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moiraineswife · 4 years

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Jasnah - The Facade Meta

Today we’re going to discuss the stormlight of my life, your life, your cat’s life: Jasnah Kholin. Topics of discussion include (but will likely not be limited to): the face she wears, the effect her childhood and what we know if it has had on her, madness, her mother, her perceived invincibility, and whatever else strikes me as relevant in the midst of this chaotic clusterfuck of yelling tarted up as character analysis.

Now. To business:

Let us begin at the beginning (of what we know) and talk about Jasnah’s childhood illness, and what this has done to her in terms of her relationship with her mother, her outlook on life, and her perception of, well, perception…

“It’s your daughter,” Dalinar guessed. “Her lunacy.”

“Jasnah is fine, and recovering. It’s not that.” (OB, 49, Born Unto Light)

Peppered through Dalinar’s flashbacks in Oathbringer are small hints at the dark side of Jasnah’s childhood. We’ve had hints before that Jasnah’s life has not always been...entirely typical for a princess.

Her existence as a radiant was a hint itself, as it's implied most of them are ‘broken’ in some way.

The others are more obvious: Kaladin’s depression, Shallan’s PTSD, anxiety, and DID, Dalinar’s repressed memories, and alcoholism etc,etc.

With Jasnah, you know it has to be there, but it’s harder to see. To use Shallan’s metaphor, she’s like a cracked vase, but the cracked side has been turned to the wall, so the outside world sees only smooth perfection.

This flashback comment is the most obvious indication at what caused Jasnah to break. A fairly shocking one for a reader as 'Jasnah' and 'lunacy' seem to match as well as chasmfiends and tea parties.

It also provides some rather awful context for this segment a few chapters earlier:

“Something stirred deep within her. Glimmers of memory from a dark room, screaming her voice ragged. A childhood illness nobody else seemed to remember, for all it had done to her.

“It had taught her that people she loved could still hurt her.” (O, 47, So Much Is Lost)

We know, given Shallan’s research into Taln at the behest of the Ghostbloods, that the current treatment for madness involves confining the person in darkness.

It seems like far too much of a coincidence that Jasnah, diagnosed with lunacy, would have memories of screaming herself hoarse in a dark room that could somehow be unconnected to this.

Based on my shoddy maths, she was around 11 or 12 at this point, which is marked by many, especially Navani, as a turning point in her life. There was a profound change in how she acted with those around her following this.

“She wouldn’t let me be a mother to her, Dalinar,” Navani said, staring into the distance. “Do you know that? It was almost like . . . like once Jasnah climbed into adolescence, she no longer needed a mother. I would try to get close to her, and there was this coldness, like even being near me reminded her that she had once been a child. What happened to my little girl, so full of questions?” (WoR, 67, Spit and Bile)

It seems like too much of a coincidence, again, to assume that Jasnah’s childhood illness and her confinement had nothing to do with her reluctance to allow Navani to mother her any more.

Jasnah herself reflects that her imprisonment, for lack of a better word, taught her that people she loved could still hurt her. It seems very likely that this refers to Navani and Gavilar, as they would have allowed this treatment to continue. It’s also likely the reason for the change in their relationship afterwards.

Navani's presence didn't remind her she had been a child; it reminded her of what had been done to her.

Navani’s little girl was branded insane and locked away in a dark room with her parents' consent. This removed her ability to trust in Navani to mother and protect her. She kept her distance, she kept herself aloof and removed from everyone, and that’s something that hasn’t changed over twenty years later.

She takes no wards, an expected thing for a woman of her rank. She's unmarried, well past the age she should be. She has no friends, the closest she has are both "pen pals" she communicates with via spanreed.

Jasnah, of all the characters in Stormlight, is the one least emotionally connected. She clearly loves her family, and is devoted to them...But again it's from a distance.

She works in the shadows with assassins to protect them. She studies the end of the world a world away from everyone she loves.

When we see her in Kharbranth for the first time with Shallan, she’s alone.

The servants she uses seem to belong to the Palaneum. She travels alone, she researches and works and bears her burdens alone.

The sole exception is Ivory and she doesn't really have a choice with him BUT to have him with her.

I am NOT suggesting that Jasnah doesn’t actually care about her family/Shallan - we see repeatedly that she absolutely does.

Poignantly, the first thing Renarin’s visions predict that turns out to be false is the lack of love that Jasnah has - they claim she will choose logic and kill her cousin, but she chooses to save him instead.

It’s clear that Jasnah cares very deeply...but she also deliberately distances herself, both physically and emotionally, from other people.

(continued below)

Jasnah is so independent that it’s almost a flaw. She’s an interesting opposite to Kaladin, in this regard.

Kaladin defines himself so much by those around him, his family, his men, those under his care and protection, that that almost becomes a flaw in him. He destroys himself to protect them, and every failure wrecks him.

Jasnah keeps everyone away. She operates alone, in secret, and she clearly struggles to let people get close to her.

The reasons for this are twofold, I feel.

The first one is assassins: Jasnah has been ‘killed’ by one such assassination attempt, has survived another, who made multiple attempts on her life in the form of Kabsal, and has almost certainly experienced more beyond that.

Her casual expectation that Kabsal is trying to use Shallan to get close to her, likely, though she doesn’t say it, to kill her - which turns out to be true.

She knows firsthand how easy it is for someone with enough money and influence to place spies and assassins into a setting- she does it herself all the time. And it resulted in the death of her father.

In a lot of ways, she’s as paranoid about assassination as Elhokar is - she just expresses it in a far more subtle/rational way. Where Elhokar rants and panics, Jasnah blocks up air vents and rejects rooms in the 90000 foot, lost for centuries, tower with balconies because they're a security flaw.

The second reason for her emotional isolation, I believe, is what caused her initial withdrawal from Navani.

Being believed mad, locked in a dark room, screaming for help and being ignored, and knowing that your parents, the people whom you went to with questions and looked to for safety and protection are at least partially responsible, all at the age of eleven is...fairly damaging.

Jasnah hides the effects of her trauma far better than Kaladin or Shallan. This is probably partially because she’s older and has been dealing with it for longer.

By this point, her trauma reactions (which went, by her own admission, unaddressed by her family after what happened, which is traumatising in itself), have melded in with her personality/are brushed off as simply Jasnah being Jasnah.

“I know what people say of me. I should hope that I am not as harsh as some say, though a woman could have far worse than a reputation for sternness. It can serve one well.” (TWoK, 8, Nearer the Flame).

As a matter of fact, we know full well that Jasnah ISN’T as harsh or stern as she’s claimed to be. Shallan repeatedly affirms to Kabsal, and to a reader, that Jasnah is not what she expected - a stern, harsh mistress. She also notes that Jasnah believes herself to be one - likely due to everyone else perceiving her that way.

I think the perception of Jasnah is one that she’s cultivated deliberately - a stern, aloof, even harsh person. Not one anyone would want to be close to. Also not someone anyone would associate with weakness, or needing to be cared for or protected.

More than assassins, I think Jasnah fears people who love her with good intentions, and the ability to assert those good intentions upon her, because it's "for her own good".

When she was a child it led to her imprisonment, something which still triggers traumatic flashbacks over ten years later. She fears having people she loves hurt her. And so she keeps them away, and cultivates for herself a presence that doesn’t need to be cared for, that almost doesn’t need or want to be loved, so that can never happen again.

She rejects, most notably and strongly, her mother, and any implication of a husband. This has led to speculation about her sexuality - maybe she’s gay - though it seems fairly acceptable in Alethkar for a person to be gay (they don’t even have to fill out social reassignment forms!). I

It might be more frowned upon in noble society, due to the expectation of forming political marriages, and while I don’t necessarily doubt it (give me queer Jasnah, Brandon, I beg of you, I’m a starving lesbian and I need this) the only commentary we have from Jasnah on the subject sems to suggest a different, sadder, motive:

Jasnah relaxed visibly. “Yes, well, it did seem a workable solution. I had wondered, however, if you’d be offended.”

“Why on the winds would I be offended?”

“Because of the restriction of freedom implicit in a marriage,” Jasnah said. “And if not that, because the offer was made without consulting you.

[...]

“It doesn’t bother you at all?” Jasnah said. “The idea of being beholden to another, particularly a man?”

“It’s not like I’m being sold into slavery,” Shallan said with a laugh.

“No. I suppose not.” Jasnah shook herself, her poise returning.

(WoR, 1, Santhid).

This is the only time, after an entire book of content in which Jasnah, amongst other things: Soulcasts three men into oblivion, is almost assassinated repeatedly, is betrayed by the first person she’s taken in and trusted in a long time, and is researching the literal end of the world, that Shallan notes Jasnah looking nervous/uncomfortable in discussing anything.

And it’s about marriage.

Jasnah views marriage as being a ‘restriction of freedom’ and finds it distasteful because it encompasses the idea ‘of being beholden to another’.

Anything that even implicitly binds her to another or puts them in her power is something she wants nothing to do with. And, legally, if she were ever to be accused of lunacy again, the two people most likely to have the authority to make a decision on her treatment/send her back to the ardents would be either a parent, or a husband.

The first she’s distanced herself from in pretty much every way since the first event, and the second she’s refused to entertain for years, to the point that high society whispers that she must be gay.

I also think she's uncomfortable because she sees what she did here - setting up a betrothal, which she views as a restriction of freedom - for Shallan, without consulting her, as the same thing that was done to her as a child.

A restriction of freedom for Shallan’s own good. The same justification that was used to imprison her. It's obviously not the same, but Jasnah views marriage as a kind of imprisonment. So in her mind it is.

Jasnah also has huge trust issues. She just covers them with what appears to be personality traits - of being independent, and aloof - but that’s largely just a cover for her own insecurities, and her fear of ever having her freedoms restricted again.

This idea also gives a little bit more of a twist (or dramatic gut punch, thanks Brandon), to her advice to Shallan about perception and power:

“Power is an illusion of perception.”

Shallan frowned.

“Don’t mistake me,” Jasnah continued. “Some kinds of power are real—power to command armies, power to Soulcast. These come into play far less often than you would think. On an individual basis, in most interactions, this thing we call power—authority—exists only as it is perceived.

“You say I have wealth. This is true, but you have also seen that I do not often use it. You say I have authority as the sister of a king. I do. And yet, the men of this ship would treat me exactly the same way if I were a beggar who had convinced them I was the sister to a king. In that case, my authority is not a real thing. It is mere vapors—an illusion. I can create that illusion for them, as can you.” (WoR, 1, Santhid)

Jasnah is talking here with Shallan about being more confident, assertive, and being able to have people do what you want (Something Navani later notes Jasnah is very good at doing).

But I think Jasnah uses this same idea - the power of perception, as a defence mechanism against her trauma, a way to protect herself.

We dismiss her isolation as aloofness. We dismiss her lack of emotional reaction as a cornerstone of the "strong female character" trope. But I think it's deeper than that. Because Jasnah isn't ACTUALLY like that deep down. It's a perception she works very hard to achieve.

Jasnah uses logic in a similar way to how Shallan uses art and drawing, or how Kaladin uses training with the spear. It’s a distraction, a grounding technique, something she can calm herself with. It’s an anchor and a crutch all at the same time.

Jasnah is logical to a fault, to the point that it makes others see her as a monster lacking empathy. I don’t think, at any point in the last few books, we’ve seen Jasnah genuinely distressed/angry/displaying emotion to the point she’d be considered out of control.

Almost all the other POV characters have had moments of weakness/breakdowns/extremely poignant emotional displays. But not Jasnah. All we ever see from Jasnah is the controlled, cultivated perception that she wants us to see. Something which I think is rooted in her trauma.

Logic is the antithesis of lunacy. Rational thought is the direct counter to madness. If the whole world sees Jasnah as logical, utterly in control of herself, if that is the perception she has everyone believe at all times then she can’t be accused of madness again.

Madness, at least in Jasnah’s mind, is an outburst of excessive, uncontrolled emotion. It is the opposite of logic. It’s acting impulsively, without thought, based purely on emotions. Ivory supports this idea:

“Ivory, you think all humans are unstable.”

“Not you,” he said, lifting his chin. “You are like a spren. You think by facts. You change not on simple whims. You are as you are.”

She gave him a flat stare.

“Mostly,” he added. “Mostly. But it is, Jasnah. Compared to other humans, you are practically a stone!” (O, 39, Notes)

Even Ivory, who has been closer to Jasnah in recent years than anyone we know of in the series so far, characterises her this way.

She rejects this idea, telling Ivory that:

“You call me logical,” Jasnah whispered. “It’s untrue, as I let my passions rule me as much as many.” (O, 39, Notes) I think this is true, she does let her passions rule her, but she doesn’t let anyone, even Ivory, see that from her.

That's deliberate. She deliberately makes herself out to be this logic-driven robot, with no feeling or passion.

To the world, Jasnah Kholin is the consummate scholar, the eternally logical thinker, untouched by empathy or feeling. This is how she wants them to think of her.

We know that it’s not true. We know that Jasnah is driven by emotions - her guilt at feeling like she failed Gavilar, her fear for what’s coming for the world, her love for her family, her true passion for scholarship and knowledge.

This is particularly notable when set against a character who exemplifies the opposite in so many ways: Kaladin.

“Yes. The answer is obvious. We need to find the Heralds.”

Kaladin nodded in agreement.

“Then,” Jasnah added, “we need to kill them.”

“What?” Kaladin demanded. “Woman, are you insane?”

“The Stormfather laid it out,” Jasnah said, unperturbed. “The Heralds made a pact. When they died, their souls traveled to Damnation and trapped the spirits of the Voidbringers, preventing them from returning.”

“Yeah. Then the Heralds were tortured until they broke.”

“The Stormfather said their pact was weakened, but did not say it was destroyed,” Jasnah said. “I suggest that we at least see if one of them is willing to return to Damnation. Perhaps they can still prevent the spirits of the enemy from being reborn. It’s either that, or we completely exterminate the parshmen so that the enemy has no hosts.” She met Kaladin’s eyes. “In the face of such an atrocity, I would consider the sacrifice of one or more Heralds to be a small price.”

“Storms!” Kaladin said, standing up straight. “Have you no sympathy?”

“I have plenty, bridgeman. Fortunately, I temper it with logic.” (O, 39, Notes)

Ah, the old ‘punt the Heralds back to Damnation to buy us time’ argument. Lovely.

Jasnah and Kaladin are at two different ends of the sympathy-logic spectrum and it was kind of inevitable they’d clash. But I think it makes Jasnah’s assertions more...Stark and shocking, when she pitches them to Kaladin.

What she suggests IS logical. And it’s actually the same sort of logic that led the Heralds themselves to abandon Taln to Damnation in the first place: “better that one man should suffer than ten.”

It’s a cold, harsh, brutal logic, and it’s very typical of how Jasnah likes to present herself when she’s speaking to others.

The killing of the footpads in Kharbranth is another prime example - it’s all cold, dissected logic when she reasons through it with Shallan afterwards. (Though I imagine if we saw Jasnah’s POV of it in the moment, it would be very different than what she presents).

Because what I find most interesting about the Heralds argument is that we get Jasnah, just Jasnah, away from anyone who has to view her performance of perception, reflecting on the situation. And her internal thoughts/her private reactions are very different from those she displays in public.

“These words trouble you,” he said, stepping up to her again and resting his jet-black fingers on the paper. “Why? You have read many troubling things.”

[...]

Something stirred deep within her. Glimmers of memory from a dark room, screaming her voice ragged. A childhood illness nobody else seemed to remember, for all it had done to her.

It had taught her that people she loved could still hurt her.

“Have you ever wondered how it would feel to lose your sanity, Ivory?”

Ivory nodded. “I have wondered this. How could I not? Considering what the ancient fathers are.”

“You call me logical,” Jasnah whispered. “It’s untrue, as I let my passions rule me as much as many. In my times of peace, however, my mind has always been the one thing I could rely upon.”

Except once.

She shook her head, picking up the paper again. “I fear losing that, Ivory. It terrifies me. How would it have felt, to be these Heralds? To suffer your mind slowly becoming untrustworthy? Are they too far gone to know? Or are there lucid moments, where they strain and sort through memories … trying frantically to decide which are reliable and which are fabrications…”

She shivered. (O, 39, Notes).

In an ironic (fuck you Brandon) twist: I think Jasnah knows EXACTLY what she’s suggesting they do to the Heralds. She’s also probably the person in that room who has the most experience with/has contemplated most what they would be condemning them to, and who therefore empathises with them the most.

It’s STRONGLY implied in this passage that Jasnah has experienced some sort of hallucinations in the past. Possibly this is connected to some kind of neurodivergence. I think this more likely than the alternative - that she was seeing into Shadesmar, because I believe that her imprisonment was what caused her to ‘break’ and enabled her to form her spren bond in the first place. But it’s possible.

Regardless of what’s happened in the past, now, Jasnah’s mind is her sanctuary. If she only ever knows one thing it’s her own mind. She’s a rationalist. She puts her faith in things that she can know intuitively, via logic, like maths - things that exist independently of god, that cannot be doubted. Their truth is tied to their very existence. All that's required to know it is to know her own mind and reason. Losing that is quite literally the worst thing she can think of.

And honestly? Taln’s story probably really fucks with her. Because what he went through is what she went through, too, as a child.

Taln was dismissed as a madman, because no one believed what he said, even though it was true. Truth doesn’t matter; not when it comes to being perceived mad. Nor does being right. Taln was telling the truth. Taln was right. Taln was a goddamn Herald. And they still decided he was mad and locked him away in a dark room, alone, the same way they did to her.

Jasnah knows what that feels like. Jasnah empathises with Taln and the other Heralds more than probably anyone else. But she speaks of condemning these people to that fate, to the greatest hell she can think of, calmly, and rationally. But that’s absolutely not what she really feels/thinks. There is...Such a stark difference, when you really sit and think about it, in the Jasnah that she lets everyone see, and the Jasnah that exists only behind closed doors.

She could see Jasnah’s face, hand against her temple, staring at the pages spread before her. Jasnah’s eyes were haunted, her expression haggard.

This was not the Jasnah that Shallan was accustomed to seeing. The confidence had been overwhelmed by exhaustion, the poise replaced by worry. Jasnah started to write something, but stopped after just a few words. She set down the pen, closing her eyes and massaging her temples. A few dizzy-looking spren, like jets of dust rising into the air, appeared around Jasnah’s head. Exhaustionspren.

Shallan pulled back, suddenly feeling as if she’d intruded upon an intimate moment. Jasnah with her defenses down. (WoR, 6, Terrible Destruction).

The text itself characterises Jasnah’s mask as a defence. A defence against being known, a defence against being seen as anything other than perfectly logical. Having this mask so firmly and so constantly in place is a lot of work. It’s almost a compulsion for her at this point - the refusal to let anyone else in, the strict adherence to logic, regardless of her own feelings or how it makes others see her. Better to be emotionless and in control, utterly, unquestionably sane and rational, than to ever go back to being considered mad.

This, ironically, isn't rational behaviour. It's a trauma response. I'm stating this, the idea that being emotionless/always rational prevents anyone viewing her as insane again (though, again ironically, this is exactly what Kaladin accuses her of being (OUCH)). But I think these are facts in Jasnah's mind? It's her coping mechanism. It's a really bad one. But that's what it is.

As an interesting side note - I think the only time we ever see Jasnah draw emotion spren is when she’s on her own (or assumes she’s on her own, as in this passage, or too exhausted to keep them away entirely - like the single fearspren she draws later in this chapter).

This feels notable because every other character who features in the books, even minor side characters, draws emotion spren of one sort or another at some point in the text.

Jasnah, for all that she’s on screen, draws very little. This may be a function of her ability to tap into Shadesmar, to keep them away, remove any trace of emotion spren from spawning around her. That or she just has such a tight hold on her emotions that she doesn’t draw them.

Either way, I think it’s (another) sign that her behaviour isn’t entirely natural. Spren are everywhere on Roshar, you draw them when you feel a powerful emotion - that’s a natural day-to-day occurrence there.

Unless you’re Jasnah.

Maybe that’s straying a little too far into the realms of what’s reasonable, but I do still think that Jasnah’s output, especially when it contrasts, often very strongly, with her internal feelings, is a coping mechanism/a response to the trauma she endured as a child.

Madness is a fairly strong theme in Stormlight, a few of the characters discuss it/experience it. Syl asks Kaladin fairly directly what it is:

“What is madness?” she asked, sitting with one leg up against her chest, vaporous skirt flickering around her calves and vanishing into mist.

“It’s when men don’t think right,” Kaladin said, glad for the conversation to distract him.

“Men never seem to think right.”

“Madness is worse than normal,” Kaladin said with a smile. “It really just depends on the people around you. How different are you from them? The person that stands out is mad, I guess.” *(TWOK)

Dalinar’s TWOK arc deals very strongly with madness and the ability to trust your own mind. Taln is, as has been noted, locked away for being mad. Several of the Heralds and the Fused are described as mad after what they've been put through. It's something I expect to be explored further as the series progresses.

Jasnah, I think, is the character who tries so hard never to seem that way. Never to be unhinged, or unbalanced, or affected by what's happened to her. But of course we know that she is.

I think, though, that it’s easy to write off Jasnah's trauma. The other characters all have flaws that are very obvious/things that make them obviously ‘broken’ in terms of their spren bond and the oaths they need to speak.

Kaladin suffers from depression, and from crippling guilt, and taking on too much responsibility. But also with his anger, and his hatred towards those who have wronged him, and how that can push him to blame them/avoid responsibility for what’s happened to him. Basically, his inability to let go or move forwards.

Shallan has the opposite problem, and an inability to look back/face the past. She repressed memories of trauma, and wove lies over them to protect herself, which she had to overcome to progress.

Dalinar had his alcoholism, and prior to that, his ‘addiction’ (which I think is absolutely how it’s written/the parallels are pretty obvious) to The Thrill. He had to accept responsibility, and guilt, and grief, and pain. He had to acknowledge that he had been a bad person, who was not worthy of Evi, but also that he’s capable of change, and improving himself, and becoming a better man.

Their trauma responses are loud, and obvious, and messy. They're aware of them, a reader is aware of them, the other characters are aware of them. "They stand out" if you like.

Jasnah does everything she can to ensure the effects of her trauma never stand out. To the point that other characters fairly consistently characterise Jasnah as perfect/an ideal woman.

I’m NOT saying that the text ACTUALLY presents Jasnah as being perfect/without any flaws (that’s...that’s kinda the point of this entire meta) but the characters gloss over these things/her flaws are perceived as good things?

She’s seen as so aloof, so unflappable, so commanding, and in control. She’s highly intelligent, she’s beautiful, she’s a cunning tactician and politician. Shallan claims that she’s almost always right, which Renarin backs up. Dalinar trusts and respects her, and wants her back at the war camps to aid them. She’s a highly revered scholar, respected, and brilliant. She is, in a way, almost beyond human, let alone being flawed or broken like the rest of them.

Jasnah grimaced at the thought. Shallan was always surprised to see visible emotion from her. Emotion was something relatable, something human—and Shallan’s mental image of Jasnah Kholin was of someone almost divine. (WoR, 1, Santhid).

Shallan reflects that seeing her as divine is a weird way to consider a heretic, and we’re kind of led along into that thread. But it’s also very...Othering?

It’s a “positive” kind of othering: she’s divine/superhuman, that’s great! Only it’s...It’s not? It’s so easy to see Jasnah as beyond human, and that makes us forget what she’s endured, and ignore the walls she’s put up and the profound effect that it’s had on her. And the fact that this is not healthy at all.

It's so unhealthy to be put on a pedestal this way. And it's unhealthy to cultivate a persona that makes the only response to you one that sees you as beyond human/without typical human reactions and emotions?

Shallan can be a bit whimsical and can romanticise/idealise people, but even Navani, another deeply scholarly, rational, and logical thinker, categorises Jasnah in a similar way.

She’s dismissive of the idea that Jasnah can have died. Even when others (like Adolin) start getting worried about the ship’s delay, Navani is sure that Jasnah is fine.

Part of this is, I assume, due to the fact that Jasnah is a radiant and, as the Diagram predicts, they survive when they should have been killed - so Navani has had this idea reinforced with empirical evidence over the years, which is noted in the text.

However, when Shallan first brings her the news of Jasnah’s death she refuses to believe it. Even after Shallan tells Navani she watched Jasnah stabbed through the heart, Navani still refers to her as being ‘unconscious’ (which...is actually correct, in this instance) but that is besides my point: regardless of reason or logic, people presume that Jasnah is beyond such mortal, trivial, human things like death:

‘Though Jasnah had been away for some time, her loss was unexpected. I, like many, assumed her to be immortal.’

If she’s beyond death, she’s certainly beyond something like trauma, or being broken, or damaged.

“You’re still human,” Shallan said, reaching across, putting her hand on Navani’s knee. “We can’t all be emotionless chunks of rock like Jasnah.”

Navani smiled. “She sometimes had the empathy of a corpse, didn’t she?”

“Comes from being too brilliant,” Shallan said. “You grow accustomed to everyone else being something of an idiot, trying to keep up with you.”

[...]

How surreal it was to imagine Jasnah as a child being held by a mother. (Wor, 77, Trust).

More ‘othering’, less positive than the divine, but it clearly categorises Jasnah as something other than human, and in this case, it fixates on her lack of (perceived) emotion.

Jasnah has so defined herself by her lack of emotional response to things that even those closest to her -her ward and her mother - view her as emotionless, like a rock, a corpse, dead. Ivory also says this in a previous quote “you are like spren” / “you are practically a stone.” Jasnah is categorised as strong, invulnerable to emotion, beyond human, something other.

Though Jasnah, as she herself admits, makes decisions based on emotion.

For all that she says about pursuing the footpads in Kharbranth as purely an act of logic/civic duty, I think you can sense the emotion in that moment.

“Besides, men like those…” There was something in her voice, an edge Shallan had never heard before.

What was done to you? Shallan wondered with horror. And who did it? (TWOK, 36, The Lesson)

Shallan can sense it. This is the point where Jasnah’s mask is at its most strong. She defends, calmly and rationally, what she had done. But I think at this point Shallan, and the reader, gets the sense that when Jasnah is her MOST logical and composed, she’s also her most vulnerable and emotional.

She does the same thing in the scene with Kaldin discussing the fates of the Heralds - yet we actually see later, not just through Shallan, the emotions, and the turmoil, and the direct, traumatic flashbacks Jasnah is experiencing in that moment. All covered up with logic and reason.

I think what Brandon is doing with Jasnah is really clever. Because I think media has conditioned us to accept these cold, aloof characters.

Characters who have become hardened to the world, and numbed by their experiences with violence and trauma. So we accept these things more readily as personality traits/a symptom of modern media.

I think especially with female characters. The "strong female character" who isn't allowed to cry lest she be called hysterical, who can't react to trauma or she's weak, who can't have an outburst of emotion or she's mad.

With Jasnah, I think Brandon is continuing to show how trauma expresses itself differently in different people. And I think, once explored more directly, Jasnah will become a condemnation of the easy acceptance/idealisation of these kinds of traits. What she’s doing is not okay. It’s not healthy. It’s as self-destructive as what Shallan, or Kaladin, or Dalinar was doing, we've just been conditioned to accept and even praise it.

Jasnah has so much pressure piled upon her to be perfect. She’s made an illusion so believable even those closest to her can’t see through it. She comes across as divine, as something other than human, as emotionless, and absolute. She’s become a constant in the world of those around her. She’s a law of nature more than a person - like a spren.

Except she’s not.

She’s human.

And she’s broken.

And she’s suffering a trauma that makes her afraid to be even a little bit human - because then they might think her mad again, and she’ll lose everything, and she can’t handle that.

I’m FASCINATED to see Jasnah’s interactions (if we get any on-screen) with Taln and Ash. It will probably give a big insight into her character, her relation to madness/her past illness, and I think it will bring out an interesting side of her, which I’m curious to see.

But I'm also really interested to see how Brandon explores the idea of the "ideal traumatised woman' and how that's absolutely bullshit and completely unhealthy.

Jasnah is, on the surface, everything men demand from a "strong female character". She's been exposed to trauma but she doesn't "let it define her" (ie she doesn't seemingly react to it at all). She's beautiful, and she's intelligent, she's a (literal) Queen, she's a fighter/skilled warrior, she's never "overly-emotional" - she reacts to trauma exactly as she's "supposed" to - as defined by men, she's the epitome of a stereotypical "strong female character".

Except there are obvious flaws in that ideal. The first one being: she does not exist for men. Fairly obviously. She point blank refuses a husband.

Also: it's been implied, as per this meta, that this is NOT an ideal anyone should aim for. It's actually very unhealthy and self-destructive and I really, REALLY hope that when Brandon finally digs into Jasnah that this is something he explores.

Jasnah is not perfect. She is not unbreakable, and invincible, and beyond emotion. And she shouldn't be. She shouldn't be idealised.

She's a person. A human being. And she should be able to express herself and process her trauma in a healthy way that allows her to heal and grow. She shouldn't be forced into anyone's ideal of who or what she should be.

I'm just...Really really excited for Jasnah's arc and what Brandon can say through her and the harmful tropes regarding women's trauma he can explore and god...can I just have the next six stormlight books now please?

#Jasnah Kholin #brandon sanderson #the stormlight archive #the way of kings #words of radiance #oathbringer #shallan davar #kaladin stormblessed #dalinar kholin #navani kholin #wheee everyone gets mentioned #i hope this makes some kind of sense??#like it does to me but who tf knows how it comes across to y'all #i considered cutting this up into smaller chunks #but that's just not true to the taryn experience #you get an avalanche of content or radio silence for 3 months #i cannot do a balance #jasnah just fascinates me so much #and in terms of meta/character analysis she's distinctly lacking and it bugs me #i want to do a parallels meta with jasnah and kal too bc i think that would be Interesting #and i think Kal's flaws would be cool to dig into via the lens of Jasnah's perspective/contrast #but we shall see #stormlight meta #my meta #taryn writes meta #taryn writes #text post tag #long post #some day someone on roshar will get therapy and deal with their trauma in a healthy way #today is not that day

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albelen · 4 years

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book talk: oathbringer

So. MUCH. HAPPENED.

Granted, it took me two months to read this because I had finals and sometimes I was not in the right headspace to read.

Where do I even begin? My thoughts, as always, are so scattered and since I have the smaller copy of the book I didn't use any sticky notes to write my comments, but instead just doggy-eared some of the pages I deemed important / I liked:

● this is from a conversation between Jasnah and Dalinar about the claims of the latter's heresy:

"I don't mind people believing what works for them, Uncle. That's something nobody ever seems to understand- I have no stake in their beliefs. I don't need company to be confident."

Among all the characters in the book, I feel like I respect Jasnah more than anyone. Her intelligence and confidence in herself and in her work are the things I admire about her a lot.

In particular, I resonate with her when it comes to religious views, which I'm not gonna talk about because that's a conversation for another day.

● there is a page of Moash marching with the parshman and Voidbringers, he's contemplating about the how humans can't govern themselves.

I honestly don't remember why I thought this was an important page, but upon re-reading it there's this line:

Moash had failed Kaladin and the others- but that was merely how men were in this debased age. He couldn't be blamed. He was a product of his own culture.

Now, I don't want dismiss Moash's hatred for Elhokar and the lighteyes, he's more than entitled to feel that way after his grandparents were killed unfairly, but the fact that he thought he couldn't be blamed for his actions and that he is what he is because of his culture... that's just way too easy, Moash. Just because the society you grew up in is as is, doesn't mean you just take it, storming man. I feel so strongly about this because I love everyone from bridge four, but after what Moash did in this book... I don't know if there's a way for him to redeem himself.

● Adolin hanging out with Bridge Four!! ISTG, Adolin is the real GOAT in this series.

I feel for him when he felt small, being surrounded by Radiants.

I mean, who wouldn't? Your father, your brother, your fiancé, your cousin and your friend. Personally I would have had very low esteem in myself, but Adolin fought through it and just did what he can. He is a character I admire a lot too. Because despite his upbringing, his background and his privileges, he still choses to be humble, be nice to anyone and work hard.

All in all, he's really the most likeable character imo. He and Shallan haven't known each other for the longest time, but it really feels like he's sincere with his feelings despite his prior reputation with girls haha

● Kaladin's friendship with Adolin and Shallan: I know our favorite bridgeboy has his Bridge Four and thinks that's they are all he needs, but I can't help but feel relieved that Kal has Adolin and Shallan.

Like I've said previously, I don't think Kal had any romantic feelings for Shallan, but he thought he did because she reminded him of Tien. His friendship with the two newly-weds are important and it's gonna help him along the way. I love that for Kal ;w;

● I need a Wit in my life, I need him to make me see things I don't see, to make my reflect and realise all the important things in life.

There is this line I particularly liked when he found Shallan:

"[...] You mostly failed. This is life. The longer you live, the more you fail. Failure is the mark of a life well lived. [...]"

This is something a lot of us should probably hear, because I know I do especially when I have doubts in myself and I'm scared of doing things for the fear of failing.

● I don't like Taravangian, and I know he's just trying to save the world but also just actually trying to save his people but when he told Dalinar this:

"This is the sacrifice, isn't it?" Taravangian said softly. "Someone must bear the responsbility. Someone must be dragged down by it, ruined by it. Someone must stain their soul so others may live."

This reminded me of someone, but for the sake of not going into a more serious tone I shall leave it like that.

● As this post is getting longer, these two lines are the last ones that I'm gonna mention:

"I will take responsibility for what I have done," Dalinar whispered. "If I must fall, I will rise each time a better man."

I feel like this is pretty self-explanatory. Dalinar frustrated me all throughout this book. I wanted to slap young Dalinar, especially because of how he treated Evi. I have to admit he was so cool in the last part of the book lol I loved his interactions with Lift.

I kinda wish we had interactions between Lift and Kaladin - I hope we got one in the next book.

And the last line and the one that gave my goosebumps:

She pulled him tight, “Maybe you don’t have to save anyone, Kaladin. Maybe it’s time for someone to save you.”

Kaladin always thinks of saving others, but never thinks that maybe he’s the one who needs to be saved. He helped the parshman, he bonded with the Wall Guards... he cares so deeply for anyone he barely thinks of himself.

Oh, Kaladin, I just wanna wrap him in a blanket and give him a warm soup. :(

I’m itching to read Rhythm of War, but I think my brain needs a break from fantasy books.

#book talk #book review #stormlight archive #oathbringer #brandon sanderson #kaladin #adolin #shallan #dalinar #jasnah #wit

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isdalinarhot · 3 years

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Dalinar, Elhokar, Renarin

oh boy the big three. this is LONG so i am putting it under the cut

Dalinar:

sexuality headcanon: he is bisexual babey! but he is very much repressed and confused about being into dudes

gender headcanon: this is a cis man. this guy has never had a gender crisis in his life.

a ship i have with said character: fuck idk hes not really shippable. i think he had a one night stand with sadeas in his youth like everyone else in the fandom does. i have an au in my head that i will NEVER talk about where basically my self insert and dalinar are bathumpin. i think he lusts after random soldiers during his loveless marriage with evi. idk im very much of the opinion that in canon dlainar should never get a s/o cuz he sucks at romantic relationshiops and he doesn't really deserve a gf or a bf or anything because he has to work on himself first

a brotp i have with said character: this is so funny does dalinar have friends besides the og war criminal squad and like. havar. ah toh how could it have been a party without you. i think dalinar and navani would have ruled if they were friends like i do not want to see elhokar's mom getting as narsty as brand sand will allow with dalinar but i do want to see them strategizing together you know. why did they have to kiss.

a notp i have with said character: Ⅰ. HATE. DALINAR/KALADIN. WHY ARE YOU DOING THAT. i also. dont like dalivani but it doesnt disgust me at the moral level dalinar/kaladin does it just makes me go wow you really are fucking your dead brother's wife huh. we really do have to read paragraphs upon paragraphs about how much of a sexy milf navani is huh.

a random headcanon: before writing oathbringer he is encouraged by like. navani. to write poems to practice like idk handwriting and creative thought or whatever the hell. and so he writes poems. but theyre all really bad and they all rhyme but have really bad rhythm. they are never published but jasnah has them in whatever the roshar equivalent of a manila folder in a file cabinet is and she looks at them for inspiration when she's stuck writing another ketek for a wedding and has poet's block because it reminds her that at least she's a better poet than her uncle

general opinion over said character: dalinar is in a very frustrating place in my brain because there are very few people who share the view that he is like. doing the best he can but also like. hes not doing enough. like both can be true at the same time. and like i either see people like DALINAR SO SEXY heart eyes emoji who cares that he killed all those people and was a terrible husband. or people who are like. dalinar sucks so in my fan content i am going to make him suck in ways that he doesnt actually suck in canon because hes never done a kind thing in his life right. and both are like sandpaper to my brain but in different ways. dalinar is great but i dont trust people with him yknow

Elhokar:

sexuality headcanon: homosexual elhokar kholin. this guy is gay. this guy is the twink of a lifetime.

gender headcanon: i think it would be fun if he was genderfluid like he propbably would figure that out if he lived and was doing lightweavery things

a ship i have with said character: CAN YOU REALLY SHIP ELHOKAR WITH ANYONE⁇⁇⁇⁇⁇⁇ he doesnt really. he doesnt really have romantic chemistry with like. anyone. hes gay but nobody wants him. i think there is something to be said about him possibly having a VERY UNREQUITED thing for kaladin but room temp milk is something that i do not even pretend to comprehend. i think he's more of a "have brief quiet flings with dudes" sort of guy. i like elhokar/hoid due to tomodachi life. and i like elhokar/elliot decker also due to tomodachi life. idk. i dont really ship elhokar w anyone

a brotp i have with said character: I LOVE THE CONCEPT OF THE KHOLIN COUSINS ALL BEING VERY GOOD FRIENDS WITH EACH OTHER like obviously i like the concept of he and jasnah actually having a sibling relationship that we see and i like the concept of him and adolin being flashy bastards that get into arguments about being flashy bastards and i like the concept of him and renarin being like. surprisingly close just cuz they both have the Liking Men thing going on yknow. it is very important to me. like i know logically the kholin cousins would not all be super close to each other because there's a 15 year gap between jasnah and renarin and even the 4 year gap between elhokar and adolin is pretty big when you're a kid but i want to believe. also honorable mention for younger aesudan and elhokar being bros jess your brain is so huge

a notp i have with said character: whoever that person is who did one chapter of a moash/elhokar fic on ao3 i would love to study you

a random headcanon: elhokar naturally sits like with one leg crossed over the other but when hes in public he sits up straight and manspreads to try to project a kingly posture

general opinion i have over said character: this is ANOTHER character that nobody gets right. like everyone is either ike ELHOKAR MY LITTLE BEAN he did nothing wrong <3 or theyre like FUCK ELHOKAR FOR DOING LIKE 2 BAD THINGS oh by the way here's my favorite character who did nothing wrong and their favorite is like. dalinar or raboniel or some shit. my friends are the only ones who know and perceive the truth

Renarin:

sexuality headcanon: gay :)

gender headcanon: i think it would be fun if he had a case of the masc aligned nonbinaries. he/they renarin. this is the future we want

a ship i have with said character: literally rlainarin is so good. i dont usually read fanfiction but sometimes when im feeling sad i read rlain/renarin fic because love is real

a brotp i have with said character: see elhokar's section on kholin cousins ALSO. i think it's really important that he's friends with people in bridge four. a group of frat boys is something that can be so personal

a notp i have with said character: i started reading the books like at the same time renarin was confirmed to have a crush on rlain so every ship i see that's not that makes my brain go [doug dimmadome voice] not right! special anti-shoutout to renarin/shallan though. hatred violence.

a random headcanon: the reason he's so knowledgeable on wine is because of him spending his preteens and early teen years buying dalinar wine to earn his love :(

general opinion of said character: RENARIN IS SO GOOD. literally the power of renarin is that i have never in my life ever seen anyone who hates renarin EVER. everyone is always like renarin is a good boy :) i will say that people infantalize him a lot and i fell into this trap partially because i thought he was like 16 or 17 because i thought adolin was like 19 or 20 so id say shit like oh i want to help him study for the sat i want to go to his band concerts. nah he is 19 in twok that is an entire adult. also i think he should go just a little bit apeshit at some point i think he should be a little bit mad at dalinar. renarin rights

#hey look an ask #hi jess #dalinar kholin #renarin kholin #elhokar kholin

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velkynkarma · 4 years

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So I’m suuuper late to the party, but I finally, finally finished Rhythm of War.

I am delighted by it. Thoughts and reactions under the cut, just in case for spoilers.

OKAY SO I had a lot of feelings about this book, and I wanted to be able to sit down and read the book properly and devote time to it, instead of sneaking paragraphs here or there during work breaks. So that’s why it took me so long to read it. In a way I feel like a terrible fan for taking so long when I was so excited about reading it for over a year, but in another way I am satisfied that I did it justice.

General thoughts/reactions:

I am legitimately impressed with how well Sanderson handled Shallan’s Dissociative Identity Disorder. DID is one of those mental illnesses that gets butchered so hard in media, and carries such a stigma of being “evil” or “creepy.” But Shallan’s representation seems much more factual in terms of how we know DID works today, including but not limited to:

Created from a severe trauma at a very young age, in which the brain starts splitting itself in order to protect against traumas and form survival mechanisms

Alters exist to protect the system and handle tasks for the host that the host cannot handle. Both Veil and Radiant handle tasks/functions that Shallan can’t

Also establishing that different alters can have different skills (such as Shallan being good at drawing and Lightweaving while Veil is bad at it, or Radiant handling espionage poorly)

Establishing that actual DID treatments do include encouraging alters to learn to work together and establish communication lines between each other. I like that the three create a pact to work together and rules to stand by and enforce them on each other to the best of their ability. They mess up sometimes (Radiant killing Ialai, Veil forcibly taking over sometimes). But they try.

But also establishing that prior to Shallan’s realization of what was happening at the end of Oathbringer, each of these alters had their own memories and ways of handling things and did not necessarily communicate with each other

Establishing that multiple times in prior books when Shallan thought she was ‘acting’ she was actually Blending with another identity, either Veil or Radiant. This becomes more apparent when Veil or Radiant actively discuss being the ones to do things that were previously from “Shallan’s” perspective (such as Veil learning slight of hand/etc at the beginning of Words of Radiance). This stuck out to me as especially interesting since accounts of people with DID often mention not knowing they have it or are switching for years, but being semi-aware of doing things differently than normal.

Veil being a protector-type alter and a trauma holder is extraordinarily common in DID cases and made an absolute ton of sense. It also suggests that she’s been around for YEARS longer than before Shallan ‘created’ her which, again, is not uncommon with DID cases

Veil, at least, also acts like she’s much older than Shallan, even calling her things like ‘kid.’ While Veil is, of course, no older than Shallan, this is completely accurate that alters can have different ages and even different genders to the host body in terms of how they perceive themselves

Establishing that fusions/integrations are possible, with Veil being ‘absorbed’ by Shallan at the end. This is a part of DID treatment and I like that it was handled in a way where both alters consented and the trauma was released, but it was handled. Even if Veil developed additional skills over time, it’s clear her first and foremost job was as a trauma holder alter, and once the trauma was no longer being hidden, her ‘purpose’ was done. And now Veil is a part of Shallan, and the expectation is that somewhere down the line, Radiant will join too.

Very very VERY VERY importantly, establishing Shallan’s interaction with other characters as a system with DID in a way that did not make her look like she was ‘crazy.’ DID is super serious and systems are often stigmatized. But I adored that Adolin is supportive and treats each alter on their own playing field (and even seems to be able to recognize them without Shallan changing hair color). I love that other characters like Kaladin admit they don’t exactly get it, but do their best to be respectful of it anyway. I love that nobody treats Shallan like a freak and sticks her in a padded room, and that people DO respect her wishes and treat Veil and Radiant as equally viable people. I love that it’s treated so healthily.

Honestly my only real ‘hmm, not exactly like that’ moments were thinking back on how Shallan ‘created’ personalities. Veil being a trauma holder for Shallan’s old memories implies she’s been around for a long time, so she wasn’t really “created” in that sense, just given more of a face/name. But Radiant appears to have been created spur of the moment when Adolin was all ‘hey, let me teach you to swordfight!!!’ To the best of my knowledge people with DID don’t really have control over when they split, nor do they really get to actively ‘design’ their alters. It’s more like alters form as needed to handle something. But considering how accurate everything else is, and that possibly this is just Shallan’s way of handling her splitting in a way that makes sense to her, I’m willing to give this a cautious pass.

Also maybe lost memory moments. People with DID generally can lose time. Shallan doesn’t seem to, but then towards the end we also see she’s not a reliable narrator in her own right, since somehow Radiant managed to kill Ialai when we’re reading that passage. So it’s possible we the readers are missing things because Shallan is, too.

That said, the way DID works, it will never really go away even if Shallan does fully integrate. I’m curious if more alters could form down the line. I thought this had been happening with ‘Formless,’ but Formless didn’t turn out to be another alter so much. Oh well.

I had wondered about Shallan and Pattern’s bond for a while, and I’d been wondering if maybe she had a different spren ever since Pattern mentioned he could go away or she might kill him too back in...Oathbringer, I think it was? It seemed strange to me that Shallan wouldn’t have seen him around for a long time in his pattern form, or that she’d get chased by so many cryptics in book 1, if she’d been bonded to him this whole time. Or that she had a shardblade she could summon in book 1, but Pattern hadn’t been established as a character yet. And then when Adolin met a deadeye Cryptic in Shadesmar, I was like, ‘damn, that’s Shallan’s first spren isn’t it.’ And I was vindicated. I feel stupidly proud of myself for catching even one of Sanderson’s twists.

I think this is the first book in the series where Kaladin’s arc didn’t really grab me as much as the others to start. Not that it was bad, I still really enjoyed it, especially towards the end. But I was surprised to find when I got to Part Three and Kaladin’s name was listed but Adolin’s wasn’t that I went, ‘awww, damn,’ and used that as my break point for the night.

I think part of this is that so much of Kaladin’s story that I love and adore is about not just Kaladin, but Kaladin’s friends and found family arcs with Bridge Four, and so much of that was taken away from him in the early part of the story. Like Kaladin, I guess I was just sad about everyone moving on and him being along. Sigzil going off to be the new Windrunner leader, Rock leaving, Rlain leaving (for a while at least), Adolin and Shallan leaving...it was hard. I felt his depression. Unfortunately, it made it a bit difficult to read, I guess.

On the flip side though, Kaladin’s ending arc in the story was A+ and I loved it. I love that his Fourth Ideal is specifically accepting that he cannot save everyone, which is something he’s struggled with from his very first appearance in the very first book. I love how this sheds so much light on that moment in Oathbringer where Syl is calling for him to speak the words and he just can’t, because at the time, he wasn’t ready to accept that he couldn’t save everyone. I love that he admits to Dalinar that he really did need help and a chance to recover, and that his setup for the next book doesn’t seem to be as Stormblessed, the soldier, but as a healer. And I love that he made up with his dad in the end, and did manage to at least save him.

ROCK. NOOOO.

TEFT. NOOOOOO!

And yet as always, Sanderson books are the only books where I really feel...ok with character death. It’s sad, for sure, but also deaths have purpose in his stories. Nobody is killed meaninglessly.

I think my favorite arc was Adolin’s, throughout the whole course of the book? I can’t help it. I love my enthusiastic, optimistic himbo who is just doing his best. Every time he was like ‘well I’m useless since I’m not a Radiant, but I’ll do the best I can’ I was like NO, HONEY NO, YOU’RE SO IMPORTANT, DO YOU UNDERSTAND HOW IMPORTANT YOU ARE REALLY? Look at all the people you help!!! Just look at them all!!!

As stated earlier, I love that he’s just so damned supportive of Shallan’s condition. Even if they don’t have words for ‘DID’ in Roshar or even understand it in their own terms, he’s just so damn supportive. She tells him she’s got multiple alters and he’s just like ‘cool, how can I help.’ He loves his wife. He’s friendly with Radiant. He’ll share jabs with Veil. He just wants to help, always.

I love that he’s so supportive of Kaladin too. I adored towards the beginning, where Kaladin’s going into a depressive spiral, and Syl gets Adolin because Adolin is one of the few people he can’t intimidate. And I adore that Adolin is supportive, but in a way that shows he gets it. He knows it’s not safe to leave Kaladin alone with himself and refuses to let that happen. But he also doesn’t force him to participate and acknowledges that yeah, you can feel like shit, and that’s ok, but you’re gonna feel like shit around other people, because it’ll help you. And it does. And I love that a thousand pages later Kaladin starts going into another depressive spiral and happens to mention, ‘fuck, Adolin’s not here to pull me out this time,’ recognizing what Adolin can do. I just love how much their friendship has progressed.

I love that he’s still so supportive of his brother, even if Renarin was barely in this book. I love that he even briefly defends Renarin against Shallan, even when he recognizes she doesn’t really mean any harm.

I adore his continued arc with Maya. I love that he was so excited to go to Shadesmar so he could see her again. I love how he’s clearly had offers from spren or other Radiants to talk to spren about bonding to him, and he’s like, ‘nah,’ cause he’s loyal to her. I love how everyone keeps insisting ‘deadeyes can’t speak, deadeyes can’t feel’ and he’s just like, yes?? Yes they can??? Have you ever fucking tried??? I love that it’s his genuine connection to Maya that helps her recover enough to actually talk on her own with more clarity, and how she’s clearly coming back to herself. And what a revelation, that Maya and the others deliberately sacrificed themselves. And I love that ultimately it’s his bond with Maya that gives him success with the honorspren. He did this his own way, with his own skills, in a unique way that nobody else has ever done before, because maybe he’s not a Radiant in the shiny new sense of the word, but he’s the only person out there willing to treat his sword like a partner and show kindness to spren and that shows.

I also really do hope he works stuff out with his dad because he’s got every right to be angry but also, I want him to be happy :(

Ultimately I adore Adolin’s whole polarity, that he’s a masterful duelist and combatant, and has probably killed hundreds, and yet his best quality is his sheer kindness. He has really grown on me as a character since book one, honestly. I remember not liking him in book one. I still don’t, when I reread it! But in the rest, he’s probably second only to Kaladin as my favorite.

Venli. I remember not really liking Venli in earlier books. I thought Eshonai was cool, but Venli I remember just not really vibing with. Seeing her story really made her a lot more interesting to me though, especially since I love her whole gradual growth as a character. Openly admitting to herself that she’s a coward and just wanted to get attention against her sister...and then doing something about it to better herself. Doubting her abilities to do so and being uneasy about it the whole time, but ultimately doing it anyway. She’s a flawed character, but she’s a good character, and I grew to like her so much more after seeing her story.

Also, I loved Eshonai’s mercy at the end there. Fuckin yes. Bittersweet smiles all around.

Szeth-son-son-Vallano wore white on the day he was to kill a king, because apparently white is the listener battle color, it makes SENSE now

I am also veeery curious what is going on with Szeth, who wasn’t really in this book all that much. And I’m curious if ‘Sixteen’ in Lasting Integrity is actually his dad, because they sure drew attention to a hiding Shin man and then immediately never mentioned him again.

Raboniel. MAN. What a fucking character. I was fascinated with her from the beginning. I never knew exactly what to think of her, because we see her from so many perspectives. Leshwi, who has been established as possibly the ‘goodest’ and most sane of the Fused, openly tells us not to trust her. We learn she’s done terrible things in her lifetime, like trying to create a plague to destroy all of humanity, and one of her titles is just straight-up scary af. She learns how to really, truly, actually kill spren, which is terrifying. She tried to kill the Sibling, which is obviously Super Bad. And yet, she’s such a compelling character. She’s polite and reasonable, to a degree. Clever and enormously genre-savvy, but also blunt and to the point, knowing full well Venli is being used to spy on her and Navani is working against her and blatantly stating so. She’s so intelligent, and is willing to both respect Navani and work with her to create things together, and recognize her worth. I never fully trusted her at any point, because we know she’s done so much to be scared of, but man, I enjoyed reading her segments so freaking much. I was sad when she died, and her weird frenemy relationship with Navani was really intriguing.

I really enjoyed Dabbid’s little segments. I’m so happy he’s comfortable talking around the others. I’m also happy to see Sanderson delving into including more autistic characters in different points on the spectrum, while also showing other people treating them well.

Taravangian. I still don’t know where to stand on this guy and I’m very nervous now that he’s basically a god and apparently smart enough to outwit everyone else again. I was excited when he actually managed to kill Rayse but fuck, we might have been better off with Rayse.

SOMEBODY ACTUALLY MANAGAGED TO OUTWIT HOID AND I’M SCARED AF AT WHAT THAT MEANS

Moash. I just. Fuck. I don’t even know. I’m not even sure if this counts as him killing under his own power or not. He doesn’t really want to take responsibility for his actions, and as long as Odium takes his pain and feelings, he doesn’t have to. But that moment when he wasn’t protected, he seemed upset with what he had done. So I really have no damned clue where his story is gonna go. But fuck, it’s scary how easily he almost undid Kaladin completely. He knew exactly what buttons to press. We’re lucky the Pursuer ignored him and attacked anyway, or he really would’ve won.

I’ll admit, my Cosmere knowledge is less than stellar, so I’m still not entirely sure I understand the stuff with the Heralds and Mraize. But I am definitely curious to see where it’s going on a surface level, at least.

LIFT USES LIFELIGHT that explains a lot. I wish she’d been in this story more because I adore her lol.

I know Sanderson announced Ace Jasnah a while back, but I love that it’s been so firmly established in the book itself. No beating around the bush or leaving people to wonder. She just straight-up says she’s got no real interest in sexual stuff and never really got how it drove others. I love it. I love seeing that so honestly and bluntly stated.

Anyway I’m sure there’s a lot more to be said but overall, A++++ as always, super adored, next one when????

#Velkynkarma rambles #Stormlight Archive #Rhythm of War spoilers

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preservationandruin · 4 years

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Rhythm Of War Liveblog Part One, Part 1 (Chapters 1-2)

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On to Part One of Rhythm of War, after I finish screaming at the ghost of Gavilar Kholin. Actually, we can��t wait for that, I’m never going to be done screaming at the ghost of Gavilar Kholin.

Our POVs are Kaladin, Shallan, Navani, Venli, and Lirin--so Kal’s family is coming back to prominence, I guess. It’s a short update, but I gotta go to work.

Lirin talks about the ethics of continuing a hopeless fight, Syl lets loose an “I told you so” first thing, we see a new and terrifying variant of Fused, I come up with a new, more accurate name for the Sons of Honor; Veil finally gets kidnapped; I start getting philosophical about the ethics of continuing a hopeless fight; and Kaladin organizes an airlift.

Epigraphs for this part seem to be a lecture that Navani gave on how to trap spren in fabrials, so that’s cool.

Alright, so our timing here is a year after the fall of Alethkar, and Herdaz has been next on the Voidbringers’ target list. They’ve been fighting the entire time, but the voidbringers have intensified their assault and now refugees are pouring into the villages in Alethkar; Lirin is insisting on examining everyone as they come in, making sure that he can find people who need treatment early. The leader of Hearthstone now is Brightness Abiajan--from the name, I’m assuming she’s one of the singers.

Also, apparently someone is coming through this line today that Lirin is anxious about. Abiajan comes to talk to Lirin, wondering if he has no compassion because he’s so numb to others’ suffering--he explains that he has to numb it to survive as a surgeon. She mentions that he set her arm, once, when she was a child. Also, hilariously, Abiajan says that plaguespren cause plague and that the idea that it’s improper sanitation is superstition.

Laral, Kaladin’s childhood friend, is helping out now, determined. Apparently the person that Lirin is worried about is a Herdazian general; Lirin does see him as responsible for much of the current strife for continuing to fight; however, he’s not going to turn him in, and instead has contacted Kaladin to come pick him up while Laral helps Roshone make a distraction.

Lirin’s condemnation of continuing a hopeless war as something that just gets people killed and is stupid (”Heroism is a myth you tell idealistic young people. It got one of my sons killed and another taken from me”) makes sense and is deeply sad. It’s also a good second perspective on the fact that so much of Roshar’s narrative has been about being forced to choose between two bad options and having the resolve to find another path or stick with the honorable thing--Lirin here is a reminder that that’s not always an option and sometimes makes things worse. “I obey the person who holds the sword to my neck, General, same as I always have.”

Heroism isn’t always an option. Heroism can get you killed and hurt the people around you. You have to be willing to take responsibility for that in order to try heroism, and that’s some of what Kaladin has had to struggle with, too--the fact that he can’t protect everyone and that his actions will lead to death sometimes.

Also, shoutout to Roshone for actually making a distraction here, good on you buddy. Anyway Lirin noticed that the parshmen always focus on what appears to be the person being seen to rather than, say, the people carrying the litter--probably because they’re used to the people doing those menial tasks being unnoticed and unspoken to, and have absorbed that norm of society? I don’t know, but Lirin is exploiting it.

Oh man, someone has visited Hearthstone, someone who Abiajan refers to as having blessed them, and she demands that Lirin come with her and that nobody leave the town. It’s one of the Fused, and it’s interrogating people about Kaladin--and they noticed that Kaladin was there, and Lirin notes that he barely recognizes Kaladin anymore, referring to him as the “harsh man Kaladin had become.”

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, just let Kaladin babysit people this book, let him rest, he deserves it. I mean, what’s happening is him having to fight again, but he deserves rest.

Cut to Kaladin’s perspective, Syl is delivering an “I told you so” about them being spotted, which is so relentlessly on-brand. Kaladin notes that he’s not looking at Lirin to avoid giving Lirin away, and also because “he knew what he would see. disappointment. So, nothing new.”

HEY. SOMEONE LOVE AND APPRECIATE KALADIN STORMBLESSED PLEASE HE’S DOING HIS BEST.

Meanwhile, Kaladin is learning the different “orders” of Fused; he’s mostly dealt with the shanay-im, “those of the heavens,” who share the flight of windrunners. Apparently Jasnah posited there would be ten orders, logically, and Dalinar--offering no explanation for how he knew--said it would only be nine. I mean, at this point if anyone knows Odium it’s Dalinar.

Also, this Fused has learned not to do single combat, which is Kaladin’s normal mode of dealing with them. I wonder if the order they’re modelled after affects their behavior--honorspren create windrunners, and agreeing to a one-on-one duel is a very honorable thing to do. Maybe there’s more connection there than either side wants to realize.

Ok, so what we know about this new Fused:

Teleports via shooting their spren forward, then forming a new body of voidlight and stone where they end up.

Probably elsecaller-linked (teleportation and then forming things out of energy)

Favors exploiting teleportation to allow for a grappling fighting style and sneaking into blind spots extremely quickly (big rogue energy)

Teleportation ability is extremely costly, can only be done three times before needing to recharge on Voidlight.

Does not teleport instantaneously; the spren-travel can be outrun, as Kaladin does by lashing himself forward five times (so, approximately five times the speed of gravity on Roshar, which is not gravity’s speed on earth, is faster than them; they’re considerably slower than light, even though that’s what they look like)

Can’t transport objects/make them from voidlight; clothing is a hair wrap and weapons are fragments of their skin

He leaves but tells Kaladin to watch for him; it also seems like Kaladin’s depression is coming back. Syl shows up to talk to him, wearing a different style--she’s been taking fashion notes from Adolin, which is hilarious.

Meanwhile, Veil is wandering around the Sadeas warcamps, irritated that she hasn’t been kidnapped yet, or even mugged. Also, Veil and Shallan are apparently teaching Radiant to appreciate humor, which is great. Adolin and his soldiers are apparently backing her up for this hopeful kidnapping, which is reassuring--I’m glad she’s not going it alone, although she’s very competent. She’s pretending to be a merchant who has a way in past Dalinar’s tariffs and is also implying he doesn’t have the authority to demand them.

Ooh, specifically Shallan is hunting the Hypocrite’s Association, which is what I’m calling the Sons of Honor for the moment I guess. For a moment, while they’re doing accounting, Shallan starts having a bit of a memory come back; Veil suggests it might be time to remember everything, but Shallan shuts that down.

Apparently, in the grand tradition of Sadeases not knowing when they’re beaten, Ialai is plotting treason. Ialai, how did that go for the last two Brightlords Sadeas? I’m begging you, quit while you’re...behind, honestly. But still alive. Anyway, the wine was drugged--finally--so they have officially been kidnapped!

Back to Kaladin, Syl is trying to convince him that it’s easy to sleep, he just has to lie down and pretend to be dead for a few hours (oh, Syl, honey, you’re trying to help but that’s not...that’s not it) but Kaladin is noting that it feels like life is strangely disconnected for him, like it keeps going for everyone else and he’s in stasis.

Chronic depression is a bitch.

Syl cheers him up by doing a terrible Kaladin impression, though. I love her. Kaladin goes back to talk to the singers, telling them that there’s a shelter half an hour to the east and telling them not to fight if they don’t want to die. They, of course, fight, which Kaladin doesn’t like; it’s very Alethi of them, though, to throw themselves forward.

Again, we’re back to whether or not there’s heroism in fighting a fight you can’t win. Even with Ialai, kind of--continuing to fight against Dalinar when she can’t win it. Hopeless fights are all well and good when your protagonists do them and it works, this part seems to be pointing out, but what if they fail? And how does it feel to be on the other side of them?

Anyway, the others retreat, and Kaladin gets to meet with his mom and baby Oroden (who pronounces his name as “Gagadin;” i’m gonna CRY). Syl always appears to Kal’s family. Also, apparently Kaladin was dating Lyn, which is wild because I’m almost positive based on her appearance last book that she’s gay as fuck, and she broke up with him. Also, Syl and Hesina are ganging up on Kaladin and it’s great.

"It’s demonstrably unfair that I have to deal with both of you at once,” Kaladin said.

Meanwhile it also turns out that the Radiants haven’t been supporting Herdaz because they saw it falling as inevitable, but it’s continued fighting against all odds. Another perspective: is it alright to abandon others fighting a fight that you assume is impossible, when it could be winnable with your strength?

Also, apparently the Mink likes to sneak away from his guards without letting them notice, and he’s done it again here. That’s pretty impressive, I’ve got to say, although Kaladin is aghast at the idea of leaving one’s men behind like that (of course).

Also, Kaladin organized one of Navani’s platforms to essentially airlift out all of Hearthstone. Trying to save as many people as he can, even still.

#rowliveblog #row spoilers #kaladin has a saving people thing #the ethics of unwinnable wars

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tousleheadedpoet · 6 years

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Religiously Motivated Atrocities in the Cosmere: A Critical Essay*

Or, My Argument on Why Hrathen is a Good Person, and Some Related Stuff about Szeth that Nobody’s Been Saying for Some Reason

Hrathen and Szeth. They don’t seem similar (like… at all) at first glance, but narrow your focus a bit and you can see that both are characters who have done terrible things because of their religious beliefs, despite knowing their actions are morally wrong and despite the tremendous guilt it causes them. Zoom in a little bit more on each man’s specific motivating factor, though, and you’ll find that they are actually opposite in their motivation, and that’s fricking fascinating.

* Lol ok not really. But it does have footnotes!

Under the cut, because when I’m talking about my faves I don’t know how to shut up.

Let’s start with Hrathen. What does he want? To conquer/convert the whole world - ok, got it. But why does he want to do that? It’s not just blind faith and obedience - he’s actually quite thoughtful about his beliefs. At the root, Hrathen does what he does because he cares about people. But that’s kind of a wild assertion, so let’s build up to it. First, it’s because he solidly, absolutely, deeply believes his religion to be true. It’s true he has a bit of a doubting episode in the book, but he comes out of it with even stronger faith. And his faith isn’t just because he grew up in Fjordell and that’s what you believe there - he’s studied it, thought hard about it, probably agonized over it, and come to the conclusion that Shu-Dereth is right. “Hrathen had been given a logical intellect. He would never be content with simpleminded devotion. … In the end, he followed Derethi because it made sense.”2 He and I apparently have pretty different criteria for determining if a religion makes sense, but still. The point is, he really, sincerely thinks his religion is the right one - the objective truth - and that every person’s life and happiness would be improved by conversion to it. And if you believe you have the truth, something that will improve people’s existence immeasurably, and believe you have a duty to people to spread it to them, you’d have to be pretty morally bankrupt to just… not. To him, it’d be like not warning someone about a catastrophic earthquake that’s about to happen, or something. Obviously, his methods are still bad. Super bad, all the time. And it’s an open question if a well-intentioned action is still good if it’s based on false beliefs, and I’m not going to address that. But the point is, Hrathen wants to convert Arelon because he thinks it’s the right thing to do. That was his motivation for converting Duladel too, but he realizes he screwed up. He wants to do better this time - save the people’s souls and their lives.

Ok, and here’s the big thing. He knows his methods are bad. He knows he’s doing reprehensible things to accomplish (what he sees as) a good goal. And he feels super guilty about it, all the time! See: “The destruction Hrathen had caused in Duladel ground against his soul like a millstone … but, Jaddeth required sacrifices. What was one man’s conscience when compared with the glory of His rule? What was a little guilt when a nation was now unified beneath Jaddeth’s careful eye? Hrathen would ever bear the scars of what he had done, but it was better that one man suffer than an entire nation continue in heresy.”3 Hrathen knows he is wrecking his own soul trying to save everyone else’s! And he still does it. Which is so interesting to me!!!! Even though this line of thinking is pretty wrong-headed, it still shows a kind of nobility that Hrathen is willing to sacrifice his own soul for the sake of others. It’s foolish, maybe (is a god that requires that of their followers really one you want to serve?), but it’s also remarkably selfless.

Now, Szeth. Why does he do what he does, killing whoever he’s told and destabilizing all the international politics, when he knows that it’s super wrong? Well, because he’s Truthless, and his religion says that’s what Truthless have to do. But why does that matter so much to him? We don’t know a ton about the Shin religion, or even about Szeth’s relationship to it, except that he believes in it (apparently very strongly, since it motivates him to do all this Truthless stuff). But we do know his thoughts the one time he started to question his religion: “Dangerous thoughts. His way of life was all that remained to him. If he questioned Stone Shamanism, would he then question his nature as Truthless? Dangerous, dangerous. Though his murders and sins would damn him, at least his soul would be given to the stones upon his death. He would continue to exist. Punished, in agony, but not exiled to nothingness. Better to exist in agony than to vanish entirely.”4

Szeth’s motivation isn’t doing what’s right. It isn’t honor. It’s fear.

For someone in Szeth’s position - forced into absolute slavery, given a powerful weapon and ordered to kill - it seems the moral thing to do would be to break his oath (an oath he didn’t even make of his own free will, so maybe not that binding as far as honor is concerned, anyway). But he believes if he does that, he would cease to exist! He doesn’t want that. Nobody wants that. It’s understandable, of course it is - but it is selfish. Where Hrathen seeks to save other people’s lives and souls at the expense of his own, Szeth is trying to protect his own soul in the one small way he can, even though it comes at the expense of many lives. Also, it’s noteworthy that when he does eventually give in and break part of his oath, it’s not because he suddenly became brave or even that the guilt was too much. It’s because he realized he was right about the Radiants returning, so he was never Truthless. The consequences he had feared didn’t apply to him. When Kaladin calls him coward, he just nods and immediately gives up, because it’s true. He had been a coward. And then, when Nale gives him the option to live or die, he chooses life, despite spending half his POV time thinking about how much he wants to die and having literally just attempted suicide. Why? Because he hears the screams. This man. is. scared.

So, Szeth. Driven by fear and despair in almost every choice he makes, and for so long that he is functionally incapable of making his own choices anymore. Contrast that with Gyorn “face Jaddeth with courage and pride” Hrathen, who has never been scared of anything in his life, except maybe the failure of his mission, and who tries desperately to save as many people as he can even at great personal cost. I love them both, but I feel mostly pity for Szeth, while I respect Hrathen (and also pity him). I think it demonstrates an impressively complex and complete understanding of the nature of faith and religion on Brandon Sanderson’s part that he could create these two characters, both required by their religion to do awful things, who are so wildly different in internal motivation, in character, and in outcome.5

But still, these men are both tragic, not evil, and earnestly struggling to figure out the complicated relationship between themselves, god, and morality. Neither of them have done a great job of that so far, honestly, but the last we saw each of them, they were both facing in the right direction. And in my book, that counts for a lot.

Footnotes:

2 Elantris ch. 33 (p. 414-415 trade paperback)

3 Elantris ch. 15 (p. 203). See also the super interesting author annotations on this chapter.

4 The Way of Kings, I-6 (p. 445 hardcover)

5 Ok, I have to put in a short note about Ais even though nobody has read White Sand, because he’s the third constantly-guilty Sanderson character religiously required to do bad things (it’s a good trope, all right?). The thing about Ais is, even though he wants to hate and destroy the Sand Masters as required by Kershtian doctrine, he doesn’t. He feels forced to choose his own conscience instead. And then he feels horribly guilty about that. Poor guy. You just can’t win, can you?

#if anyone still thinks hrathen is a bad person: that's valid and i respect your opinion #.....but it's just going to have to be an irreconcilable difference between us #i realize someone reading my various ill-advised essays on cosmere morality might get the impression that i'm a moral relativist #i'm really really not #it's just i think that someone can be a good person without adhering to absolute morality in every particular #not least because that's literally impossible #good people come in all stripes and vastly outnumber bad people #in fiction as well as reality #also i think it's possible to be a good person and do bad things #but that's enough philosophizing for one day #hrathen #szeth #elantris #stormlight archive #cosmere #brandon sanderson #meta #inspired by basket of radiants and their complicated relationship with caring about hrathen #tousleheadedposts

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mxlxdroit · 7 years

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the stormlight archive high school au that audrey asked for (blame her)

- Bridge Four is marching band, and Sadeas is the band director who’s yelling at them all the time

- Kaladin plays trombone, Moash plays trumpet, Szeth is the master of the marimba (and other assorted percussion. audrey- kind of like milo. lol), Renarin plays piccolo (unimaginable power and rage in a tiny, innocent-looking instrument!), Rock doesn’t play an instrument and refuses to learn but he brings in cookies all the time and is an expert in music theory, and Hoid plays flute because of course he does

- When Kaladin gets put in band (because of course it’s a stupid, arbitrary assigned class), he hasn’t ever played a band instrument before, but he can march SUPER WELL and teaches all the band nerds how to march and deal with carrying heavy instruments for extended practices and things. He also has a background in uber-classical music theory and piano (like his background in non-battlefield medicine in the books) that he learns to apply to the music they play. Syl is his trombone

- Sadeas chooses the worst, most laughably outdated songs for them to play. His arrangments SUCK and everyone hates it (and him)

- Band has next-to-no budget, and at the story point that’s equivalent to the part in WoK where Dalinar frees the bridgemen, he diverts funding to save them from like... financial ruin

- The highprinces are the coaches of the sports teams- Dalinar coaches football (he was a huge football star back in the day, but he was super mean and aggressive and used underhanded tactics and stuff), Sadeas coaches lacrosse (because... lacrosse. ew), and Sebarial probably coaches golf (”coaches” is a generous term for what he does, which is sit on the sidelines with Palona, drinking a soda and providing a running commentary)

- Elhokar is the principal, and Aesudan is the vice principal who does most of the administrative duties

- Dalinar also teaches language arts despite not being able to read

- Jasnah teaches political science and history, and she is the advisor for both feminism club and debate team (and like, Model UN and 300 other clubs)

- Navani teaches computer science and everyone loves her

- Shallan is simultaneously an art kid and a theater kid- she loses herself in every role so much it’s kind of unsettling... ( :(( ) She transfers from homeschooling to going to public school after the ~mysterious incapacitation~ of her father. Her brothers are all graduated by that time

- Adolin isn’t in AP, but his grades are super great, he’s the football star, and he’s in feminism club because he RESPECTS WOMEN (and also is hoping that some of the girls in feminism club will date him. many of them are not into men. he has already dated and broken up with the rest of them. oh, Adolin)

- The AP cohort are the ardents, and they still all have shaved heads

- Renarin wants to play football with Adolin, but he can’t, and everyone wants him to go into taking AP classes but he is REALLY not interested in that

- Kaladin was a really, really good soccer player, but he got into a fight with the assistant coach (Amaram, of course) and got kicked out. The next semester, he got put in band to help him “develop anger management skills” and “learn how to be a team player”

- Jasnah serves as a kind of academic advisor/ tutor for Shallan after she transfers in

- The Parshendi are the neighborhood kids. When the school board (the Shards) re-zone the city (the Cosmere), a bunch of them get transferred out of the school (killed. whoops) to make room for non-neighborhood kids (the humans, in canon). Now outnumbered and neglected, they don’t get as many resources or attention as they need anymore, and they’re (understandably) pissed about it

- The Fused are parents and grandparents of the neighborhood kids

- The Heralds are from the first graduating class after the re-zoning, so they founded most of the clubs and were the original captains of the sports teams

- Hoid... i don’t know and neither does anyone else. He shows up in band sometimes, Principal Elhokar really likes him, you can’t really stop him from doing anything because he will roast you to high heaven, and nobody can tell if he’s an adult or a kid. He barely shows up to class, and there will be periods of several weeks or even months where nobody has any idea what he’s up to. Then again, nobody really knows what he’s up to even when they’re talking to him.

- All the worldhoppers have a similar deal to Hoid. Who are they, where did they come from, and where do they go? Who knows

- Lift is in middle school but she’s always heely-ing down the halls and people either don’t notice (she’s good at hiding) or don’t care. She steals food from the cafeteria all the time

- The Shards are the school board. They mean well, or at least they used to mean well, but they aren’t very good at their jobs most of the time

Okay that’s all I’ve got for now

if people have ideas for this... i guess just tag it ‘SA HS AU’ or tag me? idk, man

#this is such a long post #oh well #that's okay #SA HS AU #mine #cosmere #stormlight archive

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chasmfriend · 7 years

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Oh, Renarin.

I have talked at length before about what I love about Renarin’s character, his quiet strength, his utter willingness to give. I worried at one point during Oathbringer that those things were being jeopardized.

When I calmed down and quietly watched him (something that’s necessary to really see him), I saw that he hadn’t changed. Renarin is still Renarin. His character shone through.

Rereading his part with Adolin at the end of Chapter 10 has a new meaning:

“Adolin, I was starting to fit in. With Bridge Four, with being a Shardbearer. Now, I’m in the darkness again. Father expects me to be a Radiant, so I can help him unite the world. But how am I supposed to learn?”

Adolin scratched his chin with his good hand. “Huh. I assumed that it just kind of came to you. It hasn’t?”

“Some has. But it … frightens me, Adolin.” He held up his hand, and it started to glow, wisps of Stormlight trailing off it, like smoke from a fire. “What if I hurt someone, or ruin things?”

“You’re not going to,” Adolin said. “Renarin, that’s the power of the Almighty himself.”

Renarin only stared at that glowing hand, and didn’t seem convinced.

Renarin’s expressing doubts he can’t explain to Adolin. He’s genuinely afraid of ruining things, because he knows something is wrong. Adolin assumes it’s self-doubt, but Renarin’s afraid of being “in the darkness” and he’s scared. “What if I hurt someone, or ruin things?” If Adolin had known exactly what Renarin was dealing with, perhaps he wouldn’t have been so quick to reassure his brother.

And no wonder Renarin wasn’t persuaded by Adolin’s saying “that’s the power of the Almighty himself”, because Renarin knew it wasn’t.

“I’m a different order of Radiant,” Renarin says to Rock. And later, “I don’t know what I am most days, Rock, but I seem to be the only one.” Both of these carry a heavier meaning to him.

“When you say these things, you are almost not bitter!” Lunamor said. “Ha! Much practice must have been required.”

“A lifetime.”

Oh, my heart. Renarin is very good at hiding his struggles and not being bitter about them, and Rock sees through it. It’s not easy to be Renarin. But he hasn’t let bitterness overcome him.

I want to talk about young Renarin. First, that his name means “like one who was born unto himself” is perfect. Like Renarin, it’s unique and strange; like Renarin, it almost doesn’t make sense. But it fits him.

I think Renarin had difficulties similar to what his mother experienced, being a part of society but never integrated in, always standing apart. Though perhaps Renarin’s differences run deeper than Evi’s did.

This part stood out to me:

Renarin stepped in and hugged him. Dalinar flinched, bracing as if for a punch. The boy clung to him, not letting go.

We haven’t seen Renarin giving a hug like this to anyone. He never initiates a hug and never clings. And then he says this:

“They talk about you,” Renarin said, “but they’re wrong. You just need to rest, after all the fighting you did. I know. And I miss her too.”

This is not the Renarin we know. He gives affection, gives words of comfort, reaches out. He’s trying so hard to help. I can only guess that the years of neglect and not fitting in with Alethi society squashed that child into silence and withdrawal.

So, Renarin remains in the background, quiet.

Then Jasnah finds him in the temple of Pailiah. He saw a vision of Jasnah approaching him, saw her kill him.

But Renarin isn’t as concerned about that.

Renarin didn’t want to die. But strangely, he found himself welcoming Jasnah’s strike.

This reminds me of him in the arena in WoR, kneeling on the ground and baring his throat to Relis during the duel.

Better to die than to live to see what was happening to his father.

And there he is. There’s my Renarin. Unconcerned with himself, he worries instead about Dalinar. He sees Dalinar’s fate in the vision, his father becoming Odium’s champion, as much worse than his own death. He knows what a betrayal it would be to not only his father, but to the fight against Odium, to the world, for Dalinar to give in and side with the enemy.

She prepared to swing, but then Renarin turned and looked at her. Tears streaming down his face, he met her eyes, and he nodded.

Renarin bears fear and pain better than anyone. He doesn’t distance himself from it, as Shallan does. He doesn’t bemoan it, as Kaladin does. And he doesn’t demand anything different. He’s present in it, allows it.

Would it have been nobler for him to fight against Jasnah? There’s something to be said for that reaction. Yet he believed his own death was inevitable.

It’s his reaction to it, his calmness in the face of what he thought was certain death, that makes me love him even more. I don’t see it as self-effacement as much as perspective. What would it matter if he himself died, in the face of someone as powerful and strong as Dalinar joining the enemy? Which is worse?

Renarin sees.

And then so does Jasnah. She remembers Renarin crying on her shoulder as a boy. She knows he has been perpetually misjudged, mocked, just as she has been. She feels an affinity for him.

I want to pause here and mention that this kind of bond is only possible because Renarin isn’t covering up who he is. He isn’t pretending. He’s being himself, all exposed and unpretentious. What do you do when you see someone else in their stark vulnerability?

You reach out to them.

And Jasnah does. She pulls him into a hug. He doesn’t resist; he breaks down and cries, still the little boy he used to be, the one he’s always been. The one who had to shoulder too much, who didn’t get enough guidance, who never fit in, who learned to put his needs aside and try hard to be useful.

“What’s wrong with me?” Renarin asked. “Why do I see these things? I thought I was doing something right, with Glys, but somehow it’s all wrong.…”

Renarin does something else here I don’t remember him doing before. He opens up and talks about what’s wrong. For the first time, someone else knows, and it’s someone who understands him. For the first time, Renarin is seen in all the wrongness he had been hiding, and he’s loved instead of condemned for it.

“Hush,” Jasnah whispered. “We’ll find a way through it, Renarin. Whatever it is, we’ll fix it. We’ll survive this, somehow.”

Jasnah, the queen of logical thought, has no idea what to do to fix it. But she knows that following her heart instead of her head is right.

And how does Renarin react to her not killing him? With tremendous relief, and not because his life was spared--

Renarin pulled back from her, his tearstained eyes going wide. “I saw you kill me.”

“It’s all right, Renarin. I’m not going to.”

“But don’t you see? Don’t you understand what that means?”

Jasnah shook her head.

“Jasnah,” Renarin said. “My vision was wrong about you. What I see … it can be wrong.”

--But because that means that Dalinar might not turn. Moments before he had been ready to die, but he was NOT ready to give up on his father.

That hope drives him. He runs with Jasnah to join the battle, still not entirely confident in his strength. He heals Adolin, and gets orders from Dalinar to work the Oathgate and fight the Thunderclast.

And then…

Regardless of not knowing HOW he fits in, Renarin moves forward. He’s not lurking uncertainly in the background anymore.

“Adolin, don’t be foolhardy!” Renarin grabbed his arm. A burst of healing moved through Adolin like cold water in his veins, causing his pains to retreat.

“But—”

“Get away,” Renarin said. “You’re unarmored. You’ll get yourself killed fighting this thing!”

“But—”

“I can handle it, Adolin. Just go! Please.”

Adolin stumbled back. He’d never heard such forceful talk from Renarin—that was almost more amazing than the monster. Renarin, shockingly, charged at the thing.

Renarin takes the upper hand in the fighting. He takes over, without a shred of his usual self-doubt. Adolin knows exactly how incredible this is.

Alright. Time to talk about what Renarin IS.

Truthwatchers are supposed to have the Surges of Progression and Illumination -- Renarin has healed so many times and so easily that he clearly has this Surge. But Illumination?

“The Surges of Progression and Illumination. I’m not sure how to make the second one work though. Shallan has explained it seven times, but I can’t create even the smallest illusion. Something’s wrong.”

Whatever happened with Glys, it made Renarin unable to access the second Surge. I’m guessing that in its place he has the Voidbinding Surge, and hasn’t figured out what it is or how to use it. I doubt that explains the light he used to get rid of the Thunderclast (I have no idea what that was, but it doesn’t make sense for it to be Voidbinding). Maybe the visions Renarin experiences are related to that other Surge.

Then again, some Truthwatchers had visions of the future:

Don’t tell anyone. I can’t say it. I must whisper. I foresaw this.

—From drawer 30-20, a particularly small emerald

Maybe a result of Glys’s corruption is that Renarin’s visions come from Odium instead of Cultivation, to skew events in favor of Odium.

I worry about my fellow Truthwatchers.

—From drawer 8-21, second emerald

I can’t explain how Renarin does what he does with the fistful of Stormlight. All I know is that if Odium hoped to have an ally in Renarin, he’s sorely mistaken.

Everything is pushing Renarin to become something he was never sure he could be. He’s not a typical Alethi warrior. He’s not a background support person, good only for staying away from the fight and healing others.

Renarin, still himself, still slightly uncertain of himself, is finding his place.

“The portal has to be opened,” Renarin said.

“Your Highness…” Teshav said. “You can’t fight them all.”

“There’s nobody else.” He turned to go.

And he is amazing.

Renarin settled down nearby on some steps, trembling from it all, but grinning anyway.

Renarin is GOOD. He is thoroughly good. He isn’t definable, not easily understood, and unique in all the world, for all he wants to fit in with everyone. He is like one born unto himself. I don’t think he ever will truly fit in, but it’s fine, because he is amazing and has a beautiful soul.

I had been so worried that Renarin was not who I thought he was, but he’s still him, still the Renarin I knew and love.

Dalinar wept and clung to that youth, that child, as if he were the only real thing left in a world of shadows.

You’re not wrong, Dalinar.

(Tagging @rhetoricandlogic & @tiabwwtws who wanted to know when this post would (finally) be finished)

#oathbringer spoilers #Renarin #character analysis #stormlight archive #cosmere

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cosmerelists · 1 year

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If Warbreaker and Stormlight characters met each other...

[Spoilers for Warbreaker & for Stormlight!]

Stormlight characters have previously encountered Mistborn characters from both Era 1 and Era 2. But in honor of my finally rereading Warbreaker, let’s see what that matchup might be like!

1. Adolin & Siri

Adolin: THREE new elaborate dresses? Every morning?!

Siri: Yes!! And they always had some more in the back too, just in case!

Adolin: And they just...destroyed the ones you didn’t wear?

Siri: I think so! They NEVER repeated options and I know they burned the ones I did wear!

Adolin: Who was designing & crafting half a dozen royal gowns every single day??

Siri: I don’t know! But they must have been AMAZING at their jobs--and very okay with their beautiful work being destroyed.

Adolin: It’s both a fashion triumph and a fashion crime at the same time!

Siri: I know!!

2. Elhokar & Vivenna

Vivenna: And I hired these mercenary bodyguards to help me stop the war but it turned out they were working against me and tried to kill me!

Elhokar: Omg that’s my worst nightmare!

Elhokar: It happened to me too! One of my own guards tried to assassinate me!

Vivenna: That’s horrible! How come?

Elhokar: Oh some mix-up where I threw his innocent grandparents in jail & left them there until they died.

Vivenna: ...

Vivenna: And you’re the good guy in this story?

Elhokar: Hey!

Vivenna: J-Just asking!

3. Lopen & Susebron

Susebron: For fifty years, I had no tongue. They cut it out.

Susebron: Until one day, a god gave his life to heal me.

Lopen: That’s an amazing story, gon!

Lopen: I was a one-armed Herdazian for a while.

Lopen: Then I grew my own arm back. And nobody died!

Susebron: ...

Lopen: Hey, so basically, I’m stronger than a God King!

Lopen: Can I stick you to a wall?

4. Sadeas & Denth

Denth: Funny thing about being a mercenary.

Denth: You literally tell people that you’re just in it for the money. That you’re not a good person.

Denth: And they’re still shocked when you betray them for the money!

Sadeas: I know what you mean.

Sadeas: I told Dalinar that his honor would get him killed.

Sadeas: And then when I took advantage of his honor and left him to die, he was like...surprised Pikachu face.

Denth: [tsks] No one values honesty anymore.

5. Weatherlove & Bridge Four

[Author’s note: Weatherlove is just a random Returned that Lightsong hangs out with once.]

Drehy: Wow! Look at this small but muscular man!

Weatherlove: Small?? I-I’ll have you know that we gods TOWER over the common man!

Teft: I mean, you’re only a little taller than Kaladin and Moash.

Rock: And shorter than me, ha!

Sigzil: The Fused are quite a bit taller than you.

Skar: You do look strong, though! I bet you could carry a bridge--with practice.

Weatherlove: ...I hate this place.

6. Shallan & Lightsong

Lightsong: I hear that you are one of the wittiest characters in your book.

Shallan: I’ve been known to turn a phrase or two. You as well?

Lightsong: Written to be someone who could thrive in an Oscar Wilde play!

Shallan: Why do you suppose we’re talking about wittiness rather than actually saying anything witty?

Lightsong: I have to imagine the blogger doesn’t have any idea how to write dialogue between characters like us!

Shallan: Tragic, really.

Lightsong: A true loss for all.

7. Jasnah & Blushweaver

Jasnah: As a Veristitalian, I’ll admit I’m interested to talk with another planet’s Goddess of Honesty.

Blushweaver: Yes, and with the two of us together, one truth has already been made plain.

Jasnah: Oh? What is that?

Blushweaver: Looking at us, it’s clear that honesty must be stored in the boobs.

Jasnah: ...

Blushweaver: They don’t call you a VerisTITalian for nothing!

Jasnah: Why do I bother?

8. Kaladin, Adolin, Renarin & Vasher

Kaladin: It’s YOU!

Vasher: Yes, yes. It’s me.

Adolin: Stormfather! It’s YOU!

Vasher: So we’ve established.

Renarin: It’s YOU!!!

Vasher: Yes, yes. Everyone is so observant today.

Hoid: Hey!

Hoid: Stop stealing my bit!!!

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hoidthevoid · 7 years

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part one, chapters 1-9

ha how cool is it that the semi-sacred number (10) is how many major servants that Odium has (the nine Unmade & his Champion in black Shardplate that Dalinar sees)

also how FRICKIN COOL is it that GOLD is the main color of the enemy?? like, finally, it’s not just black. Odium has a pretty neat color scheme, tbh--gold and really dark purple and red? sweeeet.

i like how every time Dalinar sees Navani for the first time in a chapter he goes on this mini-rant for about a paragraph about how beautiful she is

haha i remember the first time i was reading the part about the Oathgate mechanisms & how they have to be unlocked from both sides--a Radiant has to go to the Oathgate before they can use it--and thinking ‘wow that sounds a lot like the lego video games’

actually that’d be really cool. frick now i want a lego stormlight archive video game

"somehow we’ll make them listen, even if they’ve got their fingers planted firmly in their ears. makes one wonder how they manage it, with their heads rammed up their own backsides” wow, Navani.... it’s a real mystery where Jasnah got her quick, sharp tongue from

there Dalinar goes on another rant about how much he loves Navani. what a sweetheart

man all that buildup throughout with everybody looking for Sadeas’s murderer and then Adolin just goes ‘hey dad i killed him’ at the end like it’s nbd

also i love that juxtaposition between chapters. ‘sadeas has been murdered!’/immediate cut to Adolin’s viewpoint

detective dalinar, on the case

daily reminder that i love Palona

wow humankind really is a disease on Roshar.... the Desolations come and try to wipe them out but they just keep coming back. i guess that’s also true of an immune system, too, though. i know very little about medicine

highprince “i’m not like those other highprinces anymore” aladar

thank u for gasping dramatically, Kalami, you really contributed to the feeling of the moment in a way nobody else was brave enough to

all riiiight flashback chapter!

wow young Dalinar was a pretentious little prick wasn’t he

albeit a pretentious deadly little prick, covered in blood. all the same

“spare the life of my brightlord, the heir” “uhhh.......... whoops”

this is gonna sound... really bad.... but honestly? Blackthorn Dalinar is.... i like him. he makes bad decisions and has little to no self control whatsoever and all that but he’s got a very likable personality as long as he stays in the book & away from me

on the other hand, Sadeas has always been a dick and i hate him

shotgun wedding, whoohoo!

it’s kind of odd to me that Shallan hasn’t spoken at all in the scenes she’s been in for so long, but i guess that’s just bc of the circumstances & the company

tbh Elhokar’s survived so many assassination attempts that it was an actual shock when That Thing happens later. that was bad. but we’re at a wedding now& he’s still alive so i’m not gonna think about that

“i’m sorry, son” “i know, uncle” yeesh

i’m still having difficulty picturing a face stretching to both horizons. it’s not working for me

oh yeah y’all should probably get used to reading the words “i love Adolin Kholin” bc.... i really do. i love him so much

“i can point to the moment when i decided for certain this record had to be written. i hung between realms, seeing into Shadesmar--the realm of the spren--and beyond.”

dalinar, creating Honor’s Perpendicularity: wow storms i gotta write this down

kaladin that’s a weirdexpletive similie. ‘a baby with no face’ is the first thing you think of that’s unnatural?

aw i love Syl’s little umbrella. it’s completely pointless but it’s so cute

he’s so tall, and handsome as heck/he’s back home and let’s be real he is a wreck

no seriously Kaladin is So Tall. and so judgmental rn my goodness. ‘that cap is a diSGRACE’

THERE IT IS... LIRIN RECOGNIZED HIM...... kaladin casually shoves this guy charging at him out of the way i lvoe that... REUNION!! M Y LITTLE BOY

excuse me syl what’s this voice singing to you

“what’d you do? hit a lighteyes?” “yep” BAM

i live for accurate descriptions of good punches. he’s so satisfied w himself too. such a perfect punch

i’m very proud of u kaladin that was very mature of you to realize that ur better than that. all the same i’m also very glad you punched him

it’s interesting that Kaladin can feel his eyes change color. wonder what that feels like

casually namedrops the king w/o a title. iconic

“i am an elegant and graceful weapon, stupid.”

mmmmm i’m having a little bit of a hard time buying Laral’s development but ok i guess

he calls Urithiru home more readily than he calls Hearthstone home and that makes me all kinds of emotional

ORODEEEENNNNN

“it made my eyes make my brain think it forgot to wake up” is an excellent description of surrealism good job brandon

shallan honey you’ve gotta realize that almost nobody sees things exactly the way you do. ily but you can be pretentious and close-minded as frick

Dalinar keeps using the word ‘bastion’ and it’s very distracting bc i keep thinking about the Overwatch post from a couple months ago. he’d probably be a reinhardt main tho (fighting/life is about momentum and crushing the enemy. and c’mon, the armor and the hammer?)

ha first time i read this (”brightlord, sir, there’s been another murder”) i metaphorically looked directly at adolin and said ‘what did you do’

#the void screams back #the void liveblogs #Oathbringer #Oathbringer spoilers #/#Stormlight Archives #Cosmere

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adurna0 · 7 years

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Well, I finished Oathbringer (and what a journey that was) and, since I have nobody IRL who’s read it to rant to, I decided to post some of my thoughts here, in no particular order. Obviously spoilers ahead!

Character development has a name and that name is Dalinar Kholin. I was so broken up over the flashback chapters. On the one hand, I knew Dalinar had changed and I knew he’d become a good man. On the other hand, I just wasn’t prepared to let go of all his past misdeeds (if that isn’t a gross understatement idk what is), even if he was, for a large part of it, under the effect of the Thrill. Dalinar owning up to the things he did, taking responsibility for them, and asserting that there is no excuse, no justification, while also acknowledging that he’d changed, that he can still change... It was a great resolution, I feel.

While on the topic, that scene with Odium, along with Moash’s scenes, also gives us a glimpse into how Odium works. He likes to let people believe that they’re not really the masters of their emotions (which makes sense, given that he claims that he is) and offers them an out, a way to absolve themselves of responsibility because it wasn’t them, it was Odium. And Dalinar is such a great foil to Moash in this. Where one lays down his responsibility and surrenders himself to just following orders, the other defies that and refuses the easy way out. Perhaps most importantly, Odium didn’t see that coming at all, for all that he claims that he can see the future, for all the things he showed Taravangian.

I’m still not over Elhokar’s death and I probably never will be, thanks Brandon. I can see why it happened, I could see that it was going to happen, but damn it I wanted Elhokar to have a chance. The fact that he died holding on to that drawing Shallan made him? Yeah, it’s fine, I didn’t need my heart anyway...

The dreaded love triangle. Boy am I glad it got resolved. I’m also glad it was handled the way it was, with Shallan’s infatuation with both Kal and Adolin being tied to her general uncertainty about herself, to her being unable to control her personalities and feeling lost within herself. Ultimately, Shallan and Kaladin have only ever projected their expectations on each other. Kaladin viewed Shallan’s (evidently unhealthy) coping mechanisms as proof that she was strong and didn’t understand that she was only able to smile and go on because she was horribly traumatized and repressing so many of her memories. On the flip side, Shallan was romanticizing Kaladin’s “broodiness”, which made him appear mysterious and alluring, but, in truth, was just the expression of the depression he’s dealing with. Meanwhile, her relationship with Adolin has always been more genuine (in the sense that they understand more of one another) and they’re shown being very honest, even about the things they struggle with the most.

On another note, I’m so here for Kaladin and Adolin getting along. They can both grow as people from it, not to mention it’s entirely too adorable.

Jasnah is the queen of my heart and, apparently, also the queen of Alethkar. I swear I’m gonna print out the sequence on the wall of Thaylen city and frame it. She even pulled the “killing enemies without even looking” thing. (Although, seeing as how Navani, a middle aged person with no battle training, took out 3 armed dudes using only a fabrial, I kind of see where Jasnah gets it from ya know)

Renarin. Wonderful brave Renarin. That kid defies expectations at every turn. Everyone just kind of expects him to be a quiet scholar and he’s good at that yeah, but then... Then the guy goes charging into battle with a goddamn thunderclast, gets stepped on, and proceeds to give absolutely no fucks whatsoever. On top of that, he goes to face all the Fused at the Oathgate, because... There’s nobody else who can? That’s such a prime Renarin thing. Kinda like that time he jumped into an arena with a blade that was screaming in his ears because there was nobody else to help his brother. Suffice it to say, I’m resting my hopes on the fact that Sja-anat is trying to break away from Odium, so Glys might be safe? It’s of note that a lot of Odiums... notes so to speak, have faded to black and that Renarin is somehow connected to this.

The more I read these books, the more I become convinced that, while individual books have their protagonists, Hoid himself is the protagonist of the cosmere as a whole. And, honestly, the more we see of him the more I love him. It’s like that entire character was meant to ruin me specifically. The things he said in that last chapter, oh boy... I can’t find the words to express how much I appreciate that ideology.

Lift makes for a delightful bit of contrast among the more “serious” characters, especially with Szeth who tends to be so formal in his speech patterns. It reminds me of the similar way Tolkien contrasted more jovial, modern ways of speech with more “sophisticated” language (done especially with the hobbits). It worked well there and it works well here, Lift is hilarious when she pops up in the middle of Dalinar’s dramatic sequence and just casually goes “hey old man wyd” and you can almost hear the record scratch in Dalinar’s epic theme and see him break out of his slow motion walk to face Odium.

I can’t even hate Taravangian. I can’t hate him because we see so much of how he thinks and... While I don’t agree with him, I understand him and I can see how someone could (relatively easily) arrive to that line of thinking with the facts he has at hand. It’s a dangerous line of thinking, but he actually believes this is the best that can be done and well... I kind of feel sorry for him.

Overall I just love Sanderson’s brand of background worldbuilding. There is so much that is introduced through dialogues and thoughts that the narrative passes over, like the little details of running Urithiru or Bridge Four’s interactions. and it adds a lot of depth to both the setting and the characters themselves. The parts with Bridge Four, particularly, were some of my favorites. Rock cheering on the entire squad while cooking, Skar only drawing in Stormlight when he came to terms that he could just teach other people and he’d still be doing good, all the little interactions that showed how everyone belonged there... The way they learn to see past their biases and grow as people (Kaladin being called out for being vaguely shitty towards Drehy and Lyn, everyone making a conscious effort to include Rlain, Teft overcoming his guilt... I could go on for a while). It’s just all very heartwarming and goes a long way to show how things are changing for the better, as these people overcome their differences and learn to respect and value each other and themselves.

I can’t fucking believe Dalinar was getting his wine from Jezrien!

The illustrations in this book were wonderful and this artist nerd appreciates the fashion folios so much. Although, my favorite might be Veil’s “drawing is easy!” doodle, along with Shallan’s “clearly it isn’t”, because let me say... BIG MOOD... I also patiently await the arrival of my actual physical copy so I can get a good look at those wonderful Herald illustrations.

Anyway, this jumbled mess is getting too long and I’m gonna cut it here and go cry in my corner probably while I patiently await the next book...

#stormlight archive #oathbringer #oathbringer spoilers #they're under the cut though #cosmere #LONG ASS POST #I got carried away #well not as carried away as brandon gets thankfully like tf brandon 1300 pages

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esseastri · 7 years

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Megan Reads Oathbringer (part 4)

sometimes I wonder about labeling the parts of the liveblog with “part 1, part 2, etc” ‘cause like...that doesn’t mean it’s part 4 of the book. just part 4 of the liveblog? idk, I jUST realized that might be confusing in a book split up into five parts, but it’s too late now...

I’m still in part one, for those keeping track.

Part 4 encompasses pages 240-326 (previous parts)

I genuinely cannot imagine Dalinar marrying someone quiet and shy and it’s just. wild.

“his bracer clocks” bless Navani for inventing wrist watches and calling them something delightful instead

nooooooo don’t bring Taravangian here!!!! Don’t let him see the center of your power!

crap, now we’ve got, like...all the factions together, right? Taravangian and the diagram people. the Ghostbloods. Amaram and whatever he’s doing. And us....everyone who knows stuff about the end of the world, all in one convenient place. What could possibly go wrong?

Oh, except Jasnah. She’s out there, somewhere. When will my love return from the war

seriously, it’s been 240 pages, where is Jasnah.

“He’d been a friend to Gavilar and that was enough for Dalinar.” like. okay. sure. but you know your brother was trying to end the world to bring back the gods, right? like? ARGH.

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm hey do we have a way to tell Radiants from normal Shardblade holders?

I’m not saying I don’t trust Taravangian and his “newest Radiant” Malata, but... I DON’T TRUST TARAVANGIAN AND HIS NEWEST RADIANT MALATA

seriously, what is in Kholinar that all the parshmen are headed there? or...being driven there by their weird glow spren?

“Men of blood and sorrow don’t get an ending like that.” DAMN STRAIGHT THEY DON’T, YOU MURDEROUS CURMUDGEON

mmmmm she’s a Dustbringer? Our first one... “I don’t like how she smiles.” same though? I’m. concern.

oohh, I didn’t even think she might have an honorblade. where would Taravangian have gotten another honorblade. I remember reading something about there being more honorblades out and about in the world, but we don’t know whose, do we?

I. Am. Concern.

...........it’s not the bond. #confirmed by the stormfather. so there goes my theory about the the stormlight healing Dalinar’s memories.... hm

Taravangian getting all self-righteous about the Shin “murderering all those monarchs” like. even on a not-so-smart day he’s clever enough to deflect blame, to reinforce the idea that he’s just a harmless old man, would never command an assassin to kill off everyone’s kings. He’s terrifying, tbh.

mmmm, everyone thinking Dalinar is gonna attack them, I mean...good assumption but for once, you’re wrong!

omg

Dalinar, please, please do not go to war with the whole world all at the same time. Please.

I...don’t think that’s a spren...I don’t know what it is, but I don’t think it’s a spren. unless...can cities have spren? There are enough people, right? Can they manifest an incarnation of themselves? That’s basically what spren are, right? forces of nature made manifest, so...why not forces of civilization, too?

oh god

how long has it been alone?

this......is another story I wrote because it was sad, not because I wanted it. oh god. ooohh god. Urithiru...

OH ROCK!! ARE YOU OAK--okay, he’s okay.

wait

so it’s not just murders...it’s any sort of violence? the copycat is copying...all violence? or...just the criminal kind? surely it’s not copying all the violence of the army training or sparring. But...why? what’s to be gained from repeating the same crime a second time?

how long has this spren been alone and how mad is it?

does it think...violence is the way to be more human? to remember more? I’m...concerned and confused and. aaahhhhh

“Let me be stronger than those who would kill me.” punk!Dalinar, pls. you can pray for better things than that...

Dalinar keeping Navani’s prayer in his pocket like...my dude u r gettin married. the pining is. wow.

umm. #y i k e s

no wonder Kadash goes and joins the ardents...

Dalinar just...murdering a hundred people including some of his own men? is? really...like, okay, here’s the thing: We knew from the previous two books that Dalinar had done some bad shit. And we were told repeatedly that he’d changed dramatically. But being told and having it spelled out in...child murdering and unthinking friendly fire is...something else. The character development of this man is wild. and mildly uncomfortable. Like...his bad shit wasn’t just a few battles and some brutality of conquest. this was. really, really bad shit. And to see how far he’s come and how much he’s trying to atone for is. sure a thing.

and somehow people DIDN’T figure out that the Thrill is bad before now???

“This is a mercy” ARE YOU SURE?

AND THEN HE JUST GOES AND KILLS SOME MORE, JUST FOR FUNSIES

BUDDY. MY DUDE. YOU NEED TO STOP AND RECONSIDER YOUR LIFE AND YOUR CHOICES. PLEASE.

seriously, how does anyone think the Thrill is a good thing here.

Shallan really needs to look into her budding multiple personality disorder.

OKay, but are they siding with “the enemy” or are they siding with some parshmen who are now in workform and just want to be treated as real people instead of slaves? ‘cause like...you guys are all basing your strategy on the idea that EVERY parshman went stormform and started rampaging about killing everything in sight. And that definitely hasn’t happened yet.

Why hasn’t Kaladin mentioned this to you guys?? like?? oh, I guess he got his spanreed stolen, right? I just....... there’s a lot going on here, but there’s a certain amount of...maybe consider what the negotiations with the parshendi/parshmen/whatever they are now really are before you just...write them all off as evil?

Then again, these are Alethi lighteyes, who don’t really understand the concept of not generalizing a population they consider below themselves.

this is why the whole dudes not writing thing is ssooooooooo stupiiidddd. Kaladin can’t tell you guys ANYTHING unless he finds a nice lady to scribe for him. God, Vorinism is so stupid sometimes.

“Spark” is a good name for a spren tho, maybe she’s legit? I still don’t trust her. at all.

a flying bridgeman, Shallan, PLEASE

he’s a flying captain of the guard, at the very least.

nooo

NOOO

NO I DON’T WANT THIS

NOW I HAVE TO DEAL WITH FUCKING AMARAM THAT RAT BASTARD ALL THE TIME????? NOOO

NOOOOO

IALAI NO. YOU COULD HAVE JUST TAKEN OVER YOU’RE SMART ENOUGH YOU COULD HAVE BEEN THE FIRST HIGHPRINCESS AND IT WOULD HAVE BEEN AWFUL BUT ALSO AWESOME BUT NO. NO YOU HAD TO JUST DRAG FUCKING AMARAM THAT RAT BASTARD INTO THIS.

I DON’T WANT THIS TAKE IT BACK, BRANDON.

“Highprince.” “Highprince.” “Bastard.” GOD BLESS ADOLIN, BOY WONDER.

oohhhhhh Adooolliinn. babe, you can’t just--okay. there is is. The Thing.

Shallan. “Oh.” UH HUH. OKAY THEN. SO MUCH FOR THAT SECRET though it wasn’t really a secret. just a miscommunication. but still. I sort of wish that Kaladin had been able to tell Shallan himself about Helaran--though, he still didn’t know it was Helaran.

But there would have been something satisfying in that being just...between the two of them. Them working that out and him probably apologizing and her probably not forgiving him and there would just be. delightful angst before they eventually decided to be friends. But Adolin telling her gives her time to prepare, I guess? for seeing Kaladin again? I still don’t think she’s going to forgive him which will make for veerryyy interesting dynamics when he returns.

Listen, I just really wanted Shallan to pull her Blade on Kaladin, and have him trying to avoid her attacks while apologizing a lot even though he was perfectly in his rights to defend his at-the-time commanding officer from a threat. That would have been delicious angst.

Hopefully she doesn’t hate Adolin for being the messenger, though...

“Everything would have been better off if he’d just let Amaram die.” TRUER WORDS, ADOLIN. tbh, how much do you think Kaladin thinks about that very exact same thought? The answer is: A FREAKING LOT

well, shit. destroying the Oathgate seems a reasonable option, but also it’s gonna make saving the world a heck of a lot harder...

I wonder...if they’d had literally anyone else do the negotiations, if this would be going differently. People know Dalinar, they know he’s the Blackthorn, or used to be, and they don’t know him well enough to know how much he’s changed. If the Blackthorn had come to me and been like, “yo, I want to open a portal to your city center and send you soldiers to help you rebuild” I would ALSO assume he was going to invade my city and try to conquer me and I would also refuse him. But like...if Shallan or someone completely unconnected had tried, I’d be a little more likely? to agree? Idk I feel like they are definitely being hindered by Dalinar’s reputation here.

Just don’t let Taravangian do it. Don’t let him do anything. Oh god.

“a unified Vorin coalition” OH GOOD NOW IT’S A RELIGIOUS WAR. or an Inquisition. Nobody expects the Vorin Inquisition.

I love that Dalinar just....knows how to do shit. Like, Kaladin and Shallan have been practicing and had training sessions with their spren to figure out their powers and even Lift is REALLY BAD at Friction, and Dalinar’s just like. Adhesion. Got it. No problem.

aaaAAAHHH Dalinar holding Oathbringer again and it’s...not screaming it’s whimpering and I’M. SAD. ABOUT A SWORD. DANGIT.

DON’T GIVE HIM THE SWORD. AMARAM DOESN’T DESERVE A SWORD. DON’T DO THAT

okay, but Amaram calling Dalinar a hypocrite is like... POTS AND KETTLES, MY DUDE.

Taravangian: “I sound like a madman, don’t I?” No, you sound like a man for whom the ends justify the means.

Here’s the thing: I see the practicality in Taravangian’s stance. There’s always a practicality in sacrificing a few good ones to get rid of all the bad ones. And yeah, Dalinar’s desire to always save all the good ones, even if it means sparing the bad ones, is just a tad idealistic. But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t try. Idealism is never something that we should give up on, is never something we should ignore or stop working towards. We shouldn’t always have to settle for practicality.

hoooo cool. The Stormfather can just...send Dalinar to other people in visions wth that’s really cool. Like a Kyprioth/Aly situation except the destination person knows they’re there.

“Shallan had nothing to do, but Veil was useful.” No, Shallan. You’re useful. You are Veil. It’s not. It’s not a different person. It’s just you adsfghjkl just. YOU’RE ALICE, PARKER. GOD.

“Veil liked watching people. She shared that with Shallan.” THAT’S BECAUSE YOU’RE THE SAME PERSON. YOU ARE ALICE.

omg, I love that Pattern just...brought both Kholin bros and all of Bridge Four.

“go do something stupid without letting me watch” OMG PATTERN, BBY.

I have missed Bridge Four, hello darlings

THEY’RE JOKING WITH RENARIN AND HE’S SMILING AND THEY’RE FRIENDS AND I’M SO HAPPY AAHH

THIS IS SO CUTE I LOVE THEM AAH

omg, I didn’t realize there was a staircase, I thought they were just going to be jumping into a void.

dear god, roshar has a Sisyphus equivalent that’s delightful.

sooo, I’m assuming that’s...Odium, Honor, and Cultivation in those mosaics? I’m genuinely amused that Shallan thinks they’re “pagan symbols”

Bridge Four took point even though there were two Shardbearers and an extra Radiant and MY BBYS I LOVE THEM I LOVE THEM SO MUCH

NOPE

NOPPPPPEEEE

NOOOOOOOOOOPPPEEEEE

DON’t DIE?

DON’T DIIIIIIEEEE

I DID NOT SIGN UP FOR THIS HORROR NOVEL SHIT

NOOOOPE

ADOLIN NO! YOU STORMING FOOL DO NOT CHARGE THE DARKNESS UNMADE EVIL THING WHAT THE FUCK NO

NOOO

I’M OUT

BYE

if any of Bridge Four die, so help me, I will drive back to Utah and yell at Brandon personally. To his face.

NOOOPPE THIS IS CREEEEPPY AS FUUUCKK WHAT THE NOPE

ooohh Renarin’s a good, he’s healing them, that’s my boy

okay, the illusory army is preTTY DANG COOL GET IT GIRL

but also the Unmade thing is freaking terrifying and I’m nope

...I’m assuming that since Dalinar saw nine shadows and the champion that there’s one Unmade for each of the ten orders of Radiants? LIke, this one, the Midnight Mother can be directly countered by Lightweaving. So maybe another one is designed to be defeated by Windrunners or Elsecallers or whatever. And it’s one for each?

I genuinely love that the new Radiant’s don’t call their swords Shardblades. It’s Sylblade, Glysblade, Patternblade. I love it.

“Adolin [...] charged into the room, bursting right through the middle of an illusion of his father.” Well, ain’t that just storming appropriate. How beautifully poetic.

also, Adolin and Renarin fighting back to back is A LOT AND I’M LOVE THEM

ooohh my god, it’s trying to bond with her?? trying to rip Pattern away and bond with her that’s... YIKES.

oohhh shit....corrupted creationspren. ooohhhh my god.

Odium, why you gotta ruin everything good in this world, you jerk

ooh...it was...bound. by a Lightweaver. bound like the Parshendi’s gods? like the parshmen? how are we binding people? I’m getting the idea that maybe binding people is bad.

I’m getting the idea that Ishar is bad. but that’s a theory for another time.

okay, so...the pashmen weren’t...going to Kholinar. they were going to a tiny city a week’s walk from Hearthstone...to...besiege it? why

what. is. happening.

also omg Kaladin’s never been to a real city, someone take this child on a sightseeing vacation, asap.

how...did they take the city and what...are they gonna do with it?? I’m all for giving them land and lives but I’m worried about stormform. and voidbringers. and a lot of things.

the parshmen calling him Kal is murdering my soul

oooh noooooooooo there’s a highstorm coming and the people are all outside and the parshmen are camping, and I...am worried.

Yixli? that’s a terrible name. though I guess she’s a questionably evil spren of odium, so.

Fused? okay, that’s a fun word for Stormform.

Kal, babe, you need to get out of there.

Ah. Good choice.

Syl whacking at the gloryspren and telling them “Mine!” about Kaladin is FRIKKIN ADORABLE HI I LOVE SYL

of course it’s all perception, Kaladin, everything is different if you change your point of view. That’s what makes being a person so difficult.

“Treat them better than they treated you.” AMEN. THAT’S THE ONLY WAY THINGS GET BETTER.

it’s hard and it sucks a lot, but it’s the only way.

oh shit

oh sHIT

what. dark stormlight? what the?

SHIT

THERE’S LIKE, THREE OF THEM?

okay, only two. buT STILL

Why can they do Lashings? do sotrmform voidbringers whatever the fuck they are have Radiant orders too? WHAT IS HAPPENING

“You can’t save all of them.” BUT HE’S DAMN WELL GOING TO TRY

HE’S SO GOOD

SO GOOD

WHAT

THAT’S?? MAGICAL. WHAT. MAGIC WINDSPREN SHIELD????? CAN HE DO THIS NORMALLY OR IS THE STORMFATHER HELPING OR?? WHAT

omg, just...deposit him in front of Urithiru. That’s convenient. Why thanks.

YAAAASSSS

SHE’S HERE!!!!!

SHE’S BACK!!!!!!!!!

SHE’S HEEERRRREEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

YEESSSSSS

me: can I squeeze the interludes onto this part of liveblog? also me: *scrolls up to the top of this post forever me: Maaayyybe not.

#op #Megan reads OB #Oathbringer spoilers #ladyknightliveblogs #aaaahhh there is sooo much happening and so much left to happen and aaAAHH #oh hey I've now finished the preview novel--sorry the preview chapters #whoo hoo!!#Stormlight Archive #Oathbringer #Brandon Sanderson

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