drives me nuts when people treat jin guangyao or wei wuxian like they're socialist revolutionaries like no! they're not!! in fact their respective roles in society and complacency regarding its hierarchies is why ANY of the story even happens to begin with!!!
jin guangyao doesn't hold bitterness just because he was born lower class. he is bitter because others deride him and his prostitute mother in spite of both their intelligence, skills, and efforts to climb the ladder.
why do you think we were shown scenes of other prostitutes in the brothel deriding meng shi for being literate, for "trying" so hard? why do you think we were shown scenes of anxin taunting meng yao and throwing shit at him because he was trying to learn cultivation at his mother's behest?
why do you think jin guangyao arranged for the arson of that brothel, burned to the ground with everyone except sisi inside? that's not the behavior of someone who believes in true equality and the inherent worth of sex workers as human beings!
that's the behavior of someone who thinks he's better than them. the behavior of a man who already came up on top through political games and war crimes, backstabbing and spying for the sake of the "greater good".
i won't rehash his argument to nie mingjue that he didn't have a choice-- he had some choice, but no matter what he does his class will come up and people will always assume the worst and try to hurt him for it, which forces his hand to do whatever will protect him best (hence 'no choice').
jin guangyao did everything he could to secure his own safety and a place among those already higher up. and by that point, he'd won it.
the fact that the temple rebuilt on the brothel site is to guanyin, the goddess of mercy, is even more ironic! the fact that jin guangyao has the goddess's statue carved to look like his own mother is proof that he viewed both her and himself as higher than them. more worthy than them.
of course he cared about the general welfare of others (read: the watchtowers). but consider also that there is no watchtower near yi city, which ended up being one of xue yang's playgrounds. jin guangyao can and will turn a blind eye to certain sufferings if it is convenient to him.
sure, jin guangyao made undeniable contributions to cultivation society and accessibility, but he is not at any point trying to topple existing class structures. his adherence to them is in fact integral to his own downfall in the end.
it brings with it the inevitability of society conveniently ignoring his triumphs and genuine moments of humanity to deride him once more as an evil, disgusting son of a whore once his crimes come to light.
now for wei wuxian. he's the righteous protagonist of the story and he doesn't give a fuck what society thinks, yes, but he wasn't out there trying to cause an uprising so that all the poor servant classes and lower could become cultivators. he wasn't trying to redistribute wealth or insinuate that those who are lower deserve to be viewed as equal to the gentry.
the most critical and non-explicitly stated fact of mo dao zu shi is that wei wuxian has always been resigned to his position in the social hierarchy.
his unreliable narration, especially regarding his own past and thoughts, is so damn important. he doesn't EVER tell the reader directly that people treated him any which way at their leisure because of his parents' differing social classes.
no. instead we are shown how much prestige he is afforded as cangse-sanren's son-- reputation as a talented and charming young cultivator, made head disciple of Yunmeng Jiang-- and how little respect he is given in the same breath, as the son of servant wei changze.
the way he is treated by others is as fickle as the wind. if he obeys and does as told, there is no reward. of course he did that, that was the expectation to start with! if he does anything even slightly inconvenient, there is a punishment. of course he has no manners, what else would you expect from an ungrateful son of a servant?
wei wuxian's righteousness is not a matter of adhering to principles he was explicitly taught, the way nie mingjue values honor or the way jiang cheng always tries to prove himself. wei wuxian does the right thing regardless of what the consequences are to him because his good deeds are always downplayed and his bad deeds are always singled out, no matter who or how many people were doing it with him.
he has faced this double standard since childhood. there are points in the novel where it's clear that this sticks out to wei wuxian, but does he ever fight back against that view of himself? does he EVER, at any point in the story, explain his actions and choices to jianghu society and try to debate or appeal to their sense of reason?
no. because he knows, at his very core, that any explicit deviation from their interests whatsoever will be punished.
slaughtering thousands of people is fine when they want him to do it, and when the alternative is unjust torture, re-education camps, and encroachment upon other sects' lands.
slaughtering thousands of people who are trying to paint him as evil for not going along with their genocidal plans, however, is punished.
wei wuxian knows his acceptance among the higher classes is superficial and unsteady. from the age of 10, when jiang fengmian took him in, he knew subconsciously that he could be kicked out at any time.
he knows that cultivation society doesn't care about war crimes and concentration camps and mistreatment of the remaining wen survivors of the sunshot campaign. but the right thing to do now that they aren't at wartime is to help them, plus they'd punish him either way for it, so he will.
in this regard wei wuxian is more self-aware of his position than jin guangyao. he does care about common people and he does try his best to help them as an individual. even if that ends up with him disabled, arrested, targeted in sieges, or dead.
but is he revolutionary? in the full equality, fight the establishment, rewrite laws, change social structures and people's perceptions of class sense?
no. no. he isn't.
now my knowledge of chinese society and history is fairly limited to my hindu diaspora upbringing and our shared cultural similarities ... but speaking to what i absolutely know us true, adherence to one's social class is expected.
this is rigid. efforts and merits might bring you some level of mobility, but in the end, the circumstances of your birth will always be scrutinized first, and your behavior compared to the stereotypes of where and how you originate.
mdzs is not about revolution, and none of its characters are able to truly change its society. there is no grand "maybe cutsleeves aren't inherently bad" or "i'm sorry for persecuting you and believing hearsay, you were truly a good person all along!" at the finale.
people ignore history and repeat it again with the next batch of ugly gossip and rumors.
wei wuxian, lan wangji, and luo qingyang find peace only by distancing themselves from cultivation society and its opinions.
jin guangyao and wei wuxian both cannot ever escape from others' perception of their origins and actions. regardless of their personal beliefs, they are not revolutionaries.
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Unpopular Opinion: Every time a black female character (especially if this black female character is dark skinned) enters into a relationship with the popular fan-favorite white male character usually one of three things happen a. the black female character is now headcanoned as a lesbian (never bisexual or queer or anything that would leave the character with the possibility of still entering into a relationship with a man) b. white male character is now shipped with other popular fan-favorite white male character/other white female character (the popular fan-favorite white male character is usually headcanoned to be bisexual and when he is, shipped with a woman that woman is always white) or c. black female character (and sometimes their actresses) is now being talked about as if they are the devil himself.
Wanting characters to explore their sexuality is fine but I always find it odd how this always happens when one member of the relationship is a black/blackish woman. *forgot to mention the suddenly polyamorous relationship the three (black female, white male and white male/woman) characters are now without a doubt in*
Anon you spoke nothing, but facts right here 🙌🏽
(The only thing I’d add is that they don’t just do this when the woman in question is with a white man, see Namor and Shuri and the backlash some shippers got for shipping them).
You aren’t the only one who has been noticing this trend.
I say trend loosely because really just a new stereotype to add to the bunch😒
It would be one thing if it was a want for actual representation, but every time now like clockwork. as soon as they see a Black woman who looks like she’s going to have a romantic arc with said popular fandom man, boom she must be gay😑
Hell, it’s getting so bad that these shows/movies are automatically just writing their Black women characters in that way.
If people can’t see how this can be harmful/dangerous, that’s cool, but anytime you want to paint all of a group a certain way and won’t show them in any other setting, that’s how you end up birthing new stereotypes.
This isn’t creating diversity. It’s limiting it(once again).
It’s so all or nothing with our media representation. Black women don’t want to be shown as one thing(which seems to go right over most people’s heads).
We just want the same opportunities as everybody else and not to be put into one or two narrow boxes of acceptable characterization that doesn’t threaten the status quo(aka you can't have Black women looking desirable especially not when there is an available white woman right there next to her).
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I can’t help but think about this situation from everybody out of the loop’s POV but IN PARTICULAR I am enamored with whatever the hell Darius is doing. I imagine he finds out after the fact because Lilith is Losing Her Shit. Like,
Lilith, kicking down Darius’ door mid-spiral, manic enough to honestly be considering lunging at the next person who speaks to her uninvited even if it’s Belos back from the goddamn dead: MMMMY KID BURNED HER HER WHOLE BRAIN TRYING TO ERASE HER OWN MEMORIES AND IT IS ALL MY FAULT I’M A TERRIBLE INFLUENCE AND A WORSE MENTOR-
Darius, who has been Minding His Goddamn Business: …I’m sorry, Amity did- okay, actually, you know What. That is absolutely something she would do. I am shocked this didn’t happen earlier, honestly. did she get the memories back.
Lilith: I… YES?? Mostly?? To my knowledge?? I Think???
Darius: oh, wonderful. well. better learn her ticks for when she’s gonna death spiral again. was she doing the rambly-avoidant thing? I bet she was doing the rambly-avoidant thing.
Lilith: (That One Face. Horrified and taken aback. You know the one.)
Darius, going back to Minding His Goddamn Business: look. she’s Fine. in like 2 days she’ll be back to beating up the Golden Guard and they’ll be even more insufferable about it because he’s seen her brain. it’s FINE. she’s like you. she needs to have a good mental breakdown every now and again to keep functioning. enrichment or whatever.
Lilith: …I never said,
Darius: look me dead in the eyes Lilith and tell me Hunter wasn’t the one crawling around in her brain.
Lilith: Fair Enough.
Also enamored with him approaching Willow afterwords (no idea how he would have found out that she was also in there but. I’m sure someone would tell him Eventually) and just being like. Hey. Did u have fun crawling around in the terror dome. I would just like to mention that u are totally allowed to use whatever you saw in there against Amity if she’s being insane okay. I trust your judgement as one of like 3 people here I actually respect. Anyway, if you ever need a normal conversation my door is open but only in the afternoons cause I’m not getting up that early in the morning. Have fun getting entangled with my baby idiots forever. use protection. Cool talk I’m going to go push Terra off a balcony now
this is all Delightful. yeah this is about how it'd go. darius is like [looking up] do i have to be responsible or did you guys sort it already?? oh thank the titan. i didn't want to get up
darius approaching willow afterward to be like "i see you're in the polycule now. oh, you're not?? nah you will be. anyway bye" thank you darius. that's the least helpful anyone's ever done it....
i think darius and lilith being bitchy @ each other is peak content and ALSO that darius immediately clocking that hunter went into amity's mind is peak content. darius is like yeah hunter would never let amity fry her brain. where would he put all his terrorist energy without her.
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father hans you are the best worst old man to me (yes more than old jochen). i love how the game tries to give him some depth without shying away from his actions
heavy discussion of the apostasy route ahead
so, yeah, he's very zealous in his religious beliefs.
but despite (or maybe because of) his strong convictions, he cares a lot for kieferberg, even if only out of moral obligation:
i mean, he has the decency to feel a little guilty about the supernatural terrors he puts the town through:
that very religious zeal, unfortunately, also makes him willing to have any of kieferberg's residents burnt at the stake for the sake of the town's "salvation". ironic, then, that in the same letter that he condemns walpurga's followers he starts with this:
his well-meaning, yet extremist religiosity is also apparent in his relationship with elise. even with the clear animosity on both sides, he was genuinely concerned for elise's soul after learning about how holle had her in the first place:
...as that concern later turns into condemnation:
yet he doesn't even word it as something he looks forward to either. just something unfortunate that needs to be done.
the way he tries to keep the peace throughout the game and is actually one of the more vocally skeptical among the townsfolk (even if part of that is to diffuse suspicion towards his own experiments) is also interesting considering how his religious beliefs enable him to do genuinely terrible things. like he believes that his god has no problems with him burning people alive but also he wants to be absolutely sure that there's an actual witch to burn in the first place. he is simultaneously the personification of everything wrong with kieferberg and one of the few (aside from gustav, leb, and freya) who are barely keeping the village together
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