#Odd Tracks

[songsforthepierce]

Odd Tracks: We Didn't Start the Fire by Billy Joel & Fall Out Boy Cover

So...uh I legit don't know how to start this. Okay, look, we all know the only reason I am doing this is because of the whole Fall Out Boy's quite not so good cover of it. But before I can actually talk about the cover itself we have to start with the original.

You know, as I listen to this I realized I had actually never listened to the full version of the song before. I would always hear the chorus but nothing else. This is not to say I had NEVER heard of the song before. It was that when people would use it in Anime Hell AMVs to Abridged series they would only play the chorus. Which I get why, it's the most memorable part of the song that and in my opinion the strongest part of the song.

So what is the significance of the song? Well the reason it exists in the first place was because at the time Joel just turned 40 and while he met Sean Lennon's friend who just turned 21 in the recording studio. Supposedly they had a conversation where said 21 year old talked about how it was a terrible time to turn 21 and Billy said,

"Yeah, I remember when I was 21 – I thought it was an awful time and we had Vietnam, and y'know, drug problems, and civil rights problems and everything seemed to be awful".

The young adult replied back with,

"Yeah, yeah, yeah, but it's different for you. You were a kid in the fifties and everybody knows that nothing happened in the fifties".

This took Billy aback and retorted with, "Wait a minute, didn't you hear of the Korean War or the Suez Canal Crisis?"

The main dismissal from the young adult would be the main inspiration for the creation of the song while the two headlines would be the main framework of the song. I do find it weirdly funny he mentions the Suez Canal crisis at the time when in 2021 the canal would be blocked leading to another historical event. Within the song there are 118 brief references to significant political, cultural, scientific, and sport events between the birth year of Billy Joel, 1949, to 1989. These would be listed in predominantly chronological order which makes the song feel very concise and easy to follow. That and it has a very clear intention, the world has always had chaotic events and always will. I do feel like here Billy's intent is from a genuine place of telling people of the era and even before that major historical events be it good or bad have always been a constant. That it is not new nor are the events that happened in the past any less significant than the issues in the current era.

So one of the main talking points sprouted from the recent cover is people debating whether or not the song is a low tier Billy Joel song or not. Well for me, it is in the middle. I do not think it is his best song but I do not think it is his worst. It gets the job done. But how does Billy see this song? Well in the 1993 film, Billy Joel: Shades of Grey, he talked about how he felt about the song on the more musical end with documentary director David Horn. Joel would compare the more melodic content in a more unfavorable light to his song, The Longest Time,

"Take a song like 'We Didn't Start the Fire.' It's really not much of a song … If you take the melody by itself, terrible. Like a dentist drill."

Then on chapter 14 of the book, In their Own Words by Bill DeMain, he interviewed Billy about the song and he states,

"I started doing that as a mental exercise. I had turned forty. It was 1989, and I said, “Okay, what’s happened in my life? I wrote down the year 1949… It was kind of a mind game. [It’s] one of the few times I’ve written the lyrics first, which should be obvious to why I usually prefer to write the music first, because the melody is horrendous. It’s like a mosquito droning. It’s one of the worst melodies I’ve ever written. I kind of like the lyric though."

While one could see his views on the more musical side of his song as mean I do get where he is coming from. As he stated, he prefers to write the music first then the lyrics second. When you write the melody first then you can figure out how the lyrics go but for some writing the lyrics first makes it so you have to figure out "Okay, what is the music going to sound like?" So while he may not really care for how the song sounds, it is clear he liked what he wrote. My own view of the song itself is in the middle I genuinely respect the intent behind it. The concept of showing that every era has it's negatives and positives historically is a good one. A reminder to anyone from the past and to the future. While I was listening to the song I saw these comments beneath the video,

Censoring the usernames because I don't want people to bother these people. But seeing these comments are from 1-2 years ago is funny. A forty year anniversary remake of the song would be a good idea. A lot has happened since 1989 and having an updated version of the song going from then to 2023 would be a neat expansion on the original's intent and a reminder to people about how while the era we live in now does suck in a lot of ways so too does the past.

Wait...we got that. The monkey's paw oh so curled...

Okay so let's start with a positive, the instrumental is fine. Not great but serviceable. But again, the original melody is not hard to screw up. But my main critique of the cover is the verses. The list of events are not in chronological order which makes the song feel like a mess of words. In the original the order is important, it emphasizes all the major events in a way to show the broad scope of what has happened throughout time. That and the events are in phrases. While that is true here it is bizarre to have "Michael Jackson dies" but then just have "Kurt Cobain" Like Michael Jackson dying is the only notable event of Michael Jackson's significance in the pop world while Kurt Cobain's existence lets the listener make the informed thought of BOTH his life and death are important.

You know what this cover makes me think? It really reads like a first draft. Like the band got together and went "Hey, what were the major things that happened from 1989 to 2023?" and just started shouting out what they remembered in no particular order. Then when they were done went "Yeah, that's good enough. Lets record" because I notice certain historical events are not mentioned like Occupy Wall Street, Kony 2012, Gamergate, Ferguson, Flint Michigan water crisis, Hurricane Katrina, Covid-19, and many more. It just feels so incomplete and emphasizes that his cover is such a big miss opportunity. While I don't want to assume no effort was put into this cover it does come off like the effort to passion wasn't really there. It makes whatever got intention they had get so muddy. Though the lyric change that stood out to me was in the chorus,

We didn't start the fire It was always burning since the world's been turning We didn't start the fire No, we didn't light it but we're trying to fight it

This is the strongest part of the whole cover. The intention of that while all this shit has been happening that we are trying to change things for the better. But the fact this is just a tiny nugget within a mess pile just makes said pile look more disorganized than before.

I know this is like the only to first time I have really made a review on something one would consider relevant I only did so because I am just baffled by it all.

[peepingwizard]

oh kid....

[canisalbus]

Hi!! I don't know if anyone has drawn this before (sorry if they have!! I couldn't find any evidence of it) but I have recently been plagued with the question of "what if Machete and Vasco were in Bluey?"

Well. Now we know.

To my knowledge, the only Bluey dogs who wear clothes are the ones in uniforms. TECHNICALLY Machete's outfit could count, but I left it out because it's not typical of a main character. He must be naked 😔

.

[syoddeye]

price and laswell are two sides of the same coin to me in the way that they’re gonna take care of you, because they know best. but while kate will convince you to see things her way, price will make you follow his direction.

[beanie-spirk]

Deathwatch (1966) a.k.a that time Leonard Nimoy was in a gay prison movie

[race-week]

Tbh this season has come a long way from the two Red Bull’s, miles ahead driving off into the sunset in Bahrain and Jeddah

[carmenpeach]

its fascinating seeing ppl constantly make posts all "dont reduce badass female characters to the mommy role" and then immediatly turnaround and make rouge a like doting soft gentle patient caretaker. she would sell overpriced weed to shadow. crake even

[felsicveins]

Y'all know who has my OTHER vote : D omo Leonardo had my heart

@rottmntpeepawpolls

[unnonexistence]

it's true that hermann's clothing aesthetic is mostly something along the lines of "dorky professor," but i think it's really more like 80% dorky professor, 20% military surplus. (that 20% is probably all ppdc gear, but the Aesthetic™ of the ppdc gear is milsurp).

like, hermann's a practical guy. he cares more about the function of his clothes than the appearance (see: glasses cord, oversized parka). he's also been working for the ppdc since he was in his mid-20s. you can't tell me he doesn't own, like, fleece quarter-zip tops in neutral colours and too-big "one size fits all" sweatpants with "P.P.D.C." stamped on the side.

[songsforthepierce]

Odd Tracks: They’re Coming to Take Me Away Ha! Haa!... - Napoleon XIV

So this is a song I haven’t thought about in YEARS. when I was looking through what music I had I saw this and went “...oh yeah, this song.”

I debated about doing this but content warning for light discussions on ableism and institutionalization. I didn’t really expect doing that on this fucking song but here we are.

So I found this song in a video that was similar to AMV Hell back in...maaaybe 2007 or 2008? Hard to remember. But anyway, I remember buying the song, listening to it from time to time and then just moved on. Now that I came back to this song I realized this only could have been used during the big AMV Hell era of the time. I cannot imagine this being used today. Well I say that when as I am typing this maybe someone will use it in a TikTok or something.

I looked into this song and learned some things. First off is that the artist goes under Napoleon XIV which I know isn’t interesting but to me the only reason that stands out is because when I got it on itunes at the time they label him under “Napoleon’s Ghost”. Why? I don’t know. Moving on from that the artist’s real name is Jerry Samuels and he is from America. Secondly the song was released in 1966 and was a chart hit reaching number 1 on U.S. Cash Box Top 100, number 3 on US Billboard Top 100, number 4 in UK Singles Chart, number 2 on Canada RPM Top Singles, and number 40 on Australia’s Kent Music Report. I am actually surprised it topped that high in the US, Canada, and UK during the time period (find it funny it was lower in Australia though). You know, I can 100% believe this being a one hit wonder. Novelty songs getting that status isn’t new (i.e. Grandma Got Run Over by a Reindeer). However, this being high within most of the charts is what baffles me. It being number 40? more believable. But it being within the top 4? That is just confusing for me. Was there nothing else going on in 1966 for this to happen? I guess so. Hell, the guy was awarded a gold disc. Well with all of that said what is this song about? What made this such a hit?

The song is about a man, or in this case Napoleon XIV (this was Jerry’s character or something), being taken away to a mental institution. Why? Because his girlfriend broke up with him which is what is causing his insanity. Actually wait, no, it was because he lost his dog. Haha...funny...okay look, I get it is one of those “Oh tee hee look how CRAZY this character is. Oh isn’t it funny they went insane and are being institutionalized! Oh how quirky!” songs which are not uncommon. I am not gonna say it is the worse song or even the worse song about this type of thing. But I will say it did not really age well and it is very much partially a product of the culture. Well I say partially because Samuels did point out he felt like this song would come off like it was making fun of the mentally ill but that him throwing in the line at the end about the dog would somehow make this okay. You know, how wikipedia worded what he said is weirdly better than what he actually said at the time. The whole “Sickies” line is not great. I know I could talk about how a song like this technically makes light about mental illness and institutionalization especially since the abuse that goes on in places as such has gotten more attention over the years. However, I think we all know this and I already stated my general feelings on the song. Plus the guy was 28 at the time which does explain his attitude at the time. Nowadays I actually don’t know what he does and frankly I really don’t care.Though, I would I have ended this all here but I found more info on the song.

The song you may noticed uses snare drum, bass drum, tambourine, and hand clap rhythm throughout. Samuels’ vocals are not sung melodically but instead spoken rhythmically while the pitch of his vocals rises and falls at key points which creates an odd glissando effect. This is increased by the wailing sirens that were added in the song as well. Now this made me look up what a glissando is which is described as “a glide to one pitch to another”. Though what was interesting to me was the fact that Samuels was able to do the vocal pitch shifts by basically doing a variation on what the creator of Alvin and the Chipmunks did. Samuels at the time was working as a record engineer at the time which does explain all the sound stuff he was able to do on the track. A lot of it is talked about in Who Wrote a Book About Love? which I actually recommend reading the parts where he talks about all the technical stuff he did for the song. To be honest how he made the more technical aspects of the song is way more interesting than the song itself. I would have also ended all this here but then I found out this song as sequels.

Okay yeah, this song has sequels which I do not understand. Yes, this was a popular song which got banned by some stations because of the subject matter but were there people who REALLY wanted a sequel to this? Though I guess before I talk about that I should start will saying this song has a B-side. So the B-side is the same song but it is played in reverse. This fucking sounds like a song people would try to make theories about subliminal messages being inserted in. That or something out of a bad creepypasta. The most notable thing about this song is that rock critic, Dave Marsh, in his book Book of Rock Lists said the B-side is the “most obnoxious song ever to appear in a jukebox” which he claims this song cleared out a diner of forty people two minutes flat. I don’t know why but that made me remember that whole What’s New Pussy Cat meme from years back. Anyway, the fact this B-side was on a jukebox in a diner is just baffling to me. Why would someone put that on there unless they really wanted to annoy everyone in the restaurant? I would leave too if that came on. Now that I got the B-side out of the way now I can talk about the multiple sequels. The first one is I'm Happy They Took You Away, Ha-Haaa! and it’s just the same fucking song. The instrumentals sound like a bootleg of the original. The only difference is that this is about the woman happy she sent the guy away. The only notable things about this song was this was recorded Bryna Raeburn of CBS Radio Mystery Theater under Josephine XV. The second sequel is They Took You Away, I'm Glad, I'm Glad  which is I guess recorded by Josephine which appeared on These Are the Hits, You Silly Savages by Teddy & Darrel. The video of someone playing it on a promotional CD is all I could really find. I think there was one other video with the song but I guess this wasn’t popular. I am not shocked though because it is just the same song, again. I am not going to count the variation of the original song where Samuels says, “THEY'RE TRYING TO DRIVE ME SANE!!! HA HA“ different at the end as a sequel but I guess I should mention it for completion sake. “Emperor Bob” Hudson made a song called I’m Normal which is about the brother of the main character with the claims that no one will get him because he is so normal. The concept on paper sounded more funny to interesting for me because it just makes me think of all of those “I’m so normal memes”. Sadly when I listened to the song it sucked. How many times are they going to make the same song but slightly alter the tune of the song? Well, I guess they only did this four times because the forth and final sequel was made by Sameuls himself in 1988. All the other sequels were made in 1966, the same year as the original, which kind of makes sense with the fact that would be at the height of the popularity of the original. But 1988 feels like it is late to the party. Anyway, the last sequel is called They're Coming To Get Me Again, Ha Haaa! where Napoleon XIV has been released from institutionalization but alas that doesn’t last long as his fear of going back leads him being taken in. My opinion on all of these songs is lower than the original mainly because they really don’t really do much from the original concept. All of them just sound like bootlegs of one another but not even an enjoyable bootleg.

I was originally going to look into the covers of this song (yes this song had covers) but I just don’t care anymore. I already spent more time on this song than I originally intended. So yeah, this song exists and I won’t be listening to it or any of it’s variants again.

[glitteringcrab]

Nip this in the bud (2)

Okay, I think I finally figured out what Rick Prime was hoping to accomplish with this:

Because I was all "WTF" during that scene.

First things first:

It's clear that Rick Prime has been monitoring Rick C-137 during this whole time. Maybe not continually monitoring him, but monitoring him often enough that he knows:

Rick lived in the Prime Dimension

Rick is hanging out with Morty Prime

Rick has two Beths now (LOL) "echoes" of Prime's daughter since C-137 Beth never grew up

Likewise, he knew Rick C-137 was accompanied by Morty Prime, and could tell (without actually checking nor monitoring this, because then he wouldn't have fallen for Evil Morty's trick) that one of the Mortys Rick C-137 showed up with was Morty Prime, his original grandson.

In a similar vein, it's theoretically possible that he has some inkling of Evil Morty's identity. I mean, otherwise why tell him "you're like an evil Morty, a clever one". Um, excuse me? Evil Morty didn't do a single "evil" thing during the Prime fight. Why the heck call him "evil"? Just because he's wearing an eyepatch? WEAK. Call him clever, sure. But evil? Nope.

UNLESS... Rick Prime has also sporadically been monitoring the happenings in the Citadel of Ricks. News of Evil Rick's killing spree might have reached him, he might have read witness accounts and known that Evil Rick was accompanied by an eye-patched Morty who disappeared (although I seriously doubt anyone would bother to write more than a single sentence on Evil Morty in any report). Or he may have noticed (you know, after he was teleported in the Prime dimension right after Evil Morty contaminated EVERYONE'S portal travel) that the Citadel blew up, that there was a breach in the Central Finite Curve, and he might have investigated the ruins out of curiosity. He might have found out Stuff.

(Edit: nah, the name "Evil Morty" was mentioned a couple of times in the box, so Rick Prime using it only means that he was paying attention to what was happening in the Box)

In any case, even if all that isn't true, even if Rick Prime had originally no clue that there ever was any animosity between Rick C-137 and Evil Morty, and him calling Evil Morty "Evil" was just a lucky guess, Prick Prime was definitely able to tell that was no love between Evil Morty and Rick C-137 during this scene:

...in which he uses Evil Morty as a literal human shield and Rick C-137 shoots without hesitation (on a different note, I'd like to say how sad is that when strangled Evil Morty doesn't have the presence of mind to try and use any of his implants; he's just a 14 year old boy against an grown-up man at that moment. Forget shooting him with plasma guns; you can literally just strangle him).

And so we come to this scene:

Okay, Rick Prime could already tell that Evil Morty and Rick C-137 weren't family, but the suggestion of "nip this in the bud" was still absurd!

(I've written a similar post in the past while venting, but this one is actually getting somewhere, so please bear with me)

Because Evil Morty and Rick C-137 were, at worst, temporary allies. Rick C-137 owned to Evil Morty:

his freaking life (Evil Morty revived him)

his revenge (Evil Morty let him kill Rick Prime)

and (depending on to what degree Rick Prime was monitoring his clones and the killing box) he might have also known that Evil Morty helped Rick C-137 track Rick Prime down and helped him to escape the box.

That's a huge debt. And I know that Evil Morty helped Rick C-137 to save his own skin from getting Omega-ed if/when Rick C-137 failed to win, and to get the weapon plans, but he wasn't at all obligated to save Rick C-137's life nor to hand him his nemesis on a plate.

Arguably, Evil Morty did this precisely so that he'd have an Omega-enslaved and morally indebted Rick to come to his aid in a hypothetical future hour of need. However, the truth is that Evil Morty and Rick C-137 worked well with each other since the beginning of the episode, before any Omega Device threat (nor carrot!) dangled in front of Evil Morty to influence his decisions (he had just wanted to... talk) and Rick had trusted him enough to leave Morty Prime alone with him.

Like, under normal circumstances, Evil Morty honoring their alliance during the Prime Fight could have been the beginning of a friendship (or at least a more honest and permanent alliance) between Rick C-137 and Evil Morty. Evil Morty is insecure and traumatized enough to need the failsafe of the Omega Device backing him up, but Rick C-137 was game...!

Rick Prime instead puts in Rick C-137's head the idea that Evil Morty might kill him in a tantrum. Not because their interests might clash in the future. Not because Evil Morty may get power-hungry when he grows up. But because he's young and emotional. (Mind you, this is about a boy whose whole characterization revolves around being extremely cautious and calculating; not someone who'd kill another person in a fit of fury.)

Of course, the first idea that pops up in our minds (at least... it was in mine) is that Rick Prime said this hoping that Rick C-137 will drop everything to go stop Evil Morty, and so Rick Prime would get a chance to escape.

...But that doesn't make any sense, either!

Rick C-137 isn't so stupid as to give Rick Prime that chance of survival. Even if he took Rick Prime's warning seriously, he'd hurriedly shoot him in the face before running out to deal with Evil Morty. Rick Prime was toast, and he knew that. This wasn't about his own survival.

Rick C-137 wasn't about to take his worst enemy's advice to turn against his temporary ally. Like, what the heck? Since when Rick Prime fancied himself trustworthy? He could have easily lied, made this up. Rick C-137 couldn't have actually known if Evil Morty really had the weapon plans at that moment, and he'd have to take Rick Prime's word for it. No way he'd drop everything at his worst enemy's word.

Rick Prime saw that Evil Morty downloaded the weapon plans straight on his person. There was no external device that you can just snatch away (like the cone thing Evil Morty used when scanning Rick C-137's brain). So Rick Prime knew that the only way to "nip this in the bud" would be for Rick C-137 to run outside, confront Evil Morty, find out that there was no external device to forcefully take from him, and promptly attack him with lethal intent. But, come on, Rick C-137 was not going to do that, because of the aforementioned debt. Even Rick C-137 isn't so ruthless as to have his own life saved one minute, and him returning the favor with a murder attempt. This was never going to work.

Even if Rick C-137 took Rick Prime's warning seriously, even he trusted his advice, even if he was willing to murder a version of his grandson (to whom his owned his life) in cold blood, I doubt he could do it. He was a mess physically, while Evil Morty was perfectly fine. If they did clash at that moment, I think Evil Morty could have escaped easily with a portal. So this was never going to work.

And don't even get me started on what a joke it is for the Rick who wanted to murder Rick C-137's whole family, one by one, to express Rick-to-Rick camaraderie. As if...!

So what was all this for? This would never work, Rick C-137 would not try to kill Evil Morty at that moment...

...but he can do it in the future.

Any seeds of trust or appreciation that were planted that day were promptly poisoned by Rick Prime's "well-meaning" warning.

Evil Morty himself did trample said seeds further by warning Rick C-137 he could kill him any time he wanted as of now, but he also said that "using a weapon like this doesn't get you. Left. Alone." His whole speech would have hit very differently without Rick Prime's warning. We would have trusted him, we would have trusted that he did all this with the single goal of being left alone and that this is going to be the end of it. Worse case scenario, we would have thought Evil Morty might demand Rick C-137's support for A Thing (like a slave) if he had no other choice, but we still wouldn't have thought Evil Morty would murder him in a flight of rage during a disagreement. Now, the idea that Evil Morty might become unhinged in the future has been planted in our heads, by Rick Prime!

We fans were discussing on how the narrative seems to be setting Evil Morty as the final villain, but it's not the narrative, not really! It's Rick Prime manipulating Rick C-137, hoping he'll attack Evil Morty sometime in the future, so they can kill each other.

He fueled Rick C-137' paranoia on purpose, so as to get delayed revenge on the Rick who dared to think himself better than him... and on the one person who actually bested him.

[hey-hamlet]

Little mouse au, does Izuku sleep in Eraserhead's scarf? Nedzu had him when he went to work at UA when Izuku was around 3 years old.

Oh 100% - you have to be careful when Izuku is around at UA because he always gets into the tiniest, coziest spots and no one wants to sit on him. Aizawa, on pain of death, will never admit he thinks its really cute. Partly to preserve his frightening persona - partly because Nezu is possessive about his baby and his teeth are sharp.

[oneread]

I’ve been introduced to the concept of ace x law and I think I have the funniest possible version of this.

Luffy catches up to Ace in Impel Down and they escape. The government isn’t going to admit they let two high profile criminals with such complicated history get away and their connection to each other stays a secret.

They go their separate ways again and Ace either meets or reconnects with Law. Law has heard a million and a half things about Ace’s baby brother but he has not heard a very crucial fact, his actual name. Whether this is because Ace is secretive to protect Luffy or because the brothers are allergic to plot relevant information sharing is not important.

What is important is Law goes to Punk Hazard without Ace. He makes an alliance with Luffy and is perturbed at every turn by the Straw Hat crew. These people haunt even his dreams with their absolute nonsense. He has very few opportunities to bitch to his [boyfriend, casual occasional partner, fwb, qpr, however you want to see the relationship] about this horrible crew. Their conversations are short due to plot and there are other things he would rather talk about. So it somehow happens that he never says the name of the crew or the insane captain.

Ace is going to meet them in Dressrosa and Law is relived that finally he will have reasonable, enjoyable company. He’s waiting for them when they dock, but while they are still far away Luffy spots Ace and flings himself off the ship, tackling his brother and calling his name. Law is in shock, poor Ace is also caught in this annoying crew's trap? Why had he never mentioned? And then Luffy is calling out to Robin, Franky, and Brook and telling them to come meet his brother Ace.

Law just lies down right there on the deck of the Sunny while his brain bluescreens. Ace has to come pick him up and drag him off the ship.

[y-rhywbeth2]

Ye Olde Publishers were like 'People play D&D for adventuring and killing shit, they don't care about random minutia like the textiles industry. And they want the gods' avatars statted so they can fight them and cool powers for their clerics, they don't need the finer points of the life of a priest also we fear angry Christian mothers from the 80s will murder us in our beds if we don't toe the line very carefully'

And then there's me, like I do! I do! I want the random roleplaying trivia!

Only this morning, staring at my embroidery hoop I was remembering Astarion's hobby and wondering if Toril had different names for the stitches or unique fantastical methods, and whether Astarion favoured human or elven patterns/techniques.

And I need to know what obligations and restrictions Shadowheart, Durge, Jaheira, Orin and Gortash (and etc etc) have aside from the colour stuff and the insane Banite dress codes. What are some standard hymns and prayers? Does anybody have religous dietary restrictions? Do Bhaalists drink human blood as part of a pre-dinner ritual?

I love random trivia that serves no purpose except for absolutely random roleplaying things. I could've had that instead of blowing up the setting every few years and then rearranging the furniture again and again so that I can never keep the timeline straight. Where's my evil Bane-worshipping secret society that will aid me in taking over WotC and using my tyranny to this effect?

[pastafossa]

Late to the party, first time watching DD completely, not in bits and pieces.

Ya know, thinking about it, in TRT, you've added ANOTHER parallel to Fisk and Matt.

They both fall in love with women who enable them.

Vanessa reassures Fisk that he's doing the right thing, that he's not to blame for what happened as a kid.

Jane reassures Matt that he's doing the right thing, that he's not to blame for what happened as a kid.

They both calm the raging fury that's inside of them.

I'd love to see Venessa and Jane have a conversation, just one. Just to see their personalities bounce off of eachother. I have a feeling Jane would start to show her teeth and Venessa would start to show her second face by the end of it.

(Not fully caught up with trt)

YESSSSSSSS! And that's the thing, like - the parallels between Matt and Fisk have always been an amazing piece of writing for me in canon. They set it up so beautifully, weaving in all these layers where you see how similar they are, but also slightly different: their first drink with their father (Matt while stitching up his dad, Fisk trying to please his dad), their father's deaths, the rage, trying to 'fix' the city, etc. And so it felt right to show something similar with Matt and Jane versus Fisk and Vanessa who, spoiler alert: I also fucking love as a couple.

Both are arguably healthy (ish) relationships in their own way. Supportive, loving. Like you said, they encourage or enabling the other depending on the circumstance/where you're standing: you're doing the right thing. I believe in you even when no one else does. You can do this. You're not to blame for what happened then. They're kind to their partners. And neither of them are as innocent as Matt and Fisk initially think.

But much like Matt and Fisk, there are slight differences, showing the different ways the wheels can turn even in similar people, namely in the way Vanessa leans into that personal darkness, and Jane is, at least for now, trying to lean away from it. Because Vanessa's very comfortable, confident with strolling through that darkness, as is fitting for a villain power couple. Jane meanwhile is more like someone who's trying for the second time to cross a Decent Person wire above a darkened I Want To Murder Many People canyon but she slipped and is now hanging onto it upside down, holding onto that rope with her teeth, fingers, and toes all while Circumstance butters her fingers and Matt desperately uses his balancing pole to swat at Circumstance from the nearby wire Matt himself is barely walking labeled 'Violent Catholic Vigilante Issues'.

ANYWAY, I agree. I think Vanessa and Jane would have a lot to talk about, and the push and pull between them both would be really interesting! Because there's so much they agree on, and yet, there's just enough different that ooooh... that slow build in tension would be delicious. How long before the masks fell, and they both got a true sense of the other? Only time would tell.

[anxiously-sidequesting]

Hey so I'm curious, if y'all have ever thought about this reblog/tags/notes with your favorite spell casting sound (the little music notes/sounds that play as you cast a spell)