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elbiotipo · 8 months ago

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Worldbuilding: Galactic Empires

My only complaint about the Prequels is that they needed MORE politics

If you've watched Dune recently, you must have noticed the whole Emperor and space noble families thing. And yes, it's likely you heard that in WH40k too… and I HOPE you know that's where the God Emperor came from, since WH40k took "inspiration" from everywhere from Dune to Star Wars. Which also has a Galactic Empire. Like so many other science fiction franchises.

In fact, if you're a science fiction fan, it's very likely that you're familiar with space or galactic empires, they seem to be common as dragons in fantasy. Despite the fact that an empire doesn't sound very futuristic, does it?

Where did all these Galactic Empires come from? Are they just a narrative tool or are they an actual possibility? How would states and societies work in space? Let's find out, and maybe I can give you some ideas on how to write fun galactic "empires" from both a narrative and plausibility perspective.

This is going be a long post. Perhaps my longest yet. But I hope you have as much fun reading it as I did writing it. Click down to continue.

First of all, where did these space emperors come from? In another post, I've talked about the influence of the idea of the rise and fall of the Roman Empire in English-language fiction. However, in science fiction, I would say the influence is more direct. The Foundation trilogy of Isaac Asimov, one of the foundational (lol) works of science fiction, was intended by the author, very explicitly, as a retelling of The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire by Edward Gibbon in a science fiction setting. He probably wasn't the first to think about a space empire, I'm very sure the term is older, but he certainly popularized it as a staple of science fiction. Now, if your contact with science fiction comes from movies, when you hear Galactic Empire you're of course thinking about Star Wars. But yes, Star Wars is also the same retelling, because Lucas was inspired in both Asimov AND Gibbon, even though I think we should appreciate Lucas' ability to bring it to life in the screen. Certainly, Isaac Asimov wasn't the first or the last to take inspiration in history to tell stories about the future.

The most influential science fiction work of all time.

At this point you're probably telling me (or not, I don't know you) about all other sorts of science fiction works that DON'T have galactic empires, or better yet, those that don't just transpose historical societies into the far future and imagine something entirely new (my personal recommendations on this area are Banks and LeGuin). And you'd be right. But the concept of a space empire seems popular and long-lived, much like feudalism in the fantasy genre, everyone has a picture of a sorts when a videogame or a book talks about a "galactic empire" or "galactic republic" or a "federation", an "empire" much like a shorthand name for "a country In Space", regardless of the presence of an actual Emperor or not. And so, it's worth exploring how this trope could, or not, work, so we can see the possible alternatives or more fun ways to approach it.

Besides, that's the title of the post. Galactic Empires.

So, let's approach this from the perspectives of Space, Time (or to keep with the theme, Spacetime) and Technology, and lastly, the most fun part, we'll explore some fun variations on this idea of galactic empires and societies.

Space:

Space is big, and I won't quote the Hitchiker's Guide to the Galaxy here, it would be groanworthy at this point. Let's do a quick exercise instead. Let's image a "modest" space empire, not even galactic, 2000 light-years across. Sounds quite big, it encompasses most of the visible stars we can see from Earth… however, if you project it into a galactic map, it's actually a very small piece of sky, actually 2% of the entire galaxy which is about 100.000 ly across. Now, according to the Atlas of the Universe, there are 600 million stars in a 5000 ly radius from the Sun. Jesus Christ. This is actually hard to estimate accurately as the true number of red dwarfs and brown dwarfs, the dimmest stars, are hard to count, but we already know those have planetary systems as complex as our own Solar System, even planets that could bear life. Let's scale back to our 2000 ly across space empire, again, just a small cozy corner of the Milky Way Galaxy, something that would look like a small, even tiny, nation in any setting of a galactic scale. This gives us 240 million stars (from the estimated 200 billion stars of the galaxy) in this space, which is still completely insane but let's work with that.

From Atlas of the Universe, so you can compare and contrast, the stars 2000 ly from the sun (ONLY the brightest ones), and the entire Milky Way. Notice how small 2000 light years truly are at that scale.

Even if I just told you that all of those systems might be as complex and rich as the Solar System, let's rather arbitrarily say only 5% of those 240 million are worth of note. Not necessarily having life (no way I'm getting into that yet), just worth visiting or living in for the resources or the views or the cantinas… whatever. That's 12 million star systems. Okay, let's refine this further. Let's say of those 12 million, most of them are the equivalent of gas stations or farmsteads, a couple thousand people at most. The REAL places where the action happens are the systems or worlds where millions of people live, and those are few and far between (this makes both common and narrative sense, as people tend to cluster in population centers where trade, resources, etc. are). Let's say, and let's refine this further so I don't get outrageous numbers, the average population of those systems is 100 million (about the size of Mexico, Vietnam or Japan. Many sci-fi works throw worlds of billions like Earth like nothing). And those systems are… uh, like 2% of THOSE 5% 'systems of note' (a flimsly concept already but play along). That's 2% of 12 million. We got 240.000 systems or worlds the population size of entire countries, with all that implies (economy, culture, politics). Of course, 240.000 multiplied 100 million gives this speculative fictional empire a total population of… (Jesus Christ, not the scientific notations), 2.4e+13, or TWENTY FOUR TRILLION PEOPLE.

Let's wind back and remember I tried my best to make a "small" empire for a galactic-sized setting, 2000 light-years across, that's just from here to Orion's Nebula for Gagarin's sake! A trillion people is just outside the realm of my imagination, or pretty much anyone's. Can you imagine any kind of goverment system that would be enough to provide any kind of meaningful governance to 24 trillion people? In the case of a space empire, can you imagine a single space emperor, a single person, deciding over them? Keep in mind that emperors don't rule on their own (we'll talk about that), they need bureacrats to make their will done, and vassals to govern their territories in their stead. This would apply even in democratic systems, you need representatives and civil servants and more.

Let's scale back a bit before I go insane. Instead of assuming territory, let's go with population. Assume a spherical cow space empire of… 40 billion people, that's reasonable right? You can picture that in your head? Five times the population of current Earth, no biggie, we can work with that, it's all cool. Now, how big would a goverment for such a population would have to be? We actually have reasonable answers. China has about 10 million civil servants for a population of 1.4 billion people, but that's only the administrators, not including all the teachers, healthcare workers, security forces, laborers, etc. employed by the state. India has 6.4 million for about the same population. Okay, so easy math, let's say that this space empire has 6 million bureacrats for 1 billion people, for our empire of 40 billion people, that gives us a total of 240 million… just bureacrats, nothing else. Yes, you could reduce that with technology by say, half. It still means an entire Mexico-sized country of bureacrats. Imagine.

Entire worlds of this.

NOW I WILL STOP THROWING NUMBERS AT YOU, and let's just think about what this means. If we assume a space empire like the ones common in science fiction, or just any kind of… goverment at all, we're talking about, at the lowest estimates, entire countries worth of state employees, if not whole EARTHS of bureacrats. You can guess how things can get really weird fast. Current goverments as we know them just won't work at all it even if technology gets more powerful. Leaving aside, for now, things like god-like AI adminstration (yeah, have you seen what they are like now?)… to exhert ANY kind of control, FTL or not (more on that below) you would need a very, very autonomous empire, to the point it might as well not exist at all. Why take orders from A Guy who is not only far away but also has no hope at all of actually enforcing them in any meaningful sense? Why call yourself part of his "empire" that not only cannot enforce anything upon you, but also cannot benefit you in any way? Big question, of course, the benefit of a galactic or even smaller empire, but we'll discuss that later.

What could work, however, is that instead of a centralized state like we concieve it today, or even a loose confederation, even loose alliances, even pretty much anything… 'empires' (as in 'countries') In Space could be "united" by common ideas and culture instead of any institution. Perhaps not even a written delcration or constitution, but shared ideas: a culture, a religion, an ideology. Lots of different strong mini-states (that might mean billions of people…) that all claim to be part of the same "civilization", but share no goverment at all at all, just the same 'idea', in a looser way that even the most decentralized goverments you can think of. You can say "well all countries are made up" but these would barely qualify as even that. Not even the Holy Roman Empire was this fake.

Perhaps even a single person as a symbolic focus point of unity? Which would be actually a score for the proponents of galactic empires in the most literal sense. But at the same time, such an Emperor would be completely powerless to interact with the entire galaxy. His plans for, I don't fucking know, education reform or tax breaks, would have to be filtered by literal millions of bureaucrats and vassals that at that point might do whatever the hell on his name. Military-wise, his armies would count as nations of their own. However, the overall guidance of a single person (or constitution…) as a symbol might make otherwise disparate worlds to collaborate on the same causes, being part of the same greater whole no matter the distance. So maybe, instead of a Galactic Emperor, a Space Pope?

OH MY GOD-EMPEROR WAS THE IMPERIUM REALISTIC ALL ALONG? Probably not, but also yes, let's keep talking.

By the way, I'm sure you're tired of big numbers now, but I did one possible calculation for the whole galaxy, a true Galactic Empire. Asuming just 0.2% (400 million) of the 200 billion stars are populated, with an average population of one million, the size of the smallest countries that aren't micronations. The total galactic population would be 40 trillion, or 40,000,000,000,000. Five thousand Earth populations.

Time:

Or rather, space-time. We'll talk about both, because what concern us is the speed of information and trade, and that also limits the size of our empires.

I'm sure you know by now faster-than-light travel is impossible. Most of space based science fiction has it, of course, for narrative purposes. We don't want Our Heroes to spend two thousand years to get to the lair of the Evil Space Tyrant, I don't either, and I'll discuss FTL soon. But let's start with no-FTL here, just like in real life, and a smaller "empire", much, much smaller than my previous examples. A mere 250 light years across. Let's not even calculate population now.

This, quite logically, means that the fastest your communications would flow is at light speed. So if your emperor issues orders to a nearby world, say, 5 ly away, you will get an answer 5 years later. For a more reasonable distance of 60 ly, you would know the results 60 years from the descendants of those who recieved the order (now, assume however they keep in constant conversation, just with a 60 year delay), and by then, things there would have changed 60 years from the capital. You get the idea, Einstein sucks, don't need to elaborate more. At first glance, this might be another point for old-style feudal star empires, though. What better way to guarantee your empire is working well over centuries than by having an hereditary class of nobles loyal to you, no matter how much time passes (results may vary). Of course, how would you even enforce that? Rebels might overthrow them and you'll learn about it a century later, and you'll have to send ships to quash the rebellion… or would you?

Is there a point to send ships to conquer other worlds in such a situation? What kind of resources (ah, the lifeblood of empires) could you control with such an empire where transport takes decades and industry is so developed you could, theoretically, make manufactured goods yourself? I'm assuming you can, because you can build spaceships to get there in the first place (not unreasonable), but what would justify creating an interstellar goverment controlling people, trade, resources, over light-decades? Normally, it's at this point where sci-fi authors make up Something (what Atomic Rockets calls "McGuffinite") to justify interstellar trade. In Dune, for example, it's Spice, which is kind of like, to steal a joke, petroleum mixed with cocaine. But otherwise, in a no-FTL setting (so, real life as far as we know) there isn't really the incentive to conquer or even form a goverment of any but the looser kind with other worlds. Trade, maybe, but those are long-term investments, it's difficult to think what kind of good or service would be so in demand would justify it. Especially when you consider that light-speed is your upper limit, and ships might be actually way slower than that. And I'm not even gonna begin to touch relativistic effects.

I was going to make a joke about blowing a quarter of your GDP in Star Destroyers, but have you heard of the South American Dreadnought Race? One of our dumbest moments down here, surely.

Add FTL, and things change, of course. Even very slow ships, that would take months to transverse a dozen light years, would be able to justify trade in luxury goods and passengers, for instance. This is not too far from real-life either, after all, European colonial empires had travel times in the months, and they had to install local administrations such as viceroys because of this, yet rhose places they were considered part of the same empire (most European empires could be rather considered a collection of "countries" and colonies, look at all the divisions of the Spanish Empire for instance). Faster and cheaper ships would of course, mean even more trade (here, I'm using 'trade' as 'communication between worlds', not necessarily implying capitalism, it could be mercantilism or even a command economy) between worlds, even perhaps the classic trope of agrarian and mining worlds feeding the rich core worlds. The Open Veins of Latin America In Space. Fun.

The speed of your ships and communications not only determines trade, but the power projection of your state (we can discuss 'stateless' societies too, there's plenty of fun to be had). If, again, your Galactic Emperor makes a Galactic Proclamation from the Galactic Palace near the Galactic Core (let's roll with that) and he has no FTL communications of any kind, it means that his commanding voice would reach the outer edges of the galaxy 100.000 years after, that is, almost ten times the history of agriculture on Earth. If he, however, has access to ships that can cross the galaxy in say, months, yes, perhaps he can have a series of vassals all over the stars (perhaps, we'll see…), and the faster things are, the closer they resemble our current fast-paced society, but not quite, given the available resources and space in… SPACE and the possible population, as we discussed above. As you can see, the speed of your FTL or lack of it determines everything.

There is another, more *realistic* option. Instead of individual FTL ships, you could have wormhole portals connecting worlds. This is more realistic in the sense that it's theoretically possible (though we have no idea on how to make one), but it also has some interesting implications. First of all, there is an implication that such a wormhole network would be expensive to build and maintain, requiring highly complex technology, material (I'm not sure what the hell exotic matter really is) and production methods, well, more high than what you'd expect from the usual. Second, it would be something preferably fixed, with hubs, planned routes and regular transit (and for writers, it easily allows you to map your universe). Such networks would be vital pieces of infrastructure, built and maintained by central authorities, drawing routes and transport hubs in space. Yes, indeed, almost like… space railroads.

OH MY ASTRAL EXPRESS WAS HONKAI STAR RAIL REALISTIC ALL ALONG? (last joke I promise)

There is also a very strange effect about wormhole networks. Time is relative, as you know, and this is not a metaphor, it literally "flows" differently on how fast you're moving. The "universal" "speed" of "time" "seems" to be the speed at which matter moves in an expanding universe (red-shift and blue shift) as I understand it, but as you approach light-speed, time flows differently in your frame of reference. Wormholes are strange in the sense that they connect space AND time, the observable time in both sides of a wormhole would be the same, and as such, places connected by a wormhole network will "be" at the same "time". This has been talked about by some authors who have considered about wormholes in the context of space civilizations, and it's called (STOP!) Empire Time. So a space empire might not only imply a state ruling over a population and a territory, but also over a time. I have no idea how this works and it frankly makes my head hurt, but here is an analysis of transversable wormholes if you want to indulge or hit your head against a wall.

Technology:

As an extension from the previous section: Of course there is no working FTL method known in real life, as far as we know, light-speed is the upper limit for everything. Instead of constraining you as a writer, this can be one of your biggest assets.

Because if you're doing a space setting, the existence of faster-than-light travel and its speed is the most important decision you can take about it.

Got that? Did I emphasize that enough? You don't need to actually explain HOW your FTL system works, you can do some research and invent something, but you need to be clear, in your head, what it can DO: How far and how fast it can take you. A FTL system that takes months to go from star to star will be very different to one that takes hours to span the Galaxy like the hyperdrive of the Millenium Falcon. A FTL system that is cheap and can be installed in any tiny ship like in the Elite videogame would be different from the ones in Dune where interstellar travel requires enormous motherships and lots of drugs, or a wormhole network that needs massive infrastructure maintainment and probably a railway starway worker's union, or the case of no FTL at all. This is, again, the most important decision you could make for your setting, bar none. Got that? Let's continue.

FTL is perhaps the only place in science fiction where I don't care about how it works, only about how fast it goes

Now, technology. Space empires, are of course, not possible without space travel being cheap enough (not talking about FTL, just regular space travel): shipping stuff to space should be about the same as shipping stuff by airliner or, well, ships. This is not unreasonable. Efforts are being made right now to lower the cost to access space, and while space agencies like NASA might look expensive, they are not NEARLY as expensive as the money wasted in say, stealth jet fighters or fucking advertising (people who say 'why spend so much money in space when we could fix our problems on Earth' seem to forget about that all the time. But I digress.). A technologically advanced, wealthy (as in production, not literal dollars) society could easily afford as much space exploration as they wish with no real effect at all in their quality of life, indeed, it would improve it. Space isn't as expensive as it seems. At its very, very core, a spaceship is just steel and propellant.

And steel and propellant are very, very easy (once you got the technical research to do it) to get in space. Asteroids are MADE of iron and metals, a single asteroid is richer than all of Earth's mines combined. Hydrogen is literally the most abundant element in the universe, and water is on plentiful supply (no need to steal planets for water) on comets and icy asteroids and moons. Carbon is apparently widely available in carbonaceous asteroids, and in our own Solar System, Titan, the moon of Saturn, is basically covered in hydrocarbons (yes, OIL IN SPACE). All those resources could be very much in demand for manufacturing on a planet like for example, a future Earth that has taken its industry up to space. What's more, it's only bringing stuff up from Earth/an Earth-like or more massive planet (fun sci-fi term for you: "down the gravity well") that's really expensive. Once you get there, you can get anywhere with enough acceleration and propellant. Once there is space infrastructure and industry (and I get a feeling that it might get up fast, given that space technology would need to be very autonomous and reliable), it can sustain itself without a mother planet. In fact, if there's something I imagine would be considered a luxury in spacer life, it would be truly organic things; plants, wood, meat, wool, and so much more.

i am average astronaut man i work 15 hours in the asteroid mines to buy one burger

Which brings us to the big question; what kind of life would be out there? After all, I gave you numbers of millions and millions of worlds, it's hard to imagine at least a few of those don't have alien life. This is the biggest outstanding question in astrobiology currently and so I won't pretend to even try to answer it (my personal opinion, if you must, is that complex Earth life is extremely rare, but by sheer number of planets, it might exist by hundreds of thousands in our galaxy alone). Instead, let's try to see how science fiction looks at it.

Heinlein, another of the foundational writers of science fiction as a genre, saw alien worlds as just another frontier to be settled. Rich alien fruit, fertile arable lands, and huntable or tameable creatures just waiting to be exploited, and alien species to trade exotic goods with (or conquer). While Heinlein was not the only and probably not the first to write this subgenre, he certainly got it popular, and lots of works on his same vein follow this "frontier spirit" kind of writing, where space is seen as the last frontier to be tamed by hardy colonists in a very yeehaw cowboy western setting, and you can actually see this replicated in many modern science fiction like Firefly and the more cowboy-ish parts of Star Wars. And yes, this is balantly an expression of the 'manifest destiny' Usamerican imperialist worldview.

lots of Politics all over this Science Fiction Adventure

And yes, this idea of 'habitable' planets ready to be colonized like in a 4X videogame is also not very realistic either. We haven't found any alien ecosystems yet, but as a biologist I can tell you they would be very different from us in ways you probably won't expect. We can discuss how convergent evolution could be, a world with oceans would probably have equivalents of 'fish', 'algae' and 'worms' (I can GUARANTEE there will be A LOT of worms), we could even find very, very similar life to our own down to the body plan. However, we most probably could not eat them at all (which might sound silly at first glance but is needed to have you know. agriculture.), or perhaps even live in the same planet as them. We live in a society planet where most of the plants and animals which evolved with us can't be eaten, and many of them are toxic. It's possible, entirely likely, that the alien equivalents of carbohydrates (ever heard of L- and D-Glucose?), proteins and other substances would be indigestible to us, allergenics, or outright toxic, probably in ways we can't even think off. It's likely we won't catch alien diseases, but that's because our cells (if they even have cells) are completely incompatible with their diseases, just look at how different animal, plant and fungi cells are, now imagine whatever the fuck might evolve in a completely different biochemistry from us. There would be no farmsteads and cowboys like Heinlein wrote, living in Mars would probably be more pleasant that living in a world where everything might be toxic, not because life evolved to be toxic, just because it didn't evolve with you. If anything, these' habitable' worlds would be treated like giant nature preserves instead, you can look but don't touch.

(In one of my own settings, I sidestep this by proposing panspermia, that is, the idea that life spreads across the universe by means such as comets (or aliens) and thus shares similaritites and can eat the same stuff. A bit of a cop-out, but it does allow one to get with similar kinds of life.)

NOOO ANAKIN DON'T EAT THAT PEAR IT EVOLVED HIGHLY TOXIC ALKALOIDS IN A DIFFERENT EVOLUTIONARY CONTEXT NOOOO

But humans, if the biophilia hypothesis is right, will need nature in their lives. This is where orbital habitats come in. You know, like the ones in Gundam? Orbitals such as O'Neill Cylinders, Standford Torii (yeah, that's the plural for Torus) as well as bigger and more complex thingmajings I will write their own post about someday, have been proposed since the 1970s with technology available then, and there is no reason why a civilization with an advanced space infrastructure wouldn't try building them and even be better at it. What's very nifty about orbitals is that you can really make them your own personal custom miniworlds. Designs like the O'Neill cylinder are big, able to house hundreds of thousands, even millions of people if build to the top, but why do that? Mess with the lightining, the rotation, or the interior to make them a winter wonderland or a tropical paradise. I expect that they would be built to feed space communities at first with food that isn't imported from Earth or grown in hydroponics, and later as places to live and customize however you wish; perhaps a community would pool resources together and say, hey, we want to make an habitat that looks like a Colombian cloud forest, or the Okinawan Islands. Once they get cheap enough, and given how abundant resources are in space they might be not even as expensive as most engineering projects here on Earth, I expect actually many, many people would want to live in them, and it could be probably be very affordable, and just natural for the people who are born and raised and live and die in them. Another thing about habitats is that they are mobile. Like I said, as long as you got enough propellant and propulsion, you can move anything anywhere in space. Even whole habitats could move and cluster together depending on the local politics. Perhaps, much like city-states were the basic building block for countries in antiquity, in the future, the basic organization bloc would be the Orbital. You could have alliances of orbitals forming complex political intrigue inside a single solar system (yes, like in Gundam).

OH MY PLASTIC MODELS WAS GUNDAM REALISTIC ALL ALONG? (I lied)

This all might make space empires pretty much an unnecessary anachronism. Habitats can grow their own food and resources are plentiful once you have the right technology. They can also be mobile, so they could act like migrating cities at will, choosing to stay with like-minded "constellations" or strike out on their own without the dictates of a central state. It almost looks like an ideal anarchist society.

Or does it?

There is something very important to keep in mind about life in space. The technology, that is, habitats needed for life in space will require lots of maintainance and resource management, which implies there must be strong coordinating bodies with very, very strict rules so that shit doesn't blow up and you lose all your air into space, or the resources of an habitat are mismanaged and you end up with a food or water or even oxygen crisis. There is a reason why space exploration is done by state agencies or corporations with huge state backing. Another of Heinleins's favorite tropes, Libertarians in Space, would be impossible in such a situation. Actually, in ANY space situation, and this is why this section is in technology. Living in space requires you to be able to maintain complex technology and manage resources. None of this can be done ad-hoc or be left to individualism, you have to have Rules and follow them to the letter. And also, the effect of living in your 'own little world' would probably mean people have a strong indentity sense towards their home habitat. This will mean a more communitarian attitude. But before you think I'm waxing poetic about utopian habitat cultures, keep in mind that this also can mean an authoritarian mindset. After all, cults and authoritarian regimes do have "strong communities" too. An habitat could be everything from a well-managed place with responsible citizens who look for the welfare of all, to a closed society where everybody does as they're told as long as the tech works. On the other hand, I doubt habitats in a single star system would stay isolated. They'll probably trade and communicate with other habitats, forming constellations and power groups, that would prevent this 'closed system'. However, I doubt they would be too amenable to interstellar authority. Who the hell do those people from another freaking star think they are to tell us what to do in our habitat?

To be serious for a moment, habitats can be really cool places in science fiction. Especially if you imagine they could host all sorts of enviroments, from the tropical to the polar.

As an addenum… what if you really want to live in a planet? In places such as Mars or the Moon, things would be… pretty similar to orbitals actually. Habitats separated by vast expanses of barren nothingness, only now a planet instead of space (better for maps, at least). But that isn't what you're thinking, right? What if you wanted to feel the open wind and sky instead of a canned world? Well, this is where terraforming comes in. Transforming whole planets is something theoretically possible, but that would require massive investments of resources, more massive than anything we can imagine, and time, centuries at the very, very least. So stupid ideas like "terraform Mars to escape Earth", which as far as I know is only held by dumbasses like Musk, just don't make sense. It doesn't mean that terraforming itself is a worthless idea, it is a very appealing one. No matter how cool you can make your habitat, it won't ever be Earth. It won't ever be a self-sustaining biosphere with its own ecosystem that could last millions of years. For that reason, terraforming is attractive, it's something way more than an artificial "can" orbital, it's a new living world. There is a certain mystique into bringing lifeless worlds to life, but I expect that instead of the dumb Musk "ESCAPE EARTH" idea, the motivation for terraforming would be to recreate Earth, perhaps for conservation reasons (you could have whole planets as natural reserves), perhaps for tourist reasons, perhaps for spiritual reasons or even artistic reasons. On the other hand, the methods you can use to terraform a lifeless planet can also be used to 'terraform' living planets, as we've long seen in our own world… this could be done with hostile purposes. I would expect us to be better than that, but we simply don't know.

To close this section and give this post an conclusion, I think that, since there are no real borders in space, then empires, countries, polities, whatever you wish to call them, will be formed by stacking building blocs in loose alliances or confederations. The most basic would be habitats, then constellations of habitats, then inhabited planets (though I doubt any but the most populated ones would qualify), and then star systems, but little above that, and I expect up to a certain, difficult to calculate limit of population and area (though way, way below even a fraction of a speculated galaxy), things would be just impossible to manage. The effort in bureacracy, infrastructure and state control needed to project power out of a star system and the sheer scale of space probably won't ever justify empires, much less galactic empires, but you could have very interesting variations on the theme.

Fun Stuff!

So, let's play a little with what I've told you. I'm going to write a few short scenarios that might be fun takes on the "Galactic Empire" or "Space Empires" you might be familiar with already:

The Poleis Model

When the Greeks established their colonies around the Mediterranean, they didn't do it with the expectation they would be part of the same state or empire. They founded new poleis, new city-states, based on the constitution of the mother city (hence metropolis) but fully independent. The Phoenicians were much the same, with some of the daughter cities (Carthage means literally "new city") eventually becoming new cultures far from their home cities. Similarily, why should interstellar exploration mean the spread of a united state with a capital and all? Imagine that when interstellar ships depart, they do with the idea that they are going to create a completely new home, a new poleis, not an extension of the nations or organizations that sponsored them but rather more of a 'child' culture light years away from their motherland. As they develop in mostly isolation from each other, they will become new cultures on their own, while retaining ties to the ones most similar to them. This is, in my opinion, the most realistic scenario without FTL. With FTL, however, things get more interesting, as of course, Greek and Phoenician and other poleis didn't remain isolated light-years from each other, they had permanent contact. With FTL they could organize in leagues, perhaps even alliances for the ocassional military campaigns, trade and exchange of ideas, tourism and industry, and of course the Olympics.

The Wormholes Always Run In Time Model

As I've said, wormholes are pretty much like space railroads. Railroads, like other big infrastructure projects, need a centralized authority to be built and maintained. And once you are the central authority that does so, you're already in charge of the biggest arteries of trade and communication. Which makes you basically an empire, officially or not. In fact, this is the closest I imagine a space society would resemble the states we're familiar with here on Earth. If you have control over transport and the hubs of trade and politics, and that transport and communication network allows you to implent your policies, your rule might go very far indeed, and indeed, your main hub might be a great capital, the main station of known space. Now, perhaps you might be imagining a literal space empire with nobles and all that. Why not instead something else? The Socialist Interstellar, connecting the many worlds of the galaxy through a five hundred year plan of railroad wormhole construction in the path to communism... However, this would mean that people outside of the wormhole network might develop in different ways, perhaps the equivalent of nomads to the great settled empires of antiquity. And given what I've briefly touched on Empire Time (*breakdances*), the expression "the portals always run in time" might imply even more than just an aphorism.

The Civilization Cluster Model

I'll admit this is taken from Poul Anderson, as quoted in Atomic Rockets, to which I owe an inmense debt for this post and so much more. The idea is this; space is big, as is well established. Even with FTL to shorten the distances, even if you could cross the galaxy in a few weeks, the sheer number of stars is still insanely massive. Why should any civilization 'colonize' those stars dot by dot, what value is there in invading or colonizing planets with incompatible biochemistries? And how could even begin to think how to administer a thousand different worlds, each one as complex as Earth itself, let alone an entire galaxy? In this case, civilizations, instead of spreading across the galaxy, would mostly remain in their own 'civilization clusters'; even with FTL, there are so many issues closer to home that the idea of projecting power outside is ridiculous. There would be trade, exchange of ideas, and so much more between these clusters, but never constant enough and never with the authority necessary to create a "Galactic Empire"… the worlds are too many, too diverse, too populated and too far away for that. An interstellar traveller could roam the Galaxy for years exploring these clusters spread away from each other, with their own unique idiosyncracies and civilizations inside, and then a vast expanse of mostly nothing outside them. Basically, space is too big. I like to see them as constellations among the dark sky, hence the artwork.

The No Man's Sky Model

To live in space, you need complex technology, but also resilient and durable technology ready for any kind of situation, easy to repair and replace. So eventually, I believe designs would be standarized so much that every astronaut will carry or own a collection of standarized tools (somehow this reminds me of prehistoric tool cultures). Now, even with FTL, there's perhaps little material incentive for people to leave their comfortable homeworld or habitat to live in cold space. But some will, perhaps because of the sheer thrill of it, perhaps very small bands of families or friends. With a standarized tool kit for any ocassion, these small bands would spread across space, much like ancient humans spread across the world. But instead of creating space empires, without a fixed industrial base, they would be nomads. Which doesn't mean they would roam aimlessly, they would be seeking new biospheres, new resources and new cultures, and gathering in temporary or permanent market places, festivals and pilgrimages. Perhaps they could even be the majority of humans in space, while most others stay cozy on Earth.

...

This was a very long post and it took a lot work to make, so I hope you had as much fun reading it as it was for me to write it. If you did, and if you would like to see more, I would be very, very grateful if you donated to my Ko-Fi below. Anything helps a lot especially since my country is not doing great at this time governed by a libertarian idiot (not even the fun space kind), and even a little tip encourages me to post more, I'm always working on your suggestions! You can also contact me by DM or asks if you need any help with your worldbuilding or just want to rant with me a bit! See you next time, and thanks for reading.

#worldbuilding #science fiction #sci-fi #writing #writing advice #space #history #cosas mias

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amiti-art · 2 months ago

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HI! I’m here to ask honest opinion on….Lore Olympus. I’m sorry for putting my opinion here….but I hate it. I’m sorry, I try to see it in a good way….put it paints Apollo as a horrible person. And there are other things that I’d respectfully don’t like about it.However, I want to see your opinion. That is if you’re willing to share it. BTW, I fricking love your drawings., especially the ones about Apollo and his myths! Have a good day or night!

Hello!

I'm glad you like my art 🫶🏻

So, Lore Olympus.

This probably won't come as a surprise to most people, considering how much Apollo art I've made, but I hate Lore Olympus. And not only because of how poorly Apollo was portrayed there.

I'm going to be honest with you: I never read much of it. I read maybe a few chapters some years ago because it was advertised as Greek mythology retelling, but I didn't continue because it was boring to me.

Much later, I saw a lot of posts pointing out all the things wrong with Lore Olympus, and boy oh boy, it's bad.

From what I've seen, it’s hardly a retelling; if the names of the characters were changed, nobody would realize this is supposed to be myth-inspired.

And look, I'm not saying you can't change anything when making a Greek mythology retelling, because it's simply impossible to keep everything the same as in the myths—especially when you want to create a story that covers many myths. The math isn't mathing when it comes to Greek mythology, because the myths changed over time, and different city-states had their own versions of the stories, so it's pretty impossible to make a cohesive timeline without changing something.

But from what I've seen, there isn't much Greek influence in this Greek mythology retelling. From the way the characters dress and speak to the food they eat, there is nothing Greek about this comic, it’s completely Americanized.

And I hate Americanization so much. I remember watching Netflix's "The Witcher" and being so disappointed because there was nothing Slavic about it. They kept Jaskier's original name from the books and called it a day. They turned it into another generic fantasy show.

I know that many Greek people feel the same way about Lore Olympus and other American adaptations of their myths. I love Percy Jackson, but the whole "gods moved to the USA because this is where Western civilization is" is just so icky to me. Greece still exists, hello??????

Back to Lore Olympus. For some reason it's fans think that the comic is a valid source for mythology, and they spread so much misinformation.

For the last time: Persephone was abducted in the myths. There is no version where she goes to the Underworld on her own.

Demeter is a heartbroken mother looking for her beloved daughter, not some evil helicopter parent standing between Persephone and her happiness. Justice for Apollo and Demeter.

Also, Persephone is sometimes drawn like a child and looks more like Hades' daughter than his wife. Why?????

And from what I've seen, Persephone is ridiculously powerful for some reason and fights Kronos or something???????

Also, apparently, Leto is portrayed as a manipulative mother????? Leto??? The Titan goddess of motherhood??? Why????

I don't understand why this comic got so popular, to be honest. Probably because of the artstyle.

#asks #anti lore olympus #greek mythology #greek mythology retelling #apollo #demeter #hades #lore olympus

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cynthiav06 · 2 months ago

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With Percy, we know that he hates going to school and his goals don’t really line up with Annabeth’s, but Annabeth is kind of forcing him to do it with her because he can’t say no to her. Say Rick didn’t make Annabeth Percy’s entire personality, what do you think he would’ve done in the mortal world rather than go to university?

I was checking my drafts cause I am trying to catch up on all the asks in my inbox ( as I said in one of my earlier posts I was in middle of a medical situation so I have at least a month of backlog) and found this draft.

The funny thing is I had already written most of the post in the draft version, and this ask wasn't even being displayed in my inbox, so I was very confused as to when it was from.

But it's such a good prompt and a sort of controversial question in the fandom, so I wanted to post it asap.

Percy doesn't like studies, but he knows the importance of it, so I am sure he will finish his initial college, probably either in the science or arts section. We know at one point he got better grades than Annabeth at one point so he certainly isn't quitting studies and doing way better than what people expect. He also wouldn't like just staying at home and doing nothing (I am looking at certain Percabeth stans here), so he definitely would be doing one job or another.

I don't think he would study marine biology like most believe. After a conversation I had with someone who had taken the course, I am convinced Percy wouldn't like it. It's heavily based on chemistry, and we know how much Percy is affected by sea creatures being mistreated or caged, so having to study marine biology wouldn't really be something he would choose.

An interesting twist would be if he chose to be a writer like his mother.

We all know that Percy writes or at least dictates and narrates the first five books, which are written and narrated entirely from his perspective. Moreover, there are books on Percy just narrating his own sarcastic takes on Greek gods and Greek heroes. What if he did actually catalogue his own adventures in those books as a sort of manual for other demigods on how to deal with certain monsters and gods and such.

Through Percy's thoughts, even as 12 years old, we can certainly say he has advanced vocabulary despite being dyslexic and given how much he admires Sally, why wouldn't he be interested in following her footsteps. Sure, he has trouble reading, but that's not to say he wouldn't love expressing his thoughts through humorous retelling of his own adventures which he can pass as fiction to normal readers but actual experiences in demigod world. Who doesn't want to know the exploits of Percy Jackson?

Plus, it's a good money hack. And don't for a second tell me he wouldn't. Sally petrified Gabe, and then they sold his statute to a museum as a sculpture and earned money off of that. So Sally would definitely encourage it, and Percy would even follow through on it just for shits and giggles and the added benefit of helping demigods and earning money.

[I literally want this to happen just for the Godly reactions. I am all for god slander, especially Zeus slander. Poseidon would be half laughing at the book and half worried cause of the sheer catastrophes his son seems to fall into almost on a daily basis.

Apollo would be having a grand time, and Hermes will be half depressed and half impressed throughout. Overall, it would be hilarious all around, and it might finally make the gods feel a bit more accountable . It's literally the Reading Percy Jackson Series trope, and that's always fun.]

One other option is that Percy will get into environmental preservation, specifically the protection of Rivers and Seas from pollution by actively involving himself and others in its cleanliness and purification. He would also run Beach cleanliness programs.

I think he and Grover would become environmental activists and would definitely get into preserving forest areas and other places where nature spirits dwell frequently. I can see them doing it a lot, long-term wise, too.

I think he would kind of like marine explorations, but that might cause his powers to be somewhat exposed, so he might not do that, but it's a possibility.

That's all I can think of. I would like to hear everyone else's opinions on this.

#percy jackson #pjo headcanons #percy and grover #smart percy jackson #school smart percy jackson #pjo fandom #percy jackson and the olympians #sally jackson #percy and sally #Poseidon and Percy #Annabeth chase #grover underwood

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batmanisagatewaydrug · 2 months ago

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reading updates: august 2024

the good news is that I did a lot of reading this month, the bad news is that honestly? I think that my birthday month has had the biggest percentage of literary letdowns, duds, and outright bullshit than any other month of this year so far.

but at least there's plenty to talk about, so let's get going!

Unlearning Shame: How We Can Reject Self-Blame Culture and Reclaim Our Power (Devon Price, 2024) - uh oh gamers, we're starting on a doozy! I've enjoyed both of Price's previous books very much, but with Unlearning Shame I couldn't help but feel like I couldn't quite shake the feeling that I wasn't getting what I had signed on for. the issue, I think, could be corrected by an adjustment to the title, which seems to be promising a very broad tackling of the concept of shame and is therefore making some pretty big promises. in reality, the book is much more narrowly focused than that, interested primarily in the shame that arises in the activism-minded when they feel overwhelmed by the sheer amount of awful things in the world and their perceived inability to do anything about it. fairly early on Price introduces an apparently relatable anecdote about himself and a friend having mutual breakdowns in a grocery store because they were both so paralyzed by the conundrum of trying to buy the most ethical groceries possible, and I realized this book was maybe not really for me or my particular experiences with shame. I think this book will be really helpful for a lot of people for sure, would love to pass it on to a lot of my freshmen, but overall it did not live up to the expectations I brought to the party.

A Separate Peace (John Knowles, 1959) - so I wanted to reread this because someone on here sent me an ask about, I don't know, my favorite required high school reading or whatever, and I said it was A Separate Peace but then I realized it's been over a decade since I read the book and I had to go see if it still actually held up. and god, does it EVER. this is such a brutal and heartbreaking novel, beginning in the last carefree summer that best friends and roommates Gene and Finny will experience before their final year at their boys' private school and their seemingly inevitable draft into WW2. although Gene is seethingly jealous of Finny's seemingly effortless charisma, popularity, confidence, and athletic prowess, the two boys are also inseparable - until a tragic injury changes the course of Finny's life forever. this book is a mess of unspoken pain, from the looming end of innocence on a global scale to the intimate ache of loving your best friend so, so much and having no healthy way to express it because you're a repressed little rich boy in the 1940s.

Deep as the Sky, Red as the Sea (Rita Chang-Eppig, 2023) - Chang-Eppig's debut novel follows the career of Chinese pirate Shek Yeung, also known as Zheng Yi Sao, immediately following the death of her husband, fearsome pirate Sheng Yi. you've probably seen a post or two about her floating around on this very hellsite, calling her a pirate queen and accompanied by this image:

Chang-Eppig isn't interested in portraying Shek Yeung as any kind of heroine or feminist icon; over and over again it's acknowledged that she's simply a woman who has survived massive hardships and will do whatever she needs to do to survive. manipulation? spying? extortion? torture? murder? you name it, she's done it, and she does not feel remorse. while the novel wasn't a knockout for me either in terms of plot or prose, it's nice to see an entry into the trend of "retelling" stories from history and mythology centered on women that isn't determined to justify every step a maligned woman ever made. Shek Yeung is what she is, and her story makes for a gritty, bloody adventure.

Victim (Andrew Boryga, 2024) - this book is pure sleazeball fun; if you've ever wondered what I consider a romp, this is it. Victim follows our manipulative king Javi Perez as he builds a writing career for himself by turning in one essay after another about racial discrimination that he never really experienced, inventing stories of hardship caused by racism and poverty from his college application essay to his school newspaper to the story that finally brings the whole lie crashing down when he stretches the truth too far. the novel is written like Javi's apology in the wake of getting #canceled, and while I do sometimes feel that this premise makes some of the writing seem a bit implausible (why would you admit that!!!) it's a fun setup for a scandal that would have been a bloodbath on the twitter of old. come get your mess!!!

Bad Girls (Camila Sosa Villada, trans. Kit Maude, 2022) - this is my first time reading Sosa Villada's work but OH BOY, do I need to seek out more. this is a skinty little novel following a dramatized account of the travesti (or transgender) women who live and sell sex in Córdoba, Argentina. the women build an unsteady but beautiful and magic-infused family under the protection of the ancient Auntie Encarna. the protagonist (who is named Camila Sosa Villada, no relation I'm sure) watches as her unconventional family grows, changes, and frays over time, struggling to find ways to stay afloat in a world that see them as disposable. Sosa Villada's turns of phrase are brilliant and searing, and she weaves fantastical elements so nimbly into her narrative that it's utterly believable to see women becoming animals and courting headless men in the streets of a modern city. strongly recommend for fans of Kai Cheng Thom's Fierce Femmes and Notorious Liars.

Talkin' Up to the White Woman: Indigenous Women and Feminism (Aileen Morteon-Robinson, 2000) - this book serves as a scathing literature review indicting Australia's white women anthropologists and feminist scholars for the ways in which they've dehumanized and discredited Aboriginal women, stripping them of the right to be authorities of their own experiences and barring them from a white-centered feminist movement. Moreton-Robinson's account is excellent, contrasting the wok of white women academics with the accounts of Aboriginal women to reveal exactly how massive the disparities in understanding are. as a USAmerican previously aware of Australia's colonial history but unfamiliar with the specifics, it was jarring to discover exactly how similar the mechanism of colonial violence are between my country and Australia, with countless genocidal parallels to be drawn. one particular highlight of the book comes via my purchase of a 20th anniversary edition, which includes a new post-script by Moreton-Robinson in which she dissects and responds to various criticisms of the book at its time of release, taking several critics to task for the belittling tone they used to describe her work and the tools white feminists use to absolve themselves of blame in the face of critique from women of color. fascinating and thorough articulation of Moreton-Robinson's point, and deservedly blistering. I love when academics call each other out by name.

The End of Love: Racism, Sexism, and the Death of Romance (Sabrina Strings, 2024) - so the thing about this book is that there are really good PARTS. Strings is still an excellent historical writer, and I found a lot to appreciate in, for instance, the segments on the history of Black American pimp culture and the analysis of Playboy and Helen Gurley Brown's Sex and the Single Girl. the more personal segments, where Strings contorts herself to fit her own failed relationships into the narrative she's building, are decidedly less consistent in their quality, with some feeling like they would have been better off staying between Strings and her therapist. there's a long and convoluted digression about Sex and the City, and a strange anecdote towards the end in which String recounts a phone call with a friend's college-aged son who, String believes, was masturbating during the call. a yucky experience, to be certain, but I'm not sure it justifies Strings filing a police report against the youth and his mother, who she accuses of having groomed her on the son's behalf. she also casually drops in the same chapter that she considers herself pansexual because she's attracted to trans men in addition to cis men? idk man!!! this book was so uneven that I found myself genuinely questioning whether Strings' first book, Fearing the Black Body, is actually as excellent as I remember it being. I'm pretty sure it is, but god it sucks to get shaken so hard that you have to wonder!

The Diary of a Teenage Girl: An Account in Words and Pictures (Phoebe Gloeckner, 2002) - another book that I had to read for class, years ago! I read Diary of a Teenage Girl in one of my gender and women's studies classes in my undergrad, for a class with a title along the lines of Girlhood Stories in Fiction and Film. Gloeckner's novel (though heavily informed by her own life, she insists that it's a work of fiction) sees its young protagonist, Minnie, navigating a great deal of sex, alcohol, drugs in 1970s San Francisco. I started thinking about the book because I was listening to a trio of episodes of You're Wrong About in which Carmen Maria Machado guests to talk about the pervasive sham that is Go Ask Alice (great series, check it out) and I started thinking about Diary, which is so much less preachy and didactic and is, you know, actually drawn from a real teenage girl's diary, unlike Go Ask Alice, and lacking Alice's preachy didacticism. as a diary based on a real diary this book is largely lacking in any particular plot (the most consistent through line is Minnie's ongoing and tumultuous sexual relationship with her mother's 35 year old boyfriend), but if that's not a turn off then you'll find yourself rooting for Minnie to find her way all the way to the uncertain but ultimately optimistic conclusion.

One and Done (Frederick Smith, 2024) - okay, so. this is a romance novel that I picked up because I saw a review talking about how it's an incredibly realistic depiction of working at a university. now that's obviously an insane thing to look for in a romance novel, but I like romances, ESPECIALLY gay romances, and I work at a university, so I figured sure, I'll bite. spoiler alert: it's not great. I posted some examples of the prose here, and even if the two protagonists talked like actual human beings it wouldn't make up for the stale-ass plot or devastating lack of chemistry they have going for them. more like One and Glad to Be Done With This Book That Isn't Very Good, am I right, ladies?

Seduced (Virginia Henley, 1994) - guys, I'm gonna be so fucking real with you. this is the most batshit novel I've ever read, period, let alone the most batshit romance novel. this book was the winner of a poll I ran on patreon last month in which my wicked patreonites got to nominate romance novels of their choosing for my next reading project and voted amongst themselves to crown a winner, and against all odds and my own light attempts to sway the voters, Seduced won it all. this book has everything: a historical setting, a bold young lady disguising herself as her own brother, wildly unchecked orientalism, a murderous cousin, high society scandal, and some of the most torturous sex scenes I've ever encountered in my life. truly this write-up cannot do justice to what I have experienced; I've already promised by patreonites that I'll have to do a little youtube live in order to fully express the extent of my dissatisfaction.

and that was the month of August, babey!!!

#bookblr

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witchofthemidlands · 2 months ago

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even though it is my ultimate hyper fixation, i dip in & out of interacting with the fandom because ✨anxiety✨ so i don't actually know how many people are into the doctor who puffin classic crossover novels:

but i love them so much, they’re absolutely fantastic: the thirteenth doctor, & missy in “the wizard of oz”, the eleventh doctor in “treasure island”, the fifth doctor in “alice in wonderland”, the third doctor in a greek mythology retelling? absolutely phenomenal. i know there are others & i cannot wait to read them when i am able to purchase them.

anyway the next instalment is set around one of my favourite books in the world, frankenstein & i was already so excited because i love frankenstein so much & studied it intensively for my degree & today i saw the description for which doctor will be in the story & it is the ninth doctor but it's the ninth doctor with ROSE:

honestly my brain just gave out because (it's timepetals) i knew right then in that moment that all i am going to be picturing throughout this book when i am reading it & rose & nine probably end up meeting a somewhat version of frankenstein is harrytreadaway!victor frankenstein because:

i cannot wait for this book to come out so i can have the mental image of nine taking on this most cringefail pathetic wet cat of a man (affectionate)

#rose tyler #ninth doctor #harrytreadaway!victor frankenstein #victor frankenstein #frankenstein #puffin classic crossovers #doctor who #penny dreadful #whoniverse #kat's thoughts 🍄

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redstarjuly · 1 year ago

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I was reading discourse on achilles yesterday and I'm still thinking about some people calling him a r*pist and others saying that other books they've read that are from a woman's perspective completely shifted the perception they have of TSOA's Achilles. And to me that makes little to no sense.

Here's what I come from: Achilles is a character from the Illiad, and the poem itself is pretty much fanfiction. I mean, the person and warrior that Achilles is based on probably existed, and it might have been called Achilles even, but i think we all agree that the rest is dubious.

Since the illiad is like the OG story, people tend to look at it as if it's canon and we'll go with that logic. You have the canon work and poets go off on their own versions of these characters writing tragedies, more epics, thesis, all sorts of stuff, and it goes on for centuries until we reach The song of Achilles and Percy Jackson and all the other 100s retellings coming out which are fanfiction of fanfiction.

And you're letting one fanfiction distort another fanfiction? It's bonkers to me because as someone who has to read the classics and grew up on fanfiction, I don't see that happening elsewhere. Between academics, if we're discussing a myth, we mention the different versions, and we can choose one to go on from, sure. But even so, I never saw someone sound so affected by different perspectives on the same character in class.

And if we're talking on the world of street fanfiction, I most definitely don't find people going "Oh this fanfiction of hermione betraying the order and marrying voldmort changed my perspective of Harry Potter's hermione" you know? -- if that sounds like a stupid example, it's because it is. It's just to show that my whole point is that it's insane to me to let a book ruin another book when the authors are creating different versions of the same characters, which basically turns them into different characters with the same names. Especially since you know, it's all made up. And this isn't real criticism to the people forming their opinions or the authors, respect to all of them.

But it’s a little maddening watching people roll into arguments to discuss what piece of fiction is more real and relevant when they're all in the same level of glorified AO3 works.

I hope this makes sense to someone else

#greek myth retellings #classics #greek mythology #tsoa #tsoa achilles #ancient greek literature #fanfiction #achilles discourse #patrochilles #mention of abuse #literature #mine #percy jackson #the trojans #trojan war #the illiad #odysseus #patroclus #history

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veliseraptor · 7 months ago

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April Reading Recap

Stars of Chaos vol. 2 by Priest. I'm not quite grabbed by this one yet. I'm not not enjoying it, but the main relationship doesn't quite have me compelled, and the politics aren't quite sharp enough to get me either. I'm not totally sure I'll keep buying the published volumes, at least not at this time, and just read the rest online to see how I end up feeling about it as a whole before making the financial commitment.

Medea by Eilish Quin. Listen, I'm a Medea apologist, but I'm a Medea apologist who is very much of the "she absolutely did all the awful things she's accused of and she is valid" and the author here is going "she did all the awful things she's accused of but it's not as bad as you thought it was because she didn't mean it!" and I'm just. I'm not mad, just disappointed (again). I was so hoping for a book that would do something interesting with a Medea retelling but I probably should've known better than to think it'd be this one. Why, you may ask, do I keep reading myth retellings about my problematic faves when all I do is complain about them? Hope springs eternal, I guess.

She Who Became the Sun and He Who Drowned the World by Shelley Parker-Chan. Exceptional. Might be my favorite books I read in April. I'd already read She Who Became the Sun back when it was first published and knew I'd enjoyed it (was rereading to refresh my memory for the sequel), but I felt like I enjoyed it more the second time around, and I might've liked He Who Drowned the World even more than its predecessor. If you're looking for works of just-barely fantasy with delightfully fucked up queer characters, come get 'em here. I won't say most of them are happy (they're not) or that things end well (they don't), but boy is it good reading.

The Death of Jane Lawrence by Caitlin Starling. Decent horror but not particularly outstanding, in my opinion. I liked The Luminous Dead more.

Untethered Sky by Fonda Lee. I continue to struggle with novellas. This was a perfectly good novella but it felt like it could've been a stronger short story, which I guess is better than the other way I usually come out of novellas, which is "this was a fine novella but it should've been a novel."

The Mountain in the Sea by Ray Nayler. I really liked this. It has more of a thriller-ish edge than I expected, but for all that I think it's a thoughtful book with some interesting things to say, and I feel like it's one I want more people to read so I can talk to them about it. It's set in a sort-of spooky, near-future dystopia, but a lot of it is about, like, the nature of thought and consciousness. Anyway, I found myself compelled.

Islands of Abandonment: Nation Rebounding in the Post-Human Landscape by Cal Flyn. I found myself reading this thinking a lot about The World Without Us, a book I read many years ago and would kind of like to reread, and which I think I liked more than this (at least in my memory). I was hoping for more analysis than I got from this book, which was beautifully written but more nature/travel writing than science. One thing I did appreciate was the attention paid to the human cost of the "abandoned" places examined in this book - the pain that abandonment often signifies, and the trauma it indicates, in spite of the beauty that may come after.

Emperor of Rome: Ruling the Ancient Roman World by Mary Beard. I really liked the way that Beard chose to do this one - namely, taking it by theme rather than by emperor, and breaking down different areas of the emperor's life over time rather than trying to tell a linear narrative. It also let her do some of the better "skeptical" reading of sources that I've read in a popular book on ancient history, where she was actually digging into the "rather than what this says about what this person may or may not have actually done, what does it say about expectations, beliefs, and tropes that people had" kind of reading. And after some of the other popular histories of Rome I've read, thank god for that.

Metamorphoses by Ovid, trans. Stephanie McCarter. Continuing on with my "reading new translations (by women!) of classical epics" run (started with The Odyssey, The Iliad is on my list). It was fun to reread Ovid! As usual one of my favorite parts of this was reading the translator's note and introduction, and I wanted about 500% more of that through the text (tell me about the assonance you're preserving in the Latin!) but did get some of (thanks for the information on the penis/pubic hair puns!). Overall would recommend as a good translation of Ovid that very much does not flinch away from - and makes/keeps appropriately uncomfortable - the sexual assault.

Dark Rise by C.S. Pacat. Slightly more YA than I usually like, but I enjoyed it! I was a little :\ about it for a while, very much feeling the YA cliches of it all, but the late hour twist got me interested again, and I will be picking up the sequel. Did miss the full balls-to-the-wall iddy joy of Captive Prince, though, since I probably wouldn't have picked this book up without the author recognition.

Subversive Sequels in the Bible: How Biblical Stories Mine and Undermine Each Other by Judy Klitsner. I really liked this one, particularly for its commentary comparing and contrasting Eve, and the other women of Genesis, with later Biblical narratives. I don't know how much I buy all of her arguments when it comes to intentionality of all of the comparisons she's drawing, but it certainly makes interesting food for thought, and a good sampler for me of what literary-based Biblical scholarship can look like (and an indication that I'm interested in trying more of it).

Use of Weapons by Iain M. Banks. I read most of my way through this book continuing to really appreciate what Banks does with the Culture novels and planning to continue on reading the next one, but not enjoying this specific one as much as I did The Player of Games in particular, and then I got to the very end of it and went "hang on what the fuck???" but in a decidedly good way. And I'm still kind of thinking about That even though it's been a while, which I think is a positive. Anyway, I don't think I'd recommend this as a starting place for anyone to read the Culture novels, or as a must read, but it was on the upper end of a three star rating.

Juniper & Thorn by Ava Reid. I wanted this to be more gothic horror and less romance and it ended up being more romance and less gothic horror, was my feeling. Not necessarily the book's fault, but if anyone else is eyeing it wondering...now you know.

A Deadly Education by Naomi Novik. I really enjoyed this one! I was kind of skeptical going in - I'm not a big magic school person, as a rule, and the more I feel like something is hyped to me the more I tend to drag my heels about it - but Naomi Novik is really good at what she does and she clearly had a lot of fun here. It's tropey for sure, but I enjoy the narrative voice (very important, in a first person narration), and the action moves along with what I felt was pretty good momentum. The other thing I was worried about - that it'd feel too much like this was just ~commentary on/against Harry Potter~ without saying anything for itself - didn't materialize for me. I'm looking forward to reading the next ones.

The Monster Theory Reader ed. by Jeffrey Andrew Weinstock. I'm so rusty on my academic/theory reading and I felt it reading this collection, some of which was definitely better than others. Kristeva's essay on abjection was particularly rough as far as "I'm reading words and I know all the words but something about the order they're going in is just not making sense to me." Overall...it was a decent primer? There were a few very interesting essays in there; my favorite might've been the one on tanuki in modernizing Japan's folklore, but there were a couple on "monstrous" bodies that made me wish I had someone to discuss them with. That's probably my main problem reading academic works these days: I want a seminar to dissect them afterwards and I just don't have that.

The Sabbath: Its Meaning for Modern Man by Abraham Joshua Heschel. I'm trying to read something Jewish on Shabbat now and finally getting around to reading some Heschel after years of meaning to. I thought "oh, I'll start easy with something nice and short" - yeah, no, Heschel's got a very particular style of writing and there's a lot of theological depth packed into a very short volume. I'm looking forward to reading The Prophets, though.

The Husky and His White Cat Shizun vol. 5 by Rou Bao Bu Chi Rou. I think we're juuuuust about caught up now with the official translation to where I started reading the machine translation, so I'm very excited for (a) things I don't remember as well (b) reading it not in machine translation. Also looking forward to everything about what happened with Nangong Liu and Nangong Xu making more sense this time around, on account of not reading it machine translated, because I didn't follow it so well on my first read and I feel like I'm already doing better. (Though that could also be because it's a reread, no matter how different an experience of one.) Still feel real bad for Ye Wangxi, on so many levels. Mark that one down for 'characters I'd love to know more about what they're thinking.'

The Water Outlaws by S.L. Huang. I really enjoyed S.L. Huang's other work with the Cas Russell series, and I liked this book a little less than those. It felt like an almost winner, for me. Certainly I read through it quickly enough, and I can say I enjoyed it, but I'm not sure I'd give it an enthusiastic recommendation. It falls somewhere in the middle between "a fun action/adventure story" and "something I can sink my teeth into" in a way that didn't quite satisfy either itch. Still, it did make me curious about the source material, which is one of the Chinese classics (Water Margin) and I might go and find a place to read that, if I can; if I'd had that background going in I wonder if my experience of this work would've been more edifying.

I'm currently rereading A Memory Called Empire so I can (finally) read the sequel (A Desolation Called Peace); I also checked out from the library the next two Scholomance books so I'll be reading those. I'm going to try to throw some nonfiction somewhere in there (maybe The Genius of Birds by Jennifer Ackerman, which I also have out from the library, but maybe something else), but I've still got the sequel to The First Sister sitting on my shelf (also from the library).

Outside of that I've got no big reading plans - I'm working my way through some of the unreads on my own shelf (despite what it may look like, about the library books) and eyeing The Doors of Eden by Adrian Tchaikovsky or a reread of Foundryside by Robert Jackson Bennett so I can continue that series.

#long post for ts #reading recaps #sometimes i read things #sometimes i wonder if i should have more like. summary information on what books are about #but i am lazy and also that's not really the point #important text posts

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austinslounge · 8 days ago

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I honestly tried to like Kaia, I truly did, but I can’t stand this shit anymore. Her desperate attempts to be popular, seem interesting and ”deep” are driving me insane at this point. I know it’s probably not her fault, but her parents’, they made her this cringy attention-seeker after all. I can’t understand what Austin sees in her other than her family’s connections or just a plain PR agreement. She has no personality, she always tries to gain popularity by copying her mother(or people she’s dating). It’s funny how she doesn’t even look that much like Cindy, sure, she’s beautiful, but Presley literally stole Cindy’s face. Her attempts to seem intelligent are also miserable. I’ve never seen any of her book club readings, because for me, most of her book recommendations are just airplane reads, but I’ve seen many people say that even when she’s talking about books, it seems scripted and staged. Like someone just gave her a summary and she retells what happened in the book, that’s it. I mean, what intelligence? She never even bothered to take basic acting classes. Her comments about nepotism speak volumes too. During the pandemic she bragged about having dinner reservations and partying with her friends. Her merch is awful. With all her money and resources, she could have made some really good stuff, but why would she?Her small insane fan base will pay 50$ for an ugly white shirt with a caption either way. She’s desperately clinging to anyone who can give her even the smallest amount of fame, her following people and then unfollowing them if they don’t follow back. The way she was clinging to Austin hardcore in July, dragging him away from his fans, when he wanted to interact with them. Her stupid cake for his birthday. Don’t even get me started on how she makes out with her female friends constantly or throws herself on her male costars or short SNL guys. I don’t know why I feel so annoyed and disgusted by her all the time. I swear, this girl spoils my excitement for Austin and his work every fucking time. Nepotism is not always a bad thing, there are talented nepo babies, but she’s like the epitome of everything I hate about nepotism. I don’t know how she can rub shoulders with people who actually have talent, get invited to all these awards and red carpets. Kaia had plenty of time to prove that she’s worth something, she’s been in the industry since she was a child, but no. Why would she prove anything? Her mother is Cindy Crawford, her father is a millionaire worth 400 million, her boyfriend is Austin Butler. I just wish she will go away finally. No matter how hard I try, I can’t warm up to her. Sadly, looking at the state she is now, you can clearly tell that the girl has issues, but sadly,having no brain,she can’t understand that she’s a tragedy about to happen.

💯

Girl! I wish I could give you an award for this post. You basically hit the nail squarely on the head with the many various reasons why a lot of us in Austin's fandom don't like this girl! I'd be saying the exact same thing if Austin were dating another woman just like this. I'm actually verrry surprised that people haven't called Kaia out on her very obvious clout-chasing by now.

I'll be honest, I never really cared for her even when she was dating Elordi. I don't hate her, she's just meh to me. Always has been. So my thoughts and feelings about her are not about Austin. It's more so about what I've observed about her over the years.

Her dating Austin just makes things even more unbearable though -- especially when you know that he could do so much better. 😩 But hey, it's his life, not mine!

When I realized they were dating however, I really did try to like her too, or at least give her a chance. I saw that Austin was with her, so I was trying to be a "good fan"and see what he may see in her. But last year, I started seeing more and more negative things that I just didn't like about her.

I really don't have much to add to this wonderful post, because you basically touched on the many various reasons why a lot of AB fans don't really care for her. I also think she makes Austin look cheap with her weird behavior and interests. 👀 She really cheapens his brand imo. But that's a topic for another day lol.

#asks

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zahri-melitor · 1 year ago

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hi hello if it's not too much trouble, what comics would you recommend for someone trying to study the batfamily characters and dynamics for a project? I don't know which writers to avoid or which runs are considered bad characterization. I know this varies with opinion but you seem super familiar with the differences between fanon and canon stuff. don't worry about keeping the list short or anything, I don't have a problem with reading a lot

Honestly, this is a ‘how long is a piece of string’ question, but I can give you some pointers.

Which 'family' characters are you looking at, and which dynamics do you want? Because the thing is, this varies significantly over time. What I can do for you is roughly discuss a bunch of different eras, and what's good content to look at in each of them.

A shortcut - you're often well served by looking at a Gotham-wide Event during the period you're interested in. Sure, people often have some objections to some of the characterisation, but if you're looking at how characters interact, they're the best place to see lots of variations.

In addition 'bad characterisation' is largely in the eye of the beholder. There's actually less agreement on what is and isn't 'bad characterisation' than you might think - it depends on who you're talking to and what stories they like. Characterisation with comics characters is best thought of as a sliding spectrum - there's a range that most people will accept, and when characters go outside it people start getting unhappy. I'll try to note major shifts or universe resets or retcons along the way though.

Pre-Crisis:

Look there is very little in pre-crisis you need to look at for this. Sometimes people will pull stuff forward for Dick and Jason as Robin or Barbara as Batgirl, but largely things stand without this.

Post-Crisis:

I'm happy to walk you through post-crisis up to 2011. I'm still getting a handle on 2011 to present myself.

The Early Days: Bruce as Batman, Dick as Robin, Barbara as Batgirl

In the beginning, there was Batman. One day he went to Haly's Circus where he saw two acrobats falling and their devastated son...you know how this one goes.

Pretty much everything set in this period is flashback stories, so they frequently retread the same ground over and over. Want to see the Graysons fall? You're in luck! Choose one of the more than a dozen versions! (I'm not going to list them all even though I like many)

Quality stories looking at this period include:-

Batman Year One (1986) - Batman #404-407. I am recommending this, yes, even though it's Frank Miller, because it gets referenced a lot. It's a decent retelling and the best work Miller's ever done for the Bat books by a long shot. Bruce's origin story.

Robin: Year One (2000) - Chuck Dixon and Scott Beatty. This is probably my preferred version of early Bruce and Dick stories, and it's conveniently got a sequel in...

Batgirl: Year One (2003) - Chuck Dixon and Scott Beatty. Barbara's origin as Batgirl and the only one worth reading. These two update the Dick and Barbara as Robin and Batgirl dynamics into post-Crisis.

Batman Chronicles: The Gauntlet (1997) - Bruce Canwell. This is a single issue about the 'final exam' test Dick took to become Robin. I really enjoy it.

Robin & Batman (2021) - Jeff Lemire. A very recent update of early Dick as Robin. If you want something recent and quick, this is the pick. The characterisation is good but I have a bunch of quibbles with the details.

World's Finest: Batman/Superman (2022) - Mark Waid & Dan Mora. Here's a current ongoing for you! A rarity in that is set reasonably late Dick's time as Robin, and it also doesn't repeat identical beats to those above. Lots of Bruce and Dick, strong Silver Age vibes in relationships, and a lot of fun. A great intro to the wider DC simultaneously too.

Robin II: Bruce as Batman, Dick as Nightwing, Jason as Robin, Barbara as...around

Honestly this is a period I'm weaker on. Jason's post-crisis run as Robin is pretty compact: Batman #401-428 and 'Tec #568-582. Jim Starlin's the writer who wanted to kill Jason off.

Batman #408-411 (1987) - Max Collins. The original post-Crisis 'Dick Becomes Nightwing' and 'Jason becomes Robin' story.

The Diplomat's Son - Batman #424 (1988) - Jim Starlin. This is the issue everyone talks about, where Felipe Garzonas dies. You should read it just to understand the debate, if nothing else.

A Death in the Family - Batman #426-428 (1988) - Jim Starlin. Jason's death.You should read this if you want to understand the dynamics surrounding these events and what actually happened.

The New Teen Titans - look I can't get my head around the numbering of NTT, but if you want to go into this there are eleventy million guides. NTT is very popular. This is Dick as Nightwing during this period, Marv Wolfman and George Perez working together, and considered by people who like Nightwing during this period as the definitive version. Jason appears in a few issues.

Nightwing Year One (2005) - Nightwing #101-106, Chuck Dixon. Now this is going to be extremely controversial, but I do actually recommend people read Nightwing Year One. It's a retcon, but it's an important retcon because it lays out the dynamics of Jason's time as Robin as comics writers have changed them to be following his death. If you want to see how comics writes Jason as the 'angry' and 'risky' Robin following his death, this is the most compact way to see how the narrative changed.

Batgirl Special #1 (1988) - Barbara Randall. Barbara's last appearance as Batgirl. Randall is Barbara's best contemporary Batgirl writer, and this is a loving sendoff for a character who was about to get shredded.

The Killing Joke (1988) - Alan Moore. You should probably read it. Barbara is shot in the spine. However if you want to skip it that's completely fine as the relevant beats have been retold almost as many times as the Graysons have fallen.

Gotham Knights #43-45 (2003) - Scott Beatty. This is probably the best telling of the fallout of Jason's death on the family, particularly Barbara's reaction. If you want Batfam dynamics this is what you should look at.

New Beginnings: Bruce as Batman, Dick as Nightwing, Tim as Robin, Barbara as Oracle, Helena as Huntress, Steph as Spoiler

This is an interesting period in that it's the first threads of what we now call the Batfamily, but they're only just starting to come together as Tim picks each one up. (No, seriously. This era is 'Tim meets people and works with them')

Also as will be the case for a while from here on, at least 50% of all content is written by Chuck Dixon. Now Dixon has his downsides - he's notoriously a conservative homophobe and his views can be seen in the text quite frequently, but he is really good at writing relationships between characters, and he loves a crossover. If you love the modern Batfam, you do have to acknowledge Dixon for his work.

A Lonely Place of Dying (1989) Batman #440-442, New Titans #60-61 - Marv Wolfman & George Perez. Tim's origin story. Very clear on the outset dynamics between Bruce and Dick.

Identity Crisis (1990) Batman #455-457 - Alan Grant. Tim's first night out as Robin in his own costume, plus early dynamics between Bruce & Tim. A tear jerker.

To the Father I Never Knew (1992) Batman #480 - Alan Grant. If you want to actually understand the foundation of Jack and Tim's relationship and how he contrasts it with his relationship with Bruce - look no further.

Robin III (1992) - Chuck Dixon. A very early Tim team-up with Huntress. This is a good place to start for how her relationship with the other Bats evolves in Gotham.

'Tec #647-649 (1992) - Chuck Dixon. Steph's original time out as Spoiler. Again foundational dynamics.

Oracle Year One (1996) Batman Chronicles #5, John Ostrander and Kim Yale. The story of how Barbara became Oracle. Stunning. Essential.

Knightfall: Bruce as Batman, JPV as Azrael and Batman, Dick as Nightwing and Batman, Tim as Robin, everyone else keeping out the way

Knightfall is huge and messy and all over the place but there is magic in here. You just have to dig. Parts I particularly like for family dynamics:-

Batman: Sword of Azrael (1992) - Dennis O'Neil. This is an excellent intro to John-Paul Valley, and get comfortable, because this is what Denny's going to write for the next 10 years.

Batman #488 (1993) - Doug Moench. JPV starts working at Wayne Corp. Tim is assigned to teach him the ropes as a crimefighter in Gotham.

Batman #500 (1993) - Doug Moench. JPV becomes Batman. Dick turns up to complain to Tim about Bruce being insufferable. It's all here.

Bloodbath #1 (1993) - Dan Raspler. This is a terrible comic BUT it also contains some gold dynamics between JPV, Dick and Tim.

Knightsend (1994) - team written. Bruce, Dick and Tim work together to help Bruce rehab from his injury and take down JPV. Legends of the Dark Knight #63 in particular is stunning.

Prodigal (1994) - team written. Dick as Batman and Tim as his Robin. The final issue, Robin #13, has Bruce and Dick's reconciliation over both the fight when Dick became Nightwing AND their fight after Jason died. Essential.

Welcome to the Family: Bruce as Batman, Dick as Nightwing, Tim as Robin, JPV as Azrael, Barbara as Oracle, Helena as Huntress, Steph as Spoiler

I will fight to convince you that this is the first true 'Batfam'. Everything prior to this is Bruce and his Robin, with occasional associates. This is where it goes from the Dynamic Duo to a network who intersect constantly.

Writers: It's a lot of Doug Moench and Chuck Dixon still.

Nightwing: Alfred's Return and Batman #521 (1995) - Alan Grant & Doug Moench. Alfred quit during Knightfall due to what Bruce was doing to himself. This is how Dick got him to come home, and the reunion.

Contagion (1996) - team written. The Event where Gotham gets the Clench (aka Ebola). Massive teamup storyline featuring Bruce, Dick, Tim, JPV, Helena, Selina, and Barbara.

Legacy (1997) - team written. Oh no, it's the Clench Round Two. Here we go again. Basically the same team, but JPV doesn't get invited after he proved he'd forgotten was a fax machine was last event, and Helena gets a more significant role.

Robin important family issues during this period: #17 (with Helena), #29-30 (with Barbara), #34 (with Helena), #35 (with Steph), #45 (with Jack Drake), #47 (with Dick)

Nightwing important family issues during this period: #6 (with Tim), #7 (with Babs), #13-14 (with Bruce), #16 (with Babs)

Birds of Prey important family issues during this period: Birds of Prey Manhunt, as it sets the tone for Barbara and Helena's relationship for a WHILE.

No Man's Land: Bruce as Batman, Dick as Nightwing, Tim as Robin, JPV as Azrael, Helena as Huntress and the Bat, Barbara as Oracle, Steph as Spoiler, Cass as Batgirl

The earthquake where everything goes wrong. The most notable addition to the writing pool is Greg Rucka. Honestly this is a 'so many parts of this are worthwhile, read it all' sort of period, but to help navigate there's a handful of really important points:-

Nightwing #20 (1998) - Chuck Dixon. The Dick, Babs and Tim reunion issue during Cataclysm. The world's fallen apart but they're back together.

Nightwing #25 (1998) - Chuck Dixon. Dick takes Tim trainsurfing

Brotherhood of the Fist (1998) - Chuck Dixon. This is a teamup with Connor Hawke involving Bruce, Dick and Tim. I love the dynamics here.

Huntress/Spoiler Special - Blunt Trauma (1998) - Chuck Dixon. The one Helena and Steph team up during Cataclysm. Get a dynamic you won't see anywhere else.

'Tec #725 (1998) - Chuck Dixon. Dick tells Bruce that he's going to become a cop.

'Tec #727 (1998) - Chuck Dixon. Another Dick, Babs and Tim teamup to take on Firefly.

Mark of Cain (1999) - Kelley Puckett. Cass's intro story.

Birds of Prey #8 (1999) - Chuck Dixon. Dick and Babs visit Haly's Circus

Robin #67 (1999) - Chuck Dixon. Tim and Dick break into No Man's Land.

Legends of the Dark Knight #120 (1999) - Greg Rucka. Team reunion in NML at the Clocktower.

Nightwing #38-39 (1999) - Chuck Dixon - Babs looks after an injured Dick in the Clocktower.

Legends of the Dark Knight #125 (1999) - Greg Rucka. Bruce and Jim finally discuss their issues. Barbara and Tim wait upstairs.

Endgame (1999) - various. Whole team works to track down Joker and some kidnapped babies on Christmas Eve.

A New City, A New Team: Bruce as Batman, Dick as Nightwing, Tim as Robin, JPV as Azrael, Barbara as Oracle, Helena as Huntress, Cass as Batgirl, Steph as Spoiler

This is the final Chuck Dixon era, the Rucka & Brubaker run on Batman and 'Tec, Devin Grayson on Gotham Knights, and probably my favourite era of comics ever. It's hit after hit after hit. Pick up any comic here. You won't be disappointed.

Major highlights not to miss:

Gotham Knights #1-12 (2000) - Devin Grayson. GK is my favourite Bat anthology book ever, but this run includes Transference. The overarching plot is Bruce analysing his team in a series of case notes. Unmissable.

Hunt for Oracle (2000) - Chuck Dixon. The US government tries to track Oracle down. Babs, Dick and Dinah make sure they fail.

Officer Down (2001) - various. Jim Gordon is shot. This is the consequences as people search for his attacker.

Joker Last Laugh (2001) - various. Joker thinks he is about to die and breaks out of the Slab. Chaos ensues. This is the one where everyone thinks Croc kills Tim, and reacts accordingly.

Bruce Wayne: Murderer/Fugitive (2002) - various. Bruce has been pushing everyone away for a while, so when he's accused of murder, they must ask the question, did he do it? Everyone tries to solve the mystery of who killed Vesper Fairchild, and Bruce goes through one of his 'am I Bruce or am I Batman' periods.

Batgirl #18 & #20 (2001) - Kelley Puckett. Cass' first team ups with Tim and Steph respectively.

Batman/Huntress: Cry for Blood (2000) - Greg Rucka. THE definitive Batfam Huntress book.

Hush It Looks Like War: Bruce as Batman, Dick as Nightwing, Tim as Robin, Barbara as Oracle, Helena as Huntress, Cass as Batgirl, Steph as Spoiler and Robin

Among the drama of Murderer/Fugitive, almost every single book gets a new writer. Jon Lewis takes Robin followed by Bill Willingham, Devin Grayson takes Nightwing, Birds of Prey gets fills until Gail Simone picks it up, Dylan Horrocks takes over Batgirl, Jeph Loeb writes Hush on Batman, Scott Beatty takes Gotham Knights. Personally I endorse basically all these runs but Grayson on Nightwing is controversial.

Hush (2003) Batman #608-619 - Jeph Loeb. Famous for a reason, this is a Bruce story that touches on his relationships with almost EVERY major character in his life (Cass and Steph miss out).

Gotham Knights - Scott Beatty. I don't know what to pick here but #47-49 is a team story of Bruce, Dick, Tim and Cass following Bane to a Kobra stronghold which shows off the developed family-like relationship between the 4 at this point.

Robin - Jon Lewis. Your highlights here are Tim and Steph on a date together (#111), and the 16th Birthday Story (#116-120) because it's essential to understanding where Tim and Bruce are at.

Robin - Bill Willingham. Jack finds out Tim is Robin. Tim quits. Steph becomes Robin. It's an essential arc.

Nightwing - Grayson. This is widely disliked but #81 is a great Dick, Bruce and Cass issue.

Birds of Prey - Simone. Helena joins Barbara on the Birds of Prey. They very, very slowly work through their issues with each other.

Batgirl - Horrocks. #38, Steph and Cass play tag. #45, Cass tries on Barbara's old costume. #50, Bruce drugs himself and Cass with Soul and they fight. #54, Barbara and Cass argue over her reading ability.

And then lurking in the background...War Games hits and tears the Batfam apart, with a doubletap from Identity Crisis.

Leaving Gotham: Bruce as Batman, Dick out of costume, Tim as Robin, Cass as Batgirl, Barbara as Oracle, Helena as Huntress annnnd Jason as Red Hood

Steph is dead. Barbara and Helena leave Gotham for Metropolis. Tim and Cass move to Bludhaven. Dick runs off to join the mob. And in Gotham, Red Hood appears.

Writers: Well we've added Judd Winick on Batman, and now have Andersen Gabrynch on Batgirl. Gotham Knights is now mostly A.J. Lieberman and no longer a good Batfam book (it's now a Hush book). 'Tec honestly isn't worth it during this period. Willingham on Robin has a handful of decent issues to start out then increasingly gets weirdly conservative with some very odd plotlines.

Fresh Blood (2005) Robin #132-133, Batgirl #58-59 - Willingham & Gabrynch. This is a Tim and Cass team up as they move to Bludhaven and mourn together.

Under the Red Hood (2005) - Batman #635-650. You know what this is. It's the Jason returns story.

Nightwing - Grayson. #100 - a strong reflection on Dick's past plus the most heartbreaking part of the Dick/Babs breakup as Dick just runs from all his problems. #110. Tim and Dick meet in Bludhaven and fail to tell each other all the bad things happening in their lives. #112. Dick and Helena run into each other both undercover in the mob. #117. Dick finally talks to Bruce about Blockbuster, and proposes to Babs.

Robin - Willingham. #134 is the pick of the bunch - Bruce offers to adopt Tim and Tim reflects on his time as Robin, though it's a solid little story out to #138 as the truth about Uncle Eddie comes out.

Birds of Prey - Simone. #76, the Babs side of the breakup. #83-84, Helena with the mob and encountering Dick. #90, Helena gives Bruce the new compiled mob data handbook and Bruce compliments her.

Batgirl - Gabrynch. This is a strong well loved run for the build up to Cass' final fight with Shiva, but for Batfam you can't go past #67, when Cass reunites with Babs. Also Cass hallucinates Steph twice in this run (#61 & #72).

Then Infinite Crisis arrives and we all move a year into the future.

One Year Later: Bruce is Batman, Dick is Nightwing, Tim is Robin, Jason is Red Hood, Damian arrives, Cass eventually returns to Batgirl

At this point Barbara and Helena are largely doing their own thing with the Birds of Prey and won't return to the Batfam until Reborn.

New writers all around! Adam Beechen and Fabian Nicieza on Robin, Marv Wolfman and Peter Tomasi on Nightwing, Adam Beechen on Batgirl, Grant Morrison on Batman and Paul Dini on Detective Comics.

Face the Face (2006) Batman #651-654, 'Tec #817-820 - James Robinson. The Bruce and Tim story that set up Tim's adoption.

Batman and Son (2006) Batman #655-658 - Grant Morrison. Damian's introduction to the family.

Resurrection of Ra's Al Ghul (2008) - various. Ra's tries to kidnap Damian to steal his body. Bruce, Dick and Tim go to rescue him. Dick and Tim's subplot involves the highest point of their brotherhood as Dick talks Tim out of trying resurrect his lost dead.

Robin - Beechen. #156, the suicide prevention issue, for Tim and Dick. #163, Tim and Bruce on their first Father's Day. #165, Tim and Bruce working on a car together.

Robin - Nicieza. Steph's return as Spoiler. #177, where Jason thinks he can recruit Tim (and fails miserably).

Nightwing - Wolfman. You know what? #117-122, the 'Jason dresses as Nightwing and harasses Dick and turns into a tentacle monster' saga. Does everyone like to say it's out of character? Yes. Is it Jason being just as annoying as he will proceed to be all the way to 2011? Also yes. That's Jason's post-Crisis character.

Nightwing - Tomasi. Freefall, #140-146. This is just a beautiful encapsulation of Dick's many connections, of his teamwork with Bruce and Tim, and of what makes him tick.

Heart of Hush (2008) 'Tec #846-850 - Paul Dini. The premise is ridiculous, but it's about Bruce and Selina, and about Dick and Tim helping track down Hush.

Batgirl (2008) - Adam Beechen. Beechen after squiffing it with the Evil Cass saga, gets to undo the damage to Cass's character and return her to the family. I think it's a pretty successful job, despite Dick spending the entire book holding the idiot ball so someone can be unsupportive. Cass gets adopted. Tim and Barbara never lose their faith in her.

Battle for the Cowl: EVERYONE IS FREEFORM

Everyone will tell you this is all horribly out of character. They're wrong. Come for Fabian Nicieza doing hard work to actually set up characters in the places they need to be for Reborn.

Battle for the Cowl: the Network (2009) - Fabian Nicieza. Oracle and the Birds of Prey have returned to Gotham but for reasons they're not calling themselves the Birds of Prey, so it's the Network.

Oracle The Cure (2009) - Kevin VanHook. Early set up for Wendy Harris' future plot. Babs gets the mentoring itch again.

Azrael: Death's Dark Knight (2009) - Fabian Nicieza. A new Azrael for a splinter faction of the Order of St Dumas appears. Dick and Babs are immediately suspicious (and Dick has to be talked out of immediately kicking the Azrael's butt just on the SUSPICION it might be JPV).

Also the main event books happen and everyone yells at each other a lot about who should be Batman.

Batman Reborn: Bruce is missing, Dick is Batman, Tim is Red Robin, Damian is Robin, Jason is Red Hood, Barbara is Oracle, Steph is Batgirl, Cass is Black Bat

New titles! New writers! Things all over the place! People who like Jason are going to claim all of Jason's appearances are once again out of character, but Jason fans claim that about every time Jason breathes outside of UTRH, Lost Days and a small handful of very select stories after Flashpoint. I'm just saying, villain Jason is pretty consistently irritating between 2007 and 2011.

Red Robin #1-12 (2009) - Chris Yost. Not only Tim's new costume arc, but a great look at Tim's centrality as a character to the Batfam in the number of contacts he calls in at the end of the run.

Red Robin #17 & #25 (2010) - Fabian Nicieza. Tim and Cass working together as siblings and backing each other up.

Batman & Robin #20-22 (2011) - Peter Tomasi. I would strongly argue this is the best arc in B&R with the best characterisation.

Batman & Robin (2009) - Grant Morrison. Look, a lot of people like the foundation of Dick and Damian's relationship found here. Also Jason shows up to be a pain.

Streets of Gotham (2009) - Paul Dini. There's a bunch of good storylines in this anthology book, but #5-6 with Dick, Helena and Kirk Langstrom is one I particularly like.

Batman #703 (2010) - Fabian Nicieza. The best Dick, Damian and Tim team-up issue of Reborn.

Gates of Gotham (2011) - Scott Snyder. The masterpiece of Batfamily content. Dick, Tick, Damian and Cass all feature in this and all 6 possible relationships are shown in different parts.

Batgirl #3-5, #17 (2009) - Bryan Q. Miller. Damian and Steph team ups, plus a look into the tension in the Dick and Barbara relationship at the time.

Birds of Prey #10 (2011) - Gail Simone. Barbara discusses her new realignment of how she's working as Oracle and focusing on the Bats.

The Black Mirror (2010) 'Tec #871-881 - Scott Snyder. Some of the best writing of Dick as Batman during this period, and a look into his relationships with Jim Gordon, Barbara, and Tim particularly.

The Return Home (2010) - various. Bruce comes back to Gotham after his 'death' and checks in on everyone.

#reading list recs #dc #wow that took a while #here's the batfamily #comic reading guides

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