#viserys ii x daena

[sarcasticsweetlara]

Daena should have been the mother of Daeron II the Good Targaryen

Crédits to @wweskywalker

Daena was the true embodiment of a Targaryen.

I think if Viserys had married Daena before Baelor had the chance to lock her away, Daena could have had the chance to see the bigger picture of how to govern, and while trying to get justice for Daeron I Targaryen, like asking for the heads of the people who killed him and retribution from every Dornish House as the weight of every hostage on gold, and then Daena could have made the very same deal of betrothing Daeron II and Myriah Martell and later that of Daenerys and Maron, while betrothing Rhaena to a Marcher Lord, like a Lord of House Oakheart, to balance the alliances with Dorne and the Marches. The Oakhearts were a family that respected peace and liked the Faith and they would have treated Rhaena well.

They could have sent Baelor to a Sept where he could not bother anyone and therefore everyone would be happier.

Daena could have kept using the crown of her mother and thus it would've stayed within House Targaryen, and there would not have been Blackfyre Rebellions.

...

I imagine Daena convincing Daeron to let her marry Viserys and wanting to court and be courted by Viserys before marrying him, and then in the second year of their marriage they can have Daeron (in honor of her beloved brother/his eldest nephew), followed by Aegon (a more respectful and actual smart Aegon; and to honor Daena's father/Viserys' brother), Aemon the Dragon Knight, and Daenerys.

Rhaena could have had two daughters: Naerys and Visaella (we can be safe the name Naerys was used before the Conquest as it was considered a significant Targaryen name for Naerys to compensate for the Rogare blood in her in ASOIAF; and the name Visaella is possible as a variant of the name Visenya/Viserra).

Daeron would still marry Myriah Martell, and Daenerys to Maron.

Naerys and Aemon would marry and have a daughter Aerea Targaryen who would marry into House Dondarrion and become the mother of Kiera Dondarrion, the wife of Valarr Targaryen, and later Daeron The Drunken Targaryen.

Whereas Visaella could marry into House Dayne and be the mother of Dyanna Dayne.

(Rhaena was a scholar, but it's probable she developed agoraphobia after being stuck in the Maidenvault for so long; and she deserves to be part of the line of Azor Ashai.)

Aegon could have married Melissa Blackwood and have had Mya, Gwenys and Brynden, and through a relationship with Serenei have Shiera, who would be legitimized out of love and not to spite anyone; he could work as a Hand for his brother, and be a good person, and given his hard and long time working as a Hand for his brother and later his nephew Aerys, Aegon was legitimately known and recognized as Aegon IV "The Helpful".

Peace with Dorne would be done and steadfast.

Daena by Viserys' side would take wise decisions and consider the option to avenge Daeron but still work to have peace.

And it would be interesting because if they rule together it's completely different to how it was with her grandparents/his parents but still important; because with Rhaenyra and Daemon it was Rhaenyra the one taking decisions while Daemon enacted them, now it is shared by Daena and Viserys through a double claim. You can see the parallels to Henry VII and Elizabeth of York or Ferdinand II and Isabella of Castile.

And also, because Aegon III and Daenaera, and Daena above everything deserved to be in the main line of Azor Ashai, and because Viserys really deserved someone better than the abusive daughter of his kidnapper as a wife who left him in a very vulnerable position. Larra left when Viserys was becoming an adult who was wiser now and more mature as well, and when also her family had regained some of their riches, how convenient.

In this scenario Daenerys would look like her greatx4grandmothers Daena and Rhaena - it's nothing against Naerys, but we have to erase her since Larra would never have married Viserys, because it's possible part of the reason why Viserys didn't spend so much time with Aegon IV, Aemon and Naerys was because they looked like Larra; Aegon like Larra and Lysandro, - Viserys' biggest abusers - Aemon like Larra in a softer way, and Naerys like Larra and Viserys himself, an eternal reminder of what he went through with Larra.

Larra Rogare and her family only brought grief to Viserys' life, and while she may not have had another choice but leave her children behind, it is interesting to see Larra only returned to Lys once her older brother Moredo was able to get some of their old possessions back.

Maybe in other circumstances the relationship of Viserys and Larra could have been different but it was not, and Daena would have been perfect together, a reminder of Rhaenyra and Daemon.

[sarcasticsweetlara]

Honestly, I think Viserys II should have married Daena.

If Viserys had spent his youth traveling around Westeros and Essos, and then come back to fall in love and court Daena; that way his line and the line of Aegon III would have been joined

“daena was targaryen to the bone; strong, beautiful, willful.”

[thatscruelsummer]

queen daenaera

[linaartsblogsworld]

Aegon III and Viserys ii Reunion

“ King Aegon began to weep, throwing himself upon this boy in a fierce embrace. Oakenfist's "tresure" was Viserys Targaryen, the kings's lost brother, the youngest son of Queen Rhaenyra and Prince Daemon.. missing for nigh unto five years”.

[thhouseofblack]

hyperfixation had such a major comeback that i wrote yet another viserys ii x daena the defiant fic~

To Defy Is To Dare

To Be The Forbidden Fruit of Your Attraction

[nogoodsheepstealing-greatgrandma]

Add that what Jaehaerys did wasn't setting the precedent that a son comes before a daughter. What Jaehaerys did was set the precedent that the next available male relative comes before a daughter. Which goes against all laws and traditions of both the Andals and the First Men - a brother may come before a sister, but all the children of the firstborn son come before the secondborn son.

Prince Aemon's only child, regardless of gender, comes before his brother Baelon, and certainly before his nephew Viserys. Aemon's line comes before Baelon's line.

Likewise:

Rickard Karstark's daughter Alys Karstark comes before his uncle Arnolf Karstark.

Hoster Tully's daughter Catelyn Tully comes before his brother Brynden Tully.

Tywin Lannister's daughter Cersei Lannister comes before his brother Kevan Lannister.

Jonnel Stark only became Lord of Winterfell by marrying his niece Sansa Stark (her sister Serena was then the rightful heir - hopefully we'll learn more about her and her children if GRRM ever publishes The She-Wolves of Winterfell).

And, most crucially, Prince Aegon the Uncrowned's daughters Aerea and Rhaella both come before his younger brother Jaehaerys. By all rights Rhaena should have been serving as regent until her daughters came of age.

To be fair to Jaehaerys, he himself was only 14 when he was crowned. The decision was more his mother and stepfather's - who ruled as Regent and Hand respectively. Rogar Baratheon was the one to dismiss Rhaena as Queen on the grounds that 'this is not Dorne' - and he certainly did not want her to be Regent:

Moreover, Lord Rogar and Queen Alyssa both feared what might befall the realm should Rhaena Targaryen return from the west to act as regent for a daughter. Though none dared speak of it, it was plain that discord had arisen between the two queens, for the daughter had neither attended her mother’s wedding nor invited her to her own. And there were some who went further and whispered that Rhaena was a sorceress, who had used the dark arts to murder Maegor upon the Iron Throne. Therefore it was incumbent upon King Jaehaerys to marry and beget a son as soon as possible.

And sure enough, when Rogar Baratheon found his stepson to be too unmalleable* he turned to trying to kidnap Aerea then Rhaella to rule through one of them instead. *(...by marrying his sister... though again to be fair to them, their stepfather was trying to marry Alysanne off to his own brother at the time - which makes it ironic that they grew up to marry their own daughters off to old men)

So while I don't hold a 14-year-old Jaehaerys responsible for usurping his nieces... it's safe to say he was trying to retroactively legitimise his own rule by first passing over Daenerys in favour of Aemon, then passing over Aemon's daughter Rhaenys in favour of Baelon.

Jaehaerys may also have been trying to clear his conscience over Aerea running away. Aerea had a happy life in Kings Landing when she was the heir - her misery on Dragonstone was a casualty of both being displaced as heir and of the tensions and resentments between her mother and uncle. In another life Aerea would have been Queen, and spared a horrible gruesome fate.

And so Jaehaerys tried to assuage his guilt and legitimise his rule - and did so in a manner that forced Rhaenys to accept the outcome peacefully, while also washing his hands clean of having to directly dishonour his firstborn son by leaving it to the Lords. Even though it was blindingly obvious what the misogynistic outcome of the Great Council would be, which is why Rhaenys tried the tactic of promoting her son this time instead of herself.

Meanwhile the fact that Viserys was Jaehaerys' preferred choice of heir was so clear to all that when Ellard Stark voted for Rhaenys it was speculated that he did so out of resentment towards Jaehaerys:

Later still, it was said that the Starks were bitter at the Old King and Queen Alysanne for having forced them to carve away the New Gift and give it the Night’s Watch; this may be one reason for why Lord Ellard Stark sided with Corlys Velaryon and Princess Rhaenys at the Great Council of 101 AC.

While there may be some truth to this speculation, it could also be that Ellard Stark was simply following existing law and custom by supporting Rhaenys. Add that Alysanne is remembered more fondly in the North than Jaehaerys, and was also angrily vocal in supporting Rhaenys. Either way, the fact is that a vote for Rhaenys was interpreted as a vote against Jaehaerys.

However because Jaehaerys didn't want to dirty his hands (factoring in the continued existence of an angry dragon-riding Rhaenys and the fact that Alysanne's ghost would have come back to haunt him), he didn't actually codify the result of the Great Council into law. He certainly set a damaging precedent, that likely emboldened Jeyne Arryn's male relatives to challenge her rule, but it wasn't written into law that the next available male relative inherits*.

*Hence why even after the Dance, female claimants were still at least considered, even if they were ultimately passed over in favour of the next male relative, and not just by appealing to the supposed precedent of the Great Council (though that and general misogyny undoubtedly played a role).

Daena and her sisters were the rightful heirs ahead of their uncle Viserys II and his children, but their captivity meant they had few allies, and Viserys II had been de facto running the kingdom for years. Aelora was meanwhile still the heir after Aelor's death, until her own death. We don't yet know Daenora's status at the Great Council of 233 AC yet, if she was even alive, but her and Aerion's son was passed over due to his infancy and fears of him inheriting his father's madness. Vaella was also a child and probably mentally disabled, while Aegon the Unlikely was a 33 year-old father of 5. He was frankly the more reliable choice.

(It will be interesting if F&B Part 2 reveals that Daenora was alive and the rightful Queen, if not regent, but again even Rhaenys tried the tactic of promoting her son at the Great Council instead of herself, in the face of rampant misogyny).

As for Rhaenyra not being officially recognised as Queen post-Dance... for the first 6 years you can attribute that to the regency, most prominently Green Unwin Peake, who was a misogynist and explicitly wanted to make sure Baela wasn't the heir. The following Hands then had... more pressing priorities occupying their time. Torrhen Manderly for instance was carefully planning the King's royal progress to make sure Green supporters wouldn't be alienated - right down to making sure Daenaera would be wearing green if Aegon wore black, and vice versa. See also the prospect of Baela being queen igniting concerns due to her role in almost killing Aegon the Usurper. If that caused concern, you can bet listing Rhaenyra as a Queen would have been deprioritised. By the time the regency was over, Aegon III was famously a depressed shell and mainly concerned with 'full bellies and dancing bears'. So no, his failure to list Rhaenyra as Queen rather than Princess was not a recognition of the Green's cause on his part.

The thing is, you can draw a number of other precedents from the Great Council. One, that the King has the right to choose his preferred successor (again, Jaehaerys was widely perceived to have favoured Viserys). Two, that the King has the right to overturn existing laws and customs.

If the custom that a daughter comes before an uncle (or male cousin) can be overturned, then why not the custom that a brother comes before a sister? If you can overturn custom to crown a man, why not to crown a woman?

Which leaves Aegon the Usurper with no legal basis for his coup. He can't legitimately appeal to custom and tradition, because according to custom and tradition his own father wasn't even the rightful king anyway. That would be Rhaenys, followed by Laenor and his children, followed by Laena and her children. Since Rhaenyra's son Jacaerys is officially Laenor's son, and is betrothed to Laena's daughter Baela anyway, custom and tradition is on Team Black's side.

Meanwhile Aegon the Usurper can't really appeal to the Great Council's decision to crown his father, because doing so means recognising that the King has the right to overturn custom and tradition in favour of his preferred heir. Which means Viserys has the right to name Rhaenyra his heir. Which means the Great Council is also on Team Black's side.

I really dislike when I see people say that King Viserys had no right to change the laws and traditions of Westeros by making Rhaenyra his heir. They really have no idea what they're talking about when they say that. Rulers - kings and queens - create and change laws and traditions. If King Jaehaerys could officially set the precedent of sons coming before daughters then King Viserys had the right to undo it.

It's not even like it was the first time a Targaryen had changed any traditions in Westeros. The Conquerors came along, took over the land, and made multiple changes, such as outlawing certain Westerosi traditions such as making it so men could strike their wives only a certain number of times instead of beating them to death. King Jaehaerys created an entire doctrine allowing Targaryens to continue practicing incest even though that was against the tradition in Westeros. Queen Alysanne abolished The First Night, an ancient tradition in Westeros. I truly have no idea where this notion comes from that Viserys had no right to change anything. He was the most powerful man in Westeros, what do you mean he had no right? If he wanted to shake up tradition then that was his right to do so as king.

Just take a look at real life historical kings and queens, emperors, etc. Many of them changed things that previous rulers had implemented, they changed laws and traditions that existed for a long time. I mean King Henry VIII established a whole new church just so he could get a divorce and did many things to diminish the Catholic Church's influence because he was king, he could do that. Then his daughter Queen Mary came along and tried to undo what her father did and then Queen Elizabeth I came after her and reversed her reforms because kings and queens could change whatever they wanted and undo whatever they wanted.

So yeah King Viserys was well within his right to decide to make his daughter heir over his son. He was well within his right as king to change a precedent a previous king had set.

I don't know if people who say he had no right to do what he did are just used to most monarchies today being only symbolic in nature with not much power or what but most monarchies in history could do and change what they wanted because they had absolute power. House Targaryen had absolute power, meaning King Viserys could do what he wanted and if what he wanted was to make Rhaenyra his heir then he could do that. I've seen people argue that his word isn't law but yes it is.

[horizon-verizon]

Helaena & Aegon's Relationship -- A Book Reader Explaining How They Got Some Truths or Conclusions Out of an Unreliable Narrator/Account

Also can be found on Twitter HERE.

*HEADCANON*

Art Credit by fkaluis

There's really no reason to think that F&B is unreliably telling/twisting this moment, as this part is told through Munkun/Orwyle, Orwyle who was there to witness Alicent putting out this search party for Aegon to get him quickly crowned.

QUOTE of Helaena about Aegon's Whereabouts (in case pic below is illegible, not sure about pic quality)

Yes, Orwyle was writing to paint himself as non-complicit/innocuous as possible to avoid execution during his imprisonment.

Yes, Helaena is reported to be a "pleasant", seemingly non-confrontational person.

Yes, there is the possibility that he wasn't in the room when Helaena answered the searchers.

However, again, what we know of Aegon, his raping, his philandering, the fact he wasn't present and in the room with Helaena and had to be looked for maybe a few hours before being found and then found with a 12-year-old (he was in his early 20s), speaks volumes about their relationship alone. We do not hear anything that shows Aegon was even involved in his kids' development or nurturing or hung out with them, just because.

Meanwhile we absolutely, at least, know that Viserys kept Rhaenyra close to him at the feast while Aemma was alive, & even more so after he named her heir. (Viserys has got his own parenting issues even with Rhaenyra, but he was definitely loving towards Aemma & Rhaenyra and was present. Rhaenyra would have remembered him as putting in that parental effort).

We absolutely know that Baela and Rhaena, Aegon III and Viserys II & all the Velaryon boys were close with, trusted, or worshipped Daemon by:

Jace trusting him with Dragonstone and the Seeds

no would-have-been-used-against-Daemon rumor; not even rumors of contention between any of them (same guy -Daemon- that people feared? Plz they'd be talking)

Baela being described as the female version of Daemon, or her going through mourning him by being "wild" as Aegon's council saw it

Rhaena herself having Daemon's fire (fear of reaction to her 1st husband's death, love for attention, etc)

Aegon III likely naming his daughter after him & Daena naming her son (the Blackfyre) after her grandfather Daemon (indicates Aegon expressed his love for Daemon to her)

And there is absolutely no indication that Aegon II's relationship with Helaena mirrored anything like Jaehaerys x Alysanne/Daemon x Rhaenyra/Alyssa x Baelon/Aemon x Jocelyn/Rhaenys x Corlys. The Targ/Valyrian couples have the most romantic stories of the ASoIaF universe (as told by narrative).

Even in the more contentious couples' (of my list) earliest, most romantic years. Not a one. No reports of longing glances, hushed conversations ignoring the rest of the room as if they were in a bubble, screams of pleasure, tender arm holding, flying their dragons together, no famous words of affection or appreciation of the other's attributes. Nothing.

And Helaena being a "pleasant" person does not negate the ability to establish boundaries, fight back when alarmed/annoyed/feeling intruded on, or had some Targaryen pride herself. Or have some self-possession.

So really, we absolutely can & should take as fact, that Helaena said what I quoted about Aegon not being in her bed.

QUOTE of Helaena before Jaehaerys' Death

Aegon & Helaena, despite some people's insistence, were never close & were never in love & were never a true couple. And Aegon was never a good father, nor a good husband or person all on his own merit.

Anyway, back to the prime point: we as readers have managed to understand characters, their motivations, relationships, etc even though the entire account of the Dance and before the Dance/war IS made up of many sources w/agendas 7 biases before we look at "So Spake Martin"/"The Citadel 'ASoIaF' Archive"--or anything like those--websites.

But of course, some people already know & acknowledge some FACTS about these characters from these sources, but will thump their way into ad-hominems and divergent tangents just to avoid it & affirm themselves.

[martellspear]

Why Aegon IV was a piece of shit?

-Born as the eldest of his generation, Aegon was the eldest son of Viserys II and Larra Rogare, being followed by his siblings Aemon and Naerys and his cousins Daeron, Baelor, Daena, Rhaena and Elaena. There is no mention of him being fostered anywhere, so his role models were his father Viserys (a workaholic who was always busy running Westeros) and his uncle Aegon III (a melancholic man who was avoidant of affection and could spend days without speaking to anyone). To rub salt in the wound, his mother Larra leaves when he is 4 years old, dying decades later, without closing the emotional wound she left on him (which explains his deplorable attitude towards women (specially Naerys because not only they were diametrically opposites in personality, but also tied to the schemes of his father Viserys, who he hated), he abandons them before they leave him, because she taught him to associate women with abandonment and hurt).

-He expected to be the guide of the Targaryen generations, so he trained hard with weaponry and wit (and to be the best)....yet he ended up being upstaged by his younger relatives: Daeron was a charismatic and popular general, Baelor had the love of the people because of his piety and Aemon was a preternaturally skilled warrior. Hungry for recognition and starved from affection, Aegon employed himself in the arts of seduction....and the rest is history.

Just wanted to say that I first read it as "Aegon VI" and my heart stopped for a moment 😹.

Aegon IV is the definition of "men in westeros should start their life at the night's watch and prove their way out". And I'm sure that if we wanted, we could make a longer list than that haha. Even though I'm not going to list all the other reasons, I'd like to add the tourney thing he almost did with Naerys (and everything he did to her, tbh). He's NASTY.

Seriously now, since we've been talking parallels for a while: Robert Baratheon x Aegon IV - the vigorous, handsome man, that loves hunting and has a bright future ahead of him but ends up being the opposite of what he was "supposed to be"; also, both are unfit to rule.

[juliaswickcrs]

My current hyperfixations OC-wise

(In case you any to ask questions)

HOTD:

Allyria Sand: Aegon II x OC. Dornish. Enemies to lovers. Team Black, eventually Team Green. Will kill you but melts at the first sign of affection.

Alysanne Targaryen: Cregan Stark x OC. Eldest daughter of Alicent and Viserys. Arranged marriage to lovers. Dragonrider. Pure cinnamon roll too good for this world.

Daena Velaryon: Vaemond’s eldest and only daughter. Heir to Driftmark. Hostage of the crown. Aemond Targaryen x OC. Dragonrider. Angry bean.

(Yes I did use all three of my WOT girlies what about it?)

[sarcasticsweetlara]

After Visenya, Daena is the most popular choice because she has pure Valyrian blood (Targaryen and Velaryon) and my headcanon is that she would receive a dragon egg from the ones her aunt Rhaena had been gifted by Rhaenyra and that she would name it Bloodfyre; and well, yeah, we can all agree that if not Visenya it would be nice to see him with Daena and see another version of Daemon and Rhaenyra without war and in a healthy environment.

And other than Daena or Visenya, Ellyn is a good choice in my opinion, a great-granddaughter of Alyssa Velaryon.

Daena x Viserys II😏

I just love how most of y'all reading my fic only ship Baby Aegon with Daenaera but ship Viserys II with almost every woman alive or yet to be born from his sisters to his nieces to Baratheon girls etc 😂😂😂 Dude would have a harem if it was up to y'all!

This being said, they do be uncle and niece, and Daena do clearly had daddy issues so... yeah I would read it 😌

[princeofdragonstone]

Who are your favourite targaryen couples

hii

let’s start with the originals, aegon x rhaenys x visenya obviously 💋 they formed westeros into one, they made westeros better and could not do so without one another. the dragon must have three heads after all, and no other throuple is topping them ✨

aenys i and alyssa — now i didn’t think of them as one of my favourite couples before, but now that i think about it i love the respect and loyalty they had for each other. they had perfect children, i love each and every one of them. though it’s such a shame that alyssa remarried to # that person out of all people (i’m glad rhaena gave him what he deserved tho!!) and i felt so sad for her when she missed the affection aenys was showing her while being married to rogar. she deserved so much better than that man, aenys might not have been a good king but he’s def was a better man than THAT man.

jaehaerys and alysanne — now, their relationship had so many flaws and they had much to grief but they did truly love each other. they lost so many children which i absolutely hate :( and the lost children played a huge part on their relationship. (i mean most of them were created just to give them a harsh life but we ignore that) the start of their relationship is just perfect, them marrying secretly and showing up in front of their mother (and # THAT man) ?? we had to stan

baelon and alyssa — do i have to explain? the purest relationship in f&b its confirmed. baelon did NOT even glance at any other woman after her death. they were the original malewife & girlboss couple it’s true 💘💘

daemon and rhaenyra — now, they might have given so many people heart attack when they got married in secret, (like viserys lolz) but they’re just too iconic to not be one of my favourites. they’ve been making alicent mad since day 1 💋 maybe daemon wasn’t the most stable person in westeros but he still died for his queen at the end and i love that

rhaenys and corlys — corlys might annoy me sometimes �� but i believe he did love her (i just wish # that incident didn’t happen) i just shipped them so much then the old man had to go ruin it like that

aegon iii and daenaera — i can’t say much about them but definitely one of the cutest couples out there, thank R’hllor for them

aemon and naerys — now, i don’t believe that naerys and aemon had an affair behind aegon’s back or anything, but i believe they did love each other. they just didn’t act upon their feelings because of duty :((

brynden and shiera — i feel like i’m praising them too much but i can’t help it 😭 they balance each other out and they’re it for me!!!

jaehaerys and shaera — i can’t say much about them and wasn’t actually gonna put them on here, but they said fuck everyone and married each other instead, daemon and rhaenyra’s spirit 100% possessed them on this one 😭

also honourable mentions: viserys ii and larra (i don’t exactly ship them bc we know so little, but their relationship seems interesting)

daeron i and daena (again, this is kind of a crackship but like viserys and larra they seem interesting, especially knowing how much daena valued and loved daeron

i can’t think of anyone else rn but i’m sure there’s more 😭 and also snowstorm is #1 for me this is just historical targaryens

[sarcasticsweetlara]

hiii, i have seen lot of ideas where the dance never happens like rhaenyra having a succesful reign, happy marriage life for jace-baela/ luke-rhaena. i think it would be funny if viserys run away to lys in a saera style for the drama, well my point is i like your au's so i wanted to know if you have headcanons for team black where the dance of the dragons never happened

There are many scenarios I could think of, actually...

And it depends how you want to see it because there are things that if erased creates more advantages and new situations, but could still stop the war.

1. Alicent accepts Rhaenyra's proposal of betrothing Jace and Helaena.

And Baela is betrothed to a Velaryon cousin (not a son of Vaemond due his infamy of wanting to take Driftmark from Corlys and his line), like a grandson of Malentine Velaryon (Magnus Velaryon; the Velaryons are greatly inspired by the Nordics; the son of Viggo Velaryon son of Malentine Velaryon) to support the claim of Lucerys and back him

<<Read more below>>

With Helaena becoming Queen consort she gives legitimacy to Jace's reign as well as Alicent getting her daughter as Queen consort, and with Baela being a backbone with the Velaryons then Luke will receive support as the Lord of Driftmark with Rhaena as Lucerys' wife as well; Jace's children could marry Baela's children and Joffrey as well marries one of the daughters of Baela to further legitimize his line.

Baela would be a lady-in-waiting for Helaena, and together they would arrange the betrothal of their children.

2. Jace marries Baela (now Daemon sees his daughter as Queen), Lucerys still marries Rhaena, and the children of Luke and Rhaena marry the children of Joff.

Now, in all of the scenarios present Aegon III would marry Daenaera as an alliance (they would always marry each other), and Viserys II would marry his niece Daena <<Daena deserved to become The Queen and be the mother of Daeron II and Daenerys, and of the whole dynasty>> to unite their bloodlines; and if baby Visenya survives, then Viserys would marry her (the original plan of Martin), and their son would marry their niece Daena to once again unite the bloodline with Daena being Queen and having her uncle and aunt as Hand and counselors.

3. Other possible scenario but this time after Rhaenyra: Aegon the Younger calls for a High Council once Rhaenyra dies peacefully, and he is chosen as king as the oldest legitimate son of Rhaenyra (Jace would no longer have the protection of Rhaenyra), Baela gets to marry Magnus Velaryon, and she becomes the Lady of Driftmark as a consort (we know Corlys would never choose her, but he could choose a great-great-nephew he liked), while Rhaena marries Corwyn Corbray, and Viserys would still marry either Visenya or Daena; but even then Aegon III would have mercy and spare the lives of Jace, Luke and Joffrey, and they would be married off to minor ladies.

Honestly, in the second and third scenarios I have to admit I think Aegon would eventually reach for the Throne because legitimately it is his.

...

Anyways, Rhaena's children would marry Baela's children, and Rhaena and Baela would be councilors to both Aegon III and Viserys II Targaryen.

I think it would be nice to see Daena or Visenya matching Viserys' fire and having a partner who is an equal and loves and supports him since he would be spared being a hostage of three different Lyseni families that threatened him and also would spare Westeros of the Rogare family, Aegon the Unworthy and the Blackfyre Rebellions.

Either way any of these relationships would mirror that of Baelon and Alyssa or Daemon and Rhaenyra.

But beyond that, Baela would be happy to become Lady of Driftmark, this time in a happy marriage, and would have a husband devoted to her; she would name her first daughter in honor of her mother and first son in honor of her grandfather Corlys; and Laena would be the one through whom House Velaryon's main line would continue.

Rhaena would be free of the pressure of providing an heir quickly and therefore her first baby would be born, and would be able to use her dragon to quell the protestors against Joffrey Arryn (the heir of Jeyne Arryn) and Corwyn would live and they could have together the six daughters Rhaena had in canon and through them be the great-grandparents of Aelinor Penrose.

Baela would always introduce Daenaera to Aegon III, and Rhaena would take Viserys II on travels to Dragonstone and the whole realm on the back of Morning.

Once Viserys II comes back, (if Visenya is not alive) Daena would meet him and they would fall in love and marry.

Baela's favorite niece would be Daena, followed by the daughters of her sister Rhaena, whereas Rhaena's favorite niece would be her little namesake.

Without the trauma of Larra Rogare and the need to overcompensate due to their involvement, Viserys II would see the practicality in sending Baelor to a Sept and therefore there would be no Maidenvault, and no threat of a religious war with the Stepstones, the Iron Isles and the North, as well as no disbalance of taxes going to the High Septons.

Rhaenyra and Daemon would be able to meet their grandchildren and great-grandchildren, and if Rhaenyra's daughter survives, Rhaenyra would have loved spoiling her little princess.

If Baela and Rhaena's younger full-brother survives as well, this little boy called Aemon in honor of his great-grandfather, would be completely loyal to his half-brothers Aegon the Younger and Viserys, he would have a keep of his own in the Crownlands given by Rhaenyra so he doesn't compete against the Strong boys

But even then, Aemon would support his legitimate younger brother's birthright.

If Aemon lives, he would marry Maris Baratheon and that's one more ally for the Blacks.

Aemon would claim Grey Ghost itself or steal one of its eggs, he's the son of Daemon and Laena after all, and want to fight but he would be beat to it by Baela.

Aemon would be a male mini-Laena being as adventurous, smooth and demure as his mother, and his sisters would tell him stories about their mother.

Viserys would claim Vermithor and if Visenya lives, then she can claim Silverwing, and Daena and Rhaena could get one of the other dragon eggs of their aunt Rhaena, Elaena's egg could also hatch as well.

Baela would get a new dragon from one of the eggs of Morning as well.

Daemon would teach all of his sons how to fight and encourage them to embrace chaos.

Baela and Rhaena would spoil their little sister Visenya, and as Baela is a tomboy and Rhaena a girl's girl, I like to think Visenya would be kind of an introvert with a stylish witch vibe.

Viserys II would bring his mother many treasures he found on his travels.

And without the trauma of seeing Rhaenyra die, Aegon would proudly wear the crown of Rhaenyra and Daena would wear it as well.

And Visenya would get special tiaras for herself and Viserys as the second and third in command of Aegon III and later Daena.

And I guess these are my headcanons.

[goodqueenaly]

If the Dance of the Dragons is the Anarchy and the Baratheons are the Yorksh usurpation, did George RR Martin skip over the Lancastrian usurpation or was it Viserys II and Aegon IV succeeding the children of Aegon III? Also if you could rewrite the history to add it, would it be with the grandsons of Daeron II like Aerion Brighflame (Richard II) and Egg (Henry Iv) as cousins instead of brothers?

I probably sound like a broken record on this at this point, but nothing in ASOIAF is ever 1-1 with its historical (or what GRRM believes is historical) inspiration. Just as the Dance might have shades of the Anarchy while not actually being particularly accurate to the real-world Anarchy, so the Lancastrian takeover of the English throne is not specifically recreated in any one incident in ASOIAF but has certain echoes in different plotlines. For example, for a tyrannical king dispossessing a powerful cousin aristocrat, only to have that cousin lead a rebellion against him (which initially presented itself as an assertion of that aristocrat's rights, with the aristocrat then declaring himself king), see Aerys II and Robert Baratheon. For a male of a royal male line succeeding ahead of a more senior cousin (but whose royal descent came through a woman), see Viserys I and Laenor Velaryon. I wouldn't want to see the story recreate with absolute fidelity every single development of medieval English royal history, because at that point I might as well just read a real history book; I leave it to the author to take certain inspirations from history (or, again, what he thinks of as historical accuracy) while remixing them, adding his own creative flair and letting his natural talent for storytelling lead the way.

(I'm less convinced about any parallels with the succession of Viserys II, if only because neither Daena nor her sisters were ever formally acclaimed queens in their own right and had "few" supporters and allies calling for such. I'd be more willing to believe that if and when F&B Volume 2 gets into the question, it will involve the soon-to-be Viserys II playing the part of Maurice Druon's Philip of Poitiers - more on him below - who in Druon's depiction invented the Salic law to exclude women from the throne of France (although Viserys will benefit from having the in-world precedent of the Great Council of 101 AC and the post facto precedent of the Dance).)

As far as Daeron's grandsons go, I think the story works fine the way it is. Specifically, I'm very much convinced that GRRM is using the sons of Maekar - specifically, Daeron, Aerion, and Egg - to parallel Druon's depiction of the elder two sons of Philip the Fair, Louis X and the aforementioned Philip (eventually Philip V). In Daeron and Aerion, GRRM distributes some of the characteristics of Louis X: Daeron gets Louis' overall schlubby-ness, his lack of prepossessing physical features, and his daughter of uncertain dynastic prospects (with GRRM adding to the issue of female succession by replacing the question of Louis' daughter's legitimacy with Vaella's "simpleness"); Aerion gets Louis' tendency to cruelty (although Louis isn't as consistently violently sadistic as Aerion, he does torture and drown those servants he suspects as having been involved in his wife's extramarital affair, indirectly orders the murder of his wife, and often loses his temper) as well as his infant son (though Aerion at least lived long enough to see Maegor born, while Louis' son was posthumous). In Aegon, GRRM repeats Druon's obvious favoritism toward Philip V: Egg, like Philip, is the intelligent, thoughtful, good king who nevertheless dies "a lonely man ... misunderstood by his subjects" because they will not cooperate with his forward-thinking reforms. (This is why I also suspect that baby Maegor might die of natural causes but that Egg will be blamed, as a sort of twist on The Accursed King's plot where Philip indirectly orders and directly benefits from the murder of the infant King Jean and in due course becomes king himself.)

[linaartsblogsworld]

▪️𝑴𝑨𝑴𝑨'𝑺 𝑩𝑶𝒀𝑺 𝑺𝒆𝒓𝒊𝒆𝒔 :𝐑𝐡𝐚𝐞𝐧𝐲𝐫𝐚 𝐓𝐚𝐫𝐠𝐚𝐫𝐲𝐞𝐧 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐇𝐞𝐫 𝐁𝐨𝐲𝐬 ✨

[linaartsblogsworld]

Mother of Kings

[horizon-verizon]

I do believe a lot of Green stans are hypocrites when they call out show!Viserys for being a rapist but, at the same time, totally ignore Aegon doing the same thing to his sister wife Helaena because then they would also have to condemn their beloved Alicent for marrying them in the first place and forcing her own daughter to become a child bride. Instead they're even claiming Aegon is probably nice to his wife in private because their mother would NEVER allow him to hurt her. They say it's just team black stans claiming the opposite, that it's marital rape. Honestly, who would want their drunk husband forcefully having sex with them? I doubt that line from episode 8 is supposed to mean anything else. And what's more, I've also seen some of them complaining the show ruined their relationship by citing the book, saying there was probably love between them. What?? First of all Aegon was a rapist in the book as well (something most of them have never accepted to this day and never will), he was out there sexually harassing the castle's serving maids and raping girls as young as 12 years old. This is not the behavior of a loving and loyal husband, but one of a cheater who forces himself on women. Unless I'm missing something, there's no indication their arranged marriage became a loving one at all (especially in the show).

Link to Post about Who Arranges and/or is Responsible for Aegon & Helaena Marrying

Link to Post Talking about TV Helaena and Aegon, esp Supported by Episode 8 of Season 1

You're not missing anything about their book relationship. Helaena herself indicates that their marriage was a fluke:

Princess Helaena was breaking her fast with her children when the Kingsguard came to her…but when asked the whereabouts of Prince Aegon, her brother and husband, she said only, “He is not in my bed, you may be sure. Feel free to search beneath the blankets."

("The Blacks and the Greens")

There's really no reason to think that F&B is unreliably telling/twisting this moment, as this part is told through Munkun/Orwyle, Orwyle who was there to witness Alicent putting out this search party for Aegon to get him quickly crowned. Yes, Orwyle was writing to paint himself as non complicit/innocuous as possible to avoid execution during his imprisonment. Yes Helaena is reported to be a "pleasant", seemingly nonconfrontational person.

Yes there is the possibility that he wasn't in the room when Helaena answered the searchers. However, again, what we know of Aegon, his raping, his philandering, the fact he wasn't present and in the room with Helaena and had to be looked for for maybe a few hours before being found and then found with a 12 year old (he was in his early 20s), speaks volumes about their relationship alone. We do not hear anything that shows Aegon was even involved in his kids' development or nurturing, or hung out with them just because.

Meanwhile we absolutely, at least know, that Viserys kept Rhaenyra close to him at feast while Aemma was alive, and even more so after he named her heir. We absolutely know that Baela and Rhaena, Aegon III and Viserys II and all the Velaryon boys were close with, trusted, or worshipped Daemon by:

Jace trusting him with Dragonstone and the Seeds

no would-have-been-used-against-Daemon rumor; not even rumors of contention between any of them (same guy -Daemon- that people feared? Plz they'd be talking)

Baela being described as the female version of Daemon, or her going through mourning him by being "wild" as Aegon's council saw it

Rhaena herself having Daemon's fire (fear of reaction to her 1st husband's death, love for attention, etc)

Aegon III naming his daughter after her, and Daena naming her son after Daemon (indicates Aegon expressed his love for Daemon to her)

And there is absolutely no indication that Aegon II's relationship with Helaena mirrored anything like Jaehaerys x Alysanne/Daemon x Rhaenyra/Alyssa x Baelon/Aemon x Jocelyn/Rhaenys x Corlys. Even in the more contentious couples' earliest, most romantic years. Not a one. No reports of longing glances, hushed conversations ignoring the rest of the room as if they were in a bubble, screams of pleasure, tender arm holding, flying their dragons together, no famous words of affection or appreciation of the others' attributes. Nothing.

And Helaena being a "pleasant" person does not not negate the ability to establish boundaries, fight back when alarmed/annoyed/feeling intruded on, or had some Targ pride herself. Or have some self possession:

Blind to her danger, the queen appeared as dusk was settling over the castle, accompanied by her three children. Jaehaerys and Jaehaera were six, Maelor two. As they entered the apartments, Helaena was holding his little hand and calling out her mother’s name. Blood barred the door and slew the queen’s guardsman, whilst Cheese appeared to snatch up Maelor. “Scream and you all die,” Blood told Her Grace. Queen Helaena kept her calm, it is said. “Who are you?” she demanded of the two.

("A Son for a Son")

So really, we absolutely can and should take as fact that Helaena said what I quoted about Aegon not being in her bed.