#Timandra

[kebriones]

Quick little Timandra design update.

headcanons:

-her hair is naturally completely straight, she curls those two strands. -comes from thrace -bi -3 years younger than Alcibiades -knows the entirety of homer by heart as well as a ton of other poetry and songs. -very experienced with herbal medicine -always up to tattoo anyone for free -tries very hard to keep her feelings for alcibiades within the professionally acceptable range.

[she-posts-nerdy-stuff]

*reads yet another Trojan war retelling from the perspective of Clytemnestra and/or her family members knowing full well I’m going to cry my eyes out*

[brotherconstant]

Foundation Isabel Adomakoh Young as Captain Timandra "She was terrifying in a really friendly way."

[jareckiworld]

Alkis Ghinis — Timandra's Visit to Dog's Kennel (oil on canvas, 1995)

[deathlessathanasia]

Helen’s Other Sisters – SENTENTIAE ANTIQUAE

[ifelten]

Gul Syremåler (Timandra comae)

Blood-vein (Timandra comae)

[shakespeare-polls]

Preliminary Round, Match 7

In another Goddess vs. Courtesan from Timon of Athens battle, The Tempest's Juno, the Queen of the Gods and symbol of marriage and family life in Roman mythology who blesses the marriage of Ferdinand and Miranda alongside Ceres and Iris, polls against Timon of Athens' Timandra, courtesan to Alcibiades alongside her partner Phrynia, who notably converses with fellow courtesans and prostitutes about their profession and customers.

[moths-daily]

Moth Of The Day #213

Blood-vein

Timandra comae

From the geometridae family. They have a wingspan of 30-46 mm. They inhabit hedgerows, ditches, wet meadows, gardens and woodland rides. They can be found throughout western and central Europe.

Image sources: [1] [2]

[littlesparklight]

What is your opinion on Hermione and Helen relationship?

Complicated? lol

No, but... ok, it's like this for me;

Many of the (often early) sources that say anything about the moment Helen leaves Sparta generally cast it as, well, leaving/abandoning, and Hermione is always mentioned, whether first among the little list of what Helen is leaving behind. Helen herself in the Iliad says "I left/abandoned", and in, for example, Sappho 16, the case gets doubly stated with an additional "with no thought for her parents and child" (paraphrasing lightly); the Bibliotheke again goes with pointing out that she (helped to) packed the ship and left her daughter.

Now, obviously it's not strange that this should be something emphasized in the source texts; a (married) woman's greatest function and task were her children. A (married) woman (apparently or explicitly) willingly abandoning her child/ren in any way would be among the worst things she could do (aside from/alongside, well. sleeping with someone not her husband).

With that in mind, that's how I like to engage with Helen and her relationship with both the idea of children/her daughter, and Hermione as a real, living person who Helen has a relationship with.

The contrast and conflict inherent in Helen willing to abandon her two figurative and literal "most important" elements to her position as a married woman; her children and her husband.

So, it's more interesting to me to have a Helen who maybe isn't all that happy or excited about pregnancy, who doesn't like being pregnant. Who was maybe happy it took time for her to even become pregnant. (Since, for example, the Catalogue of Women casts Hermione as an unexpected child.)

A Helen who hopes the birth of the actual child will be a revelation... and then it isn't.

Does she love her daughter? Of course. But perhaps more as an idea than what the reality of an infant is. So it takes time for her to bond with her, and maybe it just never becomes easy, which would be difficult when you're then failing in something that is supposed to be your "ultimate purpose and function".

For my own ficverse, I ignored the majority version of Hermione being nine when Helen leaves Sparta, so my version of Helen there is still hoping a more grown up Hermione than her toddler-age self would let her bond more with her daughter. A Hermione that's nine poses a slightly different situation.

And then, of course, there's the whole question of Helen's return; she's been away from her daughter for 18-28 years at that point. 18 if we axe Helen's words in the Iliad and the timeline the Bibliotheke paints up, 28 if we don't. Whether Hermione was a toddler or nine when Helen left, Helen has, either way, missed her daughter's whole childhood.

Can they rebuild/remake something out of this, especially when Hermione leaves for Phthia two-three years after Helen and Menelaos comes home to Sparta? Do they want to? Do just one of them want to? Is it Hermione, is it Helen, who has been regretting and missing Hermione, yet struggled to bond with her before she left and now has to face the possibility they never might have any real relationship, as they "should", being mother and daughter?

... I guess my opinion is you can do a lot with their relationship, but to me it's more interesting if it's allowed to be complicated via Helen having Complicated Feelings about Being a Mother.

[keebydeeby]

pixel moths for my website ! (these are just a few recent + color-coordinated examples, there are many more on the site =] )

Clockwise from top left: Dryocampa rubicunda, Naganoella timandra, Psectrotarsia suavis; Deroca inconclusa, Altha subnotata, Berta chrysolineata.

[likethexan]

ok but lets add the sisterhood too…

thinking about brotherhood in greek mythology……

[kebriones]

I had a strange dream last night, Timandra. You were holding my head in your lap, and you were painting my face like a woman's.

[daily-dose-of-lepidoptera]

Daily Dose Of Lepidoptera

[Day 49]

-Cabbage Tree Emperor Moth-

Bunaea alcinoe

-Blood-vein Moth-

Timandra comae

-Racotis boarmiaria-

[cescalovestowrite]

Penelope's Childhood Headcanons

(some of these are a bit dark, but they are my personal ideas, no need to agree with them)

If we put all the sources together we see that Penelope has seven brothers and one sister. We know for sure that her father is Icarius, but not all authors agree on who her mother is.

I imagine that Icarius had a first wife, the naiad Periboea (from whom were born Penelope, Perileus, Thoas, Damasippus, Imeusmius and Aletes), but that then she left the palace to return to her river and that Icarius remarried, this time with Polycaste (mother of Iftime, Aliseus and Leucadius).

But how did Icarius and Periboea meet? Icarius is wounded during a hunting trip, and runs to the river to drink. There he sees some naiads and begs them to help him, because naiads are famous for healing wounds. Periboea comes forward: she has enormous eyes, diaphanous skin and does not speak the human language. She touches Icarius' wound and he heals. Icarius falls in love with her and decides to take her with him to the palace of Sparta: he has decided that she will be the mother of his children.

But nymphs cannot stay away from their element, their source of life, for long. Periboea is stunned by dry land, walking is not natural for her, dressing is not natural, all those smells and noises are not natural. Over time she becomes more and more restless and subject to violent fits of anger. She gives birth to one child after another but when she takes them in her hands she smells only the human odor and does not understand what to do with them. Her skin begins to gray, to dry out.

One night, when Penelope is about eight years old, she is awakened by the sounds of a commotion and terrible hissing. That night Periboea runs away. The next morning Icarius seems tired, but also partly relieved. The naiad was becoming more and more difficult to handle and he was afraid that she might even hurt their children. An excuse is invented on why their mother will have to stay away for a while and the children do not ask questions. Penelope knows that she will never see her again.

She didn't have a real relationship with her mother, but she still struggles to get used to her stepmother's presence. Where Periboea was cold and silent, Policasta is sunny and talkative. She hopes she can learn to love her.

At her first menstrual cycle, Icarius decides to send her to live with his brother Tindareus. Tindareus has many daughters of her age (Timandra, Filonoe, Phoebe, Helen and Clytemnestra) and two sons (Castor and Pollux), and Penelope will be able to learn a lot from them. However, the two families had already seen each other assiduously and the cousins ​​had always been very close. The girls go swimming together, learn the tasks of princesses and above all tell each other many secrets. Little by little they wait for the day when they will be ready for marriage.

P.S. For me they get married around 17/18 years old. I know that at the time women got married at 14, but shush😁

[dootznbootz]

Me: Almost done listening to the Iliad on audiobook, and planning to listen to the Odyssey next

Me: Goes on youtube to find a quick summary to listen to before hand

Me: Clicks on a promising video

Video, in the first 30 seconds: Haha he cheats on his wife!

Me, in a bad mood now, even though I should have seen that coming: Never-fucking-mind, then

Yep. ;~;

Quick tip for ya: Honestly don't trust really ANY "Youtube" summary of it. Especially the ones where they are mostly trying to be "entertaining" and/or "funny" instead of educational. Also they mostly likely won't be "respectful".

I'm not saying this as a "don't trust any academic source! Historians are evil!!!" I'm saying this as a "there are very biased and very opinionated folks out there and I recommend going over multiple sources just for you to get your own opinion formed on it as well!".

I mean...Madeline Miller?

And you know what? I'll vent about how much I hate Robert Graves' takes on Greek Myth. >:(

I once got an old used book about mythology by Robert Graves and I was excited to read it! But it was genuinely just...so fucking MEAN. Insulting to stories, calling them stupid, flip-flopping on "Goodhearted" to "malicious". It seems like he was a bit more of a critic and/or thought his "headcanons" as "fact". (I say this as someone who has many headcanons and gets real silly with it. At a certain point though, YOU GOTTA STATE THE FACTSSS)

An example from it: (talking about Menelaus and Helen's marriage) "Yet their marriage was doomed to failure: years before, while sacrificing to the gods, Tyndareus had stupidly overlooked Aphrodite, who took her revenge by swearing to make all three of his daughters--Clytemnestra, Timandra, and Helen--notorious for their adultries"

Very much dislikes Odysseus, (like holy crap, even his good deeds are said mockingly) while he seems to "like" Menelaus, still calls him stupid. Seems to really like Paris?? like "Oh yeah, he needed Aphrodite to help him steal a woman who didn't love him but he's just a guyyy~"

"Athen now inspired Prylis, son of Hermes, to suggest that entry should be gained into Troy by means of a wooden horse; Epeius, son of Panopeus, a Phocian from Parnassus, volunteered to build one under Athene's supervision. Afterwards, of course, Odysseus claimed all the credit for the Stratagem"

He implies Helen and Odysseus possibly having romantics when he sneaks into Troy to steal the Palladium. Implies Odysseus made up Cassandra's rape by Lesser Ajax, as "Cassandra did not support the charge".

"Little Ajax's alleged violation of Cassandra was dismissed by reputable mythographers as an Odyssean lie"

Implies that Odysseus was only angry about Pallamedes embarrassing him, NOT BECAUSE HE NEARLY KILLED HIS BABY AND MADE HIM GO TO WAR. He implies "Icarius' daughter (Penelope)" to be another "victim" (???) of Odysseus? He also kissed poor Calypso goodbye and seems determined to never talk about how much Odysseus cares about his family. only that he wants to go home, Penelope being an afterthought.

This is a "Greek Mythology book"...and yet it's biased as fuck. :/

And ofc, people deny Odysseus being a victim.. Obviously there is sexism at play here, with the "Oh Odysseus loved it! He was getting laid!" despite being held at PigPoint and literally getting fucking raped and crying everyday. ;~; it's very disheartening and honestly disturbing.

Honestly I recommend reading/listening to at least 2 (or more) to try and get a "full picture" as just like Madeline Miller and Robert Graves, there are biases in each one. (Emily Wilson is very biased for example) Some of them while favorable toward Odysseus, also favor Circe and Calypso. Some mock Menelaus and Helen. It depends.

Like I've read 8 translations of the Odyssey (I like it :3 you don't have to be insane like me though. <3 ) and all basically say the same thing with the Goddesses as "It was not a good time. He adores Penelope."

Two or three is probably enough, and that's also if you just wanna know if there's any differences between events based on the translator. so sometimes if you wanna know the differences in wording (as some translations have very cute wording) you can just find that part in the Odyssey that you are curious to see if there are differences. :)

I hope you have fun!

[haematinon]

Inspired by a photo of @grimezszsz I created the character of Timandra for my upcoming illustrated book, Ergo Cosmos.

Yes, I am a fan :)