#GRRM loves Helaena

[the-daily-dreamer]

Well well well… GRRM confirmed team 💚? ✔️✅✔️✅

GRRM SAID HELAENA THE BELOVED & RHAENYRA THE REVILED

I DONT WANT TO HEAR ANYMORE MAESTER THEORY. GRRM HIMSELF CONFIRMED RHAENYRA WAS HATED AND ITS NOT HISTORY WRITTEN BY THE WINNERS OR BY ANTI-TARG MAESTERS.

GRRM wrote this story to show that both sides were capable of evil and corruption, both sides had innocents who paid the price, and BOTH sides had a reason to fight. The reduction and changes by the writers to preserve the image of team black has even disappointed the creator of this universe! Because important character traits and plot lines have been destroyed and lost their impact and for what?

To push a “feminist” narrative of a toothless heroine in Rhaenyra. As opposed to a real story about the cost of power and war.

[helaenarts]

‘What is honor compared to a woman’s love? What is duty against the feel of a newborn son in your arms… We are only humans and the gods have fashioned us for love.’

Rhaegar Targaryen leaving a pregnant Lyanna Stark at the Tower of Joy to join the war

[imaginarianisms]

i& need yall to understand just how genuinely loved h.elaena targaryen actually was. she was so loved by the people that when she was either murdered or committed suicide, that incited a peasant uprising which led to the deaths of not just one but FIVE MOTHERFUCKING DRAGONS & queen r.haenyra had to flee because the people hated her that much (she's framed). imagine being so beloved as a queen that the literal common people rise in revolt because of either your murder or your suicide. literally no other queen had that kind of impact before or ever since.

[thesilverlady]

I'm not enough of a book purist to not being able to enjoy headcanons, crackships etc (as a matter of fact I do love them). But seeing newbies unironically and completely serious considering aemond to "trying to be the perfect son", or "heleana is the people's princess" or "rhaenyra is calm, collected and strategic", "Daemon is the family's clown, the agent of chaos" legit gives me a headache because they are nothing like that.

And I'm not talking about ppl writing fanfics with this type of characterization, but ppl legit having takes based on the terrible portrayal of the show. And even when they go to read f&b they still have the image the show gave them because they don't seem capable of letting go.

it just feels like Jon Snow/Daenerys Targaryen character assassination all of again.

There are so many people who consider Jon to be basically ned 2.0 and Dany a mad queen-girlboss-slay

I just wish we could seperate books from adaptations. That's all

[lemonhemlock]

i can't believe the amount of attempted gaslighting we went through with people left and right implying how we were being ableist or misogynistic because we were unsatisfied helaena didn't "wail" or offer herself up in exchange. a mummer's farce.

Well who would have thought...not me...sarcastically rolls my eyes pettily

[thesunfyre4446]

people are treating grrm post like it's just another opinion on the source material. girl no. he wrote the fucking source material. when he tells you that hel was beloved of the smallfolk and rhaenyra was not it's not his opinion it's a fact. when he tells you that the people of KL rebelled and sought justice for hel it's not an opinion it's a fact. making posts quoting the author's work trying to prove why acshually hel was not that important nor was she that loved and that gwurlbos qween rhae-rhae was acshally loved so much by the people of king's landing because the people in her father's court named her "the realm's delight" when she was 5yo. be so fr The Cope.

y'all are always talking about feminism so why are you so bothered by the idea that another woman that is not rhaenyra was loved and important? why are so bothered by the idea that Queen Helaena was an important character and the entire population of KL fought for her?

anyways, in the words of GRRM - "Queen Helaena was loved. Rhaenyra was not."

[girlfromenglishclass]

I know it's been months and we're all done complaining about House of the Dragon, but it was just such a wasted opportunity to not follow the book canon of the Greens being beloved of the people.

Even if they still wanted to frame the show with Rhaenyra as our star and character to root for, framing Aegon as a full blown antagonist just doesn't have the same dynamic storytelling that GRRM creates. Aegon being an inept king is absolutely not the same thing as him being disliked. Inept political leaders become populists and demagogues all the time. Framing Aegon as someone without real leadership or intelligence BUT with magnanimity and charisma makes him a much more real threat. Rhaenyra would be the better monarch, but as a woman and as less charming, she fails to get the support of the people. It's topical.

If they followed through on the scene of Aegon holding court, clearly reveling in the fact that the people love him, it creates a more interesting character motivation. Aegon didn't even want to be King, so the war to keep him on the throne feels wildly futile, but Aegon fighting to keep the love he's always been desperate for, that's compelling.

Plus, Helaena as a beloved queen would have furthered the themes around gender that season one created. She's meek and pleasant and pretty, so people love her. Rhaenyra as fiery and lusty and powerful, so people hate her. It's topical, it's dynamic, and it actually says something about the perception of gender as a performance in which you are punished for not participating.

And this isn't me saying "wow the show needed more misogyny; they needed to be nicer to the pretty princess" I'm saying it's a show about misogyny, so like, do something with that.

[lovedreamer11]

Let's clear things up once and for all. The real canon is the books written by GRRM. George may have sold his soul to HBO, but HOTD is still nothing more than poorly written by Ryan and Sara fanfiction. The events that take place in the show are not truly canon. This is more like a filmed AU fanfic.

The real canon is:

Viserys loved Alicent.

Alicent and Rhaenyra were not friends.

Alicent was eighteen years old when she married Viserys. Viserys was not yet thirty at the time.

Helaena is not a dreamer.

Aegon the Usurper is not a depressed boy who was disliked by his parents.

Mysaria and Daemon had a child together who died before he was born.

Criston did not have sex with Rhaenyra or Alicent.

Laena was twenty-two years old when she married Daemon.

In order to become a dragon rider you need to have Valyrian blood in your veins.

Whether Daemon cheated on Rhaenyra or not, he never tried to usurp her or scheme behind her back.

Killing Luke and killing Jaehaerys were not misunderstandings or accidents.

When the war began, the people of the Riverlands immediately supported Rhaenyra, except for the Tully and Brackens. But the Tully were initially neutral, and then supported Rhaenyra, and the Brackens were looking for a reason to fight the Blackwoods.

Corlys eldest illegitimate son is Addam, not Alyn.

Vaemond is Corlys nephew, not his brother.

Rhaena Targaryen's dragon is the Morning, not the Sheepstealer.

Alys charms had no effect on Daemon.

Rhaenys Targaryen has black hair. Rhaenys was not present at the coronation of the Usurper, and she was the one who proposed to attack the capital with all the dragons that the Blacks have.

Daemon really killed Laenor.

After his wedding to Rhaenyra, Laenor lived almost all time in Driftmark.

Daenerys's dragon eggs were laid by Dreamfire, not Syrax.

The marriage of Laenor and Rhaenyra lasted six years, and Rhaenyra and Daemon ten years.

Daemon didn't kill Rhea.

Rhaenyra was never cheated on Daemon.

And as a special aside, Jaehaera Targaryen died before she was ten years old. She and Aegon III have no children together. And Daenerys Targaryen is not a descendant of Aegon III, but his younger brother Viserys II. I'm writing this because at least forty green fans of the show wrote to me who were smart enough to Google that the war would end with the marriage of Aegon and Jaehaera, but not smart enough to Google what would happen after.

[synchodai]

I understand that because GRRM deleted his post, people will wildly misconstrue and exaggerate what was written, so here it is in full so you can read the actual words firsthand:

I want to isolate the part about Maelor. Here are the things GRRM says about him:

Condal assured him that Maelor would be included but walked it back.

Said that he still loved the B&C sequence on the show despite the lack of Maelor and it not being as strong as in the books.

Rickard Thorne in Bitterbridge wouldn't happen without Maelor.

Helaena commiting suicide wouldn't have happened if she didn't receive news of Maelor being so brutally murdered in Bitterbridge.

The Butterfly effect he is talking about is Maelor's birth -> B&C Helaena chooses Maelor -> Jaehaerys is killed instead of Maelor which leads to Helaena's guilt and trauma -> Maelor is brutally murdered in Bitterbridge -> Shatters Helaena's already fragile psyche -> Helaena kills herself -> KL smallfolk riot because Helaena was a popular queen -> Rhaenyra is driven out of KL by the smallfolk.

Things GRRM DIDN'T say:

He hates how the show handled B&C.

That Rickard Thorne or even Maelor is an essential character.

That the events have to happen as written in the book.

That he hates Rhaenyra.

Ryan Condal has committed treason most foul and now must be fed to his dragon.

[coffeebooksrain18]

The way TB must have been having the tantrum of their life when GrrM said.

"Helaena was loved by the small folk., and Rhaenyra was not"

Like sorry that you upset, but the Author said what he said, you can't be upset, it's his story he knows how it goes.

[maglors-grief]

I hate that people are using GRRM's blog post as proof that the smallfolk have always hated Rhaenyra and only cared for Helaena. Like tell me you didn't read the entire book without telling me you didn't read the entire book.

They act as if her nickname "The Realm's Delight" came out of nowhere or they believe the show's version of it where the smallfolk use it as a mockery against her. There were smallfolk calling out for Rhaenyra during Aegon II's coronation. The smallfolk welcomed Rhaenyra back with open arms when she arrived in King's Landing during the war because they disliked Aegon II and Aemond. It's said in the book that the smallfolk were only so quick to believe the rumors that Rhaenyra was behind Helaena's death because they had already turned against her after she raised taxes on them because the Greens left the treasury empty.

Yes they loved Helaena but do I think that they still would have rebelled against Rhaenyra after Helaena's death if she didn't raise taxes on them? No.

Saying that Helaena is remembered fondly while Rhaenyra isn't is so wild to me. Propaganda was heavily used against Rhaenyra. Her son may have sat the throne after the war but he was surrounded by Green supporters and men who did not want history to remember Rhaenyra fondly.

It's easy to love a person who did nothing during the war (no shade to Helaena). It's easy to point out all the bad things Rhaenyra did when compared to somebody who barely did anything during the story. What can the smallfolk blame Helaena for? She neither did anything good nor bad. She was just there. Rhaenyra was leading a war and had to do things that made her unlikable. The Greens left King's Landing a wreck and Rhaenyra paid the price for it.

[florisbaratheons]

What I liked most about GRRM's publication is that every time he referred to Helaena he called her queen, while with Rhaenyra he hardly ever did so or even gave her a title.

The people wanted her. They loved her. They mourned her and her children. They rioted in her name. Her death was one of the last straws for the public. Her brother and husband codified her reign so she (and Alicent) would be known as the true queens.

Helaena was the queen of the people.

[drakaripykiros130ac]

It is beyond me what Green stans are doing in the “anti-hotd” tag when the entire shitshow is basically an extremely canon-deviated version which serves their delusions, as follows:

1. Alicent is such a poor, innocent, do-gooder peacemaker, and certainly did not abuse her step-daughter, nor seduced and married the King for power, nor plotted for years to usurp the throne.

2. Aegon is not a gluttonous, lazy pig. He is just misunderstood. He harasses women because his daddy doesn’t love him.

3. Aemond is not a psycho. No, definitely not. He does terrible things “accidentally” because he was “bullied” (that word justifies your every action throughout your adult life? Really?)

4. Helaena is not irrelevant. No, of course not. The canon lies. She was a dreamer. Wow…a dreamer…but still completely useless.

I thought this was a safe tag where people can actually discuss the problems with this show, not for people to rant their delusions on how the showrunners “hate” the Greens, when they’ve done nothing but sugarcoat everything they do.

Like, suddenly, the coup orchestrated by the Greens is not treason, and not a malicious act (according to Ryan Conman and Sara Less), even though GRRM rightfully portrays that it is. I can’t believe that there is even a debate on that.

[2rats1gogh]

Jaehaera’s death was so unfair of Grrm, Aegon shows mercy and spares a whole slew of Team Black members but in turn his little girl is murdered? Grrm couldn’t let that little girl live because he says it would’ve made the story ending too neat, yet not a single one of Daemon’s children die?

I hope she lives in the show, the line is eventually continued through Viserys II anyway. It doesn’t matter if Aegon III’s children are Daenara’s or Jaehaera’s.

The show has written it like none of the Targaryens or Velaryons worship the Seven and religion is a Hightower specific thing when most of the Kingsdom, including Targaryens kept the faith of the seven, even Rhaenyra. (btw, WHERE ARE BAELA AND RHAENA’S SEPTAS?! Velaryons worshipped the seven, they’re also quarter Baratheon even though the show ignores that connection. Rhaenys and Laena would’ve grown up with Septas)

So it makes more sense that Baelor the Blessed is the Great Grandson of Alicent Hightower and Grandson of Helaena. As does Jaehaera with a daughter named HElaena, one named after Aegon’s sister and her cousin Rhaena who took her under her wings and a son named after her brave uncle Prince Daeron the Daring. She and Aegon compromise and name their daughter Daena because Jaehaera will never have a son named Daemon.

Louderrr!!🗣️ Absolutely agree with everything. I love GRRM and I think he’s a great writer, but his favoritism of Daemon clearly shows in the ending of the Dance of the Dragons.

Like it just feels so insanely unfair. And don’t get me wrong, it’s not like I can’t sit through horrible death, because I can. The death of Ned Stark was horrible, but it was foreshadowed by Joffrey’s behavior, we should’ve seen it coming. The Red wedding was brutal, but is was understandable, and if you really think about it, it was entirely on Robb. Even Blood and Cheese would’ve happened anyway, because Daemon would want to “avenge” Lucerys, so it was unavoidable.

But Jaehaera literally could’ve lived and it would’ve made the ending much better, and much more poetic. The two descendants of team green and team black, united at last, in a marriage that would finally bring peace to the realm.

And about the religion: omg fr!!! It annoys me so much as well. It’s almost as if the show tries to villainze the fate of the Seven by making Alicent extremely religious and team black almost entirely non-religious. It always felt so weird to me. Like, the Targaryens and the Velaryons still worship the Seven?? Why does everyone forget about it?

And that would also give the possible connection of making Baelor the Blessed the son of Aegon and Jaehaera. And you’re so right about the names!!!

[ceoofhelaegon]

I love how GRRM went over heels praising Phia and Tom from all the green characters. I don't even remember if he said something about Alicent or Aemond but i think he didn't. George seems pretty angry with the show and the only thing he could praise was Helaena and Aegon. Lol Relatable,he knew what makes a character, compelling.

And he gave us the most incredible and poetic description for our Queen:

"Helaena Targaryen, Aegon’s doomed, haunted queen and mother to his children."

He's the first helaegon shipper, actually.

But you're right, he went out of his way to praise Aegon and Helaena (TGC and Phia), he is probably pissed with the direction they are taking Helaena in regards to Dreamfyre because he made sure to mention their bond:

"A dragonrider since the age of twelve, Helaena’s greatest joy in life is to take to the skies on the back of her dragon Dreamfyre."

I think we can enjoy the fact that our vision for helaegon is way closer to what GRRM envisioned than whatever cheap fanfic Ryan invented.

[vhaena-targaryen]

Blood & Cheese is going to be such an awful scene to get through. Even GRRM said that it is too dark for television. I hate Daemon and Mysaria with every fiber in my body. They decided to go after the most innocent and vulnerable. Daemon didn’t say anything to Rhaenyra about it because he knew she wouldn’t allow it. I love Helaena and her children. They don’t deserve any of this.

Art in order - Renju Art and Doug Wheatley