#Miraculous fandom salt

[bananzer]

The problem with many Miraculous Ladybug fans is that most of them GENUINELY think the writers are SO BAD at their jobs all the time forever which means when we are given things like foreshadowing and dramatic irony it flies over the fans' heads instead of registering as the literary devices they are.

[richardsphere]

So there's a strange "defense" of Miraculous I've seen crop up on occasion. The idea that everything wrong about the Lovesquare powerdynamic is deliberate and will all be explored next season (lets put aside that this defense has been cropping up for 3 seasons now). The claim that Soon(TM), the writers are gonna make the characters face the concequences and explore the fallout of the entire jenga-tower of BS they've been "carefully" setting up all along... Which... isnt a defense I vibe with, cause it fundamentally boils down to "its not a Kids Rolemodel Show, its a deconstruction of a Kids Rolemodel Show". It's a defence that would place Marinette alongside Tyler Durden, Walter White and Rick Sanchez in the "you werent supposed to relate to them" pantheon. And while i think there are plenty of reasons that deconstruction is a usefull tool (even if i hate the dime-a-dozen "Childrens Fairytale but its depression" and "Superman, but psycho"' decon-stories out there). I'd argue 'Kids Rolemodel Show' is the one genre that should never be deconstructed, or at least not in the slow-burn,long-form way the people arguing this claim the show to be doing. And i hold that stance for one simple two-part reason: Poe's law, and the fact that the deconstructed genre is aimed at an audience with absolute zero media-literacy. (reminder: "5-6 year old kids" is the one audience where that is not an insult, simply a statement of fact.) A show aimed deconstructing a genre with an audience for whom it may actually be their first big piece of media is legitimately dangerous. Because there is no way a 5 year old can be expected to tell "deconstruction of a formulaic kids cartoon" from "Formulaic kids cartoon". The idea that "they've been making Marinette into a bad example deliberately and are going to reveal the entire show to have been a carefull ruse in season 6/7" is supposed to be a defense? Its frankly absurd. A 6 year kid who watched the show when it first aired and idolised Ladybug, could be old enough to drink by the time S6 reveals she was supposed to be a bad example. A little girl who based her relationships on the way Mari pursues romance would have a restraining order by the time the show indends to pull this twist. And some of y'all are claiming that "actually its a long-form deconstruction" is a defense? I legit don't get y'all.

[fille-de-skroa]

Kids understood Miraculous better than most of the adults MLB fans out there. This says something about the mentality of the fandom.

[matt0044]

I don't think it's wrong to question how Miraculous depicts rather touchy topics.

One can question where things fall short as I do think not all tangos with the censors ("Qulin" deeeeeefinately could've used one last drafting) come out perfectly yet I find myself seeing an earnest effort rather than something done for shock value.

At worst, it's clumsy yet charming for me.

What I do NOT agree is the sentiment I've seen lately is that they shouldn't be in the show at all? Frankly, I've always liked it when cheesy shows that embraced their silliness didn't shy away from more down to Earth conflicts.

I will stan Representation for how it depicted Colt's abuse towards Felix in a way that gets around TV-Y7 standards. Namely in how being a Sentimonster enabled Colt to sublimate his anger on his son without the wounds being as visible.

You also have Gabriel taking advantage of his son's true nature via emotional manipulation that's deep enough to linger even when afar. Seriously, Gabriel coming out of the dark with a cold, "No," was a perfect illustration.

However, it feels like some fans take the depiction of abuse is tantamount to endorsing abuse even when it's depicted in the poor light it should be under. Frankly, kids shows should be allowed to delve into ugly aspects of life that will involve them.

Like can we "think of the children" insofar as letting them learn of life's darkness so they can appreciate the light?

[nerdy-chocomallow]

One thing I noticed to that many Chloé fans failed to realize that Sabrina and Chloé friendship is toxic as hell and try to make sure they stay together even as an couple. It’s why I don’t like chlobrina, it less like two separate characters and more of Sabrina being a prop or object to Chloé, it’s why I like daddycop a lot. We got to explore Sabrina a lot more without her playing second fiddle to Chloé. Honestly, I just wish we got to focus on Sabrina before season 6, so we could gotten her without a lot sooner.

[eris-the-phantom-thief]

Alrighty, so it looks like the salt has already begun to flow since the start of season six. So here is an OOC of defense for Mari.

In Marinette’s defense:

Poor Mari is clearly not in a good place mentally after the whole thing and emotionally after Monarch.

Combined with the knowledge that the butterfly miraculous is in the hands of someone worse and way more dangerous now…

yeah try telling me that you would be completely fine after that. Poor girl probably has a ton of anxiety afterwards.

And considering the secret she has now, she probably doesn’t feel good enough for Adrian because she has that huge secret.

(And before anyone craps on her for having that secret, let me break down a few reasons why it’s for the best that she doesn’t tell people right now.

1. She now knows that Adrian is a senti, and thus risking him being akumatized is very dangerous.

2.She knows the miraculous is in the hands of someone WAY WORSE than Gabriel.

3.Adrien and Kagami would most likely be turned into scapegoats by the masses because of their connections to the culprits. Since Gabriel isn’t around anymore, they’re absolutely gonna turn them into scapegoats. Best case scenario they would just be social pariah, and worst case scenario they could actually be in danger.

4.Baby girl basically got emotionally blackmailed by the jerk.

5.ALSO ADRIEN CATACLYSMED GABRIEL That knowledge would actually destroy him knowing that he basically killed his dad. Abuser or not that's gonna mess him up.

Edit: do the people trying to say, “oh but he technically didn’t cataclysm him, it was Gabriel’s fault”

Do you really think that would make a difference to him? The fact means that it would have been his cataclysm that did it.

Even with the knowledge of it being Monarch, it still messed him up the fact that his catechism had hit a human being. 

Let’s take a look at how we reacted in canon, using the transcript.

Monarch screams in extreme pain, to Cat Noir's horror.)

Cat Noir: No! (Ladybug releases her yo-yo from their arms) Why did he do that? Is he crazy?

Monarch: (continues to groan in pain) Checkmate, Ladybug!

(Ladybug gasps as Monarch finds yet another way to escape the two heroes.)

Monarch: Nooroo, Kaalki, unify! (Kaalki enters the glasses) Voyage!

(A portal appears beneath him and slowly gets sucked in it, along with the Kwamis.)

Barkk: Help! I want to stay with you!

(The portal closes. Ladybug is on her knees in frustration.)

Ladybug: (on the verge of tears) We had him! We almost had him! The Kwamis were safe! They were right here!

Cat Noir: I cataclysmed him... I don’t believe this! I just cataclysmed someone! Granted it was Monarch, but there’s a real person behind that mask and... it must have hurt him terribly. M’lady, you’ve gotta fix this!

Ladybug: Cat Noir, Monarch just ran away with my lucky charm. Without it, I can’t fix anything. I can’t call up my power and undo the effects of the cataclysm. There’s nothing I can do.

(Cat Noir falls onto his knees, devastated by the events that went over.)

[red-balloon12]

Why are people still saying Chloe’s arc in season 2 is “non-existent”? And incomplete/backtracked arc isn’t the same as an arc that doesn’t exist. No matter how many people wanna say Chloe wasn’t changing in S2, she was. There were genuine glimpses of development that got reset after every episode and you can’t put that as a “Chloe not learning anything” situation because EVERY CHARACTER GETS EFFECTED BY THE RESET-

[thecoolcatstuff]

"Marinette had no reason to fall in love with Adrien in the movie."

uh... and it did in the series? What exactly was so different in the series? The umbrella scene AND the library scene were basicaly the same?!? basically Adrien being kind to Marinette, exchanging a few words and walking away getting on with his life. They barely talked.

"b-but he opens up to her!"

he didnt though? He just apologeticaly justified his actions in one sentence. Nothing crazy about it, its not like they sat down and had an hour-long conversation about their feelings. Hell. he did the same with Nino in the same day and its not treated as a romantic deal-breaker for them.

In both scenes Marinette didnt fell for Adrien because she "saw his true side" or because "it was fate", but because he was a cute boy that was kinda nice and gave her attention. AND thats okay. Because in real life thats how love happens, not in the great gestures and ultra-romantic scenes but the mundane things that make you attracted to a person, while love grows in the long run.

I hate how modern romantic portrayal in media has made us numb to this kind of thing, and Im all up for starting to normalize this.

[kittysuicoffee]

Being in the miraculous ladybug fandom for a long while makes me wonder why Chloe doesn’t get as much hate as Lila… I mean think I had seen people wanting Chloe to be redeemed while Chloe hadn’t done anything to get that redemption key. The few times she does something nice is when she wants something from others. Sabrina and Adrien are good examples of this Chloe did something mean to Sabrina which caused her to be akumatized in that same episode Sabrina forgave her because Chloe gave her something to show her “friendship” same thing with Adrien! Adrien ended the friendship Chloe not wanting to lose Adrien act being nice to show she being nice and when the friendship was reconnected she went back to the way she was! There a problem with that Chloe does something horrible and mean she never gets calls out for it when she doesn’t she does something to make the person forgave her and she back to what she’s doing before. I don’t think people in this fandom realize that they are being played like a fool Thomas had clearly no intention on redeeming Chloe if he did had that intention he’s doing it wrong. I don’t know or like the man but still Chloe was never made to be redeemed. This I am calling is a false redemption when you are a writer you have to show a character progressing or deprogressingin a show book comic or whatever Chloe character never went through development she stay as she is to beginning middle and end she never changed. (I had never written a show before but you get the point) also the writing is bad this is just my opinion it’s not an attack on Chloe fan girls and boys I am just saying it’s crazy Lila get a lot of hate while Chloe doesn’t get much of it… Gabriel is also shit too but his a villain so who’s cares he was made to be disliked. Mme. Bustier is a shit teacher that let Chloe get away with anything… this woman should had never been a teacher in the first place…

[strawberrystar7]

When the Miraculous fandom complains about Chloé’s redemption Arc

Have you guys noticed that everytime someone complains about Chloé and her redemption Arc they always bring Thomas Astruc and his immaturity up? It’s always the same pattern. People hating on Thomas Astruc, calling him “Asstruc” or saying he hates on a fictional character or saying how he holds a grudge over a childhood bully of his. Or they will say anything after Season 2 is not canon simply because they don’t like it. Some of these people are adults complaining about the immaturity of a grown man.

But what they never notice is that they’re being just as immature. Seriously they remind me of Lila Rossi holding a grudge against Ladybug for 9 months straight because Ladybug called Lila out for lying infront of Adrien. Yes it was uncalled for and Ladybug should have pulled Lila aside (granted Lila would have probably exploded even if Ladybug had talked to Lila in private because Lila is unhinged but whatever) but holding a grudge over something for such a long time to the point where you want them to die? Like… Lila literally asked Oni-Chan (akumatized Kagami) to kill Ladybug. I’ve seen people wishing Astruc would die. These people are literally just like Lila in that regard. Immature and holding grudges over a ridiculous amount of time. They’re like Lila holding a grudge against Thomas Astruc for not giving Chloé a redemption arc. Like come on. It’s been years since the redemption arc thing… can y’ll just stop? It’s annoying and won’t happen regardless of how much you complain about it.

It’s like watching toddlers fighting. If you want to complain about Thomas Astruc being immature, don’t be immature about it yourself. You’re just being a hypocrite.

The immaturity doesn’t just come in regards to Chloé’s redemption arc and Thomas Astruc tho. I’ve also seen it from other Miraculous fans regarding to topics that had nothing to do with Chloé. Like someone insulting me and calling me a 6 year old because I said Marinette and Adrien are in Middle School and 14 years old throughout Seasons 1 to 5 and not in High School or 16/17. And when I came with actual quotes from episodes they suddenly went silent. I mean I can be immature too but I usually apologize when I realize I’m being mean or something. But some fans take it to the extreme.

It’s the worst on Twitter, YouTube and Reddit actually. People like this probably exist on Tumblr too but the discussions I’ve had on Tumblr were rather civil, even when we had opposing opinions. Social Media platforms have become a hell hole regardless of the platform. People nowadays just want to fight.

[eggheadsguidetorunning]

HAD TO RE-UPLOAD This because of a YOUTUBE copyright shit.

I'm kinda of suspicious of later copyrights while trying to get this uploaded being dubious. But the first one

[richardsphere]

Rebuffing Miraculous new blame-shifting meme.

I'm sure you've seen the new meme going around miraculous fandom spaces: Either in the form of a gifset, collage or clip-montage set to sad music. It goes like this: "Isnt it ironic... that the miraculous of destruction... created a person... and that the miraculous of creation... destroyed a person..." put over either a montage of Adrien in cherrypicked 'happy' moments, and Marinette at her objectively lip-quiveringly saddest? --- No the power of creation did not "destroy a person" Marinette's own dithering and controlling nature did. Marinette destroyed herself and Tikki has repeatedly try to steer Marinette away from those behaviours, but marinette keeps ignoring her. And it also outright ignores the fact that the fallout of the Hawkmoth battle has made Adrien spiral into an equal-if-not-worse depression then Marinette (that the show is playing more subtly because, either charitably "they're playing it subtle to give it grace/build narrative tension" or less charitably "because only marinette's emotions matter to the writers") Its a way for mari's stans to pretend that adrien is the one being given preferential treatment by the writers.

This meme feels like its blaming Tiki for Marinette's flaws. It's yet another way for the fandom to make Marinette escape responsibility for her actions and to shift the blame to Tikki for 'ruining her life' and Adrien for 'secretly being writer's real favourite child".

[fille-de-skroa]

Why do Miraculous fans think that Thomas Astruc hate Chloe?? Because he didn’t have her a redemption arc she didn’t even need?

It’s not hating a character to make them an antagonist, or just a bad person. People love Disney vilains for a reason. And Thomas created Chloe to be a mean girl.

Season 3 showed that her character had more depth, that bad things happened to her when she was little, and that she has a softer side… But that doesn’t mean Chloe should suddenly become a good person. It just means that Chloe’s character is complex.

But the show made it clear until now why Chloe couldn’t get a redemption arc: she doesn’t want to change. She wants to keep her privileges and treat everyone like they were inferior to her. She can’t possibly get a redemption arc now.

[matt0044]

“Wasted Potential.” What is that? What even is that?

I’ll tell you what it is: some entitled fan who feels a promise by the narrative was broken. A promise that usually was never made to begin with.

And so they vent about it, as they are free to do, but feel the need to try and “legitimize” it as some social ill up there with Donald Trump.

I’m tried of pretending it’s not.

[t4tadrienette]

It is so annoying to see people say "they gave the male characters redemption arcs while to the female characters nothing, the writers are misogynistic" so let's see

Gabriel Agreste I will put the tweets from the creator that pretty obviously should make you think that was not a redemption, but do with that information as you please

Félix, mmmmm I'd like to say that Félix got more of a Vegeta arc rather than a redemption arc

Now do you want to know who actually got a fully redemption arc where they even tried to kill off Gabriel Agreste, right, you guessed it Nathalie, a female character, a woman

So I don't know maybe if you wanna complain about Chloé not getting a redemption, don't pull the misogyny card you know

[aeonghaseyo]

Do you know if Maria is using two accounts to act like she has a friend on this site again? I've seen this claws-and-bee-stings blog reblog a lot of shipsandpuns stuff.

@claws-and-bee-stings is a separate blog, not an account of Pee Girl’s. For one, this chump is brave enough to insult me for not perceiving sarcasm even without a tone indicator.

Pee Girl, on the other hand, is a coward.

Other than that, the former account is one that I think existed previously independent of Pee Girl, such that they never engaged with the sicko before (I think?)