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popculturebuffet · 2 years ago

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Gay as a Fox Finale: The Great North: Pride and Preju-Dance Adventure, As Goldie as It Gets Adventure and Say It Again, Ham Adventure: Love and Acceptance (Comission for WeirdKev27)

Hello all you happy people! It’s the final day of pride which means i’ts the final pride month review for yours truly and the conclusion of Queer as A Fox, my monthlong look at Animation Domination’s handling of queer characters and subjects. And i’ts been a roller coaster: We’ve had highs from the simpsons with classics like the simpsons meeting John Waters and Patty coming out, all time lows for this blog with Family Guys sterotyping and open transphobia, and some middling middles with American Dad keeping the steroyping but at least er trying. All thanks to WeirdKev, my consumate buisness partner and friend.

So for our last one we go out on a high with The Great North. It’s also the only show here i’ve covered before, and no doubt will again, having both made my best episodes of 2021 list and having reviewed the pilot as a patreon sign on reward.

As a refresher for those not familiar with it the Great North is an incredibly recent addition to Animation Domination, coming for Bobs Burgers vetrans the Mollenux Sisters that debuted in 2020. It’s in my humble opinon the best show in the lineup right now, and one of the best family adult sitcoms running alongside Close Enough. So naturally it was my idea to cover it though Kev was fully on board. The Great North follows the close knit Tobins of Lone Moose alaska and the stuff that insues whne you live in a small isolated town.

It’s also, unsuprisingly given it’s youth, the show with the best representation: For starters it’s the only one of the animation domination lineup to have a queer character in the main cast: Ham, who is easily one of my faviorites, a teen who often misses the point, is an expert baker, and in general seems off in his own world while still being deeply loving and empathetic.

He’s also very gay, with his sexuality established in what’s easily the best gag of a fairly strong pilot, announcing during a fairly tense family moment he’s gay.. only for him to be reminded he’s come out a bunch of times and that as his dad puts it “We love you just the way you are dammit!”. But what’s notable about the joke.. is that it’s not on ham for being gay. It’s that due to his nature, he’s apparently FORGOTTEN he’s come out multiple times. The show bathes the jokes around Ham in his character, never making his sexuality the joke. Which should be obvious but given I had to watch 5 episodes of Seth Macfarline assuming all gay people were Jack McFarlane, it’s still fucking refreshing. Decades later and not only does fox have a gay main character, as great north is very much an ensembl epiece but one whose just gay and while two of today’s eps have very important queer aseops, and one just a general one that happens to involve a gay teen and his boyfriend, they don’t feel as Very Special Episode as episodes like this once were. The Great North didn’t go out of it’s way to have these eps, they just naturally came from the characters involved and just happen to have good messages and while I grant the first two gay simpsons episodes slack for when they came out, it’s nice we’ve evovled to the point gay issues are tackled because the characters are who they are and not because they have to build it around the issue to even adress it. So join me one last time as we live and stay from longest night to longest day in the great north.

Pride and Preju-Dance Adventure

Look this one had my attention even before it came out. I love romance, and I love dance episodes, and it was clear from the descreption what this would be about and it didn’t disapoint.

This one centers around the Lone Moose Equvilent of a “Girls Ask the Guys” dance... which itself feels very antiquated and it feels very much the point that it is, the Thomas Wintersbone Memorial Dance. Thomas was a popular loone mooser in the 1800s who wanted to marry his fiance but her father, feeling an intellectual school teacher wouldn’t be a good provider, challenged him to spend a week in the wilderness before the two could live in seperate cabins because their love couldn’t be contained by just one. He died.. almost immedietly and this dance was created in his honor with Girls asking guys in from the cold. The unteitonal imbalance for queer students is also addressed as Ham, while not bothered by it, admits he’ll be left in the cold even if he did have the date, but thankfully his cousin Rebecca coming up with her dad Brian. And I was just as delighted by that as I assumed it’d be some time before we saw Beef’s brother Brian, after he was brought up in the second episode, but nope Brian not only comes up just two episodes later but is the star of his own subplot.

And we’ll go ahead and get said subplot out of the way. The Great North usually has an a and b plot, sometimes linked sometimes unrelated but usually intersecting at family dinner or what have you. I do appricate that kind of continuity and when you look closesly it’s clear where scenes take place in relation to each side of the plot, making the episodes feel that much more alive knowing where everyone is during it. As such Brian’s visit takes place alongside the lead up to the dance and the climax of said plot, the client meeting he’s here for , takes place the same night as the dance and it never feels contrived.

Said subplot is also engaging. Ther’es a funny enough subplot about fiances, married at the end of the season , Wolf and Honeybee trying to pitch Brian their buisness ideas but the main heart is Beef himself, who expects to spend time fishing with his brother whose instead busy with emails and the actual meeting. Beef is worried his brother has changed, now wearing what they all call wedding pants and working a white collar job selling hot tubs, though we do get a cute scene of Brian comparing emails to fishing and the brothers sending them together. Things get less cute when Beef crashes the meeting and muddles it, and the resulting heart to heart makes the subplot: Beef admits he was worried thigns had changed and Brian admits not only that’s true.. but he wasn’t fully HAPPY here. He loves his brother, the town and his family, but he’s far happier selling hot tubs and wearing wedding pants than he was fishing for a living and that dosen’t make him or beef any less brothers. It’s a touching moment and also nice considering i’m very diffrent from parts of my family and can understand that disconnect.

The meat of the episode, isn’t beef but Ham.. and Judy, ham’s sister who decides to ask out her crush Crispin, failing a lot due to nervousness.. and again I can relate. Honestly I relate to judy a lot: being talkative, awkward, and very in her own head, while at the same time being expressive. As such she makes one final run at it with Ham with her.. and given what month this is and what you saw above, you can probably tell where this is going: Crispin is gay, and is immeditly taken by ham and vice versa. And the show makes it clear from moment one some part of Judy is aware of this.. but she’s supressing the hell out of it as admitting it means loosing her crush. And while I haven’t actively supressed the idea someone i’m crushing on is gay, I have fallen for people who aren’t into men or anyone and it’s not a great feeling, so I sympathize.

That sais the episode , while feeling bad for Judy, also makes it clear that Crispin ISN’T leading her on: he never shows any romantic intrests, agrees to go assuming it’s as a group and a means to get him in from the cold, something Ham dosen’t pick up on right away, and it’s very clear like Ham and myself and even Judy, Crispin misses some social cues. So he’s clearly unaware Judy has feelings for him. But the show also dovetails from other shows by not having the humor being in her crushing on a gay man or her being “dumb” for being oblvious but just how obvious it is.. and once she finds out her pain is played very real, with her finding the two kissing.. whcih is the only part of this that feels a tad cliche.. but also feels necessary as let’s face it, she woudln’t of got it any other way. And ham respectfully backs off as not to hurt her, having likely also not realized Judy was into crispin.

It takes a ghost/hallucination whatever of thomas for the obvious to hit Judy: Thomas Wintersbone..was gay and the attempted marriage was one of convience so two gay people could be with who they really wanted without supscion. He died, and the dance was clearly made up to cover for it. It also features Leslie Jordan as thomas which is just awesome and his frustration with judy’s oblviousness is great “You would’ve gotten there eventually.. that’s not true I really had to walk you up to it” And thus is the aseop: i’ts okay to feel a bit hurt but you ultimately can’t force a romance, especailly with a queer person and i’ts not good to get in the way of someone elses romance just because you feel it shoudl’ve been yours. Judy accepts it, gives the two her blessing and tells the school the truth: that they should just dance with whomever.. or in the case of Judy’s friend and one of the shows best character Bethany, make snow demons in the parking lot instead. So Judy ends up dancing with her platonic friend adn worst character of the show gill... who we thankfully don’t have to see again. Horay! It’s a decent episode, not the shows best, again it feels mildly melodramtic, but on rewatch and after all those others it still has a good message and is a good time.

This also features what might be the first kiss with a main character on fox and one of the first incredibly romantic and lingering kisses in Animation Domination history... which it probbaly is so good going to this ep.

As Goldie as It Gets Adventure

WE jump into mid-season 2, and this one is more casual like I said: Ham’s romance with Crispin is important but it could be with any sexuality.. and that’s wonderful. This time the two are very busy, Ham volunteering at the old folks home and Crispin with his promotion at Smoothie Boss, so the two are only commuincating through text though both are being mature about it. It’s a throughline through the episode as Ham’s new friend goldie worries about time getting away from them.

And her reasons are valid as the episode centers around Goldie, one of ham’s retirees who is a delight, a fun old woman who used to hold freakouts (basically wild parties with disgusting 70′s style dishes), with her husband paul till he died and who cons ham into holding one at her old house.. which she sold but lies to him about still owning. But she still feels sympathetic, just wanting to honor her husband, and with ham rightfully calling her out for nearly getting him arrested. Plus her casual mentions of wanting to get some coke for the party (it falls through because her dealer is going to art school now and she’s proud of him) appeals directly to my love of cocaine themed humor, so it works.

The two’s friendship is also just heartwarming, with Ham geninely wanting ot help her and sharin ga dance with his pal and goldie giving ham solid advice: to not let the moment pass just because he’s young: he seems to have time but time is gone before you know it and thus he and Crispin should enjoy it. The episode is about not letting moments pass you by as you never know when they’ll be gone and ends with the two teens having a sixteen candles style moment on the roof that’ sutterly adorable.. even if they end up throwing out the geletan they brought because it’s gross. It has liver or something there were a llot of hilaroiusly gross dishes and a whole MUSICAL number to them in this episode.

The subplot really barely factors in, but is still highly entertaining as Judy gets into pottery, which leads to a great bit with her teacher gently telling people not to expect him to “ghost” them as he’s in a commited throuple with his patners wintergreen and mike, which likewise is some nice poly and gay rights. The shows queer rep as a whole is just nicely casual: ham and cripsins relationship just shows up a lot and casually as hell with the two using pet names and being cute, Judy is HEAVILY implied to be bisexual starting with season 2 and gay characters just crop up.

Judy turns out to be bad at pottery and her family, knowign she gets discouraged easy, let her run rampant with insane creations such as a plate that not only defies gravity but has several holes in it, a ceramnic shirt moon has to be cut out of and a fork that’s actually a candleholder. I didn’t think a show could get so many good jokes out of “character is bad at pottery” and was wrong. The family then tries to talk the guy into getting judy out of the class.. and all end pu singing instead because he’s that charming. Judy is absent because she’s helping ham with the party. All in all a solid, wholesome hilarious episode.

Say It Again, Ham Adventure

And so we come to the penultimate episode of season 2 and the last one of this marathon, and one I was honestly going to cover anyway, but rolled into this with two more fitting episodes.

This one uses Ham’s previously mentiond habit of having come out a bunch as a plot poitn and cleverly at that: Ham and Crispin watch the hilarious film within a film Danny Vroom: Gay in the Fastlane, which is over the top from Danny’s partner being named Buisnessman Greg, whose defintely not a cop, and feeling just as over the top as an actaul insprational story.

Ham feels coming out in films is usually overdramatic, though Crispin himself admits his had some flair as while his parents were accepting they also set off fire works and burned down their mailbox and had to pay a fine. Ham honestly can’t remember WHICH coming out was the first.. and soon realizes with Crispin’s help it’s because his coming out LACKED drama. Everyone was just .. cool with it and casually accepted it.. which is what really happened to me. While it was at the end of a long night for other reasons, my mom and brother both acccepte dme easily, as while I feared they woudln’t my fears were unfounded and I deep down knew they were. Even with my dad who I expected to reject me.. it wasn’t. He was perfectly lovely about it.. if then talking about protection. As of this review i’m still a virgin and have come nowhere near sex so.. yeah. Kinda pointless and mildly offensive but still better than I expected. So while I didn’t feel the need for a big coming out, I do feel this is something a lot of queer people might run into: because of media, assuming a coming out has to be this big dramatic teary moment when sometimes it just.. happens.

The family is supportive though in helping Ham find someone to dramatically come out to, as is Crispin, and Beef suggests his Cousin Danica who is HILAROIUSLY awful and a great one off character, being judgemental of everything to an extreme and not all exagerated by beef degree, to the point he cut off contact with her after her response to Moon’s birth announcement was “please make it stop”. His response to it is also graet “Ten years later and i’m still going.” Gratend Ham has to be TOLD this despite it being obvious sh’es who beef means, because i’ts ham, but still it’s great and she lives down to the descrption, telling moon to leave her rabbit collection alone , despite only having one “There’s only one lincoln memorial” “Not sure that’s how that works”, calling Judy a floozy which delights her in how offensive it is, for her leggins, and even can’t get the coming out thing righ tas before Ham can, it turns out she’s wanted by the police, two delightful sisters, one played by kat dennings who banter is a higlight of the episode and who are inept at their job, assumign they should keep their guns in the glove box. They do manage to disarm her at least

Wolf and Honeybee are busy in their own fun subplot doing a true crime podcast, getting hot dogs and finding out the crime was solved and they just didn’t finish the page. not much to comment on there, but i’m pleased to say all three subplots are great.

And of course we get payoff as Ham apologizes for this (and to the shows credit Beef offered an out if it got too intense), and admits he was just told by the media and just wanted a big moment to be seen, but admits having a family who just acccepts him is better. Though he gets his cake and eats it too as his family stages a coming out for him that night and they all hug. IT’s a wonderful episode, going into the pressures to have a big coming out, which to be fair hollywood DOES overdramatize een when the parent fully accepts as while many coming outs can be dramatic or traumtizing, they all aren’t, and just being plain funny

So that does it for gay as a fox and I have tenative plans to return it again next year with more shows, some returns to one here.. and hopefullyt his show. we have a whole season to go so hopefullyt here willb e more. Till then, thanks for reading, happy pride, and thanks for all of you who read all of these. It’s nice to see fox has come this far and hopefully it’ll only sail further as we go.

#the great north #ham tobin #fox #animation domination #pride month #lbgtq+

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taki118 · 4 years ago

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Go Watch the Venture Brothers

So just heard the complete and utter Bullshit news that Adult Swim has cancelled one of (if not the best shows) they have the Venture Bros. This series is one of those shows that for WHATEVER reason never got to the level of fandom Rick and Morty has even though they’ve been at the genre parody game longer and in my opinion better.

The series is about Rusty Venture former boy adventurer and failing super scientist who in an attempt to keep his head above water in debt goes around with his two boys Hank and Dean, and bodyguard Brock on misadventues while various legal archnemisis go after him, such as the Monarch.

So if you never watched or never heard of this 7 season series let me give you a break down on why you should,

1) Art Style & Animation

Venture bros is one of those rare Adult aimed animated series that that really truly tries to utilize their medium to the best of their abilities. Season 1 had like such a small budget and corners had to be cut so it can be a little hard to watch at times.

But with each passing season they get a little better, a little more fluid, go just a little harder and it truly feels rewarding to watch. Like seeing an artist you follow online improve over the years. Like they COULD have stayed with the choppy and stiff animation from season 1 it fit right in with its fellow adult animated shows but it didn’t. They strove for quality to have something that matched the story they were telling.

2) The Writing

Venture Bros has some of the tightest and consistently great writing of ANY serialized show I’ve seen, adult, animated or other wise. Wanna know why? Cause it’s all done by TWO people (save for like one ep each season where one other person is allowed to touch their baby). Yeah TWO people and they work their asses off every season to interject, humor, refrences, parody, plot and character development in equal measure.

3) Character Development

Um yes in case you were wondering that’s right an adult animated show has CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT that holds as the series goes on. Not to give spoilers but characters will go through changes in alignment, relationships will develop and change, some characters will go through negative arcs where they are straight up unbareable for a season before coming out the other side even better than they were before. There is no end of epsiode or even end of season reset. Characters, settings, and dynamics all change over the course of the show and it feels just so god damn good.

4) Story Development

Just like the characters the story of the Venture Bros grows and changes each season. Things that are set up even as early as season one are paid off as the series goes on. Like not to be that bitch but you know how RIck and Morty teases an overarching plot ALL THE TIME but like will often just spit in the face of fans hoping for more than like one episode a season addressing it? Yeahhhhhhh that doesnt happen here, fans are consistently rewarded for putting the time in to rewatch and really think about what happened in the series. Characters that are seen in the background or are just referenced by other characters will be brought in to be recurring characters, things that start off as a small detail or gag will be given larger relevance and each time they do this you get that “OH I remember that from last season! So thats what it was!” The writers WANT you to rewatch, they WANT you to analyze and they WANT you to theorize, and they give you a show that gives back the time you put in.

5) Parody & Reference

This series does a great thing with parody. They make real characters who are just as enjoyable as the characters they parody, they make story lines that both poke fun at the absurdity of the media but shows the writers love for it. So often parody and references are just used to mock the thing but with Venture Bros you feel the love and care so when you know the thing being parodied you can laugh but feel good about laughing cause they are never laughing at a thing maybe you cared for in your youth but rather laughing with it.

And it’s never just one thing. When they parody a thing its often layered with other things to make it even more unique. Scooby-Doo is overlayed with famous criminals, Laura Croft is mixed Dr. Quinn Medicine Woman, GI Joe is given the look of the Village People and so on. They never go for the easy joke or reference. Hell theres an episode that starts with them reciting the lyrics to David Bowies Space Oddity for really no reason other than they could. They weave these things in naturally with their setting and characters so nothing feels out of place. Like if you dont catch a reference or parody you dont feel like “I think this isa reference to something?” like a LOT of things do not just adult animated shows. You arent taken out of the moment cause it all feels so natural.

6) The Characters

God damn these characters, I could go on for hours about these characters. From main to one off these are some of the most likeable characters you can find. I mean it when I say I can’t think of a single character I wish they had cut cause they are all so well created. Even the ones I hate i have fun hating cause they were made to be that way. I’ll be good though I’ll only talk about my absolute top faves.

- The Monarchs

You ever sit and wish villain couples could have functional healthy relationships? Well look no further than Malcom Fitzcarraldo aka The Monarch and Dr. Shelia Girlfriend (yes that is her last name). The Monarch is a high strung impulsive saturday morning cartoon villain whos tendency to over react is only matched by his unspecified hatred of Dr. Venture. And Dr. G is his nonsense partner in crime who will cut a bitch if they don’t play by their admittedly weird rules. Both characters are great on their own but are better together. Though that doesnt mean they always get along. Like a real couple they have their ups and downs they fight, break up, make-up and grow stronger in their relationship with each season.

- Shore Leave

Ok ok so I want you to imagine James Bond, mixed with GI Joe simmering in a cocktail of the most flamboyant gay men you have ever seen and you have one of my favorite gay characters/characters in general. Shore Leave is a member of OSI (the shows SHEILD/GI Joe parody organization) he’s loud, brash, flippant, sassy and highly competent at his job loving every second of getting to beat bad guys down within an inch of their life. I love seeing him play off the stoic Brock and the two have this great brotherly dynamic that’s never called into question. He also gets to have a very cute romance with Al the Alchemist (who is also great). I could talk about this man all day.

- Dr. Rusty Venture

They did such a good job with this man. He’s a self serving, sexist, perverted, whinny, self important asshole and yet you feel pity and genuine sympathy for him and want him to succeed. You can see how Dr. V was given a raw deal by his father who seemed to care more about his adventures than his sons well being and how this molded him into the bitter man he is today, but on the flip side you can see where he chose to use that as a crutch for his worst behaviors and impulses. Seeing him slowly grow and change and be an actual good father to his boys while all the while still be a giant dick is actually really great.

- Dr. Byron Orpheus

Ahhhhh Dr. Orpheus part Dr. Strange Parody part busybody stay at home dad, he’s just such a delight. Dr. Orpheus is a divorcee, with an unfulfilling job of maintaining order to the cosmos (which isnt as hard as one might think), and uses his magical ablities in ways most of us would (ie menial tasks and home chores). Overly dramatic and affectionate Dr. O is a delight whenever he appears, but he’s at his best around his daughter and old friends The Order of the Triad.

Again I can go on but all these characters ranging from main to recurring are crafted with the utmost care for you to want to see them succeed or fail, to see them again even if you know it’ll never happen, and want them to cross paths with other characters.

The Venture Bros is one of those series that I will ALWAYS recommend even to the pickiest of humor tastes. But if you don’t believe its as good as I said or don’t think the concept is to your tastes I’ll recommend a few eps that I think best show off the base idea of the series without giving much away. In terms of plot and spoilers, though somethings wont make a lot of sense.

- S1 ep10 "Tag Sale – You're It!" - Dr. V is having a yard sale so of course all manner of costumed weirdos show up. - S2 ep5 "Twenty Years to Midnight" - basically a fetch quest around the world to save the planet with daddy issues - S3 ep2 "The Doctor Is Sin" - Again daddy issues but with one of the best recurring characters and a great showcase of the series deeper emotional plots - S4 ep6 "Self-Medication" - Really embraces the parody as Rusty goes to a former boy adventurer support group. Anyway the show is 7 seasons with 80 episodes, please go watch it. I will never forgive @adultswim for cancelling what was to be their final season. And in closing GO TEAM VENTURE!

#venture bros #the venture bros #venture brothers #adultswim #adult animated shows #animated shows #animation #go watch this show #go watch #adult animation

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kaypeace21 · 3 years ago

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Rebel Robin podcast (ep 3 &4 analysis)

For those who haven’t read them yet. Here’s the analysis for podcast ep 1&2. Analysis of Rebel Robin book-here. And eastereggs from rebel robin novel- here.

So the main things I noticed in ep 3 was how Robin spying was shown as a huge NEGATIVE-and Mr Hauser got upset over her doing so. Robin listens to mr. Hauser’s phone call (like Karen with Mike in s3/ us gov spying on calls in s1) & on a different occasion Robin also eavesdrops on a private convo he is having with someone else in his classroom ( like El spying on Mike talking to Lucas in s3). And when he finds out about this he tells her how wrong it was to spy on other people like that. In the past, I also talked about how the theme of spying is shown for many other st characters ( in the show) and how it isn’t romanticized like people think it is- here .

Anyways , Ep 3 ends with a call from a h*mophobic teen( Dash) telling Robin to “stay away” from Mr. Hauser cause he’s “dangerous”. Why he thinks he’s dangerous is solely for the fact he’s gay.I think this theme may come into play in s4 Hawkins (in relation to the satanic panic). In ep 4 Robin jokes to (gay) Mr. Hauser : “ So what are you into... satanism?” (Sadly most queer people have been told over and over we’re going to hell for being gay/lgbt+. it’s sadly an almost universal experience.) For those unaware- the ‘satanic panic’ was a right wing christian movement in the 80′s that WRONGLY associated certain things with supposed satanism. Just some of the many things they demonized : rock music , stephen king , wearing black, horror/fantasy media, and of course queer people and d&d (hellfire club - the name is a a xmen ref but in the show it’s probably an inside joke about the satanic panic and people being scared of d&d). We see foreshadowing of the satanic panic hinted in s3 (in relation to d&d)- on tv the narrator asks if “satanism” (pans to d&d set) is to blame for the odd occurrances in Hawkins. And given how the s4 el-trailer had the clock say 3:00am for the “witching hour” also called “the devil’s hour” since it’s supposed to be a subversion of jesus dy*ing at 3:00 pm. And the possibility s4 may take place around Easter. I think we’ll see that religious (Christian) extre*sm causes many people in Hawkins to interpret the supernatural as ‘satanic’. And no , I’m obviously not talking poorly about all religious/christian people).

After this Mr. Hauser jokes how Hawkins is like “lord of the flies” and how he “worries” what would happen if teens were left to their own devices-like in the book. The themes in the book mostly focus on the dangers of ‘mob mentality’ and how human beings can become v*olent and turn on each other- if the safety of civilization disappears...

This I believe is foreshadowing - i mentioned in a post a while back (here). How movies on the s4 list had the theme of : a supernatural event indirectly causing towns people to act irrationally and turn on eachother v*olently. Despite literal monsters attacking them from outside (they chose to turn on eachother instead). In the end some townspeople become the real monsters via mob mentality/v*oence/false witch hunts (the mist, the birds, etc). In ‘the birds’ (while people are hidding in a store)- they wrongly blame certain characters for the supernatural chaos. Similarly, in ‘the mist’ (crowd of townspeople are trapped in a store) and some start interpreting the monsters as being sent as punishment by god- some town’s people start quoting the bible and saying the only way to stop the punishment is to start “sacrificing the s*nners and nonbelievers”. BIG YIKES.ST references mapple street (where the wheelers and sinclairs live). It’s based on the twilight zone ep of the same name “The Monsters Are Due on Maple Street” .The ‘monsters’ of that episode -were the townspeople turning on eachother because they incorrectly think their own neighbors are part of an invading supernatural army. The enemy was actually the paranoia/mob mentality-not the supernatural force they feared. And yes i do think this concept is linked with 80s satanic panic and will cause some town division/obstacles for our heroes to deal with . **I also think the s4 bts of the Hawkins blood clinic-may be used to show h*mophobia (linked to satanic panic) in the town. Like in one s4 movie “paradise lost”the punk rock boys who were into black clothes, rock music , horror/stephen king books- were accused by the town’s people of being gay AND have demonic powers that are k*lling fellow town’s people.

Mr Hauser says he thinks steve Harrington is Ralph from lord of the flies. And Robin disagrees saying he’s Jack. Personally- since this was when Robin didn’t know/hated Steve. I think Mr hauser is right that Steve is Ralph (one of the oldest boys) who’s “commitment to civilization and morality is strong”. But Jack (perhaps the popular s4 kid Jake?) and his savage crew take control of the group and start trying to attack Ralph and his friends (steve’s crew- over satanic panic?). How this begins is -

Jack, torments Ralph and others. And some kids begin to develop savage personalities, after someone claims to have seen a Beast (demongorgan?) in the woods. This creates fear among the boys, which allows Jack to access more power.Ralph gets into an argument with Jack, who splits from the tribe. Many of the other boys follow Jack, who uses fear to manipulate the boys into leaving Ralph. And Jack’s crew begin attacking Ralph and his friends.

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Ok, next topic of ep 4- the sentimental part of my brain got emotional when hearing how upset Robin was. And than Mr Hauser-telling her she’s wrong and she’s not “broken” or “rotten” and “nothing about her needs to be fixed’” (got me right in the feels) . As a queer person- I feel like every lgbt+ kid/teen needs to hear what Mr. Hauser said to Robin.

However, the analytical part of my brain -did notice some easterggs/ series parallels.

The convo starts with them talking about music Mr hauser likes (such as Bowie). And transitions to Mr Haauser asking about things she likes, whether she’s being bullied, and he later tells her “ DON’T let other people’s small mindedness make you fell bad about yourself. you don’t need to change yourself-no matter what anyone else says” . And Mr Hauser than says him calling her the “weirdest girl in Hawkins” was a compliment (not an insult-like she initially assumed).

This is remarkably similar to certain scenes in s1/2. In s1, Jonathan mentions musicians he likes such as Bowie, asks Will about what he likes, and tells Will “don't like things cause people tell you you’re supposed to-especially not him (their dad who called him h*mophobic names)” . In s2, Jonathan tries to cheer Will up after asking if he's being being bullied. And calls Will “a freak” (and says it’s a good thing) and he should be content with being a “freak “ and compares Will to Bowie ( who was openly queer since the 70s) .

In ep 4, Robin also mentions how sad she is that her parents won’t let her ride her bike anymore cause their paranoid about her safety (like what happened to Will in s2).

Robin (before Mr. Hauser comforts her) says she feels like she has a “rot” inside her . This is a s2 eastergg that could be linked to either Will or El. Will says his now-memories are “growing”, spreading”, and killing.” Later Kali says the emotional pain caused by her father caused a “wound” to “spread”. Later allusion-Brenner tells El she has a “terrible wound “ (“a rot”) that Will “grow, spread, and kill.”

The reason Robin rants about feeling like she has a “rot” inside her is because she’s being bullied, and lost all her Hawkins friends and says “maybe I’m broken maybe there is just something about me that drives people away? I’m the only common denominator-there’s something wrong with me! There’s something inside of me that’s just rotten and there’s nothing i can do to fix it”. Which 1)-poor Robin. 2) I feel like could easily be How Will feels in s4(who will be the same age as Robin is here in the podcast)- his dad abandoned him, all his hawkins friends are gone , the st s4 movies have h*mophobic bullying in them (and he was bullied in the past). In a interview Noah said Will in s4 “doesn’t really get along with people-it’s just him and Mike.” I think it fits more so with Will than El . But they may feel similar: it’s implied in s4 audition tapes she’ll be bullied too, she moved away from her friends, and her father (Hopper) fake “passed away.” It could easily be how both Will and El feel in s4- that there is something “broken”/ “rotten” about them . In fact, in the rebel Robin novel there is even a character named Sheena. Sheena reminds me a bit of a mix between Will and el . She is very quiet, queercoded, and is often bullied. And she finds mean notes and other things stuffed in her locker- placed there by bullies. A bit like how Will found the zombie-boy note in his locker. A teacher doesn’t stop her bullying just blames her and says “ This wouldn’t happen if you made it just a smidgen easier for PEOPLE to understand you.”(sort of reminding me of that Noah quote about s4 Will not getting along with most people/Jonathan saying not to change himself cause “people” say to). But sheena can be another name for Jane (there was also a 80s show character named Sheena who was psychic) so ...maybe foreshadowing of el/jane being bullied in highschool? Along with Will?

*It’s not a eastergg/parallel...just speculation. Unlike the rebel robin book... in the podcast (in multiple episodes) almost every time she opens up to Mr Hauser about her problems she says it’s ok for him to do the same and she’ll be supportive and listen. However, Mr Hauser (so far) always rejects her offer-much to her hurt/frustration. In ep 4, she asks if he has someone his “own age” he can talk to about his problems-which he says he does. Now... since in ep 4 Mr hauser is paralleled to Jonathan maybe Jonathan will have someone his own age to talk to about his problems (maybe his new friend Argyle?) We see similar to Mr Hauser giving advice/pep talks to (gay) Robin. Jonathan is always giving advice/peptalks to our (gay-coded) Will. But so far- Jonathan has no one he really emotionally leaned on in the same way (Will does with Jonathan). I also wonder if Will in s4 starts gets tired of how he always confides in Jonathan (but Jonathan never does the same with Will in return)? Like Robin with Mr. Hauser?

#robin buckley #steve harrington #will byers #el hopper #jonathan byers #stranger things #stranger things theory

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dreamylyfe-x · 4 years ago

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you know i'm rewatching the gallavich wedding planning and i can't help but feel like i don't know who this is, but it ain't mickey! them writing him to be all specific about colors and sh*t, like where's the real mickey from s4 who was annoyed with that guy listing beer types? i get they wanted to do that dumb gag but they should've used someone else for it. i mean ian's the one who was always meticulous about details, they showed that from the beginning. i don't know i just found it so weird

Aw, yeah. I get that reaction -- I think it’s pretty widely shared. And I suspect that storyline did come from someone pitching “it’d be funny if Mickey was a groomzilla.” Which is an idea I find annoying. Because I find the whole bridezilla thing annoying.

But... I kinda love it, to be honest.

I really like the idea that Mickey has an aesthetic and some artistic tendencies. We know he draws. I think there’s some indication in canon that Mickey is creative -- both in problem solving and in, let’s say, his sartorial choices. Mickey seems to act on things a lot. He’s not buying those hoodies without sleeves. He is creating hoodies without sleeves.

Ian IS meticulous... or at least, he’s organized. He’s also given to executing a plan that isn’t necessarily of his own devising. He is drawn to uniforms and he seeks out knowledge he can apply to systems and processes. He seems to have an appreciation for creativity and art, but he isn’t particularly creative himself.

So of the two of them, I think Mickey is actually much more likely to observe the details and to have opinions about them. That’s still a long way away from having a meltdown about gold chiavari chairs with white cushions. I do realize this. And I remember how that scene came out as a sneak peek the week before and I was... concerned. But when I saw it in context, I honestly liked it. Not so much the scene itself, but the story of that episode. It’s pretty much the only ep that season where Mickey’s concerns are foregrounded over Ian’s and, though (as always) I would have liked MORE of it, I like that we got this one episode about what the wedding mean to Mickey.

So here are the top reasons why I like and buy this story.

1. Right off the top, I don’t think Mickey objecting to being given a list of beers indicates he’s not going to care about what chairs are at his wedding. Putting aside that he’s lived an additional five or so years since then, Mickey doesn’t get annoyed in that scene because he thinks it’s dumb to know a lot about beer -- He’s annoyed that Ryan has asked him a question he can’t answer. I’ve always thought of that as a class issue -- He has never been in much of a position to CARE about what he drinks, and he drinks mass-produced pilsners because that’s what everyone in Southside drinks, because it’s cheap. He might love a winter wheat. He has no goddamn idea, because he isn’t living a life where you get to concern yourself with whether or not you’re into IPAs or lagers. Mickey DOES like beer. I was surprised and delighted when he recently ordered a stout at The Alibi, because it does indicate that his life has changed enough that he gets to know a bit more about beer. That at some point, he had the time and inclination to alter his tastes. He might have a different answer for Ryan now.

2. That Mickey wants things. Just... I don’t know. Mickey wanting anything other than food, shelter and Ian gets me so much. Mickey attending to his hierarchy of needs legitimately makes me teary. For people who grow up like Mickey -- asking for things can be a very big deal. So the fact that he just decides he’s going to make a wedding happen -- and a wedding with nice flowers and chairs that will reflect the light (because, we find out, that’s why he wants the gold) and a singer who will perform Livin’ on a Prayer -- is a big deal. And as many have cited before me, it makes sense that Mickey wants a better wedding with Ian than the one he had with Svetlana. But what we also find out, when we get the moment with the vows, is that Mickey takes the whole thing very seriously. He delivers those vows with complete commitment and deep sincerity. So I understand why he wants that space to carry the weight of what is happening.

3. Mickey doesn’t break the chair because it’s not gold. He breaks the chair because every single person he’s encountered that day is a fucking dick. And they’re being a dick about his wedding. Something he’s happy about, and something he wants to celebrate. And, honestly, he’s not asking for much. He’d be annoyed, but most likely not violent, if his father hadn’t aimed a gun his face and some random old lady hadn’t refused him as a client because he’s gay. Brooks -- who tries to gaslight and act like the chairs are the chairs that were asked for when he knows damn well they are not -- is taking the wrath for a number of other people. But to me, the most important line in that scene is “why does everything always have to suck?”

4. Another thing about this is... back when Mickey responds to Ryan’s multiple choice beer question with “how ‘bout beer?” Ryan covers the awkward moment by making a joke about his own sexuality. The implication being that relating to beer with the kind of detail traditionally reserved for wine, is not masculine. And the thing is, Ryan is making a joke at his own expense, but he’s also acknowledging something that has always been true for Mickey. That Mickey has to make sure he never, ever displays any of these qualities Ryan so casually exhibits. Whether it’s natural for him or not, Mickey has to avoid anything that can be read to be a stereotype. He has to be hyper masculine, both because he’s from House that Toxic Masculinity built, but also because HE knows, even when he won’t acknowledge it, that he’s gay. So when we see Mickey openly talking about what flowers and chairs he wants at the wedding, he’s letting out something that could very well have always been there, but that he never, ever would have expressed back in seasons 1 through 4. Mickey doesn’t kiss Ian for two whole seasons because he’s so messed up about his sexuality. I 100% buy that, at that same time, he isn’t acknowledging having opinions about home decor.

5. I like it when Mickey defies our expectations. I’m find with him discovering or revealing new facets or abilities or interests -- what I don’t like is when they have him do something that seems more like a regression. The show lampshades that this is something of a surprise, for Mickey to want a wedding, by having Ian be absolutely baffled by it for most of the episode. But they also participate in the end. There’s an indication that Mickey and Ian plan the eventual wedding together, though I imagine Mickey’s stronger opinions took the day in most cases. And the gesture at the end of that episode -- a romantic gesture just as surprising from Ian as anything Mickey does in that episode, really -- validates Mickey in a way I think is pretty beautiful. Like... he gets to be a guy who wants someone to sing Livin’ on a Prayer to him while he holds his boyfriend’s fiancé’s hand. He wasn't allowed to be that guy for years. I like that he gets there.

So. We might not agree on this, but I really like that you drew a parallel between that scene and the party scene at Ryan’s because I hadn’t though of that before and I think it’s a very interesting one. I also enjoyed thinking so much about this on the day that we mark their one year anniversary! Because holy fuck. Gallavich is married!

#asks #once again I'm contrary #but I am always so grateful to be asked #and I am grateful for the opportunity to think deeply about how much of a triumph it is for Mickey to want something solely because #he likes the way the light hits it #mickey milkovich #Gallavich meta #shameless season 10

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smallblueandloud · 4 years ago

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OKAY SO remember how i said i was considering buying the librarians box set? well, i bought it and i’ve been working my way through for... a few weeks now? maybe a month. i’m like three episodes into s2 (i skipped around this season a little because i wanted to show lesbean the time loop episode) and like. hmm. i have Thoughts and i’m gonna Express Them now.

my younger self didn’t realize it, but cassandra is REALLY VERY BI, isn’t she?? the women in the fairy tale story. the way she looks at lamia when she’s holding the apple. the implication that librarian!cass slept with eve. the implication that she IS sleeping with lamia. the way she gets the italian baroness’ number without even TRYING. god that’s gay. i love john rogers.

cassandra/ezekiel remains my favorite component of the ot3. he carries around a HANDKERCHIEF for her in late s1 when her nosebleeds are getting bad. that’s CANON. i just have to DEAL with that knowledge. and like, he steals her that statue in the science fair episode, and guides her in the labyrinth, and the way they’re so effortlessly a team by the occult college episode is my FAVORITE THING IN THE WORLD

jake/ezekiel has Big Repression Energy and i need, i NEED ezekiel to hold jake’s face in his hands after he has a near miss. i need it for SCIENCE. it’s SO GOOD. the POTENTIAL.

baby me kind of disliked jake/cassandra, i think because i cared about the ot3 and/or cassandra/ezekiel a lot and i didn’t like how they were being sidelined. or maybe i just didn’t like how ezekiel was being sidelined. either way, i acted HASTILY. they’re still my least favorite component relationship but there’s some GOOD STUFF in there. the way jake takes her word for it during the tesla episode, even when it might doom his newest girlfriend? in the season where they’re having trust issues? god, poetic cinema! give me more of cassandra saying something and the guys IMMEDIATELY accepting it because it’s cass and they trust her and i’m upset about it

i love eve baird so, so much

flynn so clearly has adhd that i can’t believe it’s not canon. also evlynn is the CUTEST thing and i NEED more of that running joke where every time they have a ~moment~, flynn has a realization. it’s so funny to me but also, like, mumble mumble something about how eve inspires him? or something? it’s GOOD is what i’m saying.

i saved the best for last but: J E N K I N S

I AM EVEN MORE EMO ABOUT HIM THAN I WAS LAST TIME. also sidenote they are NOT trying to hide his identity it’s kind of delicious. highlights include: jenkins is good friends with santa claus and mrs. claus, jenkins drops his pitcher of water when someone mentions dulaque, jenkins knows a Suspicious Amount of arthur lore in the first episode, and jenkins actually LAUGHS when eve says “maybe dulaque falling out a plane killed him?” and says “it takes a lot more than falling out of a plane to kill u-- him. dulaque.”

A L S O THAT MORGAN LE FAY REVEAL IS LITERALLY THE BEST THING IN THE WORLD. THOSE KINDS OF REVEALS ARE MY FAVORITE AND I’M KIND OF OBSESSED WITH THE IDEA THAT JENKINS AND MORGAN AND DULAQUE HAVE SPENT THOUSANDS OF YEARS NAVIGATING AROUND EACH OTHER.

morgan uses magic to have fun and dulaque wants power and jenkins wants to explore it and you cannot TELL me there is not 12k of angsty character study in there you cannot CONVINCE me to stop thinking about it and i will NOT because it’s EXCELLENT.

(also jenkins Insists with a capital i that ufos are not real and like, first of all, ufos are always real because they literally just mean “unidentified flying object” and ANYTHING can be “unidentified” but also i am gonna say it’s because he was good friends with guinan for a few hundred years and he’s not gonna out her like that lmao)

Petition For Jenkins To Be Gay. i don’t know which knight of the round table galahad was close with but there’s GOTTA be one that wasn’t his FATHER (disputed) or his KING or his WEIRD WIZARD UNCLE-TYPE GUY (sorry merlin)

jenkins knowing INSTANTLY that cass met the ladies of the lake was Good And Right and my only problem is that he seems to distrust them so much? i mean, i GET it, and it’s part of the conflict of the season/show (how should magic be used? should we teach people to use it or hide it away?), but also i want his opinions to be TRUSTWORTHY

SPEAKING OF S2. PETITION FOR EVE AND FLYNN AND MORIARTY TO HAVE A BRIEF FLING. NO ONE IS AS CONFUSED AS EVE IS ABOUT THIS TURN OF EVENTS. FLYNN’S LIKE “oh, we’re sleeping with a fictional? an evil fictional? an evil fictional that wants to seize the library? [beat] oh, well, it was mostly prospero anyway. okay let’s do this then! never slept with a fictional before, this’ll be interesting!”

could’ve SWORN that jenkins was a fictional but apparently NOT? that combined with the idea that camelot was literally in the loom of fate makes me think that camelot was a REAL PLACE in this universe and i’m just. i’m so confused. why is he IMMORTAL i have QUESTIONS

the next ep i’m watching is The Librarians And Jake Stone Has Daddy Issues and i’m SO FREAKING EXCITED ABOUT IT. let’s talk about trust issues!! let’s talk about family!! PLEASE!!!!!

i watched the time loop episode. and i sobbed. a lot. it was embarrassing, frankly, and we’re not discussing it. my only real question/unresolved thing is that i could’ve sworn we got canon confirmation that ezekiel remembers it and we actually DON’T and i want to SEE the ptsd!! give me the aftermath!!!!!

i want the ot3 to date! is that too much to ask!

also i’m PRETTY SURE this ending is the one with jenkins talking about his king and y’all, i am Not Prepared for this, i am going to LOSE IT. i will Never Stop Talking About It, Ever.

I KNOW EVERYONE EVER SAYS THIS BUT THEY SHOULD’VE USED JENKINS’ BACKSTORY MORE. I WANT AN EPISODE WHERE SOMEONE NEEDS TO BE PURE OF HEART. COME ON WRITERS WHAT ARE YOU, COWARDS?

uh. i’m sure i have more thoughts but i will post them at a later point. tldr i am still in love with this show and it is so good and the only ways it could’ve been improved were 1) more queerness and 2) more arthurian details. thank you for coming to my ted talk.

#the librarians #evlynn #jassekiel #jenkins #i'm gonna make a separate post about my headcanons re: jenkins' immortality but this is long enough lmao #sb and l rambles #sb and l watches the librarians #librarians headcanons #librarians ideas #ot3: the genius the thief and the historian #eve x flynn #eve x flynn x moriarty #PLEASE WATCH THIS SHOW Y'ALL #I THINK IT'S ON HULU AND I LOVE IT MORE THAN ANYTHING

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multimetaverse · 4 years ago

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Riverdale 5x09 Recap

I like that Alice is being realistic about whose blood it is (also why do women on tv who are falling apart only ever drink wine to drown their sorrows?)

Ngl I like the Friday Night Lights knockoff they’re doing this week

Not Veronica storming into a changing room of underage kids without even knocking

Studies have shown that the fastest way to destroy motivation in kids is to pay them to do something, like play sports, that they had already been doing and then after a while you stop paying them and they’ll lose any passion they had in the activity. So hope Veronica can keep paying for points

God Jughead looks rough, even FP at his worst never looked this bad

Lmao is Cheryl really gonna try and fix Kevin and Fangs?

Damn Betty was ice cold to Glenn

Well mole people would connect with the old mines much better than aliens would. Waldo should know better by now, stories are never just stories on Riverdale

Many recaps ago I joked that Hiram would eventually be reduced to showing up to PTA meetings to try and thwart Archie and honestly sending Reggie to tell Archie to withdraw his football team from the local league is barely a step above that

Lmao Reggie walking out of pop’s and calling each bulldog loser was so petty

Oh wow Sheriff Keller gets to have a scene with his son

Well it’s a good thing that your father has never reneged on a deal before Veronica!

Lerman looks like he’s freaking out (these close ups of Jughead are not flattering). I wonder if the aliens were at all connected to the Farm? We know they were stealing organs from cult members there which could tie in with these alleged alien surgeries

Cheryl actually giving good advice

CW is letting Veronica take her bra off for sex scenes now

Ooof Betty. Although knowing Riverdale they might actually have Polly make it out alive even though it’s completely unrealistic at this point. Especially since they’ve left themselves the loophole of only testing for blood type rather than Polly’s DNA specifically

Lerman Logan? is RAS a fan of Logan Lerman?

Only Cheryl can get away with earnestly saying ‘’#kangs”

Also Fangs is right, Cheryl’s party might have been the ultimate trigger but there were clearly deep issues in the Kangs relationship

Fangs sinking his, uh, fangs, into Kevin’s long history of hooking up in the woods with random dudes

It’s nice that Jughead can just ditch his shift at pop’s whenever he needs to

I have no clue if this dude is a real life football player or not

Hiram really needs to learn how to delegate, this is not the kind of shit a mafia don should be dealing with

Nice to know that Reggie draws the line at injuring children

Sure old man Dreyfus looks crazy but he sounds crazier

Love that clearly photoshopped picture of Betty and Polly

Uh oh looks like Dark! Betty is back (how very American of her to have her ammunition stored with no protections)

Yikes we haven’t seen a gay bashing in Riverdale in quite some time

Betty would honestly be more effective at scaring off these truckers if she just flashed her FBI badge rather than going vigilante

Oh man are they really trying to pull a Kevin is ashamed of being gay plot now? After all this time?

Great acting from Casey but this scene really falls flat. For one, Kevin’s character right from the pilot has pretty much just him being gay and there really never seemed to be any issues he himself had with it, even when we saw characters like Moose or Moose’s father struggling with their sexualities. Secondly, when was the last time we even heard of Kevin’s mom? Back in S2 when it’s revealed that she and Tom were getting divorced? We’ve never met this lady who’s now revealed as homophobic and yet it turns out she’s the root of Kevin’s trauma, which is also just being revealed 85 eps into the series

Again Betty all you need to do is flash your FBI badge, you don’t have to go full Serpico on these truck drivers

Credit where due, this sleepwalking excuse is actually plausible as are his parents being the mole people since they lock him in the basement at night to keep him from hurting himself. A week is a long time to vanish with no memory

So looks like someone or some group is abducting adults and kids over the decades but letting them go while someone else is abducting and murdering women specifically

This Cheryl performance lacks the usual razzle dazzle

Yasaas Britta get that point

Poor timing Glenn

At least Hiram is getting back into the destroying Riverdale business next week rather than his pissing contests with Archie

Until next week Riverdalers

#Riverdale #Varchie #Bughead #Archie Andrews #Veronica Lodge #Hiram Lodge #Betty Cooper. Jughead Jones #Alice Smith #Kevin Keller #Riverdale Recaps

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itisa-profoundbond-sarandom · 4 years ago

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Destiel, Buddie: the great love patterns and one failure.

I'm going to highlight the patterns of baiting and good storytelling. Chim sounds like the Sam to Dean!Buck. Cas!Eddie and Claire/Jack!Chris.

WARNING: not a negative post, this is from a destielshipper!POV looking to something so beautiful like 9-1-1.

As someone pointed out: if Eddie was a girl they would've already get laid. Same thing with Dean if Cas was a girl.

(my gifs)

We know Dean and Buck like to get laid with many girls...and have some homo-joke-scenes with guys.

Dean Winchester being a disaster bi (since S1)

(+ Josh and roomate!Albert - I know someone ships it xD) What I really enjoyed with Buck/Abby is the meaning of the storyline. D (who likes older women also) and B always get the part of having fun, and when it comes to express their feelings, not all their crushes understand their soul and they don't always admit those with themselves.

Abby: I think I was afraid that If I came back, I would become that person again. Because I missed you. I wanted to see you. But I didn’t trust myself.

Buck: Because being there, being with me, you might lose yourself again?

Shannon: I can’t fail him again, or you and I won’t. I’m still learning how to be someone’s mother and after that maybe I can be someone’s wife.

Eddie [to Bobby]: [...] she wanted a divorce. And I’m still mad. How stupid is that? I’m agry at a dead person and at myself because I forgave her for everything, and that wasn’t enough. I wasn’t enough.

Buck [to Maddie]: You’re never the one getting left behind. You’re the one who leaves. You don’t know what’s like to watch someone you love walk away.

Dean [to Lisa]: When I do picture myself happy...it’s with you.

Lisa: You've got so much buried in there, and you push it down, and you push it down. Do you honestly think that you can go through life like that and not freak out? Just, what, drink half a fifth a night and you're good? Dean: You knew what you signed up for.

Lisa: Yeah. But I didn't expect Sam to come back. And I'm glad he's okay. I am. But the minute he walked through that door, I knew. It was over. You two have the most unhealthy, tangled-up, crazy thing I've ever seen. And as long as he's in your life, you're never gonna be happy. That came out so much harsher than I meant. Dean: It's not your fault.

Who does understand them? The best friend. Cas and Eddie are the best friends to who they talk to, they can feel judged by but it doesn't really matter (or it DOES); they trust each other and feel safe.

you gave up an entire army for one guy (dean)

thank you, for not giving up

stupid for the right reasons

maybe you could’ve come at it a little differently

The Abby-phase was very important 'cause B wanted to stop to think about just the sex part and really connect with the person, doin' romantic stuff, even VDay; feelings were in the game.

(He literally asked to the firetruck!girl to see her again...but she said no. Ali? She acted like a Lisa.)

B really tried to find someone and always felt left behind. D had two important relationships, one with Cassie (yeah, that's fun) and I liked her -but he couldn't have a black girlfriend, right(?). Always felt left behind, by his father, by his brother, his mother’ memories were a lie.

When we first see Cassie, they didn’t see each other in a very long time and they get a reunion during a case.

Much like Eddie and Shannon.

(not saying also this...but....this)

Lisa and the weird-and-bad-written-originally story with Amara...who knew Dean bc of his 'dark' side. (Amara has found Cas and Dean’s profound connection and Dean was scared by her darkness connected to his anger and loniless).

At one point Amara will find Dean thanks to Cas's heart just my reply to go fast (while Cas was possessed by Lucifer- an annoying bitch who is used as a destiel bait)

We know Buck for his autodiagnosed sex addiction with women and Eddie as a married man with a son and wife not in the picture...and the episode- I'm so sorry, but the beginning of S2 with Buddie can't be described as two hets - there are tropes.

We start to fall for them and Chim with Maddie, wait- Sam!Chim and Eileen!Maddie.

Sam and Eileen’ first episode is basically a blind date on a hunt. They flirt and make a badass duo, she's deaf and super sassy and they're so sweet together. Many start to ship it asap.

I cried with Madney asap.

What does Maddie do since Buck start talking about Chris and Eddie? Yeah.

What does happen in Fanfiction with Sam (he’s a Maddie here) and when Saileen comes back on S15?

Bros shipping their bros with their best friends, mirroring them.

Madney have Buddie patterns.

Saileen is presented as a Het!Destiel parallel...and they can kiss.

Sam asks Dean if he could start thinking about settle down with someone who understand the life, another hunter. Eileen is a hunter. Cas is an angel - the one who raised him from perdition and got lost for his beautiful soul/hunter.

I LOVE that Eddie can be just a friend to Lena and Marjan, basically (I hope not to see this ruined in the future).

Now, over the line: Dean has a mother figure in Bobby!Jody and Jody is shipped with Athena!Donna (also good friend to Dean) and he's got a sister figure in Hen!Charlie.

[Jody, Charlie]

(Jody and Donna have many daugthers figures and a spin-off who hasn't been picked bc too many poc girls, queer girls and two not young women with perfect bodies.)

Bobby!Jody helped him with his mother-plot-fiasco (that was really bad) and I loved Mary before s12.

[I'm having fun thinking about this connections, leave me alone if it'ss just a great big illusion]

I forgive you / of course I forgive you

personal space / personal space

Destiel, uncle!Sam and Jack

Destiel, uncle!Sam and Claire

*love is in the air*

oh and beside the MurphyPatterns (Klaine, Bryan&David) we do have the KripkePatterns also (Timeless, The Boys 2 3 )

One of the most loud BI!Dean eps

I’m ready for some domestic Buddie and Madney

Eileen and Cas back from the dead

Just to make you all laugh after this big movie, remember the chars:

what a destiel scene always looks like

THE END:

Yes, C*W and Fox aren’t the same, and yes producers can make the difference. all SPN writers WEREN’T the problem, directors neither, not to mention the actors.

C*W thrived on Destiel for 12 years, building a very good story that could’ve show two men accepting the love they deserved....but they failed, erasing every other (lgbtq, poc, disable) characters.

Fox doesn’t need more viewers but they WILL gain more of them showing Buddie because representation of a M/M ship with BI/PAN (I see Pan!Eddie) it’s a huge thing for TV and it matters. I always see gay love not many other possibilities, with Murphy mostly, he can make the change again.

A reminder to what C*W did

#destiel #buddie #I just want my couples to be happy

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roccinan · 4 years ago

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1/? simply because you have the most galaxy brain thoughts ever,,, what do you think would've happened if they waited until s5 to reveal sergio and andrés were (half)brothers?

i do know that when my fam started watching lcdp at first i was so put off. like i watched ep 1 and the prof creeped me out. ""berlin"" creeped me out. e v e r y o n e creeped me out. and i was cringing so hard becz of the short lived romance angle with alison parker. i literally did not watch s1 at all xcept for like sneak peeks. highlights being the scene where berlin discovers monica is alive and does his dramatic door by door thing? that was so SUSPENSEFUL even tho i had no idea what was going on. DOMINGO DE RESURECCION remains forever iconic.

2/? And OF COURSE the group bella ciao dance when they hit earth (hahah i thought the banda were actually like a "found family where they all love each other LOL") i am a SUCKER for found family. but anyhoo when i properly got intrigued was s2 when tokyo was kicked out (the music from that scene is still my favourite) it's just so dramatic..!! why am i telling u all this again? right, i haven't slept a wink and it's nearly 7 am pls forgive me if these rambles make no sense. i have a point with this.. i'm going somewhere

RIGHT. so when the fam actually rewound the ep cz i wanted to know WHY berlin did that (didn't fully realise how batsht crazy he can be), the russian roulette scene played. and pedro's acting. MAN. and like just that ep they made a point of showing us these flashbacks where sergio and andrés hug....

Hi anon! Thanks for stopping by- sorry took me a while to get back to you, will do my best to answer this string of messages (got all 4 parts)! Glad you like my thoughts XD

Firstly, I believe Andres/Sergio would be the biggest LCDP ship if the writers were evil enough to wait until s5 to reveal that they’re brothers asdfasdf. They’re already the two most popular male characters anyway.

It’d be especially crazy because it’s not like they tell the actors these things beforehand either. So that means there’d probably be a Serdres vs Berlermo vs Serquel fight every 5 minutes. I mean, even if not everyone agrees on everything in the lcdp fandom, it’s the most “peaceful” one I’ve ever been in because no character really gets in the way of any other ship (like even with helermo and berlermo there’s no true conflict since Andres is dead). But with Serdres in the mix?? CATASTROPHE. Everyone out here writing essays about how much of a bastard/bitch/homewrecker/motherfucker that Andres or Sergio or Martin or Raquel is. Never a moment’s peace!! so basically, a regular fandom lmao.

Then when we find out they’re brothers, it goes from catastrophe to Apocalypse. Suddenly serquel and berlermo have the upper hand. Everyone would double down and harass the crew/cast into whatever’s going on. Plot-wise, everything is the same though, just without Andres calling Sergio “hermanito.” Fandom however, would be a minefield! And I’m glad that’s not the case because I’d probably be an unfortunate serdres shippers XD No joke, my mother and I thought they were a couple in S1. So bullet dodged!

Secondly: haha, everyone creeped me out in S1 too, especially Berlin, I hated him, but thinking back, I think I mostly hated the fact that I didn’t hate him as much as I should have. I’ve made peace with it now but oh boy, was he a controversial figure in my head. I actually like the professor on sight though! IDK why, maybe because I thought his plans were cool or because of Alvaro’s delivery. I was afraid of an Alison Parker romance thing too- like, I do feel like she had a storyline that got dropped, but that part was quite cringey and overall unnecessary to the plot. Same with Ariadna, which was even cringier and even Less necessary to the plot.

Domingo de resurrecion was iconic though yes! And even with all that said, I genuinely enjoyed parts 1 and 2 because it was so different from anything else I’d seen. Not content wise, but maybe tonally? IDK, they were just really bold with a lot of things, like being objectively unafraid of having the protagonists (plural because all of them did LMAO) do objectively shitty things. Really kept me in suspense from beginning to end!

I’m usually a big fan of found families too! The funny thing is, then banda never struck me as a “family” until season 3. In 1 and 2, I was wondering what felt different about this show; then it hit me that these people remained colleagues to the end. Like, they backstabbed each other (repeatedly) and everyone was quite selfish, and only the bonds that were already there stuck. They were the opposite of a found family LOL But I think by S3, they went down the found family route and I didn’t mind because it makes quite a lot of sense for them to feel that bond after the Mint heist and almost dying/living together (and having witnessed 3 deaths together on the team). But I still doubt Berlin and Palermo were ever really part of this found family, with good reason XD

LOL the scene where Tokyo got kicked out is also among my favorites!! It was so funny and dramatic, and it was like, wow we can go anywhere with this now! Don’t worry- your rambles and thoughts are always welcome :D

I’m rolling over how you watched the Tokyo expulsion scene before the Russian Roulette scene haha. Also yes, PEDRO. Berlin may have been “controversial” to me at first, but I became Pedro’s fan from day one! Also the Hug is probably what made me like Berlin (despite my determination to hate him rip) in the first place.

3/? ... and like now that i think about it... tokyo had real guts huh. like she KNEW berlin was close enough to el prof to know his name (fhshshs imagine if she'd heard andrés saying 'hermanito' it's unrealistic that she didn't TBH. i mean obviously they decided to make them brothers only towards the end but like in canon universe. how tf did andrés de 'i raised my bby brother since he was 12 and i'd actually die for him and his stupidly brilliant plans' fonollosa go 5 months without slipping up once and calling sergio hermanito. or like,,, i like to imagine sergio kinda gave him lots of leeway(?) sergio's a lil oblivious too but like i'm sure half of it is.. that's my dumbass older bro shut up i'm not being partial you all have city names .. andr-berlin, pass the salt. like OOF. + sergio also knew his big bro was dYiNG so like. i'm sure they were sneaking in some quality time (i hope they did 😭 gosh imagine if sergio really did not ever consider the possibility of andrés dying in the heist so he'd tell himself he needs to perfect the plan now & anyway he'll have enough time to spend w/ his brother post heist in philippines. and then ... that happened :/

Tokyo has guts in place of braincells you bet that she’d do something like this, consequences be damned XD I also think it’s unrealistic for Andres not to slip up, but I have a feeling nobody besides Tokyo really tried to spy on them in private. I headcanon that Andres instead slips up and does things like ruffle Sergio’s hair or adjust his tie when other people are around. I also think Tokyo was convinced that they were a gay couple when she saw them hug XD And if Sergio never went on to tell the banda that Berlin was his brother, everyone would be giving Palermo such awkward looks after Nairobi accused him of being in love with Berlin LMAO.

I agree! I also imagine Sergio giving Andres leeway because he’s just so used to interacting with his brother that way haha. So either he’d go out of his way to ignore Berlin in front of everyone else or IDK, borderline telepathically communicate with him. Not even “pass the salt” has to leave his mouth- Berlin just puts salt into his food and cuts it up for him, in front of everyone who’s just staring like O.O

I actually do think Sergio never considered the possibility of Andres dying in the heist because he was just that confident in his own plan. Plus, Andres was probably the one person he expected to survive. And a lot of it has to do with Sergio’s attachment to him + Andres’ own habit of downplaying any illness/injury over the years, which I think is safe to believe canon. He was really in no condition to be in the heist, let alone lead it. Just the fact that he needs to take those injections is a big sign that he shouldn’t be there, but Sergio didn’t catch it because he’s human and blinded by faith :’) So yeah, I think Sergio was planning to spend proper time with Andres in Palawan and at Toledo, they just settled for those little moments by the fireplace.

4/? what always also just GETS me in the feels is that el prof was shown to be this in control creepily calm dude who is miles ahead of everyone. + in the 1st Toledo class itself we see how detached,, like how impersonal he is, how professional - choosing frickin CITY NAMES?! no 'personal relationships' ? (after recruiting his older brother, a father son pair, and war cousins... oh sergio 😂 he's such a frickin nerd and i love him) but like the earlier seasons really emphasised how robotic and down right COLD he can be. it still sometimes bothers me that he put the button in the car. he lead the police to his own damn brother, his blood, who took care of him and adopted him and was terminally ill and like - UGH i try to rationalise that sergio is that cold and unbothered. or that he has strict morals. but it still bothers me becz that button really sort of tipped andres' already unstable sanity. like andrés tells denver someth like you've robbed my future and after that he just seems so much more suicidal and accepting that he can't get out of the mint alive - WHY SERGIO WHY. I KNOW THAT AT THAT POINT YOU BASICALLY DIDN'T KNOW ANDRÉS WAS GOING TO BE YOUR BROTHER YET BECZ IT WASN'T WRITTEN IN THE SCRIPT BUT WHYYYYY

That’s so funny to me too LMAO No personal relationships, then he recruits these guys. Sergio, hello?? Also can’t forget how he just recruited his own girfrleind in the second heist too. Buddy! Love this nerd.

I don’t think that cold aspect of Sergio went away in later seasons either; he just had more opportunity to show a more open side of himself + without Andres, he had to metaphorically leave his comfort zone without a safety net. But in earlier seasons, he really did seem heartless at times XD Then again, we can argue that the same goes for Andres.

To be fair, I didn’t feel sorry for Andres over the button thing lol, but once the brothers reveal happened and all of Alvaro/Pedro’s headcanons came out and we know everything Andres did for Sergio, it makes what Sergio did REALLY harsh. We really just have to explain it through Sergio’s strict morals and him believing this to be the best non-fatal punishment for Andres, who at that point had convinced him he killed a hostage. And because he knew the television interview was coming up, maybe Sergio assumed Andres would use it to “clear” his name anyway. And empathy isn’t one of Sergio’s strong suits either, so through that lens, I can rationalize it.

Also it was lowkey funny to me how Andres was there like DENVER MUST DIE until he found out Sergio put the button there, then he was like “oh hermanito, you and your practical jokes <3″

Still, like you said, Andres and Sergio weren’t brothers yet at this point. They were probably supposed to be lovers lmao and had a dysfunctional Hannibal Lecter x Will thing going on. But because they made #hermanos canon, that button moment just feels very out of place now, especially given how much the two genuinely love each other.

Guess we could also say that Sergio’s just generally kinda bratty with Andres XD Like, he knows no matter what, Andres would forgive him anything. That’s how I see it anyway!

#anonymous #thanks for stopping by!#royalpaperhouse is this you my friend? :D

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deanstop13billyjoeltraxx · 4 years ago

Text

Superposition

a deancas college roommate au :)

Chapter 8 is up on AO3! Chapter-by-chapter masterlist here.

CW: mentions of verbal abuse, homophobia, alcoholism, jail time. instances of smoking.

some notes: I usually go through and italicize as necessary when I’m posting on tumblr because it doesn’t copy over from my og text, but this chapter is like 6200 words and i’m just not gonna do that. recommend reading on AO3 for the best experience!!

An Exercise in Futility

Three Years Earlier

Castiel was convinced that his life was one massive, cosmic joke.

He’d been considering the possibility for some time. Being the gay son of a homophobic pastor does that to a person. When he discovered, sometime around the age of twelve, that the girls in his Sunday school class were far less interesting than the boys, he could practically feel God laughing at him. Then there was high school, where the religious prattling was replaced by what felt like endless torment at the hands of his peers.

He felt like college was quickly becoming the third punchline.

Not that things were bad. Things were good, actually, better than they’d been in years. He was learning about things he cared about. He passed his midterms with flying colors. He even had friends. He spent a weekend watching all of the Lord of the Rings with Charlie. He had switched seats in accounting to sit next to Meg.

And, of course, there was Dean. Dean, who dragged Cas to a football game and didn’t drink a sip of alcohol the whole time in solidarity; Dean, who, after Tombstone, insisted on movie night every Tuesday; Dean, who, demanded that Cas print out a copy of one of his short stories and sign it (“When you’re a famous douchebag, this is gonna be worth so much money”).

It seemed that, on all fronts, Castiel had finally capitalized on the collegiate promise of a second chance.

But by his own estimation, he was doomed.

Because sometimes, his palms started sweating when Dean stood too close. Sometimes, his heartbeat skipped when Dean threw an arm across Cas’s shoulders. Sometimes, Cas woke up from a dream so vivid, he was disappointed to find himself alone in his bunk bed.

He could see how easy it would be to fall in love with Dean Winchester, what with the blond hair and green eyes, bright smiles and southern lilt, funny jokes and considerate actions. The prospect was utterly terrifying, and Castiel was doing everything in his power to stop dwelling on it.

He’d been down the “falling in love with your straight best friend” road before. AP biology class brought Cas a lab partner in Ben Wright. Soccer team captain, A-student, all around nice guy. Maybe Ben didn’t do anything to stop the constant verbal torment, but he never took part in it. At first, being around him was exhilarating. Sharing looks, catching smiles, trading inside jokes; Cas was intoxicated. He was so high on first love that he made the mistake of confiding in Bartholomew. Cas had always considered him to be a role model, friend and brother at the same time. But that night, when Cas came out, Bartholomew looked at him like one might look at spoiled food. He’d agreed not to tell their father, on the condition that Cas never speak about the matter again, that he figure out some way to “cleanse himself.” They hadn’t spoken since that night.

And so the feelings that once propelled Castiel to school with anticipation suddenly made him dread it. Not only did baring his soul to a brother get him a one-way ticket to estrangement, but Ben started dating someone else, a girl from his English class. Now every shared look was painful, smiles were false, inside jokes stopped being funny.

It was somehow worse, knowing Ben could never feel the same way. It certainly didn’t help the feelings of guilt and shame brought by his family.

Cas would do anything not to feel that way again.

He started by insisting that Dean invite Benny and Charlie to more of their nightly dinners. And while he honestly liked the both of them, he would be lying if he didn’t admit that their presence was, first and foremost, a distraction from Dean. He took up running again, as a way to get himself out of the dorm when Dean decided to stay in. He spent more time studying with Meg.

Meg was shockingly easy to befriend. She wasn’t nice — Cas had watched in shock when, once, she dumped a hot coffee on a skateboarder who had knocked her down on accident — but she never said a mean thing to Castiel. She was like him: a black sheep, the child everyone wished they could forget. Only, where Cas had become an agnostic and gone to college, Meg had become a Satanist and gone to jail for arson.

But this was her new leaf, she told him. Maybe it didn’t matter why someone needed a second chance, only that they were willing to take one.

They had been working for an hour when she threw her pen at his head and said, “Cas, you should come with me to Sig Ep’s Halloween party tomorrow. Be my date.”

Cas took a moment to process the meaning of party + date + with Meg. “Uh, I don’t — well, um, parties aren’t really —”

She raised an eyebrow at him. “You’re allowed to say no, hun.”

Cas panicked. Meg was looking at him expectantly, her resigned smile making it clear she was prepared for rejection.

“Well, I… It’s not because of you — you’re very beautiful, and smart. Actually, you’re one of the most wonderful people I’ve met here.” She grinned at that. “It’s just, I don’t really… Go on dates. With girls.”

She studied him a moment before understanding lit up her face. “Oh.”

Castiel fidgeted with his pencil, refusing to meet her eyes. He’d only ever done this once, and it hadn’t gone well. But he liked having a friend, and more than that, he liked having Meg as a friend. He didn’t want her to think he wasn’t interested because of any fault of her own.

“Cas,” she said. When he didn’t respond, she poked him in the arm. “Castiel.” He raised his eyes. “It’s cool. It’s not like you can just choose to like girls when a pretty one asks you on a date.”

“I… Understand, if you would rather not be friends,” Cas said, cautiously.

“What?” Meg’s eyes widened. “What are you talking about? Why would I not want to be friends?” She laughed a little. “That would be super ironic, considering I told you I went to juvie and you didn’t bat an eye.”

“Because I’m gay,” Cas said quietly, looking down again.

Meg grabbed both his hands. “Cas, hun, there’s nothing wrong with being gay.”

He looked up again, eyes wide. “What? I mean, I know that, I just… Not everyone does.”

Meg smiled sadly at him and gripped his hands a little tighter. “Well, I do. No biggie. We’re going to be iconic together, you and I. Sexiest gay-straight alliance of all time.”

Cas smiled weakly, relief flooding his entire body. “Thank you, Meg. I’m sorry, I didn’t intend to make any judgements on your character. It’s just… This,” he motioned at the air between them, “has never gone well for me.”

Meg shook her head. “That’s a shame,” she said. “I haven’t known you that long. But I think I can tell that you — all the parts of you — are awesome.”

“You can still come to the party,” she added after a moment.

Cas shook his head, capping and uncapping his pen repeatedly. “Parties… They’re not really my scene.”

“All right. You know who to call if you change your mind.”

On Halloween, Castiel returned from his nightly run to find Dean pulling on a flannel. He checked his watch — he had barely made it. 6:57 pm.

“Right on time,” Dean said. “I was about to leave without you.”

“I would have never forgiven you if you did,” Cas joked. Then, “Are Charlie and Benny coming?”

“Nah, they’re both busy tonight. Halloween parties, you know.”

“Oh.” Castiel took a large sip of his water. “You’re not attending a Halloween party?”

Dean shrugged. “Wasn’t really feeling it tonight. Plus, I have a feeling you’ve never seen The Exorcist?” When Cas shook his head, Dean rubbed his hands together. “Oh man, we are totally watching it tonight. Unless you’re busy,” he added, raising his eyebrows at Cas.

“I’m not,” Cas replied. Dean knew this already, of course, otherwise Cas might have made something up. The waters in which he tread got more dangerous each day. He couldn’t escape the warm feeling flooding his chest at the idea of Dean ditching the parties for a movie night.

It was precisely that feeling that caused him to hurriedly ask, “Would you mind if I invited Meg to dinner?”

“Who?” Dean asked, lacing up his boots.

“Meg Masters. She’s the friend from accounting that I told you about.”

“Ah,” Dean said. “Right. What, just me isn’t good enough anymore?” Cas thought he was joking, but it seemed forced.

“Dean —”

“I’m kidding, man,” Dean said with a short laugh. “Sure, she can come.”

Castiel hurriedly splashed his face with cold water and shed his sweaty t-shirt in favor of a hoodie. Dean feigned a sniff in his direction and made a face, to which Cas replied with an eye-roll. As they left their dorm, Cas sent a text to Meg.

CN (7:02 pm)

Would you like to get dinner with Dean and me?

CN (7:02 pm)

Unless you’re already at your party, in which case, be safe.

MM (7:03 pm)

Party not til later. hot roommate dean?

CN (7:04 pm)

...Is that a yes?

MM (7:04 pm)

Yes please ;) shocker dining?

CN (7:05 pm)

Yes. We’ll meet you there.

Dean grabbed a burger and an inordinate amount of fries while Castiel loaded his plate with spaghetti and a salad. Meg walked into the dining room just after he and Dean sat down, and Cas waved her over.

“Meg,” he said, offering her the seat next to his, “this is Dean Winchester. Dean, this is Meg Masters.” Dean smiled at her with a mouthful of french fries. Cas dropped his head in exasperation.

“Pleasure,” Meg said with a half-cocked smile. “I’ve heard a lot about you.”

Dean shrugged. “I am pretty awesome. Can’t say the same about you, though.”

Cas went bright red. He shot Dean a glare, then turned to Meg. “He’s joking —”

Meg’s grin only widened, and she giggled. “It’s all right, Cas, I’m not very interesting.” She raised an eyebrow at him. He became extremely intent upon eating his dinner.

Dean stared at her for a moment, chewing a bite of burger. “So,” he said, leaning back in his chair. “You know Cas from accounting?”

“That’s right,” Meg said brightly.

“So he’s your tutor or somethin’?”

Cas interjected. “Actually, Meg is far more capable than I am. She essentially taught me everything about liabilities.”

“Adorable,” Dean grumbled.

“Isn’t it?” Meg asked sweetly. “And you’re his roommate.”

“Yep.”

“Lucky you.” She gave him a wink. Dean choked on his diet Coke, and Castiel prayed to whomever was listening that he might cease to exist.

“Meg,” he said, giving her a pointed look, “did you finish the homework?”

She pulled her eyes away from Dean. “Yeah, I did.” She dropped her voice. “Did you want to go over it? At my place?” She winked at Cas, who stared at her in horror. Why was she acting like this? “You know,” Meg continued, “We can do other things too. Besides accounting.”

Dean cleared his throat loudly. “I’m gonna go grab some more fries. Do y’all want anything?”

Cas and Meg shook their heads. When Dean had left the table, Cas gave Meg a death stare.

“What’s wrong with you?” He hissed. “I thought we covered this —”

“Yes, Cas, hun, I know you’re extraordinarily gay,” Meg said with an eyeroll. “I’m not actually interested. I’m just conducting an experiment.”

Cas narrowed his eyes. “What ‘experiment’—”

He closed his mouth abruptly and leaned away from Meg when he saw Dean returning from the buffet line. He returned to his seat, looking between Cas and Meg suspiciously. Cas downed his water in one swift action.

“So, Dean,” Meg said after taking a bite of her pizza. “I hear you’re educating our friend here on pop culture.”

Dean didn’t bother to look up at her while he swirled a fry in ketchup. “Guess so.”

Cas cleared his throat to interject. This direction of conversation was much better. “Meg asked what my favorite movie was,” he explained to Dean, who still hadn’t looked up from his plate. “I told her about how much I liked Back to the Future when we watched it last week.”

Dean gave him a small smile. “Yeah, that movie’s friggin’ awesome.”

Cas turned to Meg. “We’re watching The Exorcist tonight.”

Meg gasped dramatically. “So that’s why you blew off our date?”

Dean sputtered into his drink. “Date?” He said through a cough.

Cas looked helplessly at Meg, who unhelpfully smiled back. He was going to have words with her after this.

“I asked him to come to the SigEp party, but he said he was busy,” Meg said, feigning a pout. “But I get it, parties aren’t really Cas’s thing, anyway.”

Dean’s eyes flickered quickly between Cas and Meg. “All right, am I missing something?” He asked. His leg was bouncing against the table leg, hard enough that Cas’s plate was vibrating.

Cas looked at him, panicked, and stuttered out, “I don’t —”

“Like what?” Meg asked, sipping on her water.

“You his girlfriend or somethin’?”

This question delighted Meg. “Why don’t you ask him?”

Dean turned to Cas with an exasperated look. “Well?” He prodded.

Cas was sure he was about three different shades of red at this point. “What — I — no,” he sputtered.

Dean seemed to relax a little. Meg was still grinning like a madman. “There you go,” she said.

Castiel could not formulate a single coherent thought. He was confused as to how they even ended up here. The silence between the three of them was thick and awkward. Meg paid it no mind, just popped a strawberry in her mouth and gave Dean a sickly sweet smile. Dean excused himself to use the restroom, hitting his leg on the table and nearly tripping over his chair. Once he had left, Meg turned to Cas, her eyes sparkling.

“You are so in,” she said.

“What the hell was that?” He asked her. “What just happened?”

“He thinks I’m into you,” she explained. She took a bite of her pizza, then continued, “And he thinks you might be into me. And he hates that.”

“That’s ridiculous,” Cas scoffed.

Meg laughed, throwing her head back. When Cas fixed her with a glare, her eyes widened. “You really don’t see it?”

Cas pinched the bridge of his nose. “There’s nothing to ‘see’. I already told you.”

“Yeah, right. Whatever, you’ll thank me later.”

“For creating what is perhaps the most awkward dinner I’ve ever had in my life?”

She waved him off. “Don’t be such a baby, it wasn’t that bad.”

Cas gave her a look that suggested otherwise. She sighed.

“Look, the way you talk about him…” Meg grabbed Cas's hand when he rolled his eyes. “I’m serious. You like him, and now you know he likes you too.” She sat up proudly. “I just did all the heavy lifting for you.”

“Right,” Cas said, his voice dripping with sarcasm. “Obviously, this interaction points to an inevitable romantic encounter. Except, and I think this is important, Dean is not gay.”

Meg raised an eyebrow. “Well, the way he looks at you, he’s not straight either. Plus, he apparently still thinks you’re straight, so you two haven’t had that conversation yet. He could be flamingly bisexual and you would never know.”

“This conversation is exhausting.” Cas felt like he was watching a Disney Channel Original Movie, and Meg was a fifteen-year-old matchmaker.

Meg laughed. “I’m sure you’ll survive. By the way, did you actually want to go over the homework this weekend?”

“Yes,” he said, relieved at the change in subject.

Dean returned then. “Are y’all done?” He asked, pointing to their plates. Cas and Meg both nodded, offering “thank you’s” as Dean took their plates to the dish rack. They followed him to the exit, the crisp air sending a chill through Castiel.

“Did you want me to walk back with you, Meg?” Cas offered.

She beamed at him. “You’re so sweet, but no. I’m getting an Uber to Sig Ep, anyway.” She dug into her coat pocket and pulled out something small and black. “Plus, if anyone tries anything, they’ll find themselves electrocuted. Just a little bit.”

Cas grinned. Dean raised an eyebrow.

“See you on Monday, Cas,” Meg said, giving him a hug that lasted just a touch too long. “It was good to meet you, Dean.”

“You too,” Dean muttered.

They watched her walk away for a moment. Cas wanted to avoid looking at Dean for as long as humanly possible. He had no idea how he was supposed to explain the previous interaction.

“So,” Dean said, clearing his throat. “She’s… Nice.”

“She is,” Castiel agreed earnestly. “Dean, I’m sorry, Meg can be a bit…” He struggled to find an adequate descriptor. “I think she enjoys others’ discomfort a bit too much, sometimes,” he finished.

Dean let out a short laugh. “Yeah. Yeah, I guess so. It’s not a big deal, man.”

They stood in silence, Dean looking at the ground intently, Cas tugging on the strings of his hoodie. Dean kicked a rock, then sighed. “You, uh, you ready to head back?”

“Yes,” Cas replied.

The walk back to their dorm was quiet. Castiel couldn’t tell for sure, but he thought Dean looked bothered. He felt bad — he had honestly expected for Meg and Dean to get along. He had thought them to be similar in their confident and boisterous personalities. Now, he wondered if that was precisely the problem. Too much personality at the same dinner table. He winced internally at his own poor judgement. Meg obviously took no issue with the encounter, but he worried that Dean might hold it against him.

Dean let them into their room, then wrinkled his nose at Cas once more. “Dude, seriously, go take a shower. You’re gross.”

“Actually, I enjoy the feeling of my sweat drying all over my skin. I was thinking of going straight to bed like this. It’s not as if I didn’t take a shower because of your constant insistence upon eating meals at the same time every day”

Dean made a gagging motion. “Hey, we had an appointment, and you were almost late. How is that my fault?”

Cas just rolled his eyes and gathered his things to head to the showers. He let out a muttered, “Crap” when he realized nearly all of his laundry was dirty. He’d been busy this week, and running every day tended to render his clothes unwearable after a single use. He made a mental note to do laundry first thing in the morning. He was able to find an old pair of gym shorts, but not a single t-shirt remained in his closet. Cas groaned inwardly. So he would simply have to sit next to Dean for approximately two-and-a-half hours, shirtless. Fantastic.

When he returned from his shower, Cas found Dean cooking two bags of popcorn, the title menu of The Exorcist already on screen. Dean stood up from the microwave when Cas entered, and was halfway into a thumbs-up when he did a double take.

“Uh… We goin’ shirtless tonight, Baywatch?” He said, tugging at his collar.

Castiel tilted his head. “I don’t understand that reference.”

“Of course you don’t,” Dean said with a chuckle. “Seriously, though, dude.”

Cas sighed as he sat on their beanbag. “I have a lot of laundry to do tomorrow,” he said by way of an explanation.

Dean didn’t respond, but made his way to his own closet. He ruffled through it for a moment before Cas was hit in the face by a t-shirt.

“Here, just wear one of mine,” Dean said. He coughed and crossed his arms over his chest. “‘S kinda cold in here, anyway.”

Cas held up the shirt. It was a Led Zeppelin graphic tee, vintage, from their tour in 1977. Cas raised his eyebrows at Dean.

“It’s pretty awesome right?” Cas donned the t-shirt. “Sammy got it for me from a Goodwill a couple years ago. Another of my prized possessions.” He looked at Cas with feigned scrutiny. “Looks good on you,” he said.

Cas played with the hem as he said, “Thank you.” Dean coughed again and walked back to the microwave to retrieve their popcorn. The air was palpable with awkwardness.

Dean turned out the lights. They settled onto the beanbag, as had become custom in the last few weeks.

Not even thirty minutes in, Dean’s phone began to ring. “Hey, my brother’s callin’, can you pause it?” Dean said.

Cas obliged, and Dean stood as he said, “Hey, Sammy, how’s it goin’?”

Cas sat awkwardly with his hands in his lap, doing his best not to eavesdrop on Dean’s conversation. Though, he supposed if it was private, Dean could have moved to the hallway. Instead, he leaned against the door, twisting the beaded bracelet on his left hand.

“He did what?” Dean suddenly yelled, and Cas jumped. Dean shot him a quick apologetic look. “

“Sammy, calm down, it’s okay,” Dean said, and Cas couldn’t pretend to not listen anymore. He looked at Dean with a silent question, but Dean was staring hard at the wall, his free hand balled into a fist.

“Put him on the phone,” Dean said in a low voice. A pause. “What, so now he’s allowed to treat you like shit whenever he wants?” Another pause. A slow exhale from Dean. “No, you’re right. I don’t… I won’t make it worse.” Pause. “Do you want me to come down there? Because I will, you know I will.”

Dean was silent for a long moment before asking, “Are you sure?” He sighed at whatever his brother said on the other line. “Okay. Let me know if you need anything, I guess. And Sam? I’m really fucking sorry. I should’ve stayed, I don’t…” He trailed off and pinched the bridge of his nose. “No, I know. Yeah. Okay, I’ll talk to you later. Bye.”

Dean lowered the phone from his ear. He stood silently for a moment, angry gaze directed at the floor. Then, causing Cas to jump once more, he turned and hurled his fist at the door.

There was a loud thud upon impact, and then Dean was yelling “Fuck! Goddammit!” as he cradled his hand. Cas stood abruptly, but had no idea what to do. He walked toward Dean, cautiously.

Dean’s eyes were closed, and he was heaving deep breaths. Cas put a hand on his shoulder. “Dean?” He ventured.

“Sorry,” Dean mumbled, still not looking at Cas. “I just — Fuck, that was so stupid,” he said, shaking out his affected hand. “Sorry,” he repeated to the wall.

“It’s fine,” Cas said, even though he thought it definitely wasn’t. “What happened?”

Dean just shook his head. Cas’s hand remained on his shoulder. He tightened his grip, a little nervous that Dean might shove him off. “Dean,” he persisted. “You can tell me.”

Finally, Dean looked at him, and Cas thought if that level of rage was ever directed at him, he would promptly die. Instead, he raised an eyebrow. “Are you all right?”

“No,” Dean growled. “I gotta — I don’t know, I need to calm down. I don’t actually want to break something,” he said, motioning to the door. “I’m gonna go for a smoke.”

Cas dropped his hand and folded his arms across his chest. “I’ll go with you.”

“Cas —” Dean started, but Cas silenced him with a look. He grabbed one of Dean’s flannels from his desk chair and threw it at him. Dean caught it with a cross between surprise and irritation. Cas grabbed his own windbreaker and put it on, looking expectantly at Dean.

“Are we going?” He asked.

Dean looked at him as if he was trying to decide whether arguing was worth it. A sigh confirmed that it wasn’t. He silently pulled on his flannel and opened the door, ushering Cas through before exiting himself.

They walked in silence, despite the fervor of Cas’s concern and curiosity at Dean’s outburst. Dean’s jaw was set, and he took a long, slow breath when they hit the crisp fall air. When they reached the Impala, Cas silently moved to lean on the hood while Dean retrieved his lighter and a cigarette.

Dean joined Cas as he took a long draw. He exhaled the smoke upwards, his eyes closed. His face was still turned to the sky when he asked, “This really doesn’t bother you?”

“What?”

Dean brandished his cigarette in answer, turning to raise an eyebrow at Cas.

Cas shrugged. “It’s not particularly comforting. But, there are worse things.” He shoved his hands into his pockets and looked up thoughtfully. “Besides, you’ve been smoking for years. If anyone could convince you to quit, your random college roommate isn’t the most likely option.”

Dean gave him a strange look before exhaling another plume of smoke. He coughed a little. “I think you have long passed the line between ‘random roommate’ and ‘new best friend.’”

Cas gave a little chuckle. “That’s good to hear.” Inside, his world was falling down and rebuilding itself anew. Dean thought of Cas as his best friend. Cas had never known that feeling, to have someone care about him like that. Cas wondered if that could be enough, being Dean’s best friend.

He didn’t say anything more, though, just let Dean finish his cigarette. After throwing the butt on the pavement and stomping on it, he heaved a sigh.

“My dad…” He started, but paused. “He, uh, he said some stuff to Sam. My brother.”

Cas nodded, doing his best to keep his face neutral. Talking things through wasn’t Dean’s strong suit, and Cas didn’t want dramatics to make it more difficult.

“What did he say?”

Dean shifted and rubbed his hands together. “Bunch of bullshit. ‘It’s your fault your Mom’s dead, it should have been you instead of her.’” Dean rubbed a hand over his mouth. “I mean, he used to say that to me. He gets into these moods when he drinks, says a bunch of shit he doesn’t mean.”

Dean shoved himself off the hood and began to pace in front of Cas. “But I could take it, you know? Sammy’s just a kid. He doesn’t need to hear that.”

“Your father says things like this often?” Cas asked, a tinge of horror in his voice.

“He used to. But only to me. Never to Sam.”

Cas took a deep breath, trying to discern how best to proceed. “Dean,” he said slowly, “he shouldn’t say those things. Ever. Not to Sam, and not to you.”

“I’m just confused,” Dean said. “And pissed. Sam and him are usually okay. I mean, they’re not buddies or anything, but Dad leaves him alone for the most part.”

“I don’t want to overstep,” Cas said, “But it seems like your father used you as an outlet for misplaced rage. A punching bag, if you will. And now you’re gone, so Sam is the next best thing.”

Dean met Cas'seyes with a horrified look. “God. I didn’t… You’re right. Shit, this is my fault, I can’t believe I —”

“No, Dean,” Cas growled. He stood and grabbed Dean by both shoulders. “This is your father’s fault. Not yours.”

“But I left Sam, alone, with him,” Dean said, and Cas could see panic rising in his eyes. “How could I do that, why —” Cas interrupted him again. “Why did you decide to attend college, Dean? What’s the real reason?”

“What?” Dean gave him an incredulous look. “I don’t know.”

Cas tilted his head down, skeptical.

Dean let out a long sigh. “Okay, all right. I went because Sam is smart, and he needs to go. But we don’t have any money. So I figured if I came and got a degree or some shit, I could make enough to throw him some cash while he goes to school. Get some summer internships and save up for his college fund. He’d probably still have to take out loans and stuff, but if I got a good job, I could help him pay them off.”

Cas wasn’t sure what answer he had expected, but it wasn’t that one. He felt his heart break for the man standing in front of him, who did everything he could and more for the people he cared about and never felt like it was enough.

“Would Sam ever hold that against you?” When Dean didn’t respond, Cas continued. “I know I wouldn’t. I have four older siblings, and not a single one of them has ever done something like that for me.”

“But—”

“You’re making yourself miserable over something that isn’t your fault,” Cas said. “Did you have anyone protecting you when your father went on a tirade?”

“No, but—”

“Is Sam incapable of handling himself?”

“No, but Cas—”

“He’ll be alright, Dean,” Cas insisted. “You can’t live your whole life as his shield. You’ll break yourself trying.”

Dean was silent, and wouldn’t meet Cas's eyes. Cas dropped his hands and leaned back against the Impala. “Did you ever think that Sam might have wanted you to go to school simply so you could get yourself out? Did you ever think that Sam hates the way your father treated you as much as you hate what he did to Sam tonight?”

Dean pursed his lips together, but his jaw relaxed slightly. Finally, he muttered, “I guess I never thought about it like that.”

Cas felt relief wash over him. He’d never seen Dean like this — angry and frantic. Cas wondered if Dean always did this, shouldered the blame for every bad thing his brother had to endure. The thought made his chest hurt.

Dean’s hands were hanging limply at his side. He looked exhausted. Against his better judgement, Cas grabbed Dean by the forearm and pulled him into a hug. Dean was still for a moment, but then sighed and rested his head on Cas's shoulder.

“Sorry, man,” he said. “I didn’t mean to act like that, punching things and shit. I just get so angry, and I don’t know what to do with it.”

Cas was trying very hard to form a coherent thought. “There’s no need for apologies. I understand.”

A chuckle escaped Dean’s lips. “You must think I’m a complete nutjob, huh?”

Cas tilted his head in consideration. Dean’s hair tickled his cheek. “No. I think your father spent years verbally abusing you, and you’re doing your best in spite of that.”

Dean broke the hug abruptly. The sudden space between them felt criminal. “I mean, I don’t know if it’s abuse…” He started, but, at Cas's look, he trailed off. Dean rubbed the back of his neck. “Thanks, Cas,” he said quietly. “Honestly, dude, I don’t know what I would have done without you.”

Cas's cheeks warmed, and he shrugged. “You would have done the same for me.”

Dean gave him a small smile. Cas’s heart nearly broke with relief. “I’m beat,” he said. “Bed?”

Cas nodded eagerly. “Bed.”

When they reached the stairs, Dean broke the heavy silence.

“So…” He began. There was a false brightness in his voice; he was obviously searching for levity. “You hanging out with your girlfriend tomorrow?”

“If you’re referring to Meg, she’s still not my girlfriend,” Cas replied vacantly. “And yes.” He suddenly felt exhausted. First the mortifying dinner with Meg, then the heavy conversation with Dean. He hardly had it in him to field jokes about Meg being his girlfriend.

“She’s not your girlfriend yet,” Dean amended, giving Cas a smirk that didn’t meet his eyes.

And what was Cas supposed to say to that? Meg was funny and smart and beautiful. She and Cas studied together on the regular. There was absolutely no reason he shouldn’t be interested in Meg from Dean’s perspective.

Of course, if Dean knew he was gay…

Cas didn’t know if he could face the consequences of coming out to Dean. Would he be upset that Cas hadn’t told him earlier? Would he be uncomfortable with a gay man as his roommate? As his friend? Cas may have expanded his social circle, but he still couldn’t bear to lose Dean.

But, then again, Dean had defended him once already, without knowing whether or not he was gay. He’d sounded indifferent to the possibility then. And just tonight, he’d called Cas his best friend. Dean cared more deeply for his friends and family than anyone Cas had ever met. Cas was in that group. Dean wouldn’t shove him out of it because of who he loved.

Right?

As they reached the entrance to their hall, Dean poked Cas in the shoulder. “Hey, Earth to Major Tom,” he said. “You okay over there?”

Cas realized he hadn’t said a word since they started their ascent up the stairs. He sighed heavily.

Perhaps this was as good a time as any.

“Dean,” he said, but closed his mouth. He should just say it. He had nothing to worry about. This wasn’t Bartholomew. He knew that, but the words remained stuck in his throat.

“What?” Dean said, eyebrows raised. “Cas,” he prodded, waving a hand in front of Cas’s face.

“I’m not…” Cas swallowed. “I will never date Meg,” he finished, with a pointed look.

Dean side-eyed him as they walked to their door. “What, she’s not your type?”

Cas gave him a lopsided smile. “You could say that.”

“I dunno, man, maybe you should reconsider, you two are pretty adorable, in a gross way —”

“Dean.” Cas was about to rip his hair out. He wasn’t taking the hint. “She’s not my type. She’s a girl.”

Realization dawned on Dean’s face. “Oh,” he said.

“I apologize for not telling you sooner,” Cas said, bracing for the worst. “If that makes you uncomfortable, I understand —”

“What?” Dean practically shouted. At Cas’s look of surprise, he lowered his voice. “No, Cas, are you kidding? I thought I told you, after all that shit with Cole. It’s not a big deal.”

“Knowing your roommate might possibly be gay and knowing he is, indeed, gay are two very different things.”

Dean looked at Cas like he had just made the worst joke in the world. “I’m not gonna, like, try to move out.” As they approached their room, Cas stared resolutely ahead, walking with purpose. But Dean jumped out in front of him, a hand on Cas’s chest to stop him in his tracks.

“Dude, it’s gonna take more than that to get rid of me. I lost my shit and punched a door, like, an hour ago, and you barely even blinked.” Dean crossed his arms over his chest.

Cas met Dean’s eyes and found unparalleled sincerity.

“I don’t… You’re not the least bit upset?” Cas asked, slightly incredulous.

Dean shrugged. “You’re my best friend, Cas,” he said as he straightened. “Nothing’s gonna change that.” He pulled on his bracelet. “I do feel bad though, for making you feel like you couldn’t tell me. Not that you had to, or anything,” he added in a rush.

Cas shook his head vigorously. “It has nothing to do with you, Dean. I’m… I’m new at this,” Cas explained. “The first time, with Bartholomew… I believe he was, as you would say, a dick about it.”

Dean’s eyes turned stormy. “Bastard,” he said. “I’m sorry, Cas. You shouldn’t have had to deal with that.”

Cas nodded. “You’re right. It was rather unfortunate. I haven’t spoken to him since the night I told him I was gay.”

Dean moved back to Cas’s side and slung an arm around his shoulders. “His loss,” he said. “You’re friggin’ awesome, dude.”

Cas smiled. Dean patted him on the back and let the two of them into their room.

Cas brushed his teeth and climbed into bed. Dean returned minutes later from a shower, and he flipped off the lights as he made his way to his own bunk.

Cas pulled off Dean’s shirt and threw it across the room. Dean’s head caught it, and he yelped.

“Thank you for the loan,” Cas said, smiling.

An odd expression crossed Dean’s face before he threw the Zeppelin shirt back to Cas. “Keep it,” he said. When Cas gave him a confused look, he put a hand on the back of his neck. “I meant what I said. Looks good on you.”

---------

tagging @nguyenxtrang :)))

#supernatural #destiel #deancas #destiel fic #spn

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keagan-ashleigh · 4 years ago

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Even though I am not mad at this ending and think some aspects of it were nice, there is still a few things that I actually think were... not good. I am going to talk about what I think was right then explain what I think was wrong (I defend them in my last post, that doesn't mean agree with everything they did).

Like I said in my other posts, I don't think the writers are ill intentioned but just sloppy, and a little bit clueless. Like, I don't think they actually sat down and said "ah ah lets get people mad 😈". We can't brush away the fact they have really been trying to do something right, it's easy to judge on a single episode but the show as a whole has been very progressive and meaningful in terms of representation, advocating for equality, and in terms of respecting the fandom and especially fanwork. They have been on our side all along, writers and cast, so, no, I don't think they actually meant to hurt their audience.

I am struggling to formulate my point, it'd be easier in my mother tongue, but I think we idealized their writing, so of course they can't meet our expectations in terms of quality. For starters, I have never thought Supernatural writers were excellent to begin with. They have done amazing things in terms of storytelling, but also, they did some really disappointing writing, it has been irregular in quality since a long time. So it's not a surprise that they don't meet expectations. But I sincerely hate the idea that they're accused of being willingly abject with the fans by disrespecting the characters, I am not excusing everything but I don't think they deserve such virulence.

They don't disrespect the characters, they've just never read them like the fans did. They failed to give them the perfect ending because they really did think this is the ending their characters needed. That doesn't mean they didn't give an ending that was decent it's just not the ending that meets the perception we have of the characters, it's the ending for the characters they wrote, not the ones we read.

We see characters that have been fighting for freedom and that fight against fate, we have seen their growth from a perspective the writers don't have. What the writers gave them is the end they where supposed to meet at the beginning. Dean deserves rest and to be at peace with himself, Sam deserves a normal life, they gave them that, 100%. It fits the characters they wrote, it gives them an end that ultimately suits them. There isn't an issue with that in itself - I know everyone in my timeline might disagree with that lol. Considering Dean has been fight his whole life, fighting for survival, fighting to please his father, fighting to fulfill Chuck's desires, in the end he just chose to not fight, to give up because for the first time in his life, it's okay, he can go, there is no battle he needs to fight anymore. Sam has been robbed from a life he wished for, a life he designed for himself that has been taken away because hunting called back to him, the writers gave him the ideal life he wanted, a wife, a kid, a house with a fence and he died of old age peacefully. I've seen people complain that it's back to square one because that was their initial destiny, but, in fact... this is ok. Castiel end his story by finding love, by standing for himself, and by sacrificing everything for the one person he loved the most. That is, in fact, in character. Their end was beautiful in itself.

Now the issue I have with that, is that the writers obviously lost grip on the meta aspect of their writing and failed to see their characters were going in a different direction than the one they wrote. They failed to see this wasn't their characters anymore, and failed to take into account our perspective. Which is ironic because they convinced Jensen that their ending was true to the audience's perspective. We've been reading into the fact Chuck was the writer loosing grasp on his story, that the story was handed to the fans because it belongs to them - I think it's right to read it like that, but I also think the writers are just clueless about that reading. We gave them much credit for this meta aspect but I don't actually think they were controlling it as much as think.

The issue I have with this ending, mostly, is what I think has always been their flaw, they struggle with construction and rythm, and struggle with making their point come across. They naively think they gave us treats, like the dog reference, the pie contestcontest, they integrated that sloppily to this episode.

I've seen people ask what the pie contest meant... It's an inside joke with the fandom. It's there to talk to us through the show, it's sloppy but the intention here is to say "here is a wink for the fandom that did such good job at imprinting the show in pop culture and had such fun turning the pie thing into an immortal meme, thank you, here's one last laugh for you" (I did laugh). I also think somehow to them it meant giving a return to normalcy to Dean, gave him a bit of naiveness back, to show that his heart was lighter due to the fact he solved his issues with self loathing, with baring all the responsibilities by himself, it shows him at peace. And that's one of the reason why I din't think they completely ignored his character development, they were bad at showing it though, because the rythm was bonkers. They didn't took the time to actually tell it, but Dean did solved his issues between ep 19 and ep 20. He DID found normalcy, peace of mind, self love, and relief, he didn't just found happiness in death, he welcomed death because he was happy with his life. And we see him go to heaven and be happy in heaven because he never thought he'd make it there. What the writers did wrong is that we read that Dean was at first seen as daddy's soldier and didn't want to go like this, he believed that was the end he deserved because he didn't think he worthed much. One perfect ending for Dean would have been to go, but older, not on his old man's unsolved case, and not so stupidly, after everything, being beaten by a rusty nail doesn't feel right, it feels rushed. But it's mundane, it's almost a normal way to go after all, there is no big epic fight, this is just life being a bitch, and for once it is not a celestial being or a undefeatable entity, it's just a plain normal boring nail. It means, this is a calm way to go, the stakes aren't high, it's like, the complete opposite if what he has had since series 1. I understand what the writers meant. This is giving Dean an ending that wasn't as stressful as all the others, for the first time it is not an apocalypse to stop, and so he looked at the situation and thought: "that's it, the world won't end if I go, I don't have any burden on my shoulders anymore, I can go". I doesn't work but I understand what they meant.

What they didn't realized also was the fact we have read the character as bisexual, that we consider him canonically bisexual, and that killing him sends a bad message. But they don't actually think he's bi, we believe they did but that is something that we have read, not something they actually wrote. So, yes they are really clueless about the message they sent here.

If they did, which I doubt, then Dean's happiness was with Castiel, and since he wasn't on earth, he could only go to heaven, hoping that Jack brought him back (which he did). But I doubt they did because if that was the case we would have had a reunion. I'll come to that later.

But first, Castiel. Castiel's arc ended with him finding the one thing that makes a human a human in this universe : love. The angelic sensebif love was devoid of actual feelings, either in a platonic way or romantically, the angels have been depicted as obedient, stone cold, practical. In Castiel's ending, all of that is gone. I think his end should have been different because he and we deserve more that yet another kill your gays, but it was in character for him to devote himself to love in a final act of irrational and deep care for humanity, for those he thinks about family and for this man he loves and lost his wings for.

As a final act of love for Dean and humanity, he shaped with Jack a heaven that gives people the freedom to choose they're own perfect heaven. He designed it perfectly so people in heaven have free will. He designed a heaven that was meant to give Dean a sense of completion and that gave him the happiness and freedom he deserved (noting that he was happy before he went there).

What they did wrong was not showing Jack bring him back, it was not actually telling how he designed heaven for humanity, because as far as I can see the point didn't came across. It was also not taking time to show that it is not heaven and death that gives dean happiness and relief, they should have said Dean was at peace before going there. And it was not reuniting them.

That was their biggest mistake in my opinion because we needed to see a response from Dean. I have read somewhere Jensen actually think the fact Dean didn't answer doesn't mean he doesn't feel the same. I think he did wanted to tell something, he did love him, no matter which way, he did love him, I saw it cristal clear because Jensen is actually a good actor and got that across not only in episode 18 but in the whole show. He wasn't always on board with the idea because he had his own perception of his character but he knows the audience saw something he didn't and eventually took that in account and you can actually see it in his acting. Maybe Misha convinced him, you know he on the other end has always been open to it. Anyway, Dean had stuff to say. I think the writer considered he already did, by calling Cas family, by saving him over and over, I can't be sure, but they apparently didn't think it was necessary to make him express what he had to express and that is why they make him say to Sam that the pain isn't gonna go away and that he can only move on.

But they needed to be together in the end. To counteract the kill your gays. We needed a end à la Song of Achilles, so the sacrifice they both did was actually worth it. Instead they reunited the brothers, again, unaware that they portrayed a toxic codependency all along, I absolutely don't think they ever saw their relationship like that. I think they thought it was emotional and cute, and beautiful. In a way it was, but in another way, we needed more for both if them than Sam waiting to die in order to ve with his brother again. They say "you can go now" as if the sole purpose of his life from that point was to die. They really were oblivious to the fact that makes Sam not actually living a live he actually enjoyed and got involved in, they may have make him laugh with his son and be a better father than his own ever was (I don't think he was teaching him to hunt, the tattoo just meant he's protected from possession) but the whole message is that "you've walked in this life by default, waiting to be able to join heaven, not because you chose to".

I don't think the writers have really thought through what they were actually saying because they didn't took enough time to show and tell what they actually meant. On one end they failed to grasp what they birthed prior to that, on the other hand they failed to make themselves clear about what they mean. We lose much of their intent because they don't master their rythm, and fail to check what is really coming across the screen.

I don't think they are disrespectful, I don't think they delivered a bad or inappropriate ending, and I don't think they were intentionally homophobic, I just think they didn't give us the most appropriate ending. In the end it still feels right to me because I understand what they did, the characters where in characters, and it was a beautiful goodbye to me, but I am not entirely happy with it because I think they missed the point because, precisely, they are too much in character. They shouldn't have given us in character, they should have given us change, evolution, growth, from what the characters have been until then, and they should have been more explicit, because the way we read them absolutely calls for that. By staying too close to what they think they wrote they couldn't possibly satisfy the audience.

Like as said in a previous post, they were also playing safe with destiel, and I think they made a mistake. But yet again, I wasn't even expecting the ship to be acknowledged at all, so to me what they did was unexpected and nice. A big lead character, not a secondary but a lead, from one of the most popular show in television is canonically gay, there's that! And actually, there isn't much big shows that can say as much. The actual norm is still very low despite more and more shows being inclusive, they actually did better than the norm. I know it's not enough, I mean, I too want representation, I am a bisexual woman, I know we need better, but sometimes we can just be grateful for the little steps people are taking. We may believe it's nothing but it is not, they've done something great, not ideal, but great. They have taken the step Sherlock wasn't willing to take, they took a step so little shows were willing to take. Accusing them of being intentionally homophobic is just plain disrespectful for the impact they've had on television considering representation in popular shows.

They just committed a mistake by staying true to Castiel's character and making him sacrifice and by not bringing him back. They had good intentions, but were clueless about the implications of what they did. They intended to be faithful to the characters they wrote, and missed to be faithful to the characters they actually created.

No it wasn't the ending that I think would have been great. But I don't think they completely failed to give a nice ending that really says goodbye and thank you. It just could have been better, it doesn't deserve all the backlash I'm witnessing here. It deserves criticism, and it deserves for some of its issues to be addressed, but also, some people need to take a huge chill pill because it wasn't the horror they believe it was. Destiel isn't canon, yet they still brought their characters to peace.

And, to finish, I've seen a post say it sent a bad message about depression too. I have depression, and let me tell you this year it is getting heavy on me because shit happens. Yes, it kinda can be read as "you only find happiness and peace in death", but like I said I don't think they go to heaven go find peace, I think they go to heaven feeling at peace and happy because they did solved their issues before that. I personally didn't read it in such a bad way, au contraire, I think they got the peace and healing they needed before dying, but the writers weren't clear about it. But yes, can be read like that and maybe they should have think twice about that too.

To conclude: yes it was flawed, no it wasn't great, but it wasn't that bad either. I feel fine about it because I get what they meant, and I am fine with writing my own end for them.

Also, let's not forget we're in the midst if a global pandemic, we have to be indulgent with the fact they couldn't do everything they wanted.

#my posts #supernatural spoilers #supernatural #destiel #supernatural finale #spn last season #spn spoilers #spn

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sunsetsover · 5 years ago

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things we haven’t talked about enough from the coming out episode:

ben moping about the date and then when phil points out that he’s moping going off on a massive tangent like ‘dating’s for muppets’ and ‘i don’t have time for romance’ like the Dramatic Gay he is

ben and tubbs doing their dodgy business in the middle of the square in broad daylight and looking like the shiftiest motherfuckers while doing it

ben trying to be nonchalant by leaning against a postbox but instead looking like this skfdkslfjkl

the fact that callum, upon finding out that stuart tried to scare ben off, goes looking for him literally everywhere instead of idk going to WORK

ben talking about getting a bulldog, joint gym memberships and moving in together 👀

how obviously hard it was for ben to lie and tell callum that they didn’t have anything

‘you’ve come here because you’re a sad, lonely old man who ain’t got no one’

not underrated but i will literally never be over lola calling callum a baby gay and then callum’s disbelieving yet satisfied little ‘baby gays’ afterwards

actually that whole lola/callum scene was underrated let them be bffs @ ee!!! they could both use a mate!!!!

jay sitting like this...... like come on we all know bisexuals can’t sit properly 👀

again not underrated but 'i might be a baby gay but i’m a fully grown man’

ben’s reaction to hearing callum referring to himself as a baby gay! like u know damn well he’s been calling callum that in the privacy of his own home and lola’s just gonna expose him like that? cold blooded

callum’s little satisfied face when he realized him being Assertive and Confident was working on ben

‘oh for crying out loud ben just go out with him will ya’

lola’s face during that entire scene....... Me

ben instinctively making some crude joke, callum calling him out on it (he’s learning!) and ben immediately being serious again

ben once again having to try really hard to try and push callum away because he thinks he deserves better than him :-(

callum’s little frown when ben says ‘you deserve someone good’ like ?? he was so confused bc he thinks ben is good

callum leaning right down to look ben dead in the eye and telling him ‘i decide who i deserve’

ben clearly struggling with the fact that callum was fighting for him!! he had done everything he could to push callum away but callum was still there, still fighting for him, for them, and poor ben didn’t know what to do!!

ben’s last ditch attempt at scaring callum off by telling him to kiss him right there in the middle of the pub for everyone to see bc he was so sure he wasn’t going to do it

but callum was !!!!!!!!!!! he literally was gonna do it !!!! u can see him working up the courage as ben was talking, take a step closer and then look down to ben’s lips!!!! he was like ‘ok if this is what it’s gonna take to prove to you i’m ready and committed and that i want this then ok’!!!!!! i guarantee callum was gonna kiss him if jonno hadn’t walked in :-(

ben literally being in bodyguard mode from the minute jonno walked into the pub until callum kissed him

like look at him :-( callum’s little bodyguard :-(

‘careful, this prime rump’s got a tidy left hook’ 🥰

ben standing up to his full height to make himself look bigger when he realized callum was about to have a go at jonno

karen frantically tapping keanu’s hand when phil walked in lmao

ben’s little suppressed smile when callum was laying into jonno.... he said that’s my baby and i’m proud!!!!!!!!!!

callum’s shaky breath before he says he’s gay :-(

LITERALLY EVERY WORD OUT OF CALLUM’S MOUTH ??? INCREDIBLE AMAZING SHOW STOPPING

but also the delicate balance of callum clearly really wanting to do this and be brave but still obviously being scared? where’s tony clay’s oscar

everyone’s faces as they realized callum was about to come out, especially whitney’s

the way ben looked at callum when he said ‘i’m gay’

like look at him......... ben ‘heart eyes’ mitchell :-(

THE FACT THAT ONCE THE WORDS ARE OUT CALLUM LOOKS LIKE HE’S TRYING SO HARD TO BE BRAVE BUT ALSO LIKE HE’S ABOUT TO BURST INTO TEARS AT ANY GIVEN MOMENT :------(

the way callum tried to laugh off jonno’s reaction but just couldn’t ..... like he knew, he knew jonno was gonna react like that but it still doesn’t stop u having the the tiniest sliver of hope, does it :-(

but him having the bravery and the strength to follow through anyway!!!

everyone’s disgusted/sad faces at jonno’s reaction

patrick and sheree being in their own world despite everything that was going on around them up until jonno starts shouting his mouth off lmao

the way jay and lola were up instantly when jonno went for callum

the fact that you see both callum open his mouth to defend himself against the vile shit jonno was spewing and ben go to pull out of the grip jay and lola have on him, but phil gets there first with the Smackdown™

everyone’s reactions to the Smackdown™ and their faces in the aftermath

especially callum’s when he’s lookin down at his dad on the floor!! the relief on his face!!!

keanu and karen just stood there listening in behind jonno when everyone’s outside... like the fact that keanu is just casually drinking his beer ?? the funniest he’s ever been lmao

ben carrying on his bodyguard duties even outside, standing there watching on w his arms crossed........ ready to jump in if it kicks off again

whitney and callum’s shared look :-( love them

lola lookin at callum like this...... girl i know

callum’s determined walk to get his man!!!!!!!!

‘you saw it too, did ya? the sexual tension between our dads?’

lola’s reaction to the kiss

actually lola this whole episode like i was kin

the fact that ben had to like.... push callum off bc he wasn’t gonna stop kissing him

FLIRTY BANTER!!!!! WHILE EVERYONE WATCHED ON!!!!!

ben ‘heart eyes’ mitchell, the return :-(

the fact that kush was very involved but also not at all involved in this whole thing lmao

the fact that u can tell that callum could tell that his whole life, his whole world had changed and he was so happy!!!!!! he was just so happy man he looked on top of the world as he just walked away and left his scumbag father behind and didn’t look back 🥰🥰

LIKE? AN ANGEL

also bonus: callum’s giant fuckin hand completely engulfing ben’s in thursday’s ep

#ballum #eastenders #THIS WAS SUPPOSED TO BE LIKE 4 THINGS BUT I JUST KEPT BEING LIKE 'AND ANOTHER THING'#also this become less of an 'underrated moments' list and more of a 'moments i loved' list lmao #*

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jq37 · 5 years ago

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oh WOW that new bloodkeep ep

**spoilers for family in freefall bloodlines and lifelines**

Man this episode was a lot. Probably my fave of the season so far.

Brennan seems to have an M.O. in terms of plotting things. They way we got a focus on each character in a stressful situation reminded me a lot of Family in Flames from the FH season which came at about the same point in the story.

Anyway, we start with Brennan giving the most unnecessarily verbose description of falling ever.

I am actually not sure how big Lilith is supposed to be in relation to everyone else at this point. Or how big her kids are supposed to be. I thought the really young ones were like straight spiders but like Jessa and the boy who’s name I’m forgetting were centaur style like her. But like, idk.

Efink insisting that she’s still holding the wheel (even though it truly means nothing) was so funny.

Both Matt and Brennan do very good re-entry sound effects.

Brennan: Feel free to do nothing.

Rekha: *SLAMS that induce labor button with no hesitation*

Truly amazing

“You feel your fire break.”

Leiland falling to his doom while bossa nova music plays in the background and rolling his eyes at Maggie is iconic.

Everyone is dying and Sohkbar is just like, fine.

Lilith polymorphs into a full ass spider.

Even though it ended up going sideways (literally) not a bad plan from Markus.

Brennan is so good at scene setting exposition.

Erika acted the hell out of that moment when she and Sohkbar share a look before she tells Russel everything is gonna be OK. She didn’t have to but she did that for us.

The wheel that steers nothing metaphor was such a good turn of phrase from Bren.

Efink’s DOUBLE NAT ONES.

WOOOOOW.

Rekha goes, “THIS is the bad day,” with Kristen Bell’s inflection and I am reminded that it has not even been a full 24 hours in game since ep 1. Wild.

Anyway, Efink’s norn spirit things disappear which is what happens when you roll snake eyes I guess. Amy is legit tearing up.

Brennan’s throwaway joke of explaining story structure low key killed me.

Leiland gets advantage on perception and rolls a nat 20!

Are all of the Vingury just gay for the next person in their chain of command? Because that’s what it seems like.

Matt’s flustered Leiland as Miles implies ~things~ is adorable.

Animal handling 2, electric boogaloo. I love that joke.

Maggie is so OP. Maggie hits the ground and isn’t even at half HP. Leiland is knocked into negatives though.

His first death save is a nat 1. WHICH IS 2 FAILURES. I was so stressed.

Then J'er'em'ih rolls a nat 20 to go save him!

I love the phrase, “J'er'em'ih’s normal form” as if he has a normal anything.

“J'er'em'ihdeserves the credit.”

Anyway J'er'em'ih(w/ an assist from Sohkbar) saves Leiland!

Rekha was so concerned for John. Like, not even Maggie. Rekha.

“It’s gonna be an egg!?”

Samantha Eagles. (Of the Philadelphia Eagles?) I died at that line.

Maggie levels up and gets healing magic. (“Fuck yeah!” says Maggie.) John stabilizes.

The fact that Maggie thought it might be an egg makes me concerned that she maybe isn’t ready to be a mom.

I love that Maggie just wordlessly presents her baby to Lilith (the alpha mom of the group) like a kid showing their mom and art project.

OK, this is such a tiny moment but I love, love, love that Maggie has a good enough relationship with Lilith that when she heard what she thought was a threat to her baby, she just asked, “Is that a threat to the baby?” instead of attacking her or going *Maggie will remember that* and harboring mistrust. The way she asked was so adorable. Also, Lilith would never.

Markus floats basically the exact same plan as Lilith (defect to good, get pardons) but at least he uses it as a plan of true last resort.

Lilith being the keeper of basically all of Efink’s self esteem is great. Also, everyone has to keep reminding her that she is queen.

“As the resident magnificent failure.”

“Allow me to be the basis for your self comparison. That’s the best I can offer you.” LEILAAAAAAAND.

Anyway, Leiland gives a great pep talk to Efink who throws her spell cards over her shoulder irl (”it’s an RP episode. it’s fine”).

Amy to Brennan who is about to start roasting Efink’s entire life: Don’t do this.

So when Brennan said, “Efink gets to decide right now if she’s good at magic.” I was thinking, that’s a big thing to put in a PC’s hands unless you want the answer to be yes. Because, in another story, “No,” might be the better answer narratively, but who’s gonna voluntarily nerf themselves like that?

So Efink dips into an episode of Friendship is Magic which Brennan beautifully picks up the narration for and gets the info they need without rolling for it. She also has some major self actualization and is now dry, less vain, and less dramatic.

It kinda seems like this was leading towards Lilith being the new leader what with her thoughts while she was falling and her being passed up for the promotion but, come on. She would have to make a crazy soul rending deal to just take the crown normally and she has kids and common sense. Otherwise, I think Erika would have made that play.

“Is my son a different player than me?” I love Rekha.

Like Leiland, I fully thought she was gonna name the kids John at first. (Are you ‘allowed’ to jr. a kid who isn’t named after you or your spouse? I’ve never seen someone do that. As in, add the jr., not name a kid after a friend).

I love that Matt roleplays Leiland into so many awkward moments. A good RP-er doesn’t care about their character being cool all the time.

“I’m naming him after the name of yours that I prefer.” That was so sweet.

“First of all, J'er'em'ih’s an excellent judge of character.”

Everyone coming together to make Leiland feel better was so so sweet. These guys are like the exact opposite of murder hobos in a game where they 100% have the right to be.

The baby tells Leiland to kneel and he just does it because of course he does. (Leiland later: I HAVE A VERY PARTICULAR SET OF SKILLS)

Maggie after Leiland swears total fealty to Leiland Jr: Can’t you keep anything at like 80%?

Efink rolls a nat 20 on her check to navigate the Bloodkeep, basically completing her self actualization arc.

Leiland resists the urge to chase Hamhead, completing a portion of his arc.

The running thing of people giving Maggie biologically incorrect info on kids because of their drastically different biology.

Aww all of Lilith’s kids.

Lilith dispel magicking the book golem, implying she could have done that at any time and just chose not to.

Leiland apologizes to Maggie for being bitchy to her out of jealously, which I thought was sweet but was just the warm up act for what was about to happen.

But, before that, Maggie’s dad calls and Efink hangs up on him for her. For a second I thought that cutting off the call meant we wouldn’t get to see what was behind the doors but, luckily, that wasn’t the case.

(Also Sohkbar and Lilith eating popcorn as Maggie and her dad fight).

Did Efink appoint herself high adviser?

“Please don’t bite him,” *Leiland Jr. bites a spider*

So, anyway, Leiland and Maggie go into the portal and see visions of (1) weird sex between Zaul and Lilith and (more importantly), (2) Zaul bagging on Maggie when she’s not around/thirsting after Leiland when he’s not around.

The simile about winning the lottery after you find out money can’t buy you happiness was so good.

“What a fucking pig!”/“I agree.”/“Oh, do you?”/“Actually I do.”

I’M SO PROUD OF THEM.

Instead of being mad at Leiland (or Lilith for that matter) she just doubled down on being mad at her dickhead ex. And Leiland, instead of being all winner winner chicken dinner just felt bad for Maggie and Decklan.

“Was this something the baby should have seen?”/“No.”

“This is one of the lesser times it’s bad to say your father’s name.” Yikes Leiland.

Anyway, the whole hang makes plans to take Sohkbar shopping and it really fits in with the theme of this ep of everyone boosting everyone’s self esteem. This ep has a lot of genuinely heartwarming moments.

“Sohkbar yes. Sohkbar yes. Sohkbar yes.”

“What did you roll? [28] You see everything.”

Leiland Jr. as new king seems like a questionable decision imo but I’m not gonna backseat RP.

“You guys start engaging in a fun conversation about statecraft.”

“Lilith, I’d like a hug.” Lilith hugs her and kicks her legs up like she’s in the climax of a romcom.

The whole group hugs and Brennan calls them out and has a NPC call them out, even though he’s the person who led them to this path!

Man, the promo for this ep really made it sound more dire and less heartwarming that it actually was.

YOU’RE DEFINING GOOD

“Imagine there’s 9 squares in a grid.” TRAPP

That like 20 seconds had so many good lines. “We’re cutting out the middle man and taking evil straight to you.”/“We’re evolving evil.”/“We’re disrupting evil.”

Now that I think about it, they really haven’t escaped the bloodkeep so far, have they? They’ve been going back and forth between it but not really trying to escape it per se.

Olag is back because, again, of course he is.

Final battle y'all!

Sounds like we’re getting actual Gollum next week so that should be fun. Also, very curious to see what that last, “No,” is in response to. These guys are good at cutting trailers so it could be nothing serious, but who knows?

#escape from the bloodkeep #bloodkeep #spoilers #asks #anon #Anonymous

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kaypeace21 · 5 years ago

Text

Byler hints in the background of s1-3

Honestly, this should just be called- ‘my autistic brain casually (and without even trying) notices shit in the background, but never mentioned it- because I thought it sounded too crazy to talk about’ XD. But the symbolism and Easter eggs give my byler-shipping heart so much life. So I thought, since you guys prob. didn’t notice it- I’ll mention it anyways. So here goes.

Drawings/rainbows

There has been a theme in s3 about how Mike equates ‘falling for girls’ as a part of growing up, and his feelings for Will as something childish that he has to has to grow out of.

- confessing to El : “A feeling … yeah, like, something… like OLD PEOPLE say it sometimes”.

- “And Will too. I was thinking we could all have new presents to play with and *scoffs* Sorry, that made me sound like a 7 year old... (apologizing to El)

- Mike getting in a fight with Will (after d&d), and saying they can’t be close anymore:

Mike says, “It’s not my fault you don’t like girls!”, and then he tries to ½ apologize only to say, “I’m not trying to be a jerk. Ok? But We’re not kids anymore.” Explaining, this is just the way things are-boys fall in love with girls, get girlfriends, and this is just a part of growing up (heteronormativity). He tells Will “I mean, what did you think, really? That we were never gonna get girlfriends? We were just gonna sit in my basement all day and play games for the rest of our lives?” And poor Will who is probably more aware of his feelings just responds. “Yeah, I guess I did. I really did.” And of course Mike immediately apologizes for being an “ asshole”, after this.

But here’s the thing! Mike actually does wish he didn’t have to grow up and that he could play games with Will (without girlfriends) for the rest of their lives. His room, in s3, SCREAMS that he’s trying to grow up/act straight... but he can’t let go of his feelings for Will.

He literally takes down his old childhood poster from s1-2 for a more mature/adult poster. But on the same wall (where the old poster used to be) he hasn’t removed a single d&d drawing Will has given him. He’s pretending that he’s grown out of d&d when Lucas is around- because he’s emulating how (the straight) Lucas acted, all season. But Mike has it BAD (and is seriously pinning) for Will! Like, I love Will but his art at 11 years old isn’t so great to justify it still be on Mike’s wall at age 14. He’s just that whipped (and literally can’t part with a single drawing Will has ever given him) XD

Like... it’s cannon that Mike caresses Will’s drawings

He’s that ‘ dumbass blinded by love’ who thinks anything Will’s draws is a perfect- masterpiece. Mike could literally see Will draw scribbles and think it’s amazing! Like in s2 he just guides his hands through the scribbles he drew on the wall- no joke! XD

However, what’s interesting though is the one other things he took down from his wall. In S1 Mike (before he even met El) has a heart sign, with a red heart being propelled by a rainbow. Yet in s3 , the season where he’s ‘obsessing’ about El- it mysteriously disappears. However, in the first ep of s3 when Mike is making-out with El we see a emergence of the heart being propelled by a rainbow (in El’s room) as a drawing. Probably signifying Mike participating in compulsory-heterosexuality and that no matter how hard he tries- he’s not straight!

So given the fact he can’t part with any of the pictures on the wall...you better believe Mike still has that giant binder filled with every drawing Will has given him . And he’s probably hidden it away , with the rainbow heart sign (because he knows it would look suspicious to have laying around).

-Also, Mike literally has more rainbow symbolism than Will (and has had it through every season) XD

-the s2 ref being the most on the nose) Forbidden fruit + rainbow = queer forbidden romance. And during the 80s, that rainbow-apple poster in the AV Club was suspected to be in reference to Alan Turning (the gay ‘father of computers’).

Animal easter eggs that relate to byler and the upside down/supernatural-plot .

tigers- Mike keeps a tiger poster (which was right next to that rainbow-heart sign) in his basement through s1-3. In s1 we see Will also has a tiger drawing, which is later put on the wall (like a poster) in s2. Sara Hopper (like Will ) had her death faked by the government (and had a tiger plushie in s1)- and Kali probably had something to do with it since in the prequel novel ‘suspicious minds’ had Kali talk non stop about her fav animal , tigers. Theory here. But again, Jancy is also connected to tigers as a romantic symbol (just like byler).

sharks- The Duffer brothers themselves said they based the s1 demorgorgan off of sharks, which Nancy even references in s1. Mike and Will have shark iconography in their room/basement. Will has a jaws poster shown in s1-2, and Mike has shark toys visible in s2. The shark (and bear) symbolism hint at the fact that Will created the upside down/demorgorgans/mind-flayer using his powers- theory here.

bears- Will since s1 has had bear symbolism around him. Bears symbolically represent “wisdom” like ‘Will the wise’ and were associated with the demorgorgan/upside down in s1 and 2 as well . Max and Nancy compared demogorgans to bears- and Nancy and Jonathan used a bear-trap to capture a demorgorgan in s1 .

But s3 made bears a romantic symbol- Mike was going to buy a golden teddy bear for El as a romantic gesture. The golden bear had a bowtie (it’s male). And the gray bear that Mike gives to her, was originally Will’s (as shown in s1 &2). This gray bear is coming right in between Mike and El (at the end of s3). They even kiss , while El presses the bear right in between them. In conclusion these romantic bears represent Will. * I mean that whole awkward kiss (where Mike’s eyes are open and he doesn’t kiss back- happens in Will’s room, in front of Will’s open closet, with Will’s bear smushed between them (pretty blatant foreshadowing).

dinosaurs- This one is probably a stretch but we see this boy has tons of dinosaurs (at least 6). He starts to info-dump on El about how much he loves them. But, she has no interest. And if the wtf look didn’t make this obvious.

She even gets up and walks away, ignoring his tangent about dinosaurs.

She literally couldn’t care less about his interest in them.

But in spite of this, we see Mike gave her Rory in s3 (since it’s in her bedroom). And in s2 we see him sadly look at Rory, with 2 other dinosaurs in frame. This, along with s1 implies he has a huge collection of various dinosaurs .But his collection is missing one of the most popular dinosaur species... the brachiosaurus (the long necked dinosaur).

And right after this scene in s2 scene, we go to Will’s room. And he has a huge brachiosaurus! This boy couldn’t even afford a halloween costume and had to have his hand-made by his mom... but he could afford this huge -fancy dinosaur replica? I bet Mike bragged about his dinosaur collection to Will (like he did with El). But Will being a nerd, was actually impressed. So Mike actually gave him his best/fav toy in his collection- kind of like what he did with Rory.

frogs- This is the most hilarious thing to me. I laughed for like 20 minutes on my rewatch. In s1 Will has a GIANT stuffed plushie of a frog next to his jaws poster and teddy bear. I’m dead! Will doesn’t even disagree with the “frog face“ insult.

He’s just like ‘well, he’s my frog face’ . Time to snuggle with this frog that looks just like Mike . Will is so in love but also low key savage dragging Mike like that. I can only imagine Dustin and Lucas saying “nah, you don’t look like a frog”. And poor baby-Mike asking Will what he thinks, and Will not being able to lie, just saying “ Well... some people like frogs.” XD

We also see that in s2 the frog is missing but the Jaws-poster, coin jar, and the bear (we later see El holding in s3) remain .Probably to indicate this is when Will started to subconsciously suppress his feelings for Mike. Although @theclericwill pointed out -that , instead, Mike may have used the frog-plushie as a pillow... for his frog-face XD

Throwing shade at Mileven/mileven shippers in s2

In the Montauk pitch (later named Stranger things) they describe the Mike and El dynamic by saying “ If Mike is the Eliot of our show,Eleven is our Et.” (AKA they’re from different planets)

-In s2 , Erica is forcing He-man and barbie to make out. Lucas angrily separates the two. And then this discussion happens.

Erica: “Hey , They’re in love!”

Lucas (livid- and standing right next to a rainbow): “No, actually, they’re not. They don’t even exist on the same planet.”

Not to mention I doubt it was a coincident they had a (bratty) pre-pubescent girl be the proxy for most mileven shippers.Like not all mileven shippers are bad, but almost all the toxic ones (that the Duffers have to deal with) are tween girls. And to the Duffers, only a child could think 2 people are ‘in love’ after a week of knowing each other. Or that El could understand such things like romance- given the fact that her and Mike are from different planets (given how El has no experience with the outside world).Mike even says in s2, he can’t hate Max because he ‘doesn’t know’ her (despite knowing her as long as he knew El). Meaning he doesn’t love El since he doesn’t know her.

Plus, El told Mike, he treats her like ‘garbage’ and ‘a pet’ . And Finn after s1, said that the Duffers told him Mike thought of El as a puppy, and she is even compared to Dart (a demo-dog in s2). Mike asking Dustin, angrily “What, You have a bond? Just cause he likes nougat (eggos)?” Being a blatant dig at people obsessing over this shallow aspect of their relationship.

Mileven was also compared to that of family members. In s1, right before they kissed, she asks “will you be like my brother?” (while wearing Nancy’s dress). And Mike also referred to her as his ‘cousin’ . Not to mention, El loved ted’s laz-eboy chair (and Nancy said Karen and Ted “never loved each other” ). And right before Karen is about to cheat on Ted - she looks at him sleeping in the chair (and the lyrics are ‘I should have walked away’).

It’s pretty hilarious, since so many people try to ‘no-homo’ byler by saying Mike thinks of Will as a brother/or family- yet, their relationship has never been directly compared to a sibling (unlike mileven).

People also seem to not realize Mike lied in s2 (just like he did in s3). He thought El was dead in s2. He told Max it “got her like it did bob” and then he made a spectacle in front of everyone saying “I never gave up on you”. Which was a blatant lie (since he just told Max a few minutes earlier, she was dead -_-). Mike simply blamed himself for her death (he said they needed her to save Will and even referred to her as a “weapon”). So when she died he felt the most responsible- and was hoping she was alive (and would answer his call) to alleviate his own guilt. Not because he loved her (that was an act). When he saw Will’s dead body, but heard his voice, he went on a rescue mission to save Will (from another dimension). But, Mike didn’t even bother going into the woods after seeing El outside his window (something he did for Will in ep 1, during a storm). And then in s3 Mike couldn’t even bother to call El and apologize- but ran to apologize to Will in the woods during a storm (bringing that whole parallel -full circle).

Plus, El told Mike, he treats her like ‘garbage’ and ‘a pet’ . And Finn after s1, said that the Duffers told him Mike thought of El as a puppy, and she is even compared to Dart (a demo-dog in s2). Mike asking Dustin, angrily “What, You have a bond? Just cause he likes nougat (eggos)?” A blatant dig at people obsessing over this shallow aspect of their relationship.

Bob and Mike parallels- the Rubik cube

Both are unathletic, smart, love comics, the only 2 to not treat Will ‘different’- and would do anything to protect their loved ones. And they also had crushes on Byers in childhood, and tried to give their Byers normalcy (despite them not being a ‘normal family’). They purposely display, and have Will -mirror Joyce- and Mike -mirror Bob- in multiple shots, throughout s2.

And both Mike and Bob are AV club leaders. Bob mentioned in one of the earlier episodes that he founded the Hawkins Middle AV club . And Mike later grabs Bob’s Rubik cube, and mentions this after his death (to solidify the connection- even if subconscious in our minds. He even proclaims after this “we can’t let him die in vain” . And this is when Mike makes the plan to help Will (before El shows up).

gif credit: cath-avery, dailystrangerthings

#byler #byeler

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