#fandom salt

[riddlers-roulette]

Probably a bit of a hot take, and definitely petty fandom salt, but i’ve come to notice that in recent years, with most fandom spaces becoming puritanical in their efforts to ice out anything that can be labeled toxic, or anything that just doesn't fit the fandom’s prevalent opinions on a situation or character–a phenomenon that has only been exacerbated by TikTok and the overuse of “therapy-speak”--there seems to be a general lack of nuance and/or sense of media literacy in most vocal fandom spaces when it comes to a story that is not just black and white.

Arcane is one of the most recent example of this, with (arcane s2 spoilers ahead) characters caitlyn and vi being discussed pretty heavily with the terms like “domestic abuse” and “abuser apologism” particularly when it comes to caitlyn’s act of jabbing her rifle at vi’s side before walking away, leaving vi anguished. Now, i’m not saying domestic abuse is not real–i’m just saying, that in this instance, I don't believe that the act was domestic violence, nor do i believe that any of the parties that make up CaitVi are abusers.

Arcane itself is a complex story with heart shattering situations that the characters find themselves in constantly, often putting them at odds with their morals, the morals of their environment, and the morals of the audience. Do I think caitlyn was right to jab her rifle at vi? No. But we as an audience can tell that neither does Caitlyn herself. Neither does Vi. But when Caitlyn did so, it was when she was under immense emotional duress, her mother’s killer getting away, and she was blocked from taking vengeance by the person she trusted the most. When she said the horrible things she did, she was hurting and angry and lashing out–she was punching the walls like a woman gone. And why is it that we can offer characters like Jinx the grace to absolve her of her crimes due to her own psychotic breaks, but not other characters to their own actions done in moments of their own breakdowns? Vi punching Powder, for instance. An act that had Vi villainized by the fandom for a long time. 

Which brings me to another point–absolution. It is one the extremes characters tend to fall into when it comes to fandom, with the other extreme being amplification. A character’s sins tend to be glossed over, or explained away so that the character in question becomes an unquestionable angel and champion of justice, or, in other cases, tend to be overly exaggerated, making the character out to be the worst of the worst, the lowest of the low. Rarely is there an in-between, with multifaceted characters complete with riveting backstory and motivations and complicated characteristics inevitably losing a little of what makes them, them, all in the pursuit of woobification, gratuitous groveling from other characters, and victimization; it’s an apology fantasy on steroids. In other cases, and often, connected cases, if one character is getting the baby treatment then chances are that another is getting the villain treatment, becoming a sort of caricature of themselves. Motives and environmental factors and politics are all thrown out the window, and all that’s left is cartoonish, flat, oft one-dimensional portrayals. 

Arcane’s Silco is an example of the former, with the singular trait of caring for Jinx becoming twisted and emphasized until he is nigh unrecognizable. His harmful actions towards the undercity are erased and he is lifted up instead as something other than he was. He is transformed from the fascinatingly flawed, human depiction to something bland and uncanny. He is just a Poor Sad Betrayed Meow Meow who is also a Good Dad. But it’s okay because he also does crimes! Except wait, those crimes are also sanitized and cutesy, or horrific and without reason or logic. He has lost what makes him, him.

And for the other half of the coin, the unnecessary villainization, we have Jayce! Jayce was hated upon widely, especially after the release of Season 1, and his struggles were erased.

(and yes, there were struggles. Jayce was more privileged than those from the Undercity, that is unquestionable, but he was not as privileged as the other Council members or even most of his peers. He had the fortune of a patron, but that was something that had to be earned, and he could always risk losing. He was from a House, yes, but it was also a minor one, and he would have labored in his factories alongside other workers–he wasn’t a crazy wealthy guy. He staked his entire life on his research that he was actually going to take his own life when his dream was taken from him. His dream wasn’t to generate wealth by unlocking the arcane, but rather, it was to put these tools in the hands of the common man too. One of his first act as councilors was to immediately try to root out corruption. He was able bodied and from Piltover, and so, had more privilege than Viktor (who is my favorite arcane character) that is undeniable. But Jayce did have struggles, he wasn’t taken seriously by the Council due to his own status and had to go through them initially when it came to his own HexTech. Jayce had struggles,but Jayce is a POC and Viktor is a white boy, so Jayce’s problems are gonna be minimized by fandom but that’s a whole other issue–)

And yet, three years ago, the Jayce hate was at a total high, with every action of his being dramatized so as to make Viktor’s pain far more excruciating. 

I’ve derailed a little! The point of this post was to point out the “therapy speak” in fandom that often comes at the cost of lifting one character up and bashing the other, all while skipping over the context and nuance for the gray situations the characters found themselves in. All this to say–with fandom’s recent behaviors when it comes to relationships in fandom, it really makes you wonder if people have forgotten that relationships aren’t easy and actually require constant work and effort. That relationships change and evolve and grow with each obstacle that comes one’s way, and that sometimes things get rough, but that love is being able to understand and empathize with one’s partners–that not everything is black and white and that not every mistake is irredeemable.

edit: also, don’t really care enough to argue with ppl on this point in the notes. it’s tired and repetitive and half the time it’s like arguing with a brick wall. if this gets out of hand I will start deleting and/or restricting replies

[melmedardasworld]

So, that Meljay reunion is still in my draft. I'll finish it and post it, but at the moment, I have zero motivation to write or even read anything after that ending 🙃. Just gonna like and reblog stuff

On a positive note, I can make tweaks for my short story to really focus on capturing both Mel and Jayce's trauma... having Jayce not act OC (like who tf was that? #notmyjayce) to push some rushed endjng, AND give Mel’s emotional its well deserved focus because it was so sidelined.

My only solace is that Mel’s story is far from over yet in canon and in fanon, neither of her and Jayce's done.

[longing-for-rain]

The “Katara and Aang are both genocide survivors so they can relate to each other better” idea might hold up if, the one time Katara actually got the chance to meaningfully talk about her trauma, Aang didn’t tell her to forgive her mother’s murderer and compare her to a madman who attempted to flood a village full of innocent civilians when she pushed back 🙃

[blackkatmagic]

Reverse Star Wars AU writing challenge: every time canon fridges a mother, fridge the father instead. Every time a woman dies for the sake of Manpain™️, kill off the dude instead.

(I know this gets particularly complicated with Obi-Wan, because his woman-who-died-in-my-arms count is in the double digits at this point, but I have faith fandom can find a way.)

The only rule is that the story cannot be about a man. It cannot be about man angst. It has to center the women.

[glorious-spoon]

ngl i'm growing increasingly weary of the Mom Steve thing in st fandom. it's gotten to the point where his prevailing characterization is, like, fussing over the kids' bedtimes and full-naming them and scolding them for swearing, and like... i'm sorry, but no. steve is not their mom (and tbh a lot of it would be wildly overbearing even if he was). he's the big brother. like, yeah, he'll look out for them and protect them and give them advice, but he also cusses them out and would probably cheerfully dump any one of them into the pool fully clothed if they gave him cause

[pathetic-lifeform]

After witnessing Hayden’s return to Star Wars, first in OWK in 2022 and now in Ahsoka, I cannot help but think that why did it take us nearly 20 years to collectively claim this man as our own? Do we even deserve him?

In the prequels he gave his everything, his portrayal of Anakin was incredibly nuanced and he clearly had done his homework (e.g. nailing JEJ’s speech pattern and his vocal cadence, as well as David Prowse’s physical mannerisms). Looking at Hayden you could see exactly what George Lucas meant when he said he wanted someone who had ” that presence of the dark side”. But you could also distinguish the former innocent slave boy, who wanted to be a Jedi and make his loved ones proud. He was Anakin, he was Vader.

It still makes me extremely sad and upset that some fans thought their image of Vader at the time was the only right one. They had their heads too up their asses to see that Anakin/Vader was right there, exactly as George Lucas had written him, both passionate and powerful but also sad and pathetic. And of course there were those who did see it, most of them were just too young at the time/without a platform to express all that awe and outpouring of love, as it was mostly drowned out by the loud, spiteful hate and criticism.

I can’t even imagine the things Hayden had to hear, directly from fans and from the media. It must’ve been so discouraging for a young actor. Heck, he was 24 when RotS came out. 24. And still, after everything, he decided to come back. He could’ve declined when Deborah Chow called him and asked him to return to the franchise, I would not have blamed him.

We are extremely lucky to have him back as Anakin and Vader again. And we better remember that.

[alabyte]

Can we talk about the fact that Scorch's death was completely irrelevant because there could've been pretty much any clone commando and the scene would've been all the same

His death had no plot weight

His death had no consequences

His death was unnecessary

I have spoken.

[frostycatblr-fandom-files]

Nothing "former" about that ARC trooper status. I have spoken.

[yourhighness6]

The thing about the whole TSR discourse is that a lot of it is centered around who was right: Zuko or Aang. Although I have seen posts focusing primarily on Katara's feelings, I do think it is necessary to remind anyone who cares to listen every once in a while that it doesn't really matter who was right. It matters who enabled Katara to make her own choices and gave her the space to do so, and I think we all know who that was.

[eriexplosion]

Cut for Negativity

One thing I will not put up with though is being called Delusional for picking up on blatant hints. They might not have panned out but like... come the fuck on. The hints of CX-2 Tech were right fucking there? You kill a man ambiguously and then bring in a masked guy that gets three episodes of focus and then you just go UHHHHHHHH ANYWAY. HE IS DEAD NOW.

Fuck that shit.

[winn-wynn]

Why is Percy the only who has to grovel at the rest of the Weasleys family feet? Why is he the only one who to apologize in a fight that wasn’t one sided.

Both sides made mistakes. Why in fics is Percy the only one begging for forgiveness? Why aren’t the rest of the family reevaluating their choices and wondering what made him want to go anyway?

Is it because that would be admitting they’re wrong? Because clearly Percy was wrong so why is the rest of the family wrong? We were on the right side of the war.

[longing-for-rain]

Schrödinger’s Redemption Arc:

It was either perfect storytelling or an insensitive colonizer guilt narrative…depending on who you ship him with.

[blackkatmagic]

really wish that fandom would at least acknowledge in passing that Alpha-17 is not some squishy father figure but a dude who was literally about to murder infants on the off chance they might not be fanatically loyal to the Republic. like, I get wanting to attach the Dad label to any random clone that stands still long enough, but it makes him so much less interesting.

can we just have ONE character who does not get sanded down to fit a fandom trope?? Please???

[thelandswemadeofpaper]

Respectfully, I am just freak out about the 'death grip' the batfam fandom has on Danny Phantom and Miraculous LadyBug

I just don't like how most authors just forgot the characters themselves, their entire personality and personal plot when they turn them into a 'batkid'

Also, the sheer number of fics, like...at least 50% of the Miraculous x Batman/Young Justice/ Justice League are like that

Most genuine ignore Marinette's wonderful parents or bashing them, went to the typical Fenton-Hunting-Phantom-After-Secret-Reveal or Friends-and-Family-All-Dead

Or Long Lost Twins? Bio Dad Au? Kinda Weird

Or forgot Billy Batson's found family and his distrustfull street kid nature and independent life, not just the 'Yes, Mr Batman Sir' thats his alter ego. Pretty sure Billy, as feral 10-14 year old foster kid, would fucking bite them

[stitchwraith-stingers]

sorry for never shutting up about how people treat hazel but ohh my god shes my fave character atm.... i get to be mad!! she has good enough information that you can play around with headcanons freely

the only moments people wouldve brung up is when dev is in the episode, there was no reason for the episode that showed her tendancy to overthink and be emberassed over small mistakes by wishing a do-over and over again, having to realise that running away from the idea of creating a problem wont help her in the long run JUST so people could go "omg haha dev has a crush on her" i could litterly not tell you what the general concensious on most episodes are because i dont know peoples opinions on them because in general they dont discuss them beyond his scenes

fanart too, ive personally muted the dev and devzel tag and when i look up #hazel wells i want you to guess how many posts i find that arent hidden! spoiler alert its barely any of them, listen im not saying im shocked at the fact The Characters Made As A Duo are drawn as a duo, its whatever and while im not personally a fan in general i really do get the appeal, but you have to admit that at some point it gets really suspicious when the only fanart you can find in one character is only with the more popular one, over 200 fics in the hazel tag on ao3 and theres only 20! without the dev tag! (10 more then when i last checked, crazy! go read fly bird, fly now), and my main problem is is that hazel is shown to be her own person OUTSIDE of their friendship, infact wouldnt you know it shes the protagonist herself! the fact that most aus ive seen are focused on dev/dale/peri is whats most confusing to me, "oh but theyre so interesting to work with"

really! youre telling me you cant think of a fic / au idea on her own? miss "i was going to have a previous godparent who didnt listen to me at all", miss "i am very anxious and i overthink to the point where my desicions", miss "i had an encounter with my evil shadow self when i was a fairy" (shout out to fairy bound au btw, im a big fan), miss "my mom doesnt fully know how to handle children inspite of being a therapist and tells me im handling things mature so i feel like i should be", miss "with the fact that im terrified my friends are making fun of me behind my back, i didnt know how to talk to anyone and a cafetiria made me so overworried and i speak to my rocks could imply the fact that i was outcasted at a young age", miss "my brother who has been my anchor and i has taught me everything i need to know has left me and hes also struggling to adjust to everything and we were insanely close to the point where the reason this whole thing started is because of him", miss "i regularly help my dad hunt a ghost that doesnt exist but it makes him happy", miss "i am litterly friends with the coolest kid in elementary school", miss "my landlords are litterly doomsday preppers and our parents want me to get along with their werido twins", miss "i didnt even hestitate to kill myself if i had to save potatoes for humanity after i pissed off mother nature", miss 'i got called out on projecting my past bonding expiriences on my best friend by some werid demon posessing her body right infront of me' none of that makes you want to think of something about her on her own? not even a spark of an idea? its almost like you guys watched exclusively 6 episodes and watched 5 minutes out of them at most

hazel is very interesting and shows her own struggles, she likes puns and fries and rocks and anime and horror movies (and apparently mushrooms if you count that one scene), she tries to problem solve so that no one is unhappy (patty being alive so winn wasnt upset, trying to get the band and orchestra together, accidently haunting her house and wishing her dads day was extra special, trying to find a dinosaur she spontaniously teleported his own job), she has multiple episodes showing her insecurities and how she tries to hide it so she doesnt look like a bad person, but inspite of it all is a understanding person and a peacemaker and doesnt like arguments, hell shes even such good autism represntation im 99.9% sure it wasnt intentional at all

dont even get me started on the takes ive seen in the finale, listen the finale has alot to be said and it definatly wont be everyones cup of tea (i think them trying to refrence every episode felt so chaotic personally) but regarding people with the ending is still giving me a headache, "she shouldve used her wish on him" that wouldve been so boring and predicable, say what you want on what she actually used it for but i think you guys should realise that for the kid whos regressing back into his bad copium mechanisms should get to face his concequences, 'hes 10 and neglected so thats why he acted like that' and 'she doesnt need to put up with how he treats her and hold his hand and be his personal therapist' can both coexist, people being pissed that she lightheartly agreed that he fucked up when HE admitted it is crazyyy CRAZYYY (also the fact ive seen someone say 'her moms a therapist she shouldve known' ???)

this isnt even touching on "hazels other relationships like her friends and family arent developed enough so thats why ppl dont care that much" while that is a valid critism i have with the show in general i still dont think applys to what im specifically talking about to demonstrate dale has appeared in THREE episodes (four if you want to stretch it), meanwhile hazels parents have appeared more often and im barely seeing them in fanart "but dale has a backstory!" so do those two have a whole episode explaining how they met "b-but dale is interesting as a role as a villain!" the guy is barely a villain [so far atleast], but also is being a therapist and a parascienists already not an interesting enough? are you guys suddenly not able to make as much headcanons expanding apon them as you did with dale? thats the thing that confuses me the most, whats stopping you from giving random information from your head to anyone else?, (i didnt know how to word this point so hopefully this makes sense)

listen im going to say it right now MOST OF THIS IS DEFINATLY UNINTENTIONAL AND NOT EVERYONE IS DOING THIS ON PURPOSE but some of u guys might really need to uncover some biases on why you think the black girl should coddle the rich white boy when he wasnt treating her well at the time, if that makes sense

[breached-containment-script]

Some arguments KA shippers make are valid and true. But that they don't necessarily do anything nearly enough to be valid anti-zutara arguments!

Stuff like, that quick burns probably wouldn't scar (Katara's hands) or that if she had gotten scarred, that Toph's feet should have gotten scarred too. This is valid.

That it's true that when Aang's negative aspects get developed to their final extreme forms in theories and fanfiction, it can feel weird and offputting to people who naturally gravitate towards staying approximately around canon vibes; that some descriptions of behaviour sound too strong to some people which results in pushing them away from zutara as a negative reaction to associated criticisms of Aang. But that also personal headcanon developments (even those with strong foundation in canon) are individual preferences and people are able to choose which headcanons to like, without using disliked ones to paint an entire show interpretation negative.

It'a true that most of Aang's bad behaviour in the show can be attributed to him being just a kid and not being self-aware enough yet. He's not intentionally malicious in most cases. His negative reaction towards Water Tribe culture and food is a depiction of a kid not knowing how to respect something that makes him uncomfortable, even if this kinda clashes with him having already had friends from all over the world. Unfortunatey, canon progression doesn't depict him learning as many lessons as he should nor does it show him outgrowing negative traits even though it should have. THIS is the source of headcanons which appreciate intentionally exploring main character developing in a negative light. His negative traits constantly repeat and have a common stay in his canon character. This is a fact, especially with his claim that he'd be in the Avatar state had it not been blocked, out of frustration that actors on a stage implied Katara doesn't feel the same way about him. This is a very bad thing, we've seen both him and others being afraid of it, it causing massive destruction and Katara having the burden of calming him down. How would she theoretically calm him down in the case he did enter the Avatar state because of this reason? Assuming she didn't have romantic feelings for him (which should always exist as a valid option for any character, to test if they have a healthy interaction) - she could pray he'd accept it and calm down on his own, or be under extreme pressure to lie that she likes him back. Even if she did like him back, having to admit under the threat of a destructive force being unleashed, IS NOT GOOD. Especially as the characters never addressed this later.

Yes, Zuko did a lot of bad things but not only are they overblown by KA-fans and Zuko-antis, they constantly purposefully ignore that he got punished repeatedly, suffered in canon for his actions and kept doing very risky and selfless things to make up for his past, they also forget that time flows FORWARD and that WHEN events happened on a timeline MATTERS. It's not an argument that Zuko burned Suki's village in book 1 when he helped rescue her and others by risking his life in book 3 and she forgave him. One thing is collateral damage in a cartoon filled with cartoon violence, and another when for example Long Feng kills Jet. Viewers should be able to discern the tone difference, because shows (or any creative work) especially with multiple writers, aren't homogenous, and aren't tonally or message-wise completely unified. Don't start your deduction argument from the idea that a show is fully consistent and is absolutely sending a singular message, start an inductive analysis from ideas about what a show's context is, what its goals are, what the tone feels like in each section, did it accomplish what it was aiming for, etc. Likewise Zuko could have been written even better in some areas and with more context!

However him hunting down heroes, knocking out Katara etc. isn't a gotcha argument some people think it is, because Katara knocked him out as well, twice even so badly he didn't wake up for quite some time; and he was struck, rejected, ignored, mocked and criticised by both Iroh, the gaang and Katara especially after he sided with Azula under Ba Sing Se, but then they forgave him as he actively worked to atone, and Katara herself forgave him for what he did. She then risked her life to save him back. The writing is very logical and consistent in this.