#thomas astruc

[certifiedducky]

It’s so weird that thomas astruc claims that chloe was never meant to be redeemed when it is the only thing that makes sense based on the first three seasons. Like, why introduce Lila as the secondary/civilian antagonist if Chloe was never going to become good? Why not have another character being developed as the bee miraculous holder during seasons 1-3? Why give Chloe such a complicated backstory/home life if you don’t want people to sympathize with her?

something that really gets me is the fact that zoe was introduced so late in the show. like, there’s absolutely no way she was a character that was planned to be there from the start, and if she WAS always meant to be introduced, the writing is abysmal. She seems to have been added so astruc could say “see? chloe being neglected by her mother and acting like her in an attempt to gain love isn’t an excuse. zoe had the same mom, and SHES a good person.” like, how gross is it to make two victims and say that one of them is “good” and the other is “bad” based on their reactions to childhood trauma????? especially to say that the “bad” one can NEVER be good? it bothers me so much.

also, queen bee’s superhero costume is one of the best in the entire show, while vesperia’s is one of the worst. why would you give the permanent bee miraculous holder such a mid costume compared to the “evil” temporary one😭

zoe makes me even more upset because if she was fully fleshed out and was able to help chloe grow it would’ve been so heartwarming:(

[motherofplatypus]

The best part of the London Special was when Ladybug said "Its London time!" and spent 99% of the special being anywhere but London.

[arikee]

Why on earth was the miraculous movie that was 1hr 40 mins better than the series that was carefully curated over around 8yrs? Thomas Astruc should be ashamed that that movie made his series and god-forsaken season 5 finale look like dogwater from the animation, to the ACTUAL ROMANCE DEVELOPING ,the songs , and that ADRIEN AND GABRIEL IDENTITY REVEAL! Cannot wait for the inevitable sequel based on that little end bit, and *loved* the running gag of ending the film right before they kissed :)

[unfortunately-a-miraculous-fan]

[immaturityofthomasastruc]

EVEN MORE SPOILERS FOR SEASON 6

I figured since I already read it, I'd give my thoughts on the recent interview Astruc and Thibaudeau took part in.

Due to incompatibility with the new animation engine, SAMG will not be working on the next seasons of ‘Miraculous’. The series is now being developed entirely in France, with the integration of Dwarf Animation.

Okay, props for no more outsourcing, even if I'm not sure what this means for the other ZAG shows.

Season 6 is considered to be “a new beginning”, aside from being a new story arc. It is sometimes referred to by the writers as Season 1.

I'm sure that isn't confusing to the executives at all. Also, maybe don't imply you're starting from scratch when you're already reusing the plot of the main villain using the Butterfly Miraculous.

The writing team already has concrete ideas for how Seasons 7, 8 and 9 will begin and end. They also have ambitions to make it to a Season 12, only if the support of viewers and executives allows them to do so. With this, they emphasize the fact that they would not continue with the show if it were no longer needed or interesting.

So basically, they're planning to keep this up for as long as they can until someone pulls the plug.

The opening of the sixth season is still undecided. They are still discussing whether they will change the musical arrangement or not. Thomas also considers the possibility of making a brand-new theme song. A song has been confirmed for S6. They have the music, the arrangement and a female singer. The character remains unknown.

Imagine how funny it would be if they brought back the woman who sang for Marinette in the movie instead of having Cristina Vee sing again.

Despite leaving Paris at the end of ‘Revolution’ (5x23), Chloé Bourgeois will return in Season 6.

Putting aside all the things I've said about her "damnation arc", what is even the point of bringing her back at this point? She has no powers, no influence, no allies, and isn't a threat of any kind. This makes her not being the next Hawkmoth make even less sense, becuse she has more of a reason to hate Ladybug than Lila does.

Also, with the news that Chloe is coming back, this means that she essentially escaped punishment or at least found a way to rebound like Lila did. So that's a grand total of ZERO villains who actually got punished for their actions after five seasons. I'm starting to think Ladybug and Cat Noir really suck at their jobs.

Sebastien Thibadeau: “[Cerise] (IOTA: I'm still calling her Lila for simplicity's sake) is a villain without costume. She is a villain all the time. There is a reason why, but this reason, neither I nor Astruc will reveal to you yet.” Interviewer: “You mean you already intend to tell it?” Thomas Astruc: “Yes. And you know what, we have already told it, but you haven’t noticed.”

Translation: Ladies and gentlemen, LET'S GET READY FOR RETCOOOOOONNNNS!

Seriously, we are approaching the sixth season of this show. It has been eight years since Lila first appeared all the way back in "Volpina", and we still know nothing about her other than the fact that she has some three moms for some reason. You can't pull the whole "This is something you need to rewatch to understand!" excuse because the last two seasons hinged on breaking the rules about Sentimonsters.

Speaking of, I love how this comment about Lila accidentally implies that Gabriel never did anything evil when he wasn't Hawkmoth/Shadowmoth/Monarch. All that emotional abuse and isolation Adrien suffered was all out of love!

Thomas Astruc on Chloe redemption arc: “We put the characters in situations, and then we say to ourselves: “what would be the logic?” How would the character logically react in “such and such” a situation? And we tried, we tried everything. But every time, we say to ourselves: “if we write this, it’ll be wrong”. There’ll be no reason, it’ll come out of nowhere, the fact that she’ll face something nice and say: “Oh, I’ve been horrible, Marinette what have I done! From now on, I’ll be...” No, nonsense. I understand people’s desire for Chloe to be nice. I’d like that too. But I’d like it if in real life, people with a lot of power suddenly started doing nice things. But Chloé has no interest in changing. She has no reason to change, unfortunately.”

Ah, yes because Gabriel (Global terrorist and abusive parent), Felix (Betrayed Ladybug and temporarily wiped out all of humanity on a whim), Nathalie (Willing accomplice to Gabriel) Andre (corrupt politician and Chloe's primary enabler), Sabrina (Willing accomplice to Chloe) all had compelling reasons to change their ways.

Also, "I've been horrible, what have I done?"

MY BROTHER IN CHRIST, THAT'S HOW VIRTUALLY EVERY REDEMPTION ON THIS SHOW IS EXECUTED.

The fact that he's seriously acting like he actually wanted to write a redemption arc is insulting. Not only does it ignore all the things he's said to fans who were upset at the turn of events, but it makes no sense for him to take this stance because he's a writer. If Chloe turning a new leaf is too strange of an idea, then write an actual character arc allowing her to progress to a state where she recognizes what she's done is wrong. You control the character for God's sake! It's not like you're training a dog to stop humping the couch. You can change things to make a redemption arc possible.

In other words, Astruc is either lying to save his ass, or THIS IS WHAT THOMAS ASTRUC ACTUALLY BELIEVES about writing characters.

Sebastien Thibadeau talks about Andre's character development: In contrast to Chloe, “Andre Bourgeois evolved as a character because we had already imagined a back story. He had the potential to change, and that’s where the beautiful scene comes from — I think it’s magnificent — between Gabriel and himself on the roof of the Grand Palace, where he says: “But Gabriel, what’s become of us? We’ve forgotten the kids we used to be”. But we [writers] know what kids they used to be, and we’d like to tell the story one day, to show what young kids they were, when they were struggling through Paris and weren’t yet what you’ve come to know in the series. He’s sad about what’s happening to his daughter [Chloe], and he’s trying to change it, but he can’t. He is proof that a character can change.”

This. This right here is what cinched it for me. I've tried for years not to say it because it's a word that has been flung around a lot over these last few years, but I feel like this little snippet is enough of a reason for me to say it.

These writers are sexist.

They may not believe it, but whether they intended for it or not, they wrote a story arc where a grown man was shown to have more sympathetic qualities than his daughter. How the hell can you defend it in a way that doesn't highlight the misogyny that this show runs on?

The fact that they gush over how much "potential" Andre had right after saying how that same kind of potential wasn't enough of a reason to attempt a redemption arc with Chloe really shows how confusing their priorities are. I'm sorry to keep saying this, but for a show that takes a heavy anti-capitalist philosophy, it seems like the members of the 1% are the characters who get the most depth and sympathy... unless you're under 18 and lack a Y chromosome, that is.

A meeting will be set up in the coming weeks to decide on whether or not to make a live-action for ‘Miraculous’, Thomas Astruc reveals.

As a former Arrowverse fan, I'm willing to see this out. Not only did the Netflix One Piece series prove you can make an animated property work in live-action, Ladybug & Cat Noir: The Movie managed to do really well even without the usual writers behind it.

Thomas when asked about Gabriel’s wish in ‘Re-Creation’ (5x26) and whether he brought Emilie back to life: “All the answers are in the episode.”

For the love of--STOP SAYING THAT!

You keep claiming that we just need to rewatch the episode to understand things, but between the continuity errors and abandoned subplots, it's hard to tell what's important and what isn't. Either say "No comment" or give us an honest answer.

If people are still confused about how the season ended after almost a year, and you keep giving answers like this:

Maybe you need to change the way you tell the story.

Astruc when asked about ‘The Supreme’: “Oh, if only you knew... Nothing we do is meaningless.”

Sebastien Thibadeau on Season 7: “Once you’ve seen the start of season 7, I can swear you’ll watch season 6 a second time. That’s all I can say.”

Because it'll make Season 6 look like a masterpiece by comparison?

Thomas Astruc on the worldbuilding: There are Kwamis and Renlings, what makes you think there aren’t others [creatures]?

I swear, by the time we get to Season 10, we're going to get stuff like aliens, demons and talking mushrooms, or at least something ludicrous like that.

Zoe had a love at first sight when she met Marinette in ‘Sole Crusher’ (4x07), they confirm.

Of course! That's why it wasn't framed any differently from something like the umbrella scene and Zoe showed absolutely no signs of attraction to Marinette! It's genius!

Executives had Thomas write several alternative concepts for ‘Miraculous’, very different from what we know today or even the early PV. Among them, “a concept where Ladybug is the head of a group of superheroines, like Sailor Moon. There was no love story.”

Can you imagine a world without the Love Square?

The script writers’ favorite episode is ‘Simpleman’ (4x19) as it represents a personal, work and family attachment. Marinette’s grandfather, Roland Dupain, is inspired by Thomas Astruc’s grandfather.

Okay, either Astruc had a complicated relationship with his grandpa or he's been dead for years. While I understand that older generations have outdated views (for example, my great-grandmother yelled at me for saying I wanted to learn Japanese because "They tried to kill us!"), the fact that a caricture of a grumpy old man was based on his grandpa is a little concerning.

Also, between this and Sabine being based off an old flame of his, this only makes the theory that Chloe is based off a real person Astruc knew more plausible.

Astruc: “This is why our work is so difficult. We have to manage to bring in this generation of younger ones, and at the same time, we have to satisfy the generation that was here before and that grows with the series.”

First, if you're trying to please older fans, maybe don't get into fights with them on Twitter.

Second, you made a thread after "Simpleman" aired where you insulted fans for not getting the "meta" element to the episode and compared them to the character you just said was based on your grandfather.

You've also been burning away a lot of the older fans' goodwill over the years. Trust me, I have a few examples.

Despite sharing a similar appearance, the symbol on Nino’s T-shirt is not related to Hack-San.

Okay, is this a fan theory I missed back when Season 4 was airing? Why would anyone draw that conclusion?

Thomas Astruc talks about Season 6: “I’ll say it sincerely, I was very doubtful at the end of Season 5. I said to myself: “if we were to continue, how would we exceed?” Well, we did. It’s been a great season. The new writers have brought us a lot of great stuff. All the episodes we’ve written in Season 6 are fabulous. Each episode is on point, there is no unnecessary lines. All the scenes are really interesting, really well-crafted.”

Translation: Tons of filler, bad comedy, reused Akumas, and more Love Square drama that we're trying to claim hasn't been done before.

Thomas when asked if Marinette will get akumatized: “We never give any information about what may or may not happen.”

JUST. SAY. NO. COMMENT.

There are many important details throughout the series that no one has noticed. Thomas says that when we see the next seasons, we’ll think, “Oh, the writers had it all planned.”

You know, like how Season 3 established that Sentimonsters can be sent out of control by Cataclysm a few episodes before Adrien, a Sentimonster, gets hit by a Cataclysm and is affected in a different way. It was all planned from the beginning.

The Ladybug PV was an animation test and was not intended to be public. Jeremy Zag decided to leak it himself.

Honestly? Dick move on Zag's part. You have to wonder how pissed off Astruc was.

According to Thomas Astruc, what the ‘Miraculous’ series is today represents only 5% of what he wrote in the original bible he presented to Jeremy Zag. “The universe has evolved a lot since. I don’t know if the ideas I put there will be reused someday. It was very extensive.”

Thomas Astruc and Sebastien Thibadeau discuss the parallels between Marinette and Gabriel: Astruc: “Gabriel’s personal back story is the cause of his misery, not his will. And above all, it creates a beautiful mirror with Marinette, which is what’s interesting. They both have a lot of love for Adrien, they��re both designers, they both have a Miraculous, but it’s other choices.” Thibadeau: “That’s what makes it a great hero-villain contrast. Even if they don’t know it from the start, they have a real point in common. As we see at the end of Season 5, they both love Adrien. Except there’s one who does it by doing the right thing, and then there’s another who does it by doing the wrong thing, hurting people, to get there.”

And the one who did the wrong thing by hurting people ended up winning. What does that say about the contrast?

------------------------------------------------------------------

And that's it for the interview. I have to say Season 6 does not look pretty so far.

[ijustliketoreadstuff]

The life Lila wants

It's interesting when Lila drops her persona and shows true emotion. Her desire to be admired isn't just a need for attention, she is desperate to be seen as a treasure among society. Lila lies about having everything, but in reality, she has nothing. 

Lila has always been good at getting what she wants through lying and maintaining those lies, but all her adventurous travels and life of fame was still just that, a lie. However, by working for Gabriel, she was able to make a big part of her lie a reality by becoming a model for the Agreste brand, then later an avatar for the alliance rings, allowing her to be recognized by the world and finally obtain the fame she always spoke of, all in exchange for acting as Gabriel's spy into Adrien's life and committing to separating him from those Gabriel considered "bad influences", specifically Marinette.

Naturally, in "Emotion", the moment she discovered from Kagami that Gabriel saw her as a common stone, rather than a diamond worthy enough to go to the diamonds dance, an event where Gabriel invited the rich and powerful along with their heirs and heiresses, Lila felt wronged. Despite not being related to Gabriel, Lila had deemed herself someone who was entitled to be viewed on equal grounds as the prestige's people Gabriel invited, and since her agreement with Gabriel involved being brought into a world of high society, Lila had assumed she was now officially part of that world by becoming an image of the Agreste brand and had to be upheld in the same regard as Adrien, Kagami and Chloe.

The realization that Gabriel never viewed her as a treasure within his company, but rather someone who was no different than a common perfume bottle his company advertised, struck a big nerve with Lila. She detested being treated like someone who could be easily forgotten and discarded. However, it was her ongoing attempts to repeatedly contact Gabriel about going to the Diamonds dance that made her whole mysterious background even more questionable, as we have never seen her show such concern for not being included in something.

Lila's background continues to elude everyone, but her determination to ensure she is recognized as someone who is far more valuable than a perfume bottle or any normal person for that matter, feels like she is actively seeking out a means to escape her true life, whatever it may really be, and permanently become the girl she spoke of in her lies. We may not know much about Lila's true life, but the fact that she always refers to herself as someone who has accomplished so much and is recognized by so many, does leave the impression that Lila has a dislike for her true identity and what little her real life has provided for her.

Added note: No, Lila does not hate Marinette because she is jealous of her life. Lila hates Marinette because she is a threat. Marinette wants to expose Lila and refused to adhere to Lila’s demands to stay quiet and not get in her way, so now Lila aims to ruin her life.

[fille-de-skroa]

Kids understood Miraculous better than most of the adults MLB fans out there. This says something about the mentality of the fandom.

[k4txlulzz]

maturing is realizing that the creator of miraculous ladybug didn't make marinette whitepassing to provide representation for mixed people who look "whiter"

they did it because of racism💀

in these pictures you can see her early designs, she even had tanner skin

the process was gradual. slowly but surely they made her more and more white passing and even whitewashed the environment around her. the house she was in had more chinese influence, she lived in a district of paris known to be ethnically diverse and art influenced

the issue isn't her not being "asian enough". the issue is that those decisions to make her less asian were made by WHITE MEN.

[ceriseisbestgirl]

Thomas Astruc tells us how Cerise got the Butterfly Miraculous

[masternia]

⚠️⚠️ATTENTION⚠️⚠️ This is a serious post and I feel the need to talk about so let’s go. This is Ezra Weiz the Voice director (I think that’s the word?) of Miraculous Ladybug. He basically casts all of the lovely voices to the English cast of miraculous. I’m pretty sure everyone by now knows that everything from every script, to episode, to storyboard of season 5 has been leaked. The leaker has NOT ONLY decided to leak all of season 5 BUT HAS ALSO decided to leak all of the miraculous staff INCLUDING winny, Jeremy, Ezra AND the creator Thomas’s phone numbers and possible addresses. It’s one thing to leak a show but to completely dox a whole miraculous cast is wayyyy to far. Whether you like them or not this is NOT okay and will NEVER be justified. It’s plainly wrong. While there’s nothing that we can do it’s important that we are educated on stuff like this. Please do nothing but send love and support to everyone and let’s all hope they are safe and sound.

[muggle-born-princess]

Season 5 in a nutshell

[makiruz]

So the things about the Chloé Bourgeois situations is that she is not real, she is a fictional character whose actions are determined by the writers and the creator Thomas Astruc, they decided she should double down on her bad actions and could have easily decided the opposite.

And now let's bring up Félix. Félix's actions are comparable to Chloé and actually kinda worse; he was never akumatized so all his villainous actions were by his own free will. So why does Félix gets to join the hero team and not Chloé? Because he regretted his action and changed his ways? Wrong! Because the writers decided he should feel bad about his actions and change his ways; and then they decided that Chloé should become a worse person (and become major of Paris? Isn't she like 15? Aren't there laws in France?). Neither of them has the ability to make their own choices, and neither does André Bourgeois the corrupt major of Paris and Hawkmoth the main villain, it was the writers who decided the male antagonists should get redemptions (including 2 absent/abusive fathers) but an abused teenage girl should not

That's the crux of the issue, this isn't a discussion of whether Chloé's actions "make sense" or "are realistic"; it's why a man who thinks putting a character with a Hijab is bringing religion in and therefore bad (but a Christmas special is not) thinks an abused teen girl is "irredeemable" but 2 grown men who abused their power to mistreat people including children are not

[motherofplatypus]

No Closure For Abuse Victim?

It comes to my attention that all the abuse victims in the show never really got a closure with their abuser. In fact, most of them even had it worse.

Adrien never got to confront his dad as himself and call him out for his mistreatment. He lived his final days with his father seeing him as a monster that he is, and when Gabe died, he sees him as a hero.

Chloe never got to confront her mom either for neglecting her for YEARS, and when she met her, Audrey attacked her with verbal abuse. In the end, she had to live with her own abuser for some fucked up reasons.

Felix is a hard case bcs we never see if he confronted Colt or not, but from that avant-garde play, apparently he didn't. Colt just died, and that's about it.

The only one who gets to have a closure with their abuser, based on how TA and the writers see it, is Andre, by sending his daughter he never raised off with her abuser and kidnap someone else's daughter bcs she's better than your own.

Im not sure to put Marinette here or not with Chloe.

It's really messed up that the writers created these abused characters and never gave them a chance to heal from their mistreatment even after the first arc finale.

Well, that's just my opinion. Im most likely wrong about some of those points, so share your thoughts.

And speaking of mistreatment, please spare your time to sign this petition to kick israel from the UN and ban them from Nobel Ceremony for illegally colonizing and committing genocide upon the Palestinians. Over 17.000 children have been murdered by them in less than a year, children like Marinette and Adrien, and even younger than them. They put civilians inside a concentration camp like the Nazi did during WW2.

All that is necessary for evil to succeed is for good people to do nothing. No more silence, no more ignorance. End the occupation now!

[nixthelapin]

So apparently the Miraculous writing team released commentary on the s5 finale, during which they explain that Chat Noir not being in the final battle was planned from the beginning. (All the way back in 2014/2015)

Like, they had to come up with a reason (they were struggling to figure out how to keep Adrien away instead of him, like, cataclysming the wall determined to help his Lady) for that specific outcome, rather than a good reason supporting the outcome.

And their big reason? Wanting to use the Bug Noire combination on Marinette. That’s it. They left out the second most important protagonist, one with personal connections to the villain… because they wanted a cool power up scene.

Just when I thought I couldn’t hate that outcome any more than I already did.

[flightfoot]

I

think

he is joking?

Yeah I'm pretty sure that's a joke. While it's not ENTIRELY out of the realm of possibility that the hard angles in Chloe's design would be smoothed away in the new artstyle (especially if Chloe's story was being taken a different direction) I just can't see her losing both her legs. I think that would be heavy, even for Miraculous.

[immaturityofthomasastruc]

I'm fine with Chloe receiving consequences for her actions, but I found it really shitty on Astruc's part as if Andre/Audrey had no part of turning their daughter into a bad person.

Even having the audacity to making a. Fucking. Adult. As a Victim. To a...literal child/teenager???..

I don't know what Astruc and the other writers are smoking on, but either they're abuse apologists or just love to play favorites and don't have the balls to call out their favs when they've done sosmthing wrong.

But anon, Chloe is rich! That means any emotional issues she has are irrelevant.

THIS IS WHAT THOMAS ASTRUC ACTUALLY BELIEVES.