#BECAUSE I JUST STARTED S15 OF SPN

[manwiththemagic]

All the hot mfs are dealing w/ a hurricane rn 😼

[f-t-e]

I started watching SUPERNATURAL in November 2020. I know, I know. My partner and I had been isolating alone since March. The timing felt right. I went though a wild amount of upheaval and trauma over the next year and SPN was there for me through it all. It was THE show at THE time and it kept me afloat when I needed it the most. Since November 2021 I've written just about 110,000 words of SPN fanfic, a number that seems unbelievable to me, and that too has been a real blessing to my creative life, no matter what haters say. (why didn't I write my own novels in that time? Because I have a hobby, Karen, and I love it.) And I've read about 500000x that much fanfic, which has been the biggest blessing of all. (ETA: oh right, if you want to read my fic, you can find my stuff here, I wrote a fic where Dean reads books. Lots of books.)

I know I'm a nobody in this fandom but I thought on this, our #DestielDay, I would submit my own humble rec list. I've curated this very deliberately: every fic here has just about 4000 hits or less (most under 3000) and all were published in 2020 or after. So, sort of a rec list for some lesser known and newer fics, something you maybe haven't stumbled on yet. Especially thank you to @jewishcharliebradbury, her rec lists gave me a place to start back in the day and I have tried to model the depth and quality they brought to their lists. I tried to link to everyone's tumblr, but if I missed one, let me know.

Most of all, thank you to everyone who has EVER created something for this fandom, from 2005 to 2023. I am so thankful and, honestly, honored to be among your number. You're not supposed to be cringe and say a show saved your life...but SUPERNATURAL saved me, it really did. See y'all when the movie/reboot drops, to quote Ryan Gosling in The Notebook: IT WASN'T OVER, IT STILL ISN'T OVER. And I'm glad.

-----

Finale Fix-It & S15 and Beyond

What The Moon Was Saying by Amiril (@runawaymarbles)

This is hands-down one of the coolest “Dean Rescues Cas from the Empty” fics I have ever read and the concept is brilliantly structured to mirror the literal and metaphorical things Dean needs to give up and let go to get free. Every scenario is very satisfying and they make sense, is there any better feeling? Dean is very open in this, but in a believable way that still has edges. And, oh, the reunion is so good. Plus all the family stuff. Just excellent, exactly what you want in a fic like this: lovely, well-written, smart, fulfilling, all the pieces clicking, the show but better.

Awake and Annoying by skycruise

I love the use and passage of time in this one, it has some real impact, and I love the way Dean gets into the Empty (so smart, fits just right) and what I REALLY love in this one is the way it lets Dean be really clear-eyed and honest about his relationship with Sam, both the strengths and the weaknesses. And the last line, very clever and moving inverse of one of fandom’s favorite things. 

Living the life you chose by allthismusic

THEEEEE post finale Sam Winchester-Outsider-POV this fandom needs. Sam is absolutely awesome in this, the most believable, loving, realistic mix of “I knew all along” and “I had no idea” versions of Sam, landing somewhere I think that’s really true and in character. It fills in and develops so many gaps and silences in what the show let Sam know in the absolute best way. Best Brother Sam is a weakness of mine and he really shines here, there for Dean in the best ways but also coming into his own, I love it so very much. (this author also has a very great 2022 Big Bang fic, hugely recommend that one too.)

your ear to the wound that whispers by EmandFandems (@lazarusemma)

Who doesn’t love a HANDPRINT FIC?!? And boy this is such a good one. It follows Dean and his thoughts on the handprint from the first touch all the way to fixing the finale and it simply buzzes with longing and desire, tenderness and rawness. It’s great insight in lot of ways into Dean’s journey. It’s short but fulfilling and oh that very perfect last line. (this author also has a lot of great Jupernatural content.)  

Somewhere Off in the Dark by magickastiel 

Another awesome fic that traces Dean’s shifting/growing feelings for Cas from when he shows up in his hotel rooms to a HEA fix it after canon. Dean, again, is handled so deftly in this one, his confusion and sorrow at all the times Cas is slipping away from him all the way through the things he won’t let himself know. He feels really true in this one, sharp and tender in the best Dean ways. Also it has an agonizingly romantic end, you love to end up there.

Pins and Feathers by theskywasblue (@buttherewasnogod)

This author has so many freaking good SPN fics, omg it was almost impossible to pick just one to include on this list. Go treat yourself with their entire list because there’s so much good stuff there! But this one, oh I am a sucker for a finale fix-it that lets Dean be this tender. While I LOVE fics where he just jumps right into Cas’s arms (and write them lol) I also feel like this is so true to Dean too: that “maybe I misunderstood, maybe I shouldn’t say anything, maybe he doesn’t still –” And on top of all that, it’s a “they go the beach” fic and it gets the details of it so right, sand in your toes and all. Tender, amazing slow-burn, real, hot, full of heart and longing and everything unspoken and just waiting. Very satisfying!

i loved you first by kalmialatifolia

A set of four short fics that create an entire world of feeling and emotion. These feel like little whispered stories told under the covers, very atmospheric. There’s one very sexy one, a haircutting one (so good) and they’re just intimate. All together a great set and did I mention they’re in the “Cas saves himself” genre which is mmmm an underrated treasure.

no other faith is light enough for this place by anonymous 

A fix-it fic that has a particularly unique and beautiful visual of both how and why Cas comes back. The mechanics behind it are fairly standard but the way this author creates the visual of it, the sheer emotion and force behind it and how it happens, it really stood out to me and stuck with me. It’s Dean being brave enough to really feel and the way that just blossoms – lovely, aching, full-tilt wonderful.

 no proof, one touch by TakeThisWaltz (@watchinghimrakeleaves)

One thing I absolutely cannot get enough of is fic where Cas is hiding out from Dean in heaven. It just hits. And the only thing better is Dean chasing him down and the WAY he does it in this fic, methodically and – well the method (sobs) it is so endearing and OBVIOUS and gives Dean a chance to shout in all the best ways. This one is just real sweet and kind of goofy and if they have to be in heaven, I want them to still be these same two dorks.

Stay by redbrickrose

This is a post S15x18 from Cas’s POV and I think it’s very true to where he would be in the moment of getting yanked out of the Empty: resigned, hesitant about what he has in front of him, still a little in shock. And then. And then. Sweet and simple and Dean gets a chance to say, say, say it. This author has a good post series AU and a lovely little spate of S15 codas, all good. And then wrote this in real-time in the week after 15x18 Despair and right before 15x19 Inherit the Earth aired (could you just sob over the possibilities?!) and then hasn’t wrote anything since and that’s a shame but, like, yeah I get it.

like a one-two punch by Muir_Wolf (@muirmarie)

Don’t you love a short fic that feels like it’s a whole novel? This goes AU after 14x20 Moriah but it is a truly delightful twist on how Chuck could’ve reacted there and it makes Dean sharp as a knife, which is one really resonant image woven through this fic. Great imagery here and so many clever solutions for the lazy plotting of S15, including simply one of my all-time favorites in any fic ever solutions to Cas’s deal (genius) and getting rid of Chuck. Brilliant like a puzzle box yet still full of so much fucking joy.

maybe i like pleasure pain by tothewillofthepeople (@kvothes)

The fact that this was written in October 2023 and is so agonizingly good fills my heart with joy and tells me Destiel will never die lol. Cas, in particular, is great in this – he’s having a hard time adjusting to being in a body and with all the fuzz of the world. I love fics where Cas struggles with coming back from the Empty and this uses a really unique approach to it: Cas facing sensory overload and not knowing how to feel but wanting it all. Lovely, hot, Dean is just right in this too.

Earlier Canon (pre S15)

Proverbs 13:12 by starlingcas (@angelcasendgame)

Many might say I am biased because Renu has beta’ed everything I have written in the SPN fandom and they can read my brain and make everything I write better. But it’s not just that. Renu has done something beautiful and delicate in this fic, which is about Dean and Cas getting trapped in a net together (forced proximity trope, yes please) and weaves a web of its own; pulling you in just as they are pulled together. This is set mostly in early S14 (before fixing the finale in the most heart-healing way) and captures that feeling so well. There’s so much that’s unsaid between them yet still conveyed and Renu absolutely nails that, along with the tender longing that was always there. This is a fic to relish.

you may tire of me (as our december sun is setting) by deludedfantasy

You know how the show just sometimes is like “uh so anyway uh then Cas…uh…left.” and it just doesn’t make one lick of sense? FINALLY FINALLY a fic where Dean says “I’ll go with you,” and then goes because he actually would do that. This is a post Tombstone fic so it is exactly where/when he WOULD go and it is tender and hesitant and aching in just all the ways it would be between the two of them at this time. It’s about needing to keep someone in sight, it’s about having another chance to say something so important, it’s slow and soft and just right for the characters in this place. I could read this one about 100 times.

the anatomy of flightless birds by cowlovely (@dollhousemary)

This fic is basically the way you feel when you get all cozy and snug underneath your favorite blanket. This is a domestic-life-in-the Bunker S9 fic where everyone behaves like they are in character and not just like they have to get Cas off screen because the writers panicked. You’ll just want to curl up in this fic and savor it the way you wrap your fingers around a hot beverage on a very cold day, there’s no better way to describe it.

virtue by JenTheSweetie

I think I’ve read this about 100 times and it still gets me everytime? It’s a five things fic about Dean and Cas hooking up and it’s all you’ve ever wished for. This is set in an amorphous S8 and it is not just agonizingly hot but also romantic and very funny. It feels really in character! Sam is hilarious, Dean is clueless but bowled over and letting himself be swept up, Cas is delighting in every second and smarter than he lets on and it ALL feels fated and lovely and sexy and just splendid. (this author only has 3 SPN fics but they are all so good and if you try sometimes, well you just might find is an absolutely brilliant deconstruction of Dean learning the differences between “needing” and “wanting.”)

Romance at the Motel 6 by shelia_amour 

This fic makes me feel like Stefon from SNL. This fic has everything: Cas and Sam pretending to be married, just the right amount of jealous Dean, Dean randomly pretending to be married to Cas, Dean realizing maybe this isn’t so fake after all, motel vibes, Cas in Dean’s clothes, Cas getting bee slippers. If you are not sold on this already, we are very different people. So good, aches just right. (set in a kind of “whenever” of canon, but I like to put it somewhere in S8.)

que sera sera by Purple_Starflower (@hauntedpearl)

The epitome of how fanfic unfolds for us all the things that COULD happen. You can’t PROVE to me Dean and Cas never snuck off to snuggle and feed Dean’s touch-starvation early in S13. I had to check when I finished because I just couldn’t believe this fic was under 4000 words because it feels so full of touch, longing, the things unspoken, and all the ways Dean was reaching, reaching, reaching. The best kind of ache, and everything by this author is lovely. 

the hard edge that you’re settling for by lesspopped (@trekkiedean)

This is some S10 Demon!Dean that made my stomach hurt and my heart ache and I absolutely loved it and I absolutely hated it and it all felt so REAL with who Demon!Dean was and could have been. There’s a TW for mildly dubious consent in this, but to me, Cas was so agonizingly true to who he was/where he was at this point in canon too. This fic is gloriously, claustrophobically intimate. I say unbearable because as a reader you know that this closeness, this intimacy, is what Dean wants/craves/deserves but can only give himself as a demon and the author does an exquisite job at getting all that across. Hurts so good! 

four of swords by sundryvillians (eurythmix) (@perenial)

Can the world ever have enough post 12x12 fic? The answer is, of course, no. Dean and Cas bake bread and in the soft space of creating something with their own hands, get so close to the words Cas said. It’s about healing and anger and making something just because you are so tired of everything breaking. If that alone isn’t enough to convince you, let me also throw in this is another one of those “possible off-screen moments in canon” that gives them something honest and tender and raw and it feels so very possible. 

Fifteen Prayers From the Faithless by koyas_cat

Short, achy, that sweet sting. A set of prayers for Cas from the beginning to the end, full of all the things Dean doesn’t let himself say outloud and just reflecting the changes in their connection over alllll the years. So good.

[chiisana-sukima]

Hey so this post just came up on my dash and its an interesting perspective for sure. I was wondering if youd feel inclined to share your thoughts on it but no pressure ofc feel free to ignore.

https://www.tumblr.com/zudilio/648738136098275328/the-thing-is-that-i-miss-the-early-seasons?source=share

Yeah, I saw it on my dash too and considered reblogging with comments, but it's three years old and the OP has said in other posts that they're a "Sam ignorer", so I figured they wouldn't be appreciative. Also, to a certain extent, "they should've given the plot points I don't like to the character I don't care about" is just a matter of taste, so there's not a ton to say about that part anyways.

As far as the "Sam is like John because at the start of the show he's driven by anger and his need for revenge" part, my thoughts on it are here, and @ardentpoop and @aliusfrater have excellent meta here as well.

Leaving aside the piece where I think the OP is wrong about Sam though, I do agree with them that Dean's character arc was mismanaged, and I sympathize with them and all the other Dean girls (gn) who got stuck with *waves vaguely at spn in general*. I agree with OP that Dean isn't an inherently angry person. I don't believe inherently angry people exist, but even beyond that, I don't think the intended reading of spn is that Dean's story is about anger. Gamble said at some point very early on that on the inside Dean is a frightened little boy who never had the chance to grow up, and I do think spn carries that thread through the seasons pretty well all the way to s15, where it attempts (with not-great success imo) to resolve it.

Unfortunately, I also think that spn's failure to resolve Dean's character arc satisfactorily was inevitable, and that the things that attract many fans like OP, who identify with Dean, are the same things that made resolving his issues impossible given the set-up. Just as Sam has a realistic case of poorly-controlled, chronic dissociative/classic PTSD (with psychosis during s7 and some CPTSD-like features) and doesn't have the resources to manage it beyond bare-bones survival, Dean has pretty realistic untreated, chronic CPTSD/BPD without the resources to even begin to manage it in a way that doesn't destroy his own life and the lives of the people around him. Dean's violence stems ultimately from his childhood environment, sure, but the person he is by the time we meet him in s1 has severe attachment issues, difficulty regulating his emotions, poor distress tolerance, black and white thinking in a job where black and white thinking results in victimizing people based on factors they have no control over, and most of all, no real concept of boundaries whatsoever. The cause was for sure his childhood, but the present of spn is just a very symptomatic adult. His mental health issues--and Sam's too--are the kinds of chronic illnesses that never go away and that people struggle with over their entire lifespans.

I don't want to be overly negative; many people with mental illnesses this severe do learn to manage them well and live full and happy lives (I am, within reasonable limits, one of them). But it's hard. And longstanding, deeply-rooted patterns of thoughts, beliefs, and behavior don't change without community resources, considerable effort, and for most people, years of trial and error. Spn's main premise is, for some wild reason, that the problems Sam and Dean encounter are metaphorically equivalent to real life problems normal people encounter all the time, but that in the spn world, all of the resources real world people have available to help them are impossible to access, except guns and torture. It's s13 before spn manages to get Sam and Dean into ONE SESSION of therapy with someone they can tell the truth to, and by then, we get this:

Dean is being a lot less unrealistic here than one might think, and yes, this picture will end badly in real life too.

Since the finale, a lot of fans have said things like "Dean deserved to go to therapy and get better" or "spn thinks if you have trauma, you should kill yourself about it", but deserving is fake. We in the real world live in a The Good Place universe. There's no fair calculus for who "deserves" anything. Everyone both deserves health and happiness and love and a comfortable life and also deserves nothing because there are other people who have nothing.

And unlike ours, the spn universe is not a The Good Place universe. It's worse. The writers of spn are and always have been profoundly ungenerous. The whole universe is built on victim-blaming and bullshit calculi of what crimes deserve what punishments and who should or shouldn't mete them out. In the spn universe, Dean is lucky. He had not one, but two BPD favorite persons, and he treated them both like shit, and they still both loved him and wanted to be with him and will be with him in the afterlife, presumably continuing to have the same intense, volatile relationships they've always semi-tolerated.

I like to pretend that maybe Sam, Dean and Cas can all read The Dialectical Behavior Therapy Skills Workbook on Heaven's version of archive.org and take it to heart, or that maybe Sam grew some boundaries in the years he lived without Dean that he can insist on hard enough and long enough for Dean to get a reparative relationship out of, and they can all after-live happily ever after. But the Dean that was alive during the 15 years of spn hadn't done that work yet, and the outcome he got was--if one subscribes to "deserving" as a concept--better than what he "deserved". If you hit your partner, you deserve to be left. If you hold a gun on them, you deserve for it to go off and kill them by mistake and you never see them again (although of course they don't deserve to die). It doesn't matter who the "angry" partner in the relationship is. Any sane person in this universe or the spn one should be angry a lot of the time, because both universes suck. Not to beat a dead horse with a flowchart but:

image source

The violence is the bastard. The emotions are not.

[zepskies]

Midnight Espresso Masterlist

In honor of Hispanic Heritage Month, here's a Masterlist for all stories in the "Midnight Espresso"-verse! ❤️‍🔥☕

Pairing: Dean Winchester x Plus-size Latina!Reader

Stories:

(**Notes 18+ only and/or smut)

Midnight Espresso** You’ve never taken Dean’s flirting seriously…until he asks you for an impromptu Spanish lesson. 

🎙️ Podcast Fic:

Want to listen to Midnight Espresso in podfic form, narrated by @talltalesandbedtimestories? Check it out below:

Then keep reading...

Touch Me** Dean isn’t used to how “touchy” you can be, but he never said he didn’t like it.

Devour Me** - Complete! When you and Dean start to press each other’s buttons, both of your tempers ignite. To make up for it, you give him an impromptu salsa dancing lesson…one he didn’t exactly ask for. 

Part 1 - A Takeover Part 2 - Telenovela Style

Bad Boy (Chico Malo)** You catch Dean red-handed—with one of his favorite episodes of Casa Erotica.

Show Me** - Complete! Dean meets your infamous ex-boyfriend at a fallen hunter’s funeral. You just forgot to mention that he’s a hunter as well. Maybe because he still has the power to get under your skin…in the worst of ways.

Part 1 - Objects Are Closer Than They Appear Part 2 - A Thorough Reminder

🎙️ Podcast Fic:

Get Stuffed Dean enjoys the way you cook Christmas dinner with a Latin flair, even if Sam likes to tease him about his insatiable appetite. You remind Sam about the true reason behind one of Dean’s biggest quirks.

A Wish to Build a Dream On** Dean has been harboring the archangel Michael in his mind for weeks now, putting a strain on your relationship. When Dean makes a wish that accidentally brings his father back from the dead, you get to meet the (in)famous John Winchester. But as always with magic, your boyfriend’s wish has unintended consequences.

A Little Danger** While relaxing together in the bunker, Dean takes your playful teasing to a new level. (And he’s too horny to care about the consequences.)

In Bad Weather** You and Dean tackle the biggest possible monkey wrench in your relationship yet: could Chuck have been manipulating you two all along?

[Set in S15 - "Fix It" for season finale]

Dream With Me** - Complete! When your ex-boyfriend calls for help on a case, you have a tough decision to make. But Dean isn’t going to let you do anything alone. (AKA: The last hunt you, Sam, and Dean will ever go on together.)

[Set in 15x20 - The true "Fix It" story]

Part 1 - On the Drop of a Dime Part 2 - We Can Fix This Part 3 - What is Deserved

Dean Winchester Series

Dean Winchester One-Shots

Dean Winchester Masterlist

Main Masterlist

✍️ Writer Support:

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[scoobydoodean]

hi, i've been inhaling your metas like air as i actually watch spn fully for the first time (in the last part of s15), so thank you so much for them! started watching knowing the finale/fan perception and kept waiting for dean to be the "angry one" but really? when did the perception switch from sam to dean as the angry brother? it feels like sam's the one suppressing anger and dean's the one suppressing fear, even in moc, widower, s15 arcs. i was curious about the perception switch in real time

<3 The perception of Dean as continuously angry skyrocketed in Season 13, but I'm sure there were always some fans who felt that way about him (from season 2 onwards likely). Sam's big "anger" arc is mainly season 1-5 for me. I don't see Sam as angry so much past season 9/10. But overall I think his emotions become increasingly understated so fans think they aren't there. I'm not really a fan of anger in of itself being demonized by the show or fans because it's just another emotion. I get irritated with 5.10/5.11 for instance because it culminates with this idea that Sam being angry and hating the devil is A Big Problem. In a similar way, writing Dean crying on his knees in season 15, saying, "I don't know why I get so angry" is perhaps one of the stupidest things the writers ever penned out of blatant laziness and disinterest.

[ananke-xiii]

i know that ruby and cas are often compared in their "love interest" function but to me there's just so much more than that. they're basically opposite characters (not just in the literal sense of hell vs heaven): ruby seems to be rebelling against hell while she's secretly acting in its favor; cas starts off as a soldier following heaven's orders and ends up rebelling and working against it. they both die for their own personal cause, although ruby was not granted the possibility of resurrection. and aside from the problematic fact that death is more permanent for women than men in spn, i wonder if it's also because ruby totally failed at her "friend/support" function (because she was sort of faking it or, if she wasn't, she was manipulating sam) while cas manages to create a real connection with the human in his charge and it starts changing him. don't get me wrong, i actually love that her "reveal" was an evil one, and i generally don't like when the show offers us weak redemption arcs consisting in monsters falling in love with one of the winchesters (ugh). i'm also not a fan of redemption arcs in general but anyway. but i do wonder if the cas/ruby parallel is way more interesting in light of their "friend/support" function. i might be wrong but these two are the first non-family characters interacting with the brothers for extended periods of time. and having someone outside of your family with whom you spend time, who supports you, and that you generally like is important. not great news here but what i'm saying is that for sam and dean to have someone else was a big step. so while i like ruby as a character, i'm a bit saddened by the fact that they didn't give sam someone to establish this type of bond with. that he was being manipulated again. and this state of affairs stays exactly the same for many seasons. sam has 0 friends/support figures outside of dean, which is just plain tragic. with ruby out of the way forever, cas' "opposite/dark mirror" function is given to crowley (it's not a case that, again, the two died on the same episode, just like with ruby and just like her crowley, too, was not granted permission for resurrection). which, okay, for all practical purposes i like crowley (although i suspect i like mark sheppard more, tbh), but i mean, bad bad bad women who die die die must stay dead dead dead so ruby had to stay as such, but what about meg? we were so close to having her as cas' mirror :"(. i'm a fan of homoeroticism as much as the next person but i do find that in spn it sometimes dims the light on other characters, especially female presenting demons (don't even wanna talk about abbadon grrr). cas cannibalized anna and then crowley cannibalized all other demonesses, it's not fair okay? i loved them! :( *me: shouting at chuck: now you bring her back! ruby, meg, even lilith!* *puches the wall* **chuck actually brings them back in s15** *me: not like that, chuckdammit! clenches her fists at heaven*.

[lol-jackles]

First off, big fan of your blog! I read it like a newspaper every day.

What I wanna know is, if the SPN revival ends up happening, what route do you see them taking where they don’t mess with the canon? I think it would’ve worked out fine had Jensen not ret-conned quite a bit with the prequel. Now what? Will TW be considered canon? Is it better to let Sam and Dean rest and just base the revival between 15x19 and 15x20 so the endgame is not impacted? Wanna hear your thoughts specifically.

Also, a lot has happened between SPN’s end and now, and a lot more will happen still before the revival takes place. Speaking in terms of J2 and their friendship and their dynamic, particularly post prequel gate, should we expect to see slight changes in the SamDean dynamic come the revival as well? It can’t possibly be the exact same as how we got used to seeing it s11-s15 with this domestic bliss, we-are-eachother’s-endgame bliss.

Thank you friend.

The Winchesters was retconned to take place in an AU, so it is irrelevant to the main SPN-verse. Think how the Apocalypse World where Sam and Dean were never born has very little impact on the main SPN-verse. There is a pair of AU Sam and Dean running around in Brazil but again, no impact in the main SPN-verse.  So while TW is canon, it is entirely separate from our SPN.

Jared seem to like the idea that 5 years passed between 15x19 and 15x20 so I think there is a fair chance the revival could take place during those 5 years, Since Jared actually looks younger now than he did in season 15, then it can work.  (Sidenote: Jared started out looking normal in season 15 but midway through he trained for the marathon and gave himself the gaunt "runner face" that significantly aged him in appearance.)

 With Jack remaking heaven and keeping the angels away from earth and Rowena keeping demons away from the Winchesters, the brothers’ hunts return to the simpler days of monster hunting and explore new urban myths.

During these so-called simple monster hunts, Sam and Dean could go deeper into dealing their personal issues, which will draw them even closer leading up to the fateful Barn Scene day. Among the drama I would like to see closure to unresolved arcs, like what happened to Sam power?   Where are all the demons that Dean made during his apprenticeship as hell’s torturer?   Belphagore opened up that opportunity in season 15, which we also saw clues that not all demons are going to follow Rowena. Then we can have queen Rowena seeking help from the Winchesters to wrangle wayward demons either back into hell or into the Empty.

I expect we will still see the same Sam and Dean dynamic. First, based on the first and second convention after the prequel mess, the J2 magic was still there. Think of the times you haven't seen friends or family members for years and as soon as you re-connect, you immediately fell back into the old dynamics out of habit. Second, Hollywood is like an endless high school.  You may not have liked your high school but you find yourself going to every reunion because nobody else in the world know what you’ve experienced other than your classmates even if you hated them back in the day.  Many deep and casual relationships are based on shared experiences rather than actual compatibility. 

[charcubed]

Hi. I tend to forget that tumblr exists and just shout all my thoughts about The Winchesters on Twitter @CharCubed, which is a problem, but for once in my life I'm posting something here!

Here are some broad Thoughts on where I've landed of what this season 1 finale of The Winchesters offered–

• I very much want season 2 of this show SO badly. I want to see how they all continue to build their lives now that we know tragedy need not be their end! THIS IS THE HEALING SHOW. That whole cast gets to write their own story... "the only thing that's worse than how it starts for a hunter is how it ends" is no longer the case, as Carlos already said... and Dean helped to free them? That fucks.

• In regards to those possibilities: now that Dean would no longer be framing the prequel as a story he's telling, it frees the prequel up to no longer be doubling as Dean's story through revealing mirroring–which is very much what it's been doing for 12 episodes. Now the monster plots and the storylines for those characters in The Winchesters can also be diversified, so every episode no longer has to include, for example... [checks notes] a situation where a character is literally and/or metaphorically trapped and has to confront their trauma, break cycles of violence, and speak truths to be freed. It's been very Loud and very much Like This Constantly because it's Dean's story, but now it won't have to be anymore, which is an interesting thing to contemplate! (To be clear, for those unaware of my history of yelling about this show: I love that it was Like This. This show is fucking genius.)

• Initially, this finale had some alarm bells pinging in my brain but then I parsed the Reasons for those things. Mary told John she had "Something to say," right? And then she never says it. That's a Chekhov's gun that's never fired and it's of course paralleling how Dean has "something to say" to Cas too. Them not speaking that truth is a problem. In addition, we also got a montage eerily akin to the 15x19 one. But these callbacks / parallels to s15 all loudly indicate something very specific: The Winchesters is an unfinished story, and this finale (like the rest of this show) is mirroring and revealing truths about the prime narrative of SPN. For one thing, with the prequel they originally expected to have 22 or so episodes and ended up having 13 to work with. For another... this is the START of their story, not the end. So along those lines, what can we deduce about the end of season 15? (Hint: that finale is not an ending either.)

• Speaking of which: We learn that everything Dean was just doing takes place in the ~heavenly~ time period before Sam “dies." This all functionally happened right after Dean died as he drove down that road. He is restless, unmoored, grieving, and–this is key–considers his "ending" to be an unhappy happy one. He's fucking around and finding out, looking for and unpacking (through his narration) what he needs and wants for HIS happy ending to look like. He found out about the Akrida being a failsafe from Chuck and couldn't resist meddling to save everyone. It's also worth noting that Dean says to Jack something like, "If you have to kick me out of Heaven then that's fine." Between the lines is the thought of "please kick me out of Heaven, I'm causing problems because I'm grieving and I'm not done, I don't want this 'peace' but would rather have freedom." That in itself is a massive subversion of the SPN finale, to say nothing of the previous 12 episodes we've received.

Anyway. So in terms of Dean's story, we now know that this all takes place smack in the middle of 15x20 timeline-wise. This checks out because Bobby's presence connects to him being the only one we saw in 15x20. And... what I personally consider to be Jack's incredibly fucked up or ~potentially taken over by Chuck~ vibes are, in that sense, consistent with 15x19 as well. (I'm so sorry but please let me drop this cursed "Alex Calvert playing Chuck" joke by Jensen from August 2022 which haunts me.)

So: nothing about the concept that @chuckwon at the end of season 15 has been confirmed or denied in canon at this point. The idea that Chuck LOST, as Dean says here, is simply what Dean may still be thinking (which makes sense). But nothing has fundamentally changed about the state of how season 15 left things in the prime narrative yet... largely because that's not what this story is / was about.

In terms of what this finale presented to us, I think "Chuck won" potential was all deliberately left open. And I continue to Call Bullshit on the finale accordingly. A Chuck won plot line COULD be used in a future sequel to great affect, or it could NOT be used in a future sequel. That will be totally up to the future authors / team behind that potential sequel to see what story they choose to tell, and where it all may or may not go. But until then (on that front) right now it's the same shit, different show, and deliberately literally nothing about that potential has changed.

• I LOVE all of the above now that I've parsed it all in my brain. It makes perfect sense. Much like we were never going see the gay angel pop up in this show and kiss Dean (with apologies to anyone who somehow thought otherwise?)... leaving other things open like this is fantastic and the objectively correct call. Dean's story is HIS story to be furthered elsewhere, whereas this show belonged and continues to belong to its cast of characters who must take center stage. But through this story within a story narrated by Dean himself, we learned a hell of a lot about his state of mind as it actively stands in 15x20. Or more accurately: the entire show reinforces and reiterates comprehensively and repeatedly that the SPN finale was wrong and bad and not the end of the story at all, and now canonically and openly and in no uncertain terms that that's how Dean feels too.

• AND THUS: season 1 of The Winchesters works as deeply clever and layered commentary on Supernatural's ending and presents the stepping stone for a sequel continuation for Dean and his family. It's also the beginning of a new chapter with endless potential for The Winchesters' cast of characters who are not tied to fate or main timeline.

I fucking love it here.

Truly, madly, deeply: ALL HAIL ROBBIE THOMPSON.

And seriously, I really hope we get a season 2 because I adore all of the prequel's characters on their own merit and I want to see what their story can become :')

[seenthisepisode]

hi! I saw your post about the why episode title change why 11 scenes cut why lamp etc etc and I know some of it but not all, and I was hoping you could elaborate on spngate— if it’s not too much trouble— or point me in a direction where I can join you in the spn gate?

I feel ashamed for HOW LONG i let this ask just rot in my askbox (it's from january, apparently, now it's april. i thought maybe two weeks passed but NO. it was months. ANON I AM SO SO SO SO SORRY. I LOVE YOU WITH ALL MY HEART) but now with the power of this url and the wine i am currently sipping, let me give you the best, most thought-out answer that i possibly can.

I don't know how long you've been following/watching spn, so I won't get into real deep iceberg theories that go back to season 8 and jeremy carver, for the purpose of this essay answer I'll just stick to the year anno domini 2020, and will try to do my best to tell you what happened.

Okay, maybe 2019. So, in june 2019, when the first scripts and drafts for s15 are presented, these things happen: 1. apparently, according to Berens, the confession scene is the first thing that was written for season 15. 2. Jensen Ackles is sat down and asked if he would be okay with this. (question is asked: why would they ask jensen if all he does in this scene is look at cas, he doesn't say anything, he does not confess, it changes nothing about his character, etc.; if you put the real tjlc tinfoil hat on you'd ask hey , maybe they asked him if precisely that is okay, if he is okay with the fact dean is practically silenced here but that's Deep) 3. Jensen apparently is okay with that, because it happens.

also this thing happens around the same time: 1. they write the ending for the brothers, and no matter what version of the finale we're talking about, Dean dies 2. Jensen Ackles is Not Okay with this. he calls Kripke who then, in a call and/or email assures him it's a good ending (Jensen says that) and also very quickly after that Jensen is announced to play Soldier Boy in Kripke's The Boys. make of that what you want

They film, blah blah, march 2020, covid happens, they stop production right after they film the confession. Last episode to air is 15x13, last episode they film is 15x18, they almost have a plane crush when flying to vegas con, and then, a loooong break until august 2020. Now, from what we know, there were two versions of the finale - the pre-covid finale they were supposed to film if the filming schedule wasn't interrupted, and the finale that happened.

What was supposed to be in the Original Finale/Pre-Covid Finale, we still don't know exactly, but from what the cast said, there was supposed to be a big cast reunion, Harvelle's Roadhouse in Heaven, Kansas Band (why are they dead?) playing there after Dean gets there and so on.

Anyway. July 2020. Misha does a livestream with Michael Sheen (the SuperGood campaign) where he says he is going back to filming the last two episodes in a few weeks. he said it LIVE. it's on youtube. people analyze the background from Misha's livestreams and photos and conclude he is in Vacouver, where spn is filmed. He also says that he is going back filming in a few interviews. Also here.

August 2020. They go back to filming in august 2020 to film 15x19 and 15x20.

August 20th, 2020, Misha's birthday.

I wasn't on set TODAY. so casual. of all days i wasn't there today.

August 24th, 2020, day 6/8 of filming 15x19, Angel with a Shotgun is hash tag Song of The Day while filming scenes of 15x19 (scene 28, 31).

September 4th, 2020. ALL THEY FILM, for the whole DAY, is one scene. They usually film a few. They film one. Song of the day? The Night We Met.

Somewhere before the episodes starts to air again, Dabb says only 30% of the audience will like the finale. Anyway, everyone concludes, Misha is filming, destiel is more or less going canon, but everyone including bibros is sure Misha is filming and will be there for the finale.

Originally, "Despair" was called "The Truth".

Finale airs.

It feels shorter (apparently it's not) but it does have an additional ad break. For Walker. But it feels shorter because of the "carry on my wayward son" cover montage that lasts too long and later it's discovered thanks to scripts that dropped that there are ELEVEN scenes that were filmed,, but didn't make it to the episode. The script that drops is also very telling, where scenes are just [OMMITTED]. It was explained that they wanted to have actor there but they didn't want actors to quarantine for two weeks to film one or two scenes BUT then that's exactly what they did with Jim Beaver lmao.

So yeah. I also remember Misha at a con (DarkLight?) where, after asked about the original ending, he answers that the original ending was something that would be better explored in fanfiction anyway. Theory rises he filmed and was cut off the episode without his or Jensen's knowledge because Misha sat down his kids to watch the spn finale (which was the first episode they were supposed to watch ever, why would he do that if he's not there?) and then, CW SPN twitter posts a goodbye video that has everyone from the cast and their mother BUT MISHA AND JENSEN ARE NOT THERE. Jensens sexy silence starts.

THEN THE WILDEST THING HAPPENS.

November 25th, the Spanish Dub. 15x18 drops in Brazil and Dean says "and i you" to Cas, after he confesses. No "don't do this cas" but "and i you". Tumblr stops working for two hours, people on discords are screaming, no one knows whats happening, someone claims Jensen was called in September 2020 to record some adlibs? To record the muffled sobs Dean does while on the floor. Theory is supported by the fact that in the Bazil version? When Dean sits on the floor? The sound that plays are birds. Chirping birds. Sounds don't match, what was Dean saying while crying on the floor, question arises.

Everyone decides there was a Rogue Translator who managed to hide from The CW Sniper (who is the reason actors just dont tell us everything) and translated some kind of Original Script. Voice Actors are invited to a podcast where they debunk this saying that it was added because the translator felt this was the right response or something like that. Anyway they debunk the fact that there existed, at any time, a version of a script, that maybe was send to them, where Dean says I love you too. This was a wild night, no one slept.

And like. I could make this post longer, but I am planning to, one day, make a huge masterpost with real sources about that because honestly you could write a book about it.

But tl;dr spngate is a theory that misha did film for the last 2 episodes and the changes they made were truly last minute (september 2020), they were going for a canon destiel, possibly human!cas engame, dabb was always on our side, and it's based on stuff like jensen actively hating the ending to the point he made his prequel after 2 years of radio silence, 11 scenes just cut from the finale, misha saying he is going back filming, and people like mark pellegrino saying the last scene he filmed was with alex and misha. also the onion field. why lamp is the theory that cas is represented and symbolized by lamps throughout the show and when dean dances with a Lamp in a drug induced dream instead of, say, some kind of a lady he is actually thinking about cas.

also there are little things like when jensen at an online con before the finale says that oh yes i am wearing a grey flannel but tomorrow? who know it could be blue and green. and we all collectively lost our shit. like when he said he is most excited to "tackle" with cas in season 15. or that "dean has no taste, clearly". WHY WAS YOUR PERMISSION NEEDED JENSEN

there are a lot of things i didn't mention here because i simply can't unflod this whole thing just like that but

but if you understand this picture you might be entitled to financial compensation

[adidegmez]

spn s15 spoilers

s15 ep1(back and to the future)

one last time, the road so far. the demon is funny. i love big brother dean. their lat scene was awesome. we got work to do, this Show is going to kill me. this is the last season. their story will end. probably with a sad ending. i dont want to say goodbye.

s15 ep2(raising hell)

ketch! hi ketch. he knows how to make an enterance. rowena and ketch? rowena cared about jack. amara, i didnt think we would see her. kevin, ive missed you. where is jack, he was in the empty what is he doing now? we started saying goodbyes with kevin. and this will go on. i hate goodbyes.

s15 ep3(the rupture)

i miss crowley. ketch died. They're slowly removing everyone from the story. We're nearing the end. and now rowena. rowena is complicated, i love her. i thought rowena would want sam to kill her so that she could e the queen of hell or something like that. maybe she can return as queen of ell that would e nice. adam is still in the cage. dean, why are you so mad at cas? cant you forgive him? i wouldnt want their story to and like this but dean sam and cas theyre alive. there are 17 eps left. things will go bad. i hope they can get a happy ending, i hope they will all live but i dont think they will.

s15 ep4(atomic monsters)

i thought i saw benny. we got him and lost him in a minute. dean is gorgeous(i had to say it, he is always gorgeous). i love seeing deans smile, sam and cas too but dean is different, he is my favorite. becky, wow, she has a family? i would love to see team free will just doing laundry and talking with eachother without worrying about monsters. im happy for becky. becky youre gonna ruin winchesters life. poor boy it wasnt his fault but if he cant control it he has to die. if only there could be another way. Did Jensen sing the song? If anyone knows the name of the song, can you tell me? dean is hopeful we need that but Chuck is not gone. and he is going to ruin things. he will make the winchesters suffer, just because he enjoys it and doesnt like the winchesters anymore. and thats why i hate him

s15 ep5(proverbs 17:3)

why is sam having those dreams? is Chuck messing with his head? everyone is confused about deans pictures but he looks the same maybe a little bit older but same look. he even has the same hair. sam is the one WHO changed he look very different especially his hair. that doesnt make any sense everyone is suprised at deans not sams? lilith?!! only thing thet can kill the god (except jack i think) is gone. nice there is a link they can use that link. you were never free dean. i wish amara ould help them. maybe se will help them. but they need jack.

s15 ep6(golden time)

now eileen. Chuck is trying to break the winchesters. Dean doesn't seem to care because he's tired of playing Chuck's games and there doesn't seem to be any way they can beat Chuck right now. If they can find a way, Dean will go back to his old self. and they will beat Chuck. together, team free will (2.0 maybe jack will come too). what happened to banes twins. will we see them again? eileen is okay. well at least we have one good thing. Chuck is messing with cas now.

s15 ep7(last call)

dean is amazing, jensen is amazing. i love when he sings. he was happy at that bar, i love seeing him happy. it was good to see him happy in this last season, i hope we can see them happy more. sam cant die. they can beat Chuck but they still need help(maybe jack can help them)

s15 ep8(our father, who aren't in heaven)

they finally remembered adam. i love donatello but i miss kevin. hello rowena! i miss crowley, im glad she is the one whos in charge. i love rowena. adam is out of the cage. eileen and sam could be together. Chuck will kill eileen, right? Dean, you shouldn't still be mad at Cas, we're getting close to the end and you two shouldn't stay on bad terms anymore. i want jack back, when is he coming? okay, i hate Chuck. i used to love him when he was just a prophet but as god no i dont like him. he just watched all of them suffer and enjoyed it. and he is stil hurting them. he is a monster. i like this Michael. thanks to cage and adam he is better now. adam is in a better situation than the others. purgatory, i hope we can at least see benny.

s15 ep9(the trap)

of course chuck was behind all of this. benny is dead. when someone dies in purgatory where would they go? i thought they would born again in purgatory. dean finally forgave cas. No, this ending definitely wouldn't happen. Even if Sam and Dean had turned into monsters, they wouldn't have become monsters. They wouldn't have fought Bobby and Jody. They would have let them kill themselves. Cas is getting the mark. I hope this doesn't end badly like Dean's. jack!!! yes. why is billie doing this? idc Shell bring jack back. and he'll beat god. how can the light be bad? if hes bad, how can there be balance?

s15 ep10(the heroes' journey)

do they have bad luck or something? its Chuck isnt it? i heard some people say, garth didnt named his kid dean because he knew sam would name his kid dean and this makes sense to me. at least nothing bad happened to garth and his family. yeah they cant be normal. it was funny to see them like that but this isnt WHO they are.

s15 ep11(the gamblers)

hi jack! you finally came. my heroes. they are going to save the World. with cas and jack.

s15 ep12(galaxy brain)

I had forgotten about Kaia. Jack now has powers but he won't be able to use them. Kaia will be a problem. i hate Chuck. he is bored so he is destroying worlds. he needs to go. i loved old dean more.

s15 ep13(destiny's child)

when i watched about scoobynatural, i thought team would travel through different universes. for at least one season we couldve just watch them travel have fun save people but no they cant have fun more than one episode. if someone would help jack he can rule instead of Chuck. jack doesnt have a soul but he is good. i wish he had his soul. i loved meg. jack got his soul back, finally.

s15 ep14(last holiday)

i love deans reaction. cant they live like this? they are happy. of course they cant, Chuck wouldnt let that happen. Jack began to speak his father's language:) . dean, the birthday cake was nice. i love them.

s15 ep15(gimme shelter)

dean lied again.first to other kaia now amara. i hope he can keep his promise so he wouldnt be lying. jack will sacrifice himself. hopefully cas will find a way.

s15 ep16(drag me away (from you))

i hate seeing winchesters fight, especially when it's so close to the end. I hope they can be back to normal before this is all over.

s15 ep17(unity)

jack's not family? dean how could you say that he is your kid, he is a winchester. i love amara. i hope jack and amara can spend time with eachother. i hate Chuck. he manipulates everyone. it was Chuck all along. if only dean didnt lie to amara. she was nice she was trying to help but now she is dead. now jack is dying again.

s15 ep18(despair)

i want to say jack cant die but i cant be sure of anything. the story is ending in 3 episodes. billie didnt change she always wanted this. okay jack is alive nice. since this is the ep i can say it. cas will die in this ep and i know it. i knew it for a while i hoped this day would never come but here we are. this will be the day i learn this storys ending. i hate billie too. billie left her toy. does that mean theyll reap god and hell die like that and billie read it so she left the weapon to kill Chuck. i love Charlie. she was happy. eileen is gone. i thought maybe she and sam could be together. i love donna. i love garth. i love jody and the girls. i love bobby. Charlie bobby donna i thought they were safe, theyre gone now. i know how this will end cas will summon empty it will kill death and cas. i hope this wont happen but it will. cas will die. their story will end. cas is gone. and he didnt day goodbye to sam and jack. he saved dean. cas is gone.

s15 ep19(inherit the earth)

what is happening to jack? how can they beat God? how can they win? i hate Chuck. he killed miracle. Michael! adam is gone too. i didnt think we would see Michael again. and i didnt think i would be happy to see him but i am. there may be hope yet. maybe they can do something together. i cant deans reaction to lucifer was funny but i cant laugh. he thought cas was alive he thought he came bak and it wasnt cas he saw lucifer. i never thought we would see lucifer. i love lucifer when he is not serious or when he isnt trying to end the World. so he is good for now. i hate lucifer again. yes! Michael killed lucifer, i cant believe it. Michael betrayed them. i liked him. i cant trust anyone but team free will 2.0. i hate Chuck. i would take that ending, i would. they won but hey lost everything but they won and theyre together except cas. there is still one ep left. and evertones back. this is not the perfect ending because cas is not here but its a good ending. if only it was the end. because they are alive. they live. this felt right but why is there another episode. i hope we just see them grow old and live their lives but we wont. i know we wont. i just wish we could. i dont want to watch next ep. i know that ep broke everyone. i know how it ends. but why this should have been the ending. this felt right it wasnt complete but it felt right. this couldve been the ending why make us suffer more? of course i dont want it to end but if the story ending i would want it to be like this. this i want to say perfect but its not cas is gone but it was okay. im not ready to watch the next ep. but here we go one last ep. their story is ending here.

s15 ep20(carry on)

what happened to carry on? why didnt it play. i wanted just one thing i hope it at least plays in the end. im okay with just wathing them live their life without a big bad guy or something. why? why? why? it was always sam and dean, always. why end it like that? they were happy they were together they were both alive. i dont want to say it but dean is gone. sam is alone. bobby, hi! cas is alive?! that what they deserved as heaven. but dean shouldve had more time with sam. but im not going to complain they all can be together again. tahnks to jack and cas. yes this ending break me but it was beautiful. in the end they are happy and they are together forever. i just wish we couldve seen at least cas and jack.

this story was beautiful 2 brothers together with the help of their frinds and family they saved the World. and they got the ending they deserved it was meant to be like this dean would die and sam would live for everyone WHO died. spn writers i think they gave us a gift with jack, they made heaven a good place they made heaven what it was meant to be. and thanks to them and jack winchesters and everyone we cared about is happy. anyway im glad i witnessed their story for 15 seasons i laughed and cried with them. they mean so much to me all of them.

i dont want to say goodbye so this is a see you later because ill be seeing them. ill always remember them. i love all of them. i love dean sam cas jack bobby mary john kevin Charlie jody donna crowley rowena and the others WHO helped winchesters WHO loved winchesters.

im really happy im a part of this fandom. ill never leave here. im looking forward to see spn stuff. so

see you later

[laf-outloud]

https://www.tumblr.com/laf-outloud/719599290829389824

Jensen Ackles seems too forced when he does anger, too obvious when peeved, too heavy with sarcasm. What kind of acting is that? Maybe it is that it is acting. I don't get the sense that there is anything beneath the surface to explore. He plays a part, rather than becomes the character. I believe the acting Jensen does is considered over-acting without any consideration for the character... it does seem very one-note, at least from what I've seen since SPN. I know he can do better, as even his Dean from early seasons of SPN had a layer of nuance that can only happen by truly understanding the character and his motivations... Unfortunately, the long stretch of SPN either made him lazy or forgetful when it comes to crafting characters and stories.

He's very histrionic when he acts, and it started in the later half of spn. He played Dean so much more nuanced and layered in the early seasons, and more subtle - although Dean as a character was never really "subtle" and that's ok because that's who the character was and it worked for him. As the seasons went on he seemed to get too comfortable and then when the writing took a nosedive, instead of trying to work with the script and still make Dean recognizable as the character we knew, he just went with the script as is and overdid it.

He got comfortable and therefore complacent. He never worked on his craft because he knew he had reliable steady employment for the foreseeable future. Then when spn was coming to an end I think he thought the popularity he found as Dean was going to continue on and he was just going to get offered roles so again, he didn't put any work in (outside of the awful s15 audition reel he tried to work into the show). And now we see where that has gotten him. If he wasn't conventionally good looking and as charismatic as he is, I don't think he would be getting the jobs he's gotten since spn - and he even got all of those by working his connections, but those are going to dry up or move to other positions where they can't help him anymore sooner or later.

I say this all the time when I see his acting nowadays (I watch TB and saw clips from both BS and BG2 online) - when I watch Jensen act I feel like I am watching him think through what he is about to do the second before he does it. I don't see the character, I see Jensen acting (I feel like I am literally watching him do the job rather than play the part). And even then its all mostly just different versions of Dean (which is funny because he seems to have forgotten how to play Dean...).

You're not the first to mention all this, and I doubt the last. I completely agree about the lack of care he took with Dean in the latter seasons of SPN. I think the only times I saw him return to early-seasons Dean were when he was acting against Sam Smith and JDM (and occasionally Jared, though I think he let Jared do most of the heavy lifting when they had emotional scenes).With everyone else, it was just business as usual.

And since then? It's just as you said: "I feel like I am literally watching him do the job rather than play the part." I get the feeling that Jensen also sees these roles as jobs and not an art form, which is why the work he puts into them is so lackluster. The problem is, while putting in the minimum amount of work in other industries can be hidden from future employers, that's not the case with the entertainment industry, where everyone can see how much or how little you care about the "job."

[fandom-hoarder]

Anybody who thinks that abomination of a TWin finale was BETTER than the spn finale or FIXED anything about it can fuck right off, tbh. Bad vibes, dnw.

Like the biggest thing about TWin is it's INSULTING.

It's insulting that it's called "the winchesters", when The Winchesters are Sam and Dean. It's insulting that those involved kept telling people to trust them and "canon we got you" and stringing people along a whole fucking pointless season. It's insulting that they claimed they were so passionate about it when it's... Like This. When clearly no one could bother to even consult the canon, or hire actors who would be faithful to the OG representations. When it feels like a really cheap cash grab, when the interviews with Robbie and Jensen tell a story of people who knew they HAD to make this work, but didn't actually have a vision or focus for it. When Danneel appears to have been given way too much creative control despite not actually watching most of spn. When her passion for the project appeared to be the clothes she and Jensen could be photographed in -- this isn't wife hate, this is sincere criticism of someone who had creative control in a project they didn't even know the canon for.

It's insulting they spent the money for good music and played actual Led Zeppelin in THIS STUPID FINALE.

I know the last seasons of spn got pretty out there, got pretty stupid and lackluster (ghosts redux but daytime? Ehh), but at least in s15 they were running through "greatest callbacks" territory. TWin was not only worse quality, it had no fucking purpose. They didn't have a STORY TO TELL at all. You think THIS was where they were originally heading with that "Dean" voiceover from the pilot, talking about the true story of his parents?

THOSE WEREN'T EVEN HIS PARENTS. THAT WASN'T EVEN THEIR STORY. AND WHY WOULD JACK RECREATE THE MULTIVERSES AND INCLUDE CHUCK'S AKRIDA FAILSAFE? WHY WOULD *DEAN* HAVE TO FIX IT IN THE FIRST PLACE? *HOW* CAN HE GIVE THEM THE COLT AND "HIS JOURNAL"🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄 -- AND, WHAT, JUST LET THE COLT DISAPPEAR FROM PRIME UNIVERSE?

AND THESE PEOPLE DIDN'T EVEN HAVE THE SAME BEGINNING AS DEAN'S PARENTS; WHY WOULD GIVING THEM A JOURNAL EVEN HELP?

(None of these questions are important enough for an s2, mind you; this show gets the atla live action treatment--never happened, doesn't count)

THE WHOLE FUCKING REASONING IS JUST POINTLESS AND STUPID. AND THERE DIDN'T SEEM TO EVER BE ANY REAL STAKES FOR THIS SCOOBY GANG ALL SEASON. It was The Magic Tree House, with all the answers handed to them. (Not to mention the pretty bad acting I witnessed from Meg -- a too-short-to-be-Mary-when-Drake-is-that-tall Claire lookalike I'm supposed to believe as Mary🙄 --and the total lack of JohnMary chemistry, and the weird af lore breaking holywater!hair vamp splash that started as a joke and shouldn't have even made it onto the page🤦‍♀️-- if you wanted to be that kind of camp you should've just done a straightup AU spinoff, and not tried to tie this in to the OG while LYING about "canon we got you" and getting your tone all the fuck wrong)

This doesn't fix anything from spn finale--NOTHING NEEDED FIXED. Whatever gripes there may be about aspects of the spn finale, essentially it was PERFECT. THIS bullshit takes a Dean who had finally come to terms with the life they'd lived, who had his actual loved ones largely available in heaven (and Sam on earth, but knowing he'd meet Dean up there, and time is different in Heaven), and takes away any character growth the spn finale suggested-- because he's ALREADY LEARNED THIS LESSON ABOUT TRYING TO CHANGE THE PAST WTF.

Also, that was not Dean. I get that Jensen probably couldn't cut his hair or whatever, but that turtleneck sweater was not an outfit OG Dean would wear, AND Jensen seems to have forgotten how to do the Dean voice/accent. They should've said it was huntercorp!Dean or something, cuz that was not the Dean that died in 15.20 and went to Heaven and took a drive to wait for Sam.

The only correct thing in TWin finale is that Sam was still Dean's #1, and all the SamDean parallels to JohnMary throughout the show get rights for preserving that. But the JohnMary was so dull.

This ridiculous show is NOT CANON, and I hope whatever future endeavors come out of spnverse has greater respect for the OG and its fandom, and better writing and casting. (I would prefer for it to die than become another abomination.)

I'm sorry for Drake's decent acting that this was the story he got, since he seemed to actually be a fan of the og -- even though some of his comments lost him some points with me. Sorry for some of the other wannabe scooby gang actors, who should've just gotten their own spoofy spinoff. I would be happy to not see Meg in anything ever again -- not that I wish for an end to her career, just that *I* won't have to see her face act. I would also be ecstatic for the Ackles' friends to not be cast in roles they're unsuited for just so they can all work together 🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄 how the fuck was that supposed to be Samuel?

You make a variety show for this shit, not a fucking prequel-that's-not-a-prequel. Good grief. Get you some good people that will tell you no. Maybe talk to Jared about it, jfc. He actually gets thoughtful about his headcanons.

[orionsangel86]

God same about Jensen!

He clearly had some insight into Dean that came out intermittently I just thought it was Instincts he had because he'd internalised Dean so much but didn't actually understand what he was saying, stuck in ol' "oh haha Dean is a stupid repressed child who only likes guns" mindset

Turns out WE'RE the fools and Jensen's been playing us ALL

when do you think he took up plans to take over SPN himself? I honestly think it's when they decided to end SPN at S15 and talks about how they should end the story were going on and they had to send him to KRIPKE of all people

Yeah its wild. I would love for him (with Misha's help) to write a tell all book one day.

I feel like jackles has been a far better actor than we all gave him credit for. He has always been very switched on to fandom, he knew about the warring sides, the hate and the bullshit, and I reckon he was being told for years by his bosses to always keep all sides of fandom happy and to play his damn role at all times (ironically just like how Chuck ordered Dean to play his role - life imitates art too often in this fucking show its almost scary). Hence why he's insights into Dean often came across contradictory and odd. Sometimes he had beautiful accurate insights which make total sense, and other times (usually in j2 panels) he'd regress back to the "haha dean just likes guns and girls like a macho man should".

We will never truly know what went on behind the scenes following the moment j2m announced s15 was the end (unless jackles writes that book) so its hard to truly speculate when jackles decided to take things into his own hands, but I also believe it was around about the time they planned the finale and everyone was kissing jarpiss's asshole and jackles was left in the cold to stare down a shitty death scene he didnt agree with. Going to kripke was prob the final straw for him.

He was gaslit into thinking that ending was okay, and whenever he tried to question it he was told to sit down shut up and do what he was told, all the while watching his manchild tantrum throwing drama queen of a costar get his dick sucked by the entire production team for coughing a few times and puffing out his chest and singing the praises of a finale that pushed the spotlight firmly on him and his cop propaganda show.

So yeah, jackles was done dirty, and so he became That Bitch and started making plans. He had the production company set up only days after the finale aired, turned off his social media and refused to be involved in any spn finale celebratory CW PR (absolute King Shit)

I think he started making calls before they even finished filming. Dean wasnt even cold on the ground before The Winchesters had been dreamed up as a way to bring him back. Jackles rare few post finale SM posts all alluded to Dean returning again. He knew what he was doing.

At the same time he was ghosting the manchild, and planning to move his family to Colorado to get away from him. After SPN finally wrapped in mid 2020, him and Jarpiss went their separate ways. They barely spoke after that. Jackles was setting in motion all his plans to fix everything that he considered a personal afront to him (because he is absolutely deranged and literally possessed by the ghost of Dean Winchester) and those plans certainly involve fixing the ending somehow - in a way that isnt obvious no doubt, because he still has to be careful and at least pretend like he respects the ending and his egotistical douchebag of a costar (though he hasn't been doing a very good job of either tbh!)

Thats all my speculation anyway. Holding out for that tell all book jackles!

[samwinchestermydude]

So I watched 15x18 for the first time and I actually liked Cas's ending

I binged watched spn to like s12 and then took a break and then started watching s13-15. This is my overall first watch of the show. I already knew about this scene long before I started watching and sort of expected to dislike it. I don't really like Castiel or Destiel. But to my surprise, I actually thought this scene was good/emotional.

The acting wasn't as horrible as people made it out. Misha collins was overall pretty good (although I concede that I can clearly see why that face was memed so hard) and the speech was pretty emotional. Castiel has gone through lots of change throughout the show and it's pretty interesting that he went from a soldier to a friend and father to Jack, and this speech really does show how he changed.

I definitely don't see the speech as romantic as I feel like there is no build-up at all in s15 (Or the rest of the show) but I appreciate that its left open to interpretation for shippers and non shippers. So one could interpret I love you as platonic, which I find to be pretty profound as platonic relationships are just as deep as romantic ones. It's very touching.

Although something that felt awkward was Castiel saying how Dean was the most selfless man. Which sort of felt really like pandering and off considering this episode is directly after 15x17 which is probably Dean's lowest moment. I do love Dean and I actually sympathized with him a lot in s15. (He's totally in the right to feel that Jack is not family because accident or not Jack did kill his mom. And he really didn't have any other idea to stop chuck who was killing worlds of people. Does this mean that I think sacrificing Jack was right? No, but I understand where Dean was coming from fully.) Dean has made lots of sacrifices for people and Sam but that was not the time, especially after 15x17.

Other than that I'm just very pleasantly surprised I actually felt emotional at the scene.

[destieltaggedfic]

Crossover Fics - Part 1

on the whole I'm not overly fussed on crossovers, probably because I'm picky about what fandoms I actually read fic for anyway (I think there are only about a dozen fandoms over the years where I've ventured into the fic) So these are pretty much limited to crossovers with shows/movies featuring characters portrayed by spn actors just because I find it entertaining.

Le Nouveau – museaway   Ao3

Set S10ish.  Stonehenge Apocalypse crossover. Sam has been communicating with Dr Jacob Glaser (Misha’s SA character) about a potential haunted hotel, when they rock up to meet him, all are shocked that he is identical to their angel.  Dean is also uncomfortable when Jacob starts flirting with him, so tells him that he and Cas are married and gets Cas to agree to it by promising to be a model husband while at the hotel.

Word Count: 24k                              Non-Graphic Sex

Five Times Dean Hooks Up with Cas’s Doppelgängers and the One Time He Doesn’t – Bbnabhk   Ao3

Nonspecific timeframe.  Dean keeps going on dates with guys he meets on cases. Guys who to Sam’s eye all look suspiciously like Cas.  This is populated by Misha’s characters from other projects.

Word Count: 2k                                 Non-Graphic Sexual Acts

The Voice of an Angel – CaremKefo   Ao3

AU.  Stonehenge Apocalypse Crossover.  Dean listens to The Real Story because he likes the guy’s voice not because he believes anything he says.  One night he picks up the phone and calls in only to end up with a date.

Word Count: 4k                                 No Sex

Flash Is Fast, Flash Is Cool – bexgowen   Ao3

Nonspecific timeframe.  The Boys crossover (kind of).  When Dean sees that Cas is really into Soldier Boy from the show The Boys, he orders a costume to wear.

Word Count: 6k                                 Graphic Sexual Acts

Losing Time – FriendofCarlotta   Ao3

Set Post S15.  Gotham Knights Crossover.  Searching the multiverse for the one where Cas has been hidden, Dean makes his way to a world where before his death, Bruce Wayne had Dean’s face and the DA of Gotham City looks a lot like Cas.

Word Count: 7k                                 No Sex

[ananke-xiii]

I've written somewhere that Team Free Will is actually Team Dean's Will but it wasn't, like, a criticism or something like that, it was what I personally got once the show was over (and I still have very legit concerns about Dean's choice during the last episode).

I don't think Chuck won in the end because he, as a character, wouldn't have wanted for Dean to die. As far as polysemy goes, Chuck does represent many things but, to be really honest, I don't really think he represents John Winchester on a cosmic level. Like, yeah, OF COURSE, we can definitely put them together in the "Shitty Fathers" box but when Chuck tells Dean that he's not like his father I think he's not that wrong after all. Chuck is much worse and not because he's a John Winchester on a gigantic scale, it's not about quantity. He's worse because he just is.

Leaving aside the many problematic aspects of their relationship, Mary and John can be totally seen as Amara and Chuck (the show does go there and I think it's interesting for many reasons) but it's also true that the one who lied in the couple was Mary, not John. Even if we know why she had to lie and it can be understandable, it's also true that both Sam and Mary are willing to omit a Very Important Thing about themselves that, eventually, gets their partners killed. But, unlike Chuck who's to blame for his omissions, lies and manipulations, both Sam and Mary are two characters that, even more than Amara, are ALWAYS stripped of any choice. So it's almost like no matter what they do, they can only fight for their free will but never fully live it (SPN final thesis: you can never get what you want).

So yeah, if we consider John as a person and, more specifically, as a partner (therefore not in his paternal role), Chuck's not like him at all. Chuck's in control of his narrative, John couldn't even choose his own car at the dealership (btw, in my fantasy John has a love/hate relationship with the whole album "Boys for Pele" by Tori Amos that he keeps hidden like Bobby's passion for Tori Spelling). John is very much mainly narrated by other characters, in this respect he's just like Mary, to be honest. We don't 100% know who he is because he's a character described by absence. So much so that Sam and Dean didn't even know he had a fucking SECRET family!!!

Chuck is portrayed to be less enigmatic. We know he lies because we are shown that multiple times even before "Moriah". He's a character without much depth and that bothers him So. Much. He's a God who wants to be like Keith Richards. LOL!

However, even if Chuck, to me, objectively doesn't win (I also have my own "Billie won theory"), he neverthless does represent the Dictorial Power of Shitty Fathers that some might call The Patriarchy (not me. I would NEVER!). In this way, yes, he sort of wins because, as I've said, the natural order wins in the end and, in SPN, the natural order is Absent, Shitty Fathers. The sugarcoated version of the bygone days, the bittersweet nostalgia for a golden past that inevitably leads to death.

And who, the show tells us, represents all of the above? The absence of John Winchester via the presence of his journal. A man who's become so powerful he's been morphed into a myth. Maybe he is the real tulpa of this story, after all.

What does this have to do with Team Dean's Will? I find that saying that what Dean did in the end is a "choice" is very troublesome. To me personally. But the show does imply that, not strongly enough because it leaves some room for doubt but it ultimately does that. So okay, I'll bite and will consider it to be a Real Choice out of Dean's Free Will. Fine. What about Sam, though?

S15 starts with Sam and Rowena and ends with Sam and Dean. Rowena and Dean both commit suicide that's not 100% framed as suicide. Among other things, it is framed as a sacrifice. And Sam's there with them and he doesn't want that. He says so. He tells Rowena to "screw the books" and he tells Dean that he doesn't want what Dean is asking for.

Rowena's act is framed as being done out of her own agency because she believes in prophecy and magic. To which I say bullshit, not to Rowena but to the show because this is a cop-out. Since S13 Rowena couldn't do what she wanted to do because it wasn't possible. Fine. But how come that prophecy seems to be working only for her? How come the "rules are rules" mindset only applies to her? Why do other characters' books change and hers alone doesn't? How come her sacrifice is both destined and out of her own free will? It means that it can happen then! That destiny and free will can coincide! This change in thinking about the question is so packed with possibilities that they could've done another 15 seasons about it. Unfortunately, destiny and free will seem to meet in Definite Death which meh. Story over.

And Sam? He's still there. Participating and not participating. Against his will.

With Dean things are a bit different because we do know that Chuck is obsessed with him. Once Chuck is out of the picture, we could imply, Dean's finally "free" to choose what he wants. Which is such a naive thought because if it were only the absence and/or presence of things/persons to determine our lives we, perhaps, wouldn't need therapy.

But, as I've said, I'll be good and keep my promise: let's say Dean chooses out of his own free will. It should be cool for us, right? This is what Dean wants. The Big Big Bad is not dead but he's not the man behind the curtains anymore so hurrah! Free/Dean's Will wins. We should feel like we must respect that. And yet, it doesn't feel right.

And Sam? He's still there. Participating and not participating. Against his will.

It doesn't feel very "Free Willy" if the people just let the orca free. It's not very Free Will for Sam if the show tells us that it's Dean literally getting out of the picture that will "free" Sam. Brrrrrrr.

So what does this tell me? That the "destiny vs free will" discourse seems to be working only when there's a villain on the horizon, a commanding power that wants to tell you what to do, someone actually stronger than you whose actions can alter your life's story.

If you take that power out, what's left? Only people with their choices. And your absent, dead father's journal radiating The Real Power (the idea of power inside your mind that controls you). Is free will still in the room with us? Cause it starts to look like somebody's supposedly "free" will might be somebody's else constraint. As far as Sam is concerned, it seems to say: it doesn't matter whether there's a God, Death or that prophecy is real or not. What matters is that you can only stand there, participating and not participating. You don't want that? Too bad, 'cause that's what you got.

Maybe the finale really took the worst from my "Billie won theory" and the worst from the "Chuck won theory", i.e. an idea of natural order that upholds patriarchy. Or, since I can and will go there, that the natural order is the patriarchy.

So what about Free Will, is it an illusion? If it applies to only a few it certainly doesn't seem like something worth fighting for. And the natural order is indeed restored in the end. I don't think the show gives a real answer to that, by the end of S15 there are so many things that simultaneously mean 100 other things that everybody can take what they want from the show.

If you ask me, I think it was a moot question, to be honest. It made sense in S4-5 but once SPN goes full meta in S15 it becomes very superficial. Of course I know they're fictional characters and literally don't have free will, the premises were interesting because I wanted to see how these characters would react to stuff happening in the story. Once the story is revelead to be a bluff, though, what am I left with? Characters spiralling into crisis after crisis. This could be interesting in a novel but in a 15-seasons-long series you have to give me something ELSE as well, the "all die more or less happily" last-minute finale (knowing Heaven is a scam, by the way) is just... not having to deal with the consequences of the narrative choices that were made.

Or, perhaps, Supernatural is a show where one of its themes is "destiny vs free will" that ultimately tells you that there's no destiny but there's also no free will, there's only John's journal aka the Power of the Dominant Narrative. Which is the power of the people who write that narrative for us to believe in it. Perhaps, not even the people making the show were free to do what they would've liked to do. They were also there, like Sam, participating and not participating. Finding ways to cope.