#GRRM loves Helaena

[the-daily-dreamer]

Well well well… GRRM confirmed team 💚? ✔️✅✔️✅

GRRM SAID HELAENA THE BELOVED & RHAENYRA THE REVILED

I DONT WANT TO HEAR ANYMORE MAESTER THEORY. GRRM HIMSELF CONFIRMED RHAENYRA WAS HATED AND ITS NOT HISTORY WRITTEN BY THE WINNERS OR BY ANTI-TARG MAESTERS.

GRRM wrote this story to show that both sides were capable of evil and corruption, both sides had innocents who paid the price, and BOTH sides had a reason to fight. The reduction and changes by the writers to preserve the image of team black has even disappointed the creator of this universe! Because important character traits and plot lines have been destroyed and lost their impact and for what?

To push a “feminist” narrative of a toothless heroine in Rhaenyra. As opposed to a real story about the cost of power and war.

[tikhagurur]

GRRM being a helaenawife was not on my bingo card

[seilnakyle]

Grrm straight up saying Helaena’s death is the beginning of the end for Rhaenyra’s rule. godddd if only this show was in competent hands

[thesilverlady]

I'm not enough of a book purist to not being able to enjoy headcanons, crackships etc (as a matter of fact I do love them). But seeing newbies unironically and completely serious considering aemond to "trying to be the perfect son", or "heleana is the people's princess" or "rhaenyra is calm, collected and strategic", "Daemon is the family's clown, the agent of chaos" legit gives me a headache because they are nothing like that.

And I'm not talking about ppl writing fanfics with this type of characterization, but ppl legit having takes based on the terrible portrayal of the show. And even when they go to read f&b they still have the image the show gave them because they don't seem capable of letting go.

it just feels like Jon Snow/Daenerys Targaryen character assassination all of again.

There are so many people who consider Jon to be basically ned 2.0 and Dany a mad queen-girlboss-slay

I just wish we could seperate books from adaptations. That's all

[imaginarianisms]

i& need yall to understand just how genuinely loved h.elaena targaryen actually was. she was so loved by the people that when she was either murdered or committed suicide, that incited a peasant uprising which led to the deaths of not just one but FIVE MOTHERFUCKING DRAGONS & queen r.haenyra had to flee because the people hated her that much (she's framed). imagine being so beloved as a queen that the literal common people rise in revolt because of either your murder or your suicide. literally no other queen had that kind of impact before or ever since.

[thesunfyre4446]

people are treating grrm post like it's just another opinion on the source material. girl no. he wrote the fucking source material. when he tells you that hel was beloved of the smallfolk and rhaenyra was not it's not his opinion it's a fact. when he tells you that the people of KL rebelled and sought justice for hel it's not an opinion it's a fact. making posts quoting the author's work trying to prove why acshually hel was not that important nor was she that loved and that gwurlbos qween rhae-rhae was acshally loved so much by the people of king's landing because the people in her father's court named her "the realm's delight" when she was 5yo. be so fr The Cope.

y'all are always talking about feminism so why are you so bothered by the idea that another woman that is not rhaenyra was loved and important? why are so bothered by the idea that Queen Helaena was an important character and the entire population of KL fought for her?

anyways, in the words of GRRM - "Queen Helaena was loved. Rhaenyra was not."

[lovedreamer11]

Let's clear things up once and for all. The real canon is the books written by GRRM. George may have sold his soul to HBO, but HOTD is still nothing more than poorly written by Ryan and Sara fanfiction. The events that take place in the show are not truly canon. This is more like a filmed AU fanfic.

The real canon is:

Viserys loved Alicent.

Alicent and Rhaenyra were not friends.

Alicent was eighteen years old when she married Viserys. Viserys was not yet thirty at the time.

Helaena is not a dreamer.

Aegon the Usurper is not a depressed boy who was disliked by his parents.

Mysaria and Daemon had a child together who died before he was born.

Criston did not have sex with Rhaenyra or Alicent.

Laena was twenty-two years old when she married Daemon.

In order to become a dragon rider you need to have Valyrian blood in your veins.

Whether Daemon cheated on Rhaenyra or not, he never tried to usurp her or scheme behind her back.

Killing Luke and killing Jaehaerys were not misunderstandings or accidents.

When the war began, the people of the Riverlands immediately supported Rhaenyra, except for the Tully and Brackens. But the Tully were initially neutral, and then supported Rhaenyra, and the Brackens were looking for a reason to fight the Blackwoods.

Corlys eldest illegitimate son is Addam, not Alyn.

Vaemond is Corlys nephew, not his brother.

Rhaena Targaryen's dragon is the Morning, not the Sheepstealer.

Alys charms had no effect on Daemon.

Rhaenys Targaryen has black hair. Rhaenys was not present at the coronation of the Usurper, and she was the one who proposed to attack the capital with all the dragons that the Blacks have.

Daemon really killed Laenor.

After his wedding to Rhaenyra, Laenor lived almost all time in Driftmark.

Daenerys's dragon eggs were laid by Dreamfire, not Syrax.

The marriage of Laenor and Rhaenyra lasted six years, and Rhaenyra and Daemon ten years.

Daemon didn't kill Rhea.

Rhaenyra was never cheated on Daemon.

And as a special aside, Jaehaera Targaryen died before she was ten years old. She and Aegon III have no children together. And Daenerys Targaryen is not a descendant of Aegon III, but his younger brother Viserys II. I'm writing this because at least forty green fans of the show wrote to me who were smart enough to Google that the war would end with the marriage of Aegon and Jaehaera, but not smart enough to Google what would happen after.

[synchodai]

I understand that because GRRM deleted his post, people will wildly misconstrue and exaggerate what was written, so here it is in full so you can read the actual words firsthand:

I want to isolate the part about Maelor. Here are the things GRRM says about him:

Condal assured him that Maelor would be included but walked it back.

Said that he still loved the B&C sequence on the show despite the lack of Maelor and it not being as strong as in the books.

Rickard Thorne in Bitterbridge wouldn't happen without Maelor.

Helaena commiting suicide wouldn't have happened if she didn't receive news of Maelor being so brutally murdered in Bitterbridge.

The Butterfly effect he is talking about is Maelor's birth -> B&C Helaena chooses Maelor -> Jaehaerys is killed instead of Maelor which leads to Helaena's guilt and trauma -> Maelor is brutally murdered in Bitterbridge -> Shatters Helaena's already fragile psyche -> Helaena kills herself -> KL smallfolk riot because Helaena was a popular queen -> Rhaenyra is driven out of KL by the smallfolk.

Things GRRM DIDN'T say:

He hates how the show handled B&C.

That Rickard Thorne or even Maelor is an essential character.

That the events have to happen as written in the book.

That he hates Rhaenyra.

Ryan Condal has committed treason most foul and now must be fed to his dragon.

[coffeebooksrain18]

The way TB must have been having the tantrum of their life when GrrM said.

"Helaena was loved by the small folk., and Rhaenyra was not"

Like sorry that you upset, but the Author said what he said, you can't be upset, it's his story he knows how it goes.

[florisbaratheons]

What I liked most about GRRM's publication is that every time he referred to Helaena he called her queen, while with Rhaenyra he hardly ever did so or even gave her a title.

The people wanted her. They loved her. They mourned her and her children. They rioted in her name. Her death was one of the last straws for the public. Her brother and husband codified her reign so she (and Alicent) would be known as the true queens.

Helaena was the queen of the people.

[maglors-grief]

I hate that people are using GRRM's blog post as proof that the smallfolk have always hated Rhaenyra and only cared for Helaena. Like tell me you didn't read the entire book without telling me you didn't read the entire book.

They act as if her nickname "The Realm's Delight" came out of nowhere or they believe the show's version of it where the smallfolk use it as a mockery against her. There were smallfolk calling out for Rhaenyra during Aegon II's coronation. The smallfolk welcomed Rhaenyra back with open arms when she arrived in King's Landing during the war because they disliked Aegon II and Aemond. It's said in the book that the smallfolk were only so quick to believe the rumors that Rhaenyra was behind Helaena's death because they had already turned against her after she raised taxes on them because the Greens left the treasury empty.

Yes they loved Helaena but do I think that they still would have rebelled against Rhaenyra after Helaena's death if she didn't raise taxes on them? No.

Saying that Helaena is remembered fondly while Rhaenyra isn't is so wild to me. Propaganda was heavily used against Rhaenyra. Her son may have sat the throne after the war but he was surrounded by Green supporters and men who did not want history to remember Rhaenyra fondly.

It's easy to love a person who did nothing during the war (no shade to Helaena). It's easy to point out all the bad things Rhaenyra did when compared to somebody who barely did anything during the story. What can the smallfolk blame Helaena for? She neither did anything good nor bad. She was just there. Rhaenyra was leading a war and had to do things that made her unlikable. The Greens left King's Landing a wreck and Rhaenyra paid the price for it.

[drakaripykiros130ac]

More and more I see people questioning how the Blacks didn’t outright win and destroy the Greens in one go with all the advantages they had.

The answer is simple: The Greens were protected by plot armor.

GRRM gave the Blacks almost everything they could ask for (thereby favoring them):

1. The best allies (the Winter Wolves, the Lads, Cregan Stark, Jeyne Arryn, etc.)

2. The most Houses supporting Rhaenyra’s cause (53)

3. The largest territories (the North, the Vale and the Riverlands)

4. The largest and best fleet (commanded by the Velaryons)

5. The Velaryon fortune

6. The most dragons

Normally, with all these advantages, they should have won the war with their hands tied behind their backs. The Greens only had home-field advantage (King’s Landing) and Vhagar. That’s pretty much it.

But of course, GRRM wanted it to be a more balanced war, and despite giving the Blacks plenty of advantages, he protected the Greens so the story can actually take place.

1. There is just no way that Aegon the Usurper could have survived everything he endured (Rook’s Rest, and then battling with Baela etc.) In my opinion, he was one greenie who was definitely protected by plot armor.

2. Daemon using B&C to only kill one of Aegon’s heirs instead of eliminating everyone in that tower is also kind of plot armor for the Greens. There is no way that he wouldn’t have taken advantage to have everyone in that tower killed. It would have weakened the Greens considerably (not to mention that Alicent was the “brains” behind the operation).

3. Then you have Rhaenyra sparing Alicent after she took King’s Landing (the woman who bullied her as a child and stole her throne) for some dumb reason like “My father loved you so I am doing this for him”. Yeah right…With how much Rhaenyra hated the woman, she wouldn’t have hesitated to chop her head off.

4. For some reason, Rhaenyra decides to go to Dragonstone after the storming of the Dragonpit, instead of the Vale. Another plot convenience for the Greens. The Vale was obviously the best place to go. The Greens wouldn’t have been able to touch Rhaenyra there. The Arryns would have protected her and her child, until Cregan Stark arrived and dethroned the usurper. Happy ending, the end. But yeah, it’s Asoiaf. There are no happy endings, and GRRM had to give Rhaenyra a tragic end.

All in all, the Greens survived as long as they did because of plot armor. No, they were not politically savvy (believe it or not, that’s Daemon. He managed to convince the Red Kraken to side with the Blacks and didn’t really offer him anything in return).

Otto was a terrible Hand who got fired twice, Criston Cole was another terrible Hand who was all muscle and had no political intelligence (or any kind of intelligence), Alicent was a manipulating and greedy shrew hiding behind her sons, Helaena was completely useless, Aegon didn’t know what the hell he was doing or why he was doing it, and Aemond was a brainless psycho on the biggest dragon in existance.

Oh, and there’s also Daeron the Forgotten, who after torching Bitterbridge, managed to get himself killed by a fallen tent.

[ceoofhelaegon]

I love how GRRM went over heels praising Phia and Tom from all the green characters. I don't even remember if he said something about Alicent or Aemond but i think he didn't. George seems pretty angry with the show and the only thing he could praise was Helaena and Aegon. Lol Relatable,he knew what makes a character, compelling.

And he gave us the most incredible and poetic description for our Queen:

"Helaena Targaryen, Aegon’s doomed, haunted queen and mother to his children."

He's the first helaegon shipper, actually.

But you're right, he went out of his way to praise Aegon and Helaena (TGC and Phia), he is probably pissed with the direction they are taking Helaena in regards to Dreamfyre because he made sure to mention their bond:

"A dragonrider since the age of twelve, Helaena’s greatest joy in life is to take to the skies on the back of her dragon Dreamfyre."

I think we can enjoy the fact that our vision for helaegon is way closer to what GRRM envisioned than whatever cheap fanfic Ryan invented.

[vhaena-targaryen]

Blood & Cheese is going to be such an awful scene to get through. Even GRRM said that it is too dark for television. I hate Daemon and Mysaria with every fiber in my body. They decided to go after the most innocent and vulnerable. Daemon didn’t say anything to Rhaenyra about it because he knew she wouldn’t allow it. I love Helaena and her children. They don’t deserve any of this.

Art in order - Renju Art and Doug Wheatley

[sansacherie]

When Prince Daemon sent forth his call to arms, they rose up all along the rivers, knights and men-at-arms and humble peasants who yet remembered the Realm’s Delight, so beloved of her father, and the way she smiled and charmed them as she made her progress through the riverlands in her youth. Hundreds and then thousands buckled on their swordbelts and donned their mail, or grabbed a pitchfork or a hoe and a crude wooden shield, and began to make their way to Harrenhal to fight for Viserys’s little girl.

Queen Helaena, a sweet and gentle soul, is much beloved by the people of Kingslanding. Rhaenyra was not-

after grrm blog post came out (before it was deleted lol) the above quote was one of several that i saw tb bring up to "disprove" him. and it's like nuance is dead with y'all because nowhere in his post or the text did grrm say rhaenyra was ALWAYS hated or unpopular among the smallfolk, particularly in kingslanding. obviously that's untrue. however she certainly was by the end of her hold on the city and for good reason. tb likes to say that it was "only" because of taxes to make rhaenyra a victim of them being "unreasonable" (even though that alone would have been more than justifiable, the taxes were obviously high enough that it was hurting the smallfolk and rhaenyra did not help matters by the sounds of it, not doing anything to really alleviate that pressure or acknowledge it) but in reality it was also about her being a murderer of children in their eyes. which is like a pretty solid reason to turn against someone lol. and if we go outside kingslanding you know who else among the lowborn has good reason to spit on rhaenyras name? the smallfolk of westernlands. look up or refresh yourselves with dalton greyjoy because it's not pretty.

but anyway what i found interesting about that quote about rhaenyra is that if im gonna be be brutal, in this particular instance the love for rhaenyra is because of her father and thats not really a compliment to her imo. and while im definitely not saying there was never any lords or smallfolk who never loved rhaenyra for her own sake (because she was charming!)

however grrm has made it clear that the major difference between helaena & rhaenyra is that helaena is mostly loved because of who she is as a person (she's sweet, gentle, kind. she just - had good vibes and by the sounds of it was pure sunshine) whereas it's undeniable that a lot of the love rhaenyra has comes from the loyalty/love people had for her father viserys.

[alicentflorent]

Have you seen GRRM’s recent blog post?

Yes it was so good. I’m glad he doubled down on the damage the changes to blood and cheese did to the narrative, the cruelty of the killers, helaena offering up her own life, the “Sophie’s choice” moment - which according to condal was all maester propaganda right? Well the author has doubled down on the real accurate story which is the book version. He’s correct about cutting Maelor, who isn’t important in himself but his impact on the story was important. Alicent taking the initiative to get her grandchildren to safety when Rhaenyra is about to take the city, ser Rickard Thorne’s sacrifice trying to protect this innocent child (I like the actor who plays him so it’s shame he won’t get his moment), Daeron, the good brother and son, who loses it after hearing about what happened to his nephew and finally helaena, her suicide was directly because of Maelor’s death and now condal is planning on having her commit suicide “for no reason” in season 3, they’ve already taken away the fact that she was loved by the people and major riots break out, the dragons are killed and Rhaenyra is chased from kingslanding directly in response to the people’s princess/queen committing suicide after the horrific deaths of her children which were caused by the blacks.

I’m assuming Alicent won’t be orchestrating the plan to get her family to safety (and do not try telling me she was trying to save jaehaera in that final scene because she just told the enemy she wanted to take aegon’s only heir which was stupid and dangerous), daeron will just be burning down villages for no reason and will just be another Aemond, helaena will probably jump “because of the prophecies” or some bs. See how these changes have made at LEAST three characters less sympathetic? How helaena’s death will be less tragic and not the fault of what was done to her by the blacks in this war? And the fact that he says things are going to get worse story wise in seasons three and four and the fact that he likely broke an nda to write that blog is very telling.