not the slightest inkling of the direction this was about to head in.

No, dub. As much as I love the Full Charge – Ultimate, whatever – evolution theme, now of all times, as Thomas evolves Gaomon to attack Marcus, is the absolute last situation in which you should be using something that gives a positive and triumphant vibe. This is the exact opposite of that vibe! Geez, the issues with them feeling contractually obligated to use that theme for an evolution no matter the situation.

ShineGreymon: “MirageGaogamon!”

~~~~~

ShineGreymon: “Good to see you again, MirageGaogamon!”

I suppose this is the dub going for creating a sense that ShineGreymon considers MirageGaogamon a good friend – which is neat, Digimon paying more heed to the other Digimon and all – but the phrasing of it is weirdly stilted and cheery, especially for ShineGreymon and at a time like this when they’ve got a fight to win.

MirageGaogamon: “I am not playing around.”

~~~~~

MirageGaogamon: “I’m not playing around!”

In the original, MirageGaogamon’s wording and delivery here sounds deadly serious, but also sort of measured and distant, like he’s trying to detach himself somewhat from the fact that he has no choice but to fight his friend for his master’s sake. In the dub, his tone is fiercer and more trash-talk-y, like his heart really is in this fight and he actually wants to beat the crap out of ShineGreymon.

Tohma: “I… will defeat you.”

Masaru: “What?!”

~~~~~

Thomas: “Marcus… You have to go.”

Marcus: “I what?!”

Yeah, Marcus should be surprised, because it basically sounds like Thomas is simply asking him to leave, and not that he’s determined to defeat Marcus himself. This isn’t even a reference to death or anything, so I see no reason why the dub felt the need to change it and have Thomas be really weirdly vague and indirect about his intentions here.

Yoshino: “Tohma!”

Ikuto: “Stop!”

~~~~~

Yoshi: “Thomas!”

Keenan: “He’s back!”

In the original, it seemed like the two of them – or at least Ikuto – had already picked up on Masaru and Tohma being about to fight (hard to miss when MirageGaogamon has started attacking ShineGreymon, surely). In the dub, it doesn’t seem like either of them are reacting to that, because Keenan only sounds happy that Thomas came back. (Even though he and Yoshi should have been standing close by enough to have seen when he reappeared a minute or two ago.)

Masaru: “Just when I’d thought you’d finally come back… What do you mean, Tohma?!”

~~~~~

Marcus: “How could you blame me for all of this, Thomas? I’m on your side! Now, what’s gotten into you? Answer me!”

Marcus makes a fair point, questioning why Thomas is blaming him for the war. But I do like how Masaru’s reaction to all this was a lot more straightforwardly Masaru. He was too busy being bewildered and going “????? This makes no sense; everything was supposed to make more sense when he came back, not less!” to even bother to question the specific illogical point Tohma was making about him.

[Tohma doesn’t answer]

Masaru: “Quit fooling around!”

~~~~~

[Thomas doesn’t answer]

Marcus: “Hngh! Then it’s fightin’ time!”

With Masaru’s words here in the original, there’s a sense that he throws a punch at Tohma to get him to stop fooling around, aka, start talking sense. With Marcus, it’s instead “you won’t answer? Then I don’t care about getting an answer any more and am just going to fight you.” As expected from the dub, which has consistently removed all hints of this from Marcus’s character, there’s no sense that he’s trying to punch Thomas in an attempt to communicate with him.

I’m usually pretty chill with Marcus’s “It’s fightin’ time!” catchphrase – it’s been happening nearly every episode and I’ve rarely pointed it out because it feels right and doesn’t bother me at all – but now is not the time for it. Masaru does not give up on getting through to Tohma and switch mindsets to just fighting him until considerably later on in the confrontation.

Also, regardless of the timing here, “fightin’ time” is meant to be when Marcus is getting into a fight that he’s going to enjoy, in that fun competitive way he has. Beating up an ex-friend for apparently betraying him is not that at all and should not constitute “fightin’”.

Tohma: “I… will make a peaceful world together with Professor Kurata!”

~~~~~

Thomas: “Just listen. With Kurata’s help, I’ll finally be able to create a peaceful world!”

This is basically the same, but there is a weird sense in the dub’s wording that the “with Kurata” part is almost an afterthought. It sounds more like he’s focused on creating a peaceful world, something he’s apparently wanted for a while based on the “finally”, and just, oh, incidentally he’s getting Kurata’s help with it. Makes it a bit less impactful, since the working with Kurata part is supposed to be the big bombshell.

Masaru: “With… Kurata…?”

~~~~~

Marcus: “What…? Kurata…? No…!”

The “No…!” there in Marcus’s line, as well as the more quiet, disbelieving whispered tone, makes it sound more like he doesn’t want to believe it, like he’s trying to deny it and find some other explanation. Which, like, yeah, that’d be the reaction you’d expect the average person to have – but it’s a very important point here that Masaru is not the average person and is so straightforward that he takes what Tohma’s telling him at face value and buys it completely without question, despite how much he hates it.

Masaru: “Have you gone insane, Tohma?!”

~~~~~

Marcus: “No way! You can’t!”

And here! Marcus is still trying to deny it, whereas Masaru has already accepted that he said it. The only possible remaining explanation Masaru can even think of is that Tohma must have gone insane to have said it. And then once that option gets ruled out, Masaru believes it completely.

Tohma: “I’m always perfectly level-headed… Daimon Masaru!”

~~~~~

Thomas: “It’s the only logical choice, Marcus. I have to do this!”

I guess Thomas’s line here is the same kind of still-technically-true. In the situation he’s trapped in, pretending to betray Marcus to earn Kurata’s trust is the most logical course of action to get out with his sister alive and without actually doing a genocide. But it doesn’t work quite as well as part of Thomas’s surface argument of “defeating you to stop the war is the only logical thing”. Meanwhile, Tohma can be doing this in a level-headed way whether or not it’s actually logical.

It also just comes a bit more out of nowhere for Thomas to say this in the dub, since Marcus wasn’t accusing him of being insane, so it’s less of a direct response to Marcus’s words.

They flash-cut the entire shot of Tohma decking Masaru across the face. Even though the fact that these two characters are fighting is extremely dramatically important. Sigh. Remember the Biyomon fight where none of the dramatically-important brutal punches were cut? I long for those days.

ShineGreymon: “Are you okay with that?!”

~~~~~

ShineGreymon: “How could you do this, MirageGaogamon?!”

In the original, there was a sense of, okay, so this is what your human partner wants (somehow), but are you, the Digimon, really okay with going along with that? It’s like he was trying to spur MirageGaogamon to think for himself (and it was MirageGaogamon’s apparent refusal to do so that goes on to make ShineGreymon lose respect for him). ShineGreymon’s line in the dub is more generic and doesn’t quite get that idea across.

MirageGaogamon: “I simply obey my master!”

~~~~~

MirageGaogamon: “I’m simply following orders!”

MirageGaogamon’s wording and tone make it sound like he’s using this as an excuse. Like it’s not even really about Thomas, but just about the fact that, well, they’re his orders, so what he does while following them isn’t really his responsibility and geez, ShineGreymon, get off his case.

In the original, there’s a kind of fierce determination to MirageGaogamon’s tone here. Knowing what’s up, you can imagine that he’s thinking, yes, he does obey his master, because he’s thought through the situation for himself and knows that he’d do anything to protect his master’s sister and get one over on Kurata, and he trusts Tohma to play this right. His line incidentally works to keep up the charade, but there’s so much more in it than that in the original that isn’t quite there in the dub version.

Tohma: “The way you only use brute strength and spirit for everything isn’t going to protect anybody, and it certainly won’t save them.”

~~~~~

Thomas: “We can’t rely on brute force. Conflict just leads to more conflict. It doesn’t protect or save anyone!”

Hmm. The energy in Thomas’s dub line, mostly thanks to the added “conflict leads to more conflict” part, seems to be more along the lines of “fighting bad, we should be pacifists, that’ll save more people than not”. Which, though I agree that pacifism is generally good, is not really the correct answer when the enemy has decided to do a genocide. All that’s doing is playing along with Kurata’s argument that “well, the Digimon are doomed anyway, so it’s less painful if you just lie down and accept it!” (even though that wasn’t quite the argument he made in that scene in the dub).

Which is, like, fine, I guess, because the whole point of this is Thomas convincing the watching Kurata that he’s fully on board. But that just makes this entirely about perpetuating the whole nonsense “this war is only happening because of Marcus” line. What this therefore isn’t is Thomas using this as an excuse to vent his genuine issues about Marcus’s brute force no-strategy approaches not being the best way to protect people (such as implicitly blaming the loss of the Sacred City entirely on him). And that’s a huge shame, because Tohma doing that was one of my favourite parts of this confrontation in the original.

(This is actually something the dub’s been somewhat consistent about dumbing down, because they also removed most of that exploration of how Tohma feels about Masaru’s approaches from the Nanami stuff in episode 31. Gragh. Why; this is good stuff.)

Tohma: “Listen to me very carefully. You can’t do anything. Anything at all!”

~~~~~

Thomas: “Listen! Don’t you get it?! There’s nothing else to be done! Nothing at all! Nothing!”

This also completely loses any chance to be about Thomas’s issues. “There’s nothing else to be done” is simply Thomas saying “yeah, I’m going to fight you and there’s nothing you can do to change my mind”. Which is nothing at all like Tohma trying to tell Masaru that he’s powerless (in a way that totally has nothing to do with how powerless and trapped Tohma feels). That was also a really delightful part of this confrontation in the original and I’m very sad to lose it.

Marcus getting punched in the stomach is completely flash-cut. Whyyyyy, this punching is importaaaaant.

Thomas: “That’s why I came here, Marcus. To prove that to you.”

To prove that… lying down and doing nothing is a good response to genocide actually, and that you’re not going to change your mind about that? Okay, sure, really meaningful and interesting things for you to be determined to prove. This whole bit is just not coming out of his actual genuine issues at all, and bah.

Kurata: “What fun, seeing two people fight amongst ignorant adolescence. It’s truly magnificent!”

~~~~~

Kurata: “Oh, what fun this is, watching those two turn against each other! And it’s all thanks to *me*!”

Mmmmm, on the one hand, this is in-character gloating, but on the other hand, I don’t know if it works as well for Kurata to be putting it all down to himself that Thomas and Marcus are fighting. If he thinks that, then he’s bound to be feeling like he’s still manipulating and coercing Thomas into doing this, and not that Thomas is doing it of his own free will because he genuinely has this beef with Marcus. The latter is very much what Kurata needs to believe in order for Thomas’s plan to work.

Masaru: “Cut the crap… Enough of this bullshit! Then… What was it that we’ve been doing all this time?”

~~~~~

Marcus: “Alright… enough of this garbage… I’m sick of listening to your traitorous mouth… I don’t care what you say, we’ve done plenty of good! I mean, you… you seriously don’t believe what you’re saying, do you? Do you?!”

Marcus’s argument still seems to be on the topic of “what do you mean I’m solely responsible for the war, I’ve been doing a lot to help stop it, actually”, which is, again, fine I guess but not really meant to be the point when Thomas knows full well that argument is nonsense anyway.

In the original, when Masaru referred to “what we’ve been doing”, he was including Tohma in that. It was an appeal of, “you’ve been fighting to protect the Digimon all this time, too; how could you just turn your back on that?!” The dub version isn’t nearly so much about that, and it really should be – because regardless of how utterly little sense Thomas’s argument makes, the real sticking point here is how can you possibly be okay with killing the Digimon after everything you’ve done to protect them up until now. Everything else ceases to matter next to that. That’s the only point that Masaru really cares about in amongst all this, and it should be all Marcus cares about, too.

There’s also more of Marcus sounding like he’s trying to deny it, by asking if Thomas seriously believes what he’s saying. (And yet, at the same time, he also called Thomas “traitorous”, so… does he actually fully believe Thomas is a traitor here, or not?)

Thomas: “It doesn’t really matter, Marcus. I have nothing else to say. We’re done!”

This line’s basically the same, but in response to Marcus decidedly not having made it about are you okay with betraying the Digimon, it’s less fun that he chooses this moment to refuse to say any more. All he’s doing is refusing to elaborate on his argument about how Marcus is totally responsible for the war. Which, yeah, of course he doesn’t really believe that, but he’s been willing to spout nonsense about it this far at least. In the original, the topic of his betrayal of the Digimon was entirely new, and it was very telling and delightful that Tohma refused to comment on that at all.

The notion of this line was also already expressed in the dub’s earlier “there’s nothing else to be done”, so this is kind of just repeating the sentiment of “shut up, stop asking me things, I’m not going to change my mind”. Makes him clamming up and refusing to say any more here have less impact when he’d already tried to do that earlier.

The cross-counter is kept in (perhaps because it wasn’t very dynamically-animated anyway and so didn’t look that violent), but Marcus punching Thomas down once he snaps is cut, again, oh my god please save the poor important dramatic punches from these mean ruthless censors I beg you.

Marcus’s VA is doing some very good rage-filled growling, by the way, I enjoy. Followed by some heavy breathing after he punches Thomas to the ground that almost sounds like he’s on the verge of a breakdown, yes, good (he kind of is).

Masaru: “Unforgivable…”

~~~~~

Marcus: “You’ve gone too far…”

I kinda don’t like Marcus’s delivery here, though. He sounds dark and sinister, not just to the point of “oh no he’s lost it, this is Bad”, but as in he sounds like an entirely different and straight-up evil character. Like, as if he’s about to consciously and wilfully exact horrible revenge on Thomas and is going to enjoy it. That’s not it. Not quite.

Masaru: “Tohma… You are completely unforgivable!”

~~~~~

Marcus: “I’ve forgiven you before, but not *this* time!”

That’s really not the right way to word this? Comparing this to any of the times he’s “forgiven” Thomas in the past, which would have been for petty meaningless bickering that was all in good faith? (We literally haven’t seen any such things go so far as even needing forgiveness! I guess this is the dub trying to insist that Marcus and Thomas actually totally disliked and outright fought with each other way more than they ever did. Telling not showing, hooray!)

Absolutely none of their previous scuffles deserves to be put in even remotely the same category as betraying the entire species of Digimon and being complicit in genocide, oh my god. Why would he ever even think to say it this way at a time like this.

Marcus: “No… MOOOOOORRRE!”

I enjoy the delivery of this as Marcus flares up with a fountain of negative energy – this was just a wordless roar in the original – but I still don’t like the wording one bit. It’s presenting this whole thing as if Thomas has always been constantly getting on Marcus’s last nerve and being this close to making him snap and give up and switch to furiously hating him, and this is just the last straw in a long line of incidents. Which, no??? Absolutely not even slightly? It should be literally the opposite of this. A large part of why this makes Masaru so angry in the original is that he trusted and respected Tohma so much that this betrayal was completely unexpected, and therefore the sudden total turnaround of how he feels about his should-have-been-friend hits extra hard.

While I love I’M JUST FIGHTER, the BGM used for this sequence in the original, the dub’s BGM – which I often like a lot more than the original’s! – is just kinda nondescript here and doesn’t really do anything special.

Overall differences

Well, this episode isn’t actually that different in any big ways, but a lot of the nuance is changed or lost. And because I care a lot about the nuance in the original episode here (it’s all so good!), I’m disappointed by this.

Relena’s character comes across as noticeably more grown-up and capable of advocating for herself, which doesn’t fit as well with her role, as young and sheltered as she should be. Franz is also slightly more of a dick in a slightly less nuanced way, judging by what we’ve seen of him so far. There’ll be more on him later.

The Kurata and Thomas scene has some good and some bad. The dub’s Kurata game is still generally good and I enjoy how he’s being even more subtly threatening about Relena. I don’t like Thomas’s side of it as much, though, in that there’s more emphasis put on making him sound like he’s genuinely in this to cure Relena, which is not actually why he’s doing this and makes me worry that the dub didn’t watch ahead to know what’s really going on here.

Then there’s the fight between Marcus and Thomas. The entire thing is basically all about Thomas going “your fight-happy nature is the cause of this war, we should just stop fighting altogether (lol what genocide)” and Marcus engaging with that point to repeatedly go “hey, that’s not true, actually”. In the original, it had more variety and touched on lots of different points, and Masaru never even really bothered to engage with the obviously nonsense parts of the argument next to being bewildered at what Tohma is even doing. I especially miss the bit that was Tohma taking the excuse to vent his genuine issues about Masaru when he otherwise probably never would. Then there’s the part where Marcus is noticeably trying to deny that this is happening on some level, which should mean he shouldn’t buy it as completely and snap so hard in the end.

Like, the whole thing’s still fine, it works, it’s not at all ruined, but it is nowhere near as exquisitely excellent as it was in the original. And because I love this scene in the original so much, I’m rather sad about that.

Also in the fight, dub, please keep the punching in dramatically important fights I beg you, you did it for Biyomon, why not now, this fight is even more important.

And then I really don’t like how Marcus triggers the dark evolution with lines that sound like Thomas has always been getting on his last nerve and has been this close to pissing him off to such an overwhelming degree. What even, no he has not been doing that, this is the literal opposite of the point of why this made Masaru snap so hard – because he trusted Tohma completely and this is the worst kind of betrayal. Why, dub.

#digimon #digimon savers #digimon data squad

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