#Women in Public Spaces

[recsspecs]

Source: Pratiyogita Darpan, October 2024

[bayetea]

I don't like the judo flip in moa as much as the next guy but in my eyes it's largely the result of rick not taking female violence half as seriously as male violence (a result of viewing women as weaker and inferior to men such that their acts of violence don't need to be taken as seriously) and not so much anything about annabeth herself. like I do genuinely feel that annabeth is a complex heroine and definitely one of the better ones in the realm of ya action-adventure fiction produced in the past 25 years but she is still a girl being written by a man and all I'm saying is that her writing clearly reflects that sometimes (more in tags)

[serpentface]

What's the Wardi cultural take on Akoshos sleeping with/partnering with/marrying other Akoshos?

It's not highly regulated to a degree that there are overwhelming cultural norms about it. There's a lot of societal focus on akoshos being theoretically suitable sexual partners for both men and women due to being dual-gendered, but not to an extent that relationships with One Another are stigmatized.

They also largely get to escape from the most severe concerns about penetrator/penetrated power dynamics because they're not regarded as Men (they're regarded as dual-gendered, and they're a female social class on every practical level), there's no status of manhood to Lose by receiving sexual penetration. The only real thing you see in that department is people assuming that one acts as 'the man' and one acts as 'the woman', but this is largely due to preoccupation with a notion of sex being Penetration With A Penis (and that Penetration With A Penis means that one person is in a Man's Role and one person is in a Woman's Role). But this will not be regarded as unnatural as in same-gender male relations, akoshos will Have to take up a position in this sexual dichotomy if they want to have Real Sex (Penetration With A Penis) with each other, and this is not unnatural and doesn't involve gaining or losing status since they are simultaneously male and female, not men.

So like you might see individual culture critics finding stuff to nitpick about it as their annoyance of the week or a singular Guy here or there who thinks it's weird, but this isn't a widespread norm. The vast majority of people don't give a shit about akoshos having sex with each other. The worst thing you're likely to experience Solely by virtue of being in an akoshos-akoshos relationship is someone asking you (probably with genuine curiosity) which one does the man stuff and which one does the woman stuff.

Akoshos also don't experience Hard expectations for marriage (though there are societal pressures that make marriage an attractive safety net all the same, ESPECIALLY marriage to a man) so unofficial life-partnerships between akoshos are pretty much the Only same gender partnerships between unwed people that are going to go unquestioned. ((Sworn brotherhood is technically a same gender life partnership for men that is Functionally similar to marriage (in that it's a kin-making practice between unrelated adults), but the tradition is Built upon the assumption that both parties will be married to women and that a primary goal of this kinship is to provide security for both parties' wives and children)). Marriage obligations in general are more lax in the economically secure but not Wealthy lower mercantile classes (as obligations to support and perpetuate one's family are universal, but these obligations can be filled simply by having at least One son who can get hitched, and marriages in the lower classes have no political functions and therefore there's less reason to ensure All your children are wed (there's still incentives like dowry, but this is not desperately needed when a family is economically secure)). So akoshos in this class group tend to have a Lot more freedom in terms of their life arrangements and chosen partners (though still experience the limiting frameworks of structural misogyny in other capacities).

The only thing that is out of the picture is akoshos/akoshos marriage. Marriage in this society has a predominantly reproductive function, the concept of reproductively non-viable marriages is generally considered absurd. This is not JUST this culture's form of homophobia, as marriage is a very practical arrangement at its core - both in a reproductive capacity and as bedrock for the patriarchal blood-kinship family system that forms the core social unit. The idea of same gender marriage isn't just absurd because 'ewwww weird' it's like, that Cannot work within this system, it Cannot fill core functions of what a marriage intends to do here, the ways on which marriage and kinship are BUILT makes same gender marriage practically (rather than just socially) untenable.

The sole exception to the 'marriage = reproductively viable" rule is that akoshos can be married to men (which in practice is almost always as a remarriage after a man has secured At Least an heir). This has a Little bit of internal logic here in that they perform predominantly female social roles (thus are suited to being a wife, even if they can't bear children) (and also on practical levels of them having the same legal status as women) but it's really more of a 'this is just how it's always been' kind of thing. A lot of the older pre-Wardi identity dual-gender roles that got mashed together under the 'akoshos' name would have involved marriage to a man as a second wife/concubine, in addition to his primary wife who would bear his children. Men potentially having multiple spouses has not been retained as a cultural practice, but the notion that an akoshos Can be a wife to a man has survived into modern day legal and doctrinal practices around marriage.

So like this being said, marriage as it is legally defined is only between a man and a woman, a man and an akoshos, or a woman and an akoshos. In practice the latter two are comparatively VERY rare- a man/akoshos marriage cannot provide children (though an akoshos can practically fulfill all other obligations and duties of a wife), a woman/akoshos marriage Can provide children (and while akoshos cannot function as a male heir, these children Will take their akoshos-parent's family name (though the wife retains her father's family name)), but akoshos are legally grouped with women in terms of rights and privileges (including being permanently under legal domain of their father unless they have been legally handed off to a male husband) and Cannot provide hard power patriarchal support that this family system is built upon and therefore depends upon, which makes these marriages socio-economically insecure. They can obviously still be a good partner and parent, but this is not the same as having the Legal hard power of a patriarch.

Akoshos marrying each other would be reproductively and socially nonviable, and is treated as a similarly absurd concept to a man marrying a man or a woman marrying a woman. It's just not a part of the marriage and kinship framework, it's not a thing that you can Do.

[itellmyselfsecrets]

“There are plenty of accounts of hostility from men when women venture into supposedly gender-neutral shared exercise spaces. Like transit environments…Gyms are often a classic example of a male-biased public space masquerading as equal access.” - Caroline Criado Perez (Invisible Women: Data Bias in a World Designed for Men)

[krispiecake]

tell me why i can hear another tenants fucking music from my flat. HE DOESNT EVEN LIVE IN MY BUILDING. HE LIVES IN A COMPLETELY SEPARATE BUILDING ON THE SECOND FLOOR AND I CAN HEAR HIS MUSIC FROM MY FLAT. MY FLAT WHICH IS IN A DIFFERENT SEPARATE BUILDING.

[butchviking]

why is "if you have a problem with transwomen in your bathrooms mind your own business/stay home" always directed at women. why's it never at men. if men have a problem w transwomen using the sex-segregated facilities that match their sex then they can get the fuck over themselves or stay at home. how about that.

[lollytea]

Tbh I think the Barbie movie handled its theme of existentialism better than the feminism.

[gender-machine-broke]

Oh so “I want to rid of gender roles without ID’ing as trans” is fine for a liberal man to say, but when I, a radfem…

[chickenisamazing]

I try to advise my friend when she feels nervous about praying in public but the truth is I'm nervous too! I try to do it anyway bc it's far worse to inconvenience my prayers than to briefly inconvenience someone else because of my prayers but it's hard to get over that shyness

[elftwink]

that one post that was like "if people had to say what they actually meant by 'queer spaces' we would find out a lot of you are just talking about discord servers" was onto something. even in cases where the joke doesn't apply im thankful for having seen it because i have now built up the reflex of asking "wait, what does 'spaces' mean in this conversation", and it turns out a lot of people are using this vague language to lend themselves undeserved legitimacy because their argument starts to look extremely flimsy if you ask literally any follow up questions.

(a secondary consequence of this language being popularized is also a lot of people's arguments actually would benefit from specificity, and they choose not to use it in favour of the more popular and [presumably] more understood and widely applicable "spaces". the problem with this is, of course, that there actually isn't a consensus on what "spaces" refers to, hence the original point about discord servers being relevant. but everyone keeps using it and so we cement its use even further.)

[trans-yllz]

I think we gotta start recognizing that "things accepted online/in leftist spaces" and "things accepted by the general public in the real world" are two very different things. like no actually gnc men are Not suddenly seen as okay because there are drag queens on tiktok. men are still beaten and harassed and ostracized and Killed for being feminine. in the us. in my very liberal city full of ppl with blue hair and pronouns I am made to feel uncomfortable and unwelcome for being a gnc guy. the tiktok comments on videos of men wearing make up are not indicative of the beliefs of most people

[bucephaly]

watching someone's children is work, and people aren't entitled for asking to be paid for working. where did you get that idea /genq

I got that idea from actually learning about other cultures and breaking the hold western capitalist individualism had on my ideas of how the world works

I'm not saying put up a sign on the street saying free daycare, I'm saying that if someone trusts you enough to ask to watch their kids, that has the potential to be a great friendship if you like, actually help them out. I'm not saying never say no or that you are necessarily an asshole for asking to be paid, I'm saying that they aren't entitled or selfish for asking for help from people they trust.

I just don't get this modern entitlement and individualism where like, a friend confiding in you and seeking advice or a listening ear is seen as 'emotional labor' and shit like that. Like. Humans naturally want to help each other and it's so weird to me seeing people just refuse to like... be nice. It's about building community.

Children are raised communally in sooo many cultures and have been throughout most of history, the modern western idea of the nuclear family is so unhealthy for both parent and kid.

[nitewrighter]

Woman was on a SPEAKER PHONE conversation in the library today and had the gall to do the “excuse me I’m on the phone” hand wave to my coworker when she came over to ask her to quiet down.

Now, I may be overreacting, but I think it should be legal for librarians to roundhouse kick people. We could solve all our problems by roundhouse kicking. Like the Bene Gesserit.

[coochiequeens]

This wasn’t just a case of a boy being in the same locker room as girls. He was watching them change and made comments about it afterwards. And then the school dealt with it by punishing the girls.

A Vermont school district has just reached a settlement to pay one local family $125,000 in damages after disciplining them for speaking out against a transgender student that was creeping out high school girls in a school locker room.

In addition, the school has promised to reinstate Travis Allen as a middle school soccer coach, as well as remove any records of discipline against him and his daughter in the school database.

Christian conservative legal group Alliance Defending Freedom, which handled the case on behalf of the Allen Family, has deemed the settlement a "resounding victory for freedom of speech."

As reported by The Daily Signal, the legal battle began last October with the Allen family filing a lawsuit claiming that Travis and his daughter Blake "were punished for expressing their view on a matter of profound public concern: whether a teenage male who ‘identifies’ as female should be permitted to change in a girls’ locker room, regardless of the discomfort experienced by the girls in that room."

As their lawsuit detailed, both Allens took a stand against a trans-identifying male student using the girls’ locker room at Randolph Union Middle/High School. According to Blake – one of the school volleyball players using the locker room at the time – the trans student was making the females in the vicinity uncomfortable.

While objecting to the biological male using the facilities, Travis and Blake allegedly "misgendered" the student, which resulted in the school district disciplining them both. 

The lawsuit added, "In objecting to a male being in the room while the girls are changing, Travis and Blake each made comments underscoring that the trans-identifying student is in fact a male, including by using male pronouns."

It continued, noting, "Yet, their remarks were too much for Defendants’ transgender orthodoxy—Travis was deemed to have ‘misgendered’ the student, while Blake was found guilty of ‘harassment’ and ‘bullying’—so Defendants disciplined both of them."

The Orange Southwest School District Board and various school staff – the defendants in the case – suspended the father "without pay from his job as the Randolph Union Middle School girls soccer coach," the outlet noted.

Allen's daughter and several of her teammates were banned from using the locker room as a result of having criticized the trans student.

The suit charged that "Superintendent Layne Millington, Co-Principals Lisa Floyd and Caty Sutton, and the Orange Southwest School District Board are state actors and ‘violate the First Amendment’ by attempting to dictate ‘what may be said on matters of public concern.’"

The school district agreed to a settlement with the Allens, which requires the Vermont School Boards Insurance Trust to pay the family $125,000 in damages and lawyer fees, reinstate the father to his coaching position, and scrub the disciplinary mark off of Blake’s school records.

Further, the outlet noted that the settlement "requires the Orange Southwest School District Board and school officials named in the Allens’ lawsuit to remove any content posted online by the school related to the locker room business as well as from the bulletin board or boards at Randolph Union Middle/High School displaying ‘love and support’ messages to the trans-identifying student."

Alliance Defending Freedom senior counsel Phil Sechler commented on the result Thursday, saying, "The settlement of Blake and Travis Allen’s case is a resounding victory for freedom of speech. Calling a male a male shouldn’t have cost Travis his job and gotten Blake kicked out of school," he added. "We are very glad that the school agreed to do the right thing by giving Travis his coaching job back and dropping the discipline against Blake."

Sechler added, "Everyone has the right to speak freely, and we are grateful that this settlement further protects that right."

Fox News Digital reached out to the Orange Southwest School District for comment on the settlement and is waiting on a response. 

Here’s an older story for more background information

“The school previously came under fire for banning the girls’ volleyball team from its own locker room after several players, among them Blake Allen, complained about the trans student, reported the Daily Signal.

Blake told station WCAX-TV earlier this month that the transgender girl made an inappropriate comment as the volleyball team was changing, which made students feel uncomfortable.”

“In his Facebook post addressed to the legal guardian of the trans female after the locker room incident, Coach Allen wrote in part: “The truth is your son watched my daughter and multiple other girls change in the locker room. While he got a free show, they got violated. You think this is fine and dandy. I wonder how you would feel if I watched you undress?” 

Orange Southwest Unified School District Superintendent Layne Millington wrote in a letter sent out last week that Allen told school officials he called the trans student a “he” on purpose. 

“Such conduct is unprofessional and unbecoming, and flies in the face of the Vermont Principal Association’s athletic regulations, Vermont State regulations, and the RUHS Middle-High School expectations,” Millington wrote.

The superintendent confirmed that Allen has been suspended without pay for “misgendering” the student. He added that school officials have “significant concerns” about the coach’s ability to “support all of our students as the law requires.”

Allen reportedly offered to stay away from using gender pronouns altogether when communicating with transgender students, but district officials demanded a public apology, which he refused to issue.”

[2prince2sparkle]

Losing my mind hearing that people think being punitively misgendered as they/ them only happens to she/her trans women and not also he/ him trans men

Edit: glad I dug through the shitty comments enough to find op saying she didn't mean the phrasing of a particular sentence to imply this didn't happen to trans men, she wasn't expecting the post to blow up and was just writing about the things she's experiencing in a casual rant way. Internet ok sometimes. (Still other people in the comments thinking the above though.)

[rdlain]

annoying zelda fans will complain that a fictional all female tribe existing is misandrist or trans"""misogynistic""" or whatever but then they be completely okay with an all male tribe existing in the same game franchise (goron tribe)

Those 'people' need jobs fr, I guess they were mad at the depiction of that beautiful and heckin valid transvai you get your drag-fit from (hits too close to home lmao?)