#LGBT Christians

[sparrow-the-tired-lesbian]

Yes, I’m Christian. Yes I’m LGBTQ+. I hold both sides accountable for their actions. Christian goes off and changes the bible to hurt the gays? I’ve got some choice words. LGBTQ+ people starts ostracizing Christian queers? Choice words. I won’t stand for one part of my identity constantly jabbing the other.

That statement is mainly directed at Christians who have literally changed the fucking bible to appeal to their oppressive agenda.

If Christian gays start jabbing at trans people or another part of their community, that is unacceptable.

You hurt someone, you answer for it. Plain and simple. I don’t care if you’re queer, religious, both, neither.

(EDIT: I am now pagan. But this post resonates with people so I’ll leave it here.)

[fierysword]

[rainbow-sheeps]

Hello everyone

After much discussion, a new date for shutting down the server has been decided upon. If you are a part of the server we have made sure to give everyone time to add friends with those they wish to stay in contact with, and gather screenshots or pictures that you wish to keep.

The server will be shut down on Tuesday, September 24th, 2024. If you are seeing this after that date we hope you find the place that you are looking for. Just know you are not alone and there are others like you.

Thank you for having been apart of the server, and we wish you all the best.

Staff

[hamliet]

Hello, Hamliet.... is it true that the Bible said homosexuals should be punish in new testament? If I'm not wrong remembered (yes, I'm from christian household) is it not that king david have 'special feelings' for jonathan?

My mother has really strong belief in religion (christianity) and she is an anti-LGBTQ+. But do you believe that her brother (my uncle) who is definitely a queer (wear make up, dresses really feminely, and sometimes called himself as she, never married until he's in sixties), my mother said he is normal ?????

That's why I want to know more about LGBTQ+ (eventhough in my country it is still a taboo topic).

Do you think it's weird Hamliet, if I prefer to read mlm & wlw instead of het romance? I just felt fed up with reading or watching het romance (wlm)....

Thanks to you Hamliet, I know more about myself, eventhough there are still a bit if feeling guilty every time I read or watch LGBTQ+ contents....

No, it doesn't say it should be punished in the New Testament.

It does get mentioned once, arguably three times, but really for certain once, and that context has nothing to do with punishment.

I'm going to give a very bare bones explanation of my understanding of it below! There are also lots of theology papers on it and I'm like, skimming the surface here.

The arguable ones lists a word that is often translated as "homosexuality" in a list of sins that "won't inherit the kingdom of God." However, the two words that get translated as such need more looking at.

One is always translated literally as "softness," but is always used in reference to prostitution. Most likely (given the letters it appears to and the communities they were a part of and the prevalence of temple prostitution there) temple prostitution (which should not be thought of as largely consensual in this context, either). There are also some fair arguments based on the words used and the known history of these cities that it's referring to ritual p*do abuse of children.

The other of the Greek words that gets translated as such is extremely unusual. So unusual that it's never seen elsewhere.

Yeah. It's a made-up word.

Now, the word arsenokoitēs certainly had meaning to the specific community to which the letter it appears in is addressed, but it's not like a word that can be translated with 100% certainty. What we do know for certain is that parts of the word are taken from words that refer to "men" and "bed/sex." So I see why people translate it that way. The thing is, though, it occurs in two lists, and these lists consist of issues concerning idolatry and slave dealers. Hence, the context strongly indicates that it's condemning some form of exploitation involving men who have sex with males.

The larger historical/cultural context also indicates this. If you read ancient Greek texts, like, say, Plato's Symposium, you'll get a very distinct view of exactly which same-sex relationships were normalized in those days, and you'll also be somewhat horrified. Basically the idea was that mentors (adult men) would mentor teenager boys, and the teen boys would be receptive to the adult man having sex with them. Does it sound creepy and exploitative? Because it is!

Yes, even for the time period. It isn't unique. Julius Caesar--yes, THE Julius Caesar--had to deal with rumors that he was one of those boys to an older mentee (Nicomedes). Because clearly, being on the receiving end of male-male sex means that you're actually a woman, which as everyone knows is the WORST thing you could possibly be (sarcastic). Anyways, this type of exploitative bs was extremely common, and even back in those days, it was known to be somewhat, y'know, f*cked up.

The other time it's talked about in the NT is in Romans 1, during which the main theme of the passage is that giving yourself over to lust is a bad thing. Paul cites women having sex with women and men with men as examples of overabundance of lust. I think most Christians, even sex-positive ones like myself, would agree that being consumed with lust (or with anything) to where it controls you and you start losing control of your life is unhealthy.

Now, that said, you can make an argument that Paul's view seems to be that homosexual tendencies stem from over abundance. But we know that's not true nowadays. And that gets into how you read the Bible as a whole.

I love the Bible. I see it as God's word to humanity, divinely inspired. I also think that to truly see it as God's word, you have to acknowledge what it is.

It's literature.

That doesn't mean it's fiction or whatever. It just means that God chose literature as a means to communicate with human beings, and that means that God knew that the whole point of literature is that people wrestle with the concepts and debate the themes. It enhances my respect of Scripture and my love of God to do precisely this, to dig into the text and its historical context and discover the timeless themes. To call it "inerrant" where every word can be taken out of context and seen as a command does a disservice to the writers God used to craft poetry, histories, stories, measurements, and letters to friends. To view the Bible as God when the Bible itself says that Jesus is the Word of God personified misses the forest for the trees, the spirit of the law for the letter.

The other really cool thing that genuinely excites me about Christianity is that God works with human beings. Individuals, yes, but also communities. He works within cultures, too. Despite modern evangelicals claiming "No Compromise!" Scripture is FULL of God compromising with humans, bargaining with them, accepting that they are flawed and working with us. He worked within human limits so much he became one to save us from death; it's kinda the premise!

So, God working to deliver his very message to us through human writers of literature is kind of amazing to me, awe-inspiring. But that also means human beings are limited by what we know and our own time periods, our own cultures. And, that's okay. Yes, keep working to do better, but it means that we can have grace for ourselves and one another. Even now, when we know a lot more about the world as a whole, we are still very limited by our own experiences, cultures, and time period. There's this attitude that modernity has reached the stage of ultimate enlightenment and boy have we not.

Hence, yeah, Paul's writing in Romans 1 especially might be kinda homophobic by today's standards. The ultimate premise--don't let yourself be under anything else's control--is a good one, but him using homosexuality as an example as if potentially all of it emerges from lust is not exactly woke, but also not necessarily abnormal for his time period and his culture. He's a flawed human being, after all, but God himself still worked with him to do some pretty great stuff, and to write some pretty cool letters that still have beautiful resonance today (the love passage in Corinthians? That's him!)

(Also, funnily enough, people--even the strictest evangelicals--actually do accept this about Paul and culture when he's writing about slavery. Because Paul doesn't endorse slavery and instructs masters to be kind to their slaves and treat them well, but he doesn't outright say "you're sinning by owning slaves" whereas today we'd definitely think that. Funny how that doesn't apply to gay people though.)

Lastly, your mom sounds like my mom. She claims she thinks it's a sin because she believes the Bible says so, but she genuinely is happy for friends who are gay and happily married and wishes them well. It's like she feels she has to believe it, not that she actually does in her core. And of course that's not an excuse, and I would never tell a gay person they should not be upset with her. Even within our modern cultures, it can be hard to unlearn things too especially if you grew up in such environments.

But reading mlm or wlw stories is actually a great tool for helping people empathize with others. Fiction absolutely helped me leave the cult I was raised in. I don't think it's inherently weird at all; curiosity exists, empathy exists, good stories exist, and also there's something to be said about people who exist in cultures that are very non-accepting seeing themselves in stories where a relationship that might often be condemned is accepted. Even if the person is straight and cis, they might have parts of themselves they see as something society would hate, and so they see themselves in the characters.

Oh actually, the real last lastly. Jonathan and David. Er... yeah. I mean, yes, people do have extremely close, extremely intimate, brotherly platonic friendships, even between men. But their relationship is certainly up for interpretation considering they literally refer to each other as having love for them that is "better than that of women." The words and phrasing used mirror those used in like, the Iliad to describe Achilles and Patroclus, and Gilgamesh between Gilgamesh and Enkidu.

David also married Jonathan's sister and didn't treat her very well, but did go out of his way to protect Jonathan's own children. Also, there are several other passages where the ancient Hebrew used could contain sexual nuances, although it doesn't necessarily have to. You can't definitively state either way what it is--the writers clearly wrote in plausible deniability. Still, there's enough to raise eyebrows even within that old ancient context that, whether or not it was ever physical, Jonathan and David were not platonic.

(Personally? David invented the Disaster Bisexual archetype.)

[sidebsapphic]

hey!! you can call me veronica. 24, she/her prns.

nondenominational Christian (raised baptist), side b sapphic (specifically bisexual), & lover of silly things, like cartoons and anime.

toga will survive the war arc! (delusional)

anyways, i had a side b blog years ago, but i took it down. no big controversy or hate train or anything. i think i wasn’t “serious” abt dedicating every part of myself to God. i still cling to manmade identities and escapist relationships.

anyways, i’d love to get to know more side b Christians, and Christians in general <3 since my last blog (sidebchristian) i’ve grown a lot in my local church community irl, and i want to be part of a Christian community online as well.

God is good, you are loved beyond measure, and Jesus Christ thinks you’re to die for. 💌

[logankisseswade]

Get To Know Me/Tag Game For Goth Christians: November 2024:

1.) what type of Christian do you consider yourself to be, other than a Goth Christian?

+ Non-Denominational, Omnistic, Progressive, Unitarian/Universalist/Humanitarianism

2.) what kind of music do you listen to?

+ all kinds of music, I love all genres of music really

3.) do you attend Church? what kind of Church is it?

+ Yes, I go to a Unitarian Church in the suburbs, it's the most wonderful Church I've ever been inside of, everyone is so loving and respectful and friendly, it's a place that Jesus would be very proud of

4.) what do you wish non Christians would know about being a Christian?

+ That being a real Christian in general means following Jesus, being held accountable for your actions, practicing what you preach, being kind and loving towards other people, Jesus doesn't want you to change your personality, he wants you to change your bad behavior and that Jesus wants a personal relationship with all of us

5.) what do you love about being a Goth?

+ Goth Music and Fashion, Goth Culture and the Aesthetic does originally come from Christianity after all, it just feels like a birthright(lol), being a Christian Goth is just so empowering

6.) are you a fan of Horror Films?

+ Yes, 100 percent, I Love the classic formula of Vaudeville Horror combined with a Modern Twist, I'm very much a Horror Punk, I am however not a fan of all types of Horror, some is just sexploitation and body horror and it disturbs me on a spiritual level/doesn't sit well with me, I hate hate hate zombies too lol, I love stuff with Vampires, Aliens, Robots and Angels however

7.) do you have any Tattoos?

+ I don't but I would love to have many someday, a bunch of Crosses and Bible Verses and Flowers would be great as well as song lyrics

8.) what do you think about Anne Rice?

+ I adore Anne Rice, she was after all a Christian Goth herself, she really left the blueprint and paved the way for Gothic storytelling

9.) how do you feel about Sparkly, Cuddly, Friendly Vampires?

+ I love Sparkly, Cuddly, Friendly Vampires, they're my best friends(lol)

10.) what would surprise people about yourself, as if being a Christian Goth isn't surprising enough(lol)

+ I hate drugs and alcohol, I'm a Vegetarian, I'm Celibate and I think promoting suicide should not be a part of Goth Culture, I also hates jokes about devil worship, I am after all, both a Christian and a Goth at the same time

[pickle-the-lad]

I started thinking about Muslim women, which made me start thinking about transness and religion...

Now I'm hyper fixating on religious justification for transitioning, but have no idea how to start researching this... so if anyone's interested, please info-dump on me about religion in an LGBT+ friendly way💖💕

I'm perfectly open to discussions about any part of the LGBT+/MOGAI community, but my main focus with this post is transness.

This is the one time I'm using a dni!

If you're NOT friendly and supportive and you reply, I will block you. If you're anti-religion, this is not the post for you.

[jmcdra]

I'm just venting but JFC I'm sick of feeling like a social pariah for being a queer Christian and feeling like an active part of both of my communities want my existence eliminated if they could. It makes me want to scream and cry and just let one of them kill me. I hate feeling like I should just kill myself.

I hate that I have to say this to stop the religious bigots but before anyone comes in and says well all of Christianity is toxic. I am a leftist, sex positive, queer affirming, Episcopalian trans woman. I am serious about my faith as I am for social justice and there is no contradiction

[loveenduresall]

Happy Transgender Day of Visibility!

The Lord loves you as much as all of His other Children; your Life is a precious Gift. God gave us wheat to make bread and grapes to make wine - being able to Create and Change is one of the most wonderful Gifts given to us. You are Loved. God bless you all!

[sparrow-the-tired-lesbian]

it’s so weird when homophobic people, specifically my parents, act like gays are out to turn others gay. Like we’re doing an army recruitment or some shit. What do they even think happens? “Hey kid you wanna suck a dick?” “Sure!” “WE GOT ANOTHER ONE FAGS” “Hey kid you wanna eat some pussy?” “Absolutely!” “WE GOT ANOTHER ONE DYKES”

[cookinguptales]

So I’ve been enjoying the Disney vs. DeSantis memes as much as anyone, but like. I do feel like a lot of people who had normal childhoods are missing some context to all this.

I was raised in the Bible Belt in a fairly fundie environment. My parents were reasonably cool about some things, compared to the rest of my family, but they certainly had their issues. But they did let me watch Disney movies, which turned out to be a point of major contention between them and my other relatives.

See, I think some people think this weird fight between Disney and fundies is new. It is very not new. I know that Disney’s attempts at inclusion in their media have been the source of a lot of mockery, but what a lot of people don’t understand is that as far as actual company policy goes, Disney has actually been an industry leader for queer rights. They’ve had policies assuring equal healthcare and partner benefits for queer employees since the early 90s.

I’m not sure how many people reading this right now remember the early 90s, but that was very much not industry standard. It was a big deal when Disney announced that non-married queer partners would be getting the same benefits as the married heterosexual ones.

Like — it went further than just saying that any unmarried partners would be eligible for spousal benefits. It straight-up said that non-same-sex partners would still need to be married to receive spousal benefits, but because same-sex partners couldn’t do that, proof that they lived together as an established couple would be enough.

In other words, it put long-term same-sex partners on a higher level than opposite-sex partners who just weren’t married yet. It put them on the exact same level as heterosexual married partners.

They weren’t the first company ever to do this, but they were super early. And they were certainly the first mainstream “family-friendly” company to do it.

Conservatives lost their damn minds.

Protests, boycotts, sermons, the whole nine yards. I can’t tell you how many books about the evils of Disney my grandmother tried to get my parents to read when I was a kid.

When we later moved to Florida, I realized just how many queer people work at Disney — because historically speaking, it’s been a company that has guaranteed them safety, non-discrimination, and equal rights. That’s when I became aware of their unofficial “Gay Days” and how Christians would show up from all over the country to protest them every year. Apparently my grandmother had been upset about these days for years, but my parents had just kind of ignored her.

Out of curiosity, I ended up reading one of the books my grandmother kept leaving at our house. And friends — it’s amazing how similar that (terrible, poorly written) rhetoric was to what people are saying these days. Disney hires gay pedophiles who want to abuse your children. Disney is trying to normalize Satanism in our beautiful, Christian America. 

Just tons of conspiracy theories in there that ranged from “a few bad things happened that weren’t actually Disney’s fault, but they did happen” to “Pocahontas is an evil movie, not because it distorts history and misrepresents indigenous life, but because it might teach children respect for nature. Which, as we all know, would cause them all to become Wiccans who believe in climate change.”

Like — please, take it from someone who knows. This weird fight between fundies and Disney is not new. This is not Disney’s first (gay) rodeo. These people have always believed that Disney is full of evil gays who are trying to groom and sexually abuse children.

The main difference now is that these beliefs are becoming mainstream. It’s not just conservative pastors who are talking about this. It’s not just church groups showing up to boycott Gay Day. Disney is starting to (reluctantly) say the quiet part out loud, and so are the Republicans. Disney is publicly supporting queer rights and announcing company-supported queer events and the Republican Party is publicly calling them pedophiles and enacting politically driven revenge.

This is important, because while this fight has always been important in the history of queer rights, it is now being magnified. The precedent that a fight like this could set is staggering. For better or for worse, we live in a corporation-driven country. I don’t like it any more than you do, and I’m not about to defend most of Disney’s business practices. But we do live in a nation where rights are largely tied to corporate approval, and the fact that we might be entering an age where even the most powerful corporations in the country are being banned from speaking out in favor of rights for marginalized people… that’s genuinely scary.

Like… I’ll just ask you this. Where do you think we’d be now, in 2023, if Disney had been prevented from promising its employees equal benefits in 1994? That was almost thirty years ago, and look how far things have come. When I looked up news articles for this post from that era, even then journalists, activists, and fundie church leaders were all talking about how a company of Disney’s prominence throwing their weight behind this movement could lead to the normalization of equal protections in this country.

The idea of it scared and thrilled people in equal parts even then. It still scares and thrills them now.

I keep seeing people say “I need them both to lose!” and I get it, I do. Disney has for sure done a lot of shit over the years. But I am begging you as a queer exvangelical to understand that no. You need Disney to win. You need Disney to wipe the fucking floor with these people.

Right now, this isn’t just a fight between a giant corporation and Ron DeSantis. This is a fight about the right of corporations to support marginalized groups. It’s a fight that ensures that companies like Disney still can offer benefits that a discriminatory government does not provide. It ensures that businesses much smaller than Disney can support activism.

Hell, it ensures that you can support activism.

The fight between weird Christian conspiracy theorists and Disney is not new, because the fight to prevent any tiny victory for marginalized groups is not new. The fight against the normalization of othered groups is not new.

That’s what they’re most afraid of. That each incremental victory will start to make marginalized groups feel safer, that each incremental victory will start to turn the tide of public opinion, that each incremental victory will eventually lead to sweeping law reform.

They’re afraid that they won’t be able to legally discriminate against us anymore.

So guys! Please. This fight, while hilarious, is also so fucking important. I am begging you to understand how old this fight is. These people always play the long game. They did it with Roe and they’re doing it with Disney.

We have! To keep! Pushing back!

[spyderslut]

I just wanted to say, I came to check out your blog from the replies on a post where you tried to, very patiently, explain to a troll why they were being an asshole by shitting on queer people of faith. And both halves of my theological queer self needed to tell you, I very much needed to read that, it was good to see, noble to attempt, and also very cool and sexy of you. I hope you have a great day.

aw thank you! this is by far the best ask ive gotten! and yea, I try my hardest to approach everyone assuming first goodfaith, explain myself the best I can, and if things arent turning out well/im not getting through to people I wish em well and move on. sometimes it does work, sometimes I end up having a nice conversation. Either way, I hope im putting a bit of good into the world. And I hope you have a great day too!

[queerism1969]

[oleandro-drag]

saint sebastian tended by saint irene but they're both drag artists

felt like this might be something this site would enjoy

on stage: oleandro & delfi oraakel, photographer: peroksiid (on ig as oleandro_drag, delfi_oraakel and peroksiid)