#Honor Culture

[recsspecs]

Source: Pratiyogita Darpan, October 2024

voice is intimate? or are opinions too loud? too deafening?

[isaacsapphire]

I am not asking anyone anything. I am entirely aware that "honor culture" and "death before dishonor" and "set bayonets suicide charges" are an expression of the patriarchal machismo mindset that purity culture is one facet of in men as well as women.

Haven't seen anyone else addressing how the "feminist" preference for being eaten by a bear over meeting a man alone in the woods is in large part about purity culture and terror of rape.

Like, this whole thing is an obvious reference to older tales where the virtuous maiden flees the wicked men and gets eaten by a bear or fell off a cliff, but at least she died a virgin!

I miss where there was at least a feminist contingent that thought that being raped wasn't a fate worse than death.

[azucarera-art]

when u, a queen, come across another king, & u discuss how best to maximize ur joint slay 💅🏽✨

[demigods-posts]

we have yet to realize the opportunity that stands before us with nicknames like seaweed brain and wise girl. just imagine percy making a really good point. and annabeth pulling a 'i like your brain, seaweed' just to fuck with him lol. or annabeth saying something profound and percy going all 'girl, you're so wise' just to throw her off. think about the implications. i beg of thee.

[peekofhistory]

What dynasty are wuxia hanfu based off? The ones in The Untamed and Word Of Honor look cool but I can't tell which dynasty they're based off

It depends on the story/show :D

Wuxia shows can be from any dynasty, or even no dynasty at all. There's a Chinese term called "架空" （jiakong), essentially it means the story takes place in a fictional time period that doesn't actually exist in history. Stories that are "jiakong" have a lot of leeway when it comes to clothing, hair, settings, etc. because the writer/director can essentially do whatever they want.

Xianxia stories (like The Untamed) tend to be "jiakong" because immortals don't actually exist. To put Xianxia stories into actual history, the writer would have to make a lot of changes to what actually happened in history, which can get messy, so most writers choose to "jiakong" the time period just to make things easier.

Wuxia stories (like Word of Honor) can be "jiakong" or set in a particular dynasty. In the case of Word of Honor, it's "jiakong".

Because of that, the Hanfu designs for both shows are a mixed batch. I don't think the costume designers had any dynasty in mind when designing these clothes and instead just went with a basic "look" of Hanfu (long sleeves, long robes) and worked from there.

(If I get any of the characters' names wrong, please forgive me, it's been a while since I saw these shows OTL)

For example, in the pic below this style of flipped out collar worn by A-Xu doesn't fit with any Hanfu styles I'm aware of. The only flipped-out collar I know of is sometimes when wearing quju robes (pic 2,3) of the Qin/Han Dynasties, and he's definitely not wearing a quju.

【EDIT】 The collar of Tang Dynasty robes could be worn flipped outwards to reveal the semi-sleeve inside, but that's not the style A-Xu is wearing here.

Also the long slits in the bottom of the robes they're wearing, some Hanfu styles from the Tang Dynasty and onward do have slits but they were one on either side, and possibly one at the back, more commonly seen with round-collared robes (though not always).

Here Wen Kexing has on a quling (turtle-neck collared) undershirt which is seen in Han/Weijin Dynasties, but then the white robe has a flipped out collar. A-Xu's entire outfit is...lol, I think he's purposely wearing his collar loose like that to portray that he didn't really care about his appearance but technically no collar should be so low as that light-blue robe he's wearing. I don't think that robe actually has a defined collar, the fabric is just loosely gathered but there's no collar "cuff".

In this pic, Wen Kexing has a round collared robe which is seen in Tang, Song, Ming, but then the sleeve is like a half-shoulder vest rather than full sleeve, and that's also not seen in any Hanfu styles.

...Or is that one robe? Is the sleeve connected to that shoulder piece? Because it looks like the robe he has underneath is red (from the collar). I can't tell, but either way, that shoulder design is not a style found in any Hanfu of a particular dynasty.

This couple's wedding outfit is influenced by a mix of Song and Ming Dynasty. She's wearing green, usually seen in Song Dynasty, but her collar is a criss-crossed collar which would be Ming (Song would be like pic 3 where the woman is wearing a low-collared top rather than a high-collared robe). She's missing the "xiapei (霞帔)" which is that strip of fabric draped on the shoulders (pic 4), but it looks like the costume designer put a strip of red along the collar to give an illusion of wearing xiapei.

For the groom, rather than the official round-collar robe he's wearing a cross-collared robe, and his red is more of a blue-ish tint. Usually wedding robes, if red, are a bright red (literally called "China red" in China, xDD).

For this pic below, it's a 1-piece robe with collar piece going across the chest, then straight down from the waist. It could be a Tang or Song style Hanfu, but the sleeves, the belt, and the overall fit of the clothing isn't quite right.

The Untamed made a lot of their clothes really form-fitting against the actors, that's actually not a good fit for Hanfu in general. You want a nice loose fit, even if the clothing is "form-fitting" it's not meant to stick to your frame. Because of this, the clothing in the Untamed always appear a size or two too small (Word of Honor did a better job of sizing their clothes). If they were wearing today's clothing then it's no problem, but for Hanfu it's too tight >_< Then again, that's probably just the style they were going for so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

This black jacket/vest definitely was just created for a "cool" aesthetic. Xianxia/Wuxia shows love doing this broad shoulder vest garment, in actual Hanfu there ARE garments that look similar but these shows really run with it.

Here, Jinguang Yao (it's Yao, right?) is wearing a round-collared robe which was popular in Tang, Song, and Ming. The outer jacket and the material (it looks like brocade rather than soft silk) makes me lean towards Ming Dynasty for this outfit.

It also has an emblem piece on the chest which makes me think of the Mandarin Square robe during the Ming Dynasty (work attire for court officials) except: 1) Mandarin squares are embroidered separately then sewn onto the robe, this looks like it was weaved into the fabric 2) Mandarin Square robes in Ming Dynast were red 3) This emblem is round instead of square

So I would say they took inspiration from the Mandarin Square robe but changed aspects to make it fit into the show better (I think the show kept most characters in lighter colours to contrast with Wei Wuxian's darker, bold colours).

There's also things like the buildings, props, etc. to consider if we were to really dig into dynasties. And the hair styles, that half-up half-down thing is purely for aesthetics because in history they wouldn't wear their hair like that (especially considering their background).

There was a short period during the Jin/North-South dynasty when some men did wear half their hair down, but that was ONLY because that period of time was notoriously chaotic and the "rules" specifying appropriate behaviour in society had crashed (礼崩乐坏). Essentially, if you were a "civil" man (particularly with some education from a wealthy family) all your hair is tied up at 15 yo, and at 20 you get your guan (hair piece) ceremony symbolizing you're now an adult.

For women, pre-marriage you can leave some hair down, but tied in the back, not loose. After marriage it all gets tied up.

Leaving hair loose would basically get you labeled as rude, disrespectful, uncouth, uneducated, crazy, you get the idea.

But in shows like this it's a nice aesthetic when they're doing martial arts moves and the hair is flying around, so these days it tends to be the go-to hairstyle for xianxia/wuxia shows.

I hope that was helpful :D None of this is to say these costumes aren't beautiful, just not history textbook Hanfu ^^;;;;

[the-genius-az]

I love that @zuko-always-lies he knows how to explain himself so well, it's very cool. 😍

Zuko is in many ways the epitome of toxic masculinity(there is nothing more toxic masculine than using rage-fueled violence against “inferior” others in order to restore one’s “honor” and pride).  It’s kind of interesting that he’s by far the most loved and popular character in the fandom, while Azula, his sister who also engages in toxic behavior but not in gender-conforming ways, is the most hated, largely for doing the same things Zuko and Iroh did.

[senvurii]

real ones remember dsmp festival ctommy

[hmtaxidermy]

Big guy comin’ through!

[renshengs]

i just think if you are going to get really passionate about any deeply cultural show with distinctive ethnic names, and you are going to be so passionate about it, in fact, that you are going to consistently post about it in a public space for other people to see and/or you're going to write fanfiction about it, then you should at least make an effort to correctly spell the characters' names and know how to refer to them.

while fandom spaces are indeed for your personal enjoyment, there is a willful ignorance in the way a lot of people navigate fandoms surrounding media that is more culturally alien to them that reflects their subconscious unwillingness to take these cultural differences and intricacies into consideration. in my post's case, as i am chinese and am frequently in fandoms for chinese media, i can only speak on the fandom etiquette around names from shows that are generally more popular in english-speaking circles, like word of honor, the untamed, etc. and to be completely straightforward i think the name and terminology butchering has been pretty bad with some fandoms and absolutely unbearable in others.

"but i'm bad with names/i'm bad at spelling!" i can empathize. but i think making excuses is also a terribly avoidant thing to do. type with more care. find a method that works for you. the cultural context is crucial to the show and its characters; why are you here if you don't care about it? and yes, not paying mind to name usage is absolutely an ignorant thing to do, even if you are doing it unintentionally. obviously, spelling a name wrong does not indicate you are someone with that kind of prejudice, but not making any effort to get it right is irresponsible and insensitive, especially considering that native english speakers in the west have an extensive history of being dismissive and rude toward ethnic names, chinese ones included.

lastly, because this website has a victim complex that almost rivals twitter's:

the aim of this post isn't to imply that anyone who misuses or misspells names are bad people who should be witchhunted and torn apart (nor am i going to do that, which is why i am making a post about it), or that people who have dyslexia and other disability issues with reading & spelling accurately just need to "get better" (see: "find a method that works for you"). typos are not morally wrong & my point is not to shame anyone. i just hope people can find it in themselves to reevaluate their own stubbornness and just—learn to tread with more care. to treat these stories and their characters with the consideration that they already give to the media they're most familiar with, and to approach the cultural learning curve with willingness, or else just don't engage with such things at all if you are not able to understand that to enjoy them fully and deeply requires you to actually interact with the cultural context in which they were created.

[specialagentartemis]

unfortunately if I want to independently develop a hypothesis about Rohan's economic/subsistence structure I really need to learn things like the requirements of taking care of horses in the winter and the growing seasons/growing lengths of crops like lettuce, radishes, carrots, and kale, and metalworking time and space commitments, and the types of houses that can be erected and torn down quickly, and the required land area of grazing per horse, and the social organization of Iron Age Eurasian horse cultures, and what other animals might naturally live on the Mark, and productivity and caloric value of mare's milk,

and like. also reread the Lord of the Rings lol

[alwaysbewoke]

[sbrown82]

Babyyy, now THAT’s how you do a tribute! 🤌🏿🔥

[thepeacefulgarden]

[megsdoodletag]

the funniest part of juno's canon is that cato sicarius and lelith hesperax end up as like. some kind of work friends. to the detriment of everyone else, naturally

they met bc guilliman and yvraine keep stationing them as guards outside the study during their 'meetings'

the super secret spicy guillivraine meeting under the readmore

LMAO fun fact for the juno verse: 90% of her parents relationship is just this, don't let anyone tell u otherwise

[galleryofart]

The Love Letter

Artist: Jean Honoré Fragonard (French, 1732–1806)

Date: Early 1770's

Medium: Oil on canvas

Collection: Metropolitan Museum of Art, New York City, NY, United States

Description

Eighteenth-century artists and collectors valued oil sketches, believing that they attested to painters’ first ideas and their physical presence in each work of art. This finished painting engages with that new aesthetic. Fragonard’s sketch has energetic brushstrokes of varying thickness that capture sunlight as it lands at the center of the canvas along the woman’s cap, powdered face, flowers, dress, and bedraggled dog. This is not a portrait, but a genre scene that implies a narrative that continues outside the frame through a letter accompanied by a bouquet. The simple conceit of love letters had been popular in the previous century with Johannes Vermeer and his contemporaries.

[blackberryhound]

Quick shoutout to taxidermists and those who work with deceased animals whether it be spiritually or otherwise. I can see the love and care put into every cleaned skull or mounted pelt and it really shows how much one cares about the animal.