#I just like the headcanon of aro-ace!charlie

[penguinsfly]

I unfortunately saw something I didn't want to see and that was my last straw. I'm fucking doing this.

Let's establish this first. Alastor is stated in the show to be asexual that is not up to discussion. He is also very heavily implied in the same conversation to be aromatic. 'An Ace in the hole' being used in context of him being with Charlie is also implying his aromanticism.

VIDEO

If that's not enough then here is Viv speaking about his romantic orientation. It's pretty clear despite the fact that afterwards she said it's okay to headcanon whatever (it's not but I will get o that later) that he is written purely as an aro ace character.

On top of that going by Alastor's interaction with Angel from the pilot and the first episode it is clear that he is sex repulsed. Not only that but on the fandom website he is stated to be touch averse with two sources which you can check out on the website.

Hazbin hotel wiki, Alastor page

Now we established that Alastor is canonically Asexual, Aromantic, Sex Repulsed and Touch Averse

As I also am all of the above I'll try to explain everything to the best of my ability as simply as I can.

Aromanticism and Asexuality.

I'm probably targeting the audience that knows those terms but regardless I will explain it anyway.

Aromantic - people that experience little to no romantic attraction towards any gender

Asexual - people that experience little to no sexual attraction towards any gender.

Little to no

Asexuality and aromanticism are spectrums in which people can feel certain attractions towards people but those attractions are less occurring or are defined by personal connection.

Diagram from AVEN website

However some people are at the end of the spectrum, they never felt attraction and that's valid. Alastor was stated to be aroace he wasn't written as demi or as gray he was written as aroace as in the end of the spectrum. His repulsion and not giving shit about romance or sex speaks for itself.

Representation

I do understand that everyone wants to be represented but it's so important to understand that aroace people are one of the most underrepresented queer groups in the media.

And I'm not here to scream about how I want my fav character to be just like me I don't care for it I'm way too confident in my orientation to rely on that however I'm tired of explaining to people what asexuality and aromanticism is just to receive 'are you sure' or 'you'll change your mind' or 'its not real' or the community favourite 'you'll find the right person' no I won't I'm not looking thank you very much (I just smile and nod to be polite and I'm sick of it).

'Harmless' buts like: 'He might be on the spectrum', 'AroAce people can still feel attraction' hurt the final outcome for all the people on the spectrum not only strictly aroaces because it allows people to write one shots with 'Demi Alastor' that falls in love in 2000 words because he is 'demi' (spoiler alert: they don't understand what that label means). It's just a cover, an opening, sneaky way to disregard his orientation, feel good about themselves and move on. Newsflash there is no moving on for aroace people it's our life.

Shipping

Shipping is just harmless fun right? Usually yes but not in this case. In the same way its not okay to ship gay characters with genders they are not attracted to.

It's erasure and since there is much less people identifying on aro/ace spectrums then there is gay or bi people our voices are being silenced. Not to mention that gay people received support from entire LGBTQIA+ community over the years in contrast to aro/ace specs who to this day are told that we are 'not queer enough' or 'not oppressed enough' often by other queer people.

And finally... FINALLY we get cannon Aro/Ace character that is clearly not interested in romance and sex. Character that beats stereotypes of boring and timid aro/ace people and what's the first people do? They ship him. Alastor's storyline provides so many points to be explored like 'what is his backstory', ' what's about his deal', ' how does he fit in in the found family trope' , 'does he care about hotel guests' yet people choose to write about the only thing that he is not interested in. As a heavily repulsed person that used to be horrified about the fact that I'll have to fall in love with somebody at some point before I found out what aro/ace is I find it repulsive and trust me he would too.

But Viv said it's okay!

Its the same point once again. What if Viv said that it's okay to ship gay Angel with woman. She doesn't have authority to say shit like that.

Queerplatonic relationships

I can't tell you not to do it I don't think he would be necessary interested in it but for fuck sake do your research and try to understand what queerplatonic means before you use it as a cover to shamelessly ship him. Respect the fact that he is sex repulsed and touch averse and you're fine.

Why can't you just avoid it?

First of all I shouldn't have to. Alastor's orientation should be respected in the fandom like any other orientation is. Second of all I've tried. I tried to only look up AroAce Alastor tag I've blocked over 80 people on tumblr alone (I just counted) to avoid to see anything that could trigger me and I'm not talking about slightly shippy posts or fanarts I'm talking about full blown disregard towards his orientation. Guess what it didn't work!

Archive of our own where do I start. I've used this website for over a decade and I could probably count days I didn't go there on my fingers. I'm fluent in AO3 I know which tags I should block. I know how to skim thorough the summary and tags to see if I'm interested. I've seen shit I'm a shipper I've been on ao3 for ten years but never had to mentally prepare myself to face queerphobia as I click on the tab.

Just use aro/ace Alastor tag.

I do and let me tell you people can't tag for shit or they just pretend to be clueless at this point. Besides see this?

there is more ff with Alastor/reader (disgusting) than there is Alastor with his canon orientation and to play the devils advocate for arophobic people there is more Angel/Alastor then his stated in the show sexuality. I understand that fandom goes back before the show was aired but Viv confirmed his orientation back then too.

Summary

I could go on and on bout different issues and maybe I will in the future but I'm not wasting anymore of this weekend on it. I'm ready to answer any questions as long as they are respectful.

I'm aware that he is a fictional character, it doesn't affect him in any way whatsoever but it does affect aromantic and asexual people keep it in mind.

If there are any mistakes grammar related I'm not sorry I'm fluent in English (not my first language) but I took 3h nap in between and I'm sleep deprived.

Have a nice day.

[elsa-fogen]

the reason I brought up Alastor only being canonically Ace is because you keep saying he's canonically Aro, and he's not. if you, and those siding with you, are gonna use canon to argue about shipping you should get it correct at least. also it amuses me that you don't argue against charalastor with the Ace argument by the way. only against radioapple. there's definitely a bias there, which is hilarious. -shrugs-

I'm not saying anyting (but this is my headcanon)

but first of all this☝️ @domni99

and this @theexecutionersmough

In fact, i don't argue about ships with this argument at all because i just forget about it all the time (other ppl do this for me and i'm like YEAH THIS TOO) (I'm just not used to keep it in my head all the time) (i need to sit there at least five minutes to remember that "he's ace" can be used as argument) (maybe now i will think of ot faster, thanks anon)

Speaking of Charlastor (and tbh any Alastor ship), i don't say that i ship them and i like this ship lol. And i skip sexual content with them if it appears just as i do for r#pple. (in fact i skip any sexual content no matter the characters, even with Radiorose (ESPECIALLY WITH RADIOROSE) eugh my ace ass can't look at this shit) The difference is that i can enjoy some platonic/qpr or slightly romantic content with them. Because there's Alastor and all i need in my life is just more Alastor in Situations. If i shipped them, it would be platonic or onesided only☝️ (in fact im gonna make one AU where Charlie and few more chracters got crush on Alastor who couldn't care less)

and speaking of r#plle i hate it not only because it's againtst Alastor's canonical ace-ness, but just because i don't like it and it's everywhere. Why can't i hate something for no reason?

Mic drop.

[broadwayfangirl222]

Headcanon for how Rosie knows Alastor's Ace when he himself doesn't (outside of her having an excellent gaydar):

She was there for him after Vox's confession and their fallout happened. Like how Charlie talked to Rosie about her relationship problems, Alastor basically did the same thing, just more ranty and angry about it. Like why are romantic/sexual relationships prioritized over friendships? Why do people make such a huge deal over those two things? It just doesn't make sense to him. And Vox is an idiot for throwing away their amazing friendship over this. Maybe he was even kinda vulnerable and asking/bringing up things aces and aros growing up and discovering their identity wonder and worry about.

I just feel like onesided radiostatic fans already focus so much on Vox's side of the fallout and not enough on Alastor's but I also feel like Rosie being there for Alastor, even if it's him just ranting/complaining and not angsty, isn't brought up enough. Like you can't tell me he wouldn't talk/rant to his bestie about the whole situation with Vox when it all went down

[shelbygraces]

I know that you've said before that every character you've ever played is canonically Ace, but I was wondering if you have a canon for each of their romantic orientations? If not, I have few headcanons that I'd like to hear your opinion on.

Shrub - Aromantic - From what I remember, Shrub never showed any romantic interest in any other characters (though, I think Joey was the only one in S1 to do so), so I just felt that Aro fit her

Great Witch Shelby - Homoromantic or Biromantic with a preference for women - This is just because of the whole thing with Katherine

Mickey Jones - Biromantic - I don't really have an explanation for this one, it just felt right

Charlie King - Panromantic - Charlie seemed like a really chill, "Let's just have fun" kind of person, so she wouldn't care what her partner's gender was, as long as they were fun to be around and they made each other happy

I never thought of my characters romantic orientations much but i love your ideas! I think Shrub being aro could be cool (but flower wives enjoyers will be sad). But that's why we have Witch Shelby, I'd say she is actually demisexual and biromantic! Mickey being bi or pan also feels right. And Charlie I think I actually felt was the closest to me personally, on the ace spectrum but not about labels much. Just likes who she likes :) I also imagine some of them as nonbinary, like Shrub and Mickey I could really feel vibing that way

[rory-adenine]

Okay but, I knew Charlastor was never going to be canon(with Al being ace, not confirmed if aro, and Charlie having a girlfriend, she and Vaggie are so cute together, just that Vivzie's storytelling is weak as hell but I got a lot of headcanons for them anyway) and people are acting like that ship has been killed when it never was going to be??? Canon??? Now they're saying I told you so... Like okay??? I can imagine in another universe where Chaggie isn't canon and believe me I now kinda understand the position of you guys, it must be so frustrating.

And people still made art about it even with that realization, did we just forget that — it never stopped anyone from shipping the dynamic anyway. The problem now is that it's considered a pro-ship. Which is mad as hell and I want to raise some debate in that, should it even be considered one? Is it weird now? I'm a Chaggie shipper through and through but seeing my fellow Hazbin Enjoyers who are Charlastor shippers get hate for it isn't in my bingo card, and is certainly what I didn't want to happen for them, especially when the hate for the ship was apparently so long ago and now people have a "valid reason" or so they call to hate the ship.

I'm not believing any rumor circulation that Vivzie wanted to bomb the ship though. These antis are insane for clowning you guys for it and I feel so fucking angry on your behalf all because of this drama, there's so much hatred over a fictional ship that people need to go outside and touch some fucking grass. They're like verbalase 50k but at least verbalase apologized, they didn't. They kept going, and this back and forth is making me want to quit being a fan of this, but the lore is good enough for me to stay.

I hear people wanting it to be dead and never have I ever wanted to spite ship something all because of them, like if they're seriously this dedicated to hating on some ship, let's see how much hours they spend harassing people who like the ship, wasting their life arguing. I wish they'd just block them instead of engaging, it's fanning the flames even more. This is some extreme pathetic actions for the antis in question, it's not even a shocker people are avoiding Hazbin Hotel just to not get involved in the drama.

Anyway, please don't hate on any ship just to get back at them please, Charlastor shippers, know you're better than them in that regard, coming from a Chaggie shipper. You're doing great, the ship in terms of canon never sailed, but for you guys, that's okay, now let's address where the hate comes from which I mentioned earlier, a "pro-ship", now is it? I'm not particularly fond of incest(It's icky), and I'm a little torn on who to believe, sometimes I wish Vivzie would come and address this although I can't hope for it to happen. Like please educate me on this. I want to hear all of the sides.

This reminds me of the hate of radiodust but to a more extreme scale. Like I want to hold all the non-canon ships and hug you guys to death, you don't deserve the hate. You guys can ignore canon all you want and do the cherry picking of the parts you like, that's the least of efforts I can give to you, maybe when I'm better at drawing, I'll be able to give you crumbs. If they start harassing fanartists who made old art about it, like 2018-2023 ship art, I WILL THROW HANDS.

Rant finished, I don't expect you to read it, it's kinda sloppy and unplanned.

[forgottenspring]

Mild rant on Alastor bc I'm tired.

*takes deep breath*

I was going to stay out of this so rip to my inbox.

Does anybody remember the whole ace doxing list on here? The whole discussion of not shipping gay characters with the opposite gender? The rep for pan/bi representation and the steps to do it right? Does anybody remember when ppl on here discussed how aros and aces aren't a part of the queer community bc they're not 'gay enough' in a way? Bc I do. That was about a decade ago. And I remember when Alastor was first introduced in the pilot and ppl not accepting he was aroace back then.

It doesn't matter if Alastor is entirely aroace and if he's capable of dating or not.

What matters is we still have so little ace representation and acceptance, especially aroace rep, that a few years ago when a real person Jaiden Animations came out as aroace, ppl tried to destroy her, bc even with a perfect valid explanation of her just saying aroaces are their own thing and she just doesn't want to date, ppl treated it like she was lying or was trying to sneak into the queer community and was straight or all the other horrible things yall might remember "fans" did to her.

Alastor being aroace isn't about being the rep of "Aroaces can feel attraction!!!" bc be real honest.

How many aroace popular characters can ppl list that a regular person on the street is going to know? Bc I've heard all their arguments to invalidate their representation.

Jughead? Oh you mean Cole Sprouse who made out and got it on with Lili Reinhart playing Betty bc he found her sexy? Oh but in the old comics he's a gay character whose in denial. Yelena Boleva? Who? Oh that woman? She's hot she's just traumatized and needs to find the right person. Charlie Weasley? Oh he was only in the books? He was confirmed as aroace through a passive comment most ppl didn't know about from the author that never used the term? Luffy? You mean one of the most shipped characters in One Piece? No he's just an idiot/childish so he doesn't understand girls are pretty. Caduceus Clay? Sorry I didn't watch Critical Role whose that? Are you sure he's aroace? He feels gay to me.

I can list more ppl, but I'm sure most ppl couldn't.

I remember the whole discussion of the pan/bi representation argument of "Yes! We know pan/bi ppl can date the opposite gender. But straight ppl don't know about pan/bi nearly at all or don't accept it," so showing it as gay, who know the term more, until it's shown clearly the character is queer and not "confused straights" they then can have opposite gender attraction. Bc sooooo many pan/bi characters end up "straight" at the end of their show/book. Bc I remember when ppl refused to accept that Deadpool is pan bc of his wife and started freaking out when he dated a nonbinary person in the comics or helped that one genderqueer person he knew.

Representation is about showing to ppl what they're not understanding about the identity in the plainest sense of the words of the identity, then when there's enough rep to show they're not all the same, then you can have the ones that break the rules.

Alastor whether or not he wants to date doesn't matter. What matters is this whole situation blew out of proportion bc ppl refused to accept that some ppl don't feel comfy shipping him. Bc they see themselves in him and don't want that. BUT! Also ppl under the aro and ace umbrella also have no rep and wanted to see him breaking the stereotype they probs have yelled at them of "You can't have a partner you're aroace I forbid it" and wanted to see thru their own experiences how that would be done.

Here's the problem.... As someone who has read a lot of aroace headcanon fanfics as an aroace....... A lot of ppl who are allo don't realize aroace "crushes" are missing emotions... That's why they're aroace. And they'll write them like they're the same just "muted" or "needs to warm up" kinda thing. Or make the character's love "childish" to explain the lack of romance/sex. Which is messed up. And that's the problem here.

Alastor didn't need to be this blown out of proportion of a situation. The problem is ppl found him sexy and the classic "But aroace hot, they can't be aroace bc why hot?" discussion got brought back up without the gentle post format discussions and instead it was a lot of shippers on tiktok with tiny word counts arguing a complex issue.

Ppl should be allowed to ship whatever (except problematic I know yall too well), especially if they see themselves in the characters and especially if they have the same identity and want to explore that!!

The truth of the matter is this is such a huge issue that just keeps happening bc ppl are too used to fandom queer spheres where ppl already know aroace means "off the table" and so they want to play with qprs or grayromantics/sexuals not knowing what that entails bc there's sooooo lil aroace rep that actually explores being aroace and a lot of ppl don't know the basics, and even how very different aroace "off the table" is when you aren't the classic "uwu I'm just innocent and have no friends or importance to the plot so just ignore me and have me be adopted by one of the main couples as a 'kid' figure."

Not to mention that a lot of ppl still think ace means aroace. That aces can't date bc there's ppl who don't know that romantic and sexual attraction are different!

I'm just.... So tired. So very tired of having ppl shout at me what it means to be aroace and being unable to look up the lil aroace rep we have bc of this issue I've seen a million times is all.

[chrysalis-the-butterfly]

Can you do Alastor please 🥺

Yep!

Send me a character and I’ll list:

Favourite thing about them: The radio filter on his voice! I'm a sucker for characters with artificial voice filters like that. And his disdain for "frivolous television technology" is amusing.

I recently rewatched the first episode of Hazbin Hotel with my dad, and he liked Alastor's radio filter too. (Yes, my dad watched some of Hazbin Hotel. And he decided it was "a bit too out there" for him.)

Least favourite thing about them: His design, I think. Yes, the creepy smile that never leaves his face is a nice touch, but that bob? It does nothing for me.

Favourite line: It's a close tie between, "Do you like blood, violence, and depravity of a sexual nature? Of course you do! That's why you're in Hell!" and, "Well, my dear, I haven't been active in Hell for some time, and everyone remembers me from my radio show! The proper medium to express oneself! But you insisted on this ... noisy picture box advertisement. So I had a little fun with it."

brOTP: I like his friendships with Mimzy and Rosie. The fact that he and Mimzy knew each other when they were alive is really interesting. And I can see how he and Rosie would bond over their shared fondness for cannibalism.

Plus, I just think it's funny that Alastor has been building this platonic girl gang around him. He's asexual, but also a chick magnet.

OTP: I don't really have one for Alastor. He's definitely ace, and he might be aro too, and I have yet to see a character that's made me go, "Ooh, I'd love to see what would happen if they were in a romantic relationship with Alastor."

But if I had to pick an OTP ... maybe RadioRose? Two cannibalistic Overlords causing chaos together? That would be pretty neat.

Actually, what about RadioStatic? The fact that the normally cool and collected Vox can be made to completely malfunction because of Alastor has piqued my interest. Maybe they were dating years ago, and then something went wrong. Or maybe they had a business partnership, and Vox wanted it to become something more, and Alastor just wasn't feeling it. Yes, Vox has Valentino now, but maybe there's a part of him that still pines for Alastor - which would be ironic, considering that Alastor has little to no interest in him.

nOTP: Charlastor. I prefer them having a "twisted mentor and innocent mentee" relationship, rather than a romantic one. Given that Alastor has positioned himself as a father figure to Charlie (albeit just to annoy Lucifer), it would be weird to think of them dating.

Random headcanon: Alastor has zero artistic ability. He once tried to paint portraits of the Hazbin Hotel staff and residents as part of an art therapy exercise, but they all look cursed. Or like cats. Or like cursed cats.

Unpopular opinion: Sorry, Alastor stans, I can't get on the hype train with this guy. Not yet, anyway.

I like characters that have a mixture of the known and the mysterious - that is, you know enough about them from the canon material that there are traits you can identify and latch onto, but there are also some things left up to interpretation for you to muse over.

Right now, Alastor's just a bit too mysterious for me. Is he going to be an ally? Is he going to be an enemy? I can't decide whether I like him because I don't know enough about him.

By contrast, I already know lots about Angel Dust, and I like what I've seen so far. And there are still things I don't know about him, such as how he met Valentino, that I can speculate on, which I find fun. That's why Angel is my blorbo and Alastor isn't.

Song I associate with them: "Love ka?" (a.k.a. "Rabuka") by Hiiragi Kirai and Ado. Particularly this Yokune Ruko cover. I see it as a RadioStatic song, because the lyrics are about sharks (Vox likes sharks, doesn't he?) and about bugs (which would fit with Vox glitching out).

The ending lyrics translate as, "These putrid 'love you,' 'love you,' 'love yous' have already fallen to the ground and died out. If you don't like what you found within your reach, maybe you should stop looking." That sounds like something Alastor would say to Vox.

Favourite picture of them:

[milomilesmib]

Alastor headcanons

He is aro ace, but would still accept/seek out a relationship/QPR for emotional reasons.

He definitely has sensitive ears, therefore hates when they're touched unless it's by someone he trusts.

He cares about Charlie but doesn't realise it. He realises he wants to be close to her/protect her and is like "ah yes, it's because she's powerful and useful. No other reason."

The more he cares about someone, the more brutally he will deal with anyone who bothers them.

He can and will wear anything and everything without a care. Skirts, suits, dingy hoodies, gym wear, hideous neons. Clothes are clothes, but he prefers to look nice.

He's always invited to tea parties because he has the best gossip ("I said no and now he's pissy, that's the tea!" "I know something you don't knowwww" etc)

He can use a laugh track as his laugh on command.

Bro definitely has some scars, and he doesn't like them. He wants to be in control and powerful, and scars are a reminder of the times he couldn't be.

He doesn't know he's aro ace. He thinks it's normal to not get crushes and that people just choose to get into relationships and pretend to be more into it than they are.

Insulting his mother is a death sentence. So much as one word against her and he explodes.

He likes making random little jingles on the piano, never really turning them into anything but still enjoying making them.

If he's ever injured/sick, he denies it repeatedly and refuses any sort of help (see above regarding scars)

He doesn't put much weight on his gender and sexuality, just wanting to go about the afterlife as himself.

He's a girl's girl. If one of his friends (they're all women) needs to vent, he's instantly all "spill the tea. What'd that man do, queen?" And he almost always takes their side.

He doesn't like coffee but definitely enjoys tea on a regular basis.

He likes wine and whiskey, but prefers not to drink at all

[ar0acejay]

hiya, here's the link to alastor not being explicitly aromantic being discussed on another blog: https://onesidedradiostatic.tumblr.com/post/743154763842093056/apparently-alastor-is-not-canonically-aromantic

tbh, I agree very much with what that blog said -- amir talai said "him being aroace is not explicitly known" which is true. the word "aro" hasn't been said explicitly in the way "ace" has. it's been stated as word of god and discussed and hinted, but it's not been said BY any character/s (yet 👀👀👀)

I think a VA of the character saying "my way of reading things is if it's in the script it's explicit, and if it's not, it's not" makes a lot of sense. that being said, it's not to say it won't be made explicit down the line, in the way "ace in the hole" was a way of making the aceness a Statement That This Is The Character

amir talai strikes me as the kind of guy who's been consistently very deliberate in only discussing what's on the page about his character, so not wanting to discuss his being aroace until/if it's on the page is very fair -- with "ace in the hole" he did also speak about how that was a way of making something explicit, while still being true to the character not knowing the terminology or the identity. until that moment, "ace" was not explicit either

(I don't btw personally totally agree on reading characters this way, considering the long history of queercoding being that one Couldn't make something explicit + that's still a very deliberate method of writing show-don't-tell today, But that's coming from my side as someone who's well-versed in that history, rather than a "I am the random person voicing a character and I do what's on the page in front of me, because that is my job and I talk about what is on the page in front of me" -- but he's clearly also trying to learn, which is awesome)

also he DID do some learning/hyping on aro-identity during this week of aro awareness, so it's also nice that he definitely understands that ace and aro aren't interchangeable and is putting in that work to open his horizons on that front

Thank you for linking the post!!

I totally agree with what the post said. Alastor got 1000% confirmed as ace by that joke and personally I also think that it included him being aromantic. A lot of people still think that ace and aro go hand in hand the same way that they assume that (for example) bisexual and biromantic go hand in hand (which they don't but a lot of people think that) so maybe the writers are part of that group. Also, like the other blog said, Rosie said the "ace in the hole" joke in relation to him dating Charlie and it basically went "she's too young for you lololol jkjk ik you're ace" (which doesn't stop people from being in an alloromantic relationship, people just think aro and ace means the same thing) so I do think they included aro into that scene. However aro actually being in the script is only my own interpretation so I get it if people think otherwise.

I completely support your point about stating things explicitly and queer coding. I think Alastor is extremely aro-coded apart from the fact that his VA didn't actually un-confirm it - he just said that it's not explicitly in the script. Personally, it's super duper implied that Alastor is aromantic but again, I get it if people don't see it. So yeah, despite what anybody says, as long as Alastor isn't confirmed to be not-aromantic I'll headcanon him on the arospec

Also, even if Alastor turned out to be not-aro, I don't think anything would change because about 95% of this fandom doesn't give a shit about aros or aces and just continued erasing Alastors aroace identity that we thought he had at that point so yeah.

(also amir talai doing research and posting about ASAW is so important to me AHSHSAHAHAJJWJFJS) (I never thought I'd be hyping up a man for doing the bare minimum but here we are)

[chaifootsteps]

Seeing how HH/HB is going down with all the shit Vivzie is doing is really sad to watch cuz I loved HH pilot and Alastor stole my heart.

I'm a sucker for manipulative bastards who wants to hold control over people but then find themselves in a found family trope and before they know, they are growing softer. Him being aro/ace character would be great thing too, considering he acts uncomfortable with Angel's (for me still hillarious) "I can suck your dick" and just seeing this so powerful Radio Demon losing sanity over sex jokes is the best thing I would ever ask for.

If Alastor turns out to be typical all-the-time-swearing character I'm actually gonna lose my shit. Vivzie already destroyed Charlie's kind and child like nature with her swearing for no reason at all. I have a lot of headcanons for all the characters and I'm just gonna keep them safe in my head because what the fuck.

I feel you, Anon. No matter how many despicable, awful things Vivzie does, no matter how much the quality of the shows crash and burn, that pilot was special, and no one can ever take away what it meant to a lot of us. Especially not Vivzie herself.

[indigosabyss]

Oh yeah sure plenty of people were headcanoning it I assume behind closed doors, Gwen had mad ace energy, you can’t deny, but I didn’t see anyone vocalising the aro headcanon online, just the ace headcanon, and half of those were the same person asking other people what they thought. And absolutely those ace vibes were unintentional, it just happened that the way Gwen was written lined up like that, she was just that kind of character. Like @vivziepop used to ship Alastor with other characters when he was just her DeviantArt and Tumblr OC, the main two he was shipped with being Mimzy and KayCee, the former being a friend whose advances Alastor always seemed a little uncomfortable with, then meant simply as flustered friend not wanting to ruin the friendship, before Viv realised what she was actually building to. Then the latter, this all powerful hatted cloud lady whose power Alastor was drawn to, meant at the main villain of Viv’s webcomic ‘ZooPhobia’ before she ended it and redeveloped the Hell-focused ideas as ‘Hazbin Hotel’ and ‘Helluva Boss’, her Hellaverse. Lucifer has her Apple sceptre in the final version of the show. And with all the talk of who Alastor made a deal with, I do think a version of this character will end up in the show, even if with a different name and design. I’m pretty sure she’ll end up being the Root of Evil, a.k.a. Roo a.k.a. Eve, based on the storybook opening of ‘Hazbin Hotel’ alone. Since that book showed Good and Evil as actual characters, like Good was a sentient force and Evil was a sentient force, and if you watch the scene again with that in mind, paying attention to what Charlie is saying and the visuals of the other characters outside of Lilith and Lucifer, it does look like Evil possesses Eve when the two give her the Apple, that those red eyes making up the void of Hell seen during the scene (and again in the season watching Alastor all the time in the background) are a part of her, who then literally takes the world in her hand and it cracks a little in red, since Evil has literally infected the creations of Good. I do think this also means in the series, “God Is Good” will be a very literal sentence, that when Viv said God wouldn’t be in the series in the way she did, she simply meant he wouldn’t be ‘God’ as he is biblically depicted, the physical embodiment of the concept of goodness being her capital ‘G’ god. So standing up to Heaven would be much worse than Charlie thinks it will be in the long run, realising what it is really doing.

Anon I'm 95% sure u forgot what u were talking about midway through this and I've never been more grateful.

[charlotterhea]

Rarepair Tag Game

Thank you for tagging me, @danpuff-ao3! 🥰

Rules: List the top rarepairs that you like outside of your OTP, and why you ship it! (Criteria for what makes a rarepair is up to your own discretion.)

Tagging: @cissykenway @snapeysister @echoofawind @giosnape @impure0purest @dilute-flower @enfinizatics @parumleo and as always everyone who likes to ramble a bit about their ships. There's too much arguing and too little gushing in fandom these days. 💙

I have to admit, I don't really have ships besides my OTP that I actively seek out and read or write so most of these are more intriguing to think about. Maybe I'll read a story or two about them someday but at this point, I've got still so many unread Snamiones on my reader that I hardly stray from them. XD

Still, there are a few I think are fascinating...

Severus/Sirius

Don't know if they are considered a rarepair but for me they fit the bill. ^^ I've actually written with them already but not really read much from other authors so I have a lot of feelings about these two idiots regarding my own plot (that I will at one point rewrite because I wasn't able to do it justice when I wrote it years ago). Occasionally, I am a fan of hate sex and while I don't really see that with Hermione and Severus, I can almost not picture Sirius and Severus anything different. They are the epitome of 'kill me or fuck me, there's no in between'. I love the fight for dominance and all the snarky and witty comebacks. I love how feral you can go with them. It's a ship best served rough. And if I like it a bit more palatable, I love to make them a threesome with Hermione (or a foursome with Hermione and therapy? ^^). She has a hard time keeping them from killing each other but she gets a pleasurable reward. :D

Severus/Filch

Similar to you, @danpuff-ao3, Delphi got me to love a ship that I will probably never write myself or read from anyone else but them. There's just no way anybody else could do it better. XD Filch is a rather unpleasurable character in canon since we only experience him through the students' eyes. But one has to wonder what kind of life he had and what's underneath all of that grumping and threatening. And who is a better way to explore that than Severus? I think they have a lot in common; if Severus were a Squib and lived amongst witches and wizards, I'm sure he would become even more like Filch than he already is. So it's intriguing (and quite hot) to put them in a culture dish, shake it a bit and see what happens - especially when Severus is still a student. It's not a ship I engage with often but I enjoy it every time I do.

Draco/Charlie

Never read or wrote anything with them, but @echoofawind put a bee in my bonnet when they mentioned it a while ago. 😂 The thing is: I don't like Draco. And I usually headcanon Charlie as being aro/ace and his life revolving solely around dragons. But I think I can make an exception with both when that exception is pairing Charlie with the only human dragon we get in the books. XD I don't know if I will ever have enough feelings for them to actually write about them but every now and then I think about what might happen on the sidelines of my Snamione plots in Romania. We don't know an awful lot about Charlie so there's a lot to discover there, and maybe he would be even able to make Draco a somewhat better person. That little shit could do good with falling in love with a bloke that he considers a blood traitor. And the ship promises a lot of denial and drama and I'm always down for that.

Neville/Draco

Same goes for these idiots. And I actually have written a longer story with them (it's not translated yet). My dislike of Draco wasn't always as strong as it is now (though I always preferred a more canon-compliant depiction of him and not the polished A+ student skilled smoothly perfect guy fanon often makes of him) and I have to admit, I had a lot of fun writing it. Neville and Draco are just funny as fuck! And that's all I need say about them. Except for maybe: the drama! Can you imagine Draco bringing Neville fucking Longbottom to present him to his parents? Or Neville bringing Draco fucking Malfoy to his gran? I ended my story before I got to that point of their relationship but tbh, sometimes I think about writing a sequel only for all of that drama. ^^

Lavender/Parvati

I never read a story solely about them but they are a background pairing in some of @morbidmuch's Snamiones and I always enjoyed the way they were portrayed. They are just sweet and wholesome and after sharing a dorm for seven years, I'm quite sure there isn't a lot that could get them to break up once they decide to be together. They just know each other, they've always been there for each other, and although I normally love the drama I sometimes enjoy some sweetness in between. ^^

Katie/Ron

Once again: Never read about them but they are a background pairing in one of my stories and will be in my current WIP. A lot of writers pair Ron with Lavender when they write Snamione but tbh, I don't think they would be happy in the long run. Ron never really was in love with Lavender and she deserves better than to be a number-two choice. So I thought about who else might fit Ron and eventually, I came up with Katie. She went through a lot in the war as well, all of that trouble with the necklace, being under the influence of Imperio, fighting with the DA... And she's a Quidditch player. I think she and Ron would have a lot in common and to talk about. They could be good for each other.

There are a lot more pairings that I like but neither of them are rarepairs. ^^ I'm surprisingly fine with a lot of the canon ships considering that Snamione is my OTP. Hinny is often a background pairing in my stories; I do love a good depiction of Romione (especially if it's a good depiction of how their relationship went wrong before she settles with Severus ^^); I have a soft spot for Remadora; Bill and Fleur are just a perfect match. But the above are some ships that I sometimes think about and if there will ever be a time when I've got enough of Snamione I might consider writing about them. ^^

[stravagatefaster]

A (slightly chaotic) Stravaganza rewrite/adaptation idea

So, now that we’ve finished the 2023 Stravaganza liveblog and I’ve told you what my headcanons for the series are after its end, let’s look at how I would change the main story if I got the chance. (Thanks to @10-dutchies-12-bicycles for being the one third of the fandom that voted for this.)

This is not an outright rewrite. I’m approaching this from the point of view of “I’m a showrunner and I’m adapting Stravaganza into a tv show”. In this theoretical show there would be one season per book with ten 40-60 minute episodes in each. I can’t take credit for all the ideas I’m presenting here, some of them have been brainstormed with a friend of mine.

Most of this focuses on the last two books, but there would obviously be minor changes in the adaptation in the first seasons as well. These changes would include things like giving side characters more depth, switching the order of some events etc. Most of the main storylines will still stay the same unless stated otherwise.

Some scenes/storylines are very clear in my head, while others are still a big ????. I may fill in the blanks in the future.

Changes pre- season 5

More development on Barbara and Marco as characters.

Cesare has a crush on Luciano in season 2, but he tries his best to get rid of it when they go to university together. (It helps that Luciano gets very annoying when he’s missing Arianna.)

Ludo gets more development during season 4. Rodolfo is the one who finds out about his di Chimici side (and even sees the ring, realizing that Jacopo is Ludo’s father). Luciano only knows that Ludo’s father is some nobleman.

Alice breaks up with Sky at the end of season 4, though it is left a little unclear where they will go from there.

At the end of season 4 it’s revealed that Jago is gay and out of the closet, Matt was just very oblivious and insecure.

Season 5 (City of Ships)

The first thing I’d change in season 5 is Isabel’s character. I already laid out some possibilities for this in an earlier post, but I would probably make Charlie good at sports + STEM and Isabel good at arts + nerdy things so that her feelings of not being good enough have at least some basis in reality. Even Charlie himself sometimes thinks Isabel's interests are silly and not that important.

I would also change Isabel’s crush on Sky to be unrequited. Or (and this came to me just as I was typing this) maybe she’s ace and/or aro? I just don’t want the group to consist of couples, some people need to stay single.

On the Talian side, I would focus way more on Classe as a city. I’d give Isabel some time to get to know the city, but have some of the other characters already preparing for the upcoming battle from the start.

Filippo could just skip the part where he messes around with mosaics and go to Bellezza almost straight away, giving him and Beatrice a chance to actually develop their relationship.

I also want more pirate stuff. Don’t know how, but more pirate stuff.

I would skip the retcon that talismans can take you to different cities now. There’s not really any major plotline in book 5 that requires it anyway. Isabel can focus on Classe, and any instances where someone travels to another city that’s not their own can just be replaced with something else.

Instead Dethridge can use his thinking brain and come up with a theory that the gate between the worlds is getting weaker. That could be what replaces the city-hopping AND the time travel shenanigans.

Speaking of which, Charlie will stravagate but it’s resolved without the detour to 16th century England. We don’t need the time travel if it’s never really going to come up again.

A side effect of Isabel beginning to hang out with the Stravaganti is that Laura begins feeling very lonely. (In this version they’re not Ayesha’s friends since that’s never relevant to the plot anyway. We’re also removing the SH storyline and replacing it with this.)

Alice (who has grown distant from Georgia as well) notices Laura’s loneliness and the two become friends.

This is the point where we really mix things up: The Fortezza plotline starts while Isabel’s adventure is still going on.

Andrea’s father is who he thinks he is, and he somehow ends the story still being a pirate.

Jacopo is very sick, and it’s obvious he won’t live long. This worries Fabio, and he speaks about it with Rodolfo via the mirrors. Rodolfo, who knows about Ludo, advises Fabio to take a new talisman to England just in case. He doesn’t tell the reason, but his ~stravagante’s intuition~ tells him Ludo might make things complicated in Fortezza and wants to play things safe.

Laura buys this talisman from Mr. Goldsmith. Alice sees it and immediately knows what it is. 

Alice fears that if Laura stravagates accidentally, she’ll end up just like the others and Alice will lose her as well. So instead she tells Laura about Talia, explaining that the whole thing is the reason why the others don’t care about them anymore. She even says that if Laura wants, she can show the talisman to the others and they’ll accept her into the group, but that it will be the only reason why they do.

Laura decides to stravagate, but insists that Alice sleeps over while she does. Before Fabio can see her, Laura slips away into the city and steals some clothes for herself. (Laura and Alice plan this all beforehand)

Fabio remains unaware that the new Stravagante has arrived.

While all of this is going on, Isabel’s adventure continues. None of the English Stravaganti notice anything wrong with Laura or Alice, since they no longer hang out together.

The season ends with Jacopo dying and Ludo arriving in Fortezza.

Season 6 (City of Swords)

The other Stravaganti have moved on with their lives, going back to normal life after Isabel’s adventure ended. Laura, however, has continued going to Fortezza. There she meets Ludo, who is now demanding the throne of Fortezza for himself. Laura finds herself crushing in Ludo, and supports him against Lucia.

Alice and Laura’s relationship continues to be slightly toxic and codependent. They both fear losing each other, but Laura doesn’t want to stop stravagating because she also wants to spend time with Ludo.

In this version Ludo does not return Laura’s feelings and is in fact quite oblivious to her feelings.

Fabio expresses his worry about Fortezza’s state to Rodolfo. They’re both a bit confused about why the talisman hasn’t brought in a new Stravagante.

Fabio even returns to Mr. Goldsmith’s shop to find out that the talisman has indeed been sold. He relays this information to Rodolfo, who stravagates to meet the English Stravaganti. He tells them about the new talisman and asks them to keep an eye out for the talisman. (They only have a very vague description of who bought it.)

The events in Talia continue largely as they did in the book. During the siege, Ludo’s side does something (I haven’t yet figured out what) which Laura does not approve of and she becomes disillusioned. She begins rethinking her crush on Ludo. This something is dangerous, and Laura ends up stabbed in her side.

Laura wanders around the streets of Fortezza, bleeding heavily and looking for a safe place to stravagate home. She finds an alley where she can lean against the wall, but just as she’s about to stravagate, she sees all the blood she’s losing and faints, the talisman slipping out of her hand.

Laura has asked Alice to stay over as often as she can, because the whole stravagating thing makes her nervous. (A big part of this is that she doesn’t have a mentor in Talia.) Laura’s parents are out on this particular night, leaving the girls to have a sleepover by themselves.

In the middle of the night Alice gets up to go use the toilet. When she gets back to Laura’s room, she sees the pool of blood on the sheets. Pulling back the covers, she sees the wound on her side. Alice remembers how Matt was beaten up when his talisman was taken from him, and she fears something similar might have happened to Laura. With one hand putting pressure on the wound to stop the bleeding, Alice reaches for her phone.

Georgia wakes up in the middle of the night to her phone ringing. She answers it, and it takes her a moment to understand what Alice is telling her. Georgia wants to ask a million questions, but from the panic in Alice’s voice she hears that this is serious and that there is no time to be wasted.

Georgia stravagates to Remora, and through a game of telephone the Stravaganti get a message to Fabio.

Fabio sets out to find Laura. It takes him a while before he finds her passed out in the alley, her talisman next to her. He wakes her up for just long enough to help her hold her talisman.

Meanwhile Alice has just been panicking. She eventually gives in and calls an ambulance. As soon as the ambulance pulls up in front of the house, Laura wakes up.

Alice makes up a lie that the girls were hungry and went to the kitchen to make sandwiches, and a knife left on the counter slipped and hit Laura. The paramedics barely believe this but they’re too busy to question it too much.

The next day Alice explains everything to Georgia. She blames herself for what happened to Laura – if she hadn’t been selfish and scared of losing Laura, this wouldn’t have happened.

After hearing Alice and Laura’s story, everyone else realizes that they treated them badly and that perhaps Talia was taking up too much space in their lives.

The others insist that Laura has to stravagate and finish her mission, but she doesn’t want to do it. Even seeing Ludo again is not enough for her to go back. Alice, feeling guilty, convinces Laura to finish her mission. Laura agrees, but insists that Alice has to stay with her whenever she stravagates.

Laura returns to Fortezza and is properly introduced to Fabio. She has now fully realized that Ludo’s cause is not worth it, and agrees to deliver messages to the castle.

Meanwhile Ludo too is beginning to see that he has gone too far. He feels especially guilty about betraying his Manoush roots. He even has a dream about his mother, and eventually he decides to surrender before more people die because of him.

There’s a lot of ?????? here that I haven’t figured out. There’s a bit of logistics that needs sorting out in regards to a few characters.

In this season Dethridge has his theory that the gate between the worlds is becoming unstable (the dates are no longer matching up in the two worlds) because of the amount of active talismans. He fears that one more talisman or translation may make the whole thing collapse. (Listen, if the books can do the city-hopping retcon, I can do this)

This ties into the way everyone gets to the wedding. Luciano goes to England and explains to everyone that they can come to the wedding, but they must give up their talismans. They’ll get temporary talismans that they’ll have to destroy later. He gives everyone a day or two to think about it.

Everyone agrees to do it, though the decision is especially hard on Georgia and Nick. Luciano says that if they can get the gate stable again, they might be able to bring over new talismans.

The temporary talismans are pages from Luciano’s original notebook. Both Vicky and David also get a talisman, with Vicky getting the leftover pages and covers.

Again, there’s a bit of ???? in regards to order of events and logistics here. But Ludo doesn’t die – instead he ends up becoming a pirate with Andrea

Ludo doesn’t die, instead he ends up in Classe and becomes a gay pirate with Andrea.

Instead, the person who dies is Cesare (listen! listen! put the tomatoes down! trust me!). I’m not exactly sure how he dies, but it happens after the Stravaganti have gone back to England after the wedding. Nick and Georgia try to stay behind to be with him as he dies, but Cesare tells them to go home. He makes Luciano promise to tell his family that he loves them. Luciano and Getano stay with Cesare as he passes.

Seriously, this whole ending is full of ????. Cesare’s death will mean more than Ludo’s to the audience, but I want the rest of the ending to feel satisfying.

The series ends with a montage of first Talia, then England. In the Talian montage, we see the people we met along the way going on with their lives (we don’t see Luciano and Arianna yet).

Then we get a scene where the English Stravaganti (plus Vicky and David) burning Luciano’s notebook in a fire. Alice shows up as well and burns her talisman. They all watch the fire die out. Alice grabs Laura’s hand and the two leave together. We start the English montage by seeing Alice and Laura happy together. Isabel is going to the movies with Charlie, who happily listens to his sister talk about whatever she’s passionate about, having learned to appreciate her interests. Matt and Ayesha go on a ride in Matt’s car. Sky hugs his mother goodbye at the airport as he leaves for the US. Georgia and Nick are at the Mulhollands’ living room, where Vicky brings them tea.

The montage ends, and we get one final scene of Luciano and Arianna watching the fireworks from their balcony in Bellezza.

Roll credits.

Jk, there’s a mid-credit scene.

A café in London. Text on the screen says: Five years later. The café is full of people. Jago Jones, now a successful author, sits by himself in a corner, working on his laptop and drinking coffee. Someone walks over to him and points at the seat opposite him. “Is this seat free?” a familiar voice asks. Jago looks up at the stranger. “Sure,” he says with a smile. The camera pans out and Cesare, dressed in regular 21st century clothes, sits opposite Jago.

Continue credits. The end.

Ok so I feel like I owe you a bit of an explanation for that last scene so I’ll rewind.

Very early in season 2, Georgia will give Cesare… something. Maybe it’s another one of her piercings or something. It’s done in a way that will not draw attention to the fact that this is a potential talisman. Cesare continues to wear this object around his neck the entire series, and no attention is ever drawn to it. But attentive viewers will know that this is one big Chekov’s gun.

There will be other small things that foreshadow Cesare’s stravagating sprinkled through the series.

Before Cesare dies, Georgia somehow ends up speaking about her home in an attempt to comfort him. As he dies, Cesare holds his talisman in his hand, though again, no special attention is drawn to it. It’s one of those things you’ll catch on your second viewing.

There we go – my changes for a possible Stravaganza TV show. There are a lot of other minor details my friend and I have planned, but those are the most coherent and important changes I would make.

[starrtoon]

Lol you'd think that if people don't like a ship that they'd utilize tumblr filters and avoid it, that's what I do. Like I'm almost positive I have the angel/alastor ship filtered out. Not gonna go after the people who partake of it. (Funny thing too is that people will come after you for shipping angel and vaggie bc of their sexualities in canon but alastor is supposed to be confirmed to be aro/ace and still ship him with anyone and everyone. I don't even have an issue with people shipping him with like Charlie or whatever it's just a bit of a hypocritical thing I've noticed.)

yeah, ikr. she seems to be consistent and says it isn't okay when people ship straight characters in gay relationships (at least she claims that, I don't know what all she ships so she could be lying, who knows 🤷‍♀️).

but why can't people just... NOT comment on art of a ship they dislike LOL. this was on DeviantArt, so she clicked on my drawing when she literally coulda just said nothing and moved on. people are acting like fanart and headcanons are gonna change canon or something 🤣

[amikye]

Here are some of my aro/ace headcanons:

Disclaimer: these are my personal opinions and even then they aren’t always consistent. I have a couple variations for the same characters. Also I’ll probably make this into a series, since I have a lot

I’m going to try to sort it by fandom/ book series.

Starting off w/ the OG fandom Harry Potter:

- Charlie Weasley: aro-ace. I firmly believe the fan theory that “working with dragons” became a euphemism for being on the aro/ ace spectrums and therefore everyone who works with dragons is on at least one of them.

- Luna Lovegood: demi-romantic/ace. She does eventually get married, but we also don’t ever see her date (though in theory that’s because she’s “odd”, which goes along w/ my HC that she’s neurodivergent)

- Newt Scamander: ace. Once again, he works with dragons. See my parenthetical note about Luna

- I could potentially see book!Hermione as aromantic, as she’s much more ruthless/ less emotional than the movies, but that’s a whole different discussion that falls more into stereotypes than how I actually see her character’s orientations

Sherlock Holmes:

- Every adaptation of Sherlock Holmes is a different variation of aro/ace. Including the original. Here’s how I break them down:

- the original Holmes is on both aro and ace spectrums, but he’s mostly apathetic towards it. He canonically says that he doesn’t prioritize emotions/ feelings (which isn’t exactly true, but I digress), so I think he isn’t completely aro-ace but is apathetic towards both attractions. The only woman he shows any interest in is his intellectual match, which has aro vibes to me

- I haven’t seen enough of the Basil Rathbone adaptation, so I don’t know, but from what I’ve seen he’s similar to the canonical Sherlock

- The RDJ Sherlock is gay(Watson)-oriented aro, demi-ace

- The BBC Sherlock is ace but not sex-repulsed. Just doesn’t really see the point in it

- Elementary’s Sherlock is aro

- We’ve only really seen the Enola Holmes Sherlock in a brotherly perspective, but I still got aro-ace vibes from the books, alà canon!Sherlock

Oh and they’re all in a queer platonic relationship with their respective Watson’s and in BBC Sherlock’s case Lestrade as well

Well this is already pretty long, so I’m gonna stop here. I’ll most likely make another list of more of my HC’s later, but for now this is the end of part 1.

[kitten-kokomo]

I’m putting in a cut because this post is long and I don’t hate everyone on mobile, but I’m also proud of my response so you should read it please :3

I would argue that the two are different, purely based on statistics. A gay male character, for example, in a media where maybe 50% of characters are male has plenty of ship partners that would match with his sexuality, and be interesting for the author/artist. And because in many medias, male characters get more development (something something fuck the patriarchy), those ships are often more appealing. Hence why you see so much mslash on ao3, especially in fandoms like Harry Potter, Star Trek and Marvell. So a gay male character is likely to have a sexuality-respecting ship that you, the shipper, enjoy.

An aro character has zero romantic ships. Which, of course, is fine for lots of people! There isn’t anything wrong with a character being aro (or ace, for that matter, or both!). But you can see why it would be more tempting to ignore their sexuality and ship them with someone, if you think it would be fun.

Also, usually it’s hard to tell if a character is canonically aro, because it’s the absence of attraction. Unless a creator steps up to share (which people who aren’t heavily in the fandom, or don’t interact with it on social media, might not see), it’s impossible to know if Charlie The Horse Man is aro, or just not into the other characters he’s met so far, and you could go either way depending on preference.

I asked myself these questions: would I ship a gay male character with a woman, or an aro character with anyone? And I realized that I don’t know of many canonically gay or aro characters in the fandoms I’m in. The closest I could think of was some mlm ships in My Hero Academia that I prefer over heterosexual ships for those characters, but that’s because I just prefer the mlm ship, and besides, neither character is officially gay. I also thought of one Gravity Falls fic where a character (Mabel, who behaves heterosexually and as alloromantically as possible) was aroace, and I didn’t like that headcanon, which was mostly due to my own personal headcanons of her being bisexual and unaware of that at present. And again, there is no canon support for either preference.

I do understand your point though, that if you wouldn’t ignore one sexuality, why would you ignore another, and it is valid. My rant was mostly directed at The Masses At Large *waves hand in general direction of fourth wall*

One other point: in your response to my rant, you said “you, someone who believes shipping is purely about having fun…”, which kind of implies that it isn’t, and it’s just a subset of people who believe that. (And maybe I’m just misreading the subtext, if I am, please please please ignore this last paragraph!!) But I would argue that of course shipping is for fun. One can’t make money off shipping (excluding commissions, which are less the creator desiring to create content for a ship, and more the commissioner desiring more content, which is actually a negative transaction for them) (I’m also excluding donations on Kofi or the like, since nobody is obligated to donate in order to keep consuming the content, and the creator has no guarantee that anyone will donate when they post their work). It’s a labor of love, that you do because a ship is cute or fun or hot. Anyone who argues that shipping is serious, or has rules, is quantifiably wrong.

Tl;dr: your point is fair, but I can see why people might regard the two differently, also I cannot for the life of me name a canon gay/mlm or aro character, and shipping is objectively for fun

new rule: if you wouldn't ship a gay male character with a lady, don't ship aro characters with anyone